Speaker 1: You are listening to Ruthie's Table four in partnership with Montclair.
Speaker 1: In September, the River Cafe will be thirty six years old,
Speaker 1: and one of the great joys of having a restaurant
Speaker 1: for so long is watching the second generation and now
Speaker 1: even a third generation of her early customers grow up.
Speaker 1: Adwa's parents, Charles Boa and Camilla Luther, have been part
Speaker 1: of the River Cafe family since reopened, and ad was
Speaker 1: gone from being a young child ordering pasta, butter and
Speaker 1: cheese and then playing in the garden space outside with
Speaker 1: her friends to a formidable woman focused on the political
Speaker 1: and social issues relevant today. After her own struggles with
Speaker 1: mental health and to support young women's well being, she
Speaker 1: founded the organization Girls Talk, providing a safe space for
Speaker 1: girls to access resources, share experiences, create community, and feel
Speaker 1: less alone, a place to escape the chaos of the
Speaker 1: every day. I think a beautiful phrase today. Ad was
Speaker 1: just come from the kitchen grilling scallops and frying zucchini,
Speaker 1: and she's going to tell us what she learned and
Speaker 1: read the recipe so you can cook this at home.
Speaker 1: It's both moving and exciting for me to have d
Speaker 1: we're here, Oh.
Speaker 2: Oh so nice.
Speaker 1: So you've been in the kitchen then in the River
Speaker 1: Cafe kitchen, which do you remember coming here all.
Speaker 2: The time all the time Ronnie and Johnathan? Yeah, they
Speaker 2: used to take us all the time.
Speaker 1: And you've just been in the kitchen, and so you
Speaker 1: watched your request for the recipe with scallops grilled scallops
Speaker 1: with chili and zucchini.
Speaker 3: My name's Adriana and I'm a chepher at the River
Speaker 3: Cafe and today I'm cooking some scallops on the grilling.
Speaker 2: That now, Joan, I'm not cooking anything. You can cook
Speaker 2: it with me if you want to. Okay, cool.
Speaker 3: We put them in the center of the grill because
Speaker 3: that's the hardest place.
Speaker 2: How long do you have to leave them on?
Speaker 3: Not very long at all. So you just keep them,
Speaker 3: don't move them around, keep them where they are, and
Speaker 3: then he'll start.
Speaker 2: Kind of coming off.
Speaker 3: You can kind of look at the bottom and see
Speaker 3: how they're cooking, because if you move them too quickly
Speaker 3: then they'll stick.
Speaker 2: Oh wow, and.
Speaker 3: Then we're gonna get some pretty may I think, Harry,
Speaker 3: you're doing pretty right? Can you drop some pretty for us?
Speaker 1: So we have two recipes. One I think it's really
Speaker 1: for the batter for the zucchini, and then quite simple the.
Speaker 2: Scales, scallops and zucchini pretty four firm ripe zucchini, one
Speaker 2: litera sunflower oil for the batter. One cup all purpose flour,
Speaker 2: three tablespoons extra virgin olive oil. I get always get
Speaker 2: really confus use that the tablespoon and teaspoon.
Speaker 1: There is a different.
Speaker 2: Like the way it's written.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because it's tablespoon tsp.
Speaker 2: Isp three tablespoons extra virgin olive oil, three tablespoons warm water,
Speaker 2: three egg whites, scallops, sixteen shelled sea scallops, two lemons
Speaker 2: extra virgin olival Cut the zucchini into ovals, then into
Speaker 2: thick matchsticks for the batter. Sift the flour into a bowl,
Speaker 2: making a well in the center. Pour in the olive
Speaker 2: oil and stuff. Loosen the paste by slowly adding enough
Speaker 2: warm water to make a batter the consistency of heavy cream.
Speaker 2: Leave for thirty minutes. Heat the oil in a high
Speaker 2: sided pan to three hundred and seventy five degrees. Beat
Speaker 2: the egg whites until stiff and fold into the batter.
Speaker 2: Dip zucchini, then fry in batch in hot oil until
Speaker 2: golden and crisp. Serve immediately scallops. Heat the grill. Season
Speaker 2: the scallops very generously on both sides with salt and pepper.
Speaker 2: Actually she said only salt and then pepper at the end.
Speaker 1: Don't put the pepper on, Yeah, don't, Okay.
Speaker 2: It burns quickly, so put the pepper on after place
Speaker 2: on the grill until lightly brown and crisp. Then turn
Speaker 2: over the grill. On the other side. The scallop should
Speaker 2: be tender on the inside and crisp on the surface.
Speaker 2: Serve with lemon and a drizzle of olive oil. And
Speaker 2: I had some chili online. So do you have to
Speaker 2: place it all up? Yeah?
Speaker 3: That's the really fun part about working here is that
Speaker 3: you get to plate all of your.
Speaker 2: Food because where who would usually do that?
Speaker 3: Like Anton, so you bring it up to the past
Speaker 3: and maybe someone on the pass would play it, but
Speaker 3: here you get to do it and it gives you.
Speaker 3: I mean, for me, it's really satisfying.
Speaker 1: God wos.
Speaker 2: Wow, I'm coming here for dinner.
Speaker 1: Tell me about going to Vogue with Edward, because we did.
Speaker 1: When Edward Nfl became the editor, we did the party.
Speaker 1: Remember that we had a party for him That was
Speaker 1: a great party. You were the cover for his first year.
Speaker 2: That was mad, that Vogue party. I remember that like
Speaker 2: it was yesterday. I remember us driving here and I,
Speaker 2: you know, Edward, and I still laugh about it now.
Speaker 2: It's like it wasn't naivety. I think it was just
Speaker 2: this we were just doing something that felt very special
Speaker 2: to both of us. It was like this, we were
Speaker 2: embarking on this new journey, and it wasn't necessarily that
Speaker 2: we were. We were completely naive to how the world
Speaker 2: was going to embrace it, you know, not only just
Speaker 2: people in fashion, but worldwide. You know, it really went viral,
Speaker 2: do you I mean? I think? And so as we
Speaker 2: kind of pulled up. I pulled up, I can't remember
Speaker 2: who I was in the car with me. It was
Speaker 2: like my mom and dad and system. We pulled up
Speaker 2: the Shepherd's Bush roundabout and it was projected on Shepherd's
Speaker 2: Bush round about. What the hell is going on? And
Speaker 2: I looked on my phone and it was just like
Speaker 2: going mad and I actually like broke out into hives.
Speaker 2: I was like, oh my god, this is so much.
Speaker 2: I don't even know how to deal with this situation.
Speaker 2: I pulled up the River Cafe and Edwin and I
Speaker 2: just giggled. We could not stop laughing. I think we
Speaker 2: were both so overwhelmed by what had happened that we
Speaker 2: kind of just like could not stop laughing. It was mad.
Speaker 2: It still feels really mad.
Speaker 1: We all had ravioli. We had this long discussion before
Speaker 1: whether all the Vogue people, the models and the actresses
Speaker 1: and the young beauties of today would actually have gluten carbs,
Speaker 1: cheese butter, and whether we would serve it. We did,
Speaker 1: and bo was actually really cool because we said, do
Speaker 1: you want to find out what people whyn't you? They get?
Speaker 1: Now we're done with that. We're done with you know,
Speaker 1: if you have a food preference, we're just going to
Speaker 1: do the menu and what they eat. They did, and
Speaker 1: everybody had Reveali and everybody. A lot of people had
Speaker 1: seconds of viali. And yet the whole issue with the
Speaker 1: being a model about your body, talk about being a
Speaker 1: woman in a profession that requires you to be a
Speaker 1: certain shape besize.
Speaker 2: I think I don't remember being worried. I think there
Speaker 2: were moments when I was at school where I was
Speaker 2: kind of worried about what I looked like. Sometimes I
Speaker 2: didn't I wasn't at a girls' school. But you know,
Speaker 2: I lived in a house full of women, so sometimes
Speaker 2: when someone would get a bit like weird with food
Speaker 2: or they'd have you know, issues, it kind of sometimes
Speaker 2: bleeds into everyone else within the community, you know what
Speaker 2: I mean. We see that all the time. And I
Speaker 2: think when I started modeling, I don't again remember feeling
Speaker 2: that pressured about it. I think I just felt like
Speaker 2: incredibly painful in my own body in general, So it
Speaker 2: wasn't necessarily like kind of weight related. I think there's
Speaker 2: always been like parts of my body that I haven't
Speaker 2: like loved, you know what I mean, And I've had
Speaker 2: to grow to love.
Speaker 1: Are you the kind of person that can eat but
Speaker 1: not gain weight.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because I've always done lots and lots of sports.
Speaker 1: But were other models that you were with? What did
Speaker 1: you feel that to be a model you had to
Speaker 1: be a Yeah.
Speaker 2: I got weird with food for a period of time
Speaker 2: actually when I got sober, and they call it that transference,
Speaker 2: you know, I think I was just trying to control
Speaker 2: something else in my life. So I got a bit
Speaker 2: weird with food when I was about twenty two. I
Speaker 2: think it was just control, to be quite honest, And
Speaker 2: I think wait for me, you know, if I'm i
Speaker 2: selfer with anxiety, you know, and so when I'm anxious,
Speaker 2: it just falls off. Yeah, I'm not the type of
Speaker 2: person sometimes I am eating, but it literally just falls
Speaker 2: off all the time. So sometimes I haven't even been
Speaker 2: like aware of like dropping way. I think. I've always
Speaker 2: done a lot of exercise and a kind of now
Speaker 2: do pilates, So I used to build a lot of muscles.
Speaker 2: So my body has changed, like you know, over the
Speaker 2: course of like many years, I think, And so I
Speaker 2: think because I think when I got started modeling properly,
Speaker 2: I decided there was a part of me that had
Speaker 2: that to do it, to really kind of walk into
Speaker 2: it again, I had to take on. It was almost
Speaker 2: like a It wasn't necessarily that I felt like that,
Speaker 2: but I had to be like, this is who I am,
Speaker 2: do you know what I mean? Like take it or
Speaker 2: leave it, you know what I mean. I'm not gonna
Speaker 2: be sucked into this idea that I should be thinner
Speaker 2: or look a different sort of way for you to
Speaker 2: kind of appreciate me or want me. So I had
Speaker 2: to and that's not exactly how I felt all the time,
Speaker 2: but I had to sort of fake it to make
Speaker 2: it so it wasn't necessarily I think I've always I
Speaker 2: don't know. I was speaking on my own podcast about
Speaker 2: this the other day. I think I wonder if my
Speaker 2: relationship with myself will ever be what I wanted to be.
Speaker 2: Whilst I model, I don't know if I have a
Speaker 2: to a certain extent a healthy relationship with myself, but
Speaker 2: I wonder if my relationship with my body will ever
Speaker 2: be what I wanted to be as long as I'm
Speaker 2: kind of within the industry. And yes, it has changed
Speaker 2: like drastically, do you know what I mean? The likes
Speaker 2: of amazing people spearheading different sorts of movements. But you know,
Speaker 2: we only have to kind of look at certain photos
Speaker 2: or fashion shows and we see the kind of the
Speaker 2: pressure that's.
Speaker 1: Playing, and I almost find it painful. I haven't been
Speaker 1: to that many catwalk shows. I think it probably when
Speaker 1: you see, you know how and kind of serious and
Speaker 1: all that. You know, I know, it's there to just
Speaker 1: showcase the clothes, and so it's opening at a hanger,
Speaker 1: but there is something as a woman to see women
Speaker 1: doing their job is a little.
Speaker 2: Bit yeah, And also when you know that someone's like
Speaker 2: kind of unwell, yeah, whatever that looks like for different people.
Speaker 2: When you know someone's kind of suffering with and you know,
Speaker 2: disordered eating, but they are praised and celebrated within the
Speaker 2: industry and they work even more. It's that in itself
Speaker 2: is an uncomfortable thing to get your head around. I
Speaker 2: think that's where sometimes the pressure for me. Lies. It
Speaker 2: isn't I want to be onwell, it's just the fact
Speaker 2: that I see people doing well because of it, you
Speaker 2: know what I mean. And that's a that's that's a
Speaker 2: mad thing to get your head around, you know what
Speaker 2: I mean. And it's and I don't think that kind
Speaker 2: of breeds healthy ways of looking yourself. You know, if
Speaker 2: you're being told that you are better for being thin, and.
Speaker 1: I suppose the other you know, we haven't talked about
Speaker 1: We've talked about body image and modeling. We haven't talked
Speaker 1: about race. And I think that there is also the
Speaker 1: issue of what it was like to be or what
Speaker 1: it is like to be a woman of color in
Speaker 1: very What was it thanks to Edward? It's it's not
Speaker 1: so much and people like Edward, but how that affected you.
Speaker 2: I think that's something that I'm really delving into at
Speaker 2: the moment is how a lack of understanding about my
Speaker 2: own identity has really kind of hindered certain aspects of
Speaker 2: my growth, do you know what I mean? And having
Speaker 2: been brought up in a predominantly white space, that how
Speaker 2: that has affected me, How the things that I've tolerated,
Speaker 2: the things that I've kind of brushed off. And I
Speaker 2: think because of the resurgence of Black Lives Matter, the
Speaker 2: conversations that they were having it kind of it really
Speaker 2: kind of shook people's core. It wasn't that we were
Speaker 2: just talking about slavery something that happened, you know, years
Speaker 2: and years ago when people were I know, but for
Speaker 2: certain people, like they weren't around where they happened when
Speaker 2: that happened, so they were like, oh, I wasn't part
Speaker 2: of that. I mean I would, I didn't do anything
Speaker 2: like that. And I think Black Lives Matter kind of
Speaker 2: brought it, made it current and suddenly you were kind
Speaker 2: of they were speaking about things that you had to
Speaker 2: check yourself on and I had to suddenly was I
Speaker 2: think validated in a lot of experiences and feelings that
Speaker 2: I had surrounding my own race and how I'd had
Speaker 2: to kind of navigate certain situations. And also I think
Speaker 2: I was also my privilege. You know, we talk about
Speaker 2: colorism within the community as being someone who's like mixed
Speaker 2: race and lighter skin. The way that I was treated
Speaker 2: compared to my cousins who are you know who who
Speaker 2: were a lot darker skinned than me. You know, I
Speaker 2: think that's a conversation that we don't have enough either.
Speaker 2: But for me, I think it was great. You know,
Speaker 2: when Edward started doing what he was doing, what he
Speaker 2: does and continues to do and sets the bar so
Speaker 2: high continuously. I think for me it had always been
Speaker 2: unspoken how uncomfortable I'd felt in certain situations. It was
Speaker 2: almost that I didn't want to give it a name.
Speaker 2: It's like I felt that there were certain reasons why
Speaker 2: my career hadn't taken off. You know, when I'd started
Speaker 2: with certain people, you know, who look very different to me,
Speaker 2: I think I still was searching for something that was
Speaker 2: completely unattainable. Different hair, different body shape, you know, sometimes
Speaker 2: even like you know, different colored skin, you know, And
Speaker 2: so I think I didn't want to blame it on
Speaker 2: something like that. I was like, why, you know, I
Speaker 2: started at the same time as car I started at
Speaker 2: the same time as so many girls, and they kind
Speaker 2: of reached such great heights and I was like, why
Speaker 2: is that? Do you know what I mean? I think
Speaker 2: it was quite nice when Edward There was many things
Speaker 2: that were beautiful about it, but like having him come
Speaker 2: in and be like, we got to change that. This
Speaker 2: is what is going on, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Were you born here?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, born in London and your father's yeah gone
Speaker 2: in he was born in Akras.
Speaker 1: So going back was part of your childhood.
Speaker 2: Yeah, very much. So it was always something that we did.
Speaker 2: Sometimes my mum came and sometimes it was just the
Speaker 2: three of us, and I think it felt quite alien
Speaker 2: at that time. And as I grew older and kind
Speaker 2: of my career changed and obviously I became like a
Speaker 2: grown up, my relationship were gone to very much change.
Speaker 2: I felt like kind of instead of just the kind
Speaker 2: of traveler, someone who'd like been born in London and
Speaker 2: who'd come back to Ghana, I felt like they really
Speaker 2: claimed me, which was really like a kind of beautiful experience,
Speaker 2: you know. I think especially after the British Vogue cover,
Speaker 2: you know, it was like they call you a Brunei,
Speaker 2: which means like a kind of traveler. Because I'm obviously
Speaker 2: a little like paler skin than most gone ears. And
Speaker 2: I think after that I felt very much like kind
Speaker 2: of claimed by the people there, which was really really amazing.
Speaker 2: But I have the most amazing memories of Ghana. We
Speaker 2: always used to stay at my grandma and granddads. It's
Speaker 2: just a modest house next to a nursery, so there
Speaker 2: were always like kids playing outside. My grandma has always
Speaker 2: had a little kind of like corner shop, so we
Speaker 2: go in there get all like cold bottles of like
Speaker 2: coke and like biscuits. Then we'd sit there and watch
Speaker 2: her and my aunt Mary, all three of them and
Speaker 2: live together, so we watch them.
Speaker 1: Did you cook? Did she cook for you?
Speaker 2: Yeah? She cooked, and then she had a woman who
Speaker 2: also helped her comfort.
Speaker 1: What is gonna and food?
Speaker 2: Like, it's amazing. I mean, you've got the joll Off rice,
Speaker 2: You've got lots of different kind of fish, You've got
Speaker 2: food food, so it's like a kind of dough that
Speaker 2: you dip into a soup. The spice there is kind
Speaker 2: of like it's like an oily one. It's amazing.
Speaker 1: And chili, yeah, a lot of chili.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah yeah, really, spike yeah yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, did you go to the market.
Speaker 2: To the markets are mad mad, like insane, just like
Speaker 2: bustling food, clothes, people wandering around. It's like mental but amazing.
Speaker 1: And how long would you stay?
Speaker 2: We'd stay for like two weeks. I have some cousins
Speaker 2: who usually stay there a bit longer. Dad and my
Speaker 2: sister there this year. My dad goes back all the
Speaker 2: time all the time. My granddad's not alive anymore. My
Speaker 2: aunt Mary, she's not alive anymore, but my grandma very
Speaker 2: much still there and my aunt Tina lives with her.
Speaker 2: So yeah, thats what.
Speaker 1: Was it like growing up in your house? You have
Speaker 1: memories of meals, you know, for cooked.
Speaker 2: My house has always been a place that is kind
Speaker 2: of people are in and out at all times, you know,
Speaker 2: I very much grew up with Maybe it was someone
Speaker 2: who had to move in for a bit, you know,
Speaker 2: my godfather would move in, or someone in you know,
Speaker 2: distress would be upstairs living in the upstairs room. There
Speaker 2: were always parties and dinner parties and lots of different
Speaker 2: people kind of in and out of the house. You know.
Speaker 2: My mum has always been like an entertainer, my dad
Speaker 2: as well. The home has always been one that kind
Speaker 2: of it feels like sacred, but they're not precious about it.
Speaker 2: You know, a place that people want to Geah, the
Speaker 2: carpets are rolled up when a party happens. But you know,
Speaker 2: they've never been kind of like prim and Popper, prim
Speaker 2: and proper about their their places.
Speaker 1: But were you kids part of it? Yeah, you kind of.
Speaker 1: You weren't sitting on the steps watching the party. We
Speaker 1: were down there.
Speaker 2: We do like things like co check yeah yeah, and
Speaker 2: we like charge everyone money and then they find all
Speaker 2: their coats just piled off on one bed, pretending like
Speaker 2: we'd organized them. Or we'd be like sat on the
Speaker 2: staircase watching everyone get up to whatever mischief they were
Speaker 2: getting up to. And then later on we were just
Speaker 2: joining in.
Speaker 1: Would you go out a lot? Would you go out? Yeah?
Speaker 2: We do such amazing things, you know what. That's the
Speaker 2: thing about growing up in London is like, I mean,
Speaker 2: I wouldn't want to bring my children out anywhere else.
Speaker 2: I loved it. Galleries and restaurants and they took us everywhere.
Speaker 2: It was never about separation. It was like you want
Speaker 2: to sit with the grown ups. You learn how to
Speaker 2: sit with the grown ups. You you know, learn how
Speaker 2: to converse and listen and talk to whoever might be
Speaker 2: next to you or in front of you. But it
Speaker 2: was never like my parents were never into the idea
Speaker 2: of like putting you on the kids stay. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 2: if we were younger, it was like come out, enjoy yourself.
Speaker 2: When you get tired, just sleep under the table, do
Speaker 2: you know what I mean? And then we'll go out.
Speaker 1: And then you went to the boarding school. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: what was that like? The food yeah, horrible, horrible? And Milfields?
Speaker 2: Was it?
Speaker 1: Millfield? Yeah, be rather proud of it. It was.
Speaker 2: You know what, maybe this is my snobby side. I'm
Speaker 2: not great with a buffet. I think school kind of
Speaker 2: like traumatized me from that. I mean some days it
Speaker 2: would be good, like the salad station was like banging,
Speaker 2: like that was good. But to be quite honest, I
Speaker 2: lived off dominoes for like five years. No, you weren't.
Speaker 2: We weren't allowed, but we'd like sneak it in and
Speaker 2: then in prep we'd like run out and get the
Speaker 2: pizza and like bring it back in and all share it.
Speaker 2: On Fridays we were allowed like to order in Indian
Speaker 2: or a Chinese Yeah.
Speaker 1: Interesting, So that must have been quite shocking to go
Speaker 1: from a house that was full of people and friends
Speaker 1: and good food.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it was also. I mean there were
Speaker 2: certain days where it was good. Chinese day, wasn't that bad? Indianigh,
Speaker 2: it wasn't that bad.
Speaker 1: How old were you thirteen to eighteen five years? Yeah? Yeah,
Speaker 1: then you'd come back weekends or would youday?
Speaker 2: Well, you were only allowed what do they call it?
Speaker 2: I can't remember what they used to call xia. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you were only allowed a certain amount of x yats.
Speaker 2: But I had the best house mistress on the face
Speaker 2: of the planet, missus Orton, and she I was really homesick. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean I kind of got over it, but it
Speaker 2: wasn't my favorite of years being at that school. I
Speaker 2: had some great friends, but I was just desperate to
Speaker 2: come back to London.
Speaker 1: Then from Millfield you went to university, went to what
Speaker 1: was that like, Brunell?
Speaker 2: Yeah, where is Brunel? That's an Oxbridge. I mean I
Speaker 2: tried to get into Goldsmith's. I've failed my English exam.
Speaker 2: I can't remember which one it was. Because you realize
Speaker 2: that it really doesn't matter, I mean, try your best,
Speaker 2: do all the things for the list.
Speaker 1: Here we're here with a friend of mine's daughter and
Speaker 1: the Hedgehead executive chef's daughter Pearl. Helena Pearl joined us
Speaker 1: today because she's a fifteen year old aspiring actor. She's
Speaker 1: an enormous admirer of your work and so.
Speaker 2: There.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and so we were talking about whether university matters.
Speaker 1: So what was that like?
Speaker 2: Obviously wanted to save money, so lived at home.
Speaker 1: We have.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I had the best time because I think it
Speaker 2: was just I was back home. I was back in London.
Speaker 2: I was back. It was more it was predominantly I mean,
Speaker 2: Millfield was very kind of like intersectional do I mean
Speaker 2: in many ways, but it was predominantly white. And I
Speaker 2: think coming back to London, it wasn't just the kind
Speaker 2: of necessarily race. It was also a boiling pot of
Speaker 2: people who've grown up differently, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2: It was like I'd grown up completely different to a
Speaker 2: lot of the people in my kind of class. But
Speaker 2: I was I just felt I felt like that was
Speaker 2: just more me. I just wanted to be amongst that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So living at home, did it come back? Did
Speaker 1: it feel like before you went to.
Speaker 2: It was very weird. I wouldn't say it was a
Speaker 2: great time for my mine and my parents' relationship. I think,
Speaker 2: you know, I think they thought sending me to Boiling
Speaker 2: School there would be more rules. But actually, when someone
Speaker 2: doesn't know you, like a teacher, you can get around them.
Speaker 2: Do I mean, like, actually, you've kind of weirdly got
Speaker 2: more space to Rome and so coming back to London,
Speaker 2: obviously there were certain rules. But I think if I
Speaker 2: was honest and I've you know, I've spoken to about
Speaker 2: this anyway, I think coming back home after five years,
Speaker 2: I was a bit like, you can't really tell me
Speaker 2: what to do, do you know what I mean? Like,
Speaker 2: we haven't lived together for five years, so I think
Speaker 2: that dynamic was quite hard on our relationship. I think
Speaker 2: I probably regressed. I think I wasn't used to the
Speaker 2: fact that I was back living under their roof, and
Speaker 2: I was like very much a different person.
Speaker 1: I remember once saying to my father. I might have
Speaker 1: said this one before, saying to my father when I
Speaker 1: was thirty or twenty eight or whatever, and I've been
Speaker 1: living in London and working, and my parents lived in
Speaker 1: the upstate New York and would start and I once
Speaker 1: went home and I was said to my dad, Oh,
Speaker 1: I'm going to leave the baby and going to New
Speaker 1: York tomorrow. And he said, I don't think you should
Speaker 1: do that. And I said, you know what, I live
Speaker 1: in London and I work and I don't have to
Speaker 1: ask anybody's you know, nice way said provision. But it's
Speaker 1: interesting that when you know, I go home, I don't
Speaker 1: know whether I'm a child or I'm an adult. And
Speaker 1: he said, I'll make it really easy for you with
Speaker 1: you the minute you walk in that door, you're a child.
Speaker 1: And it was actually quite nice because I thought, that's
Speaker 1: kind of why I like going home, you know, is
Speaker 1: it suddenly somebody's saying, you know, no one you stay
Speaker 1: here or whatever. It was just interesting.
Speaker 2: It's like a dance, isn't it. You have to learn
Speaker 2: how to live with each other again.
Speaker 1: The River Cafe Cafe are all day space and just
Speaker 1: steps away from the restaurant. Is now open in the
Speaker 1: morning an Italian breakfast with cornetti, chiambella and cristata from
Speaker 1: our pastry kitchen. In the afternoon, ice creamed coops and
Speaker 1: River Cafe classic desserts. We have sharing plates Salumi, misty mozzarella, brisqueto,
Speaker 1: red and yellow peppers for Tello, tonato and more. Come
Speaker 1: in the evening for cocktails with our resident pianist in
Speaker 1: the bar. No need to book. See you here when
Speaker 1: you went to Brune. What were you think of majoring?
Speaker 1: What was your theata?
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's why I finished, That's why I majored it.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Did you eat out a lot? Did you party?
Speaker 2: Did you? Yeah? I went out all the time, all
Speaker 2: the time. I mean we were so here was this?
Speaker 2: I was eighteen.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we were born in nineteen nineteen ninety two. Yeah.
Speaker 2: So what did I finish school twenty ten? Yeah? Yeah,
Speaker 2: we had the best time. I worked as soon as
Speaker 2: I kind of finished school, mardeling. There were bits and modeling,
Speaker 2: but it wasn't there was like a different time, do
Speaker 2: you know what I mean? So I worked in the shop,
Speaker 2: I worked as a nanny. But we were so we
Speaker 2: had so much fun, do you know what I mean?
Speaker 2: We was like I don't know how it is for you, Pearl,
Speaker 2: but we just we were so carefree and mad and
Speaker 2: doing our thing and we yeah, and we all pile
Speaker 2: our money. Yeah, I mean just but I just mean
Speaker 2: being young, do you know what I mean? It's like
Speaker 2: we weren't bothered about kind of what clothes we were
Speaker 2: wearing or anything like that. We didn't have the pressure
Speaker 2: of like social media or anything like that. It was
Speaker 2: just about being in a gang, do you know what
Speaker 2: I mean, and roaming the streets and.
Speaker 1: Most was it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, mostly I've always been a girls girl. And we'd
Speaker 2: all put our money together and like share one meal,
Speaker 2: like poor restaurants where we'd just sit for hours and
Speaker 2: hours and hours outside kind of coffee shop, sharing one
Speaker 2: coffee between like five of us, and they're like, can
Speaker 2: you leave? If you're not going to buy anything, can
Speaker 2: you leave? Or we'd go to like kind of my
Speaker 2: friend Josh Delissa, who might as well be my brother,
Speaker 2: he had a restaurant called Boomberger. We'd go in there
Speaker 2: get cheap prices. We had some Mexican restaurants around the area,
Speaker 2: and we'd all put our money together to share like
Speaker 2: kind of one plate of food. Because I mean we
Speaker 2: were quite naughty. We were spending our money on like alcohol,
Speaker 2: going out, so we didn't really have a massive interest
Speaker 2: in spending our money on food.
Speaker 1: So modeling, when did that happen? I mean, how did
Speaker 1: that happen?
Speaker 2: I mean I've been modeling on and off since I
Speaker 2: was probably since I left school. So since I was
Speaker 2: eighteen now, I did a few bits and pieces like before,
Speaker 2: but my mom was very strict about and my dad
Speaker 2: as well about finishing school. Modeling kind of took quite
Speaker 2: a long time to kind of take off. So that's
Speaker 2: why I kind of worked.
Speaker 1: Did you enjoy it?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think I've learned to like it more. I
Speaker 2: learned to like it when I it's cheesy. Is this
Speaker 2: sounds when I started to like myself, to be quite honest,
Speaker 2: you know, I mean, that's when it became more fun.
Speaker 2: And yes, there are days when I'm on my period
Speaker 2: or I'm a bit exhausted, when I'm like, this is
Speaker 2: literally the last thing I want to do, you know
Speaker 2: what I mean. There's be like kind of showcased in
Speaker 2: front of a bunch of people, and then kind of
Speaker 2: it's like Instagram have to kind of and then I
Speaker 2: start picking apart my kind of who I am, you
Speaker 2: know what I mean, face value, not who I am
Speaker 2: as a person actually, But I can ask questions what
Speaker 2: made you want to do a podcast? I think it
Speaker 2: goes back to this this idea of storytelling, I think,
Speaker 2: and the information out there on what lived experience does
Speaker 2: in regards to stigma reduction and suicide reduction, and so
Speaker 2: I couldn't think of a better place. There's something about
Speaker 2: an honest conversation and honest chat. Yeah, there's so much
Speaker 2: like intimacy within that and to just listen to some
Speaker 2: And I think it really was that it's like to
Speaker 2: talk to someone, to hear their side of a story,
Speaker 2: to hear where they've come from and where they're at
Speaker 2: and where they hope to be. I think that's definitely
Speaker 2: the essence of having the podcast, is that idea that
Speaker 2: when we hear someone else's story, we're going to feel
Speaker 2: less alone.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so you will be talking about Girls Talk. Tell
Speaker 1: me when the next series that you're so excited about
Speaker 1: is coming out?
Speaker 2: So podcast, I'd say, just keep a lookout. It will
Speaker 2: be towards the end of the year. Keep a lookout
Speaker 2: for September. How do we look for it? Yeah, so
Speaker 2: just our Instagram handles Girls Talk and My Girls Talk,
Speaker 2: gu are Ls Talk.
Speaker 1: Do you listen to Girls Talk?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 4: I but to you, like, I love listening to things
Speaker 4: that say, like you know, I lovely things. It's just like, yeah,
Speaker 4: that so should be said, that should be spoken about more,
Speaker 4: you know what I mean? People sphere of speaking out
Speaker 4: stops them from strengths like saying the truth, you know,
Speaker 4: as I really like about it, you know, like speaking
Speaker 4: about grievouses or trauma or like mental health, like all
Speaker 4: those type of things are just not talked about enough.
Speaker 2: And I think I can't wait for the new season
Speaker 2: to come out. I feel more grown up and even
Speaker 2: more opinionated and even more confident. I find, and I
Speaker 2: don't know if this is because of social media or
Speaker 2: cancel culture, that sometimes we're quite agreeable with each other,
Speaker 2: and I want to have conversations that aren't always with
Speaker 2: people that I agree with. I want to also learn
Speaker 2: about things that I have no idea about, and I
Speaker 2: want to sometimes have those uncomfortable conversations where I'm not
Speaker 2: only kind of not necessarily agreeing with the other person,
Speaker 2: but I'm also being checked about what I don't know
Speaker 2: and the ways that I think about things. Do you
Speaker 2: know what I mean? And so we've kind of changed
Speaker 2: that and it's going to be really cool. We've got
Speaker 2: some megapeople on the podcast.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I love hearing people's stories, you know. I love meeting people,
Speaker 2: you know who I like different backgrounds exactly.
Speaker 1: Everybody comes in with a story. Look around it. I've
Speaker 1: had people come in and say, ah, you know, look
Speaker 1: at how this fabulous restaurant and I've had such a
Speaker 1: hard time lately, And like if you went to every table,
Speaker 1: everybody would have a story a story about Yeah. But
Speaker 1: you know people, you know, we all think that you
Speaker 1: see all these people and their lives are perfect, and
Speaker 1: then you find out one that's just been divorced, or
Speaker 1: they've had a kid with addiction, or they have everybody.
Speaker 2: Has a story.
Speaker 1: And so those smiling, happy faces, whether you see them
Speaker 1: on Instagram or hear you know that that everybody has
Speaker 1: a story. And as you say, I love walking around
Speaker 1: and just hearing a bit of the story saying hello.
Speaker 1: Do you think peril that? Do you think that's when?
Speaker 1: When Daware talked about social media pressure, do you think
Speaker 1: that exists now a lot?
Speaker 4: I think, especially hearing about what you were saying about
Speaker 4: how when you were a kids and used to like
Speaker 4: it's to be much different to its now because you
Speaker 4: have social media. I think ever really affects more how
Speaker 4: people look at themselves because your Instagram and you've got TikTok,
Speaker 4: and you've got all these things, and if you don't
Speaker 4: have it, you're like not in with the times. But
Speaker 4: if you do, then you're just making yourself feel worse
Speaker 4: by yourself. But you can't be like like for example,
Speaker 4: and people are like, oh, I don't want social media.
Speaker 1: It's bad.
Speaker 2: People are down.
Speaker 1: On you for it.
Speaker 4: But maality, it's much better if you didn't have it,
Speaker 4: Like for you're probably happier in those times than that
Speaker 4: kids are now, oh one.
Speaker 2: Hundred percent, because it's there's one thing, you know, getting
Speaker 2: to know yourself and figuring out who you are over
Speaker 2: those like thirteen to eighteen and then onwards, do you
Speaker 2: know what I mean? It was like such a confusing
Speaker 2: time and that that's already like you know, I was
Speaker 2: talking to these girls the other day, like thirteen to fourteen,
Speaker 2: and that was a question like what would you say
Speaker 2: to your younger self? And I would be like, I
Speaker 2: used to scrutinize every single thing I did, the shoes
Speaker 2: I wore, the way I wore my eyeliner, the way
Speaker 2: my hair was, the way I carried my bag, the
Speaker 2: way I walked, you know what I mean. I was
Speaker 2: like always on my case about every single movement. And
Speaker 2: I think I would tell everyone that you don't need
Speaker 2: to do that. I wish I'd stop putting so much
Speaker 2: pressure on myself because you realize when your world gets
Speaker 2: bigger than none of them truly matters, do you know
Speaker 2: what I mean? And I think to add in the
Speaker 2: pressure of having to kind of be perceived by other people,
Speaker 2: it's like I already was kind of self conscious, so
Speaker 2: to then have to kind of portray a person that
Speaker 2: I maybe wasn't hadn't become yet, do you know. I
Speaker 2: mean something that was maybe just kind of performative would
Speaker 2: have been like an added pressure at that time.
Speaker 1: And you know what happens at any age, you know,
Speaker 1: I can, you know, for talking women's My husband died
Speaker 1: a year and a half ago, and sometimes I just
Speaker 1: look on Instagram and go, you know, another happy family,
Speaker 1: you know, and the beach resorder, another grandparents with their grandear.
Speaker 1: I mean, I have that life, but you know, it's
Speaker 1: very You can look at it in terms of whether
Speaker 1: you're thin enough, whether you're you know, whether your hair
Speaker 1: is as beautiful, whether you're a certain type with the
Speaker 1: clothes you're wearing, the way you carry a handbag, or
Speaker 1: you can look at it families and you can see
Speaker 1: you know, it just feels that there's I really I
Speaker 1: never post from a vacation. I really knew that a
Speaker 1: long time. But there's nothing worse than a day like
Speaker 1: today working and then you see somebody on there you know.
Speaker 2: It's I do it.
Speaker 1: There's a Is it acting what you wanted to do
Speaker 1: when you went to Brunel?
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what. From thirteen until eighteen, I did that
Speaker 2: at school and then I went on to study that
Speaker 2: at Brunel and then kind of life took a different direction,
Speaker 2: not only kind of personally, and then it became something
Speaker 2: you know, then I kind of fell into modeling and
Speaker 2: that started taking over. So I kind of jumped on
Speaker 2: that bandwagon and that led me to where I am now.
Speaker 2: And then I think just before COVID, I made a
Speaker 2: kind of decision that I wanted to give it another go,
Speaker 2: you know, I wanted to put one in it and
Speaker 2: see where it would take me, because I think when
Speaker 2: I first left university had a different head of my
Speaker 2: shoulders and my priorities were warped and I wasn't a
Speaker 2: very happy person. So I didn't, you know, have the
Speaker 2: the capability to give it one hundred percent. So that's
Speaker 2: where I'm at now, I'm I'm on that journey and
Speaker 2: I absolutely love it. It's just ridiculously hard. Respect to Allah.
Speaker 2: I would love to do theater one day, but at
Speaker 2: the moment it's it's TV infel. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And now you're living in your own apartment. How is that? Oh?
Speaker 2: It's really nice.
Speaker 1: Do you have an open kitchen as well? What's it like?
Speaker 2: Kitchen? It's my kitchen's yellow, blue and white tiles, I mean,
Speaker 2: describe it. It's very much open, and I've got an
Speaker 2: island in the middle that has like a kind of
Speaker 2: heart boner engraved in it that my friend Jeff did.
Speaker 2: It's got a massive, big, like kind of teak table
Speaker 2: with matching chairs that I've polstered in like leopard brint.
Speaker 1: How you like your parents? Do you like people coming
Speaker 1: to you instead of you going to that?
Speaker 2: Yeah? I love it. I mean I think to a
Speaker 2: certain extent. I grew up in an African household, so
Speaker 2: the idea that we were going to spend the night
Speaker 2: at other people's houses was like something that was like
Speaker 2: my dad just did not understand. He's like, you have
Speaker 2: a bed, you have a house, Like, why do you
Speaker 2: need to go and stay at someone else's house. There
Speaker 2: were certain people that we went to, but like eating
Speaker 2: at home and sleeping at home has always been like
Speaker 2: a kind of a priority with a house, you know,
Speaker 2: I was talking to Pearl about it. Actually, I mean
Speaker 2: I actually eat in a lot. I now spend a
Speaker 2: lot of time between London and la And when I
Speaker 2: was working before COVID, I didn't really have the time
Speaker 2: to cook. It wasn't necessarily a priority of mine. So
Speaker 2: I used to order a lot of takeaway. And I
Speaker 2: think after COVID, I started really prioritizing what was important,
Speaker 2: so I did have more time. And so my boyfriend's
Speaker 2: are really good cook My sister lives with me and
Speaker 2: she's an amazing cook. I like cooking if it's like
Speaker 2: family or people who are really close to me. I
Speaker 2: don't feel the pressure. I'm not the idea of cooking
Speaker 2: for like ten people or something that doesn't excite me.
Speaker 2: If I'm cooking for myself, it's like simple things like
Speaker 2: fish and vegetables or eggs, soup, you know, stuff like that.
Speaker 2: No I don't eat eat No, No, I haven't eaten.
Speaker 2: You're not weirdly, I've started like I think I've just
Speaker 2: been listening to my body a bit more, and so
Speaker 2: like if it's the time of the month or something
Speaker 2: like that, I'm like, oh, I kind of really feel
Speaker 2: like some met and I've never had that before. So
Speaker 2: I kind of am listening to my body a bit more.
Speaker 2: But it's still very much like kind of in when
Speaker 2: I'm cooking at home, especially in LA. We have like
Speaker 2: a tiny, tiny kitchen, so we're not gonna cook fish
Speaker 2: because it would just make the whole house smile, like
Speaker 2: fish the little flat we have. So we cook a
Speaker 2: lot of vegetarian stuff in LA, and then at home,
Speaker 2: you know, I have more space and so we cook
Speaker 2: lots of different things and have people around. I wish
Speaker 2: I I've grown up in a household full of amazing cooks.
Speaker 2: My cousin's amazing cook, my aunt and my uncle everyone.
Speaker 2: You know, they have recipes that were handwritten by my
Speaker 2: grandma about certain things. Yeah. That and I think I
Speaker 2: remember my mum always say my mom's mom. Yeah, I
Speaker 2: always remember my mom, Like I mean, there were there
Speaker 2: are many things that were kind of sad when her
Speaker 2: mom died. But I think she always thinks about, you know,
Speaker 2: when she needs on on certain recipes. She always thinks
Speaker 2: about the idea of calling my grandma, and my dad
Speaker 2: is an amazing cook as well, and so I should
Speaker 2: be more interested in it.
Speaker 1: Well, i'm the cleaner.
Speaker 2: I'm the cleaner.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's fine. I think everybody figures out I do
Speaker 1: the dishes.
Speaker 2: Well, that's fine.
Speaker 1: Do you remember when it became possible for you to
Speaker 1: go out to you to not think about how much
Speaker 1: it cost.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a really good question, I think. So I
Speaker 2: moved twenty seventeen. I moved to LA when I got sober,
Speaker 2: But I don't I wasn't eating out that much, to
Speaker 2: be quite honest, I didn't have the money I was.
Speaker 2: I'd kind of taken a year off and my mum
Speaker 2: and dad were supporting me for the first time in
Speaker 2: a long time, which I found like kind of incredibly uncomfortable.
Speaker 2: So I kind of was under certain budget, do you
Speaker 2: know what I mean? And I think probably maybe when
Speaker 2: I really could just like go to the restaurants and
Speaker 2: come here and like pay for myself. I probably was
Speaker 2: about twenty five.
Speaker 1: Had come from modeling or to acting.
Speaker 2: Or yeah, modeling, Yeah, yeah, that was a big change. Yeah,
Speaker 2: moving to New York. So I moved to New York
Speaker 2: when I was twenty four, had my twenty fifth birthday
Speaker 2: in New York, and that's probably when it started to change.
Speaker 2: You know, that's when I could like order a takeaway
Speaker 2: or like go to this restaurant called Lucy n and
Speaker 2: like or get my friend a meal or pay.
Speaker 1: You're not alone in that, you know that. It was
Speaker 1: something that I was talk When I talked to David Beckham,
Speaker 1: he said he remembered when he took Victoria and they
Speaker 1: could actually you know, I have to completely look at
Speaker 1: the prices on the right hand side. Or Paul McCartney
Speaker 1: saying that he thought wine was a horrible drink because
Speaker 1: he could only afford the cheapest, cheapest, cheapest wine because
Speaker 1: we know it's pretty. Wine was a horrible drink until
Speaker 1: he went out with Brian you know Epstein, who was
Speaker 1: his manager, and they ordered a fantastic puddle of the
Speaker 1: feet and oh that's what wine is.
Speaker 2: The main thing is is I've never tried a good
Speaker 2: glass of wine. Well never, yeah, no, But but I
Speaker 2: got sober when I was twenty. I got sober when
Speaker 2: I was twenty two, so I wasn't like spending the
Speaker 2: money and like we were going to the corner shop
Speaker 2: and getting like a Casaillio dabble, you know what I mean,
Speaker 2: and like a cheap bottle of tequila with a hat
Speaker 2: on it.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: So, and so I've never actually, you know, I've never
Speaker 2: had a like stunning cocktail. I've never had a like
Speaker 2: beautiful glass of wine. And it's fine, but it is
Speaker 2: mad to think that I've never actually because and to
Speaker 2: be honest, like that's why I could probably like go
Speaker 2: and eat out, do you know. I mean, I've never
Speaker 2: had the expense of having to kind of buy alcohol.
Speaker 1: And I suppose you know, for me, that is you know,
Speaker 1: we all have reasons why we eat the food we eat.
Speaker 1: Food can be something you have when you're hungry, could
Speaker 1: be something that you have when you want to cook
Speaker 1: or you want to entertain. It can be food can
Speaker 1: be alleviation of pain or sadness. So I suppose that
Speaker 1: my last question to you is what would you turn
Speaker 1: to if you needed food for comfort?
Speaker 2: I go home, definitely. I don't know if it's anything
Speaker 2: in particular. I think it would just be something cooked
Speaker 2: by my mom and dad. Anything that was put in
Speaker 2: front of me would feel comforting.
Speaker 1: That's beautiful and a beautiful wait to end a wonderful
Speaker 1: thank you. I love you, I love you. Yeah, we
Speaker 1: love you. Pl. Thanks, thank you, Thank you for listening
Speaker 1: to Ruthie's Table four in partnership with Montclair eight