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Speaker 1: Family Secrets is a production of I Heart Radio. I'm

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Speaker 1: Danny Shapiro and this is part two of my special

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Speaker 1: bonus episode Conversation with Alicia Keys. I hope you enjoy

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Speaker 1: it as much as I did. We'll be back with

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Speaker 1: a brand new season of Family Secrets in October. You're

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Speaker 1: right about going to see Oprah to ask her her advice. Um,

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Speaker 1: we're kind of at a cross roads. And what comes

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Speaker 1: out of that conversation with Oprah is this whole idea

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Speaker 1: of the resounding yes, you know, like that's and that feeling.

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Speaker 1: And I think everyone can relate to this if we

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Speaker 1: get quiet enough to actually pay it tension to that

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Speaker 1: still inner voice, which you know, Look, you and I

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Speaker 1: are having this conversation at a time where there's these

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Speaker 1: reckonings upon reckonings going on all over the globe and

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Speaker 1: people are in a way have been forced to become

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Speaker 1: more introspective, whether we like it or not, and to

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Speaker 1: face ourselves and to be in this slowed down state

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Speaker 1: that we didn't choose. It's not like we all decided

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Speaker 1: to go off on a retreat. It's like it it

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Speaker 1: came to us. And you talk about this resounding yes

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Speaker 1: and it's also kind of in the context of getting

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Speaker 1: quiet enough to hear it, giving yourself the space and

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Speaker 1: the time, something that you've been super deliberate about doing.

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Speaker 1: I think it seems for a long time of implementing

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Speaker 1: that space of quiet in your life. Can you talk

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Speaker 1: a little bit about that. Oh my goodness, the resounding

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Speaker 1: yes moment was definitely a huge, huge, huge turning point

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Speaker 1: to me for me and um when I when I

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Speaker 1: went to you know, when I went to sit down

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Speaker 1: with Oprah and speak with her, I was talking about

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Speaker 1: there is a big transition happening in my life. Again.

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Speaker 1: It was right on the heels of what I just

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Speaker 1: described to this album called Here, where I was really

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Speaker 1: starting to recognize who I did not want to be anymore,

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Speaker 1: and I was starting to let go of a lot

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Speaker 1: of relationships, business relationships, the personal relationships that I had

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Speaker 1: used to define me or to as used as crutches.

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Speaker 1: Thinking that I could not, um do what I was

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Speaker 1: doing without these people, that these people kind of made

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Speaker 1: me who I was or who I am or whatever.

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Speaker 1: I kind of decided that or they helped me decide

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Speaker 1: because they benefited them for sure, whatever the case was,

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Speaker 1: And I just didn't know what to do because I

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Speaker 1: had this feeling that I just couldn't find the right partnership.

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Speaker 1: I couldn't find the right people to to help me

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Speaker 1: go to the next place and to continue on my

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Speaker 1: journey in a way that was even more meaningful and

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Speaker 1: and and more powerful. And and so I would I

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Speaker 1: just I I finally she invited me to something special,

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Speaker 1: and I thought, oh, how great would this be to

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Speaker 1: just ask her advice about this? Because that's another thing

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Speaker 1: I think we probably don't do enough. I definitely don't

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Speaker 1: often where more now I'm getting better now where to

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Speaker 1: reach out to people that may everybody can't reach out

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Speaker 1: to Oprah. I'm not trying to say that that we

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Speaker 1: all end. I'm surprised that I can't trust me, um,

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Speaker 1: but the but there are people in our lives that

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Speaker 1: have great experiences, and a lot of the time we

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Speaker 1: won't reach out to them because we don't want to

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Speaker 1: bother them. I looked at probably so busy, or look,

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Speaker 1: they're already dealing with all of this, man, they probably

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Speaker 1: how would they know? Or we feel embarrassed that we

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Speaker 1: don't know, or whatever the case. And I think for

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Speaker 1: a lot of years that maybe didn't utilize my mentorship

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Speaker 1: or the people who could give me great advice the

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Speaker 1: way to the highest capacity because I didn't want to

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Speaker 1: be intrusive, or I didn't want to seem like I

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Speaker 1: didn't know, or a lot of my life I spent

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Speaker 1: pretending I knew more than I actually did, which we

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Speaker 1: probably all find ourselves in one way or another. So,

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Speaker 1: you know, finally when I had the courage to kind

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Speaker 1: of speak out this this this mentor who I knew

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Speaker 1: would have some thoughts about it, it really was a

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Speaker 1: powerful awakening because she was able to share how she

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Speaker 1: herself found herself in a position of of looking to

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Speaker 1: other people to always kind of come up with the

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Speaker 1: big ideas or assuming they would know better than her,

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Speaker 1: and until she finally realized that, you know, nobody knows

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Speaker 1: you more than you, just they just can't. They just

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Speaker 1: don't live with you, they're not close to you, they

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Speaker 1: don't know your heart like that. They don't even have

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Speaker 1: access to those places that you have access to, So

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Speaker 1: nobody knows you better than you and I and I

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Speaker 1: didn't really see it like that for so long, and

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Speaker 1: I always gave so much more credit to everybody else,

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Speaker 1: which was a part of that hiding thing that I

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Speaker 1: spoke about started to happen in the beginning, and a

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Speaker 1: part of this, uh you know, idea of maybe not

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Speaker 1: accepting the greatness that's within us. I think we do

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Speaker 1: that a lot, especially as women. You know, we're very

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Speaker 1: powerful beings. And I think that makes that scary to

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Speaker 1: the world. It's scary to ourselves, you know, to be

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Speaker 1: so you know, creative. I mean, by the nature of us,

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Speaker 1: we create, and so to to create anything out of

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Speaker 1: any circumstance, out of nothing is it's scary. And and

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Speaker 1: to embrace that's terrifying. And I also feel like that sometimes.

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Speaker 1: So when she shared that with me and and really understanding,

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Speaker 1: right how who could know better than me? Nobody could

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Speaker 1: know better than me? And to start to develop that

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Speaker 1: trust with yourself and a confidence in yourself almost the beginning.

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Speaker 1: But I still it's sound. I got it in theory,

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Speaker 1: but I still can't figure out how to like really

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Speaker 1: make it make sense. How do you actually make that

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Speaker 1: makes sense and do that in a tactic, tactful way.

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Speaker 1: And and and it wasn't until she said, because you

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Speaker 1: know what a resounding yes feels like, And I was like, oh, actually,

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Speaker 1: I do know what a resounding is still, Like, I

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Speaker 1: know when a thing is like I'm so excited to

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Speaker 1: do a thing or to go to a thing or

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Speaker 1: to talk to a person or whatever, and it's like

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Speaker 1: so strong, and I'm like, uh huh, I'm doing that

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Speaker 1: for sure without a doubt. And then I know the

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Speaker 1: one that's like I think I should do it because

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Speaker 1: it's the right thing, that right. Isn't that going to

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Speaker 1: make this happen? Whatever we do that convinces us to

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Speaker 1: do this. I know what that feels like too, And

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Speaker 1: that's not a resounding. It So when she said you

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Speaker 1: know what it resounding, it feels like I finally got it.

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Speaker 1: The resounding yes is something that that is actually applicable.

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Speaker 1: You know. It's like it's like a tool in your

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Speaker 1: toolbox that you can come back to again and again, like, Oh,

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Speaker 1: that's what that feels like. I know what that feels like.

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Speaker 1: And then conversely, that means I know what it feels

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Speaker 1: like when it's not the case yes, And so I

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Speaker 1: know when it's right for me because if a resounding

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Speaker 1: yet opposed to this deliberation that we all do, is

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Speaker 1: it right? Is it not right? Is it right? Is

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Speaker 1: it not right. You know right away that they resounding yes.

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Speaker 1: So that started to give me some clarity about how

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Speaker 1: I could start to make some decisions and some difficult decisions,

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Speaker 1: and and to be more in control of my compass,

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Speaker 1: you know where it was leading me, as opposed to

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Speaker 1: feeling so obligated to ask if anybody else or too,

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Speaker 1: you know, ask people with more experience, figuring that they

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Speaker 1: knew better, but they don't know better than you. You

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Speaker 1: know the best for you. You're the best student of yourself.

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Speaker 1: M M. I love that We'll be back in a

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Speaker 1: moment with more family secrets. There's just a couple more

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Speaker 1: things I'd love to talk to you about. And um,

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Speaker 1: you go on after your your two kids, your two

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Speaker 1: boys are born, and you are convinced. I think it's

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Speaker 1: about your friend Erica, who's such a great friend. Um,

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Speaker 1: to go on a meditation retreat and you know, like

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Speaker 1: any mom in that situation, I've been there myself. It's

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Speaker 1: like do I go? Do I not go? I can't go.

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Speaker 1: They're not going to survive without me. What will they eat?

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Speaker 1: You know, how how can they possibly? How can I

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Speaker 1: go do this thing? But you go and you and

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Speaker 1: you do you take the time and the space for yourself,

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Speaker 1: and it's a Cundalini yoga retreat, and it's like you

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Speaker 1: you find a spiritual practice that really really speaks to

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Speaker 1: you and resonates with you. Um, and then you talk

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Speaker 1: about the way that that creates quiet for you, and

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Speaker 1: you know, to connect the whole idea of that kind

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Speaker 1: of quiet too, when you can really hear the resounding yes,

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Speaker 1: or when you can really hear your deepest inner wisdom yes,

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Speaker 1: Oh my goodness. And I was so I truly I

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Speaker 1: was so disconnected to my own intuition so many ways,

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Speaker 1: and I never even thought of taking the time to

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Speaker 1: pour into myself or to even you know, dedicate X

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Speaker 1: amount of minutes a day to do that. I just

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Speaker 1: didn't know what that was. I hadn't had been exposed

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Speaker 1: to meditation before in a few different ways and breathing

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Speaker 1: and things like that, but I just didn't I just

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Speaker 1: didn't know exactly what to do with it or how

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Speaker 1: to make it part of my life style. And my

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Speaker 1: friend Erica, you know, she really did challenge me because

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Speaker 1: she told me about this retreat and she said, and

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Speaker 1: I'm making every excuse and the baby and I can't

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Speaker 1: be away. And at the time, I was like, right

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Speaker 1: around my husbin's birthday, I think I would have had

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Speaker 1: to come home right at the you know, right on

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Speaker 1: the day of his birthday, all these things that I

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Speaker 1: was using as excuses. And she asked me, when was

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Speaker 1: the last time you did anything for yourself? And I

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Speaker 1: I couldn't really answer her, and that, of course kind

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Speaker 1: of pushed me two, you know, pushed me to say

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Speaker 1: I have to do it, and so would. It introduced

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Speaker 1: me to really open me up to another logical and

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Speaker 1: an applicable way of connecting with spirit, of connecting with

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Speaker 1: my own internal compass and with my intuition, and just

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Speaker 1: the silence that I think it takes to start to

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Speaker 1: hear yourself, which you know I didn't do well before.

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Speaker 1: I didn't. I filled up every minute, I answered every request.

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Speaker 1: I tried to show up for every single person and things,

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Speaker 1: and and I never had I never knew how to

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Speaker 1: take that time to be silent and quiet with myself

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Speaker 1: for myself. And it really changed everything. And it did

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Speaker 1: help me to identify more clearly the resounding yeses and

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Speaker 1: and a nose and even the ones that were like I,

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Speaker 1: like maybes I was like, Okay, it was not a yes,

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Speaker 1: I still a no. And that's that's it. It's really

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Speaker 1: it's really been powerful and a challenge to always keep

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Speaker 1: up um, but something that I really believe in. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's it's making me think too, Like just circling back

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Speaker 1: to the beginning of our conversation about the the way

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Speaker 1: that these lessons, over the course of a life continue

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Speaker 1: to return and return to us um maybe always, maybe forever,

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Speaker 1: or maybe until we learn them. But even when we

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Speaker 1: learn them, we're still learning them anew. And you know,

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Speaker 1: towards the very end of of your your book, there's

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Speaker 1: this really beautiful passage and I won't read the whole thing,

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Speaker 1: but I'll just read the very beginning, which is the

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Speaker 1: path to self discovery is not a straight line. It's

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Speaker 1: a zig zag. We move in and out of awareness.

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Speaker 1: One step forwards, three steps to the left, a baby

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Speaker 1: step back, another leap forward. A lightbulb moment might shine

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Speaker 1: brightly one day but then flicker the next. It takes

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Speaker 1: work to hold tightly to a certain consciousness to live

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Speaker 1: in its wisdom every day. I have to intentionally maintain

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Speaker 1: an awareness of my value. I know I'm worthy, but

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Speaker 1: you don't cross over into the land of self worth

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Speaker 1: and just become a permanent resident. You have to keep

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Speaker 1: your passport current. I love that, I mean, And that's

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Speaker 1: what you're that's what you're describing there, with the meditation,

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Speaker 1: with the that deliberate you know, listening for the resounding. Yes,

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Speaker 1: it's like renewing. We all need to renew our passports

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Speaker 1: every day. Otherwise they really do just kind of sit

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Speaker 1: there in the drawer and we don't we don't learn,

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Speaker 1: and we don't grow. Yeah, oh my god, so much.

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Speaker 1: And it's just natural because you know, these things come

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Speaker 1: to us in so many different ways and from so

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Speaker 1: many different spaces, and and and and they're meant to

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Speaker 1: elevate us, and we we want to be elevated, and

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Speaker 1: we're ready to be elevated, and and and but it's tricky,

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Speaker 1: and definitely it's surely you have to keep reminding yourself,

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Speaker 1: and you have to keep telling yourself that you know.

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Speaker 1: So sometimes when I feel a little bit, a little bit,

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Speaker 1: you know, something's not going quite right, or maybe my

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Speaker 1: confidence is a little shaken over a particular this or that. Um,

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Speaker 1: there are times that I will literally say to myself,

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Speaker 1: you deserve this. You deserve this, You deserve this, you

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Speaker 1: deserve and I'll say it a billion times just to

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Speaker 1: remind myself that I deserve it. And you know, and

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Speaker 1: that's just naturally go through these places and have these

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Speaker 1: feelings where we're uncertain or it's a new place and

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Speaker 1: we don't know what to do in that place, or

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Speaker 1: you know, we're more comfortable in these other spaces because

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Speaker 1: we've been there before, and and and so this reminder

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Speaker 1: and this kind of constant reaching towards your higher you.

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Speaker 1: You know, um, you don't have to feel guilty about it.

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Speaker 1: And I think for a long time, I felt pretty

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Speaker 1: guilty about being great. I felt pretty guilty about, um,

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Speaker 1: you know, having opportunities that the people around me. I

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Speaker 1: I didn't see them having those same opportunities. And and

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Speaker 1: I wanted us all to have the same opportunities at

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Speaker 1: the same time and reach all of our dreams at

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Speaker 1: the same time. And and you know, everybody has their

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Speaker 1: own journey, and you don't have to feel guilty about yours. Um.

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Speaker 1: In fact, yours will likely inspire the next person. You know,

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Speaker 1: if you can just own it and own your your

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Speaker 1: wonder and your magnificence and your light and your connection

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Speaker 1: to you know, what your purpose is. So so I

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Speaker 1: agree this. You do have to keep kind of renewing

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Speaker 1: that passport. You have to keep in minding, and so

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Speaker 1: you do have to make sure those lessons you learned,

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Speaker 1: you didn't um, just learn it for that moment and

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Speaker 1: forget it, which I keep myself all the time, and

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Speaker 1: I find myself doing that, you know, then remember it

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Speaker 1: again and keep on going. So I think there's I

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Speaker 1: think there's really high heights to reach that we haven't

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Speaker 1: even realized yet. And I'm really excited it and I'm

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Speaker 1: looking forward to continuing to reach down. We'll be right back.

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Speaker 1: I have one last question for you. UM. Yeah, as

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Speaker 1: we're speaking, you know, during this time of reckoning. On

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Speaker 1: top of reckoning, you just released the single Perfect Way

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Speaker 1: to Die, which is chilling and magnificent. UM. I mean chilling,

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Speaker 1: like chills up and down my body listening to it.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure I'm far from alone, UM, And I'm just wondering,

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Speaker 1: as an artist, how do you respond in the moment

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Speaker 1: to the moment. I think it's something that artists so

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Speaker 1: often struggle with when we're in um, you know, a

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Speaker 1: steam in history or you know, we're really living through something, right, Um? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: how do I respond to it? Or how do I

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Speaker 1: choose to respond to it? I mean, I know this

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Speaker 1: is a song that you had written and hadn't released yet,

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Speaker 1: and in this moment it felt like time And that

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Speaker 1: makes so much sense. Why hadn't you released it before?

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Speaker 1: You know? And and what's the feeling creatively? You know,

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Speaker 1: I'm asking asking for a friend. Um, you know, what's

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Speaker 1: the feeling of being someone who makes art out of

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Speaker 1: life during a time when life is trembling? Mm hmm, wow, man,

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Speaker 1: I mean, we are all definitely in a new space

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Speaker 1: in so many ways. I mean, in so many ways.

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Speaker 1: We're in a really really repetitive space too that we

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Speaker 1: have witnessed, or some more than others witnessed over and

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Speaker 1: over again, time and time again. And the reason why

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Speaker 1: I call it a new space is because we, I

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Speaker 1: feel find are finding ourselves face to face with um,

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Speaker 1: the truth in a way that I don't know if

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Speaker 1: we've ever all had to look so glaringly and so

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Speaker 1: obviously and so clearly, and so it's just right in

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Speaker 1: front of us. Um, how much we are experiencing as

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Speaker 1: the collective and how much we are awakening as the collective,

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Speaker 1: and how much we're recognizing the inequality and the unfairness

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Speaker 1: that surrounds us, and how much we are all outraged

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Speaker 1: and invigorated too really learn more about it, speak up

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Speaker 1: more about it, be a part of the change of it,

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Speaker 1: the current of change, and and and figure out how

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Speaker 1: do we do that, How do we do that with

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Speaker 1: our kids? How are we doing that with each other?

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Speaker 1: How are we having reversations with our families? How are

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Speaker 1: we you know, how are we going out into the

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Speaker 1: world and and and expressing, you know, our intolerance with

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Speaker 1: hate and and racism and and this inequity overall. And

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Speaker 1: and so we're all in this new space to your

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Speaker 1: point of reckoning upon reckoning, I love how you've been

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Speaker 1: saying that. And we're just in this new space of

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Speaker 1: self reflection and uncovering and recognition and eye opening and

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Speaker 1: and it's it's uncomfortable, and it's scary, and it's crazy,

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Speaker 1: and and you so many of us just wish that

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Speaker 1: we could, you know, just erase all of the the

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Speaker 1: evils and the and the things that have been prevalent,

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Speaker 1: you know, in this country and in the world since

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Speaker 1: the beginning. Um but I think that there is also

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Speaker 1: this feeling of unity, and there's also this feeling of

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Speaker 1: having the hard conversation. It's the difficult conversations, and that's

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Speaker 1: great films of you know, of course, there's always going

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Speaker 1: to be every side, but I think we and for

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Speaker 1: me as an artist, I will truly, truly try and

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Speaker 1: want to focus on the part that can uplift us,

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Speaker 1: the part that can bring us to to a similar space,

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Speaker 1: to an equal ground, and to to touch us on

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Speaker 1: a level that is just visceral, because I think that's that,

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Speaker 1: to your point, that is the beauty of art. That's

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Speaker 1: why I'm so honored to be an artist that that

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Speaker 1: can speak to the moment, to the time, to the emotion,

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Speaker 1: to the feeling um because that's that's the part that

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Speaker 1: erases all the language barriers and all the different things

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Speaker 1: that try to make us feel separate from each other

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Speaker 1: and and and somehow we are all in one place

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Speaker 1: at one time with one feeling and and our eyes

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Speaker 1: are open. So I wrote this song Perfect Way to Die,

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Speaker 1: almost two years ago, and it was it was written

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Speaker 1: based off of what was happening with Mike Brown and

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Speaker 1: to mea rights and Trademon Martin and Sandra Blend and

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Speaker 1: so many other you know, just horrible murders of black people.

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Speaker 1: And I I knew that it would have its time

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Speaker 1: to come, and of course it could have been right then,

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Speaker 1: but it just felt like there was I was going

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Speaker 1: to hold onto it to find the right moment. And

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Speaker 1: I actually thought, after this project, Alicia have another project

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Speaker 1: that I'm sinalizing as well musically, and I thought it

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Speaker 1: would be on that one. But when I, you know,

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Speaker 1: realized and looked around and just as we all are

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Speaker 1: seeing everything and being a part of it and recognizing it,

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Speaker 1: it's just it was the words of everything we're feeling

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Speaker 1: right right right now, and and I was, I was

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Speaker 1: in awe and shocked that it almost felt like these

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Speaker 1: songs were written a while ago. Um, the last three

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Speaker 1: songs I've put out, I feel like they've been written

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Speaker 1: a while ago, but meant for this time. And and

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Speaker 1: so I just actually have been and also in a

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Speaker 1: state of just following, following and listening the listening of

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Speaker 1: it and and going with with that. UM, and I

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Speaker 1: think we're all in a place of deep listening. And

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Speaker 1: I and I really do believe that we're in a

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Speaker 1: place as deep awakening. Um, there's a you know, and

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Speaker 1: I think we're all discovering. So there's so much to

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Speaker 1: fight for, and there's so much that we have to

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Speaker 1: stand up for and stand up for each other for,

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Speaker 1: and and it's never going to change we don't all

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Speaker 1: recognize it and stand up for each other. So I

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Speaker 1: believe that we can see that happening. And I feel

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Speaker 1: like we're on the precipice of great change. And and

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Speaker 1: I know him an optimist, and I never want to

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Speaker 1: not be an optimist because we have to be and

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Speaker 1: and not only do we have to think it and

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Speaker 1: dream it and believe it, but we have to act

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Speaker 1: on it and not ignore it and be present. And

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Speaker 1: I believe we're doing it. M omen. Yeah, really, what

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Speaker 1: a privilege and a gift to have this conversation with you.

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Speaker 1: I really have just loved talking with you, and I'm

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Speaker 1: so excited to share it with so many people. Me

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Speaker 1: to have been really looking forward to this one, And

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Speaker 1: I really am so grateful for you too, and thank

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Speaker 1: you for taking the time to get into it and

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Speaker 1: sharing your perspective of it and bringing me into your

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Speaker 1: universe as well. And I'm really, really really blessed by

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Speaker 1: this conversation, so I can't wait to talk to you again.

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Speaker 1: Thanks me to Alicia, be well, Danny, you to take

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Speaker 1: care all right m HM. For more podcasts for My

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Speaker 1: Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

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Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.