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Speaker 1: The PAC twelve has officially canceled all sports until May one.

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Speaker 1: We all knew that this was gonna happen. No spring games,

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Speaker 1: That's what that means. The scheme is finally coming out

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Speaker 1: on HBO where the FBI was talking about looking into

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Speaker 1: the college basketball paper play scandal, which we have so

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Speaker 1: many thoughts about, and we have an interview with the director,

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Speaker 1: Pat Condolas. We have him uh Remy Martin. He turns

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Speaker 1: pro and Washington loses a legend. And finally the n

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Speaker 1: C Double A does the right thing, I mean sort of,

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Speaker 1: but they can still get it wrong. I'm George Rice

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Speaker 1: Stir with Ralph Amerson and this is the PAC twelve Apostles.

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Speaker 1: Thank you guys for listening to the PAC twelve Apostles.

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Speaker 1: We appreciate your time, appreciate your energy. Thank you for listening.

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Speaker 1: Please make sure that you share the share the feed,

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Speaker 1: tell a friend about the Pack twelve Apostles, and if

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Speaker 1: you want to contact us, you can hit us up

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Speaker 1: on Twitter at Ralph Ampston or at George Reis or

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Speaker 1: at Pack twelve Apostles, or you can send us an email.

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Speaker 1: I'm mad, I am m a d at Unafraid Show

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Speaker 1: dot com Ralph. The n C Double A finally did

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Speaker 1: the right thing. They granted seniors who played spring sports

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Speaker 1: like baseball, across, softball, track and field an extra year

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Speaker 1: of eligibility for next year. And this was the right

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Speaker 1: thing to do. However, the devil's always in the details.

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Speaker 1: So the schools don't have to offer the same amount

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Speaker 1: of aid to the kids as last year. It's up

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Speaker 1: to each individual school, so that brings up scholarship counts

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Speaker 1: and how they're gonna handle that. So the n C

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Speaker 1: Double they did the right thing, but they can still

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Speaker 1: screw it up. Where do you stand on this route?

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Speaker 1: They passed the buck. They passed the buck to the schools,

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Speaker 1: and to the schools can be the bad guy when

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Speaker 1: and and they never hesitate to do so when they

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Speaker 1: come in and say, hey, you know, we're paying a

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Speaker 1: third of your tuition if you want to stay now,

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Speaker 1: it's going to be an eighth as we got to

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Speaker 1: open that up for an incoming freshman. You know, they

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Speaker 1: could have bumped the allotted amount that that every team

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Speaker 1: was was allowed to do um, but they didn't, you know,

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Speaker 1: and they put it back in the hands of schools.

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Speaker 1: And some schools will do things the right way, and

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Speaker 1: I think they deserve praise for that. And uh and

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Speaker 1: some schools will will treat this very much like a

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Speaker 1: business the way that they always have and won't think

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Speaker 1: twice about it. And I think that you know, media

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Speaker 1: entities out there covering some of these things, if the

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Speaker 1: players are brave enough to speak up and speak out

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Speaker 1: on some of these things, then then I think the

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Speaker 1: programs should have to answer some questions about they're thinking

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Speaker 1: and what they're doing because these a lot of these,

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Speaker 1: not all of them, but a lot of them are

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Speaker 1: public institutions and the stuff that they're tossing around, you know,

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Speaker 1: is mixed in with some taxpayer money and uh and

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Speaker 1: and you know, schools are still subjected to FOI requests

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Speaker 1: and things like that, and they should be as forthcoming

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Speaker 1: as as possible about some of the stuff that they're doing.

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Speaker 1: And why hopefully we can just you know, rely on

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Speaker 1: the humanity of some of the folks involved here and

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Speaker 1: you know, they go about doing the right thing. But

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Speaker 1: I will say that if someone just is in a

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Speaker 1: Mattelineer situation where they just have ballroom dancing, then then

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Speaker 1: maybe they don't need a full ride. Uh So, hopefully

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Speaker 1: people's needs are being met, because that's really what this

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Speaker 1: is about. If you're gonna go this far out onto

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Speaker 1: a limb for people, you should make sure that you

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Speaker 1: you go out on that limb to make sure their

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Speaker 1: needs are met. You don't go out there on that

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Speaker 1: limb for the for the good publicity that's involved with it,

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Speaker 1: because they're hopefully they're will be no good publicity if

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Speaker 1: this just ends up being another uh instance of this

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Speaker 1: is a business. Except for the people who are on

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Speaker 1: the business end type deal. Oh yeah, yeah, they can

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Speaker 1: want a screw screw this up by messing up scholarship counts.

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Speaker 1: And then schools who don't if there's a player who's

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Speaker 1: not you know, in favor or in good graces with

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Speaker 1: the coaches or administration, even though that they may be

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Speaker 1: eligible if they've already graduated, they may say, yeah, you

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Speaker 1: can come back and play with you gotta pay your

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Speaker 1: own way. I mean, it can get real tricky. And

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Speaker 1: so the the n C Double A did pass the buck,

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Speaker 1: and now we're gonna see what they say about scholarship counts.

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Speaker 1: But they will not be granting eligibility on extra eligibility

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Speaker 1: on winter sports, which I really don't see a problem

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Speaker 1: with only because basketball was done for some teams already. Yes,

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Speaker 1: there were teams that were going to the tournament for

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Speaker 1: those sixty eight teams, and the same with the women.

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Speaker 1: And you had some other winter sports who were going

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Speaker 1: like hockey who were going to the playoffs. But you know,

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Speaker 1: like they played the whole entire season. It's almost like

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Speaker 1: your team just didn't make the tournament. And it sucks. Granted,

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Speaker 1: it sucks because I wanted to see Sabrina I and

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Speaker 1: ask you it felt right that she would win a

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Speaker 1: championship like this year is just sucked because ever since

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Speaker 1: Kobe died like things, I was like, Okay, the Lakers

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Speaker 1: have to win a championship. Ducks have to win a championship. Sabrina,

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Speaker 1: like this is all this stuff of that and up

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Speaker 1: and now we may not have a whole season. Dude,

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Speaker 1: this is incredible. Yeah, and you know you you invoke

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Speaker 1: the name of of Kobe Bryant and all this, and

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Speaker 1: you know the way that he was living his next chapter,

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Speaker 1: I think it can still serve as motivation for how

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Speaker 1: people are living their lives um without sports, right, and

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Speaker 1: I know that you and I are both trying to

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Speaker 1: use this time to who are advantage to get closer

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Speaker 1: with with our families, not that we weren't before, but

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Speaker 1: I mean they are physically closer and so you know,

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Speaker 1: you you might as well gauge what's going on with

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Speaker 1: them and check in with them. It spend as much

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Speaker 1: quality time as them with them as you can. And

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Speaker 1: that that's where my focus is right now, you know,

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Speaker 1: outside of this podcast, and this is a show I'm

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Speaker 1: super excited for, especially after watching The Man the Scheme

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Speaker 1: was such a good movie. But um, I will say

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Speaker 1: that that most of my energy has just been um

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Speaker 1: focused inward because there's not a lot out there that

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Speaker 1: you can control. Today, the Arizona governor shut down UH

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Speaker 1: schools for the rest of the school years, so my

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Speaker 1: kids are out for the next four months, you know,

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Speaker 1: and I'm thinking about a lot of the class of

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Speaker 1: you know, all these kids are not gonna have prom,

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Speaker 1: they're not going to have a graduation. You know, they're

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Speaker 1: not gonna have their spring sports. And I think it

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Speaker 1: definitely matters more for some of these high school kids

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Speaker 1: that are never going to go on to play college,

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Speaker 1: don't get any extra eligibility or anything like that, and

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Speaker 1: it makes a really interesting generation. And then also, I've

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Speaker 1: been a teacher man, and and that's a that's a

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Speaker 1: not a very glamorous gig. And the best part about

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Speaker 1: it is seeing other people's kids show up in front

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Speaker 1: of you every single day and being able to navigate

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Speaker 1: their life situations and help out any way you can,

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Speaker 1: while also imparting some knowledge to them that will maybe

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Speaker 1: be beneficial in the future. Now, all these teachers have

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Speaker 1: to do that job without the only good part of it,

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Speaker 1: which is hanging out with kids. And so you know,

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Speaker 1: I'm definitely feeling for a lot of people today. But

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Speaker 1: it's going to continue to be like this. It's going

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Speaker 1: to continue to be tight, and everyone just kinda gotta

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Speaker 1: pull together and hopefully, you know, we can do our

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Speaker 1: little part with this show and and entertaining some people

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Speaker 1: and taking their minds off and I know talking about

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Speaker 1: it isn't isn't the best way of getting people's minds

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Speaker 1: off of it. But I mean, you know, some things

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Speaker 1: you gotta work through instead of a void. Well, here's

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Speaker 1: one thing to pack. Twelve did that I didn't like

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Speaker 1: with the where it's shut down all the activities, so

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Speaker 1: it it also said that their schools can't have any

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Speaker 1: type of organized team activities of any type. That means

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Speaker 1: that it won't allow in person meetings, which, okay, that

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Speaker 1: makes sense, And it says that virtual workouts supervised by

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Speaker 1: a coach are not permitted either, Like how are you

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Speaker 1: supposed to keep these dudes in shape? Two? Make it

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Speaker 1: to if football is going to be around, And then

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Speaker 1: you said, and then you had um U s A

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Speaker 1: canceled their spring game. Everybody else already knows that it's

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Speaker 1: not happening. Kirk herb Street just a few days ago

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Speaker 1: said he'd be shocked if there was a season next year,

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Speaker 1: said he'll be so surprised that if it happens. He said,

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Speaker 1: I don't know how you let these guys go into

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Speaker 1: locker rooms and let stadiums be filled up, and how

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Speaker 1: you can play ball. I just don't know how you

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Speaker 1: can do it with the optics of it. I just

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Speaker 1: think that it is pretty much impossible. I mean, well,

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Speaker 1: right now, it feels impossible. Granted, there's a lot that

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Speaker 1: can happen between now and then, Like the NBA is

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Speaker 1: looking for options where they may like put teams, whole

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Speaker 1: teams in hotels, test them every day, play their season

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Speaker 1: out in quarantine basically where everybody's in the same place

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Speaker 1: getting tested every day. Corner. Everybody's quarantined, and the way

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Speaker 1: you can keep anybody if they get sick, mills are

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Speaker 1: deliver everything. So I think that that's definitely an option.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, it's it's uh, I don't know what the

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Speaker 1: hell is going on, but I would agree with you.

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Speaker 1: I am enjoying this time with my family, and I

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Speaker 1: kind of feel guilty about being, you know, happy, happy,

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Speaker 1: go lucky and super excited about this time on Twitter, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm with you a hundred percent. Like I was talking

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Speaker 1: to somebody today and I just I was like, you know,

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Speaker 1: I'm kind of enjoying. I'm I'm very sad and scared

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Speaker 1: and worried for a lot of people, but I just, man,

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Speaker 1: I enjoy my family and uh, and I like having

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Speaker 1: around and and I don't I'm you know, I don't

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Speaker 1: feel guilty about that, but I do, you know, I

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Speaker 1: know that I'm enjoying it while some other people are

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Speaker 1: definitely out there suffering and struggling with some major anxiety.

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Speaker 1: And you know, I feel for those people, I absolutely do,

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Speaker 1: and and that could easily be us, you know, a

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Speaker 1: couple of days from now, but as far as it

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Speaker 1: goes right now, you know, I think the best thing

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Speaker 1: that you can do is realize that if if you

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Speaker 1: have things in your life that can be taken away,

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Speaker 1: then you have to make sure your identity is not

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Speaker 1: in those things. You know, I left my I there's

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Speaker 1: the if you google Mercedes and Dr Pepper, a news

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Speaker 1: story comes up where my car was stolen because I

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Speaker 1: left my keys in it and went inside a circle

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Speaker 1: k to get a Dr Pepper and the guy that

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Speaker 1: took my car end up in a shootout with the police.

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Speaker 1: And it was like a huge, major weird story. Um,

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Speaker 1: but you know, I I lost everything and my camera equipment,

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Speaker 1: everything that I used to do my job, all of

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Speaker 1: it was in my car. And also, yeah, my car

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Speaker 1: was kind of important too, And it was just right

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Speaker 1: in that moment, it was like, Okay, well all my

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Speaker 1: stuff is gone, my ability to do my job is gone,

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Speaker 1: but my identity was not in those things. And so

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Speaker 1: you know, I got robbed, but I didn't get robbed,

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Speaker 1: like nothing was missing from from who I am. And

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Speaker 1: in this moment, that's that's what I'm trying to remind

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Speaker 1: people of. It's like, hey, you know, there's some things

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Speaker 1: that might get taken away from you in this process.

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Speaker 1: But your job is not in your identity. Your job

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Speaker 1: is not in your school, your job is not in

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Speaker 1: your sports team, or you're not your job. But your

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Speaker 1: your identity is not in any of those things. Your

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Speaker 1: identity is is in you know, your relationships and uh

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Speaker 1: and and in your health. And so you know, work

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Speaker 1: on your health, whether that's mental or physical or spiritual

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Speaker 1: or whatever. And work on your relationships because that's who

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Speaker 1: you are. Um and you don't you know, you don't

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Speaker 1: need things. You know. I did a puzzle for the

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Speaker 1: first time in twenty years, and I hope to not

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Speaker 1: do another one for twenty years. But I did it right.

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Speaker 1: I did it with my family and it was a

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Speaker 1: good time. I mean, it was that there there's no

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Speaker 1: difference in the joy that I experienced doing that puzzle

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Speaker 1: with my family than the times that I've spent at

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Speaker 1: Disneyland with them, you know. Yeah, that now that has

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Speaker 1: been amazing to see as well, like just the fact

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Speaker 1: that you can that we thought we had to go

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Speaker 1: on vacation to have all these experiences, but we're actually

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Speaker 1: being able to have them home and disconnect at home,

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Speaker 1: like that's dope, and it is. It is privileged, like right,

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Speaker 1: like we we have the privilege of having you know,

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Speaker 1: there's some people that are alone right now and and

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Speaker 1: they're probably pretty anxious and scared, and I definitely definitely

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Speaker 1: feel for those people. But I'm I mean, I've I've

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Speaker 1: I have enjoyed the time with my family. It's been cool.

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Speaker 1: You you and I check in every couple of days

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Speaker 1: to make sure like that the mental health is all

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Speaker 1: there and everything, and and uh, I think it's gonna

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Speaker 1: get worse before it gets better, and so you just

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Speaker 1: you have no choice but to cling to those things

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Speaker 1: that matter. Yeah, and one of the things that matters.

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Speaker 1: Everybody knows I'm an Oregon guy, but we do like

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Speaker 1: to pay homage to like, at the end of the day,

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Speaker 1: this is just sports, and yes, it affects people's lives,

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Speaker 1: but the but the humans are more important. So we

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Speaker 1: want to give a shout out to former Pack twelve

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Speaker 1: coach who passed away. His name is Jim Lambright. He

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Speaker 1: was a He was a dirty, rotten scoundrel of a husky,

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Speaker 1: but he was um. He was an assistant there from

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Speaker 1: nineteen sixty nine to nineteen seventy seven. He's beloved around

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Speaker 1: the program. He was the defensive coordinator from seventy eight

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Speaker 1: to ninety two and then the head coach from ninety

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Speaker 1: three to nine eight. Um yeah, so he had a

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Speaker 1: six thirty six coaching record. Um yeah, he got there.

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Speaker 1: He his last year was a year that I showed

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Speaker 1: up at was the year before I showed up at Oregon.

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Speaker 1: So dude, he had He was with them during their

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Speaker 1: sort of the national championship. He was there with them

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Speaker 1: through the good time. So we want to honor him

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Speaker 1: in that. He's a man of a just a completely

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Speaker 1: different era. You know, we we we talked about you know,

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Speaker 1: and Todd No, Todd Graham got in trouble for calling

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Speaker 1: assistant coaches mercenaries, but that's essentially what they are. You know,

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Speaker 1: there's so much money in this right now that everybody

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Speaker 1: is very focused on what they can do for themselves

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Speaker 1: and how they can better their situation right now. And

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Speaker 1: I don't think that there's anything wrong with that, not

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Speaker 1: not at all. I'm not criticizing that, But there is

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Speaker 1: something just sort of romantic about that era when you

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Speaker 1: could spend what was essentially a lifetime UM with one team,

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Speaker 1: and he he was on the sidelines coaching for the

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Speaker 1: University of Washington for thirty consecutive seasons. And that's after

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Speaker 1: he played defensive end there from nineteen sixty two to

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Speaker 1: nineteen sixty four. And he grew up in Everett, Washington.

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Speaker 1: Like that's not that far away from Seattle, right, So,

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Speaker 1: like I think it's a suburb if I'm not mistaken,

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Speaker 1: And so you know, he he came up in Washington,

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Speaker 1: he played for Washington, he coached high school ball in Washington, UM,

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Speaker 1: and then he coached at University of Washington for thirty seasons.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't get much more husky purple than than that.

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Speaker 1: And uh, you know, I know some people in that

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Speaker 1: community are are hurting right now. And how weird is

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Speaker 1: it that we're in a situation where it's going to

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Speaker 1: be frowned upon for people to go out and just

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Speaker 1: pay their respects, you know. Um, So it's it's it's

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Speaker 1: definitely a weird time. And I don't want it to

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Speaker 1: be overshadowed that he's enormous part of of University of

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Speaker 1: Washington's identity and a huge part of their history. Um

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Speaker 1: and uh and yeah, he'll he'll be missed. Yep. Um

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Speaker 1: we schools are also I've noticed a trend. To on

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Speaker 1: to the next subject, I've noticed a trend with UM

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Speaker 1: college basketball players this year. It seems like there are

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Speaker 1: more players declaring for the draft in light of this

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Speaker 1: coronation situation. I'm wondering if it's going to have an

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Speaker 1: impact because truthfully, there's only sixty people drafted in the

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Speaker 1: NBA every year, two rounds, and we've seen Oregon players

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Speaker 1: continuously come out inexplicably and go into second round or

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Speaker 1: go undrafted and like good players, like guys who would

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Speaker 1: have been first round draft picks the next year. And yes,

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Speaker 1: the kid in uh Tyler Dorsey's had a little bit

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Speaker 1: of success, the kid in UH Memphis, the kid from Canada,

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Speaker 1: Um oh lord, um yeah. Anyways, so some of some

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Speaker 1: of them have had success. But it's always frustrating to

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Speaker 1: me when you see guys come out early and he's

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Speaker 1: just like, oh no, like the like the Moses in

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Speaker 1: from U c l A last year, He's like, what

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Speaker 1: are you doing? You could even dominating college, Like what

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Speaker 1: what are we doing here? But UM colleges are also

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Speaker 1: having to deal with people leaving and then their seniors

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Speaker 1: not having to exit that they thought they would have,

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Speaker 1: like Oregon with Peyton Payton Pritchard, and now at Arizona

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Speaker 1: State we find out that they're gonna lose Remy Martin

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Speaker 1: to the NBA Draft. What's your take on that route,

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Speaker 1: because I know that you cover him and see them

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Speaker 1: a lot. Yeah. I mean, this is two years in

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Speaker 1: a row that Arizona State fans are kind of floored

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Speaker 1: by the early exit of one of their players. Last year,

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Speaker 1: Lou dort Um had a couple of people, I think

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Speaker 1: project him as a late first round pick and he

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Speaker 1: ended up going undrafted. Uh, and then you had a

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Speaker 1: lot of people come out of the woodworks to say,

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Speaker 1: I told you so. Meanwhile, Uh, he found a way

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Speaker 1: to despite being undrafted, start twenty one games this year

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Speaker 1: for the Thunder. So he's he he ended up getting

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Speaker 1: it figured out and he's in that situation where he's

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Speaker 1: not locked into a five year deal because of it.

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Speaker 1: So you know, if he continues playing the way that

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Speaker 1: he's playing defensively, UM, on an NBA roster, assuming the

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Speaker 1: NBA continues to be a thing, um, you know, than

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Speaker 1: than you know, he'll definitely be able to cash in,

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Speaker 1: so you never know if it if it's the decision

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Speaker 1: of a teammate or or what. You know, Remy Martin

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Speaker 1: is an interesting guy because he's got a huge following

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Speaker 1: um at Filipino basketball fans or some of the most

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Speaker 1: like dedicated and fanatic people out there. And and and

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Speaker 1: I think that that's you know, with that being part

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Speaker 1: of his heritage, he's got a really really big following

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Speaker 1: out there. Um And he's somebody who kind of just

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Speaker 1: quietly goes about his business. He's not super interested in

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Speaker 1: social media. He he loves to find ways to give back.

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Speaker 1: I think he's done a lot to send shoes to

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Speaker 1: the Philippines as a bunch of different articles about out there,

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Speaker 1: about the different types of n CE double a allowable

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Speaker 1: philanthropy that he was involved with before coming to a

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Speaker 1: s U and since um and I think that, you know,

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Speaker 1: he would have been a favorite to possibly win Pack

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Speaker 1: twelve Player of the Year next year. Um and uh

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Speaker 1: and so that there's a little bit of surprise there.

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Speaker 1: But at the same time, you know, I think there's

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Speaker 1: a lot of people out there that don't think he's

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Speaker 1: ready for the NBA. I don't think it matters he's

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Speaker 1: gonna be. He's a dog, he's an effort guy. Uh,

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Speaker 1: he's a lot of fun to watch, and I think

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Speaker 1: that he'll be a fan favorite no matter where he

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Speaker 1: ends up. And I think he's got the kind of

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Speaker 1: personality where he'd be okay playing internationally, um and just

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Speaker 1: giving it his all for wherever he goes, and you

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Speaker 1: using it to build his life experience and life's adventures

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Speaker 1: and and everything like that. He's he's just that kind

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Speaker 1: of guy. And so you know, I know that there

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Speaker 1: are some rules in place right now that allow for

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Speaker 1: players to test the waters and come back. So there's

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Speaker 1: a sliver of hope for a s U fans at

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Speaker 1: Remy Martin returns. But you can't put the post out

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Speaker 1: like that if you're testing the water. I think, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's a pretty definitive post, like when you put us

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Speaker 1: that all right, I'm out guys. And then sometimes it

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Speaker 1: takes too much humble pie for guys to eat eat

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Speaker 1: to come come back, which I think is the the

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Speaker 1: thing that you have to be willing to do is

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Speaker 1: say all right, look, look this ain't the best move

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Speaker 1: for for me. I put my name out there, I'm

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Speaker 1: coming back that and it's no no shame, but I

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Speaker 1: think sometimes people let that shame lay on him and

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Speaker 1: wear on him. Yeah, and I think you know, and

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00:20:25,560 --> 00:20:27,879
Speaker 1: and and a s U fans, you know, they didn't

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Speaker 1: handle this news very well. Not only do they not

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Speaker 1: think he's ready, Um, they're worried that that that Bobby

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Speaker 1: Hurley could take an opportunity elsewhere without his point guard. Meanwhile,

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Speaker 1: I'm back here, like, okay, so here we go. We're

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Speaker 1: gonna play a Lions over age forty minutes a game

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Speaker 1: and see what that dude can do. Because that he

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Speaker 1: to me number two right, Yeah, he's the guy with

387
00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:54,600
Speaker 1: iculous crossover off the bench. So he I put him in,

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00:20:54,760 --> 00:20:58,000
Speaker 1: play him, like, play him forty minutes, let him run

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Speaker 1: the point he can he can do it. He's like

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Speaker 1: Jim Jackson, strong, Yeah, physical. I like him, dude, He's

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Speaker 1: looks like an NBA guy to me. And so I

392
00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:10,560
Speaker 1: just say, I say, run it, run it through him,

393
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Speaker 1: And I think that you'll be able to salvage some stuff.

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Speaker 1: And they got Eddie House's kid backing him up. Um,

395
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Speaker 1: they could play a little bit of defense and gives

396
00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:19,800
Speaker 1: you some energy off the bench. I think they'll be fine.

397
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Speaker 1: I think every college basketball fan is devastated year over

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Speaker 1: year through the players that leave early. I know you

399
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Speaker 1: you as somebody who follows Oregon and I think we

400
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Speaker 1: even talked about this UM on one of our first podcasts.

401
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Speaker 1: So just some of the people leaving Oregon, you know

402
00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:37,480
Speaker 1: that that maybe shouldn't have UM, But I I think

403
00:21:37,480 --> 00:21:40,200
Speaker 1: that every fan outside of being a Kentucky fan gets

404
00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:43,400
Speaker 1: sick of it UM because they, you know, they want

405
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Speaker 1: those players to stick around as long as possible, especially

406
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Speaker 1: if they're not a one and done. I think that's

407
00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:50,800
Speaker 1: the thing that kind of took some of the UM

408
00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:55,040
Speaker 1: A s U fans UM by surprise, and they're they're

409
00:21:55,080 --> 00:21:57,080
Speaker 1: thinking back on you know a lot of players leaving

410
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Speaker 1: after three years and not necessarily being ready for the NBA,

411
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Speaker 1: whether it's like Tiago or jeh Carson UM. But it

412
00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:06,320
Speaker 1: worked out for for Lou Dorton, it worked for James Harden,

413
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Speaker 1: and so you know, when when you're when you feel

414
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Speaker 1: like you're ready, you gotta go ahead and take that chance. Yeah,

415
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Speaker 1: and I get it because I was a kid who

416
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Speaker 1: who left school early, so I get it. But you

417
00:22:20,600 --> 00:22:23,920
Speaker 1: also have to, you know, make sure that you're putting

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Speaker 1: yourself in the best possible situation. Yeah, and you don't know,

419
00:22:29,359 --> 00:22:31,639
Speaker 1: but you do have to take the advice of people

420
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Speaker 1: who are in the know, because it's a big difference

421
00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:39,399
Speaker 1: in being in basketball. The second round rat traffick than

422
00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:41,760
Speaker 1: a first round draft pick. You have not you don't

423
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Speaker 1: have a guaranteed contract. It's just like if you're gonna

424
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Speaker 1: be in the NFL draft and you're not coming out

425
00:22:48,359 --> 00:22:51,040
Speaker 1: and you're not gonna be a if you're a kid

426
00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:54,800
Speaker 1: who's coming out as a junior and you're not, you

427
00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:57,360
Speaker 1: have no possibility of being a first round draft pick,

428
00:22:57,960 --> 00:23:02,200
Speaker 1: and you're probably and you're maybe possibly be a second round,

429
00:23:02,200 --> 00:23:04,639
Speaker 1: you're probably a third round. Then you should stay in

430
00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:07,120
Speaker 1: school because you could be a first round draft pick.

431
00:23:07,800 --> 00:23:11,760
Speaker 1: But like, yeah, because there's so much money at stake,

432
00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:14,840
Speaker 1: and then there's the opportunity because first round draft picks

433
00:23:14,840 --> 00:23:17,720
Speaker 1: stay in the league on average way longer because the

434
00:23:17,760 --> 00:23:20,520
Speaker 1: team's got so much money and hope wrapped up into

435
00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:24,080
Speaker 1: him that you get more opportunity. So, like, you don't

436
00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:25,840
Speaker 1: want to be a seventh round draft pick because that

437
00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:28,080
Speaker 1: that broke with short Buddy. You are a one pulled

438
00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:32,919
Speaker 1: hamstring away from getting cut yeah, and Remy, Remy, I

439
00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:35,119
Speaker 1: just I just see him as somebody who if he

440
00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:39,800
Speaker 1: doesn't get drafted and he doesn't, you know, I think, yeah,

441
00:23:39,840 --> 00:23:42,720
Speaker 1: and I think he'll be fine. I don't. I don't

442
00:23:42,760 --> 00:23:46,000
Speaker 1: think it matters for him ultimately where he plays basketball,

443
00:23:46,040 --> 00:23:49,400
Speaker 1: as long as he's being given the opportunity to earn

444
00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:51,760
Speaker 1: a living, because he's one of those like you're blessed

445
00:23:51,760 --> 00:23:54,280
Speaker 1: to bless others, right, So he's he's one of those

446
00:23:54,280 --> 00:23:58,000
Speaker 1: people that's gonna use whatever means and resources that he

447
00:23:58,040 --> 00:24:00,440
Speaker 1: gets to immediately turn around and invest in the people.

448
00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:02,760
Speaker 1: My hope is that that comes with a hundred million

449
00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:06,240
Speaker 1: dollar NBA contracts someday, but you know, in all likelihood

450
00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:08,280
Speaker 1: it probably won't. That only happens for a few people

451
00:24:08,320 --> 00:24:10,639
Speaker 1: here and there, and so, you know, I think that

452
00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:12,800
Speaker 1: he's going to be somebody who's he's just gonna land

453
00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:15,359
Speaker 1: on his feet. And so maybe that's it. Maybe maybe

454
00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:18,920
Speaker 1: it's that he feels done with college, like just as

455
00:24:18,960 --> 00:24:21,880
Speaker 1: a as a person, because he came in more mature

456
00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:25,080
Speaker 1: than everybody else around him. And you know, four years

457
00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:27,440
Speaker 1: in school for a point guard, usually that fourth year

458
00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:29,800
Speaker 1: that's when they go off, right, That's that Steve Nash here.

459
00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:33,240
Speaker 1: But you know it, it does. It doesn't necessarily mean

460
00:24:34,080 --> 00:24:36,720
Speaker 1: um that you won't that you won't find a way

461
00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:39,160
Speaker 1: to go out there and and and uh and get

462
00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:42,720
Speaker 1: an opportunity. Um, it's just you know, it's it's tough

463
00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:44,800
Speaker 1: because there's already people out there tweeting that he's not

464
00:24:44,840 --> 00:24:48,399
Speaker 1: a top sixty player, um and everybody. That's really a

465
00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:51,720
Speaker 1: decision that everybody has to weigh weigh themselves. And I

466
00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:54,040
Speaker 1: don't I don't blame him, but I do get some

467
00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:56,879
Speaker 1: of the sadness and frustration of a su fans because

468
00:24:57,200 --> 00:24:59,520
Speaker 1: that was there, you know, that was their favorite guy. Yeah,

469
00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:03,320
Speaker 1: but that's also living from a fandom place of lack

470
00:25:03,600 --> 00:25:05,679
Speaker 1: when you're when you're like our best players leaving, that

471
00:25:05,720 --> 00:25:09,240
Speaker 1: means you don't feel very confident in what is left

472
00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:14,240
Speaker 1: in the cupboard behind him. Oh but Ralph, it is

473
00:25:14,320 --> 00:25:16,840
Speaker 1: it is time. I know you've been waiting. I know

474
00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:20,760
Speaker 1: you've been just doing on this all day. So I

475
00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:25,960
Speaker 1: was able to get us advanced screening for The Scheme

476
00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:34,720
Speaker 1: on HBO. The Scheme on HBO is a documentary about

477
00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:38,959
Speaker 1: Christian Dawkins, the guy who was at the center of

478
00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:44,000
Speaker 1: the FBI probe into the underbelly of college basketball. It

479
00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:47,280
Speaker 1: was supposed to the New York Southern Districts that they

480
00:25:47,280 --> 00:25:50,000
Speaker 1: were gonna blow the lid off, that they had to playbook,

481
00:25:50,280 --> 00:25:53,159
Speaker 1: that they were gonna indict all these coaches. Everything was

482
00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:58,280
Speaker 1: coming down because this pay for place scandal was defrauding schools.

483
00:25:58,400 --> 00:26:01,840
Speaker 1: It was there were so many victims in this. Christian

484
00:26:01,920 --> 00:26:05,160
Speaker 1: Dawkins was just a user and abuser of these high

485
00:26:05,200 --> 00:26:09,959
Speaker 1: school players. And then we see the documentary and we well, actually,

486
00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:14,440
Speaker 1: first we saw no college coaches get fired besides Rick Pattino,

487
00:26:14,520 --> 00:26:18,360
Speaker 1: and that was questionable. We saw, uh, we didn't hear.

488
00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:22,600
Speaker 1: We only heard Sean Miller and um and the l

489
00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:26,399
Speaker 1: s U will you know, will wait on tape I.

490
00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:31,080
Speaker 1: Nothing came of it, nothing like they weren't allowed to

491
00:26:31,119 --> 00:26:37,240
Speaker 1: be subpoened anything. And you actually had millions of dollars

492
00:26:38,280 --> 00:26:43,119
Speaker 1: trade trade hands, You had FBI man hours, all of

493
00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:47,920
Speaker 1: this stuff to to give six and nine month prison

494
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:54,320
Speaker 1: sentences for a victimless crime. So let's let's let's first

495
00:26:54,359 --> 00:26:56,400
Speaker 1: of all, let's just address the elephant in the room

496
00:26:56,560 --> 00:26:59,240
Speaker 1: right off to that, because listeners to this podcast are

497
00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:02,040
Speaker 1: gonna want to know what we think of you know

498
00:27:02,119 --> 00:27:05,000
Speaker 1: John Wilner, he was somebody who also had an advanced

499
00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:07,480
Speaker 1: screening of this, and he basically just came out and

500
00:27:07,520 --> 00:27:10,960
Speaker 1: said he doesn't see Sean Miller ever coaching another game

501
00:27:11,040 --> 00:27:13,560
Speaker 1: for the University of Arizona. That's got University of Arizona

502
00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:16,280
Speaker 1: fans who don't even like Sean Millard. That's got them

503
00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:20,920
Speaker 1: all all all up in uh arms because they want

504
00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:25,840
Speaker 1: to believe that this entire um investigation from the get go,

505
00:27:26,040 --> 00:27:28,199
Speaker 1: especially some of the media coverage of it, has just

506
00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:31,000
Speaker 1: been a giant shamp So even though they would be

507
00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:33,600
Speaker 1: fine with Sean Miller moving on, they don't want it

508
00:27:33,600 --> 00:27:35,879
Speaker 1: to be for this reason because they don't want to

509
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:38,439
Speaker 1: be wrong. And without a coach, right, how do you

510
00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:43,399
Speaker 1: fire Sean So I have been on the overrated train

511
00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:47,879
Speaker 1: and is not getting the results. I'm with you if

512
00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:51,200
Speaker 1: you fire him. When When When Will Wade isn't fired

513
00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:56,120
Speaker 1: when there are other coaches on tape that haven't come

514
00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:59,639
Speaker 1: out that they've suppressed. Nobody's getting in trouble for this

515
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:04,520
Speaker 1: except for low level people. And it's over. It is

516
00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:08,280
Speaker 1: literally over, like nobody else is getting fired. There's no

517
00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:12,760
Speaker 1: smoking gun coming out because everything is suppressed. Somebody stopped this.

518
00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:17,320
Speaker 1: I do not I I have do not see Sean

519
00:28:17,320 --> 00:28:21,199
Speaker 1: Miller getting fired after after watching this. Could there be

520
00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:24,199
Speaker 1: a mutual parting of ways just over the frustration of

521
00:28:24,920 --> 00:28:27,800
Speaker 1: you know, the building frustration of the fan base and

522
00:28:27,840 --> 00:28:31,720
Speaker 1: Tucson and the fact that they keep underachieving with absolute

523
00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:35,199
Speaker 1: mega levels of talent and the fact that he his

524
00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:39,000
Speaker 1: ten year assistant did you know, jail time and maybe

525
00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:42,040
Speaker 1: he just needs a reset. I think his son, UH

526
00:28:42,200 --> 00:28:44,960
Speaker 1: is set to graduate from his youngest son is set

527
00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:47,400
Speaker 1: to graduate from high school in Tucson this year, so

528
00:28:47,880 --> 00:28:50,000
Speaker 1: you know, some of his ties to the to the

529
00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:53,200
Speaker 1: area UM are gonna lessen. I could see them coming

530
00:28:53,240 --> 00:28:56,240
Speaker 1: together and having a mutual parting of ways. But there's

531
00:28:56,280 --> 00:28:58,160
Speaker 1: no way I see University of Arizona coming out and

532
00:28:58,200 --> 00:29:01,400
Speaker 1: saying based on based on the fact that it's pretty

533
00:29:01,400 --> 00:29:05,600
Speaker 1: obvious that Sean Miller lied about his level of contact

534
00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:09,680
Speaker 1: and his relationship with UH, with with Christian Dawkins when

535
00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:12,840
Speaker 1: he was addressing the media and not being forthcoming, and

536
00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:16,160
Speaker 1: the fact that he talks like a like he looks,

537
00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:19,360
Speaker 1: you know, he looks like a prohibition gangster, and he

538
00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:21,880
Speaker 1: talks like one too. I don't think those will be

539
00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:24,840
Speaker 1: reasons to dump him, especially if ellis he's not gonna

540
00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:27,880
Speaker 1: do anything with Will Wade because if anybody's guilty, it's

541
00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:35,560
Speaker 1: boy dirties. Oh man, my lord. Um So, but we

542
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:38,200
Speaker 1: have a treat for you guys. We have a treat

543
00:29:38,400 --> 00:29:41,680
Speaker 1: for for you guys. Um before we get into all

544
00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:46,200
Speaker 1: the discussion about it, um we I was able to

545
00:29:46,240 --> 00:29:52,120
Speaker 1: interview Pat Condoles earlier. He's the director who directed the film,

546
00:29:52,880 --> 00:29:55,800
Speaker 1: and you guys can hear what he had to say.

547
00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:58,520
Speaker 1: He had a lot because there's so much stuff that

548
00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:00,840
Speaker 1: was left on the cutting room f or and he

549
00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:04,480
Speaker 1: was able to talk about that. So listening to him,

550
00:30:04,560 --> 00:30:07,200
Speaker 1: and then we'll come back and we will discuss all

551
00:30:07,240 --> 00:30:10,720
Speaker 1: of it. First, Pat, thanks for joining us today. Thanks

552
00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:14,640
Speaker 1: for taking time. I appreciate it. Yeah, absolutely, thanks for

553
00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:17,959
Speaker 1: having me. Yeah, is to say, there's the family, safe, healthy,

554
00:30:18,040 --> 00:30:22,600
Speaker 1: whole everything. During this Corona scare, We're we're all going

555
00:30:22,600 --> 00:30:24,960
Speaker 1: a little insane, but you know, health and safety wise,

556
00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:28,080
Speaker 1: we're all good to no complaints. Yes, So I got

557
00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:34,160
Speaker 1: a chance to watch the entire the the scheme, and

558
00:30:34,200 --> 00:30:36,640
Speaker 1: as a person who is connected to the PAC twelve,

559
00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:39,200
Speaker 1: connected to the media, I've heard all sorts of things,

560
00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:42,440
Speaker 1: and it looked very damning from the beginning. Once you

561
00:30:42,600 --> 00:30:47,200
Speaker 1: heard the uh, the the Arizona coach, coach, Coach Miller,

562
00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:49,920
Speaker 1: and you heard the l s U coach on tape,

563
00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:52,160
Speaker 1: and you thought, I thought that this was gonna be

564
00:30:52,240 --> 00:30:54,520
Speaker 1: a huge, huge thing, and it turned out to be

565
00:30:54,720 --> 00:30:57,720
Speaker 1: just a few minor level people that ended up going

566
00:30:57,760 --> 00:31:01,440
Speaker 1: to jail. What was your take away overall from the

567
00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:06,480
Speaker 1: whole process of doing this film, Well, it was it

568
00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:09,840
Speaker 1: was such an unbelievable story. And to your point, like

569
00:31:10,080 --> 00:31:12,920
Speaker 1: you said in the intro, you know I this. I

570
00:31:12,960 --> 00:31:14,960
Speaker 1: heard about this like everybody else did. When the press

571
00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:18,880
Speaker 1: conference was announced by the Southern District in New York saying, look,

572
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:22,760
Speaker 1: this is a three year undercover FBI investigation. There was

573
00:31:22,840 --> 00:31:27,200
Speaker 1: wire tap, they they arrested an executive for Adidas. So

574
00:31:27,280 --> 00:31:31,520
Speaker 1: you've got billion dollar global you know, shoe companies involved

575
00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:34,760
Speaker 1: in this. So I remember, you know, talking with my

576
00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:38,480
Speaker 1: editor actually about about that story right when it broke, thinking, okay,

577
00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:41,520
Speaker 1: this is going to change the landscape of college athletics.

578
00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:44,720
Speaker 1: I mean, they're gonna take down big name coaches. You know,

579
00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:47,080
Speaker 1: Patino's name was thrown out there right right from the

580
00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:51,360
Speaker 1: get go, and then just nothing happened and just so

581
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:54,440
Speaker 1: the story just kind of went away. UM. And I

582
00:31:54,480 --> 00:32:00,400
Speaker 1: was not really familiar with Christian Um until HBO, you know,

583
00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:02,560
Speaker 1: kind of brought this to me and said, hey, would

584
00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:05,200
Speaker 1: you be interested in doing something like this? And then

585
00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:07,080
Speaker 1: I read, I think about every article that had been

586
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:10,520
Speaker 1: written about Christian Um and him and I got on

587
00:32:10,560 --> 00:32:13,040
Speaker 1: the phone, and then I flew out to where he

588
00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:15,360
Speaker 1: was and spent three days with him just talking, and

589
00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:20,880
Speaker 1: I found it to be such a fascinating, dynamic, complex, intelligent, um,

590
00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:24,880
Speaker 1: hilarious individual. Uh. And there was clearly so much more

591
00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:27,200
Speaker 1: to the story UM that I was like, you know,

592
00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:31,120
Speaker 1: I really really have to tell this story. And you know,

593
00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:34,280
Speaker 1: it was a roller coaster ride making this because we

594
00:32:34,280 --> 00:32:38,520
Speaker 1: we started making it in between the first and second

595
00:32:38,520 --> 00:32:41,560
Speaker 1: federal trial, so all of this stuff was was unfolding

596
00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:45,840
Speaker 1: while we were shooting um. And and the story kept

597
00:32:45,840 --> 00:32:49,920
Speaker 1: evolving as new information came out, new evidence came to light. Uh.

598
00:32:49,960 --> 00:32:52,920
Speaker 1: And from my perspective, this was just a much much

599
00:32:53,040 --> 00:32:58,080
Speaker 1: bigger story than just a sports story and just a

600
00:32:58,160 --> 00:33:03,600
Speaker 1: Christian Dawkins story. Yeah. So Christian Christians specifically, who does

601
00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:10,040
Speaker 1: a lot of the narration, how credible, how believable was

602
00:33:10,040 --> 00:33:13,200
Speaker 1: was he? And how forthcoming did you feel like he

603
00:33:13,360 --> 00:33:17,440
Speaker 1: was in the production process. He was. I found him

604
00:33:17,480 --> 00:33:19,600
Speaker 1: to be very credible. And the reason I say that is,

605
00:33:19,680 --> 00:33:23,400
Speaker 1: you know, there's we have the FBI wire taps, so

606
00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:27,320
Speaker 1: we could corroborate almost everything that he said in the

607
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:31,120
Speaker 1: interview because we could listen to him in real time

608
00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:34,320
Speaker 1: not knowing that he's being recorded, so you can hear

609
00:33:35,200 --> 00:33:38,240
Speaker 1: That's the interesting thing about this is is rarely do

610
00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:41,000
Speaker 1: you get a chance to tell a story and put

611
00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:44,800
Speaker 1: the audience in the room on the phone, pull back

612
00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:46,600
Speaker 1: the curtain, right. This is kind of a fly on

613
00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:49,480
Speaker 1: the wall experience for the audience where you get to

614
00:33:49,640 --> 00:33:53,840
Speaker 1: hear the the the kind of unvarnished, the raw truth

615
00:33:53,920 --> 00:33:55,880
Speaker 1: of what's happening here because none of these people know

616
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:59,000
Speaker 1: they're being recorded, whether it's the the wire tap calls

617
00:33:59,320 --> 00:34:02,479
Speaker 1: or the undercover FBI video where you watch some some

618
00:34:02,560 --> 00:34:05,920
Speaker 1: things happen. They don't know if they're being recorded. So

619
00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:08,080
Speaker 1: you get to hear the thought process and you get

620
00:34:08,160 --> 00:34:10,239
Speaker 1: to hear what he's saying. So when Christian answers a

621
00:34:10,360 --> 00:34:13,839
Speaker 1: question and the interviews with me, the vast majority of that,

622
00:34:15,400 --> 00:34:18,680
Speaker 1: I would say we could corroborate with with evidence that

623
00:34:18,760 --> 00:34:22,000
Speaker 1: was that was gathered for this whole investigation. So I

624
00:34:22,040 --> 00:34:26,120
Speaker 1: found Christian to be incredibly incredible. Um. But he did

625
00:34:26,200 --> 00:34:30,280
Speaker 1: stop short on a few different topics. He didn't he didn't. Uh,

626
00:34:30,320 --> 00:34:32,840
Speaker 1: he was not the most forthcoming on a couple of things.

627
00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:37,359
Speaker 1: And the biggest agreement him and I, Yeah, I think

628
00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:40,560
Speaker 1: the biggest Yeah, the biggest disagreement him and I had

629
00:34:40,719 --> 00:34:45,160
Speaker 1: was regarding Rick Pettino, Uh, because I just cannot believe

630
00:34:45,200 --> 00:34:48,439
Speaker 1: that Rick Pettino did not know what was going on. Yeah,

631
00:34:48,600 --> 00:34:53,640
Speaker 1: I just I refused to believe that. Well. So, so

632
00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:57,040
Speaker 1: my question about that is is that do you think

633
00:34:57,040 --> 00:34:58,960
Speaker 1: that that fell in line with the fact that he

634
00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:02,640
Speaker 1: would not rid out any coaches. I mean, he was

635
00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:06,160
Speaker 1: guardamant that he wasn't that he was gonna stand up

636
00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:11,520
Speaker 1: and not try to tear down everybody in their career. Yeah, exactly.

637
00:35:11,680 --> 00:35:12,960
Speaker 1: That was the thing. Yeah, he didn't want to be

638
00:35:13,000 --> 00:35:17,120
Speaker 1: a rat um and and I think he avoided that

639
00:35:17,160 --> 00:35:21,239
Speaker 1: as much as possible. And I think I think his

640
00:35:21,360 --> 00:35:24,160
Speaker 1: position he became more and more eager, I think to

641
00:35:24,239 --> 00:35:29,120
Speaker 1: have his perspective included and to be more uh, I think, um,

642
00:35:29,600 --> 00:35:33,600
Speaker 1: I think less guarded about everything as the situation evolved

643
00:35:33,840 --> 00:35:37,640
Speaker 1: in the fluidity of the trial. And yeah, I think

644
00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:39,360
Speaker 1: by the end of it, when he's the guy that

645
00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:42,560
Speaker 1: goes down and gets an eighteen month prison sentence, you know,

646
00:35:42,640 --> 00:35:45,480
Speaker 1: longer than anybody else, I think all of that kind

647
00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:47,880
Speaker 1: of changed his perspective a little bit, and he was

648
00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:50,560
Speaker 1: more more willing to be a little bit more open

649
00:35:50,600 --> 00:35:52,960
Speaker 1: with some of that stuff where he wasn't before, just

650
00:35:52,960 --> 00:35:54,719
Speaker 1: just as a as a point to say, listen, like

651
00:35:55,640 --> 00:35:58,040
Speaker 1: I'm the fall guy here, but that this is not

652
00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:02,840
Speaker 1: an accurate depiction of what was going on on exactly. No,

653
00:36:04,840 --> 00:36:08,080
Speaker 1: I was gonna say a Christian was defiant in saying

654
00:36:08,080 --> 00:36:10,480
Speaker 1: that Patino didn't know anything and that he did not

655
00:36:10,640 --> 00:36:14,359
Speaker 1: believe that Patino had direct knowledge. And I will say,

656
00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:17,839
Speaker 1: I mean, we couldn't find any evidence that said that

657
00:36:17,840 --> 00:36:21,719
Speaker 1: Patino did have direct knowledge. Um. Defense that didn't have

658
00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:26,080
Speaker 1: it obviously, um. And he was never even I think,

659
00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:30,960
Speaker 1: gotten close to to being charged unless Christian would have

660
00:36:31,000 --> 00:36:34,279
Speaker 1: decided to give them information. And I think Christian has

661
00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:36,400
Speaker 1: that information. I think he just wasn't willing to share it.

662
00:36:37,120 --> 00:36:40,560
Speaker 1: But but why, like there was no advantage for him

663
00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:43,759
Speaker 1: sharing it aside from you know, yes, he could have

664
00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:46,920
Speaker 1: got off some some more time, but he he seems

665
00:36:46,960 --> 00:36:51,360
Speaker 1: like a guy who's about helping players and doing and

666
00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:56,320
Speaker 1: and really taking advantage of a capitalistic system that seems

667
00:36:56,400 --> 00:36:59,760
Speaker 1: broken when it comes to college athletics. But the question

668
00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:03,279
Speaker 1: for you is that who is the bad guy here? Like, like,

669
00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:06,000
Speaker 1: who is the bad guy in this situation, because it

670
00:37:06,040 --> 00:37:09,840
Speaker 1: doesn't seem like it's Christian Dawkins. I agree with you,

671
00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:12,080
Speaker 1: and I think that's a great question. I think that's

672
00:37:12,080 --> 00:37:14,880
Speaker 1: a question that we wanted. We wanted the audience to

673
00:37:14,960 --> 00:37:18,480
Speaker 1: ask themselves that when they watched the documentary. The other

674
00:37:18,600 --> 00:37:20,840
Speaker 1: question we wanted them to ask is is who's the

675
00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:24,760
Speaker 1: victim here? Right for a crime to be committed, by definition,

676
00:37:24,760 --> 00:37:28,279
Speaker 1: there's gonna be a victim. Uh. And so when the

677
00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:33,759
Speaker 1: Southern District proposed that it was these universities were victimized

678
00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:38,319
Speaker 1: by this, it was it was such a laughable absurd

679
00:37:38,800 --> 00:37:43,320
Speaker 1: um proposition for people to to to accept um. And

680
00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:47,120
Speaker 1: it was really interesting to sit there. And I went

681
00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:50,680
Speaker 1: to the sentencing of the first federal trial um, and

682
00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:53,000
Speaker 1: then every day for the second trial, I was there

683
00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:58,280
Speaker 1: and it was this weird like unspoken arrangement between everybody

684
00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:01,880
Speaker 1: that walked from the hall only into the courtroom that

685
00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:04,920
Speaker 1: it was like, Okay, everybody's gonna pretend like reality is

686
00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:08,600
Speaker 1: is doesn't exist, right, We're gonna we're gonna act like

687
00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:12,600
Speaker 1: we're all living in an alternate universe within this courtroom here,

688
00:38:13,320 --> 00:38:16,600
Speaker 1: you know, because it was unbelievable the narrative that was

689
00:38:16,640 --> 00:38:19,719
Speaker 1: being pitched to a jury and judges, and and the

690
00:38:19,760 --> 00:38:22,560
Speaker 1: fact that people weren't kind of laughing out loud in

691
00:38:22,600 --> 00:38:26,280
Speaker 1: the courtroom was shocking to me. Yeah, it's a victimless crime.

692
00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:32,720
Speaker 1: So if if if Christian Dawkins actually pay the players, okay,

693
00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:36,759
Speaker 1: who is who is harmed in that? And then if

694
00:38:36,840 --> 00:38:40,200
Speaker 1: the and then the colleges they get the players and

695
00:38:40,280 --> 00:38:43,160
Speaker 1: they go to win games, who was the I can't

696
00:38:43,239 --> 00:38:46,840
Speaker 1: still figure out As a former college athlete, former professional athlete,

697
00:38:47,120 --> 00:38:49,680
Speaker 1: as a as a thinker of person who reads books,

698
00:38:50,200 --> 00:38:55,359
Speaker 1: I cannot figure out who is harmed by this? Right

699
00:38:55,480 --> 00:38:57,520
Speaker 1: and and with the So within the narrative that the

700
00:38:57,520 --> 00:39:00,920
Speaker 1: Southern District of New York came up was that the

701
00:39:01,120 --> 00:39:05,239
Speaker 1: universities were the victims. They were harmed by this because

702
00:39:06,040 --> 00:39:12,839
Speaker 1: these athletes were no longer eligible for amateur status if

703
00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:16,000
Speaker 1: they have been given money or or any sort of inducements. Right,

704
00:39:16,360 --> 00:39:17,759
Speaker 1: So by the time they went in there, then they

705
00:39:17,800 --> 00:39:21,360
Speaker 1: considered that fraud. So they're defrauding the university. You're defrauding

706
00:39:21,400 --> 00:39:24,680
Speaker 1: them out of the value of the scholarship. Right. It's

707
00:39:24,719 --> 00:39:30,040
Speaker 1: an unbelievably you could just give me, you give it

708
00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:32,720
Speaker 1: to somebody else, but then it leads to a million

709
00:39:32,719 --> 00:39:35,520
Speaker 1: different questions. Right, So that if I think what you

710
00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:37,759
Speaker 1: know what Dan Wetzel says, an example in the dock

711
00:39:37,880 --> 00:39:40,120
Speaker 1: is is I think perfect where you know, so the

712
00:39:40,719 --> 00:39:42,600
Speaker 1: top quarterback right of the team, he goes into the

713
00:39:42,640 --> 00:39:44,800
Speaker 1: pizza shop and he gets a free slice of pizza.

714
00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:48,799
Speaker 1: You've just made him ineligible under n C double A rules, right,

715
00:39:48,880 --> 00:39:52,120
Speaker 1: So have you then just defrauded a massive university and

716
00:39:52,200 --> 00:39:58,439
Speaker 1: under this Southern Districts definition, you've committed multiple federal felonies. Yeah,

717
00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:01,520
Speaker 1: and that's what this precedent is, SAI. Well, that's where

718
00:40:01,560 --> 00:40:03,640
Speaker 1: I hate the way the n C double A is

719
00:40:03,800 --> 00:40:05,879
Speaker 1: set up, which you kind of blew the lid off

720
00:40:05,920 --> 00:40:09,960
Speaker 1: with this with with the scheme. Is that is that

721
00:40:10,040 --> 00:40:14,560
Speaker 1: Dan Wetzel actually reiterated to which he said if Google

722
00:40:14,640 --> 00:40:17,680
Speaker 1: or Amazon came into a high school and said we're

723
00:40:17,680 --> 00:40:21,040
Speaker 1: gonna pay interns twenty k to come out teach them

724
00:40:21,239 --> 00:40:23,120
Speaker 1: in hopes that they will come to come work for

725
00:40:23,160 --> 00:40:26,480
Speaker 1: them later, that there would be nothing illegal with that.

726
00:40:26,520 --> 00:40:28,640
Speaker 1: They would actually applaud that. But then when it comes

727
00:40:28,640 --> 00:40:32,000
Speaker 1: to college basketball, and this is where the race factor

728
00:40:32,040 --> 00:40:34,680
Speaker 1: comes in, because Christian brought it up to if these

729
00:40:34,760 --> 00:40:38,960
Speaker 1: weren't mainly young, urban black kids, would this even be

730
00:40:39,040 --> 00:40:43,879
Speaker 1: an issue? Right right? Yeah? His point is, I think

731
00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:46,080
Speaker 1: he makes a very strong point in that. Look, if

732
00:40:46,239 --> 00:40:48,960
Speaker 1: if the whole system, with the n c A in general,

733
00:40:49,000 --> 00:40:51,960
Speaker 1: and then using basketball as an example, if all the

734
00:40:52,000 --> 00:40:55,279
Speaker 1: players were white, and all the head coaches that are

735
00:40:55,280 --> 00:40:57,880
Speaker 1: making millions of dollars a year in the eighties and

736
00:40:57,880 --> 00:41:00,360
Speaker 1: and you know, everybody running the schools against the Susians

737
00:41:00,360 --> 00:41:03,040
Speaker 1: were all black. His point was, there's no way that

738
00:41:03,080 --> 00:41:06,880
Speaker 1: this would be happening. Yeah, it wouldn't. It wouldn't be happening.

739
00:41:07,040 --> 00:41:10,200
Speaker 1: Nobody would tolerate that billions of dollars are being made

740
00:41:10,200 --> 00:41:12,279
Speaker 1: every year and none of that money is going to

741
00:41:12,360 --> 00:41:17,879
Speaker 1: the players from It's a very very interesting compelling point. Yeah, Yeah,

742
00:41:17,920 --> 00:41:20,200
Speaker 1: And it's just it's a point that people don't really

743
00:41:20,239 --> 00:41:24,719
Speaker 1: necessarily want to recognize because it might cause them to

744
00:41:25,560 --> 00:41:30,360
Speaker 1: to uh, to be honest about some uncomfortable truths. But

745
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:33,120
Speaker 1: a guy that was talked about a lot in the

746
00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:39,000
Speaker 1: In Your in the scheme, which is actually released Tuesday

747
00:41:39,160 --> 00:41:43,720
Speaker 1: at six pm Pacific nine pm Eastern time on on HBO,

748
00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:48,680
Speaker 1: was Marty Blazer. And I met. I met Marty Blazer

749
00:41:49,440 --> 00:41:53,520
Speaker 1: because yes, because he was so I played, I came

750
00:41:53,560 --> 00:41:56,640
Speaker 1: out and was drafted with a guy named Rashin Mathis

751
00:41:57,600 --> 00:42:03,680
Speaker 1: and and Marty Blazer was Rashei Mathis is uh financial advisor,

752
00:42:04,280 --> 00:42:09,799
Speaker 1: and Marty lived in Atlanta, I believe and um and

753
00:42:09,880 --> 00:42:13,279
Speaker 1: so uh Reshine started saying, yeah, dude, Marty is doing

754
00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:15,160
Speaker 1: all these great things, great things, blah blah blah. And

755
00:42:15,280 --> 00:42:16,839
Speaker 1: then I met him a couple of times. I thought

756
00:42:16,840 --> 00:42:19,759
Speaker 1: about moving my money over there where in the dock.

757
00:42:19,840 --> 00:42:23,440
Speaker 1: It didn't really well when it didn't necessarily show that

758
00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:26,520
Speaker 1: Marty was really big in the football world, like he

759
00:42:26,600 --> 00:42:30,879
Speaker 1: had a lot of NFL clients and so those were

760
00:42:30,880 --> 00:42:35,719
Speaker 1: the people that he mainly defrauded, and he and just

761
00:42:35,760 --> 00:42:38,359
Speaker 1: the fact that he stole all these millions and then

762
00:42:38,880 --> 00:42:41,800
Speaker 1: like this is how this whole investigation started. Was Marty

763
00:42:41,840 --> 00:42:44,960
Speaker 1: trying to get out of jail, and ultimately he got

764
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:48,600
Speaker 1: out of jail for sending Christian Dawkins and some low

765
00:42:48,719 --> 00:42:52,680
Speaker 1: level people to jail. Like it just didn't make sense

766
00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:59,240
Speaker 1: to me, concocting a ridiculous scenario that really, these guys

767
00:42:59,800 --> 00:43:02,520
Speaker 1: you discussed on wire taps time and time again again

768
00:43:02,520 --> 00:43:04,239
Speaker 1: not knowing that they were being recorded, that they don't

769
00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:07,320
Speaker 1: want to do yep. But the whole business model that

770
00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:11,120
Speaker 1: that was kind of created by the FBI, that was

771
00:43:11,160 --> 00:43:14,880
Speaker 1: initiated by Marty Blazer was ridiculous. And it makes sense

772
00:43:14,920 --> 00:43:17,480
Speaker 1: because you know, I listened to Marty Blazer testified. I

773
00:43:17,520 --> 00:43:19,680
Speaker 1: think he testified for five days in the second trial,

774
00:43:20,640 --> 00:43:23,000
Speaker 1: and sitting there, he was very very clear he knew

775
00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:28,160
Speaker 1: nothing about how the basketball world worked. Yes, so so

776
00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:33,200
Speaker 1: did it felt the wire taps. Listening to the wired

777
00:43:33,600 --> 00:43:36,560
Speaker 1: wire taps, I thought you did a great job displaying

778
00:43:36,640 --> 00:43:40,680
Speaker 1: like what people knew, and how many times Christian Dawkins

779
00:43:40,719 --> 00:43:43,359
Speaker 1: tried to tell them I don't want to do this,

780
00:43:43,360 --> 00:43:46,160
Speaker 1: this is not the way it works. And it almost

781
00:43:46,160 --> 00:43:49,359
Speaker 1: felt like entrapment because they tried to get something that

782
00:43:49,400 --> 00:43:54,440
Speaker 1: he wasn't even willing to do. Yeah, exactly exactly, And

783
00:43:54,480 --> 00:43:56,160
Speaker 1: it was you know that that was a big question

784
00:43:56,239 --> 00:43:59,920
Speaker 1: I had early on looking at everything, and Christians lawyer,

785
00:43:59,920 --> 00:44:02,440
Speaker 1: I think came up with the best explanation of it

786
00:44:02,480 --> 00:44:05,439
Speaker 1: was that it's it's you can't call it entrapment, because

787
00:44:05,440 --> 00:44:07,080
Speaker 1: the point is they would say that this is something

788
00:44:07,120 --> 00:44:09,040
Speaker 1: that you would have to prove that this was behavior

789
00:44:09,080 --> 00:44:14,040
Speaker 1: that he had not otherwise been likely to participate in, right,

790
00:44:14,080 --> 00:44:18,880
Speaker 1: and because Christian had paid people before, they couldn't necessarily

791
00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:24,560
Speaker 1: make that argument. But I mean, it's I would assume

792
00:44:24,600 --> 00:44:27,759
Speaker 1: that any any objective person watching it would say this

793
00:44:27,800 --> 00:44:31,359
Speaker 1: is close to coming to entrapmanated he could possibly get Yeah,

794
00:44:31,440 --> 00:44:34,520
Speaker 1: I totally totally agree. Um. I want to talk real

795
00:44:34,640 --> 00:44:37,719
Speaker 1: quick about the two college coaches that were will will three.

796
00:44:37,760 --> 00:44:41,120
Speaker 1: We already covered Rick pu Patino, who who ultimately ended

797
00:44:41,200 --> 00:44:45,920
Speaker 1: up getting fired, but Sean Sean Miller at Arizona and

798
00:44:45,920 --> 00:44:49,240
Speaker 1: Will Wait at LS you who are clearly on wire

799
00:44:49,239 --> 00:44:53,440
Speaker 1: taps talking about this, and but other coaches were on

800
00:44:53,480 --> 00:44:57,319
Speaker 1: wire taps too. But why why do you think that

801
00:44:57,400 --> 00:45:02,520
Speaker 1: the federal government kept, you know, like UM, kept saying

802
00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:07,279
Speaker 1: no to the subpoenas for the wire taps in the trials. Why, like,

803
00:45:07,320 --> 00:45:11,080
Speaker 1: why do you think that that the government wanted this

804
00:45:11,320 --> 00:45:16,480
Speaker 1: push could boss so badly? That's the biggest question of

805
00:45:16,520 --> 00:45:20,080
Speaker 1: this entire thing for me. When when we started digging

806
00:45:20,080 --> 00:45:22,200
Speaker 1: in and we got all of the the evidence that

807
00:45:22,280 --> 00:45:26,759
Speaker 1: was collected and that was presented in discovery um publicly

808
00:45:27,160 --> 00:45:29,120
Speaker 1: in these trials, that we could break it down and

809
00:45:29,160 --> 00:45:31,440
Speaker 1: listen to all of that and look at it, it

810
00:45:31,520 --> 00:45:35,359
Speaker 1: was very very clear putting everything together was like, wait

811
00:45:35,400 --> 00:45:39,600
Speaker 1: a second, what this changed? Right there? The trajectory of

812
00:45:39,600 --> 00:45:43,200
Speaker 1: this entire investigation from the very beginning was taking down

813
00:45:43,360 --> 00:45:46,880
Speaker 1: major D one coaches, potential Hall of Fame coaches. That

814
00:45:46,960 --> 00:45:48,759
Speaker 1: was the whole point. That's why they spent three years

815
00:45:48,800 --> 00:45:51,680
Speaker 1: and millions of dollars at taxpayers money to do this.

816
00:45:52,000 --> 00:45:55,440
Speaker 1: They were going to take down huge name coaches. And

817
00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:58,040
Speaker 1: then not only did they not do that, but at

818
00:45:58,040 --> 00:46:00,200
Speaker 1: a certain point in the investigation they do a one

819
00:46:00,239 --> 00:46:03,840
Speaker 1: eight and they go away from their intendedive objective of

820
00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:11,240
Speaker 1: taking them down two protecting them ultimately. So we knew

821
00:46:11,280 --> 00:46:15,200
Speaker 1: that there was wire taps of multiple coaches, and there's

822
00:46:15,320 --> 00:46:18,920
Speaker 1: three that we put into the dock that are from

823
00:46:18,920 --> 00:46:21,799
Speaker 1: my understanding is they're technically under seal. They've never been

824
00:46:21,800 --> 00:46:24,319
Speaker 1: played in in a court room publicly. They've never been

825
00:46:24,320 --> 00:46:26,640
Speaker 1: played anywhere publicly that I as far as I know,

826
00:46:27,640 --> 00:46:30,480
Speaker 1: and we had multiple sources that gave us those I've

827
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:33,280
Speaker 1: been told there's a lot more with with those coaches

828
00:46:33,320 --> 00:46:36,120
Speaker 1: and with other coaches. I haven't been able to corroborate

829
00:46:36,200 --> 00:46:38,399
Speaker 1: the number and exactly what it's being said on them.

830
00:46:38,880 --> 00:46:42,200
Speaker 1: But the reason that I wanted those calls in there

831
00:46:42,800 --> 00:46:47,239
Speaker 1: was not to necessarily be salacious regarding those coaches, but

832
00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:51,799
Speaker 1: it was to show they had evidence, and I think

833
00:46:51,800 --> 00:46:56,680
Speaker 1: objectively strong evidence against these coaches. And not only did

834
00:46:56,680 --> 00:46:59,920
Speaker 1: they not charge them, but they protected them. They did

835
00:47:00,120 --> 00:47:04,920
Speaker 1: night those being played publicly. They blocked subpoenas to get

836
00:47:04,960 --> 00:47:08,040
Speaker 1: these coaches to come into the courtroom and testify. And

837
00:47:08,080 --> 00:47:09,759
Speaker 1: I mean, what was gonna happen if they walked in

838
00:47:09,800 --> 00:47:13,560
Speaker 1: and testified. It wasn't gonna be Christian Dawkins's attorneys trying

839
00:47:13,600 --> 00:47:15,759
Speaker 1: to get these coaches in trouble. It was gonna they

840
00:47:15,760 --> 00:47:19,080
Speaker 1: were gonna ask him, Hey, did Christian Dawkins ever bribe you? Right? Like?

841
00:47:19,160 --> 00:47:20,759
Speaker 1: That was gonna be the whole point. But the fact

842
00:47:20,800 --> 00:47:22,520
Speaker 1: that they wouldn't even let them step foot in the

843
00:47:22,520 --> 00:47:25,840
Speaker 1: courtroom after three years of trying to put them in

844
00:47:25,840 --> 00:47:29,359
Speaker 1: the courtroom and put them in jail. UM didn't make

845
00:47:29,360 --> 00:47:31,279
Speaker 1: any sense to me. And I still don't know why

846
00:47:31,360 --> 00:47:34,600
Speaker 1: that was the case, But that became the biggest most

847
00:47:34,640 --> 00:47:38,719
Speaker 1: intriguing question I think in this entire thing. Why why

848
00:47:38,760 --> 00:47:42,319
Speaker 1: did this change? That was a decree from from from

849
00:47:42,360 --> 00:47:47,680
Speaker 1: on high? And yeah, I wondered. I wonder though, like

850
00:47:47,840 --> 00:47:52,680
Speaker 1: how much did this name image and likeness because because

851
00:47:52,800 --> 00:47:56,880
Speaker 1: this could what Christian Dawkins was doing, paying the players,

852
00:47:56,920 --> 00:47:59,040
Speaker 1: are using his influence to help them go to certain

853
00:47:59,040 --> 00:48:02,360
Speaker 1: schools and then signed later with the agent Andy Miller,

854
00:48:02,440 --> 00:48:05,719
Speaker 1: and you know other six situations. I just found it

855
00:48:06,200 --> 00:48:09,040
Speaker 1: that I just looked at the tie in with the name,

856
00:48:09,160 --> 00:48:13,680
Speaker 1: image and Likeness legislation legislation which that would clearly fall

857
00:48:13,840 --> 00:48:17,160
Speaker 1: fall under. And I'm just wondering, what do you think

858
00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:22,000
Speaker 1: about the name image likeness legislation as it relates to

859
00:48:22,080 --> 00:48:25,799
Speaker 1: these trials where the um where the subpoenas for the

860
00:48:25,840 --> 00:48:28,080
Speaker 1: coaches weren't allowed, Like do you think that any of

861
00:48:28,120 --> 00:48:31,680
Speaker 1: this is tied in behind the scenes. I don't know

862
00:48:31,719 --> 00:48:34,120
Speaker 1: if it isn't. I mean, somebody stopped it there's no

863
00:48:34,160 --> 00:48:38,080
Speaker 1: two ways about that. Somebody stopped it and and completely

864
00:48:38,120 --> 00:48:42,279
Speaker 1: shifted the direction of the investigation and the direction of

865
00:48:42,280 --> 00:48:46,480
Speaker 1: the prosecution clearly, very very clearly. And that was again like,

866
00:48:46,560 --> 00:48:49,200
Speaker 1: that is the point that we that is why we

867
00:48:49,200 --> 00:48:52,200
Speaker 1: put those calls in there to show, Look, they have evidence.

868
00:48:52,719 --> 00:48:56,120
Speaker 1: They they have lots of wire typs of Christian Dawkins

869
00:48:56,520 --> 00:49:03,319
Speaker 1: talking specifically about money and paying players, and and so

870
00:49:03,360 --> 00:49:07,200
Speaker 1: that it was so strange to me that that changed,

871
00:49:07,480 --> 00:49:10,960
Speaker 1: and then magically the calls are placed under seal. The

872
00:49:11,080 --> 00:49:13,359
Speaker 1: n c A supposedly is not allowed to get them,

873
00:49:13,360 --> 00:49:15,200
Speaker 1: even though I don't believe for a second to after

874
00:49:15,200 --> 00:49:17,000
Speaker 1: you want to hear any of that they and they

875
00:49:17,040 --> 00:49:20,680
Speaker 1: certainly don't want it to come out. But clearly somebody,

876
00:49:20,719 --> 00:49:22,719
Speaker 1: and Christian says in the dock, it's a cover up.

877
00:49:22,719 --> 00:49:25,480
Speaker 1: And it's hard to argue that point because you just

878
00:49:25,520 --> 00:49:28,880
Speaker 1: don't know what happened, and people are preventing that information

879
00:49:29,480 --> 00:49:31,560
Speaker 1: from getting out, and they're preventing that question from really

880
00:49:31,560 --> 00:49:35,279
Speaker 1: being answered in any sort of detailed way. UM. So

881
00:49:35,400 --> 00:49:37,279
Speaker 1: I I just don't know why they did it, but

882
00:49:37,360 --> 00:49:42,040
Speaker 1: I think that that question um probably looms largest over

883
00:49:42,080 --> 00:49:44,560
Speaker 1: this entire thing there's plenty of other questions that come up,

884
00:49:45,280 --> 00:49:48,160
Speaker 1: and you know, after after you get the context and

885
00:49:48,200 --> 00:49:50,799
Speaker 1: you can see exactly what happened and how this unfolded.

886
00:49:51,120 --> 00:49:53,399
Speaker 1: I think we answer a lot of questions in the dock,

887
00:49:53,480 --> 00:49:55,440
Speaker 1: but I think at the end of it, we we

888
00:49:55,560 --> 00:49:58,360
Speaker 1: probably ask a couple of really big questions that we

889
00:49:58,400 --> 00:50:01,640
Speaker 1: just can't answer. Yes. And so I have two questions

890
00:50:01,920 --> 00:50:04,719
Speaker 1: about that. Which which is two of the questions that

891
00:50:04,760 --> 00:50:07,319
Speaker 1: I were left with. Which was a point that you

892
00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:11,520
Speaker 1: guys made in the dock, was that where Jim Gotto

893
00:50:11,760 --> 00:50:16,319
Speaker 1: and Merrill Colde from Adidas both got prison. Uh, they

894
00:50:16,320 --> 00:50:20,120
Speaker 1: both were charged and convicted. But I just thought, and

895
00:50:20,160 --> 00:50:25,600
Speaker 1: then Adidas is a is in bed with uh Louisville,

896
00:50:25,880 --> 00:50:28,800
Speaker 1: and so are these other schools that have these huge

897
00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:33,239
Speaker 1: contracts and like. And that's where I always say, who

898
00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:37,799
Speaker 1: do you work for? Because does does Lebron James work

899
00:50:37,840 --> 00:50:41,440
Speaker 1: for the NBA or does he work for Nike? He

900
00:50:41,520 --> 00:50:46,080
Speaker 1: works for Nike, right and and and and so there

901
00:50:46,160 --> 00:50:49,239
Speaker 1: was one name that was not brought up in the

902
00:50:49,280 --> 00:50:54,840
Speaker 1: documentary that I wondered why or why not? Which is Nike?

903
00:50:55,280 --> 00:50:58,280
Speaker 1: The name Nike as it related two of this, because

904
00:50:58,280 --> 00:51:00,080
Speaker 1: I know that in the I believe the set and

905
00:51:00,200 --> 00:51:02,440
Speaker 1: trial that there was some talk about it. Then you

906
00:51:02,480 --> 00:51:06,400
Speaker 1: have Michael Avanadi, the lawyer trying to extort Nike. Like

907
00:51:06,520 --> 00:51:09,759
Speaker 1: what happened with Nike? Why was it necessarily excluded from it?

908
00:51:09,920 --> 00:51:14,440
Speaker 1: Even UH excluded from the documentary as much as Adidas

909
00:51:14,680 --> 00:51:17,080
Speaker 1: was or is it just because Jim Gotto and and

910
00:51:17,200 --> 00:51:21,440
Speaker 1: co got prisonsons? It was because there was more evidence

911
00:51:21,520 --> 00:51:24,719
Speaker 1: that was directly connected to Christian those cases that we

912
00:51:24,719 --> 00:51:29,040
Speaker 1: could access with Adidas. Um, the Nike thing was it

913
00:51:29,080 --> 00:51:30,799
Speaker 1: was brought up I think in the second trial just

914
00:51:30,840 --> 00:51:35,680
Speaker 1: in relation to Zion Williamson and some alleged offers that

915
00:51:35,680 --> 00:51:40,960
Speaker 1: that were made UH for his family. But um, there

916
00:51:41,000 --> 00:51:43,440
Speaker 1: wasn't much that came up in these first two trials

917
00:51:43,520 --> 00:51:49,040
Speaker 1: regarding Nike with Christian Avanati thing. The crazy irony of

918
00:51:49,080 --> 00:51:51,920
Speaker 1: this is right, like they go after Jim Gotto, they

919
00:51:51,920 --> 00:51:54,920
Speaker 1: sentenced him to nine months in prison for for basically

920
00:51:55,640 --> 00:51:57,719
Speaker 1: giving a kid a scholarship so that it goes to

921
00:51:57,760 --> 00:52:01,399
Speaker 1: a school that Adidas is already sponsoring. UH. In any

922
00:52:01,400 --> 00:52:04,520
Speaker 1: other situation, that's a great deal for everybody, But in

923
00:52:04,560 --> 00:52:07,000
Speaker 1: this particular situation, the federal government thought that was a

924
00:52:07,040 --> 00:52:11,000
Speaker 1: peony Um. But in the Aubenati case, Nike, they they

925
00:52:11,080 --> 00:52:14,640
Speaker 1: pretty much openly admit to all the same things that

926
00:52:14,680 --> 00:52:18,920
Speaker 1: the Southern District just went after Adidas war. So there's clearly,

927
00:52:18,960 --> 00:52:22,240
Speaker 1: in my mind like there's selective prosecution across the board

928
00:52:22,280 --> 00:52:26,279
Speaker 1: in this thing. And I mean whether it's Nike and

929
00:52:26,640 --> 00:52:29,400
Speaker 1: Adidas and and one being charged and they're not being charged,

930
00:52:29,520 --> 00:52:31,480
Speaker 1: or if it's look at the way that the coaches

931
00:52:31,520 --> 00:52:33,360
Speaker 1: are treated and protected. Right, you have Will Wade and

932
00:52:33,360 --> 00:52:37,120
Speaker 1: Sean Miller, who who the Southern District fights to prevent

933
00:52:37,160 --> 00:52:40,040
Speaker 1: them from stepping foot into the courtroom and blocks those

934
00:52:40,040 --> 00:52:43,960
Speaker 1: coach those calls from coming out publicly, Yet they destroy

935
00:52:44,120 --> 00:52:48,200
Speaker 1: Christian Dawkins publicly. Right, there's clearly a difference in treatment

936
00:52:48,200 --> 00:52:50,760
Speaker 1: between somebody like Christian Dawkins and Sean Miller. Will Wade.

937
00:52:51,320 --> 00:52:53,400
Speaker 1: You can point a race, you can point to resources,

938
00:52:53,440 --> 00:52:56,480
Speaker 1: you can point the power, whatever it is. You cannot

939
00:52:56,520 --> 00:52:58,319
Speaker 1: tell me with the straight face that those guys are

940
00:52:58,360 --> 00:53:02,600
Speaker 1: being treated equally in the eyes of the criminal justice system. No,

941
00:53:03,000 --> 00:53:06,720
Speaker 1: I've I looked at this and as a person who's

942
00:53:06,760 --> 00:53:10,360
Speaker 1: around sports and has a son who's an eighth grader,

943
00:53:10,440 --> 00:53:13,200
Speaker 1: know a lot of the top kids around because my

944
00:53:13,200 --> 00:53:17,399
Speaker 1: my son goes to see her Kenyon and so, and

945
00:53:17,560 --> 00:53:23,479
Speaker 1: you know who's who's up there and so and being

946
00:53:23,520 --> 00:53:30,319
Speaker 1: around the college, I'm sorry, the recruiting game for UH football, basketball, baseball.

947
00:53:30,840 --> 00:53:33,239
Speaker 1: Being around it, I can tell you for sure that

948
00:53:33,400 --> 00:53:38,200
Speaker 1: nothing has changed, that nothing has taken, That this child

949
00:53:38,280 --> 00:53:40,640
Speaker 1: didn't stop anything. It didn't change it. I just hope

950
00:53:40,680 --> 00:53:44,200
Speaker 1: that the name, image, likeness stuff comes UH comes up

951
00:53:44,239 --> 00:53:47,560
Speaker 1: by well, that it comes through correctly, and that the

952
00:53:47,760 --> 00:53:51,680
Speaker 1: States don't let this just pass. But the but but Pat,

953
00:53:51,680 --> 00:53:53,799
Speaker 1: I want to thank you for your time today. But

954
00:53:53,840 --> 00:53:56,520
Speaker 1: I do have one more question and then it's about

955
00:53:56,600 --> 00:54:00,880
Speaker 1: Christie Dawkins. And I looked at it, and this dude

956
00:54:00,920 --> 00:54:03,680
Speaker 1: has done a lot, and I looked, he's twenty five.

957
00:54:04,200 --> 00:54:08,040
Speaker 1: He's twenty five years old. He looks like the Doogie

958
00:54:08,080 --> 00:54:14,720
Speaker 1: Houser of sports. He was getting he was getting coaches

959
00:54:14,760 --> 00:54:16,600
Speaker 1: to pay him six hundred bucks I think when he

960
00:54:16,680 --> 00:54:20,000
Speaker 1: was twelve years old. Like this kid is a savant

961
00:54:20,840 --> 00:54:25,719
Speaker 1: and and like I'm like, he's not a criminal mastermind,

962
00:54:25,760 --> 00:54:29,480
Speaker 1: he's Bill Gates, Like he has that type of potential.

963
00:54:29,680 --> 00:54:33,360
Speaker 1: That's what I thought. What was your take on him personally?

964
00:54:33,520 --> 00:54:37,480
Speaker 1: His intelligence? And his future, whether it's in music, signing,

965
00:54:37,800 --> 00:54:41,520
Speaker 1: the deal with Atlantic Records and all of that. Christian

966
00:54:41,680 --> 00:54:44,200
Speaker 1: is a He is a one of a kind character,

967
00:54:44,880 --> 00:54:49,800
Speaker 1: a very very unique individual, a very very intelligent individual. Um.

968
00:54:49,840 --> 00:54:53,480
Speaker 1: He is very very mature for his age. He is

969
00:54:54,040 --> 00:54:58,759
Speaker 1: unbelievably funny, self deprecating. Um. But but I think, you know,

970
00:54:58,800 --> 00:55:02,640
Speaker 1: one of the best qualities I think of Christian and

971
00:55:03,040 --> 00:55:06,080
Speaker 1: looking at him within this context of the sports world

972
00:55:06,120 --> 00:55:08,279
Speaker 1: and the recruiting an agent world and all of that,

973
00:55:08,840 --> 00:55:12,240
Speaker 1: where greed is always there and normally people are stepping

974
00:55:12,239 --> 00:55:15,399
Speaker 1: on other people's heads to get ahead themselves. We never

975
00:55:15,440 --> 00:55:18,640
Speaker 1: found any evidence of Christian doing that. In fact, it

976
00:55:18,719 --> 00:55:22,000
Speaker 1: was always him making a move or making a deal

977
00:55:22,600 --> 00:55:26,160
Speaker 1: that benefited everybody so everybody could win. And there was

978
00:55:26,200 --> 00:55:30,680
Speaker 1: something admirable I think within the again the world of sports, um,

979
00:55:30,719 --> 00:55:33,120
Speaker 1: that he was doing that over time and time again.

980
00:55:33,680 --> 00:55:35,319
Speaker 1: And you can hear him here like, you know, my

981
00:55:35,400 --> 00:55:37,480
Speaker 1: investors they want to pay you here, I'm just trying

982
00:55:37,480 --> 00:55:39,359
Speaker 1: to get some money in your pocket. You've helped me out,

983
00:55:39,719 --> 00:55:41,600
Speaker 1: I'm gonna help you out. You know. It was a

984
00:55:41,680 --> 00:55:47,360
Speaker 1: very uh interesting to learn that about him, and especially

985
00:55:47,400 --> 00:55:49,920
Speaker 1: at such a young age. The connections that he had

986
00:55:50,080 --> 00:55:53,520
Speaker 1: had forged the relationships that he had. He's a very

987
00:55:53,640 --> 00:55:57,680
Speaker 1: very impressive individual, and I think he's uh. I think

988
00:55:57,719 --> 00:56:00,600
Speaker 1: he's going to be wildly successful in his in his life.

989
00:56:01,200 --> 00:56:03,880
Speaker 1: I think the question that people would have is how

990
00:56:03,920 --> 00:56:08,840
Speaker 1: in the hell was he able to forge these relationships

991
00:56:08,840 --> 00:56:11,759
Speaker 1: that people pay millions and millions of dollars to get? Like,

992
00:56:11,840 --> 00:56:16,440
Speaker 1: how was he able to Like you saw in the documentary,

993
00:56:16,560 --> 00:56:19,520
Speaker 1: Fred van Fleet talked about how much he trusts him.

994
00:56:19,600 --> 00:56:22,680
Speaker 1: Like guys that I've asked about, they like this dude steal.

995
00:56:23,120 --> 00:56:25,080
Speaker 1: They don't believe he's a crook. They don't believe he's

996
00:56:25,080 --> 00:56:27,359
Speaker 1: a criminal. They think he's a good guy, Like they

997
00:56:27,400 --> 00:56:30,440
Speaker 1: would trust him to manage them now. But it's but

998
00:56:30,520 --> 00:56:34,960
Speaker 1: he's per sonna non grata in the basketball world. It's

999
00:56:34,960 --> 00:56:36,759
Speaker 1: funny you bring up Fred van elite like Fritz So

1000
00:56:36,880 --> 00:56:39,400
Speaker 1: Fred Fred has his own like clothing line and his

1001
00:56:39,480 --> 00:56:42,400
Speaker 1: slogan has bet on yourself. He got that from Christian

1002
00:56:43,520 --> 00:56:46,439
Speaker 1: the night of the draft. Christian was saying, Hey, there's

1003
00:56:46,440 --> 00:56:47,920
Speaker 1: some offers, but they want you to go to the

1004
00:56:48,000 --> 00:56:50,040
Speaker 1: D League. I don't think you should do it. I

1005
00:56:50,040 --> 00:56:52,040
Speaker 1: think you should wait. We can do this bet on

1006
00:56:52,080 --> 00:56:55,080
Speaker 1: yourself and like that stuck with him to the point

1007
00:56:55,120 --> 00:56:58,200
Speaker 1: that that's become his own mantra that a twenty two

1008
00:56:58,280 --> 00:57:00,640
Speaker 1: year old kid said to him on the phone who

1009
00:57:00,680 --> 00:57:02,480
Speaker 1: was acting as his agent. Even though the twenty two

1010
00:57:02,520 --> 00:57:04,200
Speaker 1: year old kid had never taken a license, it never

1011
00:57:04,200 --> 00:57:06,799
Speaker 1: passed the exam to become an agent. He's the one

1012
00:57:06,880 --> 00:57:10,200
Speaker 1: doing all of these deals at two. Dude, he's like

1013
00:57:10,320 --> 00:57:16,640
Speaker 1: the lawyer in suits. He's he's really impressive. But I

1014
00:57:16,640 --> 00:57:19,200
Speaker 1: think I think what what helps him be so successful,

1015
00:57:19,240 --> 00:57:21,800
Speaker 1: as to your point, is that he he understands how

1016
00:57:21,840 --> 00:57:24,400
Speaker 1: to read people and he figures out a way very

1017
00:57:24,480 --> 00:57:27,520
Speaker 1: quickly that too, so that they can benefit while he

1018
00:57:27,560 --> 00:57:30,520
Speaker 1: benefits as well, so that everybody wins. And that's a

1019
00:57:30,640 --> 00:57:33,760
Speaker 1: that's a pretty important commodity to have in business. Yeah,

1020
00:57:33,880 --> 00:57:36,880
Speaker 1: and he's involved in in music. Now do you I

1021
00:57:37,320 --> 00:57:40,000
Speaker 1: I feel like he belongs in sports. Do you think

1022
00:57:40,040 --> 00:57:42,920
Speaker 1: that there's any path for him to get back into

1023
00:57:43,560 --> 00:57:48,360
Speaker 1: the sports world, and if so, when and how. If

1024
00:57:48,400 --> 00:57:52,360
Speaker 1: there is a path, Christian will find it. If there's

1025
00:57:52,400 --> 00:57:54,880
Speaker 1: if there's a way to make something happen, he will

1026
00:57:54,880 --> 00:57:58,680
Speaker 1: find that way, no doubt about it. Did you guys

1027
00:57:58,720 --> 00:58:02,360
Speaker 1: suffer any law suits and like people trying to like

1028
00:58:02,440 --> 00:58:04,400
Speaker 1: what were some of the obstacles they were trying to

1029
00:58:04,400 --> 00:58:07,160
Speaker 1: stop you as you'd say, not yet. I mean the

1030
00:58:07,160 --> 00:58:08,920
Speaker 1: big the biggest thing that we had was just nobody

1031
00:58:08,960 --> 00:58:11,360
Speaker 1: would talk. You know. That's why we only have I

1032
00:58:11,400 --> 00:58:13,360
Speaker 1: don't know, there's six or seven people I think interviewed

1033
00:58:13,400 --> 00:58:16,720
Speaker 1: total in the dock, which is probably the smallest number

1034
00:58:16,720 --> 00:58:20,400
Speaker 1: of subjects that I've ever interviewed for something like this. Um,

1035
00:58:20,520 --> 00:58:24,280
Speaker 1: nobody would talk. Um. You know, there's lots of different

1036
00:58:24,280 --> 00:58:26,480
Speaker 1: reasons for that, but that was that was surprising. I mean,

1037
00:58:26,520 --> 00:58:28,360
Speaker 1: it's always difficult to get people to sit down in

1038
00:58:28,400 --> 00:58:30,880
Speaker 1: front of a camera and give their perspective, and there's

1039
00:58:30,880 --> 00:58:33,720
Speaker 1: side of a story, especially something like this that it was,

1040
00:58:33,880 --> 00:58:36,240
Speaker 1: you know, kind of a traumatic experience for so many people.

1041
00:58:36,320 --> 00:58:41,160
Speaker 1: But it's very very difficult people to talk well well

1042
00:58:41,200 --> 00:58:44,440
Speaker 1: because when you when you do talk, you essentially exile

1043
00:58:45,480 --> 00:58:48,480
Speaker 1: yourself if you are snitching on other people. Like I

1044
00:58:48,520 --> 00:58:51,520
Speaker 1: remember a number of years ago when they were talking

1045
00:58:51,560 --> 00:58:54,640
Speaker 1: about college, they were talking about tyler athletes being paid,

1046
00:58:55,120 --> 00:58:58,560
Speaker 1: particularly in football. I think somebody called me it might

1047
00:58:58,600 --> 00:59:00,720
Speaker 1: it might have been an HBO reals court story or

1048
00:59:00,720 --> 00:59:03,360
Speaker 1: something they called me and they asked me about Oregon.

1049
00:59:03,600 --> 00:59:05,960
Speaker 1: They're like George and he knows where the bodies are

1050
00:59:05,960 --> 00:59:08,640
Speaker 1: buried this and that may have been a part of this,

1051
00:59:09,600 --> 00:59:11,800
Speaker 1: because there were some things that happened at school that

1052
00:59:11,880 --> 00:59:17,280
Speaker 1: probably lend lended itself to that probably possibly being true.

1053
00:59:17,920 --> 00:59:20,960
Speaker 1: And I was just like, you got the wrong guy.

1054
00:59:21,600 --> 00:59:25,600
Speaker 1: I was like, if you're if you're expecting to call me,

1055
00:59:26,200 --> 00:59:29,680
Speaker 1: who still goes up to Oregon, gets gets favors, just

1056
00:59:29,840 --> 00:59:32,160
Speaker 1: treated very well, got put in the Hall of fame,

1057
00:59:32,360 --> 00:59:35,080
Speaker 1: like if you and he's doing well, if you think

1058
00:59:35,120 --> 00:59:38,200
Speaker 1: that I'm the guy that talked to you have found

1059
00:59:38,280 --> 00:59:41,360
Speaker 1: and and who will take down the Oregon program, which

1060
00:59:41,440 --> 00:59:47,920
Speaker 1: I loved with every ounce of my being. No, sorry, you,

1061
00:59:47,760 --> 00:59:50,640
Speaker 1: you might as well never call me again about this

1062
00:59:50,720 --> 00:59:53,680
Speaker 1: because I will not be that guy. So I know

1063
00:59:53,840 --> 00:59:56,600
Speaker 1: nothing actually, and and and that were if and that

1064
00:59:56,680 --> 01:00:00,720
Speaker 1: were if I did know anything, which I don't know anything. Yeah,

1065
01:00:00,760 --> 01:00:02,160
Speaker 1: there was a lot of that. I mean, there was

1066
01:00:02,200 --> 01:00:03,760
Speaker 1: a there was a lot of the same stuff. And

1067
01:00:03,480 --> 01:00:06,320
Speaker 1: I get that. You know, we didn't want to our

1068
01:00:06,360 --> 01:00:07,960
Speaker 1: point too and this We didn't want to be trying

1069
01:00:08,000 --> 01:00:10,000
Speaker 1: to take down as many people as we could. Either,

1070
01:00:10,240 --> 01:00:13,400
Speaker 1: you know because I personally, I think the players should

1071
01:00:13,400 --> 01:00:15,440
Speaker 1: be getting getting paid. They should be able to make

1072
01:00:15,480 --> 01:00:18,160
Speaker 1: money off their their image and likeness, and you know,

1073
01:00:18,440 --> 01:00:22,000
Speaker 1: test out the free market with that. Um So we

1074
01:00:22,040 --> 01:00:24,360
Speaker 1: didn't want to. We didn't want to, even the coaches.

1075
01:00:24,400 --> 01:00:26,080
Speaker 1: And like you know, I don't really have a problem

1076
01:00:26,120 --> 01:00:29,400
Speaker 1: with what they did. My problem is that there's actually

1077
01:00:29,400 --> 01:00:32,080
Speaker 1: evidence that was collected in this case and then it

1078
01:00:32,160 --> 01:00:36,040
Speaker 1: was it was basically brushed under the rug. And I

1079
01:00:36,360 --> 01:00:39,760
Speaker 1: think that's wildly unfair. Yep. There is a free market

1080
01:00:39,920 --> 01:00:42,840
Speaker 1: for for ventilators right right now, but there's not a

1081
01:00:42,880 --> 01:00:46,160
Speaker 1: free market for college basketball player. Get out of here, dude,

1082
01:00:48,400 --> 01:00:51,280
Speaker 1: they think. Again. I appreciate it. I look forward to

1083
01:00:51,560 --> 01:00:54,240
Speaker 1: all the stuff that you that you do and put

1084
01:00:54,240 --> 01:00:57,000
Speaker 1: out and we'll be following you in super excited about this.

1085
01:00:57,880 --> 01:00:59,720
Speaker 1: Thank you so much, George. It was a pleasure talking

1086
01:00:59,720 --> 01:01:05,480
Speaker 1: to you. Alright. Okay too. If this whole thing started

1087
01:01:05,560 --> 01:01:10,000
Speaker 1: because of one guy in in an unrelated case, that's

1088
01:01:10,080 --> 01:01:15,000
Speaker 1: Marty Blazer, the financial guy who I knew. I knew

1089
01:01:15,000 --> 01:01:18,000
Speaker 1: Marty Blazer because he was one of my former teammates

1090
01:01:18,040 --> 01:01:21,440
Speaker 1: in Jacksonville who I got drafted with, who I trained with,

1091
01:01:21,480 --> 01:01:25,360
Speaker 1: before I drafted. He was Marty Blazer's client. Marty Blazer

1092
01:01:26,360 --> 01:01:28,800
Speaker 1: was not an NBA guy really, he was more in

1093
01:01:28,840 --> 01:01:32,640
Speaker 1: the NFL space of managing guy's money. And he stole

1094
01:01:32,720 --> 01:01:37,800
Speaker 1: money to make a Ving Rames movie that sucked. And

1095
01:01:37,840 --> 01:01:39,760
Speaker 1: then he was trying to use a get out of

1096
01:01:39,840 --> 01:01:43,640
Speaker 1: jail free card to say he knew some corruption going

1097
01:01:43,680 --> 01:01:46,840
Speaker 1: on in college basketball. And that's how this whole thing

1098
01:01:46,920 --> 01:01:49,640
Speaker 1: started because Marty Blazer was getting ready to go to jail.

1099
01:01:50,240 --> 01:01:55,040
Speaker 1: So after hearing the director talk, Ralph pat talk, after

1100
01:01:55,160 --> 01:02:01,200
Speaker 1: hearing after watching the scheme, who is the bad guy? Okay, Well,

1101
01:02:01,240 --> 01:02:05,880
Speaker 1: first of all, Marty Blazer sucks, right, that dude, that

1102
01:02:06,000 --> 01:02:09,880
Speaker 1: dude is the worst. I think that Christian Dawkins probably

1103
01:02:09,880 --> 01:02:13,400
Speaker 1: put it best, um and and that dude will get

1104
01:02:13,440 --> 01:02:16,880
Speaker 1: into Christian Dawkins in his dry sense of humor um

1105
01:02:16,920 --> 01:02:21,560
Speaker 1: in a little bit. But Marty Blazer stole from black

1106
01:02:21,600 --> 01:02:26,440
Speaker 1: men and got away with it because he put other

1107
01:02:26,520 --> 01:02:32,320
Speaker 1: black men in jail. That is that's that was my takeaway.

1108
01:02:32,360 --> 01:02:37,400
Speaker 1: This guy is a cancer. He is what you need

1109
01:02:37,520 --> 01:02:42,960
Speaker 1: and and it's twenty year jail sentence absolutely and he

1110
01:02:43,160 --> 01:02:48,120
Speaker 1: and and he ended up only getting probation back in February. Right,

1111
01:02:48,160 --> 01:02:50,880
Speaker 1: he so he is not going to do any jail

1112
01:02:50,920 --> 01:02:55,280
Speaker 1: time and he's filling millions of dollars right, And people

1113
01:02:55,320 --> 01:03:00,200
Speaker 1: who gave money away gave money away ended up doing

1114
01:03:00,280 --> 01:03:03,960
Speaker 1: jail time. So people who gave money away did jail time,

1115
01:03:04,000 --> 01:03:10,240
Speaker 1: and somebody who stole millions stole millions. Um, I will

1116
01:03:10,400 --> 01:03:12,520
Speaker 1: I It does sound to be like maybe you saw

1117
01:03:12,560 --> 01:03:17,000
Speaker 1: that Being Raimes movie. No oh no, I just I

1118
01:03:17,120 --> 01:03:19,560
Speaker 1: was like when they said he funded a movie, I

1119
01:03:19,600 --> 01:03:21,680
Speaker 1: was like, Okay. Then I saw Being Rams. I was like,

1120
01:03:21,680 --> 01:03:26,880
Speaker 1: this movie is terrible. Trailer, it sucks. Here's my biggest fear,

1121
01:03:26,880 --> 01:03:30,040
Speaker 1: because Marty Blazer is the worst. Marty Blazer might end

1122
01:03:30,120 --> 01:03:33,520
Speaker 1: up making money off this documentary because I am I

1123
01:03:33,640 --> 01:03:37,280
Speaker 1: cannot wait to go watch that movie. It looks so bad.

1124
01:03:38,320 --> 01:03:40,480
Speaker 1: And I'm like, man, am I putting money in Marty

1125
01:03:40,520 --> 01:03:43,720
Speaker 1: Blazer's pocket by seeking this out? So hopefully I can

1126
01:03:43,760 --> 01:03:48,720
Speaker 1: find a way to illegally download it allegedly. And uh,

1127
01:03:48,840 --> 01:03:50,480
Speaker 1: but I want to see it. It looks like I

1128
01:03:50,600 --> 01:03:52,640
Speaker 1: like that. I do. I do want to see it,

1129
01:03:52,640 --> 01:03:54,080
Speaker 1: but I don't want to put a dollar in that

1130
01:03:54,240 --> 01:03:57,240
Speaker 1: Krook's pocket. You're gonna have to call up some friends

1131
01:03:57,280 --> 01:04:03,440
Speaker 1: and be like, man, they stole your money for this dude. Um,

1132
01:04:03,480 --> 01:04:08,880
Speaker 1: So what was your takeaway of Christian Dawkins. I love

1133
01:04:08,960 --> 01:04:14,160
Speaker 1: the guy, honestly, like um that he has. He's definitely

1134
01:04:14,240 --> 01:04:20,240
Speaker 1: paid a heavy price um for uh, the rapidness of

1135
01:04:20,360 --> 01:04:26,360
Speaker 1: his ascension, But I like him. I like the man

1136
01:04:26,440 --> 01:04:30,480
Speaker 1: that that kid is all American, right, Yes, he's the

1137
01:04:30,560 --> 01:04:36,480
Speaker 1: definition of the American dream. All Americans like, this dude

1138
01:04:36,640 --> 01:04:41,360
Speaker 1: is going to be, if not a billionaire, a extremely

1139
01:04:41,640 --> 01:04:47,560
Speaker 1: successful person. He's he's twenty five. He could be president.

1140
01:04:48,400 --> 01:04:50,959
Speaker 1: He could be president because there's no rules anymore about

1141
01:04:51,000 --> 01:04:54,400
Speaker 1: who can be president, so he could be president. Like,

1142
01:04:54,600 --> 01:04:57,400
Speaker 1: this dude is the and he what did he say?

1143
01:04:57,480 --> 01:05:02,080
Speaker 1: He's on the level of of Malcolm Eggs and Gandhi

1144
01:05:02,160 --> 01:05:05,480
Speaker 1: and Martin Luther King and Dick Clark and his mom's

1145
01:05:05,520 --> 01:05:07,480
Speaker 1: like reading that list off and she's laughing about it.

1146
01:05:07,480 --> 01:05:10,160
Speaker 1: And I was like, maybe maybe he might be right.

1147
01:05:10,720 --> 01:05:13,640
Speaker 1: This dude had this Yes here, I know you're gonna

1148
01:05:13,640 --> 01:05:16,680
Speaker 1: bring up he had coaches paying him six hundred bucks

1149
01:05:16,720 --> 01:05:19,160
Speaker 1: at age twelve, and then he would but he was

1150
01:05:19,200 --> 01:05:22,640
Speaker 1: still doing twelve year old stuff like he ranked himself

1151
01:05:22,720 --> 01:05:27,920
Speaker 1: on his website as the number one player. Dude, his

1152
01:05:27,920 --> 01:05:30,560
Speaker 1: his mom he had checked showing up at the house

1153
01:05:30,600 --> 01:05:32,920
Speaker 1: and his mom was like, what is this for. He

1154
01:05:33,000 --> 01:05:35,080
Speaker 1: was like, oh, oh, that's for my business. She's like,

1155
01:05:35,120 --> 01:05:40,200
Speaker 1: what business, dude. I wish my kid would have checked

1156
01:05:40,240 --> 01:05:42,960
Speaker 1: showing showing up. I'd be like, hold on, kid, whatever

1157
01:05:43,240 --> 01:05:46,080
Speaker 1: you're doing, let's figure out how we can do this better,

1158
01:05:46,200 --> 01:05:48,920
Speaker 1: because I'm not gonna step in your way because you

1159
01:05:49,000 --> 01:05:51,560
Speaker 1: have clearly got something figured out. As long as it's

1160
01:05:51,560 --> 01:05:55,520
Speaker 1: not illegal, we're good, right. And in in America, there's

1161
01:05:55,560 --> 01:05:57,760
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff that you can do to make money.

1162
01:05:57,840 --> 01:06:01,600
Speaker 1: And if the rules are murky. If the rules are murky,

1163
01:06:01,640 --> 01:06:04,400
Speaker 1: then you just sort of you go through, you forge

1164
01:06:04,440 --> 01:06:07,080
Speaker 1: your own path and then you end up being the

1165
01:06:07,120 --> 01:06:10,040
Speaker 1: one who takes the hit if if people try to

1166
01:06:10,080 --> 01:06:12,040
Speaker 1: make new rules or something like that. I mean, this

1167
01:06:12,120 --> 01:06:15,160
Speaker 1: is the week where everyone in America, if they have Netflix,

1168
01:06:15,240 --> 01:06:18,680
Speaker 1: is binging Tiger King like and and we're and we're

1169
01:06:18,680 --> 01:06:22,640
Speaker 1: talking about Christian Dawkins on that level of of like

1170
01:06:23,960 --> 01:06:28,520
Speaker 1: of just entrepreneurial spirit, but Entiger King. People got killed,

1171
01:06:28,640 --> 01:06:32,520
Speaker 1: people got disappeared, you know, Uh, hit men were hired,

1172
01:06:32,600 --> 01:06:35,480
Speaker 1: drugs were used. All Christian Dawkins did was trying to

1173
01:06:35,480 --> 01:06:38,320
Speaker 1: make sure that kids were fairly compensated for their talents

1174
01:06:38,760 --> 01:06:44,280
Speaker 1: while using his entrepreneurial spirit to to to benefit himself

1175
01:06:44,280 --> 01:06:47,800
Speaker 1: and others in the process. Like I, if you're gonna

1176
01:06:47,880 --> 01:06:54,120
Speaker 1: be somebody who um who participates that fervently in capitalism,

1177
01:06:54,120 --> 01:06:57,280
Speaker 1: that you're willing to step over some lines, I mean,

1178
01:06:57,320 --> 01:06:59,320
Speaker 1: why not be a Robin Hood in the process. And

1179
01:06:59,320 --> 01:07:02,919
Speaker 1: then that's that's how I he is the victim? Like

1180
01:07:03,120 --> 01:07:05,720
Speaker 1: that that's the part I could not I still can't

1181
01:07:05,720 --> 01:07:08,680
Speaker 1: wrap myself around it. Who is the victim? What did

1182
01:07:08,760 --> 01:07:13,320
Speaker 1: Christian Dawkins do? Because if Google? Uh Dan Westl said

1183
01:07:13,320 --> 01:07:17,960
Speaker 1: it best in the documentary, Who if Google or Amazon

1184
01:07:18,080 --> 01:07:20,600
Speaker 1: went to a high school and said, look, we're gonna

1185
01:07:20,640 --> 01:07:24,000
Speaker 1: give you twenty k to come out be an intern

1186
01:07:24,480 --> 01:07:27,160
Speaker 1: in hopes that we can hire you again later after

1187
01:07:27,200 --> 01:07:30,440
Speaker 1: you get out of school, everybody would applaud it. And

1188
01:07:30,440 --> 01:07:33,320
Speaker 1: then if they did it for free, they'd be like, yo,

1189
01:07:33,400 --> 01:07:37,080
Speaker 1: that's a bad deal. And but then when it comes

1190
01:07:37,120 --> 01:07:41,120
Speaker 1: to young black men going to college and people making

1191
01:07:41,240 --> 01:07:44,480
Speaker 1: billions of dollars off of their name, image and likeness,

1192
01:07:44,520 --> 01:07:48,080
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, it's a problem. It's a crime, like,

1193
01:07:48,080 --> 01:07:53,080
Speaker 1: like Christian everybody who the fread band Fleet, even I've

1194
01:07:53,120 --> 01:07:55,840
Speaker 1: talked to other NBA players. I called him today and

1195
01:07:56,000 --> 01:07:57,800
Speaker 1: was like, Yo, wait, what what do you know about

1196
01:07:57,840 --> 01:07:59,640
Speaker 1: Christian Darks. They're like, oh, man, I like to do.

1197
01:08:00,200 --> 01:08:03,160
Speaker 1: He's good, He's trustworthy, good kling dude like and I

1198
01:08:03,200 --> 01:08:07,120
Speaker 1: was just sitting there like, Okay, if these dudes still

1199
01:08:07,160 --> 01:08:11,160
Speaker 1: trust him despite everything that everybody else is said, and

1200
01:08:11,400 --> 01:08:15,200
Speaker 1: everybody regards him as a good human being and that

1201
01:08:15,360 --> 01:08:18,280
Speaker 1: he hasn't like tried to get over on anybody. He

1202
01:08:18,320 --> 01:08:22,280
Speaker 1: was just trying to make sure everybody got something. Where's

1203
01:08:22,280 --> 01:08:26,559
Speaker 1: the victim? Ralph That That's the amazing part is So

1204
01:08:26,960 --> 01:08:30,920
Speaker 1: in order for the FBI to make their case, they

1205
01:08:31,000 --> 01:08:36,400
Speaker 1: needed someone to pin the torch on, like the harm, right,

1206
01:08:36,800 --> 01:08:42,919
Speaker 1: So they had to assign the harm for Adidas trying

1207
01:08:43,000 --> 01:08:46,840
Speaker 1: to guide an athlete to a school that they are

1208
01:08:46,880 --> 01:08:50,559
Speaker 1: already paying a hundred and sixty million dollars to by

1209
01:08:50,640 --> 01:08:53,880
Speaker 1: footing the bill for a hundred thousand dollars to get

1210
01:08:53,920 --> 01:08:58,480
Speaker 1: that kid to that school to kive Brian Brian Bowen. Yeah,

1211
01:08:58,720 --> 01:09:03,040
Speaker 1: So the FBI had to say that in the relationship

1212
01:09:03,240 --> 01:09:06,559
Speaker 1: of a school receiving both a hundred and sixty million

1213
01:09:06,600 --> 01:09:11,960
Speaker 1: dollars and a player who they paid a hundred thousand

1214
01:09:11,960 --> 01:09:14,840
Speaker 1: dollars to in order to go to that school to

1215
01:09:15,160 --> 01:09:19,160
Speaker 1: enhance that school's brand. The school is ultimately the victim.

1216
01:09:19,720 --> 01:09:26,439
Speaker 1: Oh and that was like, yeah, that's like, I mean

1217
01:09:26,520 --> 01:09:31,559
Speaker 1: that that that's amazing to me. That is amazing to me.

1218
01:09:32,000 --> 01:09:36,200
Speaker 1: That's like saying, like my dad's business, my dad pays

1219
01:09:36,320 --> 01:09:40,639
Speaker 1: payroll taxes just to be able to pay the people

1220
01:09:40,880 --> 01:09:44,599
Speaker 1: on his staff. And then when you get that pay

1221
01:09:44,800 --> 01:09:50,320
Speaker 1: from him, you also pay an income tax, so the

1222
01:09:50,439 --> 01:09:53,640
Speaker 1: government gets paid twice. That would be like saying, the

1223
01:09:53,680 --> 01:09:58,080
Speaker 1: government is the victim in that relationship. Yep, And we

1224
01:09:58,160 --> 01:10:01,640
Speaker 1: know the government and nobody's victim, right, And so how

1225
01:10:01,640 --> 01:10:04,760
Speaker 1: about the FBI? Man? What? And I feel stupid for

1226
01:10:04,760 --> 01:10:06,960
Speaker 1: tweeting us today because that's not gonna do me any good.

1227
01:10:07,320 --> 01:10:13,719
Speaker 1: But good lord, was this and inept over zealous, corny

1228
01:10:13,920 --> 01:10:21,080
Speaker 1: FBI investigation just terrible? Like the FBI came in completely

1229
01:10:21,360 --> 01:10:24,200
Speaker 1: unprepared for what it was that they were trying to pursue.

1230
01:10:24,560 --> 01:10:27,640
Speaker 1: They had an idea of what the crimes would be

1231
01:10:27,920 --> 01:10:31,519
Speaker 1: and would look like. And when they found their patsy

1232
01:10:31,680 --> 01:10:35,680
Speaker 1: to carry out um the elements of the investigation that

1233
01:10:35,800 --> 01:10:38,599
Speaker 1: they would need in order to bust a whole bunch

1234
01:10:38,600 --> 01:10:42,680
Speaker 1: of people. The person that they found, Christian Dawkins, repeatedly

1235
01:10:42,720 --> 01:10:45,599
Speaker 1: tried to tell them none of the things that you're

1236
01:10:45,680 --> 01:10:49,840
Speaker 1: angling for make any sense. And so then at some point,

1237
01:10:49,960 --> 01:10:55,240
Speaker 1: Christian Dawkins, in an attempt to protect the FBI from themselves,

1238
01:10:55,640 --> 01:10:59,160
Speaker 1: not knowing that they were the FBI, starts keeping the

1239
01:10:59,320 --> 01:11:05,000
Speaker 1: money so that the FBI can recoup their investment in

1240
01:11:05,280 --> 01:11:09,800
Speaker 1: his business. He's trying to be financially responsible on the

1241
01:11:09,880 --> 01:11:13,000
Speaker 1: part of the FBI. That's how stupid that they were being.

1242
01:11:13,479 --> 01:11:16,240
Speaker 1: And then and then, and we don't know because the

1243
01:11:16,320 --> 01:11:19,439
Speaker 1: FBI didn't participate in the documentary, won't produce any records.

1244
01:11:19,800 --> 01:11:22,479
Speaker 1: The guy that was the undercover agent that they were

1245
01:11:22,560 --> 01:11:26,519
Speaker 1: running everything through, his main investor, probably stole some of

1246
01:11:26,520 --> 01:11:32,680
Speaker 1: that cash, yes, and got fired and or prosecuted. I'm like,

1247
01:11:32,920 --> 01:11:36,080
Speaker 1: what are you doing? Like Christian Darkins is on tape

1248
01:11:36,080 --> 01:11:39,479
Speaker 1: saying this is a bad idea, This doesn't make sense.

1249
01:11:40,400 --> 01:11:43,120
Speaker 1: Why are you trying to do this? The coaches don't

1250
01:11:43,120 --> 01:11:44,920
Speaker 1: want to meet you, they don't want to see you.

1251
01:11:45,439 --> 01:11:48,640
Speaker 1: They this is not a good business. Model coaches are

1252
01:11:48,680 --> 01:11:52,479
Speaker 1: making millions giving them an extra fibers and grant. That's stupid,

1253
01:11:53,120 --> 01:11:55,640
Speaker 1: Like they're not gonna take it and they don't want it.

1254
01:11:56,439 --> 01:12:01,479
Speaker 1: And they tried to the FBI try to invent a crime,

1255
01:12:02,320 --> 01:12:06,640
Speaker 1: invent a they tried to like it's it's almost like

1256
01:12:08,120 --> 01:12:12,720
Speaker 1: bad detectives. What what what do they say? Bad detectives

1257
01:12:12,720 --> 01:12:17,799
Speaker 1: and bad investigators do they come up with the the

1258
01:12:17,600 --> 01:12:21,080
Speaker 1: the resolution first and then try to find their way

1259
01:12:21,160 --> 01:12:26,000
Speaker 1: back to the clues. But in investigation work, you're supposed

1260
01:12:26,040 --> 01:12:29,000
Speaker 1: to let the clues and the evidence take you to

1261
01:12:29,120 --> 01:12:32,280
Speaker 1: the solution instead of the other way around. And they

1262
01:12:32,320 --> 01:12:35,800
Speaker 1: came up with the solution first and then wanted to

1263
01:12:35,840 --> 01:12:42,479
Speaker 1: backtrack to the problem. What it's insane, real I And

1264
01:12:42,479 --> 01:12:45,200
Speaker 1: and you are right, the FBI looked like assholes. They

1265
01:12:45,240 --> 01:12:49,559
Speaker 1: look like idiots. And the fact that the FBI has

1266
01:12:49,600 --> 01:12:53,800
Speaker 1: participated so freely in the millions thing because they look

1267
01:12:53,920 --> 01:12:57,320
Speaker 1: great and they did the great, great job. Yeah, they

1268
01:12:57,320 --> 01:13:01,280
Speaker 1: clearly participated it. Yeah, great point, great point. They were

1269
01:13:01,400 --> 01:13:06,240
Speaker 1: super enthusiastic to star, uh to co star in HBO's

1270
01:13:06,360 --> 01:13:09,000
Speaker 1: mcmillions that came out about a month and a half ago,

1271
01:13:09,439 --> 01:13:13,080
Speaker 1: but they declined to participate in HBO's the Scheme which

1272
01:13:13,120 --> 01:13:15,720
Speaker 1: comes out today, and that just goes to show you,

1273
01:13:15,800 --> 01:13:18,559
Speaker 1: I think, probably how they think of the way that

1274
01:13:18,560 --> 01:13:24,040
Speaker 1: they conducted this investigation. Because they refused the subpoenas so

1275
01:13:24,080 --> 01:13:27,040
Speaker 1: they don't end up testifying in court. They never reveal

1276
01:13:27,160 --> 01:13:32,520
Speaker 1: what happens to uh, was that D'Angelo, the original undercover

1277
01:13:32,640 --> 01:13:38,040
Speaker 1: agent um who was supposedly the nightclub owner and investor.

1278
01:13:38,600 --> 01:13:42,040
Speaker 1: They end up spending an ungodly amount of money of

1279
01:13:42,160 --> 01:13:48,040
Speaker 1: taxpayer funds in order to trick Christian Dawkins into participating

1280
01:13:48,760 --> 01:13:53,040
Speaker 1: in this scheme, ultimately to have Christian Dawkins go throw

1281
01:13:53,120 --> 01:13:58,040
Speaker 1: that money it's at strippers in Vegas and then it

1282
01:13:58,200 --> 01:14:00,600
Speaker 1: was like I don't have any I can't give it

1283
01:14:00,680 --> 01:14:04,200
Speaker 1: to the coaches, so guess what, I'll just spend it

1284
01:14:04,200 --> 01:14:07,720
Speaker 1: then fine, And then Christian Dawkins hoards the cash in

1285
01:14:07,880 --> 01:14:12,360
Speaker 1: his own house and then uses it to pay his

1286
01:14:12,479 --> 01:14:16,559
Speaker 1: lawyers to defend him from the FBI case, and some

1287
01:14:16,600 --> 01:14:20,040
Speaker 1: of the money he actually put back into the business. Yeah,

1288
01:14:20,200 --> 01:14:22,400
Speaker 1: just like this is a stand up guy, like I

1289
01:14:22,520 --> 01:14:28,639
Speaker 1: would after all of this. So so, Christian Dawkins first

1290
01:14:28,640 --> 01:14:31,120
Speaker 1: had the problem with with the uber thing, which made

1291
01:14:31,160 --> 01:14:35,680
Speaker 1: sense too. And I'm sitting here like after watching everything,

1292
01:14:35,840 --> 01:14:38,600
Speaker 1: after it's eight team up prisons in all of this,

1293
01:14:39,160 --> 01:14:41,719
Speaker 1: I'm looking at this and I'm like, I would clearly

1294
01:14:41,800 --> 01:14:46,360
Speaker 1: do do business with Christian Dawkins. Clearly wouldn't think twice

1295
01:14:46,400 --> 01:14:52,880
Speaker 1: about it. Like this dude is like Doogie howser, smart, intelligent, well,

1296
01:14:53,320 --> 01:14:58,439
Speaker 1: like has your best interests in mine? Yeah, yeah, well, studie.

1297
01:14:59,680 --> 01:15:03,200
Speaker 1: That's why during the trial he was going to go

1298
01:15:03,320 --> 01:15:07,880
Speaker 1: meet with Atlantic Records and they gave him his he's

1299
01:15:07,960 --> 01:15:13,200
Speaker 1: going through a wire fraud. So he got sentenced. So

1300
01:15:13,240 --> 01:15:16,360
Speaker 1: he actually had two trials. He got sentenced to twelve

1301
01:15:16,400 --> 01:15:19,800
Speaker 1: months in one and six months in the other one

1302
01:15:20,360 --> 01:15:26,920
Speaker 1: for conspiracy to commit wire fraud wire fraud, Like what, like,

1303
01:15:27,000 --> 01:15:29,400
Speaker 1: what are we talking about here? But what did you

1304
01:15:29,439 --> 01:15:33,560
Speaker 1: think about? The one thing that Pat talked about in

1305
01:15:33,520 --> 01:15:38,200
Speaker 1: an interview which was interesting is that Christian didn't snitch

1306
01:15:38,240 --> 01:15:42,519
Speaker 1: on anybody. He didn't snitch on anybody, like, yes, there

1307
01:15:42,640 --> 01:15:46,680
Speaker 1: was wire wire taps, so he couldn't deny that. And

1308
01:15:46,720 --> 01:15:49,720
Speaker 1: the one person that got fired out of this whole

1309
01:15:49,760 --> 01:15:53,960
Speaker 1: thing was Rick Pettino. But but that was a combination

1310
01:15:53,960 --> 01:16:01,400
Speaker 1: of strippers and genuine lack of institutional control like he had.

1311
01:16:01,880 --> 01:16:05,160
Speaker 1: He had absolutely no handle on what was going on.

1312
01:16:05,760 --> 01:16:07,920
Speaker 1: He barely ever has a handle on what's going on

1313
01:16:07,920 --> 01:16:12,680
Speaker 1: in his personal life. Like that was just that was

1314
01:16:12,760 --> 01:16:16,840
Speaker 1: time was up for him. Really, so what did and

1315
01:16:16,920 --> 01:16:21,479
Speaker 1: Christie Dawkins said that Rick Pottino did not know, didn't

1316
01:16:21,520 --> 01:16:24,000
Speaker 1: anything like he And I was like, this dude's a

1317
01:16:24,040 --> 01:16:26,960
Speaker 1: stand up guy. He's not. He refused to snitch. He

1318
01:16:27,040 --> 01:16:30,639
Speaker 1: just took his medicine. Yeah, he so not only did

1319
01:16:30,680 --> 01:16:34,439
Speaker 1: he take his medicine like he he laughed about the

1320
01:16:34,479 --> 01:16:38,040
Speaker 1: fact that he got led on by Sean Miller and

1321
01:16:38,040 --> 01:16:42,439
Speaker 1: and to a much more serious extent, Will Wade. They

1322
01:16:42,800 --> 01:16:45,479
Speaker 1: said they didn't even know the dude, didn't even have

1323
01:16:45,800 --> 01:16:53,320
Speaker 1: any interactions with him. You're on tape steal in boxes, bro. Yeah,

1324
01:16:53,360 --> 01:16:55,360
Speaker 1: and and and didn't get fired on their day off,

1325
01:16:55,360 --> 01:16:59,000
Speaker 1: So like they you know, they I don't know, man.

1326
01:16:59,120 --> 01:17:03,840
Speaker 1: I just he came away a very sympathetic figure. But

1327
01:17:03,960 --> 01:17:05,720
Speaker 1: then by the end you don't really have a lot

1328
01:17:05,760 --> 01:17:08,320
Speaker 1: of sympathy for Christian Dawkins because you realize, like he

1329
01:17:08,360 --> 01:17:14,040
Speaker 1: doesn't need it, He's gonna he's gonna be just fine. Yeah.

1330
01:17:14,560 --> 01:17:17,880
Speaker 1: See that that's a good point there, because a lot

1331
01:17:17,880 --> 01:17:21,920
Speaker 1: of times when you watch these documentaries and see stuff

1332
01:17:21,960 --> 01:17:25,240
Speaker 1: like this happened, people's lives are usually ruined. He had.

1333
01:17:25,439 --> 01:17:27,720
Speaker 1: He had lived the life of a sixty year old

1334
01:17:27,760 --> 01:17:33,120
Speaker 1: successful business person by the time he was twenty twenty two. Right,

1335
01:17:34,040 --> 01:17:38,479
Speaker 1: And I've I've investigated the a AU basketball scene, paying players,

1336
01:17:38,600 --> 01:17:42,360
Speaker 1: shoe companies, hanging around. I've written stuff that has you know,

1337
01:17:42,400 --> 01:17:45,160
Speaker 1: I wrote an article that broke up Marvin Bagley and

1338
01:17:45,200 --> 01:17:48,120
Speaker 1: DeAndre Ayton, the number one and number two pick in

1339
01:17:48,160 --> 01:17:51,599
Speaker 1: the in the NBA draft. So I've been in this world.

1340
01:17:51,920 --> 01:17:56,320
Speaker 1: If somebody came to me with what Christian Dawkins was doing,

1341
01:17:56,400 --> 01:17:59,679
Speaker 1: not what the FBI made him do, but if somebody

1342
01:17:59,720 --> 01:18:02,400
Speaker 1: came to me with just what Christian Dawkins was doing

1343
01:18:02,479 --> 01:18:06,760
Speaker 1: in that moment, I wouldn't have even blinked. That's it's

1344
01:18:06,920 --> 01:18:11,639
Speaker 1: still going on, Oh absolutely, And it's going on in football.

1345
01:18:11,760 --> 01:18:14,920
Speaker 1: This is the funniest thing is the dude that ends

1346
01:18:14,960 --> 01:18:18,080
Speaker 1: up serving no jail time. Marty Blazer ends up admitting

1347
01:18:18,120 --> 01:18:22,759
Speaker 1: an open court that for fourteen years he paid football

1348
01:18:22,800 --> 01:18:26,800
Speaker 1: players at like seven different schools, including Notre Dame in

1349
01:18:26,920 --> 01:18:32,240
Speaker 1: University of Michigan and Northwestern and Pitt right, So he

1350
01:18:32,240 --> 01:18:34,160
Speaker 1: he came out and he said like, oh, I've been

1351
01:18:34,160 --> 01:18:36,960
Speaker 1: doing this in football yet that fell on deaf years

1352
01:18:37,080 --> 01:18:40,320
Speaker 1: and no head coaches end up having to testify. In

1353
01:18:40,320 --> 01:18:43,479
Speaker 1: this trial book. Richardson goes to jail and Sean Miller

1354
01:18:43,600 --> 01:18:45,880
Speaker 1: just acts gets to act like he didn't know the

1355
01:18:45,960 --> 01:18:49,880
Speaker 1: dude that he hung out with for ten years. And

1356
01:18:49,920 --> 01:18:51,240
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, it was just a

1357
01:18:51,280 --> 01:18:55,120
Speaker 1: low level campaign guy, right and then and and at

1358
01:18:55,120 --> 01:18:56,840
Speaker 1: the end of the day, the Southern District of New

1359
01:18:56,920 --> 01:18:59,879
Speaker 1: York they come out and they have this press conference,

1360
01:19:00,120 --> 01:19:03,000
Speaker 1: what we have your playbook? Like they're gonna come out

1361
01:19:03,040 --> 01:19:05,720
Speaker 1: and they're gonna break up all of college basketball and

1362
01:19:05,800 --> 01:19:10,719
Speaker 1: change things forever. I am telling you right now, those

1363
01:19:10,800 --> 01:19:13,360
Speaker 1: people that work for the Southern District of New York

1364
01:19:13,479 --> 01:19:17,960
Speaker 1: in their District Attorney's office that prosecute cases, they deserve

1365
01:19:18,160 --> 01:19:23,479
Speaker 1: nothing less than the absolute cruelest of scorn and laughter

1366
01:19:24,080 --> 01:19:26,760
Speaker 1: every single time they walk down the hallways of their

1367
01:19:26,760 --> 01:19:30,280
Speaker 1: own office. Like the way that people used to bully

1368
01:19:30,520 --> 01:19:34,519
Speaker 1: kids who definitely didn't deserve it in elementary school, you know,

1369
01:19:34,960 --> 01:19:37,479
Speaker 1: call him fatty, sent him home crying, kick dirt in

1370
01:19:37,520 --> 01:19:40,240
Speaker 1: there in there and they're like that level of bullying.

1371
01:19:40,800 --> 01:19:43,799
Speaker 1: The co workers of these people at the Southern District

1372
01:19:43,840 --> 01:19:47,160
Speaker 1: of New York that handled this case or the people

1373
01:19:47,200 --> 01:19:50,320
Speaker 1: who didn't handle this case, should all be mocking and

1374
01:19:50,439 --> 01:19:54,479
Speaker 1: laughing at every single person who did every time they're around,

1375
01:19:54,520 --> 01:19:57,680
Speaker 1: because that's how embarrassing this documentary is for them. When

1376
01:19:57,680 --> 01:20:00,559
Speaker 1: they play back that press conference, it's like at George W.

1377
01:20:00,680 --> 01:20:04,920
Speaker 1: Bush Mission accomplished. You should never be able to live

1378
01:20:04,960 --> 01:20:07,600
Speaker 1: that down to come out have a press conference and

1379
01:20:07,600 --> 01:20:10,759
Speaker 1: make it sound like you're going to change college basketball forever.

1380
01:20:11,280 --> 01:20:13,439
Speaker 1: And in the end, the only person that ends up

1381
01:20:13,439 --> 01:20:16,840
Speaker 1: doing any real time is the person that repeatedly tried

1382
01:20:16,880 --> 01:20:19,920
Speaker 1: to talk you out of this investigation because even though

1383
01:20:19,920 --> 01:20:22,040
Speaker 1: he didn't know it was an investigation, he thought your

1384
01:20:22,080 --> 01:20:26,800
Speaker 1: plans were stupid. That's the guy that you end up

1385
01:20:26,880 --> 01:20:31,200
Speaker 1: nailing on behalf of the FBI's botched investigation, in which

1386
01:20:31,280 --> 01:20:34,920
Speaker 1: the person that was heading it up probably ended up

1387
01:20:34,960 --> 01:20:39,040
Speaker 1: possibly doing jail time himself. I do. I hope the

1388
01:20:39,080 --> 01:20:44,080
Speaker 1: Internet finds that guy. I really do, because he deserves

1389
01:20:44,120 --> 01:20:46,479
Speaker 1: to be laughed at as well. What did you think

1390
01:20:46,560 --> 01:20:50,360
Speaker 1: about because I asked him about the fact that Okay,

1391
01:20:50,360 --> 01:20:54,040
Speaker 1: so Jim Jim Gotto and Merril Code who were at Adidas.

1392
01:20:54,240 --> 01:20:58,719
Speaker 1: They ended up getting uh nine months and six months

1393
01:20:58,760 --> 01:21:02,679
Speaker 1: as a process as a part of this um. But

1394
01:21:02,960 --> 01:21:08,320
Speaker 1: I said, okay, Michael Abanati and Nike didn't come up

1395
01:21:08,400 --> 01:21:11,599
Speaker 1: really well not not not not really, They just didn't

1396
01:21:11,600 --> 01:21:18,439
Speaker 1: come up because he Michael Avnati try to blackmail or

1397
01:21:19,400 --> 01:21:23,160
Speaker 1: extort Nike out of out of money. Nike was brought

1398
01:21:23,280 --> 01:21:25,960
Speaker 1: up with their you know, with with their A A

1399
01:21:26,120 --> 01:21:31,240
Speaker 1: U system program because Adidas has the grass grassroots and

1400
01:21:31,280 --> 01:21:36,720
Speaker 1: then um, Nike has the E Y B L yeah

1401
01:21:36,840 --> 01:21:40,840
Speaker 1: and so and so I asked him and he was like, well, yeah,

1402
01:21:41,280 --> 01:21:45,439
Speaker 1: it's like uh in the Nike thing, like Nike and

1403
01:21:45,560 --> 01:21:47,640
Speaker 1: Court and all this stuff. Well, everybody in court they

1404
01:21:47,680 --> 01:21:49,840
Speaker 1: knew that they had been doing the same things that

1405
01:21:49,880 --> 01:21:54,360
Speaker 1: the Adidas did. But it just like everything just got

1406
01:21:54,479 --> 01:21:58,840
Speaker 1: shut down, like everything just got just kabashed like like

1407
01:21:58,960 --> 01:22:03,200
Speaker 1: it was. It was almost like like God came down

1408
01:22:03,479 --> 01:22:05,840
Speaker 1: and was like, no, you will not talk about this,

1409
01:22:05,960 --> 01:22:10,920
Speaker 1: you will not prosecute this, And everybody was just like okay, cool, alright, alright, alright,

1410
01:22:10,920 --> 01:22:13,839
Speaker 1: by well, somebody's got to pay to keep our conviction

1411
01:22:13,920 --> 01:22:17,320
Speaker 1: rates up. There you go Christian Dawkins. There you go,

1412
01:22:17,320 --> 01:22:23,320
Speaker 1: gott Oh, there you go, Meryll Meryll code. It was crazy.

1413
01:22:23,640 --> 01:22:26,519
Speaker 1: We we gotta get my guy, Zack so Oskin on

1414
01:22:26,560 --> 01:22:29,600
Speaker 1: the on on the podcast, because I I've spent some

1415
01:22:29,680 --> 01:22:32,680
Speaker 1: time around some of these Adidas grassroots guys on the

1416
01:22:32,680 --> 01:22:37,920
Speaker 1: football side, Ryan Lacy, Zack Soskin just left UM Adidas

1417
01:22:38,000 --> 01:22:42,640
Speaker 1: to actually like work in management UM for for some athletes.

1418
01:22:42,880 --> 01:22:44,960
Speaker 1: And you know, they're out at the camps that we

1419
01:22:45,080 --> 01:22:48,400
Speaker 1: have as part of rivals. Like they're around these kids

1420
01:22:48,960 --> 01:22:51,960
Speaker 1: very young age, getting to know them, getting to know

1421
01:22:52,000 --> 01:22:54,519
Speaker 1: what they like, trying to convince them to wear Adidas,

1422
01:22:54,560 --> 01:22:57,519
Speaker 1: sending them shoes, doing all the stuff that is is

1423
01:22:57,560 --> 01:23:01,280
Speaker 1: above board and and and leave goal. But like their

1424
01:23:01,320 --> 01:23:06,559
Speaker 1: whole job is to form relationships with high school kids

1425
01:23:06,920 --> 01:23:08,960
Speaker 1: so that that kid can then go to college where

1426
01:23:09,000 --> 01:23:12,760
Speaker 1: they're supposedly untouchable, but hopefully they're at a school that

1427
01:23:12,800 --> 01:23:16,160
Speaker 1: Adidas is pumping uh tens of millions of dollars into.

1428
01:23:16,240 --> 01:23:17,960
Speaker 1: And I think was it was it Dan Wetzel who

1429
01:23:17,960 --> 01:23:20,679
Speaker 1: said that like, if if somebody's paying you a hundred

1430
01:23:20,680 --> 01:23:24,080
Speaker 1: and sixty million dollars, there your boss. Yeah, so then

1431
01:23:24,120 --> 01:23:27,120
Speaker 1: you got them in this incubator, right, um, and I

1432
01:23:27,160 --> 01:23:30,400
Speaker 1: know that you know. One one athlete that Adidas ended

1433
01:23:30,479 --> 01:23:33,400
Speaker 1: up signing was Christian Kirk, who was at an Adidas

1434
01:23:33,479 --> 01:23:36,280
Speaker 1: high school, went to Texas A and M, which I

1435
01:23:36,360 --> 01:23:38,880
Speaker 1: believe was sponsored by Adidas at the time. I could

1436
01:23:38,920 --> 01:23:41,479
Speaker 1: be wrong about that, um, But then he ended up

1437
01:23:41,520 --> 01:23:44,840
Speaker 1: with signing with Adidas coming out of UH for the

1438
01:23:44,920 --> 01:23:47,360
Speaker 1: NFL Draft. And so you know that that stuff is

1439
01:23:47,400 --> 01:23:50,080
Speaker 1: not very surprising, especially when they formed a relationship with

1440
01:23:50,120 --> 01:23:52,120
Speaker 1: you from when you're very young. But it is a

1441
01:23:52,160 --> 01:23:56,960
Speaker 1: really weird system in which you become sort of untouchable

1442
01:23:57,320 --> 01:24:00,360
Speaker 1: except for that apparel company is allowed to don't need

1443
01:24:00,439 --> 01:24:06,240
Speaker 1: directly to the program. Yeah. Yeah. And then and remember when, uh,

1444
01:24:06,600 --> 01:24:08,880
Speaker 1: when when the Pump Brothers, who I used to play

1445
01:24:08,920 --> 01:24:11,160
Speaker 1: for in high school, I think they were on Sports

1446
01:24:11,240 --> 01:24:15,559
Speaker 1: Illustrated or yes, Sports Illustrated the fifty most powerful people

1447
01:24:15,600 --> 01:24:19,240
Speaker 1: in sports, and people were like, who are these two dudes?

1448
01:24:20,040 --> 01:24:23,679
Speaker 1: And they were they So they've been in business and

1449
01:24:23,720 --> 01:24:25,760
Speaker 1: all this stuff for a long time, especially in the

1450
01:24:25,880 --> 01:24:31,680
Speaker 1: in the basketball auth circuit. And then you have and

1451
01:24:31,680 --> 01:24:36,200
Speaker 1: then then and then they essentially would be steering kids

1452
01:24:36,240 --> 01:24:41,760
Speaker 1: to colleges, and then those colleges would then allow them

1453
01:24:41,760 --> 01:24:47,240
Speaker 1: because they owned a ticket broker like a resale company,

1454
01:24:47,280 --> 01:24:52,400
Speaker 1: So then their company would be allowed to buy almost

1455
01:24:52,439 --> 01:24:56,919
Speaker 1: like season tickets from the schools and the March Madness

1456
01:24:56,960 --> 01:25:00,000
Speaker 1: tickets and the Bowl game tickets, all of this stuff

1457
01:25:00,120 --> 01:25:03,280
Speaker 1: get they would get the premo seats and then they

1458
01:25:03,320 --> 01:25:05,599
Speaker 1: would be able to sell them, so they would get

1459
01:25:05,640 --> 01:25:08,360
Speaker 1: an opportunity to buy them at face value and then

1460
01:25:08,400 --> 01:25:11,960
Speaker 1: they can mark them up and sell them. So so

1461
01:25:12,240 --> 01:25:16,479
Speaker 1: instead of taking huge payments, they would just from from schools.

1462
01:25:16,760 --> 01:25:19,960
Speaker 1: They just wanted to ticket inventory the way then they

1463
01:25:19,960 --> 01:25:23,080
Speaker 1: could uh then be able to buy it and then

1464
01:25:23,160 --> 01:25:27,400
Speaker 1: mark it up and sell it later. Does it is

1465
01:25:27,439 --> 01:25:29,400
Speaker 1: it weird to you at all that U c l

1466
01:25:29,479 --> 01:25:32,160
Speaker 1: A has the by far highest apparel contract, Like they

1467
01:25:32,200 --> 01:25:37,080
Speaker 1: even commented on what is under Armour doing? Dude, Well,

1468
01:25:37,720 --> 01:25:41,120
Speaker 1: under Armour wanted to be with a huge brand, and

1469
01:25:42,280 --> 01:25:47,280
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know, because dude, that's an extraordinarily

1470
01:25:48,080 --> 01:25:53,600
Speaker 1: big contract for a college and you know, and you

1471
01:25:53,720 --> 01:25:56,599
Speaker 1: said U c l A still wasn't paying their bills, No,

1472
01:25:56,760 --> 01:25:59,960
Speaker 1: and people don't even and truthfully it's kids that don't

1473
01:26:00,080 --> 01:26:05,120
Speaker 1: go to colleges. As we know, based upon shoe contracts,

1474
01:26:05,120 --> 01:26:07,040
Speaker 1: based upon shoe contracts because they don't want to wear

1475
01:26:07,080 --> 01:26:11,000
Speaker 1: certain shoes so they won't go to certain schools. Yeah yeah,

1476
01:26:11,000 --> 01:26:13,080
Speaker 1: I mean look at this whole Puma thing, right, like

1477
01:26:13,160 --> 01:26:15,840
Speaker 1: the first of all, the thing that he said about

1478
01:26:15,880 --> 01:26:18,000
Speaker 1: like doing all the legwork and you can put fifty

1479
01:26:18,000 --> 01:26:19,800
Speaker 1: thou dollars into a kid and they can turn around

1480
01:26:19,800 --> 01:26:22,519
Speaker 1: and signed with a a mega agent who put no

1481
01:26:22,680 --> 01:26:25,040
Speaker 1: effort in that whole time. And that's just the risk

1482
01:26:25,120 --> 01:26:28,960
Speaker 1: that you run. That reminded me of DeAndre Ayton uh

1483
01:26:29,120 --> 01:26:32,720
Speaker 1: signing with Puma after going to a Nike school and

1484
01:26:32,720 --> 01:26:37,960
Speaker 1: having Nike sponsor his high school before he went to

1485
01:26:38,000 --> 01:26:40,840
Speaker 1: a Nike college. Then he ends up signing that shoe

1486
01:26:40,920 --> 01:26:44,040
Speaker 1: deal with Puma. Well, now, DeAndre Ayton has missed like

1487
01:26:44,320 --> 01:26:47,920
Speaker 1: six different stints of games with ankle injuries, and there

1488
01:26:47,920 --> 01:26:50,320
Speaker 1: are kids out there who look at that and say, like, man,

1489
01:26:50,600 --> 01:26:53,000
Speaker 1: never wear that shoe. And so if Puma ends up

1490
01:26:53,040 --> 01:26:55,479
Speaker 1: getting a big time sponsorship deal with a with a

1491
01:26:55,920 --> 01:26:59,280
Speaker 1: you know, a big college, at some point you have

1492
01:26:59,360 --> 01:27:01,479
Speaker 1: kids say like, I would never play at that college,

1493
01:27:01,560 --> 01:27:05,519
Speaker 1: and that's absurd. But that's just that's how it goes,

1494
01:27:05,840 --> 01:27:08,720
Speaker 1: you know, That's it's it's really weird some of the

1495
01:27:08,760 --> 01:27:12,040
Speaker 1: things that factor into, you know, a kid making their decision.

1496
01:27:12,040 --> 01:27:13,960
Speaker 1: And you also have to realize every single one of

1497
01:27:13,960 --> 01:27:18,320
Speaker 1: these kids thinks they're going to the league, every single one, um,

1498
01:27:19,040 --> 01:27:21,679
Speaker 1: and it takes getting to the college level to ultimately

1499
01:27:21,720 --> 01:27:24,280
Speaker 1: end up getting humbled. And then some kids don't end

1500
01:27:24,360 --> 01:27:26,400
Speaker 1: up getting humbled. They end up saying like, oh, it's

1501
01:27:26,439 --> 01:27:33,880
Speaker 1: the coach, you know, like LaVar always yeah, yeah, if

1502
01:27:33,880 --> 01:27:36,160
Speaker 1: you would, if if you yeah, so it's and then

1503
01:27:36,200 --> 01:27:38,240
Speaker 1: it's not. It's never a you problem. You never have

1504
01:27:38,320 --> 01:27:42,400
Speaker 1: to take accountability for anything. And why would you be

1505
01:27:42,439 --> 01:27:45,439
Speaker 1: in a position to even take accountability when you have

1506
01:27:45,680 --> 01:27:50,080
Speaker 1: people paying your family because they believe that you could

1507
01:27:50,240 --> 01:27:52,800
Speaker 1: ultimately end up being a star. You have all these

1508
01:27:52,800 --> 01:27:54,960
Speaker 1: people treating you like a king. In the second you

1509
01:27:55,000 --> 01:27:59,320
Speaker 1: start to act like it, everyone's like, oh, what a diva. Well, yeah,

1510
01:27:59,600 --> 01:28:01,320
Speaker 1: that's the way we're set up. We're pushing them in

1511
01:28:01,320 --> 01:28:05,280
Speaker 1: that direction. Yeah, and I am, for one, not like

1512
01:28:05,520 --> 01:28:09,719
Speaker 1: I hope that this sort of thing turned, like trickles

1513
01:28:09,800 --> 01:28:13,880
Speaker 1: over into the name image likeness stuff, and that this

1514
01:28:14,040 --> 01:28:18,960
Speaker 1: legislation gets passed like meaningful legislation. So the kids, these

1515
01:28:19,520 --> 01:28:24,320
Speaker 1: most of them young black kids coming from disadvantageous socioeconomic

1516
01:28:24,439 --> 01:28:28,560
Speaker 1: situations where they can get what is due to them.

1517
01:28:28,680 --> 01:28:33,640
Speaker 1: And truthfully, I I just always look at it like

1518
01:28:34,560 --> 01:28:37,200
Speaker 1: you should be able to participate when you are in

1519
01:28:37,360 --> 01:28:42,519
Speaker 1: revenue generation and I and and the other part that

1520
01:28:42,680 --> 01:28:45,200
Speaker 1: is most important, that I think is most crucial in

1521
01:28:45,240 --> 01:28:49,120
Speaker 1: this situation is everybody has a point in time in

1522
01:28:49,120 --> 01:28:51,559
Speaker 1: their life that they have the highest earning potential, when

1523
01:28:51,560 --> 01:28:54,000
Speaker 1: they are the most popular, when they can capitalize on

1524
01:28:54,040 --> 01:28:58,599
Speaker 1: these things. Sometimes that's when you're Macaullague talking at home alone.

1525
01:28:58,640 --> 01:29:02,080
Speaker 1: Sometimes it's when you're sixty years old you have a windfall.

1526
01:29:02,520 --> 01:29:04,600
Speaker 1: You know, you don't know when it's going to be.

1527
01:29:05,200 --> 01:29:07,840
Speaker 1: And sometimes that time for people live in college, Like

1528
01:29:07,920 --> 01:29:10,920
Speaker 1: imagine how much money Sabrina I and ask you could

1529
01:29:10,960 --> 01:29:13,080
Speaker 1: have could have made, or Remy Martin at a s

1530
01:29:13,200 --> 01:29:17,719
Speaker 1: U or you know, sometimes the volleyball or or the

1531
01:29:17,720 --> 01:29:20,639
Speaker 1: girl that we talked about at Oregon the other day.

1532
01:29:20,800 --> 01:29:23,080
Speaker 1: If if we knew about LaVar Ball when he was

1533
01:29:23,080 --> 01:29:25,639
Speaker 1: at Washington State, I mean, give that man his own

1534
01:29:25,720 --> 01:29:30,400
Speaker 1: show back then, yep, yep. So I hope that it

1535
01:29:30,439 --> 01:29:33,479
Speaker 1: trickles all down into that. Do do you have anything

1536
01:29:33,520 --> 01:29:36,680
Speaker 1: else on on the scheme besides telling people to watch it, well,

1537
01:29:36,800 --> 01:29:42,560
Speaker 1: please watch it. Please. It is it's funny, it's it's

1538
01:29:42,560 --> 01:29:45,160
Speaker 1: pulls it your heart strings, things that you wouldn't expect

1539
01:29:45,280 --> 01:29:48,960
Speaker 1: right like there are there and and then it'll piss

1540
01:29:49,000 --> 01:29:51,640
Speaker 1: you off a little bit too, which is is, I

1541
01:29:51,680 --> 01:29:55,280
Speaker 1: think what any good documentary does. And this is obviously

1542
01:29:55,320 --> 01:30:00,559
Speaker 1: a very um single sided documentary that is p presented

1543
01:30:00,560 --> 01:30:05,720
Speaker 1: from the only perspective that was really truly available. But

1544
01:30:05,800 --> 01:30:08,280
Speaker 1: the nice thing about it is, with so many things

1545
01:30:08,400 --> 01:30:12,280
Speaker 1: on the record, everything is corroborated, so you're actually able

1546
01:30:12,320 --> 01:30:15,000
Speaker 1: to trust the point of view and trust the source

1547
01:30:15,080 --> 01:30:18,280
Speaker 1: that this whole thing is driven through. And I would

1548
01:30:18,280 --> 01:30:20,840
Speaker 1: say that to a lot of the PAC twelve fans

1549
01:30:20,880 --> 01:30:25,440
Speaker 1: out there that have felt like your program was embarrassed

1550
01:30:25,560 --> 01:30:28,920
Speaker 1: or you lost any sort of respect for any coach

1551
01:30:29,040 --> 01:30:31,519
Speaker 1: or assistant on your staff, I would say, watch this,

1552
01:30:32,200 --> 01:30:35,559
Speaker 1: realize how widespread it is, and realize that guys like

1553
01:30:35,640 --> 01:30:39,360
Speaker 1: Tony Bland and Book Richardson really, at the end of

1554
01:30:39,360 --> 01:30:44,559
Speaker 1: the day, didn't do anything illegal um and the government

1555
01:30:44,760 --> 01:30:49,799
Speaker 1: had to invent ways in which to bend the law

1556
01:30:50,400 --> 01:30:53,599
Speaker 1: in order to put them in a situation where their

1557
01:30:53,640 --> 01:30:56,720
Speaker 1: actions were illegal and so you know that that that

1558
01:30:57,840 --> 01:31:01,040
Speaker 1: there are still rules being broken, and whatever your moral

1559
01:31:01,080 --> 01:31:04,240
Speaker 1: assignment is that you assigned to people based on those

1560
01:31:04,320 --> 01:31:07,240
Speaker 1: rules being broken, that's on you. And I understand it

1561
01:31:07,640 --> 01:31:10,880
Speaker 1: if you if or if you just the rivalries playing

1562
01:31:10,880 --> 01:31:13,120
Speaker 1: into it, right like a s U fans absolutely love

1563
01:31:13,200 --> 01:31:17,280
Speaker 1: that the cloud just sort of floats above, you know, Arizona.

1564
01:31:17,280 --> 01:31:19,360
Speaker 1: When that, when's the others you're gonna drop? You know,

1565
01:31:19,360 --> 01:31:22,519
Speaker 1: when Sean Milligant fired, they enjoy that. Um. But at

1566
01:31:22,520 --> 01:31:26,240
Speaker 1: the same time, you know, these are these are not

1567
01:31:27,080 --> 01:31:33,720
Speaker 1: These are not questions, um, of of morality in my opinion,

1568
01:31:33,960 --> 01:31:37,679
Speaker 1: and they should never have been questions of legality. Uh.

1569
01:31:37,720 --> 01:31:39,479
Speaker 1: And I'm somebody who's on the other side of this,

1570
01:31:39,520 --> 01:31:43,640
Speaker 1: who believes that players should be paid anyway. So I'm

1571
01:31:43,680 --> 01:31:47,160
Speaker 1: when I read Robin Hood, I understand Robin Hood to

1572
01:31:47,240 --> 01:31:52,120
Speaker 1: be the protagonist of robin Hood, right like as as

1573
01:31:52,400 --> 01:31:57,200
Speaker 1: and I do trend more conservatively politically. Um, I've still

1574
01:31:57,240 --> 01:31:59,320
Speaker 1: never reached a point in my life where I read

1575
01:31:59,600 --> 01:32:03,320
Speaker 1: Robin Hood and say, like, oh, thief put him in jail. Right.

1576
01:32:04,000 --> 01:32:07,560
Speaker 1: You understand the conditions at the time and the context

1577
01:32:07,600 --> 01:32:11,120
Speaker 1: at the time, and the story of America is one

1578
01:32:11,320 --> 01:32:14,760
Speaker 1: of the people getting together and saying, hey, no taxation

1579
01:32:14,760 --> 01:32:19,520
Speaker 1: without representation and and rebelling. And when I see college basketball,

1580
01:32:19,920 --> 01:32:24,280
Speaker 1: I see a story that should be moving in that direction. Uh.

1581
01:32:24,280 --> 01:32:26,400
Speaker 1: And there should be some revolution in there to make

1582
01:32:26,439 --> 01:32:29,840
Speaker 1: sure that people are all getting there's because I think

1583
01:32:29,880 --> 01:32:33,080
Speaker 1: that's a very American thing. And so, you know, for

1584
01:32:33,120 --> 01:32:36,439
Speaker 1: the people that did get punished legally, um in this

1585
01:32:36,479 --> 01:32:40,080
Speaker 1: whole deal, I I believe that. Um. Yeah, I think

1586
01:32:40,120 --> 01:32:42,720
Speaker 1: they were handed a raw deal and uh. And and

1587
01:32:42,760 --> 01:32:45,719
Speaker 1: I don't have any ill will or ill feelings towards

1588
01:32:46,200 --> 01:32:49,080
Speaker 1: anybody involved in any of this. I think that the

1589
01:32:49,160 --> 01:32:52,479
Speaker 1: fault lies with the FBI in the Southern District of

1590
01:32:52,520 --> 01:32:57,120
Speaker 1: New York and Marty Blazer. Marty Blazer sucks. Yep. Yeah,

1591
01:32:57,240 --> 01:33:00,040
Speaker 1: I totally agree you guys. Thank you guys for and

1592
01:33:00,160 --> 01:33:03,320
Speaker 1: into the pack twelve apostles. We appreciate your time, appreciate

1593
01:33:03,400 --> 01:33:06,439
Speaker 1: your energy, send us your comments. And we already got

1594
01:33:06,840 --> 01:33:10,880
Speaker 1: one end uh about somebody saying how could I defend

1595
01:33:10,920 --> 01:33:16,800
Speaker 1: a deadbeat like Christian Dawkins said, We would talk about that. Um. Uh.

1596
01:33:17,000 --> 01:33:20,360
Speaker 1: Sent it into I'm mad at Unafraid show dot com

1597
01:33:20,520 --> 01:33:22,760
Speaker 1: or hit me and Ralph up on Twitter we're gonna live.

1598
01:33:23,080 --> 01:33:28,439
Speaker 1: We're gonna live tweet during the during the documentary airing,

1599
01:33:28,520 --> 01:33:30,599
Speaker 1: so it should be fun. Make sure you hit us up.

1600
01:33:31,040 --> 01:33:32,559
Speaker 1: Peace out, catch you guys later.