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Speaker 1: Bodybacks with Joseph Scott Morgan. One of my most fond

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Speaker 1: remembrances of living in New Orleans for many years was

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Speaker 1: that he didn't just have to go to French Quarry.

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Speaker 1: You could just be in a neighborhood down there and

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Speaker 1: then off in the distance you would hear the sound

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Speaker 1: of a trumpet plane. And that city is just filled

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Speaker 1: with professional jazz musicians, and it's almost like a siren song.

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Speaker 1: It draws you, you know, you hear that sound, it

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Speaker 1: rises high in the air, becomes very soulful, and it

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Speaker 1: draws you in. And when you get down to the

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Speaker 1: jazz clubs and New Orleans, that doors are all open

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Speaker 1: and you can hear the sounds the music emanating from

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Speaker 1: the duels. That location in America has a lot of trumpeteers.

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Speaker 1: But I want to tell you today about a gentleman

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Speaker 1: named Scott's Sessions. He lived in a place that wasn't

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Speaker 1: known for jazz. I guess it's known more for cowboys,

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Speaker 1: maybe up in northern Colorado, but he was known. He

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Speaker 1: was known as a fantastic trumpetier. He had played for

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Speaker 1: years and years in a variety of bands and was beloved.

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Speaker 1: And I mean beloved, but what happened to Scott was

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Speaker 1: absolutely horrific. Scott was eventually found deceased and it turned

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Speaker 1: out that it was a murder. Today, I'm going to

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Speaker 1: talk about the murder of Scott's Sessions and Heather Frind.

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Speaker 1: I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and this is body guys. I

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Speaker 1: gotta tell you, when you begin to think about somebody

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Speaker 1: that puts so much time into everything that they do

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Speaker 1: and they are truly a professional, it's almost like seeing

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Speaker 1: somebody throw a brick through a beautiful stained glass one.

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Speaker 1: That's what this is. Joining me today is my friend

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Speaker 1: Jackie Howard, executive producer of Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 1: Yet again, you picked a very complicated case that's going

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Speaker 1: to take a lot to unpack. This is thought to

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Speaker 1: be a love triangle gone wrong. There's some indications that

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Speaker 1: it may not have been a love triangle gone wrong. Again,

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Speaker 1: a very very complex case. And the desks that we're

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Speaker 1: talking about today Stanley Scott Sessions fifty three, the Trumpeter

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Speaker 1: as you were talking about, and Heather Frank forty eight.

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Speaker 1: Heather Frank was dating Kevin East for some time and

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Speaker 1: by all accounts from friends and family. It was a

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Speaker 1: very toxic, violent relationship, very controlling and manipulative. Then Heather

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Speaker 1: Frank became interested in sessions the trumpet she has gone to,

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Speaker 1: as you said, to watch him play, and a relationship

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Speaker 1: blossomed from this. Given the toxic, manipulative nature of the

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Speaker 1: original relationship, it was evident that Eastman was not going

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Speaker 1: to let go, and often friends said that Heather Frank

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Speaker 1: came to work with bruises and visibly upset. So before

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Speaker 1: we get into the actual murders, Joe, I want to

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Speaker 1: talk about that toxic relationship, the visibility of a toxic

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Speaker 1: abusive relationship when you were on the outside looking in, Joe.

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Speaker 1: Obviously we're not going to see the emotional side, but

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Speaker 1: visibly we often can. What does this toxic abusive relationship

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Speaker 1: look like on a body. Well, you say that you're

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Speaker 1: not going to be able to see the emotion, but

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Speaker 1: you can see it, I think physically manifested. If you're

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Speaker 1: a keen investigator and you've been you know, you start

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Speaker 1: to dig into a case, and with in Heather's case,

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Speaker 1: you knows she's got these peripheral people in our life

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Speaker 1: that she works with, and so she show to work

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Speaker 1: and she would have bruises on her person. And the

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Speaker 1: interesting thing about that, and I found this working case

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Speaker 1: as many years, is that people that only see you

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Speaker 1: during the day, say work, not family members necessarily, but

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Speaker 1: people that see you from day to day, and then

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Speaker 1: you're on a break from a weekend, they'll see this

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Speaker 1: progression of injuries and they might think at first, well,

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Speaker 1: maybe she bumped into something or you know, that's their

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Speaker 1: first blush, if you will. But then they'll see something

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Speaker 1: else manifested in another location, and then suddenly a pattern

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Speaker 1: begins to develop. You know, why is this woman who

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Speaker 1: seems rather stable in her gait, walks normally, she doesn't

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Speaker 1: seem disoriented or you know, maladjusted in any way. How,

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Speaker 1: it's not possible that she's bumping into furniture all the time.

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Speaker 1: You know it's not possible, right, You're talking about the

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Speaker 1: old I ran into a door excuse, yeah, yeah, And

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Speaker 1: you you find that all the time. This even extends

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Speaker 1: to adolescence, to children, you know, they're being abused. And

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Speaker 1: so in this particular case, you would look at this

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Speaker 1: and you would begin to think about, you know, the

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Speaker 1: things that we talked about about aging injuries, and one

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Speaker 1: of the interesting practices at my colleagues engage in that

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Speaker 1: do abuse cases is that they have a scale that

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Speaker 1: they grade bruises or contusions, those vocal areas of humors

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Speaker 1: throughout the body with children, primarily where they're looking as

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Speaker 1: the bruise begins to recede, and there's time elements that

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Speaker 1: can be attached to that. So I've worked cases before

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Speaker 1: where we have overlapping progressions of bruises where you'll have

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Speaker 1: something that has turned that kind of discussing the yellow

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Speaker 1: color as we know that the bruise is beginning to recede,

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Speaker 1: and then you'll have a fresh bruise that will be

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Speaker 1: immediately adjacent, and you know, you know that, you know,

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Speaker 1: science dictates that those two things cannot have occurred at

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Speaker 1: the same time. Hang out, let me ask you a

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Speaker 1: question there, Joe. Yeah, you're talking about that the yellow

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Speaker 1: green discoloration, and then you talked about looking at fresh bruises.

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Speaker 1: Can you quickly run through that Are they deep purple immediately?

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Speaker 1: Is that how you tell them? No? Okay, no, no,

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Speaker 1: And that's an excellent question. The first thing that's going

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Speaker 1: to occur, you know, if somebody slaps somebody in the face,

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Speaker 1: that's kind of the classic you know, the classic thing

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Speaker 1: you think about, Well, you're gonna have a red mark,

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Speaker 1: and the red mark will exist for a few hours

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Speaker 1: and then all of a sudden and you know you

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Speaker 1: have ask well, what causes the red mark. Well, it's

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Speaker 1: underlying hemorrhage, particularly if you're struck hard enough. Now, the

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Speaker 1: skin is going to react and turn red just by

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Speaker 1: that kind of blunt contact. But when you really hit

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Speaker 1: somebody hard, it'll be red. And the little capillier beds.

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Speaker 1: You know, we think about patitia many times, we talk

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Speaker 1: about capillier beds, but in this particular case, you'll have

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Speaker 1: a broader area where you rupture multiple of these little

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Speaker 1: capillier beds. The blood actually goes into the interstitial tissue.

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Speaker 1: What that means is that it's leached out of the

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Speaker 1: vessels and it's into that kind of underlying fatty tissue

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Speaker 1: that's there, and it takes a while for it to change.

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Speaker 1: The really horrible thing about this, when you see a bruise,

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Speaker 1: it's actually the blood decomposing beneath that layer of skin,

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Speaker 1: and it takes a while for it to kind of

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Speaker 1: transition out, and the body has a way of kind

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Speaker 1: of pushing that out and you know, and metabolizing it

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Speaker 1: if you will, and its own way, so you know,

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Speaker 1: you'll have specific grating that you can do relative to

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Speaker 1: these bruises where it will go from that red that

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Speaker 1: we mentioned into this kind of black blue phase and

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Speaker 1: people will just make off handed remarks, you know, I

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Speaker 1: was beaten to I was black and blue. You know,

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Speaker 1: it's kind of an off handed remark. But that's one

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Speaker 1: of the points along the continuum. And then as it

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Speaker 1: progresses from that color range, which is going to take

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Speaker 1: a couple of days, you're going to see it start

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Speaker 1: to turn green most of the time as it's beginning

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Speaker 1: to recede, and then finally it goes into that yellow phase.

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Speaker 1: You can't put a specific time to it, but all

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Speaker 1: in all, these things will be back to quote unquote normal.

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Speaker 1: At the outer marker is going to be about fourteen

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Speaker 1: days until it's kind of moved all the way through

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Speaker 1: and people are gonna it's going to be as variable

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Speaker 1: as people are variable, because everybody's metabolism is different in

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Speaker 1: the way they react to trauma and all these sorts

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Speaker 1: of things. But in Heather's case, they talk about how

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Speaker 1: she was seen with these bruises, and this isn't just

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Speaker 1: a passing, thinking about multiple people that saw bruising on her,

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Speaker 1: so they know that something is going on domestically with her.

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Speaker 1: So when you see someone with a bruise, if it

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Speaker 1: is super dark in color, what you're telling me is

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Speaker 1: is that the injury to that area was enough that

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Speaker 1: it damaged a lot of blood vessels. Yeah, yeah, the

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Speaker 1: underlying blood vessels. You know, this is not something most

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Speaker 1: people think about day to day, you know, but when

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Speaker 1: you look at your skin, there are a number of

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Speaker 1: programs out there that you can computerize these things with

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Speaker 1: and appreciate all the vessels in the body. And I've

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Speaker 1: seen these things where they've got arteries highlighted and veins highlighted,

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Speaker 1: and they're throughout the body, and that kind of it's

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Speaker 1: kind of an exploded view of the body, if you will.

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Speaker 1: That's only touching the surface of it. Because extending out

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Speaker 1: from that you have capillary beds, which is actually where

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Speaker 1: the blood is kind of exchanged, and it goes from

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Speaker 1: arteries to arterials to the venuals back to veins, and

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Speaker 1: so these things are even more complex, and there's these

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Speaker 1: entire fields of these capillary bets throughout our body and

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Speaker 1: so when and they're rather delicate, so when they're they're

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Speaker 1: struck externally, you know, by blow blunt force trauma, these

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Speaker 1: things are going to rupture and then you'll just begin

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Speaker 1: to seek out blood into these particular little areas and

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Speaker 1: it just it's the beauty of it from a forensic

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Speaker 1: standpoint is that, you know, we're all about time and

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Speaker 1: timelines and that sort of thing, and it's just one

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Speaker 1: more of those elements that we can apply to understand

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Speaker 1: what was going on in an anti mortem state before

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Speaker 1: death with an individual that can obviously no longer speak

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Speaker 1: for themselves. You don't have witnesses to these things, but

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Speaker 1: you can kind of begin to develop a history they

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Speaker 1: were struck in this location, this particular day, in this location.

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Speaker 1: And with abuse victims in particular, one of the things

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Speaker 1: that's very troubling, and you know, I'm hesitant to say this,

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Speaker 1: but I'll go ahead, is that many times with abusers,

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Speaker 1: they won't strike people on the face, they won't strike

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Speaker 1: people on the arms. Necessarily, with abusers, many times they'll

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Speaker 1: strike in particularly with children, they'll strike them in clothes

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Speaker 1: or covered areas. You know, you're still getting across that

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Speaker 1: point that you're in charge, you're the dominant factor here,

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Speaker 1: and I'm going to bring pain upon you. But no

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Speaker 1: one's any the wiser because their back is struck lower back,

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Speaker 1: or they're punched in the stomach or kicked between the

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Speaker 1: legs and things like that. So normal progression somebody's day.

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Speaker 1: You're not going to necessarily see that in Heather's case.

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Speaker 1: Though in Heather's case, she obviously had injuries maybe to

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Speaker 1: her neck, her arms, So it's kind of a randomized

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Speaker 1: kind of thing. It's not. It's almost gives you an

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Speaker 1: impression that it's almost a reactionary kind of event. Perhaps

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Speaker 1: Sessions was killed first, and the location of his suspected

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Speaker 1: murder led prosecutors as they unfolded the facts in this case,

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Speaker 1: to believe that he was killed at Heather Frank's apartment.

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Speaker 1: So let's talk about number one, how did he get

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Speaker 1: there and what happened to him? Joe, He, according to prosecutors,

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Speaker 1: bled profusely, and I can't wait to talk to you

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Speaker 1: about the evidence in the apartment and how they found it.

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Speaker 1: But what happened to Sessions. The term that would I

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Speaker 1: would apply to this is the term ambush. He was

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Speaker 1: lured to Heather Frank's apartment and then he was ambushed

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Speaker 1: and his life was just spilled out literally onto the

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Speaker 1: floor in that apartment. And later, you know, the police

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Speaker 1: found evidence of this. He was attacked with an edged weapon,

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Speaker 1: which essentially means a sharp instrument. This is sharp force

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Speaker 1: trauma that he sustained, and he had he you know,

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Speaker 1: people really, you know, they think about you know, they'll

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Speaker 1: use terms like euphemistic terms, you know, like, well, you're

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Speaker 1: really cutting your own throat, those sorts of things. Well,

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Speaker 1: the reason that term has kind of entered the lexicon

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Speaker 1: over you know, centuries for us is because that traditionally

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Speaker 1: has been one of the most fatal areas that an

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Speaker 1: individual can sustain trauma in. In Scott's particular case, he

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Speaker 1: actually had his throat cut. He had his throat cut

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Speaker 1: almost immediately upon entry into Heather's apartment. Is that a

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Speaker 1: difficult thing to do, Joe? I mean, let's just look

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Speaker 1: at the mechanics, because, as we've all seen TV, somebody

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Speaker 1: comes up behind you to grab you on the forehead

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Speaker 1: and they slide a knife across your throat. Blood goes everywhere.

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Speaker 1: Is it that easy? Well, a lot of it's going

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Speaker 1: to be depended upon the strength of the individual the

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Speaker 1: perpetrator that is bringing about this assault. Also, does the

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Speaker 1: individual that's being an attack completely have their guard down?

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Speaker 1: That means that you have to have them in almost

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Speaker 1: total submission, And of course you can factor in things

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Speaker 1: like skill with an edge weapon. It's dealing with edged

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Speaker 1: weapon attacks is not something that is entered into lightly

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Speaker 1: when you think about, well, what are all the different

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Speaker 1: sets of weapons that I could bring to bear in

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Speaker 1: a case like this, and you choose edge weapons. Well,

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Speaker 1: one of the problems with edged weapons is that there's

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Speaker 1: a high probability that the perpetrator is going to run

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Speaker 1: the risk of harming themselves as well creating an injury

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Speaker 1: on their own self, because you know, let's face it,

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Speaker 1: if you don't take somebody by surprise, they're going to

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Speaker 1: fend you off as best they can, at least at

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Speaker 1: a primal level, you know, throwing up their arms and

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Speaker 1: those sorts of things to give themselves a chance to survive.

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Speaker 1: And you might, if you're the perpetrator, wound up being

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Speaker 1: cut yourself, but in this case there's not really that

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Speaker 1: much evidence of it. But if you show up to

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Speaker 1: this event, you can take somebody by surprise, and the

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Speaker 1: weapon is sufficient to the task. And what I mean

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Speaker 1: what I mean by that is it's robust enough. Because

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Speaker 1: you know, I've had cases where people have gone to

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Speaker 1: discount stores and purchase state knife sets you know that

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Speaker 1: are made and who knows where, and the strength of

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Speaker 1: the blade is insufficient to the task. Blades break off,

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Speaker 1: they don't have the edge on them. But if you

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Speaker 1: have a robust weapon, and there's any number of ways

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Speaker 1: that we can describe that, but the quality of the

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Speaker 1: steel itself that it's made with the edge of the weapon,

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Speaker 1: if there is a great edge on that weapon, you

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Speaker 1: can do a lot of harm if you know what

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Speaker 1: you're doing. Heather Franks was killed later, but after her

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Speaker 1: body was found and investigators started going to her home

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Speaker 1: and looking at what happened, they discovered this pool of

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Speaker 1: blood and there was so much blood, Joe, that it

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Speaker 1: seeped through the carpet, through the pad. So remind me

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Speaker 1: again how much blood there is in the human body

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Speaker 1: and when it pulls out like that, what are they

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Speaker 1: going to find? That is a fantastic question, because you know,

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Speaker 1: one of the things that we actually look for at

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Speaker 1: autopsy and it's kind of a tell when your people

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Speaker 1: might might think this is kind of an incidental finding,

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Speaker 1: but it's actually very significant. When you're dealing with a

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Speaker 1: sharp force injury attack, you're going to bleed profusely, okay,

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Speaker 1: and at autopsy, and I've actually been present when this happens.

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Speaker 1: I've actually attempted to do it. You draw blood out

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Speaker 1: of the body, right, You draw blood, and we go

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Speaker 1: in literally into the aorta, which is the big vessel

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Speaker 1: that comes off the heart. I have done autopsies on

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Speaker 1: bodies they bled so much at the scene that I'd

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Speaker 1: literally had to truly struggle to find blood to draw

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Speaker 1: out of the body just in order to get a

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Speaker 1: sample for toxicology. Many times with edged weapon events, we'd

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Speaker 1: have to go into the leg, into the femoral art

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Speaker 1: where you've got kind of peripheral blood sources in order

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Speaker 1: to draw blood because you bleed so much that these

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Speaker 1: injuries are very nasty. The difference between this and a

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Speaker 1: gunshot wound, for instance, gunshot wounds those injuries not all,

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Speaker 1: not all, but those injuries are kind of small compared

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Speaker 1: to somebody literally having their body opened up with a knife.

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Speaker 1: And so you're contacting multiple vessels, all those capillary beds,

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Speaker 1: the underlying vessels, and any kind of viscera, any kind

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Speaker 1: of the organs that are beneath that. So you've got

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Speaker 1: multiple blood you've got multiple sources of blood loss. So

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Speaker 1: you know, if the human body has it's going to

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Speaker 1: be variable. Again, you think about human body having you

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Speaker 1: know about two gallons of blood and it is there's

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Speaker 1: a chance that you can lose almost every bit of it.

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Speaker 1: And again a lot of that is going to be

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Speaker 1: depended upon where the injury is. Let's say, for instance,

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Speaker 1: here the back of somebody's calf is cut. All right,

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Speaker 1: now you're going to bleed. Obviously, that goes without stating, however,

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Speaker 1: you compare an injury to the calf with a sharp

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Speaker 1: edged weapon, to say the throat, there's no competition because

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Speaker 1: there's so many vessels that travel through the neck. And

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Speaker 1: we've talked about this any number of times, but it

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Speaker 1: needs to be repeated. You've got major vessel structures that

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Speaker 1: are running through the neck to supply the brain, which,

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Speaker 1: out of all the organs in the body, the brain

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Speaker 1: requires the most blood. So when you start to get

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Speaker 1: into the complex involving the juggler veins and then the

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Speaker 1: carotid arteries. You're talking about major blood loss because guess what,

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Speaker 1: the heart hasn't been disrupted yet, the heart still pumping,

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Speaker 1: and as the heart pumps, you're going to have this

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Speaker 1: gush of blood that is coming out of the neck.

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Speaker 1: And if the person hits the floor and stays in

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Speaker 1: one spot, it will saturate that underlying area. And then

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Speaker 1: Scott's death and when they were able to actually recover

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Speaker 1: the evidence of this event at Heather's apartment, you're right.

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Speaker 1: You had a layer of carpeting, the top layer, and

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Speaker 1: then the pad which people are familiar with, the kind

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Speaker 1: of softens, you know, softens your footfall, and then down

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Speaker 1: into the subflooring that area was supersaturated. And why is

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Speaker 1: this important forensically, Well, we can look at that bloody

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Speaker 1: area and tie the blood. We can actually type it

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Speaker 1: and loop it back to who's blood it might have

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00:20:05,320 --> 00:20:08,040
Speaker 1: been through blood type, and then of course we can

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Speaker 1: collect it and perhaps that there's a viable sample we

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00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:15,359
Speaker 1: can do DNA. But it also gives us another indication

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Speaker 1: that dynamics of the event. You know, you begin to

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Speaker 1: look at it and you think, well, if I've got

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Speaker 1: this heavy concentration of blood right here, and there are

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Speaker 1: no other, say, peripheral areas of blood, like blood drops,

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Speaker 1: or any kind of blood staining on the walls or

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Speaker 1: anything like that. What we can opine at that point

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Speaker 1: in time is that the individual that sustained this injury

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Speaker 1: didn't move any further than that location. What kind of

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Speaker 1: person possesses the will to perpetrate such a violent crime

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Speaker 1: on another person, and not just a person that they

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Speaker 1: were involved in an intimate relationship with, but a person

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Speaker 1: that they didn't really know. How much anger and how

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Speaker 1: much hatred would have to be brought to bear in

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Speaker 1: order to take a knife and cut somebody's throat. It's

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Speaker 1: absolutely startling when you think about. It's a little ironic

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Speaker 1: that you say it like that, Joe, because slicing Session's

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00:21:37,880 --> 00:21:43,960
Speaker 1: throat is not the only injury that this man had. Yeah,

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00:21:44,200 --> 00:21:47,800
Speaker 1: it's really not. And as I mentioned, this is an

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Speaker 1: ambush attack. There were multiple sharp force injuries to the

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Speaker 1: back of his neck. According to what the courts have

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00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:57,920
Speaker 1: said and what was set a trial, it wasn't just

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Speaker 1: simply the cutting of this rope. And we talk about

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Speaker 1: things in forensics in degrees. Many of times sometimes we

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Speaker 1: don't have we don't really have the verbiage to apply

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Speaker 1: to it. Many times, it's very interesting when you read

347
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Speaker 1: autopsy reports and you hear people in forensics talk and

348
00:22:21,359 --> 00:22:26,080
Speaker 1: they're talking about injuries, they'll use the term gaping quite

349
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Speaker 1: a bit. And I am in no way making a

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Speaker 1: light of this, but if folks at home will just

351
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Speaker 1: imagine what a sharp force injury where the edge that

352
00:22:38,720 --> 00:22:44,520
Speaker 1: blade is actually drawn across the surface of the anterior neck,

353
00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:49,960
Speaker 1: it creates this kind of gaping injury that looks very

354
00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:54,240
Speaker 1: similar to a smile. And the reason that happens is

355
00:22:54,440 --> 00:22:57,679
Speaker 1: kind of the biomechanics that are involved in the person

356
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Speaker 1: wielding the knife and of course the surface of the

357
00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:02,439
Speaker 1: x so when they cut, many times, it's not just

358
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Speaker 1: going to be straight across the throat. And that's one

359
00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:08,280
Speaker 1: of the kind of weird things that you'll see in Hollywood,

360
00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:10,840
Speaker 1: you know that they'll display that kind of event like that.

361
00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:13,320
Speaker 1: It's generally not it's going to be kind of elliptical

362
00:23:13,359 --> 00:23:15,520
Speaker 1: in shape where we'll go from high to low the

363
00:23:15,680 --> 00:23:18,480
Speaker 1: back to high. Many times if there can be direct

364
00:23:18,640 --> 00:23:24,200
Speaker 1: pressure applied for the entire stroke of that blade. And

365
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Speaker 1: one of the things that really kind of grabs you

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Speaker 1: in the death of Scott and the injury that he

367
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Speaker 1: sustained when they were finally able to assess it, is

368
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Speaker 1: the fact that investigators had described and the pathologist had

369
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Speaker 1: described the fact that Scott's head was almost completely separated

370
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Speaker 1: from his body. So what that means is that you're

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Speaker 1: not just going through these vessels that we've talked about,

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Speaker 1: you know, these major vessels that supply the brain with oxygen,

373
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Speaker 1: but you're also going through all the muscletachments and some

374
00:24:02,359 --> 00:24:06,520
Speaker 1: of these features that keep our head upright, if you will,

375
00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:10,119
Speaker 1: the musculature and all those sorts of things, until the

376
00:24:10,160 --> 00:24:14,880
Speaker 1: individual would have gotten down to the spinal proceeds, those

377
00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:20,400
Speaker 1: stacked vertebra in the cervical area that hold our head upright,

378
00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:23,640
Speaker 1: you know, that structure that had gotten all the way

379
00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:27,040
Speaker 1: down to that point to where his neck was in

380
00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:30,440
Speaker 1: such a condition that when they observed his body, there

381
00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:37,080
Speaker 1: was this idea that he had almost been decapitated. And again,

382
00:24:37,280 --> 00:24:41,320
Speaker 1: I think that that's a demonstration of how much anger

383
00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:46,160
Speaker 1: and hatred is involved in an attack like this. So

384
00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:51,320
Speaker 1: would the near decapitation come from the repeated blows? I mean,

385
00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:54,200
Speaker 1: let's be realistic. When you look at your neck, it's

386
00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:58,159
Speaker 1: smaller than your torso than your head. So is the

387
00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:02,560
Speaker 1: near decapitation from repeated cuts. We said that he had

388
00:25:02,760 --> 00:25:05,920
Speaker 1: many injuries to his neck, or did that come from

389
00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:09,879
Speaker 1: one long slice across his throat? It can, and again

390
00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:14,119
Speaker 1: a lot of this is depended upon the amount of

391
00:25:14,200 --> 00:25:19,160
Speaker 1: pressure that can be applied in one fail swoop and

392
00:25:19,480 --> 00:25:21,879
Speaker 1: how sharp the edge is on the blade. I would

393
00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:28,640
Speaker 1: suspect that this occurred as a result of multiple, multiple

394
00:25:28,680 --> 00:25:33,760
Speaker 1: insults or strokes across that area. It would be very difficult,

395
00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:36,719
Speaker 1: I would think, at least, to render this kind of

396
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:40,920
Speaker 1: injury with one blow. We're not talking about somebody swinging

397
00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:44,320
Speaker 1: an axe here, okay, We're talking about an individual that

398
00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:47,359
Speaker 1: is using a handheld blade where they're having to generate

399
00:25:47,440 --> 00:25:50,760
Speaker 1: all of this force by moving their hand either from

400
00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:53,920
Speaker 1: left to right or right to left and getting down

401
00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:56,800
Speaker 1: into that tissue. I don't see that it would necessarily

402
00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:00,480
Speaker 1: be possible to do that. So you have to do

403
00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:04,600
Speaker 1: this multiple times, and you know, to re emphasize this point.

404
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:07,240
Speaker 1: This gives you an indication as to how much time

405
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:12,600
Speaker 1: the perpetrator would have had to have spent doing this,

406
00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:17,800
Speaker 1: how much rage how much anger is driving this event

407
00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:21,520
Speaker 1: that is so unimaginably horrific, And it really goes to

408
00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:25,639
Speaker 1: I think it leads to the pathology of an individual

409
00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:28,680
Speaker 1: that would do this, because you know, it's not like

410
00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:32,320
Speaker 1: you've got somebody that is in the person of Eastman.

411
00:26:32,520 --> 00:26:34,919
Speaker 1: You don't have somebody that's working, say, for instance, in

412
00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:38,400
Speaker 1: a slaughterhouse. Okay, that's day after day there, You've seen

413
00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:40,760
Speaker 1: blood they're used to seeing. I mean, let's face it,

414
00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:44,120
Speaker 1: the death of animals. There's almost kind of a disconnect

415
00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:47,320
Speaker 1: between what they're doing occupationally in the gored that they're

416
00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:52,520
Speaker 1: they're subjected to. This is a guy that, to the

417
00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:56,280
Speaker 1: best of our knowledge it doesn't have this level of experience,

418
00:26:56,320 --> 00:26:58,760
Speaker 1: certainly not in the immediate he wasn't doing a job

419
00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:02,560
Speaker 1: like that. So they have to have a very strong

420
00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:06,879
Speaker 1: driver behind them that you know, we're not talking about

421
00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:10,000
Speaker 1: doing this to some poor animal in a slaughterhouse. We're

422
00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:12,840
Speaker 1: talking about a fellow human being. I mean, just let

423
00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:15,399
Speaker 1: that sink in and resonate with you, just for a moment.

424
00:27:15,760 --> 00:27:20,000
Speaker 1: And this is another point along this is that in

425
00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:24,800
Speaker 1: doing this you talk about contact trace evidence. Oh my lord,

426
00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:28,119
Speaker 1: this particular case, you know, he would have had to

427
00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:31,679
Speaker 1: have cleaned himself up very very well, gotten rid of

428
00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:34,200
Speaker 1: his clothes. More than likely that's what happened, because he

429
00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:37,280
Speaker 1: would have been super saturated in blood. Because this is

430
00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:39,639
Speaker 1: not something you just merely walk away from. This is

431
00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:43,720
Speaker 1: not like you've taken firearm and shot somebody and then

432
00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:48,520
Speaker 1: you're essentially absent visible, visible evidence on your body. And

433
00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:50,320
Speaker 1: I know that people will say, well, you can get

434
00:27:50,480 --> 00:27:53,240
Speaker 1: you know, blood staining that blows back on it. Yeah

435
00:27:53,320 --> 00:27:56,200
Speaker 1: you can, and there's gunshod residue. But come on, let's

436
00:27:56,200 --> 00:27:59,159
Speaker 1: face it, what we're talking about here is just the

437
00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:02,679
Speaker 1: depths of horror. Before we talk about the discovery of

438
00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:05,880
Speaker 1: Session's body, let's jump ahead and talk about the death

439
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:10,760
Speaker 1: of Heather Frank for a second. Heather Frank continued about

440
00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:16,440
Speaker 1: her quote unquote normal life for a week before she

441
00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:22,159
Speaker 1: was killed. How was she killed? Joe with Scott, you know,

442
00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:26,520
Speaker 1: we've talked about this at nauseam relative to Sharp Hoor's injuries,

443
00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:31,960
Speaker 1: but with Heather, Heather was actually shot shot twice in

444
00:28:32,040 --> 00:28:36,480
Speaker 1: the chest with twenty two caliber ammunition. It's a much

445
00:28:37,760 --> 00:28:40,520
Speaker 1: I don't know if the term merciful really fits in here,

446
00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:44,080
Speaker 1: but let's face it, in the grand scheme of things,

447
00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:49,200
Speaker 1: you're not almost decapitating her, all right, So it would

448
00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:52,200
Speaker 1: have been a much cleaner death, I would think, and

449
00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:55,920
Speaker 1: much less dramatic, if you will, because if she shot

450
00:28:55,920 --> 00:28:58,360
Speaker 1: in the chest, there's high probability that you're going to

451
00:28:58,480 --> 00:29:02,200
Speaker 1: hit a vital area, perhaps a heart, the lungs, and

452
00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:05,960
Speaker 1: death would soon follow thereafter deepen upon the location of

453
00:29:05,960 --> 00:29:07,760
Speaker 1: the injuries. But we do know that she was shot

454
00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:13,440
Speaker 1: in the chest, and fascinatingly enough, when Eastman was discovered,

455
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:17,040
Speaker 1: he actually had twenty two caliber ammunition in his pocket

456
00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:20,640
Speaker 1: and that was what she was killed with. Yeah, she

457
00:29:20,880 --> 00:29:24,120
Speaker 1: was in fact killed with twenty two caliber ammunition. You've

458
00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:27,360
Speaker 1: got kind of this forensic tie back. You know, that's

459
00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:30,440
Speaker 1: a very specific ammunition, and yeah, a lot of people

460
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:32,160
Speaker 1: have it. I think twenty two caliber is one of

461
00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:35,240
Speaker 1: the most popular types of ammunition that's out there. People

462
00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:37,760
Speaker 1: use it for varmint hunting. You know, it's a very

463
00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:41,120
Speaker 1: small caliber. It's probably the smallest. Now I know there

464
00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:43,160
Speaker 1: are people out there to say, well, it's not smallest.

465
00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:45,760
Speaker 1: There's yeah, there's these other kind of off the beaten

466
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:48,040
Speaker 1: path ammos that are out there, But I'm talking about

467
00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:51,360
Speaker 1: something that is widely sold. When you know we've gone

468
00:29:51,360 --> 00:29:54,400
Speaker 1: through ammunition shortages in this country, one of the things

469
00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:58,160
Speaker 1: that goes off the shelf first is twenty two caliber ammunition.

470
00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:01,400
Speaker 1: And it's because it's a small caliber people can keep

471
00:30:01,440 --> 00:30:03,720
Speaker 1: it around. They use it for varmint hunting, they use

472
00:30:03,800 --> 00:30:06,280
Speaker 1: it for what's referred to as plinking, which is just

473
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:08,720
Speaker 1: target shooting out on property and that sort of thing.

474
00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:12,360
Speaker 1: A lot of people possess twenty two caliber weapons, whether

475
00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:15,080
Speaker 1: it be a pistol or whether it be a shoulder

476
00:30:15,080 --> 00:30:17,840
Speaker 1: fired arm. So just the fact that he had it

477
00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:21,040
Speaker 1: in his pocket is not necessarily mean that he did

478
00:30:21,080 --> 00:30:24,320
Speaker 1: the killing. But then when you combine the fact that

479
00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:28,400
Speaker 1: she's found with these rounds that had been pumped into

480
00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:30,920
Speaker 1: her chest, and that he had the same ammunition, and

481
00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:34,680
Speaker 1: the fact that when she was found deceased, she was

482
00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:38,760
Speaker 1: actually found in an area he had access to, wrapped

483
00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:42,320
Speaker 1: in plastic and tied up with bailey and wire. So

484
00:30:42,400 --> 00:30:45,200
Speaker 1: here's the point I want to make about these two murders, Joe.

485
00:30:46,760 --> 00:30:52,400
Speaker 1: Given the fact that prosecutors believe that Heather Frank's lured

486
00:30:52,680 --> 00:30:58,080
Speaker 1: Sessions to her apartment to make this murder happen, she

487
00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:02,000
Speaker 1: was part of it. Whether it was coerced by abuse

488
00:31:02,800 --> 00:31:05,640
Speaker 1: doesn't really matter. She was a part of it. So

489
00:31:05,680 --> 00:31:08,320
Speaker 1: then why was she killed? If she was a part

490
00:31:08,360 --> 00:31:11,800
Speaker 1: of this to begin with, why did she have to die?

491
00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:15,560
Speaker 1: You know, I've had somebody else asking that question about this,

492
00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:18,720
Speaker 1: because you know, you think about how some people have

493
00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:22,760
Speaker 1: put forth this idea that this toxic relationship that these

494
00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:25,959
Speaker 1: two had and it lasted for seven years, all right,

495
00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:28,120
Speaker 1: and it was on again, off again, they'd fight and

496
00:31:28,320 --> 00:31:32,440
Speaker 1: carry on and whatnot. If she was so afraid of

497
00:31:32,520 --> 00:31:37,440
Speaker 1: him and she had lured Sessions to her apartment, why

498
00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:40,440
Speaker 1: would Eastman kill her? Because you would think that he

499
00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:44,080
Speaker 1: could control her, you know, just merely through fear. I

500
00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:47,440
Speaker 1: think that and some people put forth this theory that

501
00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:52,640
Speaker 1: after a time he realized that she could talk, that

502
00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:56,720
Speaker 1: she would be a source of information that would tie

503
00:31:56,800 --> 00:32:00,400
Speaker 1: him back. And let This is not just like you know,

504
00:32:00,520 --> 00:32:03,480
Speaker 1: randomly bumping into a car when you're driving down the

505
00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:06,800
Speaker 1: road and you've got a passenger that witnesses it. We're

506
00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:10,680
Speaker 1: talking about bringing a man to your apartment. We're talking

507
00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:15,360
Speaker 1: about you being a witness to him, literally ambushing This

508
00:32:15,400 --> 00:32:19,800
Speaker 1: man is a sweet, beloved man, and you're bearing witness

509
00:32:19,880 --> 00:32:23,080
Speaker 1: to him cutting his throat until he bleeds out on

510
00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:27,840
Speaker 1: the carpet. We're thinking about potentially her health helping him,

511
00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:32,360
Speaker 1: that is Eastman, or remove Scott's body and helping to

512
00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:37,280
Speaker 1: dispose of it. All of those things in his mind

513
00:32:37,320 --> 00:32:40,200
Speaker 1: at least are kind of connecting these dots, and he

514
00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:43,280
Speaker 1: has maybe a moment of lucidity where he says, look,

515
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:45,080
Speaker 1: if if I don't get rid of her, she can

516
00:32:45,120 --> 00:32:50,240
Speaker 1: tie me back to this murder, this disposal, and then

517
00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:52,960
Speaker 1: my life is over with. So if I remove her

518
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:56,400
Speaker 1: from the equation, even though I quote unquote love her,

519
00:32:56,640 --> 00:32:58,680
Speaker 1: I gotta get rid of her. I gotta get rid

520
00:32:58,680 --> 00:33:18,960
Speaker 1: of her, and I gotta do it right quick. You know,

521
00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:21,040
Speaker 1: when you get up there to this area of the

522
00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:25,800
Speaker 1: country where these two horrific deaths took place, it's isolated,

523
00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:29,760
Speaker 1: it's beautiful, it's you know, it's it's more like you're

524
00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:31,440
Speaker 1: not right in the middle of the Rockies. You can

525
00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:33,240
Speaker 1: probably see them in the distance in a couple of

526
00:33:33,240 --> 00:33:36,840
Speaker 1: locations there. We're talking about Laramie in Weld Counties, not

527
00:33:36,960 --> 00:33:40,040
Speaker 1: too far from Greeley, and for Collins in that area

528
00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:46,480
Speaker 1: up in northern Colorado. What's absolutely shocking about this is

529
00:33:46,520 --> 00:33:52,920
Speaker 1: that this case, these two homicides or so brutal and

530
00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:57,080
Speaker 1: so horrific, and it's so isolated. I had this kind

531
00:33:57,080 --> 00:34:01,680
Speaker 1: of moment of clarity when I'm going over these cases

532
00:34:01,720 --> 00:34:06,320
Speaker 1: to talk about them, I suddenly came to realization, Well,

533
00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:11,760
Speaker 1: County is actually where Chris Watts had killed his entire family.

534
00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:14,440
Speaker 1: What are the hots I think that he would have

535
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:20,760
Speaker 1: These two completely unconnected events happened in such a rural,

536
00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:24,279
Speaker 1: isolated area, that's, you know, by all accounts, a very

537
00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:27,120
Speaker 1: peaceful area. What they found out at the scenes, though,

538
00:34:27,360 --> 00:34:34,720
Speaker 1: involving Sessions and in front, was absolutely horrific. We've seen

539
00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:39,800
Speaker 1: this over and over again, Joe on bodybags. People think

540
00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:43,759
Speaker 1: that it's easy to render down a body. Let's just

541
00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:49,359
Speaker 1: throw them in the fire. That's what happened to sessions body. Yeah,

542
00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:54,080
Speaker 1: you're right, it was and it rendered down, and we're

543
00:34:54,120 --> 00:34:57,920
Speaker 1: just talking about the lower torso. There was still sufficient

544
00:34:58,040 --> 00:35:03,400
Speaker 1: remain left behind that Scott's body was found, you know,

545
00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:05,799
Speaker 1: still intact to the point where they could do an

546
00:35:05,800 --> 00:35:09,960
Speaker 1: assessment on his remains the upper torso, and they could

547
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:14,440
Speaker 1: assess this injury to his neck, you know that we

548
00:35:14,520 --> 00:35:17,520
Speaker 1: talked about, and that was so horrific, but also one

549
00:35:17,600 --> 00:35:22,640
Speaker 1: other significant finding that kind of connects these two deaths.

550
00:35:22,640 --> 00:35:25,640
Speaker 1: Scott's body was found in Laramie County and then Frank's

551
00:35:25,719 --> 00:35:30,040
Speaker 1: was found over in World County. Scott had plastic melted

552
00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:33,600
Speaker 1: to his face, and it can be surmised that his

553
00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:37,080
Speaker 1: body had in fact been wrapped in plastic, and not

554
00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:42,360
Speaker 1: only wrapped in plastic, but the same plastic that was

555
00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:46,320
Speaker 1: used to wrap up Heather Frank's body that was intact.

556
00:35:46,360 --> 00:35:49,560
Speaker 1: Her body was intact if she had been shot multiple times,

557
00:35:49,640 --> 00:35:53,479
Speaker 1: wrapped in plastic and then tied off with Baylen wire.

558
00:35:53,520 --> 00:35:56,560
Speaker 1: But Scott had been placed into this burn pit and

559
00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:01,160
Speaker 1: his remains were burned. It was an insufficient job. It

560
00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:03,479
Speaker 1: was insufficient to the task. And we hear that theme

561
00:36:03,600 --> 00:36:06,279
Speaker 1: over and over and over again in forensics, and I

562
00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:10,440
Speaker 1: certainly talked about it here on body backs. And the

563
00:36:10,520 --> 00:36:14,040
Speaker 1: individual that's doing this either loses the will to continue

564
00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:16,920
Speaker 1: on with what they're doing, they get distracted, maybe they

565
00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:19,319
Speaker 1: have to go to work. Maybe there they don't have

566
00:36:19,440 --> 00:36:22,440
Speaker 1: sufficient supplies in order to keep this up, because you know,

567
00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:26,480
Speaker 1: when you're burning a body, you have to keep this

568
00:36:26,640 --> 00:36:29,480
Speaker 1: heat going, and it's not something that can be backed

569
00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:32,160
Speaker 1: off of because you're in an open area. This is

570
00:36:32,160 --> 00:36:35,479
Speaker 1: not a crematory. You're having to always stoke the fire,

571
00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:39,759
Speaker 1: turn the fire, and in sense, come in contact constantly

572
00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:43,680
Speaker 1: with the remain Can anyone possibly imagine what that's like.

573
00:36:43,920 --> 00:36:49,560
Speaker 1: You're standing over a fire pit that you have seemingly created,

574
00:36:49,640 --> 00:36:53,880
Speaker 1: and you're applying fuel, you're applying accelerant, you're turning the fire,

575
00:36:54,360 --> 00:36:56,799
Speaker 1: and maybe all of a sudden you have this kind

576
00:36:56,840 --> 00:36:59,359
Speaker 1: of epiphanal moment. It's like, oh my god, I'm I'm

577
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:03,319
Speaker 1: actually burning another human being's body here, and you just

578
00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:06,239
Speaker 1: kind of walk away from it for a moment. In

579
00:37:06,239 --> 00:37:12,440
Speaker 1: this particular case, when the fire was not tended to properly,

580
00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:15,920
Speaker 1: that's the moment, you know, forensically, when you get a break,

581
00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:18,399
Speaker 1: because that means that all of the evidence hasn't been

582
00:37:18,440 --> 00:37:22,840
Speaker 1: consumed buy the fire. You still have this gaping wound

583
00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:25,600
Speaker 1: in the neck where you can actually make the assessment

584
00:37:25,640 --> 00:37:29,080
Speaker 1: that the head was almost separated from the body. And

585
00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:32,719
Speaker 1: also this plastic that is a tie back, and we

586
00:37:32,760 --> 00:37:35,919
Speaker 1: look for tie backs and forensics all the time. Connectivity,

587
00:37:35,960 --> 00:37:38,360
Speaker 1: if you will, to send you that kind of holds

588
00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:42,720
Speaker 1: everything together. And this plastic that was found on Scott's

589
00:37:42,719 --> 00:37:47,440
Speaker 1: Session's body was also found wrapping Heather Frank's body. Investigators

590
00:37:47,440 --> 00:37:49,960
Speaker 1: are not just going to look at that and go, oh,

591
00:37:50,080 --> 00:37:53,000
Speaker 1: they're green. Plastic on both of these body must have

592
00:37:53,040 --> 00:37:55,479
Speaker 1: come from the same source. They're actually going to set

593
00:37:55,520 --> 00:37:58,960
Speaker 1: out to prove that it came from the same source.

594
00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:02,640
Speaker 1: How do they do that? Yeah, isn't that interesting when

595
00:38:02,719 --> 00:38:05,080
Speaker 1: you begin to think about there's any number of ways

596
00:38:05,120 --> 00:38:09,120
Speaker 1: that like plastics sheeting like this can be tied back.

597
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:11,040
Speaker 1: We think, first off, you have to do a general

598
00:38:11,080 --> 00:38:14,719
Speaker 1: overall classification, and again that's one of the things that's

599
00:38:14,760 --> 00:38:19,080
Speaker 1: done in forensic practice. You look at the plastic that

600
00:38:19,120 --> 00:38:23,360
Speaker 1: you have, and they've termed this as construction grade plastic,

601
00:38:23,400 --> 00:38:28,000
Speaker 1: which means it's robust, and it also means that it

602
00:38:28,080 --> 00:38:31,880
Speaker 1: is unique. That this is not necessarily the kind of

603
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:35,680
Speaker 1: plastic sheeting you're going to have laid around in your garage. Okay,

604
00:38:36,040 --> 00:38:38,600
Speaker 1: it's not the same type of plastic you're going to

605
00:38:38,680 --> 00:38:41,439
Speaker 1: put down in your garden, for instance, when people put

606
00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:44,160
Speaker 1: down a barrier of plastic in order to keep weeds

607
00:38:44,200 --> 00:38:47,080
Speaker 1: from from growing up through it. This is a very

608
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:51,919
Speaker 1: particular type of plastic that has specific features. We begin

609
00:38:51,960 --> 00:38:54,680
Speaker 1: to think about the thickness of it, you know, how

610
00:38:54,800 --> 00:38:58,080
Speaker 1: robust is it? We think about color and what kind

611
00:38:58,120 --> 00:39:01,799
Speaker 1: of sources locally could you acquire this plastic from or

612
00:39:02,239 --> 00:39:04,640
Speaker 1: where's it being used? Did you go into a job site?

613
00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:07,080
Speaker 1: Did somebody go into a job site and steal the plastic?

614
00:39:07,560 --> 00:39:10,879
Speaker 1: Was the individual that was using this involved in construction,

615
00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:15,359
Speaker 1: which of course Eastman was, And then you know, when

616
00:39:15,440 --> 00:39:19,799
Speaker 1: you get into more of the dense forensics here, these

617
00:39:19,800 --> 00:39:23,000
Speaker 1: plastics have very specific chemical structures and if you want

618
00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:25,640
Speaker 1: to go this far with it, you can begin to

619
00:39:25,680 --> 00:39:29,880
Speaker 1: think about, well, if we've got plastics involved in this case,

620
00:39:29,960 --> 00:39:33,760
Speaker 1: are these two things chemically related molecularly? You know, it's

621
00:39:33,800 --> 00:39:36,040
Speaker 1: the same composition, that sort of thing, because these things

622
00:39:36,080 --> 00:39:38,279
Speaker 1: have a formula to them that are very specific to

623
00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:41,759
Speaker 1: that brand. You can also look if it's perforated in

624
00:39:41,840 --> 00:39:44,760
Speaker 1: any way. Forensic scientists that are involved in trace evidence

625
00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:48,560
Speaker 1: can actually match up perforations if it's torn away. You

626
00:39:48,600 --> 00:39:51,080
Speaker 1: can also think about how was it cut, and again

627
00:39:51,200 --> 00:39:54,480
Speaker 1: that implies the use of a blated instrument in order

628
00:39:54,520 --> 00:39:56,799
Speaker 1: to facilitate that. So there's any number of ways that

629
00:39:56,840 --> 00:39:59,160
Speaker 1: you can kind of tie this back. And they were

630
00:39:59,200 --> 00:40:02,320
Speaker 1: able to least were actually able to kind of marry

631
00:40:02,400 --> 00:40:05,280
Speaker 1: up if you will, the plastic found melted to Scott's

632
00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:08,719
Speaker 1: face and that plastic that Heather Frank's body was wrapped in.

633
00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:12,080
Speaker 1: Let's talk one more piece of connectivity that you're talking about.

634
00:40:12,239 --> 00:40:16,160
Speaker 1: When Heather Frank's body was found, it was found next

635
00:40:16,200 --> 00:40:18,680
Speaker 1: to a woodpile. Not only was it found next to

636
00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:21,200
Speaker 1: a woodpile, there was a large log there that was

637
00:40:22,040 --> 00:40:26,799
Speaker 1: found smoldering. And I think that one of the interesting

638
00:40:26,800 --> 00:40:31,080
Speaker 1: we're talking about bodies being found. If we'll go back

639
00:40:31,360 --> 00:40:35,080
Speaker 1: to the discovery of Scott's body, and Scott was missing.

640
00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:37,640
Speaker 1: He had last talked to his dad in the evening

641
00:40:37,760 --> 00:40:41,480
Speaker 1: preceding these events, I think by two days, and of

642
00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:43,640
Speaker 1: course he didn't show up for a gig. His body

643
00:40:43,719 --> 00:40:46,400
Speaker 1: was actually discovered on the tent I believe it was,

644
00:40:47,520 --> 00:40:51,360
Speaker 1: and it was discovered by a snowplow driver. This is

645
00:40:51,400 --> 00:40:53,440
Speaker 1: one of the coldest times of the year up in

646
00:40:53,440 --> 00:40:58,399
Speaker 1: Colorado and so snow on the ground, snowplow drivers coming

647
00:40:58,440 --> 00:41:01,800
Speaker 1: along and he sees these human remains out there and

648
00:41:01,840 --> 00:41:06,040
Speaker 1: they burned bit. But what happened was and this is

649
00:41:06,120 --> 00:41:08,839
Speaker 1: kind of fascinating, as the police began to put two

650
00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:12,640
Speaker 1: and two together. In this case, they actually drew up

651
00:41:13,640 --> 00:41:18,680
Speaker 1: warrants for the murder of Scott's session. They drew up

652
00:41:18,719 --> 00:41:24,240
Speaker 1: warrants for both Eastman and Heather Franks. They wanted both

653
00:41:24,280 --> 00:41:28,040
Speaker 1: of them for questioning in the disappearance of Scott, and

654
00:41:28,080 --> 00:41:31,799
Speaker 1: they went so far as to put tracking devices on

655
00:41:32,120 --> 00:41:36,400
Speaker 1: Scott's vehicle and on Heather Frank's vehicle. And one of

656
00:41:36,400 --> 00:41:40,239
Speaker 1: the things that occurred is that they were able to

657
00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:46,960
Speaker 1: track Eastman's location relative to Heather's body. They knew that

658
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:49,759
Speaker 1: he had visited that area, and then when they went

659
00:41:49,800 --> 00:41:52,319
Speaker 1: out to conduct a search day being the police, they

660
00:41:52,760 --> 00:41:55,440
Speaker 1: discovered her remains. He was actually they get this, he

661
00:41:55,480 --> 00:41:59,480
Speaker 1: was actually arrested at a local filling station with a

662
00:41:59,520 --> 00:42:04,480
Speaker 1: gasking he was getting ready to burn her body up,

663
00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:07,360
Speaker 1: and it was just adjacent to this woodpile. There was

664
00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:09,560
Speaker 1: even a large log they said, that was out there

665
00:42:09,600 --> 00:42:12,320
Speaker 1: that was smoldering. So he was prepping. He was getting

666
00:42:12,360 --> 00:42:16,440
Speaker 1: ready to attempt to render down the body of this

667
00:42:16,520 --> 00:42:20,279
Speaker 1: woman that he had been involved in an intimate relationship

668
00:42:20,320 --> 00:42:26,279
Speaker 1: with for over seven years. Kevin Eastman was subsequently convicted

669
00:42:26,600 --> 00:42:31,880
Speaker 1: and is serving consecutive life sentences in Colorado State Penitential.

670
00:42:36,120 --> 00:42:40,080
Speaker 1: I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and this is body Backs