Speaker 1: It's the inside scoop of FT senior insider Ken Rosenthal.
Speaker 1: Let's do a little trade talk and speculation, shall we. Ken,
Speaker 1: We're going to get into some of your notes column
Speaker 1: that was put up in The Athletic yesterday. I want
Speaker 1: to start with Seya Suzuki and the Chicago Cubs and
Speaker 1: what you wrote about there and the possibility that he
Speaker 1: could be moved at the deadline. What do you think.
Speaker 2: With than anything, But there is a lot of basis
Speaker 2: to it. And here's the deal. So, right handed hitting
Speaker 2: in the game is at a premium right now. There
Speaker 2: aren't many quality right handed hitters available or even in
Speaker 2: the major leagues. The ops by right handed hitters is
Speaker 2: like the lowest since nineteen ninety two or would be.
Speaker 2: So that's one element why Suzuki could be in some demand.
Speaker 2: And the other thing here is that the Cubs, even
Speaker 2: after signing Nico Horners, still have a number of potential
Speaker 2: free agents. It's in Hap, it's Suzuki, it's ti im Naga, Boyd.
Speaker 2: They're not going to sign all of them, so they
Speaker 2: might not even make qualifying offers to all of them.
Speaker 2: So do you want to get something back and in
Speaker 2: the process shake up a team that until last night
Speaker 2: at least has looked I don't know, wildly inconsistent. It
Speaker 2: hasn't looked like it. They've played wildly inconsistent, and go
Speaker 2: about it that way. Now. The negative would be, of course,
Speaker 2: removing Suzuki's bat from the lineup. He had a home
Speaker 2: run last night. But they could go with Matt Shaw,
Speaker 2: they could go with kind of a platoon there and
Speaker 2: figure things out along the way with Confordo. So I'm
Speaker 2: not saying it's going to happen. I'm just saying there
Speaker 2: is a lot of reason to believe it could happen,
Speaker 2: and something that I imagined they would at least discuss rather
Speaker 2: than get just a draft pick back in return at
Speaker 2: the end of the season.
Speaker 3: Ken, I love the way you're thinking right now. I'm
Speaker 3: all for it kind of. But my thing is, he's
Speaker 3: a guy that's been there before. I'm big on veteran guys.
Speaker 3: I'm big on guys that have been there before. They
Speaker 3: are only one game out of the wild card. I
Speaker 3: understand they haven't been playing well, but this is a team.
Speaker 3: If they do make the playoffs, they're going to be
Speaker 3: a team to be reckoned with. Once injuries come back
Speaker 3: and guys start playing the way they can. So my
Speaker 3: question would be, why do you think this makes you
Speaker 3: talked about a little bit, But I don't really think
Speaker 3: it makes sense right now to really be trading anybody there.
Speaker 3: I know they're seven and a half games out. Do
Speaker 3: you think do you think in the NL Central they
Speaker 3: don't have a shot to get back in there?
Speaker 2: No, no, no, no, I totally hear you and the idea
Speaker 2: of trading him now, the thing I didn't mention should
Speaker 2: have is that maybe you get pitching back and they're
Speaker 2: pitching or at least that rotation is kind of in shambles.
Speaker 2: Borton's out for the year, Steele still hasn't come back,
Speaker 2: Boyd has yet to come back from his thing, Cabrera
Speaker 2: his time earlier. Tyone is on the IL as well.
Speaker 2: So you don't do it. I don't think for prospects.
Speaker 2: You're trying to win this year. But if there is
Speaker 2: a picture under control somehow you could get in a
Speaker 2: package or even a pitcher who, like Suzuki, is a
Speaker 2: potential free agent that could simply kind of rebalance your team,
Speaker 2: give you more pitching. That is when you do it,
Speaker 2: or that is why you do it. You don't do
Speaker 2: it simply to play for next year, and you don't
Speaker 2: give up on this year. But maybe you can make
Speaker 2: your team better this year in some fashion by doing this.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and we were talking a little bit before about
Speaker 3: Trek schoobl my opinion, this is a guy that needs
Speaker 3: to be traded. I feel like that team would get
Speaker 3: a a lot of players back. I don't see them
Speaker 3: in a foreseeable future, even when he does come back
Speaker 3: on Saturday, go out there and dominate and make the playoffs. Now,
Speaker 3: is this a guy you can see getting traded? Or
Speaker 3: do you think the Tigers are going to try and
Speaker 3: make a run out of this thing and try and
Speaker 3: fight their way back into a playoff contention.
Speaker 2: It's June twelfth, thot. They're not going to make a
Speaker 2: decision today. You know that and I know that too,
Speaker 2: So they're going going to ride this recent wave as
Speaker 2: long as they can. But the point I made last week,
Speaker 2: and I wrote this, I guess about a week and
Speaker 2: a half ago. They're starting from sixteen games under five
Speaker 2: hundred and in the current format, which began in twenty
Speaker 2: twenty two, the current expanded format, no team has made
Speaker 2: it back from that big a hole. Now, it's a
Speaker 2: relatively small sample, I know, and the AL Central certainly
Speaker 2: is weak. The AL certainly is weak. So it's not
Speaker 2: out of the question that the Tigers can push and
Speaker 2: maybe get this done. But what are we talking about here?
Speaker 2: Are we talking about making the playoffs? Okay, they can
Speaker 2: maybe do that, or are we talking about a serious
Speaker 2: World Series contender in this particular season. Maybe with schoolbl
Speaker 2: and Mis coming back this weekend as well, they can
Speaker 2: be that. It's just going to be an awfully difficult
Speaker 2: roadback for them. And I had an executive point out
Speaker 2: to me, and this is a great point. It's one
Speaker 2: of the Actually it's kind of obvious, but basically, they're
Speaker 2: in a position where they can't go into a losing
Speaker 2: streak again. They've got to keep going and they've got
Speaker 2: to keep winning. It's still like eleven twelve under right now,
Speaker 2: So it's going to be a tough road for them.
Speaker 2: And that's why, ultimately I do believe that they will
Speaker 2: trade Schooble rather than hold on to him and again
Speaker 2: make the qualifying offer and get the draft pick.
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Speaker 5: He Ken, I'm curious about another player Lars Nubar and
Speaker 5: kind of the cardinal side of this dynamic. It's flipped
Speaker 5: from the two teams we just talked about. You know,
Speaker 5: the Cubs and the Tigers both come into this year
Speaker 5: with high expectations and then you know, if it doesn't
Speaker 5: go their way, then you know, you consider pivoting into
Speaker 5: a seller at the deadline. Cardinals are in the reverse.
Speaker 5: They were coming in in a rebuilding year, a developmental year.
Speaker 5: Now they're playing pretty good baseball. They do have a
Speaker 5: couple more chips if they want to cash them in,
Speaker 5: but what do you think they need to show ownership?
Speaker 5: And heine Bloom, you know that maybe they could build
Speaker 5: on this instead of you know and kind of pivot
Speaker 5: off that plan. And does this have any parallel for
Speaker 5: you to the twenty twenty one Red Sox where we
Speaker 5: were also so when that type of plan with him
Speaker 5: at the helm and then we started winning and then
Speaker 5: we actually actually went for it. So it's a little
Speaker 5: bit of an interesting dynamic, and I'd love to get
Speaker 5: your read on that.
Speaker 2: Adam absolutely right, and I hadn't thought of the twenty
Speaker 2: one Red Sox, but that's a good comparison. The only
Speaker 2: difference is the Red Sox that season. The Red Sox
Speaker 2: in no season are ever rebuilding. They may be in transition,
Speaker 2: but they're never like what the Cardinals were this off
Speaker 2: season when they traded Arnatto and Gray and Contraras and Donovan.
Speaker 2: They were purely rebuilding and are purely poorly rebuilding. Now,
Speaker 2: my understanding of this is is that heim Blum is
Speaker 2: not going to simply ignore the standings and say, you
Speaker 2: know what, I don't care that we're in a wildcard spot,
Speaker 2: the top wildcard spot. Now, we're just gonna keep going.
Speaker 2: We're gonna keep trading veterans. No, they may do that
Speaker 2: if they believe it's ultimately in their best interests, but
Speaker 2: they will not if they are still in this kind
Speaker 2: of position at the deadline, and remember talking six or
Speaker 2: seven weeks away. They will not simply abandon the season.
Speaker 2: And I don't expect the White Sox to do that.
Speaker 2: I don't even expect the Nationals to do that if
Speaker 2: they are in a position where they have even an
Speaker 2: outside chance of making the playoffs. So what do you
Speaker 2: do at that point? Nutbart is a really interesting guy.
Speaker 2: Like Donovan, he is someone you can look to as
Speaker 2: a player you build around. He is that kind of presence,
Speaker 2: that kind of leader. But they traded Donovan, they traded
Speaker 2: him with two years of control because they are trying
Speaker 2: to upgrade their pitching. Nut Bart could be another player
Speaker 2: who helps them upgrade their pitching. Switch hitter guy who
Speaker 2: would be in demand if his heels are okay, they
Speaker 2: look like they are, he had a home run last night,
Speaker 2: if he continues to play at a high level or
Speaker 2: resumes playing at a high level. So it's going to
Speaker 2: be an interesting choice for them because they might be
Speaker 2: in a spot where they can say, arguably, okay, we're
Speaker 2: trading laws Nutbar, but we're not up. Depends what they
Speaker 2: get back, of course, and maybe they do something else
Speaker 2: to reinforce themselves in the outfield in another way. There
Speaker 2: are all kinds of ways you can go, and we
Speaker 2: are all in the habit of labeling teams buyers or sellers,
Speaker 2: when in reality many teams do both. At the deadline,
Speaker 2: they're kind of just shaking up their.
Speaker 3: Mixed A grade one hundred percent. Now back to the
Speaker 3: al Central the Guardians. I know they just got beat
Speaker 3: up by the Yankees. Ultimately, I feel like this team
Speaker 3: is going to strike come trade deadline. To try and
Speaker 3: get over the hump to win their division as well.
Speaker 3: They have a great farm system. Do you see this
Speaker 3: team making any moves as we move forward.
Speaker 2: I don't know, Todd, because they do have a great
Speaker 2: farm system, and I detail that in my notes column
Speaker 2: how they're really deep infielders, catchers, outfielders. But they are
Speaker 2: a team because they play in a small market that
Speaker 2: are very protective of their prospects. They are also a
Speaker 2: team that if you talk to other clubs, they will
Speaker 2: tell you they're hard to deal with in the sense
Speaker 2: that they set their price and they don't come off it.
Speaker 2: They're not flexible, they don't get emotional. They just do
Speaker 2: what they do, and obviously they do a great job
Speaker 2: of it. They're competitive almost every season. So in my opinion,
Speaker 2: they're in a position where they are kind of bursting
Speaker 2: with prospects and kind of need to do something, and
Speaker 2: I expect that they will, perhaps with a catcher. They've
Speaker 2: got three in Triple A right now, all of whom
Speaker 2: they like. One was bon Naylor, who just got demoted
Speaker 2: when they acquired Patrick Bailey, and they've got two other
Speaker 2: prospects who are pretty well regarded, Cooper Ingele and Cody Huff,
Speaker 2: So I don't know exactly how they're going to play this.
Speaker 2: They made a small trade with Nolan Jones last night,
Speaker 2: I believe it was, and they traded him because they
Speaker 2: couldn't find enough at bats for their outfielders in Triple A.
Speaker 2: Problems still exists to some extent. So they're going to
Speaker 2: be a really interesting team to watch because they are
Speaker 2: are a team that clearly could do some things, and
Speaker 2: they also are a team that did very little in
Speaker 2: the offseason. Why because hey, we've got Bizana coming, We've
Speaker 2: got all of these infielders, we've got the laughter coming.
Speaker 2: They are a really interesting group in that sense and
Speaker 2: will be a team to watch for sure at the deadline.
Speaker 3: Talk about another team right next door, the Chicago White Sox.
Speaker 3: They're gonna roll with more comedy. I love everything about this,
Speaker 3: you know, it's a team that took everybody by surprise.
Speaker 3: I think they're up a half game right now. How
Speaker 3: did they approach the trade deadline? As we move forward here,
Speaker 3: they're kind.
Speaker 2: Of the American League version of the Cardinals. Maybe they'll
Speaker 2: be a little bit hungrier to win because it's been
Speaker 2: a while, or they've had some really rough years, but
Speaker 2: Murra comedy is coming back, Teal is coming back, the
Speaker 2: catcher Kyle Teal. They're going to be quite interesting offensively,
Speaker 2: and they are quite interesting offensively even without more comedy
Speaker 2: con you to score. So I expect that they're going
Speaker 2: to look for pitching. I expect if they're in this
Speaker 2: position still, they're going to try to get pitching. I
Speaker 2: don't expect them to trade top prospects, because, like the Cardinals,
Speaker 2: they're still building toward a more sustainable future. To use
Speaker 2: executives speak there for a minute. So yeah, I do
Speaker 2: expect they'll be active and busy. I just don't know
Speaker 2: how far they'll go. And they are another team deep
Speaker 2: in infielders already, and they've got the number one pick
Speaker 2: in the draft coming up. Could conceivably take an infielder
Speaker 2: at number one, the guy from UCLA, the kid from
Speaker 2: I think he's from Texas. They could take one of
Speaker 2: these kids and supplement themselves even more, giving them even
Speaker 2: more depth in the infield. To do some things at
Speaker 2: the deadline. It doesn't have to be and it wouldn't
Speaker 2: be for a rental pitcher. It could be you trade
Speaker 2: a young infielder for a young pitcher on the verge
Speaker 2: of the big leagues and go about it that way.
Speaker 5: That's intriguing for sure. I gotta love what the White
Speaker 5: Sox are doing for a team that I think that
Speaker 5: the incentives might be a little kakamemi here as the Angels,
Speaker 5: so they're in last place. They're not technically out of
Speaker 5: it because nobody is in the American League, but odds
Speaker 5: of them being not in last place seem pretty low
Speaker 5: to me. And typically you would think this is a
Speaker 5: clear seller. However, you've got last year of contract for
Speaker 5: general manager, only a one year contract on the actual manager,
Speaker 5: and so there's a little bit more of an incentive
Speaker 5: to try to push through this. What's your read on
Speaker 5: the situation over there.
Speaker 2: Ken Adam, You kind of said it kaka mami. That's
Speaker 2: how they operate, and they're hard to follow. They don't
Speaker 2: necessarily do what you think they're going to do at
Speaker 2: any time. They have not ever sold in a big way.
Speaker 2: They are a team that always seems to think they're
Speaker 2: on the verge of doing something, and it would be
Speaker 2: surprising to me if they traded a netto or a
Speaker 2: debt merch they could and they could get a lot
Speaker 2: for either of those guys, But it just doesn't seem
Speaker 2: to be something Ardie Moreno, as their owner, is comfortable
Speaker 2: doing that kind of trade, much less trout, which is
Speaker 2: a whole nother story. So I'm not sure what to
Speaker 2: expect from them, because, as you mentioned, they're in an
Speaker 2: uncertain dynamic with both their general manager and manager. Maybe
Speaker 2: if you're gonna let the general manager go at the
Speaker 2: end of the season, you don't want him doing a
Speaker 2: deconstruction at the deadline. You want the next guy doing
Speaker 2: it if you're willing to do it at all. So
Speaker 2: I always have a hard time kind of reading what
Speaker 2: the Angels might do or not do. They could have
Speaker 2: traded Sho Heo Tani for a big package a few
Speaker 2: years ago and didn't do it. They could have possibly
Speaker 2: kept show Heo Tani when you offered the seven hundred
Speaker 2: million dollars deal to every team, and they were the
Speaker 2: one team that said, naw, we're not gonna do that.
Speaker 2: So I'm trying to figure them out always and never can.
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Speaker 3: My most intriguing guy for me that you might not
Speaker 3: agree with me, but at the same time, I love
Speaker 3: this guy to death, Jared Duran. I think he's one
Speaker 3: of the most fascinating players. I got to play with
Speaker 3: him one time. He's fast, he does everything. I think
Speaker 3: he needs to change the scenery, in my opinion, get off,
Speaker 3: get on a team that is ready to rock and go.
Speaker 3: I know he loves it there. How do you see
Speaker 3: trade talks with him coming up?
Speaker 2: If any, Well, Tom, I'm with you, and their team
Speaker 2: president Sam Kennedy said yesterday on the radio that if
Speaker 2: they don't turn it around, they may be in a
Speaker 2: position where they are sellers. So if that's the case,
Speaker 2: you arguably should have traded Duran bre Rafaela one of
Speaker 2: these outfielders in the offseason, and Duran was the one
Speaker 2: that was kind of the obvious choice. He's got the
Speaker 2: fewest amount of years left before he becomes a free agent.
Speaker 2: And if they didn't do that, now, if they are
Speaker 2: in cell mode or anything close to sell mode, he
Speaker 2: will be in demand again. And he is a really intriguing,
Speaker 2: exciting player. So I'm with you they should entertain that. Frankly,
Speaker 2: even if they're in it, if Anthony is healthy, they
Speaker 2: still have not an excess of outfielders, but they have
Speaker 2: the ability to trade an outfielder. They haven't done that,
Speaker 2: and who knows if they will or not. But if
Speaker 2: they go into a deadline believing that they're not going
Speaker 2: to be a contending team this year and are willing
Speaker 2: to move pieces, I would think he would be at
Speaker 2: the top of the list.
Speaker 1: Hey, Ken, last one for you. In the notes column,
Speaker 1: you finished with the ABS system and just a little note,
Speaker 1: a little nugget, So I want to see if you
Speaker 1: could share that and then lighten everyone on the misconceptions.
Speaker 2: Yeah. My perception from just watching games anecdotally was Man,
Speaker 2: the game's a longer. They're getting a longer again, and
Speaker 2: I don't know, maybe ABS is the problem here. And
Speaker 2: when I asked the league for the data for the
Speaker 2: information on this, I was told, really, they're only four
Speaker 2: minutes longer than they were last year, and the league
Speaker 2: believes that only one minute of that is attributable to ABS,
Speaker 2: and the other parts of it are just the noise
Speaker 2: or differences that come season to seasons. So what you
Speaker 2: might think is happening with ABS lengthening games is not happening.
Speaker 2: So from that perspective, and actually all perspectives, it seems
Speaker 2: that this is a hit, and there have been obviously
Speaker 2: questions about the zone and how pictures are adapting, but
Speaker 2: they seem to be adapting. I was told earlier this
Speaker 2: season by an umpire the pictures were going to be
Speaker 2: screaming and yelling and they're going to be having fits
Speaker 2: by May, and that hasn't happened. Everyone's adjusting fine. So
Speaker 2: I would say that ABS has been a success and
Speaker 2: it has not been a detriment to the pace of play.
Speaker 1: Yeah, roaring success just for me fan perspective, and talking
Speaker 1: to many fans can like, I can't find anyone that's going, oh,
Speaker 1: I don't like this. I mean it's fun, Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: not extending the time. I just there's not much wrong.
Speaker 1: Is Are there a few little tweaks we got to
Speaker 1: think about. Sure, But for the fan experience, they are
Speaker 1: loving it. I'm sure you feel the same way when
Speaker 1: you're at the ballpark.
Speaker 2: I do feel the same way. They are loving it.
Speaker 2: They've loved it from the beginning. And you have to
Speaker 2: give the lead credit here and the commissioner credit because
Speaker 2: the pitch clock, which was something that was not entirely
Speaker 2: embraced by the players initially, and ABS the same. They
Speaker 2: have both proven to be absolute additions to the game
Speaker 2: that have proven beneficial.
Speaker 1: One more quick note on this, Ken, because often the
Speaker 1: decision makers are you know, can involve players, front office executives, etc.
Speaker 1: That are talking about the rules of the game. Sometimes
Speaker 1: I'm like, you guys are too deep into it. I
Speaker 1: don't you know, Like a front office executive's job is
Speaker 1: to win games, right, and that's why sometimes the game
Speaker 1: got slower and they're just looking for three true outcomes
Speaker 1: and all that. So I like the way that you
Speaker 1: need to let some other people kind of handle the
Speaker 1: way the sport's being viewed. I might not have conveyed
Speaker 1: that the best way, but the point is that you
Speaker 1: might play it. That doesn't mean you're an expert on
Speaker 1: what people like to watch.
Speaker 2: No, And this is always a question, and it's always debatable,
Speaker 2: and all of these innovations have been debatable. But again,
Speaker 2: credit where credit is due. Pitchclock success abs success, both
Speaker 2: of them, I would say overwhelming successes. And that is
Speaker 2: why once again, we should not have a situation next
Speaker 2: season where we're missing games when the sport is enjoying
Speaker 2: a renaissance.
Speaker 1: Yes, attendance ratings, everything is soaring. Ken we'll be watching
Speaker 1: it this weekend, Philly's Brewers, Right, Yes, got it, all right,
Speaker 1: we'll watch Ken on Fox. Thanks Ken, have a good weekend.