Speaker 1: Hey, this is Matt Miller.
Speaker 2: You listen to me every day, I hope on the
Speaker 2: Tape podcast with Paul Sweeney. I've got a new podcast though,
Speaker 2: that I'm running alongside the Tape with my friend Hannah Elliott.
Speaker 1: She's the car reviewer from Bloomberg Pursuits.
Speaker 2: We call it Hot Pursuit, and we tell you everything
Speaker 2: you need to know or want to know about new cars,
Speaker 2: about the automotive industry, about car events. I'm gonna drop
Speaker 2: a little sample from the Hot Pursuit podcast here.
Speaker 1: Take a listen.
Speaker 2: If you like it, go to the Hot Pursuit page
Speaker 2: and subscribe. You can find it on Apple, on Spotify,
Speaker 2: or anywhere you get your podcasts.
Speaker 3: I'm Matt Miller and I'm Hannah Elliott, and this is
Speaker 3: Hot Pursuit.
Speaker 4: All right.
Speaker 2: We have really got a special guest today, Jason Chinuck.
Speaker 2: He is the North American CEO for Jucati. And it's
Speaker 2: no secret, Hannah, that I'm a pretty big Ducati fan obsessed.
Speaker 1: Yeah that's fair.
Speaker 2: I think I'm about to get my twentieth Dukati. So
Speaker 2: and I've known Jason since he worked at Lamborghini. He
Speaker 2: was the marketing director at Lamborghini. I still remember the
Speaker 2: first day that I met you at the New Jersey
Speaker 2: Motorsports Park, when you were teaching me how to drift
Speaker 2: an event a door.
Speaker 4: Yes, oh, yes, which is definitely an art in itself.
Speaker 1: Which I means so much fun.
Speaker 2: All right, let me set up the topics that we
Speaker 2: have today, because there's a lot.
Speaker 1: Going on in the world of automotive Hannah.
Speaker 2: As you pointed out, we're waiting for an auction on Monday,
Speaker 2: and we're expecting a Ferrari a gto to set another
Speaker 2: world record for Ferraris. Plus, I want to talk about
Speaker 2: old cars because you have a couple yourself. It's a
Speaker 2: love affair that has its downsides, dysfunctional.
Speaker 1: Yes, I also want to talk about a Remac.
Speaker 2: You know, Jason's Dukati is a member of the Volkswagen
Speaker 2: Group and Remac is also very closely connected in that
Speaker 2: the founder is now running Bugatti. And I don't know
Speaker 2: the whole structure, but Remac recently had another world record,
Speaker 2: uh set. They've set so many that we're going to discuss.
Speaker 2: And I want to talk about the my box that
Speaker 2: you're driving this week. And then finally, I want to
Speaker 2: get to all the new Ducatis that Jason and everybody
Speaker 2: at the motor company is launching, talking about the new Panagalies,
Speaker 2: the new multi Strata, the new supermano is, which I'm
Speaker 2: most excited about. So we'll get to everything that Ducatti's
Speaker 2: putting out. They have one still to reveal in December,
Speaker 2: and I don't think he's going to tell us what
Speaker 2: it is, but.
Speaker 4: You can tell us, give you a hint, but I'm
Speaker 4: not gonna.
Speaker 1: Neither confirm nor deny.
Speaker 2: All right, let's kick it off with the world of ferraris,
Speaker 2: the world of auctions, the world of collector cars. Hannah,
Speaker 2: I still remember when I was in high school, having
Speaker 2: seen Ferris Bueller's Day Off, I became obsessed with the
Speaker 2: California Spider Cameron's dad had, and he that at the
Speaker 2: time one of those fetched a world record price at
Speaker 2: the time, fourteen million dollars.
Speaker 1: What are we looking for?
Speaker 3: Fourteen million probably won't crack the top, It might crack
Speaker 3: the top fifteen these days on Monday, we're looking at
Speaker 3: a nineteen sixty two Ferrari two fifty gto that RM
Speaker 3: Southeby's is saying they hope to get sixty million dollars.
Speaker 3: For now, I'm hearing from sixty million dollars million six zero.
Speaker 3: I'm hearing from my sources. Fifty million may be more realistic.
Speaker 3: But arm Southeby's certainly is billing this car as a
Speaker 3: sixty million dollar Ferrari. That would be the most expensive
Speaker 3: Ferrari sold publicly this year, although there has been another
Speaker 3: Ferrari sold that was closer to fifty million. It was
Speaker 3: forty eight, so this may not be the most expensive
Speaker 3: Ferrari sold ever publicly, but certainly for this year, it's
Speaker 3: kind of a big deal. It's the only this is
Speaker 3: a nineteen sixty two raising Ferrari. It did raise in
Speaker 3: the Nurber grading in sixty two and it won its class.
Speaker 3: But it's the only one of those V twelve racing
Speaker 3: Ferraris that got a four leader engine straight from the factory.
Speaker 3: And they basically did that because they found some racing
Speaker 3: loopholes that particular year. They knew they wanted to race it,
Speaker 3: and they figured we can put in this four liter
Speaker 3: engine and qualify for certain different races. And the car
Speaker 3: did well. It did raise lamon and actually didn't end
Speaker 3: up finishing. But it's been owned by the same guy
Speaker 3: for almost four decades, so it sort of checks every
Speaker 3: single box. And yeah, they're thinking fifty to sixty million.
Speaker 3: We'll see sales on Monday.
Speaker 2: You know who has a GTO I think is what's
Speaker 2: the name of the drummer for Pink Floyd. He's got
Speaker 2: a big car collection, he's got a big collector car fund,
Speaker 2: and he has a GTO. I know because I saw
Speaker 2: Mason Nick Mason, right, Yeah, I saw him go on
Speaker 2: a Spanish talk show to explain why the car is
Speaker 2: so valuable. One other cool thing that I heard today
Speaker 2: from a car collector. I was talking to Philip Richter
Speaker 2: here in New York. He runs Hollowbrook Wealth Management, but
Speaker 2: also the Turtle Invitational is his car show here in Bedie.
Speaker 2: He said that Enzo started building V twelves he loved
Speaker 2: the twelve cylinder engine because he was such a huge
Speaker 2: fan of the Packard V twelves from the nineteen thirties.
Speaker 1: Wow, I have not heard that. That is wild.
Speaker 2: Apparently, like Packard had at the time, they were the
Speaker 2: luxury vehicles of the day, and they had like an
Speaker 2: amazing V twelve and Enzo was obsessed with the Packard
Speaker 2: V twelve and that's why he kicked off his cars
Speaker 2: with those.
Speaker 3: Well, I mean, obsession does lead you to good places,
Speaker 3: I have to say. And whatever Enzo was obsessed with
Speaker 3: really worked out for him because if you look at
Speaker 3: the car market, Ferraris are the standard. They are the
Speaker 3: blue chip vehicles. They hold their value. I mean this
Speaker 3: year is actually was actually a bit of a cooling
Speaker 3: year for collector cars. The sales in Monterey were down.
Speaker 3: We're seeing some cooling, but Ferraris in particular are really
Speaker 3: staying very solid. I can't remember if I told you
Speaker 3: this before, but eleven of the fifteen top individual sales
Speaker 3: here publicly were Ferrari's, So it's kind of a sure thing.
Speaker 3: It's interesting. I was, I know, you love you know,
Speaker 3: your muscle cars, Matt, and I was talking to Craig
Speaker 3: Jackson yesterday, you know, from Barrett Jackson, and I was like,
Speaker 3: under what circumstances would we have a muscle car like
Speaker 3: a Challenger? You know? In this really really rarefied error
Speaker 3: because we have had a few over a million yeah, completely, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3: We've had some Shelby you know, some Shelby Cobras in
Speaker 3: a couple million dollar range. So they're not there yet.
Speaker 3: It's like Ferrari, Ferrari, Ferrari. It's almost boring.
Speaker 2: What was that like, Jason, you worked at Lamborghini. I
Speaker 2: think you were head of marketing for in North America.
Speaker 2: What was it like being always compared to Ferrari?
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, inevitably, there's a long shadow that they
Speaker 5: cast and so and we were and we're part of
Speaker 5: our story, is part of Ferrari's story.
Speaker 4: It's that challenge. I loved it.
Speaker 5: I actually loved it because you know that there was
Speaker 5: a certain entity that they hold in a place in
Speaker 5: the luxury car world. And we made it a point
Speaker 5: that we're not We don't need to be that. We
Speaker 5: can be something else. We can be something that more accessible, approachable,
Speaker 5: a little bit more let's got it loose and fun
Speaker 5: and a little wild. And I think that that really
Speaker 5: when you look at the founders of both of those companies,
Speaker 5: one was a little more rough around the edges and
Speaker 5: the other one was a little bit more polished, and
Speaker 5: that itself, I think really led to the type of
Speaker 5: clients that we attracted. And that's the one thing I
Speaker 5: loved about that time that I had there, because there's
Speaker 5: a misperception of the type of client that owns a Lamborghini,
Speaker 5: and then when you get in to really.
Speaker 4: Learn who these people are, they're amazing. They're self made.
Speaker 5: They're people that are let's say that maybe work their
Speaker 5: lives to death to the point where they're like, Okay,
Speaker 5: I'm finally going to go do something nice for myself,
Speaker 5: and they reward themselves with this dream card that they saw.
Speaker 4: In a seventies movie. It's nice. It's actually it's fun to.
Speaker 5: Have, let's call it, something that challenges you instead of
Speaker 5: just riding your own path.
Speaker 2: Do you see, Hannah, the old Lamborghini's going for anywhere
Speaker 2: close to older Ferraris Well.
Speaker 3: Not yet. But I have to say some of the
Speaker 3: coon Tashes, especially, we wrote about one recently that was
Speaker 3: just sold. It was in the Wolf of Wall Street.
Speaker 2: The white one. By the way, Doug DeMuro. Doug DeMuro
Speaker 2: just bought a white Cuontash, which.
Speaker 3: Is kind of insane. Yeah, I think they're holding their value.
Speaker 3: They're slowly getting up there. They're certainly over a million
Speaker 3: dollars in value, and I see that continuing. I mean,
Speaker 3: I don't know what you think, Chazy, but yeah.
Speaker 2: Remember when Matt Farah bought one, and I thought, like,
Speaker 2: first of all, how is Matt Farrah?
Speaker 1: And by the way, no dig.
Speaker 2: At him because I'm about the same size. How's he
Speaker 2: going to fit into a coon tash?
Speaker 1: You know?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, Jason, you would have trouble fitting into
Speaker 2: an old Cuontash as well, right, And I heard they
Speaker 2: drive horrorbly but Doug says.
Speaker 3: Well, they are tractors. Let's not forget. I mean, they
Speaker 3: are tractors. This is a classic case. I think of
Speaker 3: you never sometimes never want to meet your car heroes
Speaker 3: and buy car heroes. I mean the cars you had
Speaker 3: on the poster on your bedroom wall. Yeah, sometimes you
Speaker 3: don't actually want to drive them because they drive like
Speaker 3: a truck or a tractor. And that's just the truth.
Speaker 4: Keep it, keep it the dream, keep it that. I
Speaker 4: mean absolutely.
Speaker 5: I can tell you that I spent some time in
Speaker 5: those cars and they do drive like you said.
Speaker 2: I will tell you something really cool happened to me
Speaker 2: so famously, Ferruccio Lamborghini got into a fight with Enzo
Speaker 2: about the clutch in the Ferraris that kept breaking, and
Speaker 2: then Ferruccio found out that Enzo was using the same
Speaker 2: clutches that Lamborghini was buying for its tractors, and then
Speaker 2: he made his own car.
Speaker 1: So a couple of years ago I was.
Speaker 2: In the Motor Valley and Motor No they do this
Speaker 2: Motor Valley thing where they bring together all the car
Speaker 2: makers and they have dinners and they have a car
Speaker 2: show and stuff. And I saw Tamaso Lamborghini standing by
Speaker 2: an old, like nineteen fifties Ferrari and I walked over
Speaker 2: to him and I said, yeah, I heard the clutches
Speaker 2: in these things suck.
Speaker 1: He found it amusing.
Speaker 4: I'd hope you would provoke a smile. Yeah.
Speaker 2: So in terms of old cars, I've never been one
Speaker 2: to buy like I always wanted to have an old
Speaker 2: collector car, and I've never pulled the trigger because I thought,
Speaker 2: I'm into muscle cars really, so I might as well
Speaker 2: buy a new muscle car that has the crash protection.
Speaker 2: I'm a dad, you know, so I want safety and
Speaker 2: stuff and the driveability of it. But Hannah, you boring.
Speaker 2: You have succumb and bought a couple. You have what
Speaker 2: a C three Corvette? Yeah, an old Rolls Royce, like
Speaker 2: seventies early seventies Rolls Royce.
Speaker 3: Yes, I've got access to quite a few.
Speaker 2: Isn't it like deadly expensive to get these things fixed?
Speaker 2: Certainly the Rolls Royce must be prohibitively.
Speaker 3: Well, look, there's that famous saying there's nothing as expensive
Speaker 3: as a cheap Rolls Royce, by which they mean you
Speaker 3: can pick up an old silver shadow. I've got a
Speaker 3: silver shadow. You can old pick up an old silver
Speaker 3: shadow for under twenty thousand dollars. But you know the
Speaker 3: costs of fixing the hydraulic brakes, and you know the
Speaker 3: alternator continually going on the fritz is can be expensive.
Speaker 3: It can be a dysfunctional relationship. And I had a
Speaker 3: really good run driving a sort of a combination of
Speaker 3: a couple different old Rolls Royses in the corvette, and
Speaker 3: yesterday on the way to work, I did have a
Speaker 3: failed to proceed in the Rolls Royce, which was really annoying.
Speaker 3: And I think it was an alternator issue because the
Speaker 3: car ran fine started fine. I pulled off to get coffee,
Speaker 3: and when I went back to make the rest of
Speaker 3: the way to the work, it didn't start dead battery,
Speaker 3: So I think it's an alternator issue. It was getting
Speaker 3: like eleven volts when it should be getting like thirteen.
Speaker 3: But it's annoying. It's annoying, it's painful. I had to
Speaker 3: wait for someone to jump me and then you'd switch
Speaker 3: out battery. But all that to say, I think the
Speaker 3: world would be a better place if everybody drove old cars.
Speaker 3: It forces you to drive slower, it makes you appreciate
Speaker 3: mechanical engineering, and it just is it's more beautiful.
Speaker 1: Have you ever had experience with old cars or old bikes?
Speaker 5: Definitely, I mean I went down both of those paths,
Speaker 5: and then I got to a certain point in my
Speaker 5: life where I decided I had little time to fiddle
Speaker 5: and I just want to ride and drive. I'm an
Speaker 5: old Volkswagen guy, not just not just because of the company,
Speaker 5: but first car was a seventy one square back. I
Speaker 5: love that car to death, and I still even romanticize
Speaker 5: me and I'm on, bring a trailer and all these
Speaker 5: other things to like wait to see if the perfect
Speaker 5: one pops up, which is completely insane, like there's no
Speaker 5: reason I need that car, but if the right one
Speaker 5: shows up, baby blue seventy one, then I'm there, And
Speaker 5: so there is a fondness.
Speaker 4: But I do feel as though that like I would have.
Speaker 5: A moment of realizing I probably shouldn't have done it,
Speaker 5: probably shouldn't have met my hero.
Speaker 4: Same thing with like an old nine fourteen, which was.
Speaker 5: The first car I ever went over one hundred miles
Speaker 5: an hour in, and so's it's burned into my brain. Wow,
Speaker 5: you know, you lean over as a seven year old
Speaker 5: kid and look at the dash and you see the
Speaker 5: needle buried at one hundred and you're like holding on
Speaker 5: for beer life in a nine fourteen.
Speaker 1: Yes, that feet's quite that's a feat.
Speaker 3: It was.
Speaker 5: It was rattling, but it was so exhilarating. I mean,
Speaker 5: and that immediately I knew I was hooked on speed,
Speaker 5: Like I mean, that was where I.
Speaker 2: Feel like Bring a Trailer has really revived. This is
Speaker 2: another thing that the collector. I was talking to Philip Richter.
Speaker 2: He was saying, Bring a Trailer has really done a
Speaker 2: lot for the collector car market.
Speaker 3: It's unbelievable what Randy Knaudenberg, who's the founder of Bring
Speaker 3: a Trailer has done. They just actually released an app finally,
Speaker 3: but last year they did like one point three billion
Speaker 3: dollars in sales. It's unbelievable. And they forced every other
Speaker 3: major auction house to start selling online and to start
Speaker 3: having these online auctions that they never did before because
Speaker 3: people kind of realized, oh, I don't have to drive
Speaker 3: a car to buy it. And I think Bring a
Speaker 3: Trailer is done a really good job of being very transparent.
Speaker 3: You know what you're getting. It's so fun to read
Speaker 3: the comments, even if you're not bidding. It's so addicting.
Speaker 3: I admit I'm on it under a different name just
Speaker 3: because I want to read the comments and you know,
Speaker 3: follow along on my jer I do, I do it.
Speaker 1: It's hilarious.
Speaker 3: It's so fun. Yeah, they it's unbelievable what they've done,
Speaker 3: and they forced all the other auction houses to so.
Speaker 2: I like the the retro releases. Like my favorite Mustang
Speaker 2: is like a twenty twelve Boss Rio two that obviously
Speaker 2: I bought the Challenger, which is an homage. One of
Speaker 2: my favorite motorcycles is the Sport Classic, which, by the way, Jason,
Speaker 2: that was a motorcycle that didn't really sell for Dukati
Speaker 2: at the time, and now you can't find one for
Speaker 2: less than like twenty grand. And I'm talking about not
Speaker 2: the small Paul Smart, but you can't even find a
Speaker 2: regular one with like fifteen thousand miles on it for
Speaker 2: less than twenty gree Everybody wants one of those. Why
Speaker 2: why don't you guys do something like that again?
Speaker 5: I mean, simply put, we're that that is a bike
Speaker 5: that was kind of it was an extension of what
Speaker 5: we did with the MHE nine hundred E. The Mike
Speaker 5: Hale would inspire replica and then the idea was, wow,
Speaker 5: this was so good. We saw two thousand of them
Speaker 5: right away in your two thousand of its first time
Speaker 5: that we did an online sale of a motorcycle. We're like, oh,
Speaker 5: let's extend this. And we were too early. We were
Speaker 5: too early for this trend of the classics. There's been
Speaker 5: discussion internally a Ducatti about like resurrecting the KI.
Speaker 1: After that, the R nine T.
Speaker 2: After that came the triumphs I.
Speaker 5: Created a It created an entire trend of those motorcycles,
Speaker 5: and actually really interesting to your point, we actually did
Speaker 5: really well for the first couple of years of selling them.
Speaker 5: In then the third and the fourth year of the bike,
Speaker 5: it just was like, okay, we're a little longer. The
Speaker 5: tooth one thing happened. We loaned the motorcycle for the
Speaker 5: launch for the New Tron movie, and as a result,
Speaker 5: it just created this really cool buzz that all these
Speaker 5: people who didn't know about the bike, all of a
Speaker 5: sudden the wind Saw Tron were like, okay, I need it,
Speaker 5: and that that single handedly drove the prices up.
Speaker 2: I like the first one which had the yellow and
Speaker 2: the single shock in the back, and then the Tron
Speaker 2: was the black one with no faring. But then then
Speaker 2: you had the sport version with the fairing, the red
Speaker 2: one with it. I love all those, and the Paul
Speaker 2: Smart those are great. All right, let's move on to
Speaker 2: another topic. I want to talk about the ultra expensive vehicles,
Speaker 2: one of which handle you're driving, and one of which,
Speaker 2: well even on another level of expensive, is the Remac,
Speaker 2: which made has made so many records.
Speaker 1: Tell us about the weird record that you.
Speaker 2: I mean, you messaged me about this last night and
Speaker 2: I told my wife I couldn't believe it.
Speaker 3: It's kind of wild. So yesterday in Germany, Remac set
Speaker 3: a Guinness Book of World Records for going in reverse
Speaker 3: for top speed in reverse. Do you want to guess
Speaker 3: what the top speed was?
Speaker 1: I thought you were gonna say, like seventy miles an hour.
Speaker 3: One hundred and seventy one miles per hour in reverse,
Speaker 3: which is kind of it's ridiculous. It sounds so stupid
Speaker 3: and silly, but it's also kind of cool.
Speaker 1: It sounds very unsafe to me.
Speaker 3: I need to know more about it. I should say.
Speaker 3: Rimac has plenty of speed records. They have like twenty
Speaker 3: speed records going forward, so they're obviously very legit. This
Speaker 3: is like, this is the record, I guess you go
Speaker 3: for after you've already set the world record for an
Speaker 3: electric car, which they do have, and you know going
Speaker 3: forward there I think the world records at two hundred
Speaker 3: and fifty six miles an hour, which is phenomenal, doesn't
Speaker 3: beat the Bugatti Sharon, but for an electric vehicle, it's
Speaker 3: the record. But yeah, this reverse record, it's weird, weird,
Speaker 3: bit cool. I'd say, I.
Speaker 1: Just don't love electric cars.
Speaker 2: I have to say I've been thinking about it so
Speaker 2: much recently because I've driven some that have impressed me.
Speaker 2: The Mercedes, especially the Gle, but most of them, like
Speaker 2: the kind of speed that you get is amazing, but
Speaker 2: it doesn't feel that great, right. I haven't driven to Rimac,
Speaker 2: but I've driven the Cairne and it's awesome.
Speaker 1: It's like earth shattering.
Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, the Rimac. Honestly, I really liked it when
Speaker 3: I drove it. I think Rimek as a company is fascinating.
Speaker 3: Mate Rimac, the founder, is sort of the anti Elon Musk.
Speaker 3: He is very young, he's Croatian, He's received millions of
Speaker 3: dollars in funding from Portia and also now he's leading Bugatti.
Speaker 3: He's a genius, I should say too. This afternoon, I'm
Speaker 3: going to be driving the Batista Peninfarina, which is another
Speaker 3: electric vehicle that is powered by Rimac automotive batteries. So
Speaker 3: Rimac actually has their hands in a lot of some
Speaker 3: of these supercars. And I actually did like how the
Speaker 3: Navara drove. I thought it was really nimble, really elegant,
Speaker 3: obviously extremely fast, and the interior I thought was very
Speaker 3: well done. You know, we're used to seeing a lot
Speaker 3: of these electric cars with very shoddy interiors that almost
Speaker 3: feel like an afterthought, but the Nevara they really pulled
Speaker 3: it off. I think Rimac is doing a lot of
Speaker 3: things right. They're a lot more conservative in running their
Speaker 3: mouths promising things they can't deliver, and that seems to
Speaker 3: be rare among some of these electric startup companies. I'm
Speaker 3: not going to name any other names, but you can
Speaker 3: fill in the blanks. So yeah, I just think it's cool.
Speaker 3: I think Rimac is you know, they're they're having fun.
Speaker 3: I saw their team. I talked to Mate in August
Speaker 3: and Pebble Beach and he is just very humble. He's
Speaker 3: a family man. He leads a quiet life.
Speaker 2: Well, because I was wondering if if you've got him
Speaker 2: on any bikes, Jason, have you ever given him Oh.
Speaker 5: Not that I'm aware of, but it could only I
Speaker 5: can only imagine what that could do.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, by the way, electric motorcycle.
Speaker 3: I was just going to ask, Yeah.
Speaker 4: That's the million dollar question, isn't it. It's a really
Speaker 4: interesting thing.
Speaker 5: At the end of the day, people are asking us,
Speaker 5: when is Ducatti building an electric motorcycle.
Speaker 4: Good news, as we have in Moto GP or MotoE.
Speaker 4: We actually there's sole.
Speaker 5: Supplier of the motorcycle for that series, and it's one
Speaker 5: of the things that we know that eventually we're going
Speaker 5: to have to get there. But the battery technology right
Speaker 5: now is really really challenging for motorcycles because you don't
Speaker 5: have the same energy density as you do with an
Speaker 5: internal combustion engine, and unlike automotive where you have the
Speaker 5: opportunity to put the weight down on the floor and floorboards,
Speaker 5: with motorcycling, where are you going to go?
Speaker 4: You're going up. And we did this analysis.
Speaker 5: A couple of years ago where let's call it our
Speaker 5: middleweight sport bike, the Pentagony V two at the time.
Speaker 5: In order for us to deliver the same sort of
Speaker 5: performance and the same sort of range for that motorcycle,
Speaker 5: it would practically be double in weight. And we're talking
Speaker 5: double in waight all of a sudden, what's an important
Speaker 5: characteristic of Dukati.
Speaker 4: It's the hand and you just throw that away if
Speaker 4: you double the weight.
Speaker 2: I also liked, you know, the acceleration. I love the breaking,
Speaker 2: I like the design. I love the build quality.
Speaker 3: Is there anything you don't love that?
Speaker 2: Jason Channa, you are the CEO of Ducatti North America.
Speaker 2: You guys have released a string of bikes, some of
Speaker 2: which I find absolutely fascinating. So let's just run through
Speaker 2: the real quick starting with a SUPERMANO, because that's to me,
Speaker 2: an amazing opportunity.
Speaker 1: You can get now girls.
Speaker 2: And guys out on a Dukatti doing supermoto for real,
Speaker 2: and like, what's the genesis of this bike? How did
Speaker 2: you come to do it after not having done a
Speaker 2: single cylinder or motorcycle for so long?
Speaker 5: Well, I mean, it's it's a really interesting thing because
Speaker 5: you know, we have the history of a Supermano engine,
Speaker 5: which which is basically a seven forty nine many years
Speaker 5: ago at one of our motorcycles that we lobbed one
Speaker 5: of the cylinders.
Speaker 1: I keep calling it Supermano, but you have a different
Speaker 1: name for it.
Speaker 4: Back then it was the Supermano.
Speaker 5: But we actually the model itself is the it's basically
Speaker 5: the super Mono, the super quadr Mono.
Speaker 4: And the reason why is because the over square engine.
Speaker 5: What we did is we took half of a Pentagley
Speaker 5: twelve ninety nine, which was the pinnacle of the V
Speaker 5: two engines for us, and once again we took a
Speaker 5: cylinder off.
Speaker 4: We took the horizontal.
Speaker 5: Cylinder off of the motorcycle and kept the vertical and
Speaker 5: then made sure to balance it out right. And we
Speaker 5: have a motorcycle that when the engine is mounted into
Speaker 5: the chassis's three hundred and thirty three pounds and it
Speaker 5: will be delivering almost seventy five horsepower seventy four point
Speaker 5: five and with a full race exhaust system that you're
Speaker 5: only going to use for the track, of course, of course.
Speaker 3: I mean, Jason, I'm curious you said earlier that you
Speaker 3: know it's inevitable that you guys will do an electric bike.
Speaker 3: But why? My question is why?
Speaker 4: Why?
Speaker 5: Because that's part of it is to do with our
Speaker 5: requirements as a manufacturer being part of this larger group.
Speaker 5: But we're not specifically set on electric, just so to
Speaker 5: be clear, like, our objective here isn't to build an
Speaker 5: electric motorcycle. That's not the box that we're checking. We're
Speaker 5: checking the box of how do we reduce our carbon footprint?
Speaker 5: Simply how do we be a responsible sustainable company in
Speaker 5: terms of what product we're bringing to market? And electric
Speaker 5: is one of the boxes. It's one of the areas
Speaker 5: for us to look. It seems to be the one
Speaker 5: that's getting the most attention, so we have to pay
Speaker 5: attention to it.
Speaker 3: Are people asking for it?
Speaker 4: Absolutely?
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 4: No, Yeah, they're not. They're not. They're not.
Speaker 5: And that's that's that's actually a point that seems to
Speaker 5: be not wanting.
Speaker 4: People don't want to discuss that point.
Speaker 2: But maybe they will after MotoE, you know, because the
Speaker 2: Desmo Sudici was only in race form until people ask
Speaker 2: for it for.
Speaker 1: So many for so long that you had to finally
Speaker 1: put it out well.
Speaker 5: And that's part of our strategy in terms of moto e,
Speaker 5: is like, if we're going to do this, we're going
Speaker 5: to do it at the highest level, and we're going
Speaker 5: to use that as an opportunity to be a real
Speaker 5: world R and D lab. I mean, that's and that's
Speaker 5: what we're getting out of it. We're starting to set
Speaker 5: times that are actually in line with what we used
Speaker 5: to do in World Superbike and so we're close using
Speaker 5: the gap. But what better lab to be able to
Speaker 5: experience that and find a way for it to trickle
Speaker 5: down to the final consumer. But to your point, kind
Speaker 5: of like we're also looking at other technologies. For example,
Speaker 5: simple things that have been done in automotive for years
Speaker 5: but it's never been applied to motorcycling, like cylinder deactivation
Speaker 5: like the V.
Speaker 4: Four, the rear bank of cylinders.
Speaker 5: You know, whether you're at low RPMs when you're riding
Speaker 5: in town or you're at low RPMs when you're out
Speaker 5: on the open highway and you're just not cracking on
Speaker 5: the motor, the bank of real cylinders will deactivate, and
Speaker 5: actually it's definitely good for a heat transfer for fuel reduction.
Speaker 5: So there's those sorts of things we're looking at. Also
Speaker 5: alternative fuels, which we know Moto GP is going to
Speaker 5: be going to one hundred percent alternative fuels in a
Speaker 5: couple of years, and so that's an area that we're
Speaker 5: looking at as well. So I think there is that
Speaker 5: area of us being a big company, let's say big
Speaker 5: in terms of our world, and trying to find a
Speaker 5: way to be responsible and actually what we're doing and
Speaker 5: bringing new product to market, and so this is something
Speaker 5: that this is why E is deaf.
Speaker 4: One of the solutions there's.
Speaker 2: By the way, the cylinder bank activate deactivation, which happens
Speaker 2: on most of the Maulti stratas, I think does not
Speaker 2: happen on the new multi strata on the RS, the
Speaker 2: V four RS, because that goes back to the Desmo
Speaker 2: dramaic valves, which I'm so pumped about.
Speaker 1: And I have had three multi stratas.
Speaker 2: Twins, and I was waiting to get the V four
Speaker 2: until they put a smaller front tire on it, which
Speaker 2: they did at the Pike's Peak last year. And then
Speaker 2: I told Jason at one point like, but I want
Speaker 2: Desmo Drama Valves on it, and he was like, wait
Speaker 2: till next year.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and so little Birdie, Yeah, that's.
Speaker 1: Great, and I'm pretty excited about that.
Speaker 5: And you know, of course it's not I'm not a
Speaker 5: sales prevention officer. I'm not going to tell somebody to
Speaker 5: not buy a motorcycle. But I also know that I
Speaker 5: will be hearing it for a long time if he
Speaker 5: went out and got the Pike's Peak. Yeah, and then
Speaker 5: the RS came a couple months later.
Speaker 2: So tell us about the new Panagali that you put
Speaker 2: out as an homage to the nine sixteen. And a
Speaker 2: lot of people will say that the nine sixteen is
Speaker 2: one of the most beautiful motorcycles ever penned. But I
Speaker 2: think it didn't even have a hundred horsepower, right, and
Speaker 2: this one's going to have basically two.
Speaker 5: Well, the original nine sixteen was just bumping right about
Speaker 5: above a hundred, just barely. Yeah, but this thing is
Speaker 5: it is perfectly put as an homage to the original
Speaker 5: nine sixteen for a matter of recognizing its place and history.
Speaker 5: For Jakati, one of the most iconic motorcycle designs ever.
Speaker 5: In fact, if you ever typed google the word superbike,
Speaker 5: usually the nine sixteen is what comes to mind right away.
Speaker 5: And it was important for us to celebrate that because
Speaker 5: part of our heritage is actually a really important part
Speaker 5: of who we are and what we've done, and especially
Speaker 5: as we look at the current design of the motorcycle
Speaker 5: that we have today with the Pentagali V four series.
Speaker 5: I mean, the ability to find that livery and to
Speaker 5: be able to connect it with that model and then
Speaker 5: speck it out with all of the best stuff I mean,
Speaker 5: from the carbon fiber wheels to the dry clutch, but
Speaker 5: things that are actually a real world I had actually
Speaker 5: a client texting me last night as I was flying
Speaker 5: into New York, asking me should I get it? Should
Speaker 5: I get it?
Speaker 4: Should I like? Do you love it? Yes? Okay, then
Speaker 4: you get it?
Speaker 5: And that's what it inspires those people that are serious
Speaker 5: collectors to get it. And actually, right now, I could say,
Speaker 5: as of today, because I checked with my sales team,
Speaker 5: we've sold out of a North American production of this
Speaker 5: motorcycle or allocation gone in one day.
Speaker 2: That's good for you, but depressing for those of us
Speaker 2: who haven't ordered one yet.
Speaker 4: Sorry, Matt, I'll get you on the list, all right.
Speaker 2: So I'm very excited about all that. There's a new
Speaker 2: bike coming. There's one more new bike that you guys
Speaker 2: had to premiere in December, and I don't know what
Speaker 2: it is, but I remember one time when I met
Speaker 2: Magnus Walker. I think we were in Geneva or maybe
Speaker 2: in Frankfort at a Lamborghini unveiling. You had put a
Speaker 2: bike out that was like unveiled at the same time
Speaker 2: as a Lamborghini, and they had kind of the same
Speaker 2: livery and it was so cool, And that partnership makes
Speaker 2: a lot of sense to me.
Speaker 1: Because it's Italian. Yeah, it's Italian.
Speaker 2: They're both like in Bologna basically, and I just get it.
Speaker 2: But this next bike you're gonna put out as a
Speaker 2: collab and what is not with Lamborghini.
Speaker 4: It's not with Lamborghini.
Speaker 5: And it's definitely a departure from what people would maybe
Speaker 5: normally expect. There's some collaborations where you it's an obvious, right,
Speaker 5: it's a gimme. This one is a bit of a
Speaker 5: stretch for us. But it's actually, like I said, I've
Speaker 5: to you earlier. I've seen the bike in person. It's
Speaker 5: just beautiful, elegant, the perfect collaboration, and we're going to
Speaker 5: be hosting it at Art Basel in Miami the first
Speaker 5: week of December, so that's where we're going to unveil
Speaker 5: this motorcycle. And I think that there's a great opportunity
Speaker 5: for us to be able to reach actually a little
Speaker 5: bit of a different audience with this, and that's the
Speaker 5: one thing that as a brand, we're always trying to do.
Speaker 5: How do we stretch but stay true to who we
Speaker 5: are And part of it.
Speaker 4: Is the design.
Speaker 5: And I can tell you that our design team, Andre Feridasi,
Speaker 5: along with the other designers from the other company, worked
Speaker 5: very closely on the details of this motorcycle to bring
Speaker 5: something to market that I think will be a bit unexpected.
Speaker 3: You mentioned reaching an audience. This is a self serving
Speaker 3: question because I'm going to get a Scrambler full throttle
Speaker 3: in a couple weeks to try. I have to imagine
Speaker 3: that the Scrambler is your best selling bike. Is that true?
Speaker 3: I mean, Matt has all of his fancy, expensive, extremely
Speaker 3: powerful bikes, but honestly, I love the Scrambler.
Speaker 1: Agreed, totally agree.
Speaker 3: Is that actually your best selling model is that when
Speaker 3: people think of Doucati, is that what they actually think about.
Speaker 5: Actually, No, the Scrambler had when it first came out.
Speaker 5: It was part of this kind of on the tail
Speaker 5: end of this trend of postmodern heritage influenced motorcycles, and
Speaker 5: it did very very well for us, and consistently it
Speaker 5: does well. But it's very interesting to see that since
Speaker 5: the shift of the pandemic in the motorcycling market, we've
Speaker 5: really seen a lot of our growth in terms of
Speaker 5: our volumes and improfit going to our higher end product.
Speaker 5: And the Scrambler has been great because it allows access
Speaker 5: and intrigue to Dukati into the entire world of Dukatti,
Speaker 5: but through let's say, something that's unintimidating and fun. I
Speaker 5: personally still have my Scrambler desert sled I've had for
Speaker 5: five years now, and I get on it and I
Speaker 5: ride it, and I love it. Eight hundred cc air cooled,
Speaker 5: you know, it's seventy something horse power.
Speaker 4: It's just fun and fun.
Speaker 5: Yeah, And that simplicity of riding is it reminds me
Speaker 5: what got me into motorcycling in the first place.
Speaker 4: But then of course, I like to.
Speaker 5: Get on a multi strata before rally and crack the
Speaker 5: throttle triple digits on open roads. So it's great that
Speaker 5: we have that broad breadth of product that allows people
Speaker 5: to find their way into Dukati as well. So and
Speaker 5: the next these current versions of the next gen Scrambler
Speaker 5: have been spectacular for us because we've been able to
Speaker 5: add a lot of the technology to the motorcycles, making
Speaker 5: them i'd say definitely safer, more easily accessibly, more approachable
Speaker 5: riding modes and all of this stuff, but still have
Speaker 5: that kind of classic design that's been a little bit
Speaker 5: more modernized.
Speaker 3: I love that. It's interesting that you say, really, your
Speaker 3: business is showing growth in the more expensive things, because
Speaker 3: that's the same exact with automakers. I mean, they are
Speaker 3: just it's like price isn't really a consideration. If you're
Speaker 3: over a certain threshold of what the MSRP is, it
Speaker 3: doesn't really matter to the people who are I mean
Speaker 3: it does, but that's not going to be the prohibiting
Speaker 3: factor for the metal.
Speaker 4: You're absolutely right.
Speaker 5: In fact, this is something that we have engineered by
Speaker 5: design in North America as well, because we see the
Speaker 5: opportunity we see that as being a differentiator for us
Speaker 5: and as a brand. When we do that, we actually
Speaker 5: are more profitable and we get to make investments back
Speaker 5: into the client experiences. And at the end of the day,
Speaker 5: there's a lot of great motorcycles out there, but what
Speaker 5: do people want? They want stuff to do with their motorcycles, right, Like, Okay,
Speaker 5: I'm biased, Matt. You're probably a little biased about the
Speaker 5: greatest motorcycles in the world. But it doesn't mean anything
Speaker 5: unless you have something to do with it. So we
Speaker 5: have been really investing on creating experiences for these clients
Speaker 5: that beyond just you own it and you get a
Speaker 5: look out of the garage, which is definitely an ownership experience,
Speaker 5: isn't it. Yeah, that's to open the door and go,
Speaker 5: oh yeah, But what do you actually do with it?
Speaker 4: And that is what people are looking for. That's what
Speaker 4: really matters, and that brings substance to the ownership experience.
Speaker 2: Jason has been great having you here with us in
Speaker 2: the studio. Thanks so much for joining us. Jason Chennik
Speaker 2: is the CEO of Ducati North America. And we didn't
Speaker 2: get to the my box because Hannah is driving. I
Speaker 2: don't know which one but a my bock and I
Speaker 2: wanted to get her take on it. But Hannah, at
Speaker 2: some point you're going to write a story about it, right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we'll have the review in a couple of weeks.
Speaker 3: It's the Mercedes my Box GLS six hundred. It's their big,
Speaker 3: big expensive suv and it's it is kind of fabulous,
Speaker 3: So look forward to that in a couple of weeks.
Speaker 3: You can read all of my coverage on Bloomberg at
Speaker 3: Bloomberg Pursuits and follow me on Instagram at Hannah Elliott XL.
Speaker 2: You can follow me on Instagram as well at Matt
Speaker 2: Miller nineteen seventy three. And you can watch me on
Speaker 2: Bloomberg Television every day one pm. You can listen to
Speaker 2: me on Bloomberg Radio every day from ten to one.
Speaker 2: We're also on YouTube. And one other cool thing is
Speaker 2: that the Bloomberg Business App is now available on Apple
Speaker 2: CarPlay and Android Auto, which is super cool because you
Speaker 2: have it in your dashboard and you can click on
Speaker 2: any of the podcasts or any of the live programs
Speaker 2: as well. Thanks very much for listening. We'll be back
Speaker 2: next week, same time, same place. I'm Matt Miller.
Speaker 3: I'm Hannah Elliott and this is Bloomberg.