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Speaker 1: Hello Sunshine, Hey bestsies.

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Speaker 2: Today on the bright Side, it's Wellness Wednesday, and in

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Speaker 2: honor of ADHD Awareness Month, we're joined by Board certified

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Speaker 2: psychiatrist and ADHD specialist, doctor Sasha Hamdabi. It's Wednesday, October

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Speaker 2: twenty third. I'm Simone Boyce, I'm.

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Speaker 1: Danielle Robe and this is the bright Side from Hello Sunshine,

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Speaker 1: a daily show where we come together to share women's stories,

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Speaker 1: to laugh, learn and brighten your day.

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Speaker 2: Today's Wellness Wednesday is presented by Coli Guard.

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Speaker 1: So October is ADHD Awareness Month and this year's theme

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Speaker 1: is awareness is key. ADHD stands for attention deficit hyperactivity

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Speaker 1: disorder and according to the CDC, it's one of the

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Speaker 1: most common neurodevelopmental disorders of childhood and often lasts into adulthood.

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Speaker 2: That's true, but what's really fascinating about this is that

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Speaker 2: women and girls are underdiagnosed and undertreated when it comes

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Speaker 2: to ADHD, and identifying symptoms of ADHD can manifest differently

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Speaker 2: depending on age and gender.

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Speaker 1: I mean, Simone, I actually feel like particularly interested in

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Speaker 1: hearing from doctor Hamdani because you've said before that you

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Speaker 1: feel like you have some symptoms of ADHD.

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Speaker 3: Oh.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I've definitely had my questions and my doubts for

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Speaker 2: a long time about my inability to focus. I identify

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Speaker 2: as a hypergirly, so maybe there's something to that. But

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Speaker 2: I think if you're chronically online, you've probably seen this

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Speaker 2: conversation pop up on social media. It seems like people

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Speaker 2: are talking about it more and more, and there are

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Speaker 2: upsides to that, but there are also downsides. Some of

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Speaker 2: the downsides include misinformation, like are we really getting the

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Speaker 2: truth when we're engaging in these discussions online. So that's

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Speaker 2: why it's really important to bring in the experts, someone

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Speaker 2: like doctor Sasha Hamdani, who knows her stuff.

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Speaker 1: Is one of the upsides Doing viral Instagram videos with

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Speaker 1: your husband in a pool about being hyper.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if my husband would call it an upside.

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Speaker 4: I certainly enjoyed that experience.

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Speaker 1: I certainly feel it's an upside as if you were

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Speaker 1: I do. But okay, jokes aside, because this is a

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Speaker 1: serious topic. Joining us today to answer all of our

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Speaker 1: questions and clear up any misconceptions about ADHD is doctor

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Speaker 1: Sasha Hamdannie. She's a psychiatrist, the author of Self Care

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Speaker 1: for People with ADHD. And what feels very unique is

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Speaker 1: she's someone who has ADHD herself. You might recognize her

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Speaker 1: from social media where she shares insights on ADHD and

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Speaker 1: mental health to her almost two million fans across platforms.

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Speaker 4: So let's bring her in.

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Speaker 1: Doctor Sasha Hamdannie, Welcome to the bright Side.

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Speaker 5: Hi, thank you for having me.

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Speaker 2: We're so happy to have you, especially during October, which

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Speaker 2: is ADHD Awareness Month. Yeah, you are a board certified psychiatry.

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Speaker 2: You also have ADHD yourself, and you actually disappeared at

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Speaker 2: the White House to talk about this very subject.

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Speaker 4: So we are in such good hands.

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Speaker 2: Why do you feel called to speak out about ADHD awareness?

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Speaker 3: Well, partially because I have it, and so it comes

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Speaker 3: very naturally because this is something that I'm speaking about

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Speaker 3: from firsthand experience, but also because I think as.

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Speaker 5: Someone who has.

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Speaker 3: Lived through it, it's really frustrating trying to navigate these waters.

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Speaker 3: With one, for a long time, there wasn't a lot

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Speaker 3: of great information about it. Yeah, and number two, there

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Speaker 3: was a lot of stigma around it.

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Speaker 2: I mean, women are historically underdiagnosed and untreated when it

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Speaker 2: comes to ADHD. Yes, from your research and just your

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Speaker 2: experience as someone who lives with this condition and speaking

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Speaker 2: to others about it.

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Speaker 4: Why do you think that is?

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Speaker 3: How much time do you have because I could go

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Speaker 3: on before we have time. Honestly, Good Right volumes on

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Speaker 3: this just because it is such a rich area of

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Speaker 3: why women are under or misdiagnosed, and so some of

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Speaker 3: the reasons they're just historical.

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Speaker 5: Right.

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Speaker 3: For a long time, ADHD was considered as like something

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Speaker 3: that hyper little boys have and it was outside of

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Speaker 3: the scope of everything else, like if a woman was diagnosed, Nope,

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Speaker 3: you don't have it, because it was only hyper little boys.

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Speaker 3: The other reason is that women have different societal pressures,

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Speaker 3: and so they are you know, trained from a very

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Speaker 3: young age you have to conform, you have to do

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Speaker 3: these things. You can't cause trouble, you can't act up

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Speaker 3: in class, you have to So they're forced to mask

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Speaker 3: all these symptoms and kind of toe the line. Whereas

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Speaker 3: you know they're feeling all these things, they're feeling restless,

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Speaker 3: they're feeling impulsive, but they are so afraid of getting

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Speaker 3: in trouble or they're told like, you cannot be anything

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Speaker 3: besides this one image, and so they just hide their

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Speaker 3: symptoms because that's what they're told to do the high

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Speaker 3: the mask. So that's another thing. Another humongous thing is hormones.

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Speaker 3: There is a huge correlation between hormonal cycles and ADHD expression,

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Speaker 3: and so like for example, with PMDD or PMS, people's

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Speaker 3: symptoms just like body symptoms, everything gets worse. But then

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Speaker 3: your focus also and executive function gets significantly worse. And

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Speaker 3: so a lot of times when people are going to

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Speaker 3: the doctor, they might be on their cyclone. People are

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Speaker 3: just like, it's puberty, or it's hormones, or it's mommy brain,

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Speaker 3: and so everything is getting blamed on hormones throughout it.

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Speaker 5: It's perimenopause, it's menopause.

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Speaker 3: So there's so many different things that people are just

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Speaker 3: saying it's hormones. Everybody goes through this one. It's actually not.

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Speaker 3: It's hormones on top of an existing condition.

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Speaker 1: When you talk about these symptoms being different in girls

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Speaker 1: and boys, I'm curious how they show up for women. Yeah, like,

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Speaker 1: what do we associate as a typical ADHD case in.

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Speaker 3: A woman, So you know, for males versus females, And

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Speaker 3: when I'm saying females assigned female at birth, I think

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Speaker 3: we have to look at the fact that females present

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Speaker 3: more as this inattentive picture. For ADHD, there are three

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Speaker 3: different types. There's inattentive, there's hyperactive, and there's combined type,

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Speaker 3: which is a combination of the two of them. Females

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Speaker 3: present more as this inattentive picture, so like the classic daydreaming.

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Speaker 3: So difficulty organizing things, difficulty staying on tasks, difficulty forgetting

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Speaker 3: daily routine like walking out of the house, did I

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Speaker 3: brush my teeth, did I, you know, close the garage,

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Speaker 3: all of these things, difficulty with you know, people are

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Speaker 3: talking to them and they can't maintain the conversation or

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Speaker 3: pay attention within the conversation, getting easily derailed off task,

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Speaker 3: or having difficulty with prolonged focus in tasks. That's typically

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Speaker 3: how women present, and even younger roles present. Males typically

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Speaker 3: present as this combined type or hyperactive picture, which is

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Speaker 3: more of what you think of with that physical impulsivity

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Speaker 3: and hyperverbosity. So they're super talkative, they are interrupting, they're

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Speaker 3: being disruptive in class, they're fidgety, they're getting up, they're

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Speaker 3: running around. So those are the things that maybe a

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Speaker 3: female presents like that, but it is you know, it's

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Speaker 3: shut down. That behavior is shut down pretty quickly, and

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Speaker 3: you know, they're not the ones typically running around there's

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Speaker 3: they're not the ones getting kind of a past, so

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Speaker 3: they mask those symptoms.

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Speaker 1: I keep reading about studies that say that all of

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Speaker 1: our attention spans are decreasing at a rapid rate. So

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Speaker 1: I can imagine people listening thinking, well, my attention span

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Speaker 1: is sort of low, Like, what is the marker of

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Speaker 1: regular sort of twenty twenty four lack of attention Instagram

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Speaker 1: era versus a woman who suffers from ADHD.

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Speaker 3: So I think it's important to note that brain mot

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Speaker 3: is for real, right, That's something that we are in

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Speaker 3: an increasingly digital age, and we are attention is constantly

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Speaker 3: being fragmented by one hundred million things, by notifications, by dings,

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Speaker 3: by social media, by you know, work, all these different reasons. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: so it's hard to distinguish that. But what we're looking

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Speaker 3: for with ADHD is that this is a pervasive pattern

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Speaker 3: of behavior since childhood. So this isn't just a twenty

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Speaker 3: twenty four problem. This is coming from a really young age.

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Speaker 3: This is something that is causing significant dysfunction to your life.

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Speaker 3: And this is where a lot of people have issues

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Speaker 3: with the terminology of ADHD. Like the name ADHD attention

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Speaker 3: deficit hyperactivity disorder not great. I don't love the name, honestly,

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Speaker 3: but a lot of people have beef with the disorder part.

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Speaker 3: And I think the disorder part is actually really important

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Speaker 3: because ADHD causes dysfunction. It is a disorder. It's not

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Speaker 3: a lot of people, you know, when they're talking about

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Speaker 3: ADHD within the context of neurodivergence and feeling like, oh,

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Speaker 3: everybody's brain works a little bit differently. I think that's

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Speaker 3: entirely true. But I also think that the disorder part

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Speaker 3: is really important because it causes that person dysfunction and

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Speaker 3: it feels like a disorder and it is negatively impacting

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Speaker 3: their lives.

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Speaker 1: Right.

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Speaker 4: I rarely do this.

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Speaker 2: I'm literally taking notes as you're speaking, because this all

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Speaker 2: just feels so relevant, Like for me personally, I've wondered

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Speaker 2: if I have it or have a later in life diagnosis.

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Speaker 4: As a parent, I think this is so informative.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, let's talk about late diagnosis and how it impacts women.

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Speaker 2: So I've heard anecdotally, you know, stories of mothers who

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Speaker 2: have reportedly discovered their own ADHD after their children are

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Speaker 2: diagnosed because it's the first time that it really causes

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Speaker 2: them to think about how these symptoms might be impacting them.

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Speaker 2: How does a late diagnosis impact us.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so the unfortunate thing is statistically males get diagnosed

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Speaker 3: between six and eight years old.

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Speaker 5: It's so early.

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Speaker 3: Females their average age of diagnosis is their mid thirties.

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Speaker 3: Who so it's not late like this is our average

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Speaker 3: time of diagnosis, which is really unfortunate because they present

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Speaker 3: at the same time. It just gets skipped and ignored,

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Speaker 3: or or people just get passed from grade to grade

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Speaker 3: to grade and they don't really you know, no one

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Speaker 3: picks up on it or is unwilling to do things

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Speaker 3: about it.

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Speaker 1: Well. Also, then, like these women have suffered all throughout

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Speaker 1: studying for tests in school and college, potentially college years

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Speaker 1: and early work years.

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Speaker 3: It's not even just that, Danielle. The thing that I

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Speaker 3: really like think is worth talking about with ADHD is

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Speaker 3: it's not just a focus issue. I think the scope

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Speaker 3: of the DSM is kind of narrow, but ADHD bleeds

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Speaker 3: into everything else. If you don't have enough attention to

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Speaker 3: figure out what's happening actively in your life, you're also

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Speaker 3: things are falling apart at home, and so your home

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Speaker 3: like gets impacted, your relationships are impacted, you are, the

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Speaker 3: way you integrate with the rest of the world is impacted.

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Speaker 3: So these women that are getting diagnosed much later in life,

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Speaker 3: they've gone through a significant portion of their formative years

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Speaker 3: without a diagnosis, without understanding how their brain works, and

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Speaker 3: instead getting, you know, the input that I'm lazy, I'm dumb,

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Speaker 3: i can't live up to my potential, I'm not as

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Speaker 3: good as anybody else. And so that's what I think.

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Speaker 3: We're dealing with an entire generation of women that were

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Speaker 3: skipped and that are now kind of making amends and

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Speaker 3: you know, helping their children through this while also trying

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Speaker 3: to heal themselves. So it's a really complicated and confusing

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Speaker 3: snapshot of their lives.

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Speaker 1: Well, speaking of coming a long way, you've said that

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Speaker 1: the diagnostic criteria basically all comes from a book called

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Speaker 1: the DSM. Yeah, the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders.

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Speaker 1: I learned about this manual about four years ago. It

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Speaker 1: encapsulates basically every mental disorder you can think of.

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Speaker 4: Yes, but in the.

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Speaker 1: DSM, the criteria for ADHD is really centered around focus

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Speaker 1: and I know we've been talking about other symptoms, but

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Speaker 1: ones that you've mentioned that are not focused enough.

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Speaker 4: On our anxiety and mood.

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Speaker 1: How does that sort of like come up in people

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Speaker 1: with ADHD.

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Speaker 3: Honestly, I think with I see it a lot in

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Speaker 3: patience of mind. I've also experienced this myself. I think

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Speaker 3: they travel hand in hand. And so if your ADHD

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Speaker 3: is unregulated and not properly controlled, you get overwhelmed, you

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Speaker 3: get exhausted, you get it looks depression, it looks like

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Speaker 3: anxiety because you're trying to make up for these deficits

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Speaker 3: and can't. A lot of times, like without proper instruction

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Speaker 3: or methods to cope, it's really difficult to stay on

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Speaker 3: top of these things. And so I think that you know,

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Speaker 3: a lot of women get diagnosed with depression and get

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Speaker 3: diagnosed with anxiety, but really you need to look at

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Speaker 3: that underlying cause. So I think that like in a

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Speaker 3: dream world situation, the DSM would have like a line

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Speaker 3: in there, or like a credentialing kind of thing where

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Speaker 3: it's like, Okay, well we will look at the criteria

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Speaker 3: for depression and anxiety, but it's ADHD the cause of it.

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Speaker 5: If that's the case, then ADHD is.

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Speaker 3: A diagnosis rather than ADHD plus these other things.

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Speaker 2: We need to take a quick break, but we'll be

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Speaker 2: right back with doctor Sasha Hamdanni. And we're back with

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Speaker 2: doctor Sasha Hamdannie.

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Speaker 1: You mentioned earlier that one of or some of the

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Speaker 1: symptoms that women deal with, particularly when they're younger, get internalized. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: what are the symptoms that we don't talk about as much?

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Speaker 3: You know? I think like if you're strictly going along

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Speaker 3: with the DSM, I think one of the biggest things

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Speaker 3: is that, partially because of the name attention deficit hyperactivity disorder,

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Speaker 3: people get really hung up on like, oh, if I

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Speaker 3: have ADG, I have to be hyperactive. You don't have

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Speaker 3: to be what you think of typically as hyperactive. It

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Speaker 3: could be like a mental hyperactivity that your brain is

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Speaker 3: moving along and clipping along so quickly that it's hard

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Speaker 3: to organize thoughts or categorize thoughts or figure out what

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Speaker 3: your next steps are. I think a very commonly overlooked

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Speaker 3: one that people usually call stress or mommy brain is

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Speaker 3: this feeling of being catastrophically overwhelmed, just like all of

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Speaker 3: these things piling up on your plate and not knowing

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Speaker 3: where to start. Or how to attack the problem. And

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Speaker 3: with this like that problem gets compounded, like every single

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Speaker 3: day you're not addressing the underlying issue, your problems are

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Speaker 3: getting bigger and more complicated and increasingly more difficult to solve.

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Speaker 3: So I think that's one really important thing that we

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Speaker 3: don't talk about enough.

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Speaker 1: So you mentioned hyperactivity. I've heard you talk about two

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Speaker 1: other subtypes of ADHD, which are inattentive and combined. How

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Speaker 1: do each of these three how are they distinguished from

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Speaker 1: each other?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, So, I mean the way that we make our

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Speaker 3: diagnosis is based on this set of criteria in the DSM,

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Speaker 3: which is the guidebook for symptomology and medical criteria. So

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Speaker 3: the hyperactive is more of what you think about with

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Speaker 3: impulsivity and hyperactivity, like difficulty staying in your seat and

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Speaker 3: you're constantly fidgeting and you are talking a lot, interrupting

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Speaker 3: a lot, blurting on or not letting other people participate

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Speaker 3: in conversation. And then combined type is a combination of

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Speaker 3: both of those. You need to hit a certain number

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Speaker 3: and have a combination of both criteria.

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Speaker 1: When you mentioned hormones, my first thought was I recently

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Speaker 1: interviewed a woman who is making a running shoe, a

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Speaker 1: performance shoe for women. I was unaware, but most of

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Speaker 1: the running shoes that we're all wearing are actually basically

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Speaker 1: made from male molds, and we're just wearing smaller sizes.

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Speaker 1: And when I was asking her what the impacts are,

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Speaker 1: one of the things she brought up was that our

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Speaker 1: hormones actually really affect our physiology and how we're running,

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Speaker 1: and that we need certain things at different times of

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Speaker 1: the months. But the issue is that it's completely understudied

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Speaker 1: and it's expensive to study hormones. I was really interested

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Speaker 1: to see you talk about how much hormones can impact

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Speaker 1: ADHD and our experience with it as women.

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Speaker 4: Can you elaborate on that a bit?

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Speaker 3: I think you're absolutely right. I think this is a

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Speaker 3: hugely understudied area because hormones are fluctuant with ADHD. How

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Speaker 3: this presents it is actually really distinct and really important

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Speaker 3: to notice because with those hormonal cycles, and you know,

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Speaker 3: if we're talking about the menstrual cycle, there is a

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Speaker 3: period of time premenstrually, so before your period actually starts,

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Speaker 3: where your estrogen drops. Okay, fine, whatever you might be,

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Speaker 3: you know, PMS having all of those symptoms, But what

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Speaker 3: people don't also kind of notice is that estrogen and

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Speaker 3: dopamine kind of go hand in hand. So when your

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Speaker 3: estrogen levels drop, your dopamine levels drop, and that just

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Speaker 3: leads to this chaos. In all of a sudden, you're

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Speaker 3: unable to do simple tests that you were able to

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Speaker 3: do before. So you're having a much harder time with

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Speaker 3: like planning how to do things, executing tasks, making sure

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Speaker 3: things get done. You're dropping the balls on things, and

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Speaker 3: so it gets even more confusing because then you're just like, well,

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Speaker 3: I know I feel bad that it's because I'm not

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Speaker 3: getting as much done or I'm not but people don't

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Speaker 3: actually put those two things together, that your hormones are

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Speaker 3: making your ADHD symptoms worse, and so that's you know,

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Speaker 3: these are some of the things that you look at

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Speaker 3: when you're doing an assessment for someone like do you

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Speaker 3: have a cyclical variation? Do you notice your symptoms get worse?

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Speaker 3: Which is why I think it is so so, so

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Speaker 3: so so vital to track your patterns.

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Speaker 4: I'm so mad right now. I gotta be honest, I'm

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Speaker 4: so upset.

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Speaker 2: I'm so upset that I am just now finding out

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Speaker 2: about all of this at thirty six years old, Like.

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Speaker 4: That is so messed up.

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Speaker 2: I know, I've learned so much about my body in

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Speaker 2: the past few years, particularly since I became a mom,

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Speaker 2: and I know where I am in my cycle at

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Speaker 2: all times. I know that my lutel phase is going

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Speaker 2: to be chaos every month. But you just helped me

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Speaker 2: make the connection between my desire to seek out dopamine

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Speaker 2: inducing experiences and also my lack of focus during that

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Speaker 2: week before my period.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and spoone don't even feel bad about that because

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Speaker 3: I literally I'd gone to school essentially the entirety of

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Speaker 3: my whole life to do psychiatry to learn about the brain.

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Speaker 3: And it wasn't until you know, it was during COVID

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Speaker 3: that I was like, oh god, you know it is

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Speaker 3: so it was so hard to stay on top of

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Speaker 3: my ADHD symptoms, and so I started thinking about, like,

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Speaker 3: what are ways that I could make this better and

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Speaker 3: reach more people with this, And so my sister and

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Speaker 3: I created an app. And one of the things on

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Speaker 3: the app is like a focus tracking thing where you

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Speaker 3: get to see your patterns and you see it very visually.

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Speaker 3: I did that so when I was beta testing this app,

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Speaker 3: I did eight months of that it was a four

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Speaker 3: day period every single month where I was like, I

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Speaker 3: was tracking my impulsivity and I was like, oh, my

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Speaker 3: impulsivity time and impulsivities high.

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Speaker 5: It would be four days.

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Speaker 3: And then I went back and I looked at my

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Speaker 3: credit card statement and there was a six hundred dollars

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Speaker 3: bump like on average those four days. And it's because

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Speaker 3: I was just sitting, not like spacing out and like

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Speaker 3: going on Amazon or going on Revolve or going on

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Speaker 3: I just was doing this so mindlessly. And then I

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Speaker 3: was like, that's so weird. Why does this happen every

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Speaker 3: day and every time at the end of the month.

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Speaker 3: And I was like, oh, okay, that's why it's so hormonal.

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Speaker 1: As you're sharing more about your own symptoms, I'm really

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Speaker 1: curious about your own diagnosis and how old were you

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Speaker 1: when you were diagnosed.

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Speaker 3: The first or the second time. I was diagnosed kind

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Speaker 3: of twice both.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know you could be diagnosed twice.

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Speaker 3: Okay, So the first time, I was in fourth grade,

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Speaker 3: and it was like I was just I presented kind

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Speaker 3: of like a boywood. I was super disruptive. I was

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Speaker 3: starting riots in my classroom. I was like getting up

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Speaker 3: on the desk. I was just out of control.

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Speaker 4: Also legend though, legend, So you know.

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Speaker 5: The teachers in the school talked to my parents.

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Speaker 3: My mom was a pediatrician, and she's like, okay, yeah,

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Speaker 3: there could be something. She got me in to see,

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Speaker 3: like somebody. I was diagnosed with ADHD and I actually

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Speaker 3: started medication. Now this was many years ago, and it

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Speaker 3: was still super super stigmatized. I was a really sensitive

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Speaker 3: little kid. My parents didn't tell me I had ADHD.

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Speaker 3: They just gave me my vitamins. So every day I

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Speaker 3: took my vitamins, and I felt better, and I started

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Speaker 3: doing really well in school and enjoying school. And I did.

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Speaker 3: I continued to do well. I didn't change my dose.

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Speaker 3: I didn't do anything, continue to do well all throughout

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Speaker 3: high school. Got into medical school out of high school,

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Speaker 3: and that was the first time I was away from home.

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Speaker 1: I obviously, you skipped college, You're a genius.

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Speaker 3: So I did college and mid school at the same time.

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Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, So I applied. I got into this program.

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Speaker 3: So I started my med school classes when I was seventeen.

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Speaker 4: Oh my goodness. Wow.

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Speaker 3: So I got into my classes and I was used

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Speaker 3: to being awesome, like in high school, I was awesome.

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Speaker 3: I was on top of it. I didn't have to

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Speaker 3: try really hard. I was just like great at school

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Speaker 3: and I really loved it. I got into med school.

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Speaker 3: I had a neurology test and they would like post

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Speaker 3: the scores on the board and you'd go and find

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Speaker 3: your number and figure out which your thing was. And

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Speaker 3: I remember going to that thing and I was like,

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Speaker 3: oh my god, somebody got a thirty two. What is

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Speaker 3: wrong with this person? And then I was like, oh wait,

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Speaker 3: that was me. I got a thirty two.

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Speaker 4: What did the thirty two mean?

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Speaker 3: It was a test in like a neurobiology lab, so

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Speaker 3: you were like writing down like okay, these are the

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Speaker 3: structures of brain. And I was like, I studied, I

401
00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:51,639
Speaker 3: don't understand. I went I went to teacher. I was like,

402
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Speaker 3: this is impossible. How did this happen? I didn't turn

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Speaker 3: over the test, so I turned in the exam, didn't

404
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Speaker 3: turn it over. I've done that and I was like,

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Speaker 3: oh my god, I've made this mistake like four times

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Speaker 3: this month, Like I did this with a homework assignment,

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Speaker 3: I did this with a lab and I was like,

408
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Speaker 3: there is something wrong with me. This happened again and

409
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Speaker 3: again and again, and I was like, I like, it

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00:23:14,000 --> 00:23:16,199
Speaker 3: got so bad to the point where they were like

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Speaker 3: you need to, Like, I don't think you're gonna make

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Speaker 3: it through. So my dad at this point was just like,

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Speaker 3: you know what, come home, let's figure out what's going on.

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Speaker 5: So I go home. He was like, are you taking vitamins?

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Speaker 3: I was like, I don't know where they are, so no,

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Speaker 3: obviously no, I'm not. Oh wow, And he's like, okay,

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Speaker 3: so you have ADHD. I was like, there's no way,

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Speaker 3: there's no way. I'm super angry. I felt really betrayed.

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Speaker 3: I felt like, you know, I was given medication without

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Speaker 3: my knowledge. You know, I just didn't believe it. I

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Speaker 3: go back to school. I'm like, I'm going to try now.

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Speaker 3: I know I don't have a medication. I'll prove to

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Speaker 3: you I don't have ADG, for sure have ADG. It

424
00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:03,359
Speaker 3: didn't get easier. I was just falling more and more behind.

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Speaker 3: My dad pulls me out again. We sit and he's like,

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Speaker 3: I don't want you to worry about school. He's like,

427
00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:11,399
Speaker 3: for the next week or however long I have, we

428
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Speaker 3: will just go and study the brain. So we were

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Speaker 3: going to the library and we were like reading about ADHD,

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Speaker 3: We're reading about the brain. We're reading about these like

431
00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:23,440
Speaker 3: different like brain structures and how people grew and developed

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Speaker 3: and like from evolution and genetics, and I mean, it

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Speaker 3: was just incredible the amount of information I got.

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Speaker 5: And then after that I was assessed again.

435
00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:37,880
Speaker 3: They were like, yeah, you have ADHD, and so then

436
00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:40,640
Speaker 3: I got more ownership of like, Okay, now I understand

437
00:24:40,640 --> 00:24:42,040
Speaker 3: how my brain works a little bit more.

438
00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:44,439
Speaker 5: What do I want to do? What are the medications

439
00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:44,840
Speaker 5: going to do?

440
00:24:45,200 --> 00:24:47,840
Speaker 3: And then I was just trial and error with medications

441
00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:49,320
Speaker 3: and then that's my story.

442
00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:51,440
Speaker 4: Your dad sounds awesome.

443
00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:53,919
Speaker 5: Yeah, he was the most.

444
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:56,440
Speaker 3: I mean, and my mom super My mom is a pedaedrician,

445
00:24:57,200 --> 00:25:01,679
Speaker 3: really really educated about this stuff, but my dad was

446
00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:03,840
Speaker 3: the most.

447
00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:06,120
Speaker 5: He was my biggest cheerleader always.

448
00:25:07,160 --> 00:25:08,679
Speaker 3: I've thought about this and I was like, you know,

449
00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:11,359
Speaker 3: I wish they had like it had been handled differently

450
00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:14,120
Speaker 3: or I had been explained. Yeah, but I don't think

451
00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:17,119
Speaker 3: they had been given that knowledge either. It was just

452
00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:20,600
Speaker 3: this highly stigmatized thing. They were like, honestly, we got

453
00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:24,080
Speaker 3: that information. We were scared. Like the information we were

454
00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:28,200
Speaker 3: given is like, this is psychiatric disorder. People typically don't

455
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:31,240
Speaker 3: live alone you know, if they have ADHD, and so

456
00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:34,199
Speaker 3: they were like, it sounded horrible. We didn't know how

457
00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:36,120
Speaker 3: to frame that to you. We just wanted to try

458
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:38,280
Speaker 3: something to see if it helped. It did it never

459
00:25:38,320 --> 00:25:42,120
Speaker 3: came up again, so we've come a long way since.

460
00:25:42,119 --> 00:25:48,280
Speaker 1: Then it's time for another short break, but don't go

461
00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:51,359
Speaker 1: anywhere because we'll be right back to wellness Wednesday with

462
00:25:51,440 --> 00:25:52,639
Speaker 1: doctor Sasha Hamdani.

463
00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:04,800
Speaker 4: And we're back with doctor Sasha Hamdani.

464
00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:09,400
Speaker 2: Well, I want to talk about how you manage your ADHD. Yeah,

465
00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:12,920
Speaker 2: you mentioned going through the pandemic and how that really

466
00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:16,760
Speaker 2: revealed to you a lot of the patterns that ADHD

467
00:26:16,840 --> 00:26:21,200
Speaker 2: has brought into your life. And I'm curious, what did

468
00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:25,879
Speaker 2: the pandemic teach you about how environment and circumstance play

469
00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:28,600
Speaker 2: a role in the management of this condition.

470
00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:33,160
Speaker 3: So I think it has a lot to do with it, right,

471
00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:36,080
Speaker 3: So I struggled for a long time throughout medical school

472
00:26:36,119 --> 00:26:38,679
Speaker 3: trying to figure out like what the right combination of

473
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:42,560
Speaker 3: medication and altered my environment could be.

474
00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:44,200
Speaker 5: I got through.

475
00:26:44,040 --> 00:26:47,800
Speaker 3: Medical school, but I don't feel like I gained mastery

476
00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,280
Speaker 3: or ownership of it until I got into like psychiatry residency.

477
00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:53,200
Speaker 3: Because as soon as I landed there, I was surrounded

478
00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:55,480
Speaker 3: by psychiatrists and therapists and they were just.

479
00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:57,639
Speaker 5: Like, oh, let me help you, let me, let me

480
00:26:58,000 --> 00:26:59,000
Speaker 5: make your life easier.

481
00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:02,359
Speaker 3: And it was like a crack, like three years of

482
00:27:02,400 --> 00:27:07,680
Speaker 3: intensive like restructuring and building up my self esteem again,

483
00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:12,280
Speaker 3: which had been basically zero after medical school. And so

484
00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:16,720
Speaker 3: I think that they in that program, I think they

485
00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:23,240
Speaker 3: kind of also taught me how to manipulate the environments

486
00:27:23,280 --> 00:27:25,840
Speaker 3: that I'm in for the greatest success. And so I

487
00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:29,119
Speaker 3: think that's what's been the greatest thing that I've learned

488
00:27:29,119 --> 00:27:30,800
Speaker 3: from that, Like what do I need to do to

489
00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:33,640
Speaker 3: adjust the environment that I'm in to make it more

490
00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:36,439
Speaker 3: conducive for my brain. They'll give you some examples, like

491
00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:40,520
Speaker 3: for me, I don't learn if I'm typing on a computer,

492
00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:44,040
Speaker 3: and so like even with my patients, I take notes

493
00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:47,199
Speaker 3: on the computer. I put their information on a on

494
00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:50,160
Speaker 3: a medical chart in the in the computer. But while

495
00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:52,879
Speaker 3: they're talking, I'm writing because it's going into my brain

496
00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:54,840
Speaker 3: and that's that's how I learn, and that's how I'm

497
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:59,879
Speaker 3: absorbing what you're telling me. Things like with sleep and

498
00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:02,920
Speaker 3: with waking up. I tried as much as I can

499
00:28:03,040 --> 00:28:05,520
Speaker 3: to keep to the same routine. I need to kind

500
00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:08,959
Speaker 3: of manipulate my schedule or plan things so it's not

501
00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:11,840
Speaker 3: running past that ten PM because if I get if

502
00:28:11,840 --> 00:28:14,400
Speaker 3: I'm not in bed by like eleven, things get real

503
00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:17,360
Speaker 3: weird the next day. So like trying to figure out

504
00:28:17,400 --> 00:28:21,240
Speaker 3: things like that. Eating was a huge, huge thing for

505
00:28:21,280 --> 00:28:23,800
Speaker 3: me because it's taken me a long time to figure out,

506
00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:28,040
Speaker 3: like how to eat to sustain and nourish my body

507
00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:30,320
Speaker 3: in a way that's gonna not make me feel number

508
00:28:30,359 --> 00:28:33,199
Speaker 3: one disgusting, where I'm like, I'm forcing myself to eat

509
00:28:33,240 --> 00:28:35,760
Speaker 3: and I hate every second of it. But something that's

510
00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:38,760
Speaker 3: going to help my brain. What can I What can

511
00:28:38,800 --> 00:28:40,400
Speaker 3: I eat that's not going to make me sleepy? What

512
00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:42,760
Speaker 3: can I eat to give me long lasting energy? What

513
00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:45,480
Speaker 3: can I eat at night to keep me full through

514
00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:46,920
Speaker 3: the night so I'm not waking up at two am

515
00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:48,920
Speaker 3: and I'm like, oh, I'm hungry and fully awake.

516
00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:53,680
Speaker 1: If people listening feel like any of these symptoms ring true,

517
00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:57,760
Speaker 1: or they have a suspicion that maybe they have gone undiagnosed,

518
00:28:58,160 --> 00:28:59,880
Speaker 1: what do you think the first step is?

519
00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:01,120
Speaker 4: What do you suggest that they do?

520
00:29:01,840 --> 00:29:05,960
Speaker 3: My first step is learn about it as much as

521
00:29:05,960 --> 00:29:08,560
Speaker 3: you can, I mean even before you go to a doctor,

522
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:12,080
Speaker 3: if you just immerse yourself in it, because I think

523
00:29:12,160 --> 00:29:14,920
Speaker 3: that you are the only person who understands your own

524
00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:18,360
Speaker 3: internal environment. And it's important to have a vocabulary and

525
00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:21,000
Speaker 3: learn about things because you might get into and be like, oh,

526
00:29:21,000 --> 00:29:23,160
Speaker 3: that actually doesn't sound like me, or you might get

527
00:29:23,160 --> 00:29:25,440
Speaker 3: into it and be like, oh, this really does sound

528
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:28,320
Speaker 3: like me, Like and I didn't even realize that this

529
00:29:28,480 --> 00:29:32,320
Speaker 3: was related to it. So having understanding that is going

530
00:29:32,360 --> 00:29:36,480
Speaker 3: to be huge. Number two, Track your patterns, Track your patterns,

531
00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:38,520
Speaker 3: And this is like why I keep screaming about it,

532
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:41,880
Speaker 3: because then you're gonna know, like, is there a hormonal

533
00:29:41,920 --> 00:29:44,640
Speaker 3: swing with it? Is there times where like is this

534
00:29:44,720 --> 00:29:46,840
Speaker 3: all caused because I did not drink a single glass

535
00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:48,520
Speaker 3: of water for the entire month of October?

536
00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:49,520
Speaker 5: Yes? Probably?

537
00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:54,200
Speaker 3: And then if you still feel strongly about it, it's

538
00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:56,680
Speaker 3: seeking out the right type of help. So you can

539
00:29:56,720 --> 00:29:59,840
Speaker 3: get assessments through a therapist. You can get assessments through

540
00:29:59,880 --> 00:30:03,600
Speaker 3: a primary care doctor, get assessment through a psychiatrist. Psychiatrist

541
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:05,719
Speaker 3: not only can they diagnose you, but they can treat you.

542
00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:09,120
Speaker 3: If medication is the option you want to go through.

543
00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:13,080
Speaker 3: And I think getting specific therapy. Like I will tell

544
00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:15,280
Speaker 3: you that I would not be in the position that

545
00:30:15,560 --> 00:30:19,760
Speaker 3: I am right now if I hadn't had those instructors

546
00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:22,680
Speaker 3: giving me that specific therapy and helping me kind of

547
00:30:22,680 --> 00:30:26,800
Speaker 3: restructure my life because it you know, with medication, it's great,

548
00:30:26,800 --> 00:30:29,680
Speaker 3: but when the medication wears off, I'm still still have

549
00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:32,480
Speaker 3: stuff to do. So it's important to have those good

550
00:30:32,600 --> 00:30:33,920
Speaker 3: basics to build on.

551
00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:38,000
Speaker 1: Okay, you developed an app that you mentioned earlier that's

552
00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:42,360
Speaker 1: geared to be an ADHD companion. I need to better

553
00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:46,800
Speaker 1: understand this. From what I read, it's really about tracking patterns.

554
00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:47,480
Speaker 1: Is that correct?

555
00:30:47,840 --> 00:30:50,680
Speaker 3: So Focus Genie is the name of the app, and

556
00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:54,080
Speaker 3: it's kind of just like this comprehensive platform. So it's

557
00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:57,840
Speaker 3: got educational modules, which I mean they're just like really

558
00:30:58,080 --> 00:31:00,680
Speaker 3: it feels like an Instagram swipe through going, but like

559
00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:03,960
Speaker 3: by the end of that two minutes you have learned

560
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:07,440
Speaker 3: something new about your brain. So there's educational modules. There's

561
00:31:07,560 --> 00:31:10,320
Speaker 3: a focus tracker where you could track like how much

562
00:31:10,360 --> 00:31:12,120
Speaker 3: water I drank, this is what I ate, this is

563
00:31:12,120 --> 00:31:14,400
Speaker 3: how much I slept, this is how impulsive I was,

564
00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:16,400
Speaker 3: and so you can see your patterns over the month.

565
00:31:17,280 --> 00:31:18,240
Speaker 5: There's a journal.

566
00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:22,280
Speaker 3: There's also this is coming out later this month, and

567
00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:25,720
Speaker 3: I'm actually so excited about this. I felt like where

568
00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:27,840
Speaker 3: I was getting stuck is sometimes I was like, I

569
00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:29,840
Speaker 3: can't even make my to do list, Like I can't

570
00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:32,920
Speaker 3: even break down this task because it is so complicated

571
00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:37,000
Speaker 3: and hard and overwhelming for me right now. But we

572
00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:41,520
Speaker 3: just integrated AI into the app. We're rolling out hopefully

573
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:45,440
Speaker 3: by mid November, maybe maybe a week earlier. So now

574
00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:48,720
Speaker 3: you type in what you want to do, it'll break

575
00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:51,560
Speaker 3: it down for you in eight steps. If you're still

576
00:31:51,600 --> 00:31:54,400
Speaker 3: having difficulty with it, it'll break it down further. You

577
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:56,880
Speaker 3: can import that into your to do list and you

578
00:31:56,920 --> 00:31:58,840
Speaker 3: can go through and continue along your day.

579
00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:01,760
Speaker 2: I love that. That's so good. I can't wait to

580
00:32:01,800 --> 00:32:04,240
Speaker 2: download this app. I feel like, even if you don't

581
00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:06,880
Speaker 2: have ADHD, your app sounds so helpful.

582
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:10,040
Speaker 4: Yeah, just to all of us living in the digital age.

583
00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:13,160
Speaker 3: It kind of helps break things down because I feel like,

584
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:17,560
Speaker 3: especially with housework, especially with stuff that is so boring

585
00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:19,880
Speaker 3: to me, so boring that I don't want to do it.

586
00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:23,040
Speaker 3: I really like being able to break things into those

587
00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:25,200
Speaker 3: tiny little chunks.

588
00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:29,600
Speaker 1: Doctor Hamdannie, thank you so much. This sum was really enlightening.

589
00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:31,560
Speaker 5: But thank you for having me. That's so much fun.

590
00:32:31,960 --> 00:32:33,720
Speaker 4: You're the coolest psychiatrist ever.

591
00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:41,360
Speaker 5: Oh, come on, come on, be real. Doctor.

592
00:32:41,400 --> 00:32:44,800
Speaker 1: Sasha Hamdanni is a Bored certified psychiatrist and the author

593
00:32:44,880 --> 00:32:47,840
Speaker 1: of Self Care for People with ADHD. You can find

594
00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:51,920
Speaker 1: her on Instagram, TikTok and YouTube as the psych Doctor MD.

595
00:32:54,200 --> 00:32:57,480
Speaker 2: That's it for today's show. Tomorrow, it's a double simone day.

596
00:32:57,600 --> 00:33:00,840
Speaker 2: We've got the one, the only Raven Simon here with us.

597
00:33:01,240 --> 00:33:03,600
Speaker 2: Thank you to our partners at Coligard, the one of

598
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Speaker 2: a kind way to screen for colon cancer in the

599
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Speaker 2: privacy and comfort of your own home. Talk to your

600
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Speaker 2: doctor or healthcare provider, or go to coliguard dot com

601
00:33:11,280 --> 00:33:14,600
Speaker 2: slash podcast to see if you are eligible to order online.

602
00:33:14,840 --> 00:33:16,880
Speaker 2: If you're forty five or older and at average risk,

603
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Speaker 2: ask your healthcare provider about screening for colon cancer with Coliguard.

604
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Speaker 2: You can also request a collar guard prescription today at

605
00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:28,680
Speaker 2: coliguard dot com slash podcast. Join the conversation using hashtag

606
00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:31,360
Speaker 2: the bright Side and connect with us on social media

607
00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:34,680
Speaker 2: at Hello Sunshine on Instagram and at the bright Side

608
00:33:34,680 --> 00:33:37,600
Speaker 2: Pod on TikTok oh and feel free to tag us

609
00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:40,240
Speaker 2: at Simone Voice and at Danielle Robe.

610
00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:43,440
Speaker 1: Listen and follow the bright Side on the iHeartRadio app,

611
00:33:43,480 --> 00:33:46,160
Speaker 1: Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

612
00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:49,880
Speaker 2: We'll see you tomorrow, y'all. Keep looking on the bright side,