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Speaker 1: Cool Zone Media.

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Speaker 2: Hello, and welcome to Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff

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Speaker 2: rerun edition. That's right, it's the holidays, and that means

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Speaker 2: that I am going to run reruns. And I thought,

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Speaker 2: what's better to get us in the holiday spirit than

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Speaker 2: that holiday band. I've decided their holiday band the history

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Speaker 2: of everyone's favorite an arcopop band, Chumbawamba. It's probably not

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Speaker 2: a Christmas band. In fact, they might be annoyed if

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Speaker 2: I call them that. Well, it's too bad because it's

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Speaker 2: my podcast and this is a history of Chumbawamba. We'll

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Speaker 2: be back next week with a non rerun whatever you

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Speaker 2: call it, a run, a regular run. Anyway, here it.

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Speaker 1: Is Welcome to Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff with

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Speaker 1: Margarete Kiljoy, a podcast that's about cool people who did

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Speaker 1: cool stuff. Our guest today is Max Collins. Max, how

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Speaker 1: are you doing? You want to well about yourself at all?

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Speaker 1: What's going on?

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Speaker 3: I'm doing great.

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Speaker 4: Thank you, it's good to be here.

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Speaker 2: I was going to say on this day. That is

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Speaker 2: definitely a different day. I think everything this podcast knows

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Speaker 2: that we record it and two takes or.

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Speaker 3: Good.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so so Max Collins our guest in the nineties,

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Speaker 2: he actually did an anthropological field study on one hit

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Speaker 2: wonders in the rock world.

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Speaker 3: That's right, everything Margaret, you're saying right now is absolutely, unequivocally,

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Speaker 3: verifiably true.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, Yeah. Yeah. So today we're talking about one

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Speaker 2: hit wonder Chumbawamba, And if you haven't listened to part one,

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Speaker 2: what the fuck is wrong with you? Did something go

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Speaker 2: wrong with your life? Why do you make the choices

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Speaker 2: that you make? So go listen to that. Okay, So

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Speaker 2: around the early nineties, life starts changing for Chumbawamba. It

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Speaker 2: stays a galitarian, but it goes from this like loose

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Speaker 2: chaotic thing into something more like a worker's cooperative. They

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Speaker 2: start having tons of meetings. By one account, they spend

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Speaker 2: more times in meetings than in practice. There's like eight

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Speaker 2: or nine of them at this point, and most of

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Speaker 2: them move out of the squat but stay in the

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Speaker 2: band and stay activists, and they just want to do

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Speaker 2: other things with their lives and more and more. They're

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Speaker 2: also like having families and shit, right, and sometimes maybe

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Speaker 2: obviously some of them are having kids in the squad,

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Speaker 2: but I could imagine not being like this is where

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Speaker 2: I want to raise my children. I don't know, whatever,

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Speaker 2: and One of the cooler things about them is as

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Speaker 2: they start doing this, they don't go off vh ones

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Speaker 2: behind the music, like they keep not exploding. Some of

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Speaker 2: them did drugs, some of them were sober. They date

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Speaker 2: within the band, They get one of them dumps one

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Speaker 2: of them to go date the other bandmate, and everyone

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Speaker 2: stays good with each other more or less. Like I

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Speaker 2: don't know, they I feel like they kind of like

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Speaker 2: did hedonism right at least as its presented. And they're

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Speaker 2: self mythologizing, right, yeah, parties and raves and shows and everything,

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Speaker 2: but they're they're not doing the like trash the hotel room,

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Speaker 2: draw penises, a sexually assault fans thing.

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Speaker 4: Right and so.

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Speaker 2: And they're basically at this point trying to make it

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Speaker 2: as no longer young musicians. They're trying to be like

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Speaker 2: this is. So they sit down and they have a

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Speaker 2: what the fuck are we doing meeting, like a conversation

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Speaker 2: ten years into the band, and they're like, all right,

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Speaker 2: let's fucking do this thing, like let's double or nothing,

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Speaker 2: let's you know. They they quit their jobs to do

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Speaker 2: it full time, which means that they needed to pay

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Speaker 2: their employees, which was themselves and also other people were

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Speaker 2: helping them out, and so commercial considerations start having to

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Speaker 2: be balanced alongside musical and political considerations as they make

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Speaker 2: this music. And in nineteen ninety four they release Anarchy

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Speaker 2: as the name of an album and the cover of

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Speaker 2: which features the photo of a child being born, which

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Speaker 2: is from a book for children about where babies came from.

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Speaker 2: But this is obviously like their whole point is like,

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Speaker 2: you're all going to call this pornographic, aren't you, And

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Speaker 2: it did. It's called pornographic. Stores refuse to sell it.

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Speaker 2: They keep it in brown bags because you can see

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Speaker 2: a vagina in it or whatever. It's my favorite of

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Speaker 2: their albums, and it's the first time that they crack

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Speaker 2: the very bottom of the mainstream charts, and it has

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Speaker 2: the song if you haven't if you've never listened to

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Speaker 2: a Chumbawamba song besides tumb pumping, or even if you

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Speaker 2: haven't heard that, go listen to Homophobia by Chumbawombam. So

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Speaker 2: they start getting to play larger and larger shows right

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Speaker 2: as they start taking this band really seriously. Ten years in,

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Speaker 2: they tour more of the world, and the press fucking

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Speaker 2: hates them. They're like, you're washed up, bad musicians. You're

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Speaker 2: all too old. You scream about politics, but you don't

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Speaker 2: even believe any of it. You're or like they're all

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Speaker 2: like you're too woke, you're ruining the music whatever. And

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Speaker 2: the fans love them. They sell out shows left and right,

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Speaker 2: and the press goes between ignoring them and hating them,

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Speaker 2: which is like, this is just like literally how to

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Speaker 2: succeed as a cult band, that really is. And in

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Speaker 2: nineteen ninety six, they're not super famous yet, they're not

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Speaker 2: tub thumping famous yet, but they're sharing a stage of

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Speaker 2: Smashing Pumpkins in Germany at some big televised event, and

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Speaker 2: Smashing Pumpkins is apparently being real assholes about it, at

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Speaker 2: least as related in bof Whaley's book. And so they,

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Speaker 2: like all the other bands, have to like hide in

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Speaker 2: their dressing rooms with the doors closed and they can't

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Speaker 2: be in the corridors when Billy Corgan comes through or something.

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Speaker 3: And this is still pretty tough something. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So they're like not seeing as Smashing Pumpkins as

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Speaker 2: peer yet, but they're big enough to be at this

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Speaker 2: televised event. And so Dan one of the people in

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Speaker 2: Tumble one, but he likes being naked, like constantly. He's

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Speaker 2: stripping on stage for the fuck of it, and the

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Speaker 2: band is like, Ock, what are we going to do

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Speaker 2: to prank these assholes? That's like what we got to do.

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Speaker 2: That's our thing, you know, I know, Dan, take off

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Speaker 2: all your clothes. So Dan gets naked. They write that

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Speaker 2: word punk and huge letters across his chest. He strolls

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Speaker 2: out on stage just as Smashing Pumpkins's their big finale.

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Speaker 2: You know, he walks up to Billy and he salutes

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Speaker 2: the crowd naked, and then he walks off and yes,

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Speaker 2: the band has to physically rescue him from bouncers and

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Speaker 2: that they fled the scene as like they're being chased,

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Speaker 2: and the promoter is like, you'll never appear on German

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Speaker 2: television again, which probably didn't turn out to be true.

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Speaker 4: Incredible, and yeah, I know, I love it.

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Speaker 2: I love it. Also, in nineteen ninety six, they turn

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Speaker 2: in an album called tub Thumping into their label, which

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Speaker 2: is a label called One Little Indian, which was not

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Speaker 2: a great name for a label, and just to be clear,

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Speaker 2: the label realized that and in twenty twenty they changed

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Speaker 2: their name to One Little Independent. In nineteen ninety six,

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Speaker 2: Chumbawamba turns in this album to them, and the label's like, no,

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Speaker 2: this sucks, go home and write better songs. No good onward.

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Speaker 2: And then EMI Germany, a major label, was like, well,

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Speaker 2: we'll give you one hundred thousand fake europe money for it,

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Speaker 2: maybe pounds, maybe euros, I don't know, one of the

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Speaker 2: fake moneys that they have over there. And at first

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Speaker 2: they laugh it off, right, They're like, no way, well

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Speaker 2: we do that obviously, and then they kind of sit

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Speaker 2: on it and they're like, we're so fucking broke, and

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Speaker 2: that is enough money that even if the album doesn't

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Speaker 2: sell at all, we can still pay everyone involved a

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Speaker 2: decent wage, you know. They To be clear, Chumbawamba had

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Speaker 2: put a song out on an anti EMI compilation about

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Speaker 2: ten years earlier. The compilations called fuck EMI. At the time,

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Speaker 2: I was deep in the nuclear arms industry. EMI had

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Speaker 2: since divested from that. But still it wasn't It clearly

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Speaker 2: wasn't good optics, and they weren't sure, but they I

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Speaker 2: think what happened is that they they were sure it

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Speaker 2: wasn't good optics to the punk scene. What they were

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Speaker 2: trying to figure out was whether or not it was

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Speaker 2: good ethics, and they wanted to make their decision based

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Speaker 2: on that. So they talk it over as a collective

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Speaker 2: like they do everything. They don't vote about major decisions.

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Speaker 2: They work for consensus, and they talk it over for weeks.

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Speaker 2: They are like, look, symbolism is bad, but change for

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Speaker 2: change's sake is sometimes good. They were stagnating, and they

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Speaker 2: were like, fuck stagnating, that's what we don't want to do.

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Speaker 2: It's more of a chance to reach more people. Saying

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Speaker 2: fuck you to a scene that was getting way too

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Speaker 2: essentially conservative from their point of view, seemed fun to them.

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Speaker 2: Being able to pay themselves enough to not worry for

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Speaker 2: a while. Like they're all working class folks, right, and

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Speaker 2: they're prosing middle aged without much of a safety net

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Speaker 2: because they all were squad or punks, and and they're

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Speaker 2: like bands like Fugazi can get away with being fiercely

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Speaker 2: independent because they're just big enough and sell enough records, right,

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Speaker 2: Chumbawamba wasn't selling that kind of those kinds of numbers.

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Speaker 2: And but fear of what people would think was a

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Speaker 2: big part of it. A few years earlier, in Poland,

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Speaker 2: some American punk had taken it upon himself to like

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Speaker 2: slash their tour van tires because he was mad about

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Speaker 2: how much the band was charging for the show. Punks

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Speaker 2: can be sort of myopic, Yeah, yeah, and one of

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Speaker 2: the one of the things that they thought about a lot,

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Speaker 2: you know. The most convincing argument to some of them,

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Speaker 2: and I actually think maybe the most convincing argument to

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Speaker 2: me is they're like, look, our independent labels are also

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Speaker 2: just all about the money. They are also fucking us over.

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Speaker 2: They're also greedy, we might as well get paid well.

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Speaker 2: Alice Nutter puts it in an interview with a punk

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Speaker 2: magazine later. My reasoning for doing it isn't how we're

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Speaker 2: going to get our message across to more people. It's

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Speaker 2: nothing to do with that. It's because my experiences with

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Speaker 2: one little Indian in the music industry have me convinced

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Speaker 2: that they're all the fucking same. They're small businessmen and

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Speaker 2: big businessmen, and they have a different agenda to us.

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Speaker 2: There's no good or bad capitalism is kind of what

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Speaker 2: they hit upon. Yeah, they do it, and which brings

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Speaker 2: us to probably the only song by them that most

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Speaker 2: of the people listening to this podcast have actually heard.

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Speaker 2: It'sub thumping about falling down and standing up and about drinking.

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Speaker 2: I literally don't know. I didn't actually ask Sophie what

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Speaker 2: I'm allowed to do in terms of quoting song lyrics,

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Speaker 2: so that's why keep tee speaking about it very vaguely.

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Speaker 2: Sophie says, yes, I can claim that I wrote the

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Speaker 2: song and that it is legally my property. That is

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Speaker 2: what Sophie is nod in and saying yes right now.

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Speaker 2: So I wrote the song tub Thumping, and when I did? Okay, so,

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Speaker 2: but I'm going to quote both whiley about this song.

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Speaker 2: Tub Thumping, from his very outset as an idea, was

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Speaker 2: definitely populist and based on working class experience. That's working class,

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Speaker 2: not just as a mythic Trotskyist vision, but as a

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Speaker 2: cultural and historic whole, which includes family and sport and

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Speaker 2: community and war and love and entertainment, not just the cliched,

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Speaker 2: clenched fist getting up, but the getting knocked down as well.

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Speaker 2: Tub Thumping became known to some purely as a drinking song,

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Speaker 2: which is fair enough because of nothing else. It didn't

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Speaker 2: belong to an elite group of musicians. It belonged to people.

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Speaker 2: People at football matches, people singing along to the radio

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Speaker 2: as they drove, people at parties, drinking too much whiskey

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Speaker 2: and tripping over the kitchen chairs people like me, and

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Speaker 2: because it helped beggar the notion that Chumbo Wamba were

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Speaker 2: boring zealots from planet Anarchy, And that's not what I

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Speaker 2: realized when I heard it when I was in the

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Speaker 2: nineties and like driving around and like, but.

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Speaker 5: I think it's cool to They don't try to shew

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Speaker 5: that interpretation, because yeah, it is a drinking song, you know,

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Speaker 5: it's but it works on a couple different levels. But

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Speaker 5: it is a drinking song insofar as like you know,

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Speaker 5: you're drinking with your mates, and there's community there, and

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Speaker 5: there's solidarity there, and and there's you know, commiseration for

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Speaker 5: the getting knocked down, you know, parts of life.

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Speaker 2: There, which is punk as fuck. It is punk as fucked,

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Speaker 2: like put your arms around all your friends and drunkenly

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Speaker 2: sing songs like whatever. The song you know, like yeah,

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Speaker 2: like yeah.

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Speaker 3: It's collective, it's it's yeah, it's kind of a spiritual experience, you.

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Speaker 2: Know, yeah, totally, and it's one that we have like

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Speaker 2: increasingly stripped away from us by by modern life. And

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Speaker 2: apparently one of the main inspirations of the song was

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Speaker 2: watching a drunk Irish guy stumbling home from a bar

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Speaker 2: singing Danny Boy and being told to shut up by

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Speaker 2: a neighbor. So and the song goes fucking huge. And again,

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Speaker 2: if you were live in the nineties, you probably remember this.

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Speaker 2: It's number two in the UK, it's number six in

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Speaker 2: the US, It's in the charts everywhere in the world.

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Speaker 2: It gets ranked on lists of like the twenty most

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Speaker 2: annoying songs of all time.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean there's a distinction to be made there

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Speaker 5: between between like a hit song and like a global smash.

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Speaker 4: Like that song was.

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Speaker 5: Like, you know, number one on alternative rock radio or whatever,

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Speaker 5: but also pop radio and also not just in the US,

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Speaker 5: but like, yeah, you know everywhere. It was just one

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Speaker 5: of those, you know, hyper ubiquitous songs that you could

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Speaker 5: not escape no matter where you were, no matter what

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Speaker 5: your where, your tastes, what genres your tastes went to,

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Speaker 5: or whatever.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, because it's also kind of a genre list song,

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Speaker 2: Like on its face, you know, it has like I

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Speaker 2: think electronic drums and just this catchy singalong chorus and

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Speaker 2: like it's just and it's like, yeah, it's almost like

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Speaker 2: like a collective delusion, you know, this thing that just

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Speaker 2: like absorbed everyone for a moment, you know, and yeah,

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Speaker 2: I don't know, it's fucking interesting.

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Speaker 6: It's like, in a way, it's like it it was.

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Speaker 6: It was a troll sort of, but it also wasn't

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Speaker 6: a cynical one. They were Yeah, they weren't looking down

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Speaker 6: on the people enjoying it. Yeah, for whatever surface reasons.

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Speaker 6: There was no contempt there. Yeah, but it was this

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Speaker 6: thing that functioned on a couple different levels.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, it's so fucking like, it's just brilliant. It's

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Speaker 2: such a it's yeah, it's a prank, but it's not

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Speaker 2: a prank, you know. It's this earnest thing they did

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Speaker 2: that got injected into pop culture and don't it's fucking

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Speaker 2: and a lot of their old fans write them letters

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Speaker 2: calling them sellouts. But the people who really led the

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Speaker 2: charge of calling them hypocrites were the same music journalists

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Speaker 2: who had always hated them because they're like, ah see,

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Speaker 2: we told you their politics didn't mean anything, which was

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Speaker 2: their way of basically excusing themselves for never having had

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Speaker 2: decent politics in the first Yeah.

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Speaker 5: Which is a really dubious way to sort of yeah,

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Speaker 5: you know, truffle Hunt for what seems like hypocrisy, but

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Speaker 5: if you scratch the surface at all, you realize really isn't.

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Speaker 5: It's a collective who wants to be able to take

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Speaker 5: care of their own and, as we'll find soon enough

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Speaker 5: in the story, take care of others as well, and

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Speaker 5: do that by siphoning corporate bunny and yeah, like you know,

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Speaker 5: doing Robin hood shit.

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Speaker 2: Really yeah, totally totally. And it's funny is to look

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Speaker 2: at like if I had been I, you know, I

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Speaker 2: was a a salty subcultural but not like a punk

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Speaker 2: yet right at the time of all of this, if

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Speaker 2: I had been, like if it had happened in two

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Speaker 2: thousand and three, I probably would have been one of

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Speaker 2: the people being like, h you fucking sellouts, right, But

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Speaker 2: I'm glad that I don't, you know, like twenty one

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Speaker 2: year old me is not who I look back to

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Speaker 2: about what decisions were best to make for my life.

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Speaker 2: You know. No, I'm stuck with some of the tattoos.

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Speaker 2: But that's okay too.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So they spend two years, the next two years in

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Speaker 2: this whirlwind of fame. It doesn't stop them from being themselves.

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Speaker 2: And first and foremost, they give away just a fuck

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Speaker 2: ton of money, since since all the money gets split equally.

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Speaker 2: They didn't like fuss about who deserves what amount and

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Speaker 2: stuff like that. You know, there were the people who

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Speaker 2: are the lead singers of the songs whatever, but they're like,

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Speaker 2: we're just split it in and evenly. We'll work from there.

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Speaker 2: And they peer pressure each other out of like running

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Speaker 2: out and buying Jaguars. Boff notes that Dan went out

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Speaker 2: and bought a really fancy vacuum cleaner, which I must

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Speaker 2: be what middle age anarchists do. And they suddenly have

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Speaker 2: a lot of money. You know, nice vacuum cleaner. It's

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Speaker 2: a very nice thing. And they I get the impression

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Speaker 2: that they hold onto enough money to not have to

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Speaker 2: worry about being poor. But they donate money to artists,

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Speaker 2: women's groups, prisoner defense campaigns, kids football teams, radical media projects, venues,

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Speaker 2: solidarity groups, individual organizers, community groups, magazines, direct action groups,

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Speaker 2: and social centers. At one point in two thousand and two,

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Speaker 2: GM wanted a song for a commercial. Yeah, Jumble Womba

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Speaker 2: said yes, and they take it. Took one hundred thousand

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Speaker 2: dollars or different accounts give different amounts, but a large

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Speaker 2: number of money, high money number one hundred thousand will

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Speaker 2: go with that, and they just turn around and they

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Speaker 2: give half of it to indie Media, which is this

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Speaker 2: big decentralized ub the media network, and they give which

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Speaker 2: is unfortunately kind of probably what prefigured Twitter and to

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Speaker 2: rest of the nightmare we live now, but it was

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Speaker 2: a good idea at the time. And they give the

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Speaker 2: other half to a project called corp Watch that is

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Speaker 2: specifically tracking GM, like exposing their crimes. And so they

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Speaker 2: just turn around and give fifty thousand dollars to people

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Speaker 2: who are like specifically attacking GM. Yeah, and so if

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Speaker 2: the two main arguments that they have in favor of

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Speaker 2: selling out are reach a wider audience and get fuck

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Speaker 2: tons of money, they do both. But I actually I

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Speaker 2: think Alice Nutter was right in some ways. The fuck

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Speaker 2: tons of money, which seems less the radical goal, is

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Speaker 2: actually in some ways the more radical thing they did

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Speaker 2: because the wider audience didn't necessarily like get it right.

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Speaker 2: They talk about anarchism on news shows, they mostly get

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Speaker 2: made fun of. They sell their music to a ton

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Speaker 2: of places, but they turned down other places too. They

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Speaker 2: turned down Nike, who offered them a million and a

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Speaker 2: half bucks. Their rules were really simple and strict. They

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Speaker 2: wouldn't sell their music to anyone involved in sweatshop labor

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Speaker 2: or the arms industry. And when I first started researching

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Speaker 2: this episode, I thought it was going to be mostly

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Speaker 2: about their high jinks during the fame period, because they

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Speaker 2: did really good hijinks. But in the end, I you

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Speaker 2: know the reason. The first half is more about the

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Speaker 2: working clas punks in a squat breaking laws is like

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Speaker 2: what I kind of lingered on. But let's talk about

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Speaker 2: the hijinks one time. In nineteen ninety seven, in the

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Speaker 2: Top Thumping era, Dan gets arrested in Italy literally for

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Speaker 2: just walking down the street wearing a skirt, and he's

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Speaker 2: held in his cell. He has a show that night.

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Speaker 2: He gets held in a cell with no one speaking

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Speaker 2: to him in English, and finally he scrawls I'm in

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Speaker 2: a pop group called Chumbo Wumba on a piece of

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Speaker 2: paper and helds it up to the glass of the

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Speaker 2: cell and they release him and he gets in time

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Speaker 2: to go to the sound check. The next day, he

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Speaker 2: appears on Italian TV in the Skirt and says Italy

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Speaker 2: has some problems with homophobic, macho cop culture. Alice Nutter

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Speaker 2: steps up as being the kind of unofficial spokesperson for

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Speaker 2: the band. I think mostly because she enjoyed talking the

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Speaker 2: most and had the most to say. She was also

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Speaker 2: maybe the most firebrand of them. In nineteen ninety seven,

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Speaker 2: she told the UK Press, nothing can change the fact

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Speaker 2: that we like it when cops get killed. Emi is like,

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Speaker 2: oh my god, please apologize. What the fuck? Oh my god?

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Speaker 2: She didn't apologize and such. She clarified her statement. If

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Speaker 2: you're working class, they won't protect you. When you hear

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Speaker 2: about them, it's in the context of them abusing people,

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Speaker 2: you know, miscarriages of justice. We don't have a party

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Speaker 2: when cops die, you know, we don't. But before we

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Speaker 2: hear about more of Alice Nutter's anti capitalist hijinks. Ooh,

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Speaker 2: we have some capitalist hijinks for you in the form

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Speaker 2: of products and services. Okay, and we are back in

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Speaker 2: January nineteen ninety eight, Alice Nutter, she goes on the

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Speaker 2: talk show Politically Incorrect, and she says, basically, yeah, if

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Speaker 2: you can't afford our music, just go to the nearest big, evil,

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Speaker 2: giant chain store like Virgin and steal it. And Virgin

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Speaker 2: didn't like this. Chumbawamba at the time is Universal's number

377
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Speaker 2: one selling band, and here's the band saying, just steal it.

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Speaker 2: Who fucking cares? As long as you steal it from

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Speaker 2: a large corporation. Virgin threatens to remove the album from

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Speaker 2: their stores, and it depends on what account you read.

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Speaker 2: They either stopped carrying it entirely or hit it behind

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Speaker 2: the counter.

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Speaker 7: I don't know.

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Speaker 2: And this only makes sales go up, which doesn't fucking

385
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Speaker 2: surprise me, right, Like I could have told them that, like, yeah,

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Speaker 2: more will get stolen. But if people steal the CDs,

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Speaker 2: people are going to listen to it and talk about it,

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Speaker 2: and more people are going to go out and fucking

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Speaker 2: buy it, right.

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Speaker 5: And and if you're taking it off the shelves or

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Speaker 5: hiding it, you're literally manufacturing scarcity for the thing, and

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Speaker 5: by making it more valuable.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, so everyone wants to go out and find

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Speaker 2: it and get it. Yeah. So anyway, they're contact at

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Speaker 2: Universal called the band and was like, well, you all

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Speaker 2: just laugh at me if I tell you that Universal

397
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Speaker 2: wants to ask you to apologize for saying all that,

398
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Speaker 2: Like they're rep knows it's a like fool's errand that

399
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Speaker 2: he's been tasked to call them and ask them to apologize.

400
00:21:03,200 --> 00:21:05,040
Speaker 2: He's like, y'all aren't going to do this, are you?

401
00:21:05,200 --> 00:21:11,480
Speaker 2: And they're like ha ha Nope. And later Alice Nutters

402
00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:15,320
Speaker 2: in a recollection says, why should I apologize? I wasn't sorry,

403
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Speaker 2: which is exactly how you should or shouldn't apologize when

404
00:21:18,880 --> 00:21:22,919
Speaker 2: you make decisions about apologies. So and on the The

405
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Speaker 2: David Letterman Show, they changed the lyrics of tub thumping

406
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Speaker 2: to include from free Mumiya bou Jamal and Mamiya bu

407
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Speaker 2: Jamal for anyone who's not aware. As a black political

408
00:21:33,119 --> 00:21:35,280
Speaker 2: prisoner who was probably framed up on the murder of

409
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Speaker 2: a cop in Philly and at the very least definitely

410
00:21:37,840 --> 00:21:40,760
Speaker 2: had an unfair trial, he spent a couple decades on

411
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Speaker 2: death row, which was reduced to Life without Pearl in

412
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Speaker 2: two thousand and one. So Chumbawamba goes on Letterman and

413
00:21:45,560 --> 00:21:48,359
Speaker 2: sings free Mumiya bou Jamal, and it was pre recorded,

414
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Speaker 2: so Letterman let it happen. In the end, basically they

415
00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:55,160
Speaker 2: like sat down, Like The Letterman Show, people were like, fuck,

416
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Speaker 2: are we gonna let this fucking happen? And finally the

417
00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:00,560
Speaker 2: network is like, all right, fuck it. They run it

418
00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:05,000
Speaker 2: and they talk about anarchism with Barbara Walters. They basically

419
00:22:05,119 --> 00:22:07,520
Speaker 2: leave a trail of chaos that the record labels are

420
00:22:07,720 --> 00:22:10,320
Speaker 2: running around trying to clean up for them. But instead

421
00:22:10,320 --> 00:22:13,960
Speaker 2: of trash hotel rooms, it was just weird shit, you know.

422
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Speaker 2: And the peak of all this was the nineteen ninety

423
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Speaker 2: eight brit Awards, which I think are the Grammys for

424
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Speaker 2: people stuck on a tiny island without sunshine. My theory

425
00:22:24,560 --> 00:22:26,800
Speaker 2: is that they actually named the country after the award show.

426
00:22:27,880 --> 00:22:30,959
Speaker 2: It was called brit Land, but then with the accent,

427
00:22:30,960 --> 00:22:32,600
Speaker 2: sound like Britain, and so that's what's stuck.

428
00:22:33,320 --> 00:22:35,080
Speaker 4: That's my thavorite sounds true to me.

429
00:22:35,400 --> 00:22:40,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, So I wonder how long I'm gonna get away

430
00:22:40,119 --> 00:22:44,920
Speaker 2: with this bit so Jumbawamba. They get invited to the

431
00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:47,359
Speaker 2: nineteen ninety eight brit Awards. They're even up for an

432
00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:51,440
Speaker 2: award themselves Best Single, and they're going to perform. At first,

433
00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:54,680
Speaker 2: they weren't going to perform, but the director he knows

434
00:22:54,680 --> 00:22:57,320
Speaker 2: their fucking number, and he's like, all right, you don't

435
00:22:57,320 --> 00:22:59,359
Speaker 2: want to perform, We'll let you have a video behind you.

436
00:22:59,800 --> 00:23:02,480
Speaker 2: And they're like, yeah, okay, we're in. We can show propaganda.

437
00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:07,320
Speaker 2: We are in. And the day of the director of

438
00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:09,879
Speaker 2: the wards. He goes up to chumble One personally with

439
00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:13,440
Speaker 2: a plea and he's like, hey, could you could you

440
00:23:13,600 --> 00:23:17,400
Speaker 2: not physically attack any of the other artists, And that's

441
00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:22,960
Speaker 2: his big request to them. Tumbawamba is like, all right, fine, whatever,

442
00:23:23,119 --> 00:23:26,320
Speaker 2: we won't attack any of the other artists physically, and

443
00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:30,560
Speaker 2: they even technically stuck with that. They they're not super

444
00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:33,600
Speaker 2: stoked about it, though, and everyone else is pissing them

445
00:23:33,600 --> 00:23:35,520
Speaker 2: off with all being off pop star and shit. And

446
00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:38,440
Speaker 2: I have a feeling that every like band that's played

447
00:23:38,480 --> 00:23:41,520
Speaker 2: at this level kind of like vaguely enjoys talking about bands.

448
00:23:41,920 --> 00:23:45,520
Speaker 2: But you know, they point out this in the book

449
00:23:45,600 --> 00:23:48,080
Speaker 2: that like half of Fleetwood Mac refuses to use their

450
00:23:48,160 --> 00:23:51,760
Speaker 2: dressing room because of inadequate carpeting. And I don't know

451
00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:54,120
Speaker 2: shit about Fleetwood Mac, and I'm taking both Whaley's word

452
00:23:54,119 --> 00:23:56,480
Speaker 2: for it. Maybe inadequate carpeting was like maybe like the

453
00:23:56,520 --> 00:23:58,480
Speaker 2: whole thing was like this like sewage swamp. I don't

454
00:23:58,480 --> 00:23:59,280
Speaker 2: fucking know, you.

455
00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:02,760
Speaker 4: Know, yeah, yeah, yeah.

456
00:24:01,800 --> 00:24:04,760
Speaker 2: But it's easier to imagine, like, ah, those damn rock stars,

457
00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:07,880
Speaker 2: said the one rock star to that. Anyway, whatever, it's

458
00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:12,520
Speaker 2: more fun to imagine too, Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So they

459
00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:14,840
Speaker 2: go up and play and they're all wearing sweatshirts that

460
00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:17,600
Speaker 2: say things like sold out or whatever, and they put

461
00:24:17,600 --> 00:24:19,560
Speaker 2: on a film behind them and it's full of people

462
00:24:19,720 --> 00:24:22,600
Speaker 2: rioting and protesting, and there's act up banners and there's

463
00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:26,280
Speaker 2: the stages streaming with red and black banners, and it's like,

464
00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:29,400
Speaker 2: it's exactly what I would do if I was up

465
00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:32,320
Speaker 2: for one of these aworts. And it's not even not

466
00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:35,199
Speaker 2: necessarily in an original way, but just it's it's like

467
00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:37,959
Speaker 2: you kind of have to if you're that band, you know.

468
00:24:38,359 --> 00:24:39,119
Speaker 4: Yeah.

469
00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:42,000
Speaker 2: And at the time, dockers in Liverpool had been on

470
00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:44,040
Speaker 2: strike and it was one of the longest labor disputes

471
00:24:44,040 --> 00:24:49,320
Speaker 2: in British history, and the dockers had mostly lost. They

472
00:24:49,359 --> 00:24:51,479
Speaker 2: had been forced into a settlement package and they all

473
00:24:51,520 --> 00:24:54,760
Speaker 2: lost their jobs. And the Labor Party was currently branding

474
00:24:54,800 --> 00:24:56,919
Speaker 2: itself as New Labor and they were culpable for a

475
00:24:56,920 --> 00:24:59,720
Speaker 2: lot of that. So Chumbawamba changed the course of tub

476
00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:03,159
Speaker 2: Thump to include new Labors sold out the dockers, just

477
00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:06,320
Speaker 2: like they'll sell out the rest of us. And they

478
00:25:06,359 --> 00:25:08,600
Speaker 2: even brought some dockers with them to the ceremony. With

479
00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:10,560
Speaker 2: the plan that if they win, the doctors would go

480
00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:13,840
Speaker 2: up and accept on their behalf and give a speech

481
00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:16,639
Speaker 2: about what was going on. But Chaumbowama didn't win, so

482
00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:20,600
Speaker 2: they didn't get to do the Doctors accept thing. But

483
00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:24,680
Speaker 2: after they get off stage, they're like, oh shit, that's

484
00:25:24,760 --> 00:25:28,280
Speaker 2: John Prescott and he's the Deputy Prime Minister, which is

485
00:25:29,200 --> 00:25:32,480
Speaker 2: roughly the equivalent of vice president, and he's from the

486
00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:35,000
Speaker 2: working class. He used to be a member of the

487
00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:38,720
Speaker 2: same union as the Dockers, but he basically sold them out.

488
00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:41,480
Speaker 2: He was blocking tuition bills, he was fucking over the unemployed.

489
00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:44,720
Speaker 2: He was just doing all kinds of shit, right, And

490
00:25:44,760 --> 00:25:46,960
Speaker 2: so they're sitting around and they're like, what the fuck

491
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:49,399
Speaker 2: are we going to do. There's the vice president of Britain,

492
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:52,760
Speaker 2: which definitely has a vice president, and they they look

493
00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:54,399
Speaker 2: at the bin that had been full of all the

494
00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:58,560
Speaker 2: ice for the champagne and all of that, and they're like, Dan, Alice,

495
00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:01,360
Speaker 2: you got this and Dan and Alice are like, yes,

496
00:26:01,640 --> 00:26:04,840
Speaker 2: we do indeed have it. So they go up to Prescott.

497
00:26:05,440 --> 00:26:07,720
Speaker 2: Dan jumps on the table says this is for the

498
00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:10,840
Speaker 2: Liverpool Dockers and dumps a bucket of ice water on

499
00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:14,560
Speaker 2: John Prescott's head. Not to be outdone, Nutter is right

500
00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:16,439
Speaker 2: there behind him with I think an extra bucket of

501
00:26:16,480 --> 00:26:19,480
Speaker 2: water and also just soaks him with that as well,

502
00:26:20,760 --> 00:26:24,080
Speaker 2: and this is like on okay, So so Dan gets

503
00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:26,359
Speaker 2: arrested and Prescott has to be a good sport about

504
00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:27,879
Speaker 2: it because he's like trying to look cool with the

505
00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:30,520
Speaker 2: kids he's here at the brit Awards or whatever. It's

506
00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:32,960
Speaker 2: really hard to imagine a US politician being this cool

507
00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:35,879
Speaker 2: about especially a vice president. I'm like, I'm struggling to

508
00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:39,080
Speaker 2: imagine the punk band that can dump ice water on

509
00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:41,800
Speaker 2: the vice president of the United States and survive, you know.

510
00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:45,080
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, I mean we saw the way was it Giuliani?

511
00:26:45,320 --> 00:26:49,240
Speaker 5: Who there was that video of a guy who kind

512
00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:53,560
Speaker 5: of like lightly like oh yeah, pat on the back

513
00:26:53,640 --> 00:26:56,760
Speaker 5: and then talks some shit yeah, and he acted like

514
00:26:56,840 --> 00:26:58,360
Speaker 5: it was a saul and.

515
00:26:58,560 --> 00:27:04,280
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah yeah. But however, they managed to dump ice

516
00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:10,160
Speaker 2: water on the fucking deputy prime minister's head, and the

517
00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:12,720
Speaker 2: deputy Prime Minister of Prescott is like, all right, I'm

518
00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:15,199
Speaker 2: not pressing charges, and so they get let go and

519
00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:17,680
Speaker 2: the tabloids eat the whole thing up, and of course

520
00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:21,959
Speaker 2: the usual snotty critics get mad and oh and then

521
00:27:22,119 --> 00:27:24,639
Speaker 2: Ginger Spice from The Spice Girls goes up to Prescott

522
00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:26,679
Speaker 2: to make sure he's okay. They made sure to include

523
00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:33,240
Speaker 2: that part in the in their biography or that's really funny,

524
00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:35,760
Speaker 2: and Alice Nutter later, I think it's talking about the

525
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:39,040
Speaker 2: entire like arc of Chumbawamba, and it's like it was

526
00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:40,879
Speaker 2: all worth it just to be able to get at

527
00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:43,880
Speaker 2: John Prescott, just to get at these people who think

528
00:27:43,920 --> 00:27:46,920
Speaker 2: they're untouchable. And that's the thing that's kind of interesting

529
00:27:46,960 --> 00:27:49,360
Speaker 2: to me about like like people used to pie politicians

530
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:52,439
Speaker 2: more often, it feels like, and it seems like the

531
00:27:52,520 --> 00:27:56,240
Speaker 2: point of that is just to say, like, hey, remember

532
00:27:56,320 --> 00:28:00,720
Speaker 2: you're a person. Yeah, you know, like this have been worse,

533
00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:02,840
Speaker 2: is what you're saying when you dump ice water on

534
00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:03,840
Speaker 2: someone's head. You know.

535
00:28:04,280 --> 00:28:09,919
Speaker 4: Yeah, you're a person who's supposed to be accountable to us.

536
00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:13,600
Speaker 5: Yeah, and you clearly aren't. And you enjoy this sort

537
00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:17,240
Speaker 5: of like protected celebrity status, you know.

538
00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:22,560
Speaker 2: Yeah totally And so okay. So they spent about two

539
00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:25,119
Speaker 2: years on the road doing the celebrity thing, and then

540
00:28:25,119 --> 00:28:27,200
Speaker 2: they take a break and they resume other parts of

541
00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:29,879
Speaker 2: their lives, figuring out their next move, and then they

542
00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:32,720
Speaker 2: put out a second album with EMI, which is a

543
00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:37,240
Speaker 2: bit confusing because then they're mythologizing. I've read some of

544
00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:39,320
Speaker 2: their accounts that are like, em I wanted to put

545
00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:41,440
Speaker 2: out another album, but we said no. But I think

546
00:28:41,480 --> 00:28:44,640
Speaker 2: they did put out another album with EMI. Either way,

547
00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:50,280
Speaker 2: either em I dumps them or they dump EMI and or.

548
00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:54,920
Speaker 5: Yeah, EMI could have done something where if they were

549
00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:58,120
Speaker 5: under contract for another record or something but didn't want

550
00:28:58,520 --> 00:29:01,560
Speaker 5: to deliver it where they either. I mean, we had

551
00:29:01,600 --> 00:29:04,840
Speaker 5: our record label do that with us, where they put

552
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:08,120
Speaker 5: out I don't know if it was like live stuff

553
00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:09,320
Speaker 5: for you know.

554
00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:12,080
Speaker 2: Oh interesting because you owed them an album but they

555
00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:13,160
Speaker 2: didn't like the way they turned in.

556
00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:16,880
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, that kind of thing for us. I don't

557
00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:19,640
Speaker 5: remember exactly what the circumstances were, but I could see

558
00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:22,520
Speaker 5: it being something like that where they basically manufactured some

559
00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:26,880
Speaker 5: kind of release out of B sides or whatever.

560
00:29:27,000 --> 00:29:32,000
Speaker 2: You know. Yeah, are you still they technically owned? I

561
00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:34,719
Speaker 2: think you're not still with a major label. Is that correct?

562
00:29:35,280 --> 00:29:35,880
Speaker 4: That's correct?

563
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:39,600
Speaker 5: Yeah, we got dropped from RCA and like two thousand

564
00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:42,640
Speaker 5: and three, and we put records out now with an

565
00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:43,520
Speaker 5: indie label.

566
00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:46,560
Speaker 2: Called Velocity okay, which always seemed like kind of a

567
00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:48,840
Speaker 2: cool like after this, and I'll get to it in

568
00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:51,680
Speaker 2: a moment, like Chumbawamba kind of like goes from major

569
00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:53,840
Speaker 2: label back to indie. They go from indy to major

570
00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:57,280
Speaker 2: to indie, right, and they're like all right, And it's

571
00:29:57,320 --> 00:30:00,280
Speaker 2: kind of interesting to me to see that as a well,

572
00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:03,000
Speaker 2: you just do what's best in the situation, rather than like,

573
00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:07,120
Speaker 2: oh no, you're a failure because the major label dropped you,

574
00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:09,920
Speaker 2: or oh no, you're a sellout because you know you

575
00:30:11,480 --> 00:30:12,840
Speaker 2: went to a major label at all.

576
00:30:13,600 --> 00:30:17,240
Speaker 4: I don't know, yeah, yeah, I mean sort of like.

577
00:30:19,800 --> 00:30:24,840
Speaker 5: Judging or making the metric of like what is worthwhile

578
00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:31,200
Speaker 5: about making rock by what type of record label you're

579
00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:35,040
Speaker 5: on or whatever, ain't really.

580
00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:35,440
Speaker 4: Where it's at.

581
00:30:35,560 --> 00:30:39,640
Speaker 5: I can also see how, you know, perception is created

582
00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 5: by like by that kind of story, Like you know,

583
00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:48,680
Speaker 5: it did feel embarrassing to get dropped from a major

584
00:30:48,720 --> 00:30:51,200
Speaker 5: label for all of those reasons, but then you sort

585
00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:55,000
Speaker 5: of realize.

586
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:56,800
Speaker 4: Like why why do you feel that way?

587
00:30:57,480 --> 00:30:57,680
Speaker 1: Right?

588
00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:03,600
Speaker 5: And you know this, the reasons for it are pretty

589
00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:07,520
Speaker 5: dubious once you examine them a little bit, like what

590
00:31:07,520 --> 00:31:10,800
Speaker 5: what do you what are you making stuff for? Anyway,

591
00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:16,880
Speaker 5: is it too, you know, appease, you know, the bean

592
00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:20,800
Speaker 5: counters or whatever because you like like to like to

593
00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:23,200
Speaker 5: make rock because it makes you feel free or whatever.

594
00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:27,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, and like connecting to people like you connect with

595
00:31:27,200 --> 00:31:30,040
Speaker 2: people different ways depending on what means by which you

596
00:31:30,120 --> 00:31:34,880
Speaker 2: access them, and doesn't make it better or worse, like yep, no,

597
00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:37,920
Speaker 2: it's interesting. Yeah, it must have been. You have not

598
00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:40,000
Speaker 2: been in that position, but it must have been like, oh,

599
00:31:40,120 --> 00:31:42,760
Speaker 2: we've we've hit our crest and now we are coming

600
00:31:42,840 --> 00:31:45,040
Speaker 2: down from it, as compared to like, well, no, you

601
00:31:45,120 --> 00:31:49,320
Speaker 2: got this like boost of attention and now you're able

602
00:31:49,360 --> 00:31:50,760
Speaker 2: to do things with that, you know.

603
00:31:51,280 --> 00:31:52,160
Speaker 4: Yeah, totally.

604
00:31:52,400 --> 00:31:56,000
Speaker 5: It's all in how you sort of frame your perspective

605
00:31:56,040 --> 00:31:59,080
Speaker 5: toward it. Yeah, Like I mean, in our case, we

606
00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:03,120
Speaker 5: did need to like break up for a host of reasons,

607
00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:06,800
Speaker 5: and we did for a few years, and only recently,

608
00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:10,920
Speaker 5: in the last couple of years have we started doing

609
00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:13,560
Speaker 5: this new iteration of the band that, like I said,

610
00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:17,720
Speaker 5: is sort of in practice a side project, but we

611
00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:24,560
Speaker 5: just still call it Eve six. But yeah, you know,

612
00:32:25,760 --> 00:32:29,239
Speaker 5: we're doing it for for the right reasons. And I

613
00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:33,480
Speaker 5: think a band like Trumbawamba was always doing it for

614
00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:34,720
Speaker 5: the right reasons.

615
00:32:34,360 --> 00:32:38,120
Speaker 2: You know, yeah, yeah, And you know who else is

616
00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:41,960
Speaker 2: doing it for the right reasons. It's it's it's the Advertiser.

617
00:32:42,320 --> 00:32:45,760
Speaker 2: We're actually sponsored by this new this new act on

618
00:32:45,920 --> 00:32:50,960
Speaker 2: our ca clup Eve seven new band. It's very original.

619
00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:54,080
Speaker 4: Okay, this is interesting. I hadn't I hadn't heard of this,

620
00:32:54,600 --> 00:32:55,760
Speaker 4: hadn't heard of this group.

621
00:32:55,880 --> 00:32:59,160
Speaker 5: But my first reaction is, I don't know if this

622
00:32:59,240 --> 00:33:01,520
Speaker 5: town is big enough for two of us.

623
00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:04,360
Speaker 2: Well, they've got this hit, and you know it's the

624
00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:07,240
Speaker 2: first Advertisers is going to be this hit. It's called what.

625
00:33:07,200 --> 00:33:08,720
Speaker 4: Kind of prepositions are they working with?

626
00:33:09,240 --> 00:33:11,120
Speaker 2: You? Put a blender in my heart? I believe?

627
00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:11,360
Speaker 7: Is that?

628
00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:12,000
Speaker 4: Oh?

629
00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:17,640
Speaker 5: Okay, it's funny because five Seconds of Summer apparently just

630
00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:21,200
Speaker 5: released a song called Blender or like emotional Blender or

631
00:33:21,240 --> 00:33:22,000
Speaker 5: something like that.

632
00:33:22,440 --> 00:33:23,800
Speaker 4: I haven't listened to it yet, but.

633
00:33:24,280 --> 00:33:26,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, town's only big enough for one blender song.

634
00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:29,840
Speaker 4: That's right? Yeah, stay away from our kitchen appliance.

635
00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:32,320
Speaker 2: That is the official motto of cool Zone Media.

636
00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:32,560
Speaker 1: Is that?

637
00:33:33,280 --> 00:33:35,360
Speaker 2: Is that correct? Sophie is nodding?

638
00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:36,880
Speaker 4: Okay?

639
00:33:36,960 --> 00:33:39,640
Speaker 2: Sometimes I just say Sophie's nodding when Sophie's actually holding

640
00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:41,440
Speaker 2: up a sign that says stop doing this, you're going

641
00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:44,040
Speaker 2: to get us in trouble. But Sophie's not in this case.

642
00:33:44,120 --> 00:33:47,160
Speaker 2: She was nodding, yeah, yeah, totally. And here's some other

643
00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:50,680
Speaker 2: products and services including Eve six, I mean sorry, seven, eight,

644
00:33:50,760 --> 00:34:00,920
Speaker 2: and nine, and we are back. Okay, so up, and

645
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:02,840
Speaker 2: we were talking about the the at this point, you know,

646
00:34:02,920 --> 00:34:06,720
Speaker 2: Chumbawamba is in there. Uh, they've taken a break from

647
00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:09,359
Speaker 2: the celebrity thing. Then they then they come back at

648
00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:12,200
Speaker 2: making music and they keep at it for another fifteen years.

649
00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:14,560
Speaker 2: Tom Pumping is right in the middle of the career

650
00:34:15,040 --> 00:34:18,360
Speaker 2: of Chumbawamba as a band. They start their own label,

651
00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:20,560
Speaker 2: they work with a bunch of different indies, and they

652
00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:23,160
Speaker 2: put out a ton of music and they continue to

653
00:34:23,360 --> 00:34:27,200
Speaker 2: accidentally show up at the craziest riots in history. Wow,

654
00:34:27,239 --> 00:34:30,400
Speaker 2: what a weird coincidence. And I actually this part actually

655
00:34:30,400 --> 00:34:32,400
Speaker 2: caught me by surprise because I had kind of assumed that,

656
00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:35,800
Speaker 2: like they're in their forties, I think at this point,

657
00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:39,279
Speaker 2: and like they're doing all right, and they're still just like, oh,

658
00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:41,319
Speaker 2: there's this riot. I mean, actually it's an accident. There's

659
00:34:41,320 --> 00:34:44,600
Speaker 2: just accidentally in all these things. And I really I

660
00:34:44,640 --> 00:34:47,279
Speaker 2: really appreciate about that they're bad timing where they keep

661
00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:49,799
Speaker 2: showing it for these things and so, and they also

662
00:34:49,920 --> 00:34:53,080
Speaker 2: fund a bunch of direct actions, which I think there's

663
00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:55,960
Speaker 2: still I don't want to conjecture too hard about the

664
00:34:55,960 --> 00:34:59,719
Speaker 2: things that they fund. And a bunch of them leave

665
00:34:59,760 --> 00:35:01,400
Speaker 2: the band and in two thousand and four, And I

666
00:35:01,400 --> 00:35:02,799
Speaker 2: spent a while trying to be like, what did they

667
00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:05,160
Speaker 2: leave the band about? Right? But then I realized that

668
00:35:05,480 --> 00:35:07,279
Speaker 2: none of them were trying to talk about it. There

669
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:09,600
Speaker 2: was a little bit of like personal and political differences,

670
00:35:09,640 --> 00:35:11,440
Speaker 2: and they leave it at that, right, And.

671
00:35:13,000 --> 00:35:13,800
Speaker 4: And that's cool.

672
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:17,160
Speaker 2: It's cool that I don't know because they're just like,

673
00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:19,960
Speaker 2: their whole thing seems to be like, how do we

674
00:35:20,960 --> 00:35:23,279
Speaker 2: come close to this environment that could have made us

675
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:27,239
Speaker 2: douchebag rock stars without And so they're just like they

676
00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:30,399
Speaker 2: just worked through it, at least somewhat privately, right.

677
00:35:31,040 --> 00:35:31,239
Speaker 3: Yeah.

678
00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:35,720
Speaker 5: It sounds like they have loyalty to one another and like, yeah,

679
00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:37,719
Speaker 5: actual friendship.

680
00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:40,920
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah. And it's almost like they, you know, repaired

681
00:35:40,920 --> 00:35:42,920
Speaker 2: a house together for ten years before they went on

682
00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:45,719
Speaker 2: any of this crazy shit, you know. And and even

683
00:35:45,719 --> 00:35:47,640
Speaker 2: the people who left in two thousand and four came

684
00:35:47,680 --> 00:35:49,839
Speaker 2: back for their twenty twelve Fuck It Were Done Tour.

685
00:35:49,880 --> 00:35:51,319
Speaker 2: I don't think that was the actual name of it,

686
00:35:51,360 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 2: but it might as well have been their fuck it, We're

687
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:54,719
Speaker 2: Done tour, because they basically were like, fuck it, We're done,

688
00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:58,279
Speaker 2: and then they had a tour. And they still contribute

689
00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:01,200
Speaker 2: to each other's art to this day. They like a

690
00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:03,799
Speaker 2: bunch of them make movies and theater and music, and

691
00:36:03,960 --> 00:36:06,760
Speaker 2: you know, Baff writes books about running, Alice writes for TV.

692
00:36:08,719 --> 00:36:13,560
Speaker 2: Bruce is working on a documentary about Chumbawamba that's currently

693
00:36:13,560 --> 00:36:17,439
Speaker 2: on the the circuit where you're not allowed to watch

694
00:36:17,480 --> 00:36:18,399
Speaker 2: it unless you have a.

695
00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:20,520
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's it.

696
00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:25,560
Speaker 2: Right when they broke up, they put out a statement.

697
00:36:25,719 --> 00:36:28,400
Speaker 2: I'm a quote from it because I think they do

698
00:36:28,440 --> 00:36:30,160
Speaker 2: a good, pretty good job of summing up what they

699
00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:33,360
Speaker 2: were doing. Chumbowomba was our vehicle for pointing at the

700
00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:36,800
Speaker 2: naked emperors, for telling our version of the truth. It

701
00:36:36,880 --> 00:36:39,640
Speaker 2: gave us more than the joy and love of playing live,

702
00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:42,680
Speaker 2: writing songs and singing together. It gave us a chance

703
00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:45,320
Speaker 2: to be part of a broad coalition of activists and hectors,

704
00:36:45,360 --> 00:36:48,919
Speaker 2: optimists and questioners. But eventually the rest of our lives

705
00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:50,759
Speaker 2: got in the way and we couldn't commit the time

706
00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:53,840
Speaker 2: and enthusiasm that the band demanded, couldn't keep up with

707
00:36:53,880 --> 00:36:57,600
Speaker 2: whatever responsibilities came with a band like this. If there

708
00:36:57,640 --> 00:37:01,120
Speaker 2: were ever a Chumbawamba manifesto, it would and the inconsistent,

709
00:37:01,239 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 2: contradictory language of the dataists part strident belligerence and part foolishness.

710
00:37:06,640 --> 00:37:09,040
Speaker 2: This ending is no different. It comes almost as much

711
00:37:09,040 --> 00:37:11,120
Speaker 2: of a surprise to us as it may do to you.

712
00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:15,680
Speaker 2: Always more clown than politician, the band trips over its

713
00:37:15,719 --> 00:37:19,560
Speaker 2: outsized feet and performs its final tumble. There have been

714
00:37:19,600 --> 00:37:24,839
Speaker 2: squabbles and arguments along the way, a deal of griping, frustration, moaning, exasperation,

715
00:37:25,440 --> 00:37:28,480
Speaker 2: but always alongside a huge amount of good will and generosity,

716
00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:31,960
Speaker 2: good humor and love. What a riot it's been, frankly,

717
00:37:32,320 --> 00:37:34,120
Speaker 2: and now it's time to clear up the mess and

718
00:37:34,160 --> 00:37:38,240
Speaker 2: move on. And Dan, I'm gonna read one more quote

719
00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:40,759
Speaker 2: about from one of them about this, Dan in an

720
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:43,600
Speaker 2: interview with band Camp in twenty twenty two. This year,

721
00:37:43,640 --> 00:37:45,080
Speaker 2: I guess I can just say this year, if I'm

722
00:37:45,160 --> 00:37:48,520
Speaker 2: talking about the year I'm in, I'm very proud of

723
00:37:48,520 --> 00:37:50,800
Speaker 2: what we did. The whole way through. We tried to

724
00:37:50,840 --> 00:37:53,840
Speaker 2: push the envelope. We weren't always successful, but we always tried,

725
00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:57,680
Speaker 2: and that's probably a defining characteristic of Chumba Womba. Whatever

726
00:37:57,760 --> 00:38:00,680
Speaker 2: era or genre we tried, it always had a working

727
00:38:00,719 --> 00:38:03,200
Speaker 2: class basis, which is a whole other story. When we

728
00:38:03,239 --> 00:38:05,960
Speaker 2: signed with the major labels in the mainstream, it didn't

729
00:38:05,960 --> 00:38:09,279
Speaker 2: destroy us. You could accuse us of selling out, but

730
00:38:09,360 --> 00:38:12,240
Speaker 2: we weren't bought up, and I think that's a testament

731
00:38:12,239 --> 00:38:14,840
Speaker 2: to the way we had each other's backs. The mainstream

732
00:38:14,920 --> 00:38:18,080
Speaker 2: usually swallows people and spits them out. I mean it

733
00:38:18,160 --> 00:38:20,920
Speaker 2: did split us out, but we took it as a compliment.

734
00:38:21,000 --> 00:38:22,719
Speaker 4: Really there you go.

735
00:38:23,400 --> 00:38:24,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like what you were saying about, Like it

736
00:38:24,880 --> 00:38:27,239
Speaker 2: is just how you fucking look at it, you know.

737
00:38:28,440 --> 00:38:34,920
Speaker 8: Yep, they're like prose or you know, I don't know

738
00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:39,080
Speaker 8: if that last quotation was what you know, said to

739
00:38:39,239 --> 00:38:40,759
Speaker 8: a reporter or something like that.

740
00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:44,560
Speaker 5: But it's so beautiful and it's like better than their lyrics,

741
00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:51,239
Speaker 5: I know, their own sort of like yeah, assessment of

742
00:38:51,320 --> 00:38:57,360
Speaker 5: their story is is really deep and just like so

743
00:38:57,600 --> 00:39:01,200
Speaker 5: on point and includes.

744
00:39:00,640 --> 00:39:07,279
Speaker 7: All of the admittedly seemingly contradictory things that made made

745
00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:11,960
Speaker 7: up Shambawamba, this thing that was you know, on one level,

746
00:39:12,400 --> 00:39:19,320
Speaker 7: just like a vessel for entertainment and diversion, and on another,

747
00:39:20,280 --> 00:39:24,120
Speaker 7: you know, straight up you know activism.

748
00:39:24,320 --> 00:39:26,520
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, And it's interesting because I was thinking about

749
00:39:26,520 --> 00:39:27,960
Speaker 2: this as I was writing this out. I was like,

750
00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:29,960
Speaker 2: you know, I'm not really talking about their music, right,

751
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:32,800
Speaker 2: and like their songs, and I'm not talking about like

752
00:39:32,840 --> 00:39:36,280
Speaker 2: their instrumentation and like and all that stuff really matters,

753
00:39:36,320 --> 00:39:38,080
Speaker 2: And it clearly mattered to them because the whole time

754
00:39:38,080 --> 00:39:39,600
Speaker 2: they're always like, oh yeah, we don't have to play

755
00:39:39,600 --> 00:39:42,880
Speaker 2: our instruments. They are like musically really talented to the

756
00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:44,719
Speaker 2: point where it's like sort of almost annoying. Like their

757
00:39:44,719 --> 00:39:48,080
Speaker 2: a cappella album, I'm like, you all wrote these amazing

758
00:39:48,239 --> 00:39:51,000
Speaker 2: like multiple harmonies and like all this crazy shit, you know,

759
00:39:51,960 --> 00:39:54,400
Speaker 2: and it's about all of these things at once. It's

760
00:39:54,440 --> 00:39:55,120
Speaker 2: one of the things I've had.

761
00:39:55,160 --> 00:39:59,640
Speaker 5: Yeah, the music is an aspect of this thing that

762
00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:07,799
Speaker 5: as a whole is like yeah activist performance art. Yeah, yeah,

763
00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:09,399
Speaker 5: is really inspiring.

764
00:40:09,680 --> 00:40:09,960
Speaker 4: You know.

765
00:40:10,120 --> 00:40:15,960
Speaker 5: I mean, they they they they they did buck the system,

766
00:40:16,239 --> 00:40:20,040
Speaker 5: as as he put like, yeah, maybe they they sold.

767
00:40:19,760 --> 00:40:23,719
Speaker 4: Out, but they didn't. What's the language he used, it.

768
00:40:23,719 --> 00:40:26,040
Speaker 2: Spits them out? Oh right, But.

769
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:30,319
Speaker 4: Maybe but they weren't bought up. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, it's

770
00:40:30,320 --> 00:40:30,799
Speaker 4: really cool.

771
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:34,280
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah that it is really like this is funny

772
00:40:34,280 --> 00:40:35,320
Speaker 2: because it's like, I know, you're in a band and

773
00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:36,600
Speaker 2: I'm in a band, and I'm like, doesn't it make

774
00:40:36,640 --> 00:40:38,040
Speaker 2: you want to start a band or like makes you

775
00:40:38,080 --> 00:40:40,680
Speaker 2: want to like be in a band, you know, like yeah, yeah,

776
00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:44,560
Speaker 2: I'm writing right now. I've been in a bunch of

777
00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:46,920
Speaker 2: bands that have done various things, and right now I

778
00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:49,400
Speaker 2: like signed to my first indie label with my metal

779
00:40:49,440 --> 00:40:52,680
Speaker 2: band Cool and we have an album do soon, right

780
00:40:52,719 --> 00:40:54,640
Speaker 2: and it's our It'll be our second full length of

781
00:40:54,680 --> 00:40:57,600
Speaker 2: the band. And I'm like, oh, I should really care

782
00:40:57,680 --> 00:40:59,520
Speaker 2: about that, you know, in a way where I'm like,

783
00:40:59,760 --> 00:41:01,120
Speaker 2: I care about it and I've been working with this

784
00:41:01,160 --> 00:41:05,440
Speaker 2: band for years, but I'm like, I don't know it. No,

785
00:41:05,560 --> 00:41:10,200
Speaker 2: it's inspiring, yeah it it uh, you know, trains your

786
00:41:10,680 --> 00:41:15,440
Speaker 2: your eyes back on like what's important? Fun, joyful?

787
00:41:15,640 --> 00:41:21,719
Speaker 5: Yeah about about a project and you know, exposes all

788
00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:24,640
Speaker 5: the things that aren't, all the metrics that are seemingly

789
00:41:24,680 --> 00:41:28,320
Speaker 5: important and that matter, and all of that shit which.

790
00:41:29,640 --> 00:41:33,520
Speaker 2: Don't ultimately yeah yeah, and the way in which they

791
00:41:33,560 --> 00:41:35,319
Speaker 2: matter is the vehicle with which to do it, like

792
00:41:35,800 --> 00:41:39,640
Speaker 2: the thing that, you know, getting the money to make

793
00:41:39,719 --> 00:41:42,279
Speaker 2: the music allows them to make the music. That is

794
00:41:42,320 --> 00:41:45,279
Speaker 2: the the part of that that matters, you know. It's

795
00:41:45,320 --> 00:41:49,000
Speaker 2: just the ability to continue to allow to continue to happen, Right,

796
00:41:49,080 --> 00:41:49,799
Speaker 2: That's the end.

797
00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:55,840
Speaker 5: It's not it's not you know, to make yourself obscenely

798
00:41:55,920 --> 00:42:00,920
Speaker 5: wealthy or you know, fame or whatever whatever else. It's like,

799
00:42:01,040 --> 00:42:06,560
Speaker 5: how that in their case, how that served their project.

800
00:42:06,680 --> 00:42:10,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, totally, and both as individuals and as activists and

801
00:42:10,000 --> 00:42:13,000
Speaker 2: as artists, like the music that they make, how it

802
00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:14,319
Speaker 2: matters for its own sake and.

803
00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:15,279
Speaker 4: Like mm hmm.

804
00:42:15,560 --> 00:42:18,759
Speaker 2: And so they actually they released one album after they

805
00:42:18,840 --> 00:42:22,400
Speaker 2: broke up, because the very last release came in twenty thirteen,

806
00:42:22,560 --> 00:42:24,680
Speaker 2: the year after they broke up, and because in two

807
00:42:24,719 --> 00:42:28,680
Speaker 2: thousand and five they recorded an EP called in Memoria

808
00:42:28,840 --> 00:42:33,320
Speaker 2: Margaret Thatcher, and they were like, this would be released

809
00:42:33,480 --> 00:42:38,160
Speaker 2: when Margaret Thatcher dies, And so in twenty thirteen, Margaret

810
00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:40,640
Speaker 2: Thatcher did that did the world that that favor and

811
00:42:40,719 --> 00:42:43,720
Speaker 2: went ahead and died, and the EP came out along

812
00:42:43,760 --> 00:42:46,520
Speaker 2: with a statement, our deepest sympathies go out to the

813
00:42:46,520 --> 00:42:49,520
Speaker 2: families of all Margaret Thatcher's victims and it's a very

814
00:42:49,520 --> 00:42:50,960
Speaker 2: happy little album.

815
00:42:51,880 --> 00:42:52,520
Speaker 4: It's amazing.

816
00:42:52,680 --> 00:42:55,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, and so okay, so this is and so thanks

817
00:42:55,719 --> 00:42:58,240
Speaker 2: for coming along with my episode that I totally didn't

818
00:42:58,239 --> 00:42:59,920
Speaker 2: write in order to get myself off the hook for

819
00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:03,000
Speaker 2: taking corporate money Giant Faceless Corporation to run a podcast

820
00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:05,680
Speaker 2: about radical history. Now you all know my secret reason

821
00:43:05,719 --> 00:43:10,120
Speaker 2: we're telling you about Umble them. But but I I look,

822
00:43:10,160 --> 00:43:11,480
Speaker 2: I think the analogy works.

823
00:43:11,600 --> 00:43:15,080
Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, yeah, I think I think they might

824
00:43:15,239 --> 00:43:18,320
Speaker 5: you know, tip their their bowlers.

825
00:43:18,719 --> 00:43:23,439
Speaker 2: I hope. So if you're listening Jumble one. But yeah,

826
00:43:24,040 --> 00:43:27,720
Speaker 2: all right, well well uh yeah, what what can people

827
00:43:27,840 --> 00:43:29,879
Speaker 2: you say? You're in a band? What what is that band?

828
00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:32,319
Speaker 2: What do you you're the the band that ripped off

829
00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:32,880
Speaker 2: Eve seven?

830
00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:39,000
Speaker 5: I think, right, yeah, Look, there's there's a bunch of

831
00:43:39,360 --> 00:43:44,960
Speaker 5: you know, vicious like rumors going out going around that

832
00:43:45,760 --> 00:43:49,879
Speaker 5: I have no footpold in the truth. Eve six came

833
00:43:50,200 --> 00:43:54,799
Speaker 5: before Eve seven, and Eve seven has been like, you know,

834
00:43:54,880 --> 00:44:00,520
Speaker 5: biting our vibe, you know, agreed egregiously and and and

835
00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:02,560
Speaker 5: you know, anyone who's got.

836
00:44:02,360 --> 00:44:05,360
Speaker 4: Their ear to the ground Margaret has.

837
00:44:05,320 --> 00:44:11,760
Speaker 2: Heard of Eve six, this quiet band that yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, okay,

838
00:44:11,800 --> 00:44:14,560
Speaker 2: And it does chronologically, six does come before you?

839
00:44:14,600 --> 00:44:17,000
Speaker 4: Could you could use that that six comes before seven?

840
00:44:17,080 --> 00:44:20,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I actually here it's afraid of

841
00:44:20,719 --> 00:44:22,640
Speaker 2: seven because seven eight.

842
00:44:22,640 --> 00:44:27,760
Speaker 4: Nine, that's right. See, And that's that too, is true.

843
00:44:28,480 --> 00:44:29,640
Speaker 2: That was despicable.

844
00:44:34,239 --> 00:44:37,839
Speaker 1: If the lizards could only see how happy she was

845
00:44:37,960 --> 00:44:41,720
Speaker 1: while making that terrible joke, they would.

846
00:44:41,600 --> 00:44:44,640
Speaker 5: Be they would be truly dismayed.

847
00:44:44,719 --> 00:44:47,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, truly the worst. I lost all of my my

848
00:44:47,800 --> 00:44:50,200
Speaker 2: goth points went out the river river.

849
00:44:51,160 --> 00:44:53,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, down the river.

850
00:44:54,080 --> 00:44:56,239
Speaker 2: Yeah.

851
00:44:56,320 --> 00:44:56,600
Speaker 4: Okay.

852
00:44:56,640 --> 00:44:59,200
Speaker 2: Well yeah, so so what a what do you have

853
00:44:59,239 --> 00:45:01,480
Speaker 2: going on? You play or like, how can people check

854
00:45:01,520 --> 00:45:03,480
Speaker 2: it out? Maybe you have a new album out coming out?

855
00:45:03,520 --> 00:45:05,359
Speaker 2: Maybe it's even out by the time people listen, because

856
00:45:05,360 --> 00:45:07,400
Speaker 2: this will come out about a month after we record it.

857
00:45:08,320 --> 00:45:09,719
Speaker 4: Yeah it might be.

858
00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:12,040
Speaker 5: I have I have no idea when our album comes out,

859
00:45:12,080 --> 00:45:14,880
Speaker 5: but I know it comes out in like a few weeks.

860
00:45:14,960 --> 00:45:16,040
Speaker 4: I think I should know this.

861
00:45:16,320 --> 00:45:21,319
Speaker 5: But it's called hyper relevisation. If you follow us on

862
00:45:21,560 --> 00:45:24,799
Speaker 5: Twitter at Eve six, you'll you'll hear about all of

863
00:45:24,840 --> 00:45:25,520
Speaker 5: that stuff.

864
00:45:25,760 --> 00:45:27,680
Speaker 2: That's the only thing you talked about on Twitter, as

865
00:45:27,719 --> 00:45:28,600
Speaker 2: I recall.

866
00:45:29,160 --> 00:45:32,040
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's that's that's all I talk about on Twitter

867
00:45:32,160 --> 00:45:35,839
Speaker 5: is just uh, just you know, we just do band

868
00:45:35,880 --> 00:45:39,880
Speaker 5: promo on there. It's a very typical nineties band account

869
00:45:39,880 --> 00:45:44,319
Speaker 5: where we just like post photos of ourselves with with

870
00:45:44,440 --> 00:45:48,360
Speaker 5: wallet chains, you know, doing the devil horns and saying

871
00:45:48,960 --> 00:45:53,239
Speaker 5: come out to our show, the rib Fest, you know

872
00:45:53,480 --> 00:45:54,520
Speaker 5: in Tulsa.

873
00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:56,879
Speaker 4: That's that's what. That's the kind of content that you're

874
00:45:56,880 --> 00:45:58,800
Speaker 4: going to find at our on our Twitter.

875
00:45:58,880 --> 00:46:04,480
Speaker 2: Okay, cool? Do you still have the pants which are

876
00:46:04,520 --> 00:46:06,120
Speaker 2: the ones that you cut slits in the side to

877
00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:06,840
Speaker 2: make wider so you.

878
00:46:09,320 --> 00:46:16,319
Speaker 4: No, I wish I can't changed, I know, I know. Yeah,

879
00:46:16,360 --> 00:46:17,840
Speaker 4: those were so cool.

880
00:46:17,880 --> 00:46:21,080
Speaker 5: Like when I see pictures of us from from back

881
00:46:21,120 --> 00:46:22,880
Speaker 5: in the day, it's just really funny because none of

882
00:46:22,960 --> 00:46:23,600
Speaker 5: us have feet.

883
00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:27,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, I used to. I used to chain when my

884
00:46:27,440 --> 00:46:29,200
Speaker 2: when my pants would rip down the side, I would

885
00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:32,960
Speaker 2: chain the hole between the two sides of it, make

886
00:46:33,120 --> 00:46:33,520
Speaker 2: chain men.

887
00:46:36,000 --> 00:46:38,160
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's pretty tough, pretty tough.

888
00:46:38,239 --> 00:46:40,239
Speaker 2: Yeah that's what people saw. I saw me coming and

889
00:46:40,280 --> 00:46:43,160
Speaker 2: we're like, well that girl's tough. That is absolutely the

890
00:46:43,280 --> 00:46:46,520
Speaker 2: vibe I managed to communicate when I was a goth

891
00:46:46,560 --> 00:46:53,800
Speaker 2: girl didn't know she was a girl in the nineties. Yeah, okay, Well, Sophie,

892
00:46:53,840 --> 00:46:56,880
Speaker 2: do you have anything you'd like to plug just at.

893
00:46:56,760 --> 00:46:59,920
Speaker 1: Cools on media on Twitter and Instagram for all things Margaret.

894
00:47:00,120 --> 00:47:01,680
Speaker 1: And you have a book coming out.

895
00:47:01,480 --> 00:47:04,560
Speaker 2: Correct, I do, but I should pitch my band. I

896
00:47:04,680 --> 00:47:08,759
Speaker 2: have a band called Feminage School where a feminist, atmospheric

897
00:47:08,800 --> 00:47:13,400
Speaker 2: black metal band. And we have a bunch of different releases,

898
00:47:13,480 --> 00:47:16,239
Speaker 2: mostly on band camp or through various labels. And then

899
00:47:16,280 --> 00:47:19,160
Speaker 2: also eventually we'll have a full length again, we already

900
00:47:19,200 --> 00:47:22,200
Speaker 2: have one, but it's not up for pre order right now.

901
00:47:22,280 --> 00:47:24,839
Speaker 2: Unlike my book We Won't be Here Tomorrow, in which

902
00:47:24,880 --> 00:47:26,960
Speaker 2: I name every short story things that sound like they

903
00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:30,160
Speaker 2: would be black metal album titles like The Devil Lives

904
00:47:30,200 --> 00:47:35,360
Speaker 2: Here and Into the Gray and you know, very dramatic

905
00:47:35,440 --> 00:47:40,000
Speaker 2: things a very dramatic person. And that is okay. So

906
00:47:40,040 --> 00:47:41,520
Speaker 2: my book is available for pre order. You can get

907
00:47:41,560 --> 00:47:44,319
Speaker 2: at Akpress and if you get it, you get a

908
00:47:44,320 --> 00:47:48,839
Speaker 2: little postcard of art. That is nice part. We love that.

909
00:47:49,840 --> 00:47:51,600
Speaker 1: And we'll be back what next week?

910
00:47:51,680 --> 00:47:57,560
Speaker 2: Monday, I believe so cool every Monday and Wednesday. Great,

911
00:47:57,600 --> 00:48:00,719
Speaker 2: I'll see you there, all right, Thank.

912
00:48:00,480 --> 00:48:02,080
Speaker 4: You both so much for having me on. This has

913
00:48:02,120 --> 00:48:02,719
Speaker 4: been really fun.

914
00:48:02,960 --> 00:48:03,239
Speaker 2: Thank you.

915
00:48:09,040 --> 00:48:11,520
Speaker 1: Cool people who did Cool Stuff is a production of

916
00:48:11,600 --> 00:48:14,680
Speaker 1: cool Zone Media. For more podcasts on cool zone Media,

917
00:48:14,840 --> 00:48:18,080
Speaker 1: visit our website coolzonmedia dot com, or check us out

918
00:48:18,160 --> 00:48:21,560
Speaker 1: on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get

919
00:48:21,600 --> 00:48:22,880
Speaker 1: your podcasts.