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Speaker 1: You're listening to the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast DAM

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Speaker 1: Paranormal podcast network, where we offer you podcasts of the paranormal, supernatural,

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Speaker 1: and the unexplained. Get ready now for Beyond Contact with

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Speaker 1: Captain Wrong.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to our podcast. Please be aware the thoughts and

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Speaker 2: opinions expressed by the host are their thoughts and opinions

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Speaker 2: only and do not reflect those of iHeartMedia, iHeartRadio, Coast

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Speaker 2: to Coast AM, employees of premier networks, or their sponsors

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Speaker 2: and associates. We would like to encourage you to do

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Speaker 2: your own research and discover the subject matter for yourself.

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Speaker 3: Hey everyone, it's Captain Ron and Each week on Beyond Contact,

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Speaker 3: we'll explore the latest news in ufology, discuss some of

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Speaker 3: the classic cases, and bring you the latest information from

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Speaker 3: the newest cases as we talk with the top experts.

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Speaker 4: Welcome to Beyond Contact. I am Captain Ronod. Today I

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Speaker 4: am joined by Travis Walton. Travis, of course, is one

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Speaker 4: of the most well known, well documented and studied abduction

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Speaker 4: cases that we have. We are also joined by Jennifer Stein,

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Speaker 4: who is a moof on leader and the co writer,

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Speaker 4: executive producer and director of Travis The True Story of

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Speaker 4: Travis Walton, which is a really well done documentary about

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Speaker 4: the events that happened to Travis back in nineteen seventy five.

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Speaker 4: The regular listeners to this show will know how I

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Speaker 4: feel about Travis, that he is one of the most

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Speaker 4: credible cases that we have, and I always so appreciate

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Speaker 4: his willingness to share the details of his account with us.

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Speaker 4: It's an honor to have both of these people with

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Speaker 4: me here today. Welcome guys, How you doing good?

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Speaker 5: Seeing you great to be here.

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Speaker 4: You know, I was just thinking the last time the

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Speaker 4: three of us got together on something like this anyway,

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Speaker 4: I mean, we saw Travis at Contact and you at Contact, Jen,

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Speaker 4: But the last time we did it on Zoom like

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Speaker 4: this was when we did that thing back in November

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Speaker 4: sixth of twenty twenty one, we did a full day

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Speaker 4: celebration of the forty sixth anniversary of Travis's incident on

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Speaker 4: the Observation Deck, and here we are getting ready for

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Speaker 4: the fiftieth anniversary.

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Speaker 5: You guys remember that day, crazy, absolutely crazy.

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Speaker 4: And we were able to get Travis's brother Don, who

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Speaker 4: hadn't spoken to in a while, and we had Mike

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Speaker 4: Rogers and John Gillette and Steve Pierce, the crew guys.

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Speaker 5: Were all there, remember, and Lee Spiegele.

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Speaker 4: Lee Spiegel was there, and Ray Jordan from Apro the

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Speaker 4: Investigator was there. It was incredible. I think we had

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Speaker 4: a total of fifteen speakers that were involved directly with

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Speaker 4: the case. It was really a special day for me

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Speaker 4: and I was thrilled to be involved with it.

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Speaker 5: Peter Robinson, Riche Dolan too.

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Speaker 4: Absolutely, you know, that was really great. And we all

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Speaker 4: know Travis's story, so I'm not going to make him

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Speaker 4: go through it for a ten thousandth time time. If

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Speaker 4: you don't know all the details, please go to a

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Speaker 4: contact in the Desert YouTube page and I'm going to

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Speaker 4: post that Travis account on there that we gave that

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Speaker 4: day on the forty sixth anniversary. It's truly incredible to

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Speaker 4: hear directly from him, you know, you guys. Just last

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Speaker 4: week I was asked my mom, Hey, how long ago

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Speaker 4: did dad pass away? And it's been seven almost eight

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Speaker 4: years is what she said. I think it's been seven,

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Speaker 4: maybe eight, it's actually been over thirteen and that shocked her.

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Speaker 4: And it's funny how we perceive time. So Travis, I

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Speaker 4: wanted to ask you you had such a unique traumatic experience.

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Speaker 4: Does it feel like it's been fifty years to you?

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Speaker 6: Yeah, it's amazing to think it's nearly half a century.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, it's incredible. Does it feel like it felt like

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Speaker 4: maybe like it's more recent than that, or does it

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Speaker 4: feel like it was your whole life?

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Speaker 6: Well, it does seem more recent than that. You know,

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Speaker 6: it's something that it's always fresh in my mind.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, you able to go about your day to day

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Speaker 4: life or do these memories frequently? And do you work

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Speaker 4: at that?

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Speaker 6: I just try to have a normal wife and don't

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Speaker 6: let it take over.

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Speaker 5: Poor Travis does radio shows on this subject all the time,

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Speaker 5: so he's constantly reminded because we're doing radio shows. Of course,

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Speaker 5: we have the upcoming conference, so he's automatically reminded of it,

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Speaker 5: whether he'd like to be or not.

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Speaker 6: Oh, I definitely worked going about my day to day life.

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Speaker 6: I definitely try not to think about it all the time.

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Speaker 4: Sure, Jennifer. When did you meet Travis?

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Speaker 5: I had the pleasure of meeting Travis in twenty ten

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Speaker 5: when I worked with Peter Robbins and I ran the

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Speaker 5: Rothweld conference as his assistant. He was a little overwhelmed

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Speaker 5: that year, and I was a good friend always Peter,

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Speaker 5: so I said, I'll come in and help you. And

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Speaker 5: little did I know we'd have dinner with Travis and

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Speaker 5: Ruben U, DRT and a couple of other people, and

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Speaker 5: we were sitting around talking and saying, you know, we

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Speaker 5: said to Travis, your event is just as significant as

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Speaker 5: the Rosweald case. And I talked him into doing a

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Speaker 5: conference and then that led to the film. And you

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Speaker 5: know that was twelve years ago.

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Speaker 4: Now, yeah, your documentary came out I think at twenty fifteen,

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Speaker 4: is that right?

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Speaker 5: Yes, it did that. We were shooting for the fortieth anniversary.

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Speaker 5: So the first version of it came out in twenty fifteen.

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Speaker 5: Then we had a rights issue with some footage, so

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Speaker 5: we remade it after it was started to win awards

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Speaker 5: and I didn't have full rights. I thought I did,

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Speaker 5: but I had to remake it to then like put

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Speaker 5: it on film Hub or you know, get it out

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Speaker 5: on Amazon Prime and things like that. To work with

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Speaker 5: a distributor, I needed to have signed off film rights

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Speaker 5: and I didn't have them on some of the archive

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Speaker 5: footage gotcha.

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Speaker 4: So we you know, we have the ten year anniversary

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Speaker 4: of that release of the documentary and the fifty year

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Speaker 4: anniversary of the incident itself. Does it feel like ten

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Speaker 4: years ago to you? No?

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Speaker 5: Oh no, but a lot's happened in ten years, so yeah,

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Speaker 5: I mean I can look back on it and go, wow,

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Speaker 5: you know, we've had disclosure in the last ten years. Really,

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Speaker 5: you know, in twenty fifteen we had not, but twenty

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Speaker 5: sixteen we did seventeen.

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Speaker 4: Well, seventeen, yeah, I say seventeen certainly was that watershed moment, which,

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Speaker 4: interestingly enough, you did this documentary two years before that,

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Speaker 4: so it's all fun to put this stuff in that perspective. Hey, Travis,

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Speaker 4: we had you back at Contact in the Desert a

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Speaker 4: year ago, which was wonderful. You are part of our

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Speaker 4: Legends panel, as you certainly are a legend to all

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Speaker 4: of us in our community. Your courage to share this story,

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Speaker 4: even in the face of people who ridiculed your account

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Speaker 4: and the topic itself, is very impressive. I've spoke to

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Speaker 4: a lot of people about this, and I wonder how

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Speaker 4: it's been for you over the years. I mean we're

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Speaker 4: talking now back in nineteen seventy five, when it was

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Speaker 4: a completely different world, certainly before the twenty seventeen thing

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Speaker 4: Jun just brought up. Have you noticed a change attitudes

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Speaker 4: towards you, towards your story or the topic in general

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Speaker 4: over these years.

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Speaker 6: You know, people who are skeptical or doubting don't express

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Speaker 6: it now. I just don't get that anymore. I guess

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Speaker 6: there's probably a plenty of people who have their doubts,

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Speaker 6: but they just don't come forward with it.

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Speaker 4: Does anyone ever come back to you now and maybe

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Speaker 4: apologize for the way they first thought of your story?

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Speaker 6: Well, not apologize, but people say I used to doubt,

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Speaker 6: but now I don't. I mean, they'll say it that way.

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Speaker 4: It's great. I feel that stories like yours and Whitley's

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Speaker 4: and some of these other accounts that you know, Whitley's

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Speaker 4: book came out in the early eighties. Yours is in

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Speaker 4: the seventies. You know, back then a lot of people

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Speaker 4: were very skeptical, of course, and Whitley, particularly because he

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Speaker 4: was a science fiction writer. They're just like, while he's

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Speaker 4: making it up here we are fifty years later for

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Speaker 4: both of you, gentlemen, and both of you guys, as

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Speaker 4: well as some other famous cases, have stuck to these accounts.

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Speaker 4: And I feel like It brings even more credibility to

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Speaker 4: it that you've lived your whole life with this, You've

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Speaker 4: stuck to this story, and I feel like it needs

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Speaker 4: to be taken serious now. I mean, at this point,

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Speaker 4: it's been fifty years, these guys are sticking to it.

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Speaker 4: Can we please finally believe them? How do you feel

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Speaker 4: about how people should respond to these kind of cases.

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Speaker 6: The key to that is the whole reason that they

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Speaker 6: continue to be seen. I don't feel that it's an accident.

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Speaker 6: I feel that these beings are allowing the glimpse as

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Speaker 6: a sort of the conditioning process. I think that if

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Speaker 6: they wanted to, they could do everything they're doing here

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Speaker 6: and remain completely undetected. It's not an accident. I use

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Speaker 6: the analogy of them slapping their ruins that ah ah,

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Speaker 6: humans spotted me again. I guess I'd better be more

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Speaker 6: careful next time.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, tongue in cheek.

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Speaker 6: I think when you catch a glimpse of them, then

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Speaker 6: it's no accident, right.

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Speaker 4: It seems like if they're that far technologically ahead of us,

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Speaker 4: if they wanted to remain completely clandestine, they would indeed

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Speaker 4: do so. Correct Yeah, Yeah, I think so too. Is

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Speaker 4: that your feeling too, Jen.

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Speaker 5: Oh, absolutely, yes, And I've been lucky enough. I've had

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Speaker 5: a couple of sightings, but I'm lucky. I haven't had

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Speaker 5: anything like Travis has had happen. But yes, it's exhilarating

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Speaker 5: and your life is forever changed once you've had a sighting.

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Speaker 5: I mean, some people get pretty freaked out, and I

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Speaker 5: think I was when I first had a sighting myself

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Speaker 5: in nineteen seventy five, actually before Travis's event.

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Speaker 4: A sighting is one thing I think I could handle.

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Speaker 4: A sighting. I think with Travis and some of these

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Speaker 4: people have experienced as a whole other level that I

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Speaker 4: can't even imagine. Your immediately, your world has turned upside down.

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Speaker 5: I couldn't have done nearly as well as Travis had

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Speaker 5: if I'd experienced what he had, I don't think I

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Speaker 5: could have.

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Speaker 4: It's pretty remarkable that he overcame that and here we

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Speaker 4: are today talking about it, what happened fifty years ago,

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Speaker 4: on what an impact it had, you know, on humanity,

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Speaker 4: even not just in our community.

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Speaker 5: That's really why I want Travis to be honored. We

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Speaker 5: have to mark these occasions. We marked the fortieth and

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Speaker 5: I feel a duty to mark the fiftieth. I think

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Speaker 5: it's very important.

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Speaker 4: I do too too. I do too, And obviously I

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Speaker 4: think the courage that Travis has shown, you know, I

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Speaker 4: think a lot of people wouldn't have done that, or

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Speaker 4: would have crawled away in a cave and never talked about.

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Speaker 4: So we in the community, once again, Travis, appreciate that

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Speaker 4: you've shared your story so openly with us over the years,

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Speaker 4: because it gives us something to get closer to the

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Speaker 4: truth of what's going on. We're going to take a

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Speaker 4: quick break here and come right back and pick it

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Speaker 4: up with Travis and Jen. You're listening to Beyond Contact

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Speaker 4: on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal podcast network.

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Speaker 4: We're back and Beyond Contact. We're speaking with Travis Walton

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Speaker 4: and Jennifer Stein. Jen. Are there aspects of the Travis

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Speaker 4: Walton case that are maybe newer or perhaps is there

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Speaker 4: something that people just didn't realize about this case or

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Speaker 4: has been misunderstood, like, for example, in addition to the

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Speaker 4: crew seeing the craft, there was that hunter and his wife.

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Speaker 4: Are there other things like that that people may not

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Speaker 4: know about.

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Speaker 5: People still like to deny things, So I think the

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Speaker 5: thing that continues to amaze me is there are lots

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Speaker 5: of new debunkers out there that still go after this

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Speaker 5: case and they dig up the old Philip class files

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Speaker 5: and they say, see Philip new is talking about and

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Speaker 5: Travis made it all up. And I'm just amazed that

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Speaker 5: people buy their stories hook line and sinker. You know that.

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Speaker 5: So to me, that's new because it continues to go

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Speaker 5: on and on, and it's really a shame because when

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Speaker 5: you really evaluate the pieces of the story, you see

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Speaker 5: that it's impossible that it could be a fire tower,

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Speaker 5: and this is one of those things they still come

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Speaker 5: up with. No that these working crew boys saw a

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Speaker 5: fire tower. Well, they drove past fire towers all the time.

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Speaker 5: They were freaking bloggers.

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Speaker 4: Oh listen, I've studied this really thoroughly, and it's it's ludicrous.

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Speaker 4: I mean, I'm very skeptical of a lot of the

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Speaker 4: cases out there and things, but this just doesn't even

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Speaker 4: make sense.

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Speaker 6: It doesn't have to make sense. All it has to

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Speaker 6: do is satisfy their desire to explain it away. You know,

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Speaker 6: I was making list the other day. Some of these

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Speaker 6: explanations were so they don't in any way resemble the descriptions,

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Speaker 6: but its satisfies the people who want to explained the

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Speaker 6: way ball lightning a new planet at Jupiter.

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Speaker 4: You almost touched it. Oh it's the planet Jupiter. I mean,

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Speaker 4: that's just ludicrous.

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Speaker 5: But it was Jupiter, right right, Ka Yeah, yeah, So

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Speaker 5: I guess the only newest thing maybe that Travis and

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Speaker 5: I recently discovered in twenty fourteen. You know that we

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Speaker 5: discovered rapid tree ring that was epicentric, and that was

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Speaker 5: a little bit new. We did know already from Mike

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Speaker 5: Rogers that and Travis themselves that the forest where it

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Speaker 5: had happened suddenly seemed to be larger. When they went

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Speaker 5: back with film crews, they had harder and harder time

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Speaker 5: finding the place because the trees were so much larger

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Speaker 5: than they were in the surrounding forest. So they knew

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Speaker 5: there was rapid tree growth. But when Ben Hansen and

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Speaker 5: Travis and I were filming for this film that I made,

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Speaker 5: we discovered the epicentricness of about twelve different or maybe

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Speaker 5: it was only eight different stumps that were there. There

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Speaker 5: had been a big fire in two thousand and three,

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Speaker 5: I believe, called the Radio Chetta sci fire maybe it

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Speaker 5: was two thousand and six, and it burnt a large

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Speaker 5: part of this hill where the event had taken place.

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Speaker 5: So there was new rapid growth coming up along, you know,

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Speaker 5: in the area, kind of concealing it, making it harder.

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Speaker 5: But they cut the big trees and just let them

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Speaker 5: lay right there on the hill. So walking around with

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Speaker 5: Ben Hansen and Travis and I, we realized, oh my god,

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Speaker 5: all these tabletop stumps, you know, were about waist high,

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Speaker 5: and we could look at them and we could see

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Speaker 5: that the rapid growth pointed right where the craft had

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Speaker 5: been and not on the opposite side. So every single

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Speaker 5: tree in that circle, in that vicinity grew differently towards

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Speaker 5: where the epicentric of the craft had been. Now that's

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Speaker 5: also where the sunlight was because a large tree had

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Speaker 5: been cut the year before that created the hole in

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Speaker 5: the canopy.

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Speaker 6: Well, in the case of the tree rings, there's always

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Speaker 6: only one ring per year, no matter what the thickness

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Speaker 6: of the ring. It reflects the vigor that the tree

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Speaker 6: grew with, so it'll be a thicker ring, but not

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Speaker 6: more rings per year.

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Speaker 5: So we did some research and trees will grow an

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Speaker 5: extra ten percent more with increased sunlight. So if you

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Speaker 5: have a big tree that you're taking down. Trees will

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Speaker 5: grow more, and they'll grow maybe more on that side,

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Speaker 5: but not thirty six times.

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Speaker 4: It's traumatic. I've seen those photographs from Ben and you,

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Speaker 4: and it's incredible that all of the trees on that

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Speaker 4: exact facing side, yet it's normal growth everywhere else. So

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Speaker 4: that is some compelling evidence.

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Speaker 5: And that tree grew because it was rapid and it's

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Speaker 5: also it's both directions of the tree growth, so it's

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Speaker 5: the simple fabric term would be wharf and wept, but

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Speaker 5: they have different names when it's tree pulp. It's like

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Speaker 5: xcelm and x flem or something. I don't know the term.

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Speaker 5: I'm not a dendrologist. But wherever that rapid growth happened,

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Speaker 5: the tree doesn't rot. That's another really interesting thing. So

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Speaker 5: you had the outer edge after fifteen years, it settles down.

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Speaker 5: It's only rapid growth for fifteen years as well. That's

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Speaker 5: another important fact to remember, so we could see it.

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Speaker 5: But what we discovered in twenty sixteen when we went

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Speaker 5: back there with a new young filmmaker out of Phoenix

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Speaker 5: who's doing a little special about Travis. It'll probably be

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Speaker 5: out in September. His name is Patrick James. We discovered

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Speaker 5: that someone went and burnt those tree stumps, no way,

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Speaker 5: some on fire and hatchet to them. We can still

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Speaker 5: see them because we know what they are. But I

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Speaker 5: think I don't know if it was Ryan Gordon or not,

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Speaker 5: but he's the one who was up there debunking the

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Speaker 5: case in twenty twenty one, and it looks like they

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Speaker 5: have been destroyed. So he must have found them. He

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Speaker 5: must have found them and wanted to destroy them, because

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Speaker 5: he debunked that subject in his podcast with Erica Luke's

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Speaker 5: several well.

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Speaker 4: He debunked it in his own head because I don't

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Speaker 4: think many of us believe that. I think a lot

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Speaker 4: of us do believe and agree with Trevor's looking back.

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Speaker 4: You know, nearly fifty years now, Travis, has your interpretation

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Speaker 4: of what happened to you changed over that fifty year

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Speaker 4: time span.

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Speaker 6: Well, definitely. You know, initially I just took it as

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Speaker 6: an attack on myself, that I had somehow elicited some

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Speaker 6: hostility and that they had fired a weapon at me.

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Speaker 6: But you know, I accepted the term abduction. But you know,

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Speaker 6: understand what happened. I realized that it was my mistake

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Speaker 6: of getting so close that triggered the discharge of this energy,

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Speaker 6: that it was that injury that led them to take

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Speaker 6: me aboard because they were the only ones who could

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Speaker 6: repair that kind of damage.

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Speaker 4: Right, So it was in fact a rescue mission rather

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Speaker 4: than an abduction in your view. Interesting, Travis, When this

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Speaker 4: first happened to you, you are obviously taken aback and

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Speaker 4: utterly shocked by what you're seeing, of course, But now

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Speaker 4: that we're fifty years later and you've had a chance

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Speaker 4: to digest it and live with it and learn about

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Speaker 4: what others have said about this phenomenon. If you had

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Speaker 4: a second encounter like this, Number one, would you want

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Speaker 4: to have another encounter? And number two, what would you

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Speaker 4: ask them today?

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Speaker 6: I would like to think that I would remain calm

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Speaker 6: and make the most of it. But I did have

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Speaker 6: a siding where I had the option of stopping and

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Speaker 6: taking a closer look, and I surprised myself that I

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Speaker 6: was reluctant to do that. Interesting, But yeah, I would

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Speaker 6: like to think that I would make the most of

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Speaker 6: the contact. And I get some questions answered, not necessarily

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Speaker 6: that I would go public with them, but you know,

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Speaker 6: satisfy my own desire to know you.

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Speaker 4: Have anything you'd share here? That you'd like to know that,

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Speaker 4: you would ask them.

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Speaker 6: Sorts of things, but you know, some of the things

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Speaker 6: that I think I figured out, it'd be nice to

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Speaker 6: have them confirm it, But I'm so sure of it

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Speaker 6: that that's not really necessary. I really do think that

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Speaker 6: it was an accident.

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Speaker 4: I understand that. All Right, let's take a quick break here.

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Speaker 4: When we come back, we're going to continue this conversation

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Speaker 4: with Travis and Jennifer and delve into some of the

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Speaker 4: possibilities that life exists in our universe. You're listening to

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Speaker 4: Beyond Contact on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM

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Speaker 4: Paranormal Podcast Network. We are back on Beyond Contact on

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Speaker 4: the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.

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Speaker 4: We're talking with Travis Walton and Jennifer Stein. Travis, one

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Speaker 4: of the things I find fascinating about your case, taking

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Speaker 4: place way back in nineteen seventy five is just how

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Speaker 4: much science has grown over that fifty years. For example,

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Speaker 4: it wasn't until nineteen ninety two, nearly twenty years after

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Speaker 4: your encounter, that science even discovered its very first exoplanet.

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Speaker 4: Up until then, we widely believe that there were no

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Speaker 4: planets anywhere, and today we now believe that for every

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Speaker 4: single star in the sky, there's one point six planets.

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Speaker 4: Are your thoughts on this.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, that's there's something called the Drake equation, and the

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Speaker 6: numbers that they plugged into the Drake equation were far

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Speaker 6: far lower back before they got this actual the ability

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Speaker 6: to detect the presence of planets going around stars at

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Speaker 6: great distances. They're far too tiny to actually see. What

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Speaker 6: happens is there's a diming of the light from that

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Speaker 6: star at uniform intervals, which is the planet passing between

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Speaker 6: the star and us cutting out that amount of light.

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Speaker 6: And the only thing that would make that diming uniform

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Speaker 6: like that at intervals is the planet eclipsing some of

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Speaker 6: the starlight. So it raised the number of potential planets

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Speaker 6: exponentially from what it was before that.

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Speaker 4: You know. Another one was in nineteen seventy five, science

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Speaker 4: believed that there were somewhere between one hundred and two

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Speaker 4: hundred galaxies in the known universe. Today we think it's

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Speaker 4: around two hundred trillion galaxies, which is quite a difference.

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Speaker 4: People don't realize that in fifty years we've expanded the

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Speaker 4: size of our universe exponentially. They also believe that there

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Speaker 4: are somewhere between two hundred billion and four hundred billion

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Speaker 4: stars in our galaxy alone. So Travis, you start doing

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Speaker 4: some of this math, you got two hundred billion times

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Speaker 4: two hundred trillion, and that's an awful lot of planets

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Speaker 4: that could possibly hold life. Not to mention that we

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Speaker 4: started four and a half billion years ago and the

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Speaker 4: universe started more like fourteen billion years ago. So these

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Speaker 4: two things provide a lot of space for the potential

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Speaker 4: for intelligent life out there.

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Speaker 6: Well, the universe is we, by direct observation, have determined

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Speaker 6: that it's bigger and older than what was thought back

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Speaker 6: before they learned these things exactly.

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Speaker 4: And I just wonder, if you know your case had

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Speaker 4: happened today, if maybe would have been perceived slightly differently.

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Speaker 4: Because now we have that information, we're armed with a

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Speaker 4: totally different set of facts that we know about the

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Speaker 4: universe that we did not know in nineteen seventy five.

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Speaker 6: Humans are relatively new. The entire human history is just

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Speaker 6: a drop on the bucket.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I think it's only two hundred thousand years, right.

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Speaker 6: And the potential for life forms to have lived many, many, many, many,

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Speaker 6: many many times longer than the entire human history, you know,

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Speaker 6: points to the fact that their technology would of course

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Speaker 6: continue on a a trajectory that would be far, far

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Speaker 6: more advanced than anything we can imagine.

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Speaker 4: I completely agree. In fact, I would go so far

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Speaker 4: as to say, I bet there's civilizations that advanced their

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Speaker 4: technology and blew themselves up and are no longer in

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Speaker 4: existence before Earth was even born.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, that's that's my argument on the idea that these

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Speaker 6: beings are benign. If they did mean us harm, we

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Speaker 6: never know what.

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Speaker 4: Hit us, right, I think that wipe us right out.

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Speaker 6: If they intended to take the planet for themselves, we

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Speaker 6: had never know the way it hit us. Been over

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Speaker 6: with a long time ago.

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Speaker 4: Do you think that there are more than one group

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Speaker 4: of aliens?

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Speaker 6: Yeah, I think it's inevitable that there would be large numbers.

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Speaker 6: I think that they might even physically resemble each other.

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Speaker 6: That there's kind of inevitability about intelligence directs the the

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Speaker 6: form that's taken. You know, there's not going to be

429
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Speaker 6: ten foot tall cockroaches or giant worms or anything like that,

430
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Speaker 6: building spaceships. It's Barton Parcel.

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Speaker 4: And they talk about the possibility of genetic manipulation of

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Speaker 4: even humans and even possibly other alien races. Do you

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Speaker 4: have a wild guess or a guttural feeling about what

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Speaker 4: they're doing here on Earth?

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Speaker 6: My guess is that we're catching glimpses at regular intervals Intentionally.

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Speaker 6: I think that if they wanted to remain undetected, they could,

437
00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:45,000
Speaker 6: So it's no accident that we know they're here. In

438
00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:47,280
Speaker 6: answer to the people who say, well, if they're here,

439
00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:49,920
Speaker 6: why don't they land on the White House on say hello,

440
00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:52,919
Speaker 6: mister President, here we are and here's a whole bundle

441
00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:56,280
Speaker 6: of technology for you. There's all kinds of good reason

442
00:25:56,359 --> 00:26:00,679
Speaker 6: why they wouldn't do that. Sure would be instructive. It

443
00:26:00,720 --> 00:26:06,440
Speaker 6: would be fatal to humanity to introduce technology.

444
00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:10,240
Speaker 4: You guys brought up the growth patterns on these trees,

445
00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:13,159
Speaker 4: and that Ben Hansen and some people looked at that

446
00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:17,080
Speaker 4: and scientifically discovered this. Has there been any other sort

447
00:26:17,119 --> 00:26:20,480
Speaker 4: of research done on the site or on Travis yourself

448
00:26:21,400 --> 00:26:24,280
Speaker 4: over the years that can point to physical evidence of this.

449
00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:30,480
Speaker 6: Well, you know, it was curious that radiation would cause

450
00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:35,080
Speaker 6: accelerated growth in plants. You would think you would expect

451
00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:39,280
Speaker 6: it to cause them to wither and die or something. Sure,

452
00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:44,960
Speaker 6: but Ben Hansen discovered research on the pine trees in

453
00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:48,800
Speaker 6: the vicinity of the Chernobyl nuclear accident that there was

454
00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:55,119
Speaker 6: a similar accelerated thickening of the growth rings. It's a

455
00:26:55,240 --> 00:27:01,920
Speaker 6: kind of an oddity. You would expect radiation to gild

456
00:27:02,320 --> 00:27:08,400
Speaker 6: a plant life, but apparently it's a phenomenon that they've

457
00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:13,160
Speaker 6: discovered right here in connection with the Chernomyl nuclear accident.

458
00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:16,439
Speaker 5: That was a five mile radius around Chernobyl, and the

459
00:27:16,480 --> 00:27:21,760
Speaker 5: trees grew omnidirectional in all directions, but for fifteen years,

460
00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:25,800
Speaker 5: and then after fifteen years it starts to settle down.

461
00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:29,000
Speaker 5: That's what's also confirmed the Walton case.

462
00:27:29,600 --> 00:27:32,560
Speaker 4: Interesting trivis. Do you keep up on other accounts or

463
00:27:32,600 --> 00:27:35,159
Speaker 4: other big UFO cases in the community. Is there anything

464
00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:36,119
Speaker 4: that you pay attention to.

465
00:27:37,200 --> 00:27:42,600
Speaker 6: I don't study the phenomena that much in general, there's

466
00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:45,360
Speaker 6: so much to keep track of, a lot going on,

467
00:27:45,800 --> 00:27:53,880
Speaker 6: always of a certain limited level of probability. I think intentional,

468
00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:58,280
Speaker 6: it would think people would pay attention to take your

469
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:02,640
Speaker 6: eyes off the ground and what does all this mean?

470
00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:08,560
Speaker 6: What does that imply? And I hope that people humanity

471
00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:14,639
Speaker 6: will wake up and realize just accepting that we're not

472
00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:17,399
Speaker 6: alone is going to be a major step forward.

473
00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:21,600
Speaker 4: Agreed. What do each of you guys think about the

474
00:28:21,640 --> 00:28:26,600
Speaker 4: recent developments we've had in government were pushing towards government disclosure.

475
00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:30,120
Speaker 4: We're having Congress having hearings and they're talking about this.

476
00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:33,240
Speaker 4: I guarantee in nineteen seventy five, you guys never saw

477
00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:36,400
Speaker 4: this happening. What do you both feel about this happening

478
00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:37,359
Speaker 4: in today's world?

479
00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:43,440
Speaker 6: In my opinion, pressuring and pushing for the government to

480
00:28:43,520 --> 00:28:48,000
Speaker 6: open their files and not have any secrets would be

481
00:28:48,400 --> 00:28:53,880
Speaker 6: counterproductive for no other reason than the fact that our enemies,

482
00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:58,160
Speaker 6: the Russians and the Chinese, wish they knew what we had.

483
00:28:58,560 --> 00:29:03,200
Speaker 6: Whether we've recovered technology or not, it's important that they

484
00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:07,200
Speaker 6: not know exactly how much we have. It keeps the peace.

485
00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:11,360
Speaker 5: I kind of agree with Travis, but heart of me thinks,

486
00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:13,840
Speaker 5: of course, I'm a bit of a journalist and a filmmaker.

487
00:29:14,240 --> 00:29:17,280
Speaker 5: We need to acknowledge that we are not alone.

488
00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:24,080
Speaker 6: They've actually came forward twice now and acknowledge, well, there's

489
00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:27,480
Speaker 6: something there. We don't know what it is. It's not ours,

490
00:29:27,600 --> 00:29:33,440
Speaker 6: it's technology beyond ours. And both were anti climactic. It's

491
00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:35,960
Speaker 6: died down to, yeah, so what.

492
00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 4: I mean, gotcha. Listen, we take a less break here,

493
00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:42,400
Speaker 4: we'll come right back for our last segment, and we're

494
00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:44,760
Speaker 4: going to talk to Travis and Jennifer and ask them

495
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:47,920
Speaker 4: about the Fire in the Sky and their upcoming event

496
00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:51,800
Speaker 4: celebrating fifty years since the Travis Walton encounter. You're listening

497
00:29:51,840 --> 00:29:54,280
Speaker 4: to Beyond Contact on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast

498
00:29:54,320 --> 00:30:15,960
Speaker 4: AM Paranormal podcast network. We are back on Beyond Contact

499
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:19,000
Speaker 4: speaking with Travis Walton and Jennifer Stein. This our final segment.

500
00:30:19,320 --> 00:30:22,920
Speaker 4: So back in nineteen ninety three, Tracy Tormat came out

501
00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:25,680
Speaker 4: with Fire in the Sky, which was your story, Travis,

502
00:30:26,120 --> 00:30:28,680
Speaker 4: and it was in Hollywood movie form, and I know

503
00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:33,120
Speaker 4: you didn't like the inaccuracies in the film, and I

504
00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:36,920
Speaker 4: myself often cite this and I don't know why they

505
00:30:37,120 --> 00:30:40,880
Speaker 4: cannot tell the story exactly how you say it happened

506
00:30:41,120 --> 00:30:44,360
Speaker 4: to me, It's remarkable enough without all the embellishments. In

507
00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:46,560
Speaker 4: the past. You've expressed to me that you had an

508
00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:51,080
Speaker 4: interest in getting the true story made into a feature film.

509
00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:53,000
Speaker 4: Is that still something you'd like to see?

510
00:30:53,360 --> 00:30:57,320
Speaker 6: Yeah, I was actually working with Tracy on a remake.

511
00:30:57,800 --> 00:31:01,160
Speaker 6: I hope to continue in that endeavor to tell it

512
00:31:01,360 --> 00:31:05,520
Speaker 6: more like it really happened and include some things that

513
00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:08,560
Speaker 6: weren't in the original movie because we weren't aware of

514
00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:13,960
Speaker 6: it at the time. So there's good reasons to revisit

515
00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:14,800
Speaker 6: the topic.

516
00:31:15,200 --> 00:31:16,880
Speaker 4: Oh, I think so now now that it's under the

517
00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:19,760
Speaker 4: zeitgeist of such a bigger part of the population, now

518
00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:21,960
Speaker 4: would be the time. Do you feel like the First

519
00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:24,480
Speaker 4: Fire in the Sky did justice to the efforts of

520
00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:27,200
Speaker 4: getting the truth out or do you think the inaccuracies

521
00:31:27,200 --> 00:31:29,400
Speaker 4: of the film hurt the cause overall?

522
00:31:30,360 --> 00:31:36,520
Speaker 6: Well, we're all they changed important things too much. They

523
00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:41,480
Speaker 6: were going to tap into invading monsters, and that just

524
00:31:43,120 --> 00:31:49,040
Speaker 6: is an accurate representation of what happened, and it's deep

525
00:31:49,400 --> 00:31:55,240
Speaker 6: and there's some intellectual thinking that needs to be included

526
00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:57,000
Speaker 6: there that wasn't.

527
00:31:57,240 --> 00:31:59,640
Speaker 4: So Jennifer, You guys are doing a big celebration of

528
00:31:59,640 --> 00:32:02,960
Speaker 4: the fifth fieth anniversary coming up in Sedona October seventeenth

529
00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:05,320
Speaker 4: through twentieth, which is just a couple hours from where

530
00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:08,040
Speaker 4: the incident actually took place back in nineteen seventy five.

531
00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:12,640
Speaker 4: It covers secrecy to transparency, breaking the eighty year cycle

532
00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:17,080
Speaker 4: of the UFO account suppression and ridicule. You have some

533
00:32:17,160 --> 00:32:20,000
Speaker 4: really interesting speakers there too. You've got, of course, Travis

534
00:32:20,080 --> 00:32:24,480
Speaker 4: Walton will be there, yourself, Don Schmidt, David Hatcher, Childress,

535
00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:29,000
Speaker 4: Ron James, some people from Moufon, Stacy Wright, Melinda Leslie.

536
00:32:29,040 --> 00:32:31,280
Speaker 4: Are there any other interesting things happening that weekend? Tell

537
00:32:31,320 --> 00:32:31,760
Speaker 4: us about it.

538
00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:36,480
Speaker 5: Well, we're planning it to be a nice, close, tight knit,

539
00:32:36,640 --> 00:32:40,040
Speaker 5: little intimate conference. It's obviously not large. We have a

540
00:32:40,200 --> 00:32:43,320
Speaker 5: small venue and we expect we will sell out because

541
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:47,120
Speaker 5: it's so small, but it gives us the opportunity to

542
00:32:47,120 --> 00:32:50,120
Speaker 5: get to know one another, to sort of enjoy the

543
00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:53,600
Speaker 5: beauty of Sedona. So since we're doing it in a church,

544
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:56,720
Speaker 5: we have a Sunday morning free to take in some

545
00:32:56,800 --> 00:33:00,360
Speaker 5: of those great hikes or a great brunch and arrest restaurant,

546
00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:05,600
Speaker 5: and Sunday night will have a nice little celebratory reception

547
00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:10,840
Speaker 5: down at Tallacapake with some Flamingo dancing and music. And

548
00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:13,960
Speaker 5: then Monday morning we're going to close off the conference

549
00:33:14,240 --> 00:33:17,560
Speaker 5: with the World Disclosure UFO Day, which you were part

550
00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:22,120
Speaker 5: of last year with Jim Garrison and Danny She and

551
00:33:22,240 --> 00:33:25,320
Speaker 5: of course now Danny She's taken over the new Paradigm

552
00:33:25,400 --> 00:33:28,400
Speaker 5: Institute and Don Schmidt will be making a statement for

553
00:33:28,480 --> 00:33:31,200
Speaker 5: us from our group. So it'll be a way to

554
00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:34,800
Speaker 5: kind of have our group connect with people all around

555
00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:39,800
Speaker 5: the world who are really taking the subject, seriously, grappling

556
00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:44,560
Speaker 5: with it and now using it where knee it needs

557
00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:47,160
Speaker 5: be to expand the consciousness in their communities.

558
00:33:47,560 --> 00:33:50,080
Speaker 4: And that's on Monday the twenty first, at the end of.

559
00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:53,200
Speaker 5: Your conference, Monday the twentieth, actually Monday the twentieth.

560
00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:56,320
Speaker 4: What else is happening at your conference you're.

561
00:33:56,200 --> 00:33:56,640
Speaker 6: Part of it.

562
00:33:57,080 --> 00:34:00,400
Speaker 5: Well, what we're also doing is we have this four

563
00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:04,400
Speaker 5: day conference which is Friday, Saturday, Sunday and Monday, but

564
00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:08,759
Speaker 5: we also have on November fifth in Sedona, we're going

565
00:34:08,840 --> 00:34:11,480
Speaker 5: to have a screening up the Travis film. We're not

566
00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:15,719
Speaker 5: screening that at the actual UFO conference. We're screening Accidental

567
00:34:15,760 --> 00:34:19,480
Speaker 5: Truth on Friday night, but on November fifth the Sedona

568
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:23,799
Speaker 5: Film Festival and The Truth too, right, Yeah, I don't

569
00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:25,719
Speaker 5: know whether we'll be doing two or one. I think

570
00:34:25,800 --> 00:34:29,120
Speaker 5: Ron's telling us we're just doing one, but he wants

571
00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:33,040
Speaker 5: to release version two in a different way, a different format,

572
00:34:33,320 --> 00:34:36,680
Speaker 5: So we'll probably be screening Accidental Truth one, which is

573
00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:39,080
Speaker 5: still an award winning film. It's one I think twenty

574
00:34:39,120 --> 00:34:42,080
Speaker 5: six twenty eight Film Festival awards, which we're very proud of.

575
00:34:42,719 --> 00:34:46,520
Speaker 5: So on November fifth, we'll actually screen the Travis film

576
00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:51,279
Speaker 5: at the Sedona Film Festival right there on eighty nine

577
00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:53,960
Speaker 5: a in the heart of Sedona, and we'll do two screenings,

578
00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:57,320
Speaker 5: one at three with Q and A with Travis and myself,

579
00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:00,319
Speaker 5: and then another one at seven, And then a few

580
00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:03,400
Speaker 5: days later on the eighth down in Phoenix, we'll be

581
00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:06,879
Speaker 5: doing another little celebratory event because you know, fifty years

582
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:09,279
Speaker 5: is a big thing to mark, and we're only ever

583
00:35:09,320 --> 00:35:12,480
Speaker 5: going to do these things once, right, you can't come

584
00:35:12,520 --> 00:35:14,759
Speaker 5: to this conference next year or the year after, like

585
00:35:14,800 --> 00:35:17,480
Speaker 5: we can Contact in the Desert, which is a great conference,

586
00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:19,520
Speaker 5: by the way. I just love it, and I'm so

587
00:35:19,600 --> 00:35:22,960
Speaker 5: glad you're doing this now, Ron, But on November eighth,

588
00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:23,520
Speaker 5: we will.

589
00:35:23,360 --> 00:35:26,439
Speaker 4: Well more than that, Jennifer. Listen, this Travis Walton case

590
00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:29,239
Speaker 4: is one of the few mere cases that we have

591
00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:33,880
Speaker 4: and it deserves this acknowledgment of fifty years. It's, you know,

592
00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:35,840
Speaker 4: one of the marquee things that's right up there with

593
00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:38,239
Speaker 4: Roswell and Whitley and those kind of things.

594
00:35:38,320 --> 00:35:41,920
Speaker 5: On November eighth, we will do a special event with

595
00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:45,200
Speaker 5: Phoenix Move On, and we'll have some special ceremonies and

596
00:35:45,239 --> 00:35:49,040
Speaker 5: a nice dinner reception there at the Arizona Historical Society.

597
00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:53,319
Speaker 5: So people who want to meet with Travis see him,

598
00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:57,279
Speaker 5: congratulate him, and just hear from him directly. They can

599
00:35:57,320 --> 00:36:00,200
Speaker 5: do it there too, So there's lots of opportunities to

600
00:36:00,239 --> 00:36:01,960
Speaker 5: connect in with Travis over this.

601
00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:04,160
Speaker 4: I think it's wonderful that he gets a chance to

602
00:36:04,320 --> 00:36:06,879
Speaker 4: sort of get a little bit of accolade and appreciation

603
00:36:07,680 --> 00:36:11,000
Speaker 4: for being so forthcoming with his story instead of the

604
00:36:11,080 --> 00:36:13,920
Speaker 4: ridicule that I think he received initially back in the seventies.

605
00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:16,759
Speaker 5: Well, even if he just gets an award for like

606
00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:19,760
Speaker 5: putting up with a ridicule for fifty years, that itself

607
00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:21,359
Speaker 5: is incredible.

608
00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:23,359
Speaker 4: And putting up with you and me and everyone else

609
00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:26,040
Speaker 4: asking him a hundred questions every day and he's repeating

610
00:36:26,040 --> 00:36:28,360
Speaker 4: the stories. Travis, it must be tough just dealing with

611
00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:32,399
Speaker 4: all that, right, It's to be expected, Yes, I mean,

612
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:34,640
Speaker 4: when you think about it, you know, you're one of

613
00:36:34,640 --> 00:36:37,000
Speaker 4: a handful of humans who have had such an experience

614
00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:39,000
Speaker 4: that we know of. Of course, they're going to be coming

615
00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:40,520
Speaker 4: at you with questions. We all want to know, we

616
00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:42,560
Speaker 4: all want to know about this and what does it mean,

617
00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:46,040
Speaker 4: and what happens from here and that sort of thing. Jennifer,

618
00:36:46,040 --> 00:36:49,680
Speaker 4: do you feel that there's been a change in people's

619
00:36:49,719 --> 00:36:53,279
Speaker 4: perception about this since twenty seventeen? You mentioned earlier how

620
00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:55,719
Speaker 4: that's a watershed moment for this community. Have you seen

621
00:36:55,760 --> 00:36:58,439
Speaker 4: a change since then regarding this specific case?

622
00:36:59,120 --> 00:37:01,960
Speaker 5: Yes, yes, I have, and I think it's just because

623
00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:05,560
Speaker 5: the number of people from my perspective who have taken

624
00:37:05,600 --> 00:37:09,520
Speaker 5: an interest in the Travis case and who have demanded

625
00:37:09,600 --> 00:37:13,399
Speaker 5: or asked to screen the film at their conferences. I've

626
00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:16,080
Speaker 5: been asked to put it in multiple languages now, for

627
00:37:16,280 --> 00:37:19,440
Speaker 5: you know, around the world people want to know more

628
00:37:19,480 --> 00:37:22,759
Speaker 5: in depth about this story because we no longer have

629
00:37:22,880 --> 00:37:27,719
Speaker 5: the Georgia Dampski's, you know, or the George van Tassels

630
00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:30,960
Speaker 5: that were here, or the Howard managers who claim to

631
00:37:31,040 --> 00:37:34,760
Speaker 5: have contact experience, and the Betty and Barney Hills story.

632
00:37:34,760 --> 00:37:37,319
Speaker 5: They're both gone now too, so you know, and so

633
00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:40,360
Speaker 5: was Charlie Parker, right, who just passed away.

634
00:37:40,480 --> 00:37:42,520
Speaker 4: All the Roswell witnesses, all.

635
00:37:42,400 --> 00:37:45,960
Speaker 5: The Roswald witnesses, are gone, so there's very few people

636
00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:50,640
Speaker 5: like Travis still with us that are going to you know,

637
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:54,200
Speaker 5: stand in his truth and is in his integrity. And

638
00:37:54,920 --> 00:37:57,880
Speaker 5: I myself am very honored to have worked as closely

639
00:37:57,920 --> 00:38:01,279
Speaker 5: as I have with Travis and to gotten to know

640
00:38:01,480 --> 00:38:03,759
Speaker 5: the various people in the story. Of course, you know

641
00:38:03,840 --> 00:38:07,799
Speaker 5: sy Gilson, I got to interview and Marlon Gillespie and

642
00:38:07,920 --> 00:38:11,640
Speaker 5: Chuck Ellison And for those who don't know, the website

643
00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:16,760
Speaker 5: for the film called traviswaltonthemovie dot com has many different

644
00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:19,720
Speaker 5: video clips up that didn't make it into the film,

645
00:38:19,920 --> 00:38:21,759
Speaker 5: but I just put them up there for free for

646
00:38:21,840 --> 00:38:24,880
Speaker 5: people to watch to get an in depth perspective. Because

647
00:38:24,880 --> 00:38:27,760
Speaker 5: there was so much debunking on this subject, I wanted

648
00:38:27,800 --> 00:38:30,800
Speaker 5: people to actually see the aerial footage of the area

649
00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:34,959
Speaker 5: around it, so they know there isn't a fire tower there, right,

650
00:38:35,440 --> 00:38:38,000
Speaker 5: They can look down on the ground and see Nope,

651
00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:41,239
Speaker 5: it's not anywhere in a five mile radius. And to

652
00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:44,520
Speaker 5: hear directly from the sheriff and the marshall who were

653
00:38:44,560 --> 00:38:47,280
Speaker 5: involved in this case. And you meet the best people

654
00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:50,280
Speaker 5: when you come and connect in at a UFO conference.

655
00:38:50,760 --> 00:38:53,400
Speaker 5: My girlfriends and I always call it consciousness school. Like,

656
00:38:53,440 --> 00:38:57,040
Speaker 5: oh yeah, we get to go. And there's many subjects

657
00:38:57,080 --> 00:39:00,200
Speaker 5: that interloop into this. Now we're dealing with the on

658
00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:03,799
Speaker 5: set of AI, which is changing our life rapidly, and

659
00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:07,560
Speaker 5: we must begin to grapple with these, you know, twenty

660
00:39:07,560 --> 00:39:08,760
Speaker 5: first century issues.

661
00:39:09,560 --> 00:39:14,439
Speaker 6: Absolutely, I haven't found anyone who can give me an explanation,

662
00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:21,400
Speaker 6: a satisfactory explanation for why Philip Class never attempted to

663
00:39:21,520 --> 00:39:26,760
Speaker 6: contact me at all, not one single attempt to speak

664
00:39:26,800 --> 00:39:29,680
Speaker 6: to me, even even on the Larry King Show. He

665
00:39:29,840 --> 00:39:35,000
Speaker 6: just totally ignored me and went for Mike Rogers' throat. Yeah, well,

666
00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:38,600
Speaker 6: he went to the trouble to find Steve Pears in

667
00:39:38,640 --> 00:39:42,360
Speaker 6: another state taking out for dinner and try to bribe

668
00:39:42,400 --> 00:39:47,720
Speaker 6: him giving ten thousand dollars to deny the truth of it. Unsuccessful.

669
00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:52,360
Speaker 6: But it's really strange to me that he would ignore

670
00:39:52,400 --> 00:39:52,960
Speaker 6: me like that.

671
00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:56,799
Speaker 4: Yeah, it said, it's weird. It really is. And you know,

672
00:39:56,880 --> 00:39:58,759
Speaker 4: that's the thing about this case is that, you know,

673
00:39:58,800 --> 00:40:01,960
Speaker 4: we do have four other moreultiple witnesses who all passed

674
00:40:02,080 --> 00:40:05,320
Speaker 4: multiple light detector tests as well as Travis has passed

675
00:40:05,400 --> 00:40:07,600
Speaker 4: multiple light detector tests. You know, if you're not familiar

676
00:40:07,640 --> 00:40:10,040
Speaker 4: with this case, do yourself a favor and check this

677
00:40:10,160 --> 00:40:12,600
Speaker 4: out on our YouTube channel. Thanks a lot, Travis. I

678
00:40:12,600 --> 00:40:15,160
Speaker 4: so appreciate you sharing this with us and sharing it

679
00:40:15,160 --> 00:40:18,160
Speaker 4: with the world yet one more time. I really appreciate

680
00:40:18,160 --> 00:40:21,240
Speaker 4: it and thank you Jennifer for documenting all these important

681
00:40:21,239 --> 00:40:24,640
Speaker 4: and historical facts. Check out the twenty twenty five Skyfire

682
00:40:24,680 --> 00:40:27,560
Speaker 4: Summit at Sedonamoufon dot org. You can find me on

683
00:40:27,600 --> 00:40:30,960
Speaker 4: Twitter and Instagram at cd Underscore Captain Ron. Stay connected

684
00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:34,160
Speaker 4: by checking out contact intheesert dot com. Stay open minded

685
00:40:34,160 --> 00:40:36,560
Speaker 4: in rational as we explore the unknown right here on

686
00:40:36,600 --> 00:40:40,120
Speaker 4: the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.

687
00:40:53,880 --> 00:40:56,399
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast

688
00:40:56,480 --> 00:40:59,680
Speaker 1: AM Paranormal Podcast Network. Make sure and check out all

689
00:40:59,800 --> 00:41:02,880
Speaker 1: our shows on the iHeartRadio app or by going to

690
00:41:02,960 --> 00:41:04,719
Speaker 1: iHeartRadio dot com.

691
00:41:09,120 --> 00:41:09,520
Speaker 6: MHM