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Speaker 1: Pushkin. Ben Bridwell is a frontman of Band of Horses,

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Speaker 1: a group whose sound he describes as y'all alternative, a

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Speaker 1: genre that tips its hat to Southern rock's deep myriad

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Speaker 1: of musical influences. Next month, the group is celebrating the

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Speaker 1: twentieth anniversary of their debut album Everything All the Time,

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Speaker 1: with an expanded reissue featuring previously unreleased demos and live recordings.

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Speaker 1: The album was recorded in two thousand and five with

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Speaker 1: producer of Phil Eck, who's known for producing albums by Built,

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Speaker 1: The Spill, Modest Mouse, and The Shins. When Band of

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Speaker 1: Horses started working on the project with Phil, Ben had

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Speaker 1: only been writing songs for a couple of years. He

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Speaker 1: was also new to Seattle, where he relocated from Tucson,

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Speaker 1: a city he'd moved to at sixteen after dropping out

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Speaker 1: of high school in his native Irmo, South Carolina. On

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Speaker 1: today's episode, Lea Rose talks to Ben Bridwell about recording

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Speaker 1: Everything All the Time. He opens up about hitting rock

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Speaker 1: bottom in South Carolina before moving to Seattle, including sitting

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Speaker 1: in his mattress on fire, getting hit by a car,

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Speaker 1: and getting arrested, all within the span of one week.

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Speaker 1: He also talks about recently breaking the generational curse of

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Speaker 1: alcoholism and his family, getting his life together post divorce,

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Speaker 1: and explains why the upcoming Band of Horses album may

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Speaker 1: sound aggressive despite the fact that it's in such a

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Speaker 1: happy place. This is broken record, real musicians, real conversations.

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Speaker 1: Here's Lea Rose with Ben Bridwell. Head over to YouTube

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Speaker 1: dot com slash Broken Record podcast to see the video

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Speaker 1: version of this interview.

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Speaker 2: What were you like in high school?

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Speaker 3: Like?

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Speaker 2: What were you up to in high school?

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Speaker 3: Bad? Pretty bad?

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Speaker 1: No?

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Speaker 3: I I was all right. I only lasted I think

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Speaker 3: my tenth grade year. I think I think I went.

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Speaker 3: I'm not sure if I'm still a sophomore or what

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Speaker 3: I am, But yeah, I didn't. I wasn't there very long.

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Speaker 3: I was missing too many days, and they're kind of

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Speaker 3: like you don't really want to be here, not at all,

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Speaker 3: you know, So like, off you go. So I moved

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Speaker 3: out west and started the chant, like the whole thing

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Speaker 3: that would kind of cascade into Band of Horses and

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Speaker 3: all that. By searching for a place where there was

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Speaker 3: like a punk rock scene and an engine rock scene

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Speaker 3: and you could go. You didn't have to drive three

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Speaker 3: hundred miles to go see a show.

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Speaker 2: So there was no like punk rock scene in South Carolina.

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Speaker 3: There was. There was a lot of straight edge kids

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Speaker 3: and a lot of skateboard scene was kind of intertwined,

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Speaker 3: and and there was some There was a couple of

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Speaker 3: good punk bands out of Columbia, South Carolina. But again

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Speaker 3: I had to get like my a mother's note to

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Speaker 3: go to the club, you know what I mean. I

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Speaker 3: was still like sixteen, you know, and I'm like, I

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Speaker 3: want to go for I want to go, you know.

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Speaker 3: And we drived like Charlotte or Chapel Hill or Atlanta

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Speaker 3: or something Athens to go see yeah, you know, like

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Speaker 3: you are a loaf or Sebado's playing there and Pavement

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Speaker 3: was coming around, and uh so we or the Ramones,

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Speaker 3: you know, we'd drive, We'd have to drive, and I

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Speaker 3: was like, man, I want to go someplace where that

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Speaker 3: stuff is, like people are like in bands that are

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Speaker 3: playing big places, you know, like there's like a real

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Speaker 3: scene going on. I wanted to be near that. So

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Speaker 3: I went to Tucson, Arizona.

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Speaker 2: Oh and wich was going on in Tucson at that time.

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Speaker 3: A thriving punk and goth and weirdo scene. Oh my god,

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Speaker 3: I'd never lived out west and or been out West,

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Speaker 3: and it was it was different. You know, kids were

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Speaker 3: like doing speed and like they're nails, you know, and

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Speaker 3: going to the club and stuff. So it was it

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Speaker 3: was cool. It was very different. There's like raves and

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Speaker 3: stuff like that. Didn't know nothing about dance music or nothing,

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Speaker 3: and uh, and I became kind of entrenched in that

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Speaker 3: scene by working, uh, delivering pizzas and working in cafes

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Speaker 3: and stuff like that. And yeah, it was pretty freaky, honestly.

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Speaker 3: Like these kids, they weren't much older than me, but

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Speaker 3: they were out of high school, you know, they were

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Speaker 3: like pioneering twenty years old. They were like grown ups

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Speaker 3: and they were making a go of it.

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Speaker 2: So you were already playing music at that point.

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Speaker 3: No, no, no, no, I didn't.

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Speaker 2: Just kind of like a fan, like want to be

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Speaker 2: in the scene and kind of yeah, party type.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. I just wanted to be around it and yeah

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Speaker 3: and be friends with people that were in bands and

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Speaker 3: I didn't and I was. I was really always into

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Speaker 3: making like mixtapes. I was always about trying to spread

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Speaker 3: other people's music to others. That was always what I

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Speaker 3: thought would be more my calling. Maybe working in radio

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Speaker 3: or something like that, or with a label even so yeah,

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Speaker 3: like an A totally that would have been amazing. Hey

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Speaker 3: they're still young, I'm available, you know. I ended up

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Speaker 3: starting a label. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's plentny how that

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Speaker 3: worked out. But yeah, I didn't end up playing music

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Speaker 3: until like my mid twenties or something like that.

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Speaker 2: That's crazy.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. I didn't think that would be something in the

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Speaker 3: cards for sure.

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Speaker 2: That's so crazy. So how did that happen? Was it

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Speaker 2: just kind of like messing around with friends, instruments around

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Speaker 2: and you just took a go at it or how

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Speaker 2: did you even make that transition?

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Speaker 3: Well? I was releasing bands on my label, and mostly

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Speaker 3: as a stepping stone kind of label just to get like, hey,

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Speaker 3: y'all can have some CDs to sell the show, you

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Speaker 3: know what I mean, and then maybe like a big

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Speaker 3: label be like yoink and you know, we're going to

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Speaker 3: superstardom or something. But I ended up joining the main

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Speaker 3: group that I was like just entrenched with. I met

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Speaker 3: out in Tucson called Chris is Weird and and it

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Speaker 3: was a male and female songwriter and they picked up

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Speaker 3: some good steam. Once once we all kind of relocate,

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Speaker 3: we met in twosons, and we all ended up living

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Speaker 3: in Seattle, and they started to really get their act

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Speaker 3: together and put out a couple of records with them,

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Speaker 3: and then they're one of their drummer had to leave

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Speaker 3: to go be in modest mouse for a second as

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Speaker 3: like a utility dude, and they needed someone to play

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Speaker 3: kind of like slow core drums, and uh, I hate

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Speaker 3: that term, but still that's what we kind of wore.

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Speaker 3: It was. It was very slow and easy to play drums.

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Speaker 3: I was like, because I had a car basically, and

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Speaker 3: they trusted my driving skills and they needed to go

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Speaker 3: on tour, I think they're like, then will you do it?

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Speaker 3: Learned to play some drums, and so I started to

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Speaker 3: do that, and a little bit later I picked up

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Speaker 3: a bass a little bit for like a song or two,

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Speaker 3: you know, And then the band broke up and it

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Speaker 3: was like, what are we going to do? I now

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Speaker 3: got kind of used to that lifestyle of like staring

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Speaker 3: out the window all day and meeting new people at night.

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Speaker 3: So I just started falling around with the gear that

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Speaker 3: was kind of left in the ashes of that band.

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Speaker 3: It was just we still were paying for a rehearsal space.

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Speaker 3: I was like, I'm just gonna go down there every

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Speaker 3: day that I can and spend as much time as

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Speaker 3: I can figuring it out. And that's what I did.

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Speaker 3: I just put in the honestly, the hours. I think

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Speaker 3: that's what really got me to where I am now

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Speaker 3: is just I just I didn't know what I was doing,

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Speaker 3: but I just tinkered long enough to find some melody

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Speaker 3: and then it it just kind of took its own course.

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Speaker 2: That's so cool. Did it feel good to be on stage,

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Speaker 2: like the first time you were up there playing drums? Like,

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Speaker 2: as someone who was such a fan of music, did

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Speaker 2: it feel cool to be in a band?

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Speaker 3: Like?

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Speaker 2: What was that experience like for you?

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Speaker 3: I'm sure the tightrope act of it was was a thrill, right,

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Speaker 3: But I've always i mean, more than imposter syndrome like

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Speaker 3: this just isn't where I'm supposed to be, you know,

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Speaker 3: So that was always I mean, I liked I think

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Speaker 3: I'm more like the camaraderie of being in a band

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Speaker 3: more than I did like trying to grow my craft

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Speaker 3: in a band, you know what I mean. I just

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Speaker 3: liked the whole I liked I liked the whole party

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Speaker 3: of it all, and the whole experience of traveling and

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Speaker 3: that wanderlust that's totally been impossible to really satisfy my

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Speaker 3: whole life. So I think that was more the thing.

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Speaker 3: So the playing was out of necessity, just to earn

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Speaker 3: my keep. I think on the road you still am

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Speaker 3: still trying. Yeah. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I was reading an old article in Rolling Stone. It

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Speaker 2: was in a section called hot bandy. Oh my god,

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Speaker 2: I think it was from two thousand and seven, and

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Speaker 2: it said, one of the reasons you left Charleston was

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Speaker 2: because you lit your mattress on fire with a handle.

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Speaker 3: True?

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Speaker 2: What what is that story? What happened?

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Speaker 3: Good lord? It was the first year that I'd ever

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Speaker 3: heard the term el nino. Okay, I was like, what

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Speaker 3: is el Nina? What is y'all? But so one night

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Speaker 3: I was well, my roommate was woken up by the

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Speaker 3: ceiling dripping on him because this crazy el Nino pushed

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Speaker 3: this storm through and uh, and so he woke up

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Speaker 3: to find that my room was on fire. He could

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Speaker 3: like see it under the door, like the flames or whatever,

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Speaker 3: and he came in and kicked me awake. My bed

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Speaker 3: had caught fire thanks to because I was making mixtapes

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Speaker 3: before I was going to bed and drinking and sitting

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Speaker 3: there in bed making mixtape, drinking pass out, and the

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Speaker 3: candle ended up catching this, you know, fifteen dollars mattress

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Speaker 3: from the seventies, probably on fire, which was the opposite

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Speaker 3: of flame retardant. It was only like it just it

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Speaker 3: would not go out. So even like I had to

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Speaker 3: run with this I got once we realized dumping water

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Speaker 3: on it wouldn't work. I had to drag it through

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Speaker 3: the house and throw it outside where it was dumping rain. Right,

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Speaker 3: throw it outside, it lands on like the steps the

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Speaker 3: stairs going up to the house. It lands on this

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Speaker 3: and still wouldn't go out in the rainstorm. The flames

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Speaker 3: just got even more and more.

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Speaker 2: Oh my god.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and so so that and I had gotten thrown

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Speaker 3: in jail also for some thing, No, for something different,

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Speaker 3: but I had this. I had this like round round

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Speaker 3: trip ticket to go visit my friends from Chris is Weird,

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Speaker 3: who I met out in Tucson. They were living out

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Speaker 3: in Olympia, Washington. Now, I was gonna go visit Northwest

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Speaker 3: and then come back. But after all this happened within

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Speaker 3: a week, I mean I got hit by a car.

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Speaker 3: Also right after that, with all my bandage. My hands

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Speaker 3: were all bandaged up, like fingers were touching this far apart,

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Speaker 3: and I hit by a car delivering a Brita and

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Speaker 3: pizzas to the hospital and all my bandages like blew up.

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Speaker 3: So I'm like, oh my god. So I changed I

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Speaker 3: changed the ticket to one way a sign yeah, and

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Speaker 3: moved out to the Northwest. And that's what also kind

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Speaker 3: of started this whole push for U for the music thing.

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Speaker 3: You hit rock bottom, I reckon, I reckon, I did yeah,

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Speaker 3: and I didn't. My prospects were very, very low, and

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Speaker 3: you know, but then I was homeless out there. I

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Speaker 3: was living on the streets of Seattle, living outside before

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Speaker 3: and and got hired by a rock club, the Crocodile,

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Speaker 3: owned by one Peter Buck from r E.

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Speaker 2: M uh.

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Speaker 3: They hired me with my sleeping bag on my back

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Speaker 3: and gave me a chance.

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Speaker 2: Uh.

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Speaker 3: So I was able to start saving up money and

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Speaker 3: getting living inside.

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Speaker 2: What do you think, Like, what perspective does that give you,

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Speaker 2: having once been sleeping on the street, Like are you

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Speaker 2: grateful for that?

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Speaker 3: I don't like to go camping? And tell you that

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Speaker 3: I don't to go camping, I'm like, no, I've done,

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Speaker 3: why would I do?

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Speaker 2: I don't need that experience?

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Speaker 3: Yeah right, yeah, it's yeah, I definitely don't like to

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Speaker 3: go camping. But you know, I'm just I'm eternally also

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Speaker 3: like a bit of a like feeling a bit like

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Speaker 3: I don't belong wherever I'm supposed to be, Like I'm

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Speaker 3: not supposed to be allowed in this place, you know.

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Speaker 3: You know, I always feel like someone would be like,

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Speaker 3: who let the freak in?

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Speaker 2: You know, well, it seems like you were a go getter.

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Speaker 2: I mean if you're sitting there starting a label, like,

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Speaker 2: how did you how did you even come up with

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Speaker 2: that idea?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? Well, I was working at this club in Seattle. God,

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Speaker 3: now my dream has come true. I get to work

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Speaker 3: at a rock club and like the bands that I

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Speaker 3: like are playing, you know, every month you get a calendar.

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Speaker 3: It's like, oh, oh I'm getting off that night.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 3: It's like watching sound and watching how bands interact, and

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Speaker 3: oh my god. It was a dream come true. But

248
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Speaker 3: I was also not making very much money and I

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Speaker 3: was I'm just always ornery too, and I'm like, man,

250
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Speaker 3: I want to do what those guys are doing, Like,

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Speaker 3: you know, they're tipping me nothing, you know, my tip

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Speaker 3: out and I'm getting like eleven bucks you know, for

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Speaker 3: like the busiest shift ever, and I'm like, there's got

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Speaker 3: to be a better way. So I just started saving

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Speaker 3: every tip. I was almost like in defiance of my

256
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Speaker 3: own my own prospects as as a as a growing person,

257
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Speaker 3: or I'm like, I don't have an education. I don't

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Speaker 3: I don't have a whole lot going for me as

259
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Speaker 3: skill wise. I'm going to just I'm how good at

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Speaker 3: cooking on the line. I'm just gonna save every dollar

261
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Speaker 3: and I'm gonna hide it for myself, and I'm gonna

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Speaker 3: put out my friend's record that those friends I met

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Speaker 3: in Tucson. I'm gonna put out their record. They're finally

264
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Speaker 3: gonna have a CD, and everything will just kind of start,

265
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Speaker 3: you know, snowballing. And it it did. So you know,

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Speaker 3: it had enough to put out one record, and it

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Speaker 3: had enough to repress it, and all of a sudden,

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Speaker 3: it's like Jesus, we got like a thing going on

269
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Speaker 3: here now and growing up with like I mean, even

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Speaker 3: in Irmo, South Carolina, I had stenciled Subpop on my backpack,

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Speaker 3: you know, in white out, you know, so there was

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Speaker 3: already like this like indie rock kind of like the

273
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Speaker 3: branding of indie rock was was working on me, you

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Speaker 3: know what I'm saying. Yeah, moving up to Seattle and stuff.

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Speaker 3: There's so many record labels. This is like peak indie sleeves,

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Speaker 3: whatever era this was. But there were so many great

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Speaker 3: labels and and everyone was cool and intermixing with one another.

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Speaker 3: And my idea to help other people dream their dreams

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Speaker 3: bigger was more than business savvy, because I had always said, like,

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Speaker 3: this is like a stepping stone. I'm not trying to

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Speaker 3: like put you on a contract. I'm not trying to

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Speaker 3: do nothing but get us on k XP, you know,

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Speaker 3: and like and put our shops or our CDs and

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Speaker 3: all these shops. There were so many great record stores

285
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Speaker 3: in Seattle too, so you could put them on consignment.

286
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Speaker 3: And if you can sell those, they want to get more.

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Speaker 3: And all of a sudden, well, now we got something going,

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Speaker 3: and I was able to at least harness that dream

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Speaker 3: and help some people believe along with me.

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Speaker 1: We'll be back with more from Ben Bridwell after the break.

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Speaker 2: So, when you started Band of Horses, making the jump

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Speaker 2: from being the guy in the back who's supporting everybody,

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Speaker 2: and you know, helping other people get a foothold in

294
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Speaker 2: the scene and get you know, the band to grow

295
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Speaker 2: and stuff like that. When all of a sudden it

296
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Speaker 2: becomes you and it's your work and you're out there,

297
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Speaker 2: you're the front person. Was that a big transition for

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Speaker 2: you or did that happen seem to happen more naturally.

299
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Speaker 3: No, it's a transition. I still like I feel I

300
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Speaker 3: still feel like I'm like reeling from it in a

301
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Speaker 3: way where it's like I've come now twenty some years later,

302
00:16:20,836 --> 00:16:22,596
Speaker 3: I do feel like, Okay, I know what I'm doing,

303
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Speaker 3: but it took a while to get there where I'm

304
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Speaker 3: like it could all just fall apart in front of

305
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Speaker 3: everyone right here, you know, Like and even times where

306
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Speaker 3: I've like lost my voice or something been sick on

307
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Speaker 3: the road, I'm like, oh, there, it is, there, it

308
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Speaker 3: is now, you can't do it.

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Speaker 2: And then oh, like you're waiting for something, Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Like waiting for like to either be exposed as a

311
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Speaker 3: fraud or like or not meant to be there in

312
00:16:49,916 --> 00:16:52,476
Speaker 3: that role. In some way, I kind of accepted that

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Speaker 3: I was gonna feel that way and I just had

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Speaker 3: to push through that. But somewhere along the line, I

315
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Speaker 3: have like accepted that this is like my gig, you know,

316
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Speaker 3: and I am good at it and I love and

317
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Speaker 3: I've found a way to grow in that space and

318
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Speaker 3: really and love it and cherish it and miss it

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Speaker 3: when I'm not doing it.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that's yeah. So your two thousand and six

321
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Speaker 2: album Everything All the Time, turns twenty this year. Man,

322
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Speaker 2: So how long were you writing songs before that album

323
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Speaker 2: came out?

324
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Speaker 3: Ooh. I would say it took me a while to

325
00:17:33,076 --> 00:17:35,636
Speaker 3: get those up to snuff, probably about two years. I

326
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Speaker 3: think we started in two thousand and four. Yeah, okay, yeah,

327
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Speaker 3: so I didn't know how to play guitar or anything,

328
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Speaker 3: you know, I had like I was like dtuning the

329
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Speaker 3: pegs to you know, my hand is comfortable here, I'll

330
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Speaker 3: just work the strings around that. You know. I still

331
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Speaker 3: got them tattooed on me, just in case I forget.

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Speaker 2: What songs are those?

333
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Speaker 3: Uh, No, One's gonna Love You in the Funeral. Okay,

334
00:17:58,956 --> 00:18:01,516
Speaker 3: it's two different tunings, and I swear it makes no sense.

335
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Speaker 3: Every guitar check we've ever had is like it's kind

336
00:18:04,316 --> 00:18:07,636
Speaker 3: of a nightmare trying to line check those guitars. In

337
00:18:07,636 --> 00:18:09,836
Speaker 3: front of like a crowd, like, I don't know how

338
00:18:09,876 --> 00:18:13,836
Speaker 3: to what do you do with this? These strings? They

339
00:18:13,876 --> 00:18:16,396
Speaker 3: make no sense to another guitar player, But they're also

340
00:18:16,476 --> 00:18:19,836
Speaker 3: part of the sauce that I discovered down there writing

341
00:18:19,876 --> 00:18:23,556
Speaker 3: those first songs, not having any idea what to do.

342
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Speaker 3: So it took a while to get them to the

343
00:18:26,796 --> 00:18:31,076
Speaker 3: point of even I think playing live or sharing them

344
00:18:31,636 --> 00:18:35,036
Speaker 3: with any demos with like Phil k or somebody who

345
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Speaker 3: produced the record.

346
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Speaker 2: Yeah, do you remember the first time you played on stage,

347
00:18:39,396 --> 00:18:41,476
Speaker 2: like you sang your own songs on stage?

348
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Speaker 3: Yeah, I do. I do. There's this place called the

349
00:18:45,156 --> 00:18:48,356
Speaker 3: Sit and Spin in Seattle, and I still had the

350
00:18:49,196 --> 00:18:53,756
Speaker 3: poster actually a little flyer. We were first of four

351
00:18:54,276 --> 00:18:57,476
Speaker 3: on like a Wednesday night or something like that, and uh, yeah,

352
00:18:57,476 --> 00:19:00,396
Speaker 3: I had like a I was such I mean, I

353
00:19:00,476 --> 00:19:02,676
Speaker 3: was such a Freddy cat about it too. I would

354
00:19:02,756 --> 00:19:06,076
Speaker 3: sing with like a vocal processor thing that would just

355
00:19:06,116 --> 00:19:08,836
Speaker 3: like delay it and echo it so deeply that I

356
00:19:08,876 --> 00:19:12,716
Speaker 3: would it didn't really did not. Yeah, absolutely, Yeah, I

357
00:19:13,236 --> 00:19:15,796
Speaker 3: wish they made him for the best Man speeches, you know. Oh,

358
00:19:18,676 --> 00:19:23,596
Speaker 3: but any public speaking we need those delays. But but yeah,

359
00:19:23,676 --> 00:19:27,276
Speaker 3: I was I was nervous, but I do remember feeling like,

360
00:19:29,356 --> 00:19:33,676
Speaker 3: of course, like exhilarated, but relieved relieved that uh no

361
00:19:33,756 --> 00:19:35,036
Speaker 3: one through tomatoes or whatever.

362
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Speaker 2: You know, did you get any reaction, like real time

363
00:19:38,876 --> 00:19:41,116
Speaker 2: reaction from the crowd, Like did people seem into it?

364
00:19:42,036 --> 00:19:44,956
Speaker 3: Yeah? I think there was a sense already that this

365
00:19:45,276 --> 00:19:48,316
Speaker 3: was going to be a thing, and and I knew,

366
00:19:49,116 --> 00:19:51,076
Speaker 3: I mean it was you could see it quickly up there.

367
00:19:51,076 --> 00:19:55,676
Speaker 3: We also had like dueling weekly magazines. You know, there's

368
00:19:55,716 --> 00:19:57,596
Speaker 3: like who's got the better music coverage of the scene.

369
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Speaker 3: You know, it was there's at least two, there's at

370
00:19:59,956 --> 00:20:02,676
Speaker 3: least two and uh, you know someone's writing about it.

371
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Speaker 3: In the first week you played a show, all of

372
00:20:04,556 --> 00:20:07,916
Speaker 3: a sudden you're Seattle famous in the in the Gnarly

373
00:20:08,036 --> 00:20:12,676
Speaker 3: Times or whatever. Uh for uh for starting a new

374
00:20:12,716 --> 00:20:14,236
Speaker 3: band and generating buzz?

375
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Speaker 2: Was your Was the sound of the band different than

376
00:20:17,556 --> 00:20:19,876
Speaker 2: what else was going on locally? Like, did you guys

377
00:20:19,876 --> 00:20:22,196
Speaker 2: stand out as as a new sound?

378
00:20:23,436 --> 00:20:26,276
Speaker 3: Yeah? I guess we kind of did. Now thinking about it,

379
00:20:26,316 --> 00:20:32,636
Speaker 3: because whether I like it or not, my my southernness,

380
00:20:32,676 --> 00:20:36,476
Speaker 3: you know, my accent, my vibe, I mean, I'm very

381
00:20:36,716 --> 00:20:40,516
Speaker 3: like just like I identify as y'all. You know what

382
00:20:40,596 --> 00:20:45,116
Speaker 3: I mean, I am y'all. Y'all. It's just everything. I

383
00:20:45,156 --> 00:20:48,436
Speaker 3: say it constantly, So I do. I do think I

384
00:20:48,516 --> 00:20:51,236
Speaker 3: put some y'all in that alternative you know that y'a

385
00:20:51,236 --> 00:20:52,236
Speaker 3: alternative was? Was?

386
00:20:53,276 --> 00:20:54,596
Speaker 2: Is that a thing? Alternative?

387
00:20:54,916 --> 00:20:57,156
Speaker 3: It was? We talked about it back in the day.

388
00:20:57,196 --> 00:20:59,716
Speaker 3: I don't know if anyone's really uh stuck with it,

389
00:20:59,836 --> 00:21:03,356
Speaker 3: but uh yeah, but it was because you had like

390
00:21:03,396 --> 00:21:06,756
Speaker 3: people like let's say, the Supersuckers from Tucson. They ended

391
00:21:06,796 --> 00:21:08,836
Speaker 3: up coming up to Seattle and living and they had

392
00:21:08,876 --> 00:21:11,716
Speaker 3: like a kind of country punk thing going on. And

393
00:21:11,756 --> 00:21:14,516
Speaker 3: you know, I grew up on the Stones, but like

394
00:21:14,596 --> 00:21:19,396
Speaker 3: and Neil Young and and like the Almond Brothers and stuff.

395
00:21:19,436 --> 00:21:21,396
Speaker 3: So I was I think I was bringing something that

396
00:21:21,516 --> 00:21:26,236
Speaker 3: was that was a little bit different. Yeah, I don't know.

397
00:21:26,276 --> 00:21:27,836
Speaker 3: I think it was mostly the fact that I was

398
00:21:27,916 --> 00:21:30,596
Speaker 3: just like it was so echoey and a bit more

399
00:21:30,636 --> 00:21:33,196
Speaker 3: psychedelic before it got kind of cleaned up in the

400
00:21:33,276 --> 00:21:37,876
Speaker 3: process that I was probably leaning more towards Jan's addiction

401
00:21:38,556 --> 00:21:41,476
Speaker 3: than maybe even say like the My Morning Jacket stuff

402
00:21:41,556 --> 00:21:45,396
Speaker 3: or something. I think a lot of that stuff snuck

403
00:21:45,436 --> 00:21:47,196
Speaker 3: in there and built a spill and flaming lips I

404
00:21:47,276 --> 00:21:48,596
Speaker 3: was listening to a lot of that stuff, so I

405
00:21:48,636 --> 00:21:51,956
Speaker 3: was singing a bit more of a higher register where

406
00:21:51,996 --> 00:21:53,796
Speaker 3: a lot of the Seattle bands there was still a

407
00:21:53,796 --> 00:21:56,796
Speaker 3: lot of like math rock going on, a lot of

408
00:21:56,836 --> 00:22:01,356
Speaker 3: post punk vibes, a lot of still like K Records

409
00:22:01,356 --> 00:22:05,036
Speaker 3: pop stuff still was like, uh was popping off, and

410
00:22:05,076 --> 00:22:08,476
Speaker 3: then you had like this new kind of macho rock

411
00:22:08,516 --> 00:22:13,676
Speaker 3: scene that subpop was having a go a little era with.

412
00:22:13,916 --> 00:22:17,116
Speaker 3: There's like a lot of like everyone's wearing black and

413
00:22:17,156 --> 00:22:22,316
Speaker 3: getting sleeve tattoos today and they're all dancing, you know.

414
00:22:22,476 --> 00:22:25,916
Speaker 3: It was We definitely were a different kind of vibe

415
00:22:25,956 --> 00:22:30,436
Speaker 3: where it was swinging wild in all directions, which is nice.

416
00:22:31,116 --> 00:22:33,516
Speaker 3: But yeah, for some I think we were melodic enough

417
00:22:33,636 --> 00:22:35,756
Speaker 3: to uh to catch people's eye.

418
00:22:36,276 --> 00:22:40,476
Speaker 2: Yeah, what was the build up to releasing the first album? Like,

419
00:22:41,156 --> 00:22:44,116
Speaker 2: were you a band that played out all the time?

420
00:22:44,236 --> 00:22:48,436
Speaker 2: Did you tour? Did you play outside of Seattle? Was

421
00:22:48,476 --> 00:22:51,236
Speaker 2: your set covers? Was it original songs?

422
00:22:51,356 --> 00:22:51,476
Speaker 3: Like?

423
00:22:51,596 --> 00:22:53,716
Speaker 2: Tell me about the lead up to putting out the

424
00:22:53,716 --> 00:22:54,756
Speaker 2: first album?

425
00:22:55,076 --> 00:22:59,756
Speaker 3: Cool? Yeah, Well I was lucky that well I had

426
00:23:00,436 --> 00:23:02,956
Speaker 3: become friends with Sam Beam from Iron and Wine. He's

427
00:23:02,996 --> 00:23:05,836
Speaker 3: also from the same town that I'm from. In the

428
00:23:05,876 --> 00:23:09,476
Speaker 3: middle of South Carolina and he's a my brother age.

429
00:23:09,476 --> 00:23:12,356
Speaker 3: They were buddies, and I had met him one time

430
00:23:13,116 --> 00:23:15,676
Speaker 3: coming home for like a Christmas and I heard his

431
00:23:15,796 --> 00:23:18,276
Speaker 3: songs in his truck and I was like, what though,

432
00:23:18,556 --> 00:23:21,516
Speaker 3: this is crazy, Like, dude, you've got like something going here.

433
00:23:22,516 --> 00:23:26,876
Speaker 3: And I was lucky enough to dub some of those

434
00:23:26,916 --> 00:23:29,716
Speaker 3: songs down to another cassette tape and bring them with

435
00:23:29,796 --> 00:23:34,996
Speaker 3: me up to Seattle and and kind of introduce his

436
00:23:35,076 --> 00:23:40,556
Speaker 3: music to the subpop folks. And and my friend Howard

437
00:23:40,556 --> 00:23:44,116
Speaker 3: in Chicago, who worked with Thrill Jockey and Overcoat Records,

438
00:23:44,116 --> 00:23:46,996
Speaker 3: I was like, y'all gotta check out Sam Beamstaf. So

439
00:23:47,036 --> 00:23:49,556
Speaker 3: he ends up getting signed and kind of popping off

440
00:23:49,676 --> 00:23:54,276
Speaker 3: right around that a little bit, A little bit that day,

441
00:23:54,636 --> 00:24:01,196
Speaker 3: for sure, that day for sure. Oh man, I know. Actually,

442
00:24:01,396 --> 00:24:02,956
Speaker 3: you get one of those and you think all those

443
00:24:02,996 --> 00:24:06,116
Speaker 3: labels are going to listen to you the next time, right, No, No,

444
00:24:06,356 --> 00:24:08,516
Speaker 3: this was one. This is once in a lifetime here.

445
00:24:08,596 --> 00:24:14,356
Speaker 3: So so luckily Sam starts popping off right around the

446
00:24:14,396 --> 00:24:17,836
Speaker 3: time that horses was starting, and he took us out

447
00:24:17,876 --> 00:24:21,116
Speaker 3: on tour of the United States. Yeah, we were like

448
00:24:21,276 --> 00:24:25,636
Speaker 3: went around mostly in the South, open up for Iron

449
00:24:25,676 --> 00:24:29,276
Speaker 3: and Wine, which was a huge learning experience for us.

450
00:24:29,556 --> 00:24:31,636
Speaker 3: I mean for me as a as a singing person,

451
00:24:32,036 --> 00:24:34,876
Speaker 3: but also for just like the level of operation compared

452
00:24:34,916 --> 00:24:36,556
Speaker 3: to even the band that I was in before. It

453
00:24:36,636 --> 00:24:39,156
Speaker 3: was just like, Okay, this is a this is how

454
00:24:39,196 --> 00:24:43,596
Speaker 3: you tour, you know, and uh, it's funny. I ended

455
00:24:43,676 --> 00:24:46,996
Speaker 3: up getting in some way helping Sam get sign the subpop.

456
00:24:47,396 --> 00:24:49,716
Speaker 3: We end up open up for him two nights in Seattle,

457
00:24:50,356 --> 00:24:53,116
Speaker 3: and in turn, he gets me kind of signed a

458
00:24:53,156 --> 00:24:55,836
Speaker 3: subpop from all the way across the country. You know,

459
00:24:55,916 --> 00:24:59,596
Speaker 3: these two dudes in Irmo, South Carolina somehow end up

460
00:24:59,596 --> 00:25:05,116
Speaker 3: connected to Seattle via each other. Yeah, yeah, so that

461
00:25:05,236 --> 00:25:08,476
Speaker 3: was amazing he and yeah, that that process of of

462
00:25:09,156 --> 00:25:14,836
Speaker 3: seeing how Sam crafts his songs and then translates them

463
00:25:14,876 --> 00:25:18,276
Speaker 3: onto the stage and becomes also from maybe a bedroom

464
00:25:18,396 --> 00:25:22,156
Speaker 3: type of recording vibe all of a sudden in front

465
00:25:22,196 --> 00:25:25,796
Speaker 3: of you know, hundreds and hundreds of people. I kind

466
00:25:25,796 --> 00:25:28,716
Speaker 3: of followed his lead. He was very much like a

467
00:25:29,956 --> 00:25:30,836
Speaker 3: mentor in that way.

468
00:25:31,276 --> 00:25:34,156
Speaker 2: Nice. So what specifically did you pick up from him?

469
00:25:34,316 --> 00:25:35,916
Speaker 2: Like as far as performing.

470
00:25:36,676 --> 00:25:40,196
Speaker 3: Well, I still pick up from him his freedom. He

471
00:25:41,716 --> 00:25:46,156
Speaker 3: expresses himself so freely on stage and in front of

472
00:25:46,196 --> 00:25:52,276
Speaker 3: people with whether it's you know, playing different different ways

473
00:25:52,276 --> 00:25:54,196
Speaker 3: of playing songs that he's written a long time ago,

474
00:25:54,316 --> 00:25:57,316
Speaker 3: and challenging the audience in a way not and just

475
00:25:57,316 --> 00:26:03,236
Speaker 3: being unafraid to still make artful expression out of something

476
00:26:03,316 --> 00:26:05,156
Speaker 3: that doesn't have to be it doesn't you know, you

477
00:26:05,476 --> 00:26:07,756
Speaker 3: could serve it on a clean platter, you know. And

478
00:26:07,916 --> 00:26:11,156
Speaker 3: I like that he's messy with it and he's brave.

479
00:26:11,276 --> 00:26:14,156
Speaker 3: I'm not as brave. I'm a bit more loyal to

480
00:26:14,236 --> 00:26:19,996
Speaker 3: the recorded versions, but but he he's showed me so much.

481
00:26:20,036 --> 00:26:21,916
Speaker 3: I mean, how long you got It might be a

482
00:26:21,956 --> 00:26:24,556
Speaker 3: whole different other podcast, but yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm still

483
00:26:24,636 --> 00:26:27,356
Speaker 3: learning so much from Sam. And we just got off

484
00:26:27,396 --> 00:26:30,676
Speaker 3: a tour last year together again, which is crazy. That's now,

485
00:26:31,716 --> 00:26:34,236
Speaker 3: you know, twenty five years ago that we started touring together.

486
00:26:34,636 --> 00:26:39,276
Speaker 3: I'm still learning things and and I hope, I hope

487
00:26:39,316 --> 00:26:42,076
Speaker 3: I have a bit more steady footing to maybe where

488
00:26:42,116 --> 00:26:44,276
Speaker 3: he maybe he learns a couple of things from me

489
00:26:44,316 --> 00:26:45,036
Speaker 3: too along the way.

490
00:26:45,276 --> 00:26:46,116
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm sure.

491
00:26:46,396 --> 00:26:46,956
Speaker 3: Yeah.

492
00:26:47,316 --> 00:26:50,116
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's funny. I was listening to the album that

493
00:26:50,196 --> 00:26:54,636
Speaker 2: you put out the live at the Ryman, Yeah, and

494
00:26:54,756 --> 00:26:56,836
Speaker 2: I was thinking about the way that you play the

495
00:26:56,876 --> 00:26:59,276
Speaker 2: songs live. And it's funny that you said that about Sam,

496
00:26:59,316 --> 00:27:01,236
Speaker 2: how he has the courage to kind of like mix

497
00:27:01,276 --> 00:27:04,636
Speaker 2: stuff up or try new, try a new approach to

498
00:27:04,716 --> 00:27:07,596
Speaker 2: a song. Do you find that you play the songs

499
00:27:07,636 --> 00:27:12,636
Speaker 2: that maybe are like the bigger, like hit songs, more straight,

500
00:27:12,796 --> 00:27:15,596
Speaker 2: and then you feel more freedom to kind of bug

501
00:27:15,636 --> 00:27:18,876
Speaker 2: out on the other ones that maybe are the deeper cuts.

502
00:27:19,516 --> 00:27:23,596
Speaker 3: Well. An easy way of explaining this would be, I

503
00:27:23,636 --> 00:27:27,876
Speaker 3: don't I'm still not as like musician I'm still not

504
00:27:27,916 --> 00:27:29,876
Speaker 3: that much of a musician about it. Like I'm like,

505
00:27:30,076 --> 00:27:32,076
Speaker 3: I just want to, like I want the song to

506
00:27:32,116 --> 00:27:34,556
Speaker 3: get off, like I want it to just go. I

507
00:27:34,556 --> 00:27:38,116
Speaker 3: want the impact to be how people are feeling about

508
00:27:38,316 --> 00:27:41,916
Speaker 3: finally finally getting to experience it. I'm trying to hit

509
00:27:41,956 --> 00:27:44,476
Speaker 3: them and their feels as hard as I can. And

510
00:27:44,516 --> 00:27:48,076
Speaker 3: for me, that's like not messing up, you know, because

511
00:27:48,236 --> 00:27:51,036
Speaker 3: I think I might come on glued completely. It gets

512
00:27:51,076 --> 00:27:54,316
Speaker 3: a little bit squirrely, like even trying to jam. We've

513
00:27:54,316 --> 00:27:56,996
Speaker 3: been on like the show the Jules Holland Show out

514
00:27:56,996 --> 00:27:59,396
Speaker 3: of England, and even on like these shows where you

515
00:27:59,436 --> 00:28:01,236
Speaker 3: have to like we're gonna start the show and all

516
00:28:01,236 --> 00:28:03,276
Speaker 3: the bands are like jamming in the round. We had

517
00:28:03,276 --> 00:28:04,956
Speaker 3: to do it, like they had to start over twice,

518
00:28:04,996 --> 00:28:06,916
Speaker 3: just because I don't know how to jam bro I

519
00:28:06,916 --> 00:28:09,756
Speaker 3: don't know where to put my fingers on threat board

520
00:28:09,756 --> 00:28:15,876
Speaker 3: because these tunings are so weird it's crazy. Yeah.

521
00:28:15,916 --> 00:28:19,636
Speaker 2: I like that, all right. So I want to ask

522
00:28:19,636 --> 00:28:23,196
Speaker 2: you specifically a little bit about this album, Like now,

523
00:28:23,356 --> 00:28:28,236
Speaker 2: twenty years later, what's the personality of this album for you? Like,

524
00:28:28,276 --> 00:28:30,956
Speaker 2: how do you describe this album?

525
00:28:31,156 --> 00:28:33,716
Speaker 3: Wow? Well, I had to like go back and listen

526
00:28:33,756 --> 00:28:36,676
Speaker 3: to it, and I haven't. I never listened to our records.

527
00:28:36,676 --> 00:28:38,956
Speaker 3: Once it's done, I'm like good, you know, And it

528
00:28:39,036 --> 00:28:41,476
Speaker 3: was it was out of here, yeah, And it was

529
00:28:41,516 --> 00:28:44,396
Speaker 3: nerve wracking too for to have like this kind of

530
00:28:44,436 --> 00:28:49,396
Speaker 3: immediate success where all of a sudden, you know, we'd

531
00:28:49,436 --> 00:28:51,076
Speaker 3: walk into a bar and it was like playing on

532
00:28:51,116 --> 00:28:54,556
Speaker 3: the bar speakers, you know, and you're like, I gotta

533
00:28:54,556 --> 00:28:56,636
Speaker 3: get out of here. I can't. This is weird, you know.

534
00:28:56,996 --> 00:29:00,996
Speaker 3: So I've kind of I've hidden from it and all

535
00:29:01,036 --> 00:29:05,916
Speaker 3: of it's amateurism, I don't know. Just like the way

536
00:29:05,956 --> 00:29:07,996
Speaker 3: I sang even, I was like, oh my god, this

537
00:29:08,076 --> 00:29:12,156
Speaker 3: is so weird. It's so weird. It's like dysmorphia or

538
00:29:12,196 --> 00:29:14,516
Speaker 3: something like that. I'm like, that's so weird. I can't

539
00:29:14,556 --> 00:29:14,756
Speaker 3: you know.

540
00:29:15,196 --> 00:29:16,516
Speaker 2: And how's it different than you sing?

541
00:29:16,556 --> 00:29:16,636
Speaker 1: Now?

542
00:29:16,716 --> 00:29:19,556
Speaker 2: Would you say, oh, man.

543
00:29:19,636 --> 00:29:24,876
Speaker 3: Well, it sounds very that voice sounds very like closed

544
00:29:24,876 --> 00:29:29,676
Speaker 3: and restrained and and just not there's not enough breath

545
00:29:29,676 --> 00:29:32,476
Speaker 3: in there, and it's just it freaks me out. But

546
00:29:32,996 --> 00:29:36,756
Speaker 3: also I would still criticize the voice I have now,

547
00:29:36,916 --> 00:29:41,956
Speaker 3: I'm sure, but yeah, I had to kind of give

548
00:29:42,076 --> 00:29:45,316
Speaker 3: in to the overall vibe and just listen to what

549
00:29:45,396 --> 00:29:50,076
Speaker 3: everyone else was doing, the other musicians. Listening to them

550
00:29:50,876 --> 00:29:54,436
Speaker 3: was more like it kind of allowed me to accept

551
00:29:54,476 --> 00:29:57,916
Speaker 3: it a bit easier and get the whole vibe that

552
00:29:57,956 --> 00:30:01,436
Speaker 3: Phil the producer was making. And just the soundscapes of

553
00:30:01,476 --> 00:30:04,916
Speaker 3: everything is pretty. It was pretty revealing to me there

554
00:30:04,916 --> 00:30:06,516
Speaker 3: to day, I'm like, this is actually kind of this

555
00:30:06,916 --> 00:30:09,476
Speaker 3: kind of its kind of hits all right, got you.

556
00:30:11,236 --> 00:30:15,756
Speaker 3: I'm grateful for the for all the rough stuff back then. Yeah,

557
00:30:15,756 --> 00:30:18,036
Speaker 3: and im and I'm really proud of the other musicians

558
00:30:18,076 --> 00:30:21,036
Speaker 3: that we all punched above our weight to a great

559
00:30:21,116 --> 00:30:24,556
Speaker 3: degree to to also meet Phil's expectations, which was this

560
00:30:24,596 --> 00:30:26,756
Speaker 3: is a this is a moment in time that deserves

561
00:30:26,796 --> 00:30:31,476
Speaker 3: to be captured and preserved and uh, and you must

562
00:30:31,956 --> 00:30:35,476
Speaker 3: give it every bit of of your effort, you know,

563
00:30:35,636 --> 00:30:40,076
Speaker 3: to to really make it something bigger than yourself. And

564
00:30:40,156 --> 00:30:44,876
Speaker 3: so I see it as yeah, an an awkward, scrappy,

565
00:30:45,516 --> 00:30:49,956
Speaker 3: scrappy new dad that's uh, it's gonna take some licks

566
00:30:49,996 --> 00:30:52,516
Speaker 3: before he figures out, you know, remembers to bring diapers

567
00:30:52,516 --> 00:30:55,796
Speaker 3: with him when he goes to the store just in

568
00:30:55,836 --> 00:30:59,516
Speaker 3: case anything goes down. Yep, I listened to it last night.

569
00:30:59,556 --> 00:31:01,316
Speaker 2: I had Oh you listened to it last night.

570
00:31:01,636 --> 00:31:04,036
Speaker 3: Yeah. I listened to the first side of it two

571
00:31:04,116 --> 00:31:06,676
Speaker 3: days ago, and I was like, oh man, it's like

572
00:31:06,716 --> 00:31:08,636
Speaker 3: I don't want, I don't want to listen to the

573
00:31:08,676 --> 00:31:11,236
Speaker 3: other but I did it. I was like, I got to.

574
00:31:11,276 --> 00:31:12,916
Speaker 3: I have to do my research to make sure I

575
00:31:12,956 --> 00:31:16,036
Speaker 3: know what I'm talking about. So yeah, I'm pretty familiar

576
00:31:16,036 --> 00:31:16,356
Speaker 3: with it.

577
00:31:16,716 --> 00:31:20,756
Speaker 2: Okay, I'm sorry you had that experience.

578
00:31:22,716 --> 00:31:27,036
Speaker 3: That sounds cute. This is not good for promo, but yeah, no,

579
00:31:27,116 --> 00:31:29,156
Speaker 3: it's just it's just hard to look at old pictures

580
00:31:29,156 --> 00:31:29,676
Speaker 3: of yourself.

581
00:31:29,756 --> 00:31:34,076
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh my gosh, yes, yes, Okay, So are there

582
00:31:34,156 --> 00:31:37,876
Speaker 2: any memorable sessions you remember, like any of the songs

583
00:31:38,916 --> 00:31:44,076
Speaker 2: that you know, maybe something memorable happened in the studio

584
00:31:44,236 --> 00:31:46,116
Speaker 2: or all of a sudden the song started to work,

585
00:31:46,196 --> 00:31:49,076
Speaker 2: it makes sense, or maybe a funny story around recording

586
00:31:49,116 --> 00:31:50,276
Speaker 2: one of the songs.

587
00:31:50,876 --> 00:31:53,956
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it was I'm sure for fulfill the producer.

588
00:31:53,996 --> 00:31:59,116
Speaker 3: I'm sure it was just a you know, NonStop follies

589
00:31:59,596 --> 00:32:02,676
Speaker 3: with us. But you know, I didn't know what to

590
00:32:02,676 --> 00:32:06,716
Speaker 3: do with my hands while singing. I've only been singing

591
00:32:06,796 --> 00:32:08,636
Speaker 3: at to this point with the guitar in my hands.

592
00:32:08,636 --> 00:32:10,916
Speaker 3: So I said, you're in a studio. I didn't know

593
00:32:10,956 --> 00:32:14,076
Speaker 3: where to put my hands without making noise, like you know,

594
00:32:14,396 --> 00:32:16,916
Speaker 3: putting in my pockets and you got keys in your pockets.

595
00:32:16,916 --> 00:32:19,076
Speaker 3: Stop doing that, you know. So I took to the

596
00:32:19,076 --> 00:32:22,116
Speaker 3: only thing that was available was this like serrated bread

597
00:32:22,156 --> 00:32:25,476
Speaker 3: knife that I would like just holding my hands kind

598
00:32:25,516 --> 00:32:27,396
Speaker 3: of waving around, just to make sure I didn't make

599
00:32:27,396 --> 00:32:31,916
Speaker 3: any noise while singing. Stuff like that, I mean serious

600
00:32:31,956 --> 00:32:35,916
Speaker 3: greenhorn stuff where you just don't have any prior knowledge

601
00:32:35,916 --> 00:32:39,476
Speaker 3: of what to do much less I tell you what,

602
00:32:39,596 --> 00:32:42,676
Speaker 3: like trying to play guitar. It's one thing to like

603
00:32:42,716 --> 00:32:45,916
Speaker 3: write the songs and find the melody and then get

604
00:32:45,956 --> 00:32:49,636
Speaker 3: over yourself to write lyrics that you're not afraid to display.

605
00:32:49,676 --> 00:32:51,516
Speaker 3: But now it's like you gotta be able to play

606
00:32:51,516 --> 00:32:56,516
Speaker 3: those guitars like adequately for Phil who has a very

607
00:32:56,596 --> 00:32:59,516
Speaker 3: high standard set. So I was like, I mean, I've

608
00:32:59,556 --> 00:33:02,156
Speaker 3: never played guitar like that before, and where you're playing

609
00:33:02,196 --> 00:33:05,556
Speaker 3: something over and over trying to make someone feel good

610
00:33:05,556 --> 00:33:08,476
Speaker 3: about it, even though you know they're just like accepting

611
00:33:08,476 --> 00:33:10,316
Speaker 3: it's as good as it's going to get. You know.

612
00:33:10,876 --> 00:33:14,236
Speaker 3: That kind of that kind of pressure was like was

613
00:33:14,356 --> 00:33:16,636
Speaker 3: kind of scary, you know, or or seeing you know,

614
00:33:16,836 --> 00:33:20,516
Speaker 3: friends deal with like trying to keep a steady tempo

615
00:33:20,996 --> 00:33:24,276
Speaker 3: or to do these things that were he was really

616
00:33:24,316 --> 00:33:28,076
Speaker 3: lifting us up into a into a weight class that

617
00:33:28,076 --> 00:33:31,356
Speaker 3: we weren't ready to be in. So it was it

618
00:33:31,396 --> 00:33:37,596
Speaker 3: was terrifying and and also just being a bit clueless

619
00:33:37,676 --> 00:33:39,916
Speaker 3: that it would that it would catch on or anything

620
00:33:39,956 --> 00:33:42,596
Speaker 3: I was trying. I tried to not finish what would

621
00:33:42,596 --> 00:33:45,956
Speaker 3: become like our flagship or bell Cow song the funeral.

622
00:33:46,316 --> 00:33:47,996
Speaker 3: I was like, Oh, we'll just save it for the

623
00:33:48,036 --> 00:33:50,196
Speaker 3: next one. It's too hard to pull off. We'll just

624
00:33:50,196 --> 00:33:53,436
Speaker 3: put this other song on there instead. And I think

625
00:33:54,156 --> 00:33:56,836
Speaker 3: Phil and the label were like, bro, finish that song

626
00:33:56,956 --> 00:34:00,116
Speaker 3: that is like the song you know, the I was

627
00:34:00,156 --> 00:34:02,316
Speaker 3: just clueless, you know, I didn't even want and when

628
00:34:02,316 --> 00:34:04,036
Speaker 3: we were done, I didn't even choose that one to

629
00:34:04,036 --> 00:34:07,116
Speaker 3: be a single. I'm like, I've always been clueless about

630
00:34:07,156 --> 00:34:10,676
Speaker 3: like what are gonna like about it? I guess. So

631
00:34:10,716 --> 00:34:13,716
Speaker 3: I'm just like, I guess it's if I remember anything.

632
00:34:13,956 --> 00:34:17,116
Speaker 3: Is that I didn't know nothing, you know, and I

633
00:34:17,156 --> 00:34:17,956
Speaker 3: still kind of don't.

634
00:34:18,476 --> 00:34:21,236
Speaker 2: Yeah, what were you writing the funeral about? Do you

635
00:34:21,236 --> 00:34:23,476
Speaker 2: remember what was happening in your life at that time,

636
00:34:23,716 --> 00:34:25,636
Speaker 2: like what you were even thinking about.

637
00:34:26,756 --> 00:34:31,636
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, I think it's a mixture of living out

638
00:34:31,836 --> 00:34:35,876
Speaker 3: west and having to go home for like Christmas to

639
00:34:35,916 --> 00:34:38,276
Speaker 3: like see my family and stuff like that, and like

640
00:34:38,956 --> 00:34:44,476
Speaker 3: having to like deal with I don't know, like uh,

641
00:34:45,356 --> 00:34:49,996
Speaker 3: just awkward conversations and just social anxiety. I think social

642
00:34:50,036 --> 00:34:53,036
Speaker 3: anxiety was a big part of it, where I'm just like, oh,

643
00:34:53,116 --> 00:34:57,036
Speaker 3: this is all just this is all brutal. I don't

644
00:34:57,036 --> 00:34:59,716
Speaker 3: want to have to like talk in front of people

645
00:34:59,996 --> 00:35:04,156
Speaker 3: and like answer questions about myself. And then the growing

646
00:35:04,236 --> 00:35:09,316
Speaker 3: anxiety I think of just growing older and the fear

647
00:35:09,316 --> 00:35:17,196
Speaker 3: of the fear of losing like my parents and and

648
00:35:17,276 --> 00:35:22,516
Speaker 3: that like I'm just yeah, death, losing people like to death,

649
00:35:22,676 --> 00:35:26,556
Speaker 3: or or even sometimes hearing you know, other people's stories,

650
00:35:26,596 --> 00:35:30,156
Speaker 3: you know, some when people lose unrequired love or whatever.

651
00:35:30,276 --> 00:35:34,436
Speaker 3: You know, it's like, uh, it just it really messes

652
00:35:34,436 --> 00:35:37,396
Speaker 3: me up, I guess, and yeah, still does to this day.

653
00:35:37,436 --> 00:35:42,756
Speaker 3: I'm still terrified of of dealing with when people got

654
00:35:42,756 --> 00:35:46,596
Speaker 3: to go move on. So uh yeah, I think there was.

655
00:35:46,676 --> 00:35:48,716
Speaker 3: It was a mixture of those things, my own crippling

656
00:35:48,756 --> 00:35:53,676
Speaker 3: social anxiety and then the fear of mortality.

657
00:35:54,556 --> 00:35:56,836
Speaker 2: Had you lost anyone who was close to you at that.

658
00:35:56,836 --> 00:36:01,996
Speaker 3: Point friends, Yeah, but no real close family members to

659
00:36:02,076 --> 00:36:04,956
Speaker 3: that point. Yeaheah, nothing, It.

660
00:36:05,036 --> 00:36:06,876
Speaker 2: Was just more of a fear of it rather than

661
00:36:06,916 --> 00:36:07,756
Speaker 2: an experience.

662
00:36:07,956 --> 00:36:10,716
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, which is which is maybe just a human

663
00:36:10,756 --> 00:36:13,916
Speaker 3: condition thing that I just happened to have elevated or something.

664
00:36:15,476 --> 00:36:18,716
Speaker 3: And sometimes yeah, it's other people's stories make me cry

665
00:36:18,956 --> 00:36:23,236
Speaker 3: like that, just people like people go through that pain.

666
00:36:24,076 --> 00:36:28,676
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, do you remember what it was about that song?

667
00:36:28,756 --> 00:36:31,756
Speaker 2: Like at what point were you were you stuck? Like

668
00:36:31,796 --> 00:36:34,956
Speaker 2: what made it hard for you to finish the guitar?

669
00:36:35,156 --> 00:36:37,836
Speaker 3: The guitar? I remember, I was just getting kind of

670
00:36:39,396 --> 00:36:44,716
Speaker 3: exhausted by Phil's expectations of where it needed to get to,

671
00:36:45,276 --> 00:36:48,316
Speaker 3: you know, and I physically didn't feel like I could

672
00:36:48,316 --> 00:36:53,156
Speaker 3: pull it off, so I just had to. I think

673
00:36:53,196 --> 00:36:56,036
Speaker 3: I probably gave up at least one time. I was like,

674
00:36:56,076 --> 00:36:58,596
Speaker 3: I don't know, I can do it. It's just if

675
00:36:58,596 --> 00:37:00,836
Speaker 3: it's not good enough for you, we'll just put it

676
00:37:00,876 --> 00:37:03,156
Speaker 3: on the next album. I'll get better Phil, you know.

677
00:37:04,756 --> 00:37:10,596
Speaker 3: But no, I think it was just a growing moment

678
00:37:10,636 --> 00:37:12,756
Speaker 3: where I had to get up and play big boy ball.

679
00:37:13,356 --> 00:37:15,276
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, Well that's good that you didn't have

680
00:37:15,316 --> 00:37:17,356
Speaker 2: someone else step in and just do the guitar part.

681
00:37:18,356 --> 00:37:18,676
Speaker 2: You could have.

682
00:37:18,756 --> 00:37:20,676
Speaker 3: Just sure I still had help. Don't worry. I'm sure.

683
00:37:20,676 --> 00:37:23,436
Speaker 3: I okay, I'm sure I still had the village lifting

684
00:37:23,476 --> 00:37:24,276
Speaker 3: me up. Don't worry.

685
00:37:24,796 --> 00:37:26,876
Speaker 2: Who else had Phil work? What other bands had Phil

686
00:37:26,876 --> 00:37:28,996
Speaker 2: worked with at the time, Like were you thinking of

687
00:37:28,996 --> 00:37:30,956
Speaker 2: those people? And be like damn when he worked with

688
00:37:31,356 --> 00:37:33,436
Speaker 2: the Black Crows, like they were probably killing it? Or

689
00:37:33,476 --> 00:37:34,516
Speaker 2: whoever he worked with?

690
00:37:34,956 --> 00:37:38,716
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, he was working with a lot of bands

691
00:37:38,716 --> 00:37:41,116
Speaker 3: that I admired, like and do you still like Built

692
00:37:41,116 --> 00:37:49,236
Speaker 3: the Spill and Modest Mouse and the Shins and God

693
00:37:49,356 --> 00:37:52,876
Speaker 3: Countless bands, Lesavi FIV was a band that I really love.

694
00:37:53,316 --> 00:38:00,356
Speaker 3: And the guitars and stuff his his his vivid sound

695
00:38:00,836 --> 00:38:04,516
Speaker 3: textures and things were or what drew me to him

696
00:38:04,676 --> 00:38:07,556
Speaker 3: wanting to work with him. But then it's like immediately

697
00:38:07,556 --> 00:38:10,676
Speaker 3: like Buyer's remorse were like, I'm gonna have to I'm

698
00:38:10,676 --> 00:38:13,036
Speaker 3: really going to have to get my level up to

699
00:38:13,156 --> 00:38:15,036
Speaker 3: what he needs to be able to pull that off.

700
00:38:15,076 --> 00:38:16,956
Speaker 2: You know, that's a nice challenge though.

701
00:38:17,796 --> 00:38:20,116
Speaker 3: It's helped. I mean it it helped, you know, move

702
00:38:20,196 --> 00:38:23,836
Speaker 3: us up another step into being to being whatever we

703
00:38:23,916 --> 00:38:29,396
Speaker 3: are now, whatever that is.

704
00:38:31,236 --> 00:38:33,556
Speaker 1: Well, nas break and we're back with Ben Bridwell.

705
00:38:38,036 --> 00:38:40,236
Speaker 2: So you said that the album kind of started to

706
00:38:40,276 --> 00:38:42,796
Speaker 2: pick up. How did you know, Like, how did you

707
00:38:42,916 --> 00:38:45,516
Speaker 2: know that it was? You said you would hear it

708
00:38:45,676 --> 00:38:48,436
Speaker 2: when you walked into bars. Was it being played on

709
00:38:48,476 --> 00:38:50,876
Speaker 2: the radio? Like how did you get a sense that?

710
00:38:50,956 --> 00:38:55,036
Speaker 2: It was? Kind of like catching on your time back then?

711
00:38:55,636 --> 00:38:57,876
Speaker 3: For sure? And we were so lucky to have to

712
00:38:57,996 --> 00:39:03,796
Speaker 3: be in Seattle where k XB was lifting up so many,

713
00:39:03,996 --> 00:39:07,316
Speaker 3: so many local bands. I mean, they've really helped grow

714
00:39:07,356 --> 00:39:09,836
Speaker 3: a scene. And I knew it from work and the

715
00:39:09,916 --> 00:39:12,596
Speaker 3: label side of it and getting some of my bands

716
00:39:12,716 --> 00:39:15,196
Speaker 3: over to k XP, you know. So it was amazing

717
00:39:15,236 --> 00:39:18,556
Speaker 3: to be on that receiving end of their affection at

718
00:39:18,556 --> 00:39:21,916
Speaker 3: the time, and it starts to pick up I think

719
00:39:21,996 --> 00:39:26,716
Speaker 3: the real like because very early in the process, we

720
00:39:26,756 --> 00:39:29,396
Speaker 3: went to Europe to play a couple of shows, and

721
00:39:29,836 --> 00:39:33,316
Speaker 3: we played in Norway at this festival, and people, these

722
00:39:33,356 --> 00:39:37,396
Speaker 3: Norwegian people were singing back to us. Whether it was

723
00:39:37,556 --> 00:39:41,516
Speaker 3: correct or not, it was just like mind blowing. These

724
00:39:41,556 --> 00:39:45,356
Speaker 3: people even heard of us and decided to come watch

725
00:39:46,076 --> 00:39:48,676
Speaker 3: and listen. But the fact that they knew the words

726
00:39:48,716 --> 00:39:51,876
Speaker 3: to our songs is like, this is something that I mean,

727
00:39:51,876 --> 00:39:55,596
Speaker 3: that was like huge expectation blown right there. You know,

728
00:39:56,076 --> 00:39:59,196
Speaker 3: we actually might we actually might be here for a bit.

729
00:40:00,036 --> 00:40:02,636
Speaker 2: That's cool. What was your first time in Europe?

730
00:40:02,716 --> 00:40:09,636
Speaker 3: Like, oh, Greenhorns? Just you know, we already you know,

731
00:40:09,676 --> 00:40:13,876
Speaker 3: we I've I had no problem living that that cliche

732
00:40:14,196 --> 00:40:18,356
Speaker 3: of like let's let's go get it, you know, let's

733
00:40:18,396 --> 00:40:24,436
Speaker 3: drink all the drinks and and be silly, you know,

734
00:40:24,556 --> 00:40:27,116
Speaker 3: and be and kind of ride the wave of it

735
00:40:27,116 --> 00:40:30,076
Speaker 3: because it's probably fleeting, you know, it's it's more than

736
00:40:30,196 --> 00:40:37,036
Speaker 3: likely fleeting. So we enjoyed ourselves and shortly thereafter real

737
00:40:37,076 --> 00:40:42,396
Speaker 3: life luckily intervened and and I had my first child,

738
00:40:42,516 --> 00:40:45,476
Speaker 3: like along before the second record came out, So we

739
00:40:45,516 --> 00:40:47,916
Speaker 3: didn't get all that. It wasn't all that long of

740
00:40:47,956 --> 00:40:51,956
Speaker 3: getting to live like this, you know, kind of imaginary

741
00:40:52,036 --> 00:40:55,556
Speaker 3: rock star thing. It was real life came to help

742
00:40:55,596 --> 00:40:56,596
Speaker 3: ground me pretty soon.

743
00:40:56,836 --> 00:40:59,556
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that'll do. The kid'll do that. Did you

744
00:40:59,556 --> 00:41:02,276
Speaker 2: ever get to like tear up a hotel room or

745
00:41:02,316 --> 00:41:04,156
Speaker 2: anything like that, like throw TV's out the.

746
00:41:04,116 --> 00:41:09,676
Speaker 3: Window, y'all? I am way too respectful to do that.

747
00:41:09,876 --> 00:41:13,276
Speaker 3: I would Oh my god, my parents, they would, they

748
00:41:13,276 --> 00:41:16,436
Speaker 3: would be so disappointed in me. There's no way, no,

749
00:41:16,556 --> 00:41:19,796
Speaker 3: there's no way. I'm not trashing any I clean up

750
00:41:19,836 --> 00:41:22,956
Speaker 3: for the housekeeping, you know, I do. I still to

751
00:41:22,996 --> 00:41:24,556
Speaker 3: this day, will clean up for housekeeping.

752
00:41:24,996 --> 00:41:28,436
Speaker 2: That's so nice? Was it so once you once you

753
00:41:29,676 --> 00:41:33,716
Speaker 2: were experiencing that, like fame and riding high and partying

754
00:41:33,756 --> 00:41:36,636
Speaker 2: and all that, Like, was that different than you expected

755
00:41:36,636 --> 00:41:39,076
Speaker 2: it to be? Or was it exactly what you hoped

756
00:41:39,116 --> 00:41:39,516
Speaker 2: it was?

757
00:41:41,316 --> 00:41:44,156
Speaker 3: All the expectations were being exceeded, There's no doubt. So

758
00:41:44,196 --> 00:41:46,996
Speaker 3: it's hard to be prepared for what you what your

759
00:41:47,036 --> 00:41:50,436
Speaker 3: personality might be like in those situations. But I already knew.

760
00:41:50,516 --> 00:41:53,236
Speaker 3: I already knew that was kind of not much of

761
00:41:53,276 --> 00:41:56,156
Speaker 3: a joiner for one. I'm not like a Jam. I

762
00:41:56,156 --> 00:41:58,756
Speaker 3: don't want to get together in Jam like I'm not

763
00:41:59,436 --> 00:42:02,796
Speaker 3: and I'm also not like trying to rung up on

764
00:42:02,876 --> 00:42:08,956
Speaker 3: the ladder, and I'm a bit nervous with meeting here

765
00:42:09,756 --> 00:42:15,356
Speaker 3: or or even like like industry people and stuff like.

766
00:42:15,916 --> 00:42:18,756
Speaker 3: I'm not much of a joiner. So I shouldn't have

767
00:42:19,036 --> 00:42:24,476
Speaker 3: I shouldn't be surprised by how lonely the job would be.

768
00:42:24,796 --> 00:42:28,236
Speaker 3: I shouldn't. I shouldn't be surprised by it because I'm

769
00:42:28,276 --> 00:42:32,196
Speaker 3: already a bit of an isolated kind of personality anyways.

770
00:42:33,476 --> 00:42:36,836
Speaker 3: But maybe the fact that I didn't expect it to

771
00:42:37,116 --> 00:42:42,796
Speaker 3: kind of become the safe place. And you know, when

772
00:42:42,836 --> 00:42:46,396
Speaker 3: your ego is people can you know, pump up your

773
00:42:46,396 --> 00:42:51,236
Speaker 3: ego at every every turn. I'm surprised that I was

774
00:42:51,276 --> 00:42:54,956
Speaker 3: able to want to avoid it, you know, like I

775
00:42:54,956 --> 00:42:57,116
Speaker 3: don't want that. I don't want to see us on

776
00:42:57,236 --> 00:42:59,476
Speaker 3: the late night TV thing. I'm not gonna watch it.

777
00:43:00,036 --> 00:43:03,716
Speaker 3: I'm not gonna watch the performance. I'm not gonna listen

778
00:43:03,756 --> 00:43:09,916
Speaker 3: to this. So I'm I'm glad that I've been able

779
00:43:09,956 --> 00:43:12,316
Speaker 3: to avoid a lot of that ego pump and stuff.

780
00:43:12,396 --> 00:43:15,716
Speaker 3: But I'm sure it finds its way in other ways.

781
00:43:15,436 --> 00:43:18,596
Speaker 2: You know how is a transition for you becoming a dad,

782
00:43:18,756 --> 00:43:21,956
Speaker 2: like transitioning from Okay, we got we have the albums out,

783
00:43:21,996 --> 00:43:25,756
Speaker 2: it's doing well, we're touring internationally, and then you come

784
00:43:25,796 --> 00:43:28,636
Speaker 2: home and have such a different life, the domestic life.

785
00:43:29,116 --> 00:43:29,836
Speaker 2: How is that for you?

786
00:43:30,596 --> 00:43:35,356
Speaker 3: Well, I'm still evolving and learning. You know, I'm forty seven,

787
00:43:35,436 --> 00:43:40,156
Speaker 3: I have four children. They're all daughters in between the

788
00:43:40,196 --> 00:43:43,676
Speaker 3: ages of ten and seventeen. So we're like, we're in

789
00:43:43,716 --> 00:43:47,956
Speaker 3: a wild spot right now. But it's amazing and I'm

790
00:43:48,116 --> 00:43:51,956
Speaker 3: so I just I love this. I love this time

791
00:43:51,956 --> 00:43:54,636
Speaker 3: that we have right now in their development and their

792
00:43:54,676 --> 00:43:58,716
Speaker 3: brain growth and our bonding time is just so amazing.

793
00:43:58,836 --> 00:44:02,516
Speaker 3: And it's only got room to still grow bigger. And

794
00:44:01,996 --> 00:44:05,556
Speaker 3: I'm so enthused by them. They are my masterpiece. And

795
00:44:05,596 --> 00:44:09,476
Speaker 3: this music thing is kind of a byproduct, honestly. Oh

796
00:44:10,996 --> 00:44:15,916
Speaker 3: and so it's it's it's there's been a learning curve too,

797
00:44:15,956 --> 00:44:20,476
Speaker 3: of just I think with anybody, you're you're learning to

798
00:44:20,596 --> 00:44:24,876
Speaker 3: be less selfish and more patient and things like that.

799
00:44:25,116 --> 00:44:28,036
Speaker 3: So I'm still I'm still growing in that. But I

800
00:44:28,036 --> 00:44:32,116
Speaker 3: feel like I'm in a really great spot where I

801
00:44:32,156 --> 00:44:33,796
Speaker 3: don't know, I'm just I feel like the sky is

802
00:44:33,836 --> 00:44:39,076
Speaker 3: the limit for us and our love for one another. So, uh,

803
00:44:39,276 --> 00:44:43,516
Speaker 3: it's only getting better, and it's it's only getting bigger.

804
00:44:43,676 --> 00:44:46,796
Speaker 3: And I feel like I'm I have more patients to

805
00:44:46,956 --> 00:44:50,236
Speaker 3: ride with them through all this you know, development they're

806
00:44:50,236 --> 00:44:52,996
Speaker 3: going through and whatever they need from me. So I'm

807
00:44:53,116 --> 00:44:54,916
Speaker 3: I'm here for and more.

808
00:44:55,476 --> 00:44:59,876
Speaker 2: How's the co parenting situation going? How's the post divorce?

809
00:45:01,916 --> 00:45:03,516
Speaker 2: I mean, if you don't want to answer that, that's

810
00:45:03,556 --> 00:45:04,596
Speaker 2: totally fine. We don't even know.

811
00:45:05,436 --> 00:45:07,796
Speaker 3: I'm an open book with respect.

812
00:45:08,076 --> 00:45:13,236
Speaker 4: Uh yeah, it's it's you know, it's it's it's strange

813
00:45:13,276 --> 00:45:16,836
Speaker 4: because you have to let go of how someone else

814
00:45:16,916 --> 00:45:18,956
Speaker 4: is parenting your children and you have to be able

815
00:45:18,996 --> 00:45:22,996
Speaker 4: to allow them to also live their life and how

816
00:45:23,036 --> 00:45:23,956
Speaker 4: they see things, you know.

817
00:45:23,996 --> 00:45:28,076
Speaker 3: So that's that's really the the balance you're trying to seek.

818
00:45:28,116 --> 00:45:33,516
Speaker 3: And and I'm lucky to co parent with with the

819
00:45:33,556 --> 00:45:36,396
Speaker 3: woman that you know, we have at least like the

820
00:45:36,436 --> 00:45:40,516
Speaker 3: same core values and and that helps that that helps

821
00:45:40,556 --> 00:45:45,556
Speaker 3: answer a lot of questions. You know. Yeah, but it's

822
00:45:45,636 --> 00:45:48,676
Speaker 3: you know, not being married to some anymore. I'm like,

823
00:45:49,396 --> 00:45:52,076
Speaker 3: I've really been able to discover who I truly am

824
00:45:52,156 --> 00:45:55,236
Speaker 3: when I'm by myself and and what I expect in

825
00:45:55,316 --> 00:46:00,716
Speaker 3: any sort of partnership really, And god, I'm just so happy.

826
00:46:00,876 --> 00:46:04,516
Speaker 3: I'm just like so happy, and I'm good. I'm just

827
00:46:05,076 --> 00:46:08,276
Speaker 3: I'm just in such a good, happy place with being

828
00:46:09,276 --> 00:46:12,036
Speaker 3: in my own piece, you know, and just and and

829
00:46:12,076 --> 00:46:15,556
Speaker 3: creating a beautiful piece with my children that uh, no

830
00:46:15,556 --> 00:46:17,716
Speaker 3: one's allowed to mess it up, including me, you know.

831
00:46:18,316 --> 00:46:21,356
Speaker 2: Good good. I feel like the most recent interviews I

832
00:46:21,356 --> 00:46:23,356
Speaker 2: saw with you, you weren't. It didn't seem like you were.

833
00:46:23,956 --> 00:46:27,676
Speaker 2: Maybe it was more fresh and so I think maybe

834
00:46:27,676 --> 00:46:30,316
Speaker 2: you weren't as in such a settled place. So that's

835
00:46:30,316 --> 00:46:30,796
Speaker 2: good to hear.

836
00:46:30,956 --> 00:46:33,396
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, well, well I'll tell you what. For me,

837
00:46:33,796 --> 00:46:37,516
Speaker 3: and this job helped a lot to fuel even the

838
00:46:37,516 --> 00:46:42,876
Speaker 3: genetic curse of alcoholism. Uh and uh, you know, riding

839
00:46:42,956 --> 00:46:48,436
Speaker 3: with that through this crazy job was an interesting, interesting,

840
00:46:48,676 --> 00:46:52,236
Speaker 3: interesting road to fallow. But uh, I finally got that

841
00:46:52,956 --> 00:46:54,636
Speaker 3: nipped in the bud a couple of years ago, and

842
00:46:54,676 --> 00:46:59,396
Speaker 3: that has just been amazing. From my own piece, and

843
00:46:59,396 --> 00:47:02,116
Speaker 3: and just being able to deal with the world in general. Honestly,

844
00:47:02,156 --> 00:47:08,356
Speaker 3: it's it's night and day. How easier things are. I

845
00:47:08,436 --> 00:47:09,876
Speaker 3: quit you're at home.

846
00:47:10,716 --> 00:47:11,716
Speaker 2: Just like cold turkey.

847
00:47:12,196 --> 00:47:14,676
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I just kind of weaned myself off and

848
00:47:15,636 --> 00:47:17,676
Speaker 3: set a goal and never looked back.

849
00:47:18,236 --> 00:47:19,276
Speaker 2: Good for you.

850
00:47:19,396 --> 00:47:22,196
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's awesome. I'm really I'm having a great time

851
00:47:22,356 --> 00:47:26,396
Speaker 3: and everything's easier. Honestly, Yeah, everything's just easier. I Mean

852
00:47:26,756 --> 00:47:28,756
Speaker 3: there's times where I'm like, God, it'd be easier at

853
00:47:28,756 --> 00:47:30,996
Speaker 3: the social function to get you know, to get some

854
00:47:31,076 --> 00:47:34,716
Speaker 3: drinks up in here or do with this anxiety. But

855
00:47:34,956 --> 00:47:37,316
Speaker 3: I found with uh, it was it was kind of

856
00:47:37,356 --> 00:47:40,716
Speaker 3: fueling more anxiety for me trying trying to kind of

857
00:47:40,796 --> 00:47:44,876
Speaker 3: kill that imposter syndrome and stuff like that. That just

858
00:47:44,916 --> 00:47:47,796
Speaker 3: the natural it's there backstage. You kind of get used

859
00:47:47,836 --> 00:47:52,036
Speaker 3: to trying to bury those feelings of you know, awkwardness

860
00:47:52,036 --> 00:47:54,876
Speaker 3: on the road and missing people at home, all those

861
00:47:54,876 --> 00:47:56,876
Speaker 3: feelings you're trying to bury them with that. But it

862
00:47:56,916 --> 00:48:01,476
Speaker 3: was only creating more anxiety for me to where I

863
00:48:01,516 --> 00:48:05,036
Speaker 3: was like, oh, what if we eliminated that one and see,

864
00:48:05,396 --> 00:48:07,916
Speaker 3: let's try to see if that helps in Uh. Yeah,

865
00:48:08,076 --> 00:48:12,436
Speaker 3: it just opened my world to a whole lot more,

866
00:48:13,996 --> 00:48:17,996
Speaker 3: a whole just big, brighter space to feel at peace

867
00:48:18,116 --> 00:48:21,196
Speaker 3: and to navigate, to navigate any kind of troubles.

868
00:48:22,556 --> 00:48:25,076
Speaker 2: How has it been with songwriting, Like has that changed

869
00:48:25,076 --> 00:48:28,316
Speaker 2: your processes at all writing new songs, like not being

870
00:48:28,356 --> 00:48:32,876
Speaker 2: able to drink or I imagine drinking was maybe somehow

871
00:48:32,916 --> 00:48:36,436
Speaker 2: part of that process. Did you have any fear that, like, oh,

872
00:48:36,556 --> 00:48:38,836
Speaker 2: maybe I can't write as well now?

873
00:48:39,716 --> 00:48:42,436
Speaker 3: Well, I think it still kind of persists in that.

874
00:48:42,596 --> 00:48:46,756
Speaker 3: I'm like, I used to go escape to write and drink,

875
00:48:47,156 --> 00:48:48,756
Speaker 3: you know what I mean. So it's like now that

876
00:48:49,756 --> 00:48:51,636
Speaker 3: you're only escaping to go I need to go escape

877
00:48:51,676 --> 00:48:54,236
Speaker 3: to the writing aspect, It's like, oh, there was this

878
00:48:54,276 --> 00:48:57,796
Speaker 3: whole other thing. I was a destination I was reaching too,

879
00:48:57,836 --> 00:49:00,556
Speaker 3: which was to finally be able to like to booze,

880
00:49:00,996 --> 00:49:05,356
Speaker 3: and so to get the motivation is different, right, Like

881
00:49:06,316 --> 00:49:08,676
Speaker 3: because it used to be like, Okay, I'm escaping like

882
00:49:09,476 --> 00:49:11,676
Speaker 3: this marriage for a second to go right you know.

883
00:49:12,876 --> 00:49:15,796
Speaker 3: Now it's like, damn, I'm so easy with everything. In

884
00:49:15,836 --> 00:49:17,676
Speaker 3: a way, it's like, Okay, I have to like force

885
00:49:17,796 --> 00:49:20,676
Speaker 3: myself to go deal with this stuff, you know, to

886
00:49:20,716 --> 00:49:24,596
Speaker 3: like or to like tap into things, you know, themes

887
00:49:24,996 --> 00:49:29,716
Speaker 3: that are uncomfortable to kind of to tread in. It's

888
00:49:29,796 --> 00:49:32,436
Speaker 3: it's it's harder to get the motivation to go into

889
00:49:32,516 --> 00:49:36,996
Speaker 3: the lab, you know what I mean. But I've found

890
00:49:37,156 --> 00:49:42,276
Speaker 3: that the clarity with which the job is performed is

891
00:49:42,316 --> 00:49:46,556
Speaker 3: a bit more keen, you know, I feel like, uh

892
00:49:46,596 --> 00:49:50,716
Speaker 3: and I feel totally different in the studio now, like

893
00:49:51,236 --> 00:49:54,316
Speaker 3: and singing on a mic, and and because I would

894
00:49:54,316 --> 00:49:57,476
Speaker 3: also even in the studio just like drinking to you know,

895
00:49:57,636 --> 00:50:01,356
Speaker 3: kill the kill the feelings, yeah, and kill the scaries.

896
00:50:01,396 --> 00:50:04,396
Speaker 3: But uh now I'm I feel like I sing better,

897
00:50:04,716 --> 00:50:08,116
Speaker 3: I perform better. Everything I do is just easier. So

898
00:50:09,876 --> 00:50:12,236
Speaker 3: like even with the new record, yet it's been hard

899
00:50:12,276 --> 00:50:18,196
Speaker 3: to find the damn the gut to go and really spill.

900
00:50:19,676 --> 00:50:23,996
Speaker 3: I do feel like the product isn't isn't diluted in

901
00:50:24,036 --> 00:50:27,476
Speaker 3: any way. The despair is the despair is still there,

902
00:50:27,556 --> 00:50:29,956
Speaker 3: you know, and the imagination is still there. I haven't

903
00:50:29,996 --> 00:50:32,116
Speaker 3: lost a minute of that. If anything, I feel like

904
00:50:32,196 --> 00:50:36,396
Speaker 3: my my mental capacity is just is a bit more focused.

905
00:50:36,716 --> 00:50:37,916
Speaker 3: It's so cool, I.

906
00:50:37,876 --> 00:50:40,636
Speaker 2: Hope, so amazing. Like still at this age, we're the

907
00:50:40,636 --> 00:50:43,996
Speaker 2: same age, but still at this age you can kind

908
00:50:44,036 --> 00:50:45,676
Speaker 2: of repair yourself.

909
00:50:45,316 --> 00:50:49,196
Speaker 3: Like that, really can, you really can. And it's never

910
00:50:49,236 --> 00:50:52,236
Speaker 3: too late. It's never too late to reverse the curse

911
00:50:52,316 --> 00:50:56,076
Speaker 3: whatever it may be. You know, I'm so just as

912
00:50:56,116 --> 00:50:59,156
Speaker 3: much as like you know, falling into this this band

913
00:50:59,196 --> 00:51:01,636
Speaker 3: thing and writing the songs. It's it's like, oh my god,

914
00:51:01,676 --> 00:51:05,036
Speaker 3: it's like it feels like a manifestation, you know, And

915
00:51:05,356 --> 00:51:08,236
Speaker 3: it kind of it happened, you know, out of nowhere.

916
00:51:08,276 --> 00:51:12,236
Speaker 3: I had no business being getting signed to subpoth and

917
00:51:12,436 --> 00:51:15,076
Speaker 3: going to Europe and stuff. I had no business doing that.

918
00:51:15,156 --> 00:51:19,036
Speaker 3: But here we are. I had no business also bucking

919
00:51:19,036 --> 00:51:23,996
Speaker 3: the trend of my ancestors and getting that thing turned

920
00:51:24,036 --> 00:51:29,156
Speaker 3: in the other direction. So yeah, it's anyone can do it.

921
00:51:29,156 --> 00:51:31,516
Speaker 3: You just gotta just kind of gotta buck up and

922
00:51:32,356 --> 00:51:33,356
Speaker 3: you know, hit it head on.

923
00:51:34,076 --> 00:51:36,036
Speaker 2: It takes a lot of guts, and it takes a

924
00:51:36,036 --> 00:51:38,796
Speaker 2: lot of perseverance too, because it's not easy.

925
00:51:40,076 --> 00:51:42,796
Speaker 3: Oh but it's easy once you start feeling good, once

926
00:51:42,836 --> 00:51:43,396
Speaker 3: you start.

927
00:51:43,156 --> 00:51:45,556
Speaker 2: Feeling till you start feeling better.

928
00:51:46,716 --> 00:51:49,916
Speaker 3: I would say I started to really notice that my

929
00:51:50,076 --> 00:51:54,276
Speaker 3: mood was so much lighter. I wouldn't say, like a

930
00:51:54,396 --> 00:51:56,636
Speaker 3: month and a half, two months, and I'm like, I

931
00:51:56,716 --> 00:52:00,276
Speaker 3: just felt a weight less weight on me, you know,

932
00:52:00,516 --> 00:52:04,996
Speaker 3: and my my good moods were lasting longer. Yeah, you know,

933
00:52:05,196 --> 00:52:08,996
Speaker 3: I was just yeah, just oh my god. Everything immediately

934
00:52:09,276 --> 00:52:11,676
Speaker 3: started to feel like it was easier to deal with

935
00:52:11,916 --> 00:52:15,796
Speaker 3: on a phone call, face to face and da Dennis office,

936
00:52:16,196 --> 00:52:18,436
Speaker 3: you know what I mean, or going to the school

937
00:52:18,476 --> 00:52:20,396
Speaker 3: functions and stuff. I'm not hiding a secret.

938
00:52:20,796 --> 00:52:23,236
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, oh yeah, yeah that was brutal.

939
00:52:23,276 --> 00:52:25,476
Speaker 3: It's like you kind of always feel like you are

940
00:52:25,556 --> 00:52:28,836
Speaker 3: kind of like living this like dark other life kind

941
00:52:28,916 --> 00:52:31,756
Speaker 3: of thing that these the the rest of society. They

942
00:52:31,796 --> 00:52:34,316
Speaker 3: know that you're different because of your job in a way, right,

943
00:52:34,556 --> 00:52:36,716
Speaker 3: But when you're mixing and mingling with all these kids,

944
00:52:36,836 --> 00:52:39,356
Speaker 3: parents and teachers and stuff like that, it's like, oh,

945
00:52:39,396 --> 00:52:43,316
Speaker 3: you have no idea the darkness I'm caring around. Oh yeah,

946
00:52:44,036 --> 00:52:44,596
Speaker 3: not anymore.

947
00:52:44,716 --> 00:52:46,676
Speaker 2: I bet a lot of people have stuff though, you

948
00:52:46,716 --> 00:52:49,716
Speaker 2: know for sure it's a lot of people have stuff.

949
00:52:54,036 --> 00:52:55,916
Speaker 2: So tell me about the new album. What point in

950
00:52:55,916 --> 00:52:57,196
Speaker 2: the process are you at right now?

951
00:52:57,756 --> 00:53:00,796
Speaker 3: Supposed to be sending it to mixing was supposed to

952
00:53:00,916 --> 00:53:03,796
Speaker 3: about a couple of weeks ago. I'm I'm really trying

953
00:53:03,796 --> 00:53:06,276
Speaker 3: to strike a balance of being at home and working too.

954
00:53:06,756 --> 00:53:09,676
Speaker 3: But there's still some growing pains going on here where

955
00:53:09,716 --> 00:53:14,476
Speaker 3: I'm like it's hard to have my foot and and

956
00:53:14,476 --> 00:53:18,036
Speaker 3: and that creative space like that where because I really

957
00:53:18,076 --> 00:53:20,596
Speaker 3: dig in and I'm I'm all in when i'm and

958
00:53:20,636 --> 00:53:22,596
Speaker 3: I'm usually out of town when I do it when

959
00:53:22,596 --> 00:53:27,236
Speaker 3: it's time to like finish a project, especially to get

960
00:53:27,276 --> 00:53:30,276
Speaker 3: over that finish line. But right now I'm like, oh,

961
00:53:30,596 --> 00:53:33,196
Speaker 3: I'm not I'm not ready to send it all in yet.

962
00:53:33,236 --> 00:53:35,956
Speaker 3: So I'm I'm still himming in the hauling on a

963
00:53:35,996 --> 00:53:40,196
Speaker 3: couple of lyrical things. And I'm just like, come on,

964
00:53:40,236 --> 00:53:42,876
Speaker 3: You're better than this, bro, You're better than this. Don't

965
00:53:42,916 --> 00:53:47,076
Speaker 3: be don't be so basic. I just I kick my

966
00:53:47,156 --> 00:53:49,796
Speaker 3: own butt throughout the entire process. I'm sure I've done

967
00:53:49,836 --> 00:53:52,756
Speaker 3: it for every other project. It's just that I'm like,

968
00:53:52,956 --> 00:53:55,596
Speaker 3: I'm finding a new excuse. I'm like, well, if if

969
00:53:55,636 --> 00:53:58,236
Speaker 3: I was in a dang hotel room at night, you know,

970
00:53:58,316 --> 00:54:01,356
Speaker 3: and just like only thinking of that instead of like, oh, dang,

971
00:54:01,356 --> 00:54:05,036
Speaker 3: I gotta get kid to an orthodontist appointment tomorrow. You know,

972
00:54:05,076 --> 00:54:07,436
Speaker 3: I'm looking for excuses of why I'm not finishing it.

973
00:54:07,556 --> 00:54:11,796
Speaker 3: But but the answer would be it's just not good

974
00:54:11,876 --> 00:54:12,436
Speaker 3: enough yet.

975
00:54:12,516 --> 00:54:16,556
Speaker 2: So and you know that, like, yeah, do you know

976
00:54:16,636 --> 00:54:20,716
Speaker 2: that from just from within yourself or is it stuff

977
00:54:20,756 --> 00:54:23,436
Speaker 2: you're playing for other people in their reaction, or do

978
00:54:23,476 --> 00:54:26,236
Speaker 2: you just know like to me, it's not up to

979
00:54:26,276 --> 00:54:27,476
Speaker 2: snuff to.

980
00:54:27,396 --> 00:54:31,716
Speaker 3: Me, the stories aren't adding up completely. Okay, Like I'm

981
00:54:31,716 --> 00:54:35,196
Speaker 3: trying to describe something and I'm not doing as good

982
00:54:35,196 --> 00:54:37,276
Speaker 3: a job as I could if I could just lock

983
00:54:37,396 --> 00:54:41,476
Speaker 3: in once I've tapped into it and really describe it correctly.

984
00:54:42,356 --> 00:54:45,116
Speaker 3: Just some things are just clumsy. Somethings are just clumsy,

985
00:54:45,396 --> 00:54:48,196
Speaker 3: and that's not that's not good enough. If anything Phil

986
00:54:48,756 --> 00:54:51,156
Speaker 3: taught me also from that first record too, is like

987
00:54:52,196 --> 00:54:55,596
Speaker 3: this project deserves your full attention and all of your

988
00:54:55,636 --> 00:54:58,956
Speaker 3: ability to get it to that next that that higher

989
00:54:58,956 --> 00:55:02,276
Speaker 3: place where it can live forever. So he I think

990
00:55:02,276 --> 00:55:04,836
Speaker 3: he instilled that in me. Uh, and I carry it.

991
00:55:04,916 --> 00:55:07,076
Speaker 3: I carry it with you. I'm like, which is tough

992
00:55:07,116 --> 00:55:10,836
Speaker 3: because you're always gonna you could you could nitpick you know,

993
00:55:11,316 --> 00:55:15,036
Speaker 3: everything in your life, but no, at some point you

994
00:55:15,076 --> 00:55:17,356
Speaker 3: do have to let the thing go. And I will

995
00:55:17,716 --> 00:55:21,436
Speaker 3: because we got to start working this this reissue next month,

996
00:55:21,636 --> 00:55:24,676
Speaker 3: so I'll I'll finish it in the next couple of weeks.

997
00:55:24,676 --> 00:55:27,276
Speaker 3: I reckon, I will. Actually I'm not. I don't reckon.

998
00:55:27,356 --> 00:55:28,196
Speaker 3: I know I'm going to.

999
00:55:28,356 --> 00:55:31,596
Speaker 2: You're going to. Yeah, is there anything you can tell

1000
00:55:31,676 --> 00:55:34,476
Speaker 2: us about it? The sound, any of the songs, like

1001
00:55:34,596 --> 00:55:36,676
Speaker 2: anything that I'm sure a lot of people want to

1002
00:55:36,716 --> 00:55:39,876
Speaker 2: know every little thing about it. What do you what

1003
00:55:39,916 --> 00:55:41,436
Speaker 2: do you want to say about it?

1004
00:55:42,396 --> 00:55:48,756
Speaker 3: Well, the record is a bit more organic in that

1005
00:55:48,836 --> 00:55:51,396
Speaker 3: it's like there's not a lot of keyboards, if any

1006
00:55:51,596 --> 00:55:53,236
Speaker 3: so far. I don't think there's not a lot of

1007
00:55:53,276 --> 00:55:56,796
Speaker 3: like extra touches. It's it's a bit more. The songs

1008
00:55:56,796 --> 00:56:00,956
Speaker 3: are a bit aggressive for one, and and yeah, and

1009
00:56:00,996 --> 00:56:02,556
Speaker 3: that's always been kind of a thing, even if they

1010
00:56:02,556 --> 00:56:05,636
Speaker 3: didn't make the cut. Sometimes I've always been into like

1011
00:56:07,236 --> 00:56:10,396
Speaker 3: always wanting to be in a punk band anyways, and

1012
00:56:11,076 --> 00:56:15,476
Speaker 3: always loving the rough and tumble nature of you know, uh,

1013
00:56:15,756 --> 00:56:18,916
Speaker 3: punk rock and hindie rock and just sloppy art rock

1014
00:56:18,996 --> 00:56:23,116
Speaker 3: and whatever. So this is a bit abrasive, i think

1015
00:56:24,356 --> 00:56:27,516
Speaker 3: in a way, which is strange to not be mellowing

1016
00:56:27,596 --> 00:56:32,596
Speaker 3: with age. But but and it's yeah, I'm still pissed off,

1017
00:56:32,636 --> 00:56:36,636
Speaker 3: you know, I'm still I've always been ornery and cantankerous

1018
00:56:36,796 --> 00:56:40,556
Speaker 3: and just mad, you know, but I'm so happy. I'm

1019
00:56:40,716 --> 00:56:43,116
Speaker 3: so happy. It's weird too, because I'm like, I'm in

1020
00:56:43,196 --> 00:56:45,396
Speaker 3: such a good place, and I'm like, oh.

1021
00:56:45,036 --> 00:56:47,436
Speaker 2: Right, yeah, that's a funny thing that like you're not

1022
00:56:47,476 --> 00:56:48,836
Speaker 2: all of a sudden you made the switch, like the

1023
00:56:48,876 --> 00:56:52,316
Speaker 2: new album's all happy songs. I figured it out.

1024
00:56:52,596 --> 00:56:54,876
Speaker 3: It is not, which is so weird because I think

1025
00:56:54,916 --> 00:56:56,716
Speaker 3: a lot of people meet me like you seem like

1026
00:56:56,796 --> 00:56:59,516
Speaker 3: such a happy dude, like why are your songs so sad?

1027
00:57:00,236 --> 00:57:03,236
Speaker 3: And I'm and this is weird because a lot of

1028
00:57:03,236 --> 00:57:05,276
Speaker 3: these songs I'm trying to get over the finish line

1029
00:57:05,516 --> 00:57:09,196
Speaker 3: are written from the perspective of, you know, from a

1030
00:57:09,196 --> 00:57:13,916
Speaker 3: couple of years now of accumulated experiences since the last one,

1031
00:57:14,036 --> 00:57:17,436
Speaker 3: And I'm like, God, this guy was buzzkill, you know

1032
00:57:17,476 --> 00:57:19,116
Speaker 3: what I mean. I'm like, how do I relate to

1033
00:57:19,156 --> 00:57:22,716
Speaker 3: this guy too? But I'm always gonna be a bit

1034
00:57:22,876 --> 00:57:27,236
Speaker 3: uh probably always a bitsive, pisson vinegar to some degree.

1035
00:57:27,276 --> 00:57:29,876
Speaker 3: But I'm really having a great time. Please don't be alarmed.

1036
00:57:29,916 --> 00:57:33,476
Speaker 3: I'm I don't need a wellness check. I'm doing great. Promise.

1037
00:57:34,196 --> 00:57:36,996
Speaker 2: Have you ever just like messed around and made music

1038
00:57:37,036 --> 00:57:39,436
Speaker 2: that sounds completely different than Band of Horses?

1039
00:57:40,316 --> 00:57:43,796
Speaker 3: Yes? Yes, I mess around with lots of weird stuff

1040
00:57:43,796 --> 00:57:47,116
Speaker 3: and I get I get obsessed on samples and stuff

1041
00:57:47,156 --> 00:57:50,556
Speaker 3: like that, and I will I'll make I'll make like

1042
00:57:51,316 --> 00:57:55,116
Speaker 3: cutting up audio and stuff like that from from you know,

1043
00:57:55,156 --> 00:57:57,916
Speaker 3: like TV stuff or from other records and stuff like that. Yeah,

1044
00:57:58,076 --> 00:58:00,916
Speaker 3: I'll get really obsessive with that kind of stuff. Sometimes

1045
00:58:01,756 --> 00:58:04,556
Speaker 3: I'll get into like making beats. Sometimes I'll get into

1046
00:58:04,596 --> 00:58:10,916
Speaker 3: making instrumental kind of ambient thing. Sometimes too, I'm really

1047
00:58:10,916 --> 00:58:13,876
Speaker 3: into toys because I've never really again never been much

1048
00:58:13,876 --> 00:58:19,556
Speaker 3: of a real musician, and that I'm gonna learn my craft.

1049
00:58:19,636 --> 00:58:22,236
Speaker 3: I'm like, I'm always looking at new toys, new things,

1050
00:58:22,356 --> 00:58:27,676
Speaker 3: new sources of inspiration all over the place. You know,

1051
00:58:27,676 --> 00:58:30,356
Speaker 3: whether it's like we have songs where it's like a

1052
00:58:30,396 --> 00:58:32,676
Speaker 3: song will be born out of a window being cracked

1053
00:58:32,676 --> 00:58:34,916
Speaker 3: in my hotel room and it's paying a playing a pitch.

1054
00:58:34,956 --> 00:58:37,076
Speaker 3: I'm like, Okay, I'm just gonna hone in on that

1055
00:58:37,156 --> 00:58:39,396
Speaker 3: sound and try to write around that kind of stuff.

1056
00:58:40,516 --> 00:58:46,036
Speaker 3: So yeah, I'm forever curious and messy with it. But yes,

1057
00:58:46,156 --> 00:58:48,516
Speaker 3: i do love that stuff. But there's nothing like the

1058
00:58:48,556 --> 00:58:53,316
Speaker 3: satisfaction for me of of also making music that my

1059
00:58:53,396 --> 00:58:55,956
Speaker 3: brother and my dad and I can be like, you know,

1060
00:58:55,996 --> 00:58:58,996
Speaker 3: at Christmas time, be like that slaps you know what

1061
00:58:59,036 --> 00:59:01,276
Speaker 3: I'm saying. So that's kind of like that's where it

1062
00:59:01,356 --> 00:59:04,156
Speaker 3: usually returns to home base, you know, and it's a

1063
00:59:04,196 --> 00:59:08,236
Speaker 3: bit full circle here, but yeah, yeah, that kind of

1064
00:59:08,316 --> 00:59:13,556
Speaker 3: southern end rock stuff is it's kind of our jam,

1065
00:59:13,716 --> 00:59:17,476
Speaker 3: you know, it's really it's the cornerstone I think of

1066
00:59:17,476 --> 00:59:20,516
Speaker 3: of of where we end usually back when we're listening

1067
00:59:20,556 --> 00:59:23,276
Speaker 3: to other stuff around the stereo when we get together.

1068
00:59:23,756 --> 00:59:27,676
Speaker 3: And I'm still making mixtapes for people, honestly, really absolutely,

1069
00:59:27,716 --> 00:59:29,716
Speaker 3: I'm still. I mean, now it's what is a playlist now?

1070
00:59:30,636 --> 00:59:34,996
Speaker 3: But my dad asked me. My dad had his birthday

1071
00:59:35,356 --> 00:59:38,036
Speaker 3: two weeks ago and we had another snowstorms, so I

1072
00:59:38,076 --> 00:59:40,156
Speaker 3: couldn't make it down to go see him. But he's like, hey,

1073
00:59:40,156 --> 00:59:42,396
Speaker 3: when you do come back, will you burn me a CD?

1074
00:59:42,916 --> 00:59:45,396
Speaker 3: You know I still got a CD burner. Yes, I'm

1075
00:59:45,396 --> 00:59:47,876
Speaker 3: gonna burn you a new CD. So, uh, we're still

1076
00:59:47,916 --> 00:59:48,316
Speaker 3: doing it.

1077
00:59:48,636 --> 00:59:50,556
Speaker 2: What'd you put on it?

1078
00:59:49,916 --> 00:59:53,076
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm waiting to go see him, but I know

1079
00:59:53,116 --> 00:59:55,116
Speaker 3: he wants the new Horses stuff that I'm making. I

1080
00:59:55,116 --> 00:59:56,476
Speaker 3: think he wants to be able to listen to it

1081
00:59:56,516 --> 00:59:59,156
Speaker 3: in his car. That's what I am going to make

1082
00:59:59,196 --> 01:00:02,916
Speaker 3: him A proper, a proper mix. For sure. He's he's due.

1083
01:00:03,636 --> 01:00:07,076
Speaker 2: I was looking at your the Georgia Volume one mixtape

1084
01:00:07,156 --> 01:00:09,836
Speaker 2: or the playlist sorry that you put up and Spotify,

1085
01:00:10,356 --> 01:00:13,516
Speaker 2: And I was wondering, like, do blood, Sweat and Tears

1086
01:00:13,556 --> 01:00:16,596
Speaker 2: go into that playlist? Like are you overthinking it? Like

1087
01:00:16,716 --> 01:00:18,436
Speaker 2: or do you just throw stuff together and you're like,

1088
01:00:18,436 --> 01:00:19,196
Speaker 2: all right, that's good.

1089
01:00:19,716 --> 01:00:23,876
Speaker 3: The answer is I definitely overthink it and I always

1090
01:00:23,876 --> 01:00:25,796
Speaker 3: feel like it's not enough. But and a lot of

1091
01:00:25,796 --> 01:00:28,836
Speaker 3: that like mixing with messing with like cutting up audio

1092
01:00:28,956 --> 01:00:33,636
Speaker 3: and stuff. Stem tell me that's from mixtapes. From mixtapes, Yeah,

1093
01:00:33,636 --> 01:00:35,596
Speaker 3: I would have like you know, like the dual cassette

1094
01:00:37,236 --> 01:00:40,076
Speaker 3: decks and then like the CD player and the CD burner,

1095
01:00:40,156 --> 01:00:41,956
Speaker 3: you know, and I would I would kind of make

1096
01:00:42,556 --> 01:00:44,916
Speaker 3: just like interludes in between songs and stuff like that

1097
01:00:44,956 --> 01:00:48,796
Speaker 3: to two smooth transitions into different styles or whatever it know.

1098
01:00:48,836 --> 01:00:50,116
Speaker 2: So yeah, very.

1099
01:00:50,076 --> 01:00:52,716
Speaker 3: Much so in movie clips and stuff like that just

1100
01:00:52,716 --> 01:00:57,236
Speaker 3: to make you know, somebody laugh. So a lot of

1101
01:00:57,236 --> 01:01:01,276
Speaker 3: that stuff stems from it all comes back to making

1102
01:01:01,316 --> 01:01:03,556
Speaker 3: mixtapes really, you know, and I'm just trying to make

1103
01:01:03,756 --> 01:01:05,396
Speaker 3: and I'm trying to make one for my dad and

1104
01:01:05,436 --> 01:01:09,236
Speaker 3: my brother and me within the band in a way.

1105
01:01:09,756 --> 01:01:12,556
Speaker 2: That's so cool. Okay, I want to ask you about

1106
01:01:12,596 --> 01:01:14,956
Speaker 2: some of the specific songs here on this Georgia volume.

1107
01:01:14,996 --> 01:01:22,076
Speaker 2: One playlist. What about RIM's imitation? Is it imitation? Man?

1108
01:01:22,516 --> 01:01:25,396
Speaker 3: I just love Rim so much. And you know, Rim

1109
01:01:25,596 --> 01:01:32,196
Speaker 3: really uh, Rim emboldened the art and indie and rock

1110
01:01:32,316 --> 01:01:34,956
Speaker 3: community of the South, you know, to say like, oh

1111
01:01:34,996 --> 01:01:37,996
Speaker 3: my god, we can do this, like you can actually

1112
01:01:38,756 --> 01:01:45,116
Speaker 3: break through and and there's there's legit talent that needs

1113
01:01:45,116 --> 01:01:47,516
Speaker 3: to be expressed here in the South that's not just

1114
01:01:48,236 --> 01:01:53,876
Speaker 3: you know, uh, you know, country frat boy stuff. So

1115
01:01:55,636 --> 01:01:58,596
Speaker 3: I love that song so much and it means a

1116
01:01:58,596 --> 01:02:00,316
Speaker 3: lot to me. I used to listen to that song

1117
01:02:00,356 --> 01:02:02,916
Speaker 3: with my two oldest kids when they were first going

1118
01:02:03,356 --> 01:02:06,196
Speaker 3: to like pre k and stuff like that. We that's

1119
01:02:06,316 --> 01:02:10,156
Speaker 3: we always gravitated toward that song. They just they love

1120
01:02:10,276 --> 01:02:13,876
Speaker 3: that And I would start to play that I'm really superstitious,

1121
01:02:13,876 --> 01:02:16,236
Speaker 3: and I'd play it like after a if Georgia won

1122
01:02:16,316 --> 01:02:18,716
Speaker 3: a football game, you know, I'd have to like listen

1123
01:02:18,756 --> 01:02:22,196
Speaker 3: to that song for fear that if I don't, we'll

1124
01:02:22,236 --> 01:02:26,796
Speaker 3: lose the next game. Yeah, that kind of stuff. But yeah,

1125
01:02:26,876 --> 01:02:29,636
Speaker 3: I love Rim so much. I saw something recently of

1126
01:02:29,836 --> 01:02:32,356
Speaker 3: you know, like in office, all these people going around

1127
01:02:32,396 --> 01:02:34,796
Speaker 3: like what's the best Rim song? And everyone's got a

1128
01:02:34,876 --> 01:02:37,396
Speaker 3: different song, you know, And I saw I. This was

1129
01:02:37,396 --> 01:02:38,836
Speaker 3: like four thirty in the morning when I saw this,

1130
01:02:38,876 --> 01:02:40,516
Speaker 3: So I was like, dude, I don't know if I

1131
01:02:40,516 --> 01:02:43,156
Speaker 3: could name mine. So I like started my own like

1132
01:02:43,316 --> 01:02:45,596
Speaker 3: RIM playlist. This is just like two days ago, and

1133
01:02:45,636 --> 01:02:49,236
Speaker 3: I'm like, it's like twenty five songs deep. I'm still

1134
01:02:49,276 --> 01:02:52,156
Speaker 3: not satisfied with uh, with making sure that I've got

1135
01:02:52,156 --> 01:02:53,156
Speaker 3: all my favorites in it.

1136
01:02:53,276 --> 01:02:54,676
Speaker 2: You know, I like night Swimming.

1137
01:02:55,156 --> 01:02:59,636
Speaker 3: Night Swimming is fantastic, so good, so good, and I

1138
01:02:59,636 --> 01:03:03,116
Speaker 3: mean beautiful. There's still a lot of gold to go

1139
01:03:03,196 --> 01:03:05,836
Speaker 3: mine in for in the RIM catalog that maybe got

1140
01:03:06,716 --> 01:03:08,476
Speaker 3: kind of overlooked in those later years.

1141
01:03:08,756 --> 01:03:09,876
Speaker 2: I feel the same way.

1142
01:03:09,996 --> 01:03:13,876
Speaker 3: Yeah, for me, Perfect Circle, the perfect Circle gives me

1143
01:03:13,956 --> 01:03:16,036
Speaker 3: chills from the top of my head to the tip

1144
01:03:16,036 --> 01:03:17,436
Speaker 3: of my toes. Perfect Circle.

1145
01:03:17,796 --> 01:03:19,396
Speaker 2: Okay, I need to listen to that as soon as

1146
01:03:19,396 --> 01:03:24,396
Speaker 2: we're off. Since you spent time sort of like the band,

1147
01:03:24,476 --> 01:03:27,796
Speaker 2: some of the band's formative years in Seattle, and this

1148
01:03:27,956 --> 01:03:32,356
Speaker 2: was post grunge, of course, who looking back at like

1149
01:03:32,476 --> 01:03:34,996
Speaker 2: the you know, grunge at its height, Like, who were

1150
01:03:35,036 --> 01:03:36,716
Speaker 2: your favorite grunge bands?

1151
01:03:37,516 --> 01:03:41,636
Speaker 3: Well, I was lucky that, you know, to have Me

1152
01:03:41,676 --> 01:03:43,676
Speaker 3: and my friend group were like really lucky to have

1153
01:03:44,436 --> 01:03:46,636
Speaker 3: older siblings. We were all like the babies of our

1154
01:03:47,156 --> 01:03:50,516
Speaker 3: of our families, and our older siblings got us into

1155
01:03:50,556 --> 01:03:52,796
Speaker 3: like my brother got me into mud Hunting before I

1156
01:03:52,796 --> 01:03:56,796
Speaker 3: heard Nirvana, so it was like, but Nirvana to me

1157
01:03:56,996 --> 01:04:01,076
Speaker 3: is like they're just so raw and real and good

1158
01:04:01,076 --> 01:04:03,756
Speaker 3: to me, the songwriting is so good, like like Beatles

1159
01:04:04,036 --> 01:04:09,596
Speaker 3: level good. Yeah, so it lives forever. But I I love,

1160
01:04:11,036 --> 01:04:14,796
Speaker 3: I love mud Honey and I and I, I mean

1161
01:04:14,836 --> 01:04:19,396
Speaker 3: I liked, I liked even like the stuff that wasn't

1162
01:04:19,516 --> 01:04:22,556
Speaker 3: considered grunged but was like like pop like the Fastbacks

1163
01:04:22,556 --> 01:04:25,636
Speaker 3: and stuff like that, or like there was like some

1164
01:04:25,716 --> 01:04:28,756
Speaker 3: kind of garage type bands that were on like Espress Records,

1165
01:04:28,756 --> 01:04:32,956
Speaker 3: and I mean, what was Tree people. They were like

1166
01:04:33,676 --> 01:04:37,196
Speaker 3: Neil Young influenced. Yeah, they just didn't fit into like

1167
01:04:37,196 --> 01:04:39,796
Speaker 3: whatever the grunge sound was, which is just a label, right,

1168
01:04:39,876 --> 01:04:44,396
Speaker 3: But yeah, of the time frame, there's so many there's

1169
01:04:44,436 --> 01:04:48,716
Speaker 3: such a well of inspiration up there that is undeniable.

1170
01:04:49,276 --> 01:04:51,596
Speaker 3: But for me and Pearl Jam, I love Pearl Jam.

1171
01:04:51,676 --> 01:04:53,516
Speaker 3: I grew to love Pearl Jam getting to know them

1172
01:04:53,516 --> 01:04:54,356
Speaker 3: and torn with them.

1173
01:04:54,516 --> 01:04:56,756
Speaker 2: Yeah, they seemed like super cool guys.

1174
01:04:56,916 --> 01:05:00,956
Speaker 3: Absolutely and have great songs, but for me, like Nirvana

1175
01:05:01,036 --> 01:05:05,036
Speaker 3: is really like top tier. Like I'm I feel like

1176
01:05:05,156 --> 01:05:09,316
Speaker 3: lucky to have been alive and seen that happen me too.

1177
01:05:09,556 --> 01:05:11,476
Speaker 2: I say that all the time. I feel like you're

1178
01:05:11,516 --> 01:05:14,316
Speaker 2: so special and I love that there's only three of them.

1179
01:05:15,116 --> 01:05:18,076
Speaker 3: Yeah, I know what in the world, there's a lot

1180
01:05:18,116 --> 01:05:19,796
Speaker 3: of racket for just a few dudes.

1181
01:05:20,196 --> 01:05:20,756
Speaker 2: That's right.

1182
01:05:22,196 --> 01:05:24,516
Speaker 3: How's he doing that that guitar, Mike? How many guitars

1183
01:05:24,556 --> 01:05:25,676
Speaker 3: are playings like one? Dude?

1184
01:05:25,716 --> 01:05:26,156
Speaker 2: Oh?

1185
01:05:26,196 --> 01:05:26,676
Speaker 3: Wow?

1186
01:05:27,156 --> 01:05:30,476
Speaker 2: Okay, So thank you so much, Ben, I'm sorry I

1187
01:05:30,516 --> 01:05:32,236
Speaker 2: took so much of your time. You're fun to talk to.

1188
01:05:32,796 --> 01:05:35,236
Speaker 3: I didn't even notice if it was over and us

1189
01:05:35,236 --> 01:05:37,876
Speaker 3: and no, you're amazing. Thank you so much for having me.

1190
01:05:37,916 --> 01:05:40,556
Speaker 3: And I'm a fan of what y'all do, and I'm

1191
01:05:40,556 --> 01:05:42,076
Speaker 3: just such a fan of music. I love that y'all

1192
01:05:42,076 --> 01:05:45,596
Speaker 3: get underneath the surface of these stories and I really

1193
01:05:45,636 --> 01:05:47,876
Speaker 3: appreciate what you do so respect and thank you for

1194
01:05:47,876 --> 01:05:51,356
Speaker 3: having me. I really, I really am grateful and it's

1195
01:05:51,436 --> 01:05:52,116
Speaker 3: nice to meet you.

1196
01:05:52,356 --> 01:05:53,996
Speaker 2: Nice to meet you too. I can't wait to hear

1197
01:05:53,996 --> 01:05:55,916
Speaker 2: the new album. When you hear you rock out.

1198
01:05:56,116 --> 01:05:58,996
Speaker 3: Hey, it'll be fun, I swear. Just don't just don't

1199
01:05:59,036 --> 01:06:03,876
Speaker 3: think I'm depressed, so I'm doing fine, cool all right.

1200
01:06:05,996 --> 01:06:08,156
Speaker 1: An episode description, you'll find a link to a playlist

1201
01:06:08,156 --> 01:06:10,916
Speaker 1: feature in our favorites from Brand of Courses. Be sure

1202
01:06:10,916 --> 01:06:13,476
Speaker 1: to check out YouTube dot com slash Broken Record podcast

1203
01:06:13,516 --> 01:06:16,116
Speaker 1: to see all our video in it, and be sure

1204
01:06:16,116 --> 01:06:18,596
Speaker 1: to follow us on Instagram at the Broken Record Pod.

1205
01:06:18,916 --> 01:06:21,796
Speaker 1: You can follow us on Twitter at broken Record. Broken

1206
01:06:21,836 --> 01:06:23,836
Speaker 1: Record is produced and edited by Leah Rose, with the

1207
01:06:23,876 --> 01:06:26,556
Speaker 1: marketing and help from Eric Sandler and Jordan McMillan. Our

1208
01:06:26,596 --> 01:06:30,036
Speaker 1: engineer is Ben Holliday. Broken Record is a production of

1209
01:06:30,076 --> 01:06:33,196
Speaker 1: Pushkin Industries. If you love this show and others from Pushkin,

1210
01:06:33,356 --> 01:06:36,756
Speaker 1: consider subscribing to Pushkin Plus. Pushkin Plus is a podcast

1211
01:06:36,796 --> 01:06:39,876
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1212
01:06:39,956 --> 01:06:42,236
Speaker 1: four ninety nine a month. Look for Pushkin Plus on

1213
01:06:42,276 --> 01:06:45,716
Speaker 1: Apple podcast subscriptions. And if you like this show, please

1214
01:06:45,716 --> 01:06:48,156
Speaker 1: remember to share, rate, and review us on your podcast app.

1215
01:06:48,476 --> 01:06:50,996
Speaker 1: Our theme music's by Kenny Beats. I'm justin Richmond.