WEBVTT - Sleep Expert Matthew Walker: Do THIS to Sleep Through The Night And Never Wake Up Tired Again 0:00:01.880 --> 0:00:04.960 Hey everyone, it's Jay Sheddy and I'm thrilled to announce 0:00:05.000 --> 0:00:07.840 my podcast tour. For the first time ever, you can 0:00:07.880 --> 0:00:12.160 experience on purpose in person. Join me in a city 0:00:12.200 --> 0:00:17.200 near you for meaningful, insightful conversations with surprise guests. It 0:00:17.239 --> 0:00:20.439 could be a celebrity, top wellness expert, or a CEO 0:00:20.720 --> 0:00:25.079 or business leader. We'll dive into experiences designed to experience growth, 0:00:25.360 --> 0:00:29.159 spark learning, and build real connections. I can't wait to 0:00:29.200 --> 0:00:32.400 meet you. There are a limited number of VIP experiences 0:00:32.600 --> 0:00:36.040 for a private Q and a intimate meditation and a 0:00:36.080 --> 0:00:39.360 meet and greet with photos. Tickets are on sale now. 0:00:39.720 --> 0:00:43.520 Head to Jaysheddy dot me forward slash Tour and get 0:00:43.560 --> 0:00:45.680 yours today right now. 0:00:45.720 --> 0:00:49.400 We estimate that approximately eighty percent of people who have 0:00:49.560 --> 0:00:51.600 sleep amnia are undiagnosed. 0:00:51.760 --> 0:00:55.240 That's crazy. Please welcome Maria. 0:00:55.960 --> 0:00:58.680 What is good sleep and should we just use the 0:00:58.760 --> 0:01:02.240 metric of quanta? The range is somewhere between seven to 0:01:02.320 --> 0:01:05.080 nine hours. Once you start to get less, the shorter 0:01:05.200 --> 0:01:10.080 your sleep, the shorter your life. When sleep is abundant, 0:01:10.240 --> 0:01:13.640 all of a sudden, your appetite hormones are rebalanced, so 0:01:13.760 --> 0:01:17.000 you naturally stop eating as much as you wanted to 0:01:17.520 --> 0:01:20.720 the weight starts to come off you, and you're simply 0:01:20.760 --> 0:01:22.440 sleeping the weight off yourself. 0:01:22.520 --> 0:01:25.360 It sounds like you're saying that sleep is that number 0:01:25.400 --> 0:01:28.720 one domino that then naturally helps all of the others. 0:01:29.520 --> 0:01:32.720 If you are not sleeping in harmony with your natural 0:01:32.840 --> 0:01:36.720 biological sort of rhythm, then your sleep quantity and quality 0:01:36.880 --> 0:01:40.960 is worse. Regularity maybe as if not more important than quantity. 0:01:41.640 --> 0:01:43.959 And I would say to anyone listening, if you're going 0:01:44.000 --> 0:01:47.600 to do anything with this podcast, just do this one thing. 0:01:48.800 --> 0:01:57.880 The number one health and wellness podcast, jayd. Hey, everyone, 0:01:57.960 --> 0:02:00.680 welcome back to On Purpose, the place you to become 0:02:00.720 --> 0:02:04.600 the happier, healthier, and more healed three of the most 0:02:04.640 --> 0:02:08.360 important priorities in our lives. Today's guest is someone that 0:02:08.400 --> 0:02:10.600 I've been wanting to speak to for a long long 0:02:10.639 --> 0:02:14.200 time about a subject that I believe is critical to 0:02:14.280 --> 0:02:17.640 our health, happiness, and healing. Today I get to speak 0:02:17.680 --> 0:02:22.720 to Matthew Walker, a sleep expert, scientist, author, podcast host, 0:02:23.000 --> 0:02:27.760 and professor of neuroscience at UC Berkeley. Translated in forty 0:02:27.840 --> 0:02:32.440 different languages, his best selling book Why We Sleep explores 0:02:32.480 --> 0:02:36.919 the goal to reunite humanity with sleep Matthew's work has 0:02:36.919 --> 0:02:40.760 shaped public understanding of how a simple thing likes sleep, 0:02:41.120 --> 0:02:46.480 impacts memory, aging and disease prevention. Please welcome to On Purpose, 0:02:46.840 --> 0:02:49.000 Matthew Walker. Matt it's great to have you. 0:02:48.880 --> 0:02:51.560 Here, Jay, that absolute pleasure to be here. Thank you 0:02:51.680 --> 0:02:54.440 so much for having me and giving me the opportunity 0:02:54.520 --> 0:02:56.120 to speak the voice of sleep. 0:02:57.080 --> 0:02:59.320 I love it. I love it. Matthew. Let's dive straight 0:02:59.360 --> 0:03:03.840 in because there's so much to decipher with you, and 0:03:04.280 --> 0:03:06.880 I want to start by asking you how much sleep 0:03:07.000 --> 0:03:08.200 do we actually need? 0:03:08.400 --> 0:03:11.680 Yeah, it's an interesting question, and there is definitely a range, 0:03:11.960 --> 0:03:14.720 you know, I think there is, and perhaps even populated 0:03:14.760 --> 0:03:17.480 by idiots like me that there was this magical eight 0:03:17.560 --> 0:03:21.640 hour number that was you know, necessary and get anything 0:03:21.800 --> 0:03:24.359 less and there's doom and gloom. The range is somewhere 0:03:24.400 --> 0:03:27.720 between seven to nine hours for the average adult. And 0:03:27.760 --> 0:03:29.760 what we certainly know is that once you start to 0:03:29.760 --> 0:03:33.360 get less than seven hours of sleep, we can measure 0:03:33.760 --> 0:03:36.520 impermit in both your brain performance as well as your 0:03:36.520 --> 0:03:40.760 body metrics. So there is a range. But in some 0:03:40.800 --> 0:03:44.120 ways it's also a question of what is good sleep 0:03:44.240 --> 0:03:48.040 and should we just use the metric of quantity and 0:03:48.080 --> 0:03:51.240 we absolutely should because using that sweet spot of seven 0:03:51.280 --> 0:03:54.680 to nine hours, it looks as though the shorter your sleep, 0:03:54.720 --> 0:03:57.920 the shorter your life. Short sleep predicts all cause mortality, 0:03:58.360 --> 0:04:02.360 so duration total man is necessary. But if you actually 0:04:02.400 --> 0:04:05.440 look at the science, what is good sleep can be 0:04:05.520 --> 0:04:08.720 really answered by a four part equation that in my mind, 0:04:08.720 --> 0:04:11.960 there are really sort of four macros of good sleep 0:04:12.120 --> 0:04:15.840 three macros of food, fat, protein, carbohydrate for sleep four 0:04:15.840 --> 0:04:19.920 macros and you can remember it by the acronym QQRT, 0:04:20.600 --> 0:04:27.120 and it stands for quantity, quality, regularity, and timing. So quantity, 0:04:27.120 --> 0:04:30.320 you're absolutely right, somewhere between seven and nine is that fit. 0:04:31.040 --> 0:04:34.880 Quality is about the continuity of your sleep. Is your 0:04:34.920 --> 0:04:38.280 sleep fragmented and littered with all of these awakenings and 0:04:38.320 --> 0:04:40.120 you're awake for a lot of the night, that's not 0:04:40.160 --> 0:04:42.760 good quality of sleep. So you could be in bed 0:04:42.800 --> 0:04:45.960 for nine and a half hours and still get seven 0:04:46.040 --> 0:04:49.359 hours of sleep, but you're spending two and a half 0:04:49.440 --> 0:04:52.520 hours of time awake. That's not good quality of sleep. 0:04:53.560 --> 0:04:56.600 Then we can speak about regularity going to bed at 0:04:56.600 --> 0:04:59.000 the same time, waking up at the same time. It 0:04:59.160 --> 0:05:02.279 sounds very benign. Well, do I really have to worry 0:05:02.279 --> 0:05:05.800 about regularity. There's a great study and they looked at 0:05:05.920 --> 0:05:10.440 regularity and quantity. Both of them predicted all cause mortality. 0:05:10.520 --> 0:05:13.279 So if you're very regular and you get that seven 0:05:13.320 --> 0:05:15.960 to nine hours of sleep, you have the lowest mortality risk. 0:05:16.480 --> 0:05:18.760 But then because they had these two measures in the 0:05:18.800 --> 0:05:22.440 same individuals, they put them in the same statistical analysis 0:05:22.640 --> 0:05:25.320 and did the sort of Coke Pepsi challenge between the two. 0:05:25.920 --> 0:05:30.599 What they found is that regularity beat out quantity in 0:05:30.720 --> 0:05:35.360 terms of predicting your mortality, meaning regularity maybe as if 0:05:35.440 --> 0:05:38.960 not more important than quantity. Now you've got to get both. 0:05:39.040 --> 0:05:45.880 But so QQR quantity quality regularity timing. Timing sounds like regularity, 0:05:45.880 --> 0:05:49.440 and you think, well, what's the difference. Timing is about 0:05:49.440 --> 0:05:52.880 your Krono type? Are you a morning type, evening type, 0:05:53.120 --> 0:05:55.760 or a neutral. And it turns out, by the way, 0:05:55.760 --> 0:05:58.160 that if you're a night out, it's not your fault. 0:05:58.640 --> 0:06:01.680 It is genetically a large genetically determined There are at 0:06:01.800 --> 0:06:05.520 least twenty two different genes that dictate whether you want 0:06:05.560 --> 0:06:07.840 to be a morning person or an evening person. So 0:06:07.880 --> 0:06:10.839 you don't get the choice. It's gifted to you at birth. 0:06:11.720 --> 0:06:13.880 And what we find is that if you are not 0:06:14.040 --> 0:06:18.480 sleeping in harmony with your natural biological sort of rhythm, 0:06:18.920 --> 0:06:22.000 then your sleep quantity and quality is worse. So let's 0:06:22.040 --> 0:06:24.640 just say we take someone who goes to bed at 0:06:24.760 --> 0:06:27.760 ten pm and wakes up at six am. Well, if 0:06:27.800 --> 0:06:31.839 you're a slight morning type, that's actually quite ideal for you. 0:06:32.560 --> 0:06:34.840 But if you're an evening type who likes to go 0:06:34.880 --> 0:06:37.760 to bed at two am and maybe wake up at 0:06:38.000 --> 0:06:41.279 ten am, then it's the same eight hour window that 0:06:41.320 --> 0:06:44.200 they're getting. But if the night our two am to 0:06:44.320 --> 0:06:47.960 ten am is forced to sleep from ten pm to 0:06:48.080 --> 0:06:52.200 six am still eight hours, the quality of their sleep 0:06:52.240 --> 0:06:55.800 that they get will no word be as sufficient as 0:06:55.839 --> 0:06:58.840 the morning type. So some people will come to our 0:06:59.040 --> 0:07:02.200 sleep center and say, I have terrible sleep onset insomnia. 0:07:02.440 --> 0:07:04.599 I get into bed and I'm awake for the first 0:07:04.680 --> 0:07:07.479 two hours, and then I fall asleep, and we do 0:07:07.720 --> 0:07:11.520 a CRONA type assessment, which is morning type evening type. 0:07:11.600 --> 0:07:13.960 And by the way, people can do this online very quickly. 0:07:14.040 --> 0:07:17.360 Right now. You can just type into Google m e 0:07:17.720 --> 0:07:21.440 Q test me EQ. It stands for Morning this Evening 0:07:21.480 --> 0:07:25.320 this questionnaire and it fits very well with your genetics. 0:07:25.360 --> 0:07:28.160 Takes about three minutes when we do this type of 0:07:28.360 --> 0:07:30.800 assessment with them, what we realize is that they don't 0:07:30.800 --> 0:07:34.600 have insomnia. They're a night owl, but they're trying to 0:07:34.720 --> 0:07:39.600 sleep like a morning type. And so when you sleep 0:07:39.840 --> 0:07:45.040 sort of against your natural biological predilection, your sleep is 0:07:45.120 --> 0:07:47.480 not going to be as good as it could be 0:07:47.840 --> 0:07:52.560 if you move yourself closer to your natural, innate biological tendency. 0:07:52.600 --> 0:07:56.440 Does that make sense? So those to me would be yeah, yeah, 0:07:56.640 --> 0:07:57.960 can you shift your sleep? 0:07:58.920 --> 0:08:02.080 If people want to have Someone said Matt, that made 0:08:02.120 --> 0:08:05.520 so much sense. I've been a night on my whole life, 0:08:05.720 --> 0:08:08.360 but I just feel like I should be trying to 0:08:08.400 --> 0:08:10.320 sleep early and wake up earlier. It would be better 0:08:10.360 --> 0:08:13.240 for my partner, would be better for my lifestyle, would 0:08:13.200 --> 0:08:15.480 better for my kids. Whatever it is. Can you shift 0:08:15.480 --> 0:08:16.000 your type? 0:08:16.080 --> 0:08:18.080 It's a really good question. I get asked that a 0:08:18.080 --> 0:08:21.560 lot because in some ways, what I'm talking about is 0:08:21.600 --> 0:08:25.400 the ideal world, and drum roll, none of us live 0:08:25.400 --> 0:08:27.480 in the ideal world. We live in this thing called 0:08:27.480 --> 0:08:29.760 the real world. So you know, stop your fancy sleep 0:08:29.800 --> 0:08:32.640 science and tell me just you know, can that change? 0:08:32.880 --> 0:08:35.480 There was a study done in by a group in 0:08:35.520 --> 0:08:38.160 Australia and they took I think it was about eleven 0:08:38.280 --> 0:08:41.040 different things that you had to do as a night 0:08:41.120 --> 0:08:44.080 owl to see if they could drag you back so 0:08:44.160 --> 0:08:47.200 you felt more capable of going to sleep earlier. And 0:08:47.280 --> 0:08:49.880 it was things like, as soon as you wake up, 0:08:50.240 --> 0:08:54.479 eat a large breakfast, gon't get daylight first thing, exercise 0:08:54.600 --> 0:08:59.160 before midday, do not nap, take an earlier lunch, don't 0:08:59.200 --> 0:09:02.120 nap again in the afternoon. In the afternoon, start to 0:09:02.120 --> 0:09:04.959 get as much darkness as you can, meaning put shades 0:09:04.960 --> 0:09:07.760 on if you're going to go outside in the evening, 0:09:07.880 --> 0:09:10.480 make sure that you eat at least three hours before 0:09:10.520 --> 0:09:14.160 you expect to go to bed, and then try to 0:09:14.200 --> 0:09:17.120 push your sort of alarm clock the next morning by 0:09:17.160 --> 0:09:20.480 about one to two hours. And they collected all of 0:09:20.520 --> 0:09:23.120 these different sort of regiments and sure enough they were 0:09:23.120 --> 0:09:25.600 able to drag people back by a little bit over 0:09:25.720 --> 0:09:29.120 one hour, which sounds great, but the problem is these 0:09:29.120 --> 0:09:31.520 were extreme night owls who would prefer to go to 0:09:31.520 --> 0:09:35.160 sleep at maybe let's say one thirty am. That means 0:09:35.200 --> 0:09:38.760 they're still having to go to bed biologically at twelve 0:09:38.920 --> 0:09:42.800 thirty am. It's not the nine to thirty PM or 0:09:42.840 --> 0:09:46.280 the ten PM that you would prefer. And imagine trying 0:09:46.320 --> 0:09:50.240 to capitulate and adhere to that regiment for the rest 0:09:50.280 --> 0:09:54.200 of your life. So there is some wiggle room. It 0:09:54.280 --> 0:09:58.120 seems that you can sort of manipulate. But in truth, 0:09:58.280 --> 0:09:59.840 I think what we have to try and do as 0:10:00.080 --> 0:10:03.840 best we can is to say, how can I align 0:10:04.000 --> 0:10:07.720 myself better with my biology. When you fight biology, you 0:10:07.880 --> 0:10:10.280 normally lose, and the way you know you've lost is 0:10:10.320 --> 0:10:13.440 disease and sickness. And that's what we see with night 0:10:13.480 --> 0:10:17.160 owls who are sort of trying to sleep against their tendency. 0:10:17.960 --> 0:10:21.000 That said, though, is there a way that you can 0:10:21.440 --> 0:10:24.440 I mean, hack isn't the right word, but there are 0:10:24.480 --> 0:10:26.960 ways that you can try to help yourself. So think 0:10:26.960 --> 0:10:29.360 about what you do in the morning that takes time. 0:10:29.840 --> 0:10:31.760 So is it that you sort of, you know, make 0:10:31.760 --> 0:10:34.280 the coffee, you put the coffee and the coffee pot, 0:10:34.360 --> 0:10:36.880 You get your clothes ready for work, you pack your 0:10:36.920 --> 0:10:40.360 bag for the gym after work. All of these things 0:10:40.679 --> 0:10:44.040 you can do ahead of time the night before. To 0:10:44.200 --> 0:10:46.960 take that fifteen minutes of added time the next morning 0:10:47.360 --> 0:10:49.840 and say, allow yourself to sleep a little bit later, 0:10:49.880 --> 0:10:53.000 see at least getting closer to your natural tendency. Then 0:10:53.120 --> 0:10:55.320 go to the front end of sleep and say, what 0:10:55.520 --> 0:10:57.640 is it that I do in the last fifteen minutes 0:10:57.679 --> 0:11:00.520 before I go to bed? Well, I usually sort of 0:11:00.520 --> 0:11:03.240 maybe I take a shower, maybe I change for bed, 0:11:03.360 --> 0:11:06.160 Maybe you know, I brush my teeth, maybe some people 0:11:06.240 --> 0:11:09.640 take their makeup off, whatever it is, Set an alarm 0:11:09.760 --> 0:11:13.600 two hours before bed, do all of those things, and 0:11:13.640 --> 0:11:16.440 then right before you go to bed, when that alarm 0:11:16.520 --> 0:11:19.040 goes off, the to bed alarm, all you do is 0:11:19.080 --> 0:11:21.040 get up and you go straight to bed. So you've 0:11:21.080 --> 0:11:23.480 saved yourself fifteen minutes on the front end, So you 0:11:23.520 --> 0:11:26.679 can go to bed fifteen minutes sort of later, and 0:11:26.720 --> 0:11:29.480 you can wake up fifteen minutes later, but you're not 0:11:29.679 --> 0:11:33.800 necessarily having to go to work any later. So does 0:11:33.840 --> 0:11:35.680 that make some sense? So you can try to short 0:11:35.840 --> 0:11:38.160 sort of thin slice some of that a little bit. 0:11:38.320 --> 0:11:42.719 Yeah, absolutely. If you're someone who's waking up tired regularly, 0:11:42.800 --> 0:11:45.800 Like right now, someone's listening and they're just like Jane Matt, 0:11:46.200 --> 0:11:48.560 I wake up every day and I'm just tired. Yeah, 0:11:48.640 --> 0:11:50.520 and I'm trying to get the right amount of sleep, 0:11:50.520 --> 0:11:53.160 but I'm still figuring it out. Where do I start? 0:11:53.280 --> 0:11:54.920 What would you encourage them to look. 0:11:54.800 --> 0:11:57.200 At so I think the first thing, let's go back 0:11:57.240 --> 0:12:00.680 to the four principles. Are you getting a concert seven 0:12:00.720 --> 0:12:04.440 to nine hours of time at least in bed? Next, 0:12:04.480 --> 0:12:08.240 are you trying to assess your sleep and say, am 0:12:08.280 --> 0:12:10.680 I waking up a lot throughout the night? I would 0:12:10.720 --> 0:12:13.040 say that's one of the first places I would go to. 0:12:13.679 --> 0:12:16.160 If yeah, if the If you're not feeling restored and 0:12:16.240 --> 0:12:19.680 refreshed by your sleep the next day and you're getting 0:12:19.760 --> 0:12:21.840 four hours of sleep at night, then it's obvious it's 0:12:21.880 --> 0:12:24.720 just not the right quantity. But if you're being good 0:12:24.960 --> 0:12:28.079 and you're spending sufficient time in bed but still feeling 0:12:28.280 --> 0:12:31.480 unrefreshed and restored, we have to ask are you waking 0:12:31.559 --> 0:12:34.240 up a lot throughout the night? If you are, let's 0:12:34.240 --> 0:12:37.080 figure out why is it that you are, for example, 0:12:37.360 --> 0:12:40.400 snoring a lot throughout the night, and you have undiagnosed 0:12:40.559 --> 0:12:44.040 sleep app near and you can just download an app 0:12:44.080 --> 0:12:46.240 on your phone. I have no association with them. It's 0:12:46.240 --> 0:12:51.840 called snare lab, So snare Lab and you download it. 0:12:51.840 --> 0:12:54.240 It records your breathing. You place the phone next to 0:12:54.240 --> 0:12:56.520 you on your bed. Then in the morning it shows 0:12:56.520 --> 0:12:59.200 you a Richter shock sort of scale throughout the night. 0:12:59.800 --> 0:13:04.680 And it quantifies your snoring into quiet, moderate, loud, and epic. 0:13:05.600 --> 0:13:08.040 And the frightening thing is you can then tap anywhere 0:13:08.040 --> 0:13:11.000 throughout the night and you can hear yourself snoring in 0:13:11.040 --> 0:13:13.000 a way that we don't. So the next thing is, 0:13:13.240 --> 0:13:16.680 let's make sure that you don't have an undiagnosed sleep disorder. 0:13:17.280 --> 0:13:19.600 Then I would say, is it a case that you're 0:13:19.640 --> 0:13:24.000 maybe over consuming on caffeine during the day. Some people 0:13:24.040 --> 0:13:27.920 will feel completely comfortable having an espresso with dinner and 0:13:27.960 --> 0:13:30.400 they say, I fall asleep and I stay asleep. So 0:13:30.440 --> 0:13:33.080 I'm one of those. And it is genetically determined who 0:13:33.080 --> 0:13:36.520 can metabolize caffeine quickly and it has no effect. We've 0:13:36.520 --> 0:13:39.400 done studies and unfortunately, even if you do fall asleep 0:13:39.440 --> 0:13:42.720 and stay asleep, that caffeine can prevent you from going 0:13:42.760 --> 0:13:46.160 into the deepest stages of what we call deep non 0:13:46.280 --> 0:13:48.679 rapidi movement sleep. That's where you get a lot of 0:13:48.760 --> 0:13:53.160 restoration sensation from. So maybe we need to ask how 0:13:53.240 --> 0:13:56.079 much caffeine are you taking, the dose and the timing 0:13:56.120 --> 0:13:58.480 make the poison. Try to cut yourself off after about 0:13:58.520 --> 0:14:01.640 three cups and try to stay away from caffeine at 0:14:01.760 --> 0:14:04.040 least ten to twelve hours before you expect to go 0:14:04.080 --> 0:14:06.920 to bed. The final thing I would probably say is 0:14:07.320 --> 0:14:11.000 are you also using anything in the evening to help 0:14:11.040 --> 0:14:13.560 you fall asleep? And the principal thing I'm talking about 0:14:13.559 --> 0:14:17.319 here is alcohol. It's probably the most misunderstood sleep aid 0:14:17.679 --> 0:14:19.800 that there is out there. It's actually not a sleep aid, 0:14:20.040 --> 0:14:22.280 and it will fragment your sleep and block you from 0:14:22.360 --> 0:14:25.960 getting rapid eye movement sleep. So what we would do 0:14:26.040 --> 0:14:29.680 is we would march you through a set of environment 0:14:29.760 --> 0:14:31.880 or behavioral things. What are you doing in terms of 0:14:31.920 --> 0:14:34.840 your bed timing, are you spending a lot of time awake? 0:14:35.400 --> 0:14:39.720 And also the things that you're taking into your body alcohol, caffeine, etc. 0:14:40.360 --> 0:14:44.320 The final thing I would say is stress and anxiety 0:14:44.400 --> 0:14:49.200 if there is one outside of skeletal pain. The principal 0:14:49.240 --> 0:14:51.640 reason that we as a society seem not to be 0:14:51.680 --> 0:14:55.720 sleeping is this role that acts of anxiety. Because, and 0:14:55.760 --> 0:14:58.880 you've spoken so eloquently about this, in this modern era, 0:14:59.280 --> 0:15:02.760 we are con instantly on reception. Very rarely do we 0:15:02.800 --> 0:15:06.040 do reflection. And the only time now in the modern 0:15:06.080 --> 0:15:08.960 world when we do reflection is when our head hits 0:15:09.000 --> 0:15:12.240 the pillow, and that's the last time that we need 0:15:12.240 --> 0:15:15.360 to do reflection, because at that point the rolodex of 0:15:15.440 --> 0:15:18.840 anxiety starts worrying. At that point you start to ruminate. 0:15:19.280 --> 0:15:25.000 When we ruminate, we catastrophize, and then everything feels twice 0:15:25.040 --> 0:15:27.360 as bad in the dark of night than it does 0:15:27.360 --> 0:15:29.720 in the light of day. And at that point we're 0:15:29.720 --> 0:15:31.240 dead in the water for the next two hours. So 0:15:31.280 --> 0:15:33.520 the final thing I would say is, let's speak about 0:15:33.520 --> 0:15:35.880 your mental state. So does that give you a sense 0:15:35.920 --> 0:15:38.480 of sight? The pinwheel diagnostics that we would go. 0:15:38.440 --> 0:15:40.760 Through, we love it. I love it. I love the acronym. 0:15:41.040 --> 0:15:44.840 I love how simple and formulaic it is for us 0:15:44.840 --> 0:15:47.960 to be able to actually measure what's going wrong, and 0:15:48.000 --> 0:15:51.760 I can. I'm fortunate and very grateful and knock onward, 0:15:52.200 --> 0:15:57.960 sleep very very well and generally always have. But whenever 0:15:58.000 --> 0:16:01.640 I have had disturbances in my sl I can easily 0:16:01.640 --> 0:16:04.520 pinpoint it to something you've said. And that shows me 0:16:04.600 --> 0:16:07.680 how great the model is. Because as someone who is 0:16:07.760 --> 0:16:10.560 lucky and fortunate enough to have great sleep, when I 0:16:10.640 --> 0:16:14.240 have been disrupted, it's always been related either to caffeine, 0:16:14.560 --> 0:16:17.560 to stress and anxiety. I can easily draw the parallels 0:16:17.560 --> 0:16:19.960 because it's such a rare occurrence, and so I can 0:16:20.000 --> 0:16:22.600 see why and when I want to dive into each 0:16:22.640 --> 0:16:24.960 of those, let's start with sleep apnea, because I think 0:16:24.960 --> 0:16:27.720 that's something a lot of us don't actually know enough about, 0:16:28.200 --> 0:16:29.720 and so I love the fact that people can use 0:16:29.760 --> 0:16:32.800 the apps or lab as you mentioned, how many people 0:16:32.840 --> 0:16:36.400 actually struggling with sleep apnea don't even know about it? 0:16:37.040 --> 0:16:40.560 And what is actually happening if you have sleep apnea? 0:16:41.000 --> 0:16:43.760 Yeah, two great questions. So right now, we estimate that 0:16:43.840 --> 0:16:49.480 approximately eighty percent of people who have sleep apnia are undiagnosed. 0:16:49.680 --> 0:16:51.600 That's crazy, which, if you look. 0:16:51.480 --> 0:16:54.080 At the numbers, is going to be a non trivial 0:16:54.200 --> 0:16:57.920 proportion of the population. And the reason it's so dangerous 0:16:58.080 --> 0:17:01.240 is because when you have sleep apna, essentially what's happening 0:17:01.280 --> 0:17:05.840 is that your airway is either partially becoming obstructed or 0:17:06.320 --> 0:17:10.879 like a straw, it's collapsing flat entirely. Now, if it 0:17:11.000 --> 0:17:15.080 starts to become obstructed, so let's say you're sleeping on 0:17:15.119 --> 0:17:18.679 your back and the airway flaps in that airway are 0:17:18.680 --> 0:17:21.600 starting to give weight to gravity, then you'll start to 0:17:21.640 --> 0:17:24.719 get a partial blocking, a partial what we call occlusion 0:17:24.760 --> 0:17:27.080 of the airway. And that's what you hear. When you 0:17:27.080 --> 0:17:30.760 hear the sound, that's the sort of the flapping of 0:17:30.840 --> 0:17:35.040 the partial occlusion. And then when you stop breathing entirely, 0:17:35.320 --> 0:17:38.639 at that point, the airway has completely collapsed, the straw 0:17:38.680 --> 0:17:42.360 has gone flat, and after about fifteen or twenty seconds, 0:17:42.680 --> 0:17:47.200 your brain stem registers the alarming buildup of carbon dioxide 0:17:47.400 --> 0:17:50.959 in your blood because at that point you are slowly asphyxiating, 0:17:51.400 --> 0:17:54.639 and it sends a wake up trigger up to your cortex, 0:17:54.680 --> 0:17:57.919 and then all of a sudden you hear and you gasp, 0:17:58.119 --> 0:18:02.520 and you're awake. So imagine now we have a way 0:18:02.520 --> 0:18:06.840 that we measure these sort of occlusions and these partial collapses, 0:18:07.680 --> 0:18:10.880 and it's called the a HI score. And don't worry 0:18:10.920 --> 0:18:13.560 about this stands a fort the apnea hypot nea index. 0:18:14.240 --> 0:18:16.360 Suffice it to say that we look to see how 0:18:16.359 --> 0:18:19.760 many events like this are you having per hour of sleep, 0:18:20.359 --> 0:18:22.600 And if you were to have very mild sleep at 0:18:22.640 --> 0:18:25.879 near you may be having five, ten, fifteen of these events. 0:18:25.880 --> 0:18:28.800 That's considered mild. Some people could have eighty of them perhaps, 0:18:28.800 --> 0:18:31.200 But let's just say you have mild sleep at near 0:18:31.560 --> 0:18:34.399 ten of these events an hour, and you're in bed 0:18:34.440 --> 0:18:38.560 for eight hours. So imagine the following scenario with undiagnosed 0:18:38.800 --> 0:18:41.919 mild sleep apna. What if I were to say tonight, 0:18:42.080 --> 0:18:44.359 I'm going to come into your bedroom, Jay, and every 0:18:44.440 --> 0:18:47.560 hour I'm going to throckle you, strangle you to the 0:18:47.560 --> 0:18:50.760 point where you actually stop breathing. And I'm going to 0:18:50.800 --> 0:18:53.879 do that ten times every hour for every one of 0:18:53.920 --> 0:18:56.119 the eight hours. So I'm going to do that eighty 0:18:56.240 --> 0:18:59.000 times throughout the night. Do you think you're going to 0:18:59.000 --> 0:19:01.280 feel restored and refresh by a sleep the next poem? 0:19:01.880 --> 0:19:05.200 And the answer is no. But that's what Now that's hyperbolic, 0:19:05.280 --> 0:19:07.719 of course, but in some ways that's what we're facing 0:19:07.800 --> 0:19:11.720 even with the mildest version of undiagnosed sleep apnea. That's 0:19:11.760 --> 0:19:17.040 why sleep apnea untreated is associated with a very significant 0:19:17.040 --> 0:19:21.200 increase in all cause mortality as well as increases immortality 0:19:21.280 --> 0:19:25.399 related to diabetes, to cardiovascular disease, as well as certain 0:19:25.440 --> 0:19:29.119 forms of cancer. So I think for me, it's the 0:19:29.160 --> 0:19:32.840 case of it's not only going to erode the quantity 0:19:32.960 --> 0:19:36.560 of your life, meaning your lifespan, it will certainly shorten 0:19:36.600 --> 0:19:39.440 your health span. That's what most of us are worried about, 0:19:39.480 --> 0:19:41.840 not really our lifespan, it's our health span. None of 0:19:41.920 --> 0:19:44.879 us want to live with disease or sickness. I certainly 0:19:44.960 --> 0:19:47.160 don't want to. And I remember there was a patient 0:19:47.200 --> 0:19:49.960 that we work with with sleep apnea, and after they 0:19:50.000 --> 0:19:52.840 were treated, they were saying, well, before that, I just 0:19:52.880 --> 0:19:55.840 thought this was me at fifty seven years old. I 0:19:55.880 --> 0:19:59.400 just thought I would deteriorated with age. And I realized 0:19:59.560 --> 0:20:02.600 there was some one in there that wasn't the way 0:20:02.640 --> 0:20:06.600 I felt. And when you treated me with sleep apnea, 0:20:06.720 --> 0:20:10.800 it was almost as though someone cognitively had wiped a 0:20:10.840 --> 0:20:14.719 fogged glass clear and finally I could see again. And 0:20:14.760 --> 0:20:18.240 so that's why I think so many people can benefit 0:20:18.400 --> 0:20:22.320 by way of just simply doing taking this app seeing 0:20:22.359 --> 0:20:25.320 whether you snore. Also, you can do something called the 0:20:25.800 --> 0:20:32.439 stop bang questionnaire so stop all in caps, dash B 0:20:32.720 --> 0:20:35.919 A NG, and you can do it also online, and 0:20:35.960 --> 0:20:38.719 it's a very quick questionnaire, probably about two minutes, and 0:20:38.760 --> 0:20:43.600 it will evaluate your risk likelihood of having sleep apnar 0:20:44.000 --> 0:20:46.520 one of those two. If you fear that you have 0:20:46.760 --> 0:20:49.440 sleep apnea, or if you know that your partner has 0:20:49.480 --> 0:20:52.480 sleep apnre please go and get it seen to. It's 0:20:52.480 --> 0:20:55.480 a laughing about you know. We think, well, they sound 0:20:55.520 --> 0:20:58.400 like a chainsaw, they wake the neighbors up. It's almost 0:20:58.400 --> 0:21:01.600 this thing of sort of humor. Trust me, when it 0:21:01.640 --> 0:21:04.800 comes to your health and your wellness, it is anything 0:21:04.880 --> 0:21:07.160 but a funny story when it comes to undiagnosed sleep 0:21:07.160 --> 0:21:07.639 at MEA. 0:21:07.600 --> 0:21:09.640 Yeah, thank you so much for giving sense practical tips 0:21:09.640 --> 0:21:11.439 as to how we can check as well. And I 0:21:11.480 --> 0:21:14.360 hope everyone is listening and watching. Please go do that 0:21:14.400 --> 0:21:17.800 because the fact that eighty percent of people may not 0:21:17.920 --> 0:21:21.320 have a clue and that could be the secret behind 0:21:21.600 --> 0:21:26.440 better sleep is crazy to me that we haven't uncovered 0:21:26.480 --> 0:21:27.679 it for eighty percent of people. 0:21:27.720 --> 0:21:31.360 That's huge, and so many downstream consequences happen when they 0:21:31.359 --> 0:21:34.879 get treated that they are typically overweight, they usually have 0:21:35.040 --> 0:21:38.720 high levels of blood sugar, of blood glucose, they typically 0:21:38.760 --> 0:21:42.920 have hypertension, high blood pressure. And what's nice is that 0:21:43.240 --> 0:21:44.959 when you were to say, okay, we've got to have 0:21:45.080 --> 0:21:48.280 you reducing your food intake, we need to stop you 0:21:48.320 --> 0:21:50.720 from eating sugar, we need to get you to the gym, 0:21:50.880 --> 0:21:54.320 all of those things of herculean in their challenge. And 0:21:54.359 --> 0:21:59.480 people often in that state of being overweight, hypertensive, high glycemic, 0:21:59.800 --> 0:22:02.160 they just find it so hard to change. But if 0:22:02.200 --> 0:22:07.120 you treat them with sleep apnea. When sleep is abundant 0:22:07.320 --> 0:22:09.480 in good quantity and quality, which it will be when 0:22:09.520 --> 0:22:12.800 you treat them, all of a sudden, your appetite hormones 0:22:13.160 --> 0:22:17.240