WEBVTT - Questlove Supreme: Lin-Manuel Miranda 0:00:00.160 --> 0:00:03.080 Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. 0:00:04.760 --> 0:00:07.400 Wait a minute, why does Listen and Bill have the 0:00:07.400 --> 0:00:13.400 same interior? My gosh, are you all the same person 0:00:14.560 --> 0:00:18.520 our guest today, Ladies and gentlemen, Oh actually wait, let 0:00:18.520 --> 0:00:19.880 me let you know where you are. My name is 0:00:19.960 --> 0:00:22.720 Quest Love and this is another episode of Quest Love Supreme. 0:00:23.400 --> 0:00:27.320 We're here with Teams Supreme, Sugar Steve, Hello there, Yo, 0:00:27.440 --> 0:00:29.040 how are you great? 0:00:29.200 --> 0:00:34.519 Fan? Takeo? What up? What up? And we have Laiah. 0:00:33.920 --> 0:00:37.000 Still here, yes, yes, and we. 0:00:36.960 --> 0:00:44.400 Have unpaid Bill new Bill, Bill's Bill's Bill's yeah, Bill 0:00:44.440 --> 0:00:48.559 two point h. I'll say that our guests absolutely well. 0:00:48.600 --> 0:00:50.920 I always say that our guest needs no introduction, but 0:00:51.000 --> 0:00:55.440 I guess our guest does introduction because he's literally done 0:00:55.880 --> 0:00:57.920 everything except for bounce. 0:00:57.680 --> 0:01:03.240 The budget, save us from COVID. He's worn a. 0:01:03.280 --> 0:01:08.840 Pulitzer, a MacArthur Genius Grant, a Kennedy Center Honor. I 0:01:08.840 --> 0:01:11.880 thought you had to be like at least three hundred 0:01:11.959 --> 0:01:14.319 years old to get a Kennedy Center Honor. I didn't 0:01:14.360 --> 0:01:17.560 realize that one could be nineteen and win a Kennedy 0:01:17.560 --> 0:01:18.160 Center honor. 0:01:19.040 --> 0:01:24.280 He's won a lot, said, he's. 0:01:23.800 --> 0:01:27.000 Won a lot of Grammys. He has an Emmy, and 0:01:27.080 --> 0:01:29.680 he might have a tony or two. I don't know, 0:01:30.880 --> 0:01:34.920 be it forty thousand dollars on stub Hub or on 0:01:35.000 --> 0:01:38.760 Disney Plus. You literally have zero excuse if you're not 0:01:38.880 --> 0:01:43.960 seeing our guests. His creation one of the biggest global 0:01:43.959 --> 0:01:48.200 phenomenons in entertainment, probably short of thriller. See, this is 0:01:48.200 --> 0:01:52.520 what happens when I don't That's what happens when I 0:01:52.560 --> 0:01:54.480 don't have three by five cards. 0:01:54.920 --> 0:01:54.960 No. 0:01:55.200 --> 0:01:58.880 Literally, Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome the quest lof Supreme, 0:01:59.480 --> 0:02:02.840 the creator of in the Heights of Hamilton. Let's not 0:02:02.880 --> 0:02:07.800 forget Fossey, Vernon, actor, playwright, mc producer. 0:02:08.639 --> 0:02:10.799 What else are you? You're director, your father, your. 0:02:10.760 --> 0:02:13.240 Son, first time caller, thrilled to be. 0:02:13.320 --> 0:02:19.559 Here, Washington Heights, own Lin Manuel Miranda. 0:02:21.200 --> 0:02:22.400 All right, so check it all right? 0:02:23.080 --> 0:02:25.520 You know, like, if I really know guests, I won't 0:02:26.200 --> 0:02:29.480 prep notes. I'll just go off the top. However, I'm 0:02:29.600 --> 0:02:34.519 googling you and the questions, the questions surrounding your name. 0:02:35.639 --> 0:02:38.720 This is this is hilarious to me because under your 0:02:38.800 --> 0:02:44.160 name comes these following questions. Did Burgh regret killing Hamilton? 0:02:44.919 --> 0:02:48.000 Why do people like Hamilton so much? Why is Hamilton 0:02:48.120 --> 0:02:51.560 so expensive? How old she wouldn't be to go see Hamilton? 0:02:52.880 --> 0:02:56.400 What's the most famous Broadway show? What is Will Smith's 0:02:56.400 --> 0:02:58.200 net worth? I don't know where that came from. 0:02:58.000 --> 0:03:01.480 But that came out of no where. 0:03:01.720 --> 0:03:02.959 I asked that every day. 0:03:03.320 --> 0:03:04.040 Who's limit? 0:03:04.120 --> 0:03:09.320 Wels Miranda's best friend? Who is the highest note in 0:03:09.320 --> 0:03:12.520 into the unknown? And who is a mortal technique? So 0:03:12.600 --> 0:03:14.959 basically you have you have Oh wow. 0:03:17.040 --> 0:03:17.639 That runs again? 0:03:17.680 --> 0:03:18.200 It pretty good? 0:03:18.639 --> 0:03:22.320 Yeah you're yeah, you literally run the whole spectrum of 0:03:22.400 --> 0:03:27.160 hip hop and and uh in history and one in 0:03:27.280 --> 0:03:30.120 ten questions, one fell swoop. I wish it was that 0:03:30.360 --> 0:03:33.280 for for me, this this has taken a long time. 0:03:33.880 --> 0:03:38.600 Do you do you remember your the pilot episode Bill, Yes, 0:03:38.800 --> 0:03:42.560 that you came to and you just casually flick you know, 0:03:42.680 --> 0:03:45.440 we get them, no problem, And it's like four and 0:03:45.440 --> 0:03:46.240 a half years later. 0:03:46.640 --> 0:03:50.600 Wow, it's got a busier schedule than me. It's you 0:03:50.760 --> 0:03:54.280 and getting those to line up is like the death 0:03:54.320 --> 0:03:58.160 star window of just like, okay, these forty five minutes, 0:03:58.240 --> 0:03:58.760 here we go. 0:03:59.120 --> 0:04:03.600 Dude, I know, I trust me. I know I do 0:04:03.760 --> 0:04:04.640 not take for granted. 0:04:04.800 --> 0:04:07.000 I remember asking you had a. 0:04:06.720 --> 0:04:08.280 Spare hour to even talk to us. 0:04:08.440 --> 0:04:11.080 I wait, a minute. But it's funny. 0:04:11.120 --> 0:04:15.120 I remember you had agreed to dj I think our 0:04:15.160 --> 0:04:17.119 opening night party, and I saw you a few days 0:04:17.120 --> 0:04:20.560 before and I said, hey, thanks again for doing that, 0:04:20.800 --> 0:04:21.360 and you were. 0:04:21.200 --> 0:04:22.400 Like, what are you talking about? 0:04:22.480 --> 0:04:25.720 Yeah, that's up right, and I said, you're djaying the 0:04:26.080 --> 0:04:29.240 opening night party and he went forget me show you 0:04:29.279 --> 0:04:31.920 something about my life, and you showed me your schedule 0:04:32.600 --> 0:04:35.000 and you like literally opened your phone and it was 0:04:35.640 --> 0:04:38.640 more colors than the rainbow in terms of like hour 0:04:39.360 --> 0:04:44.240 to hour what you were doing. And Hamilton hadn't really 0:04:44.320 --> 0:04:46.880 happened yet. Hamilton hadn't opened yet, and I was like, 0:04:46.920 --> 0:04:51.000 how can one person, be one human do this much? 0:04:51.080 --> 0:04:53.160 And it was like a glimpse of it was a 0:04:53.200 --> 0:04:55.560 glimpse of my future. I was like, no, you're going 0:04:55.600 --> 0:04:56.360 to be busy. 0:04:56.800 --> 0:05:00.599 That you show for Grace Harry who insists if we 0:05:00.640 --> 0:05:02.840 have a future, you're going to drop ten jobs. 0:05:03.080 --> 0:05:04.480 So thank you, Grace. 0:05:09.000 --> 0:05:09.680 The low down. 0:05:10.040 --> 0:05:15.040 Wait, speaking of which, uh Lynn and Bill, do you 0:05:15.160 --> 0:05:18.719 know do you truly know that my involvement with this 0:05:19.279 --> 0:05:21.760 was an accident To show you how aloof I am 0:05:21.800 --> 0:05:23.120 about my schedule. 0:05:23.080 --> 0:05:25.400 You're involved with what Camill tell? 0:05:29.400 --> 0:05:32.960 Do you know how aloof and how like mister McGoo 0:05:33.120 --> 0:05:34.080 accidental tourist. 0:05:34.120 --> 0:05:37.479 It was all right, let me let me walk you 0:05:37.520 --> 0:05:38.240 through it real quick. 0:05:39.040 --> 0:05:41.119 You you meant to go see a show at Joe's 0:05:41.120 --> 0:05:43.040 Pub and you wandered into our show. Is that what 0:05:43.120 --> 0:05:43.680 you're telling me? 0:05:45.400 --> 0:05:49.919 Basically? Yes, No, I'm serious. John. 0:05:50.040 --> 0:05:54.719 When John Ridley had won for twelve Years of Slave, 0:05:55.279 --> 0:05:59.360 you know John Ridley and uh have wrote twelve Years 0:05:59.360 --> 0:06:02.280 of Slave and what's his name famously directed it. 0:06:04.560 --> 0:06:06.120 Stephen Queen quin Queen. 0:06:06.839 --> 0:06:10.359 Right, So when Ridley had written Twelve Years of Slave, 0:06:10.440 --> 0:06:15.560 in about maybe six months after he won his oscar, 0:06:16.360 --> 0:06:20.280 he had a meeting with us about working on a project. 0:06:21.160 --> 0:06:25.400 So in trumeir fashion, arriving and Steve can attest to this, 0:06:26.279 --> 0:06:29.599 I came like to the meeting six minutes late, okay, 0:06:29.640 --> 0:06:34.200 really sixteen minutes late. And what I didn't realize was 0:06:34.240 --> 0:06:39.640 that he was giving us homework to do. And part 0:06:39.680 --> 0:06:43.920 of that homework was look research these plays that I 0:06:44.000 --> 0:06:49.680 think that are cutting edge and you know, like going 0:06:49.680 --> 0:06:52.200 to change the shift. And he had five plays that 0:06:52.240 --> 0:06:56.920 he wanted us to see and homework number one was 0:06:56.960 --> 0:07:02.240 seeing an unknown Hamilton at the public So me not me, 0:07:02.400 --> 0:07:05.400 not putting two two together. I didn't realize because when 0:07:05.400 --> 0:07:08.080 you started talking to me backstage, you had already gone 0:07:08.120 --> 0:07:13.600 into pitch mode about joining being down, and in my head, 0:07:13.640 --> 0:07:17.960 I'm like, yeah, I talked to John earlier. 0:07:18.040 --> 0:07:19.280 I'm yeah, I'm down. 0:07:19.560 --> 0:07:22.280 I didn't realize that at that point, I talked myself 0:07:22.280 --> 0:07:26.240 into a second production and it became a who's on 0:07:26.320 --> 0:07:29.720 first situation for about two weeks with the Roots organization, 0:07:29.960 --> 0:07:34.560 until Sean and Tarik were like, Noahmir, what we're doing 0:07:34.600 --> 0:07:38.000 with John Ridley is something different. Hamilton's a whole nother animal. 0:07:38.120 --> 0:07:40.920 I've never met John Riddle in my life. 0:07:43.840 --> 0:07:49.880 Now I know so, but literally the whole time backstage, 0:07:49.920 --> 0:07:52.120 I was just like saying yes to everything and not 0:07:53.000 --> 0:07:56.320 just literally having zero clue that you guys weren't associated 0:07:56.960 --> 0:08:00.720 with Ridley. I thought Ridley was just ending us there 0:08:00.880 --> 0:08:04.960 as a part of this project he was with and 0:08:05.000 --> 0:08:05.880 it wasn't until later to. 0:08:05.920 --> 0:08:09.200 Finalize I obviously knew nothing about that since I've never 0:08:09.760 --> 0:08:10.320 met that man. 0:08:10.360 --> 0:08:15.520 Sorry to this man, but sorry man to this man. 0:08:16.760 --> 0:08:18.760 The but I. 0:08:20.680 --> 0:08:24.280 For me, you coming to the show was like waiting 0:08:24.320 --> 0:08:28.200 for Guffman. It was like, I love is finally coming 0:08:28.240 --> 0:08:32.480 to the show Man. You were so been manifesting the 0:08:32.600 --> 0:08:35.760 roots coming to our show while I was writing the show. 0:08:37.000 --> 0:08:37.920 One was about the roots. 0:08:37.920 --> 0:08:40.000 The one was both Steph like most De's gonna be here, 0:08:40.040 --> 0:08:41.360 like it is most de gonna be in the show. 0:08:41.360 --> 0:08:43.160 That was always like the biggest thing, That's what I'm saying. 0:08:43.160 --> 0:08:44.679 The way you were talking was. 0:08:44.640 --> 0:08:50.920 So like like coument, No, it was. It was just 0:08:51.080 --> 0:08:55.440 so exciting and in my head, I'm like, you guys 0:08:55.520 --> 0:08:57.760 had me at a little like I already knew, you know, 0:08:57.880 --> 0:09:01.160 like you people already talked to me at nine a m. 0:09:01.559 --> 0:09:05.640 Yesterday morning like I'm I'm a board, Like I didn't realize. 0:09:05.920 --> 0:09:07.920 That's also why it's like Guffman, because you know in 0:09:07.960 --> 0:09:11.280 the movie that guy's not Guffman who shows up and 0:09:11.280 --> 0:09:17.560 they're like because we're like Quest loves in, but he 0:09:17.720 --> 0:09:19.800 thinks he has said yes to a totally different thing 0:09:19.800 --> 0:09:20.760 that I know nothing about. 0:09:21.080 --> 0:09:27.600 Yeah, man, I just musical theater, lib I Quest loves 0:09:28.640 --> 0:09:30.760 yes to everything. What do you. 0:09:32.320 --> 0:09:32.360 Like? 0:09:32.720 --> 0:09:33.080 Now? 0:09:34.840 --> 0:09:38.400 What are you what's your what's your daily routine? Are 0:09:38.440 --> 0:09:45.440 you still able to stay creative despite what we're in 0:09:46.720 --> 0:09:52.480 or are you also having just stop moment? 0:09:52.520 --> 0:09:55.520 And I had a I had like a solid month 0:09:55.559 --> 0:09:57.480 and a half two months where I didn't I didn't 0:09:57.480 --> 0:09:58.840 do any I didn't do anything. 0:09:59.000 --> 0:10:01.920 I was about to start directing my first movie. 0:10:01.960 --> 0:10:05.720 We'd shot eight days of footage when Netflix, I'm directing 0:10:05.760 --> 0:10:07.280 his musical for Netflix. 0:10:07.640 --> 0:10:10.120 And they shut us down, which was. 0:10:11.600 --> 0:10:13.600 Both a bummer and a huge relief because we were 0:10:13.600 --> 0:10:16.920 already social distancing on set. We were already asking ourselves 0:10:17.000 --> 0:10:19.880 hard questions of like how do you do a musical 0:10:19.920 --> 0:10:22.680 where you singing to each other and not spin on 0:10:22.720 --> 0:10:25.959 each other? And so when Netflix said we're shoving me 0:10:26.040 --> 0:10:28.920 on everything, it was like, good, someone higher up than 0:10:28.920 --> 0:10:32.400 me has has answered it for us. But you know, 0:10:32.440 --> 0:10:36.200 the momentum that goes into making a movie, it's your 0:10:36.240 --> 0:10:39.520 whole life. You spend every waking hour and like it's 0:10:39.520 --> 0:10:41.360 go time. And then that just stopped. 0:10:41.840 --> 0:10:43.640 So when did they shut out down? How far are 0:10:43.679 --> 0:10:47.440 well around? What time was this This was? It's like 0:10:47.480 --> 0:10:49.480 the day March ninth or. 0:10:49.800 --> 0:10:54.120 March March eighth, and I we were doing a night shoot, 0:10:54.160 --> 0:10:56.880 so they shut us down at They told us this 0:10:56.920 --> 0:10:58.520 is going to be your last night filming at nine 0:10:58.600 --> 0:11:00.840 pm and we still had like three shots left to go. 0:11:01.120 --> 0:11:04.000 So for a while, it was just me and the producers. 0:11:04.000 --> 0:11:07.440 And like our happy crew and actors with jobs and 0:11:07.559 --> 0:11:09.720 like at that moment, like you know where you can't 0:11:10.080 --> 0:11:12.240 tell anyone yet, and we you know, we waited till 0:11:12.240 --> 0:11:14.280 the end of the night to tell everyone. Luckily it 0:11:14.320 --> 0:11:16.599 was before weekend, so everyone was going home for the 0:11:16.640 --> 0:11:19.959 weekend anyway. And then, you know, a lot of it 0:11:20.000 --> 0:11:23.720 was just the new what's the new normal? Like what's 0:11:23.760 --> 0:11:27.040 the procedure to leave the house? What is school? We'd 0:11:27.120 --> 0:11:30.040 already stopped sending my kid to school, just on our 0:11:30.080 --> 0:11:32.480 own gut shit like of just like. 0:11:32.520 --> 0:11:34.719 Like the same thing too, I stopped sending to my kid. 0:11:34.800 --> 0:11:37.480 I think like a couple of days before they finally 0:11:37.520 --> 0:11:37.880 called it. 0:11:37.880 --> 0:11:39.280 It was like even a little like a week or 0:11:39.320 --> 0:11:40.319 something before they find it. 0:11:40.440 --> 0:11:42.000 It was it was a week for me too, And 0:11:42.040 --> 0:11:46.160 so you know it that first month was just what 0:11:46.200 --> 0:11:46.520 do we do? 0:11:46.920 --> 0:11:49.160 I'm so grateful my wife was so ahead of it. 0:11:49.200 --> 0:11:52.680 My wife was a scientist, so like in January, she 0:11:52.880 --> 0:11:55.080 was like, this is coming here and we have to 0:11:55.080 --> 0:11:55.840 take it seriously. 0:11:56.200 --> 0:11:58.400 And it was like, wow, I'm in pre production on 0:11:58.440 --> 0:11:58.920 a movie. 0:11:59.040 --> 0:12:01.920 Like I agree with you, but I also can't stop 0:12:02.000 --> 0:12:02.920 doing what I'm doing. 0:12:03.960 --> 0:12:06.439 It's not my money. 0:12:07.000 --> 0:12:07.520 In your mind? 0:12:07.559 --> 0:12:09.160 Did you think that this is just going to be 0:12:09.240 --> 0:12:12.360 like maybe a six week thing, maybe a two month thing. 0:12:13.000 --> 0:12:13.400 I I. 0:12:15.520 --> 0:12:18.600 When my wife explained the science of it to me, 0:12:18.760 --> 0:12:23.400 of like, this two week break is bullshit because it's 0:12:23.520 --> 0:12:25.360 it doesn't even show up in people, and that's why 0:12:25.400 --> 0:12:29.120 it's spreading so fast, like healthy people spread this and 0:12:29.160 --> 0:12:33.280 then find out they're sick after they've already exposed however 0:12:33.320 --> 0:12:37.040 many people they've been in contact with, and so like 0:12:37.400 --> 0:12:38.800 she was like, this is not gonna be two weeks. 0:12:38.840 --> 0:12:40.959 She just saw she saw the whole thing early. 0:12:41.280 --> 0:12:44.040 His wife, for those who don't know, is the most 0:12:44.040 --> 0:12:47.280 beautiful person ever to attend m I T oh, okay, so. 0:12:50.520 --> 0:12:54.240 What was that me? That's as. 0:12:55.559 --> 0:12:58.320 You just made it weird by saying that, like you no, no, no, no, 0:12:58.480 --> 0:13:00.720 I mean was she in the college squad? 0:13:00.880 --> 0:13:03.839 Was she in the no? Because we didn't go to T. 0:13:03.960 --> 0:13:14.360 But now I can't imagine myself that is a YouTube 0:13:14.400 --> 0:13:16.959 series that we need I. 0:13:16.920 --> 0:13:20.120 T Animatics immediately. Please Yeah, but. 0:13:20.160 --> 0:13:22.719 Lin, does she get some insight to as well as 0:13:22.760 --> 0:13:24.640 because now that we're in it, and that was her 0:13:24.640 --> 0:13:26.920 insight before I'm sure she got some things to tell 0:13:26.960 --> 0:13:29.600 you now as you are approaching production thing. 0:13:29.800 --> 0:13:33.319 Yeah, absolutely, I mean she you know, we are. We 0:13:33.640 --> 0:13:37.679 started filming again in a week, and it's it is, 0:13:38.679 --> 0:13:40.920 we're doing everything we can to be safe. And we've 0:13:41.000 --> 0:13:43.199 learned from the movies that have already gone into production. 0:13:43.720 --> 0:13:44.960 The stop production. 0:13:45.600 --> 0:13:47.800 Yeah, the actors are in their own bubble and in 0:13:47.840 --> 0:13:51.760 their own quarantine. There's the red zone and the yellow 0:13:51.840 --> 0:13:56.040 zone and the green zone. I basically see my kids 0:13:56.080 --> 0:13:58.640 on the weekend. They get tested before they can see 0:13:58.640 --> 0:14:03.560 me again. Like I can't even break that for just 0:14:03.880 --> 0:14:06.320 hanging out with my kid. Like we're taking it as 0:14:06.400 --> 0:14:09.560 seriously as possible because it is it's life and death. 0:14:09.600 --> 0:14:14.680 We you know, as we all know and so so. 0:14:14.800 --> 0:14:17.520 Yeah, but my wife saw it early and so by 0:14:17.559 --> 0:14:20.720 the time I kind of they shut down production on 0:14:20.760 --> 0:14:23.000 the movie and I looked up, Vanessa was like, well, 0:14:23.000 --> 0:14:25.520 here's everything that's going on, Like she had already kind 0:14:25.520 --> 0:14:29.080 of figured out how to get in and out of 0:14:29.080 --> 0:14:31.000 the house, like all of the stuff that is normal 0:14:31.040 --> 0:14:33.440 to us now and we were still learning. She was 0:14:34.160 --> 0:14:35.880 on top of that. So I'm grateful to her for that. 0:14:35.920 --> 0:14:38.360 So anyway, a month and a half of nothing, and 0:14:38.400 --> 0:14:42.200 then I basically pivoted to the writing projects that I 0:14:42.400 --> 0:14:44.360 wasn't going to be touching for a year because I 0:14:44.400 --> 0:14:47.600 was working on this movie. I'm writing two scores for 0:14:47.640 --> 0:14:50.400 two different animated movies, one for Disney and one for 0:14:50.680 --> 0:14:54.880 Sony Animation, and so I basically just that's been keeping 0:14:54.920 --> 0:14:58.920 me busy during the pandemic. It's just like all right, 0:14:59.240 --> 0:15:01.280 like go back to writing, back to your keyboard. 0:15:03.000 --> 0:15:06.400 Wait, it just hit me. I really want to start 0:15:06.440 --> 0:15:11.800 from the very beginning, in the beginning. I want to 0:15:11.800 --> 0:15:16.680 start with Lynn can he tells three things about unpaid. 0:15:16.640 --> 0:15:20.560 That we don't know? Yes, it is really the. 0:15:20.440 --> 0:15:24.520 Unpaid Bill episode. We're just using limit limits. 0:15:25.600 --> 0:15:27.600 I knew that's how I end up here, and I'm 0:15:27.600 --> 0:15:33.760 happy to be of service. All My entire career, and 0:15:33.920 --> 0:15:38.480 Bill's entire career is as the result of an accident, 0:15:39.000 --> 0:15:41.080 UH and and an infidelity. 0:15:41.360 --> 0:15:42.680 Do we want to tell that story? 0:15:43.360 --> 0:15:46.360 Name names? 0:15:46.360 --> 0:15:46.680 We won't. 0:15:46.720 --> 0:15:52.920 We want to bode not mine. It's your episode, Bill, 0:15:53.120 --> 0:15:58.200 we hold mine. And it was tragically great. So so. 0:16:00.320 --> 0:16:06.080 My college girlfriend produced a musical at the school Theater 0:16:07.040 --> 0:16:10.200 at Wesleyan and she produced Once on This Island and 0:16:10.360 --> 0:16:13.520 it had a music director and Bill was the sax 0:16:13.600 --> 0:16:20.000 player in the pit. However, the music director was dating 0:16:20.240 --> 0:16:22.960 the director of the show and he cheated on her. 0:16:23.080 --> 0:16:27.120 She walked in on him cheating, and I mean, this 0:16:27.160 --> 0:16:30.160 is college theater, guys, and she was like, you're fired 0:16:31.160 --> 0:16:34.640 guy playing saxophone. You're the music director now. And so 0:16:34.720 --> 0:16:37.000 Bill Shea's the music director of this and then like 0:16:37.080 --> 0:16:39.640 proceeded to kill it. Like I remember going to see 0:16:39.640 --> 0:16:43.120 the show being like, why does this college show sound 0:16:43.280 --> 0:16:48.960 so good? And was just like amazed at how professional 0:16:49.080 --> 0:16:52.880 and great the band sounded and so and they were like, 0:16:52.920 --> 0:16:55.520 that's Bill Sherman. He became the band conductor after he 0:16:55.600 --> 0:16:57.920 fired fucking around. 0:16:59.080 --> 0:17:02.520 And so I then re hired to play the bass 0:17:02.520 --> 0:17:06.199 because we didn't have a bass player there was, so 0:17:07.200 --> 0:17:10.440 in fact re hired and he was in the band. 0:17:10.800 --> 0:17:17.160 Yeah. So wait, awkward, Bill, you paid a saxophone. So yeah, 0:17:17.240 --> 0:17:21.840 you guys replays the didn't know this. We did not 0:17:21.960 --> 0:17:22.280 know this. 0:17:24.160 --> 0:17:28.440 Bill was player. And Bill had an African high life 0:17:28.520 --> 0:17:30.800 band in college called on. 0:17:33.560 --> 0:17:36.160 An African highlight band. So you white fail, o, Bill, 0:17:44.680 --> 0:17:46.840 you have selective remembering. 0:17:47.119 --> 0:17:51.439 So like I majored in West African music, do you 0:17:51.520 --> 0:17:52.879 know that deep into it bruh. 0:17:52.920 --> 0:17:54.720 So I played the saxophone and I was I was 0:17:54.840 --> 0:17:55.760 really big into fail out. 0:17:55.800 --> 0:17:57.399 But something like you know, like you just took a 0:17:57.440 --> 0:17:58.960 trip to Africa like a vacation. 0:17:59.600 --> 0:18:01.600 Oh you guys. 0:18:01.480 --> 0:18:03.640 Are talking to philastin. 0:18:10.280 --> 0:18:20.200 New Name. Oh my god, oh man. 0:18:20.359 --> 0:18:21.920 If I had known we were going to go this deep, 0:18:21.920 --> 0:18:22.959 I would have brought cuts. 0:18:24.640 --> 0:18:26.240 I really would like to hear some of your West 0:18:26.240 --> 0:18:26.960 African music. 0:18:27.000 --> 0:18:30.639 Bill Professor was a dope band. It was like fifteen 0:18:30.800 --> 0:18:32.080 white guys played. 0:18:32.200 --> 0:18:37.080 We couldn't find no black people. 0:18:37.640 --> 0:18:39.960 No. See, here's the thing, if you really want to 0:18:39.960 --> 0:18:42.960 get into it. So wesley we would have played West 0:18:42.960 --> 0:18:47.240 African music fair. It's fair. 0:18:47.359 --> 0:18:52.359 But also Wesleyan world music is I mean the guys 0:18:52.400 --> 0:18:53.159 with dreadlocks. 0:18:53.200 --> 0:18:59.119 Okay, a lot of weed, my boy. 0:18:59.640 --> 0:18:59.800 Uh. 0:19:00.000 --> 0:19:01.840 But what was interesting about Wesleyan is that it was 0:19:01.880 --> 0:19:06.560 billed as uh like diversity university as it were, but uh, 0:19:06.680 --> 0:19:10.359 it was so segregated that it was affable. So like 0:19:10.720 --> 0:19:15.199 Lynn lived in Latin guy house, which is called and 0:19:15.240 --> 0:19:17.399 then and then all of the black folks lived in 0:19:17.440 --> 0:19:19.680 Malcolm X's house. Like I'm not even I'm not even making. 0:19:19.440 --> 0:19:21.600 This up the street We saw that all the time. 0:19:23.040 --> 0:19:28.760 We wait and house party, uh boy from Young Black. 0:19:33.040 --> 0:19:35.560 The movie PCU was based on wesley and the writers 0:19:35.600 --> 0:19:39.080 of that movie went to west like every nationality and 0:19:39.160 --> 0:19:40.840 affinity group had its house. 0:19:42.240 --> 0:19:45.000 I was part of the White Boys Stoner World music group. 0:19:45.480 --> 0:19:50.399 Yeah yeah, and Lynn was like the Latin guy. 0:19:51.119 --> 0:19:52.879 Guess what he continues to this. 0:19:54.400 --> 0:19:57.840 Is this is this the Santi gold Angela Yee era 0:19:58.080 --> 0:20:02.080 of Wesleyan. But or afterwards, I think between better than 0:20:02.480 --> 0:20:04.800 MGMT was year you. 0:20:04.760 --> 0:20:06.000 Guys, where's your class were? 0:20:06.000 --> 0:20:08.520 Class of two thousand and two? MGMT was like the 0:20:08.600 --> 0:20:09.520 year after us. 0:20:09.680 --> 0:20:12.320 Yeah, oh wow, they were like maybe three years before 0:20:12.320 --> 0:20:19.080 you guys. Okay, yeah, yes, before ahead of us Miranda era. 0:20:19.200 --> 0:20:22.399 If you didn't know that what is now we were 0:20:22.400 --> 0:20:23.880 part of what is now referred to as the line 0:20:23.880 --> 0:20:28.960 Manuel Miranda era. Actually, like that's if you ask anybody 0:20:29.080 --> 0:20:31.240 that's those years, what's funny. 0:20:30.920 --> 0:20:34.720 Is I mean one of the lessons of that I 0:20:34.840 --> 0:20:37.879 got out of Wesleyan was when I did the first 0:20:37.960 --> 0:20:40.240 version of In the Heights at wesley and it was 0:20:40.280 --> 0:20:44.480 an eighty minute show and to get latinos in a show, 0:20:44.600 --> 0:20:46.880 I had to go beyond the like six white theater 0:20:46.960 --> 0:20:49.960 majors that were theater majors. So I had Ralphie from 0:20:50.000 --> 0:20:52.680 Ebony Singers in the cast, and I had the result 0:20:52.800 --> 0:20:56.119 of like me casting the net across campus instead of 0:20:56.280 --> 0:21:00.199 just people who auditioned for musicals, was that we were 0:21:00.240 --> 0:21:03.040 a huge hit show because everyone had a friend in 0:21:03.080 --> 0:21:05.679 the show. Because that's how you get people to your 0:21:05.680 --> 0:21:06.800 show when you're in college. 0:21:07.119 --> 0:21:09.520 How did you appeal to him Land? How did you even? Oh? 0:21:09.600 --> 0:21:11.919 I fly, I fly it everywhere and I was in 0:21:11.960 --> 0:21:14.080 the gospel choir and I fly in the gospel. I 0:21:14.119 --> 0:21:17.840 just like went beyond like the theater board call sheet. 0:21:18.440 --> 0:21:23.400 Lynn posed for art classes as the naked guy he knows, come. 0:21:23.240 --> 0:21:25.679 On, we're going. 0:21:27.400 --> 0:21:31.399 Yes, the highest thing at the time girlfriend started. 0:21:32.359 --> 0:21:34.920 Lynn's girlfriend started in the Heights and she was Filipino 0:21:35.240 --> 0:21:38.639 and she remains Filipino to this day. But she was 0:21:38.680 --> 0:21:42.560 like she was the Filipino girl who played like the 0:21:42.640 --> 0:21:45.960 Latin girl from fucking Washington Heights, which was hilarious but 0:21:46.119 --> 0:21:46.760 great casting. 0:21:47.320 --> 0:21:52.840 I didn't succeed in finding latinos. I cast the net 0:21:52.840 --> 0:21:54.520 as winded as as I could. 0:21:55.400 --> 0:21:57.880 And at Wesleyan Filipino is close enough. 0:22:00.080 --> 0:22:03.960 Both is this on tape? Right down. The version of 0:22:04.000 --> 0:22:04.720 this on tape. 0:22:04.880 --> 0:22:08.000 Yeah, you'll never see it. You'll never see it. 0:22:08.840 --> 0:22:09.800 There's a record. 0:22:09.600 --> 0:22:12.439 Toot I put the opening I actually did put the 0:22:12.480 --> 0:22:13.520 opening number on YouTube. 0:22:13.520 --> 0:22:15.200 You can see the opening number. You can see a 0:22:15.200 --> 0:22:16.320 little Filipina Aleen. 0:22:16.359 --> 0:22:18.600 But just for the record was part of it at 0:22:18.600 --> 0:22:21.920 that moment. So don't wait a minute. 0:22:21.920 --> 0:22:24.800 You went so fast, Bill, you sped past. First of all, 0:22:25.760 --> 0:22:29.120 posing for drawing one class was the highest paying job 0:22:29.200 --> 0:22:29.840 on campus. 0:22:30.600 --> 0:22:31.760 How much does that learn? 0:22:32.080 --> 0:22:35.240 Fourteen dollars an hour that's paid. 0:22:36.960 --> 0:22:37.840 You never told me that. 0:22:38.240 --> 0:22:42.000 Yeah, so I was like, it's not photography, it's just 0:22:42.119 --> 0:22:44.679 people's bad drawings of me naked. 0:22:44.960 --> 0:22:45.720 I can live with that. 0:22:46.320 --> 0:22:50.320 Yeah, until for like all kinds of cash, you can. 0:22:51.160 --> 0:22:53.639 The way it worked, you start with quick poses, right 0:22:54.200 --> 0:22:56.840 the first time in this class, it's like ah one minute, 0:22:57.400 --> 0:23:03.760 ah yeah, one minute, and then you have the long 0:23:03.800 --> 0:23:05.639 poses where it's ten minutes where they're going to kind 0:23:05.640 --> 0:23:07.720 of bring out the colors and the chark holes and 0:23:07.760 --> 0:23:09.879 those you have to choose very carefully because if you 0:23:09.920 --> 0:23:12.199 try to be cute, like you're holding that shit for 0:23:12.200 --> 0:23:15.040 you hold. Yeah, so a lot of there's a lot 0:23:15.080 --> 0:23:17.760 of drawings to be lying down that have surfaced since 0:23:17.840 --> 0:23:21.840 my fame. People were like, well, you've been making a 0:23:21.840 --> 0:23:23.399 picture of you and it's just a drawing. Gonna be 0:23:23.440 --> 0:23:25.560 lying down because I didn't want to hold standing up 0:23:25.560 --> 0:23:26.359 for fifteen minutes. 0:23:26.480 --> 0:23:27.359 That's at least ten. 0:23:28.240 --> 0:23:31.240 Yeah, oh naked Lee Manuel, that's the new room brand 0:23:31.280 --> 0:23:31.600 right there. 0:23:34.240 --> 0:23:37.680 It was one guys, they can't be that good. 0:23:37.800 --> 0:23:39.200 It was intro to drawing. 0:23:42.119 --> 0:23:44.399 Wow, boy, that's crazy. 0:23:44.520 --> 0:23:48.000 So anyway, so Bill killed being music director, and then 0:23:48.040 --> 0:23:49.800 I was like, you're working with me, You're coming with 0:23:49.800 --> 0:23:52.240 me on my shows. I write my own ship. And 0:23:53.640 --> 0:23:56.040 he sort of had no choice. It's sort of like 0:23:56.080 --> 0:23:57.359 how he wound up on your show. 0:23:57.400 --> 0:23:58.560 He was just like, oh good. 0:23:59.359 --> 0:24:02.560 And then there was Lin's been doing the same impression 0:24:02.640 --> 0:24:05.160 impression of me for like almost twenty years. 0:24:05.680 --> 0:24:09.320 Here's here's here's my line on Bill, because he says 0:24:09.320 --> 0:24:12.159 it at every juncture in our career is from college onward. 0:24:12.440 --> 0:24:13.760 I didn't think it was gonna be a big deal. 0:24:13.800 --> 0:24:14.480 It was a big deal. 0:24:15.760 --> 0:24:23.159 He makes me an idiot, my boss, Now that's you. 0:24:23.200 --> 0:24:24.919 Why do you always have to tell everybody what I do? 0:24:24.960 --> 0:24:26.000 My whole resume every show? 0:24:26.040 --> 0:24:29.040 I just want to know why. Yeah, fuck because. 0:24:28.800 --> 0:24:30.440 You're fucking amazing whatever. 0:24:30.600 --> 0:24:34.360 Okay, anyway, so they you guys, did they know how 0:24:34.400 --> 0:24:36.159 great you guys were At the time, it was the 0:24:36.200 --> 0:24:38.159 whole theater department like, oh, this is going to be 0:24:38.160 --> 0:24:40.080 our this is going to be a hit, and people 0:24:40.119 --> 0:24:42.400 are going to always come back to Lesley Bill. 0:24:42.960 --> 0:24:45.520 There has to be that professor that was like scoffing 0:24:45.560 --> 0:24:48.720 at this, and now you you came back like giving 0:24:48.760 --> 0:24:50.440 a master class ten years later, like. 0:24:51.880 --> 0:24:52.720 There has to be The. 0:24:52.720 --> 0:24:56.000 Issue actually was that In the Heights was I kind 0:24:56.000 --> 0:25:00.080 of peaked sophomore year because he was really good. It 0:25:00.160 --> 0:25:05.440 was a huge hit. We sold cast albums of a 0:25:05.480 --> 0:25:08.399 college show mainly because I couldn't get any This is 0:25:08.440 --> 0:25:12.119 so dated, but like the weekend I had the theater 0:25:12.680 --> 0:25:15.920 was the weekend of the Wesleyan Millennium Concert, So all 0:25:15.960 --> 0:25:19.359 the good musicians were playing the Wesleyan Millennium Concert. So 0:25:19.400 --> 0:25:21.600 I couldn't get any the musicians I wanted to play 0:25:22.240 --> 0:25:26.520 the weekend you played the Millennium Concert. I took my 0:25:26.600 --> 0:25:29.520 sound budget and I created karaoke tracks. So even in 0:25:29.600 --> 0:25:31.960 the first performance of In the Heights they're singing to 0:25:32.040 --> 0:25:34.920 playback that I did at like a studio in Middletown, 0:25:34.960 --> 0:25:36.880 and so and then I paid the money back by 0:25:36.920 --> 0:25:40.119 selling albums and. 0:25:40.240 --> 0:25:49.160 So we were copy of the original, never oone saying yes. 0:25:50.960 --> 0:26:05.960 No anyway my so uh wow, you haven't Organics under 0:26:06.000 --> 0:26:07.040 your belt. That's amazing. 0:26:10.760 --> 0:26:17.360 Organics Records the first roots album. That's not a roots album, 0:26:17.359 --> 0:26:18.240 but it's a roots album. 0:26:18.359 --> 0:26:18.679 Okay. 0:26:19.119 --> 0:26:22.320 Who played our senior concert at Wesleyan anyone? 0:26:22.640 --> 0:26:27.200 The roots? Y'all playing saved ten feet before we even 0:26:27.240 --> 0:26:29.800 knew each other, many many years ago, even there while 0:26:29.840 --> 0:26:34.800 you guys were there yep, with Ben on the base Wow, 0:26:36.560 --> 0:26:39.120 during phrenology period, look at God only. 0:26:39.359 --> 0:26:42.560 The only reason why I remember the santi era was 0:26:42.600 --> 0:26:47.719 only because the infamous by Mob Deep came out. 0:26:47.200 --> 0:26:49.840 The day that we had to play their. 0:26:50.520 --> 0:26:54.960 Their spring Fleeing and in ninety five, and we were 0:26:55.000 --> 0:26:57.600 So that's the only time I remember. 0:26:58.680 --> 0:27:01.400 That. And the and the sopran knows uh. 0:27:02.800 --> 0:27:08.080 Uh the Sopranos ending season series ending? Do I remember 0:27:08.240 --> 0:27:12.000 abbreviating the show the Roots show so we could rush 0:27:12.040 --> 0:27:14.120 off stage to do something else. 0:27:14.800 --> 0:27:17.520 What's funny is the Roots played at all our college shows. 0:27:17.560 --> 0:27:18.760 Like I'm sure he's a fante. 0:27:19.040 --> 0:27:21.439 I'm sure I was at my I saw him at 0:27:21.520 --> 0:27:22.040 un CG. 0:27:22.200 --> 0:27:24.919 They never came to They never came to Central Butt 0:27:24.960 --> 0:27:25.360 un CG. 0:27:25.440 --> 0:27:26.160 And they came to Duke. 0:27:27.880 --> 0:27:32.359 Yeah, you guys have biz Marquis as the DJ beforehand. 0:27:33.440 --> 0:27:39.440 Perfect college. 0:27:39.480 --> 0:27:40.280 It was awesome. 0:27:40.320 --> 0:27:43.640 It all the white kids were friends six times, six 0:27:44.000 --> 0:27:47.600 times without even giving a ship without like there was 0:27:47.640 --> 0:27:48.960 no nothing. 0:27:48.960 --> 0:27:52.480 He was just like, fuck it, So were you doing 0:27:52.520 --> 0:27:55.479 any were you putting together? Now? 0:27:55.520 --> 0:28:00.399 I know there's a difference between participating in productions and 0:28:00.560 --> 0:28:08.480 putting it together. What what gave you the the spark 0:28:08.960 --> 0:28:11.760 or the coumpsion or the nerve to even say I 0:28:11.800 --> 0:28:14.880 have to put this together myself? Like why does one 0:28:14.880 --> 0:28:16.440 to do that at a college? Like I want to 0:28:16.440 --> 0:28:17.280 put something together. 0:28:18.400 --> 0:28:20.080 It's funny because I went. 0:28:20.240 --> 0:28:24.000 I chose Wesleyan because it's one of the few places 0:28:24.000 --> 0:28:26.320 that lets you double major in theater and film, and 0:28:26.359 --> 0:28:28.840 I really loved film and I really love theater. And 0:28:28.880 --> 0:28:33.040 then like like I just got really practical once I 0:28:33.080 --> 0:28:36.800 got there. If you're a film major, this was pre digital, 0:28:37.160 --> 0:28:39.960 so you're paying for film. To make your senior film, 0:28:40.000 --> 0:28:42.840 you have to pay for it yourself, and the best 0:28:42.960 --> 0:28:45.880 you can do is get your short into a festival 0:28:45.960 --> 0:28:48.320 or maybe get an agent. If the head of the 0:28:48.320 --> 0:28:51.320 department likes you more than the other kids and like 0:28:51.440 --> 0:28:55.320 kind of pushes you. If you make theater, it's three 0:28:55.400 --> 0:28:58.120 hundred bucks for a show and the school pays for it. 0:28:58.680 --> 0:29:01.320 So I just remember thinking, like, I'm going to make 0:29:01.320 --> 0:29:03.480 as much theater as I can in these four years. 0:29:03.480 --> 0:29:06.080 Because I knew my parents were killing themselves to pay 0:29:06.120 --> 0:29:10.040 for school. My dad like literally quit his non for 0:29:10.080 --> 0:29:12.800 profit job and went to like a higher pay because 0:29:12.920 --> 0:29:14.200 I was going to college. 0:29:14.240 --> 0:29:16.640 Like I was very aware of that burden. 0:29:17.000 --> 0:29:19.360 What was like to do what My. 0:29:19.280 --> 0:29:23.760 Mom's psychologist and my dad was the head of a 0:29:23.800 --> 0:29:27.000 nonprofit called Hispanic Federation that's sort of this umbrella organization 0:29:27.080 --> 0:29:30.720 for Latino organizations, and he went into political consulting the 0:29:30.800 --> 0:29:32.760 year I went to school because he was like, I have. 0:29:32.760 --> 0:29:35.000 To go to make this breed money. 0:29:35.360 --> 0:29:37.600 And so, I mean, it's not an accident that one 0:29:37.640 --> 0:29:39.840 of the major plot lines of In the Heights is 0:29:39.920 --> 0:29:43.880 like parents killing themselves to pay for Nina's school and 0:29:43.920 --> 0:29:48.440 her kind of accepting that sacrifice and instead of being 0:29:48.480 --> 0:29:52.080 like I don't want this life, it's it's like, you know, 0:29:52.240 --> 0:29:53.560 I'm going to make the most of it. I'm going 0:29:53.600 --> 0:29:55.320 to make the most of what you guys have done 0:29:55.440 --> 0:29:59.840 that I could be here. And so I just was like, 0:30:00.040 --> 0:30:03.520 if I leave Wesley with just a degree in theater studies, like, 0:30:03.920 --> 0:30:06.040 I don't know what that's going to be. So I 0:30:06.120 --> 0:30:08.280 just like tried to treat it like a four year workshop. 0:30:08.320 --> 0:30:11.480 Like I wrote a musical every year and I would 0:30:11.520 --> 0:30:13.680 put it up and I acted in other people's stuff too, 0:30:13.800 --> 0:30:17.640 And I you know, the cool thing about theater majoring 0:30:17.720 --> 0:30:20.080 is that you you learn you hang lights for other 0:30:20.080 --> 0:30:22.840 people shows. I did set design for other people's shows. 0:30:22.880 --> 0:30:24.760 I did sound as like, you learn all these other 0:30:24.840 --> 0:30:28.040 different skills, which helps you in the world because you 0:30:28.160 --> 0:30:31.160 kind of know what everyone else does in their respective departments. 0:30:31.920 --> 0:30:32.280 Hustle you. 0:30:32.280 --> 0:30:37.479 Because I will say this as stoner hippie music guy, 0:30:37.720 --> 0:30:40.880 I got laid X amount of times as music director 0:30:40.920 --> 0:30:43.960 in Lynn shows. I got laid x times a thousand 0:30:44.000 --> 0:30:47.000 more times than being stoner hippie drum circle guy. 0:30:47.520 --> 0:30:49.120 That's what was the time for me to have the 0:30:49.200 --> 0:30:50.680 damn sound effects of machines. 0:30:50.760 --> 0:30:57.040 I wish a mere hit it know that you can't 0:30:57.040 --> 0:30:58.200 do it on stud. 0:31:00.200 --> 0:31:06.040 Yeah, wait, I do want to know I mean, you know, 0:31:06.160 --> 0:31:09.640 no one, no one can plan lightning in a battle, 0:31:10.400 --> 0:31:14.080 or plan a phenomenon or any of those things. But 0:31:14.920 --> 0:31:20.320 I have to say that if anyone has been privy 0:31:20.320 --> 0:31:28.280 to many a meeting or a summit meeting for these 0:31:28.320 --> 0:31:32.680 pitches in which they promise you the world, I've been 0:31:32.720 --> 0:31:39.400 that guy, meaning since nineteen ninety nine, since two thousand, 0:31:39.800 --> 0:31:44.760 I've heard many a pitch about. You know, there was 0:31:44.760 --> 0:31:46.400 a point where they were going to try to bring 0:31:46.480 --> 0:31:48.080 Wild Style the Broadway. 0:31:48.200 --> 0:31:50.840 And they described how we're going to change the world. 0:31:50.880 --> 0:31:53.800 And I was part of the meeting when they first 0:31:53.880 --> 0:32:01.200 started at you know the famous Tupaca too. Yeah yeah, 0:32:01.640 --> 0:32:06.600 play that that you know got deaded in three weeks. 0:32:07.640 --> 0:32:10.920 Everything there was even a play based on I probably 0:32:10.960 --> 0:32:16.240 the furthest. I got involved with hip hop and Broadway. 0:32:17.080 --> 0:32:22.880 If you remember the the Nike commercials where they were 0:32:22.880 --> 0:32:25.800 like bouncing the ball and rhythm. 0:32:26.040 --> 0:32:30.240 Yeah, yeah, right, yeah. 0:32:30.240 --> 0:32:34.600 I wanted they signed ll up. They wanted to do 0:32:34.680 --> 0:32:37.520 something about like street ball, like on the Rucker. 0:32:37.800 --> 0:32:44.880 That sort of thing. We got. 0:32:46.040 --> 0:32:48.320 I'll say that we got about three months into it, 0:32:48.760 --> 0:32:54.120 three months into workshops. Here here's the music lineup, Bootsy Collins, 0:32:54.200 --> 0:33:00.120 Nonah Hendricks Quest Love, Bootsy Collins, Nona Hendricks Questlove, and 0:33:00.240 --> 0:33:04.400 I think Mums so that you know, they they were like, 0:33:04.840 --> 0:33:09.520 He's just gonna be poetry and basketball and Llo cool 0:33:09.640 --> 0:33:13.240 Jay and and you know the thing is is that 0:33:13.600 --> 0:33:18.720 Broadways so addicted to this, like to this ten pan 0:33:18.840 --> 0:33:24.440 alley jazz fingers like this, this this Gershwind thing. 0:33:24.760 --> 0:33:30.920 They can't let go. And it's like you, I mean, 0:33:31.040 --> 0:33:33.960 out out of And there's there's four or five other. 0:33:33.840 --> 0:33:37.680 Plays that I've seen or been involved with, pitches in 0:33:37.880 --> 0:33:40.600 which they go over the top and describing it. I mean, 0:33:41.080 --> 0:33:45.880 in your mind, are you thinking, Okay, I'm finally gonna 0:33:47.320 --> 0:33:50.360 rid Broadway of its of its disease of being stuck 0:33:50.440 --> 0:33:54.760 in the nineteen thirties and just updated, Like, are you 0:33:54.960 --> 0:33:57.200 thinking this at all when you're when you're putting these 0:33:57.240 --> 0:34:00.560 productions together? Is it just like, Hey, it's Thursday, and 0:34:00.600 --> 0:34:02.200 I have a clever idea I want to get down. 0:34:02.600 --> 0:34:04.440 Yeah, it's a combo of both. 0:34:04.480 --> 0:34:06.960 And it's actually it brings us back to tiktick Boom 0:34:07.040 --> 0:34:10.680 because I think that I have parents who grew up 0:34:10.719 --> 0:34:13.040 with I grew up with cast albums. My parents were 0:34:13.120 --> 0:34:15.880 like that generation who just collected didn't even see the shows, 0:34:15.920 --> 0:34:16.799 but collected. 0:34:16.480 --> 0:34:20.399 The cast albums, and so I grew up with those 0:34:20.560 --> 0:34:21.399 and loving those. 0:34:21.560 --> 0:34:23.960 But again, I think like for a lot of people, 0:34:24.120 --> 0:34:26.800 it just felt like something old white people did and 0:34:26.960 --> 0:34:28.000 old white people saw. 0:34:28.400 --> 0:34:30.880 And I enjoyed it, but it didn't seem. 0:34:30.719 --> 0:34:32.239 Like a place in it. 0:34:32.360 --> 0:34:37.600 Yeah, it was like a walled garden. And then I 0:34:37.719 --> 0:34:42.319 saw Rent, and that really changed it for me because one, 0:34:42.560 --> 0:34:48.160 it took place in the present, and that sounds so normal, 0:34:48.480 --> 0:34:50.680 but I hadn't seen any musicals. It took place in 0:34:50.760 --> 0:34:52.880 the present by the time I'm a teenager. Even a 0:34:52.960 --> 0:34:54.880 chorus line is a period piece. 0:34:56.239 --> 0:34:58.160 And okay, I hate to be that guy. What year 0:34:58.200 --> 0:34:58.919 did you see Rent? 0:34:59.040 --> 0:35:01.920 I saw first year on my seventies. You saw it 0:35:01.960 --> 0:35:05.080 in ninety six the last row of the Neederlander Theater. 0:35:05.320 --> 0:35:08.799 Mezzani me too, So you saw it in ninety six. 0:35:09.080 --> 0:35:10.960 I saw it in ninety seven because I saw it 0:35:10.960 --> 0:35:12.000 for my seventeenth birthday. 0:35:12.080 --> 0:35:13.879 Yeah, well, I didn't know if it was ninety six 0:35:13.960 --> 0:35:18.160 ninety seven. And for you that was life changing, because 0:35:18.200 --> 0:35:23.560 the thing was when I saw Rent in two thousand 0:35:23.600 --> 0:35:25.239 and four, two thousand and. 0:35:25.239 --> 0:35:28.960 Five, Yeah, I was kind of like it's a different thing. 0:35:30.440 --> 0:35:30.840 I don't know. 0:35:31.160 --> 0:35:34.960 Maybe no, you're you're right, because I remember seeing Rant 0:35:35.040 --> 0:35:37.279 in two thousand and four, two thousand and five, and 0:35:37.440 --> 0:35:39.479 it was it felt like a copy of a copy 0:35:39.520 --> 0:35:42.880 of a copy by then, Like I remember seeing it. 0:35:42.960 --> 0:35:44.920 We had a friend who was a swing in it, 0:35:45.280 --> 0:35:47.160 and so I got to go around the era you 0:35:47.239 --> 0:35:50.200 saw it. I remember seeing one of the actresses like 0:35:50.680 --> 0:35:53.719 straight up falling asleep during lave v Bom and it's 0:35:53.760 --> 0:35:57.880 like that show doesn't work if like everybody doesn't believe 0:35:57.960 --> 0:36:00.600 in it in every iota of their being. And you 0:36:00.719 --> 0:36:06.520 saw like that twentieth cast, and but I remember. 0:36:06.440 --> 0:36:11.520 That really shows the power of you, because Hamilton is 0:36:11.680 --> 0:36:17.439 able to resonate powerfully with or without the nucleus cast. 0:36:17.640 --> 0:36:18.560 Well yeah, but I. 0:36:18.600 --> 0:36:23.080 Also think we also as a production team are so 0:36:23.320 --> 0:36:26.840 much more involved than other production teams at this stage 0:36:26.880 --> 0:36:29.799 in the musical's life, Like still weekly zooms with our 0:36:29.920 --> 0:36:33.319 cast member like we're Tommy checks in, our director checks 0:36:33.360 --> 0:36:34.480 in like more than anybody. 0:36:35.080 --> 0:36:37.280 But but for me, Rent in ninety seven. 0:36:37.400 --> 0:36:41.400 Was a contemporary show and it's not like, oh my gosh, 0:36:41.440 --> 0:36:43.120 that sounds like it could be on the radio. It 0:36:43.200 --> 0:36:47.440 still sounded very rock on Broadway, but to me it 0:36:47.880 --> 0:36:51.160 ended the conversation about rock on Broadway. It was sort 0:36:51.160 --> 0:36:54.160 of like Jonathan Larson was like, rock music and pop 0:36:54.239 --> 0:36:57.560 music and Broadway should reflect each other. They just should 0:36:57.600 --> 0:37:00.160 be friends. That's why we liked to gershawin he on 0:37:00.239 --> 0:37:02.480 the radio, and then you would go see the song 0:37:02.520 --> 0:37:04.440 you heard on the radio in the shows that night. 0:37:04.920 --> 0:37:08.440 And there's no reason popular music and theater music shouldn't 0:37:08.440 --> 0:37:10.800 be in conversation with each other all the time. And 0:37:10.920 --> 0:37:13.040 that was I mean, if anything, that's the thesis of 0:37:13.080 --> 0:37:17.400 Rent and the Score, and so I just extrapolated that 0:37:17.600 --> 0:37:19.840 to hip hop. I was just like, I don't understand 0:37:19.960 --> 0:37:22.200 why every time I see hip hop reference in a 0:37:22.239 --> 0:37:25.600 Broadway musical, it's like in quotes, it's like, isn't it 0:37:25.719 --> 0:37:28.440 crazy that characters are rapping? I was like, hip hop 0:37:28.560 --> 0:37:31.279 is thirty years old, it's so way past a joke 0:37:31.840 --> 0:37:35.439 at this point. That and it's some of the best 0:37:35.440 --> 0:37:38.400 storytelling in music. So why aren't you all in conversation 0:37:38.520 --> 0:37:42.040 with each other? So even in the musicals I wrote 0:37:42.200 --> 0:37:44.920 in high school, I was always putting hip hop in them. 0:37:45.320 --> 0:37:46.880 In the Heights had a ton of hip hop in it. 0:37:47.360 --> 0:37:50.160 It was just I just felt like it was a 0:37:50.280 --> 0:37:54.839 more exciting way to tell a story through music than 0:37:54.960 --> 0:37:55.760 what I was seeing. 0:37:56.440 --> 0:37:58.320 I think with hip hop too, but with Ryman, like 0:37:58.400 --> 0:38:01.320 you can get more content in Like you know what 0:38:01.320 --> 0:38:03.960 I'm saying. If you give a singer sixteen bars and 0:38:04.040 --> 0:38:07.040 you give a rapper sixteen bars, I'm saying, I'm gonna 0:38:07.040 --> 0:38:09.040 say a whole lot more, you know what I'm saying, 0:38:09.400 --> 0:38:11.040 because it's just more content. 0:38:11.320 --> 0:38:13.600 There's something to say too about the audience that hip 0:38:13.600 --> 0:38:15.880 hop attracts and what that would bring to Broadway in 0:38:15.920 --> 0:38:18.840 the theater and what they were afraid of, right, yeah, No. 0:38:18.960 --> 0:38:20.680 I mean it's so funny when I see when I 0:38:20.719 --> 0:38:23.120 would see Dave do the first round of interviews on 0:38:23.239 --> 0:38:26.760 Hamilton and like people be like, you're rappid so fast, 0:38:26.960 --> 0:38:32.080 and He's like, oh no, I'm not being fast for Broadway, 0:38:33.160 --> 0:38:35.680 right right right. The laugh I think is it's slower 0:38:35.760 --> 0:38:38.520 than anything tech nine's ever said in his life. 0:38:39.360 --> 0:38:42.280 Right, technolog the same thing, Yeah. 0:38:42.200 --> 0:38:47.800 Exactly, all tho the Worldlife Shoppers. But like you know, 0:38:48.040 --> 0:38:51.640 it is in a way Hamilton's so passed to do. 0:38:51.960 --> 0:38:55.800 But the reason Hamilton works is because it is the 0:38:55.880 --> 0:38:58.200 story of a writer, and I don't think people think 0:38:58.239 --> 0:39:01.200 of hip hop artists as writers. And that was that 0:39:01.400 --> 0:39:03.640 was the only that was the insight I brought to it, 0:39:03.880 --> 0:39:06.759 was like, this is a guy who wrote himself into 0:39:06.840 --> 0:39:09.440 every situation. And that's what our favorite mcs do. They 0:39:09.520 --> 0:39:13.560 write about their reality so well that they transcend them 0:39:13.800 --> 0:39:16.360 that when you go across the world with your African 0:39:16.440 --> 0:39:19.360 High Life band Bill, you will meet people on the 0:39:19.440 --> 0:39:22.080 other side of the world who can wrap every lyric 0:39:22.160 --> 0:39:25.040 of Ready to Die or the eight Mile soundtrack or 0:39:26.040 --> 0:39:31.080 things Fall Apart, like it transcends because of its specificity. 0:39:31.320 --> 0:39:34.839 And that's you know, when I was reading that book, 0:39:35.400 --> 0:39:37.480 that's to me what Hamilton did. And so I was like, 0:39:37.520 --> 0:39:39.080 this is a hip hop is the only way to 0:39:39.120 --> 0:39:39.600 do this story? 0:39:40.200 --> 0:39:42.279 And how long did you spend writing Hamilton? How long 0:39:42.360 --> 0:39:43.000 the process was. 0:39:43.000 --> 0:39:45.200 That I started in two thousand and eight and we 0:39:45.320 --> 0:39:49.279 opened on Broadway in twenty fifteen. Shit, yeah, it was 0:39:49.320 --> 0:39:51.680 like because it was also like I kind of felt 0:39:51.760 --> 0:39:54.880 like a snake staring down an elephant, like for me 0:39:55.000 --> 0:39:58.400 to digest this history and then be able to like 0:39:59.080 --> 0:40:01.560 spit it back out in a way that it like 0:40:01.800 --> 0:40:03.800 told the story, you know, because I had to just 0:40:03.880 --> 0:40:07.960 do a ton of research full stop, and then you know, 0:40:08.080 --> 0:40:11.560 attack every moment and decide. You know, it's just a 0:40:11.680 --> 0:40:16.320 million decisions. And I had to read a lot of 0:40:16.480 --> 0:40:20.440 boring papers by people who are smarter than me, right, 0:40:20.880 --> 0:40:22.239 and have it make sense to me in a way 0:40:22.280 --> 0:40:24.360 that then I could write it and embody it and 0:40:24.480 --> 0:40:25.520 tell those stories and make it. 0:40:25.640 --> 0:40:26.800 Make it make sense to the audience. 0:40:27.120 --> 0:40:28.640 Yeah, it makes it makes sense to myself. 0:40:29.600 --> 0:40:32.000 The other thing in the Secret Sauce is like a 0:40:32.080 --> 0:40:33.800 lot of the energy in Hamilton is like, can you 0:40:33.840 --> 0:40:35.960 believe this should happen? Can you believe this should happened? 0:40:36.040 --> 0:40:39.520 Because I'm experiencing that as I'm reading this story, like 0:40:39.640 --> 0:40:41.840 and then he's vice president and then he shoots it 0:40:42.040 --> 0:40:44.040 like it's fucking crazy. 0:40:45.040 --> 0:40:48.080 And it's a soap opera. But yeah, it took a 0:40:48.120 --> 0:40:49.239 long time for me to digest it. 0:40:53.920 --> 0:40:56.520 I'm still trying to wrap my mind around the fact 0:40:56.560 --> 0:41:01.680 that when you go on vacation, you take like right now, 0:41:02.440 --> 0:41:06.120 Obama is about to turn in a two volume book, 0:41:07.480 --> 0:41:12.760 and volume one, I believe, is seven hundred and ninety pages, 0:41:13.800 --> 0:41:17.200 so already a book the size of Hamilton that you 0:41:17.600 --> 0:41:21.959 read when you went on vacation. You finished that book 0:41:22.440 --> 0:41:25.319 on vacation. You couldn't, don't. 0:41:25.400 --> 0:41:27.200 I don't know that I finished it on vacation. But 0:41:27.560 --> 0:41:30.120 this was pre kindled. This is before you could put 0:41:30.200 --> 0:41:31.120 fifty books. 0:41:30.960 --> 0:41:32.879 In your backund Yeah, no, that's what I'm saying. 0:41:33.360 --> 0:41:35.520 You don't want to pack twenty books. I'm just gonna 0:41:35.560 --> 0:41:37.799 pack one big book and that'll be my vacation book. 0:41:38.360 --> 0:41:41.640 It was just like, who takes a seven hundred page 0:41:41.680 --> 0:41:43.080 book on vacation? 0:41:43.920 --> 0:41:45.799 I just knew the guy died in a duel at 0:41:45.840 --> 0:41:46.080 the end. 0:41:46.239 --> 0:41:48.120 That was it made that to what made it interesting? 0:41:48.200 --> 0:41:50.040 And like I learned that in school and I was 0:41:50.080 --> 0:41:50.239 just like. 0:41:50.320 --> 0:41:51.080 This would be interesting. 0:41:51.160 --> 0:41:52.120 Yeah, because that was my quine. 0:41:52.160 --> 0:41:54.000 That was my next question. I was like, why Hamilton 0:41:54.080 --> 0:41:56.640 and not Lincoln or Jefferson or whoever? 0:41:56.760 --> 0:41:59.120 Right? Like why or Icebergs? What made you speak? 0:42:00.280 --> 0:42:03.880 I think, honestly, it's because there was so much I 0:42:03.960 --> 0:42:06.000 didn't know by the time I started writ Like what 0:42:06.200 --> 0:42:08.200 got the book off the shelf and into my hands 0:42:08.840 --> 0:42:11.320 was I knew this guy got shot by the vice president, 0:42:12.400 --> 0:42:14.680 like and I think around the time Dick Cheney had 0:42:14.719 --> 0:42:19.440 just shot a dude like an accidental hunting money in 0:42:19.480 --> 0:42:27.680 the face and his face the face, and so that 0:42:27.800 --> 0:42:30.120 was enough to just like pique my curiosity because that's 0:42:30.200 --> 0:42:32.560 really all I knew other than he was on the ten. 0:42:32.960 --> 0:42:35.360 And then when I opened the book and realized he 0:42:35.960 --> 0:42:38.840 was born and grew up in the Caribbean, that was 0:42:38.920 --> 0:42:39.560 interesting to me. 0:42:39.640 --> 0:42:41.759 I didn't know any of the white dudes on money were. 0:42:41.680 --> 0:42:47.520 Not born here. And then when he got the scholarship, 0:42:47.800 --> 0:42:50.560 this hurricane destroys the island, he writes about it, and 0:42:50.760 --> 0:42:54.400 they collect money for a scholarship to send him to 0:42:55.520 --> 0:42:58.160 not the States. It wasn't the States yet the fucking mainland. 0:43:00.280 --> 0:43:00.480 You know. 0:43:01.080 --> 0:43:02.920 That's when I was like, well, this guy, that's what 0:43:03.000 --> 0:43:05.080 my dad did. Like my dad grew up in Puerto 0:43:05.160 --> 0:43:07.879 Rico and got a scholarship to come to New York 0:43:08.000 --> 0:43:10.840 at the same age. Because my dad is way smarter 0:43:10.960 --> 0:43:13.080 than me, he had graduated college by the time he 0:43:13.200 --> 0:43:13.600 was eighteen. 0:43:13.680 --> 0:43:14.720 He skipped all the grades. 0:43:14.760 --> 0:43:19.680 He was like Puerto Rican doogie. And so it that 0:43:20.000 --> 0:43:23.080 temperament of like how he was like I gotta get 0:43:23.120 --> 0:43:24.640 the fuck out of here. I gotta make a life 0:43:24.680 --> 0:43:27.560 for myself, Like that was a very It reminded me 0:43:27.640 --> 0:43:29.840 of my dad. And it also felt fundamentally like a 0:43:29.920 --> 0:43:32.799 hip hop story, like I'm gonna get the fuck out 0:43:32.880 --> 0:43:35.040 of where I am and get to a better place 0:43:35.120 --> 0:43:39.320 in life. And that's the stuff of good musicals. You 0:43:39.480 --> 0:43:42.960 want the character who has a really strong want. You 0:43:43.120 --> 0:43:48.840 want you know, fucking Tony singing, Something's coming. You want. 0:43:50.160 --> 0:43:52.480 Alpha Ba singing, I'm gonna meet the fucking Wizard. 0:43:53.280 --> 0:43:57.600 You know, that's the stuff of good musicals because they've 0:43:57.760 --> 0:43:59.120 just got this engine in them. 0:44:01.200 --> 0:44:02.200 So can I ask you a question? 0:44:02.520 --> 0:44:05.520 I'm curious in between like the heights, how does as 0:44:05.600 --> 0:44:08.120 a working artist? Because you said how long it took 0:44:08.160 --> 0:44:09.719 for you to get to Hamilton? Like, what are you 0:44:09.880 --> 0:44:11.719 doing in the in between years? 0:44:11.840 --> 0:44:14.600 It was Sesame Street Songs for Bill. 0:44:15.120 --> 0:44:16.640 That's okay, that's. 0:44:19.480 --> 0:44:19.520 No. 0:44:20.239 --> 0:44:23.120 Yeah, well, hold on, we haven't completed this full start. 0:44:23.160 --> 0:44:25.760 So we creduated from college. All right, So graduated from college. 0:44:26.120 --> 0:44:28.560 We don't even get the freestyle of supreme Wait, hold. 0:44:28.400 --> 0:44:30.920 On, we're getting in there. That's there, you go. So 0:44:31.160 --> 0:44:34.439 then so we graduated college, and then so we both 0:44:34.560 --> 0:44:36.640 moved home for like six months. 0:44:36.960 --> 0:44:37.799 I never moved home. 0:44:37.880 --> 0:44:39.160 I went to apartment. 0:44:39.360 --> 0:44:43.280 Yeah, so he we we if I moved home, stay apartment. 0:44:43.840 --> 0:44:46.440 So Lynn rents this apartment with two other people. It's 0:44:46.560 --> 0:44:51.480 five thousand Broadway and so two on a twelve street, 0:44:51.760 --> 0:44:54.719 which is like twenty blocks now, like ten blocks from 0:44:54.760 --> 0:44:55.600 Lynn's parents. 0:44:55.360 --> 0:44:57.520 Who live on b Boo boo boo boop treat. 0:44:58.080 --> 0:45:02.440 Oh yeah, get that address too. I forgot you're like 0:45:02.440 --> 0:45:04.279 an important person. Stop looking at me like that. 0:45:04.560 --> 0:45:05.279 So so so. 0:45:07.000 --> 0:45:09.879 Uh okay, So I move into this apartment. So if 0:45:09.920 --> 0:45:13.839 it rains outside, it rains inside. We made we make 0:45:13.920 --> 0:45:15.799 pizza bagels, like solely because we. 0:45:15.800 --> 0:45:16.520 Don't have any money. 0:45:16.719 --> 0:45:17.360 We skate. 0:45:19.239 --> 0:45:24.600 Beans get we skateboard in the house. There's like a 0:45:24.680 --> 0:45:26.839 mattress like if you fall on the skateboard, you take 0:45:26.840 --> 0:45:28.280 a nap on the mattress. 0:45:27.960 --> 0:45:30.680 Like it's gross. It's gross, and you bring people there 0:45:30.719 --> 0:45:32.960 and they're like, this is fucking gross. Anyway, we lived 0:45:33.000 --> 0:45:35.120 there for like four years, and. 0:45:35.400 --> 0:45:38.360 I was just a substitute tea shirt right, and I worked. 0:45:38.160 --> 0:45:40.720 At MTV because my dad got me a job working 0:45:40.760 --> 0:45:43.360 in the IT department at MTV. So I was like 0:45:43.480 --> 0:45:46.759 answering emails sent into MTV. This is all true. And 0:45:47.440 --> 0:45:50.919 during during my lunch breaks, Lynn and I would meet 0:45:50.960 --> 0:45:53.520 at the drama bookshop, which was then on fortieth Street 0:45:53.560 --> 0:45:55.759 between Something and Something, and we would go down in 0:45:55.840 --> 0:45:57.760 this basement and we would work on in the heights. 0:45:58.000 --> 0:45:59.920 So he would bring a song, we would do a thing. 0:46:00.000 --> 0:46:00.799 Blah blah blah blah. 0:46:00.840 --> 0:46:03.600 We're talking and I'm more like that crew. 0:46:03.880 --> 0:46:05.920 Right, And this went on for years and then and 0:46:06.000 --> 0:46:09.640 then finally, after you know, charming enough people and doing 0:46:09.800 --> 0:46:13.759 enough work, we went up off Broadway on thirty seven 0:46:13.880 --> 0:46:17.240 Arts on thirty seventh Street and that was like an amazing, 0:46:17.640 --> 0:46:20.759 humongous moment. Meanwhile, we're both He's still subbing. I'm still 0:46:20.800 --> 0:46:22.920 working this totally dead end job. At one point, I 0:46:22.960 --> 0:46:25.719 think I was like being paid to transcribe things for 0:46:25.920 --> 0:46:31.319 people like us request live Yeahdale to. 0:46:31.360 --> 0:46:38.400 The translator for Carson Davis. I mean, yeah, car uh 0:46:38.880 --> 0:46:41.080 what we other? We had other weird jobs. Lynn what else? 0:46:41.120 --> 0:46:41.239 Oh? 0:46:41.280 --> 0:46:44.960 Lynn wrote music for his dad's like camp ads. 0:46:45.120 --> 0:46:47.440 Yeah, just like I mean, that's the easiest gig of 0:46:47.640 --> 0:46:52.040 just like sad Chord. This politician wants to kick puppy. 0:46:52.320 --> 0:46:54.480 That's crazy because as your career is blowing up, so 0:46:54.719 --> 0:46:56.319 is your dad's. Like he's going in a whole different Okay, 0:46:56.360 --> 0:46:57.360 So go ahead, Bill. 0:46:57.560 --> 0:47:00.719 So every Sunday we would go to lynn parents house 0:47:00.760 --> 0:47:04.200 and watch the Soprano It was live, like we would 0:47:04.239 --> 0:47:04.600 get off the. 0:47:04.600 --> 0:47:07.600 Stage and they had cable and we didn't, right, and. 0:47:07.840 --> 0:47:08.640 We had no food. 0:47:08.680 --> 0:47:10.320 So it's like the only real real we ate was 0:47:10.440 --> 0:47:13.960 every Sunday at Lynd's parents house with like Lynn's grandmother, 0:47:14.400 --> 0:47:16.640 his cousin like his parents. 0:47:16.800 --> 0:47:19.040 It was awesome and we went every Sunday, and we 0:47:19.120 --> 0:47:21.359 want to watch the Sopranos every week. Yeah. 0:47:21.960 --> 0:47:27.560 In fact, we saw the Last School okay uh, and 0:47:27.640 --> 0:47:29.480 then in the Heights went went up off Broadway two 0:47:29.480 --> 0:47:29.920 thousand and eight. 0:47:29.960 --> 0:47:30.719 We were like, holy shit. 0:47:30.840 --> 0:47:34.640 My first acting job, my first TV job was on 0:47:34.760 --> 0:47:36.320 the last season of The Sopranos. I got on. 0:47:36.480 --> 0:47:40.720 I was a bell hop, Oh, bell hop, mister Herman, 0:47:40.840 --> 0:47:41.680 paging mister Herman. 0:47:44.880 --> 0:47:48.200 Literally my line is I don't know, I don't know, 0:47:48.600 --> 0:47:49.760 and I'm so great. 0:47:50.040 --> 0:47:50.759 You can see me. 0:47:50.840 --> 0:47:53.320 Look down from my mark where to stop in the 0:47:53.400 --> 0:47:54.880 episode you're seeing me. 0:47:54.920 --> 0:47:56.560 Go, wait, do you know the name of the episode. 0:47:56.640 --> 0:47:58.400 I'm sorry, My Apple TV is right in front of 0:47:58.440 --> 0:47:58.880 me right now. 0:48:00.520 --> 0:48:03.640 Miss It's called remember when I mere you missed the 0:48:03.680 --> 0:48:04.640 re enacted damn. 0:48:04.719 --> 0:48:07.480 Then was about to do yes, I don't know, I 0:48:08.520 --> 0:48:08.759 don't know. 0:48:08.960 --> 0:48:11.560 And then uh goes fucking guy. 0:48:15.840 --> 0:48:19.640 But you got to share screen time with the great Gandolphine. 0:48:20.360 --> 0:48:22.240 Paully was in that scene too, right, Paul. 0:48:22.200 --> 0:48:22.799 Was the scene? 0:48:25.360 --> 0:48:28.040 Okay, that was okay, PAULI is pussy, No pussy is different. Okay, 0:48:28.160 --> 0:48:28.839 I gotta go back. 0:48:28.960 --> 0:48:32.880 Damn, you're in the last Wow, that's amazing when you 0:48:32.920 --> 0:48:33.480 went to Vegas. 0:48:33.600 --> 0:48:42.640 Right, stopped talking. I'm sorry watching the Sopranos. 0:48:43.560 --> 0:48:45.840 This is what happens on Quest of Supreme. I'm still listening. 0:48:45.920 --> 0:48:46.240 Go ahead. 0:48:46.680 --> 0:48:49.920 So during this time getting towards off Broadway, Uh, I 0:48:50.080 --> 0:48:53.080 moved out of that house and moved in with my girlfriend, 0:48:53.560 --> 0:48:55.560 who then became my wife. 0:48:55.920 --> 0:49:03.160 Don't go and and then and then wait where are 0:49:03.160 --> 0:49:09.600 they coming from? The right on time? You're welcome. 0:49:09.920 --> 0:49:12.239 Were we were rehearsing that before we did this, And 0:49:12.360 --> 0:49:15.440 then what happened Lynn Lynn started dating his now wife. 0:49:15.640 --> 0:49:18.000 We had children anyway, and so then in the Heights 0:49:18.040 --> 0:49:21.120 happens and we have careers, poof careers. 0:49:21.719 --> 0:49:23.640 How long was that in the Heights? How long was 0:49:23.680 --> 0:49:25.200 writing at that process? 0:49:25.640 --> 0:49:29.040 It was from I mean basically from the moment I 0:49:29.080 --> 0:49:31.000 met Tommy Cale, when I graduated in two thousand and 0:49:31.080 --> 0:49:36.399 two to opening night, like January of two thousand and eight, 0:49:36.560 --> 0:49:36.799 it was. 0:49:36.840 --> 0:49:41.120 My twenty like basically in the Heights was my twenties thirty. 0:49:41.920 --> 0:49:45.719 So like lots of other gigs and and sort of 0:49:45.800 --> 0:49:49.080 amazing things in between, but those are the broad strokes. 0:49:49.280 --> 0:49:53.280 Yeah, So with theater, I'm curious to know how long 0:49:54.000 --> 0:49:57.640 do you have I guess to edit something before it 0:49:57.760 --> 0:49:58.200 goes up? 0:49:58.719 --> 0:50:00.839 You know how if you've it happens long. 0:50:02.719 --> 0:50:07.960 You know, in terms of every show is different. For 0:50:09.800 --> 0:50:12.759 for Heights, we gave ourselves a solid four weeks so 0:50:12.880 --> 0:50:15.080 that we can make changes because the audience is the 0:50:15.120 --> 0:50:18.680 last collaborator and and they'll they'll tell you what's working, 0:50:18.800 --> 0:50:20.080 what's not, and what needs finessing. 0:50:20.120 --> 0:50:21.440 And it may not even be the writing of it. 0:50:21.520 --> 0:50:24.680 It may be that that number is not ending with 0:50:24.760 --> 0:50:28.719 the right light, or this dance sequence isn't landing the 0:50:28.760 --> 0:50:30.960 way we want it to land. So pre that's what 0:50:31.080 --> 0:50:39.080 previews is for, is to get the audience in and yeah, 0:50:39.200 --> 0:50:43.520 and and I mean Hamilton was interesting because we did 0:50:43.600 --> 0:50:47.480 the first performance at the Public and it ran at 0:50:47.680 --> 0:50:52.560 three hours and ten minutes. Yeah, about three hours and 0:50:52.640 --> 0:50:56.359 ten minutes and it was sort of like, well, shit, 0:50:56.400 --> 0:50:57.759 I like lame Is, but I don't want to be 0:50:57.800 --> 0:51:04.040 longer than Lamys. And so first and Tommy was so, 0:51:04.320 --> 0:51:06.920 you know, Tommy is is smart full stop, but he's 0:51:06.960 --> 0:51:10.400 also politically really smart, because sometimes people get salty when 0:51:10.400 --> 0:51:13.480 their stuff is cut, like you can do cuts the 0:51:13.560 --> 0:51:16.520 wrong way, in a way that the cast doesn't feel 0:51:16.640 --> 0:51:18.759 in on it. And he said, the first thing we 0:51:18.840 --> 0:51:21.720 need to do is cut any song addressing any character 0:51:22.040 --> 0:51:24.759 that is not on stage. And I had a hot 0:51:24.840 --> 0:51:28.120 sixteen bars about John Adams, who was never played by anyone. 0:51:28.200 --> 0:51:30.520 It was like an off stage address. And that was 0:51:30.600 --> 0:51:32.759 the first thing we cut. And it was great because 0:51:32.760 --> 0:51:34.799 it also sent a message to the rest of the cast, 0:51:34.960 --> 0:51:37.400 like we just cut the composer's best sixteen. 0:51:38.200 --> 0:51:42.200 So this is not as it's not a. 0:51:42.280 --> 0:51:45.640 Value, it's a what's best for the show. 0:51:45.640 --> 0:51:47.680 It's not about whether you're doing it well or not, 0:51:48.040 --> 0:51:50.480 like this is about honing the material. So we cut 0:51:50.600 --> 0:51:54.200 all my Ship first and brought like brought down ten 0:51:54.280 --> 0:51:57.120 minutes and then and then you know, we got it 0:51:57.239 --> 0:52:01.040 down to about we got it down to like two 0:52:01.400 --> 0:52:05.000 fifty at the public and then we use the jump 0:52:05.080 --> 0:52:07.319 to Broadway to cut another fifteen. 0:52:06.960 --> 0:52:09.560 Minutes, so before it goes to Broadway. 0:52:09.719 --> 0:52:13.040 You have the previews that are foreign audience, where that's 0:52:13.080 --> 0:52:14.879 almost kind of like, I don't say a focus group, 0:52:14.960 --> 0:52:17.400 but that's what you like said, it's. 0:52:17.239 --> 0:52:19.560 A nightly focused group, and it's and again it's also 0:52:20.520 --> 0:52:22.840 it's not even about like they laughed at this. They 0:52:22.880 --> 0:52:25.279 didn't laugh at this, because sometimes you get the wrong laugh, 0:52:25.440 --> 0:52:28.320 Like we had a line in History Has Its Eyes 0:52:28.360 --> 0:52:31.239 on You where Chris Jackson was getting a laugh at 0:52:31.280 --> 0:52:35.320 the top of the song because I can't remember what 0:52:35.440 --> 0:52:37.920 it was, but he basically Nane checks the French and 0:52:38.000 --> 0:52:40.840 Indian War, and the nerds in the audience were like, aha, 0:52:41.400 --> 0:52:43.960 I know about that, and it was like, no, no, 0:52:44.040 --> 0:52:46.440 we don't want to laugh here, like that may be true, 0:52:46.840 --> 0:52:48.960 but it's a laugh when we don't need it. 0:52:49.840 --> 0:52:51.200 Similar with the ll quote we had. 0:52:51.520 --> 0:52:53.960 We used to have an I need love quote in 0:52:54.120 --> 0:52:59.520 the show, and that's the affair, right That song used 0:52:59.560 --> 0:53:02.200 to start when I'm alone in my room sometimes and 0:53:02.239 --> 0:53:05.399 you took it out all yeah, I took it out 0:53:05.960 --> 0:53:08.279 because the audience was laughing at the reference and they 0:53:08.320 --> 0:53:10.160 weren't listening to what was happening to what was saying, 0:53:10.760 --> 0:53:12.799 you know, like it was a free reference and even 0:53:13.080 --> 0:53:15.279 Ll reached out was like, you be clear, I'm cool 0:53:15.320 --> 0:53:19.960 with it, and that was amazing. She like literally like 0:53:20.360 --> 0:53:21.880 tweeted at me like let's talk about it. 0:53:21.960 --> 0:53:24.799 But it was just a laugh at the wrong moment. 0:53:25.000 --> 0:53:25.880 So we cut it. 0:53:26.640 --> 0:53:30.200 Yeah, I saw in the Heights. I still I've still 0:53:30.280 --> 0:53:32.520 yet to watch themton I saw in the Heights. A 0:53:32.640 --> 0:53:36.280 local the original theater group did it here in probably 0:53:36.320 --> 0:53:38.640 North Carolina, and a good friend of mine, Carly Jones, 0:53:38.840 --> 0:53:43.000 she played Camilla and we saw it and it was 0:53:43.080 --> 0:53:45.319 a great show man. I hit Bill afterwards, I send 0:53:45.360 --> 0:53:46.920 in the program. I was like, Yo, this was this 0:53:47.000 --> 0:53:48.759 is really dope because I'm not a theater. 0:53:48.600 --> 0:53:50.040 Guy, you know at all. 0:53:50.200 --> 0:53:52.120 You know, I hadn't really you know. That's why I 0:53:52.239 --> 0:53:54.360 just hearing all these stories. I'm just curious to know, 0:53:54.480 --> 0:53:56.680 like how they're worked out and how they're fleshed out. 0:53:56.760 --> 0:53:59.239 And you know when you say you started something, oh too, 0:53:59.280 --> 0:54:02.080 and y'all were working up until oh eight, It's like, damn. 0:54:04.080 --> 0:54:10.040 Because I feel like you would shine in theater. 0:54:10.320 --> 0:54:14.280 Oh yeah, indeed, absolutely, but in fund that you should 0:54:14.280 --> 0:54:16.840 be Inhilton in the new in. 0:54:18.600 --> 0:54:21.160 I mean any new version of it, not again, like 0:54:21.239 --> 0:54:24.239 I feel like there's not jazz hands thirty. 0:54:24.200 --> 0:54:28.879 Yeah, like input too, though not just the performing well 0:54:28.920 --> 0:54:32.440 again like that, I have to say, like after Heights 0:54:32.520 --> 0:54:34.640 Close we ran from two thousand and eight through the 0:54:34.760 --> 0:54:37.560 end of twenty ten, there was a part of me 0:54:37.640 --> 0:54:40.400 that was a little frustrated that. 0:54:41.320 --> 0:54:43.560 Hip hop land was over here and musical theater was 0:54:43.600 --> 0:54:46.160 over here, and there was so little ven diagram, Like 0:54:46.239 --> 0:54:49.600 I could not get the hip hop artists I admired 0:54:49.800 --> 0:54:53.040 too into the Rogers. I could not get awareness of 0:54:53.160 --> 0:54:55.520 the show in the hip hop community. It did well 0:54:55.560 --> 0:54:58.680 in the Latin community, and it brought Latin audiences to 0:54:58.760 --> 0:55:00.960 Broadway in a big way while it was there, but 0:55:01.080 --> 0:55:03.200 it was just like no one was even checking for it. 0:55:03.280 --> 0:55:04.960 I felt like I was jumping up and waving my 0:55:05.120 --> 0:55:08.480 arms and and it hadn't happened in a real way. 0:55:08.600 --> 0:55:10.800 Like I remember Run DMC came to the show, like 0:55:10.840 --> 0:55:13.719 a couple of like like legends came and they were 0:55:13.800 --> 0:55:18.360 it was really like huge for me. But with with Hamilton, 0:55:18.400 --> 0:55:20.400 I just I remember wanting so I was just like, 0:55:20.760 --> 0:55:22.920 this thing is such a fucking love letter to hip 0:55:22.960 --> 0:55:24.920 hop like it would be a shame. 0:55:25.320 --> 0:55:28.680 And I know it's sailing over the heads of the strictly. 0:55:28.400 --> 0:55:31.560 Musical theater fans. We're not getting the ten Crack Commandments 0:55:31.600 --> 0:55:34.719 reference or the mob Deep reference or the you know, 0:55:35.280 --> 0:55:37.880 brand Nubian reference because. 0:55:37.600 --> 0:55:39.719 It's all the nineties hip hop shit. I like, I 0:55:39.960 --> 0:55:40.959 crammed into the show. 0:55:42.000 --> 0:55:44.760 And so do you think point was an issue? 0:55:44.880 --> 0:55:48.120 Because maybe not not for those those famous people, but 0:55:48.520 --> 0:55:50.680 for their audience or for the people who surround them 0:55:50.719 --> 0:55:51.920 that they couldn't have a conversation with. 0:55:52.080 --> 0:55:54.080 I think it's I think it's always an issue. It's 0:55:54.080 --> 0:55:57.080 one of the biggest issues facing theater. 0:55:57.280 --> 0:55:59.239 I mean, that's a lot. 0:55:59.120 --> 0:56:00.920 I definitely wanted to see and I still have yet. 0:56:00.920 --> 0:56:03.000 I gotta now, I gotta get Disney Plus. 0:56:05.719 --> 0:56:06.960 Or Disney Plus password. 0:56:07.400 --> 0:56:09.200 Oh yes, I'm working on that. 0:56:10.760 --> 0:56:18.800 Device's friends. I got to so I was I was 0:56:18.880 --> 0:56:22.320 really gratified when Hamilton was received the way it was 0:56:22.400 --> 0:56:25.160 because the folks that I knew would enjoy it were 0:56:25.200 --> 0:56:25.920 able to see it. 0:56:26.480 --> 0:56:27.080 Have you seen it? 0:56:27.200 --> 0:56:29.120 Have you seen it now since it's on Disney Plus 0:56:29.200 --> 0:56:32.719 and it's becoming more accessible, do you have you seen 0:56:32.840 --> 0:56:35.439 or do you foresee an influx of it being used 0:56:35.440 --> 0:56:38.320 as a tool and teaching like in school and stuff 0:56:38.360 --> 0:56:38.480 like that. 0:56:39.040 --> 0:56:40.680 Well, that was one of the first things that we 0:56:40.840 --> 0:56:43.080 realized coming out of it, Like two hundred and fifty 0:56:43.160 --> 0:56:46.880 thousand students have seen Hamilton thanks to Edgeham, this educational 0:56:46.920 --> 0:56:51.160 program we did because we realized really quick like, oh, 0:56:51.320 --> 0:56:54.480 this is becoming a buzz that is bigger than we 0:56:54.600 --> 0:56:57.400 can control. And if kids can't see the show, be 0:56:57.480 --> 0:56:59.839 fucked up because this is like a semester of ap 0:57:00.440 --> 0:57:04.480 history in about two and a half hours. And so 0:57:05.400 --> 0:57:10.600 we partnered with a nonprofit called the Gilded Learnment Association 0:57:10.680 --> 0:57:16.160 that basically deals in teaching American history, and we created Edgeham, 0:57:16.240 --> 0:57:19.520 which is these dedicated shows that are these student matinees. 0:57:20.040 --> 0:57:23.080 We start with the students do a curriculum where they 0:57:23.200 --> 0:57:26.160 write about whoever they want in American history. 0:57:26.560 --> 0:57:28.680 And I mean you can go if you google Edgeham, 0:57:28.720 --> 0:57:30.240 you'll see the most amazing shit. 0:57:30.600 --> 0:57:35.680 Like Phyllis Wheatley poems and Sally Hemming songs. I Like, 0:57:35.760 --> 0:57:40.040 people really like take the assignment and like of like, oh, 0:57:40.360 --> 0:57:42.560 what's the history I'm not learning about, I'm going to 0:57:42.640 --> 0:57:45.120 write about that, and they perform it for us. They 0:57:45.160 --> 0:57:47.440 get their Broadway debut, and they perform on stage and 0:57:47.600 --> 0:57:50.360 the best group from each school performs and they all 0:57:50.400 --> 0:57:52.000 scream for each other. Then they do a Q and 0:57:52.080 --> 0:57:54.560 A with the cast, and then we perform the matinee 0:57:54.640 --> 0:57:57.720 for them, and it's the It's the biggest legacy of 0:57:57.800 --> 0:58:00.960 the show because I feel like it opens up, it 0:58:01.040 --> 0:58:03.520 opens up history in a way that says, this is yours. 0:58:04.280 --> 0:58:04.960 This is ours. 0:58:06.280 --> 0:58:08.480 Oh no, no, uh now, I was just gonna ask you, 0:58:08.920 --> 0:58:11.080 you know, in regards to Hamilton. Uh, this was a 0:58:11.160 --> 0:58:13.800 couple of this is a while back. You're on Twitter 0:58:14.040 --> 0:58:20.280 and H Tracy Clayton, H Tracy Okay, playing family. I 0:58:20.360 --> 0:58:21.920 was like, we all kind of go way back. But 0:58:22.520 --> 0:58:25.800 y'all were having a discussion about about Hamilton, and you 0:58:25.920 --> 0:58:28.960 were very open, like to the criticisms of like, you know, 0:58:29.520 --> 0:58:32.080 what didn't really address kind of the horrors of slavery 0:58:32.120 --> 0:58:34.000 and him being like the slave owner like all that stuff, 0:58:34.280 --> 0:58:36.640 and you know, and I thought what you said was 0:58:36.800 --> 0:58:38.760 very fair of just like, look, I tried to get 0:58:38.800 --> 0:58:40.320 in what I could only had, you know, two and 0:58:40.360 --> 0:58:43.200 a half hours. You know, how do you decide what 0:58:43.400 --> 0:58:46.560 to cut, what to leave in, what's pertinent to the story. 0:58:47.440 --> 0:58:49.640 How do you I guess, how do you wrestle with 0:58:49.680 --> 0:58:50.720 all that and tell him the story? 0:58:51.080 --> 0:58:56.040 Every show is different. With Hamilton, the relentlessness was the thing. 0:58:56.200 --> 0:58:58.720 Like if it didn't, I mean, we had we cut 0:58:58.840 --> 0:59:01.840 characters because they were in Hamilton's life for long enough, 0:59:02.320 --> 0:59:04.840 you know, Like the guy who eulogized him is not 0:59:05.000 --> 0:59:07.880 in the show because he didn't meet him till later 0:59:07.960 --> 0:59:11.600 in his life. Ben Franklin, kind of an important guy 0:59:12.000 --> 0:59:15.600 not in the show because he didn't interact with Hamilton enough. 0:59:16.640 --> 0:59:20.160 And so it's interesting when when you have the success 0:59:20.560 --> 0:59:25.480 that Hamilton has had, what what happens is everyone like 0:59:25.640 --> 0:59:28.320 gets interested because the show has made them interested, and 0:59:28.400 --> 0:59:30.320 then they go and they do their research and they go, 0:59:30.440 --> 0:59:34.440 wait a minute, this city for this senor and put 0:59:34.520 --> 0:59:38.320 this in. And I'm over here, like I know, I've 0:59:38.360 --> 0:59:42.400 been researching this thing for six years, but I wanted 0:59:42.480 --> 0:59:44.720 to get you know, I'm writing a musical, I'm not 0:59:44.760 --> 0:59:48.640 writing a history report. And so I'm I'm open to 0:59:48.680 --> 0:59:51.000 the criticism because I know what's on the cutting room 0:59:51.040 --> 0:59:56.360 floor and I know that, you know, you know, it's interesting. 0:59:56.480 --> 0:59:59.960 Like I remember in the first year people really discovered 1:00:00.080 --> 1:00:04.160 John Lawrence John Lawrence was the most anti slavery of 1:00:04.320 --> 1:00:10.400 that group of friends, and he also people believe, and 1:00:10.760 --> 1:00:13.320 there's a really strong case for it, that he and 1:00:13.440 --> 1:00:16.960 Hamilton were lovers. Like the letters they write to each 1:00:16.960 --> 1:00:19.560 other are just as passionate as some of the ones 1:00:19.680 --> 1:00:23.480 Hamilton wrote to Eliza. And people said, what about this, 1:00:23.680 --> 1:00:27.280 and I said, yeah, maybe probably. The thing is Lawrence 1:00:27.320 --> 1:00:29.880 doesn't survive the act, so I can't really go there 1:00:30.360 --> 1:00:33.120 because I'm not going to get to explore it in 1:00:33.240 --> 1:00:33.600 act too. 1:00:33.800 --> 1:00:37.600 So that's why I didn't explore that facet of him. 1:00:37.840 --> 1:00:39.560 Yet to lean on on others. 1:00:39.560 --> 1:00:41.400 I'm curious because there's a lot of people who've had 1:00:41.440 --> 1:00:45.120 the experience of creating by epics or you know, things 1:00:45.160 --> 1:00:46.960 based on people's lives. Did you ever have to talk 1:00:47.000 --> 1:00:49.520 to other folks that had that similar experience that they 1:00:49.560 --> 1:00:50.080 had to cut. 1:00:49.920 --> 1:00:52.120 Out stuff and they were criticized because I thought about as. 1:00:52.040 --> 1:00:53.480 You were talking, I was like, yeah, I know, I 1:00:53.520 --> 1:00:55.360 rememb when people came to Spike Lee because even with 1:00:55.480 --> 1:00:58.240 that long ass movie, it wasn't enough for Malcolm X. 1:00:59.080 --> 1:00:59.240 Yeah. 1:00:59.680 --> 1:01:01.760 I mean that's just the part of the and the 1:01:02.240 --> 1:01:05.080 and the only thing you can say is everyone's right 1:01:05.720 --> 1:01:09.400 but it's not all in there. And also, like criticism 1:01:09.520 --> 1:01:13.000 is not cancelation, it's criticism. And I can take criticism, 1:01:13.240 --> 1:01:15.320 do you know what I mean? Like that's I'm a 1:01:15.360 --> 1:01:17.240 big boy, and I know what's not in there. And 1:01:18.320 --> 1:01:21.480 what I console myself with is it sparks conversations about 1:01:21.480 --> 1:01:24.160 what's not in it and about the faults of these 1:01:24.320 --> 1:01:28.000 folks and and how flawed the documents are and how 1:01:28.080 --> 1:01:31.480 flawed these men were. The thing I take issue with 1:01:31.800 --> 1:01:34.160 is I don't think we'd glorify these guys for a second. 1:01:34.320 --> 1:01:35.120 I just don't think. 1:01:35.240 --> 1:01:36.120 That was not my aim. 1:01:37.200 --> 1:01:39.720 My aim was to tell as compelling a story as 1:01:39.800 --> 1:01:41.760 I have while I have you in that theater for 1:01:41.840 --> 1:01:43.920 two and a half hours, and paint them as flawed 1:01:43.960 --> 1:01:48.360 as a piece of musical theater can paint them. But like, yes, 1:01:48.600 --> 1:01:49.960 you're all right, that's not in it. 1:01:50.040 --> 1:01:51.480 That's not in it. That's not in it, that's not 1:01:51.600 --> 1:01:54.640 in it, like and you know, and and and this 1:01:55.000 --> 1:01:56.960 was the springboard for that discussion. 1:01:57.320 --> 1:02:00.120 Yeah do you think you know? Because seeing in the 1:02:00.200 --> 1:02:04.280 heights and just seeing yeah, just seeing like all like 1:02:04.480 --> 1:02:07.560 just you know, black and Latino faces on stage, you 1:02:07.600 --> 1:02:10.880 know what I mean? That was probably the first theater, 1:02:11.680 --> 1:02:14.240 you know, show I've been to since I was small. 1:02:14.360 --> 1:02:17.640 You know, I hadn't been in like decades. And you know, 1:02:17.760 --> 1:02:20.120 do you think that these stories and the way you're 1:02:20.120 --> 1:02:22.480 telling them, have you seen that open the door for 1:02:22.640 --> 1:02:26.440 more black and Latino people to tell their stories on Broadway? 1:02:27.680 --> 1:02:27.880 Yeah? 1:02:27.960 --> 1:02:31.280 I mean I'm always pessimistic about Broadway. I'm actually really 1:02:31.320 --> 1:02:34.120 optimistic about this moment because we're in the middle of 1:02:34.200 --> 1:02:38.880 a civil rights movement in our country and business. 1:02:38.640 --> 1:02:41.200 Is on pause. So you cannot say you don't have 1:02:41.320 --> 1:02:42.280 time to deal with this. 1:02:42.840 --> 1:02:45.200 You cannot say you don't have time to talk about 1:02:45.240 --> 1:02:48.000 equity and the kinds of stories you're choosing to put 1:02:48.040 --> 1:02:53.920 your money into as Broadway producers. But listen, I started 1:02:53.960 --> 1:02:57.480 writing in the Heights because I don't dance well enough 1:02:57.520 --> 1:03:01.640 to be in West Side Story and I when I 1:03:01.840 --> 1:03:04.440 was a senior in high school, this musical by Paul 1:03:04.520 --> 1:03:06.960 Simon called The cap Man came out and it was 1:03:07.040 --> 1:03:09.080 about Puerto Rican gang. 1:03:08.960 --> 1:03:10.880 Members in the nineteen fifties. 1:03:11.080 --> 1:03:13.440 And as much as I love Paul Simon, I was like, 1:03:14.000 --> 1:03:17.720 what the fuck, Like, this is a very overrepresented group 1:03:17.800 --> 1:03:20.560 on Broadway at this point. Putan gang members from the 1:03:20.640 --> 1:03:23.400 nineteen fifties, can we literally have a show where we 1:03:23.440 --> 1:03:26.480 don't have a fucking knife in our hands? And so 1:03:26.920 --> 1:03:30.240 In the Heights was born out of him, Oh shit, 1:03:30.760 --> 1:03:32.280 no one's gonna write your dream show. 1:03:32.760 --> 1:03:34.400 Because Paul Simon's one of my favorite writers. 1:03:34.440 --> 1:03:36.040 He didn't write about. 1:03:35.800 --> 1:03:39.240 Porto Rican like I'm not expecting Paul Simon, and. 1:03:39.320 --> 1:03:41.760 He loved the music and he wrote music that really 1:03:41.840 --> 1:03:44.960 fits in that world. But like I just I just 1:03:45.080 --> 1:03:47.800 remembered because it also had Mark Anthony, had Ruben Blades, 1:03:47.880 --> 1:03:49.560 like it had a lot of my heroes in it. 1:03:50.120 --> 1:03:52.800 Like I remember having the highest hopes. 1:03:52.560 --> 1:03:55.640 Of like, oh shit, here comes your dream show. It's 1:03:55.720 --> 1:03:59.320 the Cape man, and then it super wasn't and I 1:04:00.040 --> 1:04:01.760 it was like it was the wake up moment of 1:04:01.920 --> 1:04:04.120 like you have to create the thing that you want 1:04:04.160 --> 1:04:07.800 to for it to exist because no one's going to. 1:04:07.800 --> 1:04:09.080 Make it interesting enough. 1:04:09.120 --> 1:04:11.040 When when In the Heights first came out, we got 1:04:11.160 --> 1:04:13.640 bad press saying that like In the Heights didn't have 1:04:13.760 --> 1:04:16.760 enough teeth, like it wasn't a real representation of Washington 1:04:16.800 --> 1:04:17.720 Heights because. 1:04:19.760 --> 1:04:22.760 Lis and we were like all it's about but we 1:04:22.840 --> 1:04:26.520 were like we lived there, We lived there. Man like 1:04:26.680 --> 1:04:28.400 we lived there the whole time, you know. 1:04:28.520 --> 1:04:31.600 Because if your only access to a neighborhood is seeing 1:04:31.640 --> 1:04:33.280 it on the eleven o'clock news and you have no 1:04:33.400 --> 1:04:35.680 engagement with it beyond that, that's all you see. 1:04:35.920 --> 1:04:39.640 Yeah, I was curious what spoke to y'all, you and Bill, 1:04:39.800 --> 1:04:42.960 since we talked about there weren't many spaces for hip 1:04:43.000 --> 1:04:44.840 hop in that way, but when you were growing up, Like, 1:04:45.520 --> 1:04:47.680 what were the shows? I know you listened to the 1:04:47.760 --> 1:04:49.600 cast albums. What were the shows that spoke to y'all 1:04:49.640 --> 1:04:50.400 to is that this is. 1:04:50.480 --> 1:04:51.880 I might want to be in this. 1:04:53.440 --> 1:04:57.240 Well Again, I'm born in nineteen eighty, so there's just 1:04:57.480 --> 1:04:59.520 never a point where hip hop's not a part of 1:04:59.600 --> 1:05:01.880 my life. I have an older sister. She gets all 1:05:01.920 --> 1:05:04.320 the credit from my hip hop education. She took me 1:05:04.400 --> 1:05:12.720 to Beat Street in the theater. I cried, Yeah, she 1:05:12.880 --> 1:05:15.320 took me to Wild Style. She took me to Crush 1:05:15.360 --> 1:05:20.120 Groove for my sixth grade graduation. My sister's present to 1:05:20.200 --> 1:05:22.280 me was a pair of Drabo jeans, and she took 1:05:22.320 --> 1:05:24.720 me to see Class Act starting. Oh, my. 1:05:27.960 --> 1:05:30.680 Sister, you'd be like, that's her, that's hip hop straight. 1:05:31.640 --> 1:05:36.000 I stole her Black Sheet album I stole her day 1:05:36.200 --> 1:05:39.240 Sola's Dead album Like that was like digging in my 1:05:39.320 --> 1:05:41.479 sister's albums. Was how I fell in love with hip. 1:05:41.400 --> 1:05:43.880 Hop's It's funny y'all say that to somebody. 1:05:44.080 --> 1:05:46.240 I told somebody yesterday that we were interviewing Lynn, and 1:05:46.440 --> 1:05:49.160 it literally was like, do you make sure you bring 1:05:49.240 --> 1:05:51.200 up the fact that Kid and Play changed how hip 1:05:51.240 --> 1:05:53.800 hop was proceived in media and changed the way, like 1:05:54.120 --> 1:05:55.920 started the real diversification of hip hop. 1:05:55.960 --> 1:05:58.120 And I was like, I never thought about that, Like 1:05:58.240 --> 1:06:01.720 that Kid and Play class act. 1:06:03.320 --> 1:06:08.760 House Party with the cartoon, they had a cartoon. Here's 1:06:08.760 --> 1:06:10.000 another great thing sequels. 1:06:10.040 --> 1:06:12.280 House Party three has one of the funniest lines in 1:06:13.040 --> 1:06:17.600 cinema history when they accidentally give the grandma the porno 1:06:17.720 --> 1:06:18.160 instead of the. 1:06:23.200 --> 1:06:24.720 One of the funniest lines in cinema history. 1:06:25.760 --> 1:06:28.560 Well, literally, talking about Lynn is like a mere going 1:06:28.640 --> 1:06:31.040 record shopping for people. One of Lynn's great things when 1:06:31.080 --> 1:06:33.920 we were younger was he would make mix CDs like 1:06:34.240 --> 1:06:36.680 for everything and all the time, and so like we 1:06:36.800 --> 1:06:41.360 had this bathroom that had like this wallpaper sort of stuff. 1:06:42.640 --> 1:06:45.920 It had like like hundreds of mixed CDs. So like 1:06:46.000 --> 1:06:48.680 we had this, we had a boombox, what a CD 1:06:48.760 --> 1:06:51.440 player in the bathroom, and it was only in the bathroom, 1:06:51.600 --> 1:06:54.160 so we would play we would turn on his big 1:06:54.240 --> 1:06:56.080 CDs and we would listen to everything. And so like 1:06:56.440 --> 1:06:59.200 those were the days of like pun and and that 1:06:59.400 --> 1:07:01.440 kind of stuff and b Ig like that's all we 1:07:01.560 --> 1:07:03.960 listened to. It was like really heavy Latin music, so 1:07:04.120 --> 1:07:07.120 like Juan Luis Ghetta and Hilberta Santa Rosa and like 1:07:07.200 --> 1:07:10.960 William and then like fucking just like hip hop all 1:07:11.040 --> 1:07:12.800 day long and like all this stuff that we're talking about. 1:07:12.800 --> 1:07:14.560 And so that's also where I sort of. 1:07:14.680 --> 1:07:16.240 Was that dance. 1:07:18.440 --> 1:07:25.480 Dance New York. 1:07:25.520 --> 1:07:28.200 So just with all the the speaking of dance, like 1:07:28.240 --> 1:07:31.000 with all the the dancers, like specifically in the Heights, 1:07:31.120 --> 1:07:33.920 like the break dancing that you found were they were 1:07:33.960 --> 1:07:36.760 those people on Broadway that already knew how to break 1:07:36.920 --> 1:07:38.959 or did you have to go and find. 1:07:39.080 --> 1:07:42.400 It was a mix of like breakers and folks who 1:07:42.600 --> 1:07:45.840 had who had a little theater experience. But we had 1:07:45.880 --> 1:07:47.880 a lot of debuts within the Heights, Like there were 1:07:48.000 --> 1:07:51.080 so many debuts with Heights and with Hamilton. 1:07:52.760 --> 1:07:53.400 Made his debut. 1:07:53.640 --> 1:07:56.480 Like you know, the thing is the shows I write 1:07:56.520 --> 1:07:59.720 are made for people who don't ordinarily get invited to 1:07:59.800 --> 1:08:02.560 get us on the board, like so with Heights, Bring 1:08:02.640 --> 1:08:05.880 It On broke the record for the number of debuts. 1:08:05.920 --> 1:08:08.200 We had thirty two Broadway debuts with that show. 1:08:09.240 --> 1:08:10.240 And that's the one I wrote. 1:08:10.520 --> 1:08:13.560 I co wrote in between in the Heights and Hamilton. 1:08:13.800 --> 1:08:16.360 But you know, sort of the same principles at work, 1:08:16.520 --> 1:08:19.519 like of just like pop music and theater music should 1:08:19.560 --> 1:08:22.360 be friends, like there's no reason there should be a separation. 1:08:22.439 --> 1:08:27.680 There is there a pressure to bring a name to 1:08:28.760 --> 1:08:29.960 the show when you present it. 1:08:30.560 --> 1:08:38.160 I remember in Fla maybe during the last well well 1:08:38.479 --> 1:08:41.200 not during the last run, but basically us getting a 1:08:41.360 --> 1:08:45.360 name would ensure that it could have an additional four months, 1:08:45.400 --> 1:08:46.439 an additional. 1:08:46.120 --> 1:08:48.840 That's why pressure comes with time, I think, I think, 1:08:48.920 --> 1:08:52.040 And every show goes through reversion of it where the 1:08:52.960 --> 1:08:55.800 you hope, the novelty of a new musical catches on 1:08:56.000 --> 1:08:59.519 in the word of mouth catches on. But there's a 1:08:59.560 --> 1:09:02.840 point at which the professional Broadway goers have all seen 1:09:02.880 --> 1:09:06.320 it and unless you have something to attract them, you know, 1:09:07.080 --> 1:09:08.960 and that's when the name thing comes. But like I 1:09:09.040 --> 1:09:12.320 remember a Broadway producer told me, like getting a name 1:09:12.560 --> 1:09:14.679 a quote unquote celebrity name to be in your show 1:09:14.840 --> 1:09:17.320 is like starting hard drugs, Like you don't get off it. 1:09:17.439 --> 1:09:21.080 Once you start off, you can't just put so and 1:09:21.200 --> 1:09:23.720 so from Dancing the Stars and then have like just 1:09:23.840 --> 1:09:27.200 a talented guy who auditioned after him, Like, once you're 1:09:27.320 --> 1:09:28.720 on that ride, you don't get off. 1:09:28.960 --> 1:09:35.439 Wow, who's the who's the biggest name that we would 1:09:35.600 --> 1:09:38.160 know that has approached you about wanting to do. 1:09:39.960 --> 1:09:40.480 Hamilton? 1:09:40.560 --> 1:09:44.479 For like a second, like YouTube, every white actor wants 1:09:44.520 --> 1:09:48.360 to play King George really yeah, because they yeah, because 1:09:48.400 --> 1:09:50.800 they love Hamilton. But they know it's not right to 1:09:50.880 --> 1:09:53.439 ask to play Hamilton or Bird because those are us, 1:09:55.720 --> 1:09:57.439 And so they go, can I pla King George? I 1:09:57.520 --> 1:10:01.240 mean insert white to hear and they go kind of 1:10:01.360 --> 1:10:03.240 And also they realize it's not a lot of work. 1:10:03.400 --> 1:10:07.040 It's one song and two repriezes, right right, So that's 1:10:07.080 --> 1:10:08.879 been the most probably most requested. 1:10:09.120 --> 1:10:12.200 It's like mad famous white people are like I could planking. 1:10:11.920 --> 1:10:16.640 George the way that the way that I don't know 1:10:16.760 --> 1:10:20.360 the system of how Broadway works, but is it that 1:10:21.080 --> 1:10:25.599 only in your first year are you eligible for Tony run? 1:10:25.920 --> 1:10:26.720 And then that's it. 1:10:26.800 --> 1:10:30.280 Tony happens sort of within the season in which you 1:10:30.360 --> 1:10:35.000 come out, which pre pandemic was sort of June, because 1:10:35.000 --> 1:10:38.599 that's when the Tonys are to June to like May April, 1:10:38.720 --> 1:10:41.080 May of the following year, and then that's your that's 1:10:41.120 --> 1:10:41.599 your class. 1:10:42.120 --> 1:10:42.400 Okay. 1:10:42.520 --> 1:10:46.880 So if there wasn't if there wasn't a pandemic, and 1:10:47.160 --> 1:10:51.240 say Clooney wanted to or bad Brad Pitt wanted to 1:10:51.320 --> 1:10:55.240 play King George and he killed it, would he would 1:10:55.280 --> 1:10:56.400 he be eligible? 1:10:56.520 --> 1:10:59.040 It would be for the love of the game. Wow, 1:10:59.560 --> 1:11:03.240 that already happened. Yeah, there's no There have been occasionally 1:11:03.360 --> 1:11:09.320 campaigns for a Tony Award for like best Replacement, which 1:11:09.360 --> 1:11:11.960 I think is honestly like celebrities being like can I 1:11:12.040 --> 1:11:13.799 just be in Chicago, ton. 1:11:18.439 --> 1:11:20.920 And sometimes it's really like warranted, you know, like I 1:11:21.040 --> 1:11:22.120 remember seeing you know. 1:11:22.479 --> 1:11:26.200 The most famous case is they did a production and 1:11:26.320 --> 1:11:29.040 to Get Your Gun with Bernadette Peters and she was amazing, 1:11:29.120 --> 1:11:32.720 but then they got like Reba McIntyre, Like nobody's more 1:11:32.840 --> 1:11:36.320 fucking perfect for that part than McIntire, and so people 1:11:36.360 --> 1:11:38.560 were like, man, I wish there was a Tony for 1:11:38.640 --> 1:11:40.760 Best Replacement because she really like transformed. 1:11:42.680 --> 1:11:44.360 So there's a case to me. 1:11:44.479 --> 1:11:47.240 But they do have a revival category, So how long 1:11:47.320 --> 1:11:50.800 would Hamilton have to be dormant for it to get 1:11:51.120 --> 1:11:54.280 best revival or is it a five or ten year ruld. 1:11:54.520 --> 1:11:56.920 I don't think there's a hard and fast rule. 1:11:57.320 --> 1:12:00.320 You just get like I guess, like all the way 1:12:00.320 --> 1:12:03.479 people being like that was quick that you're back, Like 1:12:03.640 --> 1:12:07.320 I remember when like le Mins did their revival, everyone 1:12:07.479 --> 1:12:09.120 was like was closed. 1:12:09.360 --> 1:12:10.000 I didn't even know the. 1:12:11.760 --> 1:12:11.880 Way. 1:12:13.160 --> 1:12:15.360 Man, what are some of your favorite musicals? 1:12:15.360 --> 1:12:18.599 Because I'm you know, this is all like it's very 1:12:18.680 --> 1:12:22.400 new to me, and I remember, actually you talk about 1:12:22.400 --> 1:12:23.160 theater nothing. 1:12:23.200 --> 1:12:25.280 But I actually did hair when I was a senior 1:12:25.360 --> 1:12:29.559 in high school. I did. I didn't tell you, but. 1:12:33.360 --> 1:12:35.080 Come on, man, this was in high school. This is 1:12:35.120 --> 1:12:37.760 in North Carolina. Like we had to cut all kinds 1:12:37.760 --> 1:12:39.360 of ship out of the play, like it was so 1:12:39.600 --> 1:12:44.960 much No, we didn't even we cut that ship out. 1:12:45.000 --> 1:12:47.880 We were so much a lot of appropriate. 1:12:49.680 --> 1:12:50.840 That ship was like an hour. 1:12:52.439 --> 1:12:55.519 Yeah that ship was an episode of datelineig, so you 1:12:55.560 --> 1:12:59.120 know what I mean. But like but yeah, but but 1:12:59.200 --> 1:13:01.080 I did it. But but now, so I was curious 1:13:01.120 --> 1:13:04.360 to know, like, what are some of your favorite musicals 1:13:04.439 --> 1:13:07.920 and like what makes them good? Because to me just 1:13:08.040 --> 1:13:09.679 kind of as an outsider, it all kind of sounds 1:13:09.720 --> 1:13:09.960 the same. 1:13:10.000 --> 1:13:13.040 Like Hair spoke to me because I knew Pete Rock sample. 1:13:13.720 --> 1:13:14.320 The break. 1:13:16.320 --> 1:13:20.360 Was just like just wrote great bass ship like mcermott, 1:13:20.439 --> 1:13:24.000 you know what, incredible basslines in all of Goalt mcdermot's ship. 1:13:24.200 --> 1:13:26.600 So like from that to all of this stuff, Like. 1:13:29.360 --> 1:13:31.000 I can tell you they're gonna shout out Annie in 1:13:31.040 --> 1:13:33.200 this episode. An ain't gonna get no love. But that's fine. 1:13:33.240 --> 1:13:33.920 It's a girl thing. 1:13:34.000 --> 1:13:36.719 It's fine, it's fine. 1:13:36.760 --> 1:13:41.960 Well, I was gonna start with Annie, you know what? 1:13:42.560 --> 1:13:47.160 You know what? Wait, the secret secret uh fact, I 1:13:47.400 --> 1:13:53.160 was part of the of the of the letter writing 1:13:53.360 --> 1:13:58.040 process of Jay Z asking permission to use that sample. 1:13:58.120 --> 1:14:00.639 Of the use you talked about. 1:14:03.800 --> 1:14:06.439 She was like I listened to this and it gave 1:14:06.520 --> 1:14:08.360 me faith that I was going to get out one day. 1:14:08.439 --> 1:14:11.960 Wait that that letter got out, it's in his book. 1:14:13.360 --> 1:14:19.960 Oh yeah, I didn't know. Right after Hamilton, right before 1:14:20.000 --> 1:14:21.840 Hamilton he read Jay's book, I was I. 1:14:21.920 --> 1:14:24.920 Was the sounding board for do you think this will work? 1:14:25.360 --> 1:14:28.880 And I was like, oh, okay, Like and I was like, 1:14:29.520 --> 1:14:30.439 this really happened. 1:14:31.040 --> 1:14:31.439 I didn't know. 1:14:31.840 --> 1:14:35.200 I was like, Okay, no, they did not still. 1:14:35.000 --> 1:14:37.280 Want to be the best songs of all musical time, 1:14:37.800 --> 1:14:38.960 decide everything that happened in. 1:14:38.960 --> 1:14:43.360 The whiz so andy, Like, what's what's your take on Cats. 1:14:43.400 --> 1:14:45.639 I've never seen Cats, but like I've heard it kind 1:14:45.640 --> 1:14:47.240 of get trashed later. 1:14:47.400 --> 1:14:49.760 And I was not a Cats guy, so like when 1:14:49.840 --> 1:14:51.960 I was a kid, you know, my parents had a 1:14:52.000 --> 1:14:54.080 lot of cast albums, but I was like a lot 1:14:54.120 --> 1:14:56.000 of Hamilton fans and that, like I just kind of 1:14:56.120 --> 1:14:59.800 imagined the shows we didn't have money for. Probably, you know, 1:15:00.120 --> 1:15:02.160 no production of Made Lamont is going to match my 1:15:02.320 --> 1:15:04.639 mental version of man A la Mancha. I've still never 1:15:04.720 --> 1:15:09.519 seen it, but we saw the like eighties Holy Trinity 1:15:09.880 --> 1:15:12.160 of Phantom, lame Is, and Cats. Those were the three 1:15:12.280 --> 1:15:16.920 musicals in the eighties, and lame Is like what I 1:15:17.080 --> 1:15:20.400 remember most about it. I fell asleep. I was seven. 1:15:20.800 --> 1:15:25.679 I remember sort of the fact that the Confrontation, which 1:15:25.720 --> 1:15:27.840 is as hip hop as that show, gets where it's 1:15:27.880 --> 1:15:30.280 like Valjean and Javer singing their parts of each other. 1:15:30.360 --> 1:15:34.040 And I always wanted a meth Redman version of the 1:15:34.120 --> 1:15:38.680 Confrontation and I was just like, I am warning you 1:15:38.880 --> 1:15:41.360 Shoven and it's like yelling at each other. 1:15:42.360 --> 1:15:43.000 I love that song. 1:15:43.040 --> 1:15:44.280 I'm just glad they made it a movie, so I 1:15:44.400 --> 1:15:45.160 know what you're talking about. 1:15:45.600 --> 1:15:51.519 Yeah, I was like I couldn't find go through once. 1:15:52.040 --> 1:15:54.599 But what I remember the most is my parents buying 1:15:54.640 --> 1:15:56.280 the two CD set. It was like one of the 1:15:56.360 --> 1:15:59.320 first CDs we owned, because this is when they still. 1:15:59.120 --> 1:16:00.800 Sold them in the long box. 1:16:01.360 --> 1:16:05.519 And my March would cry every time they played. 1:16:05.600 --> 1:16:08.160 She would play bring Him Home and just like weep, 1:16:08.240 --> 1:16:11.840 and I remember I think the seeing how that music 1:16:11.880 --> 1:16:15.519 affected my parents made it more interesting to me, Like 1:16:15.680 --> 1:16:18.320 the fact that it could make my parents cry was 1:16:18.360 --> 1:16:19.080 a huge deal. 1:16:19.400 --> 1:16:22.560 And then Phantom was just my shit. Like Phantom is about. 1:16:22.400 --> 1:16:25.000 An ugly songwriter who was like, if you don't like me, 1:16:25.080 --> 1:16:30.519 I'm gonna fuck everybody else well, and I related to that. 1:16:30.680 --> 1:16:34.799 I was like, yes, go on Phantom. And then Cats 1:16:34.840 --> 1:16:36.479 like I just remember the cats coming out and pawn 1:16:36.520 --> 1:16:39.080 at you in the audience. I didn't really have any patience. 1:16:39.520 --> 1:16:41.640 I didn't get it and I wasn't into it like 1:16:42.200 --> 1:16:42.920 it had a moment. 1:16:44.080 --> 1:16:45.519 I wasn't. I missed the moment. 1:16:45.520 --> 1:16:48.760 I was too young any well, not any thoughts on 1:16:48.840 --> 1:16:54.000 the movie, but is there fear or in trepidation when 1:16:55.520 --> 1:17:01.360 something that's such a sure shot doesn't translate well on screen. 1:17:01.479 --> 1:17:04.960 That was never a sure shot. That's that's the That's 1:17:05.080 --> 1:17:06.280 the thing is that like. 1:17:07.160 --> 1:17:13.240 You from outside looking time out from the outside looking in, Yeah, 1:17:17.760 --> 1:17:21.040 looking looking in, and I'm thinking like, Okay, they got 1:17:21.200 --> 1:17:23.880 all their all their porns in a row, and and 1:17:24.360 --> 1:17:27.160 it's coming out for Christmas, and how can I not 1:17:27.320 --> 1:17:30.240 expect this to be like this is it? 1:17:30.560 --> 1:17:32.519 Like what? Yeah? 1:17:32.800 --> 1:17:35.519 What happened? How did that turn into istar? 1:17:36.040 --> 1:17:37.720 Because it's about cats. 1:17:39.800 --> 1:17:44.760 And it has period, it has so it has one 1:17:45.360 --> 1:17:50.920 incredible eighties ballad for the ages with memory and Jennifer 1:17:51.000 --> 1:17:53.719 Hudson singing that is not enough for a whole movie, 1:17:54.040 --> 1:18:01.240 although it is a wonderful sequence in the movie. No, 1:18:01.400 --> 1:18:03.360 it's not, as it's even due to It's that it 1:18:03.479 --> 1:18:05.960 was sort of like this cult favorite that I think 1:18:06.160 --> 1:18:09.160 was successful because it was so out of the box 1:18:09.240 --> 1:18:11.200 that you had to see it. And then I think 1:18:11.240 --> 1:18:14.080 it ran a long time because you don't need to 1:18:14.160 --> 1:18:17.320 speak a word of English to enjoy cats. So it 1:18:17.479 --> 1:18:20.519 was a huge international hit. You could just be like 1:18:20.600 --> 1:18:22.720 what's on Broadway? Like you come from any country in 1:18:22.720 --> 1:18:24.840 the world, what's on Broadway Cats, Let's go see Cats 1:18:25.400 --> 1:18:29.320 like it just became this hit that you had to 1:18:29.439 --> 1:18:31.880 see it just it became synonymous with Broadway in a 1:18:32.000 --> 1:18:34.599 very real way. But if you look, if you actually 1:18:34.640 --> 1:18:37.479 took a closer look like, there's no story. These cats 1:18:37.560 --> 1:18:40.000 all say, I want to go. This is a song 1:18:40.040 --> 1:18:43.280 about me. This is a song about me. Jennifer Husinsing's memory. Okay, 1:18:43.360 --> 1:18:44.000 it's her, Let's go. 1:18:46.160 --> 1:18:48.920 Do you remember the last play that worked on film? 1:18:50.439 --> 1:18:53.200 I see it. That's the It's interesting because. 1:18:56.800 --> 1:18:59.880 Conversation was just as it was the Whiz Men Everything 1:19:00.120 --> 1:19:03.840 to men conversation, because it's about to be a real 1:19:03.920 --> 1:19:05.760 black conversation about the Here we Go. 1:19:07.479 --> 1:19:09.160 I was trying to avoid the Whiz I was trying 1:19:09.200 --> 1:19:10.080 to listen. 1:19:10.200 --> 1:19:12.240 The Wiz is one of the greatest horror movies of 1:19:12.360 --> 1:19:13.760 our time. It is. 1:19:15.439 --> 1:19:16.360 The trash Monsters. 1:19:16.439 --> 1:19:21.400 As you say it, the Whiz on Mushrooms is even better. 1:19:22.560 --> 1:19:26.479 I'll bet Cats on Mushrooms is much more experience. 1:19:26.920 --> 1:19:30.200 Is there is there an answer to that question? Has 1:19:30.240 --> 1:19:32.840 there been a great film play on film? 1:19:33.360 --> 1:19:36.719 So here's my thing. I believe there are great movie musicals. 1:19:36.840 --> 1:19:40.439 I think adapting a stage musical to film is one 1:19:40.479 --> 1:19:41.720 of the hardest things you can do. 1:19:41.840 --> 1:19:42.880 I like the churse line. 1:19:43.680 --> 1:19:44.840 You like the course Line movie? 1:19:44.920 --> 1:19:46.200 Do you like the course Line the movie? 1:19:46.320 --> 1:19:46.680 I did? 1:19:46.880 --> 1:19:47.120 Is there? 1:19:47.320 --> 1:19:49.160 Do you have a I watched it like fifteen times? 1:19:49.160 --> 1:19:52.400 Are I think if you watch the course Line the 1:19:52.479 --> 1:19:58.240 show first, the movie is like what's happening? Okay? Yeah, 1:20:00.000 --> 1:20:02.360 it's about it's having how you experience it, you know, 1:20:02.400 --> 1:20:04.840 because there's great performances in the chorus Line movie, but 1:20:05.320 --> 1:20:07.880 the show is so much about that line and everyone 1:20:07.960 --> 1:20:10.920 being equal that like the movie is like where are 1:20:11.040 --> 1:20:14.520 we what's happening? Like, so are we following Michael Douglas. 1:20:17.560 --> 1:20:18.759 Yes, he was the director. 1:20:18.960 --> 1:20:21.000 What talking about the record? 1:20:21.360 --> 1:20:24.719 I will say so, knowing that you have that level 1:20:24.800 --> 1:20:29.600 of scrutiny as a fan, you still treat movies and 1:20:29.960 --> 1:20:32.400 you know you're still a fan first before you're a suit. 1:20:33.600 --> 1:20:37.920 How much adjustment did you have to make to in 1:20:38.080 --> 1:20:39.960 the Heights the movie? 1:20:40.760 --> 1:20:43.400 I think the gold standard of an adapt movie adaptation 1:20:43.520 --> 1:20:49.439 is Cabaret. The Cabaret movie is completely different from the show. 1:20:49.920 --> 1:20:53.360 You wouldn't recognize it, but it's genius and it is 1:20:53.439 --> 1:20:55.639 its own thing, and when you go see the show, 1:20:55.840 --> 1:20:57.639 it is genius in its own way. But it's it's 1:20:57.840 --> 1:21:00.439 just they're different things. And that's how we approached in 1:21:00.439 --> 1:21:03.320 the Heights. We were like, we cannot put the show 1:21:03.400 --> 1:21:03.960 on stage. 1:21:04.160 --> 1:21:05.200 It's a different medium. 1:21:05.240 --> 1:21:06.840 Yeah, you can't put a two act show in a 1:21:06.920 --> 1:21:07.759 three act structure. 1:21:08.840 --> 1:21:11.599 And so a lot of the credit for I think 1:21:11.720 --> 1:21:14.800 Heights is an amazing adaptation, but a lot of the 1:21:14.840 --> 1:21:17.880 credit goes to Kiara, who really had distance from it. 1:21:18.000 --> 1:21:19.200 When she wrote the screenplay. 1:21:19.320 --> 1:21:21.639 She was the she was my co writer for the show, 1:21:22.560 --> 1:21:25.720 and she wrote the libretto for the show, and she 1:21:25.880 --> 1:21:29.640 made a bunch of really bold choices to update it. 1:21:29.880 --> 1:21:33.639 That means cutting some songs, that means, but it also 1:21:33.760 --> 1:21:36.519 means opening up the world in the way. The other 1:21:36.600 --> 1:21:38.760 thing we did that was so important was we shot 1:21:38.840 --> 1:21:42.040 on location and we cast this thing, like you can't 1:21:42.160 --> 1:21:45.400 just be like Hollywood good. You have to like be 1:21:46.520 --> 1:21:47.960 you have to not look out of place on one 1:21:48.040 --> 1:21:50.519 hundred and seventy fifth and Watsworth things that make sense, 1:21:51.120 --> 1:21:55.360 Like you've got to it's got to work some authenticity. Yeah, 1:21:55.400 --> 1:21:58.680 it's got to have real authenticity. And and so I 1:21:58.800 --> 1:22:02.320 think our movie is a good adaptation because it's not faithful, 1:22:02.840 --> 1:22:04.680 but it's faithful in the right way. It's faithful to 1:22:04.760 --> 1:22:07.800 the spirit, but not the this happens, and this happens, 1:22:07.880 --> 1:22:10.320 this happens, and this happens. Like I think that's where 1:22:10.560 --> 1:22:13.880 like I think that's where The Red Movie is less successful. 1:22:14.120 --> 1:22:17.240 They use the original cast fifteen years after the fact, 1:22:17.560 --> 1:22:19.160 and they're all incredibly talented, but. 1:22:19.200 --> 1:22:20.679 Those aren't twenty somethings anymore. 1:22:21.040 --> 1:22:22.639 It's a different story, different story. 1:22:23.439 --> 1:22:24.599 It just is a different story. 1:22:24.720 --> 1:22:27.240 And so you know that's that's the tricky thing. 1:22:32.240 --> 1:22:34.360 Now, this is totally off subject, but I feel like 1:22:34.640 --> 1:22:38.720 only you can explain this to me. Okay, So in Quarantining, 1:22:38.880 --> 1:22:43.000 I got caught up. One of the best movie podcasts 1:22:43.040 --> 1:22:46.439 that you can listen to is the A twenty four channel. 1:22:47.120 --> 1:22:52.679 Oh oh, they got to the production yo, the Saftie 1:22:52.720 --> 1:22:56.720 Brothers and Paul Thomas Anderson alone that episode where they 1:22:56.800 --> 1:23:00.759 have like directors interview each other. So when Uncut Gems 1:23:00.800 --> 1:23:03.960 came out, Paul Thomas Anderson and interviewed the Safti brothers. 1:23:04.240 --> 1:23:09.599 But there's an episode where Martin Scorsese finally talks about 1:23:10.240 --> 1:23:14.960 New York, New York and as a Scorsese fan for 1:23:15.080 --> 1:23:18.040 the life of me, and this is weird. Of all 1:23:18.120 --> 1:23:20.920 the films, what convinced Michael Jackson to do the Bad 1:23:21.000 --> 1:23:22.439 Film with Scorsese. 1:23:23.040 --> 1:23:26.800 Was New York, New York. He had never seen Raging Bull, 1:23:26.960 --> 1:23:27.559 none of that stuff. 1:23:27.680 --> 1:23:29.880 But as a Scorsese fan, I knew that he had 1:23:29.920 --> 1:23:34.160 a nervous breakdown doing New York, New York. But I 1:23:34.320 --> 1:23:38.120 never knew how that film. I don't know if I 1:23:38.520 --> 1:23:41.680 can't judge musicals on film to know, Like I'm like 1:23:41.760 --> 1:23:44.080 light Ye with the Cortius line, like I like everything, 1:23:44.439 --> 1:23:46.439 like I'm the guy that's all staying alive and was 1:23:46.479 --> 1:23:47.439 like it was. 1:23:47.479 --> 1:23:56.840 Good right to like. But that's the thing. You can't 1:23:56.880 --> 1:23:59.200 trust nothing under if you're under the age of twelve, 1:23:59.320 --> 1:24:02.080 you like any thing, you know. 1:24:02.080 --> 1:24:05.320 What I'm saying, probably right after Beat Street, right, I. 1:24:05.439 --> 1:24:08.760 Liked all that ship. I didn't realize that that ship is. Yeah, 1:24:10.760 --> 1:24:15.439 what I'm asking is, was assuming that you least saw 1:24:15.520 --> 1:24:19.560 New York, New York, was it bad or like? 1:24:20.640 --> 1:24:22.240 I don't think it was so much that was bad. 1:24:22.320 --> 1:24:25.120 I just think it was an uneasy mix of styles. 1:24:25.360 --> 1:24:30.120 It's Jake Lamatta in a musical, It's Travis Bickle in 1:24:30.200 --> 1:24:34.880 a musical. Like Scorsese doesn't stop Scorsese and he's mean 1:24:34.960 --> 1:24:38.400 Tolzam and Ellie and he beats her up, but then 1:24:38.439 --> 1:24:42.960 you're bursting into song and I don't think that to me. 1:24:46.840 --> 1:24:52.479 Okay, similar similar to Jungle Fever. Like for some reason 1:24:52.840 --> 1:24:54.839 Scorsese won't let this out. 1:24:54.760 --> 1:24:59.040 On you know, it's really hard to find. 1:24:59.600 --> 1:24:59.880 It is. 1:25:01.680 --> 1:25:04.120 Somewhere in my storage room. But this is my first 1:25:04.120 --> 1:25:06.080 I've ever hearing of this movie. I've ever heard of it. 1:25:06.680 --> 1:25:09.240 He did it, and he did all the Yankee games 1:25:09.320 --> 1:25:11.400 is from that movie that was never written for a musical, 1:25:12.200 --> 1:25:14.719 like that was written for that movie. And then Sinatra 1:25:14.840 --> 1:25:17.360 did his own version, you know. Candor and I like 1:25:17.600 --> 1:25:20.160 don't love Sinatra's version. They're like he fucked up all 1:25:20.200 --> 1:25:22.680 the lyrics, but version that's the. 1:25:22.800 --> 1:25:27.959 Version that right, Yeah, he did it seventy seven. 1:25:27.800 --> 1:25:30.240 After Taxi Driver, Right, ain't number one? 1:25:33.479 --> 1:25:34.559 You just said that twice? 1:25:36.320 --> 1:25:43.320 Right, Yeah, Scorsese did it in uh seventy six or 1:25:43.360 --> 1:25:48.080 seventy seven, right after tax Driver, and it it was 1:25:48.120 --> 1:25:50.360 almost like it's his version of I love it. Well, 1:25:50.439 --> 1:25:54.400 I'm interested only because that's his apocalypse. Now as far 1:25:54.439 --> 1:25:58.599 as how it nearly destroyed him, like he almost didn't 1:25:58.600 --> 1:26:01.760 make Razing Bull because he was almost driven to the 1:26:01.800 --> 1:26:03.240 brink of suicide because. 1:26:03.040 --> 1:26:03.559 Of this film. 1:26:04.439 --> 1:26:07.040 I'm going to bring up The Whiz one more time 1:26:07.120 --> 1:26:11.439 in that pant Okay, there's a I mean any director 1:26:11.800 --> 1:26:14.559 like you read making movies by Sidney la Mette. Sidney 1:26:14.600 --> 1:26:17.800 Lamette made Cirproco and All Day Afternoon and directed The Whiz, 1:26:18.840 --> 1:26:21.680 and it's one of the few times he cops to 1:26:21.800 --> 1:26:24.840 a mistake in the book. All he says is, I 1:26:25.000 --> 1:26:27.280 felt the look of the movie getting away from me. 1:26:27.680 --> 1:26:31.240 I felt like a distance between what I pictured and 1:26:31.479 --> 1:26:35.160 what my different departments were making and when they were 1:26:35.240 --> 1:26:38.439 doing the the Emerald City sequence, and you know, it's 1:26:38.760 --> 1:26:42.280 those beautiful dancers and like the colors change and then 1:26:42.320 --> 1:26:46.599 all that change like they the footage because the gel 1:26:46.800 --> 1:26:49.160 was so hot that it like it's like blew out 1:26:49.240 --> 1:26:53.439 the exposure. So it was sort of I mean, you 1:26:53.600 --> 1:26:56.320 will never get a better cast again in the history 1:26:56.320 --> 1:26:57.960 of movies than the cast of The Whiz. 1:26:58.400 --> 1:27:01.240 But sorry, I got selfish play. 1:27:01.320 --> 1:27:03.600 And the news like you can't win is not in 1:27:03.680 --> 1:27:04.400 the stage. 1:27:04.080 --> 1:27:05.439 Show you can't win. 1:27:06.280 --> 1:27:09.080 I mean, it's not in the state the stage show, 1:27:10.800 --> 1:27:13.559 the stage you don't remember home? Is that what we're doing. 1:27:13.960 --> 1:27:15.880 You remember my home was the home. 1:27:16.040 --> 1:27:17.000 But I'm just saying, I. 1:27:17.000 --> 1:27:20.599 Mean you've seen as like a two year old singing. 1:27:20.960 --> 1:27:21.080 Ye. 1:27:21.920 --> 1:27:23.960 Yeah, I mean there's a lot of new songs. 1:27:24.400 --> 1:27:28.479 Well in the Quincy and the Unheard Quincy episode, he 1:27:28.600 --> 1:27:31.720 did six new songs for the Whiz that you know. 1:27:31.880 --> 1:27:33.439 That's why he was up all night writing them. You know, 1:27:33.520 --> 1:27:36.600 he's writing them joints on the spot that that that 1:27:36.800 --> 1:27:38.120 Emerald City. 1:27:38.280 --> 1:27:41.040 Charlie Small who wrote most of the music. 1:27:42.880 --> 1:27:46.000 The songs that weren't Charlie involved, Like I know, but 1:27:46.080 --> 1:27:48.240 his name doesn't get He was literally flying by the 1:27:48.560 --> 1:27:51.519 seat from his pants, like writing stuff three days before 1:27:52.720 --> 1:27:55.519 they were due on set in a rap and you 1:27:55.680 --> 1:27:57.400 have the ship ready and like they were. 1:27:57.400 --> 1:27:59.760 Kind of winging. It sounds like a morand deadline. Yeah, 1:27:59.760 --> 1:28:00.760 I got, I can imagine that. 1:28:03.320 --> 1:28:09.120 Yeah, you know what, I'm a less project between just 1:28:09.200 --> 1:28:13.519 you know, being you know, uh playwright, actor, uh you know, 1:28:14.200 --> 1:28:15.600 MC songwriter. 1:28:15.400 --> 1:28:16.479 Like I have, I. 1:28:18.280 --> 1:28:21.320 Try to go by two criteria. One, am I gonna 1:28:21.439 --> 1:28:24.519 learn from this a thing that I could? Like I 1:28:24.560 --> 1:28:28.040 always think of the DeVry Technical School commercial. 1:28:28.400 --> 1:28:30.000 Commercial, like like. 1:28:32.960 --> 1:28:35.960 You use that tool, it goes in your toolbox, like 1:28:36.080 --> 1:28:38.200 you learn each tool one at a time, and that's 1:28:38.240 --> 1:28:38.800 how it worked. 1:28:39.200 --> 1:28:41.400 So like that's how I like. It's like, Okay, I'm 1:28:41.439 --> 1:28:43.519 gonna learn. You know, Mary Poppins returns. 1:28:43.560 --> 1:28:45.400 I was not a big Mary Poppins guy, but I'm 1:28:45.439 --> 1:28:49.120 gonna watch the director of Chicago Directive musical like and 1:28:49.160 --> 1:28:51.360 I'm gonna learn from watching him do that, and that's 1:28:51.400 --> 1:28:52.720 gonna help me for the next thing. 1:28:53.200 --> 1:28:53.320 Uh. 1:28:53.400 --> 1:28:55.000 And then the other ship is just like stuff I'd 1:28:55.040 --> 1:28:58.360 kick myself forever if I said no, like duck Tails 1:28:58.400 --> 1:29:01.120 do a voice gizmo duck on duct. He was like, yeah, 1:29:01.200 --> 1:29:03.240 I if I say no, I'm gonna hate the person 1:29:03.280 --> 1:29:03.960 who did it forever. 1:29:04.200 --> 1:29:06.040 Like I'm gonna please tell me about your curby your 1:29:06.120 --> 1:29:07.280 enthusiasm experience. 1:29:07.880 --> 1:29:10.720 That's an example of like I kick myself forever. 1:29:10.840 --> 1:29:14.280 Yes, in which I know everything. Please show what you. 1:29:14.320 --> 1:29:16.200 Have to know is that not a word of it 1:29:16.479 --> 1:29:17.400 dialogue is written. 1:29:17.600 --> 1:29:20.960 I do know this. But he has the whole season 1:29:21.360 --> 1:29:23.720 like and he calls you like he's like they're like 1:29:23.800 --> 1:29:25.240 Larry David wants to talk to you, and you go, 1:29:25.320 --> 1:29:27.360 oh my god. And so he calls you and he 1:29:27.439 --> 1:29:28.680 pitches you the whole season goes. 1:29:28.760 --> 1:29:30.639 You know, I don't know if you know the show, 1:29:30.800 --> 1:29:33.400 but there was a fouta on me and I'm gonna 1:29:33.439 --> 1:29:36.200 I'm gonna figure, I'm gonna lift the fotoa because I'm 1:29:36.240 --> 1:29:38.800 gonna help a guy cut the line and like I'm 1:29:38.800 --> 1:29:40.760 gonna say he was here before and because of that, 1:29:41.240 --> 1:29:44.040 he's gonna cut the and I'm gonna Okay, So can 1:29:44.080 --> 1:29:45.519 I go on with Fox while the musical? 1:29:45.840 --> 1:29:47.640 And the people in charge of the Fox say you 1:29:47.680 --> 1:29:49.599 can do fout while the musical, but only if Linnmann 1:29:49.600 --> 1:29:52.080 will Miranda's involved? Oh, Hamilton, we love Hamilton, Yes, yes, 1:29:52.160 --> 1:29:54.680 we love Hamilton. And then like you're involved, but like 1:29:55.080 --> 1:29:57.560 we don't get along and like you're pain in the 1:29:57.640 --> 1:29:59.920 ass and we don't like each other. And then somehow 1:30:00.160 --> 1:30:02.160 we're gonna get to like a duel and I'm gonna 1:30:02.160 --> 1:30:03.320 shoot you with a paintball gun. 1:30:03.680 --> 1:30:05.680 Like it was all in. 1:30:08.040 --> 1:30:09.920 On the phone, and like how fuck you say no 1:30:10.040 --> 1:30:10.200 to that? 1:30:10.520 --> 1:30:14.160 You don't and there's no script, Like there's no and. 1:30:14.120 --> 1:30:18.479 There's no script. And so I told him I have 1:30:18.680 --> 1:30:22.000 to do that with you, but I'm about to leave 1:30:22.040 --> 1:30:24.920 the country. For eight months, I was doing I was 1:30:24.960 --> 1:30:28.479 doing Mary Poppins returns, and so he said, well, they 1:30:28.600 --> 1:30:30.120 let me film it whenever I want, so we'll work 1:30:30.160 --> 1:30:33.320 around you. So I filmed my stuff for the first episode, 1:30:33.479 --> 1:30:35.839 like the weekend I was in town for the oscars. 1:30:35.840 --> 1:30:38.479 I filmed all the office ship and then they like 1:30:38.800 --> 1:30:41.640 broke until I got back, and then they reassembled the 1:30:41.720 --> 1:30:44.400 crew filmed my scenes and coming again. Because he has 1:30:44.600 --> 1:30:48.439 such cachet at HBO, he just goes, I got an idea, 1:30:49.120 --> 1:30:50.000 and they're like, all right. 1:30:49.920 --> 1:30:50.840 We're doing another season. 1:30:51.560 --> 1:30:56.920 Like that's what's amazing is he really like has he's 1:30:56.960 --> 1:30:59.320 a genius because he's created a system where he doesn't 1:30:59.360 --> 1:31:02.000 have to learn online, but he can create a whole 1:31:02.040 --> 1:31:05.360 season in TV. Like Jeff Schaeffer, who's his number two, 1:31:05.439 --> 1:31:08.040 who's sort of the show runner, has these pieces of paper. 1:31:08.160 --> 1:31:10.280 He's kind of keeping track of the plot lines and 1:31:10.439 --> 1:31:12.320 so like there would be times when he'd come in 1:31:12.400 --> 1:31:14.840 and be like, all right, remember in this scene, you've 1:31:14.960 --> 1:31:18.320 just come from your cousins and and and Larry would 1:31:18.360 --> 1:31:20.280 just show him away like a we'll figure it out, 1:31:20.280 --> 1:31:22.439 we'll figure it out. He's like, I don't like knowing 1:31:22.479 --> 1:31:25.559 too much stuff. We'll get there, and he just wants 1:31:25.680 --> 1:31:28.920 to get there organically. He doesn't want to have to remember, shit, 1:31:33.800 --> 1:31:37.160 it's Jeff Schaeffer and and uh and Larry Dave. Like 1:31:37.240 --> 1:31:39.080 Larry David gets an idea and he works with his 1:31:39.160 --> 1:31:41.240 showrunner and they kind of work out the beats and 1:31:41.439 --> 1:31:44.000 they schedule it by episode what they want to happen, 1:31:45.320 --> 1:31:47.800 but not a line of dialogue. And it was funny 1:31:47.800 --> 1:31:49.680 because then you also have to figure out your own 1:31:50.240 --> 1:31:51.639 relationship to Larry. 1:31:52.240 --> 1:31:54.880 So like I figured, like, all right, I can't be 1:31:55.600 --> 1:31:58.559 Nina Esmond because no one curses out Larry like Nina Esmond. 1:31:58.600 --> 1:32:00.759 And I can't be the hype guy because like JB's 1:32:00.800 --> 1:32:05.840 move is a legit genius and I can't do what 1:32:05.960 --> 1:32:08.720 he does. So I was like, I'll be the antagonist, 1:32:08.800 --> 1:32:11.920 but I'm just gonna be like really positive while I 1:32:12.040 --> 1:32:13.840 do the opposite of whatever he wants me to do. 1:32:14.360 --> 1:32:16.600 Like that was my whole thing, was Like you like. 1:32:16.680 --> 1:32:19.240 This shirt, Larry. He'd be like, yeah, I like it, Okay, Okay, 1:32:19.280 --> 1:32:20.400 we need to look at more shirts. 1:32:22.680 --> 1:32:24.320 Like just do the opposite. 1:32:25.680 --> 1:32:28.120 To him, because he knows how to deal with aggressive, 1:32:28.160 --> 1:32:28.799 but he doesn't. 1:32:28.560 --> 1:32:32.559 Know how to deal with like passive aggressive positivity that is. 1:32:32.720 --> 1:32:33.880 The opposite of what he wants. 1:32:34.200 --> 1:32:36.639 So that was my way of being an age. 1:32:36.840 --> 1:32:41.519 So thank you have you have you planned it at 1:32:41.640 --> 1:32:43.639 least that you can talk about. I guess the white 1:32:43.680 --> 1:32:47.160 elephant in the room is people were dying to know 1:32:48.720 --> 1:32:54.360 what your next Broadway venture will be, which you know 1:32:54.560 --> 1:32:57.360 again is you know, I assume that this time is 1:32:57.439 --> 1:32:59.800 sort of like what nineteen eighty five was to Michael 1:33:00.000 --> 1:33:01.960 accident after a joke. 1:33:02.080 --> 1:33:05.679 But there's lessons in that, right, Like I think. 1:33:07.040 --> 1:33:10.960 There's stuff in Bad that I love, Like Dangerous is 1:33:11.080 --> 1:33:13.360 legit my favorite album because I was twelve when it 1:33:13.439 --> 1:33:16.000 came out, and the music that comes out with twelve 1:33:16.120 --> 1:33:17.519 is what means the most to you forever. 1:33:18.200 --> 1:33:21.360 I remember being in the mirror being like there will 1:33:21.439 --> 1:33:28.280 be and it's just trials and my obsessions, like yes. 1:33:28.360 --> 1:33:33.559 Yes, but the thing, but the thing is just let 1:33:33.600 --> 1:33:35.840 me wait, let me Like artists. 1:33:37.200 --> 1:33:40.920 I think one of the dangers is to go bigger, 1:33:41.680 --> 1:33:44.080 Like there's a temptation to be like this one's going 1:33:44.160 --> 1:33:47.160 to be even we can thrill, like if you go 1:33:47.400 --> 1:33:51.200 to the like topping yourself place, like that's where I 1:33:51.280 --> 1:33:53.800 think people mess up and and so like I'm not 1:33:53.880 --> 1:34:00.080 gonna write like a three act historical musical, like it 1:34:00.160 --> 1:34:05.040 hits twenty times a day on Twitter every day, Oh 1:34:05.120 --> 1:34:07.560 really every day? Can you please write something about this 1:34:07.720 --> 1:34:10.080 so people finally know. I was like, I think people know. 1:34:12.880 --> 1:34:15.160 It's just a matter of what side people are chosen 1:34:15.479 --> 1:34:17.439 exactly because don't care. 1:34:17.560 --> 1:34:20.439 The thing is is, though most artists will do what 1:34:20.520 --> 1:34:24.400 they call the departure album, which is like the opposite 1:34:24.439 --> 1:34:26.880 of that. I was actually gonna say I kind of 1:34:26.880 --> 1:34:30.080 admire Mike's balls for actually saying you know what, I 1:34:30.160 --> 1:34:35.120 get top thriller, Like, yeah, he's literally the only one 1:34:35.160 --> 1:34:37.680 that had a mountain and was like, all right, I'm 1:34:37.680 --> 1:34:40.519 gonna climb this other mountain, which I gotta give it 1:34:40.560 --> 1:34:43.360 to him. Okay, five five albums, five number one songs 1:34:43.360 --> 1:34:45.080 from an album is not a failure. 1:34:44.760 --> 1:34:49.400 To me, man in the mirror, leave me Alone just 1:34:49.520 --> 1:34:51.200 on the knee, but wasn't on the cassette. 1:34:53.240 --> 1:34:56.400 But what I'm saying is it's jam bad. Though yeah 1:34:56.640 --> 1:34:58.800 it's it's weird. It's a success, but it's still not 1:34:58.960 --> 1:35:01.760 my favorite. But what I'm say thing is that people 1:35:01.960 --> 1:35:07.519 either like we'll do the opposite or they'll try to 1:35:07.600 --> 1:35:11.040 top it. But there's also middle ground, and people never 1:35:11.160 --> 1:35:13.720 explore the middle ground. I guess for you, what would 1:35:13.720 --> 1:35:18.080 the opposite of Hamilton be, like a one man play 1:35:18.280 --> 1:35:20.280 or Shakespeare in the Park. 1:35:20.160 --> 1:35:23.920 Or you know. One of my favorite books, which. 1:35:25.800 --> 1:35:28.920 Like a Latino, I'm gonna write. 1:35:28.800 --> 1:35:34.120 A play for every decade. Oh god, I wish no. 1:35:34.360 --> 1:35:38.360 The one of my favorite books in high school was 1:35:38.479 --> 1:35:40.519 because I remember I was like a film guy. Was 1:35:41.080 --> 1:35:44.440 Rebel Without a Crew by Robert Rodriguez, who directed Desperado 1:35:44.720 --> 1:35:47.680 and directed In City. And his whole thing was like 1:35:48.840 --> 1:35:51.360 he made his first movie for eight thousand dollars. He 1:35:51.439 --> 1:35:54.519 maxed out all his credit cards, sold his blood and 1:35:54.760 --> 1:35:58.080 was like a lab rat in like like experiments to 1:35:58.120 --> 1:36:03.000 make the money. Yeah, clinical truck for clinical trial for 1:36:03.080 --> 1:36:07.439 his first movie and she's and he did on eight 1:36:07.520 --> 1:36:11.800 thousand dollars, damn. And so he wrote this book about 1:36:11.880 --> 1:36:14.080 like stop waiting for Hollywood, just make your own ship. 1:36:14.240 --> 1:36:16.439 Like that was really influential to me, Like stop waiting 1:36:16.479 --> 1:36:19.160 for anybody, make your own ship. And he said, after 1:36:19.280 --> 1:36:23.559 I made Desperado, everyone was waiting for the sophomore slump. 1:36:23.800 --> 1:36:26.360 And everyone is waiting for the sophomore slump, so just 1:36:26.520 --> 1:36:29.280 do so much different shit that no one knows what 1:36:29.400 --> 1:36:34.040 your sophomore project is like that, and that's basically what I've. 1:36:33.920 --> 1:36:35.680 Been trying to do. Like he did a segment for 1:36:35.760 --> 1:36:37.360 Four Rooms. Remember four Rooms? 1:36:39.240 --> 1:36:41.880 He did an episode for like a show on Showtime. 1:36:42.000 --> 1:36:44.800 Like he just did like lots of different ship, and 1:36:44.960 --> 1:36:46.560 that's kind of like I was like, Okay, I'm not 1:36:46.600 --> 1:36:49.040 going to go right into writing another musical after Hamilton. 1:36:49.080 --> 1:36:51.400 I'm just gonna go do lots of different ship until 1:36:51.439 --> 1:36:53.320 I amass enough ideas. 1:36:53.360 --> 1:36:55.719 And I have ideas for stuff I want to write 1:36:55.800 --> 1:36:59.519 that is the length of Hamilton, but it doesn't tell 1:36:59.600 --> 1:37:01.000 me what form it wants to be. 1:37:01.080 --> 1:37:03.160 Like, remember I thought Hamilton was gonna be a mixtape. 1:37:03.240 --> 1:37:05.000 Like I thought I was going to be doing like 1:37:05.160 --> 1:37:08.320 a Prince among Thieves, Like that's what Hamilton was. In 1:37:08.400 --> 1:37:10.920 my head. It was like it was a concept album. 1:37:11.160 --> 1:37:13.880 I'd have rappers play the founders. I just didn't know 1:37:13.920 --> 1:37:15.880 any rappers yet, Like I had to write the show 1:37:16.280 --> 1:37:20.200 to get there. And so I have ideas for full 1:37:20.280 --> 1:37:23.080 length things, but I don't know whether their movies, or 1:37:23.120 --> 1:37:25.639 whether their concept albums, or whether they're shows. 1:37:25.680 --> 1:37:27.720 But there's all say because you know rappers now, so 1:37:27.800 --> 1:37:30.160 that whole concept album thing is like a thing. It 1:37:30.240 --> 1:37:32.600 can't of course, it can't be Hamilton, but it can be. 1:37:32.880 --> 1:37:35.320 So yeah and yeah. So I have an idea for 1:37:35.400 --> 1:37:37.519 something that I think could be a concept album and 1:37:37.880 --> 1:37:40.920 could be a play. But until I start like really 1:37:40.960 --> 1:37:43.200 writing it, I'm not gonna know what it is. 1:37:43.280 --> 1:37:45.800 It'll tell me what it is, all right, So you're 1:37:45.840 --> 1:37:48.800 just planning seeds, Yeah, okay, the fun stuff. Gun to 1:37:48.880 --> 1:37:54.840 your head? What are the five albums? And they can't 1:37:54.960 --> 1:37:57.920 no greatest hits? Man, Okay, That's why I hate that 1:37:58.040 --> 1:38:00.880 Rolling Stones list. It's like, come on, you can't put 1:38:01.000 --> 1:38:05.000 James start Time in there. That's every James Brown record ever. 1:38:05.760 --> 1:38:07.960 Right, Gun to your head. 1:38:08.680 --> 1:38:14.600 Five records that you are forced to listen to in 1:38:14.880 --> 1:38:18.960 solitary confinement four years straight. 1:38:19.280 --> 1:38:19.559 Weird. 1:38:19.840 --> 1:38:29.000 Five records from Neon Wesley University professor Neon my college 1:38:30.200 --> 1:38:31.320 highlighte Yeah. 1:38:32.880 --> 1:38:37.920 Bizarre, Right to the far Side. Yes, yes, I probably listened. 1:38:37.640 --> 1:38:40.080 To that more than any other team lab Cab. I 1:38:40.120 --> 1:38:44.160 think me and just Blaze might be the only two dudes. Yes, 1:38:45.360 --> 1:38:48.320 you born in seventy eight. I was on seventy eight. 1:38:49.320 --> 1:38:51.879 Seventy eight motherfuckers. So contrary man. 1:38:51.840 --> 1:38:56.120 Like Team Black Cabin Man, if you, if you, I 1:38:56.160 --> 1:38:59.880 have a theory about that, okay, seventy three to seventy eight. 1:39:00.320 --> 1:39:04.240 The reason you also contrary is because your formative Star 1:39:04.280 --> 1:39:06.840 Wars movie is Empire strikes Back, and it is the 1:39:06.920 --> 1:39:10.400 one with the sad ending and it taught a generation 1:39:10.720 --> 1:39:15.080 like I imagine seeing Empire strikes Back and being like, 1:39:15.200 --> 1:39:16.439 and that's the end of the movie. 1:39:17.280 --> 1:39:21.400 What that's theory. I've never seen War about to say, 1:39:22.920 --> 1:39:24.519 but no, I've never seen Star. 1:39:26.400 --> 1:39:30.519 Most contrary seventy eight people more return to Jedi, but 1:39:30.600 --> 1:39:32.240 I know is out of that regardless. 1:39:32.280 --> 1:39:34.640 So I can see all right, because I feel like 1:39:34.760 --> 1:39:36.280 that's the album that birthed Eminem. 1:39:36.760 --> 1:39:37.760 That's what I told you. 1:39:38.000 --> 1:39:45.000 What hmm, all right? Number two Forest, That's that's Eminem 1:39:45.040 --> 1:39:45.839 all day everything. 1:39:46.520 --> 1:39:48.880 As if that album drops and you're fourteen years old 1:39:48.880 --> 1:39:50.080 and you hear passing me by. 1:39:50.280 --> 1:39:53.360 What and the remix. 1:39:56.600 --> 1:40:05.120 M number one Fish the Burp, right, I mean, just 1:40:05.760 --> 1:40:08.840 like it is love that album. 1:40:10.160 --> 1:40:12.360 I found with lab Cat too. It's just that album 1:40:12.600 --> 1:40:15.200 was like, takes this much real estate in my brain. 1:40:16.240 --> 1:40:19.439 I just I don't like records that I learned early. 1:40:21.120 --> 1:40:24.760 We almost we almost made a mistake on idel or 1:40:24.800 --> 1:40:29.679 we were going to do like industry complaint songs, the industry, 1:40:29.760 --> 1:40:31.840 Oh yeah, industry complaint songs. 1:40:31.880 --> 1:40:34.280 And my A and R is like no, like no 1:40:34.400 --> 1:40:36.880 one cares that SOCD label doesn't care. 1:40:36.760 --> 1:40:40.040 About vils of fame album, right that. 1:40:40.160 --> 1:40:45.599 WASPS is about like the record label. And I learned early, 1:40:45.760 --> 1:40:50.120 like never made songs about the record label, So I 1:40:50.280 --> 1:40:54.160 learned early, you know, all right? Number two? What's your number? Two? 1:40:54.600 --> 1:40:57.640 Number two is an album that I remember more as 1:40:57.720 --> 1:40:59.960 like a vinyl in my dad's collection. It's a Ruby 1:41:00.080 --> 1:41:04.720 Blades's album called Buscando America looking for America, and it 1:41:05.080 --> 1:41:08.400 was it's it's one of those moments where like, you know, 1:41:08.479 --> 1:41:10.439 you just you dance to your parents ship when you're 1:41:10.720 --> 1:41:13.880 like with dym dancing dancing, and then you listen and 1:41:13.960 --> 1:41:16.320 then like you learn enough Spanish to understand the lyrics 1:41:16.360 --> 1:41:20.960 and you go, this is about capitalism or like this 1:41:21.160 --> 1:41:25.400 is about the perils of like religious fanaticism. Like there's 1:41:25.600 --> 1:41:28.040 deep ship in the lyrics of those songs. But I 1:41:28.160 --> 1:41:31.439 experienced it as like a kid dancing to it, and 1:41:31.560 --> 1:41:34.040 then I had a whole other like thing when I 1:41:34.120 --> 1:41:35.320 was old enough to appreciate it. 1:41:36.080 --> 1:41:37.960 So that's an album I can fuck with forever. 1:41:39.120 --> 1:41:41.280 All the kids that don't relate him to the guy 1:41:41.320 --> 1:41:42.280 from the Predator. 1:41:42.000 --> 1:41:48.160 Movies Predator too with Danik Lover, Yes, and then another 1:41:48.240 --> 1:41:49.880 generation who just knows him as a guy on the 1:41:50.080 --> 1:41:55.280 Walking Dead sequel, and yes he is, he's the father, 1:41:55.479 --> 1:41:59.040 Oh my god, Yes, and he's like he's like Dylan, 1:41:59.320 --> 1:42:01.280 and then like kids know him as Predator to. 1:42:03.960 --> 1:42:05.640 Put me on who he really was, But that's some 1:42:05.720 --> 1:42:06.280 New York ship. 1:42:06.320 --> 1:42:08.240 But yeah, that's the New York ship because he was. 1:42:08.600 --> 1:42:11.360 He was, He was the seventies Sign. He wrote all 1:42:11.400 --> 1:42:14.519 the best songs of Sound Sign in the seventies, him 1:42:14.560 --> 1:42:17.719 and Willie Quimber three. 1:42:18.720 --> 1:42:21.720 I gotta pick a theater album at some point, right, 1:42:21.840 --> 1:42:23.479 But I've listened to Rent so many times. 1:42:23.520 --> 1:42:25.519 I don't think I would. I would stay in it. 1:42:25.720 --> 1:42:28.360 It would probably be it probably would be something I 1:42:28.400 --> 1:42:31.280 don't know as well, like Gershwin's Porgie and Bess, or 1:42:32.520 --> 1:42:35.280 or like any sound time show like those are so 1:42:35.439 --> 1:42:37.479 fucking dense you you will hear new shit in it 1:42:37.640 --> 1:42:41.560 every time. Listening to Sondheim like Arrangement Wise is like 1:42:41.640 --> 1:42:44.080 listening to pun lyrically like you will get a new 1:42:44.160 --> 1:42:47.880 ship every time you're here. It so probably like Sweeney Todd. 1:42:47.880 --> 1:42:49.880 I think Sweeney Todd is a good number three. And 1:42:49.960 --> 1:42:51.639 it's also so I'm kind of cheating. 1:42:53.400 --> 1:42:55.960 Do you play land you talk about like just composition, 1:42:56.160 --> 1:42:57.120 do you play keys or. 1:42:57.680 --> 1:42:59.880 Like piano just well enough to write my ship? 1:43:00.160 --> 1:43:04.200 And actually, when I started working with Bill will appreciate this, 1:43:04.439 --> 1:43:06.040 Like it used to be like four tracks, Like I 1:43:06.080 --> 1:43:07.840 would play the bass here, in the piano here, and 1:43:07.960 --> 1:43:11.479 it was like terrible. And then finally like most of 1:43:11.720 --> 1:43:14.160 Heights got written a garage band and Hamilton got written 1:43:14.160 --> 1:43:17.719 on logic like I just like anything. That's the distance 1:43:17.840 --> 1:43:21.320 between my brain and like these keys, and to the 1:43:21.360 --> 1:43:23.200 point where it's part of the editing process, like a 1:43:23.240 --> 1:43:25.519 melody has to survive my shitty chops. 1:43:27.479 --> 1:43:33.120 Right, that's that's did you get melody through the rough stages? 1:43:33.240 --> 1:43:36.599 Then you got some Yeah, yeah, there are composers who 1:43:36.640 --> 1:43:38.920 have no distance between their brain and their hands. I'm 1:43:39.120 --> 1:43:40.880 I'm just not one of those guys. It's got to 1:43:40.960 --> 1:43:44.439 survive my chops. And then sometimes I find shit along 1:43:44.479 --> 1:43:46.240 the way while I'm trying to get it out of 1:43:46.280 --> 1:43:53.160 my head. Uh okay. Number four songs in the key Life. 1:43:53.280 --> 1:43:55.360 I could listen to that forever and be very very happy. 1:43:56.920 --> 1:43:59.920 I could pick any Stevie. I could pick intervisions like 1:44:00.280 --> 1:44:01.360 you know, like we were. 1:44:01.320 --> 1:44:03.519 We were talking on Twitter about like I think like 1:44:03.640 --> 1:44:05.920 Talking Book being better than songs, and I was like, 1:44:06.800 --> 1:44:07.439 I'm not mad. 1:44:07.560 --> 1:44:09.080 I think I play. 1:44:09.240 --> 1:44:11.560 I played Talking Book more. I mean, songs is a masterpiece. 1:44:11.640 --> 1:44:13.800 But talking about that kind of come back to more. 1:44:14.120 --> 1:44:18.880 Yeah, two discs, So I'm cheating, all right. I'm just 1:44:18.960 --> 1:44:21.960 trying to get more music into this little desert island 1:44:22.040 --> 1:44:23.080 situation you've got me into. 1:44:23.920 --> 1:44:26.479 That's why I picked the least liked one, which is 1:44:27.080 --> 1:44:27.519 feeling this. 1:44:28.120 --> 1:44:30.479 Oh it's like plants, plants, That's what I thought he 1:44:30.560 --> 1:44:31.559 was gonna say, because he. 1:44:34.920 --> 1:44:36.559 Well, if I'm stuck with the record for a year, 1:44:37.000 --> 1:44:39.040 I just haven't. 1:44:38.840 --> 1:44:44.439 Been question why hasn't there been a great Stevie jukebox musical. 1:44:45.240 --> 1:44:50.479 I've imagined it many times, like you yeah, yeah, and 1:44:50.680 --> 1:44:54.320 like you enter the world okay, and then it's tell. 1:44:55.680 --> 1:44:55.920 Truth. 1:44:59.400 --> 1:45:04.719 Talk about that a sort of like the Prince musical 1:45:06.760 --> 1:45:11.360 Trust Me when one day in the musical, I'm telling 1:45:11.400 --> 1:45:17.560 you one day your last one, my last one. I 1:45:17.680 --> 1:45:18.880 think you say some Pun record. 1:45:18.920 --> 1:45:22.360 At this point, I mean I still fun. 1:45:22.360 --> 1:45:24.720 With capital punishment like it's the one. 1:45:24.920 --> 1:45:25.120 I mean. 1:45:26.760 --> 1:45:28.240 Everything else after it's. 1:45:28.160 --> 1:45:33.800 Sort of like the hell yeah you baby, Yo. You 1:45:33.920 --> 1:45:39.840 know what, here's the thing Spotify list on my Spotify playlist. 1:45:40.360 --> 1:45:42.640 I don't know why. First of all, I love one. 1:45:44.720 --> 1:45:45.360 I love. 1:45:46.880 --> 1:45:49.200 I should not love that nigga ship, but I love it. 1:45:52.960 --> 1:45:54.800 I love I'm laughing at you now. 1:45:56.320 --> 1:45:57.240 I don't even have. 1:46:00.120 --> 1:46:00.519 You. Now. 1:46:02.560 --> 1:46:06.160 There's like five songs that I really really on the 1:46:06.240 --> 1:46:09.280 yeah this on the yeah baby, yeah baby. Yeah, there's 1:46:09.320 --> 1:46:13.880 five joints I really like. I like the sketches. My favorite, 1:46:14.120 --> 1:46:16.920 My favorite part of sketches, and I know he was 1:46:16.960 --> 1:46:20.240 doing scar phase was when the guy's laughing during the 1:46:20.320 --> 1:46:23.880 shooting scene like thanks Pun, and he's like when he. 1:46:23.880 --> 1:46:34.120 Gets shot exactly exactly, You'll you'll appreciate this Lynn Pun. 1:46:35.040 --> 1:46:39.519 Mm hmm, well not really. Pun was supposed to be 1:46:39.640 --> 1:46:50.439 on adrenaline on things fall apart what like, It's just 1:46:50.960 --> 1:46:56.240 the conversation with Pun. To talk to him is another language, 1:46:56.720 --> 1:47:01.080 because he'll call the studio like, hey, what's up, how 1:47:01.160 --> 1:47:01.439 you doing? 1:47:04.120 --> 1:47:04.160 What? 1:47:06.080 --> 1:47:12.080 It's like talking to the Charlie Brown teacher that's how 1:47:12.160 --> 1:47:14.080 it is to talk to Big Pun like he he 1:47:14.240 --> 1:47:19.360 was on his adrenaline. Should have been a uh four 1:47:19.479 --> 1:47:27.640 man operation with Pun, Beanie Tarique and Molik and Pun uh, 1:47:30.000 --> 1:47:30.840 but he never made it. 1:47:31.320 --> 1:47:35.160 So wow, you've seen that footage of it's like Pun 1:47:36.120 --> 1:47:38.160 d m X and they're all sitting in that booth 1:47:38.920 --> 1:47:41.680 and they're daring each other to freestyle and like it. 1:47:41.720 --> 1:47:43.439 She's like, no writtens, no writtens. 1:47:43.479 --> 1:47:47.880 It's a great little video really. Oh yeah yeah, and 1:47:48.240 --> 1:47:48.920 spit some ship. 1:47:49.040 --> 1:47:52.400 He definitely spit on someone else's album and it's fantastic. 1:47:54.520 --> 1:47:58.280 Oh yeah, well forgot. Oh you're a spot in the 1:47:59.479 --> 1:48:03.679 God Watch the Night Watter maccado joint. Oh yeah, yeah. 1:48:04.560 --> 1:48:07.200 Kind of it's explained to us and kind of tell 1:48:07.560 --> 1:48:11.120 you know, our viewers what Walter mccado meant to the 1:48:11.320 --> 1:48:14.360 what what he meant to the Latino community. 1:48:15.080 --> 1:48:18.080 The way I try to explain it to like Americans 1:48:18.120 --> 1:48:20.519 who didn't grow up with Walter muccado is like, imagine 1:48:20.600 --> 1:48:26.760 Bob Ross told you your future. Like imagine Bob Ross 1:48:26.920 --> 1:48:29.160 came into your home each day and was like, forgo, 1:48:29.760 --> 1:48:33.439 it's gonna be okay. You have a fortune coming down 1:48:33.479 --> 1:48:36.400 the lane and then like Pisces, and so like I 1:48:36.560 --> 1:48:39.720 remember most of my because remembering to a room being 1:48:39.760 --> 1:48:42.599 loud and my grandmother being like the fuck up waiting 1:48:42.680 --> 1:48:46.479 for Sagittarius, like waiting for Walter to tell her what 1:48:46.680 --> 1:48:47.519 was going to happen her day. 1:48:47.520 --> 1:48:50.080 And I would sit through Sagittarius because Capricorn was after that. 1:48:51.960 --> 1:48:52.840 Radio personality. 1:48:53.160 --> 1:48:57.519 No, he was a TV personal Also remember Bob Imagine 1:48:57.560 --> 1:49:01.200 Bob Ross tells you your horoscope and he dresses like Liberocchi. 1:49:01.320 --> 1:49:07.439 When he's feeling he dress Baker. Yeah, he was. 1:49:07.600 --> 1:49:11.240 Incredibly flamboyant at a time, you know, like machismo in 1:49:11.360 --> 1:49:14.560 Latin culture is like off the charts talks sometimes. But 1:49:14.720 --> 1:49:18.040 because Walter was so positive and he told us our future, 1:49:18.680 --> 1:49:20.040 he was just a fixture in. 1:49:20.080 --> 1:49:23.519 Our wow and so like remember I never knew his name. 1:49:24.040 --> 1:49:27.000 My Christmas present every year to my grandmother was the 1:49:27.240 --> 1:49:31.280 almanac Walter meccaldoll like next year Almanac to tell her 1:49:31.400 --> 1:49:34.880 what she could expect in the coming year. And one 1:49:34.880 --> 1:49:37.559 of the producers of the docs Friends with Foucars who 1:49:37.600 --> 1:49:39.200 was in Freestyle of Supreme with us. So I got 1:49:39.240 --> 1:49:42.880 a text from woodcarsh being like, hey, would you be 1:49:42.960 --> 1:49:45.000 interested in being in a Walter medcal when I wrote yes, 1:49:45.840 --> 1:49:49.479 I didn't let him finish because I got a chance 1:49:49.520 --> 1:49:53.360 to meet him. I could feel my ancestors doing backflips 1:49:53.680 --> 1:49:55.559 that I was meeting the guy who told them their 1:49:55.640 --> 1:49:59.600 future every day, and and I feel really grateful. I was. 1:49:59.680 --> 1:50:01.360 I was doing Hamilton Porto Rico at the time, so 1:50:01.439 --> 1:50:03.120 I got like an afternoon with him. He read me 1:50:03.200 --> 1:50:06.120 my chart, he read me my kids charts, like he 1:50:06.320 --> 1:50:08.720 like looked up my birthday and was like, oh, well, 1:50:08.800 --> 1:50:10.560 this was happening in this moon and this is like 1:50:10.960 --> 1:50:12.840 of course you were going to go into writing like 1:50:12.920 --> 1:50:13.240 of course. 1:50:13.400 --> 1:50:17.280 It was just like I was crying so much, not 1:50:17.400 --> 1:50:19.479 in the movie of me, just like holy shit. 1:50:20.560 --> 1:50:23.240 And then he passed away like within the year. So 1:50:23.439 --> 1:50:26.400 I felt I feel extra grateful for that moment because 1:50:26.920 --> 1:50:29.600 it was like, you know, that was that was like 1:50:30.160 --> 1:50:32.439 that's as close as I've gotten to like meeting a 1:50:32.479 --> 1:50:35.760 celebrity that Westy on my TV every day. 1:50:36.360 --> 1:50:38.479 I was a great documentary man. I you know, I 1:50:38.800 --> 1:50:40.759 had knew who he was, I didn't know his story, 1:50:41.040 --> 1:50:42.479 and I thought that was really good. 1:50:42.520 --> 1:50:44.920 I think, say I got it. 1:50:44.960 --> 1:50:46.880 Look then got a couple because I still gotta witch 1:50:46.880 --> 1:50:48.439 se him for Luis too, So it's. 1:50:48.720 --> 1:50:49.679 That's coming out on Tuesday. 1:50:49.720 --> 1:50:52.240 That's not out yet, oh god, okay, but it'll be 1:50:52.280 --> 1:50:54.000 out by by the time this episode place. 1:50:54.400 --> 1:50:57.680 Yes, And then there's the Freestyle doc which Quest is 1:50:57.720 --> 1:51:02.080 in and uh is like, what's crazy about that? Is 1:51:02.120 --> 1:51:05.160 they got footage of us at our peak, like at 1:51:05.560 --> 1:51:09.639 Baked Beans era substitute teaching, Like the guy who directed 1:51:09.720 --> 1:51:11.720 that movie started following us with a camera in two 1:51:11.720 --> 1:51:12.360 thousand and five. 1:51:12.640 --> 1:51:15.320 So this movie is about you, guys at your beginnings. 1:51:15.600 --> 1:51:19.000 It's about like the fifteen years of freestyle when like 1:51:19.360 --> 1:51:22.320 we were, I was a substitute teacher, Bill's working MTV 1:51:22.560 --> 1:51:25.120 and then we were making up funny raps for people 1:51:26.720 --> 1:51:29.760 where that's all Hulu. 1:51:30.280 --> 1:51:33.360 Okay, how do you stay sharp? 1:51:33.720 --> 1:51:37.720 Because I now realize one of the things about being 1:51:37.800 --> 1:51:43.360 in quarantining is that us doing the Tonight Show every night, 1:51:44.280 --> 1:51:47.320 at least when we were doing it before quarantining, I 1:51:47.400 --> 1:51:51.600 mean to re expending two hours every day wrapping, so 1:51:51.760 --> 1:51:56.280 that keeps his mind sharp, which explains like the amount 1:51:56.360 --> 1:51:58.040 of fire that he's which is. 1:52:00.000 --> 1:52:02.040 It's probably that ten minute freestyle because I've watched that 1:52:02.160 --> 1:52:05.360 more times than any album, any album of the past 1:52:05.439 --> 1:52:05.880 few years. 1:52:07.000 --> 1:52:09.360 So how do you say, Because the thing is as 1:52:09.439 --> 1:52:14.280 a freestyler, you're like you're super or one point, I've 1:52:14.360 --> 1:52:17.280 never seen you fall or slip yet, And in doing 1:52:18.120 --> 1:52:21.439 freestyle love supreme the amount of times I've seen it, 1:52:22.000 --> 1:52:25.760 Like the amount of pressure that it takes to make 1:52:25.920 --> 1:52:29.880 that happen. Like how often every day are you guys, 1:52:31.000 --> 1:52:33.680 especially now in quarantining, Like how often every day you 1:52:33.800 --> 1:52:35.240 guys even practicing? 1:52:35.240 --> 1:52:37.960 When quarantine happened, we were doing our Broadway run and 1:52:38.000 --> 1:52:41.719 we were doing an eighth show week, and that was incredible. 1:52:41.760 --> 1:52:43.680 I wasn't doing eight shows. I was doing two or 1:52:43.720 --> 1:52:47.519 three a week, but still that was enough. My my 1:52:47.760 --> 1:52:50.840 learning curve with freestyle was, oh, if you try to 1:52:50.880 --> 1:52:53.400 plan your rhymes, you're gonna fall the fuck on your face. 1:52:54.320 --> 1:52:57.200 Like I that's that was my learning curve because when 1:52:57.240 --> 1:52:58.760 we started doing it, I was trying to be cute 1:52:58.760 --> 1:53:00.320 and I was like, all right, I got two punch 1:53:00.400 --> 1:53:03.680 lines that if I can't think of anything, I'll say 1:53:03.760 --> 1:53:06.160 these funny punch lines and then like I would get 1:53:06.200 --> 1:53:08.559 out on stage, I would fuck up the punch lines 1:53:08.680 --> 1:53:12.640 and then be terrible like and so you learn the 1:53:12.800 --> 1:53:16.719 only answers to just be truly open and truly present, 1:53:17.200 --> 1:53:19.800 and then like you get enough reps that like it 1:53:19.960 --> 1:53:22.840 becomes another language filter, like, oh no, everything I'm gonna 1:53:22.840 --> 1:53:24.960 say is gonna rhyme, but I'm gonna express this. I'm 1:53:25.000 --> 1:53:28.000 gonna express this and it will just rhyme because I've 1:53:28.040 --> 1:53:29.640 had enough reps and I know how to do it. 1:53:30.560 --> 1:53:34.040 And if you get, like chess, enough on it, you 1:53:34.200 --> 1:53:36.599 can know where you're going and build your way there, 1:53:37.160 --> 1:53:40.000 which Tarik's amazing at. Every time we play Wheel of Freestyle, 1:53:40.479 --> 1:53:42.160 I love hearing what his first line is. 1:53:42.160 --> 1:53:44.200 Because I already know he knows what his last line is, 1:53:44.240 --> 1:53:44.639 and he's. 1:53:44.600 --> 1:53:46.519 Building to it and builds. 1:53:46.560 --> 1:53:47.479 Yeah, he builds backwards. 1:53:47.600 --> 1:53:49.920 He builds backwards, but he builds backwards in real time. 1:53:50.000 --> 1:53:52.040 And that's what I try to do too. Of Like 1:53:52.400 --> 1:53:54.519 I'm going to end on Dinosaur, so now I got 1:53:54.640 --> 1:53:56.480 to think of three rhyns for Dinosaur. 1:53:56.080 --> 1:53:57.080 And I got to do it as I go. 1:53:57.240 --> 1:54:00.400 Yeah, and he's the best in the world at it. 1:54:01.200 --> 1:54:03.599 But that's that's what I try to do in the shows, 1:54:03.640 --> 1:54:06.879 and that's my own little discipline for myself. Like Anthony 1:54:07.360 --> 1:54:10.040 will literally build to rhyme and say the opposite just 1:54:10.120 --> 1:54:13.080 to surprise himself. I don't think Anthony's rhyme three times, 1:54:13.960 --> 1:54:17.320 Like he just likes to fucking zig and zag ootcars, 1:54:17.479 --> 1:54:20.080 just like u TK is, just like he hits these 1:54:20.160 --> 1:54:24.080 pockets where like he's got twenty syllables and then he can't. 1:54:24.600 --> 1:54:27.200 Like everyone kind of approaches it differently, which I think 1:54:27.240 --> 1:54:31.839 also works well. Like my technique wouldn't work for Anthony 1:54:32.200 --> 1:54:35.240 and u tk's wouldn't work for me, But we all 1:54:35.360 --> 1:54:36.840 kind of meet in the middle because we're all just 1:54:36.880 --> 1:54:38.960 trying to be present and listen to each other and 1:54:39.800 --> 1:54:42.320 like say what comes out right? 1:54:43.120 --> 1:54:46.120 Yeah, I think like freestyling for MC's that's like DJing 1:54:46.280 --> 1:54:51.040 for producers. Like I think just being in that coming 1:54:51.120 --> 1:54:52.839 up in there, if you came up in battle culture 1:54:52.920 --> 1:54:56.520 or like cipher culture, like freestyling that definitely you know 1:54:56.720 --> 1:54:58.520 you talk about earlier, you were saying they don't really 1:54:58.600 --> 1:55:01.120 teach rapping his songwriting or they don't think of it 1:55:01.200 --> 1:55:04.120 as songwriting. That's something that's always kind of been a 1:55:04.280 --> 1:55:07.280 thing for me. And just that your I tell I 1:55:07.400 --> 1:55:09.600 tell all EMC's, anybody want to rap for me? 1:55:09.680 --> 1:55:11.600 Whatever? Like I'm like, no, please don't rap me. I 1:55:11.640 --> 1:55:12.160 don't hear it. 1:55:12.520 --> 1:55:15.200 But you got four bars to close me, Like that's 1:55:15.240 --> 1:55:17.240 my home, you got you got four bars to close me. 1:55:17.360 --> 1:55:19.640 I know I can tell within four bars if somebody 1:55:19.720 --> 1:55:22.880 really got some shit or not, because you gotta. You 1:55:23.040 --> 1:55:26.160 have to pretty much a you know, attack grab the 1:55:26.200 --> 1:55:28.560 listen about a throat in that beginning, and you got 1:55:28.640 --> 1:55:30.600 a close strong you know what I mean. And the 1:55:30.720 --> 1:55:32.920 middle you can you know, the middle gotta be strong too. 1:55:32.960 --> 1:55:35.080 But that opening, that closing, like you got to bring 1:55:35.120 --> 1:55:35.840 that mofucker home. 1:55:36.800 --> 1:55:36.960 Lynn. 1:55:37.200 --> 1:55:39.320 I just want to ask you. It's interesting because we 1:55:39.440 --> 1:55:40.040 were talking. 1:55:39.800 --> 1:55:42.560 About like, as you're growing, your father is growing, and 1:55:42.800 --> 1:55:45.400 we know that this documentary is coming out about his life. 1:55:45.800 --> 1:55:49.400 And it's interesting because it's it's it's an interesting responsibility 1:55:49.480 --> 1:55:51.440 put on your shoulders. It feels like at this time 1:55:51.480 --> 1:55:54.160 in your life as a new Eurekan man, as a 1:55:54.200 --> 1:55:57.240 Puerto Rican man, same thing with this. It's like an 1:55:57.280 --> 1:56:00.240 activism versus capitalism kind of line. Like I just wanted 1:56:00.280 --> 1:56:01.840 you to speak on it for a second and speak 1:56:01.920 --> 1:56:04.760 on this weight that has kind of been thrust it 1:56:05.080 --> 1:56:07.760 upon you and you've taken on a lot voluntarily in 1:56:07.880 --> 1:56:09.000 that sense, you know. 1:56:09.120 --> 1:56:11.520 I used to use Twitter to just like live tweet 1:56:11.600 --> 1:56:13.680 buffy and shit like everybody else on Twitter. 1:56:14.480 --> 1:56:16.480 Like you can't do that when you have three million 1:56:16.520 --> 1:56:18.040 people follow you. It's a particle. 1:56:18.720 --> 1:56:22.720 Like every tweet's a press release, so your relationship to 1:56:22.760 --> 1:56:25.960 that change is But also like I try to treat 1:56:26.760 --> 1:56:29.200 the causes I get involved in the same way I 1:56:29.320 --> 1:56:32.080 treat creative impulses of like what's the shit that doesn't 1:56:32.120 --> 1:56:32.720 leave you alone? 1:56:33.760 --> 1:56:36.280 Like, what is the thing that like you went to 1:56:36.400 --> 1:56:37.280 bed thinking. 1:56:37.080 --> 1:56:38.960 About it and you woke up and You're like, this 1:56:39.120 --> 1:56:40.920 is so fucked up. I can't stop thinking about it. 1:56:41.000 --> 1:56:43.360 It hurts my heart, it hurts my stomach, Like I'm 1:56:43.400 --> 1:56:45.240 going to get involved in some way. And I tried it, 1:56:45.320 --> 1:56:48.720 because you could go on Twitter all day and see 1:56:48.840 --> 1:56:50.960 all the things going on in the world and drown 1:56:51.160 --> 1:56:54.400 in it, like and drown in how much need there 1:56:54.520 --> 1:56:55.560 is in the world. 1:56:55.560 --> 1:56:57.280 But you can only listen to the shit that doesn't 1:56:57.320 --> 1:56:59.320 leave you alone, And so I try to. 1:57:00.520 --> 1:57:02.120 I try to do that, and then I think the 1:57:02.200 --> 1:57:05.280 biggest lesson I got for my dad because I'm the mellowest, 1:57:05.640 --> 1:57:08.040 laziest guy in my family by a lot, but the 1:57:08.240 --> 1:57:10.960 median is so high because my dad is such an 1:57:11.240 --> 1:57:14.120 achiever that like even falling below the media and I 1:57:14.200 --> 1:57:18.080 still get a lot of you dun. Yeah, but I 1:57:18.280 --> 1:57:20.840 am I'm the slow poke. I'm the one who like 1:57:21.280 --> 1:57:23.920 like just want you know, I'm very happy that we 1:57:23.960 --> 1:57:27.080 have all successfully skipped watching this first debate live. 1:57:27.800 --> 1:57:29.720 And let's talk about it. Let's talk about it. 1:57:30.040 --> 1:57:31.560 Listen, I'm about to DV here. I don't know what 1:57:31.600 --> 1:57:32.480 you're saying. It's an addiction. 1:57:32.640 --> 1:57:34.400 So yeah, I can't. I can't. 1:57:36.720 --> 1:57:37.480 Date with you guys. 1:57:39.600 --> 1:57:42.160 Yeah, I'm going to be. 1:57:42.280 --> 1:57:45.000 Like, you know, this guy's got some good ideas. 1:57:45.480 --> 1:57:48.960 But the pressure is on because everybody's pandering to the 1:57:49.080 --> 1:57:51.280 Latin vote, which I found it is so interesting because 1:57:51.320 --> 1:57:52.880 it's so many countries that you just put under an 1:57:52.920 --> 1:57:55.680 umbrella with different classes and ship But like, even with that, 1:57:55.800 --> 1:57:58.640 for you, it's even pressure in this election year in 1:57:58.720 --> 1:58:00.480 a way, right for you to speak up say things 1:58:00.880 --> 1:58:01.840 where do we you know? 1:58:02.280 --> 1:58:02.520 Yeah? 1:58:02.560 --> 1:58:04.040 But but the thing that my dad and I are 1:58:04.080 --> 1:58:06.160 always on about is like that we're not a monolith 1:58:06.320 --> 1:58:08.720 and you have to talk with nuance. Don't be playing 1:58:08.760 --> 1:58:12.520 mid a gay and the fucking Texas for Biden. Thing 1:58:12.840 --> 1:58:15.040 like they're fucking with Nathaniel Music down there. 1:58:15.760 --> 1:58:17.160 Yeah, you know, like. 1:58:18.960 --> 1:58:24.280 Me, but it's it's it's it's as simple as speaking 1:58:24.360 --> 1:58:27.760 to our issues and speak like and and really understanding them. 1:58:27.880 --> 1:58:33.080 And the you know the fact that we we've never 1:58:33.200 --> 1:58:36.120 had a president more hostile to Latinos than this president. 1:58:36.360 --> 1:58:38.560 And he told us who he was the moment he 1:58:38.600 --> 1:58:41.240 came down the elevator and was like, Mexican's are rapists. 1:58:41.240 --> 1:58:43.400 They're not sending over the best people, like they're sending 1:58:43.440 --> 1:58:44.480 over the rapists and killers. 1:58:44.560 --> 1:58:47.200 Like and like there's went Datinos for Trump. 1:58:47.480 --> 1:58:50.520 And it went downhill from there, Like that was his 1:58:50.640 --> 1:58:54.560 opening salvo and it went downhill from there. So you know, 1:58:55.560 --> 1:58:58.280 I think, I mean, if you want to go down policy, 1:58:58.320 --> 1:58:59.480 we talk another hour, but like. 1:59:00.480 --> 1:59:01.040 I don't have to. 1:59:01.800 --> 1:59:04.000 You have to just you know, speak to the issues 1:59:04.080 --> 1:59:05.760 that that that affect us. 1:59:05.840 --> 1:59:08.720 This motherfucker through paper towels and did everything he could 1:59:08.800 --> 1:59:10.720 not to send aid to Puerto Rico, and what he 1:59:10.800 --> 1:59:12.880 did to Puerto Rico after Marie is exactly what he's 1:59:12.920 --> 1:59:15.080 doing to this country in this pandemic. He wasn't to 1:59:15.200 --> 1:59:17.680 Matty and then he lied about how not ready he 1:59:17.920 --> 1:59:21.080 was okay on our island, and then it happened in 1:59:21.120 --> 1:59:21.600 our country. 1:59:22.320 --> 1:59:24.200 You opened the door, And I guess I have to 1:59:24.240 --> 1:59:28.000 ask one question every you know, every culture has their 1:59:28.720 --> 1:59:34.320 group of people that are willingly ignorant to actual facts 1:59:34.360 --> 1:59:37.680 and truth. How easy do you think it will be 1:59:39.000 --> 1:59:46.440 to convince? As Laya mentioned, Uh, there's a a sizable 1:59:46.520 --> 1:59:53.360 population of Latinos for Trump that you know, feel as 1:59:53.440 --> 1:59:57.480 though he's right and he speaks for me. And I'm 1:59:57.520 --> 2:00:00.280 actually shocked that a lot in what I or my 2:00:00.400 --> 2:00:02.960 hip hop I would expect it from, you know, the 2:00:03.160 --> 2:00:06.880 the old uncle that you think about at Thanksgiving or 2:00:06.880 --> 2:00:08.800 at least that you know comedians joke about. 2:00:08.880 --> 2:00:12.760 But is this at all? Is this something that could 2:00:12.760 --> 2:00:18.040 be turned around or in you're at So. 2:00:18.360 --> 2:00:22.280 Much of it is just misinformation. You're trying to play 2:00:22.360 --> 2:00:25.680 fair with someone who lies as easy as breathing, and 2:00:26.960 --> 2:00:31.440 the fact that he throws around words like socialism and 2:00:32.040 --> 2:00:34.080 they're coming to get your this or coming to get 2:00:34.080 --> 2:00:38.760 your that. Sometimes to populations that have fled countries where 2:00:39.480 --> 2:00:43.800 that real shit has happened, lies can take root, you 2:00:43.840 --> 2:00:46.560 know what I mean, Like there's all manner of atrocities 2:00:46.920 --> 2:00:50.240 happening in insert Latin American countries here, and if Trump 2:00:50.280 --> 2:00:53.000 says they're going to do that here and you've just 2:00:53.120 --> 2:00:56.640 come from there, that shit takes root. And I really 2:00:56.720 --> 2:00:59.760 think that a misinformation is a big part of it, 2:01:00.200 --> 2:01:05.320 and the fact that in Spanish language like misinformation can 2:01:05.360 --> 2:01:10.240 spread even more wildly because like you know, the fact 2:01:10.320 --> 2:01:13.080 checkers of the Washington Post aren't listening to the Latin 2:01:13.200 --> 2:01:15.880 radio station, but the Latin radio station is spouting some 2:01:16.720 --> 2:01:17.640 right conspiracy. 2:01:18.840 --> 2:01:21.400 It goes unchecked. It just straight up goes unchecked. 2:01:21.480 --> 2:01:23.960 And so you know, to me, that's a big part 2:01:24.000 --> 2:01:28.800 of it, is just like misinformation campaigns with vulnerable populations. 2:01:30.080 --> 2:01:34.360 And you know, the larger part of it I can't 2:01:34.480 --> 2:01:38.120 speak to, Like there's you know, I can't know what 2:01:38.280 --> 2:01:40.320 goes on in that mindset because I'm certainly not of 2:01:40.440 --> 2:01:43.320 that mindset. Like I'm just seeing with my own eyes 2:01:43.600 --> 2:01:46.800 the lies this guy is told. Like with Puerto Rico alone, 2:01:47.000 --> 2:01:50.360 like he said, only sixteen people died. We know that 2:01:50.440 --> 2:01:53.160 thanks to mismanagement, it was closer to four thousand, but 2:01:53.280 --> 2:01:55.800 he got stuck at sixteen and kept them moving. 2:01:56.720 --> 2:01:58.760 You know, just released the funds like a week ago, 2:01:58.920 --> 2:02:01.840 right right right, type of the election right. 2:02:01.800 --> 2:02:04.320 And when when you see him with this, with the 2:02:04.400 --> 2:02:07.040 pandemic stuff, and how unprepared he was and how much 2:02:07.080 --> 2:02:10.120 he downplayed it, he will continue to say, but China, 2:02:10.200 --> 2:02:12.200 but China. Like It's like he gets the one fact 2:02:12.320 --> 2:02:15.240 in his head and he sticks to it. So, you know, 2:02:16.320 --> 2:02:17.880 I don't know the answer to turning around, but I 2:02:17.960 --> 2:02:19.920 know that misinformation is a big part of it. 2:02:20.240 --> 2:02:24.120 Misinformation that is just sticky enough to take hold. 2:02:24.760 --> 2:02:30.280 My last question on pay bill, uh is there anything 2:02:30.320 --> 2:02:32.160 about Lynn that we haven't learned yet? 2:02:36.880 --> 2:02:39.440 Ending with you, Fela Kutstein, I just saw that you 2:02:39.520 --> 2:02:40.240 replaced the name. 2:02:42.240 --> 2:02:44.880 I mean, there are many stories about Lynn that are 2:02:44.960 --> 2:02:48.360 fantastic and uh, you know, uh, maybe we could do 2:02:48.440 --> 2:02:51.240 a second episode and get into the real mental. 2:02:52.640 --> 2:02:58.680 Situ I mean that, Yeah, No, what did you just say? 2:02:58.760 --> 2:03:00.120 That was a word salad. 2:03:02.320 --> 2:03:03.600 Make fun of how you talk. 2:03:03.800 --> 2:03:04.920 But what did you just say? 2:03:05.960 --> 2:03:08.200 I don't know how to answer this question. 2:03:08.320 --> 2:03:10.800 The answer is, yes, there are many stories about Linda 2:03:10.800 --> 2:03:13.080 that I that I could tell here, but uh, there 2:03:13.120 --> 2:03:15.800 are none that will take the short amount of time 2:03:15.880 --> 2:03:18.160 we have left to coagulate. 2:03:18.760 --> 2:03:21.720 I think it's dope now, I think it's dope for y'all. 2:03:21.760 --> 2:03:23.680 Have been been homies for all these years, you know, 2:03:24.240 --> 2:03:28.000 like twenty years for y'all to still be homies, are 2:03:28.000 --> 2:03:30.480 still working together, and you know the heights that you've 2:03:30.760 --> 2:03:31.480 both achieved. 2:03:32.080 --> 2:03:33.520 I think that's just a great story, man. 2:03:33.920 --> 2:03:37.760 It's a plan for this to be forever, forever, forever. 2:03:39.320 --> 2:03:40.600 Answer that question, like you. 2:03:42.200 --> 2:03:42.640 Plan for you. 2:03:42.960 --> 2:03:45.080 There's only there's only two people in my life not 2:03:45.200 --> 2:03:48.560 related to me that i've no longer. You're actually one 2:03:48.640 --> 2:03:52.320 of them, which is serious, that's real though. 2:03:52.680 --> 2:03:54.280 Kiss today, goodbye? 2:03:57.240 --> 2:03:57.640 What I did? 2:04:02.480 --> 2:04:03.680 Did you really? Did you have a Comodo? 2:04:05.560 --> 2:04:05.680 Oh? 2:04:05.760 --> 2:04:06.560 Yeah, Comodo six. 2:04:10.080 --> 2:04:12.480 I used to watch the play Tony Hawk's Skateboarder for 2:04:12.600 --> 2:04:13.360 like hours up. 2:04:13.880 --> 2:04:15.680 The remasters still over again. 2:04:15.800 --> 2:04:18.280 We used to watch Little Mermaid. We have a lot 2:04:18.320 --> 2:04:19.000 of weird times. 2:04:19.800 --> 2:04:21.080 Dominator, that was a big game. 2:04:21.520 --> 2:04:23.080 Do you do you still game? You still game it? 2:04:24.080 --> 2:04:24.200 Uh? 2:04:24.400 --> 2:04:24.600 Yeah? 2:04:24.680 --> 2:04:27.080 I just got the remaster Tony Hawk because that was 2:04:27.240 --> 2:04:29.360 that was the game that got me back into games. 2:04:29.440 --> 2:04:31.520 Like I started playing with that in college and then 2:04:31.680 --> 2:04:35.480 I never got off again. I'm replaying Red Dead too. 2:04:35.680 --> 2:04:38.320 Like that's like and I never opened it. It was 2:04:38.360 --> 2:04:41.160 just this so much game. I finished the game. 2:04:41.240 --> 2:04:42.480 But once you start hunting Theres. 2:04:42.560 --> 2:04:42.920 It's like. 2:04:44.800 --> 2:04:48.720 U P S four, U Xbox PS four, U ps 2:04:48.760 --> 2:04:51.120 FOALKM P four two. I just finished a couple of 2:04:51.440 --> 2:04:53.440 months ago U Ghost of Sushima. 2:04:53.920 --> 2:04:54.040 Uh. 2:04:54.920 --> 2:04:55.920 That ship is amazing that. 2:04:57.600 --> 2:05:00.200 My wife likes, Like she plays Zelda forever. She will 2:05:00.200 --> 2:05:04.320 be every book in the room. I just want to fight. 2:05:04.800 --> 2:05:05.360 I just want to fight. 2:05:05.440 --> 2:05:07.560 I can still go okay if you just want to 2:05:07.600 --> 2:05:11.240 fight ship. There is a game. It's four. It's like 2:05:11.360 --> 2:05:12.040 twenty bucks. 2:05:12.360 --> 2:05:14.200 It was on Xbox but now it's They made it 2:05:14.240 --> 2:05:17.760 for PS four called Cuphead, Cuphead, Cuphead. 2:05:18.760 --> 2:05:22.520 Dude, dude, I'm getting head. It is like I heard 2:05:22.600 --> 2:05:24.040 I like I saw somebody in the form. 2:05:24.120 --> 2:05:26.800 They described it as cartoon Dark Souls and it is 2:05:26.880 --> 2:05:29.800 the realist ship ever, Like it is as hard as fuck. 2:05:29.840 --> 2:05:33.560 It's super hard, but the animation style is in like 2:05:33.640 --> 2:05:36.880 that nineteen thirties Tom and Jerryles. 2:05:37.160 --> 2:05:39.240 My first date with my wife was Grand Theft, Autos 2:05:39.240 --> 2:05:41.120 and Andres. That's how I got this to come to 2:05:41.200 --> 2:05:42.520 my house to play that with what. 2:05:44.120 --> 2:05:45.880 I used to play Burnout Revenge. I used to watch 2:05:45.920 --> 2:05:48.120 them crash cars for like hours and hours. 2:05:48.280 --> 2:05:49.120 Yeah, it's all. 2:05:51.400 --> 2:05:53.520 I don't think none of that was the best. 2:05:53.760 --> 2:05:58.000 Yeah, man, man, ladies and gentlemen. You asked for it, 2:05:58.120 --> 2:05:58.560 you got it. 2:05:58.800 --> 2:06:03.880 The four years red linn Manuel Miranda episode of Quest 2:06:03.920 --> 2:06:06.280 Love Supreme. We thank you very much for joining us 2:06:07.600 --> 2:06:12.120 on behalf of Team Supreme. Uh Laya Sugar, Steve, Finn, 2:06:12.160 --> 2:06:14.480 Tickeelo and Bill's Bill. 2:06:14.680 --> 2:06:14.880 Bill. 2:06:21.880 --> 2:06:24.880 It's the best name ever. Please call me in there 2:06:24.920 --> 2:06:27.520 you go, boy, all right, this Quest Loves signing off. 2:06:27.560 --> 2:06:29.080 We will see you the next go round. Thank you 2:06:29.360 --> 2:06:31.040 very much, Lynn, We appreciate you. 2:06:31.080 --> 2:06:31.320 Guys. 2:06:34.560 --> 2:06:42.920 Must Love Supreme is a production of iHeart Radio. For 2:06:43.040 --> 2:06:46.120 more podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, 2:06:46.360 --> 2:06:49.400 Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.