1 00:00:00,210 --> 00:00:27,600 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome back to 2 00:00:27,620 --> 00:00:30,980 Speaker 1: the show, fellow ridiculous historians. Thank you, as always, so 3 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:34,120 Speaker 1: much for tuning in. Let's hear it for our super producer, 4 00:00:34,580 --> 00:00:37,129 Speaker 1: Max Winslow Williams. 5 00:00:37,430 --> 00:00:41,909 Speaker 2: Max Reindeer Velvet. Max the Velvet Reindeer Williams. 6 00:00:42,050 --> 00:00:42,610 Speaker 3: How about that? 7 00:00:43,030 --> 00:00:46,909 Speaker 1: That's Noel Brown. They call me Ben Bullen for tax purposes. 8 00:00:47,210 --> 00:00:52,080 Speaker 1: And we, Noel, Max, we are in Chapter 2 of a, well, 9 00:00:52,120 --> 00:00:56,150 Speaker 1: Chapter 3, technically, of a continuing exploration of on weird 10 00:00:56,230 --> 00:00:58,950 Speaker 1: stuff people used to get high off of. And we 11 00:00:59,020 --> 00:01:02,060 Speaker 1: have really classed it up, you guys, because we are 12 00:01:02,140 --> 00:01:07,240 Speaker 1: joined with our returning special guest. I can't believe we 13 00:01:07,280 --> 00:01:11,869 Speaker 1: got into the schedule and his writer is crazy. It's 14 00:01:12,130 --> 00:01:13,130 Speaker 1: Zarin Burnett. 15 00:01:13,610 --> 00:01:16,250 Speaker 4: Yo, what up, gentlemen? I remember I said all brown 16 00:01:16,370 --> 00:01:18,250 Speaker 4: M & Ms, so make sure I want that. 17 00:01:18,740 --> 00:01:21,020 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, we're counting them. 18 00:01:21,060 --> 00:01:22,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure. 19 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:24,380 Speaker 2: We are meticulous about our guests' riders. 20 00:01:24,420 --> 00:01:26,860 Speaker 4: I appreciate that. I really do. It's respect. I can 21 00:01:26,890 --> 00:01:27,470 Speaker 4: feel it, you know? 22 00:01:27,470 --> 00:01:30,649 Speaker 3: 100%. Thanks, guys, for having me. Of course. 23 00:01:30,670 --> 00:01:32,530 Speaker 4: Always a fun time with y'all. 24 00:01:32,630 --> 00:01:33,310 Speaker 3: Oh, dude, the best. 25 00:01:33,510 --> 00:01:35,270 Speaker 2: What do you say we just jump right into our 26 00:01:35,350 --> 00:01:36,830 Speaker 2: conversation already in progress? 27 00:01:43,790 --> 00:01:48,080 Speaker 1: We got to get to another drug of yesteryear. We're 28 00:01:48,100 --> 00:01:52,100 Speaker 1: going to be less anthrocentric here. Guys, we got to 29 00:01:52,140 --> 00:01:52,920 Speaker 1: get to reindeer. 30 00:01:53,480 --> 00:01:53,690 Speaker 4: Reindeer? 31 00:01:53,710 --> 00:01:54,310 Speaker 1: Are you a fan? 32 00:01:54,610 --> 00:01:57,470 Speaker 3: Yeah, are you a fan? Like antlers? Are we scraping 33 00:01:57,490 --> 00:02:00,810 Speaker 3: little bits off the antlers and snorting them? You know 34 00:02:01,270 --> 00:02:02,030 Speaker 3: I love reindeers. 35 00:02:03,270 --> 00:02:05,050 Speaker 4: Is this why Rudolph has a red nose? 36 00:02:05,410 --> 00:02:07,890 Speaker 3: Yeah. Alcoholism. 37 00:02:08,290 --> 00:02:16,290 Speaker 1: Oh, geez. Yeah, Rudolph had his inner demons. We're pretty sure. So, reindeers, 38 00:02:16,590 --> 00:02:23,609 Speaker 1: in addition to having one troubling superhero, they are also 39 00:02:24,889 --> 00:02:29,150 Speaker 1: super into getting high. They love mushrooms. 40 00:02:29,350 --> 00:02:29,730 Speaker 3: Mushrooms. 41 00:02:29,770 --> 00:02:30,090 Speaker 4: They love them. 42 00:02:30,680 --> 00:02:36,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, they love the fly agaric mushroom, Amanita muscaria, if 43 00:02:36,060 --> 00:02:38,440 Speaker 1: it has a tie on and has to meet the parents. 44 00:02:41,030 --> 00:02:44,390 Speaker 1: It's so weird, you guys, because reindeer or caribou, if 45 00:02:44,430 --> 00:02:49,269 Speaker 1: you want, they are herbivorous, but it doesn't mean they're 46 00:02:49,330 --> 00:02:52,790 Speaker 1: automatically not fun. And I say that as a former vegan. 47 00:02:56,450 --> 00:03:00,180 Speaker 1: It's weird because, guys, we're talking about a species of 48 00:03:00,310 --> 00:03:04,940 Speaker 1: animal that lives in an unforgiving climate, right? Threats are 49 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:10,800 Speaker 1: super large. Resources are sparse. These guys have for thousands 50 00:03:10,840 --> 00:03:16,630 Speaker 1: and thousands of years actively sought out specifically the fly 51 00:03:16,770 --> 00:03:17,850 Speaker 1: agaric mushroom. 52 00:03:18,570 --> 00:03:19,049 Speaker 3: Okay. 53 00:03:19,090 --> 00:03:21,910 Speaker 2: Now, I mentioned the stoned ape theory at the top 54 00:03:21,950 --> 00:03:25,490 Speaker 2: of the show, and this is this concept that primates 55 00:03:25,910 --> 00:03:31,380 Speaker 2: who consumed psychotropic mushrooms— were able to hunt better. It 56 00:03:31,660 --> 00:03:34,700 Speaker 2: increased their visual acuity and their ability to kind of like, 57 00:03:35,800 --> 00:03:38,540 Speaker 2: you know, hone in on their prey. If anyone's ever 58 00:03:38,760 --> 00:03:41,930 Speaker 2: experienced anything, even a mild, you know, cannabis high, it 59 00:03:41,990 --> 00:03:43,990 Speaker 2: does kind of sharpen your senses a little bit. 60 00:03:44,050 --> 00:03:45,510 Speaker 3: So that theory is fascinating. 61 00:03:45,550 --> 00:03:48,050 Speaker 2: So are these reindeer been consuming these things because they 62 00:03:48,070 --> 00:03:50,309 Speaker 2: just like getting lit or is it helping them out 63 00:03:50,370 --> 00:03:52,310 Speaker 2: in some aspect of their existence? 64 00:03:52,390 --> 00:03:54,190 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's like stress reduction. You're like, I got a 65 00:03:54,210 --> 00:03:55,530 Speaker 4: lot of grizzly bears. I'm going to need to like 66 00:03:55,570 --> 00:03:56,870 Speaker 4: take a little edge off. Right. 67 00:03:58,730 --> 00:04:01,210 Speaker 1: It's been a hard day on the tundra, you know. 68 00:04:01,230 --> 00:04:04,940 Speaker 2: There's this fat, red-suited man that keeps coming around trying 69 00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:05,600 Speaker 2: to recruit me. 70 00:04:06,040 --> 00:04:12,060 Speaker 1: What is with that guy? It is interesting because it's 71 00:04:12,140 --> 00:04:18,250 Speaker 1: not especially filling as a foodstuff. It doesn't contain some 72 00:04:18,550 --> 00:04:23,570 Speaker 1: rare nutrients, right? It doesn't produce some sort of miracle 73 00:04:23,710 --> 00:04:28,369 Speaker 1: smell that'll dissuade your predators. But it does, to your point, Zarin. 74 00:04:28,760 --> 00:04:35,420 Speaker 1: Hey kids, those reindeer super waxed. Yeah, it absolutely rocks 75 00:04:35,480 --> 00:04:40,310 Speaker 1: them so much so that they don't just regularly seek 76 00:04:40,370 --> 00:04:44,300 Speaker 1: it out. They teach their young how to find it, 77 00:04:44,390 --> 00:04:47,070 Speaker 1: to dig through snow. And as we all know, teaching 78 00:04:47,130 --> 00:04:52,530 Speaker 1: other generations, huge mark of intelligence, right? They kind of 79 00:04:52,550 --> 00:04:55,820 Speaker 1: like pigs and truffles. They will, just go across. 80 00:04:56,360 --> 00:04:56,720 Speaker 4: Yeah. 81 00:04:56,820 --> 00:05:01,549 Speaker 1: Go across vast swaths of land. And basically once they 82 00:05:01,610 --> 00:05:07,010 Speaker 1: ingest them, these fungi, the reindeer are as wild as 83 00:05:07,150 --> 00:05:10,950 Speaker 1: a tourist. If their first day in new Orleans is 84 00:05:11,010 --> 00:05:11,450 Speaker 1: Mardi Gras. 85 00:05:11,770 --> 00:05:12,390 Speaker 3: Oh, hell yeah. 86 00:05:12,500 --> 00:05:17,680 Speaker 2: Hand grenades, baby hurricanes and hand grenades. Ben, this was 87 00:05:17,740 --> 00:05:20,120 Speaker 2: ringing a bell for me. And I mentioned when you 88 00:05:20,140 --> 00:05:22,060 Speaker 2: brought this up, like, what do you scrape the antlers 89 00:05:22,080 --> 00:05:23,520 Speaker 2: or whatever? And that's because I've been on a bit 90 00:05:23,540 --> 00:05:26,589 Speaker 2: of a, nerdy fitness kick lately and so like the 91 00:05:26,630 --> 00:05:29,540 Speaker 2: internet keeps feeding me ads for all these like supplements 92 00:05:29,620 --> 00:05:34,940 Speaker 2: and things and reindeer organ meat and ground up reindeer 93 00:05:35,100 --> 00:05:38,980 Speaker 2: guts and hearts and liver as well as antler velvet 94 00:05:39,500 --> 00:05:42,580 Speaker 2: are a very in vogue. 95 00:05:41,860 --> 00:05:46,050 Speaker 1: Antler velvet yeah like the little in vogue supplement right now. 96 00:05:46,970 --> 00:05:48,620 Speaker 4: I see people go out there and try to collect it. 97 00:05:48,750 --> 00:05:51,230 Speaker 4: I always assumed it was for some reason, because I 98 00:05:51,350 --> 00:05:54,390 Speaker 4: know people actually go out and collect the racks of antlers. 99 00:05:54,430 --> 00:05:56,750 Speaker 4: But now I see people big on going out to 100 00:05:56,790 --> 00:05:59,900 Speaker 4: collect the velvet. And this now makes perfect sense. It's 101 00:05:59,940 --> 00:06:01,760 Speaker 4: for supplements. I bet they're getting a pretty penny. 102 00:06:02,170 --> 00:06:06,349 Speaker 3: Apparently super vitamin rich in A and B12. So it's 103 00:06:06,390 --> 00:06:07,070 Speaker 3: good for immunity. 104 00:06:07,510 --> 00:06:10,610 Speaker 2: Claims, of course, guys, we know that supplements can be 105 00:06:10,810 --> 00:06:13,970 Speaker 2: pretty sus in terms of like what the claims are 106 00:06:14,010 --> 00:06:14,370 Speaker 2: versus what. 107 00:06:14,290 --> 00:06:14,810 Speaker 3: They actually do. 108 00:06:14,830 --> 00:06:16,450 Speaker 1: Do you remember when the FDA was a thing? 109 00:06:16,670 --> 00:06:17,710 Speaker 4: Yes, I do. 110 00:06:18,010 --> 00:06:19,589 Speaker 3: Yeah, I feel like they disbanded it. 111 00:06:21,790 --> 00:06:26,469 Speaker 2: Claims of energy and vitality and even increasing testosterone. 112 00:06:26,610 --> 00:06:27,510 Speaker 4: Oh, I'm sure. 113 00:06:27,670 --> 00:06:29,750 Speaker 2: You know, and things like that. So you'll see these ads. 114 00:06:29,770 --> 00:06:33,659 Speaker 2: They'll be called like carnivore bars. Bills or some crazy 115 00:06:33,700 --> 00:06:38,719 Speaker 2: thing like that. The FDA, what's left of it, does 116 00:06:38,800 --> 00:06:41,800 Speaker 2: lack any robust evaluation of these things in terms of 117 00:06:41,839 --> 00:06:44,760 Speaker 2: like what they actually might do. Another claim is that 118 00:06:44,800 --> 00:06:48,969 Speaker 2: they can cause increased joint health. Um, something that's referred 119 00:06:48,990 --> 00:06:52,060 Speaker 2: to in the claims as general vitality, which seems. 120 00:06:51,940 --> 00:06:55,500 Speaker 3: Real vague and, uh, reduced inflammation, but yeah. 121 00:06:55,520 --> 00:06:59,600 Speaker 1: Well, Hey, it's not Lieutenant vitality. It's general vitality. 122 00:06:59,740 --> 00:07:03,220 Speaker 5: It also seems like vitality and reduced inflation should not 123 00:07:03,279 --> 00:07:05,400 Speaker 5: be in the same conversation with each other. 124 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:05,870 Speaker 4: Yeah. 125 00:07:06,000 --> 00:07:07,730 Speaker 3: Oh, that's a good point. 126 00:07:08,089 --> 00:07:11,510 Speaker 1: Yeah. Uh, Jared, at this point we have to, we 127 00:07:11,550 --> 00:07:14,230 Speaker 1: have to pause real quick, uh, not to put you 128 00:07:14,310 --> 00:07:19,260 Speaker 1: on the spot, but, uh, Are you morally opposed to 129 00:07:19,420 --> 00:07:21,020 Speaker 1: hallucinogenic substances? 130 00:07:21,420 --> 00:07:24,200 Speaker 4: No, not at all. In fact, I've been, we'll call 131 00:07:24,220 --> 00:07:27,640 Speaker 4: it a traveler in those spaces many, many times. I 132 00:07:27,660 --> 00:07:29,900 Speaker 4: don't really mess around with mushrooms anymore because it just 133 00:07:29,940 --> 00:07:32,670 Speaker 4: kept making my stomach sicker and sicker as I was 134 00:07:32,700 --> 00:07:34,870 Speaker 4: doing them to the point that like the first two 135 00:07:34,950 --> 00:07:37,190 Speaker 4: hours would just be brutal. And then I'd have like, 136 00:07:37,230 --> 00:07:38,989 Speaker 4: you know, a number of hours where it was very enjoyable. 137 00:07:39,010 --> 00:07:40,790 Speaker 4: And then it got to three hours. Then it was 138 00:07:40,810 --> 00:07:42,250 Speaker 4: like four. I was like, okay, now I'm getting like 139 00:07:42,290 --> 00:07:46,040 Speaker 4: only a couple hours of actual enjoyment. So I would 140 00:07:46,100 --> 00:07:48,640 Speaker 4: now at this point pretty much mess around with LSD 141 00:07:48,860 --> 00:07:52,940 Speaker 4: more than mushrooms. I've never had an ayahuasca trip. I've 142 00:07:52,960 --> 00:07:56,010 Speaker 4: always kind of been curious about that. DMT I've messed 143 00:07:56,050 --> 00:08:00,090 Speaker 4: around with. I've basically tried, I'd say, most of the 144 00:08:00,210 --> 00:08:03,370 Speaker 4: common hallucinogens. But at this point, I'm pretty much down 145 00:08:03,410 --> 00:08:04,170 Speaker 4: to just LSD 25. Yeah. 146 00:08:05,370 --> 00:08:07,110 Speaker 2: And a big thing that people are doing these days, 147 00:08:07,150 --> 00:08:09,610 Speaker 2: which I recently tried for the first time, is microdosing 148 00:08:09,670 --> 00:08:11,770 Speaker 2: on LSD where you can– like I always thought it 149 00:08:11,790 --> 00:08:13,700 Speaker 2: was sort of an all-or-nothing thing. But it turns out 150 00:08:14,020 --> 00:08:15,900 Speaker 2: that it is pretty popular to just take a. 151 00:08:16,280 --> 00:08:16,620 Speaker 4: Oh, yeah. 152 00:08:16,640 --> 00:08:17,580 Speaker 3: Like a tiny little snippet. 153 00:08:17,600 --> 00:08:18,600 Speaker 4: A little dot basically, yeah. 154 00:08:18,620 --> 00:08:23,710 Speaker 2: A little– exactly. And there are, as we know– very 155 00:08:24,010 --> 00:08:29,860 Speaker 2: reasonably well-studied, it would seem, mental health benefits from supervised 156 00:08:30,100 --> 00:08:31,280 Speaker 2: use of hallucinogens. 157 00:08:31,340 --> 00:08:34,500 Speaker 4: Cary Grant was a huge fan of LSD and talked 158 00:08:34,960 --> 00:08:38,550 Speaker 4: prolifically about it, even in Good Housekeeping magazine in the 1950s. 159 00:08:38,580 --> 00:08:40,780 Speaker 3: We talked about that. That's right. 160 00:08:40,800 --> 00:08:43,130 Speaker 2: We genuinely– I didn't know that until we– I believe 161 00:08:43,150 --> 00:08:44,829 Speaker 2: it was on an episode a handful of years ago. 162 00:08:44,870 --> 00:08:48,710 Speaker 2: But the Cary Grant good housekeeping interview about the benefits 163 00:08:48,730 --> 00:08:50,949 Speaker 2: of tripping is a thing to behold. 164 00:08:50,970 --> 00:08:53,170 Speaker 4: Cary Grant. In the 1950s. He was way before the 165 00:08:53,210 --> 00:08:54,849 Speaker 4: hippies too. People were like, oh. 166 00:08:54,850 --> 00:08:57,050 Speaker 3: He was a real booster. He was a real– Huge fan. 167 00:08:58,150 --> 00:09:00,500 Speaker 1: He's probably also a fan of reindeer. 168 00:09:00,559 --> 00:09:02,900 Speaker 2: And I think that's, that's a good point too, Zarin, because, 169 00:09:03,040 --> 00:09:05,819 Speaker 2: you know, you're talking about these reindeers, like, why would 170 00:09:05,840 --> 00:09:06,520 Speaker 2: they eat this? 171 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:09,930 Speaker 3: Like, it's not particularly helpful. It doesn't particularly fill them up. 172 00:09:10,809 --> 00:09:13,989 Speaker 2: And maybe it isn't just about getting high. And it 173 00:09:14,050 --> 00:09:17,150 Speaker 2: did impart some kind of, whether it be visual or 174 00:09:17,250 --> 00:09:20,890 Speaker 2: auditory acuity or just some, Something that caused them some 175 00:09:20,950 --> 00:09:24,430 Speaker 2: level of relief or calm against them grizzly bears you 176 00:09:24,450 --> 00:09:24,970 Speaker 2: were talking about. 177 00:09:25,010 --> 00:09:27,110 Speaker 4: Yeah, totally. Maybe you make some better parents. You know, 178 00:09:27,130 --> 00:09:28,650 Speaker 4: they're like, I'm going to pay more attention to my kids. 179 00:09:28,890 --> 00:09:30,670 Speaker 4: They suddenly got more interesting. I don't know. 180 00:09:31,370 --> 00:09:37,000 Speaker 1: They're like, reindeer dad is way cooler now. And we also, 181 00:09:37,380 --> 00:09:40,980 Speaker 1: we are mentioning this not just because of the caribou 182 00:09:41,000 --> 00:09:45,780 Speaker 1: or the reindeer. It's because humans... have rocked Fly Agaric 183 00:09:46,020 --> 00:09:50,600 Speaker 1: as well. They look like the mushrooms from the Mario franchise, right? 184 00:09:50,600 --> 00:09:53,050 Speaker 1: You got a red cap, little white dots. 185 00:09:53,050 --> 00:09:54,100 Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah. 186 00:09:54,100 --> 00:09:58,319 Speaker 1: A little big up. Uh, we know that indigenous cultures 187 00:09:58,620 --> 00:10:03,200 Speaker 1: in Siberia have a deep historical usage of fly agaric 188 00:10:03,420 --> 00:10:06,179 Speaker 1: in one way or another. And it's usually not going 189 00:10:06,210 --> 00:10:10,050 Speaker 1: to be super recreational, like chewing betel. 190 00:10:09,710 --> 00:10:13,110 Speaker 4: Nut or something. It's, it's, it's more ritualistic. 191 00:10:13,730 --> 00:10:14,470 Speaker 1: Ritualistic. 192 00:10:14,610 --> 00:10:15,070 Speaker 3: Yes, sir. 193 00:10:15,170 --> 00:10:20,220 Speaker 1: Just the perfect word. Uh, We found some interesting speculation, 194 00:10:20,260 --> 00:10:25,600 Speaker 1: you guys, that delivering on our earlier references about Rudolph, 195 00:10:26,059 --> 00:10:31,750 Speaker 1: the consumption of fly agaric in northern or Scandinavian parts 196 00:10:31,770 --> 00:10:34,949 Speaker 1: of the world. It may be part of the reason 197 00:10:35,429 --> 00:10:38,370 Speaker 1: why we have all these stories about some wild guy 198 00:10:38,410 --> 00:10:41,830 Speaker 1: named Santa Claus. who hangs out with reindeer, who can 199 00:10:42,010 --> 00:10:43,470 Speaker 1: inexplicably fly. 200 00:10:43,490 --> 00:10:45,190 Speaker 4: Dude! 201 00:10:45,270 --> 00:10:49,930 Speaker 2: It's like a lot of the poultices that supposed witches 202 00:10:50,010 --> 00:10:50,450 Speaker 2: would make. 203 00:10:50,950 --> 00:10:52,220 Speaker 3: They're flying ointments. 204 00:10:52,340 --> 00:10:56,939 Speaker 2: They're really just psychedelic substances that would cause them to 205 00:10:57,020 --> 00:10:57,900 Speaker 2: think they were flying. 206 00:10:57,920 --> 00:11:00,140 Speaker 4: It would get you off and you're like, okay, all 207 00:11:00,160 --> 00:11:01,420 Speaker 4: of a sudden I'm up in the clouds. You're like, 208 00:11:01,460 --> 00:11:03,480 Speaker 4: not really. You're still weird with it. No, man, I'm 209 00:11:03,559 --> 00:11:04,420 Speaker 4: up in the clouds. 210 00:11:06,010 --> 00:11:08,750 Speaker 1: I'm up in the clouds. Who wants a gift? And 211 00:11:08,790 --> 00:11:10,310 Speaker 1: that saves the night, right? 212 00:11:10,350 --> 00:11:10,650 Speaker 4: Yes, exactly. 213 00:11:12,330 --> 00:11:18,040 Speaker 1: So we know that these substances, the active substances in 214 00:11:18,059 --> 00:11:23,950 Speaker 1: fly agaric are stuff like ibotenic acid, musimol, which to 215 00:11:23,990 --> 00:11:29,429 Speaker 1: me sounds like a made-up pharmaceutical brand, musimol. Feels like 216 00:11:29,490 --> 00:11:31,449 Speaker 1: it's got a lot of fine print at the end 217 00:11:31,490 --> 00:11:32,130 Speaker 1: of a commercial. 218 00:11:32,270 --> 00:11:34,030 Speaker 2: I was in a hotel for the first time in 219 00:11:34,090 --> 00:11:36,449 Speaker 2: a while, a couple of days ago, and I just 220 00:11:36,470 --> 00:11:38,910 Speaker 2: had the TV on mute. And, you know, you only 221 00:11:38,950 --> 00:11:43,209 Speaker 2: see them on TV, these pharmaceutical advertisements with like the idyllic, 222 00:11:43,230 --> 00:11:44,790 Speaker 2: you know, frolicking families or whatever. 223 00:11:44,809 --> 00:11:45,880 Speaker 4: Just jump in vaguely. 224 00:11:46,010 --> 00:11:49,520 Speaker 2: The names of them, man. This one was like Baltimorea 225 00:11:49,540 --> 00:11:53,240 Speaker 2: or something. I mean, it was just, they're just absolutely 226 00:11:53,280 --> 00:11:53,610 Speaker 2: made up. 227 00:11:55,000 --> 00:11:55,420 Speaker 3: Of course. 228 00:11:55,559 --> 00:12:00,210 Speaker 1: It's like choosing a car name, you know. we also 229 00:12:00,260 --> 00:12:02,550 Speaker 1: have a future episode. You got to hang out with 230 00:12:02,610 --> 00:12:06,690 Speaker 1: us on Zarin where we figure out a very small 231 00:12:06,790 --> 00:12:10,370 Speaker 1: group of people who make pharmaceutical names in the West. 232 00:12:10,770 --> 00:12:11,630 Speaker 3: Oh, okay. 233 00:12:11,830 --> 00:12:13,959 Speaker 2: It's got to be some sort of a committee, you know, 234 00:12:13,980 --> 00:12:16,060 Speaker 2: they got to, if they focus group, it's right. 235 00:12:16,140 --> 00:12:18,380 Speaker 3: It has to be very similar to any other kind 236 00:12:18,400 --> 00:12:19,300 Speaker 3: of branding, right? 237 00:12:19,700 --> 00:12:23,500 Speaker 1: It's so small. I'm sure it's like three etymology nerds 238 00:12:23,559 --> 00:12:30,060 Speaker 1: going proteo via. Right. You know, that sounds like several words. 239 00:12:30,460 --> 00:12:31,720 Speaker 4: Vi-an-stra. 240 00:12:32,620 --> 00:12:37,179 Speaker 1: Vi-an-stra, you know, because it's via the anstra. 241 00:12:37,380 --> 00:12:37,800 Speaker 4: Hulu. 242 00:12:38,309 --> 00:12:39,309 Speaker 3: Wait, that's different. 243 00:12:39,550 --> 00:12:47,930 Speaker 1: No, I was close. I thought you were good. We 244 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:52,849 Speaker 1: know you should not consume fly agaric, right? because it 245 00:12:52,890 --> 00:12:56,890 Speaker 1: can lead to nausea, vomiting, muscle twitches at the far end. 246 00:12:57,330 --> 00:13:00,030 Speaker 1: It can give your reindeer seizures or comas. 247 00:13:01,429 --> 00:13:04,340 Speaker 4: I don't want my reindeers dropping with the comas, no. No. 248 00:13:04,620 --> 00:13:05,480 Speaker 1: You've always said that. 249 00:13:05,580 --> 00:13:07,060 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's one of my stances. 250 00:13:07,440 --> 00:13:11,360 Speaker 3: But, you know, these reindeers, they're experienced. They know what 251 00:13:11,660 --> 00:13:13,320 Speaker 3: they're doing. They know what they're doing. 252 00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:18,439 Speaker 1: Zara Burnett says, Hummus, okay on a cheese sandwich. Also, 253 00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:19,860 Speaker 1: I want my reindeer. 254 00:13:20,260 --> 00:13:20,940 Speaker 4: Coma free. 255 00:13:21,590 --> 00:13:22,370 Speaker 3: Coma free. 256 00:13:22,800 --> 00:13:24,300 Speaker 4: I still got the bumper stickers to move if you 257 00:13:24,330 --> 00:13:25,050 Speaker 4: guys are interested. 258 00:13:25,610 --> 00:13:25,930 Speaker 2: Always. 259 00:13:26,050 --> 00:13:26,890 Speaker 4: Spread the word. 260 00:13:27,250 --> 00:13:28,250 Speaker 1: Can we get a price break? 261 00:13:28,730 --> 00:13:30,950 Speaker 2: I'm a guy that collects bumper stickers and never puts 262 00:13:30,970 --> 00:13:31,630 Speaker 2: them on anything. 263 00:13:32,070 --> 00:13:32,590 Speaker 3: Oh, nice. 264 00:13:34,370 --> 00:13:38,310 Speaker 5: So what I'm hearing is it's Zarin's Coma-Free Reindeer Supplement. 265 00:13:38,330 --> 00:13:40,589 Speaker 4: That's the brand. There we go. 266 00:13:40,750 --> 00:13:43,670 Speaker 2: Slap that on the side of a wagon and let's 267 00:13:43,710 --> 00:13:44,390 Speaker 2: go to town. 268 00:13:44,670 --> 00:13:46,670 Speaker 3: Let's go through Winslow's Soothing Syrup. 269 00:13:47,210 --> 00:13:50,890 Speaker 1: Yeah, we need this. Max, you got to introduce us 270 00:13:50,950 --> 00:13:55,460 Speaker 1: to this next one, man. As Noel was teasing, this 271 00:13:55,540 --> 00:14:02,000 Speaker 1: is a perfect medicine show comparison to Mrs. Winslow's Soothing Syrup. 272 00:14:02,610 --> 00:14:05,170 Speaker 5: Yeah, I was doing a little researching on this. And, 273 00:14:05,210 --> 00:14:07,949 Speaker 5: you know, we have an episode about snake oil in 274 00:14:07,970 --> 00:14:09,970 Speaker 5: the past, which is pretty funny because we're going from 275 00:14:10,030 --> 00:14:12,850 Speaker 5: reindeer supplements to, which, you know, could be argued as 276 00:14:13,010 --> 00:14:14,340 Speaker 5: modern day snake oil. 277 00:14:14,380 --> 00:14:16,740 Speaker 1: Well, you got to oil your snakes, man. Nobody wants 278 00:14:16,750 --> 00:14:17,030 Speaker 1: dry snakes. 279 00:14:17,050 --> 00:14:18,520 Speaker 4: You don't want a squeaky snake. 280 00:14:19,060 --> 00:14:20,300 Speaker 3: You don't want a squeaky snake. You'll hear it coming 281 00:14:20,340 --> 00:14:21,860 Speaker 3: a mile. Yeah, exactly. 282 00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:22,520 Speaker 4: Exactly. 283 00:14:22,860 --> 00:14:24,940 Speaker 5: And Ben, if I remember correctly, what we found out 284 00:14:24,960 --> 00:14:26,619 Speaker 5: in our snake oil episode was like, you know, in 285 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:29,480 Speaker 5: East Asia, they would harvest water snakes. 286 00:14:29,240 --> 00:14:32,160 Speaker 4: For the fatty oils, correct? Correct. But. 287 00:14:32,760 --> 00:14:35,800 Speaker 5: Then they try to do that with rattlesnakes in America 288 00:14:35,860 --> 00:14:41,990 Speaker 5: who are quite slender and don't have fatty oils. But so, yeah, 289 00:14:42,030 --> 00:14:44,790 Speaker 5: I mean, I think this era of just is we've 290 00:14:44,830 --> 00:14:46,310 Speaker 5: spent a lot of time in ridiculous history talking about 291 00:14:46,330 --> 00:14:48,880 Speaker 5: this oddly with like ice cream as well. This early 292 00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:52,910 Speaker 5: pharmaceutical Coca-Cola rising up era. And that's where I want 293 00:14:52,930 --> 00:14:55,510 Speaker 5: to introduce us to the idea of this thing called Mrs. 294 00:14:55,590 --> 00:15:00,380 Speaker 5: Winslow's Soothing Syrup, which unlike snake oil, actually had things 295 00:15:00,480 --> 00:15:00,670 Speaker 5: in it. 296 00:15:01,170 --> 00:15:03,700 Speaker 3: Which is kind of the problem. Maybe a few too 297 00:15:03,720 --> 00:15:04,160 Speaker 3: many things. 298 00:15:04,380 --> 00:15:06,420 Speaker 4: Yeah, a lot of stuff. 299 00:15:06,540 --> 00:15:08,800 Speaker 2: Like are you- Like Vitamita Vegemin. Remember that I Love 300 00:15:08,820 --> 00:15:11,660 Speaker 2: Lucy episode? Where she just keeps drinking it and just 301 00:15:11,680 --> 00:15:12,940 Speaker 2: getting absolutely plastered? 302 00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:13,240 Speaker 4: Yes. 303 00:15:13,360 --> 00:15:14,480 Speaker 1: One of my favorites. 304 00:15:14,520 --> 00:15:16,530 Speaker 5: Shared agreements between those two things. 305 00:15:16,670 --> 00:15:20,590 Speaker 1: Now, before we continue, I've got to say Zerod, I 306 00:15:20,690 --> 00:15:25,550 Speaker 1: am so impressed and so unsurprised that you instantly knew 307 00:15:25,590 --> 00:15:27,130 Speaker 1: the etymology of snake oil. 308 00:15:27,590 --> 00:15:30,040 Speaker 4: Oh, yeah, definitely. I mean, like, it's one of those things, like, 309 00:15:30,200 --> 00:15:32,220 Speaker 4: you hear it and, you know, I don't know at 310 00:15:32,500 --> 00:15:33,820 Speaker 4: what age, I think it was 12 or 13, you 311 00:15:33,840 --> 00:15:35,619 Speaker 4: get curious, like, where does this come from? Why do 312 00:15:35,640 --> 00:15:37,440 Speaker 4: we eat snake oil? And then I looked it up 313 00:15:37,480 --> 00:15:39,940 Speaker 4: and I was like, oh, that's fascinating. And then, you know, 314 00:15:40,020 --> 00:15:42,200 Speaker 4: in more recent times, we've kind of referenced it on 315 00:15:42,240 --> 00:15:44,870 Speaker 4: Ridiculous Crime a couple of times and then had to, like, 316 00:15:45,120 --> 00:15:47,350 Speaker 4: break down the derivation of where this comes from and 317 00:15:47,390 --> 00:15:48,970 Speaker 4: why it's called that and why it was bunk. 318 00:15:49,470 --> 00:15:51,370 Speaker 2: Well, and to your point, Max, I mean, we really 319 00:15:51,550 --> 00:15:55,080 Speaker 2: are living in kind of a new era of snake oil. 100%. 320 00:15:55,080 --> 00:15:57,200 Speaker 2: With a lot of the way things are advertised and 321 00:15:57,300 --> 00:16:00,090 Speaker 2: things can get around a lot of these FDA approval 322 00:16:00,120 --> 00:16:03,230 Speaker 2: guidelines by just being, quote, unquote, not for human consumption. 323 00:16:03,270 --> 00:16:06,630 Speaker 4: Yeah, exactly. And we also get the whole, like, medicine 324 00:16:06,650 --> 00:16:08,710 Speaker 4: show level with the supplements, but we're just doing it 325 00:16:08,750 --> 00:16:09,430 Speaker 4: on our phones now. 326 00:16:09,450 --> 00:16:09,870 Speaker 3: On TV. 327 00:16:10,230 --> 00:16:12,650 Speaker 2: Or, yeah, like it used to be on, like, you know, 328 00:16:12,950 --> 00:16:14,910 Speaker 2: cable access kind of stuff or, like, a lot of 329 00:16:14,930 --> 00:16:21,100 Speaker 2: these religious folks selling buckets of slop and bone broth. 330 00:16:21,720 --> 00:16:24,760 Speaker 1: Also, the AI bubble is another bit of snake oil. 331 00:16:24,980 --> 00:16:25,680 Speaker 3: No question about it. 332 00:16:25,740 --> 00:16:30,300 Speaker 1: I'll just say it. So, folks, we're an audio podcast, 333 00:16:30,340 --> 00:16:33,100 Speaker 1: so please know in your hearts that all four of 334 00:16:33,220 --> 00:16:37,350 Speaker 1: us shrugged and unanimously agreed with that last statement. 335 00:16:37,690 --> 00:16:40,740 Speaker 2: No question, no question. So what are we talking about? 336 00:16:40,750 --> 00:16:43,920 Speaker 2: What was all the stuff that was in this soothing 337 00:16:44,040 --> 00:16:47,680 Speaker 2: syrup that apparently was being fed to infants quite frequently? 338 00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:53,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, since 1849, right? We've got, you know how, we'll 339 00:16:53,700 --> 00:16:55,859 Speaker 1: do a fake commercial. You know how it is. It's 1849, 340 00:16:55,840 --> 00:17:01,350 Speaker 1: stuff is crazy. And your kids keep talking. We're dying. 341 00:17:02,470 --> 00:17:05,340 Speaker 1: So how do we... How do we shut them up? 342 00:17:05,780 --> 00:17:08,580 Speaker 1: How do we shut up those children? Well, according to 343 00:17:08,640 --> 00:17:13,780 Speaker 1: Karen Berger, writing over at Pharmacy Times, Charlotte N. Winslow, 344 00:17:13,800 --> 00:17:21,500 Speaker 1: a pediatric nurse, created Mrs. Winslow's soothing syrup to... to 345 00:17:21,580 --> 00:17:22,739 Speaker 1: shut up children. 346 00:17:24,200 --> 00:17:27,820 Speaker 3: So, you know, soothe fussy babies. Of course. 347 00:17:28,140 --> 00:17:29,659 Speaker 1: Oh, sure. Yeah. 348 00:17:29,760 --> 00:17:31,340 Speaker 3: If we're putting on our marketing hats. 349 00:17:31,920 --> 00:17:32,899 Speaker 1: Right. Right. 350 00:17:32,940 --> 00:17:36,930 Speaker 4: Does your baby cry too much? Try soothing. Wow. 351 00:17:37,590 --> 00:17:38,369 Speaker 3: Yeah. 352 00:17:38,510 --> 00:17:45,909 Speaker 1: We'd like to pivot to non-verbal children. So, apparently the 353 00:17:45,950 --> 00:17:48,610 Speaker 1: syrup is created in, Max, you can tell us more 354 00:17:48,650 --> 00:17:50,510 Speaker 1: about this, by her son-in-law. 355 00:17:51,160 --> 00:17:55,220 Speaker 5: Yeah, so as you mentioned, Charlotte Ann Winslow created the formula, 356 00:17:55,500 --> 00:17:58,790 Speaker 5: and she was a nurse, but it was actually her son-in-law, 357 00:17:58,810 --> 00:18:01,750 Speaker 5: this guy by the name of Jeremiah Curtis, who started 358 00:18:01,770 --> 00:18:04,949 Speaker 5: production of the whole thing back in 1849, along with 359 00:18:05,010 --> 00:18:08,689 Speaker 5: a partner by the name of Benjamin Perkins. In this 360 00:18:08,750 --> 00:18:10,430 Speaker 5: place called Bangor, Maine? 361 00:18:10,670 --> 00:18:12,780 Speaker 3: Bangor, Maine? Something like that? 362 00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:13,500 Speaker 1: Bangor. 363 00:18:13,520 --> 00:18:14,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, Bangor, Maine. 364 00:18:14,100 --> 00:18:14,340 Speaker 1: Bangor, Maine. 365 00:18:14,359 --> 00:18:17,700 Speaker 2: That's for Stephen King. That's Stephen King country. And you 366 00:18:17,720 --> 00:18:19,909 Speaker 2: know what the ultimate sign of good snake oil is? 367 00:18:19,920 --> 00:18:20,780 Speaker 2: It's the thing that says. 368 00:18:20,660 --> 00:18:25,030 Speaker 3: It'll do everything. It'll do like 10 different things. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 369 00:18:25,170 --> 00:18:27,890 Speaker 1: Well, that's a great question, Noel, because now we have 370 00:18:27,910 --> 00:18:32,030 Speaker 1: to ask ourselves, what does this patent medicine do? 371 00:18:32,600 --> 00:18:32,879 Speaker 3: Do? 372 00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:34,120 Speaker 1: Does it do everything? 373 00:18:34,220 --> 00:18:37,359 Speaker 2: It claims it will calm small children, clean their teeth, 374 00:18:37,420 --> 00:18:40,750 Speaker 2: freshen their breath, and also relieve constipation while you're at it. Yes. 375 00:18:41,170 --> 00:18:46,710 Speaker 3: Four benefits in one. Not one, not two, not three, 376 00:18:47,060 --> 00:18:47,680 Speaker 3: but four. 377 00:18:48,060 --> 00:18:52,960 Speaker 1: Four. Well, that also feels more legitimate because it's not 378 00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:55,700 Speaker 1: saying it's a panacea, right? It's not saying. 379 00:18:55,540 --> 00:18:56,100 Speaker 3: It'll cure everything. 380 00:18:56,119 --> 00:18:56,359 Speaker 5: That's true. 381 00:18:56,380 --> 00:19:00,740 Speaker 3: Not a cure-all, not an ultimate fountain of youth type thing. 382 00:19:00,780 --> 00:19:02,580 Speaker 4: But it will take care of both ends of your baby. 383 00:19:02,600 --> 00:19:06,250 Speaker 4: That's also true. Snout to tail. 384 00:19:07,630 --> 00:19:09,889 Speaker 1: If your kid's too hairy, you got to find a 385 00:19:09,950 --> 00:19:14,909 Speaker 1: different syrup. But for these four problems, we've got it. 386 00:19:15,030 --> 00:19:19,750 Speaker 1: And they're very successful because... all of their marketing shows 387 00:19:19,790 --> 00:19:30,300 Speaker 1: these very, uh, happy, giddy, non, uh, constipated, non-fussy babies. 388 00:19:31,100 --> 00:19:33,000 Speaker 2: Uh, the story of snake oil is also a story 389 00:19:33,020 --> 00:19:35,659 Speaker 2: of marketing because to your point, Ben, like all, a 390 00:19:35,700 --> 00:19:37,920 Speaker 2: lot of these things were, especially the ones that actually 391 00:19:37,940 --> 00:19:39,320 Speaker 2: had no active ingredients. 392 00:19:39,680 --> 00:19:42,010 Speaker 3: Um, they were just selling a story, which is marketing. 393 00:19:42,240 --> 00:19:42,440 Speaker 4: Yeah. 394 00:19:42,640 --> 00:19:42,920 Speaker 1: Yeah. 395 00:19:42,940 --> 00:19:45,429 Speaker 4: They're basically selling like the, uh, the what do you 396 00:19:45,450 --> 00:19:47,030 Speaker 4: call it the oh my god it just ran out 397 00:19:47,050 --> 00:19:48,750 Speaker 4: of my head what's the the effect when you take 398 00:19:48,790 --> 00:19:51,330 Speaker 4: a drug and you thank you the placebo effect so 399 00:19:51,350 --> 00:19:53,379 Speaker 4: basically it's just they're selling the placebo effect like this 400 00:19:53,430 --> 00:19:55,580 Speaker 4: is going to work because you believe it's going to work. 401 00:19:55,619 --> 00:19:58,080 Speaker 3: And guys placebo is hell of a drug is. 402 00:19:58,040 --> 00:20:01,680 Speaker 2: It yeah absolutely the psychological effects of belief exactly incredibly 403 00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:04,879 Speaker 2: strong we've we've seen studies in that as well and 404 00:20:04,900 --> 00:20:05,740 Speaker 2: i we've. 405 00:20:05,580 --> 00:20:08,629 Speaker 1: Got to tell you folks here Now that we're being 406 00:20:08,930 --> 00:20:13,950 Speaker 1: very fair, hopefully, with the historical context, this is not 407 00:20:14,020 --> 00:20:15,659 Speaker 1: a placebo. This is a. 408 00:20:17,280 --> 00:20:18,000 Speaker 4: Banger, man. 409 00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:21,639 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah. The soothing syrup is super active in a 410 00:20:21,720 --> 00:20:27,280 Speaker 1: problematic way. We're talking 65 milligrams of morphine. 411 00:20:27,380 --> 00:20:28,080 Speaker 4: Holy crap. 412 00:20:29,609 --> 00:20:31,670 Speaker 1: Or morphine. I don't know, guys. 413 00:20:31,690 --> 00:20:32,090 Speaker 4: I'm not cool enough. 414 00:20:32,130 --> 00:20:33,629 Speaker 3: That's how you say it in the South. That's how 415 00:20:33,670 --> 00:20:35,300 Speaker 3: we say it. Morphine. Morphine. 416 00:20:36,800 --> 00:20:40,400 Speaker 1: Okay. And then it also had booze in there. 417 00:20:40,420 --> 00:20:40,820 Speaker 4: Of course. 418 00:20:40,840 --> 00:20:42,320 Speaker 1: Alcohol for the children. 419 00:20:42,340 --> 00:20:44,740 Speaker 3: Well, you know what they say. A teaspoon, a spoonful 420 00:20:44,780 --> 00:20:46,580 Speaker 3: of morphine helps the medicine go down. 421 00:20:47,359 --> 00:20:48,119 Speaker 4: Yes. Yes. 422 00:20:48,420 --> 00:20:51,200 Speaker 1: Yep. Yep. I feel like we went to the same 423 00:20:51,240 --> 00:20:51,540 Speaker 1: day here. 424 00:20:51,600 --> 00:20:53,000 Speaker 3: In the most delightful way. 425 00:20:53,040 --> 00:20:54,900 Speaker 2: These babies were high as hell. 426 00:20:55,890 --> 00:21:02,820 Speaker 1: So, so apparently- One teaspoon full of recommended dosage had 427 00:21:03,119 --> 00:21:09,219 Speaker 1: the morphine content equivalent to 20 drops of laudanum. Oh, wow. 428 00:21:09,820 --> 00:21:10,119 Speaker 4: Yeah. 429 00:21:10,520 --> 00:21:13,859 Speaker 1: And they said, look, if your baby is six months 430 00:21:14,140 --> 00:21:19,000 Speaker 1: old or beyond, right, forget that they're not really forming 431 00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:23,449 Speaker 1: personalities yet. Just be cool and make sure that you 432 00:21:23,490 --> 00:21:26,210 Speaker 1: don't give them more than two to three drops of 433 00:21:26,330 --> 00:21:30,020 Speaker 1: laudanum or more. give them a teaspoonful of this. 434 00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:34,590 Speaker 3: I mean, if anyone's seen Deadwood, laudanum is the drug 435 00:21:34,650 --> 00:21:36,869 Speaker 3: that a lot of the, or at least in the 436 00:21:36,910 --> 00:21:39,889 Speaker 3: first season, the kind of the wife of the dude, 437 00:21:39,970 --> 00:21:42,369 Speaker 3: as they call him, who is coming from the big city. 438 00:21:42,450 --> 00:21:43,070 Speaker 3: She's addicted to it. 439 00:21:43,070 --> 00:21:45,710 Speaker 2: Yeah, Alma, right? Yeah, Alma, because she's prescribed it by 440 00:21:45,750 --> 00:21:47,790 Speaker 2: a doctor for her vapors or whatever. 441 00:21:47,869 --> 00:21:50,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, I got the pain spells. 100%. 442 00:21:50,560 --> 00:21:52,520 Speaker 2: But guys, I know we're joking around about this, but 443 00:21:52,560 --> 00:21:56,160 Speaker 2: let's just be real. This is getting infants addicted to opiates. 444 00:21:56,480 --> 00:21:56,800 Speaker 4: Oh, yes. 445 00:21:57,270 --> 00:22:00,409 Speaker 3: This is gnarly stuff. 446 00:22:00,430 --> 00:22:05,909 Speaker 1: And you've looked into the passage of the so-called Wild 447 00:22:06,010 --> 00:22:10,970 Speaker 1: West in your previous work, Zarin. Did you run into– now, 448 00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:14,580 Speaker 1: of course, I know black cowboys, but did you run 449 00:22:14,660 --> 00:22:21,280 Speaker 1: into in your research evidence of how casually or not 450 00:22:21,350 --> 00:22:24,369 Speaker 1: casually these kinds of substances were treated? 451 00:22:24,920 --> 00:22:28,879 Speaker 4: It was pretty casual. Largely, the expense was the issue. 452 00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:32,550 Speaker 4: So to Noel's point, you would find more middle-class and 453 00:22:32,590 --> 00:22:36,169 Speaker 4: upper-class people who have strong laudanum and morphine habits. But 454 00:22:36,230 --> 00:22:38,350 Speaker 4: then by the time you get into the era of 455 00:22:39,869 --> 00:22:43,530 Speaker 4: The Chinese railroad workers and then San Francisco having a 456 00:22:43,560 --> 00:22:47,430 Speaker 4: large Chinatown community, then morphine and opium become very popular 457 00:22:47,650 --> 00:22:50,240 Speaker 4: once it is opium. And then you're now, you've basically 458 00:22:50,280 --> 00:22:52,800 Speaker 4: made like the crack version of cocaine so people can 459 00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:54,659 Speaker 4: go and they can smoke it and get off and 460 00:22:54,700 --> 00:22:57,639 Speaker 4: it's not medically controlled as much. And that's when it 461 00:22:57,680 --> 00:23:00,760 Speaker 4: really just spreads as opium. But as laudanum, it was 462 00:23:00,800 --> 00:23:03,340 Speaker 4: much more likely to be like, you know, the wife 463 00:23:03,380 --> 00:23:05,660 Speaker 4: of the sheriff who's sipping on it when he's not home. 464 00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:06,600 Speaker 3: Mm-hmm. 465 00:23:07,100 --> 00:23:09,020 Speaker 2: And then the opium is when you started seeing it 466 00:23:09,080 --> 00:23:10,899 Speaker 2: hit a little bit more mainstream. 467 00:23:10,960 --> 00:23:11,580 Speaker 4: Exactly. 468 00:23:11,940 --> 00:23:15,420 Speaker 3: Hitting the streets in the form of these kind of taverns. 469 00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:19,310 Speaker 4: Yeah, opium dens. Totally. Oh, geez. 470 00:23:19,350 --> 00:23:23,750 Speaker 1: So we're saying the costs went down and economy of 471 00:23:23,790 --> 00:23:24,510 Speaker 1: scale kicked in? 472 00:23:24,609 --> 00:23:26,850 Speaker 3: And availability went way up. Yeah, for sure. 473 00:23:27,130 --> 00:23:27,770 Speaker 4: Oh, geez. 474 00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:38,980 Speaker 1: We know that the soothing syrup by Mrs. Winslow was 475 00:23:39,440 --> 00:23:44,719 Speaker 1: not problematic in any freaking way. It was super popular 476 00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:49,359 Speaker 1: because a lot of people apparently wanted their kids to 477 00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:54,139 Speaker 1: shut up. Or, guys, I posit to you that more 478 00:23:54,220 --> 00:23:59,390 Speaker 1: than a few thousand people probably bought it to use themselves. 479 00:23:59,530 --> 00:23:59,690 Speaker 2: Yes. 480 00:24:00,530 --> 00:24:03,550 Speaker 1: When you buy a Happy Meal at McDonald's and they're like, 481 00:24:03,590 --> 00:24:03,960 Speaker 1: you're 40. 482 00:24:03,950 --> 00:24:07,100 Speaker 2: Once you caught on, you know, someone actually took a 483 00:24:07,119 --> 00:24:09,000 Speaker 2: little sip of their kid's medicine, like, ooh, I kind 484 00:24:09,060 --> 00:24:09,359 Speaker 2: of like that. 485 00:24:09,380 --> 00:24:09,940 Speaker 4: Wait a minute. 486 00:24:10,160 --> 00:24:12,920 Speaker 3: This is Butterwell's heroin syrup. 487 00:24:13,080 --> 00:24:14,619 Speaker 4: Good for the baby, good for daddy. 488 00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:15,360 Speaker 3: Good for daddy. 489 00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:17,300 Speaker 1: There we go. We know that in an 1868 court summary, 490 00:24:22,230 --> 00:24:28,100 Speaker 1: There were reports that 1.5 million bottles of soothing syrup 491 00:24:28,340 --> 00:24:29,780 Speaker 1: had been sold. 492 00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:32,480 Speaker 3: Surely some babies were killed. 493 00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:33,220 Speaker 1: Per year. 494 00:24:33,560 --> 00:24:37,500 Speaker 3: Surely babies were killed. They had to. I mean, come on. 495 00:24:37,609 --> 00:24:42,670 Speaker 3: This is like the levels you're talking about? The concentration? Yeah, man. 496 00:24:42,730 --> 00:24:45,100 Speaker 2: And you know that if one drop doesn't work, you 497 00:24:45,119 --> 00:24:47,120 Speaker 2: can give them another drop. And then maybe, you know, 498 00:24:47,160 --> 00:24:49,520 Speaker 2: there are some parents that weren't exactly adhering to a 499 00:24:49,580 --> 00:24:51,780 Speaker 2: label that already was not very specific. 500 00:24:51,859 --> 00:24:53,600 Speaker 4: Yeah, or they want to go out that night. They're like, well, 501 00:24:53,619 --> 00:24:56,650 Speaker 4: just double the dosage. Maybe make sure the baby doesn't 502 00:24:56,690 --> 00:24:58,889 Speaker 4: cry throughout the night. You know, it doesn't bother the neighbors. 503 00:24:58,910 --> 00:24:59,639 Speaker 3: It's pretty dark, man. 504 00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:04,189 Speaker 1: Do we want a babysitter? Because we have this bottle. 505 00:25:04,710 --> 00:25:09,810 Speaker 1: We got the syrup. This is super dark, by the way. Like, yes, 506 00:25:10,170 --> 00:25:14,409 Speaker 1: we've nailed it because there are no official statistics on 507 00:25:14,470 --> 00:25:18,610 Speaker 1: the number of children that died due to exposure to 508 00:25:18,630 --> 00:25:23,950 Speaker 1: stuff like this. But we do know roughly, if we're guessing, 509 00:25:24,350 --> 00:25:28,909 Speaker 1: that thousands of children died may have been overdosed with it. 510 00:25:28,890 --> 00:25:31,900 Speaker 2: Oh because it was all self-reporting right right it wouldn't 511 00:25:31,940 --> 00:25:34,060 Speaker 2: have been like an investigation it would have been what 512 00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:36,160 Speaker 2: they might have called a caught death or you know 513 00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:37,580 Speaker 2: oh yeah. 514 00:25:37,420 --> 00:25:39,979 Speaker 5: Yeah that was actually when i was doing the research 515 00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:42,189 Speaker 5: on this part like some that was one of the 516 00:25:42,230 --> 00:25:45,370 Speaker 5: more morbid things was a lot of the deaths they 517 00:25:45,390 --> 00:25:47,850 Speaker 5: their estimates are like a lot of people just didn't 518 00:25:47,930 --> 00:25:50,050 Speaker 5: realize it was the syrup doing especially because it was 519 00:25:50,090 --> 00:25:52,659 Speaker 5: a pan medicine They didn't list what was in it. 520 00:25:52,750 --> 00:25:54,800 Speaker 4: And also, a lot of babies and children were dying 521 00:25:54,840 --> 00:25:57,260 Speaker 4: at this time, so it wasn't unsurprising to lose a child. 522 00:25:57,280 --> 00:25:59,080 Speaker 4: It was like, oh, well, we lost another one, Doc. 523 00:25:59,100 --> 00:26:06,520 Speaker 1: I hate how historically accurate that is. We also know 524 00:26:06,619 --> 00:26:14,480 Speaker 1: that there were definitely multiple cases of people who got addicted, right? 525 00:26:15,220 --> 00:26:21,140 Speaker 1: We know that there are definitely cases of withdrawal cases. Wherein, like, 526 00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:24,220 Speaker 1: isn't that, remind me of this, Noel, not to call 527 00:26:24,240 --> 00:26:27,980 Speaker 1: you out, which drug is the one that can kill 528 00:26:28,020 --> 00:26:29,119 Speaker 1: you with withdrawal? 529 00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:35,700 Speaker 3: That is, well, there are numerous ones, but I mean, actually, weirdly, Xanax, 530 00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:37,700 Speaker 3: what's the word I'm looking for? 531 00:26:38,109 --> 00:26:43,960 Speaker 2: Benzodiazepine withdrawal can be incredibly dangerous and doctors prescribe those for, 532 00:26:44,040 --> 00:26:47,200 Speaker 2: you know, just mild anxiety. I do think they're a 533 00:26:47,220 --> 00:26:49,680 Speaker 2: little more cautious about it nowadays because it is known 534 00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:52,240 Speaker 2: that those withdrawals can be incredibly fatal. 535 00:26:52,859 --> 00:26:54,540 Speaker 3: But that is, I think, what you're thinking of, Ben. 536 00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:56,619 Speaker 4: Totally. Also with alcohol, you have to be careful about 537 00:26:56,660 --> 00:26:59,889 Speaker 4: how you step down. Going cold turkey can kill you 538 00:26:59,910 --> 00:27:00,590 Speaker 4: too with alcohol. 539 00:27:00,830 --> 00:27:04,170 Speaker 3: Especially if you're truly physically dependent. 540 00:27:04,650 --> 00:27:05,970 Speaker 2: I don't mean to make light, but it is kind 541 00:27:05,990 --> 00:27:10,419 Speaker 2: of ironic that this, you know, opiate medicated drinks are 542 00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:13,419 Speaker 2: kind of back in vogue in a way with uh 543 00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:16,250 Speaker 2: really yeah well it's good i mean it's they're they're 544 00:27:16,430 --> 00:27:18,250 Speaker 2: they're kind of in the culture you know and they're 545 00:27:18,290 --> 00:27:21,410 Speaker 2: like in in pop culture like talking about the syrup 546 00:27:21,490 --> 00:27:24,270 Speaker 2: or making taking codeine and mixing it with sprite and 547 00:27:24,310 --> 00:27:24,650 Speaker 2: all that. 548 00:27:24,590 --> 00:27:27,190 Speaker 1: I thought i i thought you meant not for babies 549 00:27:27,369 --> 00:27:31,800 Speaker 1: so much i thought you meant like uh G-O, instead 550 00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:34,810 Speaker 1: of Gatorade Zero, it's a Gatorade with opium? What could 551 00:27:34,830 --> 00:27:35,330 Speaker 1: go wrong? 552 00:27:35,410 --> 00:27:37,770 Speaker 2: No, but there is a subculture of folks that are 553 00:27:37,830 --> 00:27:40,350 Speaker 2: highly addicted to drinking opiates. 554 00:27:40,530 --> 00:27:46,340 Speaker 4: Starting with side tangentially associated ones like the Robitussin and 555 00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:51,960 Speaker 4: using medical, like using drugs that have either, not opium itself, 556 00:27:52,020 --> 00:27:53,520 Speaker 4: but things that are very similar in terms of how 557 00:27:53,540 --> 00:27:57,070 Speaker 4: the effect is, people now, like purple drink is essentially 558 00:27:57,109 --> 00:27:57,990 Speaker 4: very much the same thing. 559 00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:02,660 Speaker 1: Right, and I think we're all somewhat of the same 560 00:28:02,740 --> 00:28:06,880 Speaker 1: generation where we remember the stories you were referencing, Zarin, 561 00:28:07,260 --> 00:28:08,440 Speaker 1: about robo-tripping. 562 00:28:08,480 --> 00:28:09,700 Speaker 4: Yeah, robo-tripping, exactly. 563 00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:13,090 Speaker 1: Which I always thought was a prank. 564 00:28:13,270 --> 00:28:13,850 Speaker 4: It is real. 565 00:28:13,890 --> 00:28:16,630 Speaker 2: There's some active ingredient in it that isn't just alcohol 566 00:28:16,670 --> 00:28:17,590 Speaker 2: that can make it. 567 00:28:17,630 --> 00:28:18,229 Speaker 3: I can't remember that. 568 00:28:18,270 --> 00:28:19,490 Speaker 4: Yeah, I can't remember it either. I was trying to 569 00:28:19,510 --> 00:28:20,870 Speaker 4: think of what it was. 570 00:28:21,050 --> 00:28:25,890 Speaker 1: It's a specific thing. These drugs we've discussed do exist, 571 00:28:25,990 --> 00:28:29,230 Speaker 1: and we got to a very dark place. But we 572 00:28:29,390 --> 00:28:31,750 Speaker 1: do want to end on a high note. 573 00:28:32,630 --> 00:28:34,149 Speaker 3: This whole episode's been a high note. 574 00:28:34,790 --> 00:28:36,389 Speaker 1: This whole episode has been a high note. 575 00:28:36,970 --> 00:28:37,260 Speaker 5: Yeah. 576 00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:40,459 Speaker 1: Zarin, you like animals, right, man? 577 00:28:40,540 --> 00:28:43,219 Speaker 4: I love animals. Big fan. Some people say I like 578 00:28:43,260 --> 00:28:44,780 Speaker 4: them more than people, but I don't think that's fair 579 00:28:44,940 --> 00:28:47,190 Speaker 4: because I consider people animals. Yeah. 580 00:28:47,500 --> 00:28:50,660 Speaker 1: Yeah, right on. Right there with you. Where are we 581 00:28:50,780 --> 00:28:52,000 Speaker 1: at on big cats? 582 00:28:52,660 --> 00:28:55,720 Speaker 4: Oh, man. I love big cats. Big, big fan of 583 00:28:55,740 --> 00:28:58,550 Speaker 4: big cats. Like, I have opinions about, like, what's your 584 00:28:58,590 --> 00:29:00,870 Speaker 4: favorite Tigers, Aaron? I'm like, oh, definitely. I'm going to 585 00:29:00,890 --> 00:29:03,430 Speaker 4: have to go with Siberians over Bengals. I like Bengals, 586 00:29:03,450 --> 00:29:04,150 Speaker 4: but Siberians. 587 00:29:04,570 --> 00:29:07,170 Speaker 1: So, yeah, Siberians got it, though, because they can remember 588 00:29:07,390 --> 00:29:08,650 Speaker 1: and they hunt down. 589 00:29:08,690 --> 00:29:11,670 Speaker 4: Yes. The stories with the Russian hunters and stuff where 590 00:29:11,690 --> 00:29:14,260 Speaker 4: they wait out and he's like, oh, man, you took 591 00:29:14,300 --> 00:29:16,240 Speaker 4: my kill. Now you are my kill. 592 00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:18,800 Speaker 2: Well, I'm a big fan of the Liger because they're 593 00:29:18,820 --> 00:29:20,520 Speaker 2: bred for their skills and magic. 594 00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:26,630 Speaker 1: We're also we're asking you this for a reason. We 595 00:29:26,690 --> 00:29:31,010 Speaker 1: wanted to end on a high note. Zarin, Noel and 596 00:29:31,150 --> 00:29:36,080 Speaker 1: I were very excited to learn. that the humble jaguar 597 00:29:36,640 --> 00:29:37,900 Speaker 1: loves ayahuasca. 598 00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:39,969 Speaker 3: Really? Yeah, this is true. 599 00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:43,739 Speaker 4: Out. They're like, this is the stuff, man. I'm about this. Okay. 600 00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:48,520 Speaker 1: Yeah. They have found the vine, right? The one that 601 00:29:48,560 --> 00:29:54,680 Speaker 1: contains DMT that will be used in ritualistic, shamanistic human experiences. 602 00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:57,850 Speaker 1: They kind of treat it like catnip. 603 00:29:59,510 --> 00:30:00,910 Speaker 3: Microdosing them, basically. 604 00:30:01,090 --> 00:30:01,430 Speaker 2: Yeah. 605 00:30:01,750 --> 00:30:04,930 Speaker 1: Yeah, they chew on the vines and the leaves, and 606 00:30:04,970 --> 00:30:09,730 Speaker 1: then they roll around in it. And then apparently for 607 00:30:09,890 --> 00:30:12,850 Speaker 1: several hours after, they are super cool. 608 00:30:13,470 --> 00:30:14,090 Speaker 3: Interesting. 609 00:30:14,310 --> 00:30:15,790 Speaker 2: Less likely to eat your face. 610 00:30:16,210 --> 00:30:18,930 Speaker 4: Yeah, that is a concern. Those are some vicious big 611 00:30:18,970 --> 00:30:20,709 Speaker 4: cats and strong as hell. 612 00:30:21,430 --> 00:30:23,100 Speaker 1: Yeah, and they can get in the trees. 613 00:30:23,130 --> 00:30:24,940 Speaker 4: Yeah, they'll take you with them right up into the trees. 614 00:30:24,980 --> 00:30:25,480 Speaker 4: They're like, come on. 615 00:30:26,870 --> 00:30:33,520 Speaker 1: So shout out to all the DMT Jaguars in the crowd. 616 00:30:33,660 --> 00:30:35,980 Speaker 1: Dolphins get high off puffer fish. 617 00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:37,180 Speaker 4: Oh, yeah. Yeah. 618 00:30:37,860 --> 00:30:38,219 Speaker 3: Yeah. 619 00:30:38,300 --> 00:30:39,950 Speaker 1: Can you tell us a little bit about that or 620 00:30:40,010 --> 00:30:40,770 Speaker 1: what you know about it? 621 00:30:41,310 --> 00:30:43,590 Speaker 4: From what I understand, they just agitate the puffer fish 622 00:30:43,670 --> 00:30:46,850 Speaker 4: that they do their puffering and then they get high 623 00:30:46,950 --> 00:30:50,150 Speaker 4: off of the active ingredients, which is essentially, once again, 624 00:30:50,190 --> 00:30:50,480 Speaker 4: a toxin. 625 00:30:50,500 --> 00:30:51,100 Speaker 3: It's a venom, right? 626 00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:52,840 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's a venom. So they figure out how to 627 00:30:52,900 --> 00:30:56,060 Speaker 4: get the right dosage. So they're kind of micro dosing 628 00:30:56,340 --> 00:30:58,760 Speaker 4: puffer fish toxin and then they get off and then 629 00:30:58,800 --> 00:31:00,570 Speaker 4: they go and like play with their buddies and go 630 00:31:00,620 --> 00:31:04,330 Speaker 4: rub themselves on rocks. So it's like a thing for them. Heard. Same. 631 00:31:04,350 --> 00:31:06,770 Speaker 4: Who are we to judge? Isn't that funny, though? 632 00:31:06,810 --> 00:31:09,040 Speaker 2: I mean, the same kind of experimentation that humans have 633 00:31:09,060 --> 00:31:11,940 Speaker 2: done for centuries, whether it be culinarily, like who ate 634 00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:13,000 Speaker 2: the first oyster? 635 00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:14,820 Speaker 3: That thing doesn't look like a good idea to you. 636 00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:16,780 Speaker 3: I mean, it happens in the animal kingdom. 637 00:31:16,860 --> 00:31:17,600 Speaker 4: Oh, yeah. 638 00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:20,410 Speaker 2: You know, along a long enough timeline, we're kind of 639 00:31:20,460 --> 00:31:21,970 Speaker 2: technically part of the animal kingdom. 640 00:31:22,010 --> 00:31:22,250 Speaker 4: Oh, yeah. 641 00:31:22,350 --> 00:31:23,990 Speaker 3: Of course. Not that much different than our animal kingdom. 642 00:31:24,030 --> 00:31:25,350 Speaker 1: Shout out, bloodhound gang. 643 00:31:25,430 --> 00:31:26,050 Speaker 3: Right. 644 00:31:26,150 --> 00:31:28,330 Speaker 1: It's crazy it took all of us so long to 645 00:31:28,370 --> 00:31:28,790 Speaker 1: get to it. 646 00:31:28,790 --> 00:31:31,630 Speaker 3: Yeah. That's true. Man, I think we put a pin 647 00:31:31,670 --> 00:31:32,360 Speaker 3: in this one, guys. 648 00:31:32,390 --> 00:31:34,340 Speaker 2: This is definitely an ongoing series, and I think we 649 00:31:34,360 --> 00:31:36,720 Speaker 2: should have Zarin back for another one. We got a 650 00:31:36,740 --> 00:31:39,180 Speaker 2: little bit of tangents and trivia here that we're going 651 00:31:39,200 --> 00:31:41,420 Speaker 2: to save because we're going on a journey, Ben and 652 00:31:41,460 --> 00:31:43,660 Speaker 2: Max and I, so we need to buffer up a 653 00:31:43,680 --> 00:31:45,630 Speaker 2: little bit. So we're going to do sort of a 654 00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:47,890 Speaker 2: leftovers episode in the coming weeks while we're. 655 00:31:47,790 --> 00:31:48,930 Speaker 4: On our cruise. I love leftovers, so if you want 656 00:31:48,950 --> 00:31:49,830 Speaker 4: to have me back, I'll. 657 00:31:49,930 --> 00:31:51,650 Speaker 3: Come roll through. Bro, are you serious? 658 00:31:51,710 --> 00:31:52,750 Speaker 4: Yeah, for real. Please, dude. 659 00:31:53,150 --> 00:31:57,890 Speaker 1: Also, Zarin, as we're wrapping up, just backstage, folks— This 660 00:31:57,970 --> 00:32:01,910 Speaker 1: is a whole week with Zarin Burnett, the creator of 661 00:32:02,010 --> 00:32:05,860 Speaker 1: not only Black Cowboys, the creator of very special episodes, 662 00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:10,350 Speaker 1: of course, the creator of Ridiculous Crime, along with Elizabeth 663 00:32:10,430 --> 00:32:12,560 Speaker 1: Dutton and Who we're also. 664 00:32:12,380 --> 00:32:14,260 Speaker 2: Going to have on in the very near future, as 665 00:32:14,340 --> 00:32:17,459 Speaker 2: well as the aforementioned game show format that we're going 666 00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:18,840 Speaker 2: to do before the end of the year. 667 00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:20,180 Speaker 1: Which Zarin invented. 668 00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:21,580 Speaker 4: Yeah, we got some fun planned for y'all. 669 00:32:21,600 --> 00:32:22,880 Speaker 3: Zarin invented the game show. 670 00:32:22,940 --> 00:32:28,000 Speaker 4: That's wild. Little fun facts. History of sitting. 671 00:32:27,680 --> 00:32:30,410 Speaker 2: On a plane, everyone was smoking, and he's like, what 672 00:32:30,450 --> 00:32:32,110 Speaker 2: if we have game shows? 673 00:32:32,190 --> 00:32:34,690 Speaker 5: And reindeer supplements, but coma free. 674 00:32:34,710 --> 00:32:35,260 Speaker 1: Love it. 675 00:32:35,990 --> 00:32:36,510 Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah. 676 00:32:36,590 --> 00:32:39,570 Speaker 1: That's back when reindeer could fly on planes as well 677 00:32:39,910 --> 00:32:42,370 Speaker 1: before they got the sleighs. Well, Zarin, man, thank you 678 00:32:42,430 --> 00:32:43,590 Speaker 1: so much for joining us. 679 00:32:43,590 --> 00:32:44,380 Speaker 4: Thank you guys for having me. 680 00:32:45,120 --> 00:32:49,280 Speaker 1: Bro, where can people go to learn more about your work? 681 00:32:50,140 --> 00:32:53,120 Speaker 4: Best place is go listen to Ridiculous Crime with me 682 00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:56,260 Speaker 4: and Elizabeth Dutton. It's a really fun, fantastic show. And 683 00:32:56,280 --> 00:32:58,610 Speaker 4: thank you guys for giving us that platform to have 684 00:32:58,650 --> 00:32:59,970 Speaker 4: fun with our fans and crowds. 685 00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:03,250 Speaker 2: Recently listed as one of, I think it was Entertainment 686 00:33:03,290 --> 00:33:05,570 Speaker 2: Weekly's top crime podcast. 687 00:33:05,590 --> 00:33:08,270 Speaker 4: Yes, top 30 best true crime podcasts of all time. 688 00:33:08,290 --> 00:33:12,420 Speaker 4: We were really stoked on that. 99% murder free. Yes, 100% ridiculous. 689 00:33:12,560 --> 00:33:15,280 Speaker 4: So go check it out. And then obviously very special episodes. 690 00:33:15,360 --> 00:33:19,230 Speaker 4: We do magazine style stories where... They're like little mini movies, 691 00:33:19,530 --> 00:33:22,170 Speaker 4: and I highly recommend that. And as you pointed out, 692 00:33:22,210 --> 00:33:24,990 Speaker 4: there's always Black Cowboys. If you'd like to hear about 693 00:33:25,070 --> 00:33:27,110 Speaker 4: the history of the West you don't normally get to 694 00:33:27,150 --> 00:33:30,120 Speaker 4: learn about, there's plenty of stories, and they're much similar 695 00:33:30,180 --> 00:33:32,340 Speaker 4: to very special episodes where they're like little mini movies. 696 00:33:32,600 --> 00:33:34,360 Speaker 4: But in this case, they're like little mini Westerns. 697 00:33:34,940 --> 00:33:41,040 Speaker 1: Big, big thanks to our super producer, Max Soothing Syrup Williams. Big, 698 00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:45,190 Speaker 1: big thanks to A.J. Bahamas Jacobs, a.k.a. The Puzzler, that 699 00:33:45,270 --> 00:33:46,830 Speaker 1: you would love to hang out with, Zarek. 700 00:33:46,910 --> 00:33:47,290 Speaker 4: Oh, yeah. 701 00:33:47,730 --> 00:33:48,270 Speaker 3: What a cool guy. 702 00:33:49,690 --> 00:33:53,590 Speaker 2: Jonathan Strickland, the Quister, Christopher Haciotis, Anita Jeff Goods here 703 00:33:53,630 --> 00:33:57,160 Speaker 2: in spirit. Ben, thank you for whipping this list together 704 00:33:57,260 --> 00:33:58,960 Speaker 2: in a pinch, man. I know that we were under 705 00:33:58,980 --> 00:34:02,060 Speaker 2: the gun and it really, really worked out beautifully. And 706 00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:04,940 Speaker 2: I'm excited to add to it and continue on with 707 00:34:04,980 --> 00:34:09,960 Speaker 2: this weird stuff people got high to series on Ridiculous History. 708 00:34:10,680 --> 00:34:11,620 Speaker 3: We'll see you next time, folks. 709 00:34:18,780 --> 00:34:21,620 Speaker 2: For more podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, 710 00:34:21,760 --> 00:34:24,710 Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.