1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:02,320 Speaker 1: Where Were You in ninety two is a production of 2 00:00:02,400 --> 00:00:07,400 Speaker 1: I Heart Radio. A special note, this episode contains descriptions 3 00:00:07,400 --> 00:00:12,640 Speaker 1: of violence. I think that the aesthetic of hip hop 4 00:00:12,720 --> 00:00:15,920 Speaker 1: changed right under our feet as we were transitioning from 5 00:00:16,040 --> 00:00:26,320 Speaker 1: album one to album two. Ye welcome to Where Are 6 00:00:26,320 --> 00:00:29,240 Speaker 1: You In nine two, a podcast in which I Your 7 00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:32,519 Speaker 1: host Jason Lafier, look back at the major hits, one 8 00:00:32,600 --> 00:00:36,640 Speaker 1: hit wonders, shocking news stories, and irresistible scandals that shaped 9 00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:40,640 Speaker 1: what might be the wildest, most eclectic, most controversial twelve 10 00:00:40,640 --> 00:00:46,920 Speaker 1: months of music effort. This week, I Feel Good alternative 11 00:00:46,920 --> 00:00:50,839 Speaker 1: to gangster rap. Arrested Development burst out of Atlanta bearing 12 00:00:50,880 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 1: messages of peace, love and unity. After they were acclaimed 13 00:00:55,080 --> 00:00:59,960 Speaker 1: genre bending debut album three Years, five Months in two 14 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:02,800 Speaker 1: as in the Life of topped critics polls, and won 15 00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:05,800 Speaker 1: them a Grammy for Best New Artist. They were poised 16 00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:08,880 Speaker 1: to become the next big thing in hip hop. But 17 00:01:08,920 --> 00:01:12,600 Speaker 1: if their success was enormous and immediate, it was also fleeting. 18 00:01:13,280 --> 00:01:15,920 Speaker 1: They had all but disappeared. Three years later as a 19 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:19,160 Speaker 1: new strain of hip hop, g funk became the defining 20 00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:24,440 Speaker 1: story of the genre. In this episode, we examine how 21 00:01:24,560 --> 00:01:28,520 Speaker 1: Arrested Development sound and Values were a refreshing musical change 22 00:01:28,520 --> 00:01:31,240 Speaker 1: of pace, but how they quickly fell out of stuff 23 00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:33,399 Speaker 1: with the trends that would dominate hip hop for the 24 00:01:33,480 --> 00:01:37,280 Speaker 1: rest of the decade plus frontman speech joins us to 25 00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:42,320 Speaker 1: discuss their breakout single Tennessee, the deeply personal real life 26 00:01:42,319 --> 00:01:45,280 Speaker 1: events that inspired it, and why the group was more 27 00:01:45,360 --> 00:01:54,760 Speaker 1: influential than many listeners realize. It's strange to think of 28 00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:57,760 Speaker 1: a time when legit hip hop artist weren't some of 29 00:01:57,800 --> 00:02:01,200 Speaker 1: the biggest names in the country. A time before Drake, 30 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:05,720 Speaker 1: Kanye West, Future, Travis Scott, Cardi B and Nicki Minaj, 31 00:02:06,320 --> 00:02:10,600 Speaker 1: A time before Eminem, t I Loew, Wayne, Nelly, Ludicrous 32 00:02:10,680 --> 00:02:14,240 Speaker 1: and Pitty Cent. A time before Outcast, jay Z Puff, 33 00:02:14,320 --> 00:02:18,120 Speaker 1: Daddy Tupac and the Notorious b I G. A time 34 00:02:18,160 --> 00:02:29,240 Speaker 1: before Dr Dre and Snoop Dogg. All of those artists 35 00:02:29,240 --> 00:02:32,160 Speaker 1: have had number one singles on the Billboard Hot one hundred. 36 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:36,200 Speaker 1: We can't really say they crossed over into the mainstream 37 00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:38,240 Speaker 1: because when they climbed to the top of the charts, 38 00:02:38,480 --> 00:02:42,760 Speaker 1: hip hop was the mainstream. Now hip hop is essentially pop, 39 00:02:43,480 --> 00:02:46,280 Speaker 1: but once upon a time, specifically at the beginning of 40 00:02:47,639 --> 00:02:49,840 Speaker 1: it was rare for a hip hop act to dominate 41 00:02:49,880 --> 00:02:53,800 Speaker 1: Top forty radio and have a gold record. The biggest 42 00:02:53,880 --> 00:02:57,400 Speaker 1: hip hop hits in this case, I mean the hip 43 00:02:57,440 --> 00:02:59,760 Speaker 1: hop songs were the strongest showings on the Hot one. 44 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:02,960 Speaker 1: Drew did not represent the prevailing sounds of hip hop 45 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:06,200 Speaker 1: at that time. They could never be categorized as gangster 46 00:03:06,360 --> 00:03:09,560 Speaker 1: rap like Iced Tea and Ice Cube, or hardcore hip 47 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:12,720 Speaker 1: hop like Public Enemy, or East Coast hip hop like 48 00:03:12,760 --> 00:03:16,399 Speaker 1: a tribe called Quest, or rap rock like Beastie Boys, 49 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:20,800 Speaker 1: or jazz rap like De La Soule. Instead, these chart 50 00:03:20,919 --> 00:03:24,320 Speaker 1: conquering tracks came with what you could call a quirky 51 00:03:24,360 --> 00:03:30,880 Speaker 1: selling point, a gimmick. Let's look at a few of them. 52 00:03:30,919 --> 00:03:35,040 Speaker 1: The second biggest single was actually a hip hop song, 53 00:03:35,840 --> 00:03:39,560 Speaker 1: Sir Mix a lots spunky Miami bass influenced number one hit, 54 00:03:39,800 --> 00:03:43,160 Speaker 1: Baby Got Back was a bouncy oh to Plentiful Booties 55 00:03:43,320 --> 00:03:47,080 Speaker 1: that unfolded like one big, fat joke, though, as we 56 00:03:47,160 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 1: covered in an episode one of the show mixes, messaging 57 00:03:50,040 --> 00:03:54,240 Speaker 1: was actually pretty damn sincere. The track was so undeniable 58 00:03:54,240 --> 00:03:57,320 Speaker 1: that it topped the Billboard Hot one for five consecutive weeks. 59 00:03:58,520 --> 00:04:03,080 Speaker 1: The number three single was also a hip hop song. 60 00:04:03,720 --> 00:04:07,680 Speaker 1: At the time, criss Crosses Jump was the fastest selling 61 00:04:07,720 --> 00:04:10,640 Speaker 1: single in fifteen years, and it stayed at the top 62 00:04:10,680 --> 00:04:13,960 Speaker 1: of the Hot one hundred for eight consecutive weeks. Criss 63 00:04:14,000 --> 00:04:18,159 Speaker 1: cross were the dinky, dimple faced duo of Chris mac 64 00:04:18,240 --> 00:04:21,800 Speaker 1: Daddy Kelly and Chris Daddy Max Smith, who were only 65 00:04:21,839 --> 00:04:26,039 Speaker 1: twelve and thirteen years old when they recorded Jump their Stick. 66 00:04:26,560 --> 00:04:31,719 Speaker 1: They wore their clothes cartoonishly baggy and backwards. No irony here. 67 00:04:32,760 --> 00:04:36,440 Speaker 1: Also massively popular that year, House of Pains jump Around, 68 00:04:36,640 --> 00:04:38,960 Speaker 1: which reached number three. I'm the Hot one hundred and 69 00:04:39,000 --> 00:04:42,839 Speaker 1: snaring listeners with its rollicking mix of rap, rock, dance 70 00:04:42,839 --> 00:04:45,960 Speaker 1: hall and club music. Folks clearly wanted to jump in 71 00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:49,800 Speaker 1: their stick. They were a couple of proud white dudes 72 00:04:49,839 --> 00:04:51,960 Speaker 1: who had banded together to put out music and imagery 73 00:04:51,960 --> 00:04:56,520 Speaker 1: that celebrated their Irish heritage. No irony here either, and 74 00:04:56,600 --> 00:04:59,080 Speaker 1: let's not forget though many of you would like to 75 00:04:59,440 --> 00:05:02,800 Speaker 1: Hammer formally mc hammer, he had a couple of hits too. 76 00:05:03,279 --> 00:05:05,719 Speaker 1: To Legit to Quit arrived with an insane the expense 77 00:05:05,760 --> 00:05:09,920 Speaker 1: of fifteen minute music video featuring cameos from numerous athletes 78 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:13,000 Speaker 1: and the Dallas Cowboys, cheerleaders and a storyline in which 79 00:05:13,120 --> 00:05:16,520 Speaker 1: James Brown sends Hammer to go take Michael Jackson's glove. 80 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:20,240 Speaker 1: The uncut version also included appearances from the likes of 81 00:05:20,400 --> 00:05:25,120 Speaker 1: Tony Danza and Millie Vanilli. Hammer's other big hit was 82 00:05:25,160 --> 00:05:29,120 Speaker 1: Adam's Groove, the theme song to the movie The Adams Family, 83 00:05:29,320 --> 00:05:31,479 Speaker 1: and the video for that song, Hammer could be seen 84 00:05:31,560 --> 00:05:36,239 Speaker 1: dancing all over the Adams family mansion and backyard cemetery. Sadly, 85 00:05:36,320 --> 00:05:41,320 Speaker 1: no irony insight here either, so yeah, you get the point. 86 00:05:41,680 --> 00:05:46,440 Speaker 1: Pop charts boasted a wild, goofy, messy all over the 87 00:05:46,680 --> 00:05:49,880 Speaker 1: map mix of hip hop, and most hip hop heads 88 00:05:49,920 --> 00:05:52,599 Speaker 1: would say I'm using that term hip hop real loosely. 89 00:05:59,640 --> 00:06:02,599 Speaker 1: And then there was Arrested Development who came out of 90 00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:07,200 Speaker 1: nowhere and suddenly were everywhere. Founded by college Pal's speech 91 00:06:07,279 --> 00:06:10,760 Speaker 1: and headliner, the Atlanta Georgia Outfit would have a bigger 92 00:06:10,839 --> 00:06:14,200 Speaker 1: year than any other hip hop act. In fact, they 93 00:06:14,240 --> 00:06:18,480 Speaker 1: would have a bigger year than virtually any other group period. 94 00:06:20,360 --> 00:06:23,880 Speaker 1: The best moments off their massive debut album Three Years, 95 00:06:24,040 --> 00:06:26,760 Speaker 1: five Months, and two Days in the Life of Struck 96 00:06:26,839 --> 00:06:30,200 Speaker 1: the balance between thoughtful and thrilling. They brought something to 97 00:06:30,279 --> 00:06:32,520 Speaker 1: hip hop that was practically unheard of in the genre 98 00:06:32,520 --> 00:06:37,080 Speaker 1: at the time, Spirituality Spirituality, and another oddity in hip 99 00:06:37,080 --> 00:06:41,720 Speaker 1: hop at that point, hopefulness positivity. Their singles were accessible 100 00:06:41,760 --> 00:06:45,440 Speaker 1: and inspired, with seductive hooks and memorable lyrics. They were 101 00:06:45,520 --> 00:06:50,560 Speaker 1: instant hits. So then, why have arrested development becomes such 102 00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:54,000 Speaker 1: a footnote in hip hop history. The answer, as you 103 00:06:54,040 --> 00:06:57,240 Speaker 1: may have guessed, is complicated. It is the result of 104 00:06:57,279 --> 00:07:00,920 Speaker 1: too much in fighting, too much fame, too fast, and 105 00:07:01,520 --> 00:07:05,160 Speaker 1: perhaps more than anything, a watershed moment at the tail 106 00:07:05,240 --> 00:07:15,960 Speaker 1: end of that would change hip hop forever. Speech was 107 00:07:16,040 --> 00:07:20,960 Speaker 1: born Todd Thomas and raised in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. His parents 108 00:07:20,960 --> 00:07:23,680 Speaker 1: were civil rights advocates and very active in the community, 109 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:28,320 Speaker 1: rallying together black owned businesses and supporting the black empowerment movement. 110 00:07:28,840 --> 00:07:32,720 Speaker 1: They instilled similar values and their children. Speech recalls them 111 00:07:32,760 --> 00:07:36,400 Speaker 1: frequently engaging him and his brother in conversations around social 112 00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:39,720 Speaker 1: issues over the breakfast table. His father owned a nightclub 113 00:07:39,760 --> 00:07:42,400 Speaker 1: called the Fox Trap, where Speech started djaying at the 114 00:07:42,440 --> 00:07:44,920 Speaker 1: age of thirteen, learning from the locals who played there. 115 00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:48,880 Speaker 1: In four he formed his first rap group, Attack, the 116 00:07:48,960 --> 00:07:52,520 Speaker 1: first rap group out of Milwaukee. As DJ Peach. He'd 117 00:07:52,560 --> 00:07:55,680 Speaker 1: spend records in rhyme. Attack gained a local following and 118 00:07:55,720 --> 00:07:58,360 Speaker 1: were active for two years, but Speech left Milwaukee for 119 00:07:58,400 --> 00:08:01,600 Speaker 1: Atlanta in seven, partly to avoid getting mixed up in 120 00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:04,640 Speaker 1: the gang violence plagging his city. There, he'd studied at 121 00:08:04,640 --> 00:08:08,960 Speaker 1: the Art Institute of Atlanta. His first week at the institute, 122 00:08:09,120 --> 00:08:11,120 Speaker 1: he put up a flyer in the cafeteria saying he 123 00:08:11,160 --> 00:08:13,880 Speaker 1: was a rapper searching for a DJ. He spotted another 124 00:08:13,920 --> 00:08:16,040 Speaker 1: student looking at it and they start up a conversation. 125 00:08:16,400 --> 00:08:19,320 Speaker 1: That student was Timothy Barnwell, but he would adopt the 126 00:08:19,360 --> 00:08:23,240 Speaker 1: stage name Headliner. They became fast friends and began making 127 00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:26,400 Speaker 1: music after class and speeches apartment and getting gigs around 128 00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:29,280 Speaker 1: the city. They changed their name and style a couple 129 00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:32,680 Speaker 1: of times, first calling themselves d l R Disciples of 130 00:08:32,720 --> 00:08:36,240 Speaker 1: the Lyrical Rebellion and opting for a gangst light vibe, 131 00:08:36,520 --> 00:08:40,200 Speaker 1: then going by Secret Society and emulating Public Enemy. They 132 00:08:40,240 --> 00:08:44,240 Speaker 1: finally landed on the Moniker Arrested development. While they were 133 00:08:44,280 --> 00:08:47,640 Speaker 1: fans of gangster rap, Speech and Headliner wanted to take 134 00:08:47,840 --> 00:08:50,920 Speaker 1: their music in a different direction. A Speech said in 135 00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:54,440 Speaker 1: a two thousand twenty interview with lad TV quote, I 136 00:08:54,480 --> 00:08:57,480 Speaker 1: felt like just the gangster rap thing wasn't showing who 137 00:08:57,600 --> 00:09:00,199 Speaker 1: we really were. So I felt like a us to 138 00:09:00,240 --> 00:09:03,040 Speaker 1: developments music was a great chance to put more flesh 139 00:09:03,080 --> 00:09:06,160 Speaker 1: on the bones of who black people are, What are issues? 140 00:09:06,200 --> 00:09:10,400 Speaker 1: Are things that were concerned about. They thought black culture 141 00:09:10,440 --> 00:09:14,520 Speaker 1: had stalled, hence the group's name arrested Development, and they 142 00:09:14,559 --> 00:09:18,120 Speaker 1: wanted to push the conversation forward. They specifically wanted to 143 00:09:18,200 --> 00:09:20,760 Speaker 1: underscore what it was like to be black in the South. 144 00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:31,800 Speaker 1: A Speech told Select magazine when the band started to 145 00:09:31,840 --> 00:09:36,280 Speaker 1: take off, quote, there's more black people in the South 146 00:09:36,440 --> 00:09:38,440 Speaker 1: than in the North, and this is the place where 147 00:09:38,440 --> 00:09:41,320 Speaker 1: black people first arrived in America. I think the South 148 00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:43,840 Speaker 1: is now the place of preference for black people. There's 149 00:09:43,880 --> 00:09:47,760 Speaker 1: a very African influence here. Headliner, who had grown up 150 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:50,520 Speaker 1: in Savannah, considered the political hip hop coming out of 151 00:09:50,559 --> 00:09:53,480 Speaker 1: New York to be an offshoot of activist Malcolm X's 152 00:09:53,520 --> 00:09:56,600 Speaker 1: Black militancy. Well. He and Speech were inspired by the 153 00:09:56,600 --> 00:09:59,600 Speaker 1: work of Southern civil rights leader Martin Luther King Jr. 154 00:10:00,120 --> 00:10:04,960 Speaker 1: Their core tenants were peace, community unity. They aimed to 155 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:08,439 Speaker 1: infuse their music with an afrocentricity that was uncommon in 156 00:10:08,520 --> 00:10:13,080 Speaker 1: rapid time, and their minds their authenticity, spirituality, and originality 157 00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:15,520 Speaker 1: would distinguish them from other acts in hip hop, a 158 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:19,920 Speaker 1: genre that was edging closer to the mainstream. Before signing 159 00:10:19,920 --> 00:10:23,520 Speaker 1: their record deal, Arrested Development was a rotating collective of 160 00:10:23,559 --> 00:10:27,840 Speaker 1: around twenty members. At live shows, Speech and Headliner would 161 00:10:27,840 --> 00:10:31,760 Speaker 1: invite their creative peers on stage, incorporating cowbell players, African 162 00:10:31,840 --> 00:10:35,400 Speaker 1: dance and artists painting into their performances. When they signed 163 00:10:35,480 --> 00:10:38,199 Speaker 1: the record deal, they had to scale back and settled 164 00:10:38,200 --> 00:10:43,720 Speaker 1: on six chief members, Speech, Headliner, Babba o j air Lee, 165 00:10:43,880 --> 00:10:48,080 Speaker 1: Terrie mosho Ishi, and Razadan, who started as a dancer 166 00:10:48,200 --> 00:10:51,080 Speaker 1: before becoming the group's drummer and graphic artist. He designed 167 00:10:51,080 --> 00:10:57,640 Speaker 1: his official logo when he wasn't working as a barber 168 00:10:57,679 --> 00:11:00,720 Speaker 1: at his day job. Headliner was the cruise create digger, 169 00:11:01,040 --> 00:11:04,200 Speaker 1: rummaging through old records and selecting beats and vocals for 170 00:11:04,280 --> 00:11:07,960 Speaker 1: Arrested Development to sample. Some twenty samples would eventually be 171 00:11:07,960 --> 00:11:10,800 Speaker 1: cleared for their first album, snippets of songs from the 172 00:11:10,840 --> 00:11:14,600 Speaker 1: likes of Minni Ripperton, Quincy Jones, Rick James, John Lee 173 00:11:14,600 --> 00:11:17,800 Speaker 1: Hooker and Sly in the family. Stone Speech would build 174 00:11:17,840 --> 00:11:23,000 Speaker 1: on them, crafting compositions diffused funk, soul, folk, jazz and 175 00:11:23,040 --> 00:11:27,320 Speaker 1: the blues. Some journalists called their style alternative rap, but 176 00:11:27,400 --> 00:11:29,960 Speaker 1: Speech was never a fan of the term, finding it reductive. 177 00:11:30,800 --> 00:11:34,400 Speaker 1: Through Headliner's girlfriend, Speech and Headliner connected with Michael Malden, 178 00:11:34,720 --> 00:11:39,000 Speaker 1: father of rapper producer Jermaine dupri who incidentally formed Criss Cross. 179 00:11:39,240 --> 00:11:42,200 Speaker 1: Malton became a rusted developments manager, but finding them a 180 00:11:42,200 --> 00:11:45,240 Speaker 1: record deal proved challenging. They were turned down left and 181 00:11:45,360 --> 00:11:48,559 Speaker 1: right because labels didn't know what to do with them. 182 00:11:48,679 --> 00:11:51,400 Speaker 1: Speech had promised his mother that if he wasn't able 183 00:11:51,440 --> 00:11:53,840 Speaker 1: to snag a record deal, he'd moved back to Milwaukee 184 00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:56,360 Speaker 1: and returned to college. He'd done just that when the 185 00:11:56,440 --> 00:11:59,640 Speaker 1: label Chrysalis decided to sign them, as he tells it, 186 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:02,720 Speaker 1: it had seen how popular progressive rappers De Las Soul 187 00:12:02,760 --> 00:12:06,560 Speaker 1: had become after the release of their critically lauded debut 188 00:12:06,640 --> 00:12:09,960 Speaker 1: album Three Ft High and Rising, and wanted to capitalize 189 00:12:09,960 --> 00:12:13,880 Speaker 1: on its success, says Speech. At that point, we were 190 00:12:14,600 --> 00:12:17,560 Speaker 1: first just offering a single deal. We had a whole 191 00:12:17,600 --> 00:12:21,920 Speaker 1: album like pretty much prepared, but the single deal was 192 00:12:22,559 --> 00:12:26,080 Speaker 1: Mr Wendell Side A, and back then we had A 193 00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:29,880 Speaker 1: and B side Side B was natural. Mr Wendell offered 194 00:12:29,880 --> 00:12:33,360 Speaker 1: a portrait of its titular character, a homeless man. It 195 00:12:33,400 --> 00:12:36,360 Speaker 1: was inspired by speeches own interaction with men living on 196 00:12:36,400 --> 00:12:38,680 Speaker 1: the streets of Atlanta near the studio where he and 197 00:12:38,679 --> 00:12:42,440 Speaker 1: Headline are recorded music. The track, which sampled drums from 198 00:12:42,480 --> 00:12:45,160 Speaker 1: Sly and the Family Stones sing a simple Song, was 199 00:12:45,200 --> 00:12:49,080 Speaker 1: bubbly and buoyant with major pop crossover potential, and it 200 00:12:49,200 --> 00:12:53,720 Speaker 1: captured the arrested Development ethos perfectly. It was social consciousness 201 00:12:53,720 --> 00:12:57,440 Speaker 1: and a pretty package, a slice of colorful, thought provoking 202 00:12:57,520 --> 00:13:02,400 Speaker 1: storytelling anchored by an infectious hoe tapping groove. Mr. Wendell 203 00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:05,959 Speaker 1: wasn't just a bum. The song's narrator realizes he has 204 00:13:06,000 --> 00:13:09,800 Speaker 1: wisdom to share that because he's unmarred by materialism, he 205 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:12,360 Speaker 1: may actually be more in layened than those who choose 206 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:16,120 Speaker 1: to discount him. But life had other plans. Mr. Wendell 207 00:13:16,160 --> 00:13:18,600 Speaker 1: would not be released as a Rusted Developments first single. 208 00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:22,040 Speaker 1: That honor would instead go to Tennessee, a late addition 209 00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:25,320 Speaker 1: to the repertoire that while the label catapulted the group's 210 00:13:25,400 --> 00:13:29,120 Speaker 1: career and became their signature song, Tennessee was literally the 211 00:13:29,200 --> 00:13:33,400 Speaker 1: last song we recorded for the album. They ended up 212 00:13:33,400 --> 00:13:38,559 Speaker 1: signing our album deal. I think because we had recorded 213 00:13:38,559 --> 00:13:40,360 Speaker 1: and shot a video for Tennessee, and I think they 214 00:13:40,360 --> 00:13:44,360 Speaker 1: were sold on us. Tennessee stemmed from personal tragedy, it 215 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:48,240 Speaker 1: would become a bomb for speeches grief. My grandmother, who 216 00:13:48,280 --> 00:13:51,560 Speaker 1: I spent all my summers with in Tennessee, she passed 217 00:13:51,600 --> 00:13:54,760 Speaker 1: away of a heart attack unexpectedly, and so we were 218 00:13:54,800 --> 00:13:58,720 Speaker 1: all devastated. I was extremely devastated because she spent I 219 00:13:58,800 --> 00:14:01,480 Speaker 1: spent a ton of time with this grandmother, and she 220 00:14:01,559 --> 00:14:04,280 Speaker 1: really was probably the biggest force outside of my mom 221 00:14:04,280 --> 00:14:06,560 Speaker 1: and dad to shape who I am as a person. 222 00:14:06,920 --> 00:14:10,640 Speaker 1: Speech and his family traveled to Tennessee for her service. There, 223 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:13,000 Speaker 1: he reunited with his brother, who had also gone off 224 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:17,000 Speaker 1: to college. He was at the funeral, and we all 225 00:14:17,080 --> 00:14:19,920 Speaker 1: left there with a sense of you know, renewal and 226 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:24,640 Speaker 1: just striving to do our lives, you know better, in 227 00:14:24,720 --> 00:14:27,960 Speaker 1: her name. And that same week, my brother died of 228 00:14:28,080 --> 00:14:31,720 Speaker 1: asthma tack. He was twenty nine, and it just wrecked 229 00:14:31,760 --> 00:14:36,480 Speaker 1: my life. Everything was, everything was tentative, there was no 230 00:14:36,800 --> 00:14:39,040 Speaker 1: it was It was very hard for me to collect hope. 231 00:14:39,600 --> 00:14:42,200 Speaker 1: Tennessee had been the last place Speech had seen his 232 00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:45,160 Speaker 1: grandmother before she passed, and now it was the last 233 00:14:45,200 --> 00:14:48,480 Speaker 1: place he had seen his brother. To mitigate the pain, 234 00:14:48,800 --> 00:14:51,560 Speaker 1: he headed to the studio and began to write the track. 235 00:14:51,840 --> 00:14:55,280 Speaker 1: Tennessee is speeches prayer to a greater power, but it 236 00:14:55,400 --> 00:14:57,520 Speaker 1: is also the sound of him processing the deaths of 237 00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:00,880 Speaker 1: his loved ones and the meaning of his life, his race, 238 00:15:01,200 --> 00:15:05,440 Speaker 1: his ancestry, his community. Its course is simple yet profound, 239 00:15:05,720 --> 00:15:10,160 Speaker 1: hookey yet heartbreaking. Take me to another place, take me 240 00:15:10,360 --> 00:15:13,280 Speaker 1: to another land, Make me forget all that hurts me. 241 00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:18,160 Speaker 1: Let me understand your plan well, the song concludes without resolution. 242 00:15:18,640 --> 00:15:21,080 Speaker 1: You can hear the catharsis that brought speech. But I 243 00:15:21,120 --> 00:15:24,240 Speaker 1: told the label I really insisted on them releasing this record. 244 00:15:24,280 --> 00:15:27,760 Speaker 1: I told him what happened with my family, and they 245 00:15:27,800 --> 00:15:31,320 Speaker 1: loved it. They really was in a mood where if 246 00:15:31,320 --> 00:15:33,480 Speaker 1: they didn't let me release this record first, I didn't 247 00:15:33,520 --> 00:15:36,440 Speaker 1: want to release anything. To me, nothing else mattered. Releasing 248 00:15:36,440 --> 00:15:38,680 Speaker 1: this single would feel like a form of closure for speech. 249 00:15:39,200 --> 00:15:41,920 Speaker 1: But he also believed in the music itself. He knew 250 00:15:41,920 --> 00:15:44,960 Speaker 1: Tennessee was special. From an ancestral standpoint. It was a 251 00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:48,160 Speaker 1: gift from my grandmother and my brother to me, But 252 00:15:49,120 --> 00:15:51,360 Speaker 1: to me it was a gift to hip hop. It 253 00:15:51,440 --> 00:15:54,520 Speaker 1: was a gift to you know, the world of music too. 254 00:15:54,840 --> 00:15:57,440 Speaker 1: I feel because it was doing some unique things and 255 00:15:57,440 --> 00:15:59,400 Speaker 1: it was bringing some unique things to the table. The 256 00:15:59,480 --> 00:16:03,360 Speaker 1: label of greed giving arrested development nineteen dollars to make 257 00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:06,280 Speaker 1: a video. Compare that to Guns and Roses one point 258 00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:09,280 Speaker 1: five million dollar budget for the November Rain video. They 259 00:16:09,280 --> 00:16:12,360 Speaker 1: filmed it not in Tennessee, but in rural Georgia at 260 00:16:12,400 --> 00:16:16,000 Speaker 1: an old, dilapidated house. Speech discovered that reminded him of 261 00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:20,040 Speaker 1: his grandmother's house, featuring the band's friends and locals who 262 00:16:20,040 --> 00:16:22,040 Speaker 1: asked that they could be part of it. It included 263 00:16:22,080 --> 00:16:24,960 Speaker 1: shots of slave shackles they actually were in the house, 264 00:16:25,120 --> 00:16:28,680 Speaker 1: a sad remnant of its dark past. Other shots included 265 00:16:28,760 --> 00:16:32,640 Speaker 1: artwork depicting black men being lynched. It's easy to see 266 00:16:32,760 --> 00:16:35,160 Speaker 1: why the black and white video convinced the band's label 267 00:16:35,160 --> 00:16:37,200 Speaker 1: to give them a full album deal. It is, by 268 00:16:37,200 --> 00:16:40,680 Speaker 1: turns celebratory as a group spins records and dances on 269 00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:43,960 Speaker 1: the house's porch and around the property, and powerful with 270 00:16:44,040 --> 00:16:48,400 Speaker 1: its nods to the South's complex, haunting history. Speech for 271 00:16:48,520 --> 00:16:50,960 Speaker 1: calls being around twenty years old and going to a 272 00:16:50,960 --> 00:16:53,440 Speaker 1: record store in Atlanta soon after Tennessee was released as 273 00:16:53,440 --> 00:16:55,920 Speaker 1: a single to see how it was selling. After the 274 00:16:55,960 --> 00:16:58,200 Speaker 1: guy there informed him that the only people buying it 275 00:16:58,280 --> 00:17:02,120 Speaker 1: were forty plus, he thought a d were doomed, but 276 00:17:02,200 --> 00:17:05,920 Speaker 1: then MTV selected the video for buzz Bin, a segment 277 00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:08,919 Speaker 1: in which VJs gave cool up and coming artists their 278 00:17:08,920 --> 00:17:11,600 Speaker 1: stamp of approval, leaving the network to put their latest 279 00:17:11,680 --> 00:17:22,639 Speaker 1: video on heavy rotation. Suddenly Tennessee blew up. The track 280 00:17:22,960 --> 00:17:25,960 Speaker 1: topped billboards Hot R and B hip Hop Songs Chart 281 00:17:26,080 --> 00:17:29,000 Speaker 1: and Hot Rap Songs Chart, and pete at number six 282 00:17:29,080 --> 00:17:32,040 Speaker 1: on the Hot one hundred, eventually going gold. It was 283 00:17:32,119 --> 00:17:35,000 Speaker 1: also a hit among critics. A review in the Los 284 00:17:35,000 --> 00:17:38,440 Speaker 1: Angeles Times read quote, some of pop's best moments come 285 00:17:38,440 --> 00:17:40,840 Speaker 1: from groups that seemed to arrive from nowhere with a 286 00:17:40,920 --> 00:17:44,639 Speaker 1: confidence and mature vision, and that's the case here. Another 287 00:17:44,680 --> 00:17:47,439 Speaker 1: claim the song quote may go down in the history 288 00:17:47,480 --> 00:17:50,879 Speaker 1: books as the first major sad rap hit. Not bitter, 289 00:17:51,320 --> 00:17:55,200 Speaker 1: not raging or recriminatory, just flat out soul and heaven 290 00:17:55,280 --> 00:17:59,280 Speaker 1: searching the heart. Sick Tennessee would also be chosen is 291 00:17:59,359 --> 00:18:02,040 Speaker 1: one of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fames songs 292 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:10,560 Speaker 1: that shaped rock and roll its place in the nineties. 293 00:18:10,600 --> 00:18:15,000 Speaker 1: Pop pantheon is well deserved. Tennessee has all the ingredients 294 00:18:15,080 --> 00:18:18,760 Speaker 1: of a sonic game changer. Slick record scratching, a juicy, 295 00:18:18,800 --> 00:18:21,960 Speaker 1: shuffling beat lifted from James Brown's Funky Drummer, a go 296 00:18:22,119 --> 00:18:26,040 Speaker 1: to sample at the time, a sticky sing along chorus, speeches, 297 00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:29,760 Speaker 1: honeyed melodic flow, a rarity in hip hop which often 298 00:18:29,800 --> 00:18:34,200 Speaker 1: favored harder, more aggressive rhyming, rafter shaking, gospel esque belting 299 00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:38,520 Speaker 1: from guest vocalist Dion Ferris, vivid lyrics that rustle with 300 00:18:38,560 --> 00:18:41,719 Speaker 1: the cruelties of life and death, the past and the present, 301 00:18:41,960 --> 00:18:45,160 Speaker 1: and illuminate the beauty and calamity of what it means 302 00:18:45,200 --> 00:18:48,920 Speaker 1: to be black in the South. I mean these lines alone. 303 00:18:49,680 --> 00:18:52,080 Speaker 1: Then out of nowhere, you tell me to break out 304 00:18:52,080 --> 00:18:56,120 Speaker 1: of the country and into more country, past Dyersburg, into Ripley, 305 00:18:56,160 --> 00:18:59,480 Speaker 1: where the ghost of childhood haunts me. Walk the roads 306 00:18:59,560 --> 00:19:03,240 Speaker 1: my four fathers walked, climbed the trees my forefathers hung 307 00:19:03,280 --> 00:19:08,600 Speaker 1: From The beloved Truck also contains a sterling sample of 308 00:19:08,600 --> 00:19:14,760 Speaker 1: Prince single Alphabet Street one word Tennessee, heard most prominently 309 00:19:14,800 --> 00:19:16,879 Speaker 1: at the beginning of the song, and then buried in 310 00:19:16,920 --> 00:19:19,919 Speaker 1: the mix a little later. But the Purple One took notice. 311 00:19:20,280 --> 00:19:22,359 Speaker 1: At that time it was a wild wild West sample. 312 00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:25,960 Speaker 1: Why so we didn't really understand exactly the laws. When 313 00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:28,119 Speaker 1: the record got to like number six, I think on 314 00:19:28,160 --> 00:19:32,000 Speaker 1: the pop charts, and it went down to seven, we 315 00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:34,320 Speaker 1: got a call from Prince's office. And because it was 316 00:19:34,359 --> 00:19:36,320 Speaker 1: just one word, I mean, it wasn't even a melody, 317 00:19:36,359 --> 00:19:42,119 Speaker 1: it wasn't just the word Tennessee and so um, we 318 00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:44,280 Speaker 1: got a call and he said he wanted a hundred 319 00:19:44,280 --> 00:19:47,280 Speaker 1: thousand dollars for the sample. And at that time, as 320 00:19:47,280 --> 00:19:52,000 Speaker 1: a twenty three year old guy, first album ever, the 321 00:19:52,119 --> 00:19:54,159 Speaker 1: very fact that he asked for a hundred thousand was 322 00:19:54,200 --> 00:19:57,480 Speaker 1: just mind blowing to you. Now looking back, Speech is 323 00:19:57,520 --> 00:20:00,240 Speaker 1: grateful that was all Prince wanted. He could have took 324 00:20:00,240 --> 00:20:02,399 Speaker 1: it off the shelves. He could have, you know, like 325 00:20:02,440 --> 00:20:05,399 Speaker 1: a cease and desist order, and he could have asked 326 00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:07,560 Speaker 1: for half the song rights are publishing, you know what. 327 00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:09,919 Speaker 1: You could do pretty much anything because the leverage was 328 00:20:10,040 --> 00:20:12,919 Speaker 1: very much on his side. Don't worry, there was no 329 00:20:13,000 --> 00:20:16,160 Speaker 1: bad blood. In fact, Speech eventually even met Prince when 330 00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:19,400 Speaker 1: he was invited to one of his birthday bashes. Arrested 331 00:20:19,400 --> 00:20:22,679 Speaker 1: Development released their debut album, Three Years, five months, and 332 00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:26,240 Speaker 1: two Days in the Life Of in March, in conjunction 333 00:20:26,320 --> 00:20:29,040 Speaker 1: with Tennessee. The title referred to how long it took 334 00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:31,200 Speaker 1: them to get a record contract the way it was 335 00:20:31,240 --> 00:20:35,320 Speaker 1: worth it. The record got raves upon its release. Entertainment 336 00:20:35,320 --> 00:20:37,800 Speaker 1: Weekly said the group was quote perhaps raps most self 337 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:41,639 Speaker 1: reflective act. The Chicago Tribune called them quote a major 338 00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:44,000 Speaker 1: new voice in hip hop and praise their lack of 339 00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:47,600 Speaker 1: quote macho boasting and gangster posing. At the end of 340 00:20:47,640 --> 00:20:51,040 Speaker 1: that year, the Village Voices Pass and Drop Critics poll 341 00:20:51,320 --> 00:20:56,040 Speaker 1: declared it the best album of rowing Stone crowned arrested 342 00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:59,800 Speaker 1: Development Band of the Year after one of the group's shows, 343 00:21:00,160 --> 00:21:03,480 Speaker 1: director Spike Lee came backstage to introduce himself. They would 344 00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:06,320 Speaker 1: go on to contribute a song Revolution to the soundtrack 345 00:21:06,359 --> 00:21:09,800 Speaker 1: of his Malcolm X. Bile pick Malcolm X a bit 346 00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:12,920 Speaker 1: ironic given that they more closely associated themselves as Martin 347 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:16,720 Speaker 1: Luther King. Three Years, five months, and two Days in 348 00:21:16,720 --> 00:21:19,160 Speaker 1: the Life Of would yield two more top ten hits. 349 00:21:19,560 --> 00:21:22,560 Speaker 1: The reggae tinge feel Good Cut People every Day boasted 350 00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:26,000 Speaker 1: a superb interpolation of slying the family Stones Everyday People 351 00:21:26,320 --> 00:21:29,159 Speaker 1: and chronicled a street confrontation between a man and a 352 00:21:29,240 --> 00:21:32,480 Speaker 1: rowdy gang who taunt him and grope his girlfriend. The 353 00:21:32,520 --> 00:21:34,760 Speaker 1: Metamorphosis mix of it peaked number eight on the Hot 354 00:21:34,760 --> 00:21:38,960 Speaker 1: one hundred and number two in the UK. Speech wrote 355 00:21:38,960 --> 00:21:41,760 Speaker 1: it to illustrate the contrast between his perception of black 356 00:21:41,800 --> 00:21:44,280 Speaker 1: culture and pride and that of most black men in 357 00:21:44,359 --> 00:21:47,719 Speaker 1: his neighborhood back home, As he explained to song facts, 358 00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:50,800 Speaker 1: they understood they were black, but for them, black was 359 00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:53,600 Speaker 1: Jerry Curls. It was pimping. I had come to understand 360 00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:55,720 Speaker 1: the black culture had a lot more to do with Africa, 361 00:21:56,200 --> 00:21:58,520 Speaker 1: and it was different hairstyles we could express ourselves with, 362 00:21:58,640 --> 00:22:01,560 Speaker 1: like dreadlocks and braids. So I would dress like that 363 00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:03,560 Speaker 1: and a lot of the people around the Milwaukee would 364 00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:05,680 Speaker 1: sort of mock it. And so the song was really 365 00:22:05,680 --> 00:22:08,119 Speaker 1: just talking about this tension between one concept of culture 366 00:22:08,280 --> 00:22:12,800 Speaker 1: and another concept of culture. At the end of a 367 00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:17,040 Speaker 1: d would release its third single, Mr. Wendell, which, like Tennessee, 368 00:22:17,080 --> 00:22:18,879 Speaker 1: would peak at number six on the Hub a hundred. 369 00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:22,640 Speaker 1: Like Tennessee, both People every Day and Mr. Wendell were 370 00:22:22,680 --> 00:22:25,600 Speaker 1: certified Gold. The band would donate half the proceeds in Mr. 371 00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:27,840 Speaker 1: Wendell to the National Coalition for the Homeless in the 372 00:22:27,960 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 1: United States. At the nine Grammys, Arrested Development would take 373 00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:37,560 Speaker 1: home the coveted award for Best New Artist, becoming the 374 00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:41,440 Speaker 1: first hip hop act to earn the prize. Tennessee would 375 00:22:41,440 --> 00:22:44,320 Speaker 1: win for Best Rap Performance by a Duo or Group. 376 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:48,840 Speaker 1: At the m As, Tennessee would snag Best Rap Video 377 00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:51,960 Speaker 1: and Award. The group would win again in nineteen three 378 00:22:52,320 --> 00:22:56,560 Speaker 1: for People Every Day. That same year, MTV would release Unplugged, 379 00:22:56,720 --> 00:22:59,280 Speaker 1: an album of their live performance at New York's ed 380 00:22:59,320 --> 00:23:02,919 Speaker 1: Sullivan Theater, making a d the first rap act to 381 00:23:02,960 --> 00:23:07,480 Speaker 1: get an unplugged record. They were critical Darling's Recording Academy Darlings, 382 00:23:07,800 --> 00:23:12,080 Speaker 1: MTV darlings, and fan darlings. Arrested Development ticked all the boxes. 383 00:23:12,440 --> 00:23:14,600 Speaker 1: They could not have had a more auspicious start to 384 00:23:14,600 --> 00:23:18,400 Speaker 1: their career, or some would say, a more abrupt ending. 385 00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:29,639 Speaker 1: The sophomore album, Singalamadouni sold poorly, not even cracking the 386 00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:32,720 Speaker 1: top fifty. None of its singles reached the top forty. 387 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:47,439 Speaker 1: Arrested Development had split up. Up. Next after the break, 388 00:23:47,840 --> 00:23:51,080 Speaker 1: we explore what led to the groups unraveling, including a 389 00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:55,119 Speaker 1: lawsuit and why are rusted development are often overlooked or 390 00:23:55,200 --> 00:24:10,800 Speaker 1: even dismissed in the annals of hip hop. Was a 391 00:24:10,840 --> 00:24:15,119 Speaker 1: banner year for Arrested Development. Their debut album, Three Years, 392 00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:17,840 Speaker 1: five Months, and two Days in the Life of would 393 00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:21,880 Speaker 1: go four times platinum and yield three hit singles, all 394 00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:25,720 Speaker 1: of which were certified gold. Rolling Stone named them Band 395 00:24:25,800 --> 00:24:28,440 Speaker 1: of the Year, and on the strength of their widely 396 00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:32,440 Speaker 1: popular releases, they would win a nine Grammy for Best 397 00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:36,359 Speaker 1: New Artist. They would tour the globe, introducing some international 398 00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:40,439 Speaker 1: audiences to hip hop, but their mainstream success was short lived. 399 00:24:40,840 --> 00:24:46,000 Speaker 1: Their follow up album, Singalama Duney flopped. None of its 400 00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:49,760 Speaker 1: singles cracked the top forty. In fact, the band hasn't 401 00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:52,880 Speaker 1: had a top forty single since Mr Wendell hit number six, 402 00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:58,200 Speaker 1: and rarely doesn't act that became so popular and beloved 403 00:24:58,480 --> 00:25:03,640 Speaker 1: fizzle so quickly, so what happened well for one eighties 404 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:07,000 Speaker 1: second album just didn't offer the radio friendly bangers its 405 00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:11,240 Speaker 1: predecessor did. Speech said it was too rushed. The group 406 00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:14,479 Speaker 1: was still touring and promoting the first LP while he 407 00:25:14,520 --> 00:25:17,280 Speaker 1: was scrambling to put together there next. He was wearing 408 00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:21,320 Speaker 1: a lot of hats, so like similar to kids now 409 00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:24,040 Speaker 1: who are in their little home studios making beats. I 410 00:25:24,160 --> 00:25:26,320 Speaker 1: was that guy. But I was also the rhymer and 411 00:25:26,320 --> 00:25:28,320 Speaker 1: so I was the lead vocalist. I was a DJ 412 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:31,119 Speaker 1: to some extent, and I made the beat, so you know, 413 00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:35,560 Speaker 1: like I sometimes envied people like n w A, who 414 00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:38,560 Speaker 1: you know, Dr Trey was sort of the producer, and 415 00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:40,600 Speaker 1: then you know, Ice C was mainly the main lyricist, 416 00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:42,720 Speaker 1: and then there was other members that did lyrics or 417 00:25:43,119 --> 00:25:45,960 Speaker 1: or a public enemy who had you know, Chuck D 418 00:25:46,119 --> 00:25:47,800 Speaker 1: and Flav and all that, but he had the Bomb 419 00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:50,600 Speaker 1: Squad who was the producers, and it was a group 420 00:25:50,640 --> 00:25:54,200 Speaker 1: of guys. You know, having the follow up and having 421 00:25:54,200 --> 00:25:57,960 Speaker 1: it just on these shoulders felt unbearable, and that I 422 00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:02,240 Speaker 1: felt really really daunted. You know. Another major reason the 423 00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:05,919 Speaker 1: group faded from the spotlight and the roughly two years 424 00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:09,880 Speaker 1: between Arrusted Developments first and second albums, hip hop culture 425 00:26:09,920 --> 00:26:16,520 Speaker 1: completely shifted. On December and w A member Dr Dre 426 00:26:16,920 --> 00:26:20,320 Speaker 1: released his debut solo album, The Chronic, featuring the lies 427 00:26:20,480 --> 00:26:24,520 Speaker 1: vocals of Snoop Doggie Dog and turned the genre upside down. 428 00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:28,600 Speaker 1: Sample and break beat, heavy party rap and political rap 429 00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:31,480 Speaker 1: gave way to g funk, a new strain of hip 430 00:26:31,480 --> 00:26:36,119 Speaker 1: hop that folded in smooth parliament funkadelic snippets, sparingly pairing 431 00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:41,560 Speaker 1: them with airy, soulful vocals and instrumentation. The Chronic was 432 00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:46,000 Speaker 1: critically held and went multi platinum. Today, it is regarded 433 00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:48,760 Speaker 1: as one of the most important albums of the nineties 434 00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:51,199 Speaker 1: and one of the most important hip hop albums of 435 00:26:51,240 --> 00:27:03,520 Speaker 1: all time. Andy Herman is a Los Angeles based music journalist, 436 00:27:03,720 --> 00:27:07,840 Speaker 1: podcast producer, and longtime fan of Arrested Development's first album, 437 00:27:07,880 --> 00:27:10,680 Speaker 1: but he considers the Chronics impact on the band and 438 00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:14,440 Speaker 1: on rap music as a whole undeniable. I think hip 439 00:27:14,440 --> 00:27:19,919 Speaker 1: hop just underwent this massive see change with the arrival 440 00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:22,439 Speaker 1: of Dr Dre as a solo artist, with the arrival 441 00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:27,040 Speaker 1: of Snoop Dogg with You Know. Gangster rap was not 442 00:27:27,160 --> 00:27:31,439 Speaker 1: a new thing in three but it it sort of 443 00:27:31,520 --> 00:27:36,920 Speaker 1: became the dominant sound in hip hop after that. Arrested 444 00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:40,119 Speaker 1: Development sound felt fresh when they descended on the scene 445 00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:45,440 Speaker 1: as socially conscious, less antagonistic hip hop acts were making waves, 446 00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:48,680 Speaker 1: But that sound an aesthetic swiftly fell out of fashion 447 00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:51,640 Speaker 1: after The Chronic introduced a novel take on gangster rap 448 00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:56,720 Speaker 1: and faunted tougher flash year more Materialistic Imagery, three years, 449 00:27:56,880 --> 00:28:00,159 Speaker 1: five months, and two days days had passed. It mean, 450 00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:02,800 Speaker 1: is as great as that album is, it was a 451 00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:04,760 Speaker 1: little bit of a fluke and a little bit of 452 00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:08,000 Speaker 1: just just arriving at the right moment. I think just 453 00:28:08,119 --> 00:28:12,000 Speaker 1: the culture, for whatever reason, just kind of was ready. 454 00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:15,160 Speaker 1: You know. I think bands like pm Don and day 455 00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:17,280 Speaker 1: Las Soul and Tribe called Quest to kind of prime 456 00:28:17,400 --> 00:28:20,720 Speaker 1: the pump for this more kind of left field style 457 00:28:20,720 --> 00:28:24,520 Speaker 1: of hip hop, and Tennessee was such a powerful single 458 00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:26,879 Speaker 1: that it just it kind of just kicked open the 459 00:28:26,920 --> 00:28:30,520 Speaker 1: door for this new group to just have some commercial 460 00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:33,840 Speaker 1: success with that sound and that vibe. But I think 461 00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:37,800 Speaker 1: in a weird way after that, you know, like mainstream 462 00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:41,960 Speaker 1: rap went in this much more kind of hard direction 463 00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:47,240 Speaker 1: and conscious rap when in this much more kind of 464 00:28:47,360 --> 00:28:53,880 Speaker 1: indie minded, almost sort of commercially averse direction. And then 465 00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:56,560 Speaker 1: where does that leave a group like arrested Development Speech 466 00:28:56,560 --> 00:29:00,840 Speaker 1: could recognize that the tides returning, but lacking time and resources, 467 00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:04,360 Speaker 1: all while still trying to maintain the ethos he and 468 00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:07,240 Speaker 1: the band weren't able to move with them. So we 469 00:29:07,360 --> 00:29:09,360 Speaker 1: got you know, we tried to do our best to 470 00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:14,480 Speaker 1: try to ride that fence of being who we are, 471 00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:17,720 Speaker 1: but still making sure we can sort of grab hold 472 00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:20,320 Speaker 1: to this new movement of things. I think it was 473 00:29:20,360 --> 00:29:22,920 Speaker 1: too little, too late as far as trying to do that. 474 00:29:23,240 --> 00:29:28,400 Speaker 1: Navigating hip hop's new metamorphosis was challenging enough, but arrested development. 475 00:29:28,480 --> 00:29:31,520 Speaker 1: We're also struggling as a group. We were internally going 476 00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:33,920 Speaker 1: through a lot, you know, because of the success of 477 00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:36,040 Speaker 1: the group and the moneys that were being made, and 478 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:40,320 Speaker 1: especially by me being the producer and writer, and those 479 00:29:40,360 --> 00:29:42,840 Speaker 1: that know about the music industry. You know, writers and 480 00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:46,440 Speaker 1: producers make certain moneys that the artists that didn't write 481 00:29:46,440 --> 00:29:49,400 Speaker 1: are produced don't make. So I'm making more money than 482 00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:51,960 Speaker 1: other people in the group, and they we don't know 483 00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:54,880 Speaker 1: how this all works, but they know that there's more money, 484 00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:57,960 Speaker 1: and there's jealousy and anger, and there's a lot going on. 485 00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:01,360 Speaker 1: At that time, Headliner arrested to Elepment's turntablist and co 486 00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:04,600 Speaker 1: founder was especially frustrated he didn't think he was getting 487 00:30:04,680 --> 00:30:08,720 Speaker 1: enough credit for his contributions. Speech has said Headliner demanded 488 00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:12,480 Speaker 1: more ownership of the band and refused to tour unless 489 00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:16,800 Speaker 1: profits were divided between them, but Headliner has claimed they 490 00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:19,760 Speaker 1: were partners from the beginning, and that speech threatened to 491 00:30:19,840 --> 00:30:23,080 Speaker 1: end the group if he couldn't increase his ownership, as 492 00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:27,600 Speaker 1: Headliner told the Atlanta publication Creative Loafing in two thousand six, quote, 493 00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:30,280 Speaker 1: the threat was everybody was going to be put out 494 00:30:30,280 --> 00:30:31,920 Speaker 1: of the band, and there was going to be no 495 00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:35,440 Speaker 1: more original members. So I sacrificed myself to give everyone 496 00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:39,520 Speaker 1: a shot, to which speech responded quote, I wouldn't consider 497 00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:42,400 Speaker 1: him a co founder. Headliner was instrumental to a D 498 00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:44,320 Speaker 1: because he was the first person that agreed to be 499 00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:52,480 Speaker 1: in the band, and he believed in my vision. Headliner 500 00:30:52,560 --> 00:30:57,040 Speaker 1: sued speech. They settled on a sixty split. The tension 501 00:30:57,120 --> 00:31:00,000 Speaker 1: created a rift in the group. Money became a huge issue. 502 00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:02,520 Speaker 1: You it's members were suddenly looking for their piece of 503 00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:05,880 Speaker 1: the pie and grew distrustful of one another, their sense 504 00:31:05,920 --> 00:31:09,240 Speaker 1: of community, their aversion to materialism and greed a D. 505 00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:12,920 Speaker 1: S Key principles began to deteriorate. Everyone in the group 506 00:31:12,960 --> 00:31:16,160 Speaker 1: had their own sort of clique of business people and 507 00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:18,520 Speaker 1: a lot of times family members that were their managers. 508 00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:21,400 Speaker 1: Now and you know, don't talk to this group member, 509 00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:24,240 Speaker 1: talk to the manager first. And you know, and everyone's 510 00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:27,400 Speaker 1: trying to strike deals and everyone's trying to figure out 511 00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:30,920 Speaker 1: ways to make more money, but in ways that had 512 00:31:31,000 --> 00:31:34,160 Speaker 1: little to do with the creativity and the actual point 513 00:31:34,200 --> 00:31:38,280 Speaker 1: of the music. One night backstage the Fox Theater in Atlanta, 514 00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:42,320 Speaker 1: contributing vocalist Dion Ferris lost it and reportedly through a 515 00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:45,240 Speaker 1: charit speech, she quit right before they were such a 516 00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:47,800 Speaker 1: perform she later scored big soul of it. I know 517 00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:53,720 Speaker 1: in headliner was ready to move on to We did 518 00:31:53,720 --> 00:31:57,640 Speaker 1: a show in Japan and or a number of shows 519 00:31:57,640 --> 00:32:01,080 Speaker 1: in Japan. Great run, but remember a headline is saying 520 00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:03,040 Speaker 1: at that run that he's like, this is my last 521 00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:04,840 Speaker 1: He was telling a fan actually was like this is 522 00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:07,360 Speaker 1: my last show. And he didn't tell me at the time, 523 00:32:07,440 --> 00:32:10,760 Speaker 1: but we weren't on best terms at that time, so 524 00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:14,320 Speaker 1: I overheard it and I was like, oh okay. That 525 00:32:14,360 --> 00:32:18,200 Speaker 1: would mark the end of the iteration of Arrested Development. 526 00:32:18,560 --> 00:32:21,800 Speaker 1: Speech would pursue a solo career and achieved great success 527 00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:25,440 Speaker 1: in Japan. When the group returned in two thousand, Speech 528 00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:28,720 Speaker 1: was leading it, but the lineup had changed. Original member 529 00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:32,600 Speaker 1: Baba O j eighties elder and Spiritual Guru would die 530 00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:40,360 Speaker 1: in two thousand eighteen. Arrested Developments legacy is complicated. For 531 00:32:40,520 --> 00:32:43,880 Speaker 1: two years in the early nineties, they were everywhere, but 532 00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:46,640 Speaker 1: you won't find many modern hip hop critics citing them 533 00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:49,680 Speaker 1: is highly influential in the genre. You won't find them 534 00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:52,800 Speaker 1: on all the best hip Hop albums or Best of 535 00:32:52,840 --> 00:32:56,200 Speaker 1: the nineties list, even though they came out of Atlanta 536 00:32:56,520 --> 00:33:00,560 Speaker 1: and racked up the accolades and units in three As 537 00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:02,680 Speaker 1: I say this, they don't even have a mention on 538 00:33:02,720 --> 00:33:06,720 Speaker 1: the Southern hip Hop Wikipedia page. Some have dismissed them 539 00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:10,480 Speaker 1: as super earnest, corny hippies or hip hop for suburban 540 00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:14,520 Speaker 1: white kids. I would agree that not all of their spiritual, 541 00:33:14,840 --> 00:33:18,000 Speaker 1: naturie preachy stuff holds up today. It can sometimes feel 542 00:33:18,040 --> 00:33:22,440 Speaker 1: a bit suffocating, simplistic, and idealistic. I would also agree 543 00:33:22,440 --> 00:33:24,800 Speaker 1: that their music took an anti gangster and for some 544 00:33:24,920 --> 00:33:27,720 Speaker 1: therefore an anti hip hop stance. Just look at the 545 00:33:27,720 --> 00:33:30,880 Speaker 1: song people every Day. I would also argue that that 546 00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:34,120 Speaker 1: was part of their appeal for suburban white kids. Their 547 00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:37,880 Speaker 1: music certainly appealed to this suburban white kid who growing 548 00:33:37,920 --> 00:33:41,120 Speaker 1: up found a lot of hip hop too aggressive. Eighties, 549 00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:43,800 Speaker 1: three years, five months, and two days in the Life 550 00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:46,680 Speaker 1: of was one of the first hip hop albums I owned. 551 00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:49,640 Speaker 1: I'd fall from many more as I got older, but 552 00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:52,960 Speaker 1: it was a gateway. Andy Herman had a similar experience 553 00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:55,560 Speaker 1: with the album. He wasn't initially a hip hop fan, 554 00:33:55,840 --> 00:33:59,280 Speaker 1: but in his teens, Adie hooked him. I think that's 555 00:34:00,520 --> 00:34:02,360 Speaker 1: that was maybe kind of both their strength and their 556 00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:05,560 Speaker 1: weakness in a way, I think was that they played 557 00:34:05,600 --> 00:34:11,719 Speaker 1: to an audience outside of uh that that sort of 558 00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:15,640 Speaker 1: core hip hop audience. And you know, maybe that's why 559 00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:20,560 Speaker 1: they haven't gotten their due in hip hop history, because 560 00:34:21,480 --> 00:34:24,120 Speaker 1: their appeal was so often outside of the hip hop 561 00:34:24,160 --> 00:34:26,919 Speaker 1: mainstream that I think like a lot of hip hop 562 00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:28,680 Speaker 1: heads maybe sort of look at them with a little 563 00:34:28,680 --> 00:34:31,640 Speaker 1: bit of suspicion. But I think they deserve a lot 564 00:34:31,640 --> 00:34:34,319 Speaker 1: of credit for opening the genre up to a lot 565 00:34:34,400 --> 00:34:38,520 Speaker 1: of people who who wouldn't have found an entry point otherwise. 566 00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:41,200 Speaker 1: If the rest of development are sometimes left out of 567 00:34:41,239 --> 00:34:44,759 Speaker 1: the conversation surrounding Southern hip hop, Speech asserts that the 568 00:34:44,800 --> 00:34:48,640 Speaker 1: band did break ground. In his mind, their success served 569 00:34:48,680 --> 00:34:51,520 Speaker 1: as a template and opened doors for future Southern hip 570 00:34:51,560 --> 00:34:54,200 Speaker 1: hop acts. What out of rest of development? In my opinion, 571 00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:58,040 Speaker 1: there's no outcast, there's no goody mob, there's no in 572 00:34:58,080 --> 00:35:01,960 Speaker 1: my opinion, Eric Abadou, there's no roots. I'm not suggesting 573 00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:04,440 Speaker 1: that they got their ideas from us. I think they 574 00:35:04,480 --> 00:35:08,600 Speaker 1: got their road paved by what we paved earlier. So 575 00:35:09,080 --> 00:35:12,279 Speaker 1: it gave them an opportunity to have a voice. And 576 00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:17,320 Speaker 1: I don't I remember literally um my label playing me 577 00:35:17,400 --> 00:35:21,440 Speaker 1: the D'Angelo Brown Sugar album before it came out, wondering 578 00:35:21,480 --> 00:35:23,920 Speaker 1: if they should sign it, you know. I remember the 579 00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:26,840 Speaker 1: label showing me the Roots stuff, wondered if they should 580 00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:32,440 Speaker 1: sign it. Um you know, because with us being as 581 00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:35,399 Speaker 1: successful as we were and yet rooted as we were, 582 00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:38,520 Speaker 1: these groups, they felt that there was really money to 583 00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:54,560 Speaker 1: be made in that in that arena. Up next, after 584 00:35:54,600 --> 00:35:57,920 Speaker 1: the break Arrested Development co founder and from that speech, 585 00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:00,399 Speaker 1: joins us to talk more about their mass of early 586 00:36:00,480 --> 00:36:04,040 Speaker 1: nineties success, the reasons for their undoing, and why he 587 00:36:04,080 --> 00:36:06,239 Speaker 1: thinks the group deserves a spot in the hip hop 588 00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:25,680 Speaker 1: history books. Welcome back to Where Were You in ninety two. 589 00:36:26,239 --> 00:36:31,880 Speaker 1: We've been discussing Arrested Developments, rapid rise, and swift unraveling 590 00:36:31,880 --> 00:36:34,319 Speaker 1: in the years that followed. Now it's time to hear 591 00:36:34,360 --> 00:36:37,880 Speaker 1: from the group's co founder and frontman, songwriter, rapper, and 592 00:36:37,960 --> 00:36:43,560 Speaker 1: producer Todd Thomas a k speech, so speech, I'm just 593 00:36:43,640 --> 00:36:48,839 Speaker 1: wondering where you were physically and mentally in N two 594 00:36:49,040 --> 00:36:53,320 Speaker 1: was a phenomenal vieer in many ways. I mean, I 595 00:36:53,360 --> 00:37:00,840 Speaker 1: was a hopeful artist, poor broke, trying to um make history, 596 00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:04,720 Speaker 1: you know, trying to breakthrough in the hip hop scene, 597 00:37:05,600 --> 00:37:10,239 Speaker 1: which at that time, the South wasn't really represented, so 598 00:37:10,480 --> 00:37:15,120 Speaker 1: it was East and West coast, and um, ghetto Boys 599 00:37:15,160 --> 00:37:18,920 Speaker 1: had a lot of success Luke way down in Miami 600 00:37:19,000 --> 00:37:22,360 Speaker 1: with more of a coastal city as opposed to what 601 00:37:22,719 --> 00:37:25,800 Speaker 1: I'm considering South right now. So um they had success, 602 00:37:25,840 --> 00:37:30,359 Speaker 1: and so um the South really hadn't made the name 603 00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:35,160 Speaker 1: just yet, and so I was really hoping to break through. 604 00:37:35,680 --> 00:37:38,799 Speaker 1: And um, this is pre LaFace, which was a very 605 00:37:38,840 --> 00:37:43,920 Speaker 1: big influence in Atlanta, and so I was connected with 606 00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:46,399 Speaker 1: as many people as possible. We got a record deal. 607 00:37:47,200 --> 00:37:49,520 Speaker 1: Um it was with a record label that took a 608 00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:52,719 Speaker 1: chance on us, really because Chrysalis at the time, which 609 00:37:52,760 --> 00:37:56,440 Speaker 1: is the label we signed with, they they didn't have 610 00:37:56,480 --> 00:37:59,919 Speaker 1: any hip hop artists, um per se, especially any coming 611 00:38:00,000 --> 00:38:02,960 Speaker 1: out of the South. So um they did have Gang 612 00:38:03,000 --> 00:38:05,239 Speaker 1: Star on a subsidiary label of theirs, and that they 613 00:38:05,239 --> 00:38:09,640 Speaker 1: were one of my favorites, so um yeah, I was 614 00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:13,000 Speaker 1: trying to break through and hoping for the best and 615 00:38:13,160 --> 00:38:19,320 Speaker 1: striving to make our presence undeniable in the music scene 616 00:38:19,880 --> 00:38:23,000 Speaker 1: there was there really just wasn't a Southern hip hop 617 00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:25,160 Speaker 1: wasn't really the thing at that point, and very much 618 00:38:25,239 --> 00:38:29,759 Speaker 1: East coast, West coast. What do you think you and 619 00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:32,080 Speaker 1: the rest of the rest of the band brought to 620 00:38:32,120 --> 00:38:37,319 Speaker 1: the table that intrigues chrysalists to sign you. I think 621 00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:39,200 Speaker 1: what we brought to the table is a lot. I 622 00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:44,720 Speaker 1: think we brought um melodic, melodic rhyming to the table 623 00:38:44,760 --> 00:38:47,720 Speaker 1: of hip hop. I think we brought a soulful energy 624 00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:53,640 Speaker 1: and like soulful um solo vocals to hip hop music. 625 00:38:54,320 --> 00:38:59,600 Speaker 1: And we brought another level of spirituality to the lyrics 626 00:38:59,640 --> 00:39:03,400 Speaker 1: of hip pop. We brought um I think a wider 627 00:39:03,440 --> 00:39:07,200 Speaker 1: scope of afrocentric city to hip hop. I think we 628 00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:10,560 Speaker 1: brought UH men and women being in the same group 629 00:39:12,040 --> 00:39:15,400 Speaker 1: UH doing hip hop music, which was very rare to 630 00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:18,160 Speaker 1: my knowledge. Literally, the only other rap group that ever 631 00:39:18,200 --> 00:39:20,640 Speaker 1: did it prior to us was Funky four plus one, 632 00:39:20,680 --> 00:39:24,120 Speaker 1: which had done it back in the early eighties late seventies, 633 00:39:24,520 --> 00:39:27,759 Speaker 1: and we were a live band, which the only hip 634 00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:30,080 Speaker 1: hop act that I knew that did that was stet 635 00:39:30,520 --> 00:39:33,520 Speaker 1: Roots weren't out yet. Statsisnic was the first to do it. 636 00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:35,800 Speaker 1: We were second. We had an elder in the group, 637 00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:39,120 Speaker 1: So we brought this whole sort of communal community energy 638 00:39:39,640 --> 00:39:45,040 Speaker 1: to to hip hop where it wasn't this generation gap anymore. 639 00:39:45,840 --> 00:39:49,200 Speaker 1: And um, so I think, among other things, that's what 640 00:39:49,280 --> 00:39:52,400 Speaker 1: we brought. Now, that's not why Chrysalis signed us, and 641 00:39:52,400 --> 00:39:55,920 Speaker 1: that's why I separated the answer. Chrysalis just wanted to 642 00:39:56,000 --> 00:40:00,439 Speaker 1: capitalize on the popularity of what was happening with day Soul. 643 00:40:01,280 --> 00:40:04,040 Speaker 1: Um They're three ft High and Rising album was really 644 00:40:04,080 --> 00:40:06,160 Speaker 1: a pop success, and it had a lot of crossover 645 00:40:06,160 --> 00:40:09,120 Speaker 1: appeal with songs like me and Myself and I but 646 00:40:09,200 --> 00:40:12,279 Speaker 1: also you know, I know, and and and um, you 647 00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:16,000 Speaker 1: know other stuff. So basically, I think they wanted to 648 00:40:17,719 --> 00:40:20,520 Speaker 1: try to get on that bandwagon in a sense. But 649 00:40:20,680 --> 00:40:24,560 Speaker 1: we had our own energy and um, while we were 650 00:40:24,600 --> 00:40:27,719 Speaker 1: definitely influenced by Native tongues and by Jungle Brothers and 651 00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:32,719 Speaker 1: day Lin Tribe, we had our own thing that we 652 00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:35,520 Speaker 1: brought to the table as well. Three years, five months 653 00:40:35,560 --> 00:40:38,040 Speaker 1: and two days in the Life of was a massive success. 654 00:40:38,680 --> 00:40:40,840 Speaker 1: How did you react to that? Here you were thinking 655 00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:42,759 Speaker 1: you weren't you know, you waited three years to get 656 00:40:42,760 --> 00:40:47,680 Speaker 1: this contract and then you're gonna go with another single 657 00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:52,120 Speaker 1: and suddenly you're one of the biggest bands in the world. 658 00:40:55,000 --> 00:40:57,200 Speaker 1: It was unbelievable and it was surreal. I mean, you 659 00:40:57,320 --> 00:40:59,799 Speaker 1: gotta put yourself in my head at the time. This 660 00:40:59,840 --> 00:41:03,719 Speaker 1: is our first record, it's our first time dealing with 661 00:41:04,520 --> 00:41:07,560 Speaker 1: a record label, it's our first time making money, it's 662 00:41:07,640 --> 00:41:10,400 Speaker 1: our first time touring the nation, and I mean I 663 00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:14,360 Speaker 1: loved it, but it was very fast paced. Talk about 664 00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:16,719 Speaker 1: learning a lot at a fast pace. I mean it 665 00:41:16,840 --> 00:41:18,960 Speaker 1: was just learning everything from how does this industry work? 666 00:41:19,000 --> 00:41:21,000 Speaker 1: And you know, still learning and I'm thirty years in 667 00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:24,239 Speaker 1: and learning how to tour and you know, how to 668 00:41:24,239 --> 00:41:26,240 Speaker 1: get along with a band, how to keep the band together, 669 00:41:26,280 --> 00:41:29,000 Speaker 1: how to you know, navigate interviews. I mean, there's so 670 00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:32,640 Speaker 1: many things that you're learning. Offered the first time you 671 00:41:32,719 --> 00:41:36,279 Speaker 1: followed the record. When you think Galamdooney, um and ninety four, 672 00:41:37,200 --> 00:41:40,319 Speaker 1: a lot of high expectations and high hopes and um. 673 00:41:40,680 --> 00:41:43,040 Speaker 1: And you know, it didn't it didn't sell as well 674 00:41:43,080 --> 00:41:47,560 Speaker 1: and it didn't really yield um. You know, many hits. 675 00:41:48,200 --> 00:41:51,279 Speaker 1: Why do you think that the follow up didn't sell 676 00:41:51,280 --> 00:41:55,879 Speaker 1: as well? I have a few thoughts. I mean, first 677 00:41:55,880 --> 00:41:57,080 Speaker 1: of all, I don't think we should have released it 678 00:41:57,120 --> 00:41:58,960 Speaker 1: when we did. We released it too earlier. I mean 679 00:41:58,960 --> 00:42:03,279 Speaker 1: we released it about a year after, you know, well, 680 00:42:03,400 --> 00:42:05,000 Speaker 1: being our first one was in ninety two, and then 681 00:42:05,719 --> 00:42:07,880 Speaker 1: we released but we were on tour like super heavy 682 00:42:07,880 --> 00:42:10,200 Speaker 1: and doing a lot of promo for that year, so 683 00:42:10,920 --> 00:42:12,440 Speaker 1: you know, there wasn't a lot of time to create it. 684 00:42:12,440 --> 00:42:14,520 Speaker 1: That's number one. Number two, I think the industry, it's 685 00:42:14,560 --> 00:42:20,880 Speaker 1: sort of hip hop in particular, the culture changed. You know, 686 00:42:21,040 --> 00:42:23,640 Speaker 1: hip hop at that time was transitioning into a Wu 687 00:42:23,760 --> 00:42:28,640 Speaker 1: Tang era, a bad boy era soon after a nas era, 688 00:42:29,239 --> 00:42:32,320 Speaker 1: and it was more gritty back to New York, Tim's 689 00:42:32,520 --> 00:42:35,080 Speaker 1: on the ground, you know, a little bit of a 690 00:42:35,160 --> 00:42:37,279 Speaker 1: hustle thing going on in the streets. That that was 691 00:42:37,360 --> 00:42:39,680 Speaker 1: the the energy that was being brought out in the 692 00:42:39,760 --> 00:42:43,600 Speaker 1: New York scene. And you know, I think that it 693 00:42:43,760 --> 00:42:46,719 Speaker 1: just the the aesthetic of hip hop changed right under 694 00:42:46,719 --> 00:42:49,799 Speaker 1: our sort of under our feet as we were transitioning 695 00:42:49,840 --> 00:42:54,239 Speaker 1: from album one to album two. Um so, and then 696 00:42:54,280 --> 00:42:57,280 Speaker 1: I also think, to be honest, consciousness in hip hop 697 00:42:57,320 --> 00:43:02,080 Speaker 1: in general started to become marginalized from the industry. The 698 00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:05,959 Speaker 1: industry was pushing back groups like Public Enemy and wasn't 699 00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:11,520 Speaker 1: really promoting their music as well. Arrested Development, Uh, Brand Nubians, 700 00:43:11,680 --> 00:43:15,359 Speaker 1: X Clan Paris, I mean, all of these acts were 701 00:43:15,840 --> 00:43:18,920 Speaker 1: sort of being relegated to the side, and what was 702 00:43:18,920 --> 00:43:22,560 Speaker 1: sort of taking its place was this more mogul oriented 703 00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:26,160 Speaker 1: business oriented. If you remember the imagery back then, either 704 00:43:26,200 --> 00:43:28,560 Speaker 1: you were on the streets with the Thames, or you 705 00:43:28,600 --> 00:43:30,440 Speaker 1: were in a private jet or a yacht on the 706 00:43:30,840 --> 00:43:33,520 Speaker 1: on the ocean, and you had the bikini women and 707 00:43:33,560 --> 00:43:37,440 Speaker 1: everyone's you know, a mogul and an enterprising business person 708 00:43:37,520 --> 00:43:40,440 Speaker 1: type of thing. And so there was just a total 709 00:43:41,080 --> 00:43:44,560 Speaker 1: shift of you know, emphasis of what hip hop was 710 00:43:44,840 --> 00:43:48,320 Speaker 1: sort of doing at the time and not just seemed 711 00:43:48,360 --> 00:43:50,799 Speaker 1: so ampathetical to what I lost the development was doing. 712 00:43:51,920 --> 00:43:56,839 Speaker 1: It was all about, I mean, the materialism and capitalism 713 00:43:56,920 --> 00:44:00,720 Speaker 1: was that's just the antithesis of what used to literally 714 00:44:00,880 --> 00:44:07,600 Speaker 1: right one with nature, spirituality, community, family, friendship, close ties, 715 00:44:09,120 --> 00:44:13,480 Speaker 1: the pure. Yeah, you have to really think about the 716 00:44:13,640 --> 00:44:18,080 Speaker 1: core value, like the ethos of arrested development, and that 717 00:44:18,160 --> 00:44:21,840 Speaker 1: was being put in question suddenly was Yeah, but the 718 00:44:21,840 --> 00:44:24,400 Speaker 1: fame and the money and and and you know, we 719 00:44:24,400 --> 00:44:28,279 Speaker 1: we touched on this earlier. You know, like I said, 720 00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:31,160 Speaker 1: there's there's you know, bands come about in different ways. 721 00:44:31,200 --> 00:44:34,439 Speaker 1: You know, not every band comes about this same way. 722 00:44:34,520 --> 00:44:37,719 Speaker 1: So for us, I'm sort of the mad scientist guy 723 00:44:37,719 --> 00:44:40,719 Speaker 1: in the room right in music. The rest of the 724 00:44:40,760 --> 00:44:45,560 Speaker 1: group members were conceptual more so than they were like 725 00:44:45,600 --> 00:44:48,440 Speaker 1: a band member. So when we came to live shows, 726 00:44:48,480 --> 00:44:52,160 Speaker 1: they were way more involved because you know, like Robs, 727 00:44:52,200 --> 00:44:54,680 Speaker 1: one of our members, played drums, Well the drums weren't 728 00:44:54,680 --> 00:44:56,839 Speaker 1: on the record, they weren't recorded on the record at all, 729 00:44:57,360 --> 00:44:59,480 Speaker 1: but in live shows he was playing them, and then 730 00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:02,719 Speaker 1: you know, so on and so forth. So that kind 731 00:45:02,719 --> 00:45:09,160 Speaker 1: of thing made the group you know, fascinating conceptually, but 732 00:45:10,280 --> 00:45:13,800 Speaker 1: you know, for the real like part of it, who's 733 00:45:13,840 --> 00:45:16,040 Speaker 1: making the songs, it's just a lot of times just me. 734 00:45:16,120 --> 00:45:18,399 Speaker 1: So it was it was really tough to be able 735 00:45:18,440 --> 00:45:22,719 Speaker 1: to navigate that that whole reality now that we're huge, 736 00:45:23,360 --> 00:45:26,520 Speaker 1: because yeah, it does reflect that. Oh wow, well Rose 737 00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:30,600 Speaker 1: who plays drums, who actually got in a band about 738 00:45:30,600 --> 00:45:33,200 Speaker 1: a month before we got a deal, wasn't on any 739 00:45:33,200 --> 00:45:36,640 Speaker 1: of the records per se. But of course he wants 740 00:45:36,680 --> 00:45:38,799 Speaker 1: to make a lot of money. You know, this is 741 00:45:38,840 --> 00:45:41,520 Speaker 1: his chance, this is his shot, but there's no avenues 742 00:45:41,560 --> 00:45:43,479 Speaker 1: for him to really make that money because he didn't 743 00:45:43,480 --> 00:45:45,440 Speaker 1: write the song and didn't produce it. He wasn't on 744 00:45:45,480 --> 00:45:48,319 Speaker 1: the record. So it's a tough thing to sort of 745 00:45:48,400 --> 00:45:51,720 Speaker 1: navigate because like, well, how do we get everybody happy 746 00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:57,719 Speaker 1: and yet keep moving on with what the successful formula 747 00:45:57,800 --> 00:45:59,600 Speaker 1: was in the first place, that got us here in 748 00:45:59,600 --> 00:46:01,640 Speaker 1: the first place that was That was sort of the 749 00:46:01,640 --> 00:46:03,840 Speaker 1: thing I was constantly trying to balance, like how do 750 00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:08,880 Speaker 1: we do that? You know? So I think you you reunited? 751 00:46:08,960 --> 00:46:12,280 Speaker 1: And so five years later sent you right in two thousand, 752 00:46:12,960 --> 00:46:14,880 Speaker 1: did you feel less pressure at that point? Did you 753 00:46:14,920 --> 00:46:18,600 Speaker 1: feel even more pressure? Because the eight years had passed 754 00:46:18,719 --> 00:46:22,359 Speaker 1: and in the landscape of change. So by the time 755 00:46:22,400 --> 00:46:24,880 Speaker 1: two thousand came, I didn't We didn't even release that 756 00:46:24,920 --> 00:46:27,800 Speaker 1: album the Arrest of Development new record um in the 757 00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:29,600 Speaker 1: United States at all. We didn't even release it in 758 00:46:29,640 --> 00:46:32,200 Speaker 1: the United States. We only focused on Japan. So in 759 00:46:32,239 --> 00:46:35,960 Speaker 1: that sense, it was great. Japan was totally in lockstep 760 00:46:36,000 --> 00:46:39,360 Speaker 1: with us the whole time, so when Arrest of Development stopped, 761 00:46:39,360 --> 00:46:43,400 Speaker 1: they were super on Arrest of development. Single Ama duty 762 00:46:43,400 --> 00:46:46,640 Speaker 1: did very well in Japan, so that was great. Then 763 00:46:46,680 --> 00:46:48,799 Speaker 1: I did a solo album in ninety six. They loved that. 764 00:46:48,840 --> 00:46:50,719 Speaker 1: It went to number one for seven weeks. I did 765 00:46:50,760 --> 00:46:56,000 Speaker 1: another solo album, they love that. Then I did uh 766 00:46:56,239 --> 00:46:58,520 Speaker 1: solo album in two thousand called Spiritual People. It was 767 00:46:58,520 --> 00:47:02,680 Speaker 1: my biggest selling solo album to date. So when we 768 00:47:02,760 --> 00:47:06,440 Speaker 1: dropped the Arrested Development album, it was anticipated heavily in 769 00:47:06,480 --> 00:47:09,440 Speaker 1: that marketplace, and so we toured really heavy on that record. 770 00:47:09,800 --> 00:47:11,959 Speaker 1: It was great for the group members because they didn't 771 00:47:11,960 --> 00:47:13,919 Speaker 1: have that solo career sort of run that I just had. 772 00:47:14,440 --> 00:47:16,279 Speaker 1: They were just coming back into the fold. But it 773 00:47:16,360 --> 00:47:19,600 Speaker 1: felt really big, and the press was all around us, 774 00:47:19,600 --> 00:47:23,439 Speaker 1: and the fans were extremely excited, so it felt really 775 00:47:23,480 --> 00:47:25,239 Speaker 1: good as long as we weren't in the States. As 776 00:47:25,239 --> 00:47:29,759 Speaker 1: long as we were, it was like everybody was on us. 777 00:47:29,760 --> 00:47:32,040 Speaker 1: And Japan is a big place, a lot of great 778 00:47:32,120 --> 00:47:35,280 Speaker 1: music fans, so it felt very It felt very good, 779 00:47:35,440 --> 00:47:37,319 Speaker 1: you know, it felt really good. So that's how we 780 00:47:37,360 --> 00:47:39,280 Speaker 1: felt when we got back into it in two thousands, 781 00:47:39,480 --> 00:47:41,919 Speaker 1: and it's it's what allowed us to sustain, like even 782 00:47:41,920 --> 00:47:43,680 Speaker 1: the new record for the f and Love and and 783 00:47:43,760 --> 00:47:47,080 Speaker 1: Don't Fight Your Demons, But prior to that. It allows us. 784 00:47:47,280 --> 00:47:49,360 Speaker 1: It allowed us to sustain our integrity or what we 785 00:47:49,520 --> 00:47:52,920 Speaker 1: consider integrity, and allowed us to to sustain the sound 786 00:47:52,960 --> 00:47:55,520 Speaker 1: that we liked, the aesthetic that we like, and it 787 00:47:55,560 --> 00:47:58,040 Speaker 1: makes a really fun story for people that come to 788 00:47:58,080 --> 00:48:01,400 Speaker 1: our shows. Now they're getting to hear of this catalog 789 00:48:01,480 --> 00:48:04,080 Speaker 1: that they probably haven't heard, especially if they're in the States, 790 00:48:04,480 --> 00:48:06,800 Speaker 1: they haven't heard a lot of it. But it feels 791 00:48:06,960 --> 00:48:09,720 Speaker 1: like it feels like they never left. In some ways, 792 00:48:10,040 --> 00:48:12,840 Speaker 1: you take Japan out of the situation, we probably in 793 00:48:12,920 --> 00:48:17,520 Speaker 1: every way just would have not been in existence. Thank 794 00:48:17,520 --> 00:48:21,840 Speaker 1: you Japan. Yeah, thank you Japan, Japan, because we're happy, 795 00:48:22,080 --> 00:48:35,360 Speaker 1: you're happy to still have you around. I think Tennessee 796 00:48:35,560 --> 00:48:38,960 Speaker 1: was probably the first hip hop record that I was 797 00:48:39,000 --> 00:48:43,160 Speaker 1: exposed to in my limited knowledge of it at the time, 798 00:48:44,320 --> 00:48:48,759 Speaker 1: where there was like something deeper being talked about, Like 799 00:48:48,880 --> 00:48:51,839 Speaker 1: I can't think of any other like top ten hit 800 00:48:51,920 --> 00:48:55,200 Speaker 1: singles that are you know, literally like a guy like 801 00:48:55,719 --> 00:49:00,640 Speaker 1: you know, addressing God and sort of you know, questioning 802 00:49:00,719 --> 00:49:04,560 Speaker 1: his relationship to God and his faith. He sort of 803 00:49:04,600 --> 00:49:07,200 Speaker 1: explores the past in that song in kind of a 804 00:49:07,200 --> 00:49:11,239 Speaker 1: way that sort of mixes like nostalgia and trauma I 805 00:49:11,239 --> 00:49:14,320 Speaker 1: would say in a way that I think is really powerful. 806 00:49:21,640 --> 00:49:27,160 Speaker 1: The year is the latest incarnation of Arrusted Development is thriving. 807 00:49:27,600 --> 00:49:31,440 Speaker 1: They released an album for the fin Love and have 808 00:49:31,520 --> 00:49:35,279 Speaker 1: been performing it. The response has been great. Fans of 809 00:49:35,320 --> 00:49:38,760 Speaker 1: the band's old school stuff are really loving their new material. 810 00:49:39,440 --> 00:49:43,000 Speaker 1: Young new school audiences love discovering what was happening in 811 00:49:43,040 --> 00:49:48,320 Speaker 1: the nineties. It's good vibes, but there is pain in Tennessee. 812 00:49:49,080 --> 00:49:51,879 Speaker 1: Tyree Nichols, a twenty nine year old black man who 813 00:49:51,920 --> 00:49:55,400 Speaker 1: lived in Memphis, sustained severe injuries after police beat him 814 00:49:55,440 --> 00:49:59,359 Speaker 1: after a traffic stop. Three days after the incident, he died. 815 00:50:00,440 --> 00:50:05,040 Speaker 1: Video footage released in late January shows the police kicking, punching, 816 00:50:05,239 --> 00:50:08,600 Speaker 1: and pepper sprang him as he screamed. The five officers 817 00:50:08,719 --> 00:50:13,719 Speaker 1: charged with nichols murder are also black. The story is complicated, maddening, 818 00:50:13,880 --> 00:50:17,800 Speaker 1: and heartbreaking. How can such senseless violence exists in this world? 819 00:50:18,280 --> 00:50:22,600 Speaker 1: What has caused it? How does Nichols family, the Memphis community, 820 00:50:22,960 --> 00:50:28,680 Speaker 1: the country move forward after such tragedy. My mind does 821 00:50:28,719 --> 00:50:31,080 Speaker 1: what it often does when it's trying to process something 822 00:50:31,080 --> 00:50:34,800 Speaker 1: so big, so sad and inconceivable. It turns to music. 823 00:50:35,600 --> 00:50:38,080 Speaker 1: I think of a rusted Developments. Thirty year old Tennessee, 824 00:50:38,520 --> 00:50:42,640 Speaker 1: a song about processing the big, sad and inconceivable. It 825 00:50:42,719 --> 00:50:46,200 Speaker 1: does not offer answers, but it offers empathy, some sort 826 00:50:46,239 --> 00:50:50,279 Speaker 1: of solace and connection, a step toward healing. I think 827 00:50:50,280 --> 00:50:52,920 Speaker 1: of its songwriter Speech and wonder where his mind is. 828 00:50:54,680 --> 00:50:57,160 Speaker 1: I learned that is the video of Nichols beating is released. 829 00:50:57,520 --> 00:51:00,200 Speaker 1: Speech has taken to Twitter to share his thoughts. He 830 00:51:00,239 --> 00:51:03,440 Speaker 1: has written, Tyree Nichols, is any one of us if 831 00:51:03,480 --> 00:51:06,600 Speaker 1: the system doesn't fundamentally change, My heart goes out to 832 00:51:06,640 --> 00:51:09,759 Speaker 1: his fami and loved ones. His next tweet comes a 833 00:51:09,760 --> 00:51:12,640 Speaker 1: little less than an hour later. It is the chorus 834 00:51:12,719 --> 00:51:17,840 Speaker 1: of Tennessee. What do you think the legacy of arrested 835 00:51:17,920 --> 00:51:21,960 Speaker 1: development has been? Yeah? I don't. I don't know for sure. 836 00:51:22,120 --> 00:51:25,160 Speaker 1: I mean, obviously that's for the people to decide. I 837 00:51:25,200 --> 00:51:29,200 Speaker 1: would like it to be that. You know, it's about revolution, 838 00:51:29,400 --> 00:51:35,480 Speaker 1: about you know, really striving to uplift you know, all 839 00:51:35,560 --> 00:51:38,840 Speaker 1: of us and take us all to you know, another place. 840 00:52:25,960 --> 00:52:28,000 Speaker 1: Where Were You in ninety two was a production of 841 00:52:28,040 --> 00:52:31,520 Speaker 1: I Heart Radio. The executive producers are Noel Brown and 842 00:52:31,600 --> 00:52:35,200 Speaker 1: Jordan run Todd. The show was researched written and hosted 843 00:52:35,239 --> 00:52:38,440 Speaker 1: by me Jason Lafier, with editing and sound design by 844 00:52:38,440 --> 00:52:41,959 Speaker 1: Michael Alder June. If you like what you heard, please 845 00:52:42,000 --> 00:52:44,880 Speaker 1: subscribe and leave us a review. For more podcasts for 846 00:52:45,000 --> 00:52:47,399 Speaker 1: my heart Radio, check out the I heart Radio app, 847 00:52:47,680 --> 00:52:50,400 Speaker 1: Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows,