WEBVTT - INTERVIEW: Michael Eric Dyson Compares Kamala To Drake, Talks Intellectual Rappers, Fighting For The Vote + More 0:00:00.480 --> 0:00:02.520 Wake that ass up in the morning. 0:00:02.880 --> 0:00:08.639 Breakfast Club Morning, everybody is dej Envy, Jess hilarious, Charlamagne 0:00:08.680 --> 0:00:11.200 the guy we are the Breakfast Club, Lon Laros of 0:00:11.280 --> 0:00:12.960 course filling in for Jess. And we got a special 0:00:13.000 --> 0:00:16.079 guest in the building, indeed, the brother Michael Eric Dison. 0:00:15.880 --> 0:00:19.439 Keeping light skin, Brothers alive. How are you feeling, brother man, 0:00:19.480 --> 0:00:22.080 I'm feeling like we're still riding with Drake, so let's 0:00:22.280 --> 0:00:23.240 hang on as long. 0:00:23.120 --> 0:00:23.639 As we can. 0:00:26.640 --> 0:00:29.000 Michael Davey got a new book I called represent the 0:00:29.120 --> 0:00:31.200 Unfinished Fight for the Vote. 0:00:31.280 --> 0:00:36.599 Yes, sir, yes, sir man, you know, look, thank the 0:00:36.640 --> 0:00:39.440 publishing gods. I was like, it's pretty good timing for 0:00:39.520 --> 0:00:42.720 what we're doing. My co author Mark Favreau, brilliant writer 0:00:42.840 --> 0:00:45.519 and gifted historian, and we wanted to talk about in 0:00:45.600 --> 0:00:48.320 issues that's central to what we're dealing with here in 0:00:48.360 --> 0:00:51.680 America today, and that's voting and why people should vote, 0:00:51.720 --> 0:00:55.120 how they fought forward over time and what it means 0:00:55.160 --> 0:00:55.760 to us today. 0:00:55.960 --> 0:00:58.800 And people think voter suppression might be new, like they've 0:00:58.800 --> 0:01:02.960 seen January sixth and all these other recent incidents that 0:01:02.960 --> 0:01:05.360 have tried to suppress the vote. But this book discusses 0:01:05.760 --> 0:01:08.080 other attempts to suppress the vote, and yeah, to vote 0:01:08.080 --> 0:01:09.840 that go way back. Can you talk about that. 0:01:09.880 --> 0:01:13.640 Yes, sir, great, great point. Let's just talk about your state, 0:01:13.760 --> 0:01:17.520 South Carolina in the eighteen I think it was seventy 0:01:17.520 --> 0:01:22.040 six election where they were deliberately trying to suppress the 0:01:22.080 --> 0:01:27.120 black vote, right, and these were the Democrats who were 0:01:27.520 --> 0:01:30.360 in power, who were trying to maintain that power. And 0:01:30.440 --> 0:01:32.399 back then it was the Democrats who were the party 0:01:32.440 --> 0:01:36.240 of the racists, and what we subsequently knew was Dixiocrats. 0:01:36.640 --> 0:01:39.959 So they invented this militia called the Red Shirts, and 0:01:39.959 --> 0:01:43.839 they were riding rough shot over black people, doing illegal 0:01:43.920 --> 0:01:47.880 stuff to suppress the vote, you know, scaring them, intimidating them. 0:01:47.880 --> 0:01:49.440 And they said, I want to read this to you 0:01:49.520 --> 0:01:52.840 because this is rather remarkable. I don't want bore people, 0:01:52.880 --> 0:01:55.920 but this is what a copy of their plan was 0:01:55.920 --> 0:01:58.560 circulated over state. This is what it says. Every Democrat 0:01:58.960 --> 0:02:02.160 must feel honored by excuse me, to control the vote 0:02:02.160 --> 0:02:05.720 at least one negro. Never threaten a man individually. If 0:02:05.720 --> 0:02:08.400 he deserves to be threatened, the necessities of the times 0:02:08.440 --> 0:02:11.799 required that he should die. A dead radical is very 0:02:11.840 --> 0:02:16.240 harmless a threatened radical is often troublesome, sometimes dangerous, and 0:02:16.320 --> 0:02:19.839 always vindictive. So they were doing their thing, and then 0:02:21.040 --> 0:02:25.639 the Democratic candidate for governor, Wade Hampton, had these people 0:02:25.680 --> 0:02:28.919 out in force, and they had rifle clubs aimed at 0:02:28.960 --> 0:02:31.880 trying to suppress the Black vote. So January sixth did 0:02:31.919 --> 0:02:34.080 not start it. It's part and parcel of what we 0:02:34.160 --> 0:02:37.800 have done as a government in America. And unbeknownst to 0:02:37.840 --> 0:02:41.320 a lot of people, January six ain't no outlier unless 0:02:41.360 --> 0:02:43.680 you say the outlining and not telling the truth about 0:02:43.680 --> 0:02:45.440 what's going on in American politics. 0:02:45.680 --> 0:02:48.919 I gotta ask, you know, what do you think about 0:02:48.919 --> 0:02:50.519 what's going on today with the race? Of course, the 0:02:50.560 --> 0:02:52.280 stuff from the beginning. We haven't seen you in a while, right, 0:02:52.600 --> 0:02:56.079 So of course, Joe Biden, you know we've been up here. 0:02:56.639 --> 0:02:58.079 I would think for like the last year and a half, 0:02:58.080 --> 0:03:00.440 A says something's not right, he's not right. 0:03:00.680 --> 0:03:00.920 Uh. 0:03:01.040 --> 0:03:02.400 They gave us a lot of flak for it. Then 0:03:02.440 --> 0:03:04.520 they came back and said, you're absolutely positively right. 0:03:04.639 --> 0:03:06.040 I didn't just say you wasn't not right. I said 0:03:06.040 --> 0:03:07.519 he should step out of the race because I didn't 0:03:07.520 --> 0:03:07.960 think he could win. 0:03:08.200 --> 0:03:12.120 Him showed early signs of dementia. We thought they pushed 0:03:12.160 --> 0:03:15.639 him out. Kamala Harris, head new energy. What is your 0:03:15.639 --> 0:03:17.119 thoughts on the whole thing? 0:03:17.639 --> 0:03:23.760 Let me probably a little look at it from my homie. 0:03:24.520 --> 0:03:28.760 I know that white manner to the wheels fellow, I 0:03:28.760 --> 0:03:32.000 didn't care. Just put weekend at Bernie's. Push him on 0:03:32.080 --> 0:03:35.040 the damn you know, wheelchair, push him in the room, 0:03:35.080 --> 0:03:39.080 because that was still acceptable over what we were facing. Now, 0:03:39.440 --> 0:03:41.840 there's no question that there were questions and concerns. You 0:03:41.920 --> 0:03:44.400 all were on the front line raising those questions. Other 0:03:44.440 --> 0:03:47.400 people were doing it more than nefariously behind the scenes, 0:03:47.600 --> 0:03:51.760 ostensibly supporting, but all the time stabbing you with the knife. 0:03:52.600 --> 0:03:54.640 Joe Biden I think could have still won. It would 0:03:54.640 --> 0:03:56.440 have been much closer. It had been a much tighter 0:03:56.600 --> 0:04:00.160 race house. And ever, as James Brown would say, there 0:04:00.280 --> 0:04:04.240 is no doubt that the shifting energy to Kamala Harris 0:04:04.320 --> 0:04:08.040 is remarkable. Let's be real, it's got a surprise. Kamala Harris. 0:04:08.440 --> 0:04:10.080 You ever done something you go like, damn, I ain't know. 0:04:10.960 --> 0:04:13.200 I didn't know I was gonna come like that. Nobody 0:04:13.240 --> 0:04:15.240 could have predicted it. You know what they were predicting 0:04:15.600 --> 0:04:17.479 White women ain't gonna stand up for that black woman 0:04:17.800 --> 0:04:21.919 because white women were voting disproportionately in their numbers for 0:04:22.000 --> 0:04:25.800 Donald Trump the last time around. They didn't support Hillary 0:04:25.839 --> 0:04:28.440 to the degree that they should have anyway. So what 0:04:28.600 --> 0:04:31.039 makes us think that they're gonna support this black woman 0:04:31.440 --> 0:04:35.960 from California? Well, lo and behold they is and Republican 0:04:36.000 --> 0:04:38.080 women are out there doing their things. I hope it's 0:04:38.120 --> 0:04:41.279 a reverse Tom Bradley effect, you know, the Tom Bradley 0:04:41.279 --> 0:04:44.240 effect and named after the governor of California, which meant 0:04:44.240 --> 0:04:46.039 white people would say, oh, yes, we'll vote for the 0:04:46.080 --> 0:04:48.560 negro work I got to support him, and then going 0:04:48.560 --> 0:04:50.599 to booth and then boom, vote for the white guy. 0:04:51.120 --> 0:04:53.600 I think the reverse might happen this time around, that 0:04:53.640 --> 0:04:56.680 white women might tell their husbands and other interested parties, yes, 0:04:56.760 --> 0:04:59.680 yes I'm a Trumper, and then going there and support 0:04:59.720 --> 0:05:03.200 common Mala Harris. Why because she's reasonable, Why because she's intelligent, 0:05:03.240 --> 0:05:06.719 Why because she's self possessed, she's not off the hinge 0:05:07.200 --> 0:05:12.120 as Trump is, and she continues to escalate a war 0:05:12.240 --> 0:05:16.040 against the lunacy that is Donald Trump. So it is astonishing, 0:05:16.120 --> 0:05:20.360 it's amazing. I've known Vice President Harris for some twenty 0:05:20.360 --> 0:05:23.560 odd years. She's been a woman of integrity, she's been 0:05:23.600 --> 0:05:27.320 a woman of serious regard for the people, and she's 0:05:27.320 --> 0:05:29.359 been willing to take on some complicated stuff. I know 0:05:29.360 --> 0:05:31.279 a lot of people are trying to portray her as 0:05:31.760 --> 0:05:33.919 you know, tough on crime and so on and so forth. 0:05:34.480 --> 0:05:36.880 You what amazes me about that black people be the 0:05:36.880 --> 0:05:39.760 first people called the police anyway, right, And I mean 0:05:40.120 --> 0:05:42.080 you be there, like Mama, I told you that sandwich 0:05:42.080 --> 0:05:45.400 wasn't right. I'm calling the cops on you. So obviously 0:05:45.440 --> 0:05:47.760 I'm being facetious, y'all. But the point is that does. 0:05:47.680 --> 0:05:48.680 Some very progressive things. 0:05:48.800 --> 0:05:53.320 She's done some very progressive bat that. But at the 0:05:53.320 --> 0:05:55.760 same time, we act like people don't commit crime. We 0:05:55.839 --> 0:05:58.880 acting like the people who are calling the cops or 0:05:59.040 --> 0:06:02.080 at least asking for crime, not this kind of antiquated, 0:06:03.000 --> 0:06:06.920 antediluvian assault upon the rights of black people. We ain't 0:06:06.920 --> 0:06:09.000 talking about that. We talking about you in the hood 0:06:09.279 --> 0:06:12.600 and I'm trying to live and you selling, you promoting, 0:06:12.680 --> 0:06:16.120 you doing whatever that's undermining our communities. You know, when 0:06:16.160 --> 0:06:19.159 I was I think ros Baroka, the mayor of Newark, 0:06:19.240 --> 0:06:21.960 said some of that defund the police stuff was from 0:06:21.960 --> 0:06:24.720 bourgeoise negroes who don't live in these hoods now, whether 0:06:24.720 --> 0:06:26.600 you take that or not, because I'm for a progressive 0:06:26.839 --> 0:06:30.680 realization of police being held to account. As Tyreek Hill, 0:06:30.720 --> 0:06:32.800 I think he's with us now. The point is at 0:06:32.800 --> 0:06:35.200 the same time that there are real concerns and issues 0:06:35.480 --> 0:06:38.240 of crime that she tried to address in very practical 0:06:38.800 --> 0:06:41.640 and progressive fashion, and we need to acknowledge that. But 0:06:41.720 --> 0:06:45.200 I think the energy with her is remarkable. It's astonishing, 0:06:45.720 --> 0:06:48.720 and more power to her. I hope she continues to 0:06:49.000 --> 0:06:51.599 grow in strength and numbers as we go on. 0:06:51.720 --> 0:06:53.320 Me too, you know, That's why I think your book 0:06:53.360 --> 0:06:55.600 is so timely, because you know, one thing that I've 0:06:55.640 --> 0:06:57.880 been speaking about is why aren't more people calling out 0:06:58.400 --> 0:07:01.719 the Supreme Court and calling out for being an illegitimate institution, 0:07:01.839 --> 0:07:04.160 Because what I don't even know if our democracy right 0:07:04.200 --> 0:07:06.760 now is healthy enough to have a free and fair 0:07:06.800 --> 0:07:09.520 election because of a lot of their recent rulings. And 0:07:09.560 --> 0:07:11.040 when you look at the fact that you know, you'll 0:07:11.080 --> 0:07:13.480 have so many people across the country who might refuse 0:07:13.520 --> 0:07:15.760 to certify the result of the election right right. 0:07:15.920 --> 0:07:17.440 That's why I think your book is very timed. 0:07:17.600 --> 0:07:19.880 Thank you for that and I appreciate that that's a 0:07:20.040 --> 0:07:25.440 brilliant point, because, look, there's enough skepticism to go around anyway, 0:07:25.880 --> 0:07:29.320 enough cynicism even to be generated in the aftermath of 0:07:29.320 --> 0:07:32.040 what the Supreme Court has done. And for those who 0:07:32.080 --> 0:07:34.760 say voting don't matter, just take the Supreme Court the 0:07:34.760 --> 0:07:38.920 issue you're talking about. Three justices were appointed by Donald Trump. 0:07:39.480 --> 0:07:44.360 Three Now, remember when Obama was in office and Mitch McConnell, 0:07:44.440 --> 0:07:47.440 the great al face One himself, said that, no, we're 0:07:47.440 --> 0:07:49.800 not gonna have an election. You know, we're not gonna 0:07:49.840 --> 0:07:52.880 you know, it's too close to election. We're not gonna 0:07:52.920 --> 0:07:55.680 do this is ten months before we're gonna hold Merrit 0:07:55.720 --> 0:07:59.440 Garland and let the next president decide. Donald Trump wins, 0:08:00.000 --> 0:08:04.120 he gets in his people on what Gorsag, Kavanaugh and 0:08:04.400 --> 0:08:09.920 Amy Cony Barrett right, they have shifted profoundly to the right. 0:08:10.360 --> 0:08:12.840 A court that was meant, as you said, to be 0:08:12.880 --> 0:08:15.560 a check and balance and democracy. You got the executive branch, 0:08:15.800 --> 0:08:18.520 the president and stuff. You got the legislative people in 0:08:18.600 --> 0:08:21.800 Congress and the Senate, and you got the Supreme Court, 0:08:22.160 --> 0:08:24.000 and they're all supposed to be held in check. But 0:08:24.040 --> 0:08:26.960 when the Supreme Court is in cahoots with the President 0:08:27.000 --> 0:08:29.240 of the United States of America, who happens to be 0:08:29.800 --> 0:08:36.320 an anti democracy figure, who is inspiring an insurrection in America. 0:08:36.679 --> 0:08:40.720 The very avatar symbol of what's supposed to be democracy 0:08:40.760 --> 0:08:48.480 itself is himself purging you know, voters. More importantly, democracy 0:08:48.880 --> 0:08:52.120 by his own actions is astonishing. So it is a 0:08:52.240 --> 0:08:54.720 question as to whether or not the Supreme Court should 0:08:54.760 --> 0:08:58.960 be reformed. Now, you know, President Biden put forth these rules, 0:08:59.000 --> 0:09:01.920 you know, but they to regulate themselves. The you know, 0:09:01.960 --> 0:09:05.000 what did Malcolm X say? The chickens are being now 0:09:05.000 --> 0:09:07.920 presided over by the foxes, So we can't you know, 0:09:08.520 --> 0:09:11.439 you know, Clarence Thomas, a white supremacist and black skin, 0:09:12.520 --> 0:09:15.800 a man who has been so unprincipled, and his wife 0:09:16.200 --> 0:09:19.520 and the wife of another Supreme Court Justice Alito, running 0:09:19.559 --> 0:09:22.800 your flag upside down, you are signifying to us that 0:09:22.880 --> 0:09:26.040 you are complicitus with the very forces that you should 0:09:26.120 --> 0:09:29.559 be opposing. So it is a problem. But I say, 0:09:29.920 --> 0:09:33.280 the answer then is not less voting, but more because 0:09:33.280 --> 0:09:37.560 if we change the constitution, not of the United States 0:09:37.600 --> 0:09:40.600 of America, but of the court of the voter, if 0:09:40.600 --> 0:09:43.600 we get a person in like Kamala Harris and Tim Wallas, 0:09:43.920 --> 0:09:47.160 and they are able to restore some sense of integrity 0:09:47.520 --> 0:09:52.040 and appreciation and confidence in our government that goes a 0:09:52.080 --> 0:09:54.760 long way towards trying to remedy some of these more 0:09:54.840 --> 0:09:56.480 systemic and structural problems. 0:09:56.880 --> 0:09:59.600 How do you think we should hand do two things? 0:09:59.640 --> 0:10:01.439 AI? In all this fake news? Right? 0:10:01.480 --> 0:10:05.040 Because people really believe what they're seeing online, and although 0:10:05.360 --> 0:10:07.880 you could hear it from the horse's mouth, people really 0:10:07.960 --> 0:10:10.720 believe it. So how do you think these politicians should 0:10:10.720 --> 0:10:11.959 handle a lot of the AI and a lot of 0:10:12.000 --> 0:10:14.000 the fake news that's going on across the social media 0:10:14.000 --> 0:10:16.679 and even the news is reporting some of this fake news? 0:10:16.720 --> 0:10:19.120 Of course, Look, AI is one of my favorite players 0:10:19.120 --> 0:10:22.959 of all time, so I support him whatever he is. Okay, Now, 0:10:23.000 --> 0:10:25.480 the other AI, right, because Allen ivers that I saw 0:10:25.520 --> 0:10:27.400 him for three years when I was a professor at 0:10:27.480 --> 0:10:29.920 University of Pennsylvania, one of the coldest ever to do 0:10:29.960 --> 0:10:32.280 it in one of the brazses. I wish we had 0:10:32.760 --> 0:10:36.280 AI in that in terms of artificial intelligence, because it 0:10:36.320 --> 0:10:39.720 is it's tricky. We don't know what's real. The deep fakes, 0:10:40.040 --> 0:10:42.200 you know, people out here saying one thing and meaning 0:10:42.240 --> 0:10:45.480 another or lying about it even before AI think about it, 0:10:45.520 --> 0:10:47.760 the robo calls that were being out put out here. 0:10:48.080 --> 0:10:50.120 You know, voting is on Wednesday. Now you know we 0:10:50.160 --> 0:10:53.240 don't vote on Wednesday, next Saturday. To vote early to 0:10:53.320 --> 0:10:56.520 the you know souls to the polls and churches is problematic, 0:10:56.559 --> 0:10:58.280 and so on and so forth. So you've got the 0:10:58.320 --> 0:11:02.680 distillation and the dial of all kinds of fake news 0:11:02.720 --> 0:11:06.080 and fake information, which is why behooves us to listen 0:11:06.120 --> 0:11:09.640 to the breakfast Club, why behooves us to read the 0:11:09.679 --> 0:11:12.600 New York Times, the Guardian, the Wall Street Journal, whatever 0:11:12.640 --> 0:11:15.280 your paper of choice is, and to make sure you 0:11:15.320 --> 0:11:18.120 can fact check, because if you've got again, and I 0:11:18.160 --> 0:11:20.679 hate to just beat this dead horse, but you've got 0:11:20.720 --> 0:11:25.280 a president who is the font of fake news, of defactualization, 0:11:25.960 --> 0:11:28.880 a factfulness gone awry. This dude don't know a fact. 0:11:28.920 --> 0:11:31.120 If it hit him in the head, he lies, and 0:11:31.160 --> 0:11:33.760 then he lies again, and people lie and lie again 0:11:33.840 --> 0:11:36.520 and create that as the basis of facts. Then you've 0:11:36.559 --> 0:11:40.920 got Senators like Hawley and Congressmen like Jordan out here 0:11:40.960 --> 0:11:45.520 reinforcing the negativity that's generated by the falseness of it. 0:11:45.760 --> 0:11:48.800 So you got misinformation, which is I didn't mean to 0:11:49.040 --> 0:11:52.000 get it wrong, but I messed up disinformation said, I 0:11:52.120 --> 0:11:53.640 meant to get it wrong, and I'm trying to lie 0:11:53.679 --> 0:11:55.800 to you so I can convince you to do something 0:11:55.920 --> 0:11:59.400 that is against your best interests. So disinformation and misinformation 0:11:59.679 --> 0:12:01.840 are bet enough. So we got to continue to do 0:12:02.000 --> 0:12:05.320 the old fashioned way. Read it for yourself, find it 0:12:05.360 --> 0:12:09.080 in a newspaper, check it against facts of history. Begin 0:12:09.160 --> 0:12:11.959 to talk to people that you trust, talk to people 0:12:12.040 --> 0:12:15.480 who you know whose job it is to think about 0:12:15.480 --> 0:12:19.160 these things. And no disrespect to celebrities, but man, oh man, 0:12:19.160 --> 0:12:21.800 in our community especially, we're vulnerable. You know, you get 0:12:21.800 --> 0:12:25.600 a celebrity, gets mad, gets upset, talks about things. And 0:12:25.640 --> 0:12:28.880 I love my man Tyrese. He was just off base 0:12:29.240 --> 0:12:31.640 when what he was saying. I love his energy, I 0:12:31.679 --> 0:12:34.600 love the sincerity with which he said it. I know 0:12:34.720 --> 0:12:37.360 his intent was right, but sometimes you could just be 0:12:37.440 --> 0:12:41.000 spreading misinformation that ain't helpful to us as the people 0:12:41.080 --> 0:12:43.280 so read. And this is why I know the sound 0:12:43.320 --> 0:12:45.880 self serving as a black intellectual. But I'm sixty five 0:12:45.960 --> 0:12:48.040 years old. I've been out here on this battlefield for 0:12:48.040 --> 0:12:51.080 forty years, and I'm telling you I'm trying to make 0:12:51.120 --> 0:12:53.080 the life of the mind sexy. To young people. I 0:12:53.120 --> 0:12:54.480 want them to see you ain't just got to be 0:12:54.480 --> 0:12:56.319 a rapper, which is important. You ain't just got to 0:12:56.360 --> 0:12:58.079 be an entertainer, which is great. You ain't got to 0:12:58.080 --> 0:13:00.559 be a singer, You ain't got to be an athlete. 0:13:00.559 --> 0:13:03.840 You could be an intellectual, a thinker, a person who 0:13:03.880 --> 0:13:06.680 puts on every day a thinking cap and tries to 0:13:06.720 --> 0:13:10.000 reflect upon the world. There's something virtuous about that, and 0:13:10.040 --> 0:13:12.880 I'm unapologetic about that because I think we need more 0:13:12.920 --> 0:13:16.840 of that now in an era when disinformation ai, the 0:13:16.920 --> 0:13:20.400 creation of deep fakes, and the perpetuation of legacies of 0:13:20.400 --> 0:13:25.280 inequity through means to dominate the masses has to be examined. 0:13:25.280 --> 0:13:26.880 So we got to go back to old school, think 0:13:26.880 --> 0:13:30.880 about Noam Chomsky and manufacturing consent, and think about these 0:13:30.920 --> 0:13:34.080 great books Marshall mclewin in terms of talking about the 0:13:34.120 --> 0:13:36.560 media and the medium is the message. That's the kind 0:13:36.600 --> 0:13:38.520 of stuff we got to think critically about as we 0:13:38.559 --> 0:13:39.000 move forward. 0:13:39.000 --> 0:13:41.480 You know, then there's about what you said, brother Dyson. 0:13:41.640 --> 0:13:44.920 Most of your favorite entertainers are rappers that people like 0:13:45.240 --> 0:13:47.800 you like them because they're intellectual, right, whether you deem 0:13:47.840 --> 0:13:50.800 them an academic intellectual or not. Like you like Pak, 0:13:50.880 --> 0:13:53.640 you like Killer Mike, you like jay Z, you like Nas, 0:13:53.679 --> 0:13:54.479 you scarface. 0:13:54.600 --> 0:13:56.440 These brothers are intellectuals, Lauren here. 0:13:56.960 --> 0:13:59.760 You know, that's a great point, and that's why I 0:13:59.800 --> 0:14:02.720 did them. I've written books about half of them. Why 0:14:02.800 --> 0:14:07.400 because they're thoughtful. Pac. I mean, Pac was amazing on 0:14:07.800 --> 0:14:12.920 that microphone. But boy, he's up here talking about American government. 0:14:13.160 --> 0:14:16.120 I mean at twenty two, twenty three, twenty four, the 0:14:16.559 --> 0:14:18.640 son of a black panther, he said, I was literally 0:14:18.640 --> 0:14:20.560 born in jail because his mother was one of the 0:14:20.560 --> 0:14:22.880 panthers twenty one that were here in New York and 0:14:22.920 --> 0:14:25.600 we're on trial. So from the very beginning, he was 0:14:25.800 --> 0:14:29.840 trained about being skeptical and suspicious of the dominant society. 0:14:30.120 --> 0:14:32.960 When you think about a Killer Mike, a Loupe Fiasco, 0:14:33.320 --> 0:14:35.840 you know people that I've talked to constantly. When you 0:14:35.920 --> 0:14:37.880 think about a Jay, when you think about a Nas. 0:14:37.920 --> 0:14:43.960 These are highly intellectual reflections and reflectors on society. And 0:14:44.000 --> 0:14:47.320 we appeal to them precisely because they teach us to 0:14:47.400 --> 0:14:49.680 think for ourselves and to be open minded. 0:14:49.680 --> 0:14:51.720 Great point, how do you feel about do you sepplies 0:14:51.720 --> 0:14:54.360 as comments that he made about Kamala and people questioning 0:14:54.440 --> 0:14:56.200 her who applies all right? 0:14:56.360 --> 0:14:59.240 And his support you mean his support for her, Yeah. 0:14:59.080 --> 0:14:59.560 It's support. 0:14:59.640 --> 0:15:02.200 But it caused a big conversation about how do you 0:15:02.280 --> 0:15:04.560 question your candidates? Should you question your candidates? Is she 0:15:04.600 --> 0:15:06.400 being questioned unfairly? And I know your book is all 0:15:06.440 --> 0:15:09.320 about like desires and voting equaling that. So how did 0:15:09.320 --> 0:15:10.240 you feel about what he said? 0:15:10.320 --> 0:15:13.880 Rayborn? Well, I love plies. You know, prize is out 0:15:13.880 --> 0:15:16.400 there just raising the serious questions that need to be raised. 0:15:16.400 --> 0:15:22.000 Another intellectually curious and insightful young man. And look, you 0:15:22.080 --> 0:15:24.600 got to question all these candidates. I love and support 0:15:24.680 --> 0:15:27.160 Kamala Harris. I've known her for over twenty years. I 0:15:27.200 --> 0:15:28.960 think she is the best woman for the job, made 0:15:28.960 --> 0:15:32.080 the best woman win, That's what I think. However, you 0:15:32.160 --> 0:15:34.800 got to hold everybody to account. She knows that if 0:15:34.800 --> 0:15:37.120 she's worth her salt, she's got to say, hold me 0:15:37.160 --> 0:15:40.360 to account. Y'all know this old story that a Philip 0:15:40.400 --> 0:15:44.880 Randolph and Mary MacLeod Bethune a visiting with Franklin Delano 0:15:45.000 --> 0:15:48.600 Roosevelt in the White House, right, and they were part 0:15:48.640 --> 0:15:50.360 of his kitchen and cabinet. This is like back in 0:15:50.400 --> 0:15:53.440 the forties, and they're telling him you got to do this. 0:15:53.520 --> 0:15:56.080 You got to create the possibility for black people to vote. 0:15:56.080 --> 0:15:58.600 You've got to we have to do everything we can 0:15:58.680 --> 0:16:01.800 to make sure that the military is, you know, desegregated. 0:16:01.880 --> 0:16:04.360 He says, everything you were doing and saying I agree 0:16:04.360 --> 0:16:05.680 with and now go out in the streets and make 0:16:05.720 --> 0:16:08.360 me do it right. Harry Belafonte used to love telling 0:16:08.360 --> 0:16:10.440 that story. So the thing is, you got to make 0:16:10.520 --> 0:16:13.680 people hold them to account. Martin Luther King Junior on 0:16:13.760 --> 0:16:19.520 the outside putting pressure on LBJ allows LBJ to collar 0:16:19.640 --> 0:16:21.280 some of those people in the Senate and say, you're 0:16:21.320 --> 0:16:23.400 gonna vote the right way, and we're gonna do what 0:16:23.440 --> 0:16:26.040 we kind of do to pass what the Voting Rights Ack. 0:16:26.160 --> 0:16:29.080 But before that, the Civil Rights Bill, right, civil Rights Ack. 0:16:29.240 --> 0:16:32.560 And then look at the Holy Trinity sixty four, the 0:16:33.200 --> 0:16:35.760 Civil Rights Act, sixty five, the Voting Rights Ack, and 0:16:35.840 --> 0:16:38.760 in sixty eight, in homage the doctor King after his death, 0:16:38.840 --> 0:16:42.240 the Fair Housing Act. That's the Holy Trinity. That's the 0:16:42.320 --> 0:16:46.280 triumphant trilogy of transformation for Black folk in this country, 0:16:46.360 --> 0:16:49.680 politically and legislatively. So you got to hold these people 0:16:49.760 --> 0:16:51.920 to account. If it wasn't for the pressure of King, 0:16:52.840 --> 0:16:55.400 then LBJ wouldn't have done what he did, couldn't have 0:16:55.440 --> 0:16:58.160 done what he did. If it wasn't for Frederick Douglas, 0:16:58.520 --> 0:17:00.920 then Lincoln might not have acted the way he did. 0:17:01.360 --> 0:17:03.320 And we ain't talking about perfect people. You know, when 0:17:03.320 --> 0:17:05.960 people always cite the history of some of these people, 0:17:06.080 --> 0:17:08.480 Joe Biden or Lincoln, I don't give a dang what 0:17:08.600 --> 0:17:13.320 Lincoln's motivation was. He signed the Emancipation Proclamation. And when 0:17:13.359 --> 0:17:17.159 he signed that Emancipation Proclamation, that opened up possibility. So 0:17:17.200 --> 0:17:20.480 we have to stop demanding perfection even as we hold 0:17:20.480 --> 0:17:23.119 people to account. And I think it is important to 0:17:23.160 --> 0:17:25.960 hold people to account. But what's interesting to me is 0:17:25.960 --> 0:17:28.320 that when I hear all that about holding to account, 0:17:28.320 --> 0:17:31.600 I ain't seeing nobody who's promoting Donald Trump saying let 0:17:31.600 --> 0:17:34.720 me do it skeptically, let me be self critical about 0:17:34.800 --> 0:17:38.040 mister Trump. Yes, I think that in their quoting going 0:17:38.080 --> 0:17:40.920 back fifty years to find something about Joe Biden, this 0:17:41.080 --> 0:17:43.840 dude was promoting the death of the Central Park five 0:17:43.880 --> 0:17:46.359 now known as the Exonerated five not long ago, and 0:17:46.480 --> 0:17:51.840 ain't apologized yet or backtrack upon demanding the death penalty 0:17:51.840 --> 0:17:54.359 for them. Here's a guy who would his father denied 0:17:54.359 --> 0:17:58.280 people access to housing when he owned these cribs in 0:17:58.320 --> 0:18:00.760 these apartments in New York. Here's a guy who has 0:18:00.800 --> 0:18:04.399 been consistent. Now, I think rappers get it twisted because 0:18:04.400 --> 0:18:07.800 he was an icon of hip hop before. Why because 0:18:07.800 --> 0:18:11.880 he had the women he had they talk, They thought 0:18:11.920 --> 0:18:13.480 he had the money. You can see he was lying. 0:18:14.000 --> 0:18:16.040 They thought he had the buildings and the money, and 0:18:16.080 --> 0:18:17.560 he was a billionaire and all that. So that was 0:18:17.600 --> 0:18:20.960 attractive to a kind of glitzy hip hop era where 0:18:21.040 --> 0:18:23.480 it was all about the pursuit of capital. But Donald 0:18:23.480 --> 0:18:25.960 Trump was faking the funk even then. His daddy gave 0:18:26.040 --> 0:18:29.280 him four four hundred million to begin with. If your 0:18:29.320 --> 0:18:32.080 father gave you four hundred million to begin with as 0:18:32.119 --> 0:18:34.640 a little loan to hook you up and you still 0:18:34.680 --> 0:18:37.080 struggling the way you're doing, you are of a failure. 0:18:37.320 --> 0:18:40.320 So even at that level, they're problematic issues. I hear 0:18:40.359 --> 0:18:43.040 young rappers saying, but he gave us a check. No, 0:18:43.560 --> 0:18:45.960 they talking about during COVID the twelve hundred dollars or 0:18:46.000 --> 0:18:49.000 whatever they got two thousand check the record. That's the 0:18:49.320 --> 0:18:53.639 legislative branch, that is Congress stuff that he opposed, and 0:18:53.720 --> 0:18:57.760 then he took credit for distributing Joe Biden done hooked 0:18:57.800 --> 0:18:59.919 up a lot of people in terms of student loan. 0:19:00.240 --> 0:19:02.399 I know three or four people have been forgiven one 0:19:02.440 --> 0:19:05.080 hundred thousand or more. So the point is, check the record, 0:19:05.359 --> 0:19:09.240 stop the disinformation, stop the misinformation, stop the deep fakes, 0:19:09.480 --> 0:19:12.880 and ask serious questions. You must always hold people to account, 0:19:13.080 --> 0:19:16.119 hold me to account, hold y'all to account. But do 0:19:16.200 --> 0:19:18.679 it in a in a in a I think respectful fashion. 0:19:18.760 --> 0:19:21.120 The thing that I have a problem with I'm I'm 0:19:21.200 --> 0:19:24.560 on Twitter or what it acts and people calling me 0:19:24.600 --> 0:19:27.239 out my name. You know, I'm trying to check as 0:19:27.240 --> 0:19:29.520 the people I know undercover. Maybe it's my mother, Okay, no, 0:19:29.560 --> 0:19:32.199 it's not her. So the thing is is that you know, 0:19:32.520 --> 0:19:35.159 you can hold me to account, you can challenge me, 0:19:35.200 --> 0:19:38.880 but I'm twenty seven books in the game, mofo. I've 0:19:38.920 --> 0:19:41.439 done my work. It doesn't mean that you have to 0:19:41.440 --> 0:19:43.439 agree with what I say, but be respectful for what 0:19:43.560 --> 0:19:46.800 I do and acknowledge that. And so On Twitter, you know, 0:19:46.840 --> 0:19:49.080 we have these Twitter you know, battles, and we got 0:19:49.160 --> 0:19:52.680 these digital warriors who are talking trash and being nasty 0:19:52.720 --> 0:19:54.439 and calling your names. Do we have to do that? 0:19:54.560 --> 0:19:58.360 Can we respect the integrity of each other and say 0:19:58.359 --> 0:20:00.719 we're in a pitched battle where trying to figure out 0:20:00.760 --> 0:20:02.680 the best way to go, and let's treat each other 0:20:02.720 --> 0:20:04.000 with fundamental love and respect. 0:20:04.080 --> 0:20:05.840 Let's talk about the dim witted doappo ganger. 0:20:07.680 --> 0:20:10.920