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Speaker 1: Go to Breakingpoints dot com to help us out. All right, guys,

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Speaker 1: time for our weekly partnership segment with the Lever. This

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Speaker 1: week we are speaking to Matthew Cunningham Cook. Go ahead

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Speaker 1: and bring Matthew up on the screen. He's a researcher

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Speaker 1: and writer focusing on capital markets, healthcare, and retirement policy. Welcome, Matthew.

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Speaker 1: It's good to see you, Matthew. Thanks for having me

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Speaker 1: on gas. Absolutely so you wrote a phenomenal piece. Let's

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Speaker 1: put this up on the screen that just tracks factually

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Speaker 1: the distance between Biden's words and what he has actually

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Speaker 1: done as president. So the headline here is Biden offers

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Speaker 1: Amazon workers rhetoric but no action. The President lauded a

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Speaker 1: union drive and declared Amazon here we come, but he's

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Speaker 1: refused to even follow his own task forces limited recommendations

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Speaker 1: to boost unionization. This is something that we've been following

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Speaker 1: here as well, Matthew, because Biden famously declared that he

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Speaker 1: wanted to be the most pro union president in history.

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Speaker 1: How has he done in living up to that bold proclamation. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean, you know, I will say, you know, the

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Speaker 1: NRB is doing a great job with very limited resources,

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Speaker 1: and you know, his budget hasn't asked for enough resources

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Speaker 1: to go to the NLRB. Nor has he challenged Mansion

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Speaker 1: or Cinema on their constant abstruction of any type of

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Speaker 1: funding for agencies that are doing good work. But that's

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Speaker 1: and that's where kind of most of the focus has been.

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Speaker 1: But there's a whole universe of separate things that the

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Speaker 1: president can do ya executive action to improve the lives

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Speaker 1: of millions of workers, and there we've seen very little developments.

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Speaker 1: I mean, so Tom Gagan, the well known labor lawyer

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Speaker 1: has said, you know, the president could actually sign an

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Speaker 1: executive order saying any federal contract has to have a

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Speaker 1: union contract. And so of course there's been a total

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Speaker 1: media blackout about that idea. But even on much more

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Speaker 1: modest aims, so requiring these large law firms to disclose

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Speaker 1: the full range of union busting activity that they're engaged

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Speaker 1: in in places like Amazon, you know, we haven't seen

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Speaker 1: any types of development on that front, despite the fact

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Speaker 1: that Obama and Tom Perez propagated a very decent rule

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Speaker 1: in twenty sixteen, and in April twenty twenty one there

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Speaker 1: was discussion that Biden would bring it back. Once this

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Speaker 1: tak Force report was released, there was no discussion whatsoever

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Speaker 1: about bringing back this so called persuade or rule. And

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Speaker 1: it's particularly relevant because the Amazon workers actually had a

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Speaker 1: lot of success using the existing disclosures for direct union

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Speaker 1: busting to expose the union busters in the warehouse. So

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Speaker 1: this would give Amazon workers other workers seeking to organize

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Speaker 1: a lot more tools to expose what's happening inside of

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Speaker 1: their workplace if the persuader rule came back. But we

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Speaker 1: haven't seen any developments on that phone got it, So

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Speaker 1: can you go a little bit more into the Amazon

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Speaker 1: piece here, specifically, like why would it help Amazon? And

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Speaker 1: also what are some of the past ties which could

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Speaker 1: explain some of this in action. Yeah, yeah, So as

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Speaker 1: the union busting campaign was going on inside of the warehouse,

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Speaker 1: one of the few tools that the workers had was

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Speaker 1: to expose these union busters using the existing forms, and

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Speaker 1: the persuader rule would really enhance those efforts. Now, what

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Speaker 1: we do know is there's extensive relationships between Amazon and

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Speaker 1: the Democratic Party. So Amazon's top communications chief is Jay Carney,

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Speaker 1: who was President Obama's press secretary. Amazon. Amazon's general counsel,

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Speaker 1: David Zapolski, donated three hundred thousand dollars to the Biden

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Speaker 1: Victory Fund. This is the same guy who called Chris

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Speaker 1: Small's not smart or articulate. Amazon hired. In December twenty twenty,

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Speaker 1: Amazon hired the Richetti Firm as one of their top

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Speaker 1: lobbyists in Washington. That firm is ran by Jeff Richetti,

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Speaker 1: whose brother Steve Richetti as the senior advisor to the President.

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Speaker 1: There's really no kind of limit actually to how tightly

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Speaker 1: hued Amazon is into the Democratic Party. Jamie Gorlik, who

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Speaker 1: was a top Justice Department official under Bill Clinton is

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Speaker 1: on the board of Amazon. There's very, very, very tight

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Speaker 1: links at this point, and there's been no pressure whatsoever

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Speaker 1: from Democrats in Congress, on the Bidy administration or on

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Speaker 1: democratic leadership to even examine these ties, much less several

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Speaker 1: of them. Well, and here's one that I didn't realize.

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Speaker 1: So we have talked here already about how this major

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Speaker 1: Democratic consulting group, Global Strategy Group, was hired by Amazon

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Speaker 1: to be part of their union busting campaign. They were

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Speaker 1: so integral that they're actually named by Amazon labor union

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Speaker 1: in a complaint against Amazon for illegal union busting behavior.

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Speaker 1: So that's how central they were to this strategy. I

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Speaker 1: knew they were a big player here in Washington. I

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Speaker 1: didn't know that Jensaki actually used to work for them,

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Speaker 1: which is something you point out in this piece. So

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Speaker 1: yet another tie there. And then I find I mean,

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Speaker 1: I just find it's so disgusting that they would even

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Speaker 1: consider being involved with this campaign. When they were asked

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Speaker 1: Global Strategy Group about their union busting efforts at Amazon,

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Speaker 1: they say, oh, we deeply regret being involved in any way,

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Speaker 1: as if they didn't know exactly what they were doing.

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Speaker 1: The entire time. So talk about that piece of it, Maddie,

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Speaker 1: because I really do find it outrageous. I mean, I

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Speaker 1: do think Global Strategy Group is really indicative of some

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Speaker 1: deeper rot here because Global Strategy Group was actually investigated

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Speaker 1: and forced to come to a settlement for engaging in

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Speaker 1: highly unethical activities as it related to pension fund investments

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Speaker 1: in private equity. This was fifteen years ago, and Andrew

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Speaker 1: Quoo actually of all people, forced them to sign a

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Speaker 1: code of conduct where they would improve their ethical standards.

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Speaker 1: And again, you know, after this, you know, I mean,

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Speaker 1: just like we saw with you know, companies engaged in

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Speaker 1: the financial crisis, like Glodman Sachs. You know, they came

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Speaker 1: back bigger and better, expanded their footprint even larger outside

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Speaker 1: of New York. And yeah, now enjoy a roster of

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Speaker 1: Democratic groups including you know, top super brat packs, the DNC,

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Speaker 1: the d SCC, the d TRIP and again, you know,

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Speaker 1: Global Strategy Group has apologized. But where is kind of

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Speaker 1: a broader set of questions about kind of Number one,

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Speaker 1: should we be hiring a union busting firm to work

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Speaker 1: for the Democratic Party? And two are these people very

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Speaker 1: good at their jobs? Elections all the time? The message, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we should have been we should encourage Amazon and everybody

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Speaker 1: else to hire this group every time whoever came up

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Speaker 1: with like Putin's price hike and build back better, Let's

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Speaker 1: get them on the union buster's side. That's actually a

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Speaker 1: great point. I think the overall picture here that you

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Speaker 1: paint is really important because, look, I've tried to highlight

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Speaker 1: the fact that, you know, having a National Labor Relations

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Speaker 1: Board with Biden's appointees that has been favorable to workers

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Speaker 1: was really key in Starbucks, it was really key in

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Speaker 1: Amazon because some key decisions went the worker's way. It's

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Speaker 1: really key right now because you have Amazon basically trying

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Speaker 1: to say, oh, it was stolen, the election was rigged,

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Speaker 1: et cetera, et cetera. So having that those personnel in

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Speaker 1: place as opposed to the people who were actively hostile

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Speaker 1: to unions who were in place under Trump, that matters

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Speaker 1: a lot. But Biden says he wants to be the

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Speaker 1: most pro union president in history, and he doesn't just

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Speaker 1: get to shift the blame to the Senate parliamentarian or

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Speaker 1: the filibuster or Joe Manchin or Kirsten Cinema, Because you're

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Speaker 1: laying out very clearly first of all, some problematic ties

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Speaker 1: to Amazon, but second of all, most critically here, there

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Speaker 1: are things he could do today with the stroke of

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Speaker 1: a pen that he is choosing not to do. So

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Speaker 1: I think is that a decent portrayal of the big

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Speaker 1: picture here and take away from the story. I think

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Speaker 1: that's absolutely right. Yeah. And I also just think even

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Speaker 1: on the NLRB component, I mean, Biden could be using

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Speaker 1: his bully pulpit every day to say this agency that

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Speaker 1: is doing critically important work is incredibly underfunded as it

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Speaker 1: relates to historical efforts, and it's time for to name

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Speaker 1: people who are holding this up where it's actually I mean,

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Speaker 1: Joe Manchin co sponsored the pro Act, so it's almost

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Speaker 1: certainly it's Cinema more than anybody else who's blocking an

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Speaker 1: increase in funding, combined with the Biden administration's failure to

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Speaker 1: focus on a critical issue affecting millions of Americans. And unfortunately,

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Speaker 1: what this administration has shown time and time again is

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Speaker 1: that you know, when it comes to actually helping workers,

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Speaker 1: even if there's people doing good work inside of the

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Speaker 1: White House and inside of these key agencies, they're never

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Speaker 1: able to get the time of day with the people

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Speaker 1: who are actually calling the shots. Yeah, I think that

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Speaker 1: is all well said. Phenomenal reporting. Thank you for joining

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Speaker 1: us today. Great to meet you. Thanks man, thanks for

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Speaker 1: having me. Some really troubling news that's just come out.

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Speaker 1: Let's go ahead and put this up there on the screen,

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Speaker 1: which is that UF life expectancy has dropped for the

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Speaker 1: second year in a row. So you might say, well,

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Speaker 1: of course because of COVID, but it's not just COVID,

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Speaker 1: and I think that that's one of the main things

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Speaker 1: that they point to within the study, Crystal, which is

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Speaker 1: that there was an extensive loss of life that yes,

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Speaker 1: includes the hundreds of thousands of people who died from COVID,

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Speaker 1: but also from an increase in deaths of despair in

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Speaker 1: fentanyl debts hit all time high, alcoholism hit all time

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Speaker 1: high drug use. Actually was just reading a new study

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Speaker 1: that if you were below the age of sixty, your

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Speaker 1: risk of dying from one of these deaths of despair, suicide, drugs,

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Speaker 1: or alcohol abuse was actually higher than your risk of

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Speaker 1: dying from COVID nineteen over the last two years. So

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Speaker 1: you combine an elderly, sick, overweight population with a mentally

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Speaker 1: kind of mentally just grasping stressed younger population, and you

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Speaker 1: have two years of declining life expectancy. So there's an

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Speaker 1: effort right now in order to paint this purely as

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Speaker 1: COVID related, and that's true in a sense, but it's

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Speaker 1: not one hundred percent just because of the COVID virus. Well,

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Speaker 1: and these are sort of the initial findings of this study,

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Speaker 1: and more research is needed to really pinpoint exactly what

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Speaker 1: this was attributable to. But one thing that is interesting

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Speaker 1: is that now we've had two years in a row,

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Speaker 1: and I'm by interesting, I mean devastating, where you have

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Speaker 1: life expectancy dropping, and this of course after we have

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Speaker 1: the introduction of these highly successful vaccines that a lot

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Speaker 1: of researchers predicted, Okay, after we have those, then we're

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Speaker 1: going to get back on track, because it's extraordinary for

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Speaker 1: a wealthy country to see a decline in life expectancy

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Speaker 1: of this nature. But instead they saw a continued trend

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Speaker 1: in this direction. So life expectancy drop by point four

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Speaker 1: a year in twenty twenty one, leading to a net

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Speaker 1: loss of two point two six years over the two

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Speaker 1: year period. This is an outlier. Guys, other peer nations

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Speaker 1: similarly wealthy and developed countries. They also found a small

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Speaker 1: decrease during these years, but a net loss of point

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Speaker 1: three years as opposed for US two point three years,

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Speaker 1: So we lost two years more effectively than our peer

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Speaker 1: nations did during COVID. Now, as I said, there's sort

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Speaker 1: of more research needed to pinpoint exactly the causes, but

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Speaker 1: there are some interesting things that we can say about

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Speaker 1: this year versus the previous year. In the previous year,

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Speaker 1: it was overwhelmingly black and Hispanic Americans who saw a

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Speaker 1: decline in life expectancy. In fact, Hispanic men in twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty lost more than four years of life expectancy, and

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Speaker 1: by the way, they did not see a rebound in

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty one. The theory is that, you know, overwhelmingly,

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Speaker 1: you know, working class people are disproportionately black and brown

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Speaker 1: were hit hardest by COVID. We all know that. So

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Speaker 1: that was the thinking as to why there was such

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Speaker 1: a significant drop among those groups during that year. This

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Speaker 1: time around, actually those groups they didn't get better, but

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Speaker 1: they didn't get worse, and I actually think Black Americans

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Speaker 1: did up a tiny bit. The big drop this time

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Speaker 1: was among white Americans, and that's why there's some theorizing

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Speaker 1: that it could be related to increased levels of vaccine hesitancy,

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Speaker 1: especially among older white men, contributing to this life expectancy drop.

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Speaker 1: But I do think it's important to point out, like

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Speaker 1: there are a lot of things that could have gone

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Speaker 1: into that we've certainly been tracking here, the deaths of despair,

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Speaker 1: the just stunning and horrific rates of overdose and addiction,

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Speaker 1: and deaths from alcoholism, and all of those signs of

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Speaker 1: society that just is not well. The last thing that

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Speaker 1: I wanted to point out, which I think is really

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Speaker 1: important here is you know, it's easy to just despair

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Speaker 1: and say, well, why are we such outliers and kind

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Speaker 1: of throw up our hands like everything is just wrong.

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Speaker 1: But you know, there was a study that said if

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Speaker 1: we had just if we had universal health care like

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Speaker 1: the rest of our pure nations, we could have saved

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Speaker 1: three hundred and thirty thousand lives just from the pandemic.

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Speaker 1: Because oftentimes it's people who are and insured who don't

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Speaker 1: want to go to the hospital until it's ultimately too late.

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Speaker 1: So a lot of solutions to this are obvious and

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Speaker 1: on the table, and other rich countries are doing it,

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Speaker 1: and we just decide not to and have a system

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Speaker 1: that is too corrupt to allow us to pursue those alternatives. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and you know, I mean I look at this too,

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Speaker 1: and I just did the math quick back in the napkin.

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Speaker 1: That means our loss of life is seven times higher

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Speaker 1: than the rest of the developed world. Yes, that's crazy, crazy,

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Speaker 1: And if you point to one of the quotes here,

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Speaker 1: is that many people are dying in the prime of

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Speaker 1: their lives. And to see the white male figure drop

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Speaker 1: like that too is really a disaster. Underlying health conditions

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Speaker 1: has just got to be one top answers here, which

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Speaker 1: is that? And they even point to that, which is that, look,

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Speaker 1: vaccine or not. If you've got diabetes and you're fat,

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Speaker 1: and especially if you're obese, you are way more likely

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Speaker 1: to die, not just of COVID, of cancer, of basically everything,

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Speaker 1: and those underlying health conditions combined with a lack of

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Speaker 1: access to healthcare, especially because those underlying health conditions are

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Speaker 1: amongst the people who are the poorest in this country.

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Speaker 1: You combine that with COVID, not just the virus, but

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Speaker 1: a lot of other stuff, alcohol, deaths of despair, You're

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Speaker 1: just going to make it so that our life expectancy

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Speaker 1: has dropped so precipitously like this, like this is a

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Speaker 1: sign of a dying civilization. Andrew Yang, my favorite quotes

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Speaker 1: he ever said on the debate stage twenty twenty was, Look,

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Speaker 1: the ultimate metric is are people living or are people dying?

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Speaker 1: And if more people are dying and are not living

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Speaker 1: as long, that's about as stark of a metric as

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Speaker 1: you can get. That was in twenty nineteen, before all

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Speaker 1: of this. So now two years in a row of

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Speaker 1: a dramatic drop in life experision, and let me tell

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Speaker 1: you something else, there's a traumatic lack of interest and

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Speaker 1: curiosity from most of the press about this issue, which, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it is sort of the most basic metric of how

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Speaker 1: we're doing as a society, especially a wealthy society. Bernie

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Speaker 1: Sanders led a subcommittee hearing to try to diget what

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Speaker 1: is going on. Let me bring in experts, let's figure

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Speaker 1: out what in the statistic actually show about how and

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Speaker 1: why this is happening and what we can do about it.

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Speaker 1: No media coverage, no interest whatsoever. All they cared about

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Speaker 1: was like Palace at that time, it was like palace

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Speaker 1: intrigue about Joe mansion and whatever. Was going on there

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Speaker 1: in a very sort of substance free, surface level, personality

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Speaker 1: driven way, so it also shows you their priorities. All right, guys,

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Speaker 1: as we have been following, one of the big races

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Speaker 1: in the Scent this year is in Georgia and also

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Speaker 1: the governor's race. And joining us now rejoining the show

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Speaker 1: an old friend here, Greg Bluestein, who has a brand

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Speaker 1: new book out. The title of it is Flipped. How

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Speaker 1: Georgia turned Purple and broke the monopoly on Republican power

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Speaker 1: and that is what it looks like. You guys should

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Speaker 1: all check that out. For those who are long time

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Speaker 1: year as you might remember, when we were building up

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Speaker 1: to the general election last time around, we pulled people

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Speaker 1: on which reporters should we have on to break down

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Speaker 1: all of these races, and that's how we found Greg.

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Speaker 1: And now you've ended up and gone and gotten nationally famous,

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Speaker 1: so we don't get to talk to you as much.

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Speaker 1: But it's great to see you again. Good to see you, man. Hey,

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Speaker 1: I'll call on anytime you want. Thank you, So just

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Speaker 1: tell us a little bit about the book. How is

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Speaker 1: it that Georgia went from being this sort of like

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Speaker 1: solid red forget about a Democrats state into now a

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Speaker 1: true swing state which could go either way. Yeah, it

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Speaker 1: was not some overnight success. This is not really a fluke.

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Speaker 1: This took years of work from not just Stacy Abrams,

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Speaker 1: but an entire web of activists and organizers and volunteers

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Speaker 1: and voters around her. It took flipping the Atlanta suburbs

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Speaker 1: that were used to be Republican fortresses and have become

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Speaker 1: younger and more diverse. They're no longer this monolithically you know, white,

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Speaker 1: upper middle class stereotype that we think of when we

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Speaker 1: think of suburbs of big cities. And of course, it

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Speaker 1: took authentic messages. It took Democrats realizing that they should

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Speaker 1: no longer run as Republican lights, but they should run

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Speaker 1: as liberals with progressive messages that helped energize and connect

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Speaker 1: with a group of voters that felt disenchanted in connected

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Speaker 1: with the electoral process and help them, you know, capture

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Speaker 1: hundreds of thousands of Democratic voters who never voted in

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Speaker 1: midterms and even sometimes skipped presidential elections. So Greg a

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Speaker 1: fascinating element to this story to me is the maga

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Speaker 1: element where Trump himself is somehow able to lose the

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Speaker 1: state of Georgia and then even more so tanks these

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Speaker 1: two Senate elections in the runoffs. Can you just talk

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Speaker 1: to us, well, first of all, is my narrative accurate?

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Speaker 1: Is that Trump's fault or is it about macro political forces?

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Speaker 1: How exactly do you think that this will then play

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Speaker 1: out also in the future with the current primary of

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Speaker 1: David Perdue and Brian Kemp. That's a great question, because yes,

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Speaker 1: Trump is partly to blame, you know, his vote, his

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Speaker 1: message of go vote in a rigged election in the

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Speaker 1: January twenty one runoffs did not exactly help Kelly Leffler

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Speaker 1: David Berdue, who were constantly trying to placate the president

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Speaker 1: appease him as he kept on moving the goalposts towards

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Speaker 1: more and more vigorous demands that eventually getting to the

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Speaker 1: point where he demanded that they block Joe Biden's electoral

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Speaker 1: college victory in the US Senate. And this is still

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Speaker 1: playing out, I mean right now, all those characters I

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Speaker 1: wrote about in the book in twenty twenty, they're still

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Speaker 1: at the center of the twenty twenty two drama in

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Speaker 1: Georgia and nationally with David Purdue challenging Governor Brian Kemp

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Speaker 1: for the Republican nomination, and David Bridue, of course, has

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump's backing. Donald Trump even came to Georgia not

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Speaker 1: that long ago and said that he'd rather see Stacy

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Speaker 1: Abrams as governor than Brian Kemp. So this just shows

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Speaker 1: you how this Trump fueled dynamics are still shaping George's election.

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Speaker 1: And really, I think Georgia is the biggest test of

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Speaker 1: Trump's influence in the entire nation. Yes, well, talk about

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Speaker 1: that a little bit more, because I have to tell you,

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Speaker 1: Sagur and I kind of called this primary thus far

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Speaker 1: on the Republican side a little bit wrong because Trump

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Speaker 1: had been so outspoken about his Brian Kemp hatred. As

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Speaker 1: you were just demonstrating, We thought, oh, once Purdue gets

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Speaker 1: in and has probably lights out for Kemp. Because if

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Speaker 1: you look at Trump's approval ratings among Republican voters in Georgia,

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Speaker 1: it's still extraordinarily high, still carries a lot of weight

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Speaker 1: in the party. But as of the last polls I saw,

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Speaker 1: Kent continues to hold on to a lead there. So

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Speaker 1: what is happening in Georgia that is different from what

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Speaker 1: sort of you know, people observing from the outside predicted

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Speaker 1: might happen in this primary. You're exactly right, not just

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Speaker 1: not only does Governor Kemp hold a lead, but he

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Speaker 1: has a double digit lead. He has an eleven point

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Speaker 1: lead in some of the recent polls, including a recent

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Speaker 1: poll that came out just after Donald Trump's last rally,

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Speaker 1: which was just a few weeks ago here in Georgia,

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Speaker 1: and has defied some of the expectations. I mean, Governor

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Speaker 1: Kemp treated this as a toss up race right when

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Speaker 1: David Purdue got in the contest. But it shows you

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Speaker 1: the extent of Donald Trump's appeal. No one's counting. No

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Speaker 1: one in Georgia who's watching this closely is counting David

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Speaker 1: Purdue out. We have no idea how the next few

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Speaker 1: weeks will go, whether or not the Trump base will

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Speaker 1: show up in droves in the May twenty fourth primary.

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Speaker 1: But what we do know is that Brian Kemp has

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Speaker 1: institutional structural advantages right now, starting with a huge fundraising advantage,

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Speaker 1: I mean his outside support from groups like the Republican

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Speaker 1: Governors Association, which is spending five million dollars on his

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Speaker 1: campaign just through May. And he's got the next few

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Speaker 1: weeks to sign a bunch of bills that conservatives love,

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Speaker 1: including a gun a pro gun bill that he's signing

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Speaker 1: this week that has long been a dream of Second

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Speaker 1: Amendment advocates. Oh that's really interesting. Out of the way.

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Speaker 1: You don't mind, doesn't mind, audience, won't care well at

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Speaker 1: at this, don't worry? All good? Completely fine? Are you

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Speaker 1: getting edit it? We'll ed at that, all right? That's right.

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Speaker 1: I almost want to leave that in all right, Joe

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Speaker 1: Camp Joe three two one. On the other side, here

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Speaker 1: is the Senate elections. I mean, talk to us about

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Speaker 1: the macro political environment because at the same time Trump

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Speaker 1: effect aside, it's not like Republicans aren't up nine or

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Speaker 1: ten points or whatever on the generic ballot. Georgia already

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Speaker 1: a barely you know, purpleish state and historically Republican. How

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Speaker 1: does this play out now in the Senate races, specifically

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Speaker 1: they're coming up in twenty twenty two. Yeah, this is

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Speaker 1: the worry for Republicans right now is that you know

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Speaker 1: that Donald Trump will work against those advantages the Republicans

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Speaker 1: have in November, going against the crowd of you know,

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Speaker 1: historically advantage during mid term elections, being the party out

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Speaker 1: of power, and herschel Walker is Donald Trump's candidate for Senate,

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Speaker 1: and he might be the only candidate of all the

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Speaker 1: eight candidates that Donald Trump endorsed who doesn't need Donald

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Speaker 1: Trump's endorsement at all. He has such high name recognition,

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Speaker 1: such high visibility in Georgia. He's the celebrity candidate who

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Speaker 1: also has Mitch McConnell's backing, and of course this famous,

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Speaker 1: you know, heroic stance as the as a former uj

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Speaker 1: football star. So all those together, you know, herschel Walker

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Speaker 1: is trying to play this sort of above the Billard campaign,

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Speaker 1: not focusing on his rivals, focusing only on Rafael Warnock.

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Speaker 1: But what he doesn't want is Donald Trump coming in

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Speaker 1: and sort of confusing voters with this go rig that

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Speaker 1: go vote in a rigged election rhetoric. Right. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I feel like Georgia is ground zero for kind of

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Speaker 1: the Trump paradox, because, you know, not to undercut the

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Speaker 1: organizational efforts of activists, but the big thing to flip

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Speaker 1: the suburbs was also opposition to Donald Trump. And so

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Speaker 1: on the one hand, you know, he us a great

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Speaker 1: boon to the Democratic Party and helps him get over

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Speaker 1: the finish line in these two peace Senate races. On

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Speaker 1: the other hand, he's also very energizing for a Republican

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Speaker 1: base that continues to love this guy. So how do

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Speaker 1: you think this is ultimately all going to shake out? Greg, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you're exactly right. His popularity among Republicans is still in Georgia,

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Speaker 1: is still in the high seventies in recent polls. Is

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Speaker 1: not quite nineties anymore, but it's still seventies and still

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Speaker 1: a significant number of Republican voters in Georgia and elsewhere,

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Speaker 1: but in Georgia say that they're more likely to vote

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Speaker 1: for Donald Trump. Sorry, They're more likely to vote for

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Speaker 1: a Trump back candidate than not. And that's going to

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Speaker 1: continue to play out in Georgia. And you're right, the

430
00:25:07,760 --> 00:25:10,640
Speaker 1: suburbs flipped not just because of Democratic messaging, but also

431
00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:13,560
Speaker 1: because of this revulsion to Trump. With him not on

432
00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:16,480
Speaker 1: the ballot in the May primaries in the November election,

433
00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:18,679
Speaker 1: we're not sure how that will play out, but we

434
00:25:18,720 --> 00:25:20,520
Speaker 1: do know that even if he's not on the ballot,

435
00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:23,359
Speaker 1: he is still seeking to shape Georgia in a number

436
00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:26,320
Speaker 1: of ways. Yeah, well, Greg, can't appreciate you enough for

437
00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:28,200
Speaker 1: joining the show. Everybody go and buy the book. We're

438
00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:30,040
Speaker 1: going to have a linked down there in the description.

439
00:25:30,119 --> 00:25:32,160
Speaker 1: Let's get it up to the top of the bestseller's chart.

440
00:25:32,359 --> 00:25:34,479
Speaker 1: Really appreciate you joining us, sir. Thank you, yeap, Go

441
00:25:34,480 --> 00:25:39,720
Speaker 1: give that scratching at the door some love. Yes, you're good,

442
00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:46,880
Speaker 1: You're good. Some interesting comments from one Senator Mitch McConnell recently,

443
00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:50,720
Speaker 1: when asked in an interview about whether or if he

444
00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:53,719
Speaker 1: had any moral redlines what they might be. Let's take

445
00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:58,040
Speaker 1: a listen. You are known for playing a ruthless style

446
00:25:58,080 --> 00:26:01,880
Speaker 1: of politics. Where do you draw your moral red lines?

447
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:07,240
Speaker 1: I didn't realize I was known for playing a ruthless

448
00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:10,360
Speaker 1: I thought my wife thinks I'm a really nice guy.

449
00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:16,040
Speaker 1: My kids like me. I got a lot of friends

450
00:26:16,119 --> 00:26:21,600
Speaker 1: or so far. Okay, I'm shocked to hear such a comment.

451
00:26:22,119 --> 00:26:24,159
Speaker 1: Let's just take as a premise, and I think the

452
00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:26,919
Speaker 1: audience might agree with me, that there are some people,

453
00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:30,000
Speaker 1: maybe some substantial people in this country who might agree

454
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:33,520
Speaker 1: without assertion. I'm sure you could find moral red lines.

455
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:37,840
Speaker 1: Where do you draw them? I'm perfectly comfortable with the

456
00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:43,560
Speaker 1: way I have conducted my political career, and I'd be

457
00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:47,080
Speaker 1: happy to respond to any specificity you want to apply

458
00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:51,080
Speaker 1: to the term, what was it? Moral red lines? Moral

459
00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:54,280
Speaker 1: red line? Yeah, well, let me give you very comfortable

460
00:26:54,280 --> 00:26:56,719
Speaker 1: with my moral red line. Let me give you one

461
00:26:56,760 --> 00:27:03,120
Speaker 1: specific help me understand. I watched your speech last year

462
00:27:03,520 --> 00:27:06,360
Speaker 1: in February on the Senate floor after the second impeachment

463
00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:10,040
Speaker 1: vote on Donald Trump, and it was an extraordinary speech.

464
00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:14,040
Speaker 1: You spoke very powerfully against the most powerful figure in

465
00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:18,680
Speaker 1: your party, the president, and you said Donald Trump's actions

466
00:27:18,760 --> 00:27:23,440
Speaker 1: preceding the January sixth insurrection were a quote disgraceful dereliction

467
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:27,680
Speaker 1: of duty, and that he was practically and morally responsible,

468
00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:32,120
Speaker 1: morally responsible, your words for provoking the events of that day.

469
00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:36,800
Speaker 1: How do you go from saying that to two weeks

470
00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:40,560
Speaker 1: later saying you'd absolutely support Donald Trump if he's the

471
00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:43,560
Speaker 1: Republican nominee in twenty twenty four, well as a Republican

472
00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:45,360
Speaker 1: leader of the Senate. It should not be a front

473
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:48,879
Speaker 1: page headline that I will support the Republican nominee for

474
00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:50,880
Speaker 1: the president after you've said that about him. I think

475
00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:53,600
Speaker 1: it's astonished. I think I have an obligation to support

476
00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:58,960
Speaker 1: the nominee of my party, and is there anything they

477
00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:01,639
Speaker 1: could do I will that will mean that whoever the

478
00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:04,840
Speaker 1: nominee is has gone out and earned the nomination. Okay,

479
00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:08,040
Speaker 1: but Donald Trump earned it last time. And I'm just

480
00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:10,760
Speaker 1: trying to understand. You know what you say matters. You're

481
00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:13,240
Speaker 1: you're a very important voice in this country. You're the

482
00:28:13,280 --> 00:28:16,440
Speaker 1: leader of your party, and you seem to hold two

483
00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:22,200
Speaker 1: concurrent conflicted. No, not at all, not at all inconsistent.

484
00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:25,000
Speaker 1: I stand by everything I said. I understand, but January

485
00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:27,320
Speaker 1: sixth and everything I said on February the thirteen, I

486
00:28:27,400 --> 00:28:29,560
Speaker 1: understand that. But what I want to understand, which I

487
00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:31,639
Speaker 1: haven't heard you address, is because I don't get to

488
00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:36,199
Speaker 1: pick the nominee for president. They're elected by the Republican

489
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:39,239
Speaker 1: voters all over the country. I fully understand that. But

490
00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:41,640
Speaker 1: take Liz Cheney for example. You want to spend some

491
00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:43,640
Speaker 1: more time on this as well. I actually do, because

492
00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:46,240
Speaker 1: I actually, no, no, I genuinely want to understand this.

493
00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:47,880
Speaker 1: I really want to understand how you think about this.

494
00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:50,360
Speaker 1: Because Liz Cheney, who has the same view of you.

495
00:28:50,680 --> 00:28:53,520
Speaker 1: Of January sixth, she said she doesn't want Donald Trump

496
00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:55,600
Speaker 1: anywhere near the White House, and she's going to work

497
00:28:55,680 --> 00:28:57,880
Speaker 1: to not make that happen because she thinks that there

498
00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:02,760
Speaker 1: are some things more important than loyal to Oh well,

499
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:05,640
Speaker 1: maybe you ought to be talking to Liz Jenny. No,

500
00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:08,640
Speaker 1: I'm not trying to really, it's not a go I'm

501
00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:11,480
Speaker 1: just actually trying to understand, like, is there any threshold

502
00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:13,640
Speaker 1: for you of what if some of you know, I

503
00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:18,640
Speaker 1: say many things. I'm sure people don't understand. There's a

504
00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:21,600
Speaker 1: lot to unpact there. I mean, first of all, Mitch

505
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:24,720
Speaker 1: can't name a single moral red line, and I think

506
00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:29,560
Speaker 1: that is uh politic demonstrated throughout. Yeah, sadly, that's the

507
00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:34,880
Speaker 1: type of just pure power machiavellian politics that gets rewarded

508
00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:39,040
Speaker 1: in DC. And so I think, you know, I mean

509
00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:41,640
Speaker 1: that is not that revealing, because I think we all

510
00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:44,560
Speaker 1: sort of suspected that he doesn't really have any moral

511
00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:46,200
Speaker 1: red lines, and if it'd been able to come up

512
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:49,760
Speaker 1: with one, it would have been bullshit anyway. But I

513
00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:52,160
Speaker 1: also think, I mean, there's also something to be said

514
00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:54,200
Speaker 1: about the fact that he holds up like Liz Cheney

515
00:29:54,680 --> 00:30:01,480
Speaker 1: as paragon a virtue given her extraordinally odious and you know, consistent.

516
00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:04,959
Speaker 1: We're mongering in all of that. So there's a lot

517
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:07,480
Speaker 1: going on here. Yeah, I mean, look, it's funny obviously

518
00:30:07,520 --> 00:30:09,720
Speaker 1: in order to see it happen. And at the end

519
00:30:09,720 --> 00:30:11,840
Speaker 1: of the day, I've said this, for like McConnell does

520
00:30:11,880 --> 00:30:15,880
Speaker 1: not care about much except for power, and then very

521
00:30:15,960 --> 00:30:19,440
Speaker 1: like Bedrock, couple of things, Supreme Court. All the guy

522
00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:24,040
Speaker 1: cares about is like the judiciary, and beyond that cutting taxes.

523
00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:26,959
Speaker 1: He's achieved both of those quite well in his life.

524
00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:29,400
Speaker 1: That's really what he's interested in, to the extent that

525
00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:32,400
Speaker 1: Trump or whoever is a Republican president. As you saw

526
00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:35,600
Speaker 1: under Trump, when Trump was like, hey, we should build

527
00:30:35,600 --> 00:30:37,920
Speaker 1: a wall and have possibly raised it was called a

528
00:30:37,920 --> 00:30:40,520
Speaker 1: border adjustment tax, which would have taxed a lot of

529
00:30:40,560 --> 00:30:43,080
Speaker 1: the goods coming over the US Mexico border. He was like, now,

530
00:30:43,080 --> 00:30:45,720
Speaker 1: we're not that's not going to happen or whenever, like

531
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:47,880
Speaker 1: any of these types of proposals which would have cut

532
00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:51,480
Speaker 1: against orthodoxy. Infrastructure was a good example. Trump wanted to

533
00:30:51,480 --> 00:30:53,680
Speaker 1: do a two trillion dollar bill. McConnell said, how about

534
00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:56,120
Speaker 1: six hundred billion in most of its fake private investment,

535
00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:59,960
Speaker 1: and of course that fell apart. I mean, he's looked

536
00:31:00,160 --> 00:31:02,200
Speaker 1: now for the donor class. That's all he cares a win,

537
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:07,840
Speaker 1: and it's when he first was coming into power in Kentucky,

538
00:31:08,280 --> 00:31:11,520
Speaker 1: and really, I mean there basically was no Republican Party

539
00:31:11,560 --> 00:31:15,000
Speaker 1: in Kentucky before Ms McConnell came along, and he positioned

540
00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:18,960
Speaker 1: himself as this sort of like good governance, like progressive

541
00:31:19,040 --> 00:31:22,960
Speaker 1: reformer against money in politics and all of that. I mean,

542
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:24,880
Speaker 1: we can see that that was just he put his

543
00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:26,440
Speaker 1: finger in the wind and thought that would be a

544
00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:30,360
Speaker 1: good campaign message and selling point. Now you know much,

545
00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:33,120
Speaker 1: it's much more clear that what he actually is all

546
00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:35,480
Speaker 1: about is just power, and part of that power base

547
00:31:35,600 --> 00:31:38,440
Speaker 1: is protecting the donor class. And that's how I read

548
00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:41,840
Speaker 1: his actions with regards to January sixth as well, because

549
00:31:41,840 --> 00:31:44,280
Speaker 1: I remember covering it you and I together at the time,

550
00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:46,800
Speaker 1: and I think he kind of put his finger in

551
00:31:46,840 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 1: the wind to see if he doesn't love having Trumps

552
00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:53,040
Speaker 1: at the head of the party because Trump is unpredictable,

553
00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:55,920
Speaker 1: They're not on great terms at this point, all of

554
00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:58,520
Speaker 1: that stuff. So there was kind of a finger put

555
00:31:58,520 --> 00:32:02,000
Speaker 1: in the win with his initial comments of like, could

556
00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:05,160
Speaker 1: this actually be his undoing? Is this actually an opening

557
00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:08,560
Speaker 1: to unseat Trump as the head of the Republican Party.

558
00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:12,400
Speaker 1: He gets the information back basically, no, the bas is

559
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:16,280
Speaker 1: still with him. The Republican, your caucus is still more

560
00:32:16,400 --> 00:32:18,880
Speaker 1: or less with him, at least what they're willing to

561
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:21,920
Speaker 1: say and do publicly. And so that's why you see

562
00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:25,800
Speaker 1: the flip. So even in that moment that Swan holds

563
00:32:25,880 --> 00:32:29,000
Speaker 1: up as an example of like here you are having principle,

564
00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:32,120
Speaker 1: I think if you scratch an inch beneath the surface,

565
00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:35,239
Speaker 1: that also was about a kind of power politics, just like,

566
00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:37,600
Speaker 1: let me see if this is an opening I can

567
00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:41,800
Speaker 1: exploit to reassert my own power and position within the party,

568
00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:46,120
Speaker 1: not any sort of actual objection to Trump and the

569
00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:50,080
Speaker 1: events of January sixth. So that's the best way to

570
00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:52,720
Speaker 1: understand Mitch McConnell. You're never going to get a straight

571
00:32:52,760 --> 00:32:54,920
Speaker 1: answer on him in terms of any sort of moral

572
00:32:54,960 --> 00:32:58,200
Speaker 1: red lines, because ultimately it's all about, you know, service

573
00:32:58,240 --> 00:33:00,640
Speaker 1: of his own position and power in the owner class.

574
00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:03,400
Speaker 1: That's it, all right, guys. Little moment over on CNN

575
00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:05,680
Speaker 1: that caught our eye. So you might recall we actually

576
00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:08,080
Speaker 1: covered this study that came out of Yale where they

577
00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:11,720
Speaker 1: paid Fox News viewers to watch CNN and then to

578
00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:13,920
Speaker 1: see if it actually changed their opinions. And it was

579
00:33:14,040 --> 00:33:16,600
Speaker 1: very interesting because it revealed like people are not the

580
00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:19,560
Speaker 1: hardened partisan automatons that you think they are, that if

581
00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:22,160
Speaker 1: they consume different information, they're going to have different ideas

582
00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:25,040
Speaker 1: about the world. That's both good. It's also bad because

583
00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:27,640
Speaker 1: it shows you how impactful cable news continues to be,

584
00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:32,560
Speaker 1: especially for boomers since their overwhelming demographic is on the

585
00:33:32,600 --> 00:33:36,400
Speaker 1: older side. So CNN decides to cover this specifically. Brian

586
00:33:36,440 --> 00:33:38,960
Speaker 1: Stelter decides to cover this study with one of the

587
00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:42,440
Speaker 1: researchers who is involved, but they try to frame it

588
00:33:42,480 --> 00:33:48,640
Speaker 1: as just about how Fox News is feeding their viewers

589
00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:51,920
Speaker 1: selective information, which of course they are, but the Yale

590
00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:56,000
Speaker 1: researcher is having none of it. Let's take a look. So, Josh,

591
00:33:56,000 --> 00:34:00,920
Speaker 1: you all call this partisan coverage filtering, and basically you're

592
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:04,200
Speaker 1: proving what we've sensed for a while, which is foxviewers

593
00:34:04,200 --> 00:34:06,200
Speaker 1: are in the dark about bad news for the GOP.

594
00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:12,960
Speaker 1: That's right, Fox and CNN cover different issues, and Fox

595
00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:16,960
Speaker 1: News predominantly covers issues that make the GOP look good

596
00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:19,960
Speaker 1: and make Democrats look bad. And on the flip side,

597
00:34:20,160 --> 00:34:23,160
Speaker 1: CNN engages in this Parsian coverage filtering is as well

598
00:34:23,160 --> 00:34:26,120
Speaker 1: as that we find for example, during this time, the

599
00:34:26,160 --> 00:34:29,160
Speaker 1: Abraham of Cords were signed, and these were the agreements

600
00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:32,680
Speaker 1: where Israel, the UAE, and Brenge signed a major piece agreement.

601
00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:36,160
Speaker 1: And we see that Fox News covered this really major

602
00:34:36,200 --> 00:34:39,640
Speaker 1: accomplishment about fifteen times more than CNEN did, so we

603
00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:43,320
Speaker 1: established both networks are really engaging in this Parson coverage filtering.

604
00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:46,640
Speaker 1: It's not about one side, it's about the media at large.

605
00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:51,280
Speaker 1: I think you're engaging in some both sides in there, Josh,

606
00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:54,040
Speaker 1: not trying to lay out a moral equivalent. See, it's

607
00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:57,400
Speaker 1: not about what an objective standard is. It's really about

608
00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:01,000
Speaker 1: how all networks do engage in this. And in order

609
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:04,720
Speaker 1: for viewers to get a realistic picture of the world,

610
00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:09,239
Speaker 1: we need viewers to see all types of information, and unfortunately,

611
00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:11,560
Speaker 1: what we find in the study is that the viewers

612
00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:15,880
Speaker 1: don't want to engage in watching all sides. So, as

613
00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:19,040
Speaker 1: David mentioned, we see that viewers we pay them for

614
00:35:19,120 --> 00:35:22,640
Speaker 1: four weeks to watch CNN, but then after this payment stop,

615
00:35:22,680 --> 00:35:25,719
Speaker 1: they go back to watching Fox News. So even though

616
00:35:25,719 --> 00:35:29,160
Speaker 1: we try to incentivize viewers to watch both Fox and CNN,

617
00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:32,239
Speaker 1: they don't want to engage in that that hard work.

618
00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:34,879
Speaker 1: They want to really just watch the side that makes

619
00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:37,799
Speaker 1: them feel good and This is why the media has

620
00:35:37,800 --> 00:35:40,800
Speaker 1: such an important responsibility to cover both sides too, to

621
00:35:40,840 --> 00:35:46,880
Speaker 1: hold both parties accountable. There's a lot so awkward. Why

622
00:35:48,160 --> 00:35:50,399
Speaker 1: this very odd? And also why was that other guy?

623
00:35:50,520 --> 00:35:52,839
Speaker 1: Why are their producers so bad? They keep that one

624
00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:56,360
Speaker 1: guy up on the screen. Just go to him just

625
00:35:56,360 --> 00:36:00,839
Speaker 1: like noddling vigorously. But the point was well done. Yeah,

626
00:36:01,000 --> 00:36:02,839
Speaker 1: I mean, prudos to hand for holding his ground even

627
00:36:02,840 --> 00:36:05,520
Speaker 1: in the most awkward way. Possibles Well, look like both

628
00:36:05,520 --> 00:36:08,359
Speaker 1: sides engage his gaer and heusic sounds like also, he's

629
00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:10,920
Speaker 1: such an untalented interviewer. It sounds like you're engaging in

630
00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:13,279
Speaker 1: them both sides. It sounds like you're engaging on both

631
00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:18,000
Speaker 1: sides of It's like aesthetic criticisms aside substance point made there.

632
00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:21,840
Speaker 1: You both engage in selective coverage. You both are engaged

633
00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:23,319
Speaker 1: in the exact same game. That's why I get really

634
00:36:23,320 --> 00:36:26,360
Speaker 1: annoyed too. Some of his Fox picks up our segments

635
00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:29,480
Speaker 1: slamming cl Yeah, and it's like, okay, fine, but like

636
00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:32,360
Speaker 1: you know, we don't really like crashing you guys. Yeah, exactly,

637
00:36:32,600 --> 00:36:34,560
Speaker 1: You're not right, and it's not like CNN covers the

638
00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:36,480
Speaker 1: other side. But more, what we're saying is you cannot

639
00:36:36,560 --> 00:36:39,000
Speaker 1: be a member of this like industrial complex and then

640
00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:41,600
Speaker 1: just use selective outrage on the other side, because you're

641
00:36:41,640 --> 00:36:44,160
Speaker 1: just as guilty of doing the exact same thing. Our

642
00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:47,279
Speaker 1: whole point is, no curse a pox on all of

643
00:36:47,320 --> 00:36:50,239
Speaker 1: your houses. You're all terrible. And of course they don't

644
00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:52,560
Speaker 1: ever want to hear right, and their incentives are never

645
00:36:52,600 --> 00:36:56,319
Speaker 1: going to change, so there's no reforming those systems. The

646
00:36:56,360 --> 00:36:58,879
Speaker 1: only thing you can do is try to supplant them

647
00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:02,680
Speaker 1: and replace the multi But yeah, you love to see

648
00:37:02,840 --> 00:37:06,200
Speaker 1: when these anchors are actually faced with the truth and

649
00:37:06,239 --> 00:37:11,160
Speaker 1: the reality of their own selective coverage, selective outrage. I

650
00:37:11,160 --> 00:37:13,680
Speaker 1: think that the term partisan filtering is actually a really

651
00:37:13,800 --> 00:37:15,839
Speaker 1: good one because that's exactly what it is. I mean,

652
00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:19,960
Speaker 1: so much of it of how they control information isn't

653
00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:23,799
Speaker 1: just about, like you know, sometimes their outright lies and

654
00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:27,000
Speaker 1: outright you know, spinning of stories or concocting of narratives

655
00:37:27,040 --> 00:37:29,319
Speaker 1: that don't really exist. But a lot of it has

656
00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:32,000
Speaker 1: to do with just which stories you choose to focus on.

657
00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:35,040
Speaker 1: And I remember very clearly when I first started going

658
00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:39,640
Speaker 1: on Fox News back a decade ago, they were obsessed

659
00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:42,359
Speaker 1: with these stories as a Tea party era, they were

660
00:37:42,360 --> 00:37:46,160
Speaker 1: obsessed with these stories where they'd find like this government

661
00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:49,759
Speaker 1: agency paid fifteen dollars for a muffin, and they do

662
00:37:49,880 --> 00:37:53,480
Speaker 1: like a whole whole thing on that. Yeah. Yeah, to

663
00:37:53,520 --> 00:37:56,480
Speaker 1: try to paint the entire government is just like worthless

664
00:37:56,520 --> 00:37:59,880
Speaker 1: and corrupt and they're just you know, flagrantly misusing your

665
00:38:00,800 --> 00:38:03,200
Speaker 1: your money without looking at you know, I'm sure there's

666
00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:05,600
Speaker 1: some plenty of that that's going on, but without looking

667
00:38:05,600 --> 00:38:07,960
Speaker 1: at the bigger picture or telling you that, oh, when

668
00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:10,560
Speaker 1: you cut the budget for these agencies, it doesn't cut

669
00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:12,680
Speaker 1: back on the fifteen dollars muffins. It cuts back on

670
00:38:12,760 --> 00:38:15,239
Speaker 1: vital services that are actually going to people. So just

671
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:17,520
Speaker 1: one example that always stood out to me of like

672
00:38:18,000 --> 00:38:21,279
Speaker 1: the partisan filtering that Fox engages in and of course

673
00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:24,839
Speaker 1: CNN obviously engaging the same Insteltier doesn't really have any

674
00:38:24,840 --> 00:38:26,960
Speaker 1: answer to it of them being like this sounds like

675
00:38:27,000 --> 00:38:28,800
Speaker 1: both sides. He always says something along the lines of

676
00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:31,400
Speaker 1: we don't understand how CNN really works. Then it's like, no,

677
00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:34,000
Speaker 1: I think we do, dude, Yeah, I don't think you're

678
00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:37,640
Speaker 1: watching the same network we are. Now, No, we're watching

679
00:38:37,880 --> 00:38:43,000
Speaker 1: we got it, brother, Hey, guys, Kyle Kolinski is letting

680
00:38:43,080 --> 00:38:45,239
Speaker 1: us post some of the clips from his channel that

681
00:38:45,320 --> 00:38:47,840
Speaker 1: we think you guys will really love in the Breaking

682
00:38:47,880 --> 00:38:50,879
Speaker 1: Points community on our channel. Yep, let's get to it.

683
00:38:51,080 --> 00:38:54,319
Speaker 1: Jerry Springer, you know, had a very famous talk show

684
00:38:54,840 --> 00:38:57,880
Speaker 1: It's going off the air after being on air for

685
00:38:57,920 --> 00:39:01,080
Speaker 1: a very very long time. He did an interview with

686
00:39:01,200 --> 00:39:05,440
Speaker 1: Dino Badala on his serious XM radio show, and you know,

687
00:39:05,480 --> 00:39:07,440
Speaker 1: Springer was askeding political questions. I don't know how much

688
00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:10,840
Speaker 1: for a political guy he is. Maybe he's dabbled, dabbled

689
00:39:10,840 --> 00:39:14,360
Speaker 1: in it every now and then, but he was asked

690
00:39:14,520 --> 00:39:17,759
Speaker 1: about the rise of Trump is an interesting question and

691
00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:20,680
Speaker 1: Jerry Springer's answer, it's a very interesting response too. So

692
00:39:21,239 --> 00:39:22,680
Speaker 1: I'll have you take a look at it. But you'll

693
00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:26,880
Speaker 1: see Jerry Springer is basically trying to almost like blames

694
00:39:26,960 --> 00:39:29,560
Speaker 1: himself and his show for the rise of Trump. Take

695
00:39:29,600 --> 00:39:31,640
Speaker 1: a look. Do you see a connection? Do you see

696
00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:34,560
Speaker 1: a line between the success the Jerry Springer show, which

697
00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:37,600
Speaker 1: was everywhere it defined think a decade to be blunt

698
00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:40,640
Speaker 1: and the way people look at TV and the way

699
00:39:40,760 --> 00:39:42,800
Speaker 1: what people they let people get away with. Do you

700
00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:45,319
Speaker 1: think that on some levels sincere I being honestly, yes,

701
00:39:45,600 --> 00:39:47,800
Speaker 1: it was fine. Do you think it contributed to people

702
00:39:47,800 --> 00:39:54,080
Speaker 1: accepting someone like Donald Trump? Uh? Probably social media more.

703
00:39:54,239 --> 00:39:59,840
Speaker 1: But yes, there's no question we uh there to be.

704
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:03,759
Speaker 1: Behavior of some of the people on the show is

705
00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:08,279
Speaker 1: exactly Donald Trump. The point is, the reason there's more

706
00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:10,760
Speaker 1: respect given to the people who were on my show

707
00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:13,400
Speaker 1: is they have enough sense not to run for president.

708
00:40:14,120 --> 00:40:19,239
Speaker 1: They're on the show letting their emotions out, their feelings out.

709
00:40:19,600 --> 00:40:22,360
Speaker 1: They don't speak the Queen's English, they don't have money,

710
00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:25,520
Speaker 1: they don't live in palaces, they aren't rich and famous,

711
00:40:26,880 --> 00:40:30,000
Speaker 1: but they have feelings like everybody else. And when they

712
00:40:30,000 --> 00:40:33,480
Speaker 1: get angry, they probably curse and they yell and sometimes

713
00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:39,080
Speaker 1: fight because they don't have the skills to settle things

714
00:40:39,080 --> 00:40:44,240
Speaker 1: in different ways. That's Trump. But what made Trump unique.

715
00:40:44,600 --> 00:40:46,960
Speaker 1: The only thing that separates him from the guests on

716
00:40:47,000 --> 00:40:50,799
Speaker 1: My show is the fact that he had this delusion

717
00:40:51,320 --> 00:40:54,320
Speaker 1: of he knew how to run the world and or

718
00:40:54,440 --> 00:40:57,560
Speaker 1: run the country, when in fact he knows he knows

719
00:40:57,600 --> 00:41:01,319
Speaker 1: nothing about how you run a country, and we paid

720
00:41:01,360 --> 00:41:05,760
Speaker 1: the price for that. But yeah, of course there's similarities

721
00:41:06,200 --> 00:41:08,360
Speaker 1: except for the issue of g I don't think I

722
00:41:08,400 --> 00:41:11,840
Speaker 1: ought to be president. That was an interesting back and

723
00:41:11,880 --> 00:41:16,000
Speaker 1: forth to me. So the argument strikes me as this,

724
00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:23,560
Speaker 1: my show helped to normalize degeneracy, and in that normalization

725
00:41:23,600 --> 00:41:29,440
Speaker 1: of degeneracy, you get this candidate who's degenerate, and so

726
00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:33,440
Speaker 1: that became not a negative thing in the eyes of

727
00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:37,440
Speaker 1: the public. It became maybe even a positive thing that

728
00:41:37,520 --> 00:41:41,120
Speaker 1: you know, my show helped lower the standards for the

729
00:41:41,120 --> 00:41:46,680
Speaker 1: way people should act, and Trump came along and gave

730
00:41:46,800 --> 00:41:49,560
Speaker 1: us a hefty dose of that, very similar type stuff

731
00:41:49,560 --> 00:41:52,080
Speaker 1: to what you see on my show, and that led

732
00:41:52,120 --> 00:41:54,600
Speaker 1: to his rise. Another way of putting it as like

733
00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:58,440
Speaker 1: Trump brought about the death of civilit My show helped

734
00:41:58,760 --> 00:42:02,359
Speaker 1: bring about the death of civility, and Trump finalized the

735
00:42:02,400 --> 00:42:05,600
Speaker 1: death of civility in our politics, and so he's sort

736
00:42:05,600 --> 00:42:07,400
Speaker 1: of he's trying to like take ownership for Trump now.

737
00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:09,799
Speaker 1: He also mentioned social media more has has led to

738
00:42:09,840 --> 00:42:12,640
Speaker 1: that as well. You know, social media is the place

739
00:42:12,640 --> 00:42:14,440
Speaker 1: where everybody goes to be the worst version of themselves.

740
00:42:14,480 --> 00:42:15,799
Speaker 1: You could argue that, or you could argue the most

741
00:42:15,840 --> 00:42:18,720
Speaker 1: authentic version of themselves, the most shit post d version

742
00:42:18,719 --> 00:42:22,799
Speaker 1: of themselves. However you want to talk about it. So

743
00:42:23,360 --> 00:42:25,960
Speaker 1: do I buy that argument. I actually don't. I don't

744
00:42:25,960 --> 00:42:29,000
Speaker 1: buy that argument at all because to me, to the

745
00:42:29,040 --> 00:42:31,319
Speaker 1: extent you're going to make any kind of argument like that,

746
00:42:31,920 --> 00:42:33,839
Speaker 1: the one that appeals more to me is the cult

747
00:42:33,880 --> 00:42:37,879
Speaker 1: of celebrity argument. So he had a built in advantage

748
00:42:37,960 --> 00:42:40,160
Speaker 1: in running for president because he had been a celebrity

749
00:42:40,200 --> 00:42:44,120
Speaker 1: for so long. And you know, in this country, whatever

750
00:42:44,160 --> 00:42:47,800
Speaker 1: people want to pretend, there is a worship of celebrity,

751
00:42:48,160 --> 00:42:50,880
Speaker 1: there is a worship of you know, faces and people

752
00:42:50,960 --> 00:42:53,280
Speaker 1: that we all know to one extent or another, based

753
00:42:53,320 --> 00:42:55,640
Speaker 1: on whatever they do for a living. It's in the

754
00:42:55,680 --> 00:42:57,359
Speaker 1: public eye. And so I think he had a built

755
00:42:57,360 --> 00:42:59,279
Speaker 1: in advantage even though he was kind of viewed as

756
00:42:59,280 --> 00:43:01,640
Speaker 1: a joke, and you know, rightly so to some extent,

757
00:43:03,120 --> 00:43:05,200
Speaker 1: I think the cult of celebrity angle is one of

758
00:43:05,200 --> 00:43:07,160
Speaker 1: the reasons that, you know, led to the rise of

759
00:43:07,239 --> 00:43:08,759
Speaker 1: him and perhaps gave more of an advantage at the

760
00:43:08,800 --> 00:43:11,880
Speaker 1: beginning than anybody may have thought he had. But to me,

761
00:43:11,920 --> 00:43:13,960
Speaker 1: the main culprit, and you guys all know this is

762
00:43:14,480 --> 00:43:20,000
Speaker 1: the real reason for the rise of Trump is the

763
00:43:20,040 --> 00:43:24,080
Speaker 1: total breakdown of trust in our institutions. And don't get

764
00:43:24,120 --> 00:43:28,200
Speaker 1: me wrong, Trump was and is a total demagogue, and

765
00:43:28,239 --> 00:43:31,040
Speaker 1: a charlatan and a con man and a fraud. But

766
00:43:31,760 --> 00:43:37,399
Speaker 1: I think people rightly looked at our institutions having failed them.

767
00:43:37,719 --> 00:43:39,360
Speaker 1: And so then when you have somebody who comes along

768
00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:44,040
Speaker 1: who postures as, no, I'm the effective person, I'm the

769
00:43:44,160 --> 00:43:47,399
Speaker 1: efficient person. Only I can fix it, and I'm looking

770
00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:49,040
Speaker 1: out for you. He literally said them on only I

771
00:43:49,080 --> 00:43:51,759
Speaker 1: can fix it, I alone can fix it, something like that,

772
00:43:52,520 --> 00:43:56,480
Speaker 1: and the posturing worked, you know, it was do you

773
00:43:56,520 --> 00:43:59,239
Speaker 1: really trust? Like the media would go after Trump relentlessly,

774
00:43:59,280 --> 00:44:01,200
Speaker 1: but his argument so easy. He's like, you're gonna trust

775
00:44:01,280 --> 00:44:05,360
Speaker 1: these people. These guys, they've given you a million reasons

776
00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:08,120
Speaker 1: not to trust them, so you should trust me over them.

777
00:44:08,400 --> 00:44:10,479
Speaker 1: You know, the same people that brought you the Iraq War.

778
00:44:10,840 --> 00:44:13,160
Speaker 1: You're gonna trust them when they criticize me. And then

779
00:44:13,160 --> 00:44:15,080
Speaker 1: he would postially he was against the Iraq War, when

780
00:44:15,120 --> 00:44:16,680
Speaker 1: of course he wasn't, and he was typidally for it.

781
00:44:16,719 --> 00:44:19,319
Speaker 1: There's that clip on Howard Stern where he talks about

782
00:44:19,320 --> 00:44:21,399
Speaker 1: it and typidly comes out in favor of the war.

783
00:44:23,120 --> 00:44:24,719
Speaker 1: But I think it's more of that. I think it's

784
00:44:24,719 --> 00:44:26,160
Speaker 1: more of the media has been lying to you all

785
00:44:26,160 --> 00:44:29,000
Speaker 1: this time. Obviously, the government has failed you a million ways,

786
00:44:29,480 --> 00:44:31,520
Speaker 1: whether it be the Iraq War, the Afghanistan War, the

787
00:44:31,560 --> 00:44:36,000
Speaker 1: trillions of dollars spent overseas for absolutely nothing, the subprime

788
00:44:36,040 --> 00:44:38,400
Speaker 1: mortgage crisis and the Great Recession where people lost their

789
00:44:38,440 --> 00:44:41,719
Speaker 1: homes and lost their livelihood, and you know, wages had

790
00:44:41,719 --> 00:44:43,880
Speaker 1: been stagnant and all the jobs are outsourced, and then

791
00:44:43,920 --> 00:44:45,799
Speaker 1: you got this guy who comes along and postures against it.

792
00:44:45,800 --> 00:44:48,320
Speaker 1: And also, by the way, he does the classic elitist

793
00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:51,840
Speaker 1: trick of scapegoating, don't look up, don't look at you know,

794
00:44:51,880 --> 00:44:54,720
Speaker 1: the billionaires and the corporations as to why you're hurting.

795
00:44:54,760 --> 00:44:58,120
Speaker 1: Look look at the the fucking it's the Muslims, it's

796
00:44:58,160 --> 00:45:06,000
Speaker 1: the Mexicans. So I mean they basically a huge number

797
00:45:06,040 --> 00:45:07,600
Speaker 1: of the Republican voters all went for it, and he

798
00:45:07,600 --> 00:45:10,000
Speaker 1: picked off enough independence to get the job done. And

799
00:45:10,040 --> 00:45:12,040
Speaker 1: so I think that's what led to the rise of Trump.

800
00:45:12,440 --> 00:45:15,400
Speaker 1: But I will also say, you know, to Jerry Springer

801
00:45:15,400 --> 00:45:16,759
Speaker 1: and his show, I don't know how much of it

802
00:45:16,800 --> 00:45:19,080
Speaker 1: was planned and how much of it was you know,

803
00:45:19,160 --> 00:45:21,920
Speaker 1: really authentic and people genuinely going through these problems and

804
00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:25,480
Speaker 1: having all sorts of tumultuous tumultuous issues that's a hard

805
00:45:25,520 --> 00:45:29,440
Speaker 1: word to say, but I think authenticity will be in

806
00:45:29,480 --> 00:45:35,440
Speaker 1: authenticity every time. So that that civility politics was going

807
00:45:35,480 --> 00:45:37,319
Speaker 1: to go out one way or another, whether it was

808
00:45:37,360 --> 00:45:39,840
Speaker 1: with Trump or with or even with Bernie, Like, it

809
00:45:39,880 --> 00:45:41,640
Speaker 1: was going to go out one way or another where

810
00:45:41,640 --> 00:45:43,480
Speaker 1: you were going to get somebody who's more of a

811
00:45:43,520 --> 00:45:46,600
Speaker 1: quote unquote straight shooter and straight talker than you were

812
00:45:46,600 --> 00:45:48,520
Speaker 1: going to get, you know, the button down politician who

813
00:45:48,520 --> 00:45:51,440
Speaker 1: talks really fakely and has a weird rhythm and cadence

814
00:45:51,480 --> 00:45:53,440
Speaker 1: to what they say. So I think that was going

815
00:45:53,480 --> 00:45:55,800
Speaker 1: out either way either way. Look, I think actually Jerry's

816
00:45:55,840 --> 00:45:58,160
Speaker 1: being too hard on himself here. I don't think his

817
00:45:58,239 --> 00:46:01,120
Speaker 1: show is led to the rise of Trump or help

818
00:46:01,160 --> 00:46:03,040
Speaker 1: facilitate Trump or lay the groundwork for Trump to the

819
00:46:03,040 --> 00:46:05,440
Speaker 1: extent you're going to point at any other individual figure

820
00:46:05,480 --> 00:46:08,200
Speaker 1: in public life that did that, maybe Sarah Palin because

821
00:46:08,239 --> 00:46:11,359
Speaker 1: she was the precursor, you know, it mirrored him in

822
00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:17,800
Speaker 1: this sense, like Sarah Palin was a tribalist demogog who's unintelligent,

823
00:46:17,800 --> 00:46:19,280
Speaker 1: and I think you could argue Trump was a tribalist

824
00:46:19,320 --> 00:46:22,680
Speaker 1: demogog who's unintelligent. So there were that sort of connecting tissue.

825
00:46:22,680 --> 00:46:24,680
Speaker 1: But I think Jerry's been a little too hard on

826
00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:28,360
Speaker 1: himself here. The real culprit, you could argue, to some extent,

827
00:46:28,800 --> 00:46:31,680
Speaker 1: the cult of celebrity, but probably more importantly the death

828
00:46:32,120 --> 00:46:34,319
Speaker 1: and the total breakdown of trust in our institutions, which

829
00:46:34,360 --> 00:46:37,440
Speaker 1: is merited. It's just that Trump obviously was not the solution,

830
00:46:37,560 --> 00:46:39,359
Speaker 1: and in fact, the way he governed you can all

831
00:46:39,400 --> 00:46:42,319
Speaker 1: see he was just a continuation of the status quo

832
00:46:42,480 --> 00:46:45,080
Speaker 1: he was. He governed like George W. Bush. That's what

833
00:46:45,120 --> 00:46:49,960
Speaker 1: he was, just a standard establishment Republican. And ultimately final

834
00:46:49,960 --> 00:46:51,440
Speaker 1: point I know I'm going on around here, but the

835
00:46:51,440 --> 00:46:54,680
Speaker 1: culture War also helped maintain Trump because he was able to,

836
00:46:56,000 --> 00:46:59,080
Speaker 1: you know, take on the culture war fight in a

837
00:46:59,120 --> 00:47:01,600
Speaker 1: way the other Republicans are not able to do it

838
00:47:01,600 --> 00:47:03,520
Speaker 1: as effectively, and so that also helped get him the

839
00:47:03,600 --> 00:47:07,840
Speaker 1: huge devoted following that he had and still has to

840
00:47:07,880 --> 00:47:11,040
Speaker 1: some extent. So anyway, there you have it, Jerry, don't

841
00:47:11,080 --> 00:47:12,680
Speaker 1: be so hard on yourself. I really don't think it's

842
00:47:12,680 --> 00:47:17,520
Speaker 1: your fault. Hey, guys, we're excited to partner with upcoming

843
00:47:17,560 --> 00:47:20,160
Speaker 1: YouTuber James Lee of fifty one forty nine. He's going

844
00:47:20,200 --> 00:47:23,160
Speaker 1: to explain culture politics anything else that he's explaining and

845
00:47:23,239 --> 00:47:25,840
Speaker 1: we're really excited about. M yep, here is his latest effort.

846
00:47:25,920 --> 00:47:27,839
Speaker 1: Let's get to it. Hey, their my name is James Lee.

847
00:47:27,880 --> 00:47:30,640
Speaker 1: Welcome to another segment of fifty one forty nine on

848
00:47:30,760 --> 00:47:34,760
Speaker 1: Breaking Points. So a few weeks ago, in my debut

849
00:47:34,800 --> 00:47:39,120
Speaker 1: segment on Breaking Points, I posited that the unsavory behaviors

850
00:47:39,160 --> 00:47:43,400
Speaker 1: exhibited by corporations are the result of choices and decisions

851
00:47:43,400 --> 00:47:48,239
Speaker 1: made by people, and those people's choices and decisions are

852
00:47:48,280 --> 00:47:53,279
Speaker 1: heavily influenced by factors such as education, environment, and incentives.

853
00:47:53,800 --> 00:47:57,120
Speaker 1: Given that most C suite executives are NBA trained, we

854
00:47:57,320 --> 00:48:01,240
Speaker 1: together explored some of the I would call reverse ideologies

855
00:48:01,800 --> 00:48:04,759
Speaker 1: I encountered during my business school education to give you

856
00:48:04,800 --> 00:48:09,160
Speaker 1: some insight as to why otherwise normal, well meaning people

857
00:48:09,239 --> 00:48:13,680
Speaker 1: can make such ruthless, destructive decisions in the business world.

858
00:48:14,520 --> 00:48:17,440
Speaker 1: So today we're going to apply that same sort of

859
00:48:17,560 --> 00:48:21,680
Speaker 1: systemic analysis to examine the underlying factors contributing to the

860
00:48:21,840 --> 00:48:27,360
Speaker 1: dysfunction of another major institution, one that quite literally governs

861
00:48:27,719 --> 00:48:31,759
Speaker 1: everyday life in the United States Congress. Now, I'm sure

862
00:48:31,800 --> 00:48:34,640
Speaker 1: most of you are aware of the perverse incentives. Members

863
00:48:34,640 --> 00:48:38,280
Speaker 1: of Congress are subjected to under our current campaign finance

864
00:48:38,320 --> 00:48:41,320
Speaker 1: regime as a result of the twenty ten Citisens United

865
00:48:41,360 --> 00:48:44,960
Speaker 1: Supreme Court case, which allows wealthy individuals and big business

866
00:48:45,040 --> 00:48:48,480
Speaker 1: to contribute unlimited sums of money and support of the

867
00:48:48,520 --> 00:48:52,279
Speaker 1: candidate of their choice via super PACs and other dark

868
00:48:52,320 --> 00:48:56,759
Speaker 1: money groups, making members of Congress literally beholden to their

869
00:48:56,760 --> 00:49:00,520
Speaker 1: donors for their political survival. However, this is far from

870
00:49:00,560 --> 00:49:04,360
Speaker 1: the only reason for America's congressional dysfunction. There are actually

871
00:49:04,960 --> 00:49:08,240
Speaker 1: many other issues that fly under the radar without scrutiny,

872
00:49:08,320 --> 00:49:11,839
Speaker 1: given that members of Congress actually only make up a

873
00:49:11,880 --> 00:49:15,319
Speaker 1: small percentage of those working on Capitol Hill. What I

874
00:49:15,360 --> 00:49:17,880
Speaker 1: mean by that is behind every member of Congress in

875
00:49:17,920 --> 00:49:21,120
Speaker 1: the House of Representatives, there are on average a dozen

876
00:49:21,200 --> 00:49:23,600
Speaker 1: or so staffers doing much of the heavy lifting behind

877
00:49:23,600 --> 00:49:26,799
Speaker 1: the scenes. For senators, there could be many more. And

878
00:49:26,920 --> 00:49:30,400
Speaker 1: this is not to mention congressional committees and special offices

879
00:49:30,560 --> 00:49:33,040
Speaker 1: like the Speaker of the House, which have their own

880
00:49:33,080 --> 00:49:36,680
Speaker 1: dedicated staff. So while members of Congress are the ones

881
00:49:36,719 --> 00:49:40,440
Speaker 1: who ultimately sponsor bills and cast votes on the floor,

882
00:49:41,120 --> 00:49:45,520
Speaker 1: those actions are all precipitated by work done by staffers

883
00:49:45,560 --> 00:49:50,520
Speaker 1: whose identities experiences and motivations are the vast majority of

884
00:49:50,560 --> 00:49:53,960
Speaker 1: cases wholly unknown to the public. What I think is

885
00:49:54,280 --> 00:49:58,280
Speaker 1: a huge blind spot in most people's understanding of Congress,

886
00:49:58,600 --> 00:50:01,800
Speaker 1: which brings us to today's segment, where we will dive

887
00:50:01,960 --> 00:50:06,000
Speaker 1: into the work of a congressional staffer as well as

888
00:50:06,000 --> 00:50:09,959
Speaker 1: the culture, the conditions, the incentives that exist on Capitol Hill,

889
00:50:10,000 --> 00:50:14,080
Speaker 1: and hopefully together will come away with a more nuanced

890
00:50:14,120 --> 00:50:17,640
Speaker 1: understanding of the dysfunction that plagues Capitol Hill from top

891
00:50:17,680 --> 00:50:20,279
Speaker 1: to bottom. So I want to begin in today's deep

892
00:50:20,320 --> 00:50:24,080
Speaker 1: dive with this quote. Washington is to advisors, lawyers, and

893
00:50:24,120 --> 00:50:28,400
Speaker 1: politicians what Hollywood is to aspiring actors, the place to

894
00:50:28,560 --> 00:50:33,200
Speaker 1: work hard, prosper and achieve your dream. And that dream

895
00:50:33,400 --> 00:50:36,920
Speaker 1: or that journey, of course, starts with getting an internship

896
00:50:37,000 --> 00:50:40,960
Speaker 1: on Capitol Hill, which could then springboard into a permanent

897
00:50:41,040 --> 00:50:43,919
Speaker 1: staffer role. The work, from what I hear, of course,

898
00:50:44,040 --> 00:50:47,759
Speaker 1: is grueing, entails long and crazy hours, but is done

899
00:50:47,880 --> 00:50:50,560
Speaker 1: with the hope that one day you will form part

900
00:50:50,640 --> 00:50:54,399
Speaker 1: of a lawmaker's elite inner circle, or perhaps even become one.

901
00:50:55,120 --> 00:50:58,360
Speaker 1: The responsibilities and priorities of staffer rolls very a little

902
00:50:58,360 --> 00:51:00,880
Speaker 1: in each office, but generally the strikeure is as you

903
00:51:00,920 --> 00:51:03,960
Speaker 1: see on the screen. The Chief of Staff serves as

904
00:51:04,000 --> 00:51:07,840
Speaker 1: the office number one, managing the policy, communications and admin

905
00:51:07,880 --> 00:51:11,799
Speaker 1: departments while also advising the members on political matters. The

906
00:51:11,840 --> 00:51:16,200
Speaker 1: policy team researches drafts, communicates about legislation, and informs the

907
00:51:16,280 --> 00:51:19,760
Speaker 1: Member of Congress on a range of issues before Congress

908
00:51:19,760 --> 00:51:24,280
Speaker 1: and in committee. The Communications team manages media requests, executes

909
00:51:24,280 --> 00:51:27,080
Speaker 1: a strategy that communicates what the team is doing and

910
00:51:27,160 --> 00:51:31,719
Speaker 1: raises awareness about issues important to the members' constituents. The

911
00:51:31,840 --> 00:51:35,200
Speaker 1: Admin team works to keep the office organized and accountable

912
00:51:35,239 --> 00:51:38,480
Speaker 1: to the members and constituents. So you can actually think

913
00:51:38,480 --> 00:51:42,080
Speaker 1: of congressional staff as essentially extensions of the Members of

914
00:51:42,120 --> 00:51:45,640
Speaker 1: Congress that they serve. And given the fact that a

915
00:51:45,680 --> 00:51:48,360
Speaker 1: lot of members are off and busy with things like

916
00:51:48,400 --> 00:51:53,799
Speaker 1: meetings fundraisers, congressional staffers really do much of the heavy

917
00:51:53,840 --> 00:51:56,839
Speaker 1: lifting when it comes to the research and drafting of legislation,

918
00:51:57,560 --> 00:52:03,240
Speaker 1: meaning that they do actually have substantial legislative influence. Professor

919
00:52:03,320 --> 00:52:06,520
Speaker 1: Jacob Montgomery of WashU and Saint Louis and Professor Brendan

920
00:52:06,600 --> 00:52:10,040
Speaker 1: Island of Dartmouth sum this up quite well in their

921
00:52:10,239 --> 00:52:13,560
Speaker 1: academic paper entitled The Effects of congressional staff networks in

922
00:52:13,600 --> 00:52:17,560
Speaker 1: the US House of Representatives. Quote. Standard accounts of legislative

923
00:52:17,560 --> 00:52:21,960
Speaker 1: behavior typically neglect the activities of professional staff, who are

924
00:52:22,160 --> 00:52:25,960
Speaker 1: treated as extensions of the elected officials they serve. However,

925
00:52:26,040 --> 00:52:29,880
Speaker 1: staff appear to have substantial independent effects on observed levels

926
00:52:29,880 --> 00:52:34,839
Speaker 1: of legislator productivity and policy preferences. Specifically, results indicate that

927
00:52:34,920 --> 00:52:39,160
Speaker 1: members of Congress who exchange important staff members across Congresses

928
00:52:39,440 --> 00:52:43,400
Speaker 1: are more similar in their legislative effectiveness and voting patterns

929
00:52:43,440 --> 00:52:46,440
Speaker 1: than we would otherwise expect. Okay, so this means that

930
00:52:46,640 --> 00:52:50,680
Speaker 1: long standing congressional staffers can actually influence to a great

931
00:52:50,680 --> 00:52:53,719
Speaker 1: degree the members of Congress who they work for. And interestingly,

932
00:52:53,760 --> 00:52:57,080
Speaker 1: if we look back at a historical example, former President

933
00:52:57,120 --> 00:53:00,880
Speaker 1: Barack Obama's success as a junior Senator from Illinois can

934
00:53:01,160 --> 00:53:04,319
Speaker 1: be linked to the hiring of Peter Russ, a well

935
00:53:04,320 --> 00:53:07,279
Speaker 1: connected and experienced staffer who has worked on Capitol Hill

936
00:53:07,520 --> 00:53:11,240
Speaker 1: since the nineteen seventies. Referencing the Montgomery and Nyland article

937
00:53:11,320 --> 00:53:14,279
Speaker 1: once more, quote. When Barack Obama was elected to the

938
00:53:14,360 --> 00:53:17,440
Speaker 1: US Senate, for instance, he hired Pete Russ, the former

939
00:53:17,520 --> 00:53:20,840
Speaker 1: chief of staff to Majority Leader Tom Dashel because of

940
00:53:20,880 --> 00:53:25,120
Speaker 1: his deep institutional knowledge and connections, Ruce played an important

941
00:53:25,200 --> 00:53:28,320
Speaker 1: role in shaping Obama's legislative career as chief of staff,

942
00:53:28,360 --> 00:53:31,960
Speaker 1: helping the first time senator successfully navigate the chamber as

943
00:53:32,000 --> 00:53:36,040
Speaker 1: a high profile newcomer and build relationships with influential legislators

944
00:53:36,239 --> 00:53:39,640
Speaker 1: like dashel Had. I think Montgomery and Nyland's conclusions can

945
00:53:39,920 --> 00:53:43,960
Speaker 1: plausibly be extended beyond just the senior staff, as every

946
00:53:44,000 --> 00:53:46,600
Speaker 1: staffer from in turns all the way up to the

947
00:53:46,680 --> 00:53:50,720
Speaker 1: chief of Staff play critical and important roles, including setting

948
00:53:50,760 --> 00:53:55,920
Speaker 1: the direction of policy preferences that contribute to the ultimate

949
00:53:55,960 --> 00:54:00,400
Speaker 1: effectiveness or you could say, ineffectiveness of the office. So,

950
00:54:00,440 --> 00:54:02,759
Speaker 1: now that we've established a little bit of the importance

951
00:54:02,920 --> 00:54:07,120
Speaker 1: of congressional staffers and their role in Congress, let's talk

952
00:54:07,160 --> 00:54:10,759
Speaker 1: a little bit about the office structure and compensation at

953
00:54:10,760 --> 00:54:12,959
Speaker 1: the highest level. How it works is that each member

954
00:54:13,000 --> 00:54:16,799
Speaker 1: of Congress essentially acts as an all powerful GM of

955
00:54:16,800 --> 00:54:21,319
Speaker 1: a small team of workers. Their only major staffing constraint

956
00:54:21,400 --> 00:54:24,560
Speaker 1: is the set budget they are allocated to staff their

957
00:54:24,560 --> 00:54:27,080
Speaker 1: office each year, kind of like a salary cap in

958
00:54:27,120 --> 00:54:31,520
Speaker 1: professional sports. Other than that, they have nearly free reign

959
00:54:31,640 --> 00:54:34,879
Speaker 1: to hire and fire people. As they please, for as

960
00:54:35,440 --> 00:54:38,640
Speaker 1: much or little money as they please as well. Taking

961
00:54:38,640 --> 00:54:41,600
Speaker 1: a look at the salary distribution of congressional staffers based

962
00:54:41,640 --> 00:54:44,759
Speaker 1: on data from twenty twenty, the majority of staffers make

963
00:54:44,840 --> 00:54:49,160
Speaker 1: between thirty thousand and seventy thousand dollars per year, which

964
00:54:49,200 --> 00:54:52,000
Speaker 1: is not a lot relative in my opinion, to the

965
00:54:52,120 --> 00:54:56,440
Speaker 1: level of responsibility they bear. But to give even a

966
00:54:56,480 --> 00:54:59,480
Speaker 1: bit more context, according to roll Call, a well known

967
00:54:59,480 --> 00:55:03,319
Speaker 1: Capital Hill news source, thirteen percent of congressional staffers make

968
00:55:03,520 --> 00:55:07,160
Speaker 1: less than a living wage. Wow. In fact, if we

969
00:55:07,280 --> 00:55:11,360
Speaker 1: zoom in on the subset of DC based staff assistants,

970
00:55:11,440 --> 00:55:14,279
Speaker 1: the most common entry level position on Capitol Hill, with

971
00:55:14,320 --> 00:55:17,120
Speaker 1: at least one in every office, the data is even

972
00:55:17,200 --> 00:55:20,800
Speaker 1: more astonishing, with seventy percent of these folks making less

973
00:55:21,040 --> 00:55:24,080
Speaker 1: than a living wage, and for those making above minimum wage.

974
00:55:24,080 --> 00:55:28,360
Speaker 1: Congressional staffers often makes significantly lower salaries than their counterparts

975
00:55:28,360 --> 00:55:31,759
Speaker 1: in the private sector. Take the role of council, which

976
00:55:32,040 --> 00:55:34,960
Speaker 1: in the vast majority of cases requires a law degree.

977
00:55:35,200 --> 00:55:38,200
Speaker 1: Compensation has remained fairly flat over the past decade, with

978
00:55:38,280 --> 00:55:42,719
Speaker 1: the median salary of about seventy two thousand dollars a year. Now,

979
00:55:42,840 --> 00:55:45,759
Speaker 1: compare that against the average salary of a first year

980
00:55:45,800 --> 00:55:49,640
Speaker 1: associate out of law school. According to the NALP, which

981
00:55:49,680 --> 00:55:53,040
Speaker 1: is the National Association for Law Placement twenty twenty one

982
00:55:53,239 --> 00:55:57,200
Speaker 1: Associate Salary Survey Report, the overall median first year associate

983
00:55:57,239 --> 00:56:00,200
Speaker 1: base salary as of January twenty twenty one was one

984
00:56:00,280 --> 00:56:03,560
Speaker 1: hundred and sixty five thousand dollars a year. There's just

985
00:56:03,640 --> 00:56:08,160
Speaker 1: no comparison, although this isn't unique to Congress. There's just

986
00:56:08,239 --> 00:56:10,920
Speaker 1: more money to be made in the private sector, a

987
00:56:10,960 --> 00:56:13,840
Speaker 1: topic which we will discuss later more in this segment.

988
00:56:13,920 --> 00:56:17,280
Speaker 1: But on top of all of that, the work itself,

989
00:56:17,320 --> 00:56:20,800
Speaker 1: like I mentioned, can be extremely grueling. Quoting an article

990
00:56:20,800 --> 00:56:23,759
Speaker 1: from Time magazine, It's no big secret in Washington that

991
00:56:23,840 --> 00:56:27,240
Speaker 1: Hill staffers are poorly paid and overworked. It's not uncommon

992
00:56:27,280 --> 00:56:30,400
Speaker 1: to see aids working at the Capitol past midnight or

993
00:56:30,480 --> 00:56:33,480
Speaker 1: chufferring their bosses to the airport before returning to a tiny,

994
00:56:33,520 --> 00:56:38,600
Speaker 1: overcrowded DC apartment. There's also this Instagram account Deer White Staffers,

995
00:56:38,640 --> 00:56:41,560
Speaker 1: which kind of functions as a gossip colmn of swords,

996
00:56:41,560 --> 00:56:45,640
Speaker 1: sharing anonymous, first person accounts of lawmakers treating staff poorly.

997
00:56:45,719 --> 00:56:50,440
Speaker 1: Some horror stories that I've read include multiple staffers claiming

998
00:56:50,440 --> 00:56:53,040
Speaker 1: that they were required to sign out in order to

999
00:56:53,160 --> 00:56:56,839
Speaker 1: leave their desks to use the restroom. Another claim that

1000
00:56:56,920 --> 00:57:00,520
Speaker 1: their pay was docked to send to ten their sick

1001
00:57:00,640 --> 00:57:06,160
Speaker 1: child despite working ample unpaid overtime. So I think to

1002
00:57:06,239 --> 00:57:10,960
Speaker 1: sum it up, congressional staffers face really long hours, very

1003
00:57:10,960 --> 00:57:15,759
Speaker 1: low pay, and something I think is worth mentioning is

1004
00:57:15,760 --> 00:57:17,840
Speaker 1: that their job security is kind of also dependent on

1005
00:57:17,880 --> 00:57:21,200
Speaker 1: the electoral success of their boss. Right for those working

1006
00:57:21,320 --> 00:57:26,480
Speaker 1: in representatives, working for representatives in competitive districts, that can

1007
00:57:26,560 --> 00:57:29,440
Speaker 1: mean that their job is at major risk of disappearing

1008
00:57:29,520 --> 00:57:33,480
Speaker 1: every two years, a very precarious kind of situation for

1009
00:57:33,560 --> 00:57:36,160
Speaker 1: folks who at the same time hold when we talked

1010
00:57:36,160 --> 00:57:39,960
Speaker 1: about a ton of legislative responsibility not only to their bosses,

1011
00:57:40,000 --> 00:57:43,960
Speaker 1: but to the American people. Now, all of this, I argue,

1012
00:57:44,000 --> 00:57:48,400
Speaker 1: contribute to and explains a lot of the overall malaise

1013
00:57:48,480 --> 00:57:52,920
Speaker 1: and dysfunction of America's top legislative body, a body, if

1014
00:57:53,360 --> 00:57:55,960
Speaker 1: we have to remember, whose members are supposed to represent

1015
00:57:56,400 --> 00:58:01,000
Speaker 1: the needs of their constituents, but in practice falls significantly

1016
00:58:01,160 --> 00:58:06,680
Speaker 1: short of that promise. With studies that show the preferences

1017
00:58:06,720 --> 00:58:09,840
Speaker 1: of the average American appear to have only a minuscule,

1018
00:58:10,040 --> 00:58:15,080
Speaker 1: near zero, statistically non significant impact on public policy. I

1019
00:58:15,120 --> 00:58:17,480
Speaker 1: think one popular talking point that we've all heard is

1020
00:58:17,520 --> 00:58:21,000
Speaker 1: that working on Capitol Hill is seen as this kind

1021
00:58:21,040 --> 00:58:24,800
Speaker 1: of pathway to a lucrative job in the lobbying industry

1022
00:58:24,880 --> 00:58:28,160
Speaker 1: rather than an actual career in public service. But I

1023
00:58:28,160 --> 00:58:32,720
Speaker 1: think it's not necessarily because folks enter public service with

1024
00:58:32,840 --> 00:58:35,680
Speaker 1: ulterior motives. From the people I've spoken to, it's actually

1025
00:58:35,800 --> 00:58:40,080
Speaker 1: quite the opposite. But unfortunately, it's really hard to be

1026
00:58:40,120 --> 00:58:43,120
Speaker 1: put in a grueling environment with relatively low pay and

1027
00:58:43,200 --> 00:58:47,080
Speaker 1: not be tempted to quote unquote sell out and move

1028
00:58:47,200 --> 00:58:51,040
Speaker 1: to a more secure, higher paying job in lobbying or

1029
00:58:51,080 --> 00:58:53,440
Speaker 1: some other part of the private sector that relies on

1030
00:58:53,560 --> 00:58:57,080
Speaker 1: knowledge of the legislative system. One recent study found that

1031
00:58:57,160 --> 00:58:59,880
Speaker 1: sixty five percent of staffers plan to leave Congress within

1032
00:59:00,160 --> 00:59:04,439
Speaker 1: five years, with many taking their valuable expertise in institutional

1033
00:59:04,480 --> 00:59:07,800
Speaker 1: knowledge with them to K Street lobbying firms. The same

1034
00:59:07,840 --> 00:59:11,280
Speaker 1: study found that between forty to forty five percent see

1035
00:59:11,360 --> 00:59:14,120
Speaker 1: the private sector as their next career step. The way

1036
00:59:14,160 --> 00:59:17,280
Speaker 1: I look at it is people don't choose to become lobbyists.

1037
00:59:17,800 --> 00:59:21,720
Speaker 1: The environment and incentive structure in place makes it the

1038
00:59:21,840 --> 00:59:26,000
Speaker 1: obvious logical choice, and perhaps not surprisingly, this kind of

1039
00:59:26,600 --> 00:59:31,520
Speaker 1: talent turnover, coupled with this unhealthy revolving door dynamic between

1040
00:59:31,880 --> 00:59:36,680
Speaker 1: the public and private sector, is a bipartisan problem. According

1041
00:59:36,720 --> 00:59:39,960
Speaker 1: to Open Secrets, it's commonplace to find staffers who either

1042
00:59:40,040 --> 00:59:43,439
Speaker 1: came to Capitol Hill after representing private interests or left

1043
00:59:43,560 --> 00:59:46,959
Speaker 1: the member staff for a lobbying position. At the top

1044
00:59:47,040 --> 00:59:51,160
Speaker 1: of the list the offices of Mitch McConnell and Chuck Schumer.

1045
00:59:52,040 --> 00:59:54,800
Speaker 1: I think there is a subset of people who follow

1046
00:59:54,840 --> 00:59:59,120
Speaker 1: politics and feel that both parties are equally corrupt, and

1047
00:59:59,320 --> 01:00:03,160
Speaker 1: this is definitely a piece of evidence that bolsters that narrative. Right.

1048
01:00:03,200 --> 01:00:07,640
Speaker 1: The data shows that the dysfunction is not party specific,

1049
01:00:07,720 --> 01:00:11,600
Speaker 1: but rather institutional. I'll give you another data point. According

1050
01:00:11,600 --> 01:00:15,080
Speaker 1: to Issue one, a cross partisan political reform group quote

1051
01:00:15,120 --> 01:00:19,640
Speaker 1: too often, this dynamic allows experienced lobbyists to run circles

1052
01:00:19,680 --> 01:00:23,640
Speaker 1: around congressional staff with less than a decade of experience. Currently,

1053
01:00:23,680 --> 01:00:26,640
Speaker 1: the average House staffer in a member office has only

1054
01:00:26,680 --> 01:00:28,960
Speaker 1: been in their position for two and a half years,

1055
01:00:29,280 --> 01:00:33,200
Speaker 1: while the average legislative assistant who advises a Member of

1056
01:00:33,240 --> 01:00:36,120
Speaker 1: Congress on key subjects has been in their position for

1057
01:00:36,240 --> 01:00:40,160
Speaker 1: less than one year. Veteran lobbyists are simply more familiar

1058
01:00:40,160 --> 01:00:42,640
Speaker 1: with the ins and outs of how Congress works and

1059
01:00:42,720 --> 01:00:46,040
Speaker 1: the politics within each chamber of Congress than junior staff

1060
01:00:46,040 --> 01:00:48,720
Speaker 1: who are fresh out of college or graduate school. I

1061
01:00:48,800 --> 01:00:51,919
Speaker 1: personally talk to a former congressional staffer who was responsible

1062
01:00:51,960 --> 01:00:55,480
Speaker 1: for eight different policy areas, which, in my opinion, is

1063
01:00:55,600 --> 01:00:58,880
Speaker 1: seven too many. I think the reality is you have

1064
01:00:58,920 --> 01:01:02,200
Speaker 1: a bunch of young and religtlatively inexperienced kids fresh out

1065
01:01:02,240 --> 01:01:05,320
Speaker 1: of college working in Congress with way too many things

1066
01:01:05,360 --> 01:01:08,360
Speaker 1: to do and not enough resources to help them do it,

1067
01:01:09,840 --> 01:01:13,360
Speaker 1: going up against these well funded special interest lobbying firms.

1068
01:01:13,920 --> 01:01:16,680
Speaker 1: Lee Drutmann, a political scientist who has appeared on the

1069
01:01:16,760 --> 01:01:21,440
Speaker 1: Realignment podcast with Sager and Marshall Koslov, made similar observations

1070
01:01:21,480 --> 01:01:24,960
Speaker 1: in an interview with Colorado Public Radio regarding the outsourcing

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01:01:25,000 --> 01:01:28,760
Speaker 1: of legislation to outside lobbyists. Quote, it does not surprise

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01:01:28,800 --> 01:01:31,200
Speaker 1: me at all. This is what happens all the time

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01:01:31,200 --> 01:01:34,480
Speaker 1: in Congress. That lawmakers have small staffs, There's a lot

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01:01:34,520 --> 01:01:36,760
Speaker 1: of things for them to do, and when a lobbyist

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01:01:36,760 --> 01:01:39,400
Speaker 1: comes along and says, hey, we've got a great idea

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01:01:39,920 --> 01:01:42,240
Speaker 1: for legislation, and by the way, we're happy to draft

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01:01:42,240 --> 01:01:46,720
Speaker 1: the bill for you. A staffer who's typically overworked, underpaid,

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01:01:46,760 --> 01:01:50,320
Speaker 1: and probably in their twenties says, oh, great, well, please,

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01:01:50,360 --> 01:01:54,120
Speaker 1: by all means help us out, and the lawmaker says, sure, well,

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01:01:54,200 --> 01:01:56,640
Speaker 1: this is something that I can introduce and then take

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01:01:56,640 --> 01:02:02,200
Speaker 1: credit for. So great win win, at least from their perspective. Now,

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01:02:02,480 --> 01:02:05,439
Speaker 1: I guess the concern is that, you know, are these

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01:02:05,560 --> 01:02:09,080
Speaker 1: folks actually thinking through these issues, are they getting are

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01:02:09,120 --> 01:02:12,000
Speaker 1: they thinking through what's best for their constituents, or are

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01:02:12,000 --> 01:02:15,560
Speaker 1: they just doing what's easiest. And that is an important point.

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01:02:15,600 --> 01:02:20,840
Speaker 1: We continue to see a trend of privatizing public sector

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01:02:20,880 --> 01:02:24,000
Speaker 1: goods in the name of efficiency or the notion that

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01:02:24,080 --> 01:02:27,960
Speaker 1: businesses can do better than the government. And in this case,

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01:02:28,000 --> 01:02:29,840
Speaker 1: sure what, We're going to be able to save some

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01:02:29,880 --> 01:02:32,840
Speaker 1: money on the salaries of congressional staffers, and we can

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01:02:32,920 --> 01:02:36,600
Speaker 1: hire less of them, but the outcome can be nothing

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01:02:36,680 --> 01:02:40,840
Speaker 1: but asymmetric, and that some interests will be better and

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01:02:40,920 --> 01:02:46,360
Speaker 1: more effectively represented than others, with public interests being discarded

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01:02:46,400 --> 01:02:49,920
Speaker 1: easily in favor of well funded special interests. And I'll

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01:02:49,960 --> 01:02:52,720
Speaker 1: give you an example of this. We all remember the

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01:02:52,760 --> 01:02:55,680
Speaker 1: first coronavirus bill to pass in twenty twenty, the two

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01:02:55,680 --> 01:02:59,120
Speaker 1: point two trillion dollar Cares Act. It was reported in

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01:02:59,280 --> 01:03:02,200
Speaker 1: Role call Back in April of twenty twenty that major

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01:03:02,240 --> 01:03:05,400
Speaker 1: passenger airlines spent about nine point five million dollars on

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01:03:05,480 --> 01:03:08,520
Speaker 1: lobbying last quarter, coinciding with the passage of the federal

1101
01:03:08,560 --> 01:03:11,760
Speaker 1: aid package in the wake of the coronavirus pandemic. That

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01:03:11,920 --> 01:03:15,200
Speaker 1: was one point six million more than the same period

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01:03:15,240 --> 01:03:19,520
Speaker 1: in twenty nineteen, according to an analysis of quarterly lobbying reports.

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01:03:19,800 --> 01:03:22,440
Speaker 1: You can probably guess what the result was. Right in

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01:03:22,480 --> 01:03:25,560
Speaker 1: that bill, the Cares Act, the airline industry received sixty

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01:03:25,600 --> 01:03:28,440
Speaker 1: one billion dollars in federal funding via grant and loans,

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01:03:28,840 --> 01:03:31,680
Speaker 1: no strings attached for the most part, because they had

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01:03:31,680 --> 01:03:36,600
Speaker 1: the benefit of powerful lobbyists writing custom legislation on their behalf. Now,

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01:03:36,720 --> 01:03:40,400
Speaker 1: compare that with the paycheck Protection Program for small businesses,

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01:03:41,320 --> 01:03:45,479
Speaker 1: which was woefully underfunded and plagued by bureaucratic issues, making

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01:03:45,520 --> 01:03:48,439
Speaker 1: it very difficult for small businesses that needed the help

1112
01:03:48,800 --> 01:03:51,800
Speaker 1: to get that help in a reasonable amount of time.

1113
01:03:51,960 --> 01:03:56,120
Speaker 1: So the effect be se Today, no airlines went out

1114
01:03:56,120 --> 01:03:58,760
Speaker 1: of business, and the recovery has been fairly swift, with

1115
01:03:58,880 --> 01:04:02,400
Speaker 1: many doing better than the we're doing before, while small

1116
01:04:02,440 --> 01:04:05,560
Speaker 1: businesses have been decimated in the last eighteen to twenty

1117
01:04:05,560 --> 01:04:08,760
Speaker 1: four months and many continue to struggle. Now, let's move

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01:04:08,800 --> 01:04:13,600
Speaker 1: on to another big problem on capital, which ironically is representation.

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01:04:14,520 --> 01:04:17,120
Speaker 1: Here's the situation we're dealing with. Like we talked about before,

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01:04:17,480 --> 01:04:20,360
Speaker 1: working in Congress is seen kind of as this springboard

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01:04:20,440 --> 01:04:24,400
Speaker 1: for many greater things to come. But the compensation is

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01:04:24,640 --> 01:04:27,800
Speaker 1: extremely low, with many young staffers making below minimum wage.

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Speaker 1: So in this environment, who can afford to take these jobs? Well,

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01:04:33,840 --> 01:04:37,640
Speaker 1: it's going to be the children of wealthy and affluent

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01:04:37,680 --> 01:04:42,400
Speaker 1: families who have the financial privilege to essentially subsidize the

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01:04:42,400 --> 01:04:46,240
Speaker 1: low pay offered on Capitol Hill in exchange for undoubtedly

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01:04:46,840 --> 01:04:49,880
Speaker 1: an impressive liight item on their resume. If we look

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01:04:49,880 --> 01:04:53,240
Speaker 1: at this visual showing which colleges produce the most number

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01:04:53,280 --> 01:04:56,080
Speaker 1: of Congressional staff on Capitol Hill adjusted for the size

1130
01:04:56,080 --> 01:04:59,320
Speaker 1: of the student body, it's evident that the pipeline of

1131
01:04:59,400 --> 01:05:03,320
Speaker 1: young staffers draws from elite liberal arts institutions from the

1132
01:05:03,520 --> 01:05:08,120
Speaker 1: mostly affluent Northeast and DC based regions. So if you're

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01:05:08,160 --> 01:05:11,640
Speaker 1: working class, you basically have no shot. And even if

1134
01:05:11,640 --> 01:05:14,080
Speaker 1: you're lucky enough to make it on Capitol Hill. You've

1135
01:05:14,080 --> 01:05:17,040
Speaker 1: got to decide now at this point whether or not

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01:05:17,240 --> 01:05:19,880
Speaker 1: it's worth it to play the game, which has, like

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01:05:19,920 --> 01:05:24,280
Speaker 1: we've talked about, huge implications on the efficacy of our democracy.

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01:05:24,760 --> 01:05:28,200
Speaker 1: Taken all together, I hope you can see why improving

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01:05:28,280 --> 01:05:32,840
Speaker 1: conditions for congressional staffers is so important and why the

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01:05:32,880 --> 01:05:37,600
Speaker 1: status quo is wholly inadequate. So what can we do? Recently,

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01:05:37,640 --> 01:05:41,520
Speaker 1: after pressure from Congresswoman AOC and other progressive members, the

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01:05:41,560 --> 01:05:46,720
Speaker 1: House of Representatives increased the Member Representational Allowance the MRAA,

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01:05:46,840 --> 01:05:51,200
Speaker 1: which comprises congressional staff budgets, by twenty one percent. Give

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01:05:51,240 --> 01:05:54,400
Speaker 1: me a huge boost to many staffers' salaries. Now, that,

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01:05:54,440 --> 01:05:57,360
Speaker 1: of course is positive, but to give some context, even

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01:05:57,400 --> 01:06:00,680
Speaker 1: with that boost, the budget is still lower than what

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01:06:00,760 --> 01:06:04,080
Speaker 1: it was back in twenty ten adjusted for inflation. And

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01:06:04,160 --> 01:06:07,760
Speaker 1: like we talked about before, each member of Congress is

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01:06:07,880 --> 01:06:10,080
Speaker 1: kind of like a GM of a sports team and

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01:06:10,160 --> 01:06:12,680
Speaker 1: can choose to allocate and use the funds as they

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01:06:12,720 --> 01:06:17,000
Speaker 1: see fit, and there is currently there's no oversight mechanism

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01:06:17,040 --> 01:06:19,320
Speaker 1: in place to make sure that the funding even goes

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01:06:19,640 --> 01:06:24,360
Speaker 1: into paying congressional staffers. Another promising development is a scrappy

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01:06:24,480 --> 01:06:28,760
Speaker 1: unionization effort bubbling up in recent months. On a Thursday

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01:06:28,840 --> 01:06:31,880
Speaker 1: afternoon in February, as many members of Congress were flying

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01:06:31,960 --> 01:06:36,000
Speaker 1: back to their districts, eleven Democratic House staffers convene for

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01:06:36,040 --> 01:06:38,640
Speaker 1: a secret meeting on zoom to discuss their plan to

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01:06:38,720 --> 01:06:41,960
Speaker 1: unionize both chambers of Congress for the first time in history.

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01:06:42,440 --> 01:06:46,720
Speaker 1: The staffers who represent the as yet still aspirational Congressional Workers'

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01:06:46,800 --> 01:06:50,960
Speaker 1: Union the CWU, have two goals. The first is to

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01:06:51,000 --> 01:06:54,040
Speaker 1: get both the House and Senate to pass resolutions granting

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01:06:54,040 --> 01:06:58,080
Speaker 1: them legal protections to unionize. The second is to leverage

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01:06:58,080 --> 01:07:01,760
Speaker 1: the power unionization would provide to improve their lot. Quote.

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01:07:01,800 --> 01:07:04,440
Speaker 1: It's a privilege to work here, says one staffer on

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01:07:04,440 --> 01:07:06,920
Speaker 1: the zoom call, but it shouldn't be a privilege to

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01:07:06,960 --> 01:07:09,840
Speaker 1: earn a living wage here. I think that's a sentiment

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01:07:09,880 --> 01:07:12,800
Speaker 1: that we can all empathize with. And something kind of

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01:07:12,800 --> 01:07:15,880
Speaker 1: interesting and important that I want to point out that

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Speaker 1: I found out during my research is that while federal

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01:07:18,240 --> 01:07:23,240
Speaker 1: labor laws protect most US employees labor organizing activities, Congress

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01:07:23,440 --> 01:07:27,080
Speaker 1: actually exempted itself from its own legislation, which leaves Hill

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01:07:27,080 --> 01:07:31,040
Speaker 1: staffers without formal legal protections, meaning, for example, they have

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01:07:31,120 --> 01:07:35,680
Speaker 1: no protections against employer retaliation. However, I think the fact

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01:07:35,720 --> 01:07:40,160
Speaker 1: that there is a unionization effort is very encouraging. It

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01:07:40,200 --> 01:07:43,160
Speaker 1: shows that the staffers are fed up with long hours

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01:07:43,200 --> 01:07:48,040
Speaker 1: and subservient wages and are ready to organize formally against

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01:07:48,160 --> 01:07:52,920
Speaker 1: their bosses. But I think perhaps more importantly organizing to

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01:07:53,040 --> 01:07:57,840
Speaker 1: save the integrity of our legislative body, because ultimately, we

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01:07:57,880 --> 01:08:01,360
Speaker 1: should view Congress the same as any other enterprise, meaning

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01:08:01,400 --> 01:08:04,200
Speaker 1: that you get what you pay for. If we wanted

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01:08:04,240 --> 01:08:08,360
Speaker 1: Congress that is capable of serving the American people, we

1182
01:08:08,480 --> 01:08:12,040
Speaker 1: must be willing to invest in that institution by properly

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01:08:12,440 --> 01:08:16,360
Speaker 1: and fairly compensating all Congressional staff in the same way

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01:08:16,479 --> 01:08:20,360
Speaker 1: that special interests lobbying groups are not afraid to invest

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01:08:20,880 --> 01:08:24,080
Speaker 1: top dollar in acquiring talent to further the issues that

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01:08:24,120 --> 01:08:27,320
Speaker 1: they care about. I hope you enjoyed this breakdown about

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01:08:27,360 --> 01:08:31,680
Speaker 1: the inner workings of Congress and the legions of underpaid

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01:08:32,080 --> 01:08:35,360
Speaker 1: and over staffers. If you'd like to know more about

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01:08:35,360 --> 01:08:38,599
Speaker 1: this topic and many others, please check out my channel

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01:08:38,600 --> 01:08:41,880
Speaker 1: fifty one forty nine with James Lee on YouTube, where

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01:08:41,920 --> 01:08:46,000
Speaker 1: I release weekly videos relating to the intersection of business,

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01:08:46,040 --> 01:08:49,000
Speaker 1: politics and society. The link will be in the description below.

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01:08:49,320 --> 01:08:52,760
Speaker 1: Of course, subscribe to Breaking Points and thank you so

1194
01:08:52,840 --> 01:08:53,719
Speaker 1: much for your time today.