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Speaker 1: This program features the individual opinions of the hosts, guests,

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Speaker 1: and callers, and not necessarily those of the producer, the station,

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Speaker 1: it's affiliates, or sponsors. This is True Crime Tonight.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to True Crime Tonight on iHeartRadio. We're talking true

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Speaker 2: crime all the time. I'm Stephanie Leidecker, and I head

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Speaker 2: up KAT Studios, where we make true crime podcasts and

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Speaker 2: documentaries and I get to do those with Courtney Armstrong

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Speaker 2: and Body Move in. What to night, Ladies. We are

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Speaker 2: here for Thursday. As you all know, it is Thursday,

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Speaker 2: October second. We're so close to Friday and therefore so

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Speaker 2: close to the weekend.

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Speaker 3: We hope you had a great weekend to be and

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Speaker 3: hope you had a great day. So listen. Diddy sentencing

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Speaker 3: is tomorrow.

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Speaker 2: There is so much to unpack tonight, so please pull

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Speaker 2: up a chair join our proverbial kitchen table conversation. Epstein

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Speaker 2: jaw dropping developments there as well. I mean, the dominoes

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Speaker 2: are starting to fall and they're not connected. Obviously Diddy

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Speaker 2: and Epstein are not connected, but there are some crossovers.

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Speaker 2: So we're going to be talking a bit about that.

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Speaker 2: In the Didty case, though, we of course, have back

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Speaker 2: Matthew Russell Lee from Inner City Press.

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Speaker 3: He's been on the show before, following it so closely.

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Speaker 2: He's so insider, so he's going to give us all

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Speaker 2: of the scoop, all of the predictions. And also later

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Speaker 2: in the show, we're going to be talking about this

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Speaker 2: ongoing trial of Sarah Hartsfield if you haven't been following that,

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Speaker 2: she's accused of murdering her fifth husband via insulin and

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Speaker 2: that's a complicated one, talk about toxicology, and of course

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Speaker 2: David the popstar.

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Speaker 3: New developments in that case too.

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Speaker 2: More people are speaking out, including his manager, so some

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Speaker 2: real tells to be had in that case. Also, welcome

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Speaker 2: to the show. Everybody, assume where should we begin? Courtney Armstrong,

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Speaker 2: I know you're kicking it off with all things, did

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Speaker 2: he Well.

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Speaker 3: I mean you have to start there.

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Speaker 4: This has been ongoing for a really long time and tomorrow.

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Speaker 3: Ending tomorrow, right.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, tomorrow is the sentencing. So did He has been

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Speaker 4: convicted of two federal prostitution charges, specifically it was transportation

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Speaker 4: of a prostitution and he was acquitted though of a

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Speaker 4: lot more serious charges, sex trafficking and racketeering counts.

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Speaker 3: This happened? Did?

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Speaker 4: He was indicted a year ago September twenty four He

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Speaker 4: was indicted on the racketeering, the sex trafficking, and the

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Speaker 4: Man Act counts. But after a two month trial, he

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Speaker 4: was acquitted of the big ones and he has remained

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Speaker 4: in custody this entire time. He and his attorneys requested

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Speaker 4: bail many, many times.

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Speaker 3: And yeah, tomorrow.

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Speaker 4: He's up for Prosecutors are seeking a little more than

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Speaker 4: eleven years. The defense is proposing fourteen months, which conveniently

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Speaker 4: is what he has served.

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Speaker 3: And that's a crazy distinction. He could walk tomorrow. He

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Speaker 3: could walk tomorrow.

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Speaker 5: That's what I was just going to say, Like, it's

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Speaker 5: possible he can walk tomorrow.

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Speaker 3: And listen, are we going to make a prediction?

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Speaker 6: Yes?

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Speaker 5: Or are we going to do that today? Yea, before

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Speaker 5: before the insider gets here. I want to make my

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Speaker 5: prediction because I don't want to be I don't want

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Speaker 5: to be swayed.

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Speaker 3: Sway.

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Speaker 5: This is your He's very smart, right, he knows what's

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Speaker 5: going on. He's got his finger on the pulse. I

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Speaker 5: think did he's gonna walk?

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Speaker 3: I think he's going to get another nine months? Go ahead?

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Speaker 4: What not?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? Go ahead? I want to hear the what wait why.

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Speaker 5: Okay, So I think he's gonna I think he's gonna

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Speaker 5: walk because, like, had this not been a federal case,

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Speaker 5: because of the rico implications, this would have been a

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Speaker 5: state charge and it would have been you know, fourteen

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Speaker 5: months or less.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, which is totally true. That's totally true.

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Speaker 2: So had the rico charge has not ever been in

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Speaker 2: the game to begin with, he would have time served.

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Speaker 2: By the way, even in that case, maybe he's done

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Speaker 2: more than time served in maybe case is I that's

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Speaker 2: been disputed yet, but many people have said, listen, if

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Speaker 2: this was an average Joe, he would have done maybe

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Speaker 2: nine months, maybe eight months. And because he's Diddy and

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Speaker 2: it was so high profile and there were so many

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Speaker 2: other things, air quotes, distractions thrown at this case that

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Speaker 2: he would have walked by. Now, the other side of

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Speaker 2: that is he's done some nefarious things and maybe there

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Speaker 2: was some overcharging from the federal government. Remember there's a

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Speaker 2: new prosecutor in line, Maureen Comy, daughter of James Comy,

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Speaker 2: who was also recently indicted by Trump, had a daughter.

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Speaker 2: The daughter was the prosecutor in the previous Ditty trial. Also, interestingly,

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Speaker 2: in the Epstein trial. Back in the day she was

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Speaker 2: set to be the prosecutor. Had Epstein lived and not

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Speaker 2: died by suicide allegedly allegedly allegedly, So she's been tossed

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Speaker 2: and replaced, and now eleven years is what the prosecution

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Speaker 2: asking for. That's also a bit strong, you know, Courtney,

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Speaker 2: you were saying earlier.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, so okay, body just to get a straight body.

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Speaker 4: You say, he walks tomorrow. That's my listen, that's that's

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Speaker 4: your prediction. No, just that's my night on the prediction.

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Speaker 4: Nice and Stephanie, you you suggested nine more months, a

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Speaker 4: few more months, a few more months. What do you

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Speaker 4: think I'm going eleven years? I'm going eleven years? Why

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Speaker 4: speak because of the judge's rulings. So, Judge Zumernian, I mean,

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Speaker 4: the defense came at them so many times. That's trying

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Speaker 4: to get him out, including they submitted a really aggressive

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Speaker 4: package saying fifty million dollars did he will be on

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Speaker 4: house arrest in Miami, there will be no.

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Speaker 3: Travel, but the judge rejected that.

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Speaker 4: As one of the many times, saying that he was

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Speaker 4: a risk, and he did he had no exceptional circumstances

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Speaker 4: and in one of the other requests. They said, he

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Speaker 4: has not shown clear evidence that he does not pose

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Speaker 4: a danger to persons in the community. And then as well,

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Speaker 4: the defense said, hey, how about we just quit this

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Speaker 4: whole thing or go for a new trial. The judge

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Speaker 4: has denied everything and last thing I'll say, including the

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Speaker 4: defense made a really aggressive I thought, showing of why

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Speaker 4: Mia who used a pseudonym to testify, why she shouldn't

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Speaker 4: be able to give victim's impact statement, and the judge

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Speaker 4: overturned that.

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Speaker 2: So I say eleven and you know what, near I'm strong. Listen,

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Speaker 2: I hope that you're correct. I'm saying my vote based

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Speaker 2: on what I think will happen versus what I feel

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Speaker 2: should happen.

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Speaker 3: Does that make sense?

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Speaker 2: So I actually am saying under a year for all

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Speaker 2: the same reasons you just noted. Because the judge has

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Speaker 2: been so stern and so clear and has been, you know,

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Speaker 2: less than lenient. That also, strategy wise, may give a

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Speaker 2: little leniency tomorrow. Prosecution is asking for eleven years, you know. Obviously,

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Speaker 2: the defense is asking let's go home tonight, could be

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Speaker 2: home for the weekend. Somewhere in the middle might be

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Speaker 2: the fair ground, or somewhere around a year or under,

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Speaker 2: and then nobody can accuse the judge of a cake

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Speaker 2: walk because he has been so fair and frankly strong

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Speaker 2: this whole time. It's a tough one. This is a

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Speaker 2: tough one. I can't wait to talk about.

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Speaker 3: It more though.

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Speaker 5: Okay, well, we're going to talk about it with the expert.

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Speaker 5: Basically right now. This is true crime tonight on iHeart

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Speaker 5: Radio on Body Moving and I'm here with Courtney and Stephanie.

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Speaker 5: We're talking the latest with p Diddy, and we want

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Speaker 5: to hear from you. Hit us up on the talkbacks

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Speaker 5: on the iHeartRadio app and listen. Right now. We're joined

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Speaker 5: by a very very special guest, Matthew Russell Lee. He's

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Speaker 5: with Inner City Press since twenty eighteen. Matthew has reported

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Speaker 5: in person on cases at the US District Court for

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Speaker 5: the Southern District of New York. That's a mouthful, by

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Speaker 5: the way, for Inner City Press. He's been following the

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Speaker 5: Ditty case literally since day one. He's been there nearly

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Speaker 5: every day every day there's court. He's been there at

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Speaker 5: the recent hearings and from the beginning. Wilson on how

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Speaker 5: things have been going and what may happen tomorrow. He's

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Speaker 5: got some real insider information. Matthew, thank you so much

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Speaker 5: for joining us.

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Speaker 7: Hi that you all right. I'm glad to be here.

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Speaker 7: It's been a long it's been a long road, and

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Speaker 7: I've want to begin by saying it's the scuttle but

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Speaker 7: here is that it may not actually finish tomorrow. That's

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Speaker 7: not true. But if you've seen I'm saying that people

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Speaker 7: that actually work in the courthouse have been told to

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Speaker 7: be ready for more than one day sentencing. And I

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Speaker 7: think if you look at today's filings where the team

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Speaker 7: Diddy says they're going to have four separate lawyers talking

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Speaker 7: and they're preparing a movie that they're going to show,

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Speaker 7: and there's obviously there's been a fight about me. But

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Speaker 7: again I'm hoping that's not the case. But I'll say

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Speaker 7: that I've been hearing that I don't particularly like it.

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Speaker 7: I also think it's too much. The defense has they

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Speaker 7: put in a filing today sixty pages a kind of

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Speaker 7: reply sentencing reply. I haven't seen this kind it's I mean, again,

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Speaker 7: I'm sure he wants to. You know, your life is

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Speaker 7: on the line. You want to do everything that you can,

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Speaker 7: but most judges don't allow a sixty page filing on

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Speaker 7: the eve of sentencing, or if they do, they say, okay,

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Speaker 7: we're going to adjourn sentencing so that the other side

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Speaker 7: has a time, you know, has a chance to respond,

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Speaker 7: or so I have a chance to read it. They

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Speaker 7: really went in strong, and I guess the big I heard.

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Speaker 7: I was listening actually before this segment to you guys predictions.

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Speaker 7: I don't know if I'm going to make a prediction,

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Speaker 7: but i'll say it. Of interest is the fact that

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Speaker 7: that Judge Subramanian is going out of his way to

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Speaker 7: let the Clones team do whatever they wanted sentencing, Like

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Speaker 7: he could easily say one hour each side that I'm ruling. Instead,

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Speaker 7: it's like, how many lawyers do you want to talk for?

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Speaker 7: I don't think normally that's not what happens normally, even

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Speaker 7: if you have even if you're an affluent defendant with

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Speaker 7: four lawyers, there are many judges that say only one

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Speaker 7: one's going to speak, no tag teaming. But this is

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Speaker 7: going to be a four way team. So either Subermanian

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Speaker 7: is setting them up by saying basically he's going to

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Speaker 7: hammer them, as I heard one and he wants to

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Speaker 7: to have no complaint about how they were treated and

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Speaker 7: what they were allowed to say, or he's actually, you know,

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Speaker 7: very attuned to them. I don't know if I'm willing

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Speaker 7: to make a prediction on that, but I'll say this

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Speaker 7: is out of the norm that you would have forced

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Speaker 7: for lawyers speaking for you at sentencing and show a

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Speaker 7: movie that's usually not done. I don't know, we haven't.

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Speaker 7: I was, actually I was. I mean, obviously there's a

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Speaker 7: lot of film that involved in this case, but I

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Speaker 7: don't it's his movie, so I don't think it's going

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Speaker 7: to be you know, greatest hits at the hotel nights.

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Speaker 7: I think it's I.

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Speaker 3: Don't know either.

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Speaker 7: I mean, he's put in a series of letters from

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Speaker 7: people that did he has, you know, and to be

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Speaker 7: in all you know fairness that that he's worked with

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Speaker 7: during his time in the MDC, some little known inmates

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Speaker 7: saying that the program has been really helpful, some big

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Speaker 7: he has. There's a there's a relatively high profile at

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Speaker 7: least to some defendant there called called Miles Glow. He's

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Speaker 7: an opponent of the Chinese government, but he also was

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Speaker 7: you know, charged with crypto swindling of people. He wrote

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Speaker 7: a letter, so I posted a letter as soon as

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Speaker 7: it was in. I've gotten a lot of pushback from

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Speaker 7: people that are either pro Miles Glow or anti Miles Glow,

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Speaker 7: and they want to know if Glow is coming to

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Speaker 7: this ended thing. But the question is, I don't know

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Speaker 7: if Brian Steele, who's been the lawyer of filing these letters,

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Speaker 7: was able to go and film people with testimonials from

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Speaker 7: the NBC, or whether it's going to be a kind

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Speaker 7: of composite of like good Times at bad Boy Records

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Speaker 7: and Block Party at Star Island. Nobody knows what it is.

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Speaker 7: Only late in the day did Subermanian say, finish it

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Speaker 7: and give the government a copy. By five pm, it

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Speaker 7: hasn't gone into the docket, So I guess we'll find

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Speaker 7: out tomorrow it's sentencing when they screen the film.

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Speaker 2: From a strategy perspective, I'm just going to go on

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Speaker 2: a limb here.

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Speaker 3: I am not a lawyer.

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Speaker 2: However, it does seem as though the judge has been

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Speaker 2: so fair. If I know that I'm not going to

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Speaker 2: let them walk, don't you or not want to show

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Speaker 2: that hand by letting the defense go and shut them down,

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Speaker 2: because then it would look like I was an open

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Speaker 2: minded So as a judge.

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Speaker 3: Your job is to be open minded.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, let them sing in dance, Let them show

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Speaker 2: me a high school play of Diddy in his greatness.

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Speaker 2: Let them show me a movie of Raisin in the

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Speaker 2: Sun that he started at one point that way, when

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Speaker 2: I dropped the hammer, No one can say I was

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Speaker 2: being biased or I didn't let the defense have their moment.

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Speaker 2: By the way, where is did he getting all this

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Speaker 2: money at this point? So he has this superstar defense team.

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Speaker 2: He's throwing all the money at the world. A defense

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Speaker 2: team has to defend, right, So they're all taking center stage.

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Speaker 3: It's the best press tour any legal team could ever do.

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Speaker 2: So the fact that they're taking so much time I

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Speaker 2: find I guys kind of find it confusing.

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Speaker 3: I guess yeah.

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Speaker 4: No.

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Speaker 7: One of his lawyers in particular, I mean Mark Agnifolo

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Speaker 7: obviously is a big and he and his wife are

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Speaker 7: representing Luigi Mangione Mangioni. But Alexander Shapiro has She was

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Speaker 7: already a well known kind of appellet lawyer around here,

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Speaker 7: but since that she's been She was hired by Charlie Javis,

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Speaker 7: the fintech frauds defraudster of JP Morgan Chase. She's been

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Speaker 7: hired by the Alexander brothers, who are these real estate

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Speaker 7: you know, three brothers and they might even be twins

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Speaker 7: or triplets. Yeah, they're in the MDC as well. They've

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Speaker 7: been brought up to New York for trial and she's

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Speaker 7: representing them. She's actually been brought into the Blake Lively

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Speaker 7: justin Baldoni case, so she's definitely parlayed, parlayed this. She's

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Speaker 7: the one that signed the sixty page filing tonight, so

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Speaker 7: she works hard. But I agree, I think I honestly,

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Speaker 7: in the interest of sort of even for news value,

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Speaker 7: that it all be done in one day, he's letting

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Speaker 7: them go too far. I think I think he could

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Speaker 7: even signal his fairness saying you can have two lawyers,

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Speaker 7: you know, or right, but four lawyers and a movie

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Speaker 7: is too much.

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Speaker 5: I think That's why I feel I might be pretty

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Speaker 5: foolish for my prediction and of letting walk.

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Speaker 3: But no, I thought that three days ago.

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Speaker 2: I'm feeling honest I or even last week, I was like,

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Speaker 2: this guy's going to be home by Saturday, no qu question,

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Speaker 2: no question, no question. I'd be curious, and I know

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Speaker 2: we're running tight on time. Until the next segment, and

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Speaker 2: that Matthew, thank goodness you're with us. I'm really curious

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Speaker 2: about the victim impact statements that are expected and some

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Speaker 2: of the letters, for example by Cassie Ventura, his ex girlfriend,

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Speaker 2: who of course took center stage nine months pregnant. We

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Speaker 2: saw the video of her abuse. She's written a letter

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Speaker 2: to the judge. That's now, you know, we've all seen it.

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Speaker 2: Curious your take on that you're staying with us right

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Speaker 2: for the next yeah segment, We're holding you hostage.

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Speaker 5: We're gonna hold Matthew hostage because we have a lot

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Speaker 5: to dig into with Diddy, and he's got all the

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Speaker 5: insight that we need, especially me, the foolish one who

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Speaker 5: just said he's probably gonna work.

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Speaker 2: No, you're not foolish. You're the smartest in the room.

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Speaker 2: I did.

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Speaker 5: I didn't want to be swayed by smart Matthew, you know,

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Speaker 5: like he knows what's going on. I didn't want to

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Speaker 5: be sway and I'm gonna stick by my prediction more

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Speaker 5: with Matthew Russey Lee. When we come back, we're going

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Speaker 5: to be hearing about all the insider information he's got.

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Speaker 5: And later singer David Manager speaking out for the first

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Speaker 5: time about victims Celestrie Us, you might be surprised by

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Speaker 5: what he say.

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Speaker 8: Keep it right here at True Crime tonight, Matthew.

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Speaker 2: What do you think so the impact statements and some

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Speaker 2: of these victims that want to speak tomorrow at the

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Speaker 2: hearing to kind of counterbalance his you know, self proclaimed

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Speaker 2: movie that did he is making on his behalf and

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Speaker 2: the many people speaking for him, including his four lawyers.

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Speaker 3: What do you make of the impact statements?

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Speaker 7: Yeah, no, I mean the first thing that jumped out

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Speaker 7: of me is that Jane didn't write one, not to

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Speaker 7: you know, to she was one of the one of

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Speaker 7: the witnesses that did show up, and the fact, I

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Speaker 7: don't know, you know again, it may have been that

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Speaker 7: she was left with a bad taste from melt from

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Speaker 7: the trial, but it was since Mia did and Cassie did,

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Speaker 7: and in fact even a witness that they said they

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Speaker 7: were going to put on the stand but never did,

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Speaker 7: Chef's Jordawn. I'm actually put in put in a letter.

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Speaker 7: I could imagine the defense just to get in terms

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Speaker 7: of them. They're going to say, you know, if you

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Speaker 7: didn't testify it, if you could have testified a trial

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Speaker 7: and did it. It's kind of putting in a letter

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Speaker 7: that can't be cross examined. Is I don't know how

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Speaker 7: much weight the judge is going to give that, And

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Speaker 7: he's also already heard the stories of Cassie and Mia.

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Speaker 7: I think that honestly. You may have seen that the

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Speaker 7: comb side got a letter from Gina saying let him go,

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Speaker 7: let him come home. So that's she had been. She

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Speaker 7: was named as one of the victims in the indictment

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Speaker 7: and for a long time during yeah, it was exactly

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Speaker 7: she was the girlfriend slash. I don't know what word

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Speaker 7: we're supposed to use for it, but she played the

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Speaker 7: same role that Cassie had played that Jane had played afterwards,

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Speaker 7: sometimes simultaneously. But she decided to write a letter of support.

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Speaker 7: So I guess I'm saying it as best I can

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Speaker 7: make out. The fact that the that the government wrote

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Speaker 7: in to say Mia wants to speak implies that nobody

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Speaker 7: else is speaking. I mean in terms of I've heard

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Speaker 7: people say there's going to be all these victim impact statements,

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Speaker 7: but I don't think Assie's going to speak, don't I

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Speaker 7: wish she.

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Speaker 2: Though, But think about it, like if I'm Jane Doe

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Speaker 2: and I sat on that stand as a single mother

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Speaker 2: who admitted that I was basically being kept in exchange

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Speaker 2: for these horrible freak offs, and that I wanted out

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Speaker 2: of this circus. I was afraid that this tape would

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Speaker 2: be released and my life would be over and and

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Speaker 2: and and there's been such backlash and such as zero

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Speaker 2: in terms of support for victims.

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Speaker 3: Why would she put herself out there one more time?

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Speaker 3: I know it so stings. It's hard.

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Speaker 2: And also for me to come forward, I say, you know,

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Speaker 2: that takes a lot of courage anybody who's putting themselves

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Speaker 2: out there right now on the front line. Let's be honest,

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Speaker 2: if did he walk tomorrow there, they're very well likely

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Speaker 2: could be a retribution tour like no other, right I would.

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Speaker 3: I wouldn't tell my sister too.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, you're absolutely right, both of them, they were the ones.

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Speaker 7: Also the fact that they went anonymous, even though it

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Speaker 7: was quite to in the case of Jane in particular

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Speaker 7: because a certain other musician was tweeting all the time

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Speaker 7: or instagramming all the time about who she was very

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Speaker 7: difficult to not know. But yeah, both of them faced

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Speaker 7: back last of the time. So I give I'm not

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Speaker 7: saying that she should have or she shouldn't. I'm just

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Speaker 7: saying kind of in terms of the victim impact statements.

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Speaker 7: Normally I've covered cases here where you know, it's just

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Speaker 7: people one after another saying, you know, he destroyed my life,

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Speaker 7: he's terrible. You know, you don't the fact that there's

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Speaker 7: sort of one of the witnesses missing, and that he

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Speaker 7: got the letter from Gina, even on whatever terms that

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Speaker 7: was gotten, I think that they're kind of a wash.

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Speaker 7: It's not as sort of as clear cut a victim

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Speaker 7: presentation as it might have been. I want to actually

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Speaker 7: sort of state this is all kind of twenty twenty.

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Speaker 7: But I'm also covering all the many, many civil lawsuits

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Speaker 7: against Sean Combe, both here and in the Southern District

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Speaker 7: and elsewhere. And I'm sure some of them are kind

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Speaker 7: of cookie cutter in falls, but if any of them

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Speaker 7: are to be believed, it seems to me like the

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Speaker 7: prosecutors they could have put on a much longer case, right,

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Speaker 7: They could have gone out and found, you know, vetted

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Speaker 7: all those people and found there are people that were

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Speaker 7: almost you know, strangers, they weren't caught up in this

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Speaker 7: escort and quote unquote girlfriend situation, but were just went

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Speaker 7: to ditty parties and ended up limping home. There seems

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Speaker 7: to be many people saying that, and they it seems

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Speaker 7: very consistent. They say that they were drugged and that

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Speaker 7: that sometimes it was Combs. Some of them go, you know,

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Speaker 7: say that name other big names. But either that's all

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Speaker 7: false or the prosecutors I think screwed up here, because

396
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Speaker 7: if in fact, this was an abusive enterprise in which

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Speaker 7: people that wanted, you know, a chance in the music

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Speaker 7: industry were getting ripped torn up literally, Yeah, to focus

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Speaker 7: on this kind of you know, very troubling, very kind

400
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Speaker 7: of netflixy freak off nights thing, it didn't work for them, right,

401
00:19:50,359 --> 00:19:52,760
Speaker 7: it really didn't work. Basically, the Rico thing was turned

402
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Speaker 7: down and they're left with this charge that the defense

403
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Speaker 7: is making fun of, which is basically, you know, fly

404
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Speaker 7: tying people to have sex on camera. And they've said,

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Speaker 7: and the defense has said, and it's it's not a

406
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Speaker 7: bad argument. How is this different than a pornography company

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Speaker 7: flying actors to LA to have sex on camera?

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Speaker 3: And can I jump in on that?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, just to say, to add to that, I'm sorry

410
00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:17,600
Speaker 2: to cut you off, but even just to add to that,

411
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Speaker 2: because I hear that so well, and I feel like I,

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Speaker 2: now that we've had a couple of months since we've

413
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Speaker 2: been covering this case so intensely, I really wanted to

414
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Speaker 2: look at it with fresh eyes, not emotionally speaking, like

415
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Speaker 2: not getting lost in the sauce and what is and

416
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Speaker 2: what isn't. The thing that does seem like, at its

417
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Speaker 2: core confusing to me is if he was taking video

418
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Speaker 2: of his girlfriend doing freak offs or anybody in his

419
00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:46,359
Speaker 2: world put in compromising sexual drug fueled you know, places,

420
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Speaker 2: which even his defense attorney says, well, this is a

421
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Speaker 2: case of sex, drugs and rock and roll. So let's

422
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Speaker 2: assume it's a consensual sex drug fueled relationship and he's

423
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Speaker 2: videotaping it. But then he's using that videotape is blackmail,

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Speaker 2: you know. Cassie Venture's testimony would suggest that he was saying,

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Speaker 2: I'm going to send tapes to your mom's employers and

426
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Speaker 2: she's going to get fired. Oh and hey, by the way,

427
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Speaker 2: you're so talented, had such a great hit record. No

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Speaker 2: more of that coming up, because I'm going to blackmail

429
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Speaker 2: you and you're never going to work again. That seems

430
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Speaker 2: to be like a through line here and that doesn't

431
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Speaker 2: seem to get much play, Like how is that not

432
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Speaker 2: a big piece of his puzzle because he wasn't convicted

433
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Speaker 2: of that, right, but the prostitution piece of it. He

434
00:21:29,560 --> 00:21:33,480
Speaker 2: wasn't distributing prostitution, but like the prostitution plus the add

435
00:21:33,520 --> 00:21:36,000
Speaker 2: on of the black if you want to do prostitution

436
00:21:36,160 --> 00:21:38,520
Speaker 2: or whatever, who cares?

437
00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:38,800
Speaker 5: Right?

438
00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:40,840
Speaker 2: Like I personally don't, I should say many people do.

439
00:21:41,000 --> 00:21:43,639
Speaker 2: I personally am like, live your life. It's not my business.

440
00:21:44,040 --> 00:21:46,760
Speaker 2: I'm staying out of it. But when you're hold against

441
00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:51,959
Speaker 2: your will or it's violent, or you're really asking for

442
00:21:52,080 --> 00:21:54,520
Speaker 2: a way out of this and you can't get out

443
00:21:54,520 --> 00:21:58,040
Speaker 2: of it, and you're being threatened by tapes that you're on,

444
00:21:58,520 --> 00:22:00,720
Speaker 2: he's not. He's the one video taping in in the

445
00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:01,879
Speaker 2: corner like a weirdo.

446
00:22:02,119 --> 00:22:02,800
Speaker 3: But even if you.

447
00:22:02,800 --> 00:22:05,200
Speaker 2: Consented to that at some point, the fact that it's

448
00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:07,840
Speaker 2: being used against you, which is why you therefore can't

449
00:22:07,920 --> 00:22:11,040
Speaker 2: leave that to me, is the loop that that's where

450
00:22:11,080 --> 00:22:12,160
Speaker 2: I get stuck on this case.

451
00:22:12,680 --> 00:22:13,560
Speaker 3: I really do.

452
00:22:13,920 --> 00:22:15,719
Speaker 7: Yeah, it's like a revie. I mean, honestly, maybe they

453
00:22:15,720 --> 00:22:17,879
Speaker 7: should have had a different charge of like, you know,

454
00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:20,400
Speaker 7: I don't know how to carrot but it's like revenge porn,

455
00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:23,439
Speaker 7: right exactly. Revenge porn is not covered by the First Amendment.

456
00:22:23,520 --> 00:22:26,040
Speaker 7: You filmed it, but then you use it to control somebody,

457
00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:28,440
Speaker 7: you can get charged with that. But again it again,

458
00:22:28,640 --> 00:22:30,320
Speaker 7: I don't like to play twenty twenty with them, but

459
00:22:30,720 --> 00:22:32,679
Speaker 7: really it seems to me that they I mean, it

460
00:22:32,720 --> 00:22:35,440
Speaker 7: was the same thing in the Glene Maxwell trial where clearly,

461
00:22:35,480 --> 00:22:37,679
Speaker 7: as you guys are, I'm sure I'm going to discuss

462
00:22:37,800 --> 00:22:41,440
Speaker 7: later today. I mean the Epstein enterprise with Gallaine Maxwell.

463
00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:44,920
Speaker 7: You know, procuring for it was extensive, but when they

464
00:22:44,920 --> 00:22:47,159
Speaker 7: put on the trial here, they really focused on a

465
00:22:47,280 --> 00:22:49,560
Speaker 7: very you know, a small number of victims. They wanted

466
00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:53,200
Speaker 7: to paint a very detailed but limited picture. In that case,

467
00:22:53,200 --> 00:22:55,479
Speaker 7: it worked out and they got twenty years against Glaine Maxwell.

468
00:22:55,480 --> 00:22:58,720
Speaker 7: But here they chose sort of like a very kind

469
00:22:58,720 --> 00:23:02,000
Speaker 7: of kind of minimalistic, not minimalistic, but they only chose

470
00:23:02,320 --> 00:23:04,480
Speaker 7: one side of what it seems clombs us up to

471
00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:07,440
Speaker 7: and the main gist of it didn't work for them.

472
00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:09,359
Speaker 7: So now they sort of have to eat it because

473
00:23:09,520 --> 00:23:11,600
Speaker 7: it is true, like if you look at what other

474
00:23:11,720 --> 00:23:15,760
Speaker 7: sentences for for Man Act convictions have been, they're they're

475
00:23:15,840 --> 00:23:17,840
Speaker 7: they're they're not that high and there's a lot of

476
00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:20,359
Speaker 7: atmospherics around it, and it's true. I mean, I guess

477
00:23:20,400 --> 00:23:22,440
Speaker 7: that's maybe why the sentence is going to go along,

478
00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:24,520
Speaker 7: as they're going to try to get into exactly that

479
00:23:24,520 --> 00:23:28,159
Speaker 7: that beyond the filming, there was the threatening on the plane.

480
00:23:28,280 --> 00:23:30,840
Speaker 7: There were all these other things going on. But hanging

481
00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:33,199
Speaker 7: over all of it is that most of those charges

482
00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:35,800
Speaker 7: didn't stick. Like the attempt to get all of that

483
00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:38,960
Speaker 7: evidence in was to paint this picture of a conspiracy

484
00:23:39,000 --> 00:23:41,800
Speaker 7: and get them to bite at it. And the jury said, no.

485
00:23:42,359 --> 00:23:43,080
Speaker 6: Right, that's right.

486
00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:47,960
Speaker 7: How much time you can you get for flying professional male?

487
00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:51,560
Speaker 7: You know, jigglows to have sex and he's saying that

488
00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:54,359
Speaker 7: the you know that that that both Cassie and later

489
00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:57,600
Speaker 7: Jane are you know, we're we're making the travel arrangements,

490
00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:01,239
Speaker 7: having input on which which esquor would go. I mean,

491
00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:03,800
Speaker 7: I sort of like I think that they know it's

492
00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:06,360
Speaker 7: the prosecution's fault. There was a lot more going on,

493
00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:08,920
Speaker 7: but this was the story that they painted, and now

494
00:24:08,920 --> 00:24:11,880
Speaker 7: they're left with really a very very kind of thin

495
00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:14,359
Speaker 7: version of the story.

496
00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:15,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a real.

497
00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:18,800
Speaker 7: Odd clensed them. They can't do it again. It can't

498
00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:20,720
Speaker 7: you know, they can't bring the case again. I think

499
00:24:20,760 --> 00:24:23,240
Speaker 7: what they I mean, I think maybe they'll learn, like

500
00:24:23,280 --> 00:24:25,840
Speaker 7: this Alexander Brothers case, hopefully they'll learning this to not

501
00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:28,520
Speaker 7: just choose no matter how good they may seem, no

502
00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:30,680
Speaker 7: matter how good they are, not good, but like how

503
00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:33,880
Speaker 7: compelling and how outrageous what happened to three individuals are.

504
00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:37,119
Speaker 7: If you're saying that there's dozens of victims, try to

505
00:24:37,119 --> 00:24:39,360
Speaker 7: put dozens of victims on the stand, because then you're

506
00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:41,919
Speaker 7: gonna have the juris even if there's one they didn't like,

507
00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:45,000
Speaker 7: or one talks about not getting an expensive enough purse

508
00:24:45,400 --> 00:24:47,439
Speaker 7: or not going to a fancy enough restaurant and they

509
00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:49,720
Speaker 7: don't like that when you got ten others, But when

510
00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:52,200
Speaker 7: you only have three and they didn't like one of them,

511
00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:54,720
Speaker 7: maybe they didn't like two of them.

512
00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:58,359
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's a really good That is a very excellent point,

513
00:24:58,440 --> 00:25:01,120
Speaker 4: well observed. I have a quick question for you, Matthew,

514
00:25:01,240 --> 00:25:04,000
Speaker 4: and if anyone else does give us a call R

515
00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:06,600
Speaker 4: at eighty to eight three one crime. We have Matthew

516
00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:10,840
Speaker 4: Russell Lee from Inner City Press and we are talking Diddy.

517
00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:14,000
Speaker 4: He's facing sentencing tomorrow. What is your prediction. Give us

518
00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:17,800
Speaker 4: a call, Matthew. So curious what has been sort of

519
00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:21,480
Speaker 4: the general atmosphere like leading up just in these last

520
00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:22,600
Speaker 4: couple of days.

521
00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:25,560
Speaker 7: I can tell you that not just tonight, but last

522
00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:28,040
Speaker 7: night there were tents outside of people waiting in line

523
00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:31,400
Speaker 7: to attend tomorrow. The people that work in the courthouse

524
00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:33,159
Speaker 7: are all like they pretty much can't wait for the

525
00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:34,200
Speaker 7: whole thing to be over.

526
00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:34,959
Speaker 5: Yeah.

527
00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:38,840
Speaker 7: Yeah, they're tense because the people wait outside. Some of

528
00:25:38,840 --> 00:25:40,720
Speaker 7: them are line sitters, like they're going to There are

529
00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:43,600
Speaker 7: some major media organizations are paying big money to come

530
00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:46,719
Speaker 7: tomorrow morning and pay somebody for having slept out there

531
00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:48,760
Speaker 7: all night. This is a New York thing. It happened

532
00:25:48,800 --> 00:25:51,760
Speaker 7: during the Trump trial. It happens. It happened to pop

533
00:25:51,840 --> 00:25:54,280
Speaker 7: up shops. It's happened more. And they've already put out

534
00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:57,280
Speaker 7: the barricade. So it has the circus like atmosphere that

535
00:25:57,320 --> 00:25:59,440
Speaker 7: exists during the trial has come back. And in fact

536
00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:02,560
Speaker 7: it was last week. Was that. I mean, there hasn't

537
00:26:02,560 --> 00:26:06,000
Speaker 7: been really many many appearances. It's been all in the papers,

538
00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:09,400
Speaker 7: except that last Thursday there was an oral argument on

539
00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:13,359
Speaker 7: Combs's motions for acquittal or for a new trial, and

540
00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:15,560
Speaker 7: that was. That was you know, there were people waited

541
00:26:15,560 --> 00:26:17,760
Speaker 7: in line to get there, and Combs came in that day.

542
00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:20,000
Speaker 7: He'd asked in advance, but all sort of at the

543
00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:23,320
Speaker 7: last minute, whether he could wear you know, non jail garb.

544
00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:26,160
Speaker 7: It doesn't really there's not a jury, so it doesn't.

545
00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:27,960
Speaker 7: During the trial, of course, he wore like, you know,

546
00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:30,600
Speaker 7: a sweater. He tried to look like mister Rogers, but

547
00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:33,880
Speaker 7: he came. He didn't work. He was in jail tomorrow.

548
00:26:33,880 --> 00:26:36,040
Speaker 7: He's going to be in a button down shirt. They

549
00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:39,399
Speaker 7: asked in advance and pointed out other defendants who've been

550
00:26:39,440 --> 00:26:41,760
Speaker 7: allowed to do it for their own, for their own,

551
00:26:41,920 --> 00:26:44,240
Speaker 7: you know, sense of sell for whatever. I think Supermanian

552
00:26:44,320 --> 00:26:46,960
Speaker 7: knows the goal of putting the defendants in street cloths.

553
00:26:47,080 --> 00:26:50,200
Speaker 7: So if the jurors don't know the person's incarcerated during

554
00:26:50,200 --> 00:26:52,360
Speaker 7: the trial, that they don't come to know it, even

555
00:26:52,400 --> 00:26:55,639
Speaker 7: though there are two you know, suited, large gentlemen behind

556
00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:58,240
Speaker 7: the sitting right behind them. You know, if you know,

557
00:26:58,359 --> 00:26:59,879
Speaker 7: you know, but if you don't, you know, there's no

558
00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:02,240
Speaker 7: reason to rub it in. But so I guess it's

559
00:27:02,280 --> 00:27:05,000
Speaker 7: been the I will say, I don't know. I think

560
00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:06,920
Speaker 7: it's hard to know, you know, people in the media

561
00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:10,440
Speaker 7: love the more filings the better. I've found that I've

562
00:27:10,440 --> 00:27:13,240
Speaker 7: found their approach kind of there's a sense of entitlement

563
00:27:13,280 --> 00:27:16,200
Speaker 7: to it or it's disappointing because there I just covered

564
00:27:16,200 --> 00:27:18,359
Speaker 7: a sentencing today where a guy got fifteen years and

565
00:27:18,720 --> 00:27:21,640
Speaker 7: there was nobody, you know, nobody in the room and

566
00:27:21,680 --> 00:27:22,920
Speaker 7: the whole thing was over in an hour.

567
00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:25,600
Speaker 3: So that's the influence and power part.

568
00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:28,919
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like that's the whole part of like him being diddy, right, Like,

569
00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:31,760
Speaker 2: that's the whole piece of it. By the way, one thing, Matthew,

570
00:27:31,760 --> 00:27:32,480
Speaker 2: and you're going.

571
00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:33,680
Speaker 3: To come back, I know you will.

572
00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:36,080
Speaker 2: But another piece of this that I feel like it's

573
00:27:36,160 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 2: less a little bit left out of the story. We

574
00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:42,160
Speaker 2: remember he also was paying people off to cover stuff off.

575
00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:45,000
Speaker 2: Now again he wasn't tried for the racketeering stuff, but

576
00:27:45,119 --> 00:27:48,800
Speaker 2: we saw him paying off officials and like the security

577
00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:51,879
Speaker 2: people out there at the hotel where Cassie was being beaten.

578
00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:54,760
Speaker 2: Two people and what was it, one hundred grand somebody

579
00:27:54,800 --> 00:27:58,920
Speaker 2: took to have that video tape disappear. Shout out to

580
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:01,600
Speaker 2: the one security guy Israel who did not take the

581
00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:02,920
Speaker 2: money and testified.

582
00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:05,520
Speaker 3: So yeah, I guess that's a confusing thing.

583
00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:08,720
Speaker 2: It's sentencing versus some of the other stuff that we've

584
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:11,080
Speaker 2: all publicly seen, and where.

585
00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:12,560
Speaker 3: He can only get sentenced for what he was convicted on.

586
00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:15,240
Speaker 5: Of course, I know that it's hard to turn they

587
00:28:15,480 --> 00:28:17,480
Speaker 5: find me guilty of those things, right, because that was

588
00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:20,160
Speaker 5: I think the government was just too overbroad in there

589
00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:21,320
Speaker 5: in their charges.

590
00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:22,400
Speaker 3: I really think it's so fair.

591
00:28:22,600 --> 00:28:25,120
Speaker 5: That's just my opinion. That's just my opinion. I think

592
00:28:25,119 --> 00:28:26,960
Speaker 5: this could have been small.

593
00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:32,680
Speaker 4: Yeah, right, actually wrapping up commercials cometh. But listen, Matthew.

594
00:28:33,040 --> 00:28:37,199
Speaker 4: We love having you on so much. Your insight is

595
00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:41,400
Speaker 4: always so great. It's like being in the courtroom ourselves. Everyone, listen,

596
00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:45,800
Speaker 4: follow Matthew. He's on X at Inner City Press. You

597
00:28:45,840 --> 00:28:48,040
Speaker 4: will get all the latest in the sentencing of Shan

598
00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:52,240
Speaker 4: Didy Combs and everything else, and also Matthew's book Did

599
00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:57,240
Speaker 4: He Do It Us Versus Sean Combs. It's available on Amazon. Matthew,

600
00:28:57,320 --> 00:28:59,800
Speaker 4: I believe you have promised to come back again.

601
00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:03,720
Speaker 3: He has to, yes, so we will tie.

602
00:29:03,520 --> 00:29:05,120
Speaker 4: Him to it and I actually I can't wait to

603
00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:08,160
Speaker 4: get into the civil lawsuits.

604
00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:08,680
Speaker 3: With him as well.

605
00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:16,080
Speaker 2: Listen, Diddy is getting sentenced tomorrow and apparently, according to Matthew,

606
00:29:16,160 --> 00:29:20,040
Speaker 2: was sharing a little movie that he's produced from behind Mars.

607
00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:24,080
Speaker 3: What I'm popping popcorn already.

608
00:29:24,360 --> 00:29:28,360
Speaker 4: I mean just the montage I'm seeing of him giving

609
00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:31,560
Speaker 4: out gifts and making a wish.

610
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:34,840
Speaker 3: For cars, going to church all day long.

611
00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:39,200
Speaker 4: I want to see nothing but this movie.

612
00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:44,440
Speaker 3: That is the rumor.

613
00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:48,000
Speaker 2: It is not an original thought, but you know, there

614
00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:50,120
Speaker 2: is a tangled web around Diddy.

615
00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:52,440
Speaker 3: So like the ands and the ANNs and the ads

616
00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:52,920
Speaker 3: and the ans.

617
00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:55,040
Speaker 2: Remember when we started this case with Diddy, there was

618
00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:58,520
Speaker 2: so much chatter about the celebrities that we're going to

619
00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:01,760
Speaker 2: start showing up to talk against him, right. We were

620
00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:05,240
Speaker 2: also going to exhume his ex wife, Kim Porter's body,

621
00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:08,200
Speaker 2: because she allegedly was going to tell a tell all.

622
00:30:08,720 --> 00:30:12,880
Speaker 2: And then she died mysteriously in her sleep for she

623
00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:15,200
Speaker 2: had some disease that nobody knew about and maybe that

624
00:30:15,360 --> 00:30:19,560
Speaker 2: was suspicious. And and there was gonna be Justin Bieber

625
00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:21,040
Speaker 2: in this one, and there's gonna be all of these

626
00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:23,600
Speaker 2: celebrities in JLO and it.

627
00:30:23,720 --> 00:30:27,560
Speaker 3: Was Mum, Mum's the word on any of it.

628
00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:31,240
Speaker 2: Now, Also nobody spoke up for him. I also think

629
00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:33,800
Speaker 2: the silence also says a lot. This is a tough

630
00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:36,080
Speaker 2: spot to be in if you're a celebrity and it's

631
00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:39,160
Speaker 2: big business and you're a brand and your business is

632
00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:42,360
Speaker 2: you and you are the brand which is a big

633
00:30:42,400 --> 00:30:43,000
Speaker 2: money maker.

634
00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:45,760
Speaker 3: Are you going to really come out and say, h,

635
00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:46,160
Speaker 3: I had.

636
00:30:46,120 --> 00:30:49,200
Speaker 2: A weird experience with Ditty or I had a great

637
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:50,400
Speaker 2: experience with Ditty.

638
00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:54,040
Speaker 3: I don't know. We don't know because no one said anything.

639
00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:56,000
Speaker 3: We didn't hear a word. Where was Jlo.

640
00:30:56,040 --> 00:30:59,840
Speaker 4: Well, Mila Kunis and Ashton Putcher that did not be

641
00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:05,080
Speaker 4: very well when they spoke, wrote letters of offensive Danny Masterson,

642
00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:09,600
Speaker 4: I'm sure so. Danny Masterson, he was charged or he

643
00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:10,560
Speaker 4: was convicted of rape.

644
00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:11,320
Speaker 3: He was convicted.

645
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:12,840
Speaker 5: He's in jail right now, he's in prison.

646
00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:15,920
Speaker 2: So if you don't know that case, yes, Danny Masterson

647
00:31:16,040 --> 00:31:19,600
Speaker 2: from that seventies show that he appeared on with Mila

648
00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:21,480
Speaker 2: Kunez and Ashton Kutcher.

649
00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:23,480
Speaker 3: So there were buds. They grew up together, right.

650
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:27,720
Speaker 2: So now two years later Masterson is accused and then

651
00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:31,600
Speaker 2: convicted of rape and then his you know, childhood buddies,

652
00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 2: Ashton Emila write a letter to the judge saying he's

653
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:35,640
Speaker 2: really a good guy.

654
00:31:35,680 --> 00:31:38,080
Speaker 3: We know a certain side of him, and.

655
00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:40,680
Speaker 2: They got a ton of backlash, like go away, like

656
00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:43,440
Speaker 2: that was like a hard no on that front. And

657
00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:45,400
Speaker 2: by the way, that's what's so interesting, And I'm curious

658
00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:46,840
Speaker 2: what you guys think about it. And by the way,

659
00:31:46,840 --> 00:31:49,520
Speaker 2: if anybody wants to jump in on the convo eight

660
00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:51,600
Speaker 2: eight eight to three one crime or leave us a

661
00:31:51,640 --> 00:31:54,520
Speaker 2: talk back, what do you do in that situation? Because

662
00:31:54,560 --> 00:31:57,080
Speaker 2: both things can be true. This is the only thing

663
00:31:57,120 --> 00:31:59,960
Speaker 2: I know in life and certainly working in this job,

664
00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:02,320
Speaker 2: is that both things can be true.

665
00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:03,480
Speaker 3: Like somebody can be.

666
00:32:03,480 --> 00:32:06,080
Speaker 2: Really devoted and a really good friend and a really

667
00:32:06,120 --> 00:32:11,120
Speaker 2: great loved one and also be horrible in another scenario.

668
00:32:11,440 --> 00:32:12,320
Speaker 3: We know, we've seen it.

669
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:15,960
Speaker 2: We've talked to family members of serial killers and loved

670
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:20,840
Speaker 2: ones of people who have done fact horrible, hideous things

671
00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:25,560
Speaker 2: that nobody could imagine. Yet in their purview, in their perspective.

672
00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:27,800
Speaker 3: They were great. They were like a beautiful.

673
00:32:27,440 --> 00:32:30,200
Speaker 2: Dad and were there every day and like at their

674
00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:32,880
Speaker 2: beck and call. Like, both things actually can be true

675
00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:36,440
Speaker 2: in some circumstances. So if you have a friend who's

676
00:32:36,440 --> 00:32:39,840
Speaker 2: accused of something hideous, like Diddy is being accused of

677
00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:42,920
Speaker 2: or you see him on video doing something so horrendous

678
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:45,920
Speaker 2: like beating poor Cassie to the ground the way he did.

679
00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:49,800
Speaker 2: But yet you had like a good experience with him.

680
00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:51,760
Speaker 2: Does that count? And like do you speak up for

681
00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:53,920
Speaker 2: your buddy when you know that? Like, what do you

682
00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:58,240
Speaker 2: do in that scenario? I don't do anything. I don't

683
00:32:58,240 --> 00:33:03,320
Speaker 2: write a letter, not for Danny Masterson, not for him. No, absolutely,

684
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:05,520
Speaker 2: I know, And like where's the line, Like I like

685
00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:06,120
Speaker 2: to think that.

686
00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:08,760
Speaker 5: I mean, it's not my brother, He's like he's a

687
00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:11,280
Speaker 5: friend of somebody I used to work with, according to

688
00:33:11,280 --> 00:33:13,880
Speaker 5: Ashton and Mila right like me, they're not like, he's

689
00:33:13,880 --> 00:33:16,600
Speaker 5: not my brother. I worked with him on a TV show.

690
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:18,640
Speaker 5: I don't write a letter defending him.

691
00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:21,120
Speaker 4: She worked with him since she's like thirteen years old.

692
00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:23,720
Speaker 4: I do believe that it was a strong and.

693
00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:27,400
Speaker 5: I'm sure important. Still not something I would do, like

694
00:33:27,520 --> 00:33:30,360
Speaker 5: me personally, absolutely not, no way.

695
00:33:30,560 --> 00:33:32,680
Speaker 2: I wonder what they would say too, Like having done

696
00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:35,680
Speaker 2: that and they got so much backlash for sticking up

697
00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:39,280
Speaker 2: for their buddy who was being charged with something very nefarious,

698
00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:42,560
Speaker 2: would they do that again? Like there's no way to win. Really,

699
00:33:42,560 --> 00:33:45,000
Speaker 2: in some cases, if you stand up for somebody, you

700
00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:47,479
Speaker 2: get backlash. And if you look the other way, you

701
00:33:47,520 --> 00:33:49,160
Speaker 2: get backlash.

702
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:51,480
Speaker 3: I don't know. I'm justsgrateful I haven't been in that spot.

703
00:33:51,520 --> 00:33:54,040
Speaker 3: I don't even care about the backlash. It's me personally.

704
00:33:54,080 --> 00:33:58,240
Speaker 5: I sure not feel good about defending somebody that was

705
00:33:58,320 --> 00:33:59,960
Speaker 5: convicted of crime such as Danny.

706
00:34:00,520 --> 00:34:01,440
Speaker 3: That's personal.

707
00:34:01,640 --> 00:34:03,680
Speaker 2: It's so true. I feel that way too. I'm going

708
00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:06,280
Speaker 2: to stand behind you on that and I agree, Yeah, Court,

709
00:34:06,320 --> 00:34:06,840
Speaker 2: what do you think?

710
00:34:07,080 --> 00:34:09,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a really top.

711
00:34:09,120 --> 00:34:11,799
Speaker 2: Judgmental though either neither of you are. By the way, Yeah,

712
00:34:12,120 --> 00:34:13,960
Speaker 2: I would say if I did something really bad and

713
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:15,239
Speaker 2: I know I didn't do it.

714
00:34:15,680 --> 00:34:16,359
Speaker 3: If I didn't do.

715
00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:18,160
Speaker 2: It, let's just go there for starters, it was a

716
00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:21,799
Speaker 2: crime I didn't commit, period the end exclamation point. But

717
00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:24,280
Speaker 2: there's like a lot of things that would suggest otherwise.

718
00:34:25,760 --> 00:34:27,279
Speaker 2: I know that there are people in my life, and

719
00:34:27,320 --> 00:34:29,040
Speaker 2: I like to think you guys included, that would say

720
00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:31,399
Speaker 2: I buy it. I believe you because I know you enough,

721
00:34:31,560 --> 00:34:33,440
Speaker 2: or like my brothers would go to the death, you know,

722
00:34:33,440 --> 00:34:34,680
Speaker 2: like my mom would go to the dinner.

723
00:34:35,400 --> 00:34:37,880
Speaker 3: That's a hard spot to put somebody in.

724
00:34:38,080 --> 00:34:40,680
Speaker 4: But you know, the whole both things being true, because

725
00:34:40,960 --> 00:34:43,120
Speaker 4: I suffer from this a little bit in my personal

726
00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:47,040
Speaker 4: life in that if you know friend A and friend B,

727
00:34:47,200 --> 00:34:49,480
Speaker 4: they don't like each other, it's an enemy. But me

728
00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:52,680
Speaker 4: in person B have a perfectly good relationship. You know,

729
00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:55,239
Speaker 4: persone wants me to hate that person. I'm like, well,

730
00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:59,440
Speaker 4: I've had nothing but good experiences with them. I understand

731
00:34:59,640 --> 00:35:01,680
Speaker 4: that you you have not, and that can be hard

732
00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:02,400
Speaker 4: to reconcile.

733
00:35:02,600 --> 00:35:05,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, you can't gang decide who's getting kicks out of

734
00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:08,000
Speaker 2: the club, but you know that's different, right, But that's

735
00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:11,120
Speaker 2: a real spot that's indifferent. I think I think you're

736
00:35:11,280 --> 00:35:12,880
Speaker 2: kind of I can't say it out lad, but what

737
00:35:12,960 --> 00:35:15,720
Speaker 2: we used to call you at work tough something, because

738
00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:19,360
Speaker 2: she's like very down the line cookie. She's a tough cookie.

739
00:35:19,400 --> 00:35:22,480
Speaker 2: Like no one's really bsing Courtney, you.

740
00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:23,719
Speaker 3: Know what I mean. Like I would be like, oh

741
00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:25,240
Speaker 3: my god, that person seems amazing.

742
00:35:25,239 --> 00:35:27,160
Speaker 2: They're so nice and they're so smart and they're so kind,

743
00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:29,839
Speaker 2: and this one tough cookie would be like, really, they

744
00:35:29,880 --> 00:35:30,680
Speaker 2: seem like a clown.

745
00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:33,879
Speaker 5: And there were always a clown speaking of Like, since

746
00:35:33,880 --> 00:35:36,120
Speaker 5: we're on the top the subject of like celebrity gossip

747
00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:37,799
Speaker 5: and crime and all that, did you guys hear about

748
00:35:37,800 --> 00:35:39,040
Speaker 5: the Raja thing?

749
00:35:39,360 --> 00:35:42,200
Speaker 3: Oh, the Kardashians talking about this yet.

750
00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:45,799
Speaker 5: I know last week last week he was on his

751
00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:51,240
Speaker 5: Twist channel and he said that he allegedly falsely declared

752
00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:53,920
Speaker 5: to like all of his you know followers, that a

753
00:35:54,040 --> 00:35:58,360
Speaker 5: federal racketeering investigation had been launched into the Kardashians, and

754
00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:00,680
Speaker 5: he said that they were getting charged with adroal Rico.

755
00:36:00,800 --> 00:36:02,080
Speaker 3: So because we're.

756
00:36:01,840 --> 00:36:03,479
Speaker 5: Talking about Diddy and all, the kind of like tells

757
00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:05,680
Speaker 5: me do that, right, like this common thread that we

758
00:36:05,680 --> 00:36:09,120
Speaker 5: were kind of just talking about right well today or

759
00:36:09,200 --> 00:36:12,319
Speaker 5: yesterday I think actually they filed a lawsuit against him

760
00:36:12,680 --> 00:36:14,719
Speaker 5: and he was kind of going through it on his

761
00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:17,520
Speaker 5: Twitch channel today. It all happened like in front of

762
00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:17,879
Speaker 5: our eyes.

763
00:36:17,920 --> 00:36:20,960
Speaker 3: And Stephanie, I know you are like obsessed with all

764
00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:22,319
Speaker 3: this stuff, right, what do you feel?

765
00:36:22,520 --> 00:36:24,239
Speaker 2: I was like a huge car I am a huge

766
00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:28,160
Speaker 2: Kardashians fan. I've seen every episode to nauseum. I could

767
00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:30,280
Speaker 2: probably do a baby Sandy EFG.

768
00:36:30,719 --> 00:36:33,879
Speaker 9: I have to go. That's like my favorite ornumber. All

769
00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:36,319
Speaker 9: I want to do is eat a salad and Kim.

770
00:36:36,680 --> 00:36:40,920
Speaker 9: People are dying for any reason.

771
00:36:41,400 --> 00:36:44,000
Speaker 2: I really did like I wanted to be a Kardashian

772
00:36:44,440 --> 00:36:46,920
Speaker 2: adjacent like on their little family parties, Like.

773
00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:48,719
Speaker 3: I just liked the show. I've seen it a lot.

774
00:36:48,800 --> 00:36:50,040
Speaker 3: Now they don't play it as much.

775
00:36:49,880 --> 00:36:54,600
Speaker 4: On E I can assure you that Stephanie really really

776
00:36:55,000 --> 00:36:58,880
Speaker 4: enjoys the Kardashians because over the years, it's interesting. I was,

777
00:36:58,960 --> 00:37:02,040
Speaker 4: actually I was at each True Hollywood story when the

778
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:03,520
Speaker 4: tape dropped, and I.

779
00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:05,400
Speaker 3: Literally remember when it came in.

780
00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:08,719
Speaker 4: It was like someone was bringing in a block of

781
00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:13,880
Speaker 4: gold or a diamond, and like what the tape like

782
00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:15,960
Speaker 4: all of the before.

783
00:37:15,840 --> 00:37:18,440
Speaker 5: For those that don't know, he's the guy that was

784
00:37:18,520 --> 00:37:22,400
Speaker 5: in the infamous sex tape with Kim Kardashian, and many

785
00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:26,359
Speaker 5: argue that it's basically why they were the Kardashians today, right,

786
00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:29,080
Speaker 5: like it was planted, it was all planned, and you know,

787
00:37:29,160 --> 00:37:31,360
Speaker 5: it got her a lot of attention, and they became

788
00:37:31,360 --> 00:37:33,920
Speaker 5: the Kardashians because of the sex tape. Right, that's kind

789
00:37:33,960 --> 00:37:34,319
Speaker 5: of like.

790
00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:37,360
Speaker 3: The lore and that is exactly right. I entered a

791
00:37:37,400 --> 00:37:38,120
Speaker 3: little bit later.

792
00:37:38,360 --> 00:37:42,440
Speaker 2: So Kim Kardashian was like buds with Paris Hilton or

793
00:37:42,520 --> 00:37:43,719
Speaker 2: was her right right, right right?

794
00:37:43,880 --> 00:37:46,320
Speaker 3: She did her wardrobe or something weird like some Herba.

795
00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:48,719
Speaker 2: Wood Beverly Hills stylists kind of Yeah, like, I don't know,

796
00:37:48,840 --> 00:37:50,759
Speaker 2: something that I was not a part of. And then

797
00:37:50,960 --> 00:37:53,080
Speaker 2: they went on to beat the Kardashians, and that I

798
00:37:53,120 --> 00:37:55,600
Speaker 2: thought was riotous. I've never had a sister. I just

799
00:37:55,640 --> 00:37:58,879
Speaker 2: thought they were so cute and clever. And eventually, as

800
00:37:58,920 --> 00:38:02,400
Speaker 2: you know Courtney in body as you're mentioning ray J,

801
00:38:02,640 --> 00:38:05,120
Speaker 2: who was like a performer and a rapper I.

802
00:38:05,120 --> 00:38:06,960
Speaker 3: Believe, right and pop star of sorts.

803
00:38:07,040 --> 00:38:09,680
Speaker 2: IP story, Yeah, he had a sex tape with Kim

804
00:38:09,760 --> 00:38:11,640
Speaker 2: Kardashian that was released to the press and it was

805
00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:15,280
Speaker 2: scandalous and it was everywhere. And later we find out allegedly,

806
00:38:15,280 --> 00:38:20,080
Speaker 2: allegedly allegedly that it was mom Kim Kardashian, a mom

807
00:38:20,200 --> 00:38:24,560
Speaker 2: Chris Kardashian rather Kim's mother that was like in kahoots

808
00:38:24,600 --> 00:38:28,120
Speaker 2: and organized the release of said tape. Wow, and that

809
00:38:28,200 --> 00:38:30,000
Speaker 2: everybody kind of made a buck on it. I don't

810
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:32,160
Speaker 2: know if that's true or not. That was always the allegation,

811
00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:34,560
Speaker 2: and I don't know. Let's put that away for a second,

812
00:38:34,600 --> 00:38:37,480
Speaker 2: because that my Kardashian. So now go years and years

813
00:38:37,520 --> 00:38:40,879
Speaker 2: and years that Kardashian's become superstars, and you know, at

814
00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:43,399
Speaker 2: some point Kanye on the this is I know.

815
00:38:43,360 --> 00:38:44,680
Speaker 3: This only from watching the show.

816
00:38:45,160 --> 00:38:48,440
Speaker 2: At some point, Kanye gets the tape back from wherever

817
00:38:48,480 --> 00:38:51,160
Speaker 2: the tape was and gives it back to Kim because

818
00:38:51,280 --> 00:38:53,520
Speaker 2: like he wants her to be free from the scandal

819
00:38:53,640 --> 00:38:56,200
Speaker 2: of knowing there's a sex tape out there, and it

820
00:38:56,239 --> 00:38:57,320
Speaker 2: all was very heartwarming.

821
00:38:57,520 --> 00:39:00,840
Speaker 4: And then I love you so much, your central soccer,

822
00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:02,000
Speaker 4: I love you, dearly.

823
00:39:02,120 --> 00:39:06,680
Speaker 3: That warmed your heart that it says more.

824
00:39:06,520 --> 00:39:09,759
Speaker 2: About me than it does about that. What about I

825
00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:13,160
Speaker 2: totally recognize. So now cut to years and years later,

826
00:39:13,719 --> 00:39:16,680
Speaker 2: ray J, the star of the said tape, is like,

827
00:39:17,239 --> 00:39:21,799
Speaker 2: I was being blackmailed by the Kardashians, and therefore I

828
00:39:21,840 --> 00:39:25,840
Speaker 2: am giving federal charges, the same charges that Diddy was

829
00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:26,799
Speaker 2: first accused of.

830
00:39:27,239 --> 00:39:29,440
Speaker 3: Rico federal charges.

831
00:39:29,120 --> 00:39:32,040
Speaker 2: To show that I was the victim in a very

832
00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:38,719
Speaker 2: large way of blackmail racketeering in the land of Kardashianville. Now,

833
00:39:38,760 --> 00:39:42,319
Speaker 2: remember Kardashians were linked in the early days when this

834
00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:45,680
Speaker 2: trial first started to Ditty. You know, they played with him,

835
00:39:45,680 --> 00:39:47,520
Speaker 2: they partied with him. They like, there's tape of him

836
00:39:47,600 --> 00:39:49,560
Speaker 2: being like, oh that party last night was crazy?

837
00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:51,400
Speaker 3: Does that mean anything? I have no idea?

838
00:39:51,480 --> 00:39:55,279
Speaker 2: And now ray J speaking out he was nuts on

839
00:39:55,320 --> 00:39:56,359
Speaker 2: Twitch and he was.

840
00:39:56,360 --> 00:39:58,520
Speaker 3: Very serious, very serious.

841
00:39:58,680 --> 00:40:01,000
Speaker 5: He kept saying, like the rain is coming, like he's

842
00:40:01,040 --> 00:40:04,319
Speaker 5: doubling down because he said he said on this live

843
00:40:04,320 --> 00:40:07,560
Speaker 5: stream in September last week, actually September, not that long ago.

844
00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:10,560
Speaker 5: It was like last night he said, the Federal Rico

845
00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:13,400
Speaker 5: I'm about to drop on Chris and Kim is about

846
00:40:13,440 --> 00:40:16,160
Speaker 5: to be crazy. The Feds are coming, That's what he said.

847
00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:18,400
Speaker 5: And then he doubled down today and he was like

848
00:40:18,440 --> 00:40:21,439
Speaker 5: it's coming, the rain is coming, like he's doubling down

849
00:40:21,440 --> 00:40:26,400
Speaker 5: on this. And Chris so, Chris, Kim's mom manager and

850
00:40:26,719 --> 00:40:30,680
Speaker 5: Kim Kardashian filed a defamation suit against him because of

851
00:40:30,719 --> 00:40:31,080
Speaker 5: all this.

852
00:40:31,560 --> 00:40:33,919
Speaker 2: Yes, but don't you think at some point j needs

853
00:40:33,920 --> 00:40:37,600
Speaker 2: some cash and the Kardashians medication.

854
00:40:39,840 --> 00:40:41,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, but he needs medication.

855
00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:46,239
Speaker 4: I'm confused, Actually, so is he saying he was blackmailed

856
00:40:46,280 --> 00:40:49,480
Speaker 4: by the Kardashians because of the tape or something.

857
00:40:49,640 --> 00:40:50,880
Speaker 3: I think it was something separate.

858
00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:53,440
Speaker 2: I'm not entirely sure, but I think it's like something

859
00:40:53,560 --> 00:40:57,520
Speaker 2: there's some other thing that's the blackmail, and that it's

860
00:40:57,680 --> 00:41:01,279
Speaker 2: RICO and that Chris Kardashians like the center of like

861
00:41:01,480 --> 00:41:05,279
Speaker 2: this huge RICO operation. Wait, I have no knowledge. I

862
00:41:05,280 --> 00:41:08,200
Speaker 2: have never met a Kardashian. I love them from a distance.

863
00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:11,960
Speaker 2: It got me through COVID, so welcome. And by the way,

864
00:41:12,000 --> 00:41:14,080
Speaker 2: I wish it was on more on E because I'm

865
00:41:14,120 --> 00:41:15,839
Speaker 2: stuck with my below deck, which I.

866
00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:16,279
Speaker 3: Know you love.

867
00:41:16,760 --> 00:41:19,000
Speaker 2: I'm sorry I'm saying it out loud. There we go,

868
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:20,920
Speaker 2: but like I follow along, I don't know.

869
00:41:20,960 --> 00:41:21,600
Speaker 3: They have my heart.

870
00:41:22,000 --> 00:41:24,680
Speaker 2: However, ray J is not having it. And then I

871
00:41:24,719 --> 00:41:26,719
Speaker 2: don't know, Chris Kardashian slapped him with a bit of

872
00:41:26,719 --> 00:41:27,880
Speaker 2: a defamation lawsuit.

873
00:41:28,480 --> 00:41:30,440
Speaker 3: Kanye is not talking. They slapped him.

874
00:41:30,480 --> 00:41:33,480
Speaker 2: Probably they had that whole movie of Kanye being, you know,

875
00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:35,359
Speaker 2: having a.

876
00:41:35,320 --> 00:41:38,840
Speaker 3: Split in his bipolar x x X. I don't know.

877
00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:41,440
Speaker 3: I wouldn't go up against the Kardashians unless.

878
00:41:41,160 --> 00:41:44,200
Speaker 5: You usually have the goods. He's been pretty vague about

879
00:41:44,200 --> 00:41:46,120
Speaker 5: the accusations too. They're really broad.

880
00:41:46,320 --> 00:41:48,400
Speaker 3: He he just keeps saying like.

881
00:41:48,360 --> 00:41:50,359
Speaker 5: This is going to be worse than Diddy, and the

882
00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:55,040
Speaker 5: Feds are coming and his blackmail claims are you know,

883
00:41:55,239 --> 00:41:58,919
Speaker 5: just he's not like being specific in nature, right.

884
00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:03,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's like hosting the TMZ like fun Bust.

885
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:05,040
Speaker 5: Documentary thing, so like he's.

886
00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:06,600
Speaker 2: Like literally the host on the bus if you like,

887
00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:09,359
Speaker 2: buy a ticket to go on the TMZ tour. And that's,

888
00:42:09,400 --> 00:42:10,759
Speaker 2: by the way, I'm not being degrading on that.

889
00:42:11,080 --> 00:42:14,880
Speaker 3: You love that you think I knew it. I knew it.

890
00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:17,400
Speaker 2: It's the first thing I take anybody who visits in

891
00:42:17,600 --> 00:42:19,160
Speaker 2: La to I go to the TMZ tour.

892
00:42:20,920 --> 00:42:23,160
Speaker 3: So maybe it's a money grab. Who knows.

893
00:42:23,719 --> 00:42:26,440
Speaker 6: I don't know. I doubt it's worse than I mean.

894
00:42:26,680 --> 00:42:29,319
Speaker 2: The whole segment has been dedicated to the Kardashians.

895
00:42:29,320 --> 00:42:32,360
Speaker 5: Well, he's saying he's working with I know, we literally

896
00:42:32,360 --> 00:42:32,920
Speaker 5: just made this up.

897
00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:33,239
Speaker 3: Just now.

898
00:42:33,560 --> 00:42:35,879
Speaker 5: He's saying he's working with the feds. He's like, I'm

899
00:42:35,880 --> 00:42:40,160
Speaker 5: working with the feds. He said, I'm bringing federal charges.

900
00:42:40,320 --> 00:42:42,760
Speaker 2: Well, one thing I will say, the only thing that's

901
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:45,600
Speaker 2: like hashtag gossipy. I'm going to say this into the microphone.

902
00:42:45,600 --> 00:42:49,200
Speaker 2: That I do find curious is that Chris Kardashian's ex

903
00:42:49,239 --> 00:42:53,680
Speaker 2: boyfriend is Corey Corey Gamble and Corey Gamble they're no more,

904
00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:56,239
Speaker 2: and Corey is not happy and Chris is having her

905
00:42:56,280 --> 00:42:59,480
Speaker 2: glow up. And Corey the ex boyfriend used to be

906
00:42:59,600 --> 00:43:02,399
Speaker 2: justin b versus poor manager, and that became a little

907
00:43:02,400 --> 00:43:04,719
Speaker 2: bit like of intrigue in the Diddy.

908
00:43:04,440 --> 00:43:07,120
Speaker 3: Thing but never played out, so I don't even want

909
00:43:07,120 --> 00:43:07,520
Speaker 3: to go there.

910
00:43:07,520 --> 00:43:09,920
Speaker 2: But there was a lot of like chatter about the

911
00:43:10,000 --> 00:43:13,319
Speaker 2: connection to Justin and Justin's connection to Ditty if you

912
00:43:13,360 --> 00:43:18,239
Speaker 2: don't remember, however, so like there has always been this

913
00:43:18,360 --> 00:43:19,840
Speaker 2: sort of six degrees.

914
00:43:19,440 --> 00:43:24,319
Speaker 3: Of So is there something bigger? Should? I hope not?

915
00:43:25,560 --> 00:43:29,520
Speaker 3: Web We Chloe is love. That's all I care.

916
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:32,160
Speaker 6: Also at the like one of the bodies that were.

917
00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:36,279
Speaker 3: Oh, that's a big connection. So okay, this is air

918
00:43:36,400 --> 00:43:38,120
Speaker 3: quotes gossip, so take it for what it is.

919
00:43:38,200 --> 00:43:41,640
Speaker 2: Please don'tsue me. Oh we're getting them. Wrap it maybe.

920
00:43:43,000 --> 00:43:44,000
Speaker 3: Caumming up.

921
00:43:44,680 --> 00:43:47,319
Speaker 4: Stephanie will finish that thought and we'll find out just

922
00:43:47,400 --> 00:43:51,680
Speaker 4: exactly where Chris Kardashian's ex boyfriend was. It's scandalous. We

923
00:43:51,760 --> 00:43:55,160
Speaker 4: have the latest in musician David's case. We have a

924
00:43:55,920 --> 00:43:59,120
Speaker 4: shocking bit of information in the Epstein case, and we

925
00:43:59,160 --> 00:44:01,200
Speaker 4: want to hear from you eight to eight three, one crime,

926
00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:09,680
Speaker 4: True crime tonight.

927
00:44:11,800 --> 00:44:14,000
Speaker 2: I don't want to derail us any further. But we

928
00:44:14,000 --> 00:44:16,800
Speaker 2: were just talking about the Kardashians and Ray J making

929
00:44:16,880 --> 00:44:22,120
Speaker 2: claims that he's filing a federal lawsuit for racketeering against

930
00:44:22,160 --> 00:44:25,440
Speaker 2: the Kardashians. It's a little vague as to what the

931
00:44:25,520 --> 00:44:28,799
Speaker 2: charges are. And then we were like briefly discussing what

932
00:44:28,920 --> 00:44:32,400
Speaker 2: the connection potentially to Diddy could be at the time,

933
00:44:32,440 --> 00:44:34,600
Speaker 2: when there was a lot of chatter which is the

934
00:44:34,640 --> 00:44:36,320
Speaker 2: category this should fall under.

935
00:44:36,360 --> 00:44:39,080
Speaker 3: So we're just closing a loop here. This is chatter.

936
00:44:39,360 --> 00:44:42,200
Speaker 2: I love my Kardashians, so I'm not speaking out against them.

937
00:44:42,239 --> 00:44:45,920
Speaker 2: God forbid, don't take my TV away. However, what was

938
00:44:46,040 --> 00:44:51,160
Speaker 2: interesting at the time was that Chris Kardashian, the matriarchan

939
00:44:51,320 --> 00:44:55,359
Speaker 2: mamager of the Kardashians, had a living boyfriend who's been

940
00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:56,440
Speaker 2: like on the show forever.

941
00:44:56,600 --> 00:44:58,719
Speaker 3: His name is Kao Corey Gamble, I.

942
00:44:58,719 --> 00:45:04,600
Speaker 2: Believe, and his previous life was as Justin Bieber's tour manager,

943
00:45:05,280 --> 00:45:07,480
Speaker 2: which was kind of significant at the time because there

944
00:45:07,560 --> 00:45:10,359
Speaker 2: was so much chatter that Justin was in all those

945
00:45:10,360 --> 00:45:12,640
Speaker 2: Diddy videos and maybe he had been a victim of

946
00:45:12,680 --> 00:45:15,759
Speaker 2: Ditty's And by the way, none of that really came

947
00:45:15,800 --> 00:45:19,319
Speaker 2: to bear, and not even kind of came to bear.

948
00:45:19,600 --> 00:45:22,719
Speaker 2: It didn't come to bear. There was no Justin in

949
00:45:22,800 --> 00:45:25,920
Speaker 2: the case. However, it also was interesting though back to

950
00:45:26,000 --> 00:45:30,840
Speaker 2: the Corey Gamble Chris Kardashian's boyfriend, because interestingly, did he

951
00:45:30,960 --> 00:45:34,000
Speaker 2: had a baby mama. It wasn't his wife, it was

952
00:45:34,080 --> 00:45:38,319
Speaker 2: somebody he loved and had several children with Quincy she

953
00:45:38,480 --> 00:45:41,640
Speaker 2: had in a previous relationship, and then with Diddy went

954
00:45:41,640 --> 00:45:44,400
Speaker 2: on to have several other children, including the twins.

955
00:45:45,120 --> 00:45:47,759
Speaker 3: And she lost her life, and she died mysteriously as

956
00:45:47,800 --> 00:45:50,279
Speaker 3: a very young woman in her forties, and it was

957
00:45:50,400 --> 00:45:54,279
Speaker 3: very tragic for all. But at her death scene, which

958
00:45:54,280 --> 00:45:58,040
Speaker 3: has been wildly debated again in the chatter category, why

959
00:45:58,040 --> 00:46:00,000
Speaker 3: did she die? How could that be? Let's exhuome her?

960
00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:00,440
Speaker 3: Her body?

961
00:46:00,560 --> 00:46:04,240
Speaker 2: Was there something the fairy is happening at her death scene.

962
00:46:04,440 --> 00:46:08,600
Speaker 2: Corey Gamble was photographed at it, that's right, which was

963
00:46:08,640 --> 00:46:09,640
Speaker 2: like a weird connection.

964
00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:14,520
Speaker 3: So he was at the house right the day she died. Yes,

965
00:46:14,560 --> 00:46:16,120
Speaker 3: so we know exactly.

966
00:46:16,239 --> 00:46:18,320
Speaker 2: So at the time when all the Diddy stuff started

967
00:46:18,320 --> 00:46:20,520
Speaker 2: blowing up and he had been arrested and all of

968
00:46:20,560 --> 00:46:23,640
Speaker 2: these reco charges, you know, everybody was doing their you know,

969
00:46:23,680 --> 00:46:26,040
Speaker 2: their timelines, and you know, I had like a straight

970
00:46:26,080 --> 00:46:29,680
Speaker 2: up like crazy board and like nobody really materialized. So

971
00:46:30,200 --> 00:46:33,640
Speaker 2: I guess that's the lead number one and number two.

972
00:46:34,040 --> 00:46:36,799
Speaker 2: You can see where that came from, because there are

973
00:46:36,920 --> 00:46:40,880
Speaker 2: some strange, interesting, eerie connections between.

974
00:46:40,560 --> 00:46:41,760
Speaker 3: All of these worlds.

975
00:46:42,360 --> 00:46:45,600
Speaker 2: And now ray J is saying that even though he

976
00:46:45,640 --> 00:46:49,400
Speaker 2: was a member of the infamous Kim Kardashian sex tape,

977
00:46:50,040 --> 00:46:53,440
Speaker 2: now he feels as though there's racketeering charges to be

978
00:46:53,480 --> 00:46:55,040
Speaker 2: had against the Kardashians.

979
00:46:55,719 --> 00:46:57,360
Speaker 3: And I don't know. All I can say is I

980
00:46:57,360 --> 00:46:57,640
Speaker 3: hope no.

981
00:46:59,040 --> 00:47:07,879
Speaker 5: Right, wow, Well, moving on, moving, moving on exactly.

982
00:47:09,120 --> 00:47:11,920
Speaker 3: All right, So listen, I want to talk about David.

983
00:47:12,320 --> 00:47:16,400
Speaker 5: Okay please, the manager has basically come forward via his

984
00:47:16,480 --> 00:47:20,400
Speaker 5: TikTok account in a comment section of All Things. So apparently,

985
00:47:20,640 --> 00:47:23,560
Speaker 5: you know, there's this email that you know, his rumored

986
00:47:23,640 --> 00:47:26,280
Speaker 5: been going around. You know, I think I've told you guys.

987
00:47:26,640 --> 00:47:29,759
Speaker 5: Steven Fisher, the private investigator, he came out and said

988
00:47:29,760 --> 00:47:33,560
Speaker 5: that he has seen this email, he's verified it, and

989
00:47:33,760 --> 00:47:38,719
Speaker 5: he's this private investigator in LA. And this email apparently

990
00:47:39,040 --> 00:47:42,160
Speaker 5: was warning it's from an outside source, and it's warning

991
00:47:43,040 --> 00:47:47,040
Speaker 5: David's management team, like, hey, listen, I know, and I'm

992
00:47:47,080 --> 00:47:51,879
Speaker 5: paraphrasing here, I know that you know Celeste is with

993
00:47:51,920 --> 00:47:53,839
Speaker 5: you guys, and you know you need to know she's

994
00:47:53,920 --> 00:47:57,400
Speaker 5: under age, she's fourteen years old, she's a runaway. Be

995
00:47:57,719 --> 00:48:01,360
Speaker 5: you know, be careful, something to that effect. Okay, Well,

996
00:48:01,880 --> 00:48:05,279
Speaker 5: on a TikTok's account making these accusations and repeating what

997
00:48:05,320 --> 00:48:09,320
Speaker 5: I just said. The manager of David has responded, and

998
00:48:10,080 --> 00:48:12,800
Speaker 5: what he has said is like, no, that's not true,

999
00:48:13,360 --> 00:48:15,279
Speaker 5: and I have never received this email. I don't know

1000
00:48:15,320 --> 00:48:18,240
Speaker 5: what you're talking about. I don't even live in that city.

1001
00:48:18,440 --> 00:48:21,080
Speaker 5: Here's what he said. This is the only time I'm

1002
00:48:21,120 --> 00:48:23,480
Speaker 5: going to speak on this matter for now. This has

1003
00:48:23,520 --> 00:48:25,279
Speaker 5: been a tough time for my family as I'm the

1004
00:48:25,280 --> 00:48:28,080
Speaker 5: father of three children. I have received no emails and

1005
00:48:28,160 --> 00:48:29,840
Speaker 5: no one and I am no one's roommate. I with

1006
00:48:29,920 --> 00:48:31,920
Speaker 5: full time at home with my wife and kids. My

1007
00:48:32,000 --> 00:48:34,880
Speaker 5: daughter is fourteen, and this news is affecting so many lives.

1008
00:48:35,200 --> 00:48:38,360
Speaker 5: I never received any emails, I had zero knowledge of anything,

1009
00:48:38,400 --> 00:48:40,839
Speaker 5: and I don't even live in California. Also, I work

1010
00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:43,200
Speaker 5: remotely ninety five percent of the time. So basically he's

1011
00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:46,240
Speaker 5: denying knowledge of we received this even meal while Stephen

1012
00:48:46,280 --> 00:48:50,640
Speaker 5: Fisher down He's like, yeah, Stephen Fisher's doubling down, saying,

1013
00:48:50,680 --> 00:48:52,960
Speaker 5: I've spoken to the person who sent the email.

1014
00:48:53,640 --> 00:48:58,000
Speaker 3: I've you know, I've seen it. Have they seen the

1015
00:48:58,000 --> 00:48:59,719
Speaker 3: email that I.

1016
00:48:59,640 --> 00:49:03,560
Speaker 5: Don't know that I don't know. He said he confirmed

1017
00:49:03,600 --> 00:49:05,480
Speaker 5: with the author of the email that it was sent

1018
00:49:05,560 --> 00:49:08,560
Speaker 5: and does exist. But I can ask him if he

1019
00:49:08,600 --> 00:49:12,279
Speaker 5: has seen it himself. But he's saying that he did

1020
00:49:12,360 --> 00:49:15,319
Speaker 5: confirm with his source, you know that this email was

1021
00:49:15,360 --> 00:49:19,080
Speaker 5: sent and and whatnot? What of course the manager is denying.

1022
00:49:19,560 --> 00:49:21,840
Speaker 5: Now here's the interesting thing. I've been thinking about this

1023
00:49:21,880 --> 00:49:23,319
Speaker 5: a lot, and I kind of want to run something

1024
00:49:23,360 --> 00:49:25,000
Speaker 5: by you guys. Let's do it, do you guys mind?

1025
00:49:25,239 --> 00:49:30,040
Speaker 5: Let's mind? I am leaning leaning in all right? So

1026
00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:33,439
Speaker 5: the Los Angeles. Okay, so we know a couple of things, right,

1027
00:49:33,800 --> 00:49:36,799
Speaker 5: they're denying the email. That's that's number one. Right, They're

1028
00:49:36,840 --> 00:49:40,879
Speaker 5: denying that they got there got a warning. Basically, Well,

1029
00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:45,160
Speaker 5: we also know that the Los Angeles the law enforcement

1030
00:49:45,239 --> 00:49:48,040
Speaker 5: has said that the there's no manner and cause of

1031
00:49:48,040 --> 00:49:51,200
Speaker 5: death yet we know that, right, and we've been spitballing

1032
00:49:51,239 --> 00:49:54,000
Speaker 5: for a hot minute basically that it's probably going to

1033
00:49:54,040 --> 00:49:56,600
Speaker 5: come down to toxicology, right, and they have to wait

1034
00:49:56,920 --> 00:50:01,160
Speaker 5: for that report to come in to rule on her death. Right. Well,

1035
00:50:01,600 --> 00:50:06,680
Speaker 5: the Ellie has come out and said they said Monday

1036
00:50:06,760 --> 00:50:10,799
Speaker 5: that you know the Los Angeles County Medical Examiner has

1037
00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:15,160
Speaker 5: not yet determined cause or manner of death, and as such,

1038
00:50:15,239 --> 00:50:19,800
Speaker 5: it remains unclear whether there is any criminal culpability beyond

1039
00:50:19,840 --> 00:50:22,279
Speaker 5: the concealment of her body. That's what they that's in

1040
00:50:22,280 --> 00:50:25,840
Speaker 5: a direct quote. So we know that right now. Listen.

1041
00:50:26,360 --> 00:50:30,799
Speaker 5: We also know that her poor little body was in

1042
00:50:30,800 --> 00:50:33,600
Speaker 5: that front for many, many weeks. We don't know how long,

1043
00:50:33,640 --> 00:50:37,279
Speaker 5: but many weeks, right, And they came out early and

1044
00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:40,760
Speaker 5: said media, we've never heard this from the police ourselves.

1045
00:50:41,200 --> 00:50:45,239
Speaker 5: The media reported that the Elie said that she had

1046
00:50:45,280 --> 00:50:48,239
Speaker 5: been dismembered. So here's what I'm going to say. I

1047
00:50:48,280 --> 00:50:51,799
Speaker 5: don't think that's true. I don't think that's true at all.

1048
00:50:52,320 --> 00:50:57,200
Speaker 5: And the reason I don't think that's true is beyond

1049
00:50:57,760 --> 00:51:02,960
Speaker 5: concealment of her body. Now, if you dismember somebody, that

1050
00:51:03,080 --> 00:51:08,319
Speaker 5: is like this massive crime. Right there's right, there's you know,

1051
00:51:08,360 --> 00:51:12,520
Speaker 5: abusive corpse, there's I think it's probably a felony. Okay,

1052
00:51:13,080 --> 00:51:18,080
Speaker 5: it's not just crepability, will you. Yeah, it's not just

1053
00:51:18,160 --> 00:51:21,000
Speaker 5: criminal culpability beyond the concealment of a body. And I'm

1054
00:51:21,000 --> 00:51:24,080
Speaker 5: doing that in quotes again, it's much more serious. Than that,

1055
00:51:24,200 --> 00:51:26,520
Speaker 5: and there would be tool marks right to you know,

1056
00:51:26,520 --> 00:51:28,879
Speaker 5: we talked to Joseph Scott Morgan all the time, he's

1057
00:51:28,920 --> 00:51:31,640
Speaker 5: on every Sunday, love him, and you know, there would

1058
00:51:31,640 --> 00:51:34,879
Speaker 5: be tool marks, there would be evidence of So the

1059
00:51:34,880 --> 00:51:38,839
Speaker 5: cops would never say there might be criminal culpability in

1060
00:51:38,880 --> 00:51:42,239
Speaker 5: regards to concealment of her body, right, they would say

1061
00:51:42,800 --> 00:51:44,200
Speaker 5: something different, They would say something else.

1062
00:51:44,280 --> 00:51:44,520
Speaker 3: Right.

1063
00:51:45,080 --> 00:51:47,400
Speaker 4: Yes, By the way, dismembering a body is illegal in

1064
00:51:47,560 --> 00:51:52,640
Speaker 4: all jurisdictions. Mutilation, dismembering, or abusing a corpse is a

1065
00:51:52,680 --> 00:51:55,640
Speaker 4: serious felony offense in every single state.

1066
00:51:57,600 --> 00:52:00,640
Speaker 5: So here's what I think, based on everything that we know.

1067
00:52:00,719 --> 00:52:03,719
Speaker 5: And listen, we know very little, right. This is just

1068
00:52:03,880 --> 00:52:07,279
Speaker 5: based on the little clues that we do have, which

1069
00:52:07,320 --> 00:52:09,440
Speaker 5: by the way, are horrible little clues.

1070
00:52:09,840 --> 00:52:10,440
Speaker 3: And I could be.

1071
00:52:10,400 --> 00:52:12,919
Speaker 5: Totally wrong, like I but I'm gonna throw I'm gonna

1072
00:52:12,920 --> 00:52:15,680
Speaker 5: go on a limb. I'm gonna make a prediction, soft launch,

1073
00:52:16,400 --> 00:52:20,879
Speaker 5: soft launch. I believe it's very likely that poor Celeste

1074
00:52:21,960 --> 00:52:25,480
Speaker 5: died from some kind of exposure to an illegal substance,

1075
00:52:26,200 --> 00:52:29,759
Speaker 5: whether she ingested it personally herself on you know, intentionally,

1076
00:52:29,880 --> 00:52:32,440
Speaker 5: or it was an accident or somebody did it to

1077
00:52:32,480 --> 00:52:35,279
Speaker 5: her that I do not know, right, And I think

1078
00:52:35,320 --> 00:52:37,719
Speaker 5: that to toxicology is going to come back, and I

1079
00:52:37,760 --> 00:52:40,440
Speaker 5: think it's going to be a really good, you know,

1080
00:52:40,840 --> 00:52:44,400
Speaker 5: uh positive result because they were able to do that

1081
00:52:44,480 --> 00:52:48,080
Speaker 5: hormonal test to determine she had ever been pregnant, so

1082
00:52:48,120 --> 00:52:50,680
Speaker 5: her body's in a good enough state, you know, and

1083
00:52:51,040 --> 00:52:54,319
Speaker 5: to get to get these hormones, this HGC, you know,

1084
00:52:54,440 --> 00:52:56,520
Speaker 5: tests that they do to determine if you've been pregnant

1085
00:52:56,560 --> 00:52:57,120
Speaker 5: in the last year.

1086
00:52:57,600 --> 00:53:01,200
Speaker 3: So I think it's going to be a good test.

1087
00:53:01,239 --> 00:53:03,200
Speaker 5: I don't think it's gonna be like a false positive

1088
00:53:03,280 --> 00:53:06,600
Speaker 5: or anything like that. So here's what I think. There

1089
00:53:06,640 --> 00:53:09,880
Speaker 5: was an accident prior to David going on tour, maybe

1090
00:53:10,000 --> 00:53:13,120
Speaker 5: end of July, beginning of August, somewhere in that timeframe

1091
00:53:13,400 --> 00:53:15,760
Speaker 5: we know he went on tour. He started tour August

1092
00:53:15,800 --> 00:53:18,799
Speaker 5: fifth in Corona in Delmar, California. It's like an hour

1093
00:53:18,840 --> 00:53:21,600
Speaker 5: and a half two hours from LA and then August sixth,

1094
00:53:21,600 --> 00:53:25,480
Speaker 5: he goes to Phoenix. Okay, so around around then, okay,

1095
00:53:25,560 --> 00:53:31,279
Speaker 5: maybe right before around then, she she has this accidental

1096
00:53:31,320 --> 00:53:34,480
Speaker 5: exposure to some kind of substance. Maybe she was supposed

1097
00:53:34,480 --> 00:53:37,560
Speaker 5: to fentanyl. Maybe you know, something something like that some

1098
00:53:37,640 --> 00:53:43,600
Speaker 5: kind of street drug. She dies and he maybe maybe

1099
00:53:44,000 --> 00:53:48,560
Speaker 5: I'm please allegedly allegedly allegedly panics, Oh my god, my

1100
00:53:48,680 --> 00:53:51,440
Speaker 5: tour is about to start. I've got this fourteen year

1101
00:53:51,480 --> 00:53:54,440
Speaker 5: old girl that's been staying at my house allegedly, I

1102
00:53:54,760 --> 00:53:55,640
Speaker 5: what am I gonna do?

1103
00:53:55,800 --> 00:53:57,719
Speaker 3: Like my life is about to change?

1104
00:53:58,239 --> 00:54:00,640
Speaker 5: Like this can't be happening, you know, like this is

1105
00:54:00,719 --> 00:54:03,080
Speaker 5: kind of going through it maybe or maybe his team

1106
00:54:03,080 --> 00:54:06,840
Speaker 5: mayor right, yep, maybe somebody. I don't know that. I

1107
00:54:06,880 --> 00:54:08,719
Speaker 5: don't know, but I think it's gonna come down to

1108
00:54:09,560 --> 00:54:12,640
Speaker 5: it was an accidental kind of overdose kind of situation,

1109
00:54:13,320 --> 00:54:14,120
Speaker 5: and they panicked.

1110
00:54:14,160 --> 00:54:16,960
Speaker 3: And listen, he's a young man. You don't make good.

1111
00:54:16,880 --> 00:54:20,640
Speaker 5: Twenty a young twenty year his frontal lobe isn't even

1112
00:54:20,640 --> 00:54:24,480
Speaker 5: developed yet, right, and he's got this minor he's harboring

1113
00:54:24,520 --> 00:54:28,280
Speaker 5: a runaway, right, and he's just jail.

1114
00:54:28,480 --> 00:54:29,080
Speaker 3: Allegedly.

1115
00:54:29,200 --> 00:54:32,800
Speaker 5: This is all sideny, guys, this is literally all allegedly.

1116
00:54:32,840 --> 00:54:34,520
Speaker 5: None of it could be true. None of it could

1117
00:54:34,520 --> 00:54:37,799
Speaker 5: be true. I'm just talking, and so I think that's

1118
00:54:37,800 --> 00:54:39,000
Speaker 5: what we're gonna learn. Do.

1119
00:54:39,160 --> 00:54:42,120
Speaker 2: I think I'm so convinced by you. I totally agree

1120
00:54:42,160 --> 00:54:44,319
Speaker 2: with your take on this. And by the way, let's

1121
00:54:44,360 --> 00:54:47,960
Speaker 2: go a step further. I'm David the pop star. Excuse me,

1122
00:54:48,000 --> 00:54:50,480
Speaker 2: I'm twenty years old, so he's to your point. I'm

1123
00:54:50,480 --> 00:54:54,440
Speaker 2: not minimizing his age. He's not a kid, but he's

1124
00:54:54,440 --> 00:54:56,279
Speaker 2: still a young man. In his frontal lobes have not

1125
00:54:56,360 --> 00:54:59,480
Speaker 2: been developed. And yes, we're going on a world tour,

1126
00:54:59,560 --> 00:55:04,839
Speaker 2: the biggest time of any musician's life. The money is

1127
00:55:05,120 --> 00:55:09,080
Speaker 2: in the amount of people behind you, and management and the pressures,

1128
00:55:09,120 --> 00:55:12,240
Speaker 2: all the things. Let's just say that, you know, Celeste

1129
00:55:12,280 --> 00:55:14,839
Speaker 2: has been hiding at his house, and maybe he had

1130
00:55:14,880 --> 00:55:16,440
Speaker 2: no idea how old she was.

1131
00:55:16,640 --> 00:55:18,319
Speaker 3: Maybe he thought she was older. She had a lot

1132
00:55:18,320 --> 00:55:19,040
Speaker 3: of fake id's.

1133
00:55:19,640 --> 00:55:22,160
Speaker 2: Maybe he wasn't the one giving her the fake IDs.

1134
00:55:22,719 --> 00:55:26,279
Speaker 2: Maybe he was the one receiving the fake IDs, so

1135
00:55:26,400 --> 00:55:28,560
Speaker 2: he's keeping her safe. Maybe she had a tale to

1136
00:55:28,600 --> 00:55:31,640
Speaker 2: tell that was maybe not true. Maybe she was coming

1137
00:55:31,719 --> 00:55:35,640
Speaker 2: from a difficult situation, or maybe she had been you know,

1138
00:55:35,760 --> 00:55:36,360
Speaker 2: using drups.

1139
00:55:36,560 --> 00:55:37,319
Speaker 3: I'm making this up.

1140
00:55:37,360 --> 00:55:40,399
Speaker 2: Also, this is nothing to victim shame all her feet,

1141
00:55:41,440 --> 00:55:44,440
Speaker 2: But like you know, she's a kid, and maybe he

1142
00:55:44,520 --> 00:55:46,040
Speaker 2: is saying to him, hey, I want to be in

1143
00:55:46,080 --> 00:55:49,319
Speaker 2: your orbit and I'm technically not allowed to and my

1144
00:55:49,400 --> 00:55:51,200
Speaker 2: parents don't want me to be. But I'm going to

1145
00:55:51,280 --> 00:55:54,880
Speaker 2: tell you that I'm wayward and I'm in a terrible situation,

1146
00:55:55,040 --> 00:55:57,880
Speaker 2: so i have to escape here, and to mom and dad,

1147
00:55:57,960 --> 00:56:00,520
Speaker 2: I'm going to say, peace out, I'm out eat. I'm

1148
00:56:00,600 --> 00:56:02,440
Speaker 2: gonna just be on the lamb and I'm gonna go

1149
00:56:02,520 --> 00:56:04,279
Speaker 2: missing because i want to be with David the pop

1150
00:56:04,280 --> 00:56:08,040
Speaker 2: star in the Hollywood Hills, living my best life. And

1151
00:56:08,719 --> 00:56:10,719
Speaker 2: David is like, look, you're way too young, but I

1152
00:56:10,719 --> 00:56:12,719
Speaker 2: don't want to send you home to a bad situation.

1153
00:56:13,320 --> 00:56:15,960
Speaker 2: Maybe yeah, she told him it was a bad situation.

1154
00:56:16,080 --> 00:56:18,319
Speaker 2: I'm not saying that it was right. And he's like

1155
00:56:18,360 --> 00:56:21,239
Speaker 2: the brother, I'm going to subtack you and like yeah,

1156
00:56:21,320 --> 00:56:23,319
Speaker 2: he By the way, this is a kid that only

1157
00:56:23,320 --> 00:56:26,000
Speaker 2: went to school till seventh grade and was homeschooled thereafter,

1158
00:56:26,200 --> 00:56:30,200
Speaker 2: So in some ways, socially this is his peer. You know,

1159
00:56:30,280 --> 00:56:33,480
Speaker 2: he's kind of operating in that same headspace. I'm guessing

1160
00:56:33,600 --> 00:56:36,600
Speaker 2: we don't know the players. And then she's you know,

1161
00:56:36,880 --> 00:56:40,359
Speaker 2: party pants or maybe somebody else's party pants around her.

1162
00:56:40,800 --> 00:56:43,880
Speaker 2: She gets slipped some drugs or she takes drugs by

1163
00:56:43,920 --> 00:56:49,520
Speaker 2: accit who knows? And the panic sets in and yeah, no,

1164
00:56:49,800 --> 00:56:52,520
Speaker 2: frontal lobes are like, yeah, I have an idea. Let's

1165
00:56:52,560 --> 00:56:55,120
Speaker 2: just stash the sash her in the car until we

1166
00:56:55,160 --> 00:56:57,000
Speaker 2: figure something better out to do.

1167
00:56:57,960 --> 00:56:59,840
Speaker 3: Or he's not involved at all and he was already

1168
00:57:00,880 --> 00:57:01,360
Speaker 3: very well.

1169
00:57:03,000 --> 00:57:05,960
Speaker 5: Put her in his own and his team is like,

1170
00:57:06,080 --> 00:57:08,359
Speaker 5: oh my god, you know are are And listen, I'm

1171
00:57:08,400 --> 00:57:11,040
Speaker 5: not saying anybody has team, please, don't you know. I'm

1172
00:57:11,080 --> 00:57:13,720
Speaker 5: just trying to come up with different ideas, like maybe

1173
00:57:13,719 --> 00:57:16,000
Speaker 5: somebody that he knows is like, we have to protect David,

1174
00:57:16,120 --> 00:57:18,680
Speaker 5: you know, like without his knowledge even yeah, right.

1175
00:57:19,040 --> 00:57:21,160
Speaker 3: Or one of his studies or one of the people

1176
00:57:21,160 --> 00:57:23,480
Speaker 3: at the party who had access to the keys. You know,

1177
00:57:23,520 --> 00:57:24,600
Speaker 3: we don't totally know.

1178
00:57:24,800 --> 00:57:25,400
Speaker 5: We don't know.

1179
00:57:25,840 --> 00:57:28,920
Speaker 2: And and then he finds this out and it's like,

1180
00:57:29,000 --> 00:57:31,360
Speaker 2: oh my goodness, I can't even come forward and tell

1181
00:57:31,360 --> 00:57:32,680
Speaker 2: the truth because.

1182
00:57:32,640 --> 00:57:34,840
Speaker 3: She was so young and I didn't even know she

1183
00:57:34,960 --> 00:57:36,800
Speaker 3: was fourteen and I did. Now I'm going to be

1184
00:57:36,920 --> 00:57:40,040
Speaker 3: seen as like my career is over.

1185
00:57:40,200 --> 00:57:40,920
Speaker 5: What's going to happen?

1186
00:57:41,320 --> 00:57:43,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm just going I don't even know whether I think,

1187
00:57:43,720 --> 00:57:46,919
Speaker 2: but these are just scenarios that I could see play out.

1188
00:57:47,400 --> 00:57:48,960
Speaker 2: If it was so black and white, he would have

1189
00:57:48,960 --> 00:57:50,040
Speaker 2: been arrested by now.

1190
00:57:50,600 --> 00:57:54,120
Speaker 5: Right, I agree, and again I just that that statement

1191
00:57:54,160 --> 00:57:57,080
Speaker 5: from the loss the about the medical examiner. As such,

1192
00:57:57,240 --> 00:58:01,680
Speaker 5: it remains unclear whether there is any criminal culpability beyond

1193
00:58:01,880 --> 00:58:06,000
Speaker 5: concealment of her body. Right, it would say dismember it

1194
00:58:06,040 --> 00:58:09,600
Speaker 5: you abuse of a corpse. Let's say, it would say

1195
00:58:09,600 --> 00:58:12,360
Speaker 5: that it had you been dismembered. And when somebody's dismembered,

1196
00:58:12,400 --> 00:58:14,480
Speaker 5: that is like a murder in my eyes, like, oh

1197
00:58:14,520 --> 00:58:16,480
Speaker 5: my god, they were stabbed and murdered or whatever. You know,

1198
00:58:16,560 --> 00:58:17,840
Speaker 5: this it doesn't seem like that.

1199
00:58:18,120 --> 00:58:21,280
Speaker 2: Oh, just this is so incredibly personal. And by the way,

1200
00:58:21,440 --> 00:58:24,920
Speaker 2: does the stut market in order to dismember a human body.

1201
00:58:25,400 --> 00:58:27,800
Speaker 3: First of all, you are next level.

1202
00:58:27,720 --> 00:58:33,920
Speaker 2: Off the mental awareness chain, and it's really personal, and

1203
00:58:34,320 --> 00:58:37,000
Speaker 2: you are in a state of craziness that it is

1204
00:58:37,160 --> 00:58:39,800
Speaker 2: impossible to imagine you can come back to that and

1205
00:58:39,840 --> 00:58:42,280
Speaker 2: then go on tour and sing on stage.

1206
00:58:42,680 --> 00:58:45,320
Speaker 3: I have to assume that's not possible. But I'm also

1207
00:58:45,360 --> 00:58:49,640
Speaker 3: wrong very often, and you know, sometimes people do dark

1208
00:58:49,680 --> 00:58:52,600
Speaker 3: things and it surprises me. Right, well, I'm glad I

1209
00:58:52,600 --> 00:58:53,560
Speaker 3: got that off my chest.

1210
00:58:53,600 --> 00:58:54,560
Speaker 5: Thank you for having it's.

1211
00:58:54,440 --> 00:58:55,520
Speaker 3: Great there for a little bit.

1212
00:58:55,840 --> 00:58:59,720
Speaker 5: Well, coming up shocking new claims. Did Jeffrey Epstein secretly

1213
00:58:59,720 --> 00:59:03,640
Speaker 5: blow backmail powerful figures with hidden recordings? Keep you ever

1214
00:59:03,720 --> 00:59:06,520
Speaker 5: hair true crime tonight we're talking true crime all the time.

1215
00:59:17,520 --> 00:59:20,200
Speaker 2: We've been talking a lot about all things Epstein, and

1216
00:59:20,320 --> 00:59:23,280
Speaker 2: it seems as though the Jeffrey Epstein kinges keeps getting

1217
00:59:23,520 --> 00:59:26,840
Speaker 2: pushed and pushed, and we hear a lot of things,

1218
00:59:26,920 --> 00:59:28,200
Speaker 2: and then it goes quiet, and then we hear a

1219
00:59:28,240 --> 00:59:30,800
Speaker 2: lot of things, and then it goes quiet. And today

1220
00:59:30,920 --> 00:59:34,280
Speaker 2: was pretty astounding. And I want to say the first

1221
00:59:34,320 --> 00:59:41,600
Speaker 2: time I've ever seen anyone really step forward and say, yeah,

1222
00:59:42,080 --> 00:59:43,840
Speaker 2: I know what the plan was, and I saw it

1223
00:59:43,880 --> 00:59:47,040
Speaker 2: with my own two eyes. So Howard Lutnik, who was

1224
00:59:47,080 --> 00:59:51,840
Speaker 2: the US Commerce Secretary under Trump, came out and basically

1225
00:59:51,920 --> 00:59:55,200
Speaker 2: was in an interview saying that he was Jeffrey Epstein's

1226
00:59:55,240 --> 00:59:58,479
Speaker 2: next door neighbor in New York City and the one

1227
00:59:58,600 --> 01:00:01,000
Speaker 2: and only time he went, we're a good old Jeffrey

1228
01:00:01,000 --> 01:00:04,800
Speaker 2: Epstein's house. Jeffrey had invited him over likely because he

1229
01:00:04,920 --> 01:00:08,040
Speaker 2: was a man of influence, meaning Howard was a man

1230
01:00:08,080 --> 01:00:11,280
Speaker 2: of influence. So Howard Lutnik goes over to his neighbor's

1231
01:00:11,280 --> 01:00:14,760
Speaker 2: house and in the middle of the main room he

1232
01:00:14,840 --> 01:00:19,440
Speaker 2: notices a massage table and like anybody would, oh my goodness,

1233
01:00:19,440 --> 01:00:20,880
Speaker 2: you have a massage table here. You get a lot

1234
01:00:20,880 --> 01:00:25,760
Speaker 2: of massages, and Jeffrey Epstein I'm paraphrasing, says, oh yeah,

1235
01:00:25,800 --> 01:00:29,120
Speaker 2: every day in fact, the good kind like wink wing,

1236
01:00:29,960 --> 01:00:34,480
Speaker 2: oh yeah. And Howard Lutnik has now said, yeah, he

1237
01:00:34,600 --> 01:00:38,960
Speaker 2: was the best blackmailer ever and that he believes in

1238
01:00:39,000 --> 01:00:42,479
Speaker 2: his heart of hearts that in fact, people were being

1239
01:00:42,600 --> 01:00:46,960
Speaker 2: either lured to any of Epstein's wild locations, whether it

1240
01:00:47,000 --> 01:00:51,439
Speaker 2: was his island or his West Palm Beach location, or

1241
01:00:51,520 --> 01:00:56,280
Speaker 2: his fancy you know, Brownstone in New York City, the

1242
01:00:56,320 --> 01:01:01,840
Speaker 2: most expensive the most expensive real estate. Boy, if you

1243
01:01:01,840 --> 01:01:06,240
Speaker 2: want to be ostentatious, I mean be ostentatious. Yeah, I

1244
01:01:06,280 --> 01:01:09,040
Speaker 2: mean he was like so front and center with it

1245
01:01:09,120 --> 01:01:13,400
Speaker 2: as well. So yeah, Howard is now speaking out, and

1246
01:01:13,480 --> 01:01:17,920
Speaker 2: it's it's really astounding because he's putting himself in a

1247
01:01:17,960 --> 01:01:21,320
Speaker 2: really tough spot on the frontline of a lot of chatter.

1248
01:01:21,800 --> 01:01:25,520
Speaker 5: And I'm underlined it needs to be underlined a little

1249
01:01:25,520 --> 01:01:31,080
Speaker 5: bit though, that this is the United States Secretary of Commerce, right,

1250
01:01:31,200 --> 01:01:33,520
Speaker 5: this isn't like some banker, right.

1251
01:01:33,480 --> 01:01:38,000
Speaker 2: Yep, this is or neighbor, some random neighbors, random, this

1252
01:01:38,160 --> 01:01:41,080
Speaker 2: is the United States Secretary of Commerce.

1253
01:01:41,160 --> 01:01:44,240
Speaker 5: And he's like, yeah, Jeffreys, you know m O was

1254
01:01:44,280 --> 01:01:48,000
Speaker 5: to invite powerful men over to get secretly filmed. And

1255
01:01:48,040 --> 01:01:52,480
Speaker 5: he also was like, I question why somebody who committed

1256
01:01:52,520 --> 01:01:55,800
Speaker 5: sex crimes was able to get a sentence of eighteen

1257
01:01:55,840 --> 01:01:58,720
Speaker 5: months on work release. Like he's like, there's more here.

1258
01:01:59,080 --> 01:02:01,560
Speaker 5: He's the greatest black mail or ever is what he said.

1259
01:02:02,360 --> 01:02:02,640
Speaker 5: And I.

1260
01:02:05,240 --> 01:02:08,200
Speaker 4: Think it's astounding, And I think that I really do

1261
01:02:08,360 --> 01:02:12,120
Speaker 4: think that this is going to be the beginning. Because

1262
01:02:12,760 --> 01:02:19,360
Speaker 4: the victims, proudly survivors pardon me, survivors spoke and we

1263
01:02:19,440 --> 01:02:23,080
Speaker 4: have spoken about how that was received poorly by some,

1264
01:02:23,800 --> 01:02:28,000
Speaker 4: disregarded by others, applauded by all of us, and many

1265
01:02:28,040 --> 01:02:34,720
Speaker 4: many others. But Howard Lutnik, as the first politician, the

1266
01:02:34,920 --> 01:02:38,560
Speaker 4: person of power, person of influence, dare I say, white

1267
01:02:38,600 --> 01:02:44,920
Speaker 4: man to say this was up and just say it plainly, And.

1268
01:02:44,920 --> 01:02:47,880
Speaker 5: Maybe this is the beginning this, maybe this is what

1269
01:02:48,000 --> 01:02:51,160
Speaker 5: breaks that damn well that it's going to start flowing now,

1270
01:02:51,600 --> 01:02:54,040
Speaker 5: Like the just one person has to like kind of

1271
01:02:54,120 --> 01:02:57,200
Speaker 5: like you know, break that opening.

1272
01:02:57,360 --> 01:03:00,720
Speaker 2: Is verify the story, because remember, this is very counter

1273
01:03:01,600 --> 01:03:05,000
Speaker 2: to what has been said by so many people real time,

1274
01:03:05,240 --> 01:03:07,760
Speaker 2: remember Cash, Patel, Pam Bondi.

1275
01:03:07,880 --> 01:03:09,720
Speaker 3: Everybody was like, yeah, there.

1276
01:03:09,640 --> 01:03:14,920
Speaker 2: Is nobody operating other than Jeffrey Epstein, right, Howard Lutnik

1277
01:03:15,040 --> 01:03:18,600
Speaker 2: went on today in a very courageous move, I might add,

1278
01:03:18,640 --> 01:03:22,080
Speaker 2: so putting yourself in the in the front the front

1279
01:03:22,080 --> 01:03:25,960
Speaker 2: line of a firestorm here and I think on behalf

1280
01:03:26,040 --> 01:03:30,800
Speaker 2: of all women alive were very grateful if this is fact,

1281
01:03:30,960 --> 01:03:35,040
Speaker 2: is your truth? So allegedly, allegedly, allegedly he is saying,

1282
01:03:35,560 --> 01:03:37,880
Speaker 2: not only was there a massage table in the middle

1283
01:03:37,880 --> 01:03:41,720
Speaker 2: of the room where Jeffrey Epstein and you know, implied that,

1284
01:03:41,840 --> 01:03:44,440
Speaker 2: you know, lots of things were happening there. The follow

1285
01:03:44,520 --> 01:03:48,320
Speaker 2: up question by the interviewee was so you know, we're

1286
01:03:48,360 --> 01:03:51,320
Speaker 2: people being lured here, and his real take on it

1287
01:03:51,400 --> 01:03:55,560
Speaker 2: was no, very powerful people were willingly participating, and that

1288
01:03:55,640 --> 01:03:58,680
Speaker 2: it was an open secret is sort of the intimation here.

1289
01:03:58,720 --> 01:04:00,920
Speaker 2: And that was the thing with Diddy and maybe some

1290
01:04:01,000 --> 01:04:04,080
Speaker 2: crossover there. It seemed as though all of the white

1291
01:04:04,160 --> 01:04:07,720
Speaker 2: parties and shenanigans in Diddy world was kind of an

1292
01:04:07,760 --> 01:04:10,560
Speaker 2: open secret. Until he got arrested and everyone was like,

1293
01:04:10,600 --> 01:04:13,240
Speaker 2: oh yeah, truth be told, and we started hearing all

1294
01:04:13,280 --> 01:04:17,040
Speaker 2: the chatter. Epstein kind of an open secret until there

1295
01:04:17,120 --> 01:04:19,600
Speaker 2: was real trouble, until he got arrested, and then later

1296
01:04:20,000 --> 01:04:22,440
Speaker 2: his life either was taken or he committed suicide.

1297
01:04:23,240 --> 01:04:25,080
Speaker 5: But don't you think like with Diddy, it was just

1298
01:04:25,160 --> 01:04:28,360
Speaker 5: like pop stars and other like influencer kind of people,

1299
01:04:28,640 --> 01:04:33,080
Speaker 5: but with Epstein it was like powerful, like powerful men.

1300
01:04:33,320 --> 01:04:36,840
Speaker 5: So I feel like it's a different like tears no scope,

1301
01:04:36,880 --> 01:04:38,880
Speaker 5: like yeah, there you go, Yeah.

1302
01:04:38,960 --> 01:04:41,840
Speaker 3: These are world Yeah, these are leaders.

1303
01:04:42,720 --> 01:04:46,640
Speaker 2: However, the only real similarity is they're being tape So

1304
01:04:46,800 --> 01:04:51,720
Speaker 2: what you know, Howard, Lena Howard, Well, according to anybody

1305
01:04:51,720 --> 01:04:54,720
Speaker 2: in recent times, the tapes don't even exist. And meanwhile,

1306
01:04:54,760 --> 01:04:59,800
Speaker 2: we saw Epstein's homes being raided and they're being like

1307
01:05:00,200 --> 01:05:02,960
Speaker 2: agents leaving the houses with big boxes that seem to

1308
01:05:02,960 --> 01:05:04,720
Speaker 2: have tapes in them. That was like the whole shape,

1309
01:05:05,240 --> 01:05:07,240
Speaker 2: and that was the whole ditty thing, right, So we

1310
01:05:07,240 --> 01:05:09,840
Speaker 2: were all assuming that there were all of these tapes

1311
01:05:09,920 --> 01:05:13,800
Speaker 2: everywhere that could in fact be used for blackmail. Again,

1312
01:05:13,880 --> 01:05:17,160
Speaker 2: the only reason that's meaningful. Again, nobody cares if you're

1313
01:05:17,200 --> 01:05:19,840
Speaker 2: making videotapes of your sex life behind closed doors and

1314
01:05:19,880 --> 01:05:21,280
Speaker 2: watching them for personal reasons.

1315
01:05:21,320 --> 01:05:22,680
Speaker 3: I don't know. I don't care.

1316
01:05:22,720 --> 01:05:25,120
Speaker 2: It isn't even like it's not my sauced away and

1317
01:05:25,160 --> 01:05:28,800
Speaker 2: I have enough problems. However, if those tapes are being

1318
01:05:28,920 --> 01:05:34,880
Speaker 2: used to influence our government, to influence the world, to

1319
01:05:35,040 --> 01:05:40,160
Speaker 2: influence decisions for our military, that's wild, and that is

1320
01:05:40,200 --> 01:05:42,880
Speaker 2: I think at the core of what we're all scratching at.

1321
01:05:44,040 --> 01:05:45,320
Speaker 5: It's scary to think about, isn't that.

1322
01:05:46,480 --> 01:05:49,760
Speaker 4: I'm so interested to see what goes on from here

1323
01:05:49,840 --> 01:05:53,760
Speaker 4: if indeed it does open the door. Because reading some

1324
01:05:53,960 --> 01:05:58,320
Speaker 4: research and I can't substantiate who, but what I'm reading

1325
01:05:58,440 --> 01:06:02,840
Speaker 4: is Lutnik, and now all are alleging that Epstein recorded

1326
01:06:02,880 --> 01:06:04,360
Speaker 4: associates to blackmail them.

1327
01:06:04,720 --> 01:06:08,120
Speaker 3: Others also, I mean, we know this is true. We

1328
01:06:08,280 --> 01:06:09,520
Speaker 3: have to assume this is true.

1329
01:06:09,960 --> 01:06:12,760
Speaker 2: This resonates in my heart so deeply, But I don't

1330
01:06:13,280 --> 01:06:15,640
Speaker 2: I don't know. You know, we have forty women who

1331
01:06:15,680 --> 01:06:19,920
Speaker 2: have come together on Capitol Hill with a very similar story.

1332
01:06:20,200 --> 01:06:22,200
Speaker 3: Very by are we, by the way too right? I

1333
01:06:22,320 --> 01:06:26,480
Speaker 3: might add? They voted for all parties, right, so why.

1334
01:06:26,320 --> 01:06:29,400
Speaker 2: Are we just discounting that? So we've already ignored them,

1335
01:06:29,480 --> 01:06:31,760
Speaker 2: which is so crazy. We've already ignored all of the

1336
01:06:31,760 --> 01:06:33,600
Speaker 2: women who have come forward and put their lives on

1337
01:06:33,640 --> 01:06:35,160
Speaker 2: the line to say this happened to me.

1338
01:06:35,680 --> 01:06:37,960
Speaker 3: I was a kid or I was a young adult.

1339
01:06:38,320 --> 01:06:42,400
Speaker 2: And they're all corroborating the stories, and everyone's so easily

1340
01:06:42,560 --> 01:06:46,120
Speaker 2: like putting that aside. So it sometimes takes a Howard

1341
01:06:46,160 --> 01:06:49,640
Speaker 2: Lutnik to come out to corroborate that story. Remember, the

1342
01:06:49,960 --> 01:06:53,400
Speaker 2: the victims are saying, if somebody doesn't come out, these

1343
01:06:53,440 --> 01:06:56,240
Speaker 2: files are not released, we're going to put our own

1344
01:06:56,280 --> 01:06:56,880
Speaker 2: list together.

1345
01:06:57,320 --> 01:06:59,560
Speaker 3: Now, enter Howard, and.

1346
01:06:59,560 --> 01:07:02,000
Speaker 5: You know what, I just want to say, it's kind

1347
01:07:02,000 --> 01:07:04,760
Speaker 5: of tongue in cheek a little bit, but you know,

1348
01:07:05,800 --> 01:07:08,440
Speaker 5: not to diminish the seriousness of this. But I never

1349
01:07:08,480 --> 01:07:13,000
Speaker 5: would have guessed a man named Howard Lutnick would be

1350
01:07:13,040 --> 01:07:15,880
Speaker 5: the you know, the United States Commerce Secretary. He's the

1351
01:07:15,920 --> 01:07:18,440
Speaker 5: bravest man in America. I never would have guessed that.

1352
01:07:18,680 --> 01:07:21,120
Speaker 2: Ever, him and Israel, the guy that did not get

1353
01:07:21,120 --> 01:07:24,200
Speaker 2: the Brazil from Ditty. Bravo, Yeah, can we like do

1354
01:07:24,280 --> 01:07:27,480
Speaker 2: a little hero segment for them, because do you know

1355
01:07:27,480 --> 01:07:29,840
Speaker 2: how much courage it takes to not take Ditty's money,

1356
01:07:29,880 --> 01:07:34,280
Speaker 2: Because you witness as security him beating his girlfriend and

1357
01:07:34,320 --> 01:07:37,160
Speaker 2: he was like, I'll give you one hundred grand. Fifty grand, No, no,

1358
01:07:37,200 --> 01:07:40,440
Speaker 2: one hundred grand. This man said no and then went

1359
01:07:40,480 --> 01:07:42,880
Speaker 2: home to his family. He's living in one of the

1360
01:07:42,880 --> 01:07:47,000
Speaker 2: most expensive cities in the world, Yright Howard.

1361
01:07:47,240 --> 01:07:50,320
Speaker 5: Yeah, probably, you know, making you know, I don't know,

1362
01:07:50,400 --> 01:07:53,120
Speaker 5: sixty seventy thousand a year. That would have been like

1363
01:07:53,320 --> 01:07:56,280
Speaker 5: life light change, life changing money for me.

1364
01:07:56,280 --> 01:07:58,880
Speaker 3: He's right, You're so right. You're living in Miami. It's

1365
01:07:58,920 --> 01:08:00,160
Speaker 3: so expensive there.

1366
01:08:00,360 --> 01:08:04,280
Speaker 2: Right, he's a security he's working maybe a second job

1367
01:08:04,320 --> 01:08:07,560
Speaker 2: after being I'm guessing, but that man is real, and

1368
01:08:07,600 --> 01:08:09,200
Speaker 2: we should pull up his last name right now.

1369
01:08:09,360 --> 01:08:11,640
Speaker 3: But I think about him so often, the fact.

1370
01:08:11,480 --> 01:08:15,640
Speaker 2: That he denied that much money and then doubly had

1371
01:08:15,680 --> 01:08:19,040
Speaker 2: the guts to come out and testify and put himself

1372
01:08:19,080 --> 01:08:22,720
Speaker 2: front and center. There are a few few heroes that

1373
01:08:22,760 --> 01:08:23,280
Speaker 2: will do that.

1374
01:08:23,880 --> 01:08:24,160
Speaker 3: Now.

1375
01:08:24,320 --> 01:08:27,000
Speaker 2: Enter Howard Lutnik, who by the way, works in the

1376
01:08:27,000 --> 01:08:27,920
Speaker 2: world so like his.

1377
01:08:27,960 --> 01:08:32,719
Speaker 3: Job is on the lines. Is real, flores Man.

1378
01:08:32,760 --> 01:08:35,479
Speaker 2: Even the guy that took the money actually came out

1379
01:08:35,520 --> 01:08:37,360
Speaker 2: against Diddy and was like, oh, okay, viye and I

1380
01:08:37,400 --> 01:08:38,760
Speaker 2: took the cash and I feel bad about it.

1381
01:08:38,840 --> 01:08:40,120
Speaker 3: I get immunity right now.

1382
01:08:40,160 --> 01:08:41,960
Speaker 2: But yes, he did offer it to me and I

1383
01:08:41,960 --> 01:08:44,400
Speaker 2: did witness this, this, this, and this, not that it mattered,

1384
01:08:44,520 --> 01:08:45,839
Speaker 2: but interesting.

1385
01:08:46,280 --> 01:08:47,639
Speaker 3: So now Howard's coming out.

1386
01:08:47,720 --> 01:08:51,200
Speaker 2: We know that we have a two hundred and eighteenth

1387
01:08:51,320 --> 01:08:55,080
Speaker 2: signature that is set to be had if we can

1388
01:08:55,160 --> 01:08:59,160
Speaker 2: finally get our congresswoman sworn in, which is now being delayed,

1389
01:08:59,560 --> 01:09:02,439
Speaker 2: and we know the victims are also prepared to come

1390
01:09:02,479 --> 01:09:06,760
Speaker 2: forward with a list. Now Howard is talking. Is there

1391
01:09:06,800 --> 01:09:09,760
Speaker 2: more behind the scenes happening? Is this heating up? I'm

1392
01:09:09,800 --> 01:09:11,200
Speaker 2: so curious what people think.

1393
01:09:12,920 --> 01:09:14,679
Speaker 3: I don't know. I mean the fact that this came

1394
01:09:14,720 --> 01:09:18,920
Speaker 3: out just in an interview and so nonchalant.

1395
01:09:19,479 --> 01:09:22,720
Speaker 4: That's what I find quite interesting, is exactly that it

1396
01:09:22,800 --> 01:09:23,920
Speaker 4: was so nonchalant.

1397
01:09:24,560 --> 01:09:27,120
Speaker 2: And it's not from page news by the way. It's

1398
01:09:27,120 --> 01:09:28,160
Speaker 2: like getting traction.

1399
01:09:28,320 --> 01:09:30,200
Speaker 3: Now. You know, we talked about it last night.

1400
01:09:30,320 --> 01:09:33,960
Speaker 2: Body brought it to our attention yesterday, so you know

1401
01:09:34,240 --> 01:09:37,479
Speaker 2: we have been trying to verify and see it for ourselves, etc.

1402
01:09:37,760 --> 01:09:40,760
Speaker 2: I mean, this is dangerous stuff, so we're trying to

1403
01:09:40,840 --> 01:09:43,800
Speaker 2: tread ourselves slightly and that get ourselves killed, you know,

1404
01:09:44,120 --> 01:09:47,120
Speaker 2: quite literally. But it's important stuff, and I think the

1405
01:09:47,200 --> 01:09:49,680
Speaker 2: parallels are very important. We're not judging jury. We don't

1406
01:09:49,720 --> 01:09:52,439
Speaker 2: have all the answers. I'm just curious on how to

1407
01:09:52,479 --> 01:09:56,599
Speaker 2: survive in the world. I'm not I'm not prescribing how

1408
01:09:56,600 --> 01:09:57,759
Speaker 2: to survive in the world.

1409
01:09:58,080 --> 01:10:00,640
Speaker 3: I just want to know how to So imagine these

1410
01:10:00,680 --> 01:10:03,479
Speaker 3: victims are finally coming out with real clarity and no

1411
01:10:03,520 --> 01:10:07,240
Speaker 3: one believes them. Like that's crazy to me, and like,

1412
01:10:07,280 --> 01:10:09,840
Speaker 3: what is this cover up? I don't understand that that's

1413
01:10:09,880 --> 01:10:11,880
Speaker 3: even possible, and I want to believe that it's not.

1414
01:10:12,600 --> 01:10:15,479
Speaker 3: But according to Howard Lutnik, there is something there.

1415
01:10:16,640 --> 01:10:19,360
Speaker 5: So I just wanted to really quick Israel Flores. He

1416
01:10:19,439 --> 01:10:21,320
Speaker 5: was making ten dollars and fifty cents an hour.

1417
01:10:21,800 --> 01:10:24,720
Speaker 3: I love him. Wow, I love him. We should like

1418
01:10:26,160 --> 01:10:26,800
Speaker 3: I love him.

1419
01:10:26,880 --> 01:10:29,880
Speaker 2: He was working at the Intercontinental Hotel in Miami Beach,

1420
01:10:29,920 --> 01:10:32,840
Speaker 2: which is a very luxury hotel in a very luxury

1421
01:10:32,920 --> 01:10:35,760
Speaker 2: Miami Beach place. You know, you've heard about it. It's

1422
01:10:35,800 --> 01:10:39,320
Speaker 2: everything you would imagine from Miami vaight Vice. I've lived there.

1423
01:10:39,479 --> 01:10:43,439
Speaker 2: I loved my time in Miami so fun. And that's

1424
01:10:43,479 --> 01:10:45,719
Speaker 2: where you met Doron, right, Oh, that's where I met Deron.

1425
01:10:45,880 --> 01:10:47,920
Speaker 2: Some of the best times of my life listen in

1426
01:10:48,080 --> 01:10:51,200
Speaker 2: little suit. Different times, yeah, yeah, different times, but you

1427
01:10:51,240 --> 01:10:52,360
Speaker 2: know it was real fun.

1428
01:10:52,760 --> 01:10:55,320
Speaker 3: But all that to be said. So here's a security guard.

1429
01:10:55,439 --> 01:10:59,040
Speaker 2: You're watching a very famous pop star beat somebody to

1430
01:10:59,120 --> 01:11:02,559
Speaker 2: the ground, and that very famous pop star says, hey,

1431
01:11:02,600 --> 01:11:06,160
Speaker 2: I'll give you some cash. Not five dollars, maybe fifty grand.

1432
01:11:06,600 --> 01:11:09,360
Speaker 2: I'll give you fifty grand, maybe one hundred grand, to

1433
01:11:09,479 --> 01:11:11,320
Speaker 2: just zip it and make this tape go away.

1434
01:11:11,560 --> 01:11:15,200
Speaker 3: And he refused it. And by the way, it was years.

1435
01:11:14,840 --> 01:11:17,639
Speaker 2: Before this tape came out, So he refused it quietly

1436
01:11:18,400 --> 01:11:21,320
Speaker 2: and it went away, and then he came back and testified.

1437
01:11:21,400 --> 01:11:25,240
Speaker 3: And that to me as a hero, it really is

1438
01:11:25,360 --> 01:11:27,439
Speaker 3: so that, by the way, I just did very quick math.

1439
01:11:27,479 --> 01:11:32,160
Speaker 4: If it was fifty grand and approximately ten dollars an hour,

1440
01:11:32,960 --> 01:11:38,240
Speaker 4: so that is five thousand working hours worth of money,

1441
01:11:39,040 --> 01:11:42,719
Speaker 4: and that is insane. That's one hundred and twenty five weeks.

1442
01:11:42,920 --> 01:11:46,000
Speaker 4: It's two years of a salary. Here you go, obviously

1443
01:11:46,120 --> 01:11:48,120
Speaker 4: not taxing it when it's coming in a paper bag.

1444
01:11:49,040 --> 01:11:50,200
Speaker 3: That is life changing.

1445
01:11:50,720 --> 01:11:53,320
Speaker 2: And by the way, I think there are more israels

1446
01:11:53,360 --> 01:11:55,559
Speaker 2: in the world than we know. We talk of a

1447
01:11:55,560 --> 01:11:57,519
Speaker 2: lot about the bad guys here, right, we talk a

1448
01:11:57,520 --> 01:11:59,599
Speaker 2: lot about Thank God, the victims were trying to give

1449
01:11:59,600 --> 01:12:01,799
Speaker 2: a voice to that. We're trying to keep ourselves safe

1450
01:12:01,800 --> 01:12:04,200
Speaker 2: by unpacking some of this stuff and understanding it better.

1451
01:12:05,200 --> 01:12:07,479
Speaker 2: But there are a lot of Israel's out there, I

1452
01:12:07,800 --> 01:12:12,360
Speaker 2: would say so many, and you know, promoting that is

1453
01:12:12,400 --> 01:12:16,479
Speaker 2: a really big deal. And listen Howard Lutnik putting herself

1454
01:12:16,479 --> 01:12:17,559
Speaker 2: in the line of fire.

1455
01:12:18,160 --> 01:12:19,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, and you.

1456
01:12:19,640 --> 01:12:21,439
Speaker 4: Know, speaking of the good guys, I feel like all

1457
01:12:21,520 --> 01:12:25,639
Speaker 4: roads lead back to mister Rogers. Even earlier when Matthew

1458
01:12:25,680 --> 01:12:29,680
Speaker 4: Russell lee yeh Inner City Press, and you know, he

1459
01:12:29,760 --> 01:12:33,080
Speaker 4: made the comparison of Diddy dressing like mister Rogers is

1460
01:12:33,160 --> 01:12:33,559
Speaker 4: kind of.

1461
01:12:33,479 --> 01:12:34,280
Speaker 3: A look at me.

1462
01:12:34,320 --> 01:12:36,639
Speaker 5: I'm so old and grown up and so I couldn't

1463
01:12:36,640 --> 01:12:37,520
Speaker 5: harm anyone.

1464
01:12:37,280 --> 01:12:41,439
Speaker 4: But the real mister Rogers look for the helpers and

1465
01:12:41,600 --> 01:12:43,200
Speaker 4: just people with strong constitution.

1466
01:12:43,720 --> 01:12:45,920
Speaker 2: Have you guys ever been in a tough situation like

1467
01:12:46,040 --> 01:12:48,599
Speaker 2: in public and people help.

1468
01:12:49,080 --> 01:12:50,000
Speaker 3: It's pretty shocking.

1469
01:12:50,439 --> 01:12:54,160
Speaker 2: I think in a moment when a regular person is

1470
01:12:54,200 --> 01:12:57,680
Speaker 2: found in a terrible situation, I like to believe in

1471
01:12:57,680 --> 01:13:01,080
Speaker 2: my heart and have witnessed it myself that the people

1472
01:13:01,160 --> 01:13:01,559
Speaker 2: jump in.

1473
01:13:02,600 --> 01:13:04,040
Speaker 3: I would jump in in a heart.

1474
01:13:04,120 --> 01:13:07,120
Speaker 5: Thankfully, I have not. I have not been in that situation,

1475
01:13:07,240 --> 01:13:09,519
Speaker 5: Thankfully I have, and.

1476
01:13:09,520 --> 01:13:13,400
Speaker 2: It's astounding, and it's like it's everybody has a firefighter

1477
01:13:13,680 --> 01:13:14,639
Speaker 2: somewhere deep within.

1478
01:13:15,200 --> 01:13:17,160
Speaker 3: Mm hmm, gosh.

1479
01:13:17,479 --> 01:13:18,280
Speaker 5: I don't know what I would do.

1480
01:13:18,400 --> 01:13:20,519
Speaker 2: No, it's pretty remarkable. I can tell you what you

1481
01:13:20,520 --> 01:13:22,639
Speaker 2: would do in a gut instinct. I'd like to think

1482
01:13:22,680 --> 01:13:25,920
Speaker 2: if you over intellectualize it, it sounds stressful, you wouldn't.

1483
01:13:25,920 --> 01:13:28,120
Speaker 2: But in the moment where you have no time to think,

1484
01:13:28,800 --> 01:13:31,280
Speaker 2: I know in my heart, without doubt, it's like a

1485
01:13:31,360 --> 01:13:33,920
Speaker 2: joke that you're even questioning it.

1486
01:13:33,400 --> 01:13:33,600
Speaker 7: I know.

1487
01:13:35,479 --> 01:13:38,599
Speaker 5: You would be even lie on my I couldn't even

1488
01:13:38,640 --> 01:13:40,920
Speaker 5: lie on the reality show that the game.

1489
01:13:41,320 --> 01:13:43,160
Speaker 3: You know we watched show in.

1490
01:13:43,120 --> 01:13:46,400
Speaker 2: Your compass, I could like, I don't even think it's

1491
01:13:46,439 --> 01:13:46,920
Speaker 2: a question.

1492
01:13:47,000 --> 01:13:49,439
Speaker 3: I think it's a I think it's human. I don't

1493
01:13:49,479 --> 01:13:53,360
Speaker 3: even think, Yeah, just instinct, right, like.

1494
01:13:53,920 --> 01:13:56,840
Speaker 6: You to do something like that. And I think maybe

1495
01:13:56,840 --> 01:13:58,639
Speaker 6: because we lived in New York and you would see

1496
01:13:58,680 --> 01:14:01,599
Speaker 6: a lot of crazy stuff. Oh yeah, some specific ones

1497
01:14:01,600 --> 01:14:03,679
Speaker 6: where I was involved, but I feel like I helped

1498
01:14:04,040 --> 01:14:04,719
Speaker 6: in some way.

1499
01:14:04,880 --> 01:14:08,880
Speaker 3: I know, Taha, you are the most anybody would want

1500
01:14:09,000 --> 01:14:11,400
Speaker 3: Taha nearby in a tragic event.

1501
01:14:12,000 --> 01:14:15,120
Speaker 2: Not only would he like save the day, but he'd okay,

1502
01:14:15,200 --> 01:14:17,160
Speaker 2: he'd hold you nicely, he'd brush your hair.

1503
01:14:17,240 --> 01:14:20,559
Speaker 3: So the photo was good. Yeah, Yeah, like the tas

1504
01:14:20,600 --> 01:14:21,240
Speaker 3: in your corner.

1505
01:14:21,760 --> 01:14:24,360
Speaker 5: Let's hope we all do that in your corner.

1506
01:14:24,640 --> 01:14:27,360
Speaker 4: Stick around. We have a lot more we're digging into.

1507
01:14:28,320 --> 01:14:30,519
Speaker 4: We are going to be hearing from you.

1508
01:14:30,600 --> 01:14:31,479
Speaker 3: We're very excited.

1509
01:14:31,520 --> 01:14:34,280
Speaker 5: We have a lot of talkbacks to get to.

1510
01:14:34,640 --> 01:14:36,519
Speaker 4: And we'd love it if he'd give us a call

1511
01:14:36,600 --> 01:14:38,880
Speaker 4: eight at eight three to one. Crime keep it here,

1512
01:14:38,920 --> 01:14:54,040
Speaker 4: True crime tonight. We are talking true crime all the time. So, ladies,

1513
01:14:54,120 --> 01:14:55,679
Speaker 4: this insulin story.

1514
01:14:56,080 --> 01:14:58,320
Speaker 2: We talked about this earlier in the show and teased

1515
01:14:58,360 --> 01:15:02,599
Speaker 2: it about so a who has been married multiple times.

1516
01:15:03,200 --> 01:15:07,479
Speaker 2: She's been accused of murdering her husbands through insulin. My

1517
01:15:07,640 --> 01:15:09,439
Speaker 2: mom actually sent me this story.

1518
01:15:09,880 --> 01:15:13,599
Speaker 4: Was it her first husband, Stephanie, because it was her

1519
01:15:13,640 --> 01:15:16,640
Speaker 4: fifth It was her fifth husband's in fact, according to

1520
01:15:16,720 --> 01:15:19,479
Speaker 4: my mother's curious Yeah, which is pretty major.

1521
01:15:19,840 --> 01:15:24,000
Speaker 2: And again we're hearing a lot of poisoning cases insulin.

1522
01:15:24,280 --> 01:15:27,759
Speaker 2: We heard the mushrooms obviously, which we've talked about a lot.

1523
01:15:27,920 --> 01:15:30,880
Speaker 2: That infamous case now in Australia, it was its first

1524
01:15:31,240 --> 01:15:35,120
Speaker 2: live trial, so we've been getting a lot of information

1525
01:15:35,200 --> 01:15:38,759
Speaker 2: about that. Thank you everyone in Australia and in Canada

1526
01:15:38,800 --> 01:15:39,160
Speaker 2: by the way.

1527
01:15:39,360 --> 01:15:40,280
Speaker 3: So what do we think.

1528
01:15:40,720 --> 01:15:43,840
Speaker 6: I heard about that earlier today and I found it fascinating,

1529
01:15:43,880 --> 01:15:45,439
Speaker 6: and I think that's when we're going to kind of

1530
01:15:45,479 --> 01:15:48,559
Speaker 6: dig into a little bit more down the road. I

1531
01:15:48,600 --> 01:15:50,679
Speaker 6: think that's a good one that maybe we can exploit

1532
01:15:50,760 --> 01:15:53,080
Speaker 6: with Joseph Scott Morgan when he's here on Sunday.

1533
01:15:53,520 --> 01:15:54,880
Speaker 3: That's a great idea.

1534
01:15:55,040 --> 01:15:57,120
Speaker 6: I think he'll really love that one. The one that

1535
01:15:57,160 --> 01:15:59,960
Speaker 6: I'm dying to talk about though, is wasn't there something new?

1536
01:16:00,320 --> 01:16:02,400
Speaker 6: There was some update with the yogurt shop murders that

1537
01:16:02,439 --> 01:16:03,360
Speaker 6: I think, yes.

1538
01:16:03,960 --> 01:16:06,000
Speaker 3: This, yes, this is a big deal.

1539
01:16:06,680 --> 01:16:10,800
Speaker 4: So the attorney for Mike Scott has called for a

1540
01:16:10,920 --> 01:16:16,840
Speaker 4: full exoneration after DNA evidence that linked a serial killer,

1541
01:16:17,000 --> 01:16:21,000
Speaker 4: Robert Eugene Brashers, to the nineteen ninety one Austin yoga

1542
01:16:21,040 --> 01:16:24,719
Speaker 4: shop murders cleared him. So it was an actual serial

1543
01:16:24,800 --> 01:16:28,479
Speaker 4: murder who participated in this. If you're not familiar, in

1544
01:16:28,600 --> 01:16:33,640
Speaker 4: nineteen ninety one, these horrible murders involved shooting four teenage

1545
01:16:33,680 --> 01:16:38,040
Speaker 4: girls to death, Jennifer and Sarah Harbinson, Eliza Thomas, and

1546
01:16:38,080 --> 01:16:41,679
Speaker 4: Amy Ayers, and after that that wasn't bad enough. Then

1547
01:16:41,800 --> 01:16:44,799
Speaker 4: it was followed by arson of this yogurt shop.

1548
01:16:45,200 --> 01:16:46,679
Speaker 3: It was a huge case.

1549
01:16:47,360 --> 01:16:51,920
Speaker 4: So and Mike Scott, he was one of the original suspects.

1550
01:16:52,560 --> 01:16:55,439
Speaker 4: He was arrested for this killing and he got a

1551
01:16:55,479 --> 01:17:00,000
Speaker 4: life sentence in two thousand and two. So his charge

1552
01:17:00,080 --> 01:17:04,120
Speaker 4: or were dismissed in two thousand and nine because this

1553
01:17:04,439 --> 01:17:08,439
Speaker 4: forensic evidence identified that the Brashers as the real killer.

1554
01:17:08,560 --> 01:17:11,240
Speaker 4: So now they want to clear his name. He has

1555
01:17:11,360 --> 01:17:13,760
Speaker 4: not been formally cleared exonerated.

1556
01:17:14,040 --> 01:17:18,280
Speaker 3: Wow, right, his conviction was overturned. Right, Chargers weren't right.

1557
01:17:18,400 --> 01:17:21,360
Speaker 5: So and there's a difference between the two, right, because

1558
01:17:22,080 --> 01:17:27,360
Speaker 5: the difference, well, it's subtle, but being exonerated means that

1559
01:17:27,400 --> 01:17:28,960
Speaker 5: you're basically proven innocent, right.

1560
01:17:28,880 --> 01:17:30,160
Speaker 3: Courtney, that's right.

1561
01:17:30,280 --> 01:17:33,200
Speaker 4: But exoneration is a form of it's a legal declaration

1562
01:17:33,320 --> 01:17:37,040
Speaker 4: of actual innocence. It clears a person's record, it makes

1563
01:17:37,080 --> 01:17:39,360
Speaker 4: them eligible This is not a small thing. It makes

1564
01:17:39,400 --> 01:17:42,320
Speaker 4: them eligible for wrongful conviction compensation.

1565
01:17:43,280 --> 01:17:46,040
Speaker 5: So that is a huge deal.

1566
01:17:46,080 --> 01:17:49,200
Speaker 6: I think that's the monetary.

1567
01:17:48,880 --> 01:17:52,519
Speaker 4: Absolutely, and compensation and laws you know, like most things

1568
01:17:52,600 --> 01:17:56,479
Speaker 4: vary by states, absolutely wildly, but that would be a

1569
01:17:56,479 --> 01:18:02,360
Speaker 4: big deal, and the attorney Tony Diaz, he said, I

1570
01:18:02,439 --> 01:18:06,080
Speaker 4: am this case stole decades of my client's life. Yeah,

1571
01:18:06,080 --> 01:18:08,080
Speaker 4: I'm sure it has come to light. I mean the

1572
01:18:08,120 --> 01:18:11,920
Speaker 4: fact that it was a serial murderer, isn't it wild?

1573
01:18:12,320 --> 01:18:13,799
Speaker 4: And your life is ruined?

1574
01:18:14,400 --> 01:18:16,960
Speaker 6: That's crazy. That's like my biggest fear is like I'm

1575
01:18:16,960 --> 01:18:19,880
Speaker 6: going to be wrongfully convicted of something same, Yeah, they

1576
01:18:19,920 --> 01:18:21,320
Speaker 6: find out fifty.

1577
01:18:21,120 --> 01:18:23,920
Speaker 3: Years later by a r by an AI video or something.

1578
01:18:24,040 --> 01:18:27,000
Speaker 2: That's my big Or it's the DNA that we heard

1579
01:18:27,040 --> 01:18:30,559
Speaker 2: about from CC, Like remember, like how many cases are

1580
01:18:30,600 --> 01:18:33,679
Speaker 2: being realized. I'm working on a case right now. We're

1581
01:18:33,680 --> 01:18:36,640
Speaker 2: doing a documentary about it. And really the DNA is

1582
01:18:36,680 --> 01:18:40,840
Speaker 2: the answer. The fact that people are accused in due

1583
01:18:40,880 --> 01:18:44,040
Speaker 2: time for as long as so many do, then they

1584
01:18:44,040 --> 01:18:47,840
Speaker 2: get released and like are strangely cool about it, like

1585
01:18:47,960 --> 01:18:50,639
Speaker 2: whether they sue and get a bajillion dollars. I'm just saying,

1586
01:18:50,960 --> 01:18:53,840
Speaker 2: can you imagine having to go to prison in a

1587
01:18:53,880 --> 01:18:57,360
Speaker 2: real way for a crime you didn't commit? It is

1588
01:18:57,479 --> 01:19:00,000
Speaker 2: no walk in the park, and like they throw it,

1589
01:19:00,080 --> 01:19:02,519
Speaker 2: hey so, and then you're innocent.

1590
01:19:02,680 --> 01:19:05,360
Speaker 3: And by the way, the giggle is always, oh yeah,

1591
01:19:05,400 --> 01:19:08,439
Speaker 3: everybody is innocent. In prison. That's like the stick. Right.

1592
01:19:08,479 --> 01:19:09,519
Speaker 3: We hear this all the time.

1593
01:19:09,840 --> 01:19:13,519
Speaker 2: Everybody finds God and everybody is innocent. What if you're

1594
01:19:13,560 --> 01:19:18,000
Speaker 2: really innocent and I don't know how you recover with

1595
01:19:18,080 --> 01:19:19,080
Speaker 2: that level of grace.

1596
01:19:19,720 --> 01:19:20,599
Speaker 5: I would be so bitter.

1597
01:19:20,680 --> 01:19:22,439
Speaker 7: I know.

1598
01:19:22,479 --> 01:19:24,519
Speaker 6: I look at the people who come out and say

1599
01:19:24,600 --> 01:19:27,120
Speaker 6: they're changed and they're positive. I would be so angry.

1600
01:19:27,200 --> 01:19:29,720
Speaker 6: You took so much. I missed everything. I didn't even

1601
01:19:29,720 --> 01:19:30,960
Speaker 6: see Madonna's new videos.

1602
01:19:30,960 --> 01:19:34,160
Speaker 5: I was stuck in it, everything Madonna's new videos.

1603
01:19:34,400 --> 01:19:34,680
Speaker 7: That's what.

1604
01:19:35,720 --> 01:19:41,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, yes, exactly, I'm with you, no.

1605
01:19:46,680 --> 01:19:46,920
Speaker 3: Girl.

1606
01:19:47,040 --> 01:19:52,280
Speaker 4: But you know Michael Scott, he is relieved, but the

1607
01:19:52,320 --> 01:19:55,639
Speaker 4: emotional toll has taken. It's taken a really big toll

1608
01:19:55,680 --> 01:19:59,559
Speaker 4: on him and his family. Of course what he said, so, yeah,

1609
01:19:59,560 --> 01:20:02,320
Speaker 4: it's it's terrible, and we talked about this a lot.

1610
01:20:02,439 --> 01:20:04,559
Speaker 3: Yeah, go ahead. The families. The families are.

1611
01:20:04,680 --> 01:20:08,360
Speaker 5: Three other kids too, right, that were charged in four total.

1612
01:20:08,400 --> 01:20:12,479
Speaker 5: I wonder if the right coming from them.

1613
01:20:13,160 --> 01:20:16,559
Speaker 6: That's a good point. Interesting that got sucked into the

1614
01:20:16,640 --> 01:20:19,960
Speaker 6: documentary the whole Yogurt Shop, and what stood out to

1615
01:20:20,000 --> 01:20:21,960
Speaker 6: me at the beginning of it. I think it was

1616
01:20:22,000 --> 01:20:24,439
Speaker 6: one of the first officers that showed up there and

1617
01:20:24,439 --> 01:20:26,360
Speaker 6: it was in the nineties, and he said they were

1618
01:20:26,360 --> 01:20:28,680
Speaker 6: trying to move the bodies and do something. And he

1619
01:20:28,760 --> 01:20:31,559
Speaker 6: said something along the lines of they were just starting

1620
01:20:31,560 --> 01:20:33,400
Speaker 6: to look into forensics. Course, it was this sort of

1621
01:20:33,439 --> 01:20:37,120
Speaker 6: a new time period and people were about to ruin

1622
01:20:37,200 --> 01:20:40,680
Speaker 6: everything that forensically would have helped the case. So there

1623
01:20:40,680 --> 01:20:43,559
Speaker 6: was a hero in that situation that helped, wasn't there.

1624
01:20:43,520 --> 01:20:46,080
Speaker 5: Like something with the fire being put out that ruined

1625
01:20:46,120 --> 01:20:49,920
Speaker 5: a lot of the evidence, like the fire retardant some

1626
01:20:49,960 --> 01:20:53,360
Speaker 5: of the evidence that was on scene.

1627
01:20:53,360 --> 01:20:54,160
Speaker 3: I do remember that.

1628
01:20:54,640 --> 01:20:57,960
Speaker 5: Okay, I did not follow this one very closely, but well,

1629
01:20:57,960 --> 01:20:59,200
Speaker 5: it was also interesting.

1630
01:20:59,360 --> 01:21:01,280
Speaker 4: It was a while ago and at the time the

1631
01:21:01,320 --> 01:21:04,559
Speaker 4: Austin Police Department, they initially handled the case, they had

1632
01:21:04,600 --> 01:21:09,920
Speaker 4: a dedicated quote yogurt chop task force before ultimately it

1633
01:21:09,960 --> 01:21:12,680
Speaker 4: was then transferred to the Cold Case Homicide.

1634
01:21:13,360 --> 01:21:16,000
Speaker 6: I just find it fascinating how far forensics and DNA

1635
01:21:16,360 --> 01:21:17,240
Speaker 6: like that has come.

1636
01:21:17,520 --> 01:21:20,160
Speaker 3: Just in my well, it's not just.

1637
01:21:20,080 --> 01:21:22,240
Speaker 5: That, it's all the technology that we have to like

1638
01:21:22,439 --> 01:21:27,240
Speaker 5: cell phones and hand we're basically holding you know, a

1639
01:21:27,320 --> 01:21:30,120
Speaker 5: camera and a computer in our in our phone in

1640
01:21:30,160 --> 01:21:32,840
Speaker 5: our hand the whole time, tracking everything that we do right,

1641
01:21:33,360 --> 01:21:36,719
Speaker 5: and everything that we're thinking, like everything that I'm thinking,

1642
01:21:36,760 --> 01:21:40,840
Speaker 5: my phone knows about right. So I am never I

1643
01:21:40,880 --> 01:21:44,040
Speaker 5: am never going to be able to get it get

1644
01:21:44,080 --> 01:21:44,320
Speaker 5: rid of.

1645
01:21:44,920 --> 01:21:48,320
Speaker 4: By the way, to answer your earlier question, body, So

1646
01:21:48,760 --> 01:21:52,000
Speaker 4: to the four total, we know Michael Scott, we just

1647
01:21:52,040 --> 01:21:53,160
Speaker 4: talked all about him.

1648
01:21:53,640 --> 01:21:55,120
Speaker 3: So Robert Springsteen.

1649
01:21:55,520 --> 01:21:58,400
Speaker 4: He was convicted and sentenced to the death penalty in

1650
01:21:58,400 --> 01:22:02,599
Speaker 4: two thousand and one. Ultimately his conviction was overturned and

1651
01:22:02,640 --> 01:22:06,040
Speaker 4: the appeal was based on a constitutional error and advanced DNA.

1652
01:22:06,400 --> 01:22:08,120
Speaker 3: He was excluded as a suspect.

1653
01:22:08,760 --> 01:22:11,240
Speaker 4: All of his charges were dismissed back in two thousand

1654
01:22:11,240 --> 01:22:15,280
Speaker 4: and nine, he's released. Maurice Pierce charges against him were

1655
01:22:15,320 --> 01:22:18,480
Speaker 4: dropped in two thousand and three, also lack of evidence,

1656
01:22:19,040 --> 01:22:22,080
Speaker 4: and finally Forest Welburn, a grand jury chose not to

1657
01:22:22,120 --> 01:22:25,479
Speaker 4: indict him. Back in two thousand and charges were dropped

1658
01:22:26,280 --> 01:22:30,120
Speaker 4: and none of them did it because Robert Eugene Bashers did.

1659
01:22:30,800 --> 01:22:32,800
Speaker 6: And to say one of them was up for the

1660
01:22:32,840 --> 01:22:35,760
Speaker 6: death penalty like that, could you imagine like this is

1661
01:22:36,040 --> 01:22:36,639
Speaker 6: was your part?

1662
01:22:37,880 --> 01:22:40,040
Speaker 3: There's I am not a proponent of the decust.

1663
01:22:40,200 --> 01:22:41,799
Speaker 6: I know in a few.

1664
01:22:41,640 --> 01:22:45,000
Speaker 2: Cases that we've worked on that have been real eye opening.

1665
01:22:45,040 --> 01:22:49,160
Speaker 2: By the way, you guys will remember in New Orleans. Imagine,

1666
01:22:49,640 --> 01:22:53,799
Speaker 2: imagine you're in New Orleans and you're a young black

1667
01:22:54,120 --> 01:22:58,040
Speaker 2: American who is convicted for a crime you didn't commit.

1668
01:22:58,439 --> 01:23:01,240
Speaker 2: Like they're saying that maybe you spray painted a car.

1669
01:23:01,520 --> 01:23:04,559
Speaker 2: You know, you were doing something like shenanigans in the area,

1670
01:23:04,640 --> 01:23:07,600
Speaker 2: and the cop was like, no more of the shenanigans.

1671
01:23:07,600 --> 01:23:09,599
Speaker 2: So I'm going to toss you in this jail and

1672
01:23:09,880 --> 01:23:13,400
Speaker 2: you'll learn your lesson. So in this certain I think

1673
01:23:13,439 --> 01:23:15,960
Speaker 2: it's called the IPP Right of Court, I think it's

1674
01:23:16,000 --> 01:23:18,519
Speaker 2: called the IPP is this president's a privately owned prison.

1675
01:23:18,720 --> 01:23:22,759
Speaker 3: And imagine being tossed into this privately owned prison where

1676
01:23:22,920 --> 01:23:26,120
Speaker 3: you don't actually have to be charged to be kept.

1677
01:23:26,479 --> 01:23:28,639
Speaker 3: So it's a real thing. This is a real thing.

1678
01:23:28,720 --> 01:23:33,160
Speaker 2: Then, so you're being held for like being accused of, say,

1679
01:23:33,240 --> 01:23:37,240
Speaker 2: spray painting a car or you know, again not like anything.

1680
01:23:37,479 --> 01:23:39,759
Speaker 3: Super supermad but obviously not great.

1681
01:23:39,840 --> 01:23:42,640
Speaker 2: But so you're waiting to go to the judge and

1682
01:23:42,840 --> 01:23:46,240
Speaker 2: obviously there's cameras all over the world and you're essentially

1683
01:23:46,280 --> 01:23:48,920
Speaker 2: going to be proven innocent and go home. But it's

1684
01:23:48,960 --> 01:23:52,760
Speaker 2: like a formality that you're there for multiple days. Then

1685
01:23:53,160 --> 01:24:01,559
Speaker 2: Katrina hints in all of the files, all cameras, ninety

1686
01:24:01,880 --> 01:24:07,559
Speaker 2: plus percent of all of evidence is washed away. And

1687
01:24:07,600 --> 01:24:10,439
Speaker 2: your innocence, by the way, you're innocent of a petty crime.

1688
01:24:10,680 --> 01:24:11,280
Speaker 3: Let alone.

1689
01:24:11,439 --> 01:24:14,840
Speaker 2: You're standing trial for the death row, not the death row,

1690
01:24:14,840 --> 01:24:15,479
Speaker 2: but for death row.

1691
01:24:15,520 --> 01:24:16,080
Speaker 6: For death row.

1692
01:24:16,200 --> 01:24:18,639
Speaker 2: Right by the way, all the prisoners are put under

1693
01:24:18,640 --> 01:24:19,120
Speaker 2: a bridge.

1694
01:24:19,320 --> 01:24:22,280
Speaker 3: It's Katrina. They're all in shackles. What do you do?

1695
01:24:22,600 --> 01:24:26,160
Speaker 3: By the way, years, I think it was ten years

1696
01:24:26,360 --> 01:24:32,000
Speaker 3: before people that were just being held were released. Imagine

1697
01:24:32,439 --> 01:24:36,280
Speaker 3: you have no job, your families, you have kids. What

1698
01:24:36,320 --> 01:24:38,599
Speaker 3: if you have children and you can't go home to them?

1699
01:24:38,760 --> 01:24:40,200
Speaker 3: Now the whole town is destroyed.

1700
01:24:40,240 --> 01:24:43,680
Speaker 2: There is no evidence in courtney Bible, correct me if

1701
01:24:43,680 --> 01:24:46,479
Speaker 2: I'm wrong. The district attorney when we were looking into this,

1702
01:24:46,800 --> 01:24:49,760
Speaker 2: the district attorney this in modern times, maybe four years ago,

1703
01:24:49,800 --> 01:24:50,720
Speaker 2: pre COVID.

1704
01:24:50,439 --> 01:24:53,320
Speaker 4: Right, like it was about twenty seventeen, and I remember

1705
01:24:53,360 --> 01:24:54,120
Speaker 4: watching it.

1706
01:24:54,120 --> 01:24:57,599
Speaker 5: It was sixteen sixty minutes. Yes, yeah, we saw it.

1707
01:24:57,800 --> 01:25:02,519
Speaker 4: Yeah. The DA said, we handle any more cases, and

1708
01:25:02,600 --> 01:25:03,080
Speaker 4: we will not.

1709
01:25:03,320 --> 01:25:04,400
Speaker 3: It was a really big deal.

1710
01:25:04,960 --> 01:25:08,759
Speaker 2: So the district attorney of this area in New Orleans,

1711
01:25:08,840 --> 01:25:12,639
Speaker 2: who is bound to sort of fight for justice. It's

1712
01:25:12,880 --> 01:25:15,680
Speaker 2: such a hard job, right to get people released if

1713
01:25:15,720 --> 01:25:18,439
Speaker 2: they didn't commit a crime. They were so backed up

1714
01:25:18,880 --> 01:25:21,880
Speaker 2: because of Katrina that they couldn't even like get through

1715
01:25:21,920 --> 01:25:23,960
Speaker 2: a file and read it with a straight face. They

1716
01:25:23,960 --> 01:25:26,479
Speaker 2: were like, you would never put an unprepared pilot in

1717
01:25:26,520 --> 01:25:26,960
Speaker 2: the air.

1718
01:25:27,479 --> 01:25:32,840
Speaker 3: We refuse. Wow, a deep dive on this.

1719
01:25:32,880 --> 01:25:36,400
Speaker 4: We should still hold that we should because even New Orleans,

1720
01:25:36,479 --> 01:25:39,280
Speaker 4: I mean, good grief, if I saw my research, then I.

1721
01:25:39,240 --> 01:25:40,880
Speaker 3: Have about one hundred and fifty pages.

1722
01:25:41,439 --> 01:25:44,679
Speaker 4: In New Orleans, a person could be held for thirty

1723
01:25:44,760 --> 01:25:48,280
Speaker 4: days before they're even charged. So Stephanie mentioned, you know,

1724
01:25:48,320 --> 01:25:51,679
Speaker 4: a petty crime of spray painting, You do not even

1725
01:25:51,800 --> 01:25:52,639
Speaker 4: have to know.

1726
01:25:52,479 --> 01:25:54,760
Speaker 5: What you are charged with for thirty days.

1727
01:25:54,880 --> 01:25:57,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, thirty a month a month, you're there, Yeah

1728
01:25:58,120 --> 01:25:58,439
Speaker 3: kind of.

1729
01:26:00,160 --> 01:26:00,479
Speaker 5: Do you guys.

1730
01:26:00,479 --> 01:26:02,960
Speaker 2: Oh and it's so racially charged too, by the way,

1731
01:26:03,080 --> 01:26:06,040
Speaker 2: so like it was, do the math on like what

1732
01:26:06,720 --> 01:26:07,640
Speaker 2: the high bars.

1733
01:26:07,720 --> 01:26:10,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's really intense. So you guys should definitely.

1734
01:26:10,720 --> 01:26:13,360
Speaker 5: Check out the Khalif Brouder story on Netflix if you

1735
01:26:13,360 --> 01:26:15,559
Speaker 5: want to. It's very it's in the same vein. He

1736
01:26:15,640 --> 01:26:17,880
Speaker 5: was a young black man in New York. He was

1737
01:26:17,880 --> 01:26:19,680
Speaker 5: being held at Riker's Island for like a year and

1738
01:26:19,720 --> 01:26:22,599
Speaker 5: a half without being formally charged in front of a judge.

1739
01:26:22,640 --> 01:26:27,880
Speaker 3: And yeah, Sharon, Yeah, that's a great it's a great example. Heartbreaking,

1740
01:26:28,840 --> 01:26:29,960
Speaker 3: absolutely heartbreaking.

1741
01:26:30,000 --> 01:26:32,360
Speaker 5: It's actually in my list, my top of my top

1742
01:26:32,360 --> 01:26:34,599
Speaker 5: listed documentaries. Do you remember before we started the show,

1743
01:26:34,640 --> 01:26:37,240
Speaker 5: I sent you a list of like my top something.

1744
01:26:38,000 --> 01:26:40,679
Speaker 5: It's like up there, it's like number three or something.

1745
01:26:40,840 --> 01:26:42,760
Speaker 5: It's one of my favorite ones. It's just so eye

1746
01:26:42,840 --> 01:26:46,559
Speaker 5: opening and so horrifically sad about what happened to this

1747
01:26:46,600 --> 01:26:50,160
Speaker 5: young man and it's it kind of reminds me of

1748
01:26:50,160 --> 01:26:52,840
Speaker 5: the story you just told us, Stephanie, Like you know,

1749
01:26:52,920 --> 01:26:55,400
Speaker 5: he he never really got any justice and they just

1750
01:26:55,479 --> 01:26:56,439
Speaker 5: kind of said, Okay, here you.

1751
01:26:56,400 --> 01:26:56,880
Speaker 3: Go, and.

1752
01:26:58,360 --> 01:27:00,880
Speaker 5: It got to him over by ten years.

1753
01:27:01,479 --> 01:27:04,519
Speaker 2: And to that end, it's ten years later, people are

1754
01:27:04,520 --> 01:27:07,400
Speaker 2: finally getting released and imagine like the toll that has

1755
01:27:07,439 --> 01:27:10,200
Speaker 2: taken on families, et cetera as they try to rebuild

1756
01:27:10,520 --> 01:27:13,240
Speaker 2: and it's a privatized prison. We should also do a

1757
01:27:13,240 --> 01:27:16,160
Speaker 2: deep dive on this because it such big, so much

1758
01:27:16,200 --> 01:27:20,240
Speaker 2: to say people in prison so privately, privately.

1759
01:27:19,920 --> 01:27:22,160
Speaker 6: Especially, Yeah, that's a big one.

1760
01:27:22,320 --> 01:27:22,960
Speaker 5: It is a big one.

1761
01:27:23,000 --> 01:27:25,040
Speaker 3: That's something I'm kind of passionate about.

1762
01:27:25,080 --> 01:27:29,759
Speaker 5: Actually, I'm totally against the privatization of our prisons prison

1763
01:27:29,800 --> 01:27:30,320
Speaker 5: for profit.

1764
01:27:30,560 --> 01:27:32,559
Speaker 3: I'm totally against it. I didn't know that.

1765
01:27:32,720 --> 01:27:35,760
Speaker 2: I didn't know any of that until we started covering this,

1766
01:27:36,080 --> 01:27:37,600
Speaker 2: and maybe we that's something we can really do a

1767
01:27:37,640 --> 01:27:40,519
Speaker 2: deep dive on because the numbers were pretty staggering. I

1768
01:27:40,520 --> 01:27:43,400
Speaker 2: don't have them off hand because I'm I'm riffing right now,

1769
01:27:43,439 --> 01:27:47,080
Speaker 2: but as always right but truthfully, like that is, it

1770
01:27:47,160 --> 01:27:51,160
Speaker 2: was the numbers per night to keep somebody held behind

1771
01:27:51,280 --> 01:27:55,120
Speaker 2: bars without being formally charged with anything or without having

1772
01:27:55,200 --> 01:27:58,880
Speaker 2: a you know, private defender is staggering.

1773
01:27:58,920 --> 01:27:59,559
Speaker 3: The number was.

1774
01:27:59,560 --> 01:28:02,479
Speaker 4: Really okay, so we'll do this, Like I was on

1775
01:28:02,520 --> 01:28:04,080
Speaker 4: speed doll with the FBI.

1776
01:28:03,800 --> 01:28:07,720
Speaker 3: And yeah, and we're welcome. I mean, we were marrying. Yeah,

1777
01:28:07,760 --> 01:28:08,759
Speaker 3: it was a big project.

1778
01:28:08,880 --> 01:28:10,840
Speaker 5: I'd like to hear with that for sure, Yeah, I

1779
01:28:10,880 --> 01:28:13,519
Speaker 5: really would. I mean, it's very interesting and it's it's

1780
01:28:13,560 --> 01:28:16,679
Speaker 5: something that keeps me kind of interested in the justice system.

1781
01:28:16,760 --> 01:28:18,759
Speaker 5: So I definitely want to hear more about that, for sure,

1782
01:28:18,920 --> 01:28:20,639
Speaker 5: because it keeps me going, you know what I mean,

1783
01:28:20,880 --> 01:28:22,320
Speaker 5: it keeps me going same.

1784
01:28:22,920 --> 01:28:25,519
Speaker 2: Well, Listen, everybody tomorrow is a big day in the

1785
01:28:25,520 --> 01:28:28,320
Speaker 2: ditty case, so everybody watch the news, pay attention. We

1786
01:28:28,400 --> 01:28:33,120
Speaker 2: will be back on Sunday, Forensic Sunday as always, lots

1787
01:28:33,160 --> 01:28:36,000
Speaker 2: of science talk with Joseph Scott Morgan. Thank you for

1788
01:28:36,040 --> 01:28:38,120
Speaker 2: having an incredible week with us. We want to hear

1789
01:28:38,160 --> 01:28:40,640
Speaker 2: from you eight at eight three one Crime. Leave us

1790
01:28:40,640 --> 01:28:44,160
Speaker 2: a message and listen. Stay with us True Crime tonight.

1791
01:28:44,240 --> 01:29:02,519
Speaker 3: We love you. Be safe.