Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You missed in History Class, a production
Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio, Hello and Happy Friday. I'm Holly Fry and
Speaker 1: I'm Tracy V.
Speaker 2: Wilson.
Speaker 1: And we talked about Wanda Gog all week. Yeah. You
Speaker 1: know what we did not talk about Regarding Wanda gog
Speaker 1: A lot of her friends kind of talk trash about her.
Speaker 1: Oh really, They were like, she was really selfish and
Speaker 1: kind of hard to be around. And I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: that would explain why there aren't a lot of friends
Speaker 1: in her picture a lot of the time. Yeah, although
Speaker 1: her siblings remained very close to her. Her her youngest sibling, Flavia,
Speaker 1: spent a lot of time with Wanda throughout her life,
Speaker 1: often staying at her house, and her other siblings would
Speaker 1: often stay there as well. I have questions.
Speaker 2: Yes, So, based on her life story, it seems like
Speaker 2: from a really early age she was trying so hard
Speaker 2: to financially hold her family together.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: So the characterization of her is selfish. Like, I get it.
Speaker 2: I get how a person can be in a friend
Speaker 2: context coming off as selfish or maybe self centered, right,
Speaker 2: But it's and I it's in some ways seems at
Speaker 2: odds with this idea of like having really tried from
Speaker 2: her teens to try to keep the family afloat. But
Speaker 2: also part of me is like I feel like if
Speaker 2: I were in that situation, and I were from my
Speaker 2: teenage years meticulously tracking my money to try to keep
Speaker 2: my family fed, I might as an adult be a
Speaker 2: little selfish. Yeah, I would be self indulgent as hell.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think part of it probably is actually
Speaker 1: that she lived for no one else but Wanda Dog,
Speaker 1: do you know what I mean? Like her desires were
Speaker 1: her primary priority, which I think is fine and great.
Speaker 1: Like she didn't do a lot of like well, would
Speaker 1: so and so be unhappy if I do? It'd be like,
Speaker 1: this is what I want to do, this is what
Speaker 1: I'm going to do. And I think on top of that,
Speaker 1: the fact that she was pretty conceited about her artistic
Speaker 1: talent probably rubbed people the wrong way, but they just
Speaker 1: put it that way, so instead they said she was selfish,
Speaker 1: do you know what I mean? Because that would be
Speaker 1: like admitting that they didn't they weren't on even footing
Speaker 1: in terms of art career. There's a fun factoid that
Speaker 1: I saw on a video that is on the website
Speaker 1: for the Wandagogue house, and it is a weird numerology thing,
Speaker 1: but it's fascinating. It is the importance or the constant
Speaker 1: recurrence of the number seven in her father and mother's lives.
Speaker 1: The house was originally painted with seven different colors when
Speaker 1: he built it would when he only had the one child,
Speaker 1: not seven. It has seven different window shapes, it has
Speaker 1: seven rooms, and then they had seven children, and then
Speaker 1: both Anton and Lissie died when they were forty nine
Speaker 1: years old, which is seven squared. It's just weird. I
Speaker 1: don't think it means anything. I don't I'm just saying
Speaker 1: it's interesting. I love it. But speaking of her parents,
Speaker 1: there's a thing we mentioned that Wanda was perceived by
Speaker 1: her friends as being kind of Victorian in her social values.
Speaker 1: And one thing we didn't talk about in the show,
Speaker 1: and in part because I feel like it's a thing
Speaker 1: that's a little hard to pick apart, is that I
Speaker 1: think she had some early experiences with people drinking that
Speaker 1: she did not like. Okay, apparently after her father died.
Speaker 1: You know, we talk about how the kids are all
Speaker 1: doing all the work to support the family, and her
Speaker 1: mom really wasn't and she was physically ill, but it
Speaker 1: seems like also she may have had a problem with
Speaker 1: alcohol misuse at the end of her life, because she
Speaker 1: had been prescribed by a doctor at some point to
Speaker 1: drink beer to help calm her nerves, and it seems
Speaker 1: like that escalated. And so I feel like Wanda would
Speaker 1: never speak ill of her mother, but it seems like
Speaker 1: that impacted her perception of drinking and alcohol use and
Speaker 1: she didn't want any part of it. And one of
Speaker 1: the reasons that she and Earl, one of the reasons
Speaker 1: she wanted to move from a house they had been
Speaker 1: in in the country for several years, was that they
Speaker 1: had a neighbor that would come over and drink with Earl,
Speaker 1: and she didn't like him drinking either, and that was
Speaker 1: part of what precipitated her being like, we should move,
Speaker 1: which is just interesting. I don't think she ever I
Speaker 1: read her younger year diaries, and I read a lot
Speaker 1: of her other writing, but I never saw, and it
Speaker 1: could be in there somewhere anything that specifically said like, hey,
Speaker 1: I saw people drinking and that was horrible and I
Speaker 1: didn't like it. So I didn't want any part of it.
Speaker 1: But she never was a drinker at all, Like I
Speaker 1: think she just associated it with not good things and painfulness,
Speaker 1: which is kind of interesting. She also there are a
Speaker 1: couple of things about her personal health that I did
Speaker 1: not include. She did, at least one time in her
Speaker 1: life terminate a pregnancy, which is pretty open about in
Speaker 1: her diary. She also had a lot of issues with
Speaker 1: her period throughout her life, which was another thing that
Speaker 1: she would try to describe to doctors and they would
Speaker 1: be like, you need rest. But they were bad enough
Speaker 1: that when she would get her period, it would be
Speaker 1: extremely painful for several days, and it was bad enough
Speaker 1: that she had to structure her life around like I
Speaker 1: need to have those days off because I can't do
Speaker 1: anything right. Like she was basically bedridden because it was
Speaker 1: so painful it was hard to move. But I will
Speaker 1: say that she called her period by a funny name,
Speaker 1: much like vacation is a funny name for open relationship. Okay,
Speaker 1: she called her period hallelujah. Okay, I don't know if
Speaker 1: that's something she started calling it. Yeah, because she was
Speaker 1: having some sexual alliances. Okay. I can't imagine another reason
Speaker 1: you would know it that, especially if but pain right, Yeah.
Speaker 2: We have made some progress as a society in terms
Speaker 2: of women's health. Yeah, but like, as an example sample,
Speaker 2: my mom has a progressive neurological disorder that she spent
Speaker 2: so many years going to doctors and specialists and having
Speaker 2: them tell her it was just stress.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's not.
Speaker 2: Her neurons are being actively damaged in her body.
Speaker 1: Right. Yeah, that happens a lot. I mean, I am
Speaker 1: not to be too overshary about personal stuff, but right,
Speaker 1: you remember, at the beginning of last year, I was
Speaker 1: having don't anybody be scared, I'm fine. I was having
Speaker 1: chest pain, which my doctor kept telling me was because
Speaker 1: I was eating spicy food, even though I was like
Speaker 1: I don't know how to eat spicy food. I could.
Speaker 1: I will eat all the butter, but I can't really
Speaker 1: do spices. I can never tolerate them. I don't know
Speaker 1: what's going on. And it turned out that I had
Speaker 1: like a big old gallstone launched in the duct between
Speaker 1: my gallbladder and my stomach, and like for it was like,
Speaker 1: you know, you're just I think it's spicy food and
Speaker 1: stress and you're not drinking too much coffee and not
Speaker 1: taking care of yourself. And like there was a week
Speaker 1: where I wasn't allowed to eat because we were trying
Speaker 1: to like get all of the stuff out of my system,
Speaker 1: and it was like it didn't get any better. Yeah,
Speaker 1: until I was in the er and they were like,
Speaker 1: oh girl, that's not what's up right, right.
Speaker 2: I remember the extended misery of like trying to avoid
Speaker 2: coffee during all of that, and then you had your
Speaker 2: gallbladder out and it was like everything result, everything was
Speaker 2: fine instantly, fine felt great after that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was. It's kind of funny. We're not there yet,
Speaker 1: and I'm sure some of it is just right, like some.
Speaker 2: Of it's the system and it applies to everyone, but
Speaker 2: there are disproportionate things that affect everyone who's not a man.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean I feel like too a lot of
Speaker 1: the times, because menopause has not been studied all that much,
Speaker 1: right compared to other things. It's not to say that
Speaker 1: there haven't been any, but when you say something sometimes
Speaker 1: they'll just be like, oh, that's probably menopause, or I
Speaker 1: don't know, maybe is this menopause. I don't know, maybe,
Speaker 1: and so it can get really frustrating. So it doesn't
Speaker 1: surprise me that she was going to doctors and going
Speaker 1: I think I'm starting menopause. I think it's giving me problems,
Speaker 1: and they were like, probably not something in my chest hurt.
Speaker 1: Since she was like, they were like, you need to
Speaker 1: lie down. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I've had multiple conversations with people in my friend group
Speaker 2: about perimenopause specifically and how everything we know about it
Speaker 2: we have learned from each other and not from doctors. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and you'll go to the doctor and have like the
Speaker 2: similar situation of like, I'm having these things happen and
Speaker 2: they're like, yeah, maybe maybe maybe you know, I feel
Speaker 2: like I have a doctor that does listen to me
Speaker 2: and does like and we'll order tests to try, but
Speaker 2: it still is like we don't really for sure know
Speaker 2: why this is happening. All of the tests are normal,
Speaker 2: maybe perimenopause maybe.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I will say this is like my moment
Speaker 1: to do a little PSA. I know that healthcare is
Speaker 1: not available to everyone, but if you can, and if
Speaker 1: you have access, and if you are able to, please
Speaker 1: get all of your baseline screenings done as often as
Speaker 1: you possibly can on your yearly or whatever schedule, because
Speaker 1: it's when you have that in place it's easier to
Speaker 1: see the variations that indicate something else is wrong. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I know it sucks, but please do it and take
Speaker 1: care of yourself because you're the only one we have.
Speaker 2: And I will also add to this that, like, I know,
Speaker 2: it can be really hard for a number of reasons
Speaker 2: to stay on top of the things that your doctor
Speaker 2: has asked you to do. But for example, I would
Speaker 2: not know that I needed an increase in my blood
Speaker 2: pressure medicine had I not been trying to take my
Speaker 2: blood pressure at home three times times a week, like
Speaker 2: my doctor asked.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean that stuff is really important, especially as
Speaker 1: you kind of hit our age, you know, as the
Speaker 1: world becomes progressively more chaotic, and possibly the increased stress
Speaker 1: in your life is making your blood pressure significantly higher. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1: We mentioned in the course of the episode, when Earle
Speaker 1: and her brother decided not to tell her she had
Speaker 1: advanced stage cancer, that it was not entirely unheard of
Speaker 1: for that to be the case, even though she and
Speaker 1: her diary is like they're giving me X ray therapy.
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure this is cancer not uncommon. Hard to
Speaker 1: hear that, you know, in our age where we are
Speaker 1: a little more aware of conscious of often discussing the
Speaker 1: ideas of bodily autonomy, and it's easy to want to
Speaker 1: condemn that choice, But I don't think that didn't feel
Speaker 1: especially out of hand given time and place, right, right,
Speaker 1: and because Earle was obviously really devoted to her at
Speaker 1: the end of her life, you know, he did basically
Speaker 1: put aside everything he had going on to take care
Speaker 1: of her. Yeah. Yeah, so, but it's also weird.
Speaker 2: Yeah, by the time these episodes come out, we will
Speaker 2: have had a Saturday Classic about George Wallace, who we
Speaker 2: have a similar story in that episode regarding his wife
Speaker 2: and a cancer diagnosis that she wasn't informed of. It
Speaker 2: is by coincidence that that is how this is lining up. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean, I feel like I also was thinking of
Speaker 2: in the recent Vonnegut episode, we mentioned that when his
Speaker 2: sister was very ill in the hospital with cancer, they
Speaker 2: didn't want to tell her that her husband had died, right,
Speaker 2: which you know, she found out by accident and it
Speaker 2: was horrible.
Speaker 1: And I don't, I don't know. That's a hard choice
Speaker 1: to make, and I don't I don't want to dog
Speaker 1: anybody as stealing someone's autonomy when I know in these
Speaker 1: cases it's not like they're hiding something from someone to
Speaker 1: try to do something devious. They're trying not to hurt
Speaker 1: them worse. But I don't I'm not equipped to make
Speaker 1: those decisions for other people, So I don't know. But
Speaker 1: I did think it would be a little more joyous
Speaker 1: to end this one by talking about what Wanda Gog
Speaker 1: throughout her life listed as her three passions, and they were, obviously,
Speaker 1: unsurprisingly to anyone. Art yep, sex yep, and growing things. Okay,
Speaker 1: she loved gardens.
Speaker 2: I love that.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I find it funny that she thought the books
Speaker 1: that made her most famous were kind of like, I'm
Speaker 1: just doing this, I have money to make art. That
Speaker 1: kind of tickles me a little bit. I love it.
Speaker 1: I kind of love her. She's she's wild. I can't
Speaker 1: imagine being as confident as her now. She just had
Speaker 1: no hesitation about how great she thought she was, which
Speaker 1: is wonderful but not something I can identify with. So, oh, Wanda,
Speaker 1: please give us strength and these times going forward. If
Speaker 1: this is your weekend coming up, I hope that you
Speaker 1: can invoke a little bit about of that Wanda Gog
Speaker 1: spirit and advocate for yourself and be confident in yourself
Speaker 1: and know that you are very good at some stuff
Speaker 1: in your life, and that you know you should. You
Speaker 1: should be able to make your own decisions and follow
Speaker 1: follow your your own conscience as to what is best.
Speaker 1: I also hope everything goes smoothly for you and that
Speaker 1: people are nice to you, and that you are nice
Speaker 1: to people in return. We got to take care of
Speaker 1: our and each other. If you have medical things and
Speaker 1: you can get them screened, please get them screened. Do
Speaker 1: it for me, Tell your doctor, Holly said. So we
Speaker 1: will be right back here tomorrow with a classic episode
Speaker 1: and then on Monday with something brand new. Stuff you
Speaker 1: missed in.
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