WEBVTT - S4: EP 2 — Cat and Mouse 0:00:00.400 --> 0:00:03.400 Hey guys. Before we dive into the episode, we have 0:00:03.520 --> 0:00:07.200 exciting news. Betrayal is coming to substack, which is an 0:00:07.280 --> 0:00:12.160 online community. We're calling our substack Beyond Betrayal, a place 0:00:12.200 --> 0:00:14.920 where we dive deeper into the stories you hear on 0:00:14.960 --> 0:00:19.160 this show. Please consider joining our community to gain access 0:00:19.400 --> 0:00:23.320 to exclusive content, engage with me and subjects, as well 0:00:23.360 --> 0:00:27.240 as connect with others who have experienced betrayal. Just head 0:00:27.280 --> 0:00:31.920 to Betrayal dot substack that's sub s T A c K. 0:00:32.560 --> 0:00:36.720 Or just go to substack dot com, search beyond Betrayal 0:00:36.880 --> 0:00:38.040 and hit subscribe. 0:00:42.320 --> 0:00:46.600 I'm embarrassed, I'm familiated, I'm ashamed. I know what I did. 0:00:46.640 --> 0:00:49.680 I was wrong. I'm very sorry for it. 0:00:50.640 --> 0:00:53.720 Again, I take four responsibility for my actions and os 0:00:53.800 --> 0:01:04.440 for mercy. 0:01:07.600 --> 0:01:11.520 I'm Andrea Gunning and this is Betrayal, Season four, Episode two, 0:01:12.920 --> 0:01:18.680 Cat and Mouse. In the last episode, we met Caroline 0:01:18.680 --> 0:01:22.240 Brega and learned about her husband, former Colorado Springs Police 0:01:22.240 --> 0:01:26.320 Lieutenant Joel Kern. On the outside, they were the perfect 0:01:26.400 --> 0:01:31.720 American family. Then on April eleventh, twenty twenty two, Joel 0:01:31.800 --> 0:01:35.199 detonated a bomb on his life, a bomb that would 0:01:35.240 --> 0:01:39.679 destroy his family. It started with the text he sent 0:01:39.760 --> 0:01:41.280 to his wife that read. 0:01:41.760 --> 0:01:46.080 I was caught receiving oral sex from two women in 0:01:46.080 --> 0:01:49.240 my cop car I lied about it during an internal 0:01:49.280 --> 0:01:53.280 affairs investigation. I am now pending termination. 0:01:54.680 --> 0:01:57.720 April eleventh is now called D Day by Caroline and 0:01:57.760 --> 0:02:01.800 her kids. Here's Caroline and Joel's daughter Nicole. 0:02:02.480 --> 0:02:06.440 That evening, I had a lacrosse game, and so I 0:02:06.520 --> 0:02:09.080 started kind of getting ready for my lacrosse game. 0:02:09.720 --> 0:02:13.080 It started as a normal day, but it soon would 0:02:13.120 --> 0:02:14.760 become an inflection point. 0:02:15.040 --> 0:02:20.600 My mom called me to follow her into the bathroom 0:02:21.200 --> 0:02:24.239 and I don't even remember what she was doing, maybe 0:02:24.480 --> 0:02:28.840 taking down her hair from her updal. She just was 0:02:28.880 --> 0:02:34.200 acting off, and so I said what's wrong? And she 0:02:34.320 --> 0:02:35.520 didn't respond. 0:02:36.639 --> 0:02:42.680 She was scared something was wrong. Did something happen? 0:02:43.560 --> 0:02:47.560 And then I said, is daddy okay? 0:02:47.720 --> 0:02:51.120 Caroline was at a loss for words. They all lived 0:02:51.120 --> 0:02:53.799 with the fear that one day Joel wouldn't come home 0:02:53.840 --> 0:02:57.480 from work. But Joel wasn't injured or killed in the 0:02:57.520 --> 0:03:03.680 line of duty. Still nothing was okay. Caroline and Joel's 0:03:03.680 --> 0:03:06.880 son was a freshman in college far from home. 0:03:08.440 --> 0:03:10.800 I get a call from my sister and so I 0:03:10.840 --> 0:03:14.320 send it to voicemail. I get another call, and then 0:03:14.400 --> 0:03:16.760 I had the text to reply, and I say, I'm 0:03:16.800 --> 0:03:19.400 about to walk into a chemistry medterm. Can I call 0:03:19.480 --> 0:03:24.279 you after? And she texted back no, it's an emergency. 0:03:24.960 --> 0:03:26.760 So I pick up the phone and I call her, 0:03:27.600 --> 0:03:34.000 and I remember my mom and my sister shaken up 0:03:34.280 --> 0:03:34.880 in tears. 0:03:36.800 --> 0:03:40.040 The family met in the living room. Nicole and Caroline 0:03:40.040 --> 0:03:43.320 sat on the couch. Caroline and Joel's son was on 0:03:43.400 --> 0:03:46.880 speaker phone, and Joel stood in front of the fireplace. 0:03:47.800 --> 0:03:51.320 It was the most bizarre family meeting you could imagine. 0:03:52.080 --> 0:03:55.600 It felt like someone else's life, but no, it was 0:03:55.640 --> 0:03:56.800 happening in their home. 0:03:57.160 --> 0:03:59.640 Our daughter's sitting right next to me, our son's on 0:03:59.680 --> 0:04:02.720 the phone, and the three of us are just in hysterics. 0:04:02.920 --> 0:04:07.760 You can hear our son hysterically crying, our daughter's hysterically crying. 0:04:08.960 --> 0:04:11.320 And I said, you need to tell the kids what's 0:04:11.360 --> 0:04:11.800 going on. 0:04:13.680 --> 0:04:17.800 What was going on? Well, to understand the events of 0:04:17.839 --> 0:04:21.120 April eleven, twenty twenty two, we need to go back 0:04:21.160 --> 0:04:28.520 a few months prior to February fifth. That day, a 0:04:28.560 --> 0:04:33.880 stranger showed up on Caroline and Joel's doorstep. Joel was 0:04:33.960 --> 0:04:37.359 home and answered the door. The whole interaction happened to 0:04:37.400 --> 0:04:40.240 be recorded. The sound isn't great, but you'll get the 0:04:40.279 --> 0:04:43.240 gist of it. And we've distorted the stranger's voice to 0:04:43.279 --> 0:04:44.320 protect his privacy. 0:04:45.839 --> 0:04:51.800 He ane dogs, man O, chance was it? 0:04:52.160 --> 0:04:52.760 You know who I am? 0:04:53.839 --> 0:04:55.800 Here's my wife out the one that you're thought in 0:04:55.839 --> 0:04:56.520 your cruiser? 0:04:57.000 --> 0:04:57.960 What are you talking about? 0:04:59.080 --> 0:04:59.680 I'm not here to. 0:04:59.640 --> 0:05:03.279 Arrest, but I'm saying, Joel, yeah, I'm talking about you 0:05:03.720 --> 0:05:04.520 say my wife. 0:05:06.000 --> 0:05:09.480 Okay, my wife is there, Dave. I wouldn't want to 0:05:09.520 --> 0:05:11.400 know if you know her. I have no idea what 0:05:11.400 --> 0:05:12.119 you're talking about. 0:05:12.680 --> 0:05:14.640 And if that's the case, then I owe you an apology. 0:05:14.640 --> 0:05:15.800 I'm not, like I said, I'm not here. If I 0:05:15.880 --> 0:05:16.839 was wrong, want me leave. 0:05:16.920 --> 0:05:17.640 The Why are you here? 0:05:18.240 --> 0:05:21.320 So if you don't know my pro property, like I said, 0:05:21.360 --> 0:05:22.640 I'm not hearing her, ask you, I will. 0:05:23.160 --> 0:05:24.880 That's not what I'm trying to do. I just wanted 0:05:24.880 --> 0:05:26.559 to know you know my wife. 0:05:26.839 --> 0:05:27.479 No, I don't. 0:05:28.240 --> 0:05:29.920 I know you're a pop and all that stuff. Man, 0:05:29.960 --> 0:05:33.920 I know that, but that's not cool. That that's not cool. 0:05:33.960 --> 0:05:35.200 I just want you to stay away from my wife. 0:05:35.240 --> 0:05:37.040 You can't even look me in the face and tell 0:05:37.080 --> 0:05:38.719 me you made a mistake. 0:05:38.560 --> 0:05:38.600 Me. 0:05:39.600 --> 0:05:41.640 I don't even know who. 0:05:41.600 --> 0:05:42.520 She is, so leave. 0:05:43.200 --> 0:05:44.440 I thought you hadn't be able to look at me, 0:05:44.480 --> 0:05:46.200 Manda Man and say, yeah, I did fuck your wife. 0:05:46.200 --> 0:05:47.679 I'm sorry for ruining your marriage. 0:05:47.760 --> 0:05:48.320 No, I'm not. 0:05:49.279 --> 0:05:50.960 You need to check your wife up because I'm not 0:05:51.000 --> 0:05:51.599 doing anything. 0:05:54.080 --> 0:05:56.760 And with that, the couple took off and Joel was 0:05:56.839 --> 0:06:01.120 left alone to contemplate what just happened. This man managed 0:06:01.160 --> 0:06:04.120 to find his house and came right to his front door. 0:06:04.880 --> 0:06:06.760 Caroline had been out on a run and missed the 0:06:06.800 --> 0:06:11.600 whole confrontation by minutes, but Joel wasn't home alone. Nicole 0:06:11.720 --> 0:06:14.080 was in the basement just doing her homework. 0:06:14.839 --> 0:06:19.200 Usually I would have went up and just saw who 0:06:19.440 --> 0:06:23.320 was at the door with him, but for whatever reason, 0:06:23.760 --> 0:06:29.359 I just continued to do my homework, and so later 0:06:29.440 --> 0:06:32.920 on I asked him, you know who was at the door, 0:06:33.640 --> 0:06:37.360 and then he just said like some solicitor. 0:06:40.120 --> 0:06:43.480 Joel carried on as if nothing happened. In fact, later 0:06:43.560 --> 0:06:46.599 that night, Joel and Caroline went to a party. He 0:06:46.680 --> 0:06:49.720 also never mentioned the confrontation to his family. 0:06:51.400 --> 0:06:54.320 It was a Yellowstone theme party and I'm throwing on 0:06:54.400 --> 0:06:57.480 a blond wig pretending to be Beth and got him 0:06:57.520 --> 0:07:01.760 a beard to be ripped. We left and we were 0:07:01.760 --> 0:07:03.680 going to a friend's house who we had been to 0:07:03.720 --> 0:07:07.719 their home hundreds of times. And he pulled up to 0:07:07.720 --> 0:07:10.640 the wrong house and I said, what are you doing? 0:07:11.080 --> 0:07:12.560 And so he was like, what do you mean? And 0:07:12.600 --> 0:07:17.360 I said, you pulled up to the wrong house. He said, oh, 0:07:16.800 --> 0:07:20.280 I didn't know that, And so, you know, we back out, 0:07:20.360 --> 0:07:21.880 go to the right house. Okay. 0:07:23.040 --> 0:07:26.800 Caroline laughed it off in the moment. Looking back now, 0:07:27.040 --> 0:07:30.040 she sees that Joel's mind was somewhere else that night. 0:07:32.720 --> 0:07:35.640 But there was bad news for Joel. The stranger who 0:07:35.720 --> 0:07:40.160 came to his door made another stop that day. After 0:07:40.200 --> 0:07:42.720 he pulled out of Joel's driveway, he and his wife 0:07:42.920 --> 0:07:46.880 drove straight to the Colorado Springs Police Department or CSPD, 0:07:47.200 --> 0:07:51.760 and filed an official complaint against Joel. After all, an 0:07:51.800 --> 0:07:55.000 officer having sex in his police car while on duty 0:07:55.480 --> 0:08:00.640 would be a major professional violation. We filed an records 0:08:00.680 --> 0:08:04.120 request so we could get those investigation records. Over the 0:08:04.160 --> 0:08:08.640 past year, we received hundreds of pages from CSPD, all 0:08:08.680 --> 0:08:12.720 relating to Joel Kern. We were also given actual audio 0:08:12.760 --> 0:08:17.160 recordings from the investigation. What you're about to hear is 0:08:17.240 --> 0:08:21.960 from one of those recordings. It's Joel's boss, Commander Strassner, 0:08:22.280 --> 0:08:26.120 being interviewed by Internal Affairs about Joel's alleged misconduct. 0:08:28.160 --> 0:08:28.640 How did you. 0:08:28.680 --> 0:08:31.240 Become aware of this investigation? Can you kind of walk 0:08:31.280 --> 0:08:31.600 me through? 0:08:31.600 --> 0:08:35.599 That's about February seventh. I got a call just advising 0:08:35.640 --> 0:08:39.560 me that there was an internal a complaint that was 0:08:39.600 --> 0:08:45.000 filed over the weekend regarding Lieutenant Kern possibly having sex 0:08:45.080 --> 0:08:46.280 in the back of his vehicle. 0:08:48.160 --> 0:08:50.560 Strassner was one of the first people Joel went to. 0:08:50.640 --> 0:08:52.680 When you heard about the complaint. 0:08:52.800 --> 0:08:55.760 He adamantly denies anything happened. He goes, I don't even 0:08:55.840 --> 0:08:58.360 know these people. I don't know what they're talking about. 0:08:58.679 --> 0:09:01.440 I haven't seen him before. There's no way I would 0:09:01.480 --> 0:09:05.160 do that in a police car. He goes, made the 0:09:05.240 --> 0:09:07.920 statement of I didn't have sex in the back of 0:09:07.920 --> 0:09:09.760 my car when I was in high school or college. 0:09:09.800 --> 0:09:11.480 I'm sure's the heck not going to do that now 0:09:11.600 --> 0:09:16.160 kind of thing. Very visibly upset, almost in tears, and 0:09:16.320 --> 0:09:20.280 just really angry about how somebody could file a false 0:09:20.360 --> 0:09:23.520 complaint and turn his entire world upside down. In his 0:09:23.600 --> 0:09:25.960 family upside down. So he was really upset and really 0:09:25.960 --> 0:09:26.520 pissed off. 0:09:27.360 --> 0:09:30.439 But was his rage really directed at the couple from 0:09:30.440 --> 0:09:33.920 making the complaint or was it directed at the Internal 0:09:33.960 --> 0:09:39.320 affairs department for taking the complaint Seriously? Joel was an experienced, 0:09:39.400 --> 0:09:44.400 respected police lieutenant. This investigation threatened to take all that away. 0:09:46.320 --> 0:09:49.520 He goes, I just don't understand why this couldn't have 0:09:49.559 --> 0:09:52.280 been a preliminary inquiry. I tell you no, and this 0:09:52.280 --> 0:09:53.079 thing be closed. 0:09:53.480 --> 0:09:56.480 A preliminary inquiry is like an initial check to see 0:09:56.520 --> 0:09:59.480 if there's any valid reason to suspect that the officer 0:10:00.000 --> 0:10:03.320 he has done something wrong. Internal affairs can then decide 0:10:03.360 --> 0:10:06.360 to move forward with the investigation or close the matter. 0:10:06.679 --> 0:10:08.960 I said, look, Joel, you know why it couldn't have 0:10:09.000 --> 0:10:11.800 been a preliminary inquiry. They got to go through the process. 0:10:13.440 --> 0:10:16.280 Let's be clear. What the complaint was alleging was no 0:10:16.559 --> 0:10:21.559 ordinary affair. They were claiming police misconduct, an officer abusing 0:10:21.600 --> 0:10:25.440 his badge, having sex in a taxpayer funded vehicle on 0:10:25.640 --> 0:10:32.280 the public's time and in public. Remember, Joel had worked 0:10:32.320 --> 0:10:38.360 in internal affairs years earlier. He understood how it operated. Ironically, 0:10:38.960 --> 0:10:42.640 he had worked in the department with Commander Strassner. 0:10:42.520 --> 0:10:44.920 Sudden they have to do a thorough job, and he's like, yeah, 0:10:44.960 --> 0:10:48.640 I get it, but he was very angry. 0:10:48.679 --> 0:10:51.640 But Strassner also gave Joel some reassurance. 0:10:53.160 --> 0:10:56.559 I said, look, I have no reason not to believe 0:10:56.600 --> 0:11:00.000 anything that you're telling because if you didn't do that, 0:11:00.200 --> 0:11:03.360 as you're saying either one or two things, they're completely 0:11:03.480 --> 0:11:06.240 lining and they need to be charged with false reporting 0:11:06.760 --> 0:11:09.199 or somebody's impersonating you. We need to get to the 0:11:09.280 --> 0:11:11.520 end of that. And so we got to do this thoroughly, 0:11:11.880 --> 0:11:13.560 and I'm going to make sure I stay in contact 0:11:13.559 --> 0:11:15.440 with internal affairs to make sure it's a complete and 0:11:15.440 --> 0:11:16.320 thorough investigation. 0:11:18.400 --> 0:11:21.880 Strassner could tell that Joel was distraught. This was a 0:11:21.920 --> 0:11:25.840 serious matter. Someone could be filing a false report or 0:11:25.880 --> 0:11:31.120 impersonating him. Strawsner assured Joel that if someone was victimizing him, 0:11:31.640 --> 0:11:35.960 they would be held accountable. To complete the investigation, the 0:11:36.040 --> 0:11:40.280 CSPD took Joel's police vehicle and his department issued phone. 0:11:42.360 --> 0:11:45.400 If it was me and his shoes and as he's saying, 0:11:45.440 --> 0:11:50.320 all of it is fabricated, I would be incredibly upset 0:11:51.280 --> 0:11:56.760 and angry. And to me it seemed very genuine and authentic. 0:11:58.520 --> 0:12:01.360 I got no reason to doubt what he scene. 0:12:02.240 --> 0:12:06.360 This was recorded in February twenty twenty two. The investigation 0:12:06.440 --> 0:12:09.839 into Joel had been going on for two months, two 0:12:09.880 --> 0:12:12.559 months where he knew his life was on the brink 0:12:12.600 --> 0:12:18.360 of collapse. Meanwhile, Caroline was completely in the dark. Joel 0:12:18.360 --> 0:12:21.000 didn't tell her about the man on their doorstep or 0:12:21.040 --> 0:12:25.400 the misconduct investigation. It seemed like Joel thought that with 0:12:25.480 --> 0:12:28.280 his rank in years of service, he would be able 0:12:28.320 --> 0:12:31.319 to talk his way out of this, but the CESPD 0:12:31.720 --> 0:12:35.120 was taking it seriously. They went ahead and looked for 0:12:35.200 --> 0:12:39.200 any evidence that would support the couple's claim, and that 0:12:39.320 --> 0:12:43.800 included interviewing the man and his wife. Yes, the couple 0:12:43.840 --> 0:12:47.760 who showed up at Joel's door agreed to cooperate, so 0:12:47.880 --> 0:12:51.960 Internal Affairs sat with the woman Joel adamantly denied ever 0:12:52.080 --> 0:12:54.960 seeing before. Here are some of that interview. 0:12:56.480 --> 0:12:58.600 Okay, this is a center field chance I with the 0:12:58.640 --> 0:13:03.000 Colorado Springs Police Department Ternal Affairs Section Today's February seventeen, 0:13:03.120 --> 0:13:06.640 twenty twenty two, also president as a general Affairs, Sergeant 0:13:06.720 --> 0:13:07.440 Drew Jealous. 0:13:08.679 --> 0:13:11.800 Lieutenant Chanza asked the woman about how she met Joel. 0:13:12.600 --> 0:13:14.960 She explained it was on a fetish and king social 0:13:15.040 --> 0:13:19.000 network called betlife dot com. And as a note, we've 0:13:19.040 --> 0:13:22.439 altered the voices of all the civilians interviewed by CSPD 0:13:22.880 --> 0:13:24.079 to protect their privacy. 0:13:24.800 --> 0:13:26.840 What was it that initially drew your attention to the 0:13:26.880 --> 0:13:28.480 person we're talking about today? 0:13:28.800 --> 0:13:33.400 He contacted me, just like Facebook has messenger, that there's 0:13:34.040 --> 0:13:36.280 a messenger within it. 0:13:37.120 --> 0:13:40.200 Joel had suggested that they meet at a public park. 0:13:41.160 --> 0:13:44.400 I drove in my vehicle to go meet him. When 0:13:44.440 --> 0:13:49.400 I got to the location, which was Memorial Park, he 0:13:50.160 --> 0:13:54.360 was in what looked like an unmarked police car. I 0:13:54.360 --> 0:13:57.079 imagine the first question would be, how would I know that. 0:13:57.559 --> 0:14:02.480 I've got a number of officers in my family who 0:14:03.000 --> 0:14:05.760 I've seen their unmarked vehicles. I do know what they 0:14:05.800 --> 0:14:08.520 look like. He could see. 0:14:08.520 --> 0:14:09.280 I was nervous. 0:14:09.320 --> 0:14:14.160 I was shaken, and at that point it probably should 0:14:14.160 --> 0:14:14.760 have stopped. 0:14:16.160 --> 0:14:18.000 Did the two if you have anything in common, any 0:14:18.080 --> 0:14:23.120 fetishes as you describe them, that that kind of made 0:14:23.160 --> 0:14:25.359 you kind of continue the conversation. 0:14:26.000 --> 0:14:29.720 Yes, he was into domination and I was into submission. 0:14:30.640 --> 0:14:35.760 He told me that he would enjoy spanking me and 0:14:36.800 --> 0:14:42.280 fisting me and choking me and pulling my hair? 0:14:46.360 --> 0:14:48.160 So what leads you to believe that this person was 0:14:48.160 --> 0:14:48.840 a police officer? 0:14:48.880 --> 0:14:50.240 Meeting stated he was? 0:14:51.440 --> 0:14:52.840 Can you tell us a little more about that. 0:14:53.760 --> 0:14:59.760 He eventually told me his name, and you know, eventually 0:14:59.800 --> 0:15:02.840 told me that he was a police officer with Springs 0:15:02.880 --> 0:15:05.640 Police told me he did traffic investigations. 0:15:07.520 --> 0:15:11.160 So when he told you his name, what name did. 0:15:11.000 --> 0:15:11.400 He give you? 0:15:12.760 --> 0:15:13.320 Joel Kerr? 0:15:17.680 --> 0:15:20.240 Were you physically harmed in anyway? I know you said 0:15:20.240 --> 0:15:24.840 it bruised. Were you harmed in any way during this encounter? 0:15:25.160 --> 0:15:28.120 I mean I was bruised, and that's about the extent 0:15:28.200 --> 0:15:31.440 of it. The dammage I'll suffer is on me. 0:15:32.920 --> 0:15:36.560 Was there any aspect of this meeting that was non 0:15:36.640 --> 0:15:38.400 consensual from your perspective? 0:15:39.440 --> 0:15:47.920 No, this isn't about digging into his life and trying 0:15:48.000 --> 0:15:53.080 to harm him. It is simply about as an officer, 0:15:54.080 --> 0:15:58.720 he should not be using his vehicle to have what 0:15:58.880 --> 0:16:03.880 I imagine this problem not the first rendezvous. What makes 0:16:03.920 --> 0:16:06.520 you say that that that you believe this wasn't. 0:16:06.280 --> 0:16:07.160 His first. 0:16:08.360 --> 0:16:15.680 Because he discussed enjoying having mate ups such as this. 0:16:15.680 --> 0:16:19.640 This woman had come to regret her actions and confessed 0:16:19.720 --> 0:16:22.760 to her husband. She gave her husband access to her 0:16:22.760 --> 0:16:27.240 computer and all her passwords. She was remorseful about the 0:16:27.320 --> 0:16:31.960 encounter and took responsibility for her part in it. The 0:16:32.040 --> 0:16:35.320 woman fully disclosed her actions to her husband and agreed 0:16:35.360 --> 0:16:38.720 to accompany him to Joel's house. However, as you heard, 0:16:38.840 --> 0:16:43.080 things didn't go as planned. They of course reported him. 0:16:43.680 --> 0:16:46.840 The woman's story was credible, and when police searched Joel's 0:16:46.880 --> 0:16:51.200 phone in computer, they found evidence supporting her story, and 0:16:51.240 --> 0:16:54.320 then they identified another woman Joel had met up with. 0:16:55.040 --> 0:16:58.320 He planned this one on his work phone, but it 0:16:58.400 --> 0:17:01.200 seemed like he forgot to delete a few messages from 0:17:01.320 --> 0:17:07.399 the exchange. This woman had also met Joel on fet life. 0:17:08.080 --> 0:17:11.680 Although she was cooperative, she seemed less eager to discuss 0:17:11.680 --> 0:17:16.240 the encounter. An internal affairs sergeant contacted her by phone. 0:17:16.440 --> 0:17:19.120 So you started talking, you think online in August twenty 0:17:19.119 --> 0:17:21.760 twenty one. You spoke on the phone, he would call you, 0:17:21.800 --> 0:17:24.920 and you spoke through WhatsApp. When's the first time you 0:17:24.960 --> 0:17:26.720 said you met. When's the first time you actually met 0:17:26.720 --> 0:17:27.280 in person. 0:17:28.280 --> 0:17:30.919 I believe that he was a conference in Denver and 0:17:31.160 --> 0:17:33.560 we just met briefly when he was on his way back, 0:17:34.160 --> 0:17:36.480 like the last day that he was going back to 0:17:36.640 --> 0:17:37.280 the Springs. 0:17:37.960 --> 0:17:41.080 The woman and Joel had talked and texted for several weeks. 0:17:41.359 --> 0:17:44.520 He had attended a work conference in Denver. After talking 0:17:44.560 --> 0:17:47.399 online and on the phone, there was an opening to 0:17:47.400 --> 0:17:50.240 meet up. On the way back from the conference, they 0:17:50.280 --> 0:17:53.160 met in the parking lot of a sporting goods store. 0:17:54.680 --> 0:17:57.880 But here was the information internal affairs was really after 0:17:58.800 --> 0:18:01.440 had Joel used his police car to have sex with her? 0:18:01.880 --> 0:18:05.240 And was it while he was on duty? 0:18:05.520 --> 0:18:07.440 Was there anything in that vehicle that made you think 0:18:07.480 --> 0:18:10.240 that it was probably not his personal vehicle? 0:18:10.480 --> 0:18:14.080 The radio police for radio of Canner. 0:18:13.840 --> 0:18:15.320 Or whatever you call him. 0:18:15.800 --> 0:18:18.159 You got into a silver ESUV you don't remember the 0:18:18.200 --> 0:18:20.399 maker model, but you believe it was a police vehicle 0:18:20.440 --> 0:18:24.359 because it has a radio in it. Maybe there for 0:18:24.400 --> 0:18:28.320 twenty to thirty minutes, and you engaged in vaginal sex 0:18:28.320 --> 0:18:34.560 in the backseat of that vehicle. Yeah, And other than that, 0:18:34.640 --> 0:18:37.320 there was no other meetings. You've still talked as friends, 0:18:37.359 --> 0:18:42.840 but no sex. No, no, And let me ask this. 0:18:44.000 --> 0:18:48.000 I was reading through some text messages between you and Joel, 0:18:48.160 --> 0:18:51.119 and one of them says like something about there's been 0:18:51.160 --> 0:18:53.919 some drama and I've deleted everything not to worry about it. 0:18:53.920 --> 0:18:55.280 Do you remember that text thread? 0:18:56.080 --> 0:18:56.919 Yeah? 0:18:58.160 --> 0:18:59.000 What was that about? 0:19:00.119 --> 0:19:02.280 I mean, he told me that. 0:19:04.400 --> 0:19:05.520 There was something going on. 0:19:06.960 --> 0:19:11.800 I didn't really go into detail, but I guess I 0:19:12.000 --> 0:19:14.240 wasn't surprise when I got your message yesterday. 0:19:37.640 --> 0:19:41.600 Despite Joel's adamant denials, it appeared he had in fact 0:19:42.040 --> 0:19:46.679 had sex in his police vehicle during work hours. CSPD 0:19:46.760 --> 0:19:51.160 conducted a full investigation. Internal affairs even ordered a forensic 0:19:51.200 --> 0:19:55.440 analysis of the car's interior. They determined that the complaint 0:19:55.480 --> 0:19:58.919 was true. Joel had been having sex with women in 0:19:58.960 --> 0:20:05.400 his police car in public on company time. On April eleventh, 0:20:05.520 --> 0:20:08.479 Joel was summoned to a meeting with his commander, and 0:20:08.520 --> 0:20:11.600 you'll hear that meeting in a later episode. And it 0:20:11.640 --> 0:20:14.520 was on that day that he could no longer hide 0:20:14.560 --> 0:20:20.000 the investigation from Caroline and their kids. In the early 0:20:20.080 --> 0:20:24.080 evening on April eleventh, twenty twenty two, Joel was home 0:20:24.119 --> 0:20:27.960 with his family. Caroline and Nicole sat huddled together on 0:20:28.000 --> 0:20:32.040 the living room sofa. There were tears, accusations, and grief. 0:20:32.880 --> 0:20:36.760 Their son was on speakerphone from college, alternating between anguish 0:20:36.800 --> 0:20:40.280 and disgust. As he sat in our home. 0:20:40.359 --> 0:20:42.439 He swore up and down to the kids. It was 0:20:42.480 --> 0:20:44.520 only two times. It was only these two people. 0:20:44.680 --> 0:20:45.120 That's it. 0:20:45.119 --> 0:20:46.359 It was only these two people. 0:20:47.160 --> 0:20:51.879 He was only admitting to what the CSPD had already uncovered. Meanwhile, 0:20:52.080 --> 0:20:55.240 he told his family a tearful story about what happened. 0:20:56.800 --> 0:21:00.720 He said, I started going down a rabbit hole online 0:21:00.760 --> 0:21:03.640 when I worked at night, and I would see these 0:21:03.640 --> 0:21:07.520 different websites, and out of curiosity, I started corresponding with 0:21:07.560 --> 0:21:09.920 different people on different websites, and that's how I met 0:21:09.920 --> 0:21:12.320 these two people. It was only these two times. It 0:21:12.359 --> 0:21:13.480 was only these two times. 0:21:14.720 --> 0:21:19.080 I was just astonished that he could do this to 0:21:19.160 --> 0:21:19.760 our family. 0:21:20.720 --> 0:21:23.119 Well I could keep saying, was how could you do 0:21:23.200 --> 0:21:26.320 this to my mom and my sister? How could you 0:21:26.359 --> 0:21:26.720 do this? 0:21:28.240 --> 0:21:30.480 You know, it's one thing to try to digest that 0:21:30.720 --> 0:21:34.240 when you have just been but traded by your spouse, 0:21:35.800 --> 0:21:40.760 But see here and watch your kids. It's just a 0:21:40.760 --> 0:21:41.960 completely different level. 0:21:44.119 --> 0:21:47.520 Joel insisted that he only had been unfaithful with two people, 0:21:48.200 --> 0:21:52.840 but Caroline wasn't naive. She knew there had to be more. 0:21:53.520 --> 0:21:56.040 You know, I had enough sense to say, if I 0:21:56.119 --> 0:22:00.000 secure a divorce attorney and they were to do an 0:22:00.080 --> 0:22:03.560 open records Request Act, what else would they find in 0:22:03.600 --> 0:22:06.679 your file, and he looked terrified. 0:22:08.440 --> 0:22:11.959 With Caroline's words still hanging in the air, Joel dropped 0:22:11.960 --> 0:22:16.399 another bombshell. Back in episode one. We learned he'd been 0:22:16.440 --> 0:22:19.199 tapped for one of the departments and most sought after roles, 0:22:19.840 --> 0:22:23.520 the public information officer. He'd be the face of the department, 0:22:23.960 --> 0:22:28.520 the media liaison, the voice. He'd already done the job temporarily, 0:22:30.240 --> 0:22:33.960 then out of nowhere, the offer vanished. 0:22:35.480 --> 0:22:38.240 He said, I had a falling out with the chief. 0:22:39.160 --> 0:22:40.399 And I said, you had a falling out with the 0:22:40.440 --> 0:22:42.240 chief of police, and he said, I had a falling 0:22:42.240 --> 0:22:46.639 out with him, and he's taken away my opportunity to 0:22:46.680 --> 0:22:48.200 be the public information officer. 0:22:49.320 --> 0:22:51.840 But that had been a lie. There hadn't been an 0:22:51.840 --> 0:22:55.600 issue with the chief. The issue had been with Joel. 0:22:56.040 --> 0:23:00.360 He did not get the public information officer position because 0:23:00.720 --> 0:23:01.800 of sexual harassment. 0:23:03.920 --> 0:23:07.760 While Joel served as temporary public Information officer in twenty sixteen, 0:23:08.320 --> 0:23:11.240 he asked female reporters to use an encrypted app to 0:23:11.240 --> 0:23:16.320 communicate with him, and what he said there unnerved the reporters. 0:23:16.880 --> 0:23:19.040 When one reporter heard Joel Kern was going to be 0:23:19.080 --> 0:23:23.280 appointed the permanent Public Information officer in twenty nineteen, She 0:23:23.440 --> 0:23:26.639 was alarmed and wrote a letter here's how it began, 0:23:28.840 --> 0:23:32.119 to the Colorado Springs Police Department. I'm writing to voice 0:23:32.119 --> 0:23:35.439 my concerns about naming Lieutenant Jul Kern the next PIO. 0:23:36.240 --> 0:23:40.199 To accuse anyone of inappropriate behavior is a risk, But 0:23:40.280 --> 0:23:44.600 to accuse an officer, especially one that controls which media 0:23:44.680 --> 0:23:49.040 members get information and how fast, could be career suicide. 0:23:49.840 --> 0:23:53.160 But that is what most emboldened me to voice my concerns. Now, 0:23:54.840 --> 0:23:58.440 this letter led to Joel Kern's first internal affairs investigation 0:23:58.680 --> 0:24:04.240 for sexually harassing female news reporters. The CSPB started by 0:24:04.280 --> 0:24:06.520 interviewing the reporter that wrote the letter. 0:24:08.840 --> 0:24:11.840 This is Commander tisshow Shewski with Calar Springs Police Department 0:24:11.880 --> 0:24:15.880 Internal Affairs Section. Today's February seventh, twenty nineteen. 0:24:16.640 --> 0:24:19.720 Internal Affairs asked the reporter about the app J'll ask 0:24:19.760 --> 0:24:20.520 her to download. 0:24:21.000 --> 0:24:24.800