WEBVTT - Bloomberg Businessweek Weekend - April 4th, 2020 0:00:01.800 --> 0:00:05.240 You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and 0:00:05.360 --> 0:00:09.040 Jason Kelly from Bloomberg Radio. Hi, I'm Jason Kelly and 0:00:09.039 --> 0:00:11.720 I'm Carol Masser. Welcome to the weekend edition of Bloomberg 0:00:11.760 --> 0:00:13.880 Business Week. Over the next couple of hours, we're going 0:00:13.920 --> 0:00:16.120 to bring you some of the most important and informative 0:00:16.120 --> 0:00:19.440 coronavirus conversations that we've had this week on our daily 0:00:19.520 --> 0:00:22.079 radio show. And Jason, you know, we kicked off saying 0:00:22.239 --> 0:00:24.439 it's a new month, new quarter this week, and yet 0:00:24.920 --> 0:00:27.400 it's a quarter that's going to be all about the health, economic, 0:00:27.440 --> 0:00:29.880 and market impact of the virus. We talked with leaders 0:00:29.880 --> 0:00:33.559 from all walks of life, medicine, politics, telecom, and of 0:00:33.600 --> 0:00:36.560 course the beaten down hospitality and restaurant worlds well, and 0:00:36.600 --> 0:00:39.760 this week felt different, I think, Carol, in the sense 0:00:39.840 --> 0:00:42.560 that we started to talk to people more and more 0:00:42.680 --> 0:00:46.760 about what's right now, but also what's next. And every 0:00:46.800 --> 0:00:50.320 single aspect of our lives has been changed and will 0:00:50.400 --> 0:00:53.200 be changed by this And as you listen to this show, 0:00:53.240 --> 0:00:55.160 I think you're going to get a sense of that because, 0:00:55.400 --> 0:00:57.120 as you say, we talked to people in all walks 0:00:57.120 --> 0:01:02.760 of life, CEOs, retired and roles chefs, and you know, 0:01:02.920 --> 0:01:05.360 all of their lives are changing, they're trying to adjust, 0:01:05.560 --> 0:01:08.000 and so getting inside all of these businesses it was 0:01:08.000 --> 0:01:11.160 actually really really interesting, right, And let's remind everybody, Jason 0:01:11.160 --> 0:01:14.000 that these conversations with leaders in their respective fields. It's 0:01:14.000 --> 0:01:17.200 happening in real time throughout our week as news concerning 0:01:17.200 --> 0:01:20.600 COVID nineteen and its impact continue to break and shape 0:01:20.600 --> 0:01:23.080 our daily lives. Let's talk about who we're going to 0:01:23.160 --> 0:01:25.080 hear from over the next couple of hours. From here, 0:01:25.160 --> 0:01:29.880 Labor Secretary Robert Reisch. He weighs in on those corporate bailouts. 0:01:29.880 --> 0:01:32.800 He's got a very hot take. Alan patrick Off, someone 0:01:32.840 --> 0:01:36.160 who's been in the business of investing in startups, some 0:01:36.360 --> 0:01:38.760 names that you know over the past four decades. And 0:01:38.840 --> 0:01:41.400 Glenn Fogel of booking dot com. And that's just to 0:01:41.480 --> 0:01:43.200 name a few. Carol. Yeah, and let's just point out 0:01:43.240 --> 0:01:45.959 Glenn Fogel found out this week that he was tested 0:01:46.000 --> 0:01:49.360 positive for COVID nineteen, continuing to do his job. So 0:01:49.680 --> 0:01:53.200 a really timely conversation on so many different levels. First up, though, 0:01:53.200 --> 0:01:55.400 we caught up with Hans Vestberg. He's the chairman and 0:01:55.440 --> 0:01:59.200 CEO of Verizon Communications. This week, President Trump held a 0:01:59.200 --> 0:02:02.800 call with telecom giants, including Verizon. Of course, we are 0:02:02.840 --> 0:02:05.760 in a very serious situation in this country and the 0:02:05.800 --> 0:02:09.720 whole world due to this pandemic, and of course having 0:02:09.720 --> 0:02:13.560 that in mind, you also understand that the networks becomes 0:02:13.560 --> 0:02:18.040 more critical for people to communicate and keeping business up. 0:02:18.639 --> 0:02:23.480 We see a clear surgeon our in our network. We 0:02:23.560 --> 0:02:26.960 see enormous a lot more of calls and we we 0:02:27.040 --> 0:02:30.160 have today eight hundred million calls a day, which is 0:02:30.240 --> 0:02:33.519 twice as much as we would have on the Mother's Day, 0:02:33.720 --> 0:02:36.320 which is the biggest day of the year. We have 0:02:36.560 --> 0:02:40.200 nine billion messages a day, a day that's equal to 0:02:40.240 --> 0:02:42.919 a New Year's even so we are on peak every 0:02:43.000 --> 0:02:46.280 day of the week. So that tells you how much haffick. 0:02:46.600 --> 0:02:49.639 At the same time, I see totally new patterns. I 0:02:49.720 --> 0:02:53.560 have fifty percent growth in DPN access. That's basically when 0:02:53.840 --> 0:02:57.520 when you work from home co operation, that's fifty percent up. 0:02:57.600 --> 0:03:01.360 And you see over hundred percent growth gaming in the 0:03:01.440 --> 0:03:04.760 network at the moment. So all that at the same time, 0:03:04.840 --> 0:03:08.200 you know, as people are moving around in the country 0:03:08.240 --> 0:03:10.919 in a different way. So but the networks are keeping 0:03:11.000 --> 0:03:13.920 up well. I would say it's very robust. We have 0:03:14.760 --> 0:03:17.959 I have to say the engineers and the and how 0:03:18.000 --> 0:03:20.440 we have built on networks over the years. It's really 0:03:20.720 --> 0:03:22.720 proven to be the right thing to do. Right now, 0:03:22.760 --> 0:03:26.800 the networks and holding up well. But the data data 0:03:26.960 --> 0:03:30.120 can give a use as the change of behavior. We 0:03:30.240 --> 0:03:34.680 see that handovers between radio cells has gone down with 0:03:34.840 --> 0:03:39.000 twenty nine percent nationwide. That means that people are moving 0:03:39.400 --> 0:03:42.480 so much less today compared to just a week ago. 0:03:42.800 --> 0:03:45.600 And if you take a place like New York Metro, 0:03:45.840 --> 0:03:50.160 it's down fifty that people are moving between one cell 0:03:50.480 --> 0:03:53.280 and another radio sells to another. So we can see 0:03:53.280 --> 0:03:56.320 that the behavior changing, the uses of the network is 0:03:56.400 --> 0:03:59.440 is dramatically changing in these times, and we understand the 0:03:59.440 --> 0:04:02.600 important us to keep the network's up and in good health. 0:04:03.240 --> 0:04:05.839 You know both, Jason, I do hope this. You sound good, 0:04:05.880 --> 0:04:08.080 So I'm hoping you are. Your family is doing okay. 0:04:08.160 --> 0:04:11.880 Your employees, how are your employees doing with all of this? 0:04:13.440 --> 0:04:16.680 That's a very good question. Our our mission is very clear. 0:04:16.800 --> 0:04:19.839 Number one, safe and healthy. Our hundred thirty five thousand 0:04:19.920 --> 0:04:23.719 and police worldwide majority In the US, I would say 0:04:23.800 --> 0:04:26.920 I have some hundred fifteen thousand people of them working 0:04:26.960 --> 0:04:29.600 from home, and we we swapped that in less than 0:04:29.600 --> 0:04:32.960 two weeks. We swapped works were never done from home before, 0:04:33.880 --> 0:04:37.359 So that's that's one category. Then of course I have 0:04:37.480 --> 0:04:41.240 so vital infrastructures. I need to have certain all my 0:04:41.839 --> 0:04:45.120 technicians out in the field. I actually manage and maintain 0:04:45.200 --> 0:04:47.960 the networks, and of course that's we'll only do for 0:04:48.080 --> 0:04:51.160 critical things. But you know, we need to keep up 0:04:51.200 --> 0:04:56.200 the first responders networks, the hospitals. We need more moved capacity, 0:04:56.480 --> 0:04:58.680 so I have a crew of that's actually out there. 0:04:58.720 --> 0:05:01.159 And then of course I also have some stores open 0:05:01.480 --> 0:05:05.160 for just critical deliveries. So they're doing fine. But of 0:05:05.160 --> 0:05:07.479 course we're impacted as any on the company or in 0:05:07.560 --> 0:05:09.920 this pandemic. And I just want to do a shout 0:05:09.960 --> 0:05:12.800 out to you guys, because you guys have implemented a 0:05:12.880 --> 0:05:16.239 virus leave of absence policy. Anybody who gets the virus 0:05:16.279 --> 0:05:19.320 eligible up to twenty six weeks, So what you're doing 0:05:19.400 --> 0:05:23.200 and everyone who had a job before the virus cause 0:05:23.279 --> 0:05:25.680 the shutdown, they're going to continue to do. So is 0:05:25.680 --> 0:05:30.919 that correct? Correct? In the crisis like this, Uh, the 0:05:30.960 --> 0:05:34.400 responsibility of companies are are enormous, and of course I 0:05:34.480 --> 0:05:37.400 feel that then, but we reassure all our employees if 0:05:37.400 --> 0:05:40.520 they cannot work and they can work from home, and 0:05:40.520 --> 0:05:43.400 they cannot work, we reassure them about their payments and 0:05:43.440 --> 0:05:46.360 the salaries, and that's saying goes if they're impacted if 0:05:46.400 --> 0:05:49.119 they need to stay home with children. But we'll also 0:05:49.200 --> 0:05:52.520 understand that some of our employees at work, not working 0:05:52.560 --> 0:05:55.279 in an office and coming home, we are actually giving 0:05:55.320 --> 0:05:57.919 them tasks as well, and so we have an exchange 0:05:57.960 --> 0:06:00.480 of work so you actually have something to do, because 0:06:00.480 --> 0:06:03.640 it's also very very dull to be home and not 0:06:03.800 --> 0:06:05.880 have ending to do, so we we do that at 0:06:05.920 --> 0:06:08.200 the same time. And that's Frison chairman and CEO, Hans 0:06:08.279 --> 0:06:10.919 Vestberg and Carol. We caught up with Hans earlier this 0:06:11.000 --> 0:06:14.000 year under very different circumstances. We were talking about big 0:06:14.040 --> 0:06:16.240 sporting events, we were talking about five GM, we were 0:06:16.279 --> 0:06:19.839 talking about the streaming wors. Obviously his business dramatically changed, 0:06:19.839 --> 0:06:23.520 and as you said earlier in the show, he was 0:06:23.760 --> 0:06:28.120 with the president at least telephonically, trying to understand what 0:06:28.200 --> 0:06:30.760 they need to do from an infrastructure perspective. Well Verising 0:06:30.800 --> 0:06:32.520 one of the companies that has seen a surge in 0:06:32.520 --> 0:06:35.880 internet traffic all right, you're listening to Bloomberg business Week. 0:06:35.920 --> 0:06:37.920 Coming up the CEO of Booking dot Com on how 0:06:37.920 --> 0:06:41.720 the coronavirus has impacted the travel sector. It's a business 0:06:41.720 --> 0:06:44.440 story for them, but it's also a personal story for 0:06:44.480 --> 0:06:55.680 the CEO of Booking dot Com. This is Bloomberg. You're 0:06:55.760 --> 0:06:59.320 listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and Jason 0:06:59.400 --> 0:07:02.359 Kelly from Bloomberg Radio, and today we're reading some of 0:07:02.440 --> 0:07:05.400 our favorite, we think the most important and informative conversations 0:07:05.440 --> 0:07:08.680 we had on our daily Bloomberg Business Week radio show 0:07:09.040 --> 0:07:12.720 about the coronavirus it's impact across all businesses. This week, 0:07:12.960 --> 0:07:15.680 one of those important conversations, Jason was our chat with 0:07:15.680 --> 0:07:18.360 Glenn Fogel. He's the CEO of Booking Holdings and Booking 0:07:18.400 --> 0:07:21.680 dot Com, home to some well known brands Priceline, as 0:07:21.680 --> 0:07:24.800 I mentioned, Booking dot Com, Open Table and more. But 0:07:24.880 --> 0:07:27.320 let's remind everybody that this was also a personal story 0:07:27.320 --> 0:07:30.240 because Glenn found out that he was tested positive for 0:07:30.320 --> 0:07:33.200 COVID nineteen just this week. Well, thanks for having me, 0:07:33.320 --> 0:07:36.680 and I feel fine. I've been very, very fortunate that 0:07:37.000 --> 0:07:40.840 I had the most mildest of symptoms and recovered very 0:07:40.960 --> 0:07:43.560 very well. In between the time I was tested last 0:07:43.600 --> 0:07:46.640 Thursday at the time I actually got the result tonights ago, 0:07:47.200 --> 0:07:51.560 all the symptoms resolved, so I am perfectly fine physically, 0:07:51.960 --> 0:07:54.720 of course, emotionally, you know, I just feel so bad 0:07:54.760 --> 0:07:57.240 for people who have not been as fortunate as I 0:07:57.280 --> 0:07:59.560 have been. And I know how hard it is. I 0:07:59.640 --> 0:08:01.920 read it about it, I hear about it. I have friends, 0:08:02.000 --> 0:08:04.920 I know others who are not having an easier time 0:08:04.960 --> 0:08:07.160 with this as I did. Well, we want to talk 0:08:07.160 --> 0:08:10.320 about the the end markets, obviously, Glenn, but tell us 0:08:10.360 --> 0:08:14.640 about how your company is dealing with this in a 0:08:14.720 --> 0:08:19.120 world where I mean travel has just essentially stopped, traveling, 0:08:19.280 --> 0:08:22.160 entertainment have come to a screeching halt. What does it 0:08:22.200 --> 0:08:25.360 look like on the ground to you. Well, look, it's 0:08:25.400 --> 0:08:28.520 been very tough. Even though, as you point out correctly, 0:08:28.640 --> 0:08:31.440 a lot of travel is stop. The fact is there's 0:08:31.480 --> 0:08:34.480 a huge number of customers who had set up plans 0:08:34.520 --> 0:08:38.280 that needed to have their issues addressed. We were dealing 0:08:38.320 --> 0:08:41.480 with four hundred thousand contacts a day and just booking 0:08:41.520 --> 0:08:45.000 dot Com alone, dealing with people who are scared, frustrated, 0:08:45.520 --> 0:08:47.920 concerned that they need to get their money back, and 0:08:47.960 --> 0:08:50.560 that's an issue when you have people who bought something 0:08:50.640 --> 0:08:53.240 a few months in advance and now all of a sudden, 0:08:53.280 --> 0:08:56.360 maybe they're losing their job, they're concerned about their health, 0:08:56.400 --> 0:08:58.840 and they're trying to talk to us as quick as possibly. Hey, 0:08:59.080 --> 0:09:01.200 something's changed, I need can you help me get my 0:09:01.240 --> 0:09:04.079 money back? And it's it's it's hard, and it's hard 0:09:04.120 --> 0:09:06.200 on our customer service. People are hearing these things and 0:09:06.200 --> 0:09:08.880 we're doing everything we can to help people because in 0:09:08.920 --> 0:09:12.280 these situations, contracts do allow people to get their money 0:09:12.280 --> 0:09:14.920 back in many cases, and it's something that are people 0:09:14.960 --> 0:09:18.120 are working all the time. It's it's hard on everyone, though, Well, 0:09:18.120 --> 0:09:21.040 what about you know this the stimulus programs and packages 0:09:21.080 --> 0:09:24.160 that are coming out of Washington, Glen, do you feel like, um, 0:09:24.280 --> 0:09:27.680 your voice and your industry is being heard pretty clearly 0:09:27.720 --> 0:09:30.120 and you're getting the assistance that you think is that 0:09:30.200 --> 0:09:33.320 should be should be coming your way. Well, listen, it's 0:09:33.360 --> 0:09:35.959 just so great that the government has stepped up and 0:09:36.240 --> 0:09:40.360 made an initial uh start to helping the economy. And 0:09:40.360 --> 0:09:43.240 it's not just the travel industries. Everybody, but travel has 0:09:43.280 --> 0:09:47.760 been hurt more than anybody, and the airlines, the hotels, everybody. 0:09:47.800 --> 0:09:50.280 When you have zero revenue. That's really really bad. So 0:09:50.360 --> 0:09:52.400 this is a good start, and I thank the President, 0:09:52.480 --> 0:09:55.480 I thank the Treasury Secretary, I think Senator Schumer and 0:09:55.800 --> 0:09:58.800 Speaker Pelosi, everybody for coming together and doing what was 0:09:58.880 --> 0:10:02.439 absolutely necessary. But I think we all recognize that's just 0:10:02.600 --> 0:10:06.040 a start. That's not going to be enough. This crisis 0:10:06.040 --> 0:10:08.560 is going to go on for too long, and we 0:10:08.640 --> 0:10:11.520 know during that time period we're gonna need additional stimulus, 0:10:11.640 --> 0:10:14.520 gonna need additional assistance, not just in the US but 0:10:14.600 --> 0:10:17.240 around the world. So what does the industry look like 0:10:17.280 --> 0:10:19.160 when we get on the other side of this. You know, 0:10:19.200 --> 0:10:21.640 we've been asking this question of so many people. You know, 0:10:21.679 --> 0:10:24.360 how will the coronavirus pandemic change the world? I mean, 0:10:24.840 --> 0:10:28.360 you know what will be the most important in your view? 0:10:28.600 --> 0:10:31.080 You know underappreciate way that the world will be different 0:10:31.080 --> 0:10:34.080 when we get on the other side. Well, the first 0:10:34.120 --> 0:10:36.600 thing is not going to be like you switch, uh, 0:10:36.960 --> 0:10:39.520 you know, you just switch right, not how it happens. 0:10:39.559 --> 0:10:43.280 What's gonna happen is we're gonna have domestic travel come back. First. 0:10:43.360 --> 0:10:46.520 People feel better about traveling domestically, and I'm certainly sure 0:10:46.640 --> 0:10:48.880 you're gonna start traveling by car more than planes to 0:10:48.960 --> 0:10:52.280 start off. Then you'll start seeing more and more people 0:10:52.400 --> 0:10:56.720 flying domestically internationally. It's going to take some time, and 0:10:56.760 --> 0:10:58.800 the reason is you're gonna have countries that are still 0:10:58.840 --> 0:11:01.920 gonna be has and to want to have a reimportation 0:11:02.040 --> 0:11:04.120 of the virus that they've already done a good job 0:11:04.160 --> 0:11:06.440 of stamping it out, and they're gonna put on a 0:11:06.440 --> 0:11:09.040 lot of checks. You're gonna see fever checks in all 0:11:09.160 --> 0:11:11.840 airports that are gonna try and catch if anybody's coming 0:11:11.840 --> 0:11:15.559 through who may be infected. And certain certain jurisdictions, they're 0:11:15.559 --> 0:11:18.240 gonna ask you to download an app to track where 0:11:18.280 --> 0:11:20.520 you are because they want to know if you've come 0:11:20.559 --> 0:11:23.160 from another country, and if you turn sick, they want 0:11:23.160 --> 0:11:24.960 to know who have you been close to so they 0:11:24.960 --> 0:11:27.880 can then alert other people. So people may have to 0:11:27.920 --> 0:11:29.800 give up so in their privacy if they want to 0:11:29.840 --> 0:11:31.679 go to certain countries who are going to be a 0:11:31.679 --> 0:11:35.160 little more hesitant about letting people into their countries. So 0:11:35.280 --> 0:11:37.720 things will be different. But the thing that won't be 0:11:37.720 --> 0:11:40.440 different people are still gonna want to travel. I know 0:11:40.520 --> 0:11:42.920 that people have always want to travel. They always will. 0:11:43.000 --> 0:11:45.560 We just have to get past this virus. And what 0:11:45.640 --> 0:11:48.559 about in the world of sort of entertainment and and 0:11:48.640 --> 0:11:52.120 sort of people meeting with each other over meals and 0:11:52.160 --> 0:11:54.240 restaurants and things like that, only got about forty five 0:11:54.280 --> 0:11:56.559 seconds left. How does that change, Glenn? Just are are 0:11:56.679 --> 0:11:59.720 sort of more intimate day to day lives. Yeah, look 0:12:00.000 --> 0:12:02.360 at the beginning, there's gonna be distancing, no doubt. And 0:12:02.360 --> 0:12:03.880 they're gonna say I don't want to go to a 0:12:03.920 --> 0:12:06.120 big crowded concert. For example, if he said I don't 0:12:06.120 --> 0:12:07.560 want to be packed in with a bunch of people. 0:12:07.600 --> 0:12:09.640 I want to have some space, that's gonna be just natural. 0:12:10.000 --> 0:12:13.440 But people's human nature does not change. And I know 0:12:13.520 --> 0:12:16.720 this because I know how many people after nine eleven, 0:12:16.800 --> 0:12:19.040 on the September twelve people said they're never going to 0:12:19.120 --> 0:12:21.560 get on another plane ever. And you know something, a 0:12:21.559 --> 0:12:23.640 few months they got back on planes. The same thing 0:12:23.720 --> 0:12:25.680 is going to happen here. People are gonna go back, 0:12:25.720 --> 0:12:27.760 they're gonna travel, they're going to go to open table, 0:12:27.760 --> 0:12:31.240 and they're gonna get reservations dining. We're going to all 0:12:31.280 --> 0:12:34.800 be good again after we get past this virus, which 0:12:34.880 --> 0:12:37.280 will happen. I gotta say, I can't wait to travel 0:12:37.320 --> 0:12:38.520 and I can't go wait. I can't wait to go 0:12:38.600 --> 0:12:41.680 out to a restaurant. So Glenn, we wish you so 0:12:41.720 --> 0:12:44.240 well and thank you so much for finding time for 0:12:44.360 --> 0:12:46.840 us to stay healthy and uh we hope your team 0:12:46.840 --> 0:12:50.120 does well through this. Uh. In addition, Glen Fogo, President, 0:12:50.200 --> 0:12:52.880 chief executive officer at Booking Holdings, I should put out 0:12:52.960 --> 0:12:56.400 Jason that their company's brand CEO has decided to forego 0:12:56.440 --> 0:12:59.960 their salaries. Their board of directors voluntarily declined to accept 0:13:00.000 --> 0:13:03.520 hash retainer payments. They've been cutting expenses and spending, so 0:13:03.520 --> 0:13:07.680 they've been really retrenching to get through this crisis. And 0:13:07.720 --> 0:13:10.160 that's Glenn Fogel. He is the CEO of Booking Holdings 0:13:10.200 --> 0:13:14.160 and Booking dot Com and again someone who we have 0:13:14.240 --> 0:13:16.640 gotten to know over the past couple of years. That 0:13:16.720 --> 0:13:20.040 business obviously so core for a lot of our listeners 0:13:20.040 --> 0:13:23.520 in terms of going on trips, whether it's business or personal. 0:13:23.800 --> 0:13:28.080 That industry has effectively shut down, and so how do 0:13:28.240 --> 0:13:31.559 you alter how do you change course in a business 0:13:31.600 --> 0:13:33.600 like that? So glad we could catch up with Glenn. 0:13:33.720 --> 0:13:36.479 You're listening to Bloomberg business Week coming up a conversation 0:13:36.520 --> 0:13:39.280 with David Mussifer, the chairman and managing partner of Advent 0:13:39.360 --> 0:13:43.240 International also lead director of Lulu Lemon. A great chat 0:13:43.320 --> 0:13:45.480 that you had with him looking forward to that. This 0:13:45.600 --> 0:13:55.400 is Bloomberg. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol 0:13:55.480 --> 0:13:59.000 Masser and Jason Kelly from Bloomberg Radio. We're bringing you 0:13:59.040 --> 0:14:01.440 some of the most important and informative conversations that we 0:14:01.480 --> 0:14:04.120 had on our daily radio show about the coronavirus this week, 0:14:04.160 --> 0:14:05.840 and Jason, we really did try to reach out to 0:14:06.000 --> 0:14:09.640 leaders in all fields because, as we know, everything's been 0:14:09.679 --> 0:14:11.760 impacted by the virus. Well, and this is a guy 0:14:11.760 --> 0:14:14.360 I really wanted to hear from, David Mussafar. I've gotten 0:14:14.400 --> 0:14:16.640 to know him over the past few years. He's the 0:14:16.679 --> 0:14:20.320 chairman managing partner of Advent International, and if you remember, 0:14:20.520 --> 0:14:22.760 I wrote a story for Bloomberg Business Week magazine did 0:14:22.760 --> 0:14:25.120 a long form conversation with him and the CEO of 0:14:25.240 --> 0:14:28.280 Lulu Lemon back in December. It was a different world, 0:14:28.280 --> 0:14:30.880 but I wanted to catch up with David to understand 0:14:31.000 --> 0:14:33.680 what he was seeing both as an investor and as 0:14:33.680 --> 0:14:36.440 a director of a very high profile company. Check it 0:14:36.480 --> 0:14:38.920 out well, David, let me start by asking you, first 0:14:38.960 --> 0:14:41.640 of all, how are you like what's it like for 0:14:41.720 --> 0:14:45.200 you personally, family wise, just sort of as a human 0:14:45.200 --> 0:14:50.200 being here? Well, I mean, firstly, that's the first question 0:14:50.400 --> 0:14:53.560 that we share with everybody, which is firstly, just how 0:14:53.600 --> 0:14:57.080 are you doing? Because this, the physical element of this 0:14:57.200 --> 0:15:00.440 is unlike anything we've ever dealt with before, and so 0:15:00.560 --> 0:15:04.520 thank you for asking. Personally, I'm I'm doing well, and 0:15:04.600 --> 0:15:09.880 actually i'm I'm quarantined here in outside of Boston. So 0:15:10.160 --> 0:15:15.120 we're in the suburbs in Boston, and I've got uh 0:15:15.320 --> 0:15:18.640 four tunity twenty year old kids, and three of them 0:15:18.680 --> 0:15:22.880 are actually here with us. So, um, it's been in 0:15:22.920 --> 0:15:27.720 the face of some really difficult times, some unique elements 0:15:27.800 --> 0:15:31.760 of being with your family. And how how is it 0:15:32.040 --> 0:15:34.920 uh feeling and looking there on the ground in Boston. 0:15:34.920 --> 0:15:36.880 I mean, I know you're outside the city, but I 0:15:36.880 --> 0:15:38.480 know you're in touch with a lot of people. You're 0:15:38.560 --> 0:15:42.680 very active from a civic perspective. You know. I feel 0:15:42.680 --> 0:15:45.520 like different cities and different parts of the country are 0:15:45.560 --> 0:15:48.440 at a different moment here, and you know, we're recording 0:15:48.840 --> 0:15:52.400 on March thirty one, and it's a it's changing daily. 0:15:53.000 --> 0:15:54.760 But what does it feel like in and around Boston 0:15:54.840 --> 0:15:59.240 right now? Well, I mean, I think it's probably equivalent 0:15:59.320 --> 0:16:02.000 to the major your metro areas. If you think about 0:16:02.120 --> 0:16:06.280 obviously New York, which is so such the epicenter right now, 0:16:06.400 --> 0:16:09.880 ben Boston is behalf of stuff behind and right there. 0:16:10.160 --> 0:16:13.560 So there's a lot of fear and concern that I 0:16:13.600 --> 0:16:19.240 think exists here in London, in Paris, certainly, Madrid, and 0:16:19.600 --> 0:16:23.160 you know, so many of our major metropolitan areas today 0:16:23.200 --> 0:16:26.800 and Boston. You know, we have terrific medical care here 0:16:26.840 --> 0:16:31.360 in the city. But I think everybody is certainly mindful 0:16:31.680 --> 0:16:36.240 of the time and where we sit today at near 0:16:36.360 --> 0:16:40.120 the you know, the peak of this crisis. And so 0:16:40.560 --> 0:16:45.840 let's talk about the firm and your portfolio companies. And 0:16:45.880 --> 0:16:47.920 I guess I'd start with the firm. How do you 0:16:48.520 --> 0:16:51.800 everybody started learning these lessons? We are certainly day to day. 0:16:53.080 --> 0:16:54.440 How do you run the firm at a time like 0:16:54.480 --> 0:16:57.240 this remotely? This is such a people intensive business in 0:16:57.280 --> 0:17:02.360 many ways relationship intensive. Well, I mean, Jason, the one thing, 0:17:02.720 --> 0:17:07.639 you know, we have offices in uh Shanghai and Hong Kong, 0:17:07.880 --> 0:17:12.520 so badly we we had a little preview of of 0:17:12.680 --> 0:17:15.600 how we were going to need to manage remotely, and 0:17:15.640 --> 0:17:20.560 so we were prepared and and uh set up for 0:17:20.880 --> 0:17:24.639 remote access once you know, we got to that point. 0:17:24.840 --> 0:17:28.920 And I think one of the lessons we actually distributed 0:17:29.000 --> 0:17:32.919 this the very first day of our UM you know 0:17:33.040 --> 0:17:36.679 that when we went to Remote Work worldwide, we shared 0:17:36.680 --> 0:17:39.520 a lessons learned memo that we had asked our team 0:17:39.560 --> 0:17:43.040 in Asia to prepare and it was both you know, 0:17:43.640 --> 0:17:49.240 pointers serious points, light hearted elements, but the key theme 0:17:49.359 --> 0:17:51.679 that we heard loud and clear was the need to 0:17:51.720 --> 0:17:56.760 over communicate the need for video because as humans, we 0:17:56.880 --> 0:18:00.879 take so much of our cues from facial express that 0:18:01.000 --> 0:18:04.280 you actually can can't get over the phone like we're 0:18:04.320 --> 0:18:07.840 doing right now. And so, you know, those were some 0:18:07.920 --> 0:18:10.480 elements that we realized early on, we're going to be 0:18:10.720 --> 0:18:14.639 really important to make sure that we were prepared to 0:18:14.680 --> 0:18:17.560 do that. And so is that a situation David, where 0:18:17.680 --> 0:18:19.320 I mean you sort of have to invest in some 0:18:19.359 --> 0:18:22.000 infrastructure that maybe you would normally have or does all 0:18:22.040 --> 0:18:26.480 of this does all of that already exists for you? Well, 0:18:26.520 --> 0:18:30.160 I think the you know, the critical infrastructure that allows 0:18:30.200 --> 0:18:33.359 you to have access to you know, your data as 0:18:33.400 --> 0:18:37.200 well as to have systems that you can use remotely 0:18:37.359 --> 0:18:42.040 were the access points. But I think, like everybody you know, 0:18:42.680 --> 0:18:46.719 they're spending much more time in a video conversations and 0:18:46.800 --> 0:18:51.320 so literally you know, just using WebEx and Zoom and 0:18:51.640 --> 0:18:54.240 a host of other resources like that have become the 0:18:54.280 --> 0:18:56.840 critical link. And that's David must For, the chairman, managing 0:18:56.840 --> 0:19:00.439 partner of Advent International and also the lead director of Lulu, 0:19:00.560 --> 0:19:03.280 Lemon and Carol. You know, I love the private equity 0:19:03.280 --> 0:19:06.600 guys in part because they have all these inputs right right, 0:19:06.680 --> 0:19:09.680 And I think talking to the private equity folks, the 0:19:09.720 --> 0:19:13.280 venture capitalists mean because they all have portfolios of companies 0:19:13.320 --> 0:19:16.280 that often are in different field. It's great to get 0:19:16.440 --> 0:19:19.159 a feeling of how those companies are doing, especially at 0:19:19.200 --> 0:19:21.280 such a stress time like we are in today. And 0:19:21.359 --> 0:19:23.240 that's just a part of the conversation I had with 0:19:23.320 --> 0:19:26.200 David Mussaf for he talked more about what they are 0:19:26.320 --> 0:19:30.959 doing from a charitable perspective through their companies. That entire conversation, 0:19:31.040 --> 0:19:33.879 it's almost thirty minutes long. You'll want to dig into it. 0:19:33.880 --> 0:19:36.360 It is our Business Week Extra podcast this week. Check 0:19:36.400 --> 0:19:38.840 that out on your feet. You're listening to Bloomberg business 0:19:38.840 --> 0:19:42.120 Week coming out. We hear from Stanley McCrystal, a retired 0:19:42.160 --> 0:19:45.200 four star Army general about how cities can better fight 0:19:45.200 --> 0:19:50.000 the coronavirus. He's helping lead the fight in Boston war footing. Indeed, 0:19:50.000 --> 0:19:58.320 this is Bloomberg. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with 0:19:58.400 --> 0:20:02.119 Carol Masser and Jason Kell from Bloomberg Radio, and today 0:20:02.160 --> 0:20:03.880 we're bringing you some of the most important, we hope 0:20:03.920 --> 0:20:07.200 informative conversations we had on our daily Bloomberg Business Week 0:20:07.320 --> 0:20:10.439 radio show. Carol all about the coronavirus this week. But 0:20:10.520 --> 0:20:14.359 as we settle into this new normal, obviously one of 0:20:14.400 --> 0:20:16.760 the things we're asking is what's happening now, but also 0:20:17.080 --> 0:20:19.440 looking ahead. That's right, Jason and we have the opportunity 0:20:19.480 --> 0:20:22.800 to catch up with retired four star Army General Stanley McCrystal. 0:20:23.320 --> 0:20:26.639 He has been tasked with leading Boston's emergency response to 0:20:26.680 --> 0:20:29.640 the coronavirus pandemic. We talked with him about how he's 0:20:29.680 --> 0:20:32.920 helping out the city and just got some ideas about 0:20:33.040 --> 0:20:36.679 leadership in this really troubled and stressed time. What we 0:20:36.720 --> 0:20:41.280 are trying to do is to help organizations bring together 0:20:41.480 --> 0:20:46.280 wider groups of stakeholders and collaborate better to the chief synergy. 0:20:46.400 --> 0:20:49.640 So if you take that model, Mayor Walsh and Boston 0:20:49.680 --> 0:20:52.680 asked us if we could help them change from a 0:20:53.560 --> 0:20:57.440 normal mode of operations first into a crisis response mode 0:20:57.480 --> 0:21:01.080 to the COVID nineteam, which brings in more people communicating 0:21:01.119 --> 0:21:04.080 on a daily basis, in a keystone form that they 0:21:04.080 --> 0:21:07.719 have every morning, which brings them together, and then also 0:21:07.800 --> 0:21:10.800 help prepare them for longer term for not just this crisis, 0:21:10.840 --> 0:21:14.679 but the crisis after next. And so what does that 0:21:14.720 --> 0:21:18.399 look like general in terms of what is the shift? 0:21:18.480 --> 0:21:21.720 Give us an example of what that shift entails, either 0:21:21.760 --> 0:21:24.879 in terms of the personnel, in terms of the pace, 0:21:24.960 --> 0:21:29.920 in terms of the assignments. Sure, mostly in a crisis, 0:21:29.960 --> 0:21:31.399 one of the key things you have to do is 0:21:31.440 --> 0:21:35.639 going to shared understanding of common contextual appreciation for what 0:21:35.720 --> 0:21:38.280 the situation is. And then you have to align on 0:21:38.320 --> 0:21:41.280 the strategy so that you can execute things that actually 0:21:41.400 --> 0:21:44.040 makes sense. So one of the things we find is 0:21:44.280 --> 0:21:48.040 you bring people together on a moral, more frequent basis. 0:21:48.520 --> 0:21:51.000 What mayor Walls does is bringing them all together for 0:21:51.040 --> 0:21:54.959 an hour every morning. It's all virtual. Everybody's brought in 0:21:55.040 --> 0:21:59.400 and he gets updates from all different players, police, fire Department, 0:21:59.440 --> 0:22:03.600 help part players, and so everyone gets a common understanding 0:22:03.640 --> 0:22:07.680 and then they solve problems right on that call. It's 0:22:07.720 --> 0:22:10.760 a video call, and they start doing it. They capture 0:22:10.800 --> 0:22:13.160 the lessons of those and then they put that out 0:22:13.200 --> 0:22:15.639 every day as an update, and so even more people 0:22:15.640 --> 0:22:19.480 can get that sense of understanding. General mc crystell. You 0:22:19.520 --> 0:22:23.280 know last June, you last year in June, you and 0:22:23.320 --> 0:22:25.240 I talked at the Bloomberg Breakaway Summit and we talked 0:22:25.240 --> 0:22:28.240 about leadership lessons that you've learned along the way and 0:22:28.480 --> 0:22:30.600 what CEOs can do to be more effective leaders in 0:22:30.600 --> 0:22:34.120 today's environment. You know, what advice can you give to 0:22:34.119 --> 0:22:36.879 today's political and corporate leaders because, as you know, a 0:22:36.880 --> 0:22:39.760 lot of criticism has been levied at our political leadership 0:22:39.760 --> 0:22:42.920 out of Washington, and I'm not looking to point fingers here, 0:22:42.960 --> 0:22:44.879 but you know, what have we learned that can be 0:22:44.920 --> 0:22:47.280 constructive about what mistakes were made early on and what 0:22:47.280 --> 0:22:50.400 can be applied now to get this under control. First off, 0:22:50.920 --> 0:22:53.240 thank you for speaking of getting Carol, who was pleasure 0:22:53.280 --> 0:22:57.200 to see last year. I guess think about the threat 0:22:57.240 --> 0:23:01.040 we've got now, We've got a MORPHOUSH viral in them 0:23:01.240 --> 0:23:04.680 that is frightening, that's the pandemic COVID nineteen. But we've 0:23:04.720 --> 0:23:08.680 also got the uncertainty of an economic shutdown of the economy, 0:23:08.760 --> 0:23:13.640 at least temporarily, so so people are assaulted from multiple directions. 0:23:14.200 --> 0:23:17.160 Nobody really knows how to defeat a pandemic on their own, 0:23:17.400 --> 0:23:20.720 and of course we feel helpless when the economy changes 0:23:20.760 --> 0:23:23.359 so suddenly. So I think the first thing leaders have 0:23:23.440 --> 0:23:26.600 got to do is be straight with us. Get in 0:23:26.640 --> 0:23:29.840 front of us and tell us what is known. Give 0:23:29.920 --> 0:23:33.480 us the data and and very candid terms. People can 0:23:33.480 --> 0:23:36.760 take that and you will build credibility over time, even 0:23:36.840 --> 0:23:40.040 when the treat changes. His data is updated, it's okay 0:23:40.040 --> 0:23:42.359 if you come back and say, okay, I think people 0:23:42.520 --> 0:23:46.359 need to understand what the situation is. Then the second 0:23:46.480 --> 0:23:50.640 is give people a sense of commitment. Think of Winston 0:23:50.720 --> 0:23:53.159 Churchill in summer of nineteen forty when he told the 0:23:53.200 --> 0:23:57.400 British people we will never surrender. He couldn't promise quick 0:23:57.480 --> 0:24:01.200 victory at that point everybody knew it was very very 0:24:01.240 --> 0:24:05.440 difficult to head. But what he communicated was absolute idea 0:24:05.480 --> 0:24:07.679 that we're in this together and we'll come out of 0:24:07.680 --> 0:24:10.800 it together as we will this crisis. Well, I think 0:24:10.880 --> 0:24:15.560 inspirations follows as well. Yeah, it's such an interesting point. 0:24:15.560 --> 0:24:18.920 General with Crystal because it feels like there there has 0:24:18.960 --> 0:24:21.119 been a turn, and I wonder if you agree with 0:24:21.160 --> 0:24:23.960 this over the last week or so, maybe even the 0:24:24.000 --> 0:24:29.159 last few days, that people are starting maybe to embrace 0:24:29.280 --> 0:24:34.840 that notion of shared sacrifice, individual responsibility. You know, it's 0:24:35.080 --> 0:24:38.680 sort of attaching themselves to this notion of Okay, what 0:24:38.760 --> 0:24:41.560 can I do? And part of what we can do 0:24:41.680 --> 0:24:44.439 it sounds like his nothing like stay at home, like 0:24:44.480 --> 0:24:47.800 don't go anywhere, um, but but there is a sense 0:24:47.840 --> 0:24:50.560 building And maybe I'm just being overly optimistic that people 0:24:50.560 --> 0:24:55.200 are are kind of reading that right. Well, I think 0:24:55.240 --> 0:24:59.080 that's right. I think the American people desperately want that. 0:24:59.840 --> 0:25:02.280 You know, we really haven't asked the American people to 0:25:02.480 --> 0:25:06.399 go to war it's World War two. Ever since that, 0:25:06.480 --> 0:25:09.119 we've always done limited and even after Non eleven, there 0:25:09.160 --> 0:25:11.840 was this brief period when we talked about we were 0:25:11.840 --> 0:25:14.399 all in this together, and then it kind of felt 0:25:14.440 --> 0:25:16.919 like pretty soon we weren't. So I think there's a 0:25:17.000 --> 0:25:19.720 hunger in the American people to do that. But it's 0:25:19.760 --> 0:25:22.359 going to take the idea that we're not fighting fifty 0:25:22.480 --> 0:25:26.240 separate state fights against COVID team, We're fighting a national fight. 0:25:26.400 --> 0:25:28.520 And it's not a national fight, it's a global fight. 0:25:29.119 --> 0:25:32.280 I think the American people will respond dramatically if the 0:25:32.359 --> 0:25:36.000 leadership asked them to. Yeah. I think that's a really 0:25:36.000 --> 0:25:37.920 good point. I do wonder too. You know, we keep 0:25:37.960 --> 0:25:41.600 talking about jenal McCrystal about kind of longer term impacted this. 0:25:41.640 --> 0:25:44.800 How do you think the coronavirus pandemic ultimately will change 0:25:44.840 --> 0:25:48.359 the world, you know, and specifically when we come out 0:25:48.359 --> 0:25:51.000 of this, what's the most important, in your view underappreciated 0:25:51.080 --> 0:25:55.239 way that the world will be different. Well, I'm going 0:25:55.280 --> 0:25:58.359 to throw two scenarios to the First is when societies 0:25:58.400 --> 0:26:01.800 are under pressure, sometime they unify, they come out stronger, 0:26:01.800 --> 0:26:05.159 and sometimes they fragment, like Irac did after two thousand 0:26:05.280 --> 0:26:09.240 three of the Balkans did in the So what I'm 0:26:09.280 --> 0:26:11.720 going to describe is the positive is not a guarantee. 0:26:11.880 --> 0:26:14.760 It's if we make it happen. But what I think 0:26:14.800 --> 0:26:18.960 happens is the pandemic stresses us. It reminds us that 0:26:19.080 --> 0:26:23.200 we are connected. It reminds us that global supply chains, 0:26:23.440 --> 0:26:28.199 personal relationships, everything are connected. And so we don't win alone. 0:26:28.400 --> 0:26:30.720 We don't even win in small groups. We don't even 0:26:30.760 --> 0:26:34.480 win as single entities or nations. We win more broadly 0:26:34.520 --> 0:26:37.440 than that, and if we have an appreciation for that, 0:26:37.640 --> 0:26:40.600 several things happen. One we start to think a little 0:26:40.600 --> 0:26:44.479 bit more broadly about problems like global warming, like income 0:26:44.520 --> 0:26:48.040 and equality and other things that dog society, and then 0:26:48.080 --> 0:26:50.400 I think our way of working is going to be different. 0:26:50.920 --> 0:26:52.760 It was sort of a shock to a lot of 0:26:53.040 --> 0:26:56.040 organizations and people that have to work from home, But 0:26:56.200 --> 0:26:58.720 now we're only a couple of weeks into it, really 0:26:58.840 --> 0:27:01.160 and a lot of people are fine. Didn't that they 0:27:01.200 --> 0:27:03.640 can stay connected. They've got to learn some new techniques, 0:27:04.280 --> 0:27:07.040 they can do something. So I think businesses are going 0:27:07.080 --> 0:27:09.679 to migrate to a new normal that's sort of a 0:27:09.760 --> 0:27:11.840 hybrid from where we used to be, because we won't 0:27:11.880 --> 0:27:15.040 do away with offices entirely, but we're going to do 0:27:15.119 --> 0:27:18.160 a lot more connected, which is actually going to open 0:27:18.240 --> 0:27:20.560 up our ability. It is going to widen our reaches 0:27:20.720 --> 0:27:25.959 individuals and organizations, and the most agile, the most aggressively 0:27:26.080 --> 0:27:31.440 networked organizations, whether their military organizations or businesses or governments, 0:27:31.480 --> 0:27:34.200 are going to come out really well well. And it's 0:27:34.240 --> 0:27:35.840 so interesting you say that you went exactly where I 0:27:35.840 --> 0:27:38.199 wanted to go. Next general with Crystal, which is you know, 0:27:38.320 --> 0:27:40.360 now in the private sector, you're working with a lot 0:27:40.359 --> 0:27:44.159 of companies, you advise CEOs and many others. And I 0:27:44.320 --> 0:27:49.760 do wonder, even though some similarities exist between government leaders 0:27:49.840 --> 0:27:55.200 and corporate leaders, you know, businesses ultimately have different stakeholders 0:27:55.280 --> 0:27:58.639 and employees and customers and whatnot. What are the lessons 0:27:58.720 --> 0:28:00.720 that may be a CEO and learned that might be 0:28:00.840 --> 0:28:06.080 slightly different from a military leader or a government leader. Sure, 0:28:06.760 --> 0:28:09.600 government leaders and military leaders can wrap themselves in the 0:28:09.720 --> 0:28:13.520 flag and cause and motivate people that way. Business leaders 0:28:13.720 --> 0:28:16.639 it's more difficult. You can talk about the goal of 0:28:16.720 --> 0:28:20.560 the company. But reality, business leaders had a big advantage 0:28:20.640 --> 0:28:25.760 because the pressures of the marketplace can both cause you 0:28:25.920 --> 0:28:29.159 to make dramatic turns and it can allow you to 0:28:29.240 --> 0:28:32.520 make dramatic turns. Because if you've got a company that's 0:28:32.600 --> 0:28:34.680 just making money year over year and you go to 0:28:34.760 --> 0:28:38.320 the boarder or stakeholders and say we want to change dramatically, 0:28:38.800 --> 0:28:44.280 you may not get automatic support, but a very competitive environment, 0:28:44.800 --> 0:28:49.480 then suddenly the CEO is not only allowed, but he's 0:28:50.080 --> 0:28:53.760 or she's expected to make that kind of significant change. 0:28:54.000 --> 0:28:57.080 And that's pretty liberating. Absolutely, and you know, I do 0:28:57.200 --> 0:29:00.680 wonder when you looked at the situation in Boston's spacifically 0:29:01.080 --> 0:29:03.200 and just when you look at the situation around the country, 0:29:03.240 --> 0:29:06.080 really around the world. I mean, does any of this 0:29:06.400 --> 0:29:09.960 feel um, I don't know, a little bit overwhelming and 0:29:10.080 --> 0:29:13.000 just a reminder that there are certain systems we've got 0:29:13.120 --> 0:29:14.480 to have in place. I mean, the military has to 0:29:14.520 --> 0:29:16.560 do it all the time, right, They're constantly probably asking 0:29:16.600 --> 0:29:18.280 themselves what if, what if? And we've got to have 0:29:18.720 --> 0:29:21.520 the backup systems. And I really do feel like this 0:29:22.000 --> 0:29:25.840 crisis has revealed to us how many backup systems we 0:29:25.960 --> 0:29:31.560 didn't have in our society. I think that's right, Carol. Uh. 0:29:32.640 --> 0:29:35.240 But but there's a danger. We learned this in the military. 0:29:35.320 --> 0:29:38.000 If you try to plan for contingencies, you never get 0:29:38.040 --> 0:29:41.000 it exactly right because that the risk that comes up 0:29:41.200 --> 0:29:43.560 is always a bit different. But it doesn't mean planning 0:29:43.640 --> 0:29:47.160 for contingencies, doesn't it value that's retired four star Army 0:29:47.200 --> 0:29:50.880 General Stanley McCrystal, who is leading the fight against the 0:29:51.000 --> 0:29:53.840 virus in Boston. So great to catch up with him, Jason, 0:29:53.920 --> 0:29:56.440 you know, at a Bloomberg Live event last yearne I 0:29:56.480 --> 0:29:59.640 caught up with him to talk about leadership when you're 0:29:59.640 --> 0:30:03.480 really stressed and when you have your own personal crisis. 0:30:03.560 --> 0:30:05.840 He's had to deal with that. Now he's helping the 0:30:05.920 --> 0:30:09.200 city of Boston deal with the virus pandemic and just 0:30:09.440 --> 0:30:12.320 trying to, you know, get some ideas about how best 0:30:12.360 --> 0:30:14.920 to lead in these times. And uh, I thought it 0:30:15.000 --> 0:30:16.920 was really great to just catch up with him. Well 0:30:17.040 --> 0:30:21.160 and the military metaphors they work here, and you understand 0:30:21.320 --> 0:30:24.280 that a lot of the ways that people fight real 0:30:24.520 --> 0:30:28.040 hot wars that is actually happening day to day when 0:30:28.120 --> 0:30:30.320 it comes to the coronavirus. Well, that wraps up the 0:30:30.360 --> 0:30:32.560 first hour of the weekend edition of Bloomberg Business Week 0:30:32.560 --> 0:30:35.040 from Bloomberg Radio. I'm Jason Kelley and I'm Carol mass 0:30:35.120 --> 0:30:37.080 are plenty coming up in our next hour, we'll hear 0:30:37.120 --> 0:30:41.560 from former Labor Secretary Robert Reich, provocative thoughts and writings 0:30:41.680 --> 0:30:44.840 from him about the bail out for companies. Yeah, it 0:30:44.960 --> 0:30:47.080 was interesting. After we did this conversation, I was telling 0:30:47.120 --> 0:30:50.600 my family about and they're like, interesting, Oh, mob, weigh 0:30:50.600 --> 0:30:53.800 and end really interesting conversation. There also Alan patrickof Love 0:30:53.880 --> 0:30:57.280 catching up with him four decades in the venture capital business, 0:30:57.360 --> 0:30:59.360 what he's seeing when it comes to investing in Also, 0:30:59.640 --> 0:31:01.840 he is a political animal. He had some thoughts on that, 0:31:02.200 --> 0:31:05.920 and Danielle Bleu, one of the best known chefs out 0:31:05.960 --> 0:31:08.320 there fighting a different sort of battle on behalf of 0:31:08.360 --> 0:31:17.160 the restaurant industry. This is Bloomberg. You're listening to Bloomberg 0:31:17.240 --> 0:31:20.760 Business Week from Bloomberg Radio. Hello, I'm Carol Masser and 0:31:20.800 --> 0:31:22.680 I've Jason Kelly. Today we're bringing you some of the 0:31:22.760 --> 0:31:25.640 most important, we hope informative conversations we had on our 0:31:25.760 --> 0:31:28.400 daily Bloomberg Business Week radio show that runs two to 0:31:28.480 --> 0:31:32.400 six pm Wall Street Time every weekday. Obviously all about 0:31:32.440 --> 0:31:36.080 the coronavirus, but Carol, we hope taking it a level deeper, 0:31:36.400 --> 0:31:39.040 understanding where we are now and where we may be going. 0:31:39.160 --> 0:31:41.560 That's right, Jason. So many of our conversations we're talking 0:31:41.600 --> 0:31:43.680 about what our world is like when we get on 0:31:43.720 --> 0:31:45.760 the other side of the virus. And we actually talked 0:31:45.760 --> 0:31:48.880 about that with Alan patrick Off, an early venture capitalist. 0:31:49.040 --> 0:31:51.200 He helped build and grows such companies as a O 0:31:51.440 --> 0:31:54.400 L Office Depot, Apple Computer. We caught up with him. 0:31:54.440 --> 0:31:57.960 He also is a big Democratic fundraisers, so we talked 0:31:58.000 --> 0:32:01.160 politics with him as well, and form Secretary Robert Reich. 0:32:01.520 --> 0:32:04.000 We talked with him. Yeah, I loved catching up with him. 0:32:04.040 --> 0:32:06.320 He had some bold ideas, as he often does. But 0:32:06.480 --> 0:32:10.560 first up, the restaurant industry been hit incredibly hard, effectively 0:32:10.680 --> 0:32:13.800 shut down by the coronavirus. We spoke about the situation 0:32:14.120 --> 0:32:17.680 with the world famous chef that is Danielle Blue. Well, Uh, 0:32:17.920 --> 0:32:21.080 it was an experience we didn't have a plan for. 0:32:21.920 --> 0:32:25.239 As we decided within twenty four hours to shut all 0:32:25.240 --> 0:32:32.080 our restaurants and to furlom entire staff. And of course 0:32:32.200 --> 0:32:37.000 it's devastating because um, we think we have to do it. 0:32:37.200 --> 0:32:38.640 We do the right thing. And I was one of 0:32:38.720 --> 0:32:42.400 the first to close UM together with the BERNARDA and 0:32:42.520 --> 0:32:45.720 Danny Meyer. We were we we didn't talk to each other, 0:32:45.920 --> 0:32:48.280 but we made the same decision the same day to 0:32:48.440 --> 0:32:52.440 shut all operation within the Friday, the thirteen of March, 0:32:52.800 --> 0:32:57.640 and and then following that weekend week of course everybody 0:32:57.760 --> 0:33:01.200 had to close after that. UM, we try to think 0:33:01.280 --> 0:33:08.160 of possibility of continuing to uh produce food while keeping 0:33:08.280 --> 0:33:11.840 some staff. And I felt that New York was such 0:33:12.200 --> 0:33:15.720 um a danger exposing all our stuff to try to 0:33:16.360 --> 0:33:19.480 do that. I didn't have the courage to do that. 0:33:20.520 --> 0:33:22.760 And uh does not mean we will not do it 0:33:22.920 --> 0:33:25.200 soon as New York gets a little bit better, for sure, 0:33:25.680 --> 0:33:29.360 but um, you know it's it's terrible not only for 0:33:29.480 --> 0:33:32.760 me but for everyone in our industree for having to 0:33:33.840 --> 0:33:37.360 you know, have all their staff on unemployment and people 0:33:37.400 --> 0:33:39.280 who have been with us for twenty five years. We 0:33:39.400 --> 0:33:43.360 have been through thin and take uh and and really 0:33:43.480 --> 0:33:47.080 will they's We have a lot of hope because we 0:33:47.200 --> 0:33:50.640 are doing things such as we did a charity called 0:33:50.720 --> 0:33:54.160 and in An with Daniel Bullet Foundation where we raise 0:33:54.280 --> 0:33:56.840 money for our our staff. And today we had our 0:33:56.880 --> 0:34:02.200 first meetings for distribution and we really already helped fifty 0:34:02.240 --> 0:34:07.000 people today, but uh, fifty of our stuff. That's not all, 0:34:07.160 --> 0:34:09.960 but at least it's the immediate need. And for the 0:34:10.080 --> 0:34:12.759 one we're really in our ships and I need to 0:34:12.960 --> 0:34:16.360 start to pay some bills of medicals or family or food. 0:34:17.040 --> 0:34:19.960 And we continue to raise money and we continue to 0:34:20.200 --> 0:34:25.200 support them. Of course, we also are trying to make 0:34:25.280 --> 0:34:29.080 sure that we um we have the right support. So 0:34:29.680 --> 0:34:32.480 we had a call with the President on last Sunday 0:34:32.640 --> 0:34:37.160 with Thomas Keller, Gen George, myself and both Gang Park 0:34:37.920 --> 0:34:43.040 and someone a connection through both Gang a gentleman was 0:34:44.760 --> 0:34:49.719 able to get us um A for a conversation with 0:34:49.800 --> 0:34:52.680 the President and and of course we talked about a 0:34:52.719 --> 0:34:55.400 lot of things, from the insurance situation, which is a 0:34:55.440 --> 0:34:59.640 big one right now, the business interruption. The insurance are 0:34:59.680 --> 0:35:02.960 kind of denying everything at this point. Yeah, let's talk 0:35:03.000 --> 0:35:05.680 about that if we can. Danielle, I want to pardon 0:35:05.719 --> 0:35:08.560 me for jumping in, but that is critical I think 0:35:09.040 --> 0:35:11.080 at this point, I know you've been working very hard 0:35:11.440 --> 0:35:15.000 on this insurance issue. Tell us what's going on, because 0:35:15.280 --> 0:35:17.600 you have some insurance companies, as I understand it, who 0:35:17.600 --> 0:35:21.200 aren't saying, who are essentially saying this basically doesn't qualify 0:35:21.600 --> 0:35:25.200 what's happening and what needs to happen. Well, we have 0:35:25.400 --> 0:35:30.279 a form with a with a law firm. We have 0:35:30.400 --> 0:35:34.600 formed an association called we Are Big and Big is 0:35:34.719 --> 0:35:40.319 for Business Interruption Group and we w E R BIG 0:35:40.440 --> 0:35:44.239 b I G dot org is explaining a little bit 0:35:44.600 --> 0:35:46.560 what we are trying to do and a lot of 0:35:46.640 --> 0:35:49.120 a lot of rest rater and chaff already all over 0:35:49.200 --> 0:35:52.279 the country as describing to we are Big because we 0:35:52.400 --> 0:35:56.799 feel that together we can have a voice big enough 0:35:57.040 --> 0:36:01.880 that there will be some real um ancentive for the 0:36:01.960 --> 0:36:04.800 government to work with the insurance and for the entrance 0:36:04.840 --> 0:36:08.200 to work with us, right right, And what from what 0:36:08.239 --> 0:36:10.919 I understand the lawsuit is about. You guys have said 0:36:11.000 --> 0:36:13.520 you know that says insurance companies are are wrongfully denying 0:36:13.600 --> 0:36:16.800 business interruption coverage for all businesses in the US and 0:36:16.880 --> 0:36:19.919 your in and supporting federal subsidies for insurers that pay 0:36:20.000 --> 0:36:23.759 business interruption losses caused by the coronavirus. In your conversation 0:36:23.840 --> 0:36:26.440 with the president, were you guys able to talk about this? 0:36:26.560 --> 0:36:28.480 And I wonder if there's any support for that out 0:36:28.520 --> 0:36:32.080 of the government very much, and the government are looking 0:36:32.280 --> 0:36:37.320 very deeply and carefully into that. Absolutely, the President was 0:36:37.520 --> 0:36:42.520 really concerned as well. Um, it was very open to 0:36:43.320 --> 0:36:46.800 to look at it and to really understand closely. I 0:36:46.880 --> 0:36:51.759 think he has all his legal support there too to 0:36:51.920 --> 0:36:55.480 advise him on our claims and what we are looking for. 0:36:56.719 --> 0:37:01.360 But uh, it's uh, it is um, there is a 0:37:01.440 --> 0:37:08.719 technicality who should protect us in the language of insurance, 0:37:08.800 --> 0:37:12.600 and I think that technicality has to be taken, uh 0:37:12.719 --> 0:37:15.560 to quote I guess, and that's Chef Danielle Blue. We 0:37:15.719 --> 0:37:18.359 had a hint of what he might say from our 0:37:18.400 --> 0:37:21.640 amazing Kate Crater, she follows the food world. She knows 0:37:21.680 --> 0:37:24.000 all these guys incredibly well. And I have to say 0:37:24.120 --> 0:37:27.360 he was very candid, very on point. I felt like 0:37:27.520 --> 0:37:30.200 Carol in terms of what has to happen next, and 0:37:30.320 --> 0:37:33.240 it does feel like he knows he's in a position, 0:37:33.400 --> 0:37:36.080 speaking of leadership, to lead well. Speaking of that, he 0:37:36.600 --> 0:37:38.440 and some other well known chefs were talking with the 0:37:38.520 --> 0:37:41.319 President over the past week or so, and we also 0:37:41.400 --> 0:37:44.279 heard the President talk about the restaurant industry, so they're 0:37:44.320 --> 0:37:47.160 looking for some more assistance from the government as well. 0:37:47.520 --> 0:37:50.400 You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week. Coming up a conversation 0:37:50.480 --> 0:37:54.440 with longtime venture capitalist and democratic fundraiser Alan patrick Off, 0:37:54.760 --> 0:37:58.080 the founder and managing director of grey Croft. This is Bloomberg. 0:38:03.360 --> 0:38:06.759 You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and 0:38:06.920 --> 0:38:10.120 Jason Kelly from Bloomberg Radio. We're bringing you some of 0:38:10.120 --> 0:38:13.320 the most important and informative conversations that we had throughout 0:38:13.440 --> 0:38:15.759 the week on our daily radio show. Of course, all 0:38:15.800 --> 0:38:19.279 of it related to COVID nineteen Jason, but it was 0:38:19.360 --> 0:38:21.600 talking about where we are in the world today, but 0:38:21.719 --> 0:38:24.239 also starting to look about what happens when we get 0:38:24.320 --> 0:38:27.839 out of the pandemic and what does our world look like? Well, 0:38:27.960 --> 0:38:30.200 and this is where it helps to talk to people 0:38:30.239 --> 0:38:32.560 who can give you some perspective. And no one has 0:38:32.640 --> 0:38:35.480 that like Alan patrick Off forty years as a venture 0:38:35.520 --> 0:38:39.120 capitalist now the founder and managing director at Greycroft. Check 0:38:39.160 --> 0:38:43.920 it out. Well, listen, it's very obvious. This is I think, 0:38:45.080 --> 0:38:47.319 I don't know how you go anything less than devastating 0:38:47.719 --> 0:38:52.080 to certainly small growing businesses. Uh. You know, to the 0:38:52.200 --> 0:38:55.920 companies that are larger, the ibms, the Microsofts of the world, 0:38:56.360 --> 0:39:00.440 they can withstandard Apple people with great ball and sheets 0:39:00.480 --> 0:39:02.800 and lots of cash on hand, they will be you know, 0:39:02.920 --> 0:39:06.760 they'll whether it's fine. The real challenges to the smaller companies, 0:39:07.280 --> 0:39:11.440 even small below the venture capital level, the local businesses 0:39:11.719 --> 0:39:17.000 with small shops and small whether they're industrial type companies 0:39:17.120 --> 0:39:23.080 or or retail or consumer service, they're all being severely affected. Uh. 0:39:23.200 --> 0:39:25.680 And you know, and that's going to be here for 0:39:25.760 --> 0:39:30.840 the next thirty days. I mean, this peak point we 0:39:31.040 --> 0:39:33.040 keep hearing the first it was April ninth, and it 0:39:33.160 --> 0:39:36.440 was April fifteenth, and April and now we don't know 0:39:36.560 --> 0:39:38.360 when the data is where it's been a peak, but 0:39:39.960 --> 0:39:43.680 I think we're in for a difficult kind time going forward. 0:39:43.960 --> 0:39:46.560 And so Alan, what does that mean for you? Know? 0:39:46.680 --> 0:39:49.440 You you mentioned that the big firms are are resilient. 0:39:49.480 --> 0:39:53.040 Tell us more about smaller companies because you know they 0:39:53.239 --> 0:39:56.680 have less wiggle room. You know, some of them don't 0:39:56.800 --> 0:40:00.520 have those fortress balance sheets that big come ben ease do. 0:40:01.280 --> 0:40:04.040 What's the mood among you know, the smaller companies that 0:40:04.160 --> 0:40:06.320 we know you're in touch with, well, yeah, which is 0:40:06.400 --> 0:40:11.440 my area focus. There's no question smaller companies are in 0:40:11.520 --> 0:40:15.960 a very disadvantageous position. Unless they have a very strong 0:40:16.520 --> 0:40:19.799 cash position, uh and not a lot of debts, UH, 0:40:20.040 --> 0:40:22.440 they are going to be under severe pressure. And even 0:40:22.520 --> 0:40:25.560 if they have cash, if you don't have enough cash 0:40:25.640 --> 0:40:29.799 on hand for six to twelve months at least, UH, 0:40:30.040 --> 0:40:34.320 you're gonna have real concerns and an environment where raising 0:40:34.400 --> 0:40:37.120 money is going to be harder than it's been and 0:40:37.200 --> 0:40:40.800 it's never easy. I think that you're you have already 0:40:40.880 --> 0:40:45.000 seen immediately uh significant layoffs, and I think you're going 0:40:45.040 --> 0:40:47.400 to continue to see that. I would expect the unemployment 0:40:47.480 --> 0:40:51.520 figures are going to increase dramatically, UH, and I think 0:40:51.680 --> 0:40:54.200 we're gonna be seeing that for the next couple of 0:40:54.280 --> 0:40:58.640 weeks so we get to a level point in the 0:40:58.719 --> 0:41:02.120 business world. Forget about leveling off of the flattening off 0:41:02.200 --> 0:41:06.040 of the virus curve. I think the uh problem in 0:41:06.840 --> 0:41:10.200 business layoffs it's just not people are doing gradually. They're 0:41:10.239 --> 0:41:14.600 not all acting fast. But frankly, the secrets is staying 0:41:14.640 --> 0:41:17.960 alive here is to take quick action and to not 0:41:18.200 --> 0:41:21.719 to contemplate and study the problem too long. I think 0:41:21.800 --> 0:41:27.000 that one has to get a visit in a financial 0:41:27.120 --> 0:41:30.920 shape very quickly, and which means cutting your expenses and 0:41:31.120 --> 0:41:36.320 realistically reassessing what your revenue expectations can be in this environment, 0:41:36.600 --> 0:41:38.960 and you know which customers you have are going to survive, 0:41:39.040 --> 0:41:42.600 who is going to pay you, and managing your cash. 0:41:43.440 --> 0:41:45.560 What does that mean for your portfolio companies? I mean 0:41:45.640 --> 0:41:51.200 you're invested in gaming, fintech, healthcare, software, publishing. I mean 0:41:51.239 --> 0:41:54.319 you're in so many different areas healthcare. Um, what does 0:41:54.360 --> 0:41:57.000 it mean for your portfolio companies? What are you saying 0:41:57.080 --> 0:41:59.800 to them? UM? What are your expectations in terms of 0:42:00.320 --> 0:42:03.080 their survival? We're across the board, as you just said. 0:42:03.360 --> 0:42:05.160 I mean, clearly, if you're in the right areas to 0:42:05.239 --> 0:42:09.000 health care, you're okay. If you have any kind of 0:42:09.120 --> 0:42:13.680 service that's performed from the home. Uh you mentioned a 0:42:13.800 --> 0:42:16.839 gaming where a company called Scope lead another one called Dots. 0:42:17.040 --> 0:42:19.680 Both of those are game companies that people pay on 0:42:19.800 --> 0:42:23.040 play online. They're doing very well in this environment. We 0:42:23.120 --> 0:42:28.040 have a to home delivery grocery companies, one called Thrive Markets, 0:42:28.120 --> 0:42:33.480 which is kind of a uh better less coarsely thry 0:42:34.280 --> 0:42:36.560 whole foods. And then we have another company called Box 0:42:36.920 --> 0:42:41.400 which is doing bulk delivery, which is a even cheaper cosco. 0:42:41.840 --> 0:42:45.279 So those companies are doing well and are hiring people 0:42:45.320 --> 0:42:48.320 and can't meet meet up with the demand. We have 0:42:48.440 --> 0:42:52.920 companies that are dealing with special aspects of the public market, 0:42:53.560 --> 0:42:57.759 building portfolios on online. They're doing very well. So I 0:42:57.880 --> 0:43:01.440 think it really is uh selective. And you're in a 0:43:01.520 --> 0:43:04.280 retail store chain, you've got a lot of problems. Fortunately, 0:43:04.280 --> 0:43:06.360 we don't have too many companies that are in the 0:43:06.440 --> 0:43:09.320 retail area. Most of our companies are in e commerce 0:43:09.400 --> 0:43:13.600 that are selling merchandise, and so far those seem to 0:43:13.680 --> 0:43:17.560 be holding up. But everybody has got to look to 0:43:17.719 --> 0:43:20.080 take a new look at their budget for this year 0:43:20.480 --> 0:43:24.200 and say, realistically, you know, I can't just expect that 0:43:24.360 --> 0:43:26.800 what I call a cascade of miracles, which is everything 0:43:26.920 --> 0:43:30.279 is gonna be all right, and everything's gonna turn out well, 0:43:30.400 --> 0:43:33.640 and and I think you've got to prepare for, you know, 0:43:33.880 --> 0:43:39.359 a really severe thunderstorm and perhaps a hurricane. Alan Joynes 0:43:39.440 --> 0:43:43.440 is on the phone from the Hampton's where I trust, 0:43:44.000 --> 0:43:46.160 Uh a lot of people are Alan, what's it like 0:43:46.320 --> 0:43:49.719 out there? Well, it's not, uh times square, but I 0:43:49.840 --> 0:43:53.320 think people are following the rules and staying secluded. And 0:43:53.480 --> 0:43:57.000 I think that, uh, you know, we're in my home 0:43:57.200 --> 0:44:00.880 and very tight and not having it is and not 0:44:01.120 --> 0:44:04.080 visiting anyone else, so we're like everyone else is following 0:44:04.120 --> 0:44:07.040 the rules. There are living a number of cars on 0:44:07.120 --> 0:44:09.840 the road, and there are are the only people that 0:44:09.880 --> 0:44:14.399 are open the restaurants which have take out at night 0:44:15.040 --> 0:44:17.200 and at a drug store. But other than that, everything 0:44:17.280 --> 0:44:19.520 is shut down. And that's Alan Patchcraft, the founder and 0:44:19.600 --> 0:44:23.160 managing director at gray Croft, so much more than that 0:44:23.440 --> 0:44:26.880 title might tell you, Carol. Of course I loved getting 0:44:26.920 --> 0:44:29.839 into politics with him, because you know, he's the sort 0:44:29.840 --> 0:44:32.319 of person who can refer to Joe Biden as Joe 0:44:32.480 --> 0:44:35.000 and mean it right. I mean, he knows these guys 0:44:35.480 --> 0:44:38.560 so well. He knows the political landscape, and he also 0:44:38.680 --> 0:44:42.120 knows what this may portend for Let's not forget this 0:44:42.280 --> 0:44:45.640 is a presidential election year. You're listening to Bloomberg business Week. 0:44:45.719 --> 0:44:47.400 Coming up, we're going to take a look at the 0:44:47.440 --> 0:44:49.960 team that's looking at ways to save the world. We're 0:44:50.000 --> 0:44:53.239 talking about finding a cure against the virus. We'll chat 0:44:53.280 --> 0:44:57.320 with Columbia professor Alejandro Chevez. Recently, that team was the 0:44:57.400 --> 0:45:00.640 cover of Bloomberg business Week magazine. This is a hopeful 0:45:00.680 --> 0:45:09.840 interview and this is Bloomberg. You're listening to Bloomberg Business 0:45:09.920 --> 0:45:13.680 Week with Carol Masser and Jason Kelly from Bloomberg Radio. 0:45:13.920 --> 0:45:15.480 And today we're bring you some of the most important, 0:45:15.480 --> 0:45:18.440 we hope informative conversations we had on our daily Bloomberg 0:45:18.480 --> 0:45:22.040 business Week radio show, all about the coronavirus, of course, 0:45:22.480 --> 0:45:25.440 and we know, Carol, this is at its core a 0:45:25.719 --> 0:45:29.680 medical crisis, correct and medical teams, healthcare teams around the country, 0:45:29.760 --> 0:45:32.640 around the world are all racing to find a cure. 0:45:33.040 --> 0:45:36.480 Alejandro Chavaz is one of those folks, part of the race. 0:45:36.520 --> 0:45:39.759 He's an assistant professor of pathology and biology at Columbia University. 0:45:40.080 --> 0:45:42.320 He is part of a team. As we said earlier, 0:45:42.560 --> 0:45:45.239 that's looking at ways to save the world. Listen to 0:45:45.320 --> 0:45:48.520 our conversation. Yeah, so, I think basically there's a lot 0:45:48.560 --> 0:45:50.640 of interest to see if we can develop some sort 0:45:50.640 --> 0:45:54.960 of therapeutic against COVID nineteen. Uh, there's several different teams involved, 0:45:55.040 --> 0:45:57.319 kind of the whole school you'll becoming mobilized and really 0:45:57.360 --> 0:46:00.239 trying to see what we can do. The core part 0:46:00.280 --> 0:46:03.040 of the group that was featured in Bloomberg are trying 0:46:03.040 --> 0:46:06.680 to develop several things. One or antibodies against the virus 0:46:06.760 --> 0:46:09.160 that would prevent the virus and enable to infect cells. 0:46:09.600 --> 0:46:11.839 And then two other three other teams are actually all 0:46:11.880 --> 0:46:15.239 looking for drugs that could prevent the virus either replicating 0:46:15.840 --> 0:46:19.400 um or for being infectious. And so that's kind of 0:46:19.480 --> 0:46:23.960 like what's going on, um from the kind of Bloomberg piece, right, 0:46:24.480 --> 0:46:27.560 And so Alex, you know, from the perspective of people 0:46:27.640 --> 0:46:31.319 who aren't nearly as smart as you are, help us 0:46:31.440 --> 0:46:36.840 understand what's different um about this and what those differences 0:46:36.920 --> 0:46:41.640 mean in terms of how you attack the problem. Yeah. So, uh, 0:46:41.760 --> 0:46:44.240 not all viruses are the same, you know, just like people, 0:46:44.280 --> 0:46:46.720 and so they all have little differences, and the differences 0:46:46.719 --> 0:46:49.279 between viruses can be quite large, UM, and so you 0:46:49.440 --> 0:46:51.839 can't take us something that works on flu, and I'll 0:46:51.840 --> 0:46:54.439 actually assume it's gonna work for this virus. And in fact, 0:46:54.480 --> 0:46:56.880 a lot of drugs that work on flu work on 0:46:57.000 --> 0:46:59.800 processes that this virus doesn't even use. So, you know, 0:47:00.000 --> 0:47:01.759 recingle virus has a little way that they like to 0:47:01.920 --> 0:47:04.400 get into cells, replicat inside the cells, and get out 0:47:04.440 --> 0:47:06.400 of the cells. And it turns out that in the 0:47:06.480 --> 0:47:10.040 case of coronavirus is we don't really have an approved 0:47:10.080 --> 0:47:12.920 therapy that we know for sure works on them. UM 0:47:13.160 --> 0:47:15.439 In general, they tend to just cause the common cold, 0:47:15.520 --> 0:47:18.720 and so there wasn't a huge incentive to discover a therapy. Obviously, 0:47:18.880 --> 0:47:21.200 two decades ago we had stars, and then you know, 0:47:21.280 --> 0:47:23.440 several years ago we had mers, and that should have 0:47:23.480 --> 0:47:25.520 been a wake up call that maybe this is a problem, 0:47:25.640 --> 0:47:27.560 but it obviously wasn't, and now we're kind of stuck 0:47:27.600 --> 0:47:29.440 with the current problem we have. Well, and we did 0:47:29.480 --> 0:47:31.399 feel like a theme today is that we did hear 0:47:31.520 --> 0:47:34.920 from a lot of different UM members of the healthcare 0:47:35.120 --> 0:47:37.560 or drug community about what they're working on. And I 0:47:37.600 --> 0:47:39.880 do feel like there's many things going on. What's the 0:47:39.960 --> 0:47:42.480 most promising what's the quickest, What are the most long 0:47:42.600 --> 0:47:44.960 lasting in terms of us getting the virus under control 0:47:45.040 --> 0:47:47.160 and managing it so that we can go back to 0:47:47.280 --> 0:47:50.359 living our lives safely and not worrying that every time 0:47:50.400 --> 0:47:52.839 the coronavirus comes back that we're going to go into 0:47:52.880 --> 0:47:57.520 this lockdown state. Yeah, so I think the longest treatment that, 0:47:57.640 --> 0:47:59.800 if we make it work, would probably the best is vaccines. 0:48:00.120 --> 0:48:03.600 You know, nothing beats vaccines. Vaccines has transformed the reason 0:48:03.680 --> 0:48:06.759 why we're probably alive today is vaccines UM. And so 0:48:06.840 --> 0:48:08.800 if you really could find a vaccine that was broadly 0:48:08.840 --> 0:48:12.120 active against coronaviruses, that would be amazing because they're incredibly safe, 0:48:12.200 --> 0:48:15.480 you can deliver them very easily. Um. Outside of that, 0:48:15.680 --> 0:48:17.480 I think the next sort of thing you're hoping for 0:48:17.719 --> 0:48:21.360 some sort of broad molecule that maybe inhibits some aspect 0:48:21.400 --> 0:48:24.320 of how the virus copies itself, or some aspect of 0:48:24.360 --> 0:48:27.520 how the virus kind of processes its proteins. UM. But 0:48:27.680 --> 0:48:31.160 really I think vaccines are very much going to be 0:48:31.160 --> 0:48:33.160 a great solution. But as far as an immediate solution 0:48:33.200 --> 0:48:36.279 to someone that is sick already, then the thing that's 0:48:36.280 --> 0:48:38.560 probably most likely is an existing drug that we're gonna 0:48:38.560 --> 0:48:39.759 try to see if we can make it work for 0:48:39.880 --> 0:48:43.040 this virus people get lucky or it's there's some people 0:48:43.120 --> 0:48:45.400 trying to take anybody's from those who have already mounted 0:48:45.400 --> 0:48:47.560 the expense against the virus and transferred to those who 0:48:47.840 --> 0:48:52.480 haven't had the opportunity to do that and that and that. Okay, 0:48:52.640 --> 0:48:55.240 could that be a really big tool in in fighting 0:48:55.320 --> 0:48:58.480 this Yeah, I mean that's the way they used to 0:48:58.520 --> 0:49:00.080 treat the theory back in the day, the way we 0:49:00.120 --> 0:49:03.520 actually treat like snake venom poisoning nowadays. Actually that you 0:49:03.640 --> 0:49:05.799 actually take animals and you infect them with the venom 0:49:05.800 --> 0:49:07.440 and then you take their anybodies and you can give 0:49:07.440 --> 0:49:10.560 it to people. Um. So it's tried and true. They've 0:49:10.560 --> 0:49:13.279 been doing that for like a long time, so work 0:49:13.440 --> 0:49:15.560 it would be effective. And it's interesting because we did 0:49:15.600 --> 0:49:17.839 talk to a researcher down at Johns Hopkins who's working 0:49:17.840 --> 0:49:21.240 on that project, as I'm sure you're aware of, Alex, 0:49:21.360 --> 0:49:24.640 So help us understand the sort of collaboration here and 0:49:24.800 --> 0:49:28.160 also this sense of urgency and what it ultimately means 0:49:28.239 --> 0:49:30.680 and how the work gets done, because you know, I 0:49:30.760 --> 0:49:33.560 think the story was relatively clear about the idea and 0:49:33.640 --> 0:49:36.200 you've alluded to this that you're trying to cram literally 0:49:36.360 --> 0:49:39.640 years of work into a much much shorter period. What 0:49:39.840 --> 0:49:43.400 what what's the given take there? Yeah, I think the 0:49:43.640 --> 0:49:45.960 thing that's been amazing about this whole opportunity is really 0:49:46.320 --> 0:49:48.919 barriers and walls have really come down. I mean, I've 0:49:48.960 --> 0:49:52.240 never seen people so agreeable, so happy to work together, 0:49:52.440 --> 0:49:55.560 so open sharing information, which has been amazing. I think 0:49:55.600 --> 0:49:57.759 it's it's transformative for us. We all push things forward. 0:49:58.040 --> 0:50:00.200 Also administratively, I think people would get the origin see 0:50:00.239 --> 0:50:02.759 and so they're all jumping to do what they can. Um. 0:50:03.120 --> 0:50:05.160 But there's some aspect of you. You have to do 0:50:05.239 --> 0:50:07.160 good science right. We don't want to hurry in Russia 0:50:07.200 --> 0:50:09.680 sloppy solution because that doesn't help anyone. And if we 0:50:09.760 --> 0:50:12.120 get it wrong, that could really be detrimental because once 0:50:12.520 --> 0:50:15.080 you know, once things become dogma, they're very hard to break, right, 0:50:15.120 --> 0:50:17.600 So once someone thinks that this is a solution, it's 0:50:17.640 --> 0:50:19.480 gonna be tough too if we find out later that 0:50:19.560 --> 0:50:21.200 it's not to get people to move away from it. 0:50:21.560 --> 0:50:24.920 So I think we're being uh quick moving, but also prudent. 0:50:25.160 --> 0:50:28.240 That's Alejandro Chavez, a sistant professor of Pathology and Biology 0:50:28.280 --> 0:50:30.600 at Columbia University, part of a team. They were recently 0:50:30.680 --> 0:50:33.360 featured on the cover of the magazine business Week magazine. 0:50:33.480 --> 0:50:35.399 They truly are looking at ways to save the world. 0:50:35.480 --> 0:50:39.840 And Jason, this is certainly a medical story, a healthcare crisis, 0:50:39.920 --> 0:50:41.879 and everyone around the world is trying to figure out 0:50:42.000 --> 0:50:45.320 how do we stop the virus. I really enjoyed that conversation. 0:50:45.440 --> 0:50:47.840 He's someone we are definitely going to keep in touch with. 0:50:47.960 --> 0:50:50.839 You're listening to Bloomberg business Week coming up former US 0:50:50.920 --> 0:50:54.160 Labor Secretary Robert Reich. He's always got a hot take, 0:50:54.600 --> 0:50:58.279 and today he's talking about corporate pailouts. This is Bloomberg. 0:51:03.440 --> 0:51:06.840 You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and 0:51:07.000 --> 0:51:09.920 Jason Kelly from Bloomberg Radio. We're bringing you some of 0:51:09.920 --> 0:51:12.319 the most important and informative conversations we had in our 0:51:12.400 --> 0:51:14.880 daily radio show about the virus this week. And we 0:51:14.960 --> 0:51:18.000 did this, of course, Jason, as the news continued to unfold, 0:51:18.360 --> 0:51:20.839 right and we were so eager and excited to catch 0:51:20.960 --> 0:51:23.480 up with former Labor Secretary Robert Rice. She's now a 0:51:23.560 --> 0:51:27.120 professor at u C. Berkeley, but still keeping a very 0:51:27.239 --> 0:51:30.520 close eye on politics and policy. He's got a new 0:51:30.640 --> 0:51:33.719 book out, and he has a take specifically right now 0:51:34.320 --> 0:51:38.040 about corporate bailouts. Well, we need all of the taxpayer 0:51:38.080 --> 0:51:42.680 money we possibly have right now for individuals. That bill 0:51:42.840 --> 0:51:47.720 that was signed into law. Uh, it provides per person 0:51:48.800 --> 0:51:51.759 just a one time payment. Now, I don't know how 0:51:51.840 --> 0:51:55.080 many people listening to this program can get by for 0:51:55.239 --> 0:52:00.280 very long on. The typical American earns about US thousand 0:52:00.280 --> 0:52:04.680 dollars a week and has expenditures that are just about 0:52:04.760 --> 0:52:08.920 that much per week, but is not going to extend 0:52:09.239 --> 0:52:12.239 nearly far enough in this pandemic, which is estimated to 0:52:12.360 --> 0:52:16.000 be uh two months, three months, possibly even four months. 0:52:16.760 --> 0:52:20.840 On the other hand, we agreed or at least provided 0:52:20.920 --> 0:52:25.640 in that bill for five hundred billion dollars of bailouts 0:52:26.280 --> 0:52:31.520 two very big companies, including airlines and Boeing and a 0:52:31.640 --> 0:52:35.880 lot of other big companies and industries. Well, here's the issue. 0:52:36.200 --> 0:52:38.279 I think we should have learned this in the big 0:52:38.320 --> 0:52:41.560 bank bail out of two thousand eight. Uh. These companies 0:52:42.320 --> 0:52:47.839 have been in bankruptcy many times before. They know how 0:52:47.960 --> 0:52:52.040 to use the bankruptcy laws to get to reorganize their debts. 0:52:52.480 --> 0:52:54.320 It's not as if they have no collateral. They have 0:52:54.360 --> 0:52:57.280 a lot of assets. I mean, the airlines have planes 0:52:57.480 --> 0:52:59.680 and landing slots. They're going to be worth a lot 0:53:00.080 --> 0:53:03.640 to the economy is back on track. The ships, the 0:53:03.760 --> 0:53:06.759 cruise ships of the hotel industry. I mean you talk 0:53:06.800 --> 0:53:13.160 about assets, these organizations, these corporations have very very large assets, 0:53:13.719 --> 0:53:17.000 and yet individuals have a great need right now. So 0:53:17.160 --> 0:53:20.319 I say, rather than bail out companies, let's bail out 0:53:20.360 --> 0:53:22.000 of people. If there is going to be a fourth 0:53:22.719 --> 0:53:27.200 co coronavirus relief bill coming up, and it looks like 0:53:27.320 --> 0:53:30.040 there will be, let's focus it on people rather than 0:53:30.120 --> 0:53:32.600 on corporations. Well, and I want to talk to you 0:53:32.640 --> 0:53:35.640 about that fourth bill because it's going to include some infrastructure. 0:53:35.640 --> 0:53:37.560 I really want to get your thoughts on that, Bob. 0:53:37.640 --> 0:53:39.800 But before we get to that, I do want to 0:53:40.080 --> 0:53:42.320 ask you because I think this speaks exactly to what 0:53:42.400 --> 0:53:44.359 you write about in your book. I mean, clearly, part 0:53:44.440 --> 0:53:47.080 of what's going on here is the system is set 0:53:47.200 --> 0:53:50.560 up to do exactly what you described as the wrong 0:53:50.760 --> 0:53:54.080 thing in many ways, which is companies have an inordinate 0:53:54.120 --> 0:53:57.120 amount of power and influence in Washington to get that 0:53:57.360 --> 0:54:01.719 half a trillion dollars right exactly and that's that's the problem. Now. 0:54:01.840 --> 0:54:06.560 You would have thought in times of national disaster emergency, 0:54:07.239 --> 0:54:12.320 certainly in wartime all of those old power relationships suspended 0:54:12.719 --> 0:54:16.160 and companies stand and the government understands that we've got 0:54:16.239 --> 0:54:21.239 to make the first priority human beings and safety. But 0:54:21.640 --> 0:54:24.680 this time around we didn't quite get there. Now, there 0:54:24.719 --> 0:54:27.440 are some things in the bill that are good, unemployment 0:54:27.480 --> 0:54:31.319 insurance six dollars over and above the unemployment people are 0:54:31.520 --> 0:54:34.440 eligible for. That's a step in the right direction. But 0:54:34.600 --> 0:54:38.400 if there is a fourth bill, let's just not worry 0:54:38.520 --> 0:54:43.040 about big companies. Let's worry about small businesses and individuals 0:54:43.120 --> 0:54:46.759 and families. They're the ones that need the help. Well. 0:54:46.800 --> 0:54:49.080 And you know what's interesting, because we've been having this conversation, 0:54:49.440 --> 0:54:51.719 um Bob with a lot of our guests here and 0:54:51.960 --> 0:54:54.080 and some say, well, you can't let these companies go down. 0:54:54.280 --> 0:54:57.000 You know they this is who could have guessed this 0:54:57.120 --> 0:55:00.080 black swan right, Nobody could have been prepared for it. 0:55:00.280 --> 0:55:02.120 I mean, what do you say to them? And and 0:55:02.239 --> 0:55:04.480 and and these folks will also say, you know, these 0:55:04.520 --> 0:55:06.799 companies employ a lot of workers. So by taking care 0:55:06.840 --> 0:55:09.640 of these companies were taking care of the workers. Um, 0:55:10.000 --> 0:55:13.320 what's your response, Well, the companies are letting off workers 0:55:13.520 --> 0:55:16.640 right and left. In fact, this week, big companies are 0:55:16.719 --> 0:55:20.440 laying off probably several million additional American workers in addition 0:55:20.520 --> 0:55:22.680 to those who were laid off last week and the 0:55:22.719 --> 0:55:26.399 week before. So what is the point of taking care 0:55:26.440 --> 0:55:29.120 of big companies that will exist? I mean these come, 0:55:29.320 --> 0:55:33.120 United Airlines isn't going anywhere. American Airlines isn't going anywhere. 0:55:33.160 --> 0:55:35.600 These companies are three or four or five months from 0:55:35.640 --> 0:55:37.879 now as still going to be there. It's the height 0:55:37.920 --> 0:55:40.560 of folly to think that these companies can't take care 0:55:40.600 --> 0:55:43.719 of them those and again, just if we're talking about 0:55:43.719 --> 0:55:47.799 the airlines, every major airline has gone through bankruptcy over 0:55:47.840 --> 0:55:50.719 the past twenty years at least once in order to 0:55:50.800 --> 0:55:54.840 rearrange its debts, and its creditors know how they do it, 0:55:55.000 --> 0:55:57.440 and its creditors are willing to let them do it 0:55:57.520 --> 0:56:01.160 because of all the assets they have. These companies are contracted. 0:56:01.320 --> 0:56:04.120 There are a bunch of contracts, they are a bunch 0:56:04.200 --> 0:56:08.719 of executives top executives, and they are some big investors. 0:56:09.239 --> 0:56:14.480 But none of those requires or deserves a bailout, particularly 0:56:14.560 --> 0:56:16.799 at a time when so many individuals and so many 0:56:16.880 --> 0:56:20.520 families are being such are being hit hard hits, so 0:56:20.719 --> 0:56:24.120 hard hits. This is a health emergency. Not only do 0:56:24.200 --> 0:56:27.440 we want to get income income support to people and families, 0:56:27.480 --> 0:56:30.480 we want to get healthcare support to people and families 0:56:30.960 --> 0:56:33.000 who need it. And we ought to we ought to 0:56:33.000 --> 0:56:36.560 do it immediately. How much do you worry about the 0:56:37.440 --> 0:56:41.680 essentially sort of fracturing of the healthcare uh system? You know, 0:56:41.840 --> 0:56:45.560 based on the stresses that you're seeing there. Oh, I'm 0:56:45.640 --> 0:56:47.560 very worried about it, as we all should be, because 0:56:47.680 --> 0:56:49.960 all the reports we're getting from all over the country 0:56:50.160 --> 0:56:53.520 is that our health care system is already at capacity, 0:56:53.600 --> 0:56:56.640 if not over capacity. In places like New York, we're 0:56:56.640 --> 0:56:59.239 finding a hospitals just can't deal with all of the 0:56:59.320 --> 0:57:03.480 people who need desperately a need help of ventilators, and 0:57:03.719 --> 0:57:08.760 I see us uh and even people inside the hospital, nurses, 0:57:08.960 --> 0:57:13.440 orderly doctors that can't find the protective equipment that they need. Uh. 0:57:13.960 --> 0:57:17.840 We'll find that the entire health care system is flooded 0:57:18.400 --> 0:57:21.800 to way, way beyond its capacity within the next two 0:57:21.960 --> 0:57:24.520 or three weeks. I think the big question for the 0:57:24.640 --> 0:57:29.760 future is whether, having experienced all this, Americans change their 0:57:29.880 --> 0:57:35.640 minds about whether healthcare ought to be organized as now 0:57:35.920 --> 0:57:40.880 is largely as a for profit corporate venture, or whether 0:57:41.000 --> 0:57:43.520 we do need to think about a different kind of 0:57:43.560 --> 0:57:46.640 healthcare system. Well, and that's what I was curious about. 0:57:46.720 --> 0:57:51.320 You know what what you see how the coronavirus pandemic 0:57:51.480 --> 0:57:55.200 will ultimately change our world? You know? You know how 0:57:55.560 --> 0:57:58.240 you know, once we get emerged from the immediate crisis, 0:57:58.320 --> 0:58:00.280 what's the most important and your view under you see 0:58:00.320 --> 0:58:04.360 a way that the world um will be different. Well, 0:58:04.440 --> 0:58:08.440 if you look at how wars have changed public attitudes 0:58:08.480 --> 0:58:10.920 in the United States, and I'm thinking particularly of the 0:58:11.000 --> 0:58:16.680 Second World War, America was able to accept certain kinds 0:58:16.720 --> 0:58:22.360 of changes that really the country didn't want to accept before. Look, 0:58:22.640 --> 0:58:25.520 and that's true also the Great Depression. It's because of 0:58:25.560 --> 0:58:29.360 the Great Depression that we were able to institutional and 0:58:29.480 --> 0:58:33.280 social security, something that we uh would not have have 0:58:33.760 --> 0:58:37.920 had the political and social capacity for accepting. Uh. The 0:58:38.000 --> 0:58:41.720 same thing with medicare after the Second World War in 0:58:41.840 --> 0:58:47.160 nineteen Medicare was again something that although it's very popular 0:58:47.280 --> 0:58:51.440 now as is social security, at that time, we accepted 0:58:51.520 --> 0:58:53.880 it because we felt like we were all in this together. 0:58:54.040 --> 0:58:57.320 We had emerged from not only the World War two 0:58:57.400 --> 0:59:00.040 but also the Korean War and the Cold War. We 0:59:00.120 --> 0:59:01.600 were still in the clod War. We were all in 0:59:01.680 --> 0:59:05.440 it together. I think that after this pandemic, it is 0:59:05.520 --> 0:59:08.240 possible now I'm I hope, I'm not looking at it 0:59:08.360 --> 0:59:11.360 through two rosy colored glasses, but I think it is 0:59:11.400 --> 0:59:14.880 possible that we may understand that, at least with regard 0:59:15.000 --> 0:59:19.920 to minimum safety nets and minimum healthcare, we need to 0:59:20.000 --> 0:59:23.400 do much more for our country and each other than 0:59:23.480 --> 0:59:27.200 we are doing now. We can't ever afford to find 0:59:27.280 --> 0:59:31.400 ourselves so unprepared and so uh with so lacking in 0:59:31.480 --> 0:59:35.240 the basics. The richest country in the world can't even 0:59:36.600 --> 0:59:38.760 make sure that all of its people are safe. That 0:59:38.880 --> 0:59:42.200 makes no sense. And will this, Bob, do you think 0:59:42.240 --> 0:59:45.640 in the short term, or if there is a different 0:59:45.760 --> 0:59:50.720 administration come next January, will it change the way certain 0:59:50.840 --> 0:59:54.600 governmental entities, including maybe the one that that you oversaw, 0:59:55.000 --> 0:59:57.800 will it change the way they operate given what we've 0:59:57.920 --> 1:00:00.920 seen in this crisis. Well, let me say this, It's 1:00:00.920 --> 1:00:03.440 hard to know obviously what what's going to change and 1:00:03.520 --> 1:00:05.840 what's not going to change, But I think Americans as 1:00:05.880 --> 1:00:09.800 a whole are gaining a deeper appreciation of how important 1:00:09.880 --> 1:00:14.200 government is and when government does not really function as 1:00:14.320 --> 1:00:17.640 it should most of the time, for most of us, 1:00:17.720 --> 1:00:20.640 it's just an irritation. Now it's a matter of life 1:00:20.680 --> 1:00:23.640 and death, and I think that changes the calculation, It 1:00:23.800 --> 1:00:27.480 changes the stakes, and people emerging Americans emerging from this 1:00:27.640 --> 1:00:30.600 may say, we may say to ourselves, now, again there's 1:00:30.600 --> 1:00:32.920 no guarantee, but we may say to ourselves, you know, 1:00:33.120 --> 1:00:36.880 we really do have to have a government that works well, 1:00:37.080 --> 1:00:41.120 that functions well. We cannot have leadership and people in 1:00:41.200 --> 1:00:43.880 responsible positions that don't know what they're doing. We've got 1:00:43.920 --> 1:00:46.919 to have a public health system that is the best 1:00:47.000 --> 1:00:50.400 in the world. Why not? And that's former Labor Secretary 1:00:50.600 --> 1:00:53.520 Robert Reich. Really excited to catch up with him, and 1:00:53.760 --> 1:00:58.200 not surprisingly, Carroll, he has some very specific opinions, but 1:00:58.400 --> 1:01:01.920 also some solutions. I really appreciated that about what we 1:01:02.080 --> 1:01:05.320 might be thinking about next, because let's be honest, the stimulus, 1:01:05.600 --> 1:01:08.160 the government, your action, it ain't over. And that wraps 1:01:08.240 --> 1:01:10.760 up the weekend edition of Bloomberg Business Week from Bloomberg Radio. 1:01:10.840 --> 1:01:12.720 Thanks so much for joining us. I'm Jason Kelly and 1:01:12.760 --> 1:01:14.880 I'm Carol mass Or be sort of tune into Bloomberg 1:01:14.920 --> 1:01:17.520 Business Week Radio Live Monday through Friday, starting at two 1:01:17.520 --> 1:01:19.680 pm Wall Street Time, and you can't catch us live, 1:01:19.760 --> 1:01:22.840 get our daily podcast wherever you download your podcast. You 1:01:22.880 --> 1:01:25.200 can also watch the show live on YouTube. Just search 1:01:25.360 --> 1:01:28.120 for Bloomberg Global News and get the latest edition of 1:01:28.160 --> 1:01:30.800 the magazine on newstands now. We'll be back next week 1:01:30.960 --> 1:01:33.160 at the same time. This is Bloomberg