WEBVTT - Shrinkage with The Shrink Chicks 0:00:00.480 --> 0:00:04.640 Hell I Suck At Dating with Denglert and Dared Haven 0:00:05.280 --> 0:00:11.320 Heart Radio podcast. Hey, welcome to an all new episode 0:00:11.320 --> 0:00:14.960 of Help I Suck at Dating. It is myself Dean 0:00:15.360 --> 0:00:19.279 and we're still joined by Anna who's graciously coming back 0:00:19.320 --> 0:00:22.400 on for a second podcast, and we have two very 0:00:22.520 --> 0:00:26.840 wonderful guests from the podcast Shrink Chicks. It is Emily 0:00:27.120 --> 0:00:30.280 and Jen. Emily and Jen, how the hell are you? 0:00:31.400 --> 0:00:33.120 You know? Where to? We're great, we have a really 0:00:33.120 --> 0:00:35.479 good visual, we got babies, we got dogs here. This 0:00:35.520 --> 0:00:38.839 is gonna be a wonderful episode. Um, but we're psyched 0:00:38.840 --> 0:00:41.239 to be here. We're two licensed marriage of emmy therapists 0:00:41.240 --> 0:00:44.199 and sex therapists and we love helping people get a 0:00:44.200 --> 0:00:46.559 little bit better at dating and relationships. Even if it's 0:00:46.600 --> 0:00:49.240 just a little bit, just an issue. You could help 0:00:49.320 --> 0:00:51.000 us suck a little bit last. We've been trying for 0:00:51.200 --> 0:00:54.680 years and trust me, it's still is. We're not going anywhere. Okay, 0:00:54.720 --> 0:00:58.000 we'll make one inch of progress today for Everything podcast. 0:00:58.080 --> 0:01:00.320 We're not looking for miracles, but a little little, a 0:01:00.360 --> 0:01:02.880 little becomes a lot. Okay, that's a promise. We're gonna 0:01:02.920 --> 0:01:05.280 hold you to that one inch. That's all we need. UM, 0:01:05.280 --> 0:01:06.880 it's great to have you guys here. It's nice you 0:01:06.880 --> 0:01:09.720 guys are your presence on the podcast, it's it's it's 0:01:09.840 --> 0:01:14.560 very obvious you guys are really good podcasting presences. I 0:01:14.600 --> 0:01:18.040 have to say it took us some time. Yeah, do 0:01:18.160 --> 0:01:19.880 that just made we have a face for radio. Like, 0:01:19.959 --> 0:01:21.520 isn't that a thing you said? You're like, you want 0:01:21.520 --> 0:01:24.360 to know what these girls these girls to say. But 0:01:24.600 --> 0:01:26.800 I will say this. We talk for a living, spend 0:01:26.800 --> 0:01:31.120 every day helping wonderful people improve their lives and relationships. 0:01:31.120 --> 0:01:33.840 That's what we specialize in. And one of the cool 0:01:33.880 --> 0:01:36.800 things about podcasting is a lot of people are free 0:01:36.840 --> 0:01:39.600 to have by therapy. So why not make this information 0:01:39.720 --> 0:01:43.040 totally accessible. Let's not gate keep this. Let's help everyone 0:01:43.160 --> 0:01:46.080 move a little bit farther along and normalize that, normalize 0:01:46.120 --> 0:01:48.400 it healthy, make it more relatable. Did you guys, are 0:01:48.440 --> 0:01:51.000 you guys friends that are both therapists or are you 0:01:51.240 --> 0:01:53.680 therapists that became friends that if that makes sense? We 0:01:53.760 --> 0:01:55.480 met in grad school. We met in grad school, so 0:01:55.520 --> 0:01:58.600 as we were becoming therapists, we were also becoming friends. 0:01:59.320 --> 0:02:02.120 So why did you want to become a therapist? Um, 0:02:02.160 --> 0:02:04.440 you know, I think there's a bunch of reasons where 0:02:04.720 --> 0:02:06.840 I personally was always the friend that everyone went to. 0:02:06.960 --> 0:02:10.440 It came really naturally for me. Um went to therapy 0:02:10.480 --> 0:02:13.520 at a very young age, had an amazing therapist, and 0:02:13.560 --> 0:02:18.160 then had some other therapy experiences that weren't so great. Um. 0:02:18.200 --> 0:02:20.600 So it's just something that I think was really natural 0:02:20.840 --> 0:02:23.160 for the both of us. I'm a spiteful human. I 0:02:23.200 --> 0:02:24.600 went to a bunche of therapist that I hated, and 0:02:24.639 --> 0:02:26.960 I said I could do this better, and that is 0:02:27.000 --> 0:02:30.359 basically how. But I think in general, we're always very 0:02:30.360 --> 0:02:34.800 interested in how relationships worked in you know, dating ourselves. 0:02:34.840 --> 0:02:37.720 I was someone who desperately wanted to be loved, desperately 0:02:37.720 --> 0:02:40.359 wanted to be in relationships, and was always desperately and 0:02:40.440 --> 0:02:43.040 needy about it. And so I think by trying to 0:02:43.080 --> 0:02:45.400 figure out our own ship, it was really helpful to 0:02:45.400 --> 0:02:47.359 look at other people's and go along the journey. Because 0:02:47.400 --> 0:02:49.280 we believe that you can only take your clients as 0:02:49.320 --> 0:02:52.720 far as you're willing to go yourself. Yeah that's fair. Um. 0:02:52.760 --> 0:02:54.360 I noticed you guys at the beginning, you said you're 0:02:54.400 --> 0:02:56.600 not You started the podcast because you didn't want to 0:02:56.880 --> 0:02:59.400 keep any information that you have, which I think is great. Um, 0:02:59.560 --> 0:03:01.680 my question for you is, have you noticed like a 0:03:01.720 --> 0:03:06.320 paradigm shift towards like the destigmatization of therapy because I 0:03:06.360 --> 0:03:07.880 feel like a lot more people are talking about it, 0:03:07.880 --> 0:03:10.320 a lot more people are open about going to it. Um, 0:03:10.520 --> 0:03:12.400 have you guys noticed that within the profession at all? 0:03:12.639 --> 0:03:15.679 A thousand percent? It's like the cool thing to do now, 0:03:15.880 --> 0:03:20.120 is they My therapist said, right, I mean there's all 0:03:20.120 --> 0:03:21.800 these things. I think that there was a really great 0:03:21.880 --> 0:03:24.079 meme going around that said like baby boomers would be 0:03:24.120 --> 0:03:27.720 like my therapist said, and like you know, millennials and 0:03:27.800 --> 0:03:29.480 gen z are like, let me can tell you about this. 0:03:29.680 --> 0:03:32.200 My therapist se so like it's just a difference in 0:03:32.240 --> 0:03:35.720 generational about like accepting help and knowing that we don't 0:03:35.720 --> 0:03:37.520 have to be experts and everything. And I think also 0:03:37.640 --> 0:03:40.720 for a long time, especially couples therapy, it was done 0:03:40.760 --> 0:03:43.360 as a punishment. If we don't figure this out, I'm 0:03:43.360 --> 0:03:46.040 gonna make us go see a couple's therapist. The thing is, 0:03:46.280 --> 0:03:49.200 a couple's therapy shouldn't be about a discipline or punishment. 0:03:49.240 --> 0:03:51.400 It should be about because like we want this to 0:03:51.480 --> 0:03:54.840 be really awesome. And also because we have this next 0:03:54.880 --> 0:03:57.480 generation of people. We also don't want to screw up 0:03:57.800 --> 0:04:00.000 a lot of us. Our parents should have been in therapy. 0:04:00.680 --> 0:04:04.240 They just and for many of us, we say this 0:04:04.520 --> 0:04:06.960 if if the generation above us had done the work, 0:04:07.000 --> 0:04:08.720 we wouldn't have had to do so much. So for 0:04:08.840 --> 0:04:11.720 many of especially that are becoming parents as well now, 0:04:12.280 --> 0:04:14.040 we want it to be different for the next generation. 0:04:14.040 --> 0:04:17.440 And I think that's really cool. Yeah, definitely, do you 0:04:17.480 --> 0:04:19.240 guys want to know? One of my biggest pet peeves 0:04:19.279 --> 0:04:20.680 is one of the one of the things that gives 0:04:20.680 --> 0:04:24.320 me the biggest if you will, is when, uh, I'm 0:04:24.360 --> 0:04:26.680 sure every one of us can attest this to Anna 0:04:26.680 --> 0:04:29.640 and Jared specifically, because you know, you put yourself out 0:04:29.680 --> 0:04:31.800 in the public eye and people feel like they have 0:04:32.240 --> 0:04:34.359 an obligation to tell you a bunch of things. My 0:04:34.440 --> 0:04:39.320 biggest pet peeve is when someone says, oh, you need therapy. 0:04:39.560 --> 0:04:42.320 And the reason it makes me so angry is because 0:04:42.680 --> 0:04:45.240 not that they're wrong, because I think everyone could benefit 0:04:45.240 --> 0:04:48.200 from therapy, but what they're basically saying is, Hey, there's 0:04:48.200 --> 0:04:50.400 something really wrong with you, and I think you benefit 0:04:50.400 --> 0:04:53.640 by going to see a therapist about it. Where it's like, okay, 0:04:53.640 --> 0:04:56.279 like are you saying that I don't know, just something 0:04:56.279 --> 0:05:00.840 about it really just irks me so much exactly. So 0:05:01.040 --> 0:05:04.520 it's also right, it absolutely stigmatizes therapy because in the end, 0:05:04.600 --> 0:05:08.240 we could all benefit from therapy, right, And I think 0:05:08.240 --> 0:05:10.280 that that's that's part of the issue, is that we 0:05:10.360 --> 0:05:12.839 say you have to be in such a horrible place 0:05:12.920 --> 0:05:15.760 to go to therapy, as opposed to like, no, we're 0:05:15.800 --> 0:05:18.159 all human beings, like there are all things that we 0:05:18.200 --> 0:05:22.960 struggle with and it can be beneficial for everyone. And 0:05:23.040 --> 0:05:25.880 so I think that that's that it almost adds to 0:05:25.920 --> 0:05:29.000 the stigmatization of therapy by saying that. And I think 0:05:29.040 --> 0:05:31.360 one of these we you know, we work with lots 0:05:31.360 --> 0:05:34.200 of people have put their lives out for the world 0:05:34.240 --> 0:05:36.440 to see in some ways, and people think because you 0:05:36.480 --> 0:05:39.120 consent to a certain part of means you can consent 0:05:39.520 --> 0:05:42.800 to the terrorizing you experience on social media, which I 0:05:42.839 --> 0:05:45.839 do not agree with. Just because somebody chooses to share 0:05:45.920 --> 0:05:48.480 parts of themselves with you does not mean that I 0:05:48.520 --> 0:05:51.440 owe you everything. And that goes back to a larger 0:05:51.440 --> 0:05:54.920 conversation about like paras social relationships and like what I 0:05:54.960 --> 0:05:57.200 owe to you because I choose to put myself out there, 0:05:57.200 --> 0:06:01.039 which is actually nothing and you're all only right, the 0:06:01.040 --> 0:06:03.400 world is only seeing a certain part of you. They're 0:06:03.400 --> 0:06:06.039 not seeing all aspects of you, and so I think 0:06:06.040 --> 0:06:08.760 it can be so polarizing for people right there only 0:06:08.800 --> 0:06:12.040 seeing this one specific part. That's like entertaining for people 0:06:12.080 --> 0:06:15.159 as opposed to like, here's my whole backstory, here's everything 0:06:15.200 --> 0:06:17.520 that has gone on that has led up to this point, 0:06:17.960 --> 0:06:21.919 which is where empathy really develops, is our ability to 0:06:22.040 --> 0:06:25.839 see the whole aspect, the entire context that we grew 0:06:25.920 --> 0:06:29.680 up in and what has led us to this point. Yeah. 0:06:29.800 --> 0:06:43.800 Absolutely So for you guys, what's uh, what do you 0:06:43.880 --> 0:06:47.040 find people coming to you most in terms of like 0:06:47.080 --> 0:06:51.080 what they're looking for for help with? Is it relationship stuff? 0:06:51.240 --> 0:06:53.919 Is it personal stuff? Is it like child driven stuff? 0:06:53.960 --> 0:06:55.599 Do you guys notice like a trend in terms of 0:06:55.640 --> 0:06:58.160 anything like that? Okay, I will say we've noticed a 0:06:58.240 --> 0:07:00.680 very big trend when we started, when we started being 0:07:00.640 --> 0:07:03.360 a couple of therapists ten years ago, people were always 0:07:03.360 --> 0:07:05.800 coming in as a last ditch effort. I'm about to 0:07:05.839 --> 0:07:08.760 get divorced, I'm about to walk out. This is people 0:07:08.760 --> 0:07:09.920 will call up. I mean, I can't even tell you 0:07:09.920 --> 0:07:12.160 how often we get phone calls and say we're calling 0:07:12.200 --> 0:07:14.440 up as the last ditch effort. Well, if there's not 0:07:14.520 --> 0:07:16.040 much I can do, when you've already called the lawyer, 0:07:16.080 --> 0:07:19.000 I gotta tell you that when you have already like already, yes, 0:07:19.040 --> 0:07:22.440 you're already out. So ten years ago it was last 0:07:22.520 --> 0:07:27.600 ditch effort for couples therapy. Now it's Hey, I've heard 0:07:27.640 --> 0:07:29.840 other people a couple of therapy change their life. I 0:07:29.880 --> 0:07:31.160 have heard that I want to be better. So I 0:07:31.240 --> 0:07:35.600 think now it's much more about growth and compassionate curiosity 0:07:35.640 --> 0:07:38.600 about your partner. I think on an individual level, a 0:07:38.680 --> 0:07:40.600 lot of it is I do not want to be 0:07:40.680 --> 0:07:43.200 like my parents. I don't want to make the same thing. 0:07:43.280 --> 0:07:44.920 I don't want to make the same decisions they did, 0:07:45.280 --> 0:07:47.400 And whether I am going down the same path where 0:07:47.400 --> 0:07:50.160 I realized that I'm overcorrecting and trying so hard to 0:07:50.160 --> 0:07:52.600 not be my parents, I'm going the other way. I 0:07:52.600 --> 0:07:55.840 think it's really about like the personal growth aspect. But honestly, 0:07:55.880 --> 0:07:58.000 in the past decade we've seen a massive change, and 0:07:58.000 --> 0:08:00.280 I think it often happens when people are at these 0:08:00.320 --> 0:08:03.840 like transitional points in their lives, right like if they're 0:08:03.840 --> 0:08:07.200 going for it to from graduating college into the workforce, 0:08:07.240 --> 0:08:09.440 if they're getting into a relationship, if they're playing on 0:08:09.440 --> 0:08:11.640 getting married, if they just had kids, if they're struggling 0:08:11.640 --> 0:08:13.880 to have kids. Right like that, there's all these really 0:08:14.400 --> 0:08:18.120 these pain points in transitions that can be really hard. Um. 0:08:18.200 --> 0:08:20.280 So is it one specific thing? I would say no, 0:08:20.760 --> 0:08:23.320 but it touches it ends up people might come in 0:08:23.360 --> 0:08:25.200 and say, oh, like I have this one specific thing 0:08:25.200 --> 0:08:27.640 I actually talk about in my relationship, it ends up 0:08:27.680 --> 0:08:31.400 going into deeper childhood stuff. Right, Even if they're coming 0:08:31.400 --> 0:08:35.800 in for one specific thing, it ends up getting deeper. Um, 0:08:35.840 --> 0:08:38.400 even if that's not what they came in for. Right, 0:08:38.520 --> 0:08:40.319 that makes sense. I Caitlin and I have been to 0:08:40.320 --> 0:08:41.840 a couple of therapy a couple of times, and it's 0:08:41.840 --> 0:08:43.560 always when we're like in the middle of an argument 0:08:43.559 --> 0:08:45.400 and we're like, this will help us, but reality, we 0:08:45.400 --> 0:08:47.040 should be going to a couple of therapy even when 0:08:47.040 --> 0:08:50.360 things are going well. So exactly, we talked about it 0:08:50.400 --> 0:08:53.640 in terms of maintenance. Um. And it's the same kind 0:08:53.640 --> 0:08:55.360 of thing that people will say, oh, they're going a 0:08:55.400 --> 0:08:58.480 couple of therapy, like things must be really bad as 0:08:58.520 --> 0:09:03.679 opposed to know, relationships are just hard, they are so complicated. 0:09:04.120 --> 0:09:07.559 You're both bringing in from your childhood into your relationship, 0:09:08.120 --> 0:09:12.679 and we trigger the biggest pain points with each other 0:09:12.760 --> 0:09:16.680 within our relationships. And so as opposed to it being oh, 0:09:16.720 --> 0:09:18.640 they go to a couple of therapy must be so bad, 0:09:19.000 --> 0:09:21.840 you know, like it's actually just important maintenance to do 0:09:22.160 --> 0:09:25.200 in your relationship. Also, I think it's really cool. It's 0:09:25.200 --> 0:09:27.400 like I care enough about this relationship to, you know, 0:09:27.520 --> 0:09:28.679 kind of do whatever I have to do to make 0:09:28.720 --> 0:09:31.040 it work. I think it's I think it's at what 0:09:31.160 --> 0:09:35.040 point in a relationship do you think it's good then 0:09:35.120 --> 0:09:38.600 to go? Because if you're sitting pretty, you're not really 0:09:38.640 --> 0:09:41.320 thinking about doing it. But is there like a certain 0:09:41.400 --> 0:09:44.040 mark like seven months, eight months, or like when you're 0:09:44.080 --> 0:09:46.880 talking about moving in, or what would you say would 0:09:46.880 --> 0:09:51.640 be a good time stamp okay. So statistically we know 0:09:51.679 --> 0:09:55.560 that people go into couples therapy seven years after it's 0:09:55.600 --> 0:09:58.800 first brought up. So the first time it's mentioned is 0:09:58.840 --> 0:10:01.559 when you go. Obviously, the therapeutic response, because we're a 0:10:01.559 --> 0:10:07.120 couple's therapist is like you should be going. It's expensive, 0:10:07.320 --> 0:10:10.760 that's not realistic, that's not gonna happen. But the first 0:10:10.880 --> 0:10:13.240 time somebody says we should do this is when you 0:10:13.240 --> 0:10:15.760 should do it, because so often it gets brought up. 0:10:15.840 --> 0:10:17.680 Once it gets brought up, twice it gets brought up. 0:10:17.720 --> 0:10:20.440 We call make the appointment that we never actually show up. Right, 0:10:20.559 --> 0:10:23.880 all of those things is what keeps these We talk 0:10:23.920 --> 0:10:25.600 about it in terms of like if you think about 0:10:25.600 --> 0:10:28.760 a crack on the sidewalk, right, if it's not repaired, 0:10:28.800 --> 0:10:30.760 it's gonna keep getting bigger and bigger, even if it's 0:10:30.760 --> 0:10:32.520 a smaller crack and it doesn't look like that big 0:10:32.559 --> 0:10:34.240 of a deal at the beginning, all of a sudden, 0:10:34.240 --> 0:10:37.839 people are falling slipping inside this crack. That's what's gonna happen. 0:10:38.280 --> 0:10:41.800 So the first time it's brought up is when you say, 0:10:41.960 --> 0:10:43.680 let's do this. Now, you don't have to go for 0:10:43.760 --> 0:10:46.000 ten months. You don't have to go for this long thing. 0:10:46.360 --> 0:10:50.120 But going in preventatively, just like Dean just said, like 0:10:50.160 --> 0:10:52.719 I think it is also a commitment. I care about you. 0:10:52.960 --> 0:10:54.480 I care about the same thing about my health. If 0:10:54.480 --> 0:10:56.400 I don't take care of my body in certain ways, 0:10:56.920 --> 0:10:59.360 well what's gonna happen. It's gonna get harder and harder 0:10:59.400 --> 0:11:02.040 to do and come back from. Once I sort of 0:11:02.120 --> 0:11:04.959 let it go. I think some of the toughest times 0:11:05.000 --> 0:11:06.920 to do that, right that we tend to write if 0:11:06.920 --> 0:11:08.600 we get into a fight, say like, oh, we should 0:11:08.600 --> 0:11:11.040 go to therapy to help us really figure this out. 0:11:11.120 --> 0:11:13.240 But I think it's even tougher when you're not talking 0:11:13.280 --> 0:11:15.960 about things right, when you when there's tension in the 0:11:16.000 --> 0:11:18.120 relationship but no one's talking. We always talk about a 0:11:18.120 --> 0:11:20.680 couple of therapists. So much easier when a couple comes 0:11:20.720 --> 0:11:23.199 in and they're fighting than when a couple comes in 0:11:23.280 --> 0:11:27.120 and they're not talking at all and they're like, everything's fine, right, 0:11:27.160 --> 0:11:29.079 So I think that that can make it even more 0:11:29.200 --> 0:11:32.560 challenging when you're not talking, but you know, you need 0:11:32.640 --> 0:11:34.400 to talk about some of these things to be able 0:11:34.440 --> 0:11:37.000 to say, let's go into couple of therapy so we 0:11:37.040 --> 0:11:40.240 can have someone mediate this because it can be scary. Yeah, 0:11:40.320 --> 0:11:43.000 I think that's that's really good advice. Um, what about 0:11:43.160 --> 0:11:45.400 what do you guys have to say to people, whether 0:11:45.440 --> 0:11:48.559 they're looking for solo counseling or a couple's counseling or 0:11:48.559 --> 0:11:51.079 anything that I think one of the things that make 0:11:51.120 --> 0:11:53.840 people so nervous is like how do they find it? 0:11:53.920 --> 0:11:55.599 How do they go about it? Like what does the 0:11:55.640 --> 0:11:57.079 process look like? So what do you what kind of 0:11:57.080 --> 0:11:58.439 advice do you have for people that are like nervous 0:11:58.440 --> 0:12:00.200 about even starting it for the first time, and even 0:12:00.200 --> 0:12:02.319 like about finding a therapist, which I'm sure you guys 0:12:02.360 --> 0:12:03.959 can go on and on about, but like people that 0:12:04.160 --> 0:12:06.120 have considered it but maybe haven't followed through with the 0:12:06.400 --> 0:12:09.880 action yet. I think one of the things that we 0:12:10.000 --> 0:12:12.600 see is that sometimes people will go in for a 0:12:12.640 --> 0:12:16.440 therapy session with a therapist, have don't have a connection 0:12:16.480 --> 0:12:18.360 with them, and then write off therapy for the rest 0:12:18.400 --> 0:12:21.280 of time, right like, Oh, I went, I tried therapy, 0:12:21.280 --> 0:12:24.600 it didn't work. When we talk about your relationship with 0:12:24.679 --> 0:12:28.559 your therapist is the most important predictor of therapeutic success. 0:12:29.440 --> 0:12:31.920 So you have to find someone who's the right fit. 0:12:32.000 --> 0:12:34.439 We almost talk about it in terms of dating, right, 0:12:34.559 --> 0:12:37.120 like there are certain people you're going to connect with 0:12:37.160 --> 0:12:38.960 and other people you're not going to connect with, and 0:12:39.000 --> 0:12:42.040 it's so important to find a therapist that you feel 0:12:42.040 --> 0:12:44.400 a connection with. Sometimes you can hit it off off 0:12:44.440 --> 0:12:47.200 the bat, sometimes it takes a few sessions, but we 0:12:47.320 --> 0:12:51.720 recommend you know, having initial consultation calls just so you 0:12:51.760 --> 0:12:54.199 can see if you connect with the person and if 0:12:54.200 --> 0:12:56.400 they work with what you're looking to come in for 0:12:57.720 --> 0:13:00.400 and so that can take time. It can be intimid dating. 0:13:00.840 --> 0:13:04.240 Ask friends if they have therapists that they would recommend. Right, 0:13:04.360 --> 0:13:06.520 Some people rave about their therapist. Anyone have a friend 0:13:06.600 --> 0:13:08.840 that they're like talk about their therapists like they're their friend. 0:13:10.440 --> 0:13:13.760 I've never close personal connection with a therapist before. I've 0:13:13.800 --> 0:13:16.000 always i guess I've always kind of walked in and 0:13:16.040 --> 0:13:18.400 looked at them, at them as like a like a 0:13:18.679 --> 0:13:21.080 like a like authority figure, and since you know so, 0:13:21.120 --> 0:13:23.000 it's hard for me to like lean and be friendly 0:13:23.040 --> 0:13:27.360 with them. Yeah, So that's that. That is why we 0:13:27.440 --> 0:13:30.800 started our practice because we have gone and had therapeutic 0:13:30.920 --> 0:13:35.160 experiences where the therapist very much had that clinical wall. 0:13:35.280 --> 0:13:37.840 You looked at them as like in this one up position. 0:13:38.559 --> 0:13:42.480 And we really believe that if you have they're a 0:13:42.559 --> 0:13:45.360 therapist who you can relate to, who you can connect with, 0:13:45.760 --> 0:13:47.880 that that is really going to help you more so 0:13:47.920 --> 0:13:50.600 in therapy than someone who is an authority figure who 0:13:50.640 --> 0:13:54.040 has this clinical wall. And so that's something that we 0:13:54.120 --> 0:13:57.960 really preach at our practice. Yeah, I think it's one 0:13:57.960 --> 0:13:59.440 of those things. Also, if you a lot of people 0:13:59.480 --> 0:14:01.800 feel this about doctors, right, like especially if we when 0:14:01.800 --> 0:14:04.320 we talk about the sex education side of it, if 0:14:04.320 --> 0:14:06.000 people like to go away and the doctors like, well, 0:14:06.000 --> 0:14:08.319 do you have any unprotected sex? And you're like no, no, 0:14:08.400 --> 0:14:10.600 never me, never row dogs in my life, but like 0:14:10.720 --> 0:14:12.440 come on, you did, and we need to know that 0:14:12.480 --> 0:14:15.120 information to test for certain stuff, right, So, like part 0:14:15.120 --> 0:14:16.640 of this is also but if I see you as 0:14:16.679 --> 0:14:19.560 this like old dude that like freaks me out and 0:14:19.600 --> 0:14:21.080 like I think you're gonna shame me if I say 0:14:21.080 --> 0:14:23.400 I've had unprotected sex, which is just like kind of 0:14:23.400 --> 0:14:25.720 part of the human experience, Like you're not this horrible person. 0:14:25.800 --> 0:14:28.560 You just made a decision. But when we don't, when 0:14:28.560 --> 0:14:30.880 we can't admit that stuff to the person who's supposed 0:14:30.920 --> 0:14:33.040 to be there to help us, they actually can't do 0:14:33.080 --> 0:14:36.480 their job properly either. So if you feel so uncomfortable, 0:14:36.520 --> 0:14:38.160 same thing, like you know, and like everyone kind of 0:14:38.160 --> 0:14:39.760 lies on things like how many times a week do 0:14:39.800 --> 0:14:41.920 you drink? Like you know, like all of these things 0:14:41.920 --> 0:14:45.000 that we like don't really tell the truth on when 0:14:45.040 --> 0:14:47.960 we see people as this really hierarchical thing. You're the 0:14:48.000 --> 0:14:50.280 authority figure, you're on top, You're on part of this. 0:14:50.600 --> 0:14:53.040 I'm not gonna go and be honest with you. And 0:14:53.120 --> 0:14:55.440 guess what, I can't do my job as well if 0:14:55.440 --> 0:14:58.360 I don't know what's going on. There's only so much 0:14:58.480 --> 0:15:01.120 I can do. If you're tell well, we don't actually 0:15:01.160 --> 0:15:03.120 ever fight ever, but also you haven't had sex in 0:15:03.200 --> 0:15:05.480 ten months and you fight every day. And also I 0:15:05.480 --> 0:15:07.600 tell you nothing about myself and I can hate you, 0:15:07.600 --> 0:15:09.480 you know, like I can't really do as much to 0:15:09.520 --> 0:15:23.000 help you. Then I remember one of my first coming 0:15:23.520 --> 0:15:26.000 coming to Jesus moments with my therapist. I started therapy 0:15:26.000 --> 0:15:27.800 and I was like, I've been in and out as 0:15:27.800 --> 0:15:30.640 a teenager and stuff, but I I self admitted when 0:15:30.680 --> 0:15:32.600 I was twenty six for the first time, I made 0:15:32.600 --> 0:15:35.480 the decision myself. And I remember one of my sessions 0:15:35.560 --> 0:15:38.800 I lied to my therapist about something like pretty early on, 0:15:38.840 --> 0:15:40.760 like maybe it was like session six or something like that, 0:15:41.240 --> 0:15:43.240 and I like took a step back, and I was like, 0:15:43.280 --> 0:15:45.040 I just lied to the to the person that I 0:15:45.040 --> 0:15:47.400 should be able to be perfectly honest with because they're 0:15:47.400 --> 0:15:50.080 trying to help me in a lot of ways. And uh. 0:15:50.400 --> 0:15:52.000 And then I stopped seeing her because I was like, 0:15:52.080 --> 0:15:54.200 if I don't feel comfortable to tell her all the 0:15:54.240 --> 0:15:55.920 truths that I need to tell her to get off 0:15:56.080 --> 0:15:58.400 my chest, then maybe this isn't really gonna go how 0:15:58.400 --> 0:16:00.920 I need to go. Um. So that's great. I love 0:16:00.960 --> 0:16:02.920 that you guys are knocking down those walls and are 0:16:02.920 --> 0:16:04.920 allowing people to do that because I think it's so important. 0:16:04.960 --> 0:16:07.360 And it's like, if you're not willing to tell the 0:16:07.400 --> 0:16:09.440 truth to the person that's like there to help you, 0:16:09.520 --> 0:16:12.120 then like, what else are you like hiding from yourself? 0:16:12.200 --> 0:16:14.320 I guess in a lot of ways, so exactly. And 0:16:14.560 --> 0:16:16.920 I think that's a question, right if you find yourself 0:16:17.000 --> 0:16:20.160 lying to your therapist to say, what's going on for me? Like, 0:16:20.200 --> 0:16:22.240 what's my fear is it? Is it that I fear 0:16:22.280 --> 0:16:25.040 that this person will judge me? Is that coming from 0:16:25.080 --> 0:16:28.160 a sense of I feel that in every relationship or 0:16:28.280 --> 0:16:31.520 is that coming from Okay, I don't have a connection 0:16:31.520 --> 0:16:34.120 with this therapist. I don't feel comfortable with them, because 0:16:34.280 --> 0:16:38.080 sometimes the relationship that we have with our therapist is 0:16:38.120 --> 0:16:40.800 reflected in all of our relationships, and that's something you 0:16:40.800 --> 0:16:44.080 can really work on in the context of therapy. Um. 0:16:44.120 --> 0:16:46.040 But that's a question to ask yourself if you find 0:16:46.080 --> 0:16:49.200 yourself lying to your therapist, say like, what where was 0:16:49.240 --> 0:16:51.640 that coming from for me? And it's something if you 0:16:51.680 --> 0:16:53.960 feel comfortable enough with your therapist that you can process 0:16:53.960 --> 0:16:56.600 through with your therapist in your next session. Like, Hey, 0:16:56.720 --> 0:16:58.840 I lied to you about this. I don't know why. 0:16:59.200 --> 0:17:01.920 I think we should talk about it. And I think 0:17:02.000 --> 0:17:05.919 especially with couples, especially when the fighting is maybe what 0:17:06.000 --> 0:17:08.840 we deem is unhealthy fighting right where like there's a 0:17:08.880 --> 0:17:11.520 lot of screaming or there's aggression and our throw a 0:17:11.560 --> 0:17:14.200 glass at the wall. There's so much shame of what 0:17:14.240 --> 0:17:17.000 this person is going to think about me. And the 0:17:17.000 --> 0:17:20.160 thing is that like we've heard it all, and like 0:17:20.400 --> 0:17:22.920 really truly, if you're feeling judged about your therapist, like 0:17:22.920 --> 0:17:25.119 if they say stuff, don't see them they suck, Like 0:17:25.200 --> 0:17:26.880 that's like it like you don't have to like you're 0:17:26.880 --> 0:17:29.520 actually paying this person. They work for you, so it 0:17:29.520 --> 0:17:31.040 doesn't mean that they have to be nice to you 0:17:31.119 --> 0:17:33.240 and like co sign all your stuff. Like our job 0:17:33.280 --> 0:17:35.159 is to tell you the truth and sometimes that sucks 0:17:35.200 --> 0:17:37.359 to hear. But if you feel like you can't be 0:17:37.359 --> 0:17:39.800 honest about what's actually happening, it's not the right fit. 0:17:40.560 --> 0:17:45.479 But the reality is is that sometimes stuff is dirty fighting. 0:17:45.920 --> 0:17:48.440 Sometimes things are so bad and I'm past aggressive and 0:17:48.480 --> 0:17:49.879 I mean to you and I shove you and I 0:17:49.920 --> 0:17:51.639 don't sleep with you when I use it as threats, 0:17:51.920 --> 0:17:55.880 and like, these are very real things that we have 0:17:55.960 --> 0:17:59.399 to talk about more. But we're so worried that that 0:17:59.440 --> 0:18:03.080 makes us evil or bad or for women crazy or 0:18:03.119 --> 0:18:05.639 for guys boys, what any of the other things that 0:18:05.640 --> 0:18:08.199 we've sort of made into We've got to come back to, 0:18:08.280 --> 0:18:11.560 like being honest about how real this is the amount 0:18:11.600 --> 0:18:14.760 of times clients will come in and say, this is 0:18:14.760 --> 0:18:21.080 going to sound so crazy, and it never sounds crazy, never, never, 0:18:21.200 --> 0:18:24.200 but people people feel so much shame or they there's 0:18:24.359 --> 0:18:26.880 they you build stuff up so much in your head, 0:18:27.359 --> 0:18:29.600 but there's something that's so healing about saying it out 0:18:29.600 --> 0:18:32.399 loud to another person who's saying, like, no, that's actually 0:18:32.520 --> 0:18:35.560 very human. That's you know, it's very natural. But also 0:18:35.600 --> 0:18:38.160 like if you say something truthful and the response is 0:18:38.200 --> 0:18:40.720 not what you expected because it's like what you did 0:18:40.800 --> 0:18:42.840 was messed up, that probably just means what you did 0:18:43.040 --> 0:18:44.600 is like the wrong thing to be doing. And so 0:18:44.680 --> 0:18:46.520 maybe just like stop putting that and figure out and 0:18:46.560 --> 0:18:48.320 get to the bottom how to fix it, which I 0:18:48.320 --> 0:18:51.719 think is super There's there's two phrases that I think 0:18:51.720 --> 0:18:53.240 are really important for us all to hear, which is 0:18:53.280 --> 0:18:56.400