WEBVTT - Ep. 288: Viscera and Bones 0:00:08.960 --> 0:00:12.760 This is me eat your podcast, coming at you shirtless, 0:00:12.800 --> 0:00:17.680 severely bug bitten and in my case, underwear listening podcast. 0:00:18.280 --> 0:00:23.360 He can't predict anything presented by first, like creating proven 0:00:23.640 --> 0:00:27.840 versatile hunting apparel from Marino bass layers to technical outerwear 0:00:27.960 --> 0:00:35.680 for every hunt. First like go farther, stay longer, Yan, 0:00:35.800 --> 0:00:38.479 He's having some trouble with the zipp around his shorts. 0:00:39.280 --> 0:00:40.879 I was wondering if you'd like to talk about this 0:00:41.000 --> 0:00:44.519 on the Era. The zipper on his shorts does not 0:00:44.720 --> 0:00:48.400 provide enough opening. Yes, now someone might see where I 0:00:48.479 --> 0:00:50.400 might be going with this, and I'm not. It's it's not. 0:00:50.440 --> 0:00:52.360 What can't come out is that he can't get his 0:00:52.440 --> 0:00:55.800 hand in there. Yeah, chase his hand and he tries 0:00:55.840 --> 0:00:57.640 to get his hand in there and it pops the button. 0:00:58.200 --> 0:01:02.640 Very disappointed. He's returning these short m hmm. I've had 0:01:02.720 --> 0:01:04.680 I had a pair of jeans that were like a 0:01:04.720 --> 0:01:06.920 low rise I think I didn't notice when my bottom 0:01:06.920 --> 0:01:08.800 they were like a low rise cut, which means that 0:01:09.040 --> 0:01:10.839 they still got to have the cross in the same place. 0:01:10.880 --> 0:01:16.399 But because the waist up like a lower as neck tattoo. 0:01:18.480 --> 0:01:22.280 No no, no, you don't have a butterfly tattooed back there. 0:01:23.400 --> 0:01:27.840 But buyer, beware of short zippers. I might be revealing 0:01:27.880 --> 0:01:30.360 too much here. Am I the only person that when 0:01:30.400 --> 0:01:34.880 they need to unzip, they also unbuttoned? No, my six 0:01:34.920 --> 0:01:36.560 year old does that. Not only does he do that, 0:01:37.920 --> 0:01:40.160 he drops him down to the to the back of 0:01:40.160 --> 0:01:42.880 his knees. Okay, I don't do that. See, thank you. 0:01:44.400 --> 0:01:47.960 But yet I don't know. You might be younger. You 0:01:48.000 --> 0:01:51.280 are younger, but you might be used to this different 0:01:51.360 --> 0:01:54.200 style of pants than I am. That just always have 0:01:54.320 --> 0:01:57.040 short zippers, and thus you're used to just always unbuttoning. 0:01:57.200 --> 0:02:02.960 Yanni was raised during an era of generous zippers, big 0:02:03.040 --> 0:02:06.480 long zippers. What what what? What's happened? Then? People got tight? 0:02:06.600 --> 0:02:08.800 People got tight? Well, I'll say what's happened in this country? 0:02:09.639 --> 0:02:13.960 People got tight with zipper material. Phil joined today by 0:02:14.240 --> 0:02:18.840 historian Ted Blue Daniel Boone his story like the first 0:02:18.880 --> 0:02:25.680 frontier historian, former professor in the history department of Franklin University. 0:02:27.080 --> 0:02:29.240 That's because you retired, not because you got fired or anything. 0:02:29.280 --> 0:02:32.840 Right now, it's a Murray State University. Why does it 0:02:32.880 --> 0:02:35.919 say Franklin Universe? Because I Franklin is my middle name. 0:02:36.160 --> 0:02:39.480 Your middle name, I knew that that was my fault. 0:02:39.520 --> 0:02:43.560 And I don't have my own university. I'm working on that, 0:02:43.639 --> 0:02:48.480 you know, like a universe. Thinking about the zipper issue, 0:02:48.520 --> 0:02:51.680 I'm thinking, you know, Daniel Boone had a loincloth and 0:02:51.800 --> 0:02:54.440 uh sash. You don't have you just go from the 0:02:54.480 --> 0:02:57.240 side you don't. It works better. I would have. I 0:02:57.240 --> 0:03:00.280 would have probably dribbled on it. Did me. I was 0:03:00.320 --> 0:03:10.080 probably sleep his name his middle name, Ted Franklin Blue. 0:03:10.160 --> 0:03:15.240 Thank you, Murray State Universe. Yeah, they'll appreciate that better. 0:03:15.320 --> 0:03:19.600 Back home we started on school. I didn't roll, man, 0:03:20.200 --> 0:03:22.320 I'd do a double major. Well, thank you you and 0:03:22.400 --> 0:03:26.560 major major and Boone and Kenton, Daniel Boone and the 0:03:26.600 --> 0:03:30.480 miner and Simon Kenton and a banjo player. Did I 0:03:30.520 --> 0:03:36.400 mention that already? Yeah? I did that for several years. 0:03:36.400 --> 0:03:38.360 I mean I still pick, but yeah. I dropped out 0:03:38.360 --> 0:03:40.600 of college actually to to play banjo. It was all 0:03:40.640 --> 0:03:42.520 I had, a free, free riot, it was all paid for, 0:03:42.640 --> 0:03:44.880 but I said, no, I want to play, and so 0:03:44.920 --> 0:03:46.720 that's what I did for two or three years. Yeah. 0:03:46.840 --> 0:03:49.200 And um Done in Florida, you know, kind of a 0:03:49.240 --> 0:03:53.200 no name, but we played the same Southeastern circuit. Does 0:03:53.400 --> 0:03:58.320 um Bill Monroe and Luster Flat and Ralph Stanley. Ralph 0:03:59.000 --> 0:04:01.880 people saw the movie Oh Brother, Where art thou? He's saying, 0:04:02.320 --> 0:04:06.680 oh Dad, he's saying that, and uh, Ricky Skaggs and 0:04:06.840 --> 0:04:09.600 Um Keith Whiley We're playing with Ralph denn and Marty 0:04:09.680 --> 0:04:13.040 Stewart was about thirteen or fourteen, was playing with Um 0:04:13.240 --> 0:04:16.159 Luster Flat, and Vince Skill was in high school. He 0:04:16.240 --> 0:04:19.400 was playing with the blue Grass Alliance. And then there 0:04:19.480 --> 0:04:23.400 was me who nobody knew and still can't get my 0:04:23.480 --> 0:04:28.680 name right seven years later. So I want to know 0:04:28.720 --> 0:04:33.960 if they was it still paid for when you went 0:04:34.000 --> 0:04:36.599 back three years later? It was not. I moved to 0:04:36.640 --> 0:04:40.559 Kentucky to play in a band and and that didn't 0:04:40.560 --> 0:04:42.320 work out so well. Then I was kind of reduced 0:04:42.320 --> 0:04:45.239 to Wendy's and painting gutters. And then I ran trap 0:04:45.320 --> 0:04:48.480 lines for four years and I was thinking about going 0:04:48.480 --> 0:04:51.280 down to the Gulf and maybe work on some or 0:04:51.320 --> 0:04:54.400 breakdown there, like commercial diving type stuff. And my wife said, 0:04:54.440 --> 0:04:57.080 why don't you go back to school. And she's always 0:04:57.120 --> 0:04:59.640 been kind of the brain to the blue outfit, and 0:04:59.720 --> 0:05:02.200 I us a lot safer, Plus I can be on land, 0:05:02.520 --> 0:05:06.200 and that's what I did. Yes, you were you on 0:05:06.200 --> 0:05:10.440 a full ride Bangel scholarship. And now my my father 0:05:10.560 --> 0:05:12.760 was a veteran of World War two and he had 0:05:12.760 --> 0:05:14.440 the g I bal he passed on when I was 0:05:14.640 --> 0:05:19.719 a boy and uh transferred, Yeah right, yeah, it's a 0:05:19.760 --> 0:05:22.880 good gig. And then he was a a male man, 0:05:23.160 --> 0:05:25.440 and so you also had civil service benefits. And so 0:05:25.480 --> 0:05:28.520 as long as I stayed in and didn't drop out 0:05:28.520 --> 0:05:31.160 for more than one year, I was it was paid for. 0:05:31.440 --> 0:05:34.360 But I dropped out and staid, I want to play banjo. 0:05:34.760 --> 0:05:37.479 That's where the that's where the money is. Did you 0:05:37.520 --> 0:05:39.800 go on to so? Did you you go on? You 0:05:39.839 --> 0:05:42.599 went on to get like a doctorate? No? I never did. 0:05:42.720 --> 0:05:46.120 I I went back. I actually majored in wildlife biology, 0:05:46.160 --> 0:05:49.400 but I couldn't pass chemistry. My actual interest then and 0:05:49.640 --> 0:05:54.200 largely still are we're theology. I wanted to study particularly 0:05:54.200 --> 0:05:58.719 bullshark behavior and uh, either that or herpetology, and study 0:05:59.160 --> 0:06:02.680 particularly Eastern I'm in backs and deal with habitite issues 0:06:02.760 --> 0:06:06.400 with the quotalist adamant aias the Eastern diamond back. And 0:06:06.440 --> 0:06:08.400 but I but I loved history, and so when I 0:06:08.440 --> 0:06:11.040 realized that that was not gonna happen, because I couldn't 0:06:11.080 --> 0:06:15.520 pass chemistry. I just sat down one day with the 0:06:15.520 --> 0:06:18.360 curriculum guying, I go, what do I like? And I know, 0:06:19.080 --> 0:06:21.159 what can I do? And so I went to history 0:06:21.160 --> 0:06:24.000 and they were having had American Indian studies. They had 0:06:24.400 --> 0:06:26.279 the American West, and I said, I love this stuff. 0:06:26.320 --> 0:06:29.880 And I was in Kentucky, and um, when I was 0:06:29.920 --> 0:06:32.119 a boy, I was really hung up on Daniel Boone. 0:06:32.120 --> 0:06:35.040 I mean Mania and third fourth, fifth grade. I mean 0:06:35.360 --> 0:06:38.400 I literally told my parents in fourth grade, and my 0:06:38.480 --> 0:06:40.760 sister will be hearing this, she can probably confirm it. 0:06:40.800 --> 0:06:43.440 I said, I'm I'm not going to study any more 0:06:43.720 --> 0:06:46.760 m math and sentis DIAGRAMM and I just want to 0:06:46.760 --> 0:06:50.520 study Earl Scruggs on the banjo and Daniel Boone. And 0:06:50.640 --> 0:06:54.120 that didn't go over well, But that's what you did. Yeah, 0:06:54.200 --> 0:06:56.159 pretty much. I kind of went to a mountain Man 0:06:56.200 --> 0:07:00.279 period and I like John Wayne and the Alamo. By yeah, 0:07:00.320 --> 0:07:03.240 it's pretty much Boone. And then uh and by junior high, 0:07:03.480 --> 0:07:06.720 you know, I start seeing cheerleaders and stuff and I said, 0:07:07.400 --> 0:07:12.520 this board of life than Daniel Boone and uh, but cheerly, yeah, 0:07:12.600 --> 0:07:16.440 not me personally. Yeah, it wasn't. Yeah, it wasn't me personally, 0:07:16.480 --> 0:07:19.960 but uh but yeah kind of kind of. And and 0:07:20.000 --> 0:07:22.360 then we moved to Kentucky, Like I said, my wife 0:07:22.400 --> 0:07:24.640 and I her name is Levina, which by the way, 0:07:24.720 --> 0:07:27.560 was also the name of one of Boone's daughters. Oh 0:07:27.640 --> 0:07:30.160 that's cool, Yeah it is. It's really kind of unusual. 0:07:30.280 --> 0:07:34.760 And when I got back to Kentucky, Um, I happen 0:07:34.800 --> 0:07:37.080 to go by one time there was a flintlock shooting 0:07:37.160 --> 0:07:40.400 exhibition and uh, I said, wow, and it it really 0:07:40.520 --> 0:07:43.640 struck a nerve. And then I read Alan Eckert's book 0:07:43.960 --> 0:07:48.960 The Frontiersman about that's a tremendous book. I mean, uh, 0:07:49.040 --> 0:07:52.240 Simon Kenton and too Kumpsa and it it just all 0:07:52.280 --> 0:07:54.400 of a sudden, I was dreaming as a kid again 0:07:54.440 --> 0:07:59.640 about you know, Torch Cavin's and um a phrase ballhead 0:07:59.680 --> 0:08:02.520 work clubs and flint locks and powder horns. Taking note 0:08:02.520 --> 0:08:04.720 of that word club hanging over your head. Yeah it 0:08:04.880 --> 0:08:10.280 was yeah that one. Wow, Yeah it was that was 0:08:10.320 --> 0:08:12.880 that specifically for me? Or do you steal that from 0:08:12.880 --> 0:08:19.800 bagore gifted? That was from West study. Here's Steve used 0:08:19.880 --> 0:08:22.880 this instead of a bow? Hey, uh, but you were 0:08:23.080 --> 0:08:24.880 actually I want to we gotta hit a couple of things. 0:08:24.920 --> 0:08:26.600 But I want to talk about one other thing. You 0:08:26.640 --> 0:08:29.320 were an extra and last of the Mohicans. How long 0:08:29.360 --> 0:08:31.480 did you hang around there? I did that. It was 0:08:31.520 --> 0:08:34.319 almost eight weeks. It was just under eight weeks. I 0:08:34.400 --> 0:08:37.040 kept waiting to get killed in the massacre scene because 0:08:37.040 --> 0:08:39.200 I had it all all ready to go with this 0:08:39.240 --> 0:08:42.920 buddy of mine from Sky to Oklahoma. He's a Shawnee 0:08:42.960 --> 0:08:44.640 and I go like, Wow, I'm gonna get killed by 0:08:44.640 --> 0:08:48.200 a real Shawnee. And uh that it didn't happen because 0:08:48.559 --> 0:08:50.520 up with the last scene with the big massacre, that 0:08:50.640 --> 0:08:53.640 it kept raining and that valley was inundated. So I 0:08:53.640 --> 0:08:56.040 had to come back and to Murray State and teach 0:08:56.240 --> 0:08:59.120 world sieve no one ever killed you. No, No, I 0:08:59.160 --> 0:09:01.600 got killed a bunch. I made three hundred bucks one time, 0:09:01.640 --> 0:09:03.840 getting one night, I made three hundred bucks and six 0:09:03.880 --> 0:09:09.720 hours getting killed. But you know there was cannon shredding, 0:09:09.760 --> 0:09:12.640 and you you had these kind of like minor bumps 0:09:12.679 --> 0:09:14.839 that for guy. You had this the real stunt men, 0:09:14.880 --> 0:09:16.840 and then they had the people that weren't that bright. 0:09:16.880 --> 0:09:18.800 They would be willing to do stuff for more money. 0:09:19.120 --> 0:09:21.560 That's kind of the category I was in. And so 0:09:21.960 --> 0:09:23.880 you had your you had your own personal get up 0:09:23.920 --> 0:09:26.920 on no. No, well, no, I had whatever they had. 0:09:27.000 --> 0:09:28.680 You know, I would typically you didn't bring your own 0:09:28.679 --> 0:09:31.440 period dress. They gave you the dress I wanted to, 0:09:31.640 --> 0:09:35.559 but no, I would be a British red Coat for 0:09:35.600 --> 0:09:38.520 a while with the brown best busket. Then they you 0:09:38.520 --> 0:09:41.600 could have paid me enough to do that. Then they 0:09:41.679 --> 0:09:43.600 switch off and they said, okay, be a French guy 0:09:43.640 --> 0:09:45.800 for a while, and so you you put on the 0:09:45.800 --> 0:09:49.360 French marine outfit and uh, you get the Charlotteville musket. 0:09:49.360 --> 0:09:51.000 Then they switched your back and a lot of it 0:09:51.040 --> 0:09:52.400 was hurry up in a way. But yeah, it was 0:09:52.440 --> 0:09:55.079 a fascinating thing. I mean, I knew that I would 0:09:55.080 --> 0:09:57.720 never have an experience like that again. And um, I 0:09:57.720 --> 0:10:00.120 mean you can't just go anywhere and see a or 0:10:00.200 --> 0:10:04.679 full scale reproduction of Fort William Henry. Uh seventeen fifty seven. 0:10:04.840 --> 0:10:07.520 And the first night on the set where we really 0:10:07.640 --> 0:10:11.120 got past the exercises because we the first week was calisthenics. 0:10:11.160 --> 0:10:15.000 Captain Dale die he wrote, he co wrote um top 0:10:15.000 --> 0:10:18.360 Gun and Platoon. He trained all those guys. He was 0:10:18.520 --> 0:10:21.520 twenty one year marine vet. He's like, all right, yeah, 0:10:21.520 --> 0:10:23.960 he just worst profanity in the world. Quite colorful. But 0:10:24.000 --> 0:10:25.880 you know, once we got past the week of training 0:10:25.920 --> 0:10:29.080 with him, Um got out there in the first night, 0:10:29.840 --> 0:10:32.640 you know, take one and you would have the pyrotechnics 0:10:32.679 --> 0:10:34.800 going off. I fire a cannon of a French marine. 0:10:34.800 --> 0:10:36.760 I took my coat off so my mom could maybe 0:10:36.840 --> 0:10:41.360 see me, and uh, hey mom, and so um, you 0:10:41.400 --> 0:10:44.600 know they had eighteen hundred Indians just come up out 0:10:44.600 --> 0:10:46.720 of the shadows and you just get chill bumps and 0:10:46.720 --> 0:10:49.360 the pyrotechnics are going. You go like, you'll never see 0:10:49.360 --> 0:10:51.880 anything like that. And so did you die with dignity 0:10:52.000 --> 0:10:54.120 or were you like uh most of the time there, 0:10:55.240 --> 0:10:57.680 sometimes I was indignant because I realized how little I 0:10:57.720 --> 0:10:59.760 was getting paid for this, and so you know, I 0:11:00.040 --> 0:11:04.920 call back and try to live again down you know. 0:11:05.000 --> 0:11:09.560 Plus I had a French name Balloo. And um, so 0:11:09.600 --> 0:11:13.040 you got killed by shrapnel? Did you get knife or 0:11:13.040 --> 0:11:15.240 anything like that? Every it's nothing cool right there, but no, 0:11:15.440 --> 0:11:18.400 mainly and it left me with really bad tenitis. I mean, 0:11:18.480 --> 0:11:22.920 I my ears are still popping because the pyrotechnics. Yeah, 0:11:23.000 --> 0:11:24.800 but they gave us a little ear plugs and so 0:11:24.920 --> 0:11:27.160 that we're like that was close enough for the period 0:11:27.320 --> 0:11:33.320 period of boom. Yeah, I don't think that the Greeks. 0:11:33.360 --> 0:11:35.320 I think the Greek's had it down, you know, because 0:11:35.360 --> 0:11:39.560 it's sponges. Uh, Okay, we'll get back to Daniel Boone. 0:11:39.559 --> 0:11:43.320 We're gonna get into Daniel Boone hardcore big time. I 0:11:43.360 --> 0:11:47.240 hope we do. Know What's what's interesting to me and 0:11:47.280 --> 0:11:51.319 this is why I'm fascinated. Boone has been dead two 0:11:51.440 --> 0:11:56.400 hundred and one years this year. Yeah, and so why 0:11:56.440 --> 0:12:00.440 are we talking about last year and anniversary was death? Well? 0:12:00.480 --> 0:12:02.199 I had a book come out then, and it came 0:12:02.200 --> 0:12:05.800 out the same day that he died, September twenty and 0:12:05.840 --> 0:12:08.600 I was like, but what was going on then? COVID? 0:12:09.360 --> 0:12:11.760 So what? And it was about the tidle of it, 0:12:11.840 --> 0:12:14.959 you know, his where's Daniel Boone Buried? I mean that's 0:12:14.960 --> 0:12:17.240 not actually the title. I can't remember his last day, 0:12:17.480 --> 0:12:20.920 Daniel Boone, his last days in Missouri and the strange 0:12:20.920 --> 0:12:24.040 fate of his remains because there's a lot of controversy 0:12:24.040 --> 0:12:25.960 about where was he buried? So I said, well, this 0:12:26.040 --> 0:12:28.000 is great, it will be the two anniversary and it 0:12:28.000 --> 0:12:32.640 will come out and and uh COVID did it come out? Yeah, 0:12:32.800 --> 0:12:37.280 September twenty six didn't sell like hotcakes thirty five cents 0:12:37.280 --> 0:12:40.840 of stack. What do you mean that's how hotcakes sell. 0:12:41.400 --> 0:12:45.000 It's a Southern joke. They don't say that in Michigan. 0:12:45.040 --> 0:12:48.160 I guess it sell like hotcake thirty five cents of stack. 0:12:48.640 --> 0:12:55.400 It's a bluegrass joke. Uh okay, but yeah, we're north 0:12:55.480 --> 0:13:04.160 of that. We don't get blue grass claim get joke. Oh, 0:13:04.320 --> 0:13:06.960 after Yanni presented to us, So if you go back 0:13:07.000 --> 0:13:10.800 in a couple of episodes, Yanni presented to us about 0:13:12.360 --> 0:13:14.720 him being out with this with Bart George doing mountain 0:13:14.760 --> 0:13:22.080 lion research and they're practicing all that. Like I'm telling 0:13:22.120 --> 0:13:24.800 you this because you don't know this. They're they're testing. 0:13:25.240 --> 0:13:27.800 I'm interested, though, Well get them out. Let's get a 0:13:27.800 --> 0:13:31.160 mountain lion hanging around. Boots Son Daniel Morgan had a 0:13:31.280 --> 0:13:34.240 real bad experience with a bound lion. So yeah, I 0:13:34.280 --> 0:13:37.040 love bound lions. So you tuned in. Yeah, let's say 0:13:37.040 --> 0:13:38.959 you get a mountain lion hanging around and they want 0:13:39.000 --> 0:13:40.640 to find a way to haze it. They want to 0:13:40.679 --> 0:13:43.680 like get it so it's not habituated to humans, spook 0:13:43.679 --> 0:13:46.040 it off. What they're what they're working on is a 0:13:46.240 --> 0:13:50.120 going uh put a collar on the line. And they 0:13:50.120 --> 0:13:55.199 approach it with sounds. They actually played this podcast to 0:13:55.240 --> 0:13:58.640 the mountain Lion to see at what point like the 0:13:58.760 --> 0:14:04.520 zipper part a little but a real short as for 0:14:04.600 --> 0:14:09.360 something so checks out. You gotta follow. What I'm saying 0:14:09.360 --> 0:14:13.920 is I'm gonna tell you something complicated. They play this 0:14:13.960 --> 0:14:18.319 podcast to a mountainline just blasting it is not I'm 0:14:18.360 --> 0:14:24.000 not and they and they got a radio. They already 0:14:24.040 --> 0:14:25.840 got a collared they got a radio Colorado, so they 0:14:25.880 --> 0:14:29.240 can tell at what point it's spooks from human voices, 0:14:30.120 --> 0:14:33.800 at what point it's runs off. Then they go in 0:14:33.880 --> 0:14:37.120 right away and re catch it with dogs and harass 0:14:37.200 --> 0:14:40.360 it a little bit. Then you're going in the future 0:14:40.360 --> 0:14:45.360 and see, like, did that experience of human voices cause 0:14:45.440 --> 0:14:49.480 it to want to keep its distance? The fact that 0:14:49.560 --> 0:14:54.280 you're playing human voices and then harassing it with dogs. 0:14:54.360 --> 0:14:56.640 Can you can you sort of like train the cat 0:14:57.600 --> 0:15:01.720 two move away and not want to be around human voices. 0:15:02.760 --> 0:15:05.840 Jim Halfminger wrote in about how if you played the 0:15:05.840 --> 0:15:08.920 show open where you can hear tree falling, that he 0:15:09.120 --> 0:15:12.160 feels that that would speak particularly well to the mountain lion, 0:15:12.920 --> 0:15:16.520 who's not gonna like that sound up in a tree Well, 0:15:16.560 --> 0:15:19.120 the thing is is that when they hear our podcast, 0:15:19.400 --> 0:15:22.320 it is, uh, the mounta lion is still on the ground, 0:15:24.000 --> 0:15:26.960 It's not when it's up on a limb, right, But 0:15:27.200 --> 0:15:29.200 even then, you know, mountain lions spend a lot of 0:15:29.280 --> 0:15:32.200 time in the woods almost all the time, and so 0:15:33.240 --> 0:15:34.960 I guess it depends on what habitat they live in. 0:15:35.160 --> 0:15:37.880 But even then, the sound of a falling tree might 0:15:37.880 --> 0:15:40.160 be alarming to a mountain lion. But you say they 0:15:40.200 --> 0:15:44.280 calculated that then, and they only play they skip ahead, Yeah, 0:15:44.360 --> 0:15:47.640 I think yeah. Bart mentioned something about that. Yanni suggests 0:15:47.640 --> 0:15:50.320 that they don't even play the ads to them because 0:15:50.320 --> 0:15:54.120 they don't want to like encourage consumerism. Yeah in mountain 0:15:54.120 --> 0:16:01.080 lions cougars. Yeah, alright. He also sent in a sign 0:16:01.200 --> 0:16:03.840 that he took a picture of. Do you want to 0:16:03.880 --> 0:16:05.960 read the sign? But I don't really understand the sign. 0:16:06.000 --> 0:16:10.360 It's a real sign British Columbia British Columbia Parks. Looks 0:16:10.400 --> 0:16:13.200 like they put it up. It's a it's a warning 0:16:13.240 --> 0:16:18.200 sign and it says very large letters cougar in area, 0:16:19.600 --> 0:16:22.520 then a little bit smaller letters, please stay on trails, 0:16:22.880 --> 0:16:27.840 travel in small groups, and do not capitalize, do not 0:16:28.160 --> 0:16:35.440 allow men under thirty to travel alone. It's a statement ahead. Yeah, 0:16:35.680 --> 0:16:40.800 if you're a young female, have at it. And I 0:16:40.840 --> 0:16:43.640 guess even said like under four team, but like what, 0:16:44.400 --> 0:16:51.960 maybe there's a particular disposition generally about or or irresponsible. 0:16:52.040 --> 0:16:55.720 Maybe I think that's that's trying to protect men under 0:16:55.800 --> 0:16:59.440 thirty from themselves, Yeah, from poor destision making. That's a 0:16:59.480 --> 0:17:02.680 weird like, are you guys missing the joke here? Cougar 0:17:02.760 --> 0:17:06.320 is another name for like an older woman who we're 0:17:10.840 --> 0:17:17.160 holy cow, Phil, God, Bills, smart, Hello, fingering. Now it's 0:17:17.200 --> 0:17:21.840 probably upside down of the stupid ass jokes. I don't 0:17:21.880 --> 0:17:27.359 realize they're jokes. Jim, really screw this O God, don't 0:17:27.400 --> 0:17:33.800 send subtle jokes, man, I like, like you're dead. That's good, Phil, 0:17:34.920 --> 0:17:36.640 I mean I don't think it's that good. I think 0:17:36.680 --> 0:17:39.080 it's just this is mostly embarrassing for you guys, very 0:17:39.119 --> 0:17:45.679 embarrassing cow man. Yeah, I know I need again. This 0:17:45.760 --> 0:17:49.880 comes back to the difference in age. Difference in ages 0:17:49.960 --> 0:17:53.280 here because I used to partake in cougar jokes, but 0:17:53.320 --> 0:17:56.440 it's been twenty years. Yeah, I mean yeah, it's it's 0:17:56.440 --> 0:18:01.439 outdated for sure. Oh yeah, I'm so um. That shows 0:18:01.440 --> 0:18:04.840 how woke. I am. There you go. You've moved past it. 0:18:05.119 --> 0:18:08.280 So you're saying cougars don't even exist anymore. I mean 0:18:08.320 --> 0:18:10.600 people probably still use the term, but I mean it's 0:18:10.640 --> 0:18:12.040 not in the main. I mean there's a whole show 0:18:12.080 --> 0:18:14.040 called cougar Town that was like the peak of it. 0:18:14.640 --> 0:18:18.359 Older women exactly. No, it's about Courtney Cox looking for 0:18:18.680 --> 0:18:23.479 men under thirty. Um. But now, oh man, dude, that 0:18:23.600 --> 0:18:26.240 is probably the most embarrassing thing. Yeah. I got half 0:18:26.280 --> 0:18:27.960 mine to edit that whole thing out and make it 0:18:28.000 --> 0:18:29.879 that I got the joke. Okay, hey, you know what, 0:18:29.960 --> 0:18:33.720 let me let me do uh oh, let me say this. Okay, 0:18:34.040 --> 0:18:36.479 you patch this in and I'm gonna say, oh, Yanni, 0:18:36.720 --> 0:18:41.080 you obviously don't get the joke older women. Okay, put 0:18:41.080 --> 0:18:44.240 that prowling, prowling for younger, for young There you go, 0:18:44.359 --> 0:18:48.400 put that all in. Patch that together. Yeah, we're losing Ted, 0:18:48.840 --> 0:18:53.400 Ted's Ted's losses. Well we're gonna we're I'm good, We're 0:18:53.400 --> 0:18:55.800 gonna come find him in a minute. We had a 0:18:55.800 --> 0:19:03.160 correction to dude, we're talking about sex and chicks, chickens, sexing, 0:19:03.480 --> 0:19:10.719 baby sexing baby chickens, and I was saying that with 0:19:10.760 --> 0:19:14.920 the increased popularity of backyard poultry raising, of which you 0:19:15.160 --> 0:19:20.040 needs a participant. UM people go out and they buy birds, 0:19:20.080 --> 0:19:23.359 and then then they are often surprised. They buy chickens 0:19:23.400 --> 0:19:25.840 to lay eggs, and they're often surprised to find that 0:19:25.840 --> 0:19:27.560 that one day it wakes up in the morning and 0:19:27.600 --> 0:19:33.960 goes right. And I was talking about how UM I 0:19:34.160 --> 0:19:38.280 felt that there was some issue where it was extremely difficult. 0:19:39.600 --> 0:19:48.800 Two sex chicks ends, young chicks, young chickens right, and 0:19:48.840 --> 0:19:51.680 a guy, a poultry guy from a poultry grower in Delaware, 0:19:53.320 --> 0:19:57.520 says it's really not that commercial poultry grower check this out. 0:19:58.359 --> 0:20:02.399 He says male chicks have of even feather follicles at 0:20:02.440 --> 0:20:06.600 the edges of their wings, whereas females will have notably 0:20:06.720 --> 0:20:13.000 long and short feather follicles. He says this strategy is 0:20:13.040 --> 0:20:20.520 pretty spot on. There's also vent sexon which Branch showed 0:20:20.600 --> 0:20:25.240 us with ducks, where you squeeze the feces out of 0:20:25.280 --> 0:20:30.080 the chick, which opens up the chicks anal vent called 0:20:30.080 --> 0:20:34.960 the cloaca, slightly allowing the chicken sex or to see 0:20:34.960 --> 0:20:38.440 if the chick has a small bump, which would indicate 0:20:38.480 --> 0:20:40.640 that the chicks a male. Now you can if you 0:20:41.600 --> 0:20:45.800 want to sex a duck, you can open that cloaca 0:20:45.920 --> 0:20:48.960 up and it looks like a little worm in there, 0:20:50.760 --> 0:20:54.040 like an inside outworm or worm, like a little wormy 0:20:54.119 --> 0:20:59.560 structure in there. And that when engorged with blood a 0:20:59.680 --> 0:21:03.639 second time, and gorge has been used in reference on 0:21:03.680 --> 0:21:08.159 this show and this year. Yeah, and gorged with blood, 0:21:08.680 --> 0:21:10.240 you can tell that it's a male or female. You 0:21:10.280 --> 0:21:13.800 know that, Johnnie, I did not. Why would you m 0:21:13.840 --> 0:21:16.920 Are there certain duck species that the males and females 0:21:17.119 --> 0:21:22.200 look the same from the outside, or kill an immature immature? 0:21:23.000 --> 0:21:25.359 Do you know about this? You know, I don't, But 0:21:25.720 --> 0:21:28.400 I was just thinking that it's hard to sex beaver too, 0:21:28.720 --> 0:21:32.520 you know, I think the the organs or internal we 0:21:32.560 --> 0:21:35.960 actually rehab one can be done when you skin them, 0:21:35.960 --> 0:21:38.520 you know right off? Yeah, yeah, I mean, but yeah, 0:21:38.640 --> 0:21:41.959 but that's kind of intrusive, you know, put them up 0:21:41.960 --> 0:21:46.800 on the It often leads to lead to we rehab 0:21:46.880 --> 0:21:49.159 one for six or seven months, and it got to 0:21:49.200 --> 0:21:52.960 be kind of onerous, and we did. Boy, girl, you 0:21:53.040 --> 0:21:55.000 took care of a baby beaver? We did? I know? 0:21:55.600 --> 0:21:57.760 At that time, I was teaching at Murray State and 0:21:58.760 --> 0:22:01.359 some I went into class one day and it was 0:22:01.400 --> 0:22:04.639 a big box in their cardboard box and I I go, 0:22:04.760 --> 0:22:06.920 what's this and they said it's a beaver. I thought 0:22:06.920 --> 0:22:09.880 it was a joke, like, oh, okay, sure, I'm game. 0:22:09.920 --> 0:22:12.000 I put up and it really was. It was a 0:22:12.359 --> 0:22:15.920 kid beaver. And um, there had been some frat guys 0:22:16.000 --> 0:22:18.600 out there, uh, I think blowing up dens or something. 0:22:18.640 --> 0:22:21.720 I'm not sure. I don't you know. And so there 0:22:21.800 --> 0:22:23.840 was just one kit that had survived all of that. 0:22:23.960 --> 0:22:26.359 And these sorority girls, I don't know if they were 0:22:26.359 --> 0:22:29.320 a O pie maybe Alpha gams try sig I'm not sure. 0:22:29.359 --> 0:22:33.679 But anyway, the thrority girls not important? Is that relevant? No, 0:22:34.440 --> 0:22:38.439 give him a shout out? Anyway, that they brought the 0:22:38.440 --> 0:22:41.800 baby beaver, and I went, what am I gonna do? 0:22:41.800 --> 0:22:43.120 And so I write it. I would think I would 0:22:43.160 --> 0:22:45.560 lecturing that day, I'll Mesopotamia. And every time I had 0:22:45.560 --> 0:22:49.000 paused talking about ARROGANTSHA would go and I'd go and 0:22:49.080 --> 0:22:51.600 they go, uh. And so I said, okay, we're gonna 0:22:51.640 --> 0:22:53.080 take it home. So we took it home and we 0:22:53.600 --> 0:22:56.520 bottle raised it. It's kind of like, um, remember the 0:22:56.520 --> 0:22:59.440 the guy Archibald what was his name? He thought he wasn't. 0:23:00.040 --> 0:23:02.480 He passed himself off as an Indian. He called himself 0:23:02.480 --> 0:23:06.320 Gray Owl. The only archballd I knows Ruttledge And so, yeah, 0:23:06.359 --> 0:23:08.480 we rehab this beaver for a while, but you know 0:23:08.520 --> 0:23:11.120 he had an understanding landlord. But you know, after a while, 0:23:11.119 --> 0:23:13.239 you gotta start replacing doors and we start, you know, 0:23:13.400 --> 0:23:18.880 replacing table legs, and so the beaver chew that stuff up. 0:23:19.000 --> 0:23:21.000 Yeah yeah, I mean the teeth they grow all the time. 0:23:21.080 --> 0:23:23.120 That they got to. But but we never I knew 0:23:23.160 --> 0:23:24.639 it was a boy or girl. That's the point you 0:23:24.800 --> 0:23:26.520 back to the relevant. We didn't know if it was 0:23:26.520 --> 0:23:29.200 a boy or girl, so we just called it baby 0:23:29.320 --> 0:23:31.560 baby beaver. Then he got to be less of baby 0:23:31.640 --> 0:23:34.880 and um, so it was pretty good and speckled where 0:23:34.880 --> 0:23:37.480 with baking over the top with no he just kidding 0:23:37.600 --> 0:23:40.560 you turned loose. We found a beaver rehab her up 0:23:40.560 --> 0:23:43.359 in northern part of Kentucky and took it up there, 0:23:43.560 --> 0:23:47.480 and um, hopefully it stayed out of you know, three 0:23:47.800 --> 0:23:53.880 conno bears. M hmm. Beaver always shine. Speaking of beavers, 0:23:54.680 --> 0:23:57.840 we had another craction. Some people like real riled out 0:23:57.880 --> 0:23:59.679 that I screwed this up. So I was saying, how 0:23:59.720 --> 0:24:01.760 sni airs used to be snares and they got rebranded 0:24:01.800 --> 0:24:07.439 as caval restraints. I was wrong, Uh, A cabor restraint 0:24:07.440 --> 0:24:09.960 has a relaxing lock on it. I thought like a 0:24:10.040 --> 0:24:13.520 relaxing lock was a snare with the like what kind 0:24:13.520 --> 0:24:16.199 of locked the relaxing lock on a snare was like, no, 0:24:16.480 --> 0:24:18.879 very big difference, very big difference. A few people out 0:24:18.880 --> 0:24:22.320 there who carry tons about snares. A snare is a 0:24:22.840 --> 0:24:25.160 when when they're using the term snare, they're using talking 0:24:25.160 --> 0:24:30.520 about a dispatch or kill type trap. A caval restraint 0:24:30.560 --> 0:24:34.200 because because the mechanism never relaxed, and every time it moves, 0:24:34.240 --> 0:24:37.480 it just cinches, and you'd rig it up so that 0:24:38.240 --> 0:24:41.360 you'd rig it up, you know, so that there's like entanglements. 0:24:42.240 --> 0:24:43.840 You know, you might like rig it to a tree 0:24:44.359 --> 0:24:46.680 to wrap around the tree and tighten up and kill it. 0:24:47.119 --> 0:24:50.440 But they're saying a restraint is rigged different, different lock. 0:24:51.240 --> 0:24:53.800 You don't have, you don't have any kind of impediments 0:24:53.840 --> 0:24:55.960 around it that might cause it to get tangled up, 0:24:56.200 --> 0:24:58.080 and just rigged very much to keep the thing alive. 0:24:59.480 --> 0:25:03.879 Caboris ranks, folks. I thought it was interesting that the 0:25:03.880 --> 0:25:07.560 one guy wrote in from somewhere in the desert southwest 0:25:07.640 --> 0:25:10.360 as a trapper, and he said that it's very important 0:25:10.400 --> 0:25:13.080 for them to use them, not because they like, you know, 0:25:13.359 --> 0:25:17.720 for some sort of animal welfare, but because in their conditions, 0:25:17.960 --> 0:25:21.600 if they use a kill snare, that can lose that 0:25:21.680 --> 0:25:25.159 animal in the matter of hours. But if it's kept alive, 0:25:25.240 --> 0:25:27.680 then they can dispatch it. And when when I said, 0:25:27.720 --> 0:25:29.600 when I say lose the animal, like, they would lose 0:25:29.640 --> 0:25:33.439 the hide because of the hot conditions. So they use 0:25:33.520 --> 0:25:36.680 that type of snare so that preserves the hide. You 0:25:36.720 --> 0:25:39.879 want something else, that guy said, He said, I would 0:25:39.880 --> 0:25:43.160 be lying if I said I wasn't a little disappointed 0:25:43.200 --> 0:25:48.919 that a fellow trapper wouldn't know the difference. But we 0:25:49.000 --> 0:25:55.000 will forgive you on this one. Can't uh here, here's 0:25:55.000 --> 0:25:57.840 a good story Krim was telling me about. Someone sent 0:25:57.920 --> 0:26:00.600 this to us. There's a guy in May. This is 0:26:00.720 --> 0:26:02.639 this is this is a real conundrum. I don't have 0:26:02.760 --> 0:26:05.960 I don't have an opinion. Real conundrum. A guy in 0:26:06.040 --> 0:26:11.040 Maine builds a house float Basically, it's like a shed 0:26:11.320 --> 0:26:13.520 on a raft. I mean, it's pretty sweet looking, like 0:26:13.600 --> 0:26:17.080 you could sleep in it. You can. He builds like 0:26:17.119 --> 0:26:21.000 a raft, puts a shed on it. In southeast Alaska, 0:26:21.040 --> 0:26:23.800 they're everywhere. Well, this is not there, though, but this 0:26:23.840 --> 0:26:28.080 is where it gets rich. Builds a raft, builds a 0:26:28.119 --> 0:26:29.879 shed on it so you can hang out and sleep 0:26:29.880 --> 0:26:32.480 in there, puts a little upper deck on there with 0:26:32.560 --> 0:26:38.240 a cable like railing for like a deck, brings it 0:26:38.240 --> 0:26:41.560 out to the local lake and says, hey, you're allowed 0:26:41.600 --> 0:26:43.479 to take a boat wherever you want an anchor it, 0:26:43.680 --> 0:26:49.520 and just moves into it, much to the consternation of 0:26:49.560 --> 0:26:54.159 people that live around the lake. Other houses on the 0:26:54.240 --> 0:26:56.360 lake don't seem to bother them, but they are very 0:26:56.440 --> 0:27:01.359 perturbed that this guy is living on their leg in 0:27:01.560 --> 0:27:05.640 his raft shed. His argument is that show me where 0:27:05.680 --> 0:27:08.280 I'm not allowed to anchor a boat anywhere I want. 0:27:08.400 --> 0:27:14.680 It's public water. I don't have an opinion about it. Yeah, 0:27:14.960 --> 0:27:19.760 kind of rooting for the guy. Two. But then he 0:27:19.800 --> 0:27:22.159 says one person says how he docked up a few 0:27:22.240 --> 0:27:26.880 hundred feet for their house and spent the whole summer partying. 0:27:32.280 --> 0:27:35.840 Someone claimed he had like people in and out that day, 0:27:36.000 --> 0:27:39.159 and he said he had never had more than I 0:27:39.160 --> 0:27:42.000 think a couple. And he said anyone on the lake 0:27:42.680 --> 0:27:46.119 is welcome to come out bring their kids and jump 0:27:46.160 --> 0:27:52.440 off the roof. It's open to anyone to party. They 0:27:52.440 --> 0:27:55.040 say he can have as many as sixteen boats tied 0:27:55.119 --> 0:27:56.600 up to it at once. But I don't know what 0:27:56.640 --> 0:27:59.280 the hell kind of boats they're talking about. He says 0:27:59.320 --> 0:28:02.520 that's not true. Anyways, they're going after they're trying to 0:28:02.560 --> 0:28:06.320 pass the ordinance. Now about mooring, I don't have an 0:28:06.359 --> 0:28:10.240 opinion about it. Now, I grew up on a little lake. 0:28:10.359 --> 0:28:18.840 If some yeah, if somebody an if someone, it's okay. 0:28:18.880 --> 0:28:21.440 But if all of a sudden there was a hundred, 0:28:22.720 --> 0:28:24.080 I'd say, as long as the guy doesn't have a 0:28:24.119 --> 0:28:27.040 stereo going like twelve hours a day. But if there's 0:28:27.080 --> 0:28:30.200 all of sudden, you can't go. You can't go water 0:28:30.280 --> 0:28:34.920 ski because there's too many float houses. Oh sure, you 0:28:35.119 --> 0:28:37.280 think this guy will attract like a bunch more people 0:28:37.400 --> 0:28:41.040 like it'll catch you think about it. You can't afford 0:28:41.120 --> 0:28:44.840 the house that's on the shore because it's a million bucks, 0:28:45.080 --> 0:28:47.360 But you can build yourself a little house float for 0:28:47.960 --> 0:28:51.120 I don't know, k I'm guessing you could do pretty good. 0:28:52.000 --> 0:28:57.480 Karn likes the Oh he's got it on pontoon floats dead. 0:28:58.400 --> 0:29:02.440 I think it's I think it's pretty cool. Alright, it's 0:29:02.480 --> 0:29:07.320 like Ted Kazinski. It's like Ted Kazinski's place on floats. 0:29:08.960 --> 0:29:11.240 That's a it's a real conundrum. May they did the 0:29:11.360 --> 0:29:14.440 mask of they socially distant? I do not know. They 0:29:14.440 --> 0:29:16.280 don't get into that level detail. And they don't get 0:29:16.320 --> 0:29:23.800 into waste disposal. M Ellsworth, Maine. I'm sure he's got 0:29:23.800 --> 0:29:27.440 a composting to If you live near Ellsworth, Maine, I 0:29:27.480 --> 0:29:29.920 would I would go out and party with this gentleman. 0:29:30.080 --> 0:29:32.600 Quietly party with this gentleman so he doesn't get in 0:29:33.240 --> 0:29:38.160 more trouble. He's got kids out there with them. If 0:29:38.200 --> 0:29:40.560 I was living out there, I might think about quickly 0:29:40.640 --> 0:29:44.160 building one myself, getting it out there, because then you'd 0:29:44.200 --> 0:29:48.880 be grandfathered in. Get out there now. Yeah, once they 0:29:48.920 --> 0:29:51.800 make those those rules, you know nobody else you'll have 0:29:51.840 --> 0:29:53.720 one of the two because you have a wood stove, 0:29:53.800 --> 0:29:56.920 and oh yeah, it'd be great. Idea. Let me get 0:29:57.160 --> 0:29:59.520 you there. Another correction, but I don't feel like getting 0:29:59.520 --> 0:30:01.800 into by why to talk about the nature of the correction. 0:30:02.880 --> 0:30:05.920 So this whole dog, like this whole german. If you've 0:30:05.920 --> 0:30:09.000 been listening to the show, this whole like people just 0:30:09.160 --> 0:30:14.560 a bicker in about attributes of obscured German hunting dog breeds. 0:30:14.600 --> 0:30:18.160 Oh my god, they wear me out, man. Yeah, there's 0:30:18.160 --> 0:30:24.200 basically between Uh, German wire hair pointers and a dog 0:30:24.360 --> 0:30:26.640 is called a jow hour. I believe it's how you 0:30:26.680 --> 0:30:28.760 pronounce it. It's like, well, actually the draw th hour 0:30:28.880 --> 0:30:32.560 has thirteen beard hairs upon birth, and the German wire 0:30:32.600 --> 0:30:36.720 hair ranges from nine to eleven beard hairs. This is like, 0:30:36.720 --> 0:30:43.360 oh my god, it never ends, man, dog, I have not. 0:30:43.800 --> 0:30:48.520 Our our next door neighbors had aim, remember, and it 0:30:48.520 --> 0:30:51.000 it held all the time. Whenever there'd be a cyrene 0:30:51.040 --> 0:30:53.560 in Orlando, there would be a lot of syrens and 0:30:53.640 --> 0:30:55.320 my dog would go. My father would go out and 0:30:55.360 --> 0:30:58.160 his underwear and it's pretty the hose across the lugust 0:30:58.200 --> 0:31:00.400 from my hedge and try to quiet that dog now. 0:31:01.560 --> 0:31:05.360 And uh. The lady her name was Irene will lead 0:31:05.360 --> 0:31:08.600 the last name anonymous. But but but she saw my 0:31:08.680 --> 0:31:12.560 dad out there and his undershort spraying the hose and 0:31:12.680 --> 0:31:15.440 didn't realize that that was my dad. And so she 0:31:15.560 --> 0:31:17.920 called my mom and said, Mara, I don't want to 0:31:17.960 --> 0:31:20.440 scare you, but there's a man outside and there's underpants 0:31:21.560 --> 0:31:24.480 and she goes, thank you, Irene, Frank get in here 0:31:25.720 --> 0:31:28.880 so now, But it's a wimer rammer. Are they bird dogs? 0:31:30.160 --> 0:31:36.000 I believe so well. I mean it's like Ronnie does 0:31:36.040 --> 0:31:38.320 have Ronnie baby does have one in his in his correction, 0:31:38.400 --> 0:31:40.960 which which you just have to explain it next time 0:31:40.960 --> 0:31:43.720 you're on Ronnie. But he does have one thing they 0:31:43.800 --> 0:31:47.200 never do. See. He's back to this sharpness and hardness test. 0:31:47.240 --> 0:31:50.480 There's some debate amongst the German hunting dog community about 0:31:50.520 --> 0:31:55.520 whether this is fact or fiction about making your dog 0:31:55.600 --> 0:31:59.680 duke it out with various small mammals, various midsized mammals. 0:32:00.560 --> 0:32:05.280 Ranny points out that the sharpness these are sharpness tests 0:32:05.360 --> 0:32:08.920 or hardness tests. You never do it on a test day. 0:32:09.240 --> 0:32:11.000 It's separate from a test day. He goes down to 0:32:11.040 --> 0:32:15.160 say this, the fox part is in the test, did 0:32:15.280 --> 0:32:20.560 danielle Oh, here's the other update the dog. You know, 0:32:20.760 --> 0:32:23.680 Daniel is donating the dog to our auction house oddities 0:32:23.760 --> 0:32:28.040 which started this whole. That dog is now pregnant. What 0:32:28.080 --> 0:32:29.760 do you call it when you're pregnant and they put 0:32:29.760 --> 0:32:36.360 that little wand over your belly. Sot the mother of 0:32:36.400 --> 0:32:38.240 the puppy that was gonna be auctioned off for the 0:32:38.280 --> 0:32:41.520 puppy that was gonna be auctioned off as already pregnant. No, no, 0:32:41.520 --> 0:32:46.040 no, no no, the dog that will burd the puppy that 0:32:46.240 --> 0:32:49.000 we will auction off in the auction house of oddities. 0:32:49.080 --> 0:32:51.480 The way you just said, it can't sound like a 0:32:51.520 --> 0:32:56.000 puppy was was pregnant? No Irish Irish puppy was that 0:32:56.040 --> 0:33:03.320 old joke Irish twins? Anyhow? Uh? What was I getting? That? 0:33:04.840 --> 0:33:07.080 The dog's pregnant, the puppy is on its way. There's 0:33:07.080 --> 0:33:08.640 at least five of them in there. They did a 0:33:09.040 --> 0:33:12.000 ultrasound on the dog, and that guy is talking about 0:33:12.000 --> 0:33:15.160 all this German dog stuff, which I like. But Ronnie 0:33:15.200 --> 0:33:18.960 goes on to say this, here's the test that they 0:33:19.000 --> 0:33:25.080 do that involves a dead fox. Okay, get yourself dead fox, 0:33:26.120 --> 0:33:31.000 tie it to a chord, give that cord to a judge. 0:33:31.320 --> 0:33:35.480 The judge then drags the fox two. You can tell 0:33:35.480 --> 0:33:38.720 where talking about European stuff because it's a meters not yards. 0:33:38.920 --> 0:33:43.400 Drags a fox two and leaves it behind a rail 0:33:43.640 --> 0:33:47.600 or a crawl of sorts. Okay, drag the dead fox 0:33:47.640 --> 0:33:51.320 all around, put it in a crowd. The dog gets 0:33:51.360 --> 0:33:54.320 there by nose, which Ronnie says is not a big deal. 0:33:55.120 --> 0:33:57.760 But what is a big deal is the dog has 0:33:57.760 --> 0:34:01.000 to jump into the corral, gray the dead fox out 0:34:01.080 --> 0:34:05.000 of there, jump out and return it to their owner handler. 0:34:06.000 --> 0:34:10.240 That test is referred to as the fox in a box. 0:34:12.440 --> 0:34:14.960 And he goes on to say true ship. There so 0:34:15.080 --> 0:34:17.399 no doubt. Someone right in to tell us how that's 0:34:17.400 --> 0:34:20.480 not actually true, And I think maybe we need to 0:34:21.640 --> 0:34:26.480 That sounds like some doctors ship. Actually that should be 0:34:26.480 --> 0:34:31.240 another shirt. We should make shirt foxing socks in a box. 0:34:31.600 --> 0:34:36.600 Do the the macro fructification T shirts coming along nicely? 0:34:36.920 --> 0:34:41.800 It's gonna be like a hundred What are you waving off? Ted? 0:34:42.320 --> 0:34:45.080 Again is wondering what we're talking about. It doesn't matter 0:34:45.160 --> 0:34:47.560 because because that's the last thing and now we're getting 0:34:47.600 --> 0:34:50.400 back in. But I'm saying I was just like waving 0:34:50.440 --> 0:34:54.080 him off, as in like the macto, I can't pronounce it. Well, 0:34:54.200 --> 0:34:56.239 I've got a question, Steve, because you're you've been saying 0:34:56.239 --> 0:34:58.800 it more correctly. Are we getting the Do the T 0:34:58.880 --> 0:35:01.640 shirts have the incorrect to word on it macro fructation 0:35:01.719 --> 0:35:03.560 or do they have the real one, which was macro fruit? 0:35:03.719 --> 0:35:05.720 What would be a better What would be a better? 0:35:06.160 --> 0:35:09.040 Better T shirt would be the email chain of people 0:35:09.200 --> 0:35:13.680 arguing about this. Okay, I eventually what was the consensus. 0:35:13.719 --> 0:35:16.440 My role here, my role here at the company allows 0:35:16.480 --> 0:35:20.239 me to have final say on on certain things, and 0:35:20.280 --> 0:35:23.920 I and and uh and one of those things was 0:35:23.960 --> 0:35:27.400 what this T shirt would say on it. I felt 0:35:28.040 --> 0:35:34.760 that I was so close to right that I wanted 0:35:34.800 --> 0:35:38.560 to have the right word. So the shirt is a 0:35:38.600 --> 0:35:41.920 collection of beautiful mushrooms, a sketch of a collection of 0:35:41.960 --> 0:35:49.000 beautiful mushrooms. And it says simply macro fructification, not macro fructation. 0:35:49.000 --> 0:35:52.960 Because the problem is it's so my bad word, my 0:35:53.040 --> 0:35:54.960 wrong word was so close to the right word that 0:35:55.040 --> 0:35:58.280 it's not really like, not that funny anymore. And even agreed, 0:35:58.280 --> 0:36:01.319 he's like then it just as confusing. It's only like 0:36:01.320 --> 0:36:03.399 a hundred of these shirts. We're gonna sell them. They'll 0:36:03.400 --> 0:36:07.680 be gone in an instant. We'll need to do has 0:36:07.840 --> 0:36:11.479 been has it been designed yet? Designs sharp looking shirts? Okay, 0:36:12.320 --> 0:36:16.600 I was going to make a suggestion, there's that's too bad. 0:36:16.840 --> 0:36:18.319 We need we'll need to make more. I think the 0:36:18.320 --> 0:36:23.879 demands it's a hundred forty four because they sell them 0:36:23.880 --> 0:36:29.480 by the dozens. Apparently eggs traps and apparently T shirts 0:36:30.120 --> 0:36:34.759 are sold by the dozen. Well, we get more in 0:36:34.840 --> 0:36:37.759 if they get sold out quickly. No, it's a one off. 0:36:39.440 --> 0:36:43.279 What's what's the price on these? A few hundred bucks 0:36:45.719 --> 0:36:49.560 of hocks? You know what? I feel like there's a 0:36:49.560 --> 0:36:52.239 lot of demand for and we should do again since 0:36:52.280 --> 0:36:54.840 we're on it. No tell me T shirts is a 0:36:55.000 --> 0:37:00.399 block T shirt rip off? A hundred forty? Were those 0:37:00.400 --> 0:37:05.160 buggers Fox in the Box is going to it would 0:37:05.200 --> 0:37:20.799 be Ronnie flip blocks. See now just to clear up now, 0:37:21.200 --> 0:37:25.000 now we're back to talking to you. Yeah, great, it's uh. 0:37:26.600 --> 0:37:28.800 I'm glad I came up from Kentucky to hear about 0:37:28.800 --> 0:37:31.440 all this. It's uh. But that that's that's that's good 0:37:31.480 --> 0:37:33.480 because I've never been to Montana. I've never been this 0:37:33.560 --> 0:37:35.799 close to Canada, you know, like I wanted to thing 0:37:36.280 --> 0:37:38.879 maybe has some Neil Young angst or something. And yeah, 0:37:38.920 --> 0:37:42.560 I know you're saying Darryl Hannah, maybe you know she'd 0:37:42.560 --> 0:37:45.719 been to Canada' bet with. I've seen Gordon Lightfoot twice live. 0:37:47.280 --> 0:37:50.400 Really Yeah, he had a great guitarist back in the sixties, 0:37:50.400 --> 0:37:53.400 Red Shake, great acoustic guitars. He did, like if you 0:37:53.440 --> 0:37:58.120 could read my mind the guitar parts read Steve, I'm 0:37:58.120 --> 0:38:03.520 reading your mind. Tell us what a long hunter was. Yeah, 0:38:03.560 --> 0:38:11.360 a long hunter was a professional hunter that across the Alleghenis, 0:38:11.440 --> 0:38:15.080 across the Blue Ridge. They came from western Virginia, western 0:38:15.080 --> 0:38:19.799 North Carolina, eastern Tennessee. They supplanted the Indian in the 0:38:19.840 --> 0:38:23.239 deer skin trade. And it could be either seasonal your 0:38:23.320 --> 0:38:26.640 hunt deer, or it could be year round. You can also, 0:38:26.920 --> 0:38:30.000 like Boon did, by the second and third frost, you 0:38:30.040 --> 0:38:34.120 start trapping beaver and then as the season rolls around again, 0:38:34.200 --> 0:38:37.680 you kind of switch off and by April May you're 0:38:38.040 --> 0:38:42.399 you're killing deer again. But yeah, it was a They're 0:38:42.440 --> 0:38:44.319 kind of like the fore runners to the mountain men. 0:38:44.440 --> 0:38:47.480 But of course the mountain men there. Number one quarry 0:38:47.640 --> 0:38:50.960 is what the Rocky Mountain trappers wanted what and for 0:38:51.200 --> 0:38:57.120 the long hunter, the number one quarry was the deer. Yeah, 0:38:57.120 --> 0:39:00.160 white tailed deer. And uh. And in both case his 0:39:00.239 --> 0:39:03.920 fashion drove it and uh and it was male fashion 0:39:04.120 --> 0:39:09.680 and male fashion, male fashion, I mean women, you know, 0:39:09.840 --> 0:39:12.000 you know they had some deer skin dresses, I guess 0:39:12.080 --> 0:39:19.120 and whatever and uh, but yeah, it was it was breaches, saddles, shoes, gloves, 0:39:19.760 --> 0:39:21.879 the fancy yellow pumps she wanted to wear. We went 0:39:21.920 --> 0:39:27.560 ballroom dancing, and uh, they were taking out deer literally 0:39:27.600 --> 0:39:29.400 by that they were making shoes. They were making like 0:39:29.520 --> 0:39:33.600 pump shoes with deer hide. Yeah, typically died yellow. Ye. 0:39:33.680 --> 0:39:35.920 It was a huge It was a huge industry in London. 0:39:36.560 --> 0:39:39.080 You know, London was was actually the one of the 0:39:39.280 --> 0:39:45.120 global centers of white tailed deer processing. And yeah, and 0:39:45.120 --> 0:39:47.440 and there was a number it was a cottage industry. 0:39:48.000 --> 0:39:50.560 There was a number of tanneries of course in the 0:39:50.560 --> 0:39:55.160 American colonies as well. And it was kind of ad hoc. 0:39:55.320 --> 0:40:00.279 It wasn't as well. Awkrutizes out a word as like 0:40:00.320 --> 0:40:04.240 the Hudson's Bay Company which begins in sixteen seventy and 0:40:04.440 --> 0:40:11.239 that really is uh well smoothly oiled. And you know, 0:40:11.280 --> 0:40:13.680 you had a kind of a pack order of who's 0:40:13.680 --> 0:40:17.000 gonna control it. You had particulous record keeping. Yeah, and 0:40:17.120 --> 0:40:19.600 maybe they even had like it was unionized like gilded 0:40:19.640 --> 0:40:22.640 and you even had laws as far as like high requirements. 0:40:22.800 --> 0:40:27.080 You had weight requirements, religious requirements. You could union it 0:40:27.120 --> 0:40:29.080 was like in your contract you had to pause every 0:40:29.120 --> 0:40:31.520 hour and smoke your pipe. It would be fine and 0:40:31.640 --> 0:40:34.040 let the boyage. You're singing in the Creative Boi. And 0:40:34.280 --> 0:40:37.720 you know you had really like those French Canadian beaver trappers. 0:40:37.719 --> 0:40:41.200 The guys had like had like in their contracts. Man, 0:40:41.239 --> 0:40:44.000 every hour we can we can stop and sing our 0:40:44.120 --> 0:40:46.879 chances And I don't know what they're saying. How used 0:40:46.880 --> 0:40:49.040 to you know Alotta? Oh yeah, I'll tell you exactly 0:40:49.040 --> 0:40:52.000 what they used to sing. I grew up in Michigan, man, 0:40:52.040 --> 0:40:59.000 we studied all this stuff. Yeah it paddle your canoe along. 0:40:59.120 --> 0:41:02.239 We studied this stuff in the core SI and uh yeah. 0:41:02.280 --> 0:41:04.759 But but you never had anything like that with with 0:41:04.840 --> 0:41:06.759 the Mountain I accuse me with with the with the 0:41:06.800 --> 0:41:10.680 Long Hunters and um, and there was never any like 0:41:10.719 --> 0:41:12.560 with the Rocky Mountain papers. You know, you would have 0:41:12.600 --> 0:41:15.239 your Manuel Liza's and your John jacob as stores and 0:41:15.280 --> 0:41:17.400 people that really hit the Jackpott and became and you 0:41:17.480 --> 0:41:21.440 never really quite had that with the Long Hunters. But 0:41:21.719 --> 0:41:24.680 ultimately there's that that's an interesting point you're bringing up 0:41:24.719 --> 0:41:30.680 that um not only it's like so decentralized, but like 0:41:30.719 --> 0:41:33.960 America's first millionaire was a guy that got involved in 0:41:33.960 --> 0:41:36.640 the beaver trade. But I never thought about that that 0:41:36.719 --> 0:41:39.360 with all this like in that boon era of the 0:41:39.360 --> 0:41:43.560 white tail hunters, didn't they weren't like producing millionaires at 0:41:43.640 --> 0:41:46.239 least not at least not ones. We know that that's true. Well, 0:41:46.320 --> 0:41:48.000 what was he the first millionaire? I thought it was 0:41:48.000 --> 0:41:50.520 George Washington, but he did it on the land. No, 0:41:50.640 --> 0:41:53.600 I thought ast was America's first million crank can find 0:41:53.600 --> 0:41:56.280 out for us when you get off at Astor Place 0:41:56.680 --> 0:41:59.759 in New York the subway station Aster Place subway station, 0:41:59.800 --> 0:42:05.879 there's beavers in the tile work. Wow. Yeah, yeah, there's 0:42:05.920 --> 0:42:08.120 beavers in the tile work of the subway station New York, 0:42:08.120 --> 0:42:12.520 at Astroplace. I spent so much time in that subway station. 0:42:12.680 --> 0:42:15.879 Well you're looking the wrong way. Yeah, you're facing out 0:42:16.120 --> 0:42:18.839 watching the rats fund in the little track area. That's 0:42:18.840 --> 0:42:21.319 what I like, standing and watch those rats are in around. Well, 0:42:21.360 --> 0:42:24.520 that was that was the big money area era area. 0:42:24.680 --> 0:42:26.359 You know, you had the you had the Dutch there, 0:42:26.680 --> 0:42:29.680 and um, you know, the beaver and the Bible it 0:42:29.800 --> 0:42:33.000 just kind of are really critically important to the settlement 0:42:33.000 --> 0:42:38.399 of America, particularly the beaver in that area. And so yeah, 0:42:38.520 --> 0:42:40.839 what was the air like, what were the years when 0:42:41.040 --> 0:42:45.200 the long hunters like Boone were most active in their hunting. Yeah, 0:42:45.280 --> 0:42:48.759 it's really short. You really could kind of sandwich it 0:42:48.800 --> 0:42:52.239 in between between the like the very end of the 0:42:52.280 --> 0:42:55.680 Prince and Indian War seventeen sixty two, seventeen sixty three, 0:42:56.080 --> 0:42:59.600 right in there to about the very beginning the first 0:42:59.600 --> 0:43:02.480 s of the American Revolution. If you're gonna put that 0:43:02.520 --> 0:43:05.040 in movie terms, think like from the last the Mohicans 0:43:05.160 --> 0:43:07.160 to the Patriot Like right in there you have the 0:43:07.200 --> 0:43:13.360 long hunter period and the real heyday really is quite brief, 0:43:13.360 --> 0:43:16.959 and it's fairly well defined from about seventeen sixty nine 0:43:17.080 --> 0:43:21.240 about seventeen seventy two seventy three. So I mean it's 0:43:21.120 --> 0:43:25.919 a tiny span. Now you always had market hunters four years. Yeah, well, 0:43:25.960 --> 0:43:29.880 I mean that you know, when you start drawing delinea 0:43:30.480 --> 0:43:32.879 delineations like that, you're gonna get people that know it's 0:43:32.880 --> 0:43:35.359 not right. You always had market hunters and market hunting. 0:43:35.400 --> 0:43:38.319 I mean that that goes back a long way. But 0:43:38.440 --> 0:43:42.000 as far as like the classic period of seventeen sixty 0:43:42.040 --> 0:43:44.200 eight sixty nine, that's when you had the big furb 0:43:44.680 --> 0:43:47.719 gads coming in that that weren't boom wasn't necessarily part 0:43:47.719 --> 0:43:51.280 of that boon hunted far more solitary, which is brother's 0:43:51.360 --> 0:43:53.399 brother in law, you know, Kith and ken. I kind 0:43:53.400 --> 0:43:56.040 of thank a few neighbors for camp tenders. But you 0:43:56.120 --> 0:43:58.759 had guys like James Knox coming up from the New 0:43:58.880 --> 0:44:02.840 River Valley of uh, Virginia and not comes in with 0:44:02.840 --> 0:44:07.200 twenty two twenty three men and uh you know they 0:44:07.520 --> 0:44:10.520 engaged in deer shooting, like twenty three guys going hunt 0:44:10.520 --> 0:44:15.279 white tails. Yeah, and they're each bringing in and these 0:44:15.280 --> 0:44:17.920 are pack horsemen. These aren't guys coming in a little backpacks. 0:44:17.920 --> 0:44:21.359 They're not out there just trekking around. They're coming in, uh, 0:44:21.640 --> 0:44:24.680 bringing in each two to three two to three uh 0:44:24.920 --> 0:44:28.000 pack horses, each with all their traps and so forth. 0:44:28.040 --> 0:44:31.160 And these are hand forged double long spring traps. And 0:44:31.400 --> 0:44:33.520 that's the difference to in the the Indian method. The 0:44:33.520 --> 0:44:37.080 Indians are hunting the fur bearers, you know, they're gigging them, 0:44:37.120 --> 0:44:40.799 they're shooting them. Well, uh, whites were trapping them. And 0:44:41.000 --> 0:44:43.520 this is when you really have the development of like 0:44:43.560 --> 0:44:46.439 the long spring traff the double long spring traf um. 0:44:46.480 --> 0:44:48.480 But their hand Fortunately before you have you know, like 0:44:48.800 --> 0:44:51.560 Oneida and Victory of those kind of folks. So they 0:44:51.560 --> 0:44:55.520 were equally trappers as much as they were hunters. They 0:44:55.520 --> 0:44:58.399 could be you know, I think Boone and people tend 0:44:58.400 --> 0:45:01.720 to overlook this. I think Boone was addicted to beaver trapping, 0:45:01.760 --> 0:45:04.799 and I throughout his live almost at the very end, 0:45:04.880 --> 0:45:07.080 he would still go out there and trap beaver. Yeah, 0:45:07.480 --> 0:45:14.040 trap beaver and otter in wintertime and you know, beaver. Again, 0:45:14.120 --> 0:45:17.040 it was the fashion that drove it, and particularly in Europe, 0:45:17.040 --> 0:45:20.040 because the European beaver was pretty well trapped out by 0:45:20.120 --> 0:45:23.880 the sixteen hundreds, and so you know, wanting to wear 0:45:24.000 --> 0:45:27.680 a a beaver fur felt hat. You can even read 0:45:27.719 --> 0:45:30.239 about him in Chaucer and Shakespeare, and so it was 0:45:30.480 --> 0:45:33.560 really a cultural thing. So that really drove the beaver industry. 0:45:33.640 --> 0:45:36.480 Of course, by that's if you talk about the Rocky 0:45:36.520 --> 0:45:40.160 mountain travers, that's when you have the fashion switched to 0:45:40.239 --> 0:45:47.440 silk and that ends that. But but that's really a 0:45:47.440 --> 0:45:50.760 a thriving dynamo during Boone's period as well, the beaver 0:45:51.120 --> 0:45:55.480 for felt hat and and then the deer skins, and 0:45:55.520 --> 0:45:59.720 so yeah, you could be seasonal, just go for the deer. 0:46:00.080 --> 0:46:03.560 Typically it would be about from April through about the 0:46:03.719 --> 0:46:07.239 second or third frost. They wanted the deer skins. I'm 0:46:07.239 --> 0:46:09.879 talking about the actual skin when the skin was thin 0:46:10.160 --> 0:46:13.279 because the tanning processes of the day, Uh, you know, 0:46:13.360 --> 0:46:16.680 they weren't using big chemical tanning vats. They if you've 0:46:16.680 --> 0:46:21.160 got the skins um tan, and you could they had 0:46:21.160 --> 0:46:24.920 three different levels of skin uh gradation. You could get 0:46:24.960 --> 0:46:29.920 them grained. That meant that they were fully processed tand 0:46:29.960 --> 0:46:31.560 ready to go. And that could be either if you 0:46:31.600 --> 0:46:33.840 got them through the Indian trade a brain tan or 0:46:33.920 --> 0:46:36.320 through the White trade typically an oak tand of some type. 0:46:36.640 --> 0:46:39.600 Or they were even using a salt alum or you 0:46:39.600 --> 0:46:42.560 could get them half dressed. Uh. That meant that you 0:46:42.800 --> 0:46:44.480 and this is what Boone and those guys are doing. 0:46:44.560 --> 0:46:47.040 The long hunters were half dressing the skins, meaning that 0:46:47.080 --> 0:46:49.400 they would go out. You know, they shoot the deer. 0:46:49.960 --> 0:46:52.600 They deherent like with the courrier and eye for a 0:46:55.680 --> 0:46:58.680 what do they call them drawn eye? Drawn eye? Yeah, 0:46:58.840 --> 0:47:01.239 and and uh and then they whip it over a 0:47:02.120 --> 0:47:07.480 steaking board until you break down the epidermal era. And 0:47:07.560 --> 0:47:10.399 then you would get about fifty and you could fall 0:47:10.480 --> 0:47:12.960 them up and you put them in a bear skin. 0:47:13.000 --> 0:47:15.440 And so they were typically wrapped in bundles of fifty 0:47:16.040 --> 0:47:18.319 and like when the long hunters would go out, they 0:47:18.360 --> 0:47:21.239 go out oftentimes in a team like locks I said, 0:47:21.280 --> 0:47:25.120 he go on guys. That's a lot of guys with horses. 0:47:25.160 --> 0:47:27.080 And they would have a big base camp where they 0:47:27.120 --> 0:47:30.440 meet about every two weeks, and then they would establish 0:47:30.480 --> 0:47:33.479 small what would refer to as out camps. We would 0:47:33.480 --> 0:47:36.719 think of been a little satellite camps. Uh and even 0:47:36.760 --> 0:47:38.879 boom when they first go to Kentucky the first time 0:47:38.920 --> 0:47:40.920 they had a base camp, and then they would have 0:47:41.000 --> 0:47:44.439 about six or eight satellite camps and you would team 0:47:44.520 --> 0:47:47.120 up would be you know, Steve and you honest. They 0:47:47.160 --> 0:47:49.839 go out and hopefully they don't get mad about something. 0:47:49.920 --> 0:47:53.399 They hunt and do their thing, and then every two 0:47:53.440 --> 0:47:57.279 weeks they bring them back to the camp and they 0:47:57.360 --> 0:48:01.319 would wrap them up in um year excuse me. They 0:48:01.360 --> 0:48:03.399 would wrap them up in bear hides, and they would 0:48:03.440 --> 0:48:06.600 put them up on scaffolds. You know, typically log scaffolds 0:48:06.600 --> 0:48:09.480 about eight twelve feet off all the ground because of 0:48:09.560 --> 0:48:12.400 what keeps stuff out of them. Yeah, like what bears 0:48:12.840 --> 0:48:16.319 bears wolves right, and a lot of times too, they 0:48:16.360 --> 0:48:21.799 would put um dried buffalo hides. They would stretch those 0:48:21.880 --> 0:48:25.040 over the top, like a hairy piece of plywood or something, 0:48:25.719 --> 0:48:29.040 because that would be part of it. You would you know, 0:48:29.160 --> 0:48:31.160 tilt and kind of deflected the ray. But it would 0:48:31.160 --> 0:48:33.520 also keep the buzzers out because the buzzers would land 0:48:33.560 --> 0:48:35.919 in and they would claw into them as well. So yeah, 0:48:36.120 --> 0:48:38.800 it was all kind of uh, I mean, it was. 0:48:38.880 --> 0:48:41.920 It was. It was a hazardous underfry enterprise. It was. 0:48:42.040 --> 0:48:46.440 It was extremely hard. It was arduous. You know, people 0:48:46.480 --> 0:48:49.000 tend to look at these folks like, you know, like 0:48:49.120 --> 0:48:51.360 that like the Daniel day Lewis type or something that 0:48:51.520 --> 0:48:54.200 you know that these are hard working guys. It's there's 0:48:54.200 --> 0:48:56.280 a lot of ways to die out there. The business 0:48:56.360 --> 0:49:00.640 itself is very very hard. You can lose your profits 0:49:01.120 --> 0:49:04.640 either through you know, rain, maybe a bear claws into it. 0:49:05.440 --> 0:49:08.279 Um things are stolen, like by the Indians, and that 0:49:08.400 --> 0:49:11.680 happened to Boone several times, you know, particularly like in 0:49:11.800 --> 0:49:14.760 his first big long hunt to Kentucky in seventeen sixty 0:49:14.840 --> 0:49:17.439 nine to seventeen seventy one, Boon's robbed two three times 0:49:17.520 --> 0:49:20.200 by Indians. He goes back after be on the trail 0:49:20.280 --> 0:49:23.600 literally from May of seventeen sixty nine to May of 0:49:23.719 --> 0:49:27.040 seventeen seventy one, he goes back to the Yadkin Valley 0:49:27.160 --> 0:49:30.960 through Rebecca and goes, well, we're broker than when I left. Yeah, 0:49:31.040 --> 0:49:34.839 he had two small fortunes stolen from him on that trip, right, Yeah, 0:49:35.000 --> 0:49:38.400 But he had seen Kentucky, and he knew the way in, 0:49:38.719 --> 0:49:41.319 and he had explored it more than any white man 0:49:41.800 --> 0:49:45.680 in the settlements. And so that's kind of paves away, 0:49:46.000 --> 0:49:48.560 you know, whether providentially or by chance or however people 0:49:48.560 --> 0:49:50.800 want to interpret that for Boon, what you know, he 0:49:50.920 --> 0:49:56.600 becomes the great uh Icon, the first true frontier hero. 0:49:57.440 --> 0:49:59.560 Can you explain real quick? Just to back up a 0:49:59.600 --> 0:50:03.080 little bit when you talk about that short period, that 0:50:03.160 --> 0:50:06.000 short heyday of long hunters. So these are like hunters 0:50:06.080 --> 0:50:10.040 that would do these months long, maybe years long trips 0:50:10.760 --> 0:50:14.399 over the Appalachians. What do you say from your where 0:50:14.400 --> 0:50:20.520 you're from? Do you go Apple Achians? I Appalachian? Uh? 0:50:20.640 --> 0:50:22.839 That's New Orleans and New Orleans. I mean it depends 0:50:22.840 --> 0:50:25.320 on where you're Probably Appellatian to fine Blue Ridge. We 0:50:25.400 --> 0:50:29.160 probably over the Blue Ridge. Yes, that's moral timy, very 0:50:29.280 --> 0:50:31.800 so it's a very fine. It's very short period. What 0:50:32.040 --> 0:50:34.240 was it about the French and Indian War that allowed 0:50:34.239 --> 0:50:36.120 it to open up? Was it we that we that 0:50:36.239 --> 0:50:41.719 the American colonists had uh displaced the French out of 0:50:41.760 --> 0:50:43.840 those areas, and that's what allowed the long hunters to 0:50:43.840 --> 0:50:47.760 start hunting in there. Well it ended, That's what happened. 0:50:47.880 --> 0:50:49.400 I mean, you know you have the bridge, like the 0:50:49.440 --> 0:50:54.360 blood bath ended. Yeah. By by seventeen sixty two, seventeen 0:50:54.440 --> 0:50:57.919 sixty three, you um have the end of the French 0:50:57.960 --> 0:51:01.080 and Indian War and you have relative of peace that's 0:51:01.200 --> 0:51:07.240 uh established and the British established the Treaty of seventeen 0:51:07.280 --> 0:51:10.839 sixty three, which ostensibly is to keep the colonists out 0:51:11.200 --> 0:51:13.440 from the west. Nobody paid much attention to that, but 0:51:13.600 --> 0:51:16.560 you had the Peace of Paris, uh and done in 0:51:16.640 --> 0:51:20.279 London in Paris that and that ended the Seven Years War, 0:51:21.040 --> 0:51:23.320 and so it was wide open. So relative peace was 0:51:23.440 --> 0:51:26.440 established with the with the the Indians, particularly the Algonquins 0:51:26.480 --> 0:51:30.400 that inhabited the land west of the Blue Ridge. But 0:51:30.560 --> 0:51:34.080 also the French agreed to not you know that that 0:51:34.160 --> 0:51:36.799 their land, I mean usurped. You know, the British gained 0:51:36.840 --> 0:51:39.719 a huge amount of territory. They gained Louisiana. You know, 0:51:40.239 --> 0:51:44.279 at least the Spanish yet and the British were possessors 0:51:44.360 --> 0:51:47.040 now of the Ohio Valley. The Ohio Valley was was 0:51:47.600 --> 0:51:51.240 like the big plum. You know. You had the French 0:51:51.400 --> 0:51:53.360 coming in from the west, and then you had the 0:51:53.440 --> 0:51:58.520 British who had established colonies along the tide water and uh, 0:51:58.640 --> 0:52:01.080 everybody's kind of fighting for the lakes. And so once 0:52:01.239 --> 0:52:07.520 that period it's settled, and then it's open and you 0:52:07.600 --> 0:52:11.759 can get in there without worrying so much about an 0:52:11.880 --> 0:52:15.919 arrow in the back. Those wars, like both the revel 0:52:16.120 --> 0:52:20.040 both the American Revolution and the French Indian War, we're like, 0:52:20.480 --> 0:52:25.520 we're horribly bloody on the frontier. Yeah, and I mean 0:52:25.600 --> 0:52:28.160 just the like the atrocities you read about that aren't 0:52:28.440 --> 0:52:32.600 widely known. Oh man, it's brutally well. Just take the 0:52:32.680 --> 0:52:36.520 American Revolution for example. Most people think, and you whether 0:52:36.520 --> 0:52:39.040 you're listening to a television broadcast or you're reading a 0:52:39.120 --> 0:52:41.279 book that go, well, you know, Corn Wallace surrender to 0:52:41.520 --> 0:52:45.600 uh George Washington in October one, that's the end of 0:52:45.600 --> 0:52:49.320 the American Revolution. Well, it was in the east, but 0:52:49.400 --> 0:52:51.520 it certainly was not out west, you know, and by 0:52:51.560 --> 0:52:55.320 out west, I mean Kentucky. Kentucky that was you know, 0:52:55.440 --> 0:52:59.560 the Far West, and so that war continued, the American 0:52:59.640 --> 0:53:03.239 revel Ousian for another year and a half. And um, 0:53:04.600 --> 0:53:07.560 it's far more catches catch can You don't have manual 0:53:07.600 --> 0:53:11.400 of arms training. Uh, you're training meaning you're getting behind trees. 0:53:11.480 --> 0:53:15.239 You're fighting Indian style. Uh, there's no rules of war, 0:53:15.400 --> 0:53:20.400 there's no real rules of engagement. You have Indian allies 0:53:20.640 --> 0:53:23.520 that are both coming out of the Great Lakes, that 0:53:23.640 --> 0:53:26.120 are being still supplied by the bridge up there in 0:53:26.560 --> 0:53:29.520 Detroit and so forth. And you have now a lot 0:53:29.560 --> 0:53:31.719 of French partisans that are that are part of that 0:53:31.840 --> 0:53:36.560 as well. And you even had some ranger units from 0:53:36.600 --> 0:53:38.960 the British Butler's Rangers. I mean, these guys were tough. 0:53:39.000 --> 0:53:41.160 They were kind of like the British equivalent of the 0:53:41.160 --> 0:53:45.080 American and earlier counterpart Rodgers Rangers. So yeah, it was bloody, 0:53:45.120 --> 0:53:47.920 it was brutal and um and and but it was 0:53:48.040 --> 0:53:51.320 just how life was it. It's inconceivable to most of 0:53:51.440 --> 0:53:53.360 us today. And that's the thing. If you read the 0:53:53.440 --> 0:53:59.960 first biography of Boone um John Philson's book, Uh, Presidents 0:54:00.000 --> 0:54:04.200 State of Kentucky. Um, it's got a biographical account of 0:54:04.239 --> 0:54:08.439 Boone and one thing about it is how incredibly dark 0:54:08.520 --> 0:54:14.680 and brooding and bloody it really was. Uh yeah, and 0:54:14.760 --> 0:54:16.319 I were talking about We talked about this a couple 0:54:16.360 --> 0:54:21.560 of times. The you see him when you watch the 0:54:21.600 --> 0:54:23.759 old Frontiers and movies, are watching Boone stuff. You know, 0:54:23.840 --> 0:54:27.160 he'll take his rifle out and split a bullet on 0:54:27.239 --> 0:54:30.000 a hatchet whatnot? Right like what he called he called 0:54:30.040 --> 0:54:32.080 his gun tick liquor right because he could shoot a 0:54:32.120 --> 0:54:34.520 tick off. I've done I've done that. You can do that. 0:54:34.640 --> 0:54:36.839 It's not a it's not an impossible fee and I've 0:54:36.880 --> 0:54:39.520 done it. But how accurate could these guys have really been? 0:54:40.120 --> 0:54:44.400 Because think about all the inconsistencies. The powder is inconsistent, 0:54:46.520 --> 0:54:48.759 like these guys are making their own powder or buying it. 0:54:49.800 --> 0:54:54.400 You're not measuring grains because it's different combustibilities. Like how 0:54:54.480 --> 0:54:57.799 good could they have been? There are there any real 0:54:59.239 --> 0:55:02.400 like are there any real assessments of how good they 0:55:02.440 --> 0:55:04.200 were with these rifles? Like how far could they shoot 0:55:04.239 --> 0:55:09.680 a deer? Well, probably the most famous long shot and 0:55:09.719 --> 0:55:12.480 it wasn't a deer, it was a British officer. It 0:55:12.640 --> 0:55:16.640 was sure shot Timothy Murphy who shot a British officer 0:55:16.680 --> 0:55:20.160 at about two d twenty five yards. Um. They were 0:55:20.200 --> 0:55:22.800 just sitting out there on the horses and uh American 0:55:22.840 --> 0:55:24.960 Revolution and Murphy came out there and kind of like 0:55:25.080 --> 0:55:28.440 maybe lick the front site like the old Sergeant Albert 0:55:28.440 --> 0:55:30.960 New York movie. I don't know, and uh put his 0:55:31.080 --> 0:55:33.520 gun in a in a cock of a tree and 0:55:33.680 --> 0:55:36.800 leveled down and these British was like, what's he gonna do? 0:55:37.120 --> 0:55:39.000 And he killed him and then he killed the guy 0:55:39.080 --> 0:55:42.800 next to him. That's around two twenty yards. UH. Typically 0:55:42.920 --> 0:55:46.120 most folks aren't shooting at that kind of uh range. 0:55:46.200 --> 0:55:50.040 But these men really knew their guns. I mean they 0:55:50.120 --> 0:55:53.040 lived with their guns. This was this is a drill bit, 0:55:53.160 --> 0:55:55.560 this was a hammer. This was their tool not only 0:55:56.120 --> 0:55:58.680 of their occupation like in the case of Boone, but 0:55:58.800 --> 0:56:00.960 it was a survival to well that you had to 0:56:01.080 --> 0:56:06.120 know your gun to stay alive. And there's one account 0:56:06.320 --> 0:56:12.680 of a rare war officer, Daniel Broadhead, who encounters a 0:56:12.800 --> 0:56:16.600 number of Samuel Brady's men. Brady was a scalp. Little 0:56:16.760 --> 0:56:19.799 is really written about him. He's, in his own way, 0:56:19.880 --> 0:56:24.160 kind of an unresolved Indian hater. His family was killed 0:56:24.160 --> 0:56:27.400 by Indians. He had these UH men with him like 0:56:27.600 --> 0:56:30.719 Lewis Wetzel, who were just really dangerous and scary. But 0:56:30.800 --> 0:56:37.960 Broadhead comes across Brady's men and they challenge them to 0:56:38.040 --> 0:56:41.280 a shooting match. And broadhead Men's are all using muskets, 0:56:41.360 --> 0:56:45.680 and Brady's men's are using long rivals and they put 0:56:45.760 --> 0:56:48.319 a keg out there about seventy or eighty yards. Can 0:56:48.360 --> 0:56:50.400 you tell us the difference between a long rifle and 0:56:52.040 --> 0:56:57.000 sure a musket is a smooth boar there it's like 0:56:57.080 --> 0:57:01.480 a shotgun like a tube, and a rifle has rifling 0:57:01.560 --> 0:57:05.720 in the barrel like they're you know, they're grooves and lands. 0:57:06.320 --> 0:57:10.520 And that was actually done uh by the Germans and 0:57:10.640 --> 0:57:14.840 around fifteen fifteen sixty, and it was really incidental that 0:57:14.920 --> 0:57:17.240 had nothing to do with accuracy in the very beginning 0:57:17.320 --> 0:57:20.160 that that had. It was it was kind of a 0:57:20.960 --> 0:57:25.880 a fix on how do we fire these guns and 0:57:26.080 --> 0:57:30.400 keep the black powder from smudging the barrel afterwards? Because 0:57:30.440 --> 0:57:34.520 black powder, once you fire it, it's high grovescopic that 0:57:34.600 --> 0:57:37.600 absorbs moisture, and so if you shoot it a few times, 0:57:37.600 --> 0:57:39.720 particularly with the smooth board, you know, it can really 0:57:39.760 --> 0:57:42.200 clunk up a barrel because you know, there's no place 0:57:42.240 --> 0:57:45.040 for the fouling to go the soot, and so that 0:57:45.120 --> 0:57:48.800 the Germans just cut grooves in the barrel, straight grooves 0:57:49.520 --> 0:57:51.840 and to keep them so the fouling could go into 0:57:51.840 --> 0:57:53.880 the grooves. And so that they did that and they 0:57:53.920 --> 0:57:56.160 were like, wow, these sure shoot a lot better. And 0:57:56.240 --> 0:57:58.360 then they spiraled a few of them, and they're like, wow, 0:57:58.440 --> 0:58:01.720 they really shoot better. And so accidentally they figured out 0:58:02.080 --> 0:58:04.560 from rife that's where rifling came from. So I rifling. 0:58:04.720 --> 0:58:06.200 That's one of the things I heard ill of it's 0:58:06.200 --> 0:58:11.400 true or not, is that the spiraling came from just 0:58:11.520 --> 0:58:16.600 wanting to increase the how much groove you could have, 0:58:18.440 --> 0:58:20.960 that you could have more surface area of groove by 0:58:21.000 --> 0:58:26.680 cutting spirals, and and there therefore house more burnt powder. 0:58:26.800 --> 0:58:28.640 And then they hit on that idea that the bullet 0:58:28.680 --> 0:58:30.720 was spinning nights and shooting acker. I don't even know 0:58:30.720 --> 0:58:33.320 where the hell I read that. Yeah, that that maybe 0:58:33.440 --> 0:58:35.360 it will be. I mean, I know, guys even now 0:58:35.520 --> 0:58:39.840 that that really like straight rifled guns, you know, straight 0:58:39.880 --> 0:58:43.560 they're called straight rifles. That they'll have their barrels uh rifled, 0:58:43.600 --> 0:58:45.840 but instead of grooving them, they'll have them cut straight. 0:58:45.920 --> 0:58:48.200 But it doesn't throw a spin on it. Well, but 0:58:48.360 --> 0:58:50.280 you have kind of maybe you could eed to say 0:58:50.320 --> 0:58:52.040 the best of both worlds or maybe the worst of 0:58:52.080 --> 0:58:54.240 both worlds. I mean, it's still functions very much like 0:58:54.320 --> 0:58:55.840 a rifle. If you want to use it for turkey 0:58:55.920 --> 0:58:58.520 hunting or something as a smooth board, you can do that, 0:58:59.040 --> 0:59:04.360 uh smooth for me. Straight rifles, straight rifling typically doesn't 0:59:04.400 --> 0:59:10.760 get shot out as readily as a a spiral group rifle. 0:59:10.800 --> 0:59:12.840 If you're shooting it. You can't take a spiral group 0:59:12.960 --> 0:59:14.480 rifle and you shot in it, you know, you're not 0:59:14.520 --> 0:59:16.680 gonna put buckshot in it or they had swan shot 0:59:16.760 --> 0:59:18.959 they called it, or you know, number six or something. 0:59:19.040 --> 0:59:22.400 But a a straight rifle you can shoot shot. You 0:59:22.440 --> 0:59:26.800 can any any starry shot, number eight, buckshot double all 0:59:26.840 --> 0:59:29.600 the way up to you know. So, yeah, that's so 0:59:29.720 --> 0:59:31.960 maybe the smooth bar was a little bit more versatile 0:59:32.880 --> 0:59:36.280 at that time. Yeah, that's a real estute comment, because yeah, 0:59:36.280 --> 0:59:38.480 they were. They were much more for a survival weapon. 0:59:39.000 --> 0:59:41.360 That's what you wanted, you know, because you can shoot 0:59:41.400 --> 0:59:44.600 shot round ball up to that very side the caliber. 0:59:45.040 --> 0:59:47.680 And by the way, um, a lot of these frontiersmen, 0:59:47.840 --> 0:59:50.400 they were riflemen. But when it came time for you 0:59:50.440 --> 0:59:52.760 know we're talking. You're talking about how bloody the Red 0:59:52.840 --> 0:59:55.600 War was in the West, and how bloody the the 0:59:55.720 --> 0:59:57.720 F and I War was. Frinch An Indian War was 0:59:57.840 --> 0:59:59.800 a lot of times when you got into woodland fighting, 0:59:59.840 --> 1:00:01.880 lie that they left their wifles back home. They got 1:00:01.920 --> 1:00:05.400 the smooth boars. At the Battle of Blue licks Um 1:00:05.680 --> 1:00:09.400 August seventeen, Boone's son was killed at his second one 1:00:09.440 --> 1:00:12.640 of the second sons, Yeah, the second Yeah, the firstborn son, James, 1:00:13.400 --> 1:00:17.600 was killed when he was sixteen by Indians in the 1:00:18.880 --> 1:00:24.760 the Powell's Valley area seventeen seventy three. That's that's man. 1:00:24.800 --> 1:00:26.960 We should get to that story later on. It's a 1:00:27.040 --> 1:00:30.600 heartbreaking story. Man tortured to death, fingernails all pulled out, 1:00:30.800 --> 1:00:33.080 killed and then when Boone went back to find his body, 1:00:34.080 --> 1:00:36.320 he goes back. Yeah, well it sure, he goes back 1:00:36.360 --> 1:00:39.840 to what happened. He goes back and they found the body. 1:00:40.000 --> 1:00:42.400 You know, initially they did find the body that there 1:00:42.480 --> 1:00:44.160 was they knew where it was. There was four or 1:00:44.200 --> 1:00:48.040 five others killed and they buried him. But Boone did 1:00:48.120 --> 1:00:50.640 go back later to rebury him and trying to identify 1:00:50.680 --> 1:00:54.560 his boy and the wolves that Dug had dug the 1:00:54.600 --> 1:00:58.080 bodies up right, and he recognized some wisps of hair 1:00:58.800 --> 1:01:01.680 right that were his son, his hair right, and he 1:01:01.760 --> 1:01:04.880 had brought a blanket cradled the body for a while, 1:01:04.960 --> 1:01:06.920 and then he heard some people, He heard Indians, some 1:01:07.040 --> 1:01:09.520 Indians coming, and slipped off into the night. And he 1:01:09.560 --> 1:01:11.440 said it was the darkest day of his life, the 1:01:11.520 --> 1:01:16.000 most melancholy day. Yeah, and I'm get getting chill. Buff's 1:01:16.040 --> 1:01:18.960 talking about that, right, And again, that kind of thing 1:01:19.160 --> 1:01:22.880 just seems unfathomable to us. I mean, I might add, 1:01:22.960 --> 1:01:25.920 not only are you dealing with the native intrusion, but 1:01:26.720 --> 1:01:28.439 you know, he's right in the middle of a number 1:01:28.480 --> 1:01:35.440 of imperial wars and they're being uh uh, they're allied 1:01:35.520 --> 1:01:39.480 with these imperial powers and they're being armed, and so yeah, 1:01:39.800 --> 1:01:42.480 it was just a tough time. Boon goes back and 1:01:42.560 --> 1:01:48.479 he buries his son, and comes a thunderstorm and he's 1:01:48.600 --> 1:01:51.920 out there and he hears a wolf's howling. It's the thunderstorm, 1:01:51.960 --> 1:01:56.120 and he just cradled his son's corpse, and uh, the 1:01:56.200 --> 1:01:57.960 Indians are creeping up on him. And he gets in 1:01:58.040 --> 1:02:00.800 a canoe and kind of paddles with his hands and 1:02:00.920 --> 1:02:04.040 kind of quietly gets on down the creek and and um, man, 1:02:04.120 --> 1:02:08.040 it's just to escape another another close call. I don't 1:02:08.080 --> 1:02:12.560 know any one hunter, any one front Tirasman in the 1:02:12.720 --> 1:02:17.640 history of the American Frontier that was captured more times 1:02:17.680 --> 1:02:21.280 by Daniel Boone, by captured by Indians, and more times 1:02:21.320 --> 1:02:23.360 than Daniel Boone. Yeah, I mean he was. He was 1:02:23.440 --> 1:02:28.000 getting routinely captured, and I think it yeah, you know, yeah, 1:02:28.080 --> 1:02:32.240 he was Boon was. He had a really interesting um 1:02:34.600 --> 1:02:38.200 attitude among Native people. And it goes back absolutely to 1:02:38.480 --> 1:02:43.120 his upbringing and uh and his relationship with his mother 1:02:43.280 --> 1:02:45.440 and his relationship with his grandfather. But can you go 1:02:45.520 --> 1:02:48.040 back to that shootout first, the guys that are gonna 1:02:48.040 --> 1:02:53.960 have the shooting tournament, tells his name? Sure, sure shot? No, 1:02:58.360 --> 1:03:01.440 he was, Yeah, that's search shot. Timothy Murphy was the 1:03:01.480 --> 1:03:05.160 guy that shot the the British officer, and you know, 1:03:05.760 --> 1:03:07.440 maybe it was just his time to go. I don't 1:03:07.440 --> 1:03:11.240 know how you look at that, but but yeah, the 1:03:12.560 --> 1:03:14.560 two the two groups that ran into each other. Yeah, 1:03:14.600 --> 1:03:17.280 that's exactly it was. It was it was Daniel Broadhead. 1:03:17.280 --> 1:03:21.360 I believe he was an American Red War officer. I know, 1:03:21.480 --> 1:03:23.200 I'm going to get all kind of people correcting me 1:03:23.280 --> 1:03:26.520 later on some of this stuff. But but he sees, uh, 1:03:26.920 --> 1:03:30.960 Samuel Brady's contingent of spies, they call him they were Scalts, 1:03:31.000 --> 1:03:33.920 but we call him scal They were spies, spies for 1:03:34.000 --> 1:03:36.360 the British. No, no, no, no, these are American guys. 1:03:36.480 --> 1:03:38.800 I mean, yeah, I mean these guys are dangerous. I mean, 1:03:38.880 --> 1:03:41.280 you know you've heard of Rogers Rangers. Yeah, these guys 1:03:41.320 --> 1:03:44.040 were like Rogers Rangers, but much more free wheeling. And 1:03:44.160 --> 1:03:45.960 they had a number of people that really had been 1:03:46.000 --> 1:03:49.200 dead as against Indians, and so yeah, they put small 1:03:49.360 --> 1:03:52.120 rum kegs out there. You know, it's about, you know, 1:03:52.160 --> 1:03:54.520 about the size of the conference wise with maybe a 1:03:54.600 --> 1:03:57.400 softball sixty or seventy yards, and they're and they're hidding 1:03:57.440 --> 1:03:59.960 at uh in some cases a hundred times out of 1:04:00.000 --> 1:04:03.160 a hundred and and Broadhead had his musketeers. They had 1:04:03.160 --> 1:04:05.040 a few riflemen come out there and throw down on it. 1:04:05.160 --> 1:04:09.040 Not on one of them hit it. Yeah, so I 1:04:09.120 --> 1:04:11.360 mean that, you know, that's not perfect, but I mean 1:04:11.400 --> 1:04:14.680 that does give you an idea. They took a a 1:04:14.800 --> 1:04:18.400 piece of paper, kind of a precious commodity, and that 1:04:18.560 --> 1:04:21.400 they and put that out at about forty or fifty 1:04:21.840 --> 1:04:24.920 yards and the same kind of thing. Everyone of Brady's 1:04:24.960 --> 1:04:27.320 men either hit it square. I think they all hit 1:04:27.360 --> 1:04:29.040 a square. I think one guy Nick did it. I 1:04:29.080 --> 1:04:31.400 think they were thirteen of them. They all hit a square. 1:04:31.480 --> 1:04:33.280 One guy Nick did a piece of paper about the 1:04:33.360 --> 1:04:35.480 size of we might say a silver dollar out there 1:04:35.520 --> 1:04:37.960 about five or sixty yards. And again they brought ever 1:04:37.960 --> 1:04:41.120 broadheads man and not note them hit it. So which 1:04:41.240 --> 1:04:43.000 was the crew of guys that were the spies that 1:04:43.040 --> 1:04:46.280 were out just like roaming around exact and revenge. Ah, 1:04:46.400 --> 1:04:50.720 that's uh, Samuel Brady's men they called Brady's Rangers. I 1:04:50.760 --> 1:04:54.200 mean they were they were rough characters. Matt my goodness, yeah, 1:04:54.280 --> 1:04:57.040 and uh like like Louis what's all? I mean, what's 1:04:57.040 --> 1:05:01.960 all one of these kind of guy is that In 1:05:02.080 --> 1:05:06.040 some ways it's um like the Greek sort of raised 1:05:06.080 --> 1:05:08.840 to the pantheon of heroes. In some ways maybe not. 1:05:09.200 --> 1:05:12.840 Maybe he's like the anti hero. His family was killed 1:05:12.880 --> 1:05:16.280 by Indians, he was captured himself as boyd and wounded, 1:05:16.560 --> 1:05:19.080 and I had part of his breastbone shut off. He's 1:05:19.080 --> 1:05:24.720 about twelve or thirteen years old, and whatsel grew his 1:05:24.840 --> 1:05:29.880 hair along it came down about to his calves. Really yeah, 1:05:30.560 --> 1:05:33.280 and uh he would tie it up in long braids, 1:05:33.400 --> 1:05:38.880 long queues, and he would shake him at the Indians. Leah, Yeah, 1:05:41.240 --> 1:05:46.800 they had that music then. And um and unlike Princess Leiah, 1:05:46.840 --> 1:05:48.880 he did have his ears pierce. Maybe she did too, 1:05:48.960 --> 1:05:52.720 but he had silk red tassels in his ears. And 1:05:53.120 --> 1:05:56.920 but he would talk. He would just tell him, he's like, 1:05:56.960 --> 1:05:58.920 come come collect these and and there would be four 1:05:59.000 --> 1:06:02.280 or five Indians and and Westll would take him on, 1:06:02.760 --> 1:06:05.840 just him. He would just charge right into him, four 1:06:05.920 --> 1:06:10.000 or five and he'd shoot and take out one. I 1:06:10.080 --> 1:06:12.080 know this is insensitive to a lot of people. I'm 1:06:12.080 --> 1:06:13.920 not condoning any of this time. You know, it's a 1:06:14.000 --> 1:06:16.120 different time for a different era. I don't know, you know, 1:06:17.040 --> 1:06:20.640 mentality wise, judgment wise, we can't relate to what these 1:06:20.720 --> 1:06:26.120 people thought, how they dealt with these issues two years ago. 1:06:26.320 --> 1:06:29.840 I mean, whether it's imperial forces in your world, native 1:06:29.920 --> 1:06:34.160 allied forces, whatever. And so he would take out one, well, 1:06:34.200 --> 1:06:37.720 of course they they run after him, right, and uh, 1:06:37.800 --> 1:06:40.000 he would spit a ball down the barrel. He really 1:06:40.080 --> 1:06:42.640 had mastered the art of reloading on the run. And 1:06:43.120 --> 1:06:46.320 uh probably had an enlarge touch hole he would pour. 1:06:46.840 --> 1:06:48.760 The touch hole is the part of the gun in 1:06:48.800 --> 1:06:50.720 the breach where the you know, when you have a 1:06:50.760 --> 1:06:54.280 flint lock and the lock clashes and it hits the frison, 1:06:54.320 --> 1:06:56.560 the flint hits the prison and the flame jets through 1:06:56.640 --> 1:06:58.880 the touch hole. So he probably had an a large 1:06:59.000 --> 1:07:01.040 touch hole. So you would lose the pan up until 1:07:01.080 --> 1:07:03.800 you you butt the gun on the ground. The butt 1:07:03.920 --> 1:07:06.400 well that once you've got it loaded, you just butt 1:07:06.440 --> 1:07:09.160 the ground. It's to self primes. You spit the ball 1:07:09.200 --> 1:07:12.000 down without all the powder that he poured in there 1:07:12.000 --> 1:07:14.080 would pour out and get into the and get into 1:07:14.080 --> 1:07:17.040 the pan. Yeah, and see he's loading straight from the horn, 1:07:17.160 --> 1:07:19.080 like from the John like in the John Wayne movies. 1:07:19.120 --> 1:07:21.240 I mean, nobody loaded straight from the horn unless you 1:07:21.360 --> 1:07:25.240 just had to. But poor bartender, Oh, that's an important 1:07:25.760 --> 1:07:29.760 I think to because everybody thinks that that you just 1:07:29.920 --> 1:07:32.960 free poured from the horn. So how did they measure it? Yeah? Okay, 1:07:33.400 --> 1:07:36.400 typically with the care intending of an American long rifle. 1:07:36.880 --> 1:07:43.760 Uh later becomes noticed that American long the care care intending. Okay, yeah, yeah, 1:07:44.000 --> 1:07:46.680 it's just basically how to deal with a long rival. 1:07:46.760 --> 1:07:50.320 And I would encourage listeners to go out and buy 1:07:50.360 --> 1:07:53.800 a flintlock. I got one. I get I tried to 1:07:53.800 --> 1:07:55.280 shoot some deer with it, but some would always go 1:07:55.360 --> 1:07:58.600 wrong every time I shot at I don't know anything 1:07:58.680 --> 1:08:01.680 about your flintlock. I didn't say that tryday but neither. 1:08:02.040 --> 1:08:06.560 But uh, anybody that's ever shot one can say the 1:08:06.640 --> 1:08:09.080 same thing. But yeah, get a good one. But yeah, 1:08:09.080 --> 1:08:11.800 I learned how to to operate that gun, you know, 1:08:11.920 --> 1:08:13.520 because the first thing you do, you just go buy 1:08:13.520 --> 1:08:16.080 a good flintlock, and then you'll go like, I gotta 1:08:16.120 --> 1:08:17.479 shoot it. And then you go like, well, how am 1:08:17.520 --> 1:08:19.800 I going to carry my powder? Well? How do you 1:08:19.840 --> 1:08:24.320 carry your powder? Listen? Man, we were idiots. We went 1:08:24.360 --> 1:08:26.599 to go to the Pennsylvania's flintlocks. He's now, my buddies 1:08:26.640 --> 1:08:29.280 do it a lot. I didn't, So like, I get one. 1:08:29.400 --> 1:08:32.160 How do you carry the powder carrying the powder horn? Okay? 1:08:32.240 --> 1:08:36.120 So you do? You did? Okay? Okay? That yeah, I 1:08:36.160 --> 1:08:39.360 mean days people should people should do that. That will 1:08:39.400 --> 1:08:41.400 put them in touch with their forebears. They'll put them 1:08:41.400 --> 1:08:43.160 in touch with our subjects. But no, no, that's not 1:08:43.200 --> 1:08:45.760 I'm lying to you. I poured it into h I 1:08:45.880 --> 1:08:47.760 had a powder horn, But I wanted to pouring it 1:08:47.840 --> 1:08:49.679 into those little like looks like a little old style 1:08:49.760 --> 1:08:54.240 film canister. Poured it pre measured. Yeah, some people used 1:08:54.240 --> 1:08:55.960 to keep seeds in those do A lot of deer 1:08:56.040 --> 1:09:01.519 had close calls on that trip. Man, they don't even realize. Well, anyway, 1:09:01.840 --> 1:09:05.599 back to the care and tending of an American calls 1:09:05.640 --> 1:09:12.040 Part two, the American long rifle or hair in tending. Yeah, 1:09:12.120 --> 1:09:17.240 I mean you you have a powder horn suspended on 1:09:17.400 --> 1:09:20.280 whatever side is most comfortably if your left hand or 1:09:20.360 --> 1:09:21.800 right handed. I have it on the right, you know, 1:09:22.200 --> 1:09:24.479 in the curl of the horn and all that. And yeah, 1:09:24.560 --> 1:09:28.320 you have a on you're shooting pouch scrap. You'll have 1:09:28.439 --> 1:09:30.320 a little piece of an antler, you know it's a 1:09:30.360 --> 1:09:32.960 holid out deer time that will be of a certain 1:09:33.040 --> 1:09:36.000 number of grains of powder. That's how they measured it. Yeah, 1:09:36.040 --> 1:09:38.639 and so you yeah, oh yeah, you you measured the powder. 1:09:38.960 --> 1:09:40.960 You you measured the powder. You pour that down the 1:09:41.000 --> 1:09:43.120 moment that you know how they would plug the horn 1:09:43.680 --> 1:09:46.559 with a piece of deer antler or like a wooden plug. 1:09:47.000 --> 1:09:49.600 Would that be the measure or the measure hangs No, no, no, no, 1:09:50.400 --> 1:09:52.760 you typically yeah, they did they use something they'd hand 1:09:52.840 --> 1:09:56.479 carved something. A fiddle peg was roll real popular fiddle 1:09:56.520 --> 1:09:58.080 peg is kind of like ready to go, just kind 1:09:58.080 --> 1:10:01.040 of whittle it down. But yeah, you you take the 1:10:01.120 --> 1:10:03.920 horn and you pour into a measure and you already 1:10:04.000 --> 1:10:06.560 know because these guys live by their guns. Okay. And 1:10:06.600 --> 1:10:08.840 if any any of your listeners can do the same thing, 1:10:08.880 --> 1:10:11.479 because they'll figure this out too. You know, you have 1:10:11.800 --> 1:10:15.600 say like a like I've got my rifle is sixty calibers. 1:10:15.840 --> 1:10:19.760 I shoot about sixty seventy grains of powder. Okay, So 1:10:19.880 --> 1:10:22.280 I have a little deer antler this holid out there, 1:10:22.360 --> 1:10:25.800 and I pour to the top and I'll dump that 1:10:25.920 --> 1:10:31.000 down the barrel. Then you take a whatever sides ball 1:10:31.080 --> 1:10:33.600 you're using. You know, typically you're going to be undersized 1:10:33.680 --> 1:10:37.400 by ten thousands, twelve thousands, fifteen thousands to me people 1:10:37.439 --> 1:10:40.080 that have shot these guns. You've got that all figured out. 1:10:40.200 --> 1:10:45.160 And you have a patch of linen usually and you 1:10:45.280 --> 1:10:49.720 have it um oil with bear fat bear bears like 1:10:49.880 --> 1:10:52.680 makes about the best loop or or whale. It's hard 1:10:52.720 --> 1:10:55.920 to get whale these days. Yeah, you just can't run 1:10:55.960 --> 1:10:58.760 down like you know, bass pro shop, I needs burn 1:10:58.840 --> 1:11:01.800 whale oil like work, I get that and so and 1:11:01.880 --> 1:11:04.280 then yeah, then you have it all, Dad, You got 1:11:04.360 --> 1:11:07.760 a private You still now use bear grease as a lubricant. Yeah, 1:11:08.000 --> 1:11:11.360 always where do you do? You get that at Sportsman's 1:11:11.479 --> 1:11:18.000 or from black bears? Get that from the elusive? Yeah, 1:11:18.000 --> 1:11:21.360 I have friends that hunt black bears and you asked 1:11:21.400 --> 1:11:24.439 them to if you know any really like any hardcore 1:11:24.560 --> 1:11:26.720 North Carolinias that live, like in the area that we're 1:11:26.720 --> 1:11:29.519 talking about, they do about four or five things really well. 1:11:29.640 --> 1:11:34.000 They hunt bears, They make moonshine, They produce a little 1:11:34.040 --> 1:11:38.599 North Carolinians and they play music and they make moonshine. 1:11:38.640 --> 1:11:42.439 Already I already said that that sounds likely to do it. 1:11:43.080 --> 1:11:46.599 Yeah you should, Yeah, you should go down there. Yeah, 1:11:46.680 --> 1:11:49.120 and they always have that kind of stuff and uh 1:11:49.960 --> 1:11:52.640 so yeah, it's just the best lubricant. So you have 1:11:52.760 --> 1:11:57.120 a grease patuln in your ball. Yeah, we'll be careful 1:11:57.160 --> 1:12:00.200 with that one. And uh yeah, yeah, it takes leads 1:12:00.200 --> 1:12:05.560 a shoot of flintlock. I got it, I got it. 1:12:08.680 --> 1:12:13.920 Oh yeah, okay, boom okay, and uh yeah, so yeah, 1:12:13.960 --> 1:12:16.560 but but you don't pour from the horn, and you know, 1:12:16.640 --> 1:12:19.680 if it was a clutch situation, yeah, but I mean 1:12:19.720 --> 1:12:22.040 you might have a spark down there in the breach, 1:12:22.080 --> 1:12:24.200 and if you're pouring from the directly from the horn, 1:12:24.240 --> 1:12:26.200 then you might have a two pound grenade right bite 1:12:26.200 --> 1:12:30.280 your head. Yeah, like you know, like John Wayne Ali 1:12:30.320 --> 1:12:32.519 Moan movies, that looks you know that you did it. Now, 1:12:32.600 --> 1:12:36.599 So you're saying like, if there's something smoldering in there, yeah, 1:12:36.800 --> 1:12:39.080 and you like that, and that powder falls down and 1:12:39.160 --> 1:12:41.680 ignites up the barrel and then ignites that handful of 1:12:42.080 --> 1:12:46.360 that Yeah, and I think that's maybe whatever happened like 1:12:46.439 --> 1:12:49.040 the guy that invented black powder, because we don't know 1:12:49.120 --> 1:12:51.439 who he was, but I I was wondered, how do 1:12:51.479 --> 1:12:54.120 you invent this? You know, the same dynasty of China. 1:12:54.200 --> 1:12:55.960 You know, you have some guy and he goes like, okay, 1:12:55.960 --> 1:12:59.800 I'm gonna take uh seventy five parts of potassium no 1:12:59.880 --> 1:13:02.439 I trade, which they got that under outhouses and they 1:13:02.520 --> 1:13:06.200 went into the soil and then then uh cent of 1:13:07.160 --> 1:13:10.160 willow ash and then tent percent of sulfur and then 1:13:10.200 --> 1:13:11.760 you you know, you start you get a mortar and 1:13:11.800 --> 1:13:14.479 pestle goal, Let's see what this does. Man. You know, 1:13:14.600 --> 1:13:17.760 like he's spread over seventeen provinces or something. And I 1:13:17.840 --> 1:13:21.040 know when Boone was when Boone would make his own powder, 1:13:22.120 --> 1:13:24.560 they would, uh, there was some part of it, like 1:13:24.640 --> 1:13:28.120 they like to take the willow ash and they wetted 1:13:28.200 --> 1:13:30.479 it with their own piss. Do you ever read that 1:13:31.479 --> 1:13:35.040 all the qualities of your own yurine were good? The 1:13:35.120 --> 1:13:37.120 way Boone did it and a lot of folks did it. 1:13:37.200 --> 1:13:39.800 I mean, you know, we call the substance saltpeter for 1:13:39.920 --> 1:13:42.479 reasons we won't maybe get into that. But they dug 1:13:42.560 --> 1:13:44.920 the spoil up under what we would refer to today 1:13:44.960 --> 1:13:50.599 as an outhouse in bat caves. Yeah, that's right. What's 1:13:50.640 --> 1:13:54.840 that called guano? And but they yeah, and then you 1:13:54.920 --> 1:13:58.559 would get the dirt, soil, whatever, and you would like take, um, 1:13:59.320 --> 1:14:02.040 take like a saw horse and inverted at the same 1:14:02.120 --> 1:14:04.519 basic idea, just full it with hey, Philip Hay and 1:14:04.560 --> 1:14:09.600 it's just pour the mixture of the earth, guando, you 1:14:09.640 --> 1:14:12.519 know whatever. They know. Typically you're digging under the old 1:14:12.560 --> 1:14:16.160 house back in Kentucky, and um, you mix it with water, 1:14:16.280 --> 1:14:18.240 you pour it through there, and then you take the 1:14:18.320 --> 1:14:21.320 liqueur that is distilled from that and you boil that 1:14:21.360 --> 1:14:22.720 a little bit an hour or so, and then let 1:14:22.800 --> 1:14:25.879 us sit and the as evaporage. You'll have these crystals 1:14:25.920 --> 1:14:29.400 that's potassium nitrate, saltpeter, and so you would take that 1:14:29.560 --> 1:14:31.920 and then he would take typically willow ash to use 1:14:32.000 --> 1:14:35.160 other kinds of ash and um and then sulfur would 1:14:35.360 --> 1:14:37.960 sometimes kind of get hard to get, but yeah, you 1:14:38.000 --> 1:14:43.719 would mix that together. Um, you grind the ingredients separately, 1:14:43.800 --> 1:14:45.519 but then you would mix it together. And then typically 1:14:45.600 --> 1:14:48.920 they would use a human urine because it had a 1:14:49.000 --> 1:14:52.680 higher oxygen content. It would flash quicker. They determined that. 1:14:52.800 --> 1:14:55.200 I don't know how they determine that, and so yeah, 1:14:55.280 --> 1:14:57.960 that was but it was arduous, it was complicated, and 1:14:58.160 --> 1:14:59.680 very few people knew how to do it. And if 1:14:59.720 --> 1:15:01.840 you how to do it on the frontier, then you 1:15:01.960 --> 1:15:04.639 were quite a commodity. It's like blacksmithing. Again, that goes 1:15:04.680 --> 1:15:07.200 over our head. Most of us aren't blacksmiths. But Boone 1:15:07.280 --> 1:15:10.360 was also a very good blacksmith, so was his brother Squire, 1:15:10.920 --> 1:15:13.640 and Squire was also a great silver smith and um, 1:15:13.880 --> 1:15:18.040 so yeah Boone but just a hunter and a trapper 1:15:18.120 --> 1:15:21.479 and had those talents. He had other talents as well, 1:15:21.600 --> 1:15:25.439 like just geared towards frontier living, not the least of 1:15:25.520 --> 1:15:28.719 which we were kind of getting into earlier his dealing 1:15:28.800 --> 1:15:31.519 with the American Indians. You know, how he how he 1:15:31.920 --> 1:15:34.479 managed to get out of some of these scrapes. How 1:15:34.560 --> 1:15:38.240 he learned his protocol diplomacy dealing with these folks. How 1:15:38.320 --> 1:15:42.120 did he learn that? Several ways? Uh, it goes back 1:15:42.200 --> 1:15:47.000 to his childhood. Um. First of all, Boone was a Quaker, 1:15:47.439 --> 1:15:51.600 as his family were. They his grandfather, George, came to 1:15:51.720 --> 1:15:55.640 America from England, made that transatlantic journey like a lot 1:15:55.680 --> 1:15:59.640 of folks did. And uh, he was a Quaker you 1:15:59.720 --> 1:16:03.320 know end as they called him, Society of Friends and 1:16:04.120 --> 1:16:08.080 lived in around present day Birdsboro, Pennsylvania. Donated a couple 1:16:08.080 --> 1:16:10.760 of acres to the Quakers there and both the little 1:16:10.800 --> 1:16:12.800 church building. I've been in that same church building a 1:16:12.880 --> 1:16:14.800 couple of times. The original pews, they are all still 1:16:14.840 --> 1:16:19.599 there that the Boone family sat, No, no I sat on. Everyone. 1:16:19.760 --> 1:16:23.479 Just catch that vibe if I could. And uh. And 1:16:23.640 --> 1:16:27.559 so Boone and his family were Quakers. Of course they 1:16:27.560 --> 1:16:29.920 are Pacifists, that the whole different kind of matter. But 1:16:30.000 --> 1:16:33.400 they had a number of Delaware converts, so you know, 1:16:33.479 --> 1:16:36.840 Indians were nothing unusually Boon. He worshiped with him in church. 1:16:37.320 --> 1:16:40.920 His grandfather also had a trading post, George Boone, and 1:16:41.160 --> 1:16:44.080 he was the Delaware hunters would come in and of course, 1:16:44.720 --> 1:16:48.040 you know they're bringing in lush, be repelleds otter pels, 1:16:48.160 --> 1:16:52.240 perfectly processed deer hyde, beautifully tanned, you know, brained hand. 1:16:52.800 --> 1:16:56.200 And Boone intuitively is picking up on this and he's 1:16:56.280 --> 1:17:01.160 there's the Delaware closely related culturally and linguistic lee as 1:17:01.240 --> 1:17:04.479 Algonquin speakers to the Shawnee. So the Shawnee would be 1:17:04.560 --> 1:17:07.200 coming in there, and you know he's learning bits and 1:17:07.320 --> 1:17:10.720 pieces of the language, you know, the Patois, but he's 1:17:10.760 --> 1:17:13.040 also learning, maybe more importantly, how do you deal with 1:17:13.160 --> 1:17:17.360 these people? And uh? And he would carry this information 1:17:17.479 --> 1:17:19.759 throughout his life. He would he would tell his sons, 1:17:21.160 --> 1:17:26.240 you know, when you greet an Indian, be friendly, be frank, 1:17:27.520 --> 1:17:29.880 and give them gifts, even if I mean literally, if 1:17:29.880 --> 1:17:31.720 you even if you can't afford it, you give them 1:17:31.800 --> 1:17:33.559 if it has to be the shirt off your back, 1:17:34.000 --> 1:17:36.000 you know, if you have some boheit. You know, t 1:17:36.280 --> 1:17:38.559 was a big deal part of the China trade, coming 1:17:39.000 --> 1:17:42.519 out of other parts as well, like India, Pakistan. So forth, 1:17:43.040 --> 1:17:47.000 give them some tea, uh, give them some beads, share 1:17:47.080 --> 1:17:51.519 something with them, compliment them, never lived, don't ever beat 1:17:51.560 --> 1:17:54.439 him in a shooting contest, you know, give them some sugar. 1:17:55.600 --> 1:17:59.840 And this kind of diplomacy always served him well and 1:18:00.080 --> 1:18:03.600 and it serves his son's well. And and Boond understood 1:18:05.360 --> 1:18:09.000 when he was in Kentucky that first hunt, that first 1:18:09.120 --> 1:18:13.559 long hunt, and you know, he's out there literally from 1:18:13.640 --> 1:18:18.519 about May to the December, and they lay in hundreds 1:18:18.560 --> 1:18:23.719 of deer skins and quite a few fur bearers, primarily beever, 1:18:24.960 --> 1:18:28.040 the Shawnee swooped down on him, Captain will Emery, who 1:18:28.080 --> 1:18:31.960 would later capture Boone five years later, the loyal Blue Licks, 1:18:32.240 --> 1:18:37.640 the Salt Boilers, and they take everything. And Boone understood, 1:18:38.520 --> 1:18:41.400 you know, we would look upon it as theft from 1:18:41.439 --> 1:18:44.560 the India perspective. They're taking what's rightfully. There's you know, 1:18:44.640 --> 1:18:46.960 Boon was there breaking all manner of law, you know. 1:18:47.920 --> 1:18:51.320 And Uh, but this kind of diplomacy would serve him well, 1:18:51.400 --> 1:18:55.639 it would serve his son's well, even his grandson, Alfred 1:18:55.680 --> 1:19:00.120 Gallatin Boone, Uh was a mountain man, full fledged. And 1:19:00.560 --> 1:19:06.120 he's out there in the famous Rendezvous of eighteen thirty two. 1:19:06.200 --> 1:19:08.760 He's out there with Bridger and all these guys, but 1:19:08.880 --> 1:19:12.240 they were just Indian treaties that some people just couldn't clinch. 1:19:12.560 --> 1:19:14.880 And so they would bring an Alpert Gallatin Boone and 1:19:15.120 --> 1:19:18.080 and just the name Boone to the Indians out west 1:19:18.160 --> 1:19:21.080 like where we are, would resonate with them because they 1:19:21.200 --> 1:19:23.640 understood that that that meant, you know, fair dealings, that 1:19:23.960 --> 1:19:27.160 uh he would be treated properly. And um, you know 1:19:28.200 --> 1:19:31.200 when we were talking earlier about Samuel Brady and those guys, 1:19:31.240 --> 1:19:33.400 and these are men of blood. You know Ken he's 1:19:33.400 --> 1:19:38.920 a scalp taker at scalf hunter and Simon Kent, Simon Ken, Yeah, Boone, 1:19:39.120 --> 1:19:42.280 that was never Boom. You know, Boone did not rebel 1:19:42.400 --> 1:19:44.759 in war, He didn't glory in war. He was certainly 1:19:44.800 --> 1:19:48.440 a warrior when he needed to be. But he understood 1:19:48.800 --> 1:19:52.680 not only maybe basic Indian language. I think actually he 1:19:52.760 --> 1:19:56.559 spoke Gonkland, Delaware, Shawnee probably pretty well. And he understood 1:19:56.640 --> 1:19:59.479 pipe ceremonies and so forth, but he understood just the 1:19:59.520 --> 1:20:03.120 basic diplomacy gift giving. You know, you give somebody a gift, 1:20:03.200 --> 1:20:07.439 we think, okay, anniversary, whatever, give a gift, um for 1:20:07.560 --> 1:20:11.479 the for for Native people, giving a gift, uh met 1:20:11.760 --> 1:20:14.960 burnishing that friendship It's like a chain and if you 1:20:15.040 --> 1:20:17.080 let the chain get rusty, that's not good. But you 1:20:17.160 --> 1:20:19.320 give a gift that kind of brings back to the glow, 1:20:19.760 --> 1:20:32.040 solidifies the relationship. Can you tell the story real quick 1:20:32.080 --> 1:20:34.240 of when when Boone went on his first long hunt 1:20:34.280 --> 1:20:37.439 to Kentucky He went with a couple of guys but 1:20:37.640 --> 1:20:42.080 wound up being alone for a year or close to it. 1:20:42.520 --> 1:20:44.719 And one of those guys, they never knew what happened 1:20:44.720 --> 1:20:48.120 to him, and you wound up they found a skeleton 1:20:48.280 --> 1:20:53.479 like years later inside a hollow tree, Like, what the hell? 1:20:53.640 --> 1:20:56.519 How did that work out? Well, it didn't work out 1:20:56.560 --> 1:20:59.080 for him too well, But you know what happened was 1:21:01.000 --> 1:21:06.559 Boone begins his first actual Kentucky long hunt and May 1:21:06.680 --> 1:21:11.040 of seventeen sixty nine, he's led to Kentucky by John Finley, 1:21:11.120 --> 1:21:14.400 who he had met in seventeen fifty five during General 1:21:14.560 --> 1:21:18.880 Edward Braddock's ill fated death March. Boone met Braddock. Boon 1:21:19.000 --> 1:21:22.479 was twenty one years old, Finley was about twelve thirteen 1:21:22.560 --> 1:21:26.479 years older. Boone witnessed that whole slaughter from from afar 1:21:26.680 --> 1:21:30.720 right at Braddock. Oh yeah, I mean that's yeah, I mean, 1:21:30.800 --> 1:21:33.400 that's that's a whole different kind of episode. I don't 1:21:33.400 --> 1:21:35.400 know if you want to segue into that much, but yeah, 1:21:35.439 --> 1:21:37.920 I mean that's Braddock. That was at the height of 1:21:37.960 --> 1:21:40.080 the French and that was before that was that's the 1:21:40.160 --> 1:21:44.040 first salvo of the French Indian War. Is Braddocks trying 1:21:44.120 --> 1:21:47.240 to build a road, and in some ways it's a 1:21:47.280 --> 1:21:50.680 miraculous near miraculous engineering feet. He builds a road from 1:21:51.200 --> 1:21:54.720 uh Maryland getting close to President Day Pittsburgh, you know, 1:21:55.200 --> 1:21:58.400 a hundred and ten miles. He's blasting routs. I mean, 1:21:59.160 --> 1:22:02.320 but yeah, they're they're trying to build a road to 1:22:02.760 --> 1:22:05.840 Port Decayne at the headwaters of the Ohio. You know, 1:22:05.880 --> 1:22:08.920 you have the Allegheny to the north, the Monongahela to 1:22:09.040 --> 1:22:11.439 the south, you have the Ohio River. There's the French 1:22:11.520 --> 1:22:16.320 for right there. And so yeah, Raddox men marching and 1:22:16.439 --> 1:22:19.080 Boon's part of that expedition. He's a wagon are He's 1:22:19.200 --> 1:22:23.120 part of the North Carolina militia and uh he sees 1:22:23.200 --> 1:22:26.240 the blood bath that ensues and Buon escapes. He cuts 1:22:26.320 --> 1:22:28.200 the traces on his horse and takes off, and he 1:22:28.320 --> 1:22:31.560 learned several things. One you know, you man deal of 1:22:31.600 --> 1:22:34.920 oars training, does not work in woodland situation too. He 1:22:35.080 --> 1:22:39.360 learns the arrogance of not using native scouts, don't you know, 1:22:39.439 --> 1:22:42.280 the arrogance of not reliant upon native intelligence like for 1:22:42.400 --> 1:22:45.880 recon and and military ops. Yeah, so that's where Boone 1:22:45.920 --> 1:22:50.680 meets Finley. Yeah, and he decided to go on a 1:22:50.680 --> 1:22:53.599 big old hunt trip. Yeah. So Fainly Fainly comes back, 1:22:53.840 --> 1:22:56.800 you know, years later, So let's let's do this and Boon. 1:22:56.920 --> 1:22:59.800 By this time, he's got several eight kids. Uh, he's 1:23:00.000 --> 1:23:02.839 already four or thirty five years old. They've adopted another 1:23:02.960 --> 1:23:05.760 four from his uh, one of his brothers who dies, 1:23:06.200 --> 1:23:09.760 and um, he needs a hunt Boon at a thirty four, 1:23:09.800 --> 1:23:13.360 he's already been professionally hunting since he's sixteen, and so 1:23:13.560 --> 1:23:16.000 he goes into You can have a question about that 1:23:16.080 --> 1:23:18.479 because you're talking about it's such a hard life. It's 1:23:18.479 --> 1:23:21.160 such a hard way to actually even make any money. 1:23:22.560 --> 1:23:26.280 There were there no other options, Like what had he 1:23:26.360 --> 1:23:28.760 not gone long hunting, he could have stayed back and 1:23:29.800 --> 1:23:32.920 just continue to be a blacksmith and farm and made 1:23:32.960 --> 1:23:34.840 a living in a farmer. Yeah, he was a very 1:23:34.920 --> 1:23:37.240 poor farmer. He didn't he didn't do well at it. 1:23:37.400 --> 1:23:40.479 And as far as making living on Blacksmith and yeah, 1:23:40.520 --> 1:23:43.560 maybe he could have done that, but why do you 1:23:43.640 --> 1:23:46.920 do what you do? It was a reason because there 1:23:47.040 --> 1:23:49.160 was a reason, just because like this is all that 1:23:49.240 --> 1:23:54.240 I have. It's not because i'm really uh, my personality 1:23:54.640 --> 1:23:58.599 dictates that I go on these adventures. I think if 1:23:58.640 --> 1:24:00.800 you look at his history here or that's a great question, 1:24:00.840 --> 1:24:03.880 if you look at his earliest history, we just he 1:24:04.080 --> 1:24:08.960 was drawn to the hunt. It's a different topic from 1:24:09.040 --> 1:24:10.960 when we're trying to talk about the first long Hunt. 1:24:11.040 --> 1:24:12.880 But if you look at at his life, even when 1:24:12.960 --> 1:24:16.439 he goes to Missouri, you know, in Sev's sixty five 1:24:16.520 --> 1:24:18.640 years old at a time when most people say, well, 1:24:18.640 --> 1:24:22.160 I'm going to kick back and boon fellas a toolip 1:24:22.200 --> 1:24:25.240 poplar about sixty ft long, they hollow it out into 1:24:25.280 --> 1:24:27.680 a giant dug out. He puts his wife and some 1:24:27.760 --> 1:24:30.120 of the children on that grandkids and send done down 1:24:30.200 --> 1:24:33.400 the Ohio. Imagine doing that nowadays. And then he and 1:24:33.520 --> 1:24:37.640 his uh it's one of his sons, Nathan and some 1:24:37.760 --> 1:24:40.760 others uh, they walked to Missouri and he begins, he 1:24:40.800 --> 1:24:43.720 starts life all over and he basically is why you 1:24:43.800 --> 1:24:47.800 know Missouri uh is Kentucky of old. You know, it's 1:24:47.840 --> 1:24:51.360 got lots of game, lots of land. The Indians are 1:24:51.360 --> 1:24:54.760 still wild and Boone's gets he gets captured now by 1:24:54.840 --> 1:24:57.439 os Age and other groups. But in the in the 1:24:57.520 --> 1:25:01.519 first long hunt into Kentucky. Yeah, the A Boon is 1:25:01.560 --> 1:25:05.360 there with his brother in law, John Stewart, that's who 1:25:05.360 --> 1:25:07.880 you're talking about, the guy in the log, and uh, 1:25:08.120 --> 1:25:13.000 Boone's brother squire. We'll join him in about five or 1:25:13.040 --> 1:25:15.040 six months. He comes from North Carolina. He's got to 1:25:15.080 --> 1:25:16.439 get the corn hung and you've got to get the 1:25:16.479 --> 1:25:18.720 hog slaughtered and so forth. But then he joined him 1:25:18.880 --> 1:25:22.439 and they have three neighbors that are helping them. But yeah, 1:25:22.520 --> 1:25:25.960 the the Indians swooped down and Calp's Shoulder captured these 1:25:26.000 --> 1:25:32.920 men and confiscate everything. Um. And then later Buddha's honey 1:25:33.000 --> 1:25:38.080 with Stewart, and Stewart doesn't come back, you know, doesn't 1:25:38.080 --> 1:25:39.599 come back to camp at No, he just doesn't come 1:25:39.600 --> 1:25:42.760 back to camp. And uh and so Boon there had 1:25:42.840 --> 1:25:44.880 been some flooding, lots lots of water and said, well, 1:25:44.920 --> 1:25:46.639 you know it's high water, you can't get back to camp, 1:25:46.720 --> 1:25:49.920 and so um several days elapse, Boon goes out looks 1:25:49.920 --> 1:25:53.280 for him. He finds a tree that carved with Stewart's 1:25:53.360 --> 1:25:55.960 name and initials, and he says, well, okay, he's been here, 1:25:56.080 --> 1:25:58.639 but it's kind of cryptic. He can't really figure out 1:25:58.640 --> 1:26:02.439 what's happened, and he never what happened. And so when 1:26:02.479 --> 1:26:05.080 this happens, the camp tenders they said, I've had enough 1:26:05.160 --> 1:26:08.200 and they go and uh Fiddley leaves. They go like 1:26:08.840 --> 1:26:12.320 between getting captured by by Indians and losing everything, and 1:26:12.360 --> 1:26:17.000 then Stewart disappeared. Um, and so it is five years later, 1:26:17.160 --> 1:26:21.360 like you say, when they're blazing the trail to the 1:26:21.960 --> 1:26:26.639 Wilderness Road, that someone one of the axe men hack 1:26:26.680 --> 1:26:30.439 into a large hall of sycamore and they find a skeleton. 1:26:32.040 --> 1:26:36.160 What are the odds man? Yeah, well again it's it's 1:26:36.240 --> 1:26:39.479 it's a yeah, it's an interesting time. It's a dark, 1:26:40.439 --> 1:26:43.280 it's incredibly violent. It's incredibly beautiful in its own way. 1:26:43.320 --> 1:26:45.600 I mean, you know, the game is like the Serengetti. 1:26:46.520 --> 1:26:50.000 It's just it's got that romantic side to it, but 1:26:50.080 --> 1:26:53.439 it's just incredibly violent. And you hack into a tree 1:26:53.560 --> 1:26:56.160 and you find a skeleton. They called Boon because he 1:26:56.280 --> 1:26:59.439 was the leader of the Axe team. Without that hole. 1:26:59.520 --> 1:27:01.880 It was just made by this axe. Where was the 1:27:02.080 --> 1:27:04.800 next closest hole in this tree for the body to 1:27:04.920 --> 1:27:10.160 get there? They feel that he crawled in there wounded yea, 1:27:10.560 --> 1:27:13.640 because he had broken bones. Yeah, so there was like 1:27:13.680 --> 1:27:17.519 a hole at the base of the tree. These are 1:27:17.560 --> 1:27:20.880 immense trees. You can read about the trees in that day. Uh. 1:27:20.960 --> 1:27:23.479 And this is what was so appealing about Kentucky. Kentucky 1:27:24.000 --> 1:27:26.920 was like this big park land. I mean, don't forget 1:27:27.040 --> 1:27:29.719 the geographic zone of Kentucky today that was in Kentucky. 1:27:30.680 --> 1:27:33.360 Kentucky then would be like just draw a triangle like 1:27:34.160 --> 1:27:38.599 Kentucky Louisville eastward over to like Lexington, Frankfort, that area, 1:27:38.720 --> 1:27:40.880 and then down to about present day Barria. That's like 1:27:40.960 --> 1:27:44.519 the blue grass that was Kentucky. And he had giant 1:27:44.800 --> 1:27:48.760 deciduous trees, tulip poppers. I mean, you would have five 1:27:48.800 --> 1:27:51.599 or six men that would camp in a tree over 1:27:51.680 --> 1:27:54.160 a season. They would camp in the tree some in 1:27:54.240 --> 1:27:57.920 some cases they can I mean in the hollow tree. 1:27:58.280 --> 1:28:01.360 In some cases you could even get the horse and there. Yeah, 1:28:01.760 --> 1:28:04.920 there's a huge and and because of the native practices 1:28:05.479 --> 1:28:08.720 of you know, now we're learning how valid this is. 1:28:08.880 --> 1:28:10.880 But they have practices that they had gone on for 1:28:10.960 --> 1:28:15.439 hundreds of years of burning u the grasses, you know, 1:28:15.640 --> 1:28:17.800 seasonally torturing them to get rid of what we would 1:28:17.800 --> 1:28:19.960 say a secondary growth and get rid of pest. And 1:28:20.080 --> 1:28:22.639 you can see for a long ways and like alpor enemies, 1:28:22.640 --> 1:28:24.080 I mean, there's a lot of reasons why they would 1:28:24.200 --> 1:28:28.640 torch um the prairie of the savannah periodically. What it 1:28:28.760 --> 1:28:31.439 did is it is it cleared out the secondary growth 1:28:31.520 --> 1:28:33.880 and then you had these large deciduous trees that would 1:28:34.160 --> 1:28:36.639 grow and grow and grow. And so when they would 1:28:36.640 --> 1:28:40.200 describe Kentucky, you can read John Pilson's book on Kentucky 1:28:40.280 --> 1:28:44.439 that came out in seventeen for the Discovery Settlement in 1:28:44.520 --> 1:28:48.040 president State of Kentucky by John Filson, and he described 1:28:48.120 --> 1:28:51.920 Kentucky like a vast meadow land. And the word Kentucky. Uh. 1:28:52.040 --> 1:28:56.240 They think there's different interpretations. You know, you have people 1:28:56.280 --> 1:28:58.400 that think that your aquoi and it means dark and 1:28:58.439 --> 1:29:03.599 bloody ground. But the Algonquin translation is um the great 1:29:03.680 --> 1:29:06.880 meadow land. And so you had these immense hollow trees, 1:29:07.000 --> 1:29:09.960 the soil was loose. Again, it means nothing for us 1:29:10.040 --> 1:29:11.720 to say you could get there on the first day 1:29:11.760 --> 1:29:14.360 and plow. You know, we don't think like that. I think, 1:29:14.520 --> 1:29:16.880 do I have my cell phone charged up? But yeah, 1:29:16.920 --> 1:29:18.360 you could get there the first day and you could 1:29:18.400 --> 1:29:21.120 actually plow because of the the openness of the land, 1:29:21.520 --> 1:29:25.000 the soil fertility, the loosest of the soil. So they 1:29:25.080 --> 1:29:27.920 find his body in one of these immense trees. But yeah, 1:29:28.200 --> 1:29:32.120 used like that. The chances of that, Oh, if I 1:29:32.160 --> 1:29:34.960 could have that body in it, I'd put that right 1:29:35.000 --> 1:29:37.639 in my living room. Man, the trigger of the body 1:29:38.000 --> 1:29:40.760 that they want to solve. I want to slve that 1:29:40.920 --> 1:29:42.600 chunk and have it sitting in my living room, right 1:29:42.600 --> 1:29:44.599 in the center of the living room. There was John 1:29:44.640 --> 1:29:47.519 Stewart and and and Boone was very close to broken 1:29:47.600 --> 1:29:50.080 up bones right, it was one. It was the the 1:29:50.240 --> 1:29:54.160 upper left arm. It was like between so like the 1:29:54.200 --> 1:29:56.600 shoulder of the Delatoy to about the elbow there was 1:29:56.800 --> 1:30:01.320 a broken bone and it was just alert and from 1:30:01.520 --> 1:30:04.280 lead and so as obviously it was a broken Uh. 1:30:04.720 --> 1:30:08.960 He got shot. He got shot and Boone their rise. 1:30:09.320 --> 1:30:12.400 It was probably getting cold or he was being chased 1:30:12.680 --> 1:30:15.760 or something, and he crawled inside the tree and uh 1:30:15.800 --> 1:30:20.439 and died there, very sad, lonesome forsaken death. Oh it's 1:30:20.479 --> 1:30:25.120 haunting man. And the fact they found it, well, and 1:30:25.240 --> 1:30:27.280 you can give him the fact that Boone was there 1:30:27.320 --> 1:30:30.479 when they found it. Yeah, and how did he identify him? 1:30:30.479 --> 1:30:31.960 How would he how would he know this is Jon 1:30:32.000 --> 1:30:35.679 Stewart right, I don't know. Yeah, he had his powder 1:30:35.760 --> 1:30:38.000 horn and had his name carved in it. Yeah, and 1:30:38.080 --> 1:30:40.880 Boone said, you know there he thought that he could 1:30:40.960 --> 1:30:42.800 kind of look see some look on the skull and 1:30:42.840 --> 1:30:46.280 maybe resemblances. I don't know how valid that is, but 1:30:46.360 --> 1:30:48.800 that that that is one account. But you know the 1:30:48.840 --> 1:30:50.920 powder horn had his name on it, and it was 1:30:51.000 --> 1:30:53.960 just you said earlier that he had carved um the 1:30:54.040 --> 1:30:56.040 guy that was dead, that he had carved his name 1:30:56.080 --> 1:30:59.840 in a in a tree. Was that a common practice? Yeah? 1:31:01.000 --> 1:31:03.679 These guys are just kind of like I was here, 1:31:03.800 --> 1:31:06.400 kind of marking. Yeah. I mean I think even now, 1:31:06.600 --> 1:31:09.360 you know, if people want to leave there there, they're 1:31:09.479 --> 1:31:11.879 John Doe. And it was common with with the American 1:31:11.960 --> 1:31:16.240 Indians as well. Uh, trees that were along well established 1:31:16.640 --> 1:31:20.400 buffalo paths. The Buffalo paths were like the great interstate system. 1:31:21.360 --> 1:31:23.160 You know, we had this idea that they just walked 1:31:23.200 --> 1:31:26.040 out into the wildernessn't like North and they think somehow 1:31:26.160 --> 1:31:28.280 knew that. Well, now they didn't know that. I mean, 1:31:28.320 --> 1:31:31.920 they could, you know, infer it figure things out. They 1:31:31.960 --> 1:31:35.799 were very good at what they did. But the Buffalo trails, 1:31:36.439 --> 1:31:38.320 you know, the Buffalo east of the Mississippi had been 1:31:38.320 --> 1:31:40.320 there for several hundred years, and so they had their 1:31:40.479 --> 1:31:45.280 vast avenues. Some were lead traces, lead met they went someplace. 1:31:45.479 --> 1:31:47.000 Some just kind of petered out, like you know, you 1:31:47.040 --> 1:31:48.960 get the wizard that you walk down a path, sometimes 1:31:49.000 --> 1:31:51.160 it goes somewhere a lot of times it doesn't. But 1:31:51.760 --> 1:31:56.679 along those trails there would be trees, and they would 1:31:56.720 --> 1:32:01.839 oftentimes bark who was there. Indians oftentime would leave cryptic 1:32:02.200 --> 1:32:09.240 uh and animalistic markings of their own devising. Uh. When 1:32:09.320 --> 1:32:13.040 Boon made camps in Kentucky his first hunt, Boon would 1:32:13.080 --> 1:32:16.040 made decoy camps because he knew how the Indians made 1:32:16.080 --> 1:32:18.120 their camps, and so he would make a camp that 1:32:18.160 --> 1:32:19.960 looks like an Indian camp, like a shawn E camp. 1:32:20.000 --> 1:32:22.280 But he would camp and cane brakes, and they would 1:32:22.320 --> 1:32:24.840 come by and lee marks like come visit us, man, 1:32:25.200 --> 1:32:30.920 how's it going, you know? And uh, yeah, uh you really? 1:32:30.920 --> 1:32:33.120 You kind of mentioned this that you get this idea 1:32:33.120 --> 1:32:35.679 of some guy going through the woods a little backpack. 1:32:36.360 --> 1:32:39.320 But these guys when they struck out, yeah, that had 1:32:39.320 --> 1:32:43.120 a big footprint. Yeah, pack horsemen. The dogs. Can you 1:32:43.200 --> 1:32:46.080 talking about the dogs a little bit? Yeah? I mean 1:32:46.120 --> 1:32:50.000 they had real distinctive dogre, some of which are we 1:32:50.120 --> 1:32:52.640 kind of had their descendants today, like like what we 1:32:52.680 --> 1:32:55.840 would call it a plothound, and the good cat dogs, 1:32:55.880 --> 1:32:58.960 you know count I mean panther you know, and uh 1:32:59.400 --> 1:33:05.120 like black and tans. Probably the most common LEAs seen 1:33:05.240 --> 1:33:07.840 dog would have been the mountain curve, like a yellow 1:33:07.880 --> 1:33:11.200 mountain curve or brindle mountain curve. You know, good catchdogs, 1:33:11.240 --> 1:33:15.200 good hold dogs. And a lot of people had bulldogs 1:33:15.280 --> 1:33:19.240 like the American bulldogs. Uh. Dr Thomas Walker who came 1:33:19.320 --> 1:33:21.000 to Kentucky. You know, Boom was not there's a lot 1:33:21.040 --> 1:33:23.639 of mythology about him. He wasn't the first guy into Kentucky. 1:33:23.800 --> 1:33:27.479 You know, long hunters in command of bring civilization. That's 1:33:27.479 --> 1:33:29.559 the last thing they wanted, you know, they weren't trying 1:33:29.600 --> 1:33:31.679 to make the land free for God and country, hearth 1:33:31.720 --> 1:33:33.600 and home again, that's be like the last thing they 1:33:33.760 --> 1:33:38.000 want there. They didn't identify as Americans that none of 1:33:38.080 --> 1:33:40.439 that was you know they were these are just guys 1:33:40.520 --> 1:33:43.320 that are that are making a living. But you know 1:33:43.400 --> 1:33:46.400 that the first guy that really comes in and leaves 1:33:46.479 --> 1:33:50.080 a wonderful journal as Dr Thomas Walker in seventeen fifty 1:33:50.120 --> 1:33:53.480 and Walker had developed his own kind of a foxhound 1:33:53.560 --> 1:33:55.960 beagle looking how and we call them that a Walker hounds. 1:33:56.280 --> 1:33:58.400 You know, I'm sure you've heard of those, and that's yeah, 1:33:58.439 --> 1:34:01.839 that's another type that they had. And the spaniels. Spaniels 1:34:01.880 --> 1:34:05.200 were popular. I thought a Bond had a spaniel. He 1:34:05.360 --> 1:34:09.680 wasn't a long hunter, but that time period close and 1:34:09.800 --> 1:34:13.160 how and how did they use them? Like they had 1:34:13.200 --> 1:34:16.880 them around obviously, but like in the notes it says 1:34:16.920 --> 1:34:22.200 it wasn't just for hunting. Yeah, well, I mean think 1:34:22.280 --> 1:34:27.680 of yourself and kind of an aboriginal fashion. You know 1:34:27.720 --> 1:34:30.920 they're gonna keep you warm. Yeah, get him in there, 1:34:30.960 --> 1:34:33.160 like if you're in that hollalog, that hollow tree, you 1:34:33.200 --> 1:34:35.639 know they're gonna keep you warm. You know, the term 1:34:35.760 --> 1:34:38.880 three Dog night, not the band, but you know that's 1:34:38.880 --> 1:34:41.400 the whole idea was. Yeah, that's how cold it was. 1:34:41.720 --> 1:34:44.200 And um, you know definitely that they can kind of 1:34:44.280 --> 1:34:47.000 be a liability. They bark, you know, and you know 1:34:47.160 --> 1:34:49.519 they give your give you away. But they're they far 1:34:49.680 --> 1:34:53.680 more than um pay for themselves advantage wise, because they 1:34:53.720 --> 1:34:57.639 can warn you, you know. You know, whenever they worked 1:34:57.640 --> 1:35:00.160 both ways. Whenever the Indians were sneaking up on the 1:35:00.200 --> 1:35:01.800 white camps, they had to be aware of the white 1:35:01.880 --> 1:35:04.200 hunter dog. Whenever the white hunters were steaking up on 1:35:04.240 --> 1:35:05.680 the Indian camps, they had to be aware of the 1:35:05.720 --> 1:35:08.639 Indian dogs. So yeah, I mean, they can they keep 1:35:08.680 --> 1:35:10.719 your company. You know, Boot loved his dogs. Just coupal 1:35:10.760 --> 1:35:16.439 accounts of Boon singing to his dogs. Yeah, in one 1:35:16.520 --> 1:35:21.080 like overheard by somebody. Yeah, that's a great that's a 1:35:21.120 --> 1:35:23.880 great story. Can I tell that one? Yeah? Sure. We 1:35:23.960 --> 1:35:26.479 were talking about these long Hunter guys that came out, 1:35:27.000 --> 1:35:30.680 you know, and the most famous brigades were led by 1:35:31.640 --> 1:35:34.200 James Knox, who did real well the Docks later and 1:35:34.240 --> 1:35:36.519 also well Long Hunty. He did well enough Long Honey, 1:35:36.560 --> 1:35:40.080 but he became a military figure, and um, you know, 1:35:40.560 --> 1:35:43.800 Boom was still out there scraping by. Uh sometimes Boon 1:35:43.880 --> 1:35:45.880 did far better surveying, but that had a kind of 1:35:45.920 --> 1:35:49.519 a shelf life too. Knox Docks did well, and he 1:35:49.560 --> 1:35:51.400 would bring in his brigades. And one of the guys 1:35:51.439 --> 1:35:53.760 that came in with an Ox is this Germantic guy, 1:35:54.520 --> 1:36:02.000 Casper Mansker. How's that grab you? Casper Mansker, Casper Mansker, 1:36:02.160 --> 1:36:03.680 and they would come in. Sometimes they go through the 1:36:03.760 --> 1:36:06.840 Cumberland Gap oot is what it was called. It was 1:36:06.960 --> 1:36:09.679 later you know Thomas Walker. We mentioned him a Walker 1:36:09.800 --> 1:36:12.720 name at the Cumberland Gap for the Duke of Cumberland, 1:36:12.840 --> 1:36:16.320 you know, the slaughterer of the of the Highlanders at 1:36:16.360 --> 1:36:21.160 the Battle of Colodin. But um, sometimes they would go 1:36:21.240 --> 1:36:23.840 in through Cumberland Gap. But sometimes they would come you know, 1:36:24.080 --> 1:36:28.720 from eastern Tennessee, western North Carolina just cut straight to 1:36:29.120 --> 1:36:32.160 French liqu French Lick today is known as what no 1:36:32.360 --> 1:36:36.960 no Idea Music City USA, Nashville, n Yeah, I mean 1:36:37.000 --> 1:36:39.040 that was the band that you talked about a teeming 1:36:39.160 --> 1:36:42.439 area for you know, that was like an area massive 1:36:42.560 --> 1:36:45.200 licks off the Cumberland River, lots of buffalo, lots of 1:36:45.600 --> 1:36:47.240 all of that, and you know, like right there where 1:36:47.280 --> 1:36:49.000 the football you know, where the stadium is for the 1:36:49.080 --> 1:36:52.439 Titans and everything. I mean that was like major hunting area. 1:36:53.000 --> 1:36:56.639 But yeah, Mansker was with the Knox and they hunt 1:36:56.680 --> 1:37:02.400 French lick Uh and they go straight up to kentuck Uh, 1:37:02.720 --> 1:37:05.400 up towards the Green River and they're in there and 1:37:05.880 --> 1:37:10.839 they they hear the sound. It's kind of like part singing, 1:37:11.280 --> 1:37:15.760 part whistling and laughter. And they're going, what is that? 1:37:16.040 --> 1:37:19.200 That's not like any species were familiar with. I'm sure 1:37:19.240 --> 1:37:21.240 they said that two species is a big word in 1:37:21.280 --> 1:37:24.280 the long hunter vocabulary. And uh until they put the 1:37:24.360 --> 1:37:27.120 guns on full cock and they're sneaking through the cane 1:37:27.160 --> 1:37:29.080 brake and the sumac and they're like, and they're hearing 1:37:29.120 --> 1:37:31.759 the sound is getting louder and louder. And they peeked 1:37:31.760 --> 1:37:34.240 through the sumac and it's Colonel Daniel Boone. He's laying 1:37:34.240 --> 1:37:36.160 on a deer skin right in the middle of in 1:37:36.400 --> 1:37:39.160 Indian country, just singing too high Heaven. He's just happy 1:37:39.240 --> 1:37:43.080 to be there. Man, don't you love it? That's a 1:37:43.120 --> 1:37:45.519 great story. And then there are accounts of him singing 1:37:45.600 --> 1:37:47.439 to his dogs, you know, and speaking of Mask or 1:37:47.520 --> 1:37:51.360 those guys by the way with um Knox. You know 1:37:51.960 --> 1:37:56.880 they kill so many bear again we yeah, well, I 1:37:56.920 --> 1:37:58.600 mean they yeah, they'd hunt them down, but but you know, 1:37:58.680 --> 1:38:01.360 whether they use dogs or yeah, but they had dogs 1:38:01.400 --> 1:38:03.120 in those parties. But they killed a lot of bear. 1:38:03.280 --> 1:38:06.559 You know, you you could process the meat, but mainly 1:38:06.640 --> 1:38:09.439 they wanted the bear for what they could render them into. 1:38:10.080 --> 1:38:12.680 Boon gotten that business selling barrels of bear fat. Yeah, 1:38:12.800 --> 1:38:15.920 you can get about forty pounds per bear. And they 1:38:16.000 --> 1:38:18.640 got they killed so many bear and they had so 1:38:18.760 --> 1:38:21.160 much rendered fat that they just got a small bat toe. 1:38:21.680 --> 1:38:24.559 And they when they that, they filled up the bat 1:38:24.640 --> 1:38:27.120 toe with bear fat and they took it down, uh, 1:38:27.640 --> 1:38:30.559 down in Mississippi, and they you know, they get down 1:38:30.560 --> 1:38:32.760 their path Memphis and they get on down their past. Yeah, 1:38:33.120 --> 1:38:35.880 and nashes when they sold their bad to a full 1:38:35.920 --> 1:38:38.960 of bear fat down there. And Masker bought a wedding 1:38:39.080 --> 1:38:43.360 dress for his bride to be off bear fat. I 1:38:43.400 --> 1:38:45.400 remember when his father in law stood it like him. 1:38:45.560 --> 1:38:48.439 I remember reading one time that Boone process Boon shot 1:38:49.080 --> 1:38:52.000 uh thirteen black bears in a day one time hunt 1:38:52.040 --> 1:38:56.080 with his dogs. Wow, wow, no kidding. Yeah, Well, your 1:38:56.160 --> 1:38:58.600 Sandy Creek, you would appreciate this because I know you 1:38:58.720 --> 1:39:01.479 had a some some grizzly run in. He had a 1:39:01.520 --> 1:39:05.599 grizzly run in in Missouri when he was about seventy two. Um, 1:39:05.920 --> 1:39:08.479 there was he just kind of had that moment that 1:39:08.560 --> 1:39:10.599 I've ever had. But you guys could probably be tell 1:39:10.720 --> 1:39:13.439 us about what you just since there's something there and 1:39:13.520 --> 1:39:18.479 you start hearing the breath and uh, he looked and 1:39:18.520 --> 1:39:20.160 there was a grizzly ride on him. He was checking 1:39:20.200 --> 1:39:23.200 his bear traps out there on the excume. He's trying 1:39:23.240 --> 1:39:25.240 to check in his beaver traps or the effort of Missouri. 1:39:25.320 --> 1:39:28.479 And he just jumped into a tilt popular pete role 1:39:28.560 --> 1:39:31.600 and just shoveled off there into the Missouri and h 1:39:31.640 --> 1:39:33.240 and he said later he thought he was getting little 1:39:33.240 --> 1:39:35.640 too old for this. I want to get into the 1:39:35.760 --> 1:39:41.280 two things that Boon people talk about now, the two mysteries. 1:39:42.360 --> 1:39:45.400 I think I know what's coming. Okay, I want to 1:39:45.479 --> 1:39:48.080 end on the unknown. And yeah, and I don't know. 1:39:48.160 --> 1:39:50.280 You've played in both of these fields. You've written about 1:39:50.320 --> 1:39:54.639 both these issues. The first one is did Daniel Boone 1:39:56.880 --> 1:40:03.320 make it to the Rocky Mountains? Yeah, that's the It's 1:40:03.400 --> 1:40:06.800 kind of like Grace. It works in the Bible. I 1:40:06.840 --> 1:40:11.160 can kind of argue both ways. But there's two accounts 1:40:11.800 --> 1:40:16.280 of Boone that have him fairly close to the Yellowstone. 1:40:17.000 --> 1:40:22.400 Okay and um, they were written by both of these 1:40:22.560 --> 1:40:26.920 written by children of those two have claimed to have 1:40:27.080 --> 1:40:31.160 gone with Boone, and uh, they're written about seventy or 1:40:31.200 --> 1:40:35.880 eighty years after the account and and one of the 1:40:35.920 --> 1:40:38.479 cases especially, the details are really great. I mean they're 1:40:38.520 --> 1:40:41.720 really tribal specific, like the like the who's on the 1:40:41.840 --> 1:40:45.439 who was on the trip, and that they had mcin 1:40:45.520 --> 1:40:50.120 all boats and they were attacked by snake Indians and 1:40:50.479 --> 1:40:53.600 kind of how that went down, and um, yeah, it 1:40:54.000 --> 1:40:59.040 might have happened. I tend two remain neutral on that 1:40:59.320 --> 1:41:03.200 because what happened since those two accounts that were written 1:41:03.320 --> 1:41:08.320 a long time after the alleged event, was that you've 1:41:08.360 --> 1:41:13.160 had other stories about people that actually did go up 1:41:13.240 --> 1:41:16.360 that contemporaneous with Boon, like this hunter friend of Boone, 1:41:16.360 --> 1:41:19.400 who name was Michael Stoner. His son George Stoner wrote 1:41:19.400 --> 1:41:22.639 about that, and George Stoner says in his father's account, 1:41:22.640 --> 1:41:25.640 he said, Daniel Boone did not go on this expedition. 1:41:25.720 --> 1:41:27.800 I've got the exact quote, in fact, I published it. 1:41:28.280 --> 1:41:32.840 But other writers have taken part of Stoner's account and 1:41:33.040 --> 1:41:36.120 left out that part that Daniel Boone did not go, 1:41:36.840 --> 1:41:40.240 and they incorporated it with these other accounts that have 1:41:40.439 --> 1:41:44.200 Boon there and have created, for lack of a better term, 1:41:44.360 --> 1:41:48.920 hybrid accounts, and then those get republished and republished by 1:41:49.240 --> 1:41:52.439 consensus historians and people like, well there you go. And 1:41:52.600 --> 1:41:55.439 so I remained neutral on that. You know, I want him, 1:41:55.720 --> 1:41:59.000 I want that moment, you know, I want that image 1:41:59.040 --> 1:42:01.600 of Boons in the Yellowstone to make it to the 1:42:01.640 --> 1:42:05.160 Second West. Yeah, I mean, you know, don't you. Yeah, 1:42:05.240 --> 1:42:07.400 I mean I'm rooting for him. Yeah, I mean it's like, 1:42:07.640 --> 1:42:12.080 you know where Boone lived in Missouri, this little tiny 1:42:12.240 --> 1:42:15.400 Traffords village. It's kind of a my opinion, kind of 1:42:15.400 --> 1:42:17.439 like them missing link in the Western Fur Trade los 1:42:17.560 --> 1:42:22.760 Errette and it's um Lewis and Clark go through there 1:42:22.800 --> 1:42:26.400 on both legs with their journey eighteen o three eighteen 1:42:26.400 --> 1:42:29.439 o five, right of that time period, and zebuelon Pike 1:42:29.600 --> 1:42:33.160 is there, you know, as Boone there too. Well see 1:42:33.320 --> 1:42:35.640 there's no mention of Boone. But that's kind of like 1:42:35.760 --> 1:42:38.479 my point about this Rocky Mountain thing. You know, you 1:42:38.600 --> 1:42:41.000 want that, you want that to happen. He would have 1:42:41.000 --> 1:42:43.760 been Robin elbows at those yeah, I mean, you know, like, 1:42:43.920 --> 1:42:46.080 who's the big artist back in that time period, Alfred 1:42:46.160 --> 1:42:48.920 Jacob Miller, you know, you want that that oil image 1:42:48.960 --> 1:42:51.320 of Boone and Lewis and Clark and you know, like 1:42:51.520 --> 1:42:56.240 like symbolic who you're passing the Yeah, fasten the torch, 1:42:56.400 --> 1:42:58.840 you know, and you want that image. I do you know, 1:42:59.000 --> 1:43:02.240 Carl Bobber, the artists or somebody painting Boone out there 1:43:02.320 --> 1:43:07.000 and uh the Yellowstone, you know. But but the dates 1:43:07.040 --> 1:43:12.280 are inconsistent. Uh, these hybrid accounts have proliferated and have 1:43:12.439 --> 1:43:15.880 a period in you know, books that are out there, 1:43:16.000 --> 1:43:18.680 and you know, they may have other evidence that I 1:43:18.760 --> 1:43:21.840 don't have. I'm not gonna discount that, but I do 1:43:22.000 --> 1:43:23.640 look at a lot of footnotes and I see a 1:43:23.640 --> 1:43:26.000 lot of the accounts out there about Boone being in 1:43:26.080 --> 1:43:29.320 the Rockies. And if you'll start examining footnotes, you'll see 1:43:29.360 --> 1:43:31.640 that a lot of these stories have nothing to do 1:43:32.120 --> 1:43:35.240 with Boone. It's the same way with the other mystery 1:43:35.320 --> 1:43:36.920 that I think that you're going to bring up. Yeah, 1:43:36.960 --> 1:43:40.600 here's the next mystery. Okay, the legend has this a 1:43:40.720 --> 1:43:43.760 fraternity issue? Legend has it? No, no, no, no, I 1:43:43.800 --> 1:43:45.360 don't know. That's a great mystery. But we're gonn get 1:43:45.360 --> 1:43:48.880 a different miss as not even legend has it when 1:43:49.000 --> 1:43:52.680 the facts are this Boon dies in Missouri. Oh, that 1:43:52.880 --> 1:43:57.879 one gets buried. Okay, Later, even though he swore off Kentucky, 1:43:58.080 --> 1:44:01.559 said he never go back to Kentucky. Later they come 1:44:01.600 --> 1:44:05.400 and dig them up and haul um over and rebury 1:44:05.479 --> 1:44:08.120 him in Kentucky and make like a little mausoleum for 1:44:08.200 --> 1:44:11.160 him there in Kentucky, or like a what do you 1:44:11.200 --> 1:44:13.040 call it? What's word? I'm looking for him? Yeah, yeah, 1:44:13.960 --> 1:44:17.160 the little vault. Yeah. But then later some people come 1:44:17.200 --> 1:44:20.559 out and say, I tricked you. That wasn't Boone. He's 1:44:20.560 --> 1:44:23.720 still in Missouri. Yeah. I just wrote a book that 1:44:23.880 --> 1:44:25.680 addresses every bit of that. I don't know if I'm 1:44:25.680 --> 1:44:29.439 allowed to talk about my books. Yeah. Well that's the 1:44:29.520 --> 1:44:31.040 last thing you're gonna do. After you answer this question. 1:44:31.080 --> 1:44:33.640 You can tell people what books you wrote. If you 1:44:33.720 --> 1:44:38.439 want to go visit Boone's grave, Yeah, do you head 1:44:38.479 --> 1:44:41.000 to Missouri or do you head to Kentucky. I had 1:44:41.080 --> 1:44:43.760 the Kentucky because what was left of Daniel Boone and 1:44:43.840 --> 1:44:46.120 what was left of his wife, Rebecca, and people tend 1:44:46.160 --> 1:44:48.000 to leave her out. And by the way, we really 1:44:48.040 --> 1:44:50.800 ought to talk about women on the frontier. Sometime uh 1:44:51.800 --> 1:44:56.200 was exhumed and taken to Kentucky. Daniel Boon died in 1:44:58.240 --> 1:45:04.960 Rebecca died seven years before. Just imagine this. You go 1:45:05.080 --> 1:45:07.479 out on that little Noel out there and you said, 1:45:07.479 --> 1:45:10.479 I want to be buried right there. I don't want 1:45:10.520 --> 1:45:12.840 to be back into Kentucky because they treated me really 1:45:12.880 --> 1:45:16.120 bad on land deals. And you know Boot always said, 1:45:16.600 --> 1:45:20.160 give him the choice between going back to Kentucky and 1:45:20.320 --> 1:45:23.320 laying his head on a chopping block. He'd have no 1:45:23.520 --> 1:45:26.599 hesitation to lay his head on the shopping block. Really, yeah, 1:45:26.800 --> 1:45:29.280 he didn't want to go back to Kentucky. You know 1:45:29.439 --> 1:45:33.960 you had asked earlier about you know, why did didn't 1:45:33.960 --> 1:45:36.400 Boot like Kentucky? Bood love Kentucky. He didn't love what 1:45:36.520 --> 1:45:38.120 had happened to it. He didn't love what had happened 1:45:38.160 --> 1:45:42.439 to him there. But yeah, his remains were exhumed, and 1:45:42.680 --> 1:45:45.840 if you read the accounts very carefully, it's very clear 1:45:46.040 --> 1:45:48.360 that they came and they dug up what they could find. 1:45:49.000 --> 1:45:51.759 You know, we're not talking about the greatest embalming methods 1:45:51.800 --> 1:45:56.000 in twenty you know. And you know they get and 1:45:56.080 --> 1:45:59.599 they put what's left of the Boone's in small pine 1:45:59.640 --> 1:46:01.960 box is that are like wide enough for a pelvis 1:46:02.439 --> 1:46:05.040 and long enough for long bones, fevers and stuff, and 1:46:05.160 --> 1:46:07.240 kind of high enough for skulls. And they're in small 1:46:07.280 --> 1:46:10.120 little boxes and they take these back to Kentucky and 1:46:10.200 --> 1:46:17.360 they inter them in September eight Nobody when Moon was buried, 1:46:19.760 --> 1:46:23.599 and for forty years, maybe fifty between forty five years 1:46:23.600 --> 1:46:27.280 after he was buried, nobody ever said anything about he 1:46:27.360 --> 1:46:28.960 may be in the wrong grave, or they might have 1:46:29.040 --> 1:46:31.560 got the wrong bones or something like that. None of 1:46:31.600 --> 1:46:38.280 that ever happened. It happens. You know, by about eight nine, Missourians, Uh, 1:46:38.560 --> 1:46:41.880 they want the boone's back. They realized kind of like 1:46:41.960 --> 1:46:43.800 what they've done. And I just had to tell you 1:46:44.160 --> 1:46:48.160 the Missourians really got um kind of craft on by 1:46:48.160 --> 1:46:51.559 the Kentuckians. You know, they could you know, the Kentucky 1:46:51.640 --> 1:46:54.080 has wanted to build a really and they did. They 1:46:54.120 --> 1:46:57.640 wanted a fancy cemetery with the state capital, and so 1:46:57.840 --> 1:47:05.840 they organized a corporation, the Frankfort Cemetery Company into and 1:47:05.920 --> 1:47:08.880 they they wanted a garden cemetery. Garden cemeteries were really 1:47:08.920 --> 1:47:10.960 big in Europe. They were big in America, like in 1:47:11.000 --> 1:47:13.479 Mount Auburn in Boston. You know, but we got to 1:47:13.520 --> 1:47:16.320 have famous people, Well who do we get you know, 1:47:16.520 --> 1:47:19.960 you had to have a famous person to make Yeah, well, 1:47:20.080 --> 1:47:23.560 people would come in and they would stroll around, and 1:47:24.760 --> 1:47:26.680 there was an idea that it's kind of like spiritualism, 1:47:26.720 --> 1:47:28.360 which I know you've heard of. They think that you're 1:47:28.439 --> 1:47:30.639 you're not only communing with each other, but you're communing 1:47:30.720 --> 1:47:35.560 with the dead. And and this is a garden cemetery 1:47:36.240 --> 1:47:41.919 um had they would actually import in trees and shrubs 1:47:42.080 --> 1:47:46.280 and landscaping. Um. It was a whole novel kind of thing. 1:47:46.360 --> 1:47:48.519 You know that the cemeteries that they had then, like 1:47:48.640 --> 1:47:51.040 in Frankfort, you know you had a future church cemeteries 1:47:51.120 --> 1:47:54.160 with the leaning crosses and some mold farm cemeteries or 1:47:54.240 --> 1:47:56.479 dogs were digging up bones and dragging them around. And 1:47:56.560 --> 1:48:00.400 so they really wanted a suitable cemetery for Frankfort. And 1:48:00.600 --> 1:48:04.439 so to make this go you had to have somebody famous. 1:48:04.520 --> 1:48:09.599 And so who but you know, the the first family 1:48:09.720 --> 1:48:13.639 of pioneering in Kentucky, Daniel and Rebecca Boon. And so, yeah, 1:48:15.240 --> 1:48:17.320 the way that the needle is threaded a lot of 1:48:17.400 --> 1:48:20.200 times these days people will say I've had a number 1:48:20.200 --> 1:48:23.120 of Missourians who, at least up to this time of 1:48:23.200 --> 1:48:26.000 this recording, has accepted me as a friend and as 1:48:26.080 --> 1:48:29.200 a brother. There's still tension between Missouri and Kentucky about 1:48:29.280 --> 1:48:34.360 this politically and um. But they'll say, well, yeah, the 1:48:34.479 --> 1:48:38.360 Kentuckians came about what bones they could get, but we 1:48:38.520 --> 1:48:44.280 have his viscera, we have his heart, we have his skin. 1:48:44.600 --> 1:48:47.200 And they start really like kind of threading that kind 1:48:47.240 --> 1:48:49.800 of needle, like he's mainly here in the soil, but 1:48:49.880 --> 1:48:54.320 they have some bones. So you know your original question, 1:48:54.400 --> 1:48:57.360 where should we go to visit them? Well, by that interpretation, 1:48:57.520 --> 1:49:01.120 you go bote to the little cimitar ary that David 1:49:01.160 --> 1:49:05.439 Bryan Cemetery in present day Morrisesville, Missouri, and then you 1:49:05.520 --> 1:49:09.160 go to frankfurt Um. But I don't think we make 1:49:09.240 --> 1:49:12.240 those exceptions about other people. I can you know, if 1:49:12.280 --> 1:49:14.360 you bring it back war veterans like from I don't 1:49:14.360 --> 1:49:16.880 know where, you you know, Vietnam or IWA, GiMA or something, 1:49:16.920 --> 1:49:19.080 they don't go like, well, you know, we have a 1:49:19.120 --> 1:49:20.960 little bit I mean more about Arlington, but the bulk 1:49:21.040 --> 1:49:25.400 of mem still over and you incorporated into the minerals 1:49:25.439 --> 1:49:27.760 of the soil. Yeah, I mean that's so, but I 1:49:27.920 --> 1:49:32.240 understand that, and uh, you know, both places have their 1:49:32.280 --> 1:49:35.280 validity and Uh, you know, it really is a shame. 1:49:35.400 --> 1:49:38.640 But you know, Frankfort, Kentucky, if we're at me, like, 1:49:38.720 --> 1:49:40.920 where would I go and say this is what was 1:49:41.000 --> 1:49:42.439 left to the man, This is where I would go. 1:49:44.120 --> 1:49:46.080 Is there anything that we left out that you wish 1:49:46.120 --> 1:49:50.080 we'd have talked about today about old dB? Yeah? I 1:49:50.200 --> 1:49:52.800 think I think Boone fundamentally was a very good man. 1:49:53.040 --> 1:49:56.320 I think at a time when America could use heroes 1:49:57.200 --> 1:49:59.920 that that Boon in his own way kind of helps 1:50:00.000 --> 1:50:03.800 filled that niche. He certainly had his flaws, and we 1:50:03.960 --> 1:50:07.600 really have trouble relating to this time period. I mean 1:50:07.680 --> 1:50:10.599 that there's only very few times in Boone's lifetime, very 1:50:10.680 --> 1:50:14.880 few years where he's not living in an era of 1:50:15.000 --> 1:50:19.240 a named war. I mean he's born in seventeen thirty four. 1:50:19.880 --> 1:50:26.519 You know, by seventeen forty four you have King George's War, 1:50:27.240 --> 1:50:31.040 which is in uh New York. It's an Arcadia, it's 1:50:31.080 --> 1:50:38.600 spilling into the Caribbean, but that will help precipitate the 1:50:38.680 --> 1:50:41.360 French and Indian War, and he lives through that. And 1:50:41.439 --> 1:50:45.439 then you have this really very brief bloody epoch, uh, 1:50:45.920 --> 1:50:49.839 Lord Dunbore's War of just death up and down the Frontier. 1:50:49.960 --> 1:50:53.720 Boon lives through that. You have the American Revolution. Uh, 1:50:54.000 --> 1:50:55.920 then you have the War of eighteen twelve, and and 1:50:56.560 --> 1:50:59.799 Boons seventy two years old, and he's still participating locally 1:50:59.880 --> 1:51:02.479 in Missouri in the War of eighteen twelve. He's helping 1:51:02.640 --> 1:51:06.320 guard for its and man palisades and so forth. It's 1:51:06.360 --> 1:51:08.120 just this, it's just a different time. It's just a 1:51:08.200 --> 1:51:11.120 different era, and we can't go back and judge people 1:51:11.200 --> 1:51:13.320 by those kinds of standards. I mean, they're not hunting 1:51:13.800 --> 1:51:18.400 um two uh, some kind of a recreational thing. I 1:51:18.479 --> 1:51:22.600 mean it was extraordinarily hard and frankly put. You know, 1:51:22.680 --> 1:51:26.360 the frontier wasn't tamed literally until the women came out there. 1:51:26.439 --> 1:51:28.960 You know, it's the women that basically civilized the men. 1:51:29.240 --> 1:51:31.200 I mean the women did everything that the men did. 1:51:31.360 --> 1:51:34.200 Like Rebecca Boon. I mean she shoots the flintlock, she's 1:51:34.200 --> 1:51:37.479 skinned the deer, she managed the palisades, she molds bullets. 1:51:38.200 --> 1:51:42.120 She's willingly takes her pewter, which is precious items they 1:51:42.120 --> 1:51:44.759 didn't have very much, and takes the pewter and molds 1:51:44.800 --> 1:51:47.880 that down and use that for bullets. Um. The women 1:51:47.920 --> 1:51:50.240 would go out in teams while the men are gone 1:51:50.320 --> 1:51:53.560 long hunting or while the men are off skirmishing, the 1:51:53.640 --> 1:51:56.599 women go out in teams and plow. You know, one 1:51:56.640 --> 1:51:58.720 group would plow wow. Another group would out be out 1:51:58.760 --> 1:52:00.599 there with their guns and there must gets, and they're 1:52:00.920 --> 1:52:04.120 sometimes pitchforks and axes, whatever they had, and they would 1:52:04.160 --> 1:52:06.639 guard the women that were plowing, and after an hour 1:52:06.760 --> 1:52:10.040 or so they would switch. And so it's when the 1:52:10.080 --> 1:52:12.040 women get out there. You know. I really am a 1:52:12.120 --> 1:52:16.120 firm believer without being too cliche, that behind successful men 1:52:16.240 --> 1:52:19.479 there are important, powerful women. And this is certainly the 1:52:19.520 --> 1:52:23.000 case of Daniel Boone. Um. You know, he was married 1:52:23.000 --> 1:52:28.120 to Rebecca for fifty six years. She bears ten children 1:52:28.360 --> 1:52:32.000 and one dies soon after birth. They adopt four more 1:52:32.120 --> 1:52:36.320 from Boone's brother Israel. Then they adopt six more from 1:52:36.720 --> 1:52:41.080 Rebecca's sister who dies. You know, but they're really typical 1:52:41.200 --> 1:52:44.400 of the American pioneer. You know. The American long hunter 1:52:44.880 --> 1:52:48.679 is the first real American fist in the wilderness. John 1:52:48.760 --> 1:52:52.320 Stewart is the first American blood, true American blood that's 1:52:52.360 --> 1:52:55.719 slained in the first salvos of the American Revolution before 1:52:55.760 --> 1:52:59.759 it really happens. Uh, these guys with the driving force 1:53:00.280 --> 1:53:03.200 that helped found this country. And you know Boone was 1:53:03.280 --> 1:53:05.599 never a war monger. You know, you had those kind 1:53:05.600 --> 1:53:08.760 of people just like you had um and in the 1:53:08.840 --> 1:53:11.720 ancient world, whether you're talking about Achilles or Napoleon or 1:53:11.880 --> 1:53:14.960 Patent or so forth, that's not Boone. Um. You know, 1:53:15.040 --> 1:53:20.240 he didn't brandish his patriotism. But they founded this country. 1:53:20.920 --> 1:53:24.320 And um enough camp he said, they were the first 1:53:24.560 --> 1:53:27.200 and my apologies to Tom Broke, all the first great 1:53:27.280 --> 1:53:32.519 generation and they should be be given their due. He's 1:53:32.560 --> 1:53:36.719 been on the show. Indeed, we were talking earlier about 1:53:36.840 --> 1:53:39.479 Samuel Brady and Lou Whistle and these guys that turned 1:53:39.520 --> 1:53:44.040 into rabbit Indian haters. Boone had every reason to be that, 1:53:44.280 --> 1:53:47.599 yet he was not. That He had his firstborn son, 1:53:47.760 --> 1:53:51.639 James is killed by Indians, second born son Israel, killed 1:53:51.640 --> 1:53:55.879 by Indians, brother in law John Stewart, killed by Indians, 1:53:56.200 --> 1:54:00.240 brother ned Edward. They called it killed by Indie ends 1:54:00.560 --> 1:54:05.720 and yet Boone never reverted to that level of savagery. 1:54:06.320 --> 1:54:09.160 Part of this is his upbringing. He was raised a Quaker. 1:54:09.240 --> 1:54:12.439 He really saw value in other cultures and he learned 1:54:12.479 --> 1:54:15.400 from Indians. His learning from Indian tail to hunt that 1:54:15.520 --> 1:54:18.639 only made him successful as as a hunter, but also 1:54:18.840 --> 1:54:24.640 just reveals a mindset of his true humanity. And this 1:54:24.840 --> 1:54:26.800 is a pattern that he'll have throughout his life. And 1:54:26.920 --> 1:54:29.599 in many ways that you know, we were flawed characters. 1:54:29.640 --> 1:54:33.720 We all have, I do tremendous feet of clay. But 1:54:34.360 --> 1:54:37.000 but there's a lot about Boon that is very, very admirable. 1:54:37.080 --> 1:54:41.440 He never resourced to like the racial the racial hating. 1:54:41.480 --> 1:54:43.800 You had men in his day that literally would drag 1:54:43.880 --> 1:54:46.720 Indian corpses up to the fort, like Hugh mc garry 1:54:46.760 --> 1:54:49.600 would do this and chop them up and feed them 1:54:49.640 --> 1:54:53.080 to the dogs because they were so embittered because of 1:54:53.200 --> 1:54:55.600 death in their own family. And this the idea that 1:54:56.360 --> 1:55:00.720 somehow this gives them a personal revenge. And Boone saw this. 1:55:01.040 --> 1:55:02.840 You know, how would I react to seeing that? I 1:55:02.880 --> 1:55:06.120 don't know? And how do you living that and not 1:55:06.360 --> 1:55:11.040 revert to some level of savagery like that yourself. This 1:55:11.200 --> 1:55:13.680 is what's so interesting about Boone. You know, you had 1:55:13.800 --> 1:55:16.920 men that and this is one reason why people feared 1:55:18.280 --> 1:55:21.520 the forest. I mean the term savage. We would oftentimes 1:55:21.560 --> 1:55:23.840 just apply this to Indians, and they didn't just apply 1:55:23.920 --> 1:55:27.320 to Indians. You know, the beast were savage. The forests 1:55:27.320 --> 1:55:31.240 were savage, the people within the forest were savage. They 1:55:31.520 --> 1:55:34.320 feared that because it was seen as like this dark, 1:55:34.880 --> 1:55:38.200 malevolent forest that you would revert to. Boone never does. 1:55:39.160 --> 1:55:44.960 Now he stays this kind of figure of great humanity. 1:55:45.520 --> 1:55:49.200 And even today, you know, why are we talking about 1:55:49.320 --> 1:55:52.320 him two one years after his death? I think for 1:55:52.440 --> 1:55:57.720 these kind of reasons. His resonance is still there. And 1:55:57.840 --> 1:55:59.880 then you have the just the notion of going over 1:56:00.080 --> 1:56:02.480 the next hill and seeing what's over there, and that 1:56:02.560 --> 1:56:05.120 it really is. You know that that heart that was 1:56:05.240 --> 1:56:08.879 beating under that buckskin coat, that's the heart of every American. 1:56:08.960 --> 1:56:12.760 That's something deep and precious on our own. Psyche, I think, Yeah, 1:56:13.720 --> 1:56:15.760 you got a new book come out recently. We're gonna 1:56:15.760 --> 1:56:18.360 plux books before we end here. Okay, I'll tell you 1:56:18.400 --> 1:56:20.480 my favorite book. You tell me you're tell me your 1:56:20.520 --> 1:56:25.840 new book. My new book is called Finding Daniel Boone, 1:56:26.240 --> 1:56:30.440 His Last Days in Missouri and the Strange Fate of 1:56:30.600 --> 1:56:36.880 his remains. And it covers every shred of where Boone is, 1:56:37.360 --> 1:56:40.560 you know, the history of this entire episode, all the 1:56:40.600 --> 1:56:43.600 different stories and legend. It has the only forensic evidence 1:56:43.720 --> 1:56:46.200 that was ever done on the on the Boone's Skull Cast, 1:56:46.840 --> 1:56:49.960 but it's it also incorporates a lot of information about 1:56:50.360 --> 1:56:54.120 Boone's last days in Missouri, like the area that he 1:56:54.200 --> 1:56:57.200 lived in and uh La Cherette, Missouri. It talks a 1:56:57.240 --> 1:57:00.440 lot about his hunting and trapping. His last was kind 1:57:00.440 --> 1:57:04.400 of adventures, and it's done in a kind of a 1:57:04.520 --> 1:57:08.360 narrative combination of first person and third person, kind of 1:57:08.360 --> 1:57:10.480 like Tony Horwitz. I don't know if you like, you know, 1:57:10.600 --> 1:57:13.880 Ian Frasier, those kind of guys. I love their writing. 1:57:14.640 --> 1:57:17.760 And um yeah, that one just came out. That's available 1:57:18.840 --> 1:57:23.520 from the History Press and I'm looking at it on 1:57:23.560 --> 1:57:27.760 Amazon right now. I brought your coffee. Oh sweet, I 1:57:28.000 --> 1:57:31.240 need to hit order. So I'll tell you how I 1:57:31.360 --> 1:57:33.360 found you, how I became a fan of your books. 1:57:33.920 --> 1:57:37.400 Your book The Long Hunt, Death of the Buffalo East 1:57:37.440 --> 1:57:40.240 of the Mississippi, which is a good ass book. Then 1:57:41.480 --> 1:57:43.760 my personal favorite, which I read after that, was just 1:57:43.840 --> 1:57:48.600 The Hunters of Kentucky and it tells the stories, methodologies, 1:57:49.720 --> 1:57:53.440 everything of the Long Hunters. Yeah, yeah, The Hunters that 1:57:53.520 --> 1:58:01.320 Kentucky a narrative history of America's first Far West. Great book. 1:58:01.720 --> 1:58:05.480 Thank you, Yeah, you put it on a like top 1:58:05.560 --> 1:58:07.840 ten list in TWI or something that one of my 1:58:07.920 --> 1:58:10.680 friends sent me. The link probably sold the Piss album too, 1:58:10.720 --> 1:58:17.920 didn't we like hotcakes? Yeah? Five cents of stacks. I'm 1:58:17.960 --> 1:58:22.000 looking at it right now, paperback. Well, I would encourage 1:58:22.040 --> 1:58:25.600 folks to us. If they don't mind to support my work, 1:58:25.840 --> 1:58:28.360 I will say, um, you know my books are available 1:58:28.520 --> 1:58:31.480 on Amazon and Barnes and Noble, from local indies and 1:58:31.560 --> 1:58:33.960 so forth. I try to support them. The new book 1:58:33.960 --> 1:58:37.400 out on on Boone, on Finding Daniel Boone. That's the 1:58:37.480 --> 1:58:41.960 only real glimpse of Boone's um Missouri years. I would 1:58:42.000 --> 1:58:44.680 like to do a much larger work. It actually wasn't 1:58:44.760 --> 1:58:46.680 much larger work, but I had to scale it way back. 1:58:48.640 --> 1:58:51.320 If you want to dig in though on some of 1:58:51.360 --> 1:58:54.880 the subject we've covered most extensively here, Uh The Hunters 1:58:54.920 --> 1:58:57.560 of Kentucky narrative history of America's first far As the West, 1:58:58.960 --> 1:59:03.120 phenomenal book. Thank you, Yeah, I got it. I got 1:59:03.360 --> 1:59:06.000 a phone call one day. It was March sixth this year, 1:59:06.240 --> 1:59:09.200 and uh it was from Russia Western Writers of America. 1:59:10.080 --> 1:59:12.720 And I didn't I let it record because I didn't 1:59:12.720 --> 1:59:16.000 know what it was. But I did it. Three part 1:59:16.200 --> 1:59:22.920 trilogy on Daniel Boone's This Whole Rocky Mountain Story and 1:59:23.240 --> 1:59:27.680 for Muzzleloader Magazine. I write for Muzzleloader Magazine magazine for 1:59:27.720 --> 1:59:32.760 a black Powder Affecianados and um Unknown to Be. This 1:59:33.560 --> 1:59:37.520 three part article from Muzzleloader had been submitted to Western 1:59:37.600 --> 1:59:42.520 Writers of America and it actually won UM Best Short Nonfiction. 1:59:42.640 --> 1:59:44.880 So I went out to Colorado and yeah, I got 1:59:44.960 --> 1:59:48.400 a relationship. Man, I mean, I got ah, it's pretty cool. Yeah, 1:59:48.520 --> 1:59:53.520 and so um yeah, so that's great your work was 1:59:54.480 --> 1:59:57.160 your work was honored. Yeah. I thought it was a 1:59:57.320 --> 1:59:59.040 prank phone call at first, because I have a lot 1:59:59.120 --> 2:00:03.360 of friends that would and stuff like that. I had 2:00:03.400 --> 2:00:04.800 that half a one time I was in college. So 2:00:04.920 --> 2:00:06.480 I call him, said, yeah, Glenn Campbell wants you to 2:00:06.520 --> 2:00:09.000 play with him, And I said really. I started jumping 2:00:09.080 --> 2:00:10.920 up and down, and I think it was a girl 2:00:11.000 --> 2:00:14.040 from the door of the next over. I just played 2:00:14.040 --> 2:00:15.600 with Glenn Campbell on a golf course and so I 2:00:15.680 --> 2:00:19.200 thought he was calling me back. I never got the call. 2:00:20.560 --> 2:00:24.840 That's great to have. Uh, that's great that you're work 2:00:24.960 --> 2:00:27.360 was recognized. I'm a big fan of the books. I 2:00:27.440 --> 2:00:29.200 love the books. Oh, people go out and get some 2:00:31.280 --> 2:00:33.680 check them. Out. Yeah, And before we wrap up, as 2:00:33.760 --> 2:00:36.720 this episode airs, Clay Nucombe is all it's in the 2:00:36.800 --> 2:00:40.480 middle of a multi part series on Bargrease about Daniel Bood. 2:00:41.000 --> 2:00:43.480 So if you're if you're interested, go read Ted's books 2:00:43.520 --> 2:00:46.240 and listen to bar Grease. Thank you for having me. 2:00:46.400 --> 2:00:49.280 It's been a real honor and I really really do 2:00:49.400 --> 2:00:52.040 appreciate it. And I'll point out the folks real quick. 2:00:52.080 --> 2:00:59.640 Did uh Clay Newcomb Beargrease podcast is doing right now. 2:01:00.120 --> 2:01:03.320 He's doing a couple of pieces on Boone, focusing on 2:01:03.440 --> 2:01:05.920 the Cumberland Gap and what else is he focusing on? 2:01:06.040 --> 2:01:08.080 Phil Oh, he's he's diving into everything. I think it's 2:01:08.080 --> 2:01:10.720 gonna be a three episode series, but he's he's also 2:01:10.840 --> 2:01:14.760 tackling kind of um Like Ted brought up how we 2:01:14.880 --> 2:01:16.720 needed heroes at that time, He's diving into kind of 2:01:16.880 --> 2:01:19.840 Boone's effect on pop culture and how we see ourselves 2:01:19.880 --> 2:01:22.400 as Americans and kind of a societal impact and stuff 2:01:22.440 --> 2:01:27.520 like that. Fascinating character man. All right, Ted Franklin Blue, 2:01:28.120 --> 2:01:32.400 check out his books. Thank you much, appreciate it, appreciate 2:01:32.440 --> 2:01:35.760 you coming on. Thank you very much. I mean, you know, 2:01:35.920 --> 2:01:38.720 for for a Kentucky boy by way of Florida. He is. 2:01:38.800 --> 2:01:42.160 It's a big deal, and and I really sure enough, 2:01:42.160 --> 2:01:44.400 I really appreciate it. I wish you're corporate, if he 2:01:44.480 --> 2:01:46.440 didn't have short writ up. But you can't have everything. 2:02:00.200 --> 2:02:00.240 S