WEBVTT - How Autopsies Work 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:02.840 Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. 0:00:03.160 --> 0:00:07.560 It's ready. Are you welcome to Stuff you should know? 0:00:08.160 --> 0:00:20.880 From House toff works dot Com. I would say, hey, 0:00:21.000 --> 0:00:23.360 welcome to the podcast, but I'm not going to yet 0:00:23.400 --> 0:00:27.040 because this is add on to what you're about to hear. Right, Chuck, 0:00:27.120 --> 0:00:30.040 let's be quiet because we don't want our our normal 0:00:30.080 --> 0:00:32.400 selves to hear us. Oh gotcha? I wonder why we 0:00:32.479 --> 0:00:36.280 were talking about that. Do you understand now, Chuck? Did 0:00:36.280 --> 0:00:38.640 you know what this is? Do you know why we're doing? 0:00:38.920 --> 0:00:44.280 What is? It is pretty freaking exciting, what Josh, we 0:00:44.320 --> 0:00:48.360 are about to release in just a few seconds show? 0:00:48.600 --> 0:00:53.800 Remember four zero zero? That's huge. There should be some 0:00:53.800 --> 0:00:55.720 sort of fancaire. I hope there was just now I 0:00:55.760 --> 0:00:58.600 think so there are four episodes of stuff you should know. 0:00:59.080 --> 0:01:02.640 That's a big deal to did I can't even like 0:01:02.720 --> 0:01:05.720 when people ask the requisite a, what's your favorite show? 0:01:06.080 --> 0:01:07.800 I can't even just melt my brain now, I can't 0:01:07.800 --> 0:01:09.960 even think of it. I used to have stock answers, 0:01:10.000 --> 0:01:12.160 and now there's so many I look through and I 0:01:12.200 --> 0:01:14.520 don't even remember some of them, Like what we did 0:01:14.560 --> 0:01:17.320 that we talked about that? I'm with you crazy. Well, 0:01:17.400 --> 0:01:22.080 let's let's hope we can do another four shows exactly. 0:01:22.440 --> 0:01:27.279 Here's two years four more. Congratulations Buddy, right back, and Jerry, 0:01:27.400 --> 0:01:29.479 thank you. You've been here since day one, aside from 0:01:29.480 --> 0:01:35.959 a few guest episodes where you're lazy, Jerry, congratulations to you. 0:01:36.160 --> 0:01:39.600 Pretty much been Jerry the whole time. Um, what what 0:01:39.720 --> 0:01:43.320 would it be without the three of us? You know? Yeah, yeah, yeah, 0:01:43.480 --> 0:01:46.960 it would be crud? Yeah. Um well, thank you, dear 0:01:47.000 --> 0:01:49.720 listener for listening to all four hundred. You know some 0:01:49.840 --> 0:01:51.640 of you out there have because we would not be 0:01:51.680 --> 0:01:54.080 around if you never listened in the first place. We 0:01:54.120 --> 0:01:56.560 would have done four shows. Yea. And yeah, those of 0:01:56.600 --> 0:01:58.240 you who have listened to one or two or just 0:01:58.320 --> 0:02:01.280 discovered us or whatever, this is your one. Welcome to 0:02:01.280 --> 0:02:27.000 the Dullhouse. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. 0:02:27.120 --> 0:02:30.280 With me is Charles W. Chuck Bryant, and that makes 0:02:30.280 --> 0:02:33.720 this stuff you should know, dead and rowdy. I just 0:02:33.760 --> 0:02:36.440 made you shudder before we pressed record. I'm out it 0:02:36.560 --> 0:02:40.119 was an actual one. No, I thought you did that well, yeah, 0:02:40.160 --> 0:02:42.679 but I was doing in response to your face. You 0:02:42.800 --> 0:02:44.800 made that face, but you didn't make annoy were you 0:02:44.840 --> 0:02:47.839 doing it on my behalf of exactly. Okank you so much. 0:02:48.120 --> 0:02:55.320 I feel so cared for so chuckers. Yes, Um, this 0:02:55.400 --> 0:02:59.000 is a little kind of a boo podcast. This this 0:02:59.080 --> 0:03:02.880 has got to complete our suite on death. You would 0:03:02.880 --> 0:03:06.000 think so, but it doesn't. No. No, we still have 0:03:06.040 --> 0:03:11.600 how dying works left. Um, we still have um, what 0:03:11.720 --> 0:03:14.440 it's like to be dead. We've got a lot of 0:03:14.480 --> 0:03:17.200 stuff we haven't even touched, like what happens to the 0:03:17.320 --> 0:03:22.160 nails after that. So, um, we're getting closer that we're 0:03:22.440 --> 0:03:27.440 creating a larger body of work. Um, and this one, 0:03:27.800 --> 0:03:29.680 this is gonna be a big one. You predicted. I 0:03:29.720 --> 0:03:34.200 think I agree with you. It's detailed too. Yeah. It 0:03:34.320 --> 0:03:37.920 was based in part on the an interview with the 0:03:37.920 --> 0:03:42.840 Fulton County Deputy Medical Examiner, who knows what he's talking about. Hey, 0:03:42.920 --> 0:03:45.240 if you're in Fulton County, you're gonna be investigating a 0:03:45.240 --> 0:03:50.360 lot of foul play. Yeah. Atlanta and Detroit used to 0:03:50.360 --> 0:03:52.480 go back and forth for the murder. Capital of the 0:03:52.600 --> 0:03:57.360 US used to shoot out and then bullets a false 0:03:57.400 --> 0:04:00.640 somewhere in the middle. DC is up there too, I think, Yeah, 0:04:00.720 --> 0:04:01.920 do you see us up there? I don't. I think 0:04:01.920 --> 0:04:05.840 Atlanta's out of the running the last several years. I 0:04:05.920 --> 0:04:08.640 know it lost this place. We just don't murder like 0:04:08.680 --> 0:04:11.160 what used to. But I mean, like the numbers all 0:04:11.200 --> 0:04:14.080 pale in comparison to like Warez. It's like, do you 0:04:14.120 --> 0:04:17.080 think that's a big number? How about fifteen times that 0:04:17.960 --> 0:04:22.160 you know? Um, so chuck. Have you ever seen an autopsy, 0:04:23.560 --> 0:04:27.680 like a real deal film of one? No? I saw that, 0:04:29.279 --> 0:04:31.120 but that was that was quite fake. Have you not 0:04:31.160 --> 0:04:34.160 seen Faces of Death? The original? I never saw that 0:04:34.200 --> 0:04:37.520 there's an autopsy in there, and um, I can't remember 0:04:37.520 --> 0:04:41.080 if we talked about it during the Exploitation Films episode, 0:04:41.600 --> 0:04:45.440 but um, part of Faces of Death was real and 0:04:45.520 --> 0:04:49.600 some was staged and fake, but the autopsy was definitely real. 0:04:50.200 --> 0:04:52.920 And you can tell after reading this, it's like, oh yeah, 0:04:52.920 --> 0:04:55.200 they do pull the skin flat from the top of 0:04:55.279 --> 0:04:58.400 the scalp down over the face and under the chest. 0:04:58.480 --> 0:05:01.000 I felt really bad for the human base reading this 0:05:02.200 --> 0:05:04.640 because it's liable. Yeah, it's well, and it's always got 0:05:04.720 --> 0:05:08.120 some flap of skin folded over it. Yeah, like, I 0:05:08.120 --> 0:05:09.400 don't know, we don't want to look at that, so 0:05:09.480 --> 0:05:13.279 let's just fold the chest over it. Exactly what what 0:05:13.520 --> 0:05:16.880 is this what's that called the scalp scalp? Yeah, but 0:05:17.000 --> 0:05:19.680 say skull, Sorry, the skulls under the scalp. No I 0:05:19.720 --> 0:05:23.840 knew that. That's the fact of the podcast. Um, So, 0:05:23.920 --> 0:05:26.680 why why do people do autopsis, Chuck? It's not just 0:05:26.760 --> 0:05:29.840 so ghouls can be paid to do their thing. Now, 0:05:30.080 --> 0:05:32.800 there's actual reasons for an autopsy, which, by the way, 0:05:32.839 --> 0:05:36.240 it doesn't say it's in the article, but autopsy is 0:05:36.600 --> 0:05:39.839 Greek based on the Greek autopsia, which means to see 0:05:39.880 --> 0:05:44.840 for one's own eyes. Yeah. Yeah, Do they want to 0:05:44.839 --> 0:05:48.400 see for oneself how somebody died? Yes, the manner of 0:05:48.480 --> 0:05:51.640 death and time of death, which we'll get into. But 0:05:51.960 --> 0:05:56.480 I think there are five certain types of death one five, 0:05:57.960 --> 0:06:02.560 uh six that that they require an autopsy if you 0:06:02.640 --> 0:06:08.720 die by injury, delayed complication of injury, poisoning, infectious complications, 0:06:09.120 --> 0:06:12.240 foul play, or if you die with no attending positions, 0:06:12.320 --> 0:06:16.520 So that those are the reasons that they were requested autopsy, right, 0:06:16.560 --> 0:06:19.799 And if the cops come out or somebody the funeral 0:06:19.839 --> 0:06:22.719 home comes out and says, whoa, whoa, whoa, this guy 0:06:22.920 --> 0:06:25.719 may have been poisoned or he's injured and he died, 0:06:26.640 --> 0:06:29.599 we need to call the corner the medical examiner. They're 0:06:29.600 --> 0:06:34.719 going to perform an autopsy, and there's um, there's a 0:06:34.760 --> 0:06:38.039 couple of types of autopsies. There's two really, and the 0:06:38.120 --> 0:06:41.560 one where the cops are involved, where the medical examination 0:06:41.680 --> 0:06:44.120 is carried out on behalf of law enforcement. That's a 0:06:44.279 --> 0:06:49.159 UM well a medical examination of forensic autopsy a k a. 0:06:49.560 --> 0:06:52.480 The the sexiest of all autopsies, because that's what you're 0:06:52.480 --> 0:06:55.640 gonna see in movies and on TV quite often, unless 0:06:55.680 --> 0:06:59.599 it's like contagion or something right exactly so, in a 0:06:59.680 --> 0:07:05.640 move like um, oh contagion, Uh, the any autopsy you 0:07:05.720 --> 0:07:08.080 performed is going to be a clinical autopsy, which is 0:07:08.160 --> 0:07:10.320 usually performed by doctors who are trying to figure out 0:07:10.360 --> 0:07:13.560 what the heck happened, what went wrong in the treatment, 0:07:14.040 --> 0:07:17.680 how a disease took its course, and they're basically documenting 0:07:18.000 --> 0:07:23.400 maybe an interesting case through autopsy for the medical literature 0:07:23.680 --> 0:07:26.120 and for well, in the case of a contagion, even 0:07:26.120 --> 0:07:28.840 though I haven't seen it, for the good of humanity, 0:07:29.440 --> 0:07:33.000 immediate good of humanity, if there's some fast spreading disease 0:07:33.080 --> 0:07:38.680 or something, or there's faulty cribs. Um autopsies were instrumental 0:07:38.880 --> 0:07:42.920 in finding getting to the bottom of like product recalls 0:07:42.960 --> 0:07:46.360 like faulty cribs that killing kids. I didn't think about that. Yeah, 0:07:46.400 --> 0:07:49.080 that's one of the benefits of autopsies. Yeah, makes total sense. 0:07:49.400 --> 0:07:51.480 So those are the two kinds of autopsies you got 0:07:51.520 --> 0:07:54.800 for forensic and clinical. And basically we're gonna be talking 0:07:54.840 --> 0:07:58.880 mainly about um law enforcement autopsies. So when we say autopsy, 0:07:58.920 --> 0:08:00.520 for the rest of the podcast, we're too much talking 0:08:00.520 --> 0:08:03.360 about a forensic autopsy. One that's trying to figure out 0:08:03.600 --> 0:08:10.160 if somebody died uh naturally, accidentally or someone's hand, yeah, 0:08:10.320 --> 0:08:15.200 foul play, um at their own hand, suicide or undetermined. 0:08:15.240 --> 0:08:17.840 Those are the five legally defined manners of death. I 0:08:17.840 --> 0:08:20.840 didn't see very sleepy on here. I thought those six 0:08:21.440 --> 0:08:23.720 that would be naturally where they go to cut into 0:08:23.760 --> 0:08:26.760 you and you're like, oh, you wake up and they're like, oh, 0:08:26.880 --> 0:08:29.800 he's not dead. Right, Well, there's no manner of death 0:08:29.800 --> 0:08:33.520 then yet. Uh, that's gonna be done by a forensic 0:08:33.559 --> 0:08:38.560 pathologist most often, or a medical examiner or a coroner, 0:08:38.720 --> 0:08:42.760 and we'll we'll get into that towards the end, right, Yeah, 0:08:43.000 --> 0:08:46.760 about the difference. Yeah, Well, ideally it's going to be 0:08:46.800 --> 0:08:49.520 carried out by a forensic pathologist, which is somebody who's 0:08:49.559 --> 0:08:54.160 trained to perform autopsies looking for a mode of death. Right, 0:08:54.240 --> 0:08:57.600 quite often a doctor, but not always almost always. Yeah, 0:08:57.720 --> 0:09:00.000 to be a forensic pathologist, you have to be a doctor. 0:09:00.720 --> 0:09:06.760 Oh really Yeah. To be a medical examiner, you have 0:09:06.840 --> 0:09:08.480 to be a doctor. You don't have to be a 0:09:08.520 --> 0:09:11.880 forensic pathologist to be a medical examiner. Well, and you 0:09:12.080 --> 0:09:15.840 ideally should be uh accredited, but that's not always the 0:09:15.840 --> 0:09:19.680 case either. You want to have to be Um. So 0:09:19.760 --> 0:09:23.880 let's say you're forensic pathologist or a corner you're going 0:09:23.960 --> 0:09:28.640 to try to assign one of these one of these 0:09:28.640 --> 0:09:33.880 manners of death to a dead person. Yeah, like Quincy, Yeah, exactly. Um, 0:09:33.920 --> 0:09:36.840 and what you're gonna do is, uh, you're gonna take 0:09:36.920 --> 0:09:39.400 not just the findings from your autopsy, but you're going 0:09:39.440 --> 0:09:42.680 to put them in a context with say a police 0:09:42.679 --> 0:09:45.520 report or something. Right, Yeah, but you're not cops. Like 0:09:45.720 --> 0:09:50.439 TV as usual overstates it as far as how involved 0:09:50.440 --> 0:09:52.720 the medical examiner is, like as far as being on 0:09:52.760 --> 0:09:55.920 the scene and collecting DNA and all that stuff. It's 0:09:56.040 --> 0:09:59.640 it's not usually the case as Mr. What's his name, 0:09:59.679 --> 0:10:05.280 doctor U Kaisel or keisel, let's go with the let's 0:10:03.480 --> 0:10:09.600 go the k um. So you take all this stuff 0:10:09.640 --> 0:10:12.880 like so so, for example, Robert Valdez who wrote this article, 0:10:13.160 --> 0:10:17.680 UM says, so there's there's head trauma on a dead 0:10:17.679 --> 0:10:22.760 man or a dead woman. Doesn't quite make sense. You know, 0:10:22.920 --> 0:10:26.200 is it a homicide? Is it's probably not a suicide. 0:10:26.520 --> 0:10:30.440 But is it accidental? Um? You know, it's definitely injury, right, 0:10:31.000 --> 0:10:33.400 which is why somebody called the corner or the medical 0:10:33.400 --> 0:10:37.880 examiner in the first place. But the exactly whether it 0:10:37.960 --> 0:10:41.160 was at someone else's hand or accidental is still up 0:10:41.160 --> 0:10:44.000 for debate. Well, you take those head that head trauma, 0:10:44.040 --> 0:10:46.240 those head wounds, and you put them together with the 0:10:46.240 --> 0:10:49.000 police report that said that there was an iced over 0:10:49.120 --> 0:10:52.720 ladder laying beside the dead body when it was found. 0:10:53.160 --> 0:10:56.880 There's probably an accident. The corner of the medical examiner 0:10:56.960 --> 0:11:00.200 is going to say, this guy's probably it was probably 0:11:00.240 --> 0:11:02.720 just slipping off the ladder, like the gutters are half 0:11:02.760 --> 0:11:06.000 cleaned out, right, He has like a big hunk of 0:11:06.080 --> 0:11:10.559 leaves in his hand, and he didn't write someone's name 0:11:10.640 --> 0:11:16.040 in blood on the sidewalk. It was um. And then 0:11:16.120 --> 0:11:18.400 you know, if you have the the old that old 0:11:18.480 --> 0:11:22.720 yarn about a gunshot wounded the head. Is it a homicide? Well, 0:11:22.760 --> 0:11:25.520 I don't know. Is there a burn pattern really close by? 0:11:25.640 --> 0:11:29.000 Is there gunshot residue on the on the hand, the 0:11:29.040 --> 0:11:33.400 dominant hand of the victim, that's probably a suicide. Yeah. 0:11:33.400 --> 0:11:34.800 And as we'll point out here in a minute, one 0:11:34.840 --> 0:11:37.160 of the steps uh which I didn't even realize this, 0:11:37.240 --> 0:11:39.040 you always see him ziping them up in the body bag, 0:11:39.120 --> 0:11:42.199 but actually bagged the hands and in a in a 0:11:43.200 --> 0:11:46.520 suspected suicie homicide, Yeah, because you bagged the hands because 0:11:46.520 --> 0:11:48.360 you want to just make sure that you can check 0:11:48.440 --> 0:11:50.839 under the fingernails to make sure that there's not like 0:11:51.800 --> 0:11:54.719 skin cells from the guy who attacked you under your 0:11:54.760 --> 0:12:00.280 under your fingernails. People get real grabby when they're being murdered. So, um, 0:12:00.320 --> 0:12:03.760 so we apparently I didn't realize this, but ductor keisel, 0:12:03.800 --> 0:12:06.720 we don't have keisel, right. Yeah, he pointed out that. 0:12:06.960 --> 0:12:09.360 So he gave an example of how it's not really 0:12:09.400 --> 0:12:14.480 that clear cut right with the gunshot wound. Yeah, it 0:12:14.559 --> 0:12:16.680 was interesting to say, you say I shot you in 0:12:16.720 --> 0:12:18.880 the head. That would be very sad thirty years ago, 0:12:19.679 --> 0:12:23.120 and um, you survived, but you developed the seizure disorder. 0:12:24.280 --> 0:12:27.840 So you're fine, but you you have seizures. Thirty years later, 0:12:28.200 --> 0:12:32.760 today you keel over dead from your seizure disorder. That 0:12:33.000 --> 0:12:36.400 death would be ruled a homicide because you developed a 0:12:36.400 --> 0:12:39.079 seizure disorder as the result of a gunshot wound, which 0:12:39.160 --> 0:12:42.800 is an unnatural event that I inflicted on you. So 0:12:42.840 --> 0:12:45.480 even though Emily can't come after me and be like, 0:12:45.520 --> 0:12:47.400 I'm gonna assue you, she could be like, I'm gonna 0:12:47.480 --> 0:12:51.599 kill you. She couldn't sue me because the apparently the 0:12:52.160 --> 0:12:55.800 um the courts don't allow that after thirty years of survival, 0:12:56.360 --> 0:12:59.360 but the the corner or the medical examiner would rule 0:12:59.400 --> 0:13:01.600 it a homicide. Yeah, it's not, like he points out, 0:13:01.600 --> 0:13:04.040 it's not their call to say, like, you gotta go 0:13:04.080 --> 0:13:06.520 after and prosecute this dude, or Emily can sue you, 0:13:06.640 --> 0:13:08.960 or she can bring you flowers and candy. They're just saying, 0:13:09.000 --> 0:13:12.080 this is how it died, how it went exactly supposedly 0:13:12.120 --> 0:13:15.760 in an ideal vacuum world, we should say that's right. 0:13:16.760 --> 0:13:20.160 So you were talking about the difference between medical examiners 0:13:20.160 --> 0:13:22.360 and corners. You want to you want to give up? Yeah, 0:13:22.840 --> 0:13:25.439 from what I understand, and especially by reading that article 0:13:25.520 --> 0:13:32.920 that you sent. Um corners are sort of the more 0:13:33.520 --> 0:13:35.839 part time although they can do it full time, but 0:13:35.920 --> 0:13:38.599 a lot of times it's in these underfunded counties and 0:13:38.640 --> 0:13:41.680 counties where they don't have a lot of crime. Uh, 0:13:41.720 --> 0:13:45.040 there will be a corner because there's only what did 0:13:45.040 --> 0:13:50.319 that articles say, like four to professional medical examiners in 0:13:50.360 --> 0:13:53.880 the United States. Yeah, that's crazy. There's plenty of medical examiners, 0:13:54.160 --> 0:13:56.719 but they're not forensic pathologists, which in this case is 0:13:56.760 --> 0:14:00.679 like the most highly qualified person in that field. Right, 0:14:01.320 --> 0:14:04.200 So that's the main difference. It all depends on the 0:14:04.200 --> 0:14:07.240 county where you live. There's different laws as you know, 0:14:07.400 --> 0:14:11.000 as far as what they require. But if you're not 0:14:11.040 --> 0:14:13.439 in a big city, you may not have the resources 0:14:13.559 --> 0:14:16.640 or the equipment, or you may be so far out 0:14:16.640 --> 0:14:18.920 of town that you know, it's hard to get people there, 0:14:18.960 --> 0:14:21.400 so you might just have a corner driving up. That 0:14:21.520 --> 0:14:25.680 was is also your contractor for your house as the 0:14:25.880 --> 0:14:28.360 case was setting? Where was that? Was that in Louisiana 0:14:28.480 --> 0:14:32.800 or Texas? Was in Washington? Washington? Yeah? Uh, there's sixteen 0:14:32.880 --> 0:14:35.960 hundred counties in the US, and there's like thirty counties 0:14:36.000 --> 0:14:39.440 total and six hundred of them used the corner system, 0:14:39.520 --> 0:14:44.040 and you know medical examiners, an appointed physician. UH. County 0:14:44.080 --> 0:14:47.120 coroner is an elected official who in most cases just 0:14:47.160 --> 0:14:49.880 has to have a high school degree for UM to 0:14:49.960 --> 0:14:53.320 be qualified for the position. Sometimes it's the sheriff. Saw 0:14:53.360 --> 0:14:56.920 in that one county it was the local county prosecutor 0:14:57.760 --> 0:14:59.960 is also the corner. Yeah, you're not supposed to do 0:15:00.080 --> 0:15:03.320 that because you want an impartial person ruling on the 0:15:03.320 --> 0:15:06.040 manner of death, especially say if like it's a police death. 0:15:06.400 --> 0:15:09.080 You know, the police killed somebody. You don't want the 0:15:09.120 --> 0:15:12.920 sheriff judging whether or not his deputies were to blame. 0:15:13.320 --> 0:15:16.400 Looks like suicide to me, exactly, Well that happened. That 0:15:16.520 --> 0:15:19.680 was a pretty good example in UM, New Orleans of 0:15:20.240 --> 0:15:23.760 there's the corner. There has been corner for like thirty 0:15:23.800 --> 0:15:29.640 five years. He um he's very very cozy with law enforcement, 0:15:29.680 --> 0:15:31.360 or has been accused of it many times. And there 0:15:31.400 --> 0:15:34.600 was a guy who stole one cops gun and shot 0:15:34.600 --> 0:15:37.400 another cop to death and started to get away and 0:15:37.520 --> 0:15:40.640 was finally caught. And when he was caught and brought 0:15:40.680 --> 0:15:45.600 in finally he died supposedly after being given iodine for 0:15:45.880 --> 0:15:48.560 X rays, but really he died because he was beaten 0:15:48.560 --> 0:15:51.080 to death. He had like a bruce testicle and like, um, 0:15:51.120 --> 0:15:53.960 all these cracked ribs in the corner. Still this day 0:15:54.000 --> 0:15:56.560 refuses to rule it a homicide. It's like a movie plot. 0:15:57.160 --> 0:15:59.120 All of a sudden, Richard gear gets called in to 0:15:59.640 --> 0:16:04.480 invest to gate and then things get sexy exactly because 0:16:04.520 --> 0:16:09.240 of course the cop is you know, Angelina Jolie. Is 0:16:09.240 --> 0:16:11.600 that how it goes down all eighty pounds of her. 0:16:11.600 --> 0:16:14.840 He's one tough cop. Um. So there there are problems 0:16:14.880 --> 0:16:17.520 with the Corners thing. And um that you read that 0:16:17.640 --> 0:16:20.520 article too from PBS Frontline. That was awesome, by the way, 0:16:20.600 --> 0:16:22.880 people should read that. Yeah, I can't remember what it 0:16:22.920 --> 0:16:25.640 was called. Um, I got it right here. Okay, good. 0:16:25.800 --> 0:16:28.960 It is called the Real c S I Colin, How 0:16:29.000 --> 0:16:33.520 America's patchwork system of death investigations puts the living at risk. 0:16:33.840 --> 0:16:37.440 It's a it's a very eye opening um article. Yeah, 0:16:37.480 --> 0:16:41.440 where basically they say that this the members of this 0:16:41.520 --> 0:16:45.640 field quite literally bury their mistakes. There's some really bad 0:16:46.200 --> 0:16:48.280 people who are really bad at their jobs out there 0:16:48.320 --> 0:16:50.440 doing it. But the problem is it's like if you 0:16:50.520 --> 0:16:52.840 have a coroner who doesn't know what he's looking at 0:16:52.880 --> 0:16:55.720 and rules something a homicide. Then there's somebody who's going 0:16:55.760 --> 0:16:58.920 to be put on trial eventually. Well, exactly right or 0:16:58.920 --> 0:17:01.560 wrong if you have medical examiners who don't know what 0:17:01.600 --> 0:17:05.439 they're doing or do a terrible job. One guy, um 0:17:05.520 --> 0:17:10.280 in Tennessee, was accused of his dog eating some human 0:17:10.320 --> 0:17:12.760 remains because it was allowed to roam free in the 0:17:12.840 --> 0:17:17.679 examination room. You can't do that. Another guy supposedly allegedly 0:17:17.800 --> 0:17:21.800 was drunk while he was doing like thousands of these things. Um, 0:17:21.880 --> 0:17:23.600 that's probably the only way he could get through it 0:17:23.640 --> 0:17:28.520 because he wasn't a real forensic pathologist. Right. But there's 0:17:28.560 --> 0:17:31.720 a huge there's this huge battle going on between you 0:17:31.720 --> 0:17:34.040 know how qualified you have to be. It's the medical 0:17:34.440 --> 0:17:38.399 establishment trying to take over this lucrative field er. Well, 0:17:38.680 --> 0:17:41.840 it's not so lucrative, because that's one reason it said 0:17:41.840 --> 0:17:43.639 in the article that there's a shortage is because they 0:17:43.680 --> 0:17:48.359 get paid on average less than a doctor would. So 0:17:48.400 --> 0:17:51.040 if you're gonna go through medical school plus I think 0:17:51.040 --> 0:17:53.160 an extra year of training for this to get paid 0:17:53.240 --> 0:17:55.560 less money. And the one guy pointed out, so like 0:17:55.600 --> 0:17:59.320 you really do this because of love for your fellow man. Yes, 0:18:00.280 --> 0:18:05.240 that was the guy who refused to rule the homicide. Yeah, yeah, 0:18:05.480 --> 0:18:07.280 I don't know what that means in but also i'll 0:18:07.280 --> 0:18:10.600 bet their UM, I'll bet their malpractice insurance. It's like 0:18:10.680 --> 0:18:15.120 next to nothing compared to a regular physicians. Yeah, because 0:18:15.160 --> 0:18:18.439 you're using Well, we'll get to that um. So the 0:18:18.480 --> 0:18:22.199 coroner also is responsible for identifying a body, notifying the 0:18:22.240 --> 0:18:26.320 next of king's billy, collecting uh and returning any personal 0:18:26.359 --> 0:18:29.560 belongings that's found on the body, which I'm sure in 0:18:29.640 --> 0:18:32.080 rural counties that you know, there's probably been more than 0:18:32.160 --> 0:18:35.760 one wallet go missing during that protest, maybe maybe not 0:18:35.840 --> 0:18:39.399 calling out corners, never trusted farmers, have you, um? And 0:18:39.440 --> 0:18:42.360 then signing the death certificate. And this kind of goes 0:18:42.400 --> 0:18:45.440 along with the origin of coroner, which is derived from 0:18:45.520 --> 0:18:49.200 the old English crowner. Yeah. I think Richard the lion 0:18:49.280 --> 0:18:52.359 Heart was when it first really came into effect, because 0:18:52.400 --> 0:18:55.680 he wanted I guess he wanted the money of dead people, 0:18:56.280 --> 0:18:58.680 so he would send out his crowner so to gather 0:18:58.760 --> 0:19:01.280 it up. Right, He's like a demo, and they would say, well, 0:19:01.320 --> 0:19:03.840 he died of of a wound from a sword, and 0:19:03.880 --> 0:19:07.439 then take his gold trinkets, yes, and return it to 0:19:07.520 --> 0:19:11.560 Richard yeah, exactly. And then apparently over time they were like, well, 0:19:11.600 --> 0:19:15.119 while you're out there, why don't you just start taking 0:19:15.240 --> 0:19:18.800 vital records and and let's make you like an official guy. 0:19:19.080 --> 0:19:21.479 And that's how the crowner became the coroner. It's right. 0:19:21.760 --> 0:19:27.320 And Dr Dr Diesel even knew that. Dr Keisel because 0:19:27.320 --> 0:19:29.040 he's the one in the article that even pointed that out. 0:19:29.080 --> 0:19:30.600 And I thought, well, that's good. He knows about the 0:19:30.640 --> 0:19:33.560 history of his profession. He seemed like a pretty sharp guy, 0:19:34.200 --> 0:19:37.040 I imagine. So so, Chuck, we've been beating around the 0:19:37.040 --> 0:19:40.359 bush quite long enough. Do you feel like it's time 0:19:40.440 --> 0:19:43.680 for people to put down their lunches and us to 0:19:43.800 --> 0:19:48.000 go through the autopsy procedure step by step? Yes, I 0:19:48.040 --> 0:19:51.040 think that's a great idea. Step one, as I have 0:19:51.119 --> 0:19:54.960 it is a body bag or an evident cheat got 0:19:54.960 --> 0:19:56.800 to use a new, brand new body bag and a 0:19:56.840 --> 0:19:59.359 brand new evident sheet. I don't want to reuse this, No, 0:19:59.520 --> 0:20:02.359 I didn't. That was worth pointing out. But it wouln't 0:20:02.400 --> 0:20:05.360 even bring myself the highlight. I know he was thorough though, 0:20:05.400 --> 0:20:07.280 so you definitely want to use new ones because you 0:20:07.280 --> 0:20:12.520 don't want, obviously any contamination. The body is moved by 0:20:12.600 --> 0:20:15.960 a deaner. Uh, make about thirty seven grand a year. 0:20:16.000 --> 0:20:19.359 I look that up on average. If you're a morgue 0:20:19.359 --> 0:20:21.679 atendent or a deaner and that is a d I 0:20:21.800 --> 0:20:24.879 E N E R. And they will take the body 0:20:24.960 --> 0:20:27.760 in the bag or sheet to the examination sweet and 0:20:27.840 --> 0:20:31.000 it stays in the bag, uh for a little while 0:20:32.119 --> 0:20:36.760 at first at least. Isn't that right? I didn't run 0:20:36.800 --> 0:20:39.960 across that. Yeah, because if you have to, uh, you 0:20:40.000 --> 0:20:41.920 can unseal the bag, but you have to take note 0:20:41.960 --> 0:20:45.480 of the clothing and oh yeah, the cloth they just 0:20:45.520 --> 0:20:49.040 put the body. Well that if they do put it 0:20:49.080 --> 0:20:53.080 in the fridge. If if there is some delay, like 0:20:53.119 --> 0:20:54.960 if the bodies are stacked up or something, or I 0:20:55.000 --> 0:21:02.639 would imagine to let rigger stop. Sure right to cease exactly, 0:21:02.800 --> 0:21:05.040 very good shock. But you leave it in the bag 0:21:05.080 --> 0:21:06.960 at first. You want to take note of the clothing 0:21:07.240 --> 0:21:09.800 after unzipping it and the position of the clothing. It's 0:21:09.880 --> 0:21:13.000 very important because the guy had let's say his turtle 0:21:13.119 --> 0:21:15.600 night pulled up over his nose. He might have died 0:21:15.640 --> 0:21:19.600 by some stinky chemical in the air. That's good. You 0:21:19.760 --> 0:21:22.720 paint a heck of a picture. I imagine a Frenchman 0:21:24.080 --> 0:21:28.520 with a little mustache. Uh, you want to begin with 0:21:28.560 --> 0:21:32.200 the this is the external examination is obviously what comes first. 0:21:32.200 --> 0:21:34.119 You don't want to go cutting into the body. You 0:21:34.160 --> 0:21:38.240 want to look at hair samples, fingernails, gunshot residue, fibers, 0:21:38.280 --> 0:21:42.399 paint chips, anything on the body, hairs that that is 0:21:42.440 --> 0:21:45.640 worth noting. Right in the bag itself or the evidence 0:21:45.640 --> 0:21:48.840 sheet is kept as evidence as well, Yeah, because stuff 0:21:48.880 --> 0:21:52.359 might have stuck to it. Um, that's gross. Yeah, it 0:21:52.440 --> 0:21:55.119 is kind of gross, but it happened, you know. Uh. 0:21:55.320 --> 0:21:57.520 You also want to keep the body in the bag, 0:21:58.160 --> 0:22:01.119 Uh to X ray as well. Yeah, X ray or 0:22:01.200 --> 0:22:03.240 cat scan the body in the bag. I didn't think 0:22:03.240 --> 0:22:05.320 about that, No, but it's true. I mean things get 0:22:05.359 --> 0:22:08.840 lost in the bank. You want to make sure they're there. True, 0:22:08.960 --> 0:22:11.119 you wouldn't be able to see through the human being 0:22:11.680 --> 0:22:14.080 find maybe a bullet or something that's missing. It's in 0:22:14.160 --> 0:22:17.280 the bag. Uh, it says in here. Sometimes I'll use 0:22:17.359 --> 0:22:23.120 a UV radiation special technique to basically make secretions glow 0:22:23.160 --> 0:22:27.040 in the dark or become fluorescent, like, hey, this guy's 0:22:27.080 --> 0:22:29.840 got some sort of spot him on his turtleneck as well, 0:22:29.880 --> 0:22:32.000 and it's glowing now and I see that right, Well, 0:22:32.040 --> 0:22:34.520 you'd have to use the correct reagent to make spot 0:22:34.560 --> 0:22:37.040 him glow under a black light. But I'm sure it's 0:22:37.040 --> 0:22:39.080 out there, right, Yeah, sure you can get it into 0:22:39.080 --> 0:22:42.439 Spencer Gifts. Um, so after you've made this, uh this 0:22:42.560 --> 0:22:46.920 initial external examinations, time to get the body nude out 0:22:46.920 --> 0:22:49.680 of the body bag. That's right, we want to weigh it. Yeah, 0:22:49.760 --> 0:22:51.760 you don't clean the body up to No, not yet, 0:22:51.920 --> 0:22:53.879 very important. You gotta leave it as is. So you 0:22:53.920 --> 0:22:57.000 make your first examination with the body fully clothed, make 0:22:57.040 --> 0:23:02.600 a second examination with the body undressed but still bloody, right, 0:23:03.440 --> 0:23:06.560 and then after that, um, you clean the body up 0:23:06.800 --> 0:23:10.760 and make a third external examination. Well, the diner will 0:23:10.760 --> 0:23:13.359 clean the body up while you go have coffee, insert 0:23:13.440 --> 0:23:17.360 the internet. You're like Rusty Gene clean that body off. 0:23:17.920 --> 0:23:23.720 And then finally after that, the cleaned naked body is 0:23:23.800 --> 0:23:28.040 placed on the autopsy table, which is I mean, everybody's 0:23:28.040 --> 0:23:30.320 seen one of these. It's a big stainless steel table 0:23:30.440 --> 0:23:33.800 with raised sides and it's slanted towards the middle with 0:23:34.040 --> 0:23:36.280