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Speaker 1: This is a production of Journalista podcast LLC and iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: When the Nicaraguan port of Corinto was bombed in October,

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Speaker 2: it was the Contrast who took the credit, but CBS

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Speaker 2: News has learned it was Americans who led the raid.

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Speaker 2: Military sources confirm it was Americans who took two boatloads

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Speaker 2: of Honduran commandos from the Salvadoran coast to Corinto to

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Speaker 2: place time bombs in the port, Americans from the CIA,

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Speaker 2: and Americans from regular military service. Publicly, the Pentagon won't

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Speaker 2: talk about those actions, and privately, the American military just

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Speaker 2: keeps doing them. Jane Wallace, CBS News to Gusigalpa, Honduras.

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Speaker 1: Welcome back to the Journalista podcasts. Cookie is becoming a

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Speaker 1: rock star for CBS. But after the CIA is exposed

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Speaker 1: mining harbors and blowing up ships in Nicaragua, folks back

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Speaker 1: home in the United States are starting to wonder what

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Speaker 1: in the hell are we doing in Central America.

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Speaker 3: The success of communism in Central America poses the threat,

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Speaker 3: but one hundred million people from Panama to the open

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Speaker 3: border on Arshall could come under the control of pro

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Speaker 3: Soviet regimes.

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Speaker 1: President Reagan made his case to the American people, but

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Speaker 1: Congress wasn't buying it. Democratic Senator Patrick Leahy called it stupid.

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Speaker 1: Republican Senator Barry Goldwater said I'm pissed off. Former President

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Speaker 1: Jimmy Carter called it disgraceful. Justin Wolfe, Tulane history professor,

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Speaker 1: explains what happened next.

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Speaker 4: In nineteen eighty two, there's an amendment put forward by

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Speaker 4: Representative Boland to a Military Appropriations Act. It's a rider.

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Speaker 4: The Democrats are in a weaker position. They don't have

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Speaker 4: the votes to outright forbid any US funding for the

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Speaker 4: Contras or US support for the Contras, but they're able

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Speaker 4: to put in limits because it's a military bill that

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Speaker 4: the Reagan administration desperately wants. Basically, they're not going to

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Speaker 4: veto it. It's a unanimously passed military appropriations bill, but

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Speaker 4: they're stuck with this. The language in the press, the

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Speaker 4: language of US officials becomes more violent, more aggressive about

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Speaker 4: the need to remove the Sananistas and the growing questions

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Speaker 4: in the US, the growing anti war movement. But I

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Speaker 4: think really importantly, the growing uncertainty that this will be

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Speaker 4: another Vietnam. There's no appetite for US interventions there's no

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Speaker 4: appetite for US involvement in a war that doesn't seem

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Speaker 4: like our war. And so in eighty three and eighty four,

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Speaker 4: the bowl And Amendment is expanded through a series of

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Speaker 4: other amendments and laws that basically limit all funding and

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Speaker 4: all overt and covert funding right including the CIA to

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Speaker 4: the contrast. And so this places the Contras in a

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Speaker 4: difficult position. They need supplies, they need new weapons, they

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Speaker 4: need ammunition, they need you name it, they need the

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Speaker 4: supplies of war. The Reagan administration, particularly members of Reagan's

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Speaker 4: National Security Council, are trying to figure out how to

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Speaker 4: get funding there that doesn't look like it's coming directly

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Speaker 4: from the US.

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Speaker 1: The Reagan administration decides to go rogue. They come up

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Speaker 1: with a secret plan to go around the Bowland Amendments,

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Speaker 1: the beginning of the Iran contrast story that would rock

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Speaker 1: the world and become the biggest scandal of the eighties.

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Speaker 1: In the meantime, Cookie is just doing work. She has

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Speaker 1: a story for Ed Bradley at sixty minutes about one

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Speaker 1: of the most badass women in Central American history. Did

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Speaker 1: you ever do any big stories with some of those

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Speaker 1: big sixty minutes people, did anyone come in and do

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Speaker 1: a story?

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Speaker 5: Oh, all the time. Don Hewett, you know he's the

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Speaker 5: creator of sixty minutes. He was the most aggressive motherfucker

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Speaker 5: to get a story. All of them were just dirty,

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Speaker 5: old fucking men. I'll fit right in. Sixty minutes rolls

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Speaker 5: on a whole different plane. It's what I used to

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Speaker 5: call working with the big boys, the elite. Sixty Minutes

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Speaker 5: wouldn't come in to just do day to day stories.

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Speaker 5: I would have to come up with something extremely interesting,

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Speaker 5: one of a kind for them to be interested. I

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Speaker 5: was always communicating with them. I developed some very good

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Speaker 5: contacts and friendships there. It's funny because Ed had a

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Speaker 5: fixation and obsession with somebody that you also have, and

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Speaker 5: that was with Nora Aga exactly. She was a lady

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Speaker 5: that came from a well to do family and educated family.

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Speaker 5: She was one of these rich kids that were in

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Speaker 5: the underground for the San Denistas, way before anybody even knew.

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Speaker 5: She was also a fighter, a warrior. You've seen pictures

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Speaker 5: that you fell in love with with her in her

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Speaker 5: uniform and always looking fabulous.

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Speaker 1: Like a fabulous badass, like.

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Speaker 5: A fabulous warrior. I called her others called her Matahari.

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Speaker 5: At least is as good as that I like to

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Speaker 5: hear it, or maybe it's too bad.

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Speaker 3: For me to hear it.

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Speaker 5: No, no, no, oh, poor friend, Dubrey.

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Speaker 6: Says that you are spy.

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Speaker 1: That was the legendary movie star Greta Garbo from the

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Speaker 1: nineteen thirty one film Matahari, who is the real Matahari,

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Speaker 1: one of the world's most notorious spies, known for her

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Speaker 1: beauty and seductive charms. Her real name was Margaretha Gertruda MacLeod,

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Speaker 1: a Dutch exotic dancer who was convicted of being a

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Speaker 1: spy for Germany during World War One. Before the war,

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Speaker 1: she had performed as Matahari several times for the Crown

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Speaker 1: Prince Wilhelm, eldest son of Kaiser Wilhelm the Second, who

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Speaker 1: was the Emperor of Germany. She was recruited by France

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Speaker 1: to seduce the Crown Prince to steal military secrets they

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Speaker 1: could use in the war. That didn't work out too well.

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Speaker 1: She did seduce him, but ended up changing sides and

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Speaker 1: spying for the Germans. She was eventually captured and executed

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Speaker 1: by firing squad. She was the original fem fatale. She

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Speaker 1: inspired dozens of books, stage plays, TV shows, and films,

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Speaker 1: as recently as twenty twenty one as a character in

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Speaker 1: The Kingsman, which grossed over one hundred and twenty five

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Speaker 1: million dollars at the box office. So, calling Nora Astorga

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Speaker 1: the Madihari of Nicaragua was both a compliment and a curse,

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Speaker 1: depending on who you listened to. But it was a

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Speaker 1: moniker that would follow her for the rest of her life.

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Speaker 5: She was Madahari because of who she was in society.

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Speaker 5: She could get in and out of things and get

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Speaker 5: information for the underground. So a spy a spy, yes.

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Speaker 5: What put her on the map was before any of this,

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Speaker 5: before the Civil War, before the revolution, before any of

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Speaker 5: those things, when the Sandinistas were still very much under

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Speaker 5: Obviously the Samosa people knew about them and tried at

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Speaker 5: every point to crush them. The plan was to kidnap

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Speaker 5: a Sumosa general, hold him hostage, hold him for ransom,

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Speaker 5: get some money out of it. I'm not quite sure,

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Speaker 5: but I don't think their intention was to kill this guy.

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Speaker 1: What was his name is?

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Speaker 5: Vega?

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Speaker 1: Perez Vega was deputy commander of Anastasio Simosa's National guard

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Speaker 1: considered one of the most brutal generals in Nicaragua, responsible

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Speaker 1: for the torture and murder of hundreds of Nicaraguans. He

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Speaker 1: was also a womanizer and went after the women he wanted,

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Speaker 1: for better or worse, whenever he felt like it. He

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Speaker 1: was a really bad man. His nickname the dog.

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Speaker 5: He actually grew up with my mother, and he had

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Speaker 5: a different nickname, remolacha, which means beat because he would

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Speaker 5: get very red in the face. So your nickname that

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Speaker 5: you discovered came years later.

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Speaker 1: And the dog in Spanish is at pedro.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 5: Yeah. Well, so Nora was with the group that kidnapped him.

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Speaker 5: It was herself and two others, and she used her

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Speaker 5: womanly whiles to set him up and hold him hostage.

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Speaker 1: Nora was a lawyer at the time and it crossed

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Speaker 1: Vegas path in the normal course of business. He decided

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Speaker 1: he wanted her, not what she wanted, but it created

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Speaker 1: an opportunity. This is Nora Astorga in her own words.

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Speaker 7: The plan was to make a date for him to

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Speaker 7: come to my house. In the house, there would be

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Speaker 7: three compagnos, one in a big closet that opened into

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Speaker 7: the main room, another in the room opposite and another

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Speaker 7: in a very small room. We had a signal. I

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Speaker 7: was to disarm him while he suspected nothing. I would

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Speaker 7: then have him totally defenseless and would hold him well.

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Speaker 7: I gave the countersign for my compagnitos to move into action.

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Speaker 1: My understanding is she was working this for a while.

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Speaker 1: It was a seduction too.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, all of this stuff had to be You couldn't

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Speaker 5: just do it because you were dealing with the ruthless regime.

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Speaker 1: And she was just sort of playing him, stringing him

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Speaker 1: along for a while, sucking him.

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Speaker 5: In absolutely, and then something went wrong.

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Speaker 7: He arrived ready to simply get on with it. No

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Speaker 7: little drinks or conversation first, none of the subtlety or

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Speaker 7: the delicacy menus from time to time. No, he just

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Speaker 7: arrived and said, here I am, let's do it.

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Speaker 5: So it began.

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Speaker 7: We went straight to the bedroom. I disarmed him and

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Speaker 7: I took off all of my outer clothes. The compans

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Speaker 7: came into the room and immobilized him. He put up qualified.

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Speaker 7: He was very strong. He began to shut to his guard,

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Speaker 7: but the guard didn't hear him. It was when I

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Speaker 7: went to the garage to get a car that they

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Speaker 7: had to kill El Perro. He resisted too much and

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Speaker 7: they had to execute him.

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Speaker 5: I remember my mother telling me, oh, one of my

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Speaker 5: childhood friends was murdered. We don't know how it happened

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Speaker 5: or who did it, because you have to understand this

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Speaker 5: is all still very underground. This isn't public knowledge. It

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Speaker 5: was years later that it came out that she was

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Speaker 5: involved with that.

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Speaker 7: I never felt guilty. The plan was to kidnap him,

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Speaker 7: but he fought back and had to be killed. It

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Speaker 7: was something you had to do for a revolutionary justice.

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Speaker 7: He had killed so many, he was a monster.

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Speaker 1: They slit his throat. His body was later found wrapped

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Speaker 1: in the Sandinista flag. A. Storica became the most wanted

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Speaker 1: woman in Nicaragua. The subject of a national manhunt, she

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Speaker 1: escaped to the Jungles and joined the Sandinista revolutionaries, where

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Speaker 1: she became a warrior and a leader in the war

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Speaker 1: against the Mosa.

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Speaker 5: The one thing the Sandinesas were good at was treating

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Speaker 5: women not only with respect, but equally. They could be

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Speaker 5: equal partners on the field, equal partners as soldiers, equal

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Speaker 5: partners on missions, and so when the Sandinistas won the revolution,

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Speaker 5: she obviously had good standing, and she had held several

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Speaker 5: high positions.

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Speaker 1: Astorga eventually became Nicaraguan Ambassador to the United Nations. She

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Speaker 1: was a controversial choice, opposed vehemently by the US government,

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Speaker 1: but she was effective, mingling with the elite and scoring

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Speaker 1: major aid packages for Nicaragua. Strident in her beliefs, always

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Speaker 1: a warrior for her country, yet always the center of

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Speaker 1: controversy and gossip. A female diplomat from Latin America at

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Speaker 1: a Security Council debates said, the moment Nora Astorga crossed

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Speaker 1: her legs, all the eyes in the room were off

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Speaker 1: the speaker and on her. One male Western ambassador said,

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Speaker 1: she wears her past like other women wear perfume. She

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Speaker 1: was one of a kind. Sixty minutes agreed.

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Speaker 5: So Ed Bradley was sort of entranced with her mystique

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Speaker 5: and everything about it, much like you are. I told

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Speaker 5: him that I could get an interview with her. Was

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Speaker 5: he interested? And he was like, tell me when and

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Speaker 5: where I'll be there. She was a very striking woman,

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Speaker 5: very intelligent. I got everything set up, Ed flew in

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Speaker 5: and we got the interview. He loved it. He brought

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Speaker 5: up her past. He brought up her present, and he

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Speaker 5: brought up what's in the future. None of us knew

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Speaker 5: at the time that she had breast cancer and she

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Speaker 5: was dying. There was not going to be much future

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Speaker 5: left for her. That evening we celebrated. Of course, we

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Speaker 5: asked Nora to join us at the hotel.

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Speaker 1: Was he flirting with her?

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Speaker 3: Oh?

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Speaker 5: Ed was a flirt Ed was a charmer. He could

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Speaker 5: charm the pants off, literally off anybody. Yeah, he was

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Speaker 5: very taken with her. You didn't see the Madahari side

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Speaker 5: of her. You could see how she was able to

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Speaker 5: do it, but you just didn't see that side of her.

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Speaker 5: You think you know people, but you don't know everything

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Speaker 5: about them.

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Speaker 1: She was tough.

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Speaker 5: She was tough, and I believe she was fighting at

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Speaker 5: the time the Port of Corinto being mined by the US,

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Speaker 5: because that was breaking we spoke of earlier the Geneva convention.

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Speaker 5: She was a tough lady. Tough lady.

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Speaker 1: When she left the party just raiged on.

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Speaker 5: Yeah. Ed could hold his own Yeah, and I was

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Speaker 5: getting producing credits in sixty minutes, which was amazing. So yeah,

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Speaker 5: it was a night to celebrate.

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Speaker 1: Do you want to say anything about having a fling ed.

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Speaker 5: And I got close.

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Speaker 6: You know.

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Speaker 5: He came back to Nicaragua a couple of times. We

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Speaker 5: would also see each other in New York and he

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Speaker 5: was also a big jazz Fest fan, so when he

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Speaker 5: would come here we would have deluxe treatment. It was

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Speaker 5: always fun to run with Ed, working or not working. Yeah,

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Speaker 5: we had a fling. He was fun. He was interesting,

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Speaker 5: but again and maybe he was a little more interested

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Speaker 5: in me than I was in him.

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Speaker 1: Interesting and not surprising either. Yeah, after the break, we'll

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Speaker 1: meet the man in Cookie's life, and after forty years,

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Speaker 1: he has a lot to say about it. We'll be

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Speaker 1: right back. Welcome back. We've talked a lot about Cookie's

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Speaker 1: many adventures, some crazy, some scary, some just plain ridiculous.

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Speaker 1: But now we meet the man in her life, her

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Speaker 1: forever dude. Some when you met back in her missus

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Speaker 1: scarface days. Here we are back again with the beautiful

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Speaker 1: and talented Cookie hood, and today we have a very

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Speaker 1: special guest, her son Patrick, who everyone knows is Chico.

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Speaker 6: Hey, Steve, thanks for having me.

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Speaker 1: We know each other a little bit, but I'd like

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Speaker 1: to know what it was like growing up in a

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Speaker 1: hotel suite in Monagua with this crazy woman in the

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Speaker 1: middle of a war.

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Speaker 8: You know, here in other people's childhoods and how they

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Speaker 8: grew up, and I always think, man, that was not

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Speaker 8: my child. I did not have that same experience. It

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Speaker 8: was different. Instead of having a front yard in a backyard,

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Speaker 8: I had a hotel lobby in a pool area.

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Speaker 5: You know, so your friends used to call Yeah.

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Speaker 8: My friends used to call it a chi Cho's big house.

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Speaker 8: So it was it was interesting, you know, because my

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Speaker 8: friends can come over and they knew that, you know,

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Speaker 8: we could stay up all night.

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Speaker 9: What was it?

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Speaker 5: One rule though?

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Speaker 6: What there are no rules.

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Speaker 5: There's only one rule in this big house. There are

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Speaker 5: no rules. And the kids friends would all be like, wow,

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Speaker 5: your mom is cool, and they could do whatever the

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Speaker 5: fun they wanted. But that did Chiecho was just another day.

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Speaker 8: It was a great experience in that piece, but the

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Speaker 8: pieces that, you know, maybe fell through the cracks where

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Speaker 8: you know, maybe at times, you know, I loved having

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Speaker 8: a best friend, but you know, at times I needed

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Speaker 8: a mother as well, and she just wasn't good at that.

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Speaker 1: You grew up with this crazy, amazing person. Her mission

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Speaker 1: to party, her driving force was to party. And she

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Speaker 1: became a journalist to party and she changed the world

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Speaker 1: in her way.

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Speaker 6: Party party.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that sounds really fun and cool. Then you realize

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Speaker 1: that's your mom.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 8: There was a few times where I would encounter her

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Speaker 8: or her coworkers, you know, maybe like out of their minds,

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Speaker 8: messed up. Maybe she's like going off the deep end

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Speaker 8: and what her perception of what reality is at the moment,

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Speaker 8: you know. And same thing with some of her coworkers.

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Speaker 8: I remember there being like lines, yeah, lines or weed

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Speaker 8: or pipes or whatever everywhere around me, and because you're

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Speaker 8: a kid, you see them, but you don't make two

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Speaker 8: sense of it. Obviously I didn't grab anything or do

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Speaker 8: anything like that, but it was all, yeah, it was

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Speaker 8: all nearby, and I was interacting with all these people

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Speaker 8: that are completely fucked up, out of their minds, you know.

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Speaker 5: So I used to think you were from the CIA,

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Speaker 5: and he was seven. Look at his eyes, those are cameras.

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Speaker 5: That's the ciabe. He's seven. He's seven years old. He's

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Speaker 5: not from the CIA.

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Speaker 8: From an early age, I knew what drugs were and

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Speaker 8: how they affected people. It's funny. It wasn't until I

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Speaker 8: was in high school going through a DARE class that

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Speaker 8: I realized that all these things were bad.

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Speaker 1: Your mom's friends, some of these people that she ran

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Speaker 1: with at the time, were they like uncles to you? Basically?

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Speaker 6: Yeah, it was.

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Speaker 5: They were all like buddies.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 8: Again, that's one of the things that was really awesome

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Speaker 8: about how she raised me was, you know, she treated

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Speaker 8: me like an equal. So even though I knew she

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Speaker 8: was my mom, you know, I could make fun of her,

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Speaker 8: or I could make jokes and feel comfortable around her.

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Speaker 8: It was the same for her crew and her friends.

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Speaker 8: Because of the way she treated me, they would do

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Speaker 8: the same thing.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 8: So maybe some of the camera guys and some of

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Speaker 8: the crew guys are a little tougher, you know what

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Speaker 8: I mean.

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Speaker 5: Because he was the mascot, you know.

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Speaker 6: Man, there were little shits, man.

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Speaker 5: Like it would wrap them up, Gaffer tam Man and

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Speaker 5: he would be hopping around. What time? This was a

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Speaker 5: great story. I took him to Bill Counsuler, you know.

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Speaker 5: William Kunstler, the famous attorney.

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Speaker 1: William Kunstler was the former director of the American Civil

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Speaker 1: Liberties Union the ACLU. He made his name defending the indefensible,

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Speaker 1: taking on unwinnable cases.

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Speaker 10: He was one of the most well known lawyers and

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Speaker 10: civil rights activists of the twentieth century. William Kunstler defended

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Speaker 10: the Chicago Seven and counted Martin Luther King, Junior, Malcolm X,

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Speaker 10: and comedian Lenny Bruce among his clients.

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Speaker 1: The New York Times called him the most hated and

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Speaker 1: loved lawyer in America.

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Speaker 5: Well, I took him to Bill's house for barbecue at

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Speaker 5: the same moment the JDL is outside protesting and wanting

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Speaker 5: to kill him because he was defending the first World

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Speaker 5: Trade Center bombers. You remember those first ones. Yeah, And

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Speaker 5: so even when we weren't in Nick Roger in the war,

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Speaker 5: anywhere we would go, this would be.

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Speaker 6: His trouble was finding us. Man.

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Speaker 8: I just remember, like we're eating and I'm like looking

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Speaker 8: at and so I'm like, what are all these people?

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Speaker 5: He just like, why are those people protesting and angry

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Speaker 5: at us? Why do they want to hurt us? Cookie?

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Speaker 5: And like we had to book and get out the

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Speaker 5: back door and run away. His life was like that,

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Speaker 5: anywhere and everywhere that we went.

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Speaker 1: Were you aware of the danger? Were you afraid for

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Speaker 1: your mom? Were you afraid for the world you have?

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Speaker 8: I always knew what her job was and I understood

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Speaker 8: the dangers because I would see news footage being spliced

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Speaker 8: in front of me in their studio in the hotel.

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Speaker 8: It didn't really hit home until she would get into

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Speaker 8: these situations where I'd be like, hey, where's my mom,

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Speaker 8: And they're like, well, she can't come home right now

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Speaker 8: because of this, or she can't come home because of that.

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Speaker 8: She would never hide anything from me, and you know,

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Speaker 8: I could be five years old and she's telling me

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Speaker 8: the cold, hard.

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Speaker 6: Facts, whether I understood it or not, you know, but uh.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well Cookie, did you ever have a moment where

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Speaker 1: you thought what am I doing to this kid?

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Speaker 6: Every day?

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Speaker 5: Actually? You know, you'd think that I would have thought that,

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Speaker 5: But everything was just so natural, just things that most

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Speaker 5: people would have just been horrified. We just took it

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Speaker 5: and stride was normal. I guess it was our normal.

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Speaker 5: And if we wouldn't have been in a war, we

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Speaker 5: would have been in some other crazy situation. So I

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Speaker 5: did try to hide certain aspects of the war from him,

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Speaker 5: you know, I wouldn't expose him to dead bodies or

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Speaker 5: people blown up. There were times when he had to

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Speaker 5: confront that kind of shit. I guess at the time,

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Speaker 5: I didn't realize how that could fuck him up or something,

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Speaker 5: which I guess just having me as a mother would

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Speaker 5: have been enough to fuck him up. I never really

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Speaker 5: felt guilty about putting him in those situations. My guilt

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Speaker 5: was more of I'm not always there for him. I'm

385
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Speaker 5: not a great mom, or a mom not on top

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Speaker 5: of his homework, or where's he going, which in later

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Speaker 5: years I felt guilty about. I didn't feel guilty at

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Speaker 5: the time because I was too caught up in everything

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Speaker 5: that was going on. The funny thing is that he

390
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Speaker 5: was everywhere, and not just myself, but all journalists, all

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Speaker 5: crews just took him for granted. He was just chi

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Speaker 5: cho hanging out. He lived in a bubble within a

393
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Speaker 5: bubble within a war. He was probably in a lot

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Speaker 5: more danger than we would care to admit or realize

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Speaker 5: at any given moment. I guess that's my bad.

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Speaker 8: The biggest takeaway from it was being ready for anything,

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Speaker 8: and you know, whether as positive or negative. And it

398
00:21:30,359 --> 00:21:33,239
Speaker 8: really got me to be in touch with people, you know,

399
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Speaker 8: whether they were you know, somebody that was really important

400
00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:39,480
Speaker 8: or treated as a VIP, or you know, maybe it's

401
00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:42,399
Speaker 8: just a poor person that's begging in the street. You know,

402
00:21:42,440 --> 00:21:46,280
Speaker 8: my mom always taught me to never differentiate between class

403
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Speaker 8: and always treat people equally. I had friends these parents

404
00:21:49,440 --> 00:21:52,240
Speaker 8: are maids, and then I had friends whose parents were,

405
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Speaker 8: you know, national diplomats.

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Speaker 1: When did you realize your mom was up to something

407
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Speaker 1: that was pretty fucking amazing.

408
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Speaker 8: I would interact with my schoolmates, and I would hear

409
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Speaker 8: what their parents were doing and what their parents' job

410
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Speaker 8: was like, and none of them sounded like my mom's,

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Speaker 8: you know. And I would see different people that you know,

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Speaker 8: would recognize from film or TV or news and be like,

413
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Speaker 8: why what.

414
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Speaker 6: Are they doing here? You know?

415
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Speaker 8: And it turned into this thing where I was like, Wow,

416
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Speaker 8: I think my mom's got something going on here, you know.

417
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Speaker 6: So it's interesting.

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Speaker 1: Well, let's get into some of that, because that's kind

419
00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:26,040
Speaker 1: of the one of the fun parts of this whole

420
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Speaker 1: journey is that hotel Suite became kind of like party central,

421
00:22:29,440 --> 00:22:32,200
Speaker 1: so everybody who was anybody was coming through there at

422
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Speaker 1: some point or another. So let's talk a little bit

423
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Speaker 1: about that. Like, what was your first essay celebrity encounter.

424
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Speaker 8: Well, you know, one of my favorite anecdotes was the

425
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Speaker 8: time I met Daryl Hannah.

426
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Speaker 1: I first saw Daryl Hannah cart wheeling into one of

427
00:22:45,080 --> 00:22:48,240
Speaker 1: my top ten films, The Original Blade Runner starring Harrison

428
00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:51,160
Speaker 1: Ford and Rucker Howard. But you might also remember her

429
00:22:51,160 --> 00:22:55,520
Speaker 1: from the tear jerker Steel Magnolias, where Tarantino's kill Bill.

430
00:22:56,080 --> 00:22:58,639
Speaker 1: She was the badass blonde wearing the black pirate patch

431
00:22:58,680 --> 00:22:59,280
Speaker 1: on her eye.

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Speaker 8: It was funny. My mom introduced me to her, and

433
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Speaker 8: I was pretty young. I think I might have I

434
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Speaker 8: might have been three or something like that, and one

435
00:23:05,920 --> 00:23:08,440
Speaker 8: of my favorite movies at the time was Splash, you know,

436
00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:11,119
Speaker 8: the way for me to associate with who this person

437
00:23:11,119 --> 00:23:12,600
Speaker 8: I was meeting. My mom was like, hey, this is

438
00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:14,080
Speaker 8: the mermaid, you know, and I was like, oh, what

439
00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:14,760
Speaker 8: with a mermaid?

440
00:23:14,840 --> 00:23:15,159
Speaker 6: Huh.

441
00:23:15,240 --> 00:23:17,639
Speaker 8: My first reaction was to go find a bucket of

442
00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:18,959
Speaker 8: water so I could throw it on her.

443
00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:21,880
Speaker 6: My mom had to stop me from all the.

444
00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:24,639
Speaker 5: Way dragging a bucket of water. I'm like, where are

445
00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:28,600
Speaker 5: you going. Water was a very valuable thing at the time.

446
00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:30,600
Speaker 5: He goes, I'm going to go throwing on the.

447
00:23:30,560 --> 00:23:32,239
Speaker 6: Mermaids, trying to help the mermaid out.

448
00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:35,879
Speaker 5: Yeah. I was like, no, it's not like that. So

449
00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:39,080
Speaker 5: for him, he had blurred lines, you know, and it

450
00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:43,840
Speaker 5: wasn't just with movie stars and TV stars, with rock stars, directors,

451
00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:46,760
Speaker 5: prominent politicians from other countries.

452
00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:50,239
Speaker 1: You met Jimmy Carter, and I know the Cookie had

453
00:23:50,240 --> 00:23:52,600
Speaker 1: a pretty special relationship with them, with yours as well.

454
00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:57,679
Speaker 5: His relationship was hit the Secret Service because they would

455
00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:00,600
Speaker 5: try to chase him down the hall and he would

456
00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:03,680
Speaker 5: just go run straight to mister Jimmy and miss Rosalind.

457
00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:06,320
Speaker 8: Well, you're putting the Secret Service against a kid that

458
00:24:06,440 --> 00:24:08,560
Speaker 8: knows the hotel inside and out, you know. So they're

459
00:24:08,560 --> 00:24:10,480
Speaker 8: trying to chase me and they can't catch me because

460
00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:12,720
Speaker 8: I know the intricacies of this place, you know. So

461
00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:16,560
Speaker 8: it was really cool though. He was a super super

462
00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:19,280
Speaker 8: gracious man. Same thing for his wife. You know, they're

463
00:24:19,320 --> 00:24:20,439
Speaker 8: really really nice people.

464
00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:23,119
Speaker 1: Jimmy Carter was in Monogua to monitor of the election,

465
00:24:23,359 --> 00:24:25,400
Speaker 1: one of the many things that shaped his legacy.

466
00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:28,479
Speaker 6: They stayed on our same floor, which was awesome.

467
00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:32,800
Speaker 5: Presidential suite was on our personal suite floor and the

468
00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:35,480
Speaker 5: CBS News suite's offices.

469
00:24:35,720 --> 00:24:38,320
Speaker 8: They were really really nice, really down to earth, and

470
00:24:38,680 --> 00:24:40,600
Speaker 8: he made it a point to make sure to talk

471
00:24:40,600 --> 00:24:43,560
Speaker 8: to everybody, and you know, it made everybody feel special,

472
00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:46,439
Speaker 8: whether it's talking to her whether he's talking to the

473
00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:47,680
Speaker 8: person that's bringing him a water.

474
00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:51,040
Speaker 5: One of the Secret Services one called the front desk

475
00:24:51,160 --> 00:24:54,720
Speaker 5: and said, there's a child running a monk in this hotel.

476
00:24:55,080 --> 00:24:57,800
Speaker 5: He's lost. Who knows what could happen to him. The

477
00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:00,159
Speaker 5: guy at the front desk said, could you describe that

478
00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:03,120
Speaker 5: child to me? And they described Chicho and the guy

479
00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:06,399
Speaker 5: started laughing. He goes, sir, that child could take you

480
00:25:06,480 --> 00:25:09,040
Speaker 5: on a tour of the hotel he lives here. The

481
00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:12,120
Speaker 5: Secret Service they had their hands full with him because

482
00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:14,840
Speaker 5: they were on our floor. They're on my turf, they're

483
00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:16,159
Speaker 5: on his turf. Yeah.

484
00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:18,639
Speaker 8: One of the people that I met that maybe I

485
00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:21,840
Speaker 8: didn't appreciate back then, but you know, definitely appreciate now

486
00:25:22,080 --> 00:25:23,720
Speaker 8: is Oliver Stone.

487
00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:26,399
Speaker 1: That's the four time Oscar winner and director of films

488
00:25:26,440 --> 00:25:29,719
Speaker 1: like Platoon, Wall Street and JFK. Just in the neighborhood

489
00:25:29,760 --> 00:25:33,000
Speaker 1: making the film Salvador, about another Central American cluster fuck

490
00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:34,399
Speaker 1: the United States was involved in.

491
00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:37,520
Speaker 8: You know, he's an incredible director, and I remember him

492
00:25:37,560 --> 00:25:40,080
Speaker 8: just having these giant hands. I got to go to

493
00:25:40,119 --> 00:25:44,280
Speaker 8: the Natural Born Killers anniversary screening two years ago, lo

494
00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:46,920
Speaker 8: and behold, he was sitting like three seats away from

495
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:49,080
Speaker 8: me behind me, and I got a chance to meet

496
00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:51,879
Speaker 8: him again and we talked about the Nicaragua experience for

497
00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:54,040
Speaker 8: a little bit, which was really interesting.

498
00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:57,240
Speaker 1: Then Cookie and Chicho met a little, tiny ass kicking

499
00:25:57,320 --> 00:25:59,119
Speaker 1: nun mother Teresa.

500
00:25:59,440 --> 00:26:01,280
Speaker 5: We were told she was going to show up at

501
00:26:01,280 --> 00:26:03,479
Speaker 5: this school and she was going to meet with some

502
00:26:03,520 --> 00:26:06,119
Speaker 5: religious leaders there. Since it was out of school, I

503
00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:08,679
Speaker 5: brought a cheajolo, and I remember we were told to

504
00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:12,360
Speaker 5: set up on a balcony overlooking the courtyard.

505
00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:15,000
Speaker 1: She received permission from the Pope to start her own

506
00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:17,800
Speaker 1: order in Calcutta, India, where she devoted her life to

507
00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:20,520
Speaker 1: caring for the poorest of the poor, even receiving the

508
00:26:20,520 --> 00:26:22,840
Speaker 1: Nobel Peace Prize in nineteen seventy nine.

509
00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:29,120
Speaker 9: Wet us all together, thank God for this beautiful ocation

510
00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:35,320
Speaker 9: where we can all together proclaim the joy of springing peace,

511
00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:41,760
Speaker 9: the joy of loving one another, and the joy acknowledging

512
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:46,520
Speaker 9: that the poorest of the poor are our brothers and sisters.

513
00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:50,600
Speaker 5: I'm not a religious person at all, And I remember

514
00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:53,320
Speaker 5: we're setting up with the camera crew that did the

515
00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:57,160
Speaker 5: opening shots of that movie you like Salvador, and all

516
00:26:57,160 --> 00:27:00,520
Speaker 5: of a sudden, I just felt something and I turned

517
00:27:00,560 --> 00:27:03,480
Speaker 5: to Domingo and I said, do you feel that? He goes,

518
00:27:03,560 --> 00:27:05,560
Speaker 5: what are you talking about? I said, I just feel

519
00:27:05,720 --> 00:27:09,680
Speaker 5: something in me. And she was walking in at that moment,

520
00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:13,399
Speaker 5: into the courtyard. I looked down at her. She looked

521
00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:16,160
Speaker 5: up at me. She had no reason to look up.

522
00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:20,080
Speaker 5: I'm like, oh, wow, okay, this is weird. We filmed

523
00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:22,520
Speaker 5: whatever it is she was doing in the courtyard, meeting

524
00:27:22,600 --> 00:27:26,639
Speaker 5: with these religious leaders, and then we had asked to

525
00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:29,880
Speaker 5: meet with her for ten minutes. She had already said

526
00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:33,040
Speaker 5: no to all the journalists for some reason. Whoever we

527
00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:35,480
Speaker 5: asked to get through to her. They got us the

528
00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:38,800
Speaker 5: ten minutes. So we packed up our gear from the balcony,

529
00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:42,600
Speaker 5: went in into a room on the inside. She's sitting

530
00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:44,639
Speaker 5: there and I went up to her, you know, to

531
00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:48,119
Speaker 5: introduce myself, and I said, I'm cooking from CBS News.

532
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:50,840
Speaker 5: We're the ones going to interview you. And she was

533
00:27:50,920 --> 00:27:56,800
Speaker 5: just this tiny, fragile little person. She looked up at

534
00:27:56,840 --> 00:27:59,920
Speaker 5: me and she said to me, can I tell you something?

535
00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:04,000
Speaker 5: And I said, sure, ask me anything. She says, you

536
00:28:04,280 --> 00:28:07,439
Speaker 5: and your generation thought that you guys were here to

537
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:10,720
Speaker 5: change the world. She says, maybe what you should have

538
00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:13,760
Speaker 5: been thinking, and you still could think that maybe you

539
00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:18,280
Speaker 5: cookie are just here to change one person's life, and

540
00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:22,040
Speaker 5: maybe that life is your life. And I'm just so

541
00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:27,200
Speaker 5: blown away. I'm like, what the fuck that just happened here?

542
00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:32,080
Speaker 5: I mean, I've got goosebumps. I'm at a loss for words.

543
00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:36,000
Speaker 5: Where if you know me, that never happens. It took

544
00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:39,120
Speaker 5: me a couple of minutes to gather myself and I

545
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:40,880
Speaker 5: turned to the crew and I said, yeah, we're going

546
00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:43,720
Speaker 5: to start the interview now. Might not have been my

547
00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:47,720
Speaker 5: best interview because I was just so thrown off by

548
00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:51,240
Speaker 5: what she said. She affected me more than the Pope

549
00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:53,800
Speaker 5: or anybody else that I had ever met, and I

550
00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:58,200
Speaker 5: interviewed the Pope three times spiritually, she was the one.

551
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:00,400
Speaker 6: She definitely had an energy her.

552
00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:01,920
Speaker 8: I got a chance to meet her, and she was

553
00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:04,640
Speaker 8: really really sweet, you know, Like I met her and

554
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:07,640
Speaker 8: she just like cupped my face with her hands, and

555
00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:10,680
Speaker 8: that's like what I mainly remember about her. She definitely

556
00:29:10,720 --> 00:29:13,440
Speaker 8: had an energy about her. I'm not even a religious person,

557
00:29:13,480 --> 00:29:14,960
Speaker 8: and I was like, man, she was amazing.

558
00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:18,400
Speaker 5: Stop somebody like me and tell me something like that.

559
00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:21,200
Speaker 6: I was like, whoa mind blown huh?

560
00:29:21,280 --> 00:29:25,560
Speaker 5: Yeah, what the fuck? Just happened. Yeah, that was one

561
00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:27,840
Speaker 5: of the better moments of my career.

562
00:29:28,280 --> 00:29:28,640
Speaker 11: Wow.

563
00:29:30,600 --> 00:29:35,040
Speaker 1: In twenty sixteen, Mother Teresa became a saint, so Cookie

564
00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:41,040
Speaker 1: had a spiritual experience. Great timing because she's about to

565
00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:51,120
Speaker 1: face her own death. We'll be right back, Welcome back.

566
00:29:53,120 --> 00:29:55,360
Speaker 1: When I was a kid, I used to wonder if

567
00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:58,080
Speaker 1: you were in an elevator and it was falling, you

568
00:29:58,160 --> 00:30:03,400
Speaker 1: just jump right before it crashed and survive. Cookies about

569
00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:06,160
Speaker 1: to find out sort of.

570
00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:12,240
Speaker 5: Before journalists could go into the boonies, into the jungles,

571
00:30:12,560 --> 00:30:18,120
Speaker 5: they always had to get permissions and authorizations from whichever

572
00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:23,280
Speaker 5: commandante's region you were going into, and nothing happens without

573
00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:29,720
Speaker 5: his permission knowledge whatever. This was Commandante Roberto Calderon. We

574
00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:34,440
Speaker 5: needed permission to go into his region because we were

575
00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:37,640
Speaker 5: going to go on a junket with the soldiers, and

576
00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:40,920
Speaker 5: I was going to try to bullshit my way into

577
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 5: getting his okay, because a lot of times journalists would

578
00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:47,520
Speaker 5: go to these regions, go to the commandante in charge,

579
00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:50,400
Speaker 5: and then be turned away. So I knew I was

580
00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:53,840
Speaker 5: going to have to use all my weaponry to get

581
00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:59,200
Speaker 5: this permission. Well, we could call it charm bullshitting, whatever

582
00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:01,080
Speaker 5: you want to call it. And we get to the

583
00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:04,840
Speaker 5: military base. I asked to speak to the commandante. Well,

584
00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:07,040
Speaker 5: do you have an appointment? No, I don't. I'm with

585
00:31:07,160 --> 00:31:10,880
Speaker 5: CBS News. We want to get permission to go on

586
00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:14,520
Speaker 5: a junket with the soldiers. And he says, well, we're

587
00:31:14,560 --> 00:31:18,120
Speaker 5: not giving permissions right now. Can you just call the

588
00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:21,280
Speaker 5: commandante and I would just like to meet with him.

589
00:31:21,560 --> 00:31:23,040
Speaker 5: It's not going to do any good. He's not going

590
00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:26,120
Speaker 5: to give you permission. I'm not leaving until you get

591
00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:29,280
Speaker 5: the commandante for me. So we waited an hour or

592
00:31:29,360 --> 00:31:32,920
Speaker 5: so and we got the meeting. He was very kind

593
00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:36,040
Speaker 5: and I explained to him what we needed his permission

594
00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:39,360
Speaker 5: to go in and he says, well, I think my

595
00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:42,280
Speaker 5: guy's already told you that we're not giving permissions at

596
00:31:42,320 --> 00:31:45,800
Speaker 5: this time. I said, it's so important to us, you know,

597
00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 5: we need to show what is going on in this war.

598
00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:54,360
Speaker 5: And he says, I can't protect you. I promise you

599
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:57,720
Speaker 5: we will get the story and we won't get killed.

600
00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:02,280
Speaker 5: He acquiesced and he gave us permission. So the first

601
00:32:02,320 --> 00:32:06,280
Speaker 5: part of the mission, we had to be flown in

602
00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:10,720
Speaker 5: a two propeller plane to the base in the jungle.

603
00:32:10,920 --> 00:32:13,080
Speaker 5: That is where we were going to meet up with

604
00:32:13,360 --> 00:32:15,760
Speaker 5: helicopters that were going to take us in to meet

605
00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:18,520
Speaker 5: with the soldiers. So we're like, great, we'll get in

606
00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:21,200
Speaker 5: this two propeller plane. It's just myself and the crew.

607
00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:26,040
Speaker 1: The military pilot was the sister of Nora Astorga, you know,

608
00:32:26,320 --> 00:32:29,400
Speaker 1: the Matahari of Nicaragua. Small world.

609
00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:34,240
Speaker 5: I'm standing behind the plane as pilot Astorga turns it on.

610
00:32:35,680 --> 00:32:40,120
Speaker 5: The exhaust from it was so strong it lifted me

611
00:32:40,360 --> 00:32:45,240
Speaker 5: up so high like I was levitating. Then it dropped me.

612
00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:49,520
Speaker 5: The pilot realized what was going on, she turned the

613
00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:52,600
Speaker 5: vehicle off, which is what caused me to fall. She

614
00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:57,520
Speaker 5: knew she had messed up. I was severely wounded. I

615
00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:01,040
Speaker 5: could feel that my whole body had just been run

616
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:04,160
Speaker 5: over by a truck. It felt like I knew I

617
00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:07,120
Speaker 5: was going to be in trouble and probably not in

618
00:33:07,160 --> 00:33:10,200
Speaker 5: good shape to go on this ten day junket walking

619
00:33:10,360 --> 00:33:12,880
Speaker 5: in the jungles. They're still going to take us to

620
00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:16,000
Speaker 5: the military base and have a doctor look at me there.

621
00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:18,680
Speaker 5: So we go on the two propeller plane. We get

622
00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:21,720
Speaker 5: to this base. I think it was called Nueva Guinea.

623
00:33:21,800 --> 00:33:25,360
Speaker 5: It was another region Immediately, a doctor from the base

624
00:33:25,440 --> 00:33:27,640
Speaker 5: looks at me and he says to the camera crew,

625
00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:32,280
Speaker 5: she cannot go on this junket with you guys. Kmatomas

626
00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:35,920
Speaker 5: had formed all over my legs, my body. I was

627
00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:39,880
Speaker 5: one big hematoma and they just send me to a

628
00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:45,080
Speaker 5: cot to go to sleep. Unbeknownst to myself, they're getting

629
00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:49,040
Speaker 5: the helicopter ready that's gonna take the crew and originally

630
00:33:49,080 --> 00:33:52,360
Speaker 5: gonna take me deeper into the jungle to meet with

631
00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:56,040
Speaker 5: the platoon that I'm going with. The doctor had not

632
00:33:56,200 --> 00:34:00,280
Speaker 5: left instructions to anybody. They wake me up, they put

633
00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:03,160
Speaker 5: me on the helicopter with the crew and here I

634
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:07,080
Speaker 5: am going deeper into the jungle to go into this junket,

635
00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:10,040
Speaker 5: and I'm so out of it, I'm not even saying anything.

636
00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:13,319
Speaker 5: And then they dump us, they leave us there. I

637
00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:15,640
Speaker 5: gotta suck it up. And you have to remember, when

638
00:34:15,640 --> 00:34:18,920
Speaker 5: I go on these junkets, I'm usually the only female.

639
00:34:19,239 --> 00:34:23,000
Speaker 5: I can't be complaining and whining and saying, oh, I

640
00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:27,600
Speaker 5: gotta be as strong as they are. The crew realizes

641
00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:30,279
Speaker 5: I'm in trouble. They're going to be in trouble if

642
00:34:30,320 --> 00:34:33,120
Speaker 5: I can't handle myself. And it was a tough one.

643
00:34:33,760 --> 00:34:36,960
Speaker 5: After ten days, it's time to be picked up and

644
00:34:37,040 --> 00:34:40,960
Speaker 5: taken back to civilization. So a helicopter comes to pick

645
00:34:41,000 --> 00:34:43,680
Speaker 5: us up. We get loaded on. We're all relieved. We're

646
00:34:43,680 --> 00:34:45,120
Speaker 5: going back to civilization.

647
00:34:45,719 --> 00:34:48,000
Speaker 1: The helicopter takes off with Cookie the crew and a

648
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:49,719
Speaker 1: couple doesn't sand Anisa soldiers.

649
00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:53,359
Speaker 5: We were in a Russian helicopter because the Russians are

650
00:34:53,360 --> 00:34:57,920
Speaker 5: the ones helping the Sandinistans. The Russian helicopters were famous

651
00:34:57,920 --> 00:35:01,640
Speaker 5: for two things. They had no p dejective ceilings around

652
00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:05,800
Speaker 5: their gas tanks, and in this particular helicopter, they're carrying

653
00:35:06,040 --> 00:35:10,399
Speaker 5: extra tanks of unsealed fuel. This does not bode well.

654
00:35:10,880 --> 00:35:13,719
Speaker 5: We had taken off. I don't know how far up

655
00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:16,520
Speaker 5: we were. All I know is that we were up

656
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:22,640
Speaker 5: in the air. I heard three somethings. I looked at

657
00:35:22,680 --> 00:35:24,760
Speaker 5: one soldier and I said, that's not a good sound,

658
00:35:24,880 --> 00:35:27,719
Speaker 5: is it? And he went white and he said, no,

659
00:35:27,880 --> 00:35:30,359
Speaker 5: we're going down. And I said, what do you mean?

660
00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:33,799
Speaker 5: We're going down? And then the other one's right, we're

661
00:35:33,840 --> 00:35:38,120
Speaker 5: gonna die. And then we started to go down. If

662
00:35:38,160 --> 00:35:40,120
Speaker 5: it had been a surface to air missile, we wouldn't

663
00:35:40,120 --> 00:35:42,520
Speaker 5: be here talking to you. We would have been blown

664
00:35:42,600 --> 00:35:49,200
Speaker 5: up midair. This was some lonely, fucking inexperienced soldier that

665
00:35:49,360 --> 00:35:54,160
Speaker 5: shot us down. Thank god. Everyone says that thing about

666
00:35:54,520 --> 00:35:57,319
Speaker 5: you know, your whole life flashes in front of you,

667
00:35:57,520 --> 00:36:01,040
Speaker 5: and that didn't happen to me. All I kept saying

668
00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:05,440
Speaker 5: was you stupid, fucking bitch. You are finally in a

669
00:36:05,520 --> 00:36:09,759
Speaker 5: situation you cannot talk yourself out of. You can't run

670
00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:13,279
Speaker 5: yourself out of it, you can't will yourself out of this.

671
00:36:13,840 --> 00:36:16,640
Speaker 5: Through the years, that was the worst story to cover.

672
00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:20,320
Speaker 5: Helicopter and plane crashes. We called them in the business

673
00:36:20,360 --> 00:36:24,520
Speaker 5: crispy critters because they would just be burned or pieces

674
00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:28,840
Speaker 5: of meat here and there. I'm fucked. I'm gonna be

675
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:29,720
Speaker 5: a crispy cretter.

676
00:36:30,840 --> 00:36:33,920
Speaker 1: So it's spinning around, spinning around, You're gonna crash.

677
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:38,160
Speaker 5: It's gonna crash in a valley, which is even worse.

678
00:36:38,680 --> 00:36:41,359
Speaker 5: I decide I'm gonna do like the movies. I'm gonna

679
00:36:41,400 --> 00:36:43,760
Speaker 5: get to that door and I'm gonna jump out before

680
00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:46,799
Speaker 5: we hit the ground. The camera crew was right behind me.

681
00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:50,440
Speaker 5: I jumped out still mid air. They jumped out.

682
00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:54,000
Speaker 1: They hit the ground hard, severely injured. Helicopter filled with

683
00:36:54,080 --> 00:36:55,600
Speaker 1: soldiers spins toward the ground.

684
00:36:55,840 --> 00:36:58,759
Speaker 5: All I know is I've got to run and just

685
00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:01,920
Speaker 5: run and not look back. But where do I have

686
00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:05,280
Speaker 5: to run? Upwards? To get out of the valley.

687
00:37:05,600 --> 00:37:08,520
Speaker 1: The helicopter crashes into the valley, exploding in flames.

688
00:37:11,480 --> 00:37:15,560
Speaker 5: So I'm climbing and I'm climbing and I'm climbing, and

689
00:37:15,600 --> 00:37:18,560
Speaker 5: as I get to the top, I realize I can't

690
00:37:18,640 --> 00:37:22,400
Speaker 5: take one more minute of this. I can't make it

691
00:37:22,440 --> 00:37:25,239
Speaker 5: to the top. And all of a sudden comes a

692
00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:29,680
Speaker 5: hand from above and somebody lifts me up and saves me.

693
00:37:30,360 --> 00:37:32,600
Speaker 5: And it was one of the soldiers that we had

694
00:37:32,640 --> 00:37:35,520
Speaker 5: been with on the ten day junket. They saw what

695
00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:39,359
Speaker 5: had happened. At that point, I don't realize that they're

696
00:37:39,400 --> 00:37:43,640
Speaker 5: getting in touch with Commandante Roberto Calderon, letting him know

697
00:37:43,680 --> 00:37:48,439
Speaker 5: what's going on. He's going to send not one, not two.

698
00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:53,000
Speaker 5: He's going to send three helicopters, one for each of us,

699
00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:56,839
Speaker 5: because at this point he doesn't know if there's more

700
00:37:57,120 --> 00:37:59,640
Speaker 5: attacks that are going to happen, and he doesn't want

701
00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:03,120
Speaker 5: all of us on one helicopter to be shot at

702
00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:03,800
Speaker 5: and killed.

703
00:38:05,040 --> 00:38:07,600
Speaker 1: And at the same time, there are contraus soldiers rushing

704
00:38:07,640 --> 00:38:10,840
Speaker 1: to the crash. There's no time to waste.

705
00:38:11,360 --> 00:38:13,879
Speaker 5: We're in a spot that's full of trees. I can

706
00:38:13,920 --> 00:38:19,080
Speaker 5: see the soldiers with their machetes chopping down trees, making

707
00:38:19,120 --> 00:38:23,000
Speaker 5: a clearing for all these three helicopters to land. Three

708
00:38:23,040 --> 00:38:27,200
Speaker 5: helicopters come, they take us away. To this day, I

709
00:38:27,280 --> 00:38:31,000
Speaker 5: have to thank that Comandante for saving my life. By

710
00:38:31,040 --> 00:38:36,280
Speaker 5: the time we got into Monogua the capitol, CBS already

711
00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:39,839
Speaker 5: had medevac jets waiting for us to take the three

712
00:38:39,880 --> 00:38:43,480
Speaker 5: of us to Miami. We were all injured. We had

713
00:38:43,520 --> 00:38:48,600
Speaker 5: internal injuries, we had outward injuries. And again CBS came through.

714
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:51,920
Speaker 5: They always took care of their journalists, got us out

715
00:38:51,960 --> 00:38:55,640
Speaker 5: of there. God us medevac to Miami. We spent about

716
00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:58,440
Speaker 5: four to six weeks recovering in Miami.

717
00:38:58,840 --> 00:39:01,200
Speaker 1: By the way, this is where Teacho story kicks in.

718
00:39:02,040 --> 00:39:04,040
Speaker 1: And that must have been terrifying. How did you hear

719
00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:05,759
Speaker 1: about it? How did it go down for you?

720
00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:08,400
Speaker 8: Anytime that she was going to cover something that would

721
00:39:08,560 --> 00:39:11,480
Speaker 8: be in overnight, or it would be something that would

722
00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:14,080
Speaker 8: take a few days, whatever, she would tell me about

723
00:39:14,080 --> 00:39:16,600
Speaker 8: it so I would know and prepare or whatever. But

724
00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:19,520
Speaker 8: she had left to go to do one of her trips.

725
00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:22,000
Speaker 8: After a few days, she didn't come back and hadn't

726
00:39:22,040 --> 00:39:24,520
Speaker 8: heard from her, and somebody she worked with came up

727
00:39:24,560 --> 00:39:25,880
Speaker 8: to me and they were like, Hey, I need to

728
00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:27,959
Speaker 8: tell you something really important. Your mom was in a

729
00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:32,440
Speaker 8: helicopter accident. All I knew about helicopter accidents was what

730
00:39:32,560 --> 00:39:34,040
Speaker 8: I saw in action movies.

731
00:39:34,200 --> 00:39:35,200
Speaker 6: You know, I'm.

732
00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:38,160
Speaker 8: Picturing this helicopter blew up or whatever, you know, and

733
00:39:38,719 --> 00:39:41,160
Speaker 8: I just didn't really know what to think or what

734
00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:44,080
Speaker 8: the extent of her injuries were. So I just remember

735
00:39:44,239 --> 00:39:46,879
Speaker 8: being like, where is she. They were like, oh, she's

736
00:39:46,880 --> 00:39:48,640
Speaker 8: in Miami. She's in a hospital, and I was like,

737
00:39:48,640 --> 00:39:52,040
Speaker 8: all right, I'm going to Miami. I remember going to

738
00:39:52,120 --> 00:39:54,960
Speaker 8: the airport. I was flying by myself. I think I

739
00:39:55,120 --> 00:39:58,800
Speaker 8: was in a suit jacket and a dress shirt and

740
00:39:58,960 --> 00:39:59,719
Speaker 8: Miami Vice.

741
00:40:00,200 --> 00:40:05,919
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, wearing the Miami Vice cotton suit with the pinked,

742
00:40:06,120 --> 00:40:07,440
Speaker 5: you know, lavender colors.

743
00:40:07,719 --> 00:40:11,120
Speaker 6: It was wild. Yeah wait you had the yeah, the

744
00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:12,520
Speaker 6: spiked area for sure.

745
00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:15,160
Speaker 8: So I was flying by myself, and you know, I

746
00:40:15,239 --> 00:40:18,680
Speaker 8: just remember that ride going to Miami and just having

747
00:40:18,680 --> 00:40:20,880
Speaker 8: that uncertainty because all I knew was, you know, a

748
00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:23,600
Speaker 8: helicopter crash. You know, so I didn't really know what

749
00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:26,480
Speaker 8: I was walking into, and you know, there was that

750
00:40:26,520 --> 00:40:28,839
Speaker 8: reality set in that, you know, I could have lost

751
00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:31,040
Speaker 8: my mom. Once I got to the hospital, I was

752
00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:33,440
Speaker 8: you know, obviously I was relieved that she was okay,

753
00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:36,759
Speaker 8: but man, she was banged up. Man, I've never seen

754
00:40:36,800 --> 00:40:40,399
Speaker 8: her like that. Yeah, I've never seen her like that.

755
00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:43,960
Speaker 1: How did the experience knowing your mom could have died

756
00:40:44,040 --> 00:40:46,720
Speaker 1: right then and how did that play out going forward?

757
00:40:46,760 --> 00:40:49,040
Speaker 1: Were you Was it a different experience from that point on?

758
00:40:49,400 --> 00:40:50,040
Speaker 6: No, Yeah, it was.

759
00:40:50,160 --> 00:40:52,279
Speaker 8: It was a reality for me at that point. You know,

760
00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:55,040
Speaker 8: I realized that I could have lost her at that moment,

761
00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:57,319
Speaker 8: and and then that reality was there that I could

762
00:40:57,320 --> 00:40:59,759
Speaker 8: lose her in the future. You know. So it wasn't

763
00:40:59,800 --> 00:41:01,840
Speaker 8: something than I was actively thinking about every day, but

764
00:41:02,200 --> 00:41:04,320
Speaker 8: every time that she was going out to do anything,

765
00:41:04,360 --> 00:41:06,240
Speaker 8: it was something that was in the back of my head.

766
00:41:06,120 --> 00:41:08,359
Speaker 5: Like, wow, I didn't think I was gonna live.

767
00:41:08,560 --> 00:41:12,240
Speaker 6: Yeah, she was so banged up. It was wow.

768
00:41:12,520 --> 00:41:14,520
Speaker 5: It was so scary, it really was.

769
00:41:15,560 --> 00:41:17,839
Speaker 1: The Miami Herald ran this story a few days later.

770
00:41:18,719 --> 00:41:22,400
Speaker 11: TV news crew Okay, after forced landing three members of

771
00:41:22,440 --> 00:41:26,040
Speaker 11: a CBS television crew who survived a forced landing aboard

772
00:41:26,040 --> 00:41:29,759
Speaker 11: a Soviet made Nicaraguan government helicopter over the weekend were

773
00:41:29,760 --> 00:41:34,040
Speaker 11: brought to Miami for treatment of minor injuries. Reporter Courtney Hood,

774
00:41:34,360 --> 00:41:38,879
Speaker 11: cameraman Domingo Rex, and sound man aziz A Chiavas were

775
00:41:38,920 --> 00:41:43,680
Speaker 11: treated for cut cintebrations. Unspecified mechanical problems brought the aircraft

776
00:41:43,719 --> 00:41:48,040
Speaker 11: down Sunday in southeast Nicaragua. CBS producer John Seislof said

777
00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:52,640
Speaker 11: Tuesday in Nicaragua, it was a bullshit story.

778
00:41:52,800 --> 00:41:55,919
Speaker 5: He never said that he had been censored. He could

779
00:41:56,000 --> 00:41:58,920
Speaker 5: not say what had happened, or they weren't going to

780
00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:02,640
Speaker 5: allow them to get me out the country for medical treatment,

781
00:42:03,080 --> 00:42:06,560
Speaker 5: so you say this or she dies kind of thing.

782
00:42:06,920 --> 00:42:08,080
Speaker 5: So I didn't know any of that.

783
00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:13,200
Speaker 1: It was covered up like everything during war. The truth

784
00:42:13,480 --> 00:42:18,600
Speaker 1: is also a casualty. After a few weeks, Cookie and

785
00:42:18,680 --> 00:42:21,759
Speaker 1: the crew were released from the hospital, CBS thought it

786
00:42:21,760 --> 00:42:23,120
Speaker 1: was a good idea to put him up in a

787
00:42:23,120 --> 00:42:25,239
Speaker 1: fancy hotel to continue the recovery.

788
00:42:25,360 --> 00:42:28,200
Speaker 5: We each had our own suite, but two of us

789
00:42:28,239 --> 00:42:31,319
Speaker 5: wound up just crashing in the same suite because we

790
00:42:31,360 --> 00:42:31,719
Speaker 5: had the.

791
00:42:31,680 --> 00:42:34,680
Speaker 1: Same Basically the party, the party was on.

792
00:42:35,200 --> 00:42:40,000
Speaker 5: Oh, the party was on, all expense paid. Yeah, it

793
00:42:40,040 --> 00:42:42,520
Speaker 5: was a great place to recuperate. By that point, I

794
00:42:42,600 --> 00:42:45,680
Speaker 5: was like, kind of this helicopter crash wasn't so bad

795
00:42:45,760 --> 00:42:46,319
Speaker 5: after all.

796
00:42:46,600 --> 00:42:53,240
Speaker 1: You know, Cookie survives a near death experience. But shit's

797
00:42:53,239 --> 00:42:55,960
Speaker 1: about to get real. She comes face to face with

798
00:42:56,000 --> 00:42:57,680
Speaker 1: the bloody consequences of terror.

799
00:42:58,920 --> 00:43:03,719
Speaker 5: Next time on Joenerally, we're heading to the Jungles. We're

800
00:43:03,800 --> 00:43:09,680
Speaker 5: just looking for a story. A mortar blows up. We

801
00:43:09,760 --> 00:43:14,480
Speaker 5: all exit the vehicles, get in the dirt and start crawling,

802
00:43:15,040 --> 00:43:18,280
Speaker 5: and all of a sudden, I hear on the side

803
00:43:18,320 --> 00:43:23,799
Speaker 5: of me some soldier whispering Cookie, Cookie, is that you?

804
00:43:24,440 --> 00:43:26,680
Speaker 5: He says, I have something I don't know if it

805
00:43:26,760 --> 00:43:31,080
Speaker 5: means anything. A book. So I'm reading it and I'm

806
00:43:31,120 --> 00:43:35,320
Speaker 5: like on the inside freaking out. I turned to Richard Wagner,

807
00:43:35,680 --> 00:43:38,879
Speaker 5: can you look at this? He starts to read it,

808
00:43:39,040 --> 00:43:44,000
Speaker 5: and he says, this is a goddamn CIA torture manual.

809
00:43:47,320 --> 00:43:51,120
Speaker 1: The Journalista podcast features the stories and voice of Cookie Hood,

810
00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:56,560
Speaker 1: narrated by Steven Estepp, produced by Sean J. Donnelly. Executive

811
00:43:56,600 --> 00:44:01,680
Speaker 1: producers Jason Wagensback, Roy Laughlin, and Ellen k iHeart Executive

812
00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:06,920
Speaker 1: producer Tyler Klang. Written and edited by Steven stem Music

813
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:10,520
Speaker 1: by Jay Weigel, Associate producer in sound design Stephen Tanti.

814
00:44:10,840 --> 00:44:16,800
Speaker 1: Sound mixing by Jesse Solansnyder. Special Guestjulaine History professor Justin Woolf,

815
00:44:16,920 --> 00:44:20,680
Speaker 1: Cindy Pohl as the voice of Nora Estorga, Patrick Chico Hood,

816
00:44:21,160 --> 00:44:25,759
Speaker 1: Lloyd Sherr. Special thanks to Esplanade Studios, The Ranch Studios,

817
00:44:25,920 --> 00:44:31,200
Speaker 1: Jason Gerwitz, Kyle Frederick, Zach Slaff. This is a production

818
00:44:31,280 --> 00:44:34,759
Speaker 1: of Journalista podcast LLC and iHeartRadio