WEBVTT - #230 Jason Flom with Ray Krone 0:00:02.480 --> 0:00:05.320 On December twenty ninth, nineteen ninety one, the body of 0:00:05.360 --> 0:00:07.760 a thirty six year old bartender was found nude in 0:00:07.800 --> 0:00:11.040 the men's restroom of her bar in Phoenix, Arizona. She 0:00:11.119 --> 0:00:15.480 had been assaulted and fatally stabbed. No seamen was found, however, 0:00:15.760 --> 0:00:18.240 what appeared to be bite marks were on her neck. 0:00:18.200 --> 0:00:20.000 And breast, along with saliva. 0:00:20.680 --> 0:00:24.520 With DNA testing still in its infancy, sorology tests could 0:00:24.560 --> 0:00:27.880 only show that both the blood and saliva at the scene. 0:00:27.920 --> 0:00:29.440 Matched the victim's blood type. 0:00:29.680 --> 0:00:32.440 One witness implied that the victim may have been dating 0:00:32.440 --> 0:00:35.199 a thirty four year old bar regular named Ray Crone, 0:00:35.280 --> 0:00:37.920 who the victim allegedly had mentioned was supposed to help 0:00:37.920 --> 0:00:40.279 her close up that night, but since Ray had been 0:00:40.320 --> 0:00:42.320 at home with his roommate at the time of the crime, 0:00:42.520 --> 0:00:45.839 he had nothing to hide, fully cooperating with investigators and 0:00:45.880 --> 0:00:48.920 eventually giving a blood sample and an impression of his teeth. 0:00:49.440 --> 0:00:52.120 With the limitations of the sorology in this case, the 0:00:52.200 --> 0:00:56.040 notorious junk science of bitemark analysis became the sole evidence 0:00:56.080 --> 0:00:59.200 against Ray. To judge's denial of a continuance for the 0:00:59.240 --> 0:01:02.000 defense to prayer to refute. This evidence made a path 0:01:02.040 --> 0:01:04.759 for a second trial, but not before Ray was. 0:01:04.720 --> 0:01:06.600 Convicted and sentenced to death. 0:01:07.400 --> 0:01:11.120 At the second trial, with the sal DNA evidence excluding Ray, 0:01:11.200 --> 0:01:14.840 he was still reconvicted, but this time the judge sentenced 0:01:14.880 --> 0:01:18.440 Rate a life while voicing his obvious doubts. In two 0:01:18.520 --> 0:01:22.160 thousand and two, further DNA testing both excluded Ray as 0:01:22.200 --> 0:01:25.320 well as identified a convicted child molester named Kenneth. 0:01:25.080 --> 0:01:26.679 Phillips as the actual killer. 0:01:27.120 --> 0:01:30.640 Within days, Ray Crohn became the one hundredth former death 0:01:30.720 --> 0:01:34.839 row inmate freed based on actual innocence since capital punishment 0:01:35.000 --> 0:01:37.240 was reinstated in nineteen seventy six. 0:01:38.160 --> 0:01:39.720 This is wrongful conviction. 0:01:51.160 --> 0:01:56.600 Welcome back to wrongful conviction. Today's episode will rock your world. 0:01:56.760 --> 0:01:58.720 And I say that with such a high degree of 0:01:58.720 --> 0:02:02.320 confidence because this story, this man Ray cron was the 0:02:02.360 --> 0:02:06.000 one hundredth exonery from death row in the United States 0:02:06.040 --> 0:02:11.080 and his case is so troubling because, on top of 0:02:11.120 --> 0:02:14.800 all the other terrible things, Ray's case relied solely on 0:02:14.919 --> 0:02:18.040 the junkiest of junk sciences, which is bite mark evidence 0:02:18.120 --> 0:02:23.080 that was it nothing else. And furthermore, as happens too 0:02:23.240 --> 0:02:25.840 often in too many of the cases that we cover, 0:02:26.320 --> 0:02:30.639 the actual perpetrator went on to commit an unspeakable crime 0:02:31.080 --> 0:02:34.960 after Ray was targeted for reasons that we'll get into later, 0:02:35.040 --> 0:02:38.840 which are inexplicable, but they're real. So without further Ado, 0:02:39.280 --> 0:02:41.440 Ray Crone, welcome to wrongful conviction. 0:02:42.160 --> 0:02:43.600 Well, thank you, I'm glad to be here. 0:02:43.960 --> 0:02:47.639 And Ray, your case happened in Maricopa County, Arizona, which 0:02:47.639 --> 0:02:52.920 has a notorious past of prosecutorial misconduct. In fact, when 0:02:52.960 --> 0:02:56.519 referring to some more recent instances, an ACLU article said, 0:02:56.520 --> 0:02:59.520 and this is a quote. It is indicative of a 0:02:59.600 --> 0:03:03.120 decade long culture of misconduct that flows from the top down, 0:03:03.680 --> 0:03:08.800 one that prioritizes winning convictions over pursuing fairness and executing justice. 0:03:09.320 --> 0:03:10.120 End quote. 0:03:10.240 --> 0:03:12.720 And to be fair to a Maricopa that quote could 0:03:12.760 --> 0:03:17.080 be applied to countless prosecutors' offices all over the country. 0:03:17.080 --> 0:03:20.720 But in your case, the prosecutor was Noel Levy, who 0:03:21.000 --> 0:03:23.680 sent at least two innocent people to death row that 0:03:23.760 --> 0:03:26.679 we know of, right. The first was Deborah Milky back 0:03:26.720 --> 0:03:30.080 in nineteen ninety when Levy hid the lead detective's long 0:03:30.240 --> 0:03:33.200 history of lying under oath, and that was exposed in 0:03:33.200 --> 0:03:36.560 twenty fifteen, which allowed Debrah Milky to finally clear her 0:03:36.640 --> 0:03:40.200 name and then of course you But before all of 0:03:40.200 --> 0:03:42.680 this insanity, can you take us back a bit, what 0:03:42.800 --> 0:03:44.360 was your life like growing up? 0:03:44.840 --> 0:03:46.440 Well? I was actually I was born and raised in 0:03:46.440 --> 0:03:50.040 a small agricultural town in southern Pennsylvania. I went to 0:03:50.080 --> 0:03:52.480 the same high school my grandparents went to the same 0:03:52.600 --> 0:03:56.000 church my great grandparents went to. I was involved in church. 0:03:56.040 --> 0:03:58.680 I was on the choir. I also played Little league baseball, 0:03:58.760 --> 0:04:01.600 pee wee football was in sports. And I grew up 0:04:01.720 --> 0:04:05.000 growing vegetables and hunting and fishing in the typical things 0:04:05.000 --> 0:04:08.320 that small town country boys do. And I graduated in 0:04:08.360 --> 0:04:10.920 nineteen seventy four and I entered the US Air Force. 0:04:11.040 --> 0:04:13.880 I signed up for six years active duty. Was stationed 0:04:13.920 --> 0:04:17.320 places like Texas, Mississippi, then Georgia, Maine, and then the 0:04:17.400 --> 0:04:20.320 last was Phoenix, Arizona. My six years were up, I 0:04:20.360 --> 0:04:22.400 got out out there. A few years later. I got 0:04:22.440 --> 0:04:25.080 a job at the post office, and life was really 0:04:25.120 --> 0:04:27.560 pretty good again. I played a lot of sports, and 0:04:27.560 --> 0:04:29.960 that's really where my problem arose. Because of the one 0:04:30.000 --> 0:04:32.160 bar that I played volleyball for that I had sought 0:04:32.200 --> 0:04:34.400 darts at a few times became a scene of a 0:04:34.480 --> 0:04:36.120 murder right. 0:04:35.960 --> 0:04:39.760 And this particular crime occurred on December twenty ninth, nineteen 0:04:39.839 --> 0:04:42.080 ninety one, where the body of a thirty six year 0:04:42.080 --> 0:04:44.800 old woman was found nude in the men's restroom of 0:04:44.800 --> 0:04:48.279 the CBS Lounge in Phoenix, Arizona. The bar owner had 0:04:48.320 --> 0:04:52.000 found the body of the previous night's bartender and she 0:04:52.200 --> 0:04:54.520 had been brutally assaulted and. 0:04:54.480 --> 0:04:55.320 Stabbed to death. 0:04:55.440 --> 0:04:58.200 Now this remember this was back in the early nineties, right, 0:04:58.240 --> 0:05:01.480 so DNA testing was still in its infancy. Right, it 0:05:01.640 --> 0:05:06.200 was a new thing, So they only had zerology to 0:05:06.279 --> 0:05:08.960 work with, and at the time, it seemed like there 0:05:09.040 --> 0:05:12.320 was very little physical evidence left behind. There was no semen, right, 0:05:12.560 --> 0:05:15.200 and the blood and saliva at the scene all matched 0:05:15.200 --> 0:05:18.680 the victim's blood type. There were, though, what appeared to 0:05:18.680 --> 0:05:21.400 be human bite marks on the victim's neck and breast. 0:05:21.920 --> 0:05:25.120 So hm, which is we've talked about that before. How 0:05:25.200 --> 0:05:27.880 notoriously reliable that is? But so ray from these facts? 0:05:28.400 --> 0:05:31.960 How did they even come to suspect and ultimately target you. 0:05:32.720 --> 0:05:34.680 Yeah, she was. She was found by the owner and 0:05:34.720 --> 0:05:37.000 he came in on that Sunday morningtone put up his bar, 0:05:37.120 --> 0:05:39.600 found the front door unlocked, was concerned why his night 0:05:39.640 --> 0:05:42.080 manager hadn't taken care of secured. Eddie went made his 0:05:42.120 --> 0:05:44.520 way to the cash reader to a safe both row 0:05:44.560 --> 0:05:47.040 on secure the money was still in there. As he 0:05:47.120 --> 0:05:49.000 made his way around the bar, he found her body 0:05:49.000 --> 0:05:51.359 in the men's bathroom, and of course the police were 0:05:51.720 --> 0:05:54.280 called in and they initiated investigation on the assumption had 0:05:54.279 --> 0:05:56.280 to be somebody that knew her. No evidence of break in, 0:05:56.400 --> 0:05:58.560 no sign of a robbery. They talked to some of 0:05:58.600 --> 0:06:00.960 the co workers. One of them mentioned my name as 0:06:01.000 --> 0:06:03.599 a potential boyfriend. I did not date. She was not 0:06:03.680 --> 0:06:05.640 my girlfriend. I knew her from the bar. You treat 0:06:05.680 --> 0:06:09.160 bartenders and waitresses are kindly in any profession if you're 0:06:09.200 --> 0:06:12.039 going to be attending that place of business, and that's 0:06:12.080 --> 0:06:14.599 all it was. But it was about one o'clock on 0:06:14.640 --> 0:06:16.960 that Sunday end. I heard my dog was outside and 0:06:16.960 --> 0:06:19.479 he started barking. Two men in suits had pulled in 0:06:19.480 --> 0:06:21.120 front of my neighbor's house and were getting out of 0:06:21.120 --> 0:06:23.200 their car. And by the time I went outside to 0:06:23.279 --> 0:06:25.320 let my dog and they were walking up my driveway 0:06:25.360 --> 0:06:27.480 and I stepped out and I said, excuse me, can 0:06:27.520 --> 0:06:29.520 I help you? The one man said, or you Ray Crone? 0:06:29.880 --> 0:06:31.480 I said, well, yes, Sam, What can I do for you? 0:06:31.560 --> 0:06:34.479 And he said you know, and I thought of SATs. 0:06:34.480 --> 0:06:36.720 I said, I don't think I knew anybody named, and 0:06:36.800 --> 0:06:38.680 he exchanged glances with the man next him, looked like 0:06:38.720 --> 0:06:41.800 he said, you don't know from the CBS lounge. I said, well, 0:06:41.800 --> 0:06:43.960 wait a minute. I played volleyball there. I shoot darts 0:06:43.960 --> 0:06:46.479 there sometimes. There was a girl there named I said, 0:06:46.480 --> 0:06:48.200 I don't know her last name. And he kind of 0:06:48.200 --> 0:06:49.520 looked at me side. He said, you don't know her 0:06:49.560 --> 0:06:51.680 last name. You're a boyfriend, aren't you. I kind of said, 0:06:51.720 --> 0:06:54.480 tell I'm not her boyfriend. What's going on here? He said, well, 0:06:54.480 --> 0:06:56.560 you're dating, or aren't you? I said, no, I'm not datinger, 0:06:56.600 --> 0:06:59.040 what is this about? And at that point, he opened 0:06:59.120 --> 0:07:01.360 up his jacket, pulled out his badge, identified himself as 0:07:01.360 --> 0:07:04.320 a homicide detective, and informed me of her death. Said 0:07:04.360 --> 0:07:06.400 he was there to ask me a few questions. Now 0:07:06.400 --> 0:07:08.599 I'm stunned. I've been going to that bar about two months. 0:07:08.800 --> 0:07:11.200 Here's somebody I knew was a victim of a homicide 0:07:11.200 --> 0:07:13.440 and the police are at my house to ask me questions. 0:07:13.680 --> 0:07:15.520 The first thing I said, well, sure, come on inside, 0:07:15.960 --> 0:07:18.080 and he said no, we really need to do this downtown, 0:07:18.160 --> 0:07:20.480 And so I was interrogated for the next three hours 0:07:20.480 --> 0:07:22.440 about how long we've been dating, where I take her 0:07:22.520 --> 0:07:24.760 on dates, every time she'd been to my house. All 0:07:24.800 --> 0:07:26.600 of them, I told him were negative. You know, she's 0:07:26.640 --> 0:07:28.240 never been to my house. I didn't date her. I 0:07:28.240 --> 0:07:29.640 would see her at the bar. I was at a 0:07:29.680 --> 0:07:32.080 Christmas party with a number of people from the bar 0:07:32.520 --> 0:07:34.680 at one point with her, and that was it. At 0:07:34.720 --> 0:07:37.240 one point they took my sneakers out. Another point they 0:07:37.240 --> 0:07:39.360 took mugshots. They had me take my shirt off, took 0:07:39.400 --> 0:07:43.200 pictures of my upper torso they took fingerprints. Another party, 0:07:43.240 --> 0:07:45.560 he had like a white stir foam cups, had it 0:07:45.760 --> 0:07:48.200 tied two pieces together. Where I actually been into that 0:07:48.680 --> 0:07:51.040 and I cooperated. I didn't know anything about her death. 0:07:51.080 --> 0:07:52.680 I didn't know her that well. I was at home 0:07:52.760 --> 0:07:54.440 that night. I have a roommate that knows I was 0:07:54.480 --> 0:07:57.200 home that night, and after about three hours it was over, 0:07:57.240 --> 0:07:59.400 and I thought that was the end up. But then 0:07:59.440 --> 0:08:01.680 the next day, which was a Monday, I went to 0:08:01.680 --> 0:08:04.000 the post office, delivered my mail, got home that day 0:08:04.040 --> 0:08:07.000 and there he was waiting. Detective Gregory said, I need 0:08:07.000 --> 0:08:08.880 to eliminate you as a suspect. I don't think you've 0:08:08.920 --> 0:08:11.520 been completely truthful. You want to cooperate, don't you, mister 0:08:11.560 --> 0:08:13.560 cron And well, I said, sure, what does it you 0:08:13.600 --> 0:08:14.960 need me to do? And he said, well, I need 0:08:15.000 --> 0:08:17.680 you to come downtown again again. I volunteered to go 0:08:17.760 --> 0:08:19.840 downtown this time. When I got down there, in a 0:08:19.840 --> 0:08:22.480 little interrogation room, right away, he pulled out a piece 0:08:22.480 --> 0:08:24.000 of paper said, oh, yeah, by the way, I have 0:08:24.040 --> 0:08:27.280 an affidavid here, or a request for for evidence, and 0:08:27.400 --> 0:08:29.080 that it said that they were going to take a 0:08:29.080 --> 0:08:31.400 blood sample or hair sample to cast in my teeth. 0:08:31.600 --> 0:08:33.880 Now I'm a little upset. Now I'm concerns, like what's 0:08:33.920 --> 0:08:36.120 going on here? It was signed by a judge, said 0:08:36.120 --> 0:08:38.520 I was required to give these samples, and it said 0:08:38.520 --> 0:08:40.960 they had three hours to do it. So I cooperated 0:08:40.960 --> 0:08:42.720 when he took blood out of both arms. I'm not 0:08:42.720 --> 0:08:45.480 sure why that was necessary. I cooperated when they took 0:08:45.480 --> 0:08:47.520 hair samples, and then I was taken next door in 0:08:47.559 --> 0:08:49.079 a bigger room where there was a dentist and a 0:08:49.160 --> 0:08:51.920 dentist chair set up, at which point they sat me 0:08:51.920 --> 0:08:54.160 in a chair, put this gup, and he took two 0:08:54.200 --> 0:08:56.440 casts in my upper teeth to cast my lower teeth, 0:08:56.720 --> 0:08:58.160 and for about the next two and a half hours 0:08:58.160 --> 0:09:00.440 there was nothing but taking pictures in question me about 0:09:00.480 --> 0:09:03.360 my identicians history. When I was eighteen years old, I 0:09:03.400 --> 0:09:05.079 was a passengor in a head on collision. I woke 0:09:05.160 --> 0:09:08.480 up with a broken jaw mouth wearing shut. Six weeks 0:09:08.520 --> 0:09:10.760 went by. The bottom jawl didn't line up with the top. 0:09:10.840 --> 0:09:12.680 They had to rebreak and wear it shut again for 0:09:12.720 --> 0:09:15.400 another six weeks. I had some teeth that it eventually 0:09:15.440 --> 0:09:18.040 had died. I had some teeth issues, root canals, they 0:09:18.160 --> 0:09:20.400 some bridge work, some different things that went on with 0:09:20.440 --> 0:09:22.520 the front teeth in my mouth. And finally, when that 0:09:22.640 --> 0:09:24.679 was over, I went next door to that little interrogation 0:09:24.760 --> 0:09:27.480 room at wench Point. The detective banged his desk with 0:09:27.559 --> 0:09:29.480 his big old book and said, look, it's time to 0:09:29.520 --> 0:09:31.280 come clean. It's time to tell the truth. I know 0:09:31.360 --> 0:09:33.240 you didn't want you just confess that we can all 0:09:33.240 --> 0:09:35.520 go home. Well, by now I was pretty angry. I 0:09:35.559 --> 0:09:37.440 was pretty upset with what was going on where I 0:09:37.480 --> 0:09:40.200 was being treated. I was almost thirty five years old. 0:09:40.240 --> 0:09:42.319 I'm not a little child. I spoke up to him, 0:09:42.320 --> 0:09:43.640 I told you what I thought of him when I 0:09:43.640 --> 0:09:46.240 thought the investigation of the police department, Why you waste 0:09:46.320 --> 0:09:48.720 my time go find a person that did this. And 0:09:48.760 --> 0:09:50.480 by the way, your three hours were up. I mean 0:09:50.520 --> 0:09:52.320 I was hot. And he looked at me, looked at 0:09:52.320 --> 0:09:54.240 his watch, he looked back up. He said, look, mister crone, 0:09:54.240 --> 0:09:55.760 I'm not going to argue with you. There's other ways 0:09:55.760 --> 0:09:58.480 to handle this. He took me home fifteen minute ride, 0:09:58.559 --> 0:10:00.360 never said a word to me again. I thought that 0:10:00.400 --> 0:10:02.080 was the end of it, but I found out what 0:10:02.120 --> 0:10:03.959 he meant by other ways to handle this. The next day, 0:10:04.120 --> 0:10:07.200 December thirty first, nineteen ninety one. It was just about 0:10:07.240 --> 0:10:09.839 four o'clock. I pulled into my driveway, just stepped out 0:10:09.880 --> 0:10:12.160 of my car, which point all Suddenly I heard a 0:10:12.200 --> 0:10:15.079 speaker go off. Freeze, don't move, you're underrest. A vanload 0:10:15.080 --> 0:10:17.240 the police officers came pulling up. Black and whites came 0:10:17.280 --> 0:10:20.400 pulling up. The van doors opened up with armed officers 0:10:20.400 --> 0:10:22.400 in full riot gear. Threw me on the ground and 0:10:22.480 --> 0:10:25.200 rescue for murder, kidnapping, and sexual assault. 0:10:25.880 --> 0:10:26.680 Jesus Christ. 0:10:26.679 --> 0:10:30.000 So there you are spending New Year's Eve in a 0:10:30.120 --> 0:10:33.960 jail cell, and from what I understand, you stayed right 0:10:34.040 --> 0:10:37.600 there until trial. But you had your roommate right who 0:10:37.600 --> 0:10:40.959 had been home with you that night, so it should 0:10:41.000 --> 0:10:43.480 have seemed like you could clear this up pretty easily. 0:10:43.800 --> 0:10:46.560 And from what I understand, you had a public defender. 0:10:46.880 --> 0:10:48.640 Did they share the same optimism? 0:10:49.440 --> 0:10:51.240 One day I got called out to a legal visit. 0:10:51.360 --> 0:10:53.240 I've probably been in there for a good month or two, 0:10:53.880 --> 0:10:55.520 and it's just like you see on TV with a 0:10:55.640 --> 0:10:57.840 separated the area where one picks a phone and you 0:10:57.880 --> 0:10:59.599 talked through clear glass. And I was in there in 0:10:59.600 --> 0:11:01.760 a lady came in, sat a briefcase down, picked up 0:11:01.760 --> 0:11:05.200 the phone and identified herself as representing the public Defender's office. 0:11:05.720 --> 0:11:08.920 She said, you've been charged with murder, kidnapping, and sexual assault. 0:11:09.400 --> 0:11:11.280 You can expect to be found guilty, but we'll fight 0:11:11.320 --> 0:11:13.440 it on appeal. And I went crazy, What do you 0:11:13.480 --> 0:11:14.920 mean if he found Giddy had not to do his 0:11:14.960 --> 0:11:17.160 own bit? I just started going off, ranting and raving, 0:11:17.240 --> 0:11:18.960 and she got the phone held away from her ear, 0:11:19.040 --> 0:11:21.320 waiting for me to calm down. And she got back 0:11:21.400 --> 0:11:23.120 in that phone and she said, listen, mister crone, let 0:11:23.160 --> 0:11:25.160 me tell you something. I don't take that to an 0:11:25.160 --> 0:11:26.920 A voice from the judge I don't take it from 0:11:26.920 --> 0:11:29.200 the prosecutor, and I'm certainly not going to take it 0:11:29.200 --> 0:11:31.800 from you. Hung up the phone, picked up a briefcase, 0:11:31.840 --> 0:11:34.199 and was gone. And I thought, this is incredible. What 0:11:35.080 --> 0:11:37.240 is this system? I believed in? What the country? I 0:11:37.240 --> 0:11:39.199 believe that things I stood for and was taught and 0:11:39.640 --> 0:11:42.000 you know, raised to believe. Anyway, I got a letter 0:11:42.000 --> 0:11:44.080 about a week or two later from the Public Defender's 0:11:44.120 --> 0:11:46.720 office that stated that they were being removed from my case. 0:11:47.200 --> 0:11:49.640 They cited a conflict of interest, said the next most 0:11:49.720 --> 0:11:52.600 likely suspect was the victim's ex husband. They had a 0:11:52.600 --> 0:11:55.920 fifteen year old daughter together, and he did a sleepover 0:11:55.960 --> 0:11:58.439 for her birthday and did something inappropriate with one of 0:11:58.480 --> 0:12:01.800 her little girlfriends and he was arrested rightfully so, and 0:12:01.840 --> 0:12:03.719 they were representing him, and I was told that I 0:12:03.720 --> 0:12:06.440 would be getting a court appointed attorney. I thought, oh good, 0:12:06.480 --> 0:12:08.320 I'm going to get a private attorney. Now. Somebody's going 0:12:08.360 --> 0:12:11.120 to be appointed to represent somebody that'll do the job. 0:12:11.400 --> 0:12:13.520 But unfortunately, the day I went before the judge to 0:12:13.520 --> 0:12:15.720 get a court appointed attorney, it was a man who'd 0:12:15.760 --> 0:12:18.080 never done a death penalty case. And at the point 0:12:18.120 --> 0:12:20.040 where the judge appoint him to me. He was granted 0:12:20.080 --> 0:12:22.840 five thousand dollars to defend me, to represent me in 0:12:22.840 --> 0:12:23.880 a capitol murder case. 0:12:24.400 --> 0:12:27.760 Yeah, and of course the state has unlimited resources to 0:12:27.840 --> 0:12:29.520 do what they want to do. 0:12:29.960 --> 0:12:32.360 Heck, you can't even get a divorce for five thousand dollars. 0:12:32.679 --> 0:12:35.960 Yeah, don't, don't, I know it, believe me. But and 0:12:36.000 --> 0:12:40.640 they're giving really just enough to create the impression that 0:12:40.640 --> 0:12:43.400 they're enabling you to mount some sort of a defense, 0:12:43.960 --> 0:12:48.080 but not enough realistically for anybody to mount a real defense. 0:12:48.160 --> 0:12:51.680 So seven months after the murder, you're on trial. 0:12:51.880 --> 0:12:53.800 This was a three and a half day trial. The 0:12:53.920 --> 0:12:56.840 prosecution was pretty much all three days. And that's why 0:12:56.840 --> 0:12:58.280 I found out why they had me bite into that 0:12:58.320 --> 0:13:00.480 stereo fim that first day, why they took those casts 0:13:00.480 --> 0:13:02.280 of my teeth the second day, because they had a 0:13:02.280 --> 0:13:07.040 bite mark expert testifier. Ray Rosen out of Nevada, very impressive, 0:13:07.080 --> 0:13:09.400 well spoken man. He was a dean of the UNLV 0:13:09.559 --> 0:13:12.240 Dental School. He was a state center out of Las Vegas. 0:13:12.320 --> 0:13:15.360 He was the elder and the Mormon Church. Very powerful speaker, 0:13:15.480 --> 0:13:18.360 very convincing. We had later found out, very well paid, 0:13:18.400 --> 0:13:21.920 over fifty thousand dollars by the Maricopa County DA's office 0:13:21.920 --> 0:13:24.800 for his testimony. But his testimony was that my teeth 0:13:24.880 --> 0:13:26.680 were unique as the result of the car accident. I 0:13:26.720 --> 0:13:29.600 was in my teeth matched the marks and the body, 0:13:29.960 --> 0:13:31.880 and the detos marks in the body were made at 0:13:31.880 --> 0:13:34.360 the time of death, and that definitively made me Ray 0:13:34.400 --> 0:13:37.160 Crone the murder. There really wasn't much other evidence, but 0:13:37.400 --> 0:13:40.120 I was called a snagger tooth killer in the papers. 0:13:39.800 --> 0:13:44.000 The snaggle tooth killer. So for ten times what you 0:13:44.120 --> 0:13:47.720 got for your whole defense, that fifty grand even came 0:13:47.760 --> 0:13:51.160 with a schoolyard bully nickname, right, And what they're really 0:13:51.200 --> 0:13:56.680 paying for with a forensic odontologist is there resume, pomp 0:13:56.800 --> 0:14:00.160 and circumstance, Because if you were looking for substance and 0:14:00.160 --> 0:14:05.160 bitemark analysis, well there just isn't any. There's not a shred. 0:14:05.320 --> 0:14:08.400 I can't even I can't even put into words the 0:14:08.480 --> 0:14:12.319 disdain I have for this particular junk science. I encourage 0:14:12.360 --> 0:14:15.720 everyone to listen to our series Wraleful Conviction Junk Science. 0:14:15.960 --> 0:14:19.920 The first episode exposes bitemark analysis for what it really is. 0:14:20.280 --> 0:14:23.000 And let's start out by saying that one of the 0:14:23.040 --> 0:14:28.320 original purposes of forensic odentology is identifying human remains with 0:14:28.480 --> 0:14:31.560 dental records. What I mean is, for instance, like a 0:14:31.600 --> 0:14:34.720 person was on a flight, right, and the flight crashed 0:14:34.720 --> 0:14:37.400 into a mountainside or whatever, it gets obliterated. 0:14:37.400 --> 0:14:38.880 But now you've got a situation where you're. 0:14:38.760 --> 0:14:43.320 Matching a limited and known set of bodies to corresponding 0:14:43.400 --> 0:14:46.600 dental impressions and dental histories. So you have a full 0:14:46.640 --> 0:14:49.560 set of teeth that you're comparing to a full set 0:14:49.680 --> 0:14:54.200 of X rays from a dentist's office. But with bitemark analysis, 0:14:54.280 --> 0:14:59.040 the so called expert pretends without taking into account that 0:14:59.440 --> 0:15:02.480 the many, many variables of the medium on which a 0:15:02.520 --> 0:15:05.240 bite was recorded. Right, So what I mean is, in 0:15:05.280 --> 0:15:08.680 this particular case, human skin and tissue, so we're talking 0:15:08.680 --> 0:15:13.280 about elasticity, decomposition. I could go on, but from there 0:15:13.720 --> 0:15:17.160 they act as if they're able to match perfectly a 0:15:17.240 --> 0:15:20.280 dental mold from a suspect to marks made on a 0:15:20.600 --> 0:15:23.640 surface that's transitioning, and they claim to be able to 0:15:23.720 --> 0:15:27.520 do this to the exclusion of all others on the planet, 0:15:27.800 --> 0:15:31.720 as Ray Rosen did in this case. So yeah, no, 0:15:32.520 --> 0:15:35.920 but as Ray mentioned, they impressed the hell out of 0:15:35.960 --> 0:15:40.760 the jury with their witnesses purported credentials, and this time 0:15:40.880 --> 0:15:45.600 tested method has tragically been very effective at producing convictions, 0:15:45.960 --> 0:15:49.360 often with no other evidence of any kind. So that 0:15:49.560 --> 0:15:52.240 was the state's case. But what about your defense? 0:15:52.600 --> 0:15:55.040 Now, the second half the trial, which was a defensive turn, 0:15:55.080 --> 0:15:57.400 which was like the last half a day, I actually 0:15:57.440 --> 0:15:59.440 took the stand. I raised my right hand. I went 0:15:59.520 --> 0:16:02.280 up there and answer my attorney's questions. And there came 0:16:02.320 --> 0:16:04.320 the prosecutor, Noel leav He got up here right in 0:16:04.320 --> 0:16:06.640 front of me right away. So you denied killing the victim? 0:16:06.640 --> 0:16:08.800 I said, yes, I do you deny being the CBS? Now, 0:16:09.040 --> 0:16:10.800 I said what night? He said, the night you killed her? 0:16:10.800 --> 0:16:12.520 Of course, mister Crone, the night you brutally took her. 0:16:12.800 --> 0:16:15.080 I just started tearing into me. I mean everything I 0:16:15.160 --> 0:16:18.000 said was twisted around. And after two or three hours 0:16:18.000 --> 0:16:20.120 of this cross examination, I come down off that wind 0:16:20.120 --> 0:16:22.600 of sand. I mean, so disorder and confused almost what 0:16:22.720 --> 0:16:25.280 over sat down next to me. Next was my roommate. 0:16:25.280 --> 0:16:27.840 My roommate was going through divorce. He had two children. 0:16:27.920 --> 0:16:30.440 Most of his money was going to support those children. 0:16:30.480 --> 0:16:32.200 He was staying with me for a month or two. 0:16:32.240 --> 0:16:35.320 He'd been there already he raised his right hand to testify, 0:16:35.400 --> 0:16:37.000 to tell the truth there in that court of law, 0:16:37.040 --> 0:16:39.960 and sat down and answered my attorney's question. And then 0:16:40.000 --> 0:16:42.840 here come nol leave again to cross examine him. Stirred 0:16:42.840 --> 0:16:44.280 there in front of him a minute with his arms 0:16:44.280 --> 0:16:46.080 cross said, now you know Ray Crone a long time, 0:16:46.120 --> 0:16:48.680 haven't you. My friend Steve said yes, that's right. He's 0:16:48.680 --> 0:16:50.600 been twelve years since we were in the Air Force together. 0:16:51.280 --> 0:16:53.040 And then the prosecutor said, and Ray Crone has always 0:16:53.040 --> 0:16:55.320 been a good friend to you. I've been there at times, indeed, 0:16:55.400 --> 0:16:57.400 times of trouble, looked out for you, helped you out. 0:16:57.560 --> 0:16:59.240 In fact, he's even given you a place to live 0:16:59.320 --> 0:17:01.320 right now, isn't he my friends to He kind of 0:17:01.320 --> 0:17:02.960 straighten up said yes, that's right. That's the kind of 0:17:02.960 --> 0:17:05.080 guy where he is. And then the prosecutor leaned right 0:17:05.080 --> 0:17:07.160 over a space point to figure and said, and you'd 0:17:07.200 --> 0:17:09.359 lie for him, wound you and turned and walked away 0:17:09.359 --> 0:17:11.640 and sat down. Later on at closing arguments, he told 0:17:11.640 --> 0:17:14.280 the jury disregard my friend a man who raised his 0:17:14.359 --> 0:17:16.439 right hand to serve the United States Air Force, a 0:17:16.440 --> 0:17:18.040 man who raised his right hand to tell his truth 0:17:18.080 --> 0:17:20.040 in the court of law. He told that jury to 0:17:20.119 --> 0:17:22.720 disregard his testimony because he's just there to protect me 0:17:23.000 --> 0:17:25.639 and will say anything. And it took the jury just 0:17:25.680 --> 0:17:27.200 three and a half hours to come back and find 0:17:27.240 --> 0:17:28.680 me guilty and murdering kidnapping. 0:17:29.560 --> 0:17:33.200 So now you go back for sentencing, and you would 0:17:33.240 --> 0:17:35.520 not have seemed to be a likely candidate to get 0:17:35.520 --> 0:17:38.960 the death penalty, especially with your background. But in fact 0:17:39.040 --> 0:17:39.760 that's what happened. 0:17:40.760 --> 0:17:42.720 To sit there and going through a mini trivel to 0:17:42.760 --> 0:17:45.560 call an aggravating mitigating hearing, and again this is their 0:17:45.600 --> 0:17:47.919 go to big tough guy prosecutor before a judge. It 0:17:48.000 --> 0:17:50.439 was an ex prosecutor a response for a half a 0:17:50.440 --> 0:17:53.080 dozen people in death row already and to sit through 0:17:53.119 --> 0:17:54.879 this the first part of the aggravating part by the 0:17:54.920 --> 0:17:57.080 prosecution where they have to argue why this is above 0:17:57.119 --> 0:17:58.919 and beyond the norm For the worst of the worst, 0:17:59.119 --> 0:18:01.199 you have to have aggravating factors, at least one to 0:18:01.200 --> 0:18:03.600 get a death sentence. They used the bite mark set. 0:18:03.600 --> 0:18:06.040 It was gratuitous violent success, he pain and suffering on 0:18:06.080 --> 0:18:08.480 a soft tissue of while she was still alive, the 0:18:08.480 --> 0:18:10.920 pain and suffering she must have went through, or because 0:18:10.960 --> 0:18:13.720 they're great at covering any possibilities in all their bases, 0:18:13.920 --> 0:18:16.240 and he said, or it was after she was already dead. 0:18:16.440 --> 0:18:19.280 That's heinous and depray, that's tampering with dead body. That's 0:18:19.359 --> 0:18:22.119