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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 2: How does a beautiful young girl end up murdered dead

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Speaker 2: in her own bathtub, the apple of her family's eye,

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Speaker 2: and still no justice? As the days pass, as the

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Speaker 2: week's past, as the months pass, Julia's family wonders.

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Speaker 1: Why, and so do I. I'm Nancy Grace. This is

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Speaker 1: Crime Stories.

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Speaker 2: Thank you for being with us here at Crime Stories

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Speaker 2: and on Serious XM one eleven. First of all, listen

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Speaker 2: to this.

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Speaker 3: Both of Julia Niewinder's roommates have been gone for the weekend,

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Speaker 3: and when one of the roommates stops by Monday morning

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Speaker 3: to pick up some things for class that day, she

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Speaker 3: hears the alarm going off in Julia Nicewinder's bedroom and

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Speaker 3: heads out without seeing or talking to her. The next day,

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Speaker 3: the roommate realizes she hasn't seen or talked to Julia

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Speaker 3: in two days. Her bedroom door is locked, so she

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Speaker 3: calls security at the apartment complex to check on her roommate.

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Speaker 3: The guard shows up with police and using a master

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Speaker 3: key to open the door, they walk into Julia Nicewinder's room.

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Speaker 3: It appears as if a home invasion has taken place.

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Speaker 3: Calling out for Julia and getting no reply, the officer

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Speaker 3: walks toward the bathroom door. A pair of white latex

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Speaker 3: gloves are on the floor in front of the bathroom door.

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Speaker 3: They are twisted and intertwined with each other.

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Speaker 2: Just as if somebody had been taking them off and

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Speaker 2: threw them down.

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Speaker 1: What happened to Julia? And why still no justice?

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Speaker 2: Joining me in all star panel, But first to Julia's mother,

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Speaker 2: him Turnquist.

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Speaker 1: Miss Turnquist, thank you for being with us. Thank you,

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Speaker 1: miss Turnquist.

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Speaker 2: It has been horrible and seemingly never ending journey for

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Speaker 2: you getting justice for Julia.

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Speaker 1: I want you to think back to the moment.

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Speaker 2: You found out that your girl, just beautiful, young girl,

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Speaker 2: had been killed.

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Speaker 1: What happened?

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Speaker 4: Well, I actually found out because she didn't show up

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Speaker 4: to her work Christmas party. And my one of my

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Speaker 4: best friends worked with her boss, and they had said

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Speaker 4: that Julia didn't show up for the Christmas party and

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Speaker 4: that friends had stopped over at her place and her

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Speaker 4: car was home, but Julia wasn't home. That one of

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Speaker 4: the roommates said, yeah, I haven't seen her all day,

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Speaker 4: she's not you know, So they so they went on

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Speaker 4: their way. Well, then when my friend called me and said, hey, Kim,

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Speaker 4: you know, I got a call that no one's seen

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Speaker 4: Julia and that she didn't show up for work, and

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Speaker 4: she typically does not just not show up for work.

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Speaker 4: And I and she said, where are you at? Well,

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Speaker 4: me and Jennifer, her twin, we were actually playing at

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Speaker 4: darts on a dart league and she I told her

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Speaker 4: where I was, and she came and picked us up,

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Speaker 4: and we kept trying to call Julia on her way

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Speaker 4: from Monroe to Ipsilanti, which is can be about a

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Speaker 4: forty five minute drive, and her cell phone was going

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Speaker 4: right to voicemail. So then we actually called one of

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Speaker 4: Jennifer's friends who's lived on campus, which was right across

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Speaker 4: the street from Julia's apartment, and we asked her to

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Speaker 4: go over there and check on her. So she In

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Speaker 4: the meantime, the roommate had the security guard and the

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Speaker 4: cops there, and then Rachel got there and she called

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Speaker 4: us and said, Kim, I'm given the EMP your phone

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Speaker 4: number because they want to talk to you. And I'm

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Speaker 4: like what.

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Speaker 5: So me and.

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Speaker 4: Jennifer were obviously freaking out, and so then they called

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Speaker 4: me and they asked me if Julia had any medical issues,

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Speaker 4: and I said, yes, she has a cardio neurosyncope, which

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Speaker 4: is something I have and Jennifer has, which causes your

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Speaker 4: blood pressure to drop it and you could just pass

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Speaker 4: right out, but then you can come to it after

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Speaker 4: a few minutes. And he said okay, and I said,

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Speaker 4: why what's going on? And he goes, he goes, I'll

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Speaker 4: call you back. Well, they never called us back. We

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Speaker 4: got up there, and when we got up there, we

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Speaker 4: seen the EMP but no lights were on, so there

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Speaker 4: was just a brief moment that we were like, Okay,

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Speaker 4: the lights aren't on, so nothing's really wrong. But then

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Speaker 4: there was a security guard standing there and me and

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Speaker 4: Jennifer just ran right into Julia's apartment and we didn't

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Speaker 4: see anybody. And her apartment was at the back of

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Speaker 4: the apartment in the corner, and so when we ran down,

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Speaker 4: when we ran down the hallway, I went to open

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Speaker 4: the door, and when we went to stuff in, we

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Speaker 4: could see that there was stuff on the floor. But

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Speaker 4: then a cop came out of the bathroom area and

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Speaker 4: pushed us into the kitchen area, and we said, you know,

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Speaker 4: what's going on with Julia? You know, we want to

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Speaker 4: see her that, you know, And of course Jennifer ring

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Speaker 4: or twin was really freaking out and he said to

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Speaker 4: us and he said, you can't see her. She's deceased.

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Speaker 4: And Jennifer just ran out of the apartment. I like,

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Speaker 4: sell to the floor. I was like punching things. I

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Speaker 4: was upset. I was freaking out. I'm like, you're you're you're,

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Speaker 4: you're lying and you know, and he's like no, he goes,

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Speaker 4: she's deceased, and and I just I lost it. And

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Speaker 4: then at that moment, because on our way up there,

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Speaker 4: we had called Jim, which at the time was my husband,

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Speaker 4: and him and Madison were on their way up there

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Speaker 4: because you know, we didn't know what was going on

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Speaker 4: with Julia and no one had heard from her two days,

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Speaker 4: so we uh so everyone was kind of on their

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Speaker 4: way up there, and uh when my husband at the

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Speaker 4: time came into the apartment, uh, he said, what's going

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Speaker 4: on And the officer goes, well, your daughter is deceased,

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Speaker 4: and we all just lost it, you know, and and uh,

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Speaker 4: you know, we had to go out and tell Madison,

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Speaker 4: who was ten years old at the time, that her

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Speaker 4: sister was, you know, it was dead, and it was

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Speaker 4: just it was it was the worst. It was the

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Speaker 4: worst moment.

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Speaker 6: And I.

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Speaker 4: It to talk about it even it just it brings

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Speaker 4: everything right back to that exact moment that like I

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Speaker 4: in my mind, I I relived that moment all the time,

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Speaker 4: and you know, and I then I get mad and

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Speaker 4: angry and and uh, you know, and I just start crying.

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Speaker 4: And you know, she was Julia was definitely special and

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Speaker 4: her family meant everything to her. And it was right

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Speaker 4: before Christmas. Christmas was her favorite holiday. She was so

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Speaker 4: excited that, you know, she was finally at an age

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Speaker 4: and had a job that she could buy her family

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Speaker 4: Christmas presents, you know, and and she she just was

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Speaker 4: so excited for Christmas. That year, me and me and

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Speaker 4: Jim had gone out got a real Christmas tree. It

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Speaker 4: was our first real Christmas tree. And Julia was more

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Speaker 4: excited than anybody about the real Christmas tree and decorating it.

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Speaker 4: And we always decorated our Christmas tree, you know, when

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Speaker 4: all of us could be there and have hot chocolate,

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Speaker 4: and you know, we had already we had already done

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Speaker 4: that when she was home the weekend before, so we

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Speaker 4: got to you know, have that last memory with her.

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Speaker 4: But it's definitely, uh, it's I yeah, I to talk

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Speaker 4: about it sometimes just you know is real upsetting, But

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Speaker 4: I also want to talk about it because I want

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Speaker 4: to keep her story alive. I don't want anyone to

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Speaker 4: forget her. I want everyone to know that this case

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Speaker 4: is still unsolved and it's been eleven years too long,

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Speaker 4: that we need some answers more for Julia than us,

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Speaker 4: But I really want justice for Julia. She deserves it.

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Speaker 2: Guys, you are hearing Julia's mom, Kim Turnquist, and I

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Speaker 2: want you to know that Kim is battling leukemia on

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Speaker 2: top of everything else, and she is with us today

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Speaker 2: to ask for your help in solving her Girls Martyr.

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Speaker 2: Also with us is Madison Turnquist. This is Julia's little sister, Madison.

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Speaker 2: Thank you for being with us.

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Speaker 7: Dear, thank you for having us today.

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Speaker 2: Madison, hear your mom, Kim, Stay how awful it is

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Speaker 2: to retell the story. I feel the same way when

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Speaker 2: people just out of the blue asked me about my

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Speaker 2: fiancee murder. I hate that, but yet I will tell

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Speaker 2: it if I feel like I need to tell it,

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Speaker 2: or if I have to tell it in some way

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Speaker 2: to help someone. Can you tell me, Madison, about the

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Speaker 2: moment you learned your big sister had been killed.

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Speaker 7: Can I can replay it exactly how it happened eleven

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Speaker 7: years ago, So say, as you guys already heard the

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Speaker 7: first you know, beginning from my mom. But to go

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Speaker 7: a little back to when she had said that, Jennifer

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Speaker 7: ran out of the room, Jennifer actually ran to me

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Speaker 7: in my dad's truck. So at that time, I was

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Speaker 7: sitting in the truck with my mom's two best friends

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Speaker 7: when Jennifer had run out to me and she had

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Speaker 7: run out, she was balling. She hugged me that I

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Speaker 7: love you.

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Speaker 8: And I had no idea what was going on still

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Speaker 8: at that moment, and she did that, and then she

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Speaker 8: had walked away. I don't know if she went to

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Speaker 8: go find my mom or I don't I just I

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Speaker 8: don't know what had happened in that moment, but she

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Speaker 8: walked away, and then I've seen my mom and my

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Speaker 8: dad walking back. So my mom's two friends got out

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Speaker 8: of the truck and my mom and my dad got

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Speaker 8: in the truck and it was just I believe it

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Speaker 8: was like a Toyota style truck at the time. So

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Speaker 8: my dad just had like that one seat bench with

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Speaker 8: the driver passenger it and the little seat in the

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Speaker 8: middle and I was in the little seat in the

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Speaker 8: middle and right in front of me dashboard. Mom's on

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Speaker 8: the right of me, my dad's on the left.

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Speaker 9: And it was quiet for like the first five minutes

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Speaker 9: in the truck and now, so back then I didn't know,

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Speaker 9: but now I know that was them trying to figure

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Speaker 9: out how they were going to tell me because I

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Speaker 9: was ten years old and they had to figure out

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Speaker 9: how they're going to tell me in a way that

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Speaker 9: I'm going to understand what they're telling me. When I

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Speaker 9: was two years old, my uncle had committed suicide and

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Speaker 9: that growing up, that affected me a lot, just because

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Speaker 9: you know, I want I would. I wanted to know

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Speaker 9: who my uncle was and never had the chance to.

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Speaker 9: So when my parents told me, my mom grabbed my

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Speaker 9: hand and my dad looked at me and said, your

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Speaker 9: sister is safe.

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Speaker 8: With your uncle, Jeff. I didn't cry, I didn't scream.

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Speaker 8: All I could do was punch my dad's radio. And

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Speaker 8: that's that's the only reaction that I had because at

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Speaker 8: ten years old, I know what they're saying to me.

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Speaker 8: I know what they meant when they said that.

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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 2: Now as you are hearing Madison Turnquist, Julia's little sister,

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Speaker 2: and Kim Turnquist, her mother, describing the moment they find

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Speaker 2: out their girl, their big sister, has been killed, her

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Speaker 2: body dumped in her apartment bathtub. Now, this apartment was

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Speaker 2: an off campus apartment there at Eastern Michigan University. This girl,

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Speaker 2: Julia scrubbed in sunshine, beautiful, sweet, not some wild party girl,

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Speaker 2: never had an arrest, never run away from home, so

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Speaker 2: excited about having her very first Christmas tree and her

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Speaker 2: very own off campus apartment. Now, how in the hey

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Speaker 2: does this case go unsolved? In addition to Kim and

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Speaker 2: Madison joining US an all star panel, first two, Ronnie

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Speaker 2: Dahl joining US investigative journalists and private investigator, owner of

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Speaker 2: Doll Investigations.

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Speaker 1: Ronnie, what do you make of it when.

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Speaker 10: You're a reporter and you get called to these stories?

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Speaker 10: There are so many questions that you're trying to get covered. Obviously,

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Speaker 10: it's who, what, when? Where? Eastern Michigan University is about

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Speaker 10: twenty thousand students, A lot of them are commuter students,

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Speaker 10: and as you know, this happened off campus, so there

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Speaker 10: weren't a lot of people on campus at the time.

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Speaker 10: It was around exam time.

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Speaker 2: Oh my goodness, Ronnie Dahl, you're reminding me so much

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Speaker 2: of the Idaho for Slaves and Moscow, Idaho. Were four

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Speaker 2: students and an off campus home they rented it. When

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Speaker 2: I say off campus, I mean right across the street.

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Speaker 1: I've been there. You look right at Fraternity Row.

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Speaker 2: When I say off campus, it's literally in the shadow

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Speaker 2: of campus. So it's very very close to campus. And

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Speaker 2: you said twenty thousand students.

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Speaker 1: Go ahead, Ronnie, and.

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Speaker 10: You know the city. Since this was off campus, it

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Speaker 10: falls to the jurisdiction of the Ipsilanti Police department. So

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Speaker 10: it's a smaller police department. I don't even think at

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Speaker 10: that time they maybe had fifty employees. Half of that's

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Speaker 10: the police officers. So when the city itself, the population

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Speaker 10: is about the same as that of the university, right,

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Speaker 10: so you have to go to the jurisdiction. So Ipsilanti

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Speaker 10: Police they're handling the investigation, and pretty much from the

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Speaker 10: beginning they were pretty tight lipped on what was happening

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Speaker 10: in this case. Sin they have remained that way all

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Speaker 10: these years later.

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Speaker 2: Guys, what do we know about the attack? Take a

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Speaker 2: listen to Sidney Sumner Crime online dot com.

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Speaker 11: Nice Winder's room looks like it has been tossed closer

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Speaker 11: all over the floor of the room. Drawers are left open.

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Speaker 11: The contents from a plastic organizer drawer have been dumped

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Speaker 11: on the floor. The contents of Nice Winter's purse also

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Speaker 11: dumped out on her bed, and some items are missing too.

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Speaker 11: A black and white zebra striped pillowcase is missing off

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Speaker 11: the pillow. Her keys to the apartment are missing from

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Speaker 11: a lanyard, and police note that it looks like a

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Speaker 11: home invasion took place, but wrapped Christmas presents and iPod,

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Speaker 11: computer and TV are not taken from the room.

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Speaker 1: So why to Jason Jensen joining us?

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Speaker 2: Jason is private investigator, owner of Jensen Private Investigations and

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Speaker 2: co founder of the Cold Case Coalition. You can find

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Speaker 2: Jason at Jensenprivate Investigations dot com.

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Speaker 1: Jason, thank you for being with us. I want to

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Speaker 1: absorb what we're just hearing.

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Speaker 2: And guys, we're back at ground zero, square one, trying

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Speaker 2: to solve the murder of this beautiful young co ed

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Speaker 2: murdered in her off campus apartment. Did you hear that,

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Speaker 2: Jason and lonlike everything had been dumped on the floor

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Speaker 2: but what's really missing the keys to the apartment, and

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Speaker 2: police note that there were unwrapped gifts and iPod, computer

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Speaker 2: and TV still there.

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Speaker 12: Right, It definitely does not sound like it was a

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Speaker 12: home invasion for a robbery. It sounds like there was

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Speaker 12: a targeting of Julia herself, which indicates strongly because like

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Speaker 12: the pillowcases missing and her keys are gone.

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Speaker 2: And to me to just got mortgage joining US Professor Forensics,

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Speaker 2: Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on

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Speaker 2: Amazon and host of Bodyback with jsm also death investigator.

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Speaker 2: He has investigated over one thousand death scenes.

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Speaker 1: Scott, is it staged?

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Speaker 2: Did someone come to kill Julia and they then make

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Speaker 2: the place look ransacked?

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Speaker 13: That's certainly a possibility because you know, if you look

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Speaker 13: at the inventory of the items that had had been

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Speaker 13: left behind, there's nothing of significance missing here. Things are there.

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Speaker 13: But yet you get this idea that someone went through

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Speaker 13: and rifled the area. And we see this lots of

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Speaker 13: times with staging cases, so that leads you to this idea.

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Speaker 2: I mean, Joe Scott, you've turned on the TV, haven't you.

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Speaker 2: Every time there is a homicide depicted, that's always staged,

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Speaker 2: They tear the room.

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Speaker 1: Up, They act like someone came in to steal something.

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Speaker 1: When that's staging. Staging the scene.

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Speaker 2: Del Carson high profile all you're out of Jacksonville, joining

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Speaker 2: us and more importantly for my purposes, former FBI and

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Speaker 2: former beatcop in Miami Dade.

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Speaker 1: You can find them at.

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Speaker 2: Dell Carsonlaw dot Comdale Staging is normally done by someone

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Speaker 2: that knows the victim, who is trying to make it

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Speaker 2: look as if it was a random attack.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, but there are a couple of things going on here,

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Speaker 6: and Joe will back me up on this. You know,

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Speaker 6: this could be somebody gathering a crophy, or from my perspective,

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Speaker 6: this is somebody removing items that connect that individual to

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Speaker 6: that lady.

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Speaker 2: It's the missing pillow case to be used as a sack.

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Speaker 6: You throw stuff in there in order to get it out,

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Speaker 6: and that things are missing that no one would expect

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Speaker 6: to be there. And there's more. When people die in bathtubs,

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Speaker 6: the mistake of uninitiated law enforcement is to drain the

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Speaker 6: tub in order to get the victim out. And what

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Speaker 6: Joe and I can both tell you is that once

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Speaker 6: you've done that, you've lost a considerable amount of evidence

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Speaker 6: down the drain. And I've seen this happen on at

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Speaker 6: least two occasions in my FBI and my police career

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Speaker 6: in Miami, and so you'll lose that evidence. So that

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Speaker 6: takes somebody with some sophistications who recognizes that when you

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Speaker 6: put somebody in the water, you're taking away important evidence. Now,

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Speaker 6: maybe they didn't get at all, but it's an effort

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Speaker 6: and it shows some sophistication that's sort of unusual.

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Speaker 2: We believe that this occurred in the early early morning hours.

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Speaker 2: Kim Turquis is Julia's mom. Were there any items of

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Speaker 2: note missing other than the pillow case, her.

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Speaker 4: Keys, which, like we said, on the lanyard, which have

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Speaker 4: a key to her bedroom, and then we have the

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Speaker 4: pillow case, and then we have they said that there

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Speaker 4: was a purple rug missing from the bathroom because the

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Speaker 4: bathroom that was zebra and a bright purple, and so

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Speaker 4: they said that the rug was missing. I don't know,

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Speaker 4: to be honest, I know that when we went to

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Speaker 4: when we were we're allowed to clean up her go

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Speaker 4: clean up her apartment, I'll be honest, we didn't pay

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Speaker 4: much attention to what was still there and what wasn't

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Speaker 4: because we were all obviously very upset and crying and

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Speaker 4: it was a really emotional time. But you know, we

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Speaker 4: do know that one of the plastic drawers is missing too,

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Speaker 4: but we don't know what it was in it.

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Speaker 2: Did she have any valuable jewelry that you know of

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Speaker 2: that was missing.

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Speaker 4: No, her check book was still there, her credit cards, everything,

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Speaker 4: we're still.

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Speaker 13: In her room, Nancy. I think that one of the

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Speaker 13: questions I would ask is were there any items of

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Speaker 13: clothing missing as well from the scene that were tied

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Speaker 13: back to her, because that's that might be inevident. So

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Speaker 13: the trophy taker names.

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Speaker 1: Kim tarquas anything.

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Speaker 4: We're not sure what was in that drawer that is missing,

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Speaker 4: So we're not.

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Speaker 1: Sure, Okay, what kind of drawer?

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Speaker 6: Was it?

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Speaker 4: A ster a light drawer, one of those bigger three

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Speaker 4: compartments STERI light drawers.

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Speaker 1: Oh, like the packable plastic ones. Yeah, Nancy, Yeah, jump in.

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Speaker 6: If the drawer is missing, that's an important clue, because

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Speaker 6: that too, is unusual and it may reflect that the

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Speaker 6: hand the gloves were taken off, grabbed that put fingerprints

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Speaker 6: and DNA on it, and then took it with them

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Speaker 6: when they realized that they didn't have the gloves on

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Speaker 6: when they were actually doing tossing the apartment.

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Speaker 1: Okay, can we talk about something just for a moment.

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Speaker 2: Who wears gloves to a crime of opportunity? Like you're

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Speaker 2: watching Julia and you say I'm going to sex attack her,

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Speaker 2: you break into her place, and you happen to have

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Speaker 2: gloves with you.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, who wears a mask?

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Speaker 14: Yes?

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Speaker 6: And the reason you wear a mask is see it

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Speaker 6: can be identified.

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Speaker 2: What I'm saying is this wasn't planned out, Joe Scott. No,

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Speaker 2: I mean it was planned out to bring gloves.

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Speaker 13: Yeah, you don't show up randomly with latex gloves. And

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Speaker 13: to Dale's point, I find it fascinating with this case

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Speaker 13: that you talk about preparedness when you show up, you

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Speaker 13: show up with the gloves, and not just that, but

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Speaker 13: also there's a level of sophistication when you think about

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Speaker 13: the bathtub in and of itself, Well, what do you

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Speaker 13: do in the bathtub? Normally in life you get in

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Speaker 13: the bathtub to get clean. So could this person have

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Speaker 13: been sophisticated enough in order to facilitate that, or at

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Speaker 13: least think about facilitating that cleaning her so that none

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Speaker 13: of his DNA is left behind too.

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Speaker 1: Karen L.

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Speaker 2: Stark, joining US high profile psychologist for renow on TV

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Speaker 2: and radio trauma expert. You can find her at Karenstark

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Speaker 2: dot com. That's Karen with the Sea. Karen, what do

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Speaker 2: you make of the scene. It was totally ransacked, but

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Speaker 2: yet nothing of value was taken.

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Speaker 5: There is no doubt in my mind, Nancy, that what

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Speaker 5: Joe and Dale are saying is absolutely correct. I believe

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Speaker 5: that this is someone who knew he had time, who

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Speaker 5: planned how he was going to do this, who made

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Speaker 5: it look like absolutely this was just, you know, a

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Speaker 5: robbery or a spontaneous break in. And I think it's

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Speaker 5: really interesting that those draws are missing that I wonder

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Speaker 5: what kind of trophies he was able to take, because

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Speaker 5: that reminds me of something that would happen in a

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Speaker 5: scene like this, where the person who killed her would

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Speaker 5: want to have things that belonged to her to remember

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Speaker 5: and relive the scene, which you can be sure happened

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Speaker 5: over and over again.

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Speaker 2: To Ronnie Dahl, joining US investigative journalist and PI Ronnie

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Speaker 2: Dall Investigation dot Com.

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Speaker 1: I understand that.

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Speaker 2: The cause of death was asphyxiation and drowning. Detectas noted

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Speaker 2: originally that she was partially nude in the bathtub in

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Speaker 2: a very unnatural position.

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Speaker 1: What does that mean, Ronnie Dall.

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Speaker 10: You know, I can tell you in the beginning of

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Speaker 10: this case, they did not release that information. It was

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Speaker 10: it was months and months later before that information came out.

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Speaker 10: At first, they were saying it didn't appear to be

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Speaker 10: any trauma to the body, so part of that could

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Speaker 10: have been part of these investigations. They don't want to

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Speaker 10: release information in the beginning while they're still trying to

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Speaker 10: collect the evidence. But you have to remember this is

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Speaker 10: a small town. Half of the town's population is college students,

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Speaker 10: so as the investigation goes on, I don't think we

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Speaker 10: even found a lot of these details out until two fifteen,

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Speaker 10: and that was when some of this information came out

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Speaker 10: in an affric David for when they were trying to

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Speaker 10: arrest the father, Jim Turnquest. So it was a long

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Speaker 10: time before we found out some of this information.

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Speaker 2: Joining me is Kim Turnquist, Julia's mom and her sister,

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Speaker 2: Madison Turnquist. I'm curious, miss Turnquist, when they say she

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Speaker 2: your daughter, Julia was in an unnatural position, what do

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Speaker 2: they mean by that well.

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Speaker 4: From what I was told, she was partially nude and

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Speaker 4: her legs were like slipped up. It was like almost

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Speaker 4: like your swimming on your stomach and your legs you kind.

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Speaker 15: Of laying in a bound position.

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Speaker 1: Laying in a bound position. Is that what you're saying?

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Speaker 9: Yep, hands behind your back, legs bent up.

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Speaker 1: Got it? Got it?

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Speaker 2: Yes, an unusual position. Everybody jump in if you have

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Speaker 2: a thought on this. But to you, just Scott Morgan,

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Speaker 2: I find it very, very difficult to believe that DNA

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Speaker 2: cannot be obtained from inside the insides of plastic gloves

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Speaker 2: or when those bindings were put on her hands, her wrists.

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Speaker 2: When you tie something, you have to touch it, especially

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Speaker 2: inside the knots. Where's all that evidence? Has it been

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Speaker 2: compared for DNA in the system.

440
00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:34,840
Speaker 4: What we were told was that two DNAs were collected

441
00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:38,320
Speaker 4: from her, one from the glove, well, one from the

442
00:26:38,359 --> 00:26:40,480
Speaker 4: glove that she had blood in that They think that

443
00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:45,919
Speaker 4: if that maybe whoever it was, went to try to

444
00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:48,560
Speaker 4: shut Julia up or something and she bit down on

445
00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:53,080
Speaker 4: her bit down and drew blood from her lips. And

446
00:26:53,119 --> 00:26:55,679
Speaker 4: then they said that they found two male DNA on

447
00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:59,240
Speaker 4: her inner side. One was inconclusive and the other one

448
00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:03,520
Speaker 4: has a supposedly matched anybody in codis That's what we

449
00:27:03,520 --> 00:27:04,360
Speaker 4: were told.

450
00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:22,960
Speaker 2: Time stories with Nancy Grace, Joscott Morgan, Ronnie Dall.

451
00:27:23,320 --> 00:27:27,520
Speaker 1: Somebody jump in, explain to me about the DNA. Has

452
00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:29,520
Speaker 1: the DNA all of.

453
00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:35,920
Speaker 2: It be subjected to the most recent technology DNA comparisons

454
00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:41,160
Speaker 2: such as genetic family tree DNA or touch DNA.

455
00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:43,359
Speaker 1: What do we know.

456
00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:47,840
Speaker 2: About the DNA tests done on the DNA found at

457
00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:49,479
Speaker 2: the scene, Ronnie Dall, what do you know?

458
00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:52,199
Speaker 10: So that's part of the problem with this case is

459
00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:55,080
Speaker 10: even you know, ten eleven years later, you try to

460
00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:58,399
Speaker 10: put in for your Freedom of Information Act requests to

461
00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:00,439
Speaker 10: try to get some of this information and they're not

462
00:28:00,640 --> 00:28:05,040
Speaker 10: releasing it. But so really all we have to go

463
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:07,719
Speaker 10: on is what has been told to the family and

464
00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:10,679
Speaker 10: what's coming from a retired detective and what was in

465
00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:14,600
Speaker 10: that affidavit for the search warrant And so the DNA

466
00:28:14,880 --> 00:28:18,040
Speaker 10: from my understanding was to ask him mentioned you had

467
00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:22,080
Speaker 10: the two from two unknown male subjects that they have

468
00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:25,240
Speaker 10: not been able to place. Yes, yet, I don't know

469
00:28:25,280 --> 00:28:28,600
Speaker 10: how much DNA they do have. I know that all

470
00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:32,080
Speaker 10: the evidence is being processed by the Michigan State Police

471
00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:36,040
Speaker 10: Crime Lab. But you know they do hold on to

472
00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:38,200
Speaker 10: that evidence with the new technology.

473
00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:42,200
Speaker 2: An you said, Ronnie Dall is being processed or it

474
00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:45,080
Speaker 2: was processed well, or it was processed.

475
00:28:45,680 --> 00:28:49,360
Speaker 10: The status of where this investigation is today, you don't

476
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:51,600
Speaker 10: get any updates out of the police department.

477
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:54,080
Speaker 1: Thank you question today.

478
00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:57,280
Speaker 13: One of my questions, Nancy, when you know we're talking

479
00:28:57,280 --> 00:29:01,760
Speaker 13: about has been examined. I hope that they still have

480
00:29:02,080 --> 00:29:05,320
Speaker 13: retained a significant amount of DNA that can be tested.

481
00:29:05,720 --> 00:29:09,080
Speaker 13: You'd mentioned genetic DNA testing just a moment ago. Remember

482
00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:14,480
Speaker 13: compared to twenty twelve, this is relatively new technology light

483
00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:18,040
Speaker 13: years Yeah, it is. And you know, look, if this

484
00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:21,320
Speaker 13: individual is not in CODIS, which there's two categories in CODUS,

485
00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:23,600
Speaker 13: you have nones and then you have what's referred to

486
00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:27,360
Speaker 13: as the forensic database, that's unknowns that are out there.

487
00:29:27,880 --> 00:29:32,920
Speaker 13: So after that, the next leap is either phenotyping if

488
00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:34,800
Speaker 13: they're willing to do that, where you can come up

489
00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:39,120
Speaker 13: with a physical description of the individual, and or you

490
00:29:39,280 --> 00:29:42,840
Speaker 13: then plug it into a genetic database to try to see,

491
00:29:42,920 --> 00:29:44,280
Speaker 13: you know, the familial tree.

492
00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:46,120
Speaker 2: You know, I'm not even sure Jo Scott if they

493
00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:50,600
Speaker 2: were using mitochondrial DNA matches in twenty twelve. So if

494
00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:54,920
Speaker 2: you could even get part of the DNA, you can

495
00:29:54,960 --> 00:29:57,479
Speaker 2: make it matched on the mother's side. Yes, you can,

496
00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:00,680
Speaker 2: don't necessarily need. You can use like a hair, you

497
00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:03,880
Speaker 2: don't need the hair in nucleus. There's been so many

498
00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:07,840
Speaker 2: advances since twenty twelve, it's like light ears ahead. What

499
00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:12,480
Speaker 2: more do we know about how Julia was found dead?

500
00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:15,080
Speaker 1: Listen to Rachel Benia Crime Online.

501
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:19,400
Speaker 16: Opening the bathroom door, officers discovered Julia's lifeless, nude body,

502
00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:22,800
Speaker 16: face down, submerged in the bathtub filled with water. Her

503
00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:25,280
Speaker 16: hands are pulled behind her back, her feet are together,

504
00:30:25,360 --> 00:30:28,600
Speaker 16: and her cell phone is found underneath her body. Nice winterers.

505
00:30:28,680 --> 00:30:31,400
Speaker 16: Clothes have been cut off except for a sleeve and

506
00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:34,440
Speaker 16: are left on the bathroom floor. Police don't find the

507
00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:36,600
Speaker 16: instrument used to cut the clothes from her body.

508
00:30:36,800 --> 00:30:39,720
Speaker 2: Okay, I want to circle back to what we're hearing

509
00:30:40,560 --> 00:30:43,480
Speaker 2: Joe Scott Morgan. How would her body being submerged in

510
00:30:43,520 --> 00:30:47,160
Speaker 2: the bathtub water affect the recovery of DNA.

511
00:30:47,480 --> 00:30:49,840
Speaker 13: Well, there's a flushing that goes on, isn't there, Nancy?

512
00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:53,160
Speaker 13: When if there is? Okay, let's just say that you

513
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:58,520
Speaker 13: have topical DNA, you have a deposition of say forgive me,

514
00:30:58,600 --> 00:31:02,120
Speaker 13: but semen on the body or if even there's blood,

515
00:31:02,200 --> 00:31:06,120
Speaker 13: it can be compromised externally, you know, depended upon how

516
00:31:06,120 --> 00:31:08,440
Speaker 13: long she was in the water, if there was any

517
00:31:08,480 --> 00:31:11,320
Speaker 13: attempt to clean her in the water. Now, when we

518
00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:15,280
Speaker 13: get to this idea of perhaps a rape kit, that's internal,

519
00:31:15,480 --> 00:31:19,280
Speaker 13: so hopefully something could be found within there, But it

520
00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:22,400
Speaker 13: sounds like they're not having success in that.

521
00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:24,840
Speaker 2: Well, they have to get DNA from somewhere. They got

522
00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:27,160
Speaker 2: it from the gloves and her inner thigh.

523
00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:29,600
Speaker 13: Coming out of the glove and on the inner thigh.

524
00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:34,360
Speaker 13: Isn't that fascinating considering that she was submerged in water. Nancy,

525
00:31:34,440 --> 00:31:37,080
Speaker 13: one more thing about this that is really striking out

526
00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:39,959
Speaker 13: of all the cases that I've covered and worked in

527
00:31:40,000 --> 00:31:44,120
Speaker 13: my career, do you realize how rare homicidal drowning is

528
00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:47,760
Speaker 13: very rare. It's not something that occurs on a regular basis.

529
00:31:48,040 --> 00:31:51,400
Speaker 13: And this is a this goes to a degree of

530
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:54,720
Speaker 13: violence that you don't normally see because you know, what

531
00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:58,640
Speaker 13: they're talking about is that her tongue is actually lacerated.

532
00:31:58,840 --> 00:32:01,200
Speaker 13: That gives you an idea that she was forced or

533
00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:04,280
Speaker 13: held beneath the water. She bit her own tongue, is

534
00:32:04,280 --> 00:32:08,320
Speaker 13: what they're opining, but and nobody does that. Normally, you

535
00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:10,880
Speaker 13: can bite your tongue as you're eating something. But I

536
00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:13,959
Speaker 13: think that she was held underwater and she bit her

537
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:16,280
Speaker 13: tongue as a result of this force, and it last

538
00:32:16,360 --> 00:32:19,040
Speaker 13: rated her tongue. You've got a lot going on here,

539
00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:21,120
Speaker 13: and somebody has really really thought this through.

540
00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:27,520
Speaker 2: To Ronnie Dahl joining US private investigator and investigative reporter, Ronnie,

541
00:32:27,520 --> 00:32:30,840
Speaker 2: what can you tell me about potential video of the perp.

542
00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:33,280
Speaker 10: Well, that's one of the first things you do, especially

543
00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:37,360
Speaker 10: if you're in a small community near a college campus,

544
00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:39,800
Speaker 10: as you're looking for a video. But again twenty twelve,

545
00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:42,760
Speaker 10: we don't have the security cameras and the number of

546
00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:45,959
Speaker 10: security cameras that are around today. There was a video

547
00:32:46,040 --> 00:32:51,920
Speaker 10: from the apartment complex and from my understanding, the around

548
00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:55,120
Speaker 10: five point thirty in the morning I believe on December ninth.

549
00:32:55,720 --> 00:32:59,120
Speaker 10: The video did show an individual that was standing out

550
00:32:59,200 --> 00:33:02,239
Speaker 10: in the parking line near the trash dumpster, which was

551
00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:07,160
Speaker 10: close to Julia's apartment. The individual was seeing kind of

552
00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:10,400
Speaker 10: frustrated walking back and forth, pacing back and forth, back

553
00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:15,320
Speaker 10: and forth, but when police went back to get the video,

554
00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 10: they didn't pull it right away and unpertly the video

555
00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:22,240
Speaker 10: was recorded over.

556
00:33:22,600 --> 00:33:25,520
Speaker 1: How many times is that going to happen?

557
00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:27,840
Speaker 2: It first came to light in the Chandra Levy case,

558
00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:32,320
Speaker 2: where the video in her high rise in DC recorded over,

559
00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:35,040
Speaker 2: So we didn't know when she left, what was she wearing,

560
00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:37,000
Speaker 2: was she going jogging, was she dressed up? Was she

561
00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:41,880
Speaker 2: with anybody? But yet it's still happening. They recorded over

562
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:45,120
Speaker 2: the video. It's been reported there was an individual a

563
00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:48,120
Speaker 2: mail pacing back and forth and back and forth near

564
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:50,720
Speaker 2: the trash cans at the apartment. And isn't it true

565
00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:56,480
Speaker 2: Kim Turnquist that apparently Julian went out to empty the trash.

566
00:33:56,640 --> 00:33:59,040
Speaker 4: Well, that's what that's what there. That's what we were

567
00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:03,520
Speaker 4: told is that that Julia woke up that day, obviously

568
00:34:03,560 --> 00:34:07,800
Speaker 4: got ready for school, and made herself some breakfast, because

569
00:34:08,080 --> 00:34:11,880
Speaker 4: they did find eggs in her stomach, and then it

570
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:14,960
Speaker 4: appeared that she had taken her garbage out, So they

571
00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:17,439
Speaker 4: their theory to us was that they think she took

572
00:34:17,480 --> 00:34:22,480
Speaker 4: her garbage out and then she was followed in her apartment,

573
00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:26,120
Speaker 4: so that's how the person got got in. There's no

574
00:34:26,239 --> 00:34:30,239
Speaker 4: forced entry, but they think that they followed her in

575
00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:34,759
Speaker 4: when she went back into her apartment. I do want

576
00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:37,600
Speaker 4: to say too, that we did learn that they now

577
00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:41,279
Speaker 4: which didn't release to us before, that they think that

578
00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:44,680
Speaker 4: the theory is is that Julia was tortured all day long.

579
00:34:45,040 --> 00:34:48,360
Speaker 4: That this wasn't just a few hours that they followed

580
00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:51,359
Speaker 4: her in in the morning and that person didn't leave

581
00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:56,040
Speaker 4: until nighttime, so she had been in her room and

582
00:34:56,120 --> 00:34:58,399
Speaker 4: pretty much had been tortured all day.

583
00:34:58,600 --> 00:35:00,719
Speaker 1: Well, where was the roommate in the room? May have

584
00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:02,160
Speaker 1: been in and out during that time.

585
00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:06,560
Speaker 4: From what we were told, the one roommate was, but

586
00:35:06,640 --> 00:35:10,279
Speaker 4: she didn't hear anything, and the other one wasn't still there.

587
00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:12,800
Speaker 2: That doesn't make sense to me that she was held

588
00:35:12,920 --> 00:35:16,960
Speaker 2: and tortured all day long and the roommate was there

589
00:35:17,440 --> 00:35:21,080
Speaker 2: and didn't hear or see anything. But yeah, I mean,

590
00:35:21,520 --> 00:35:25,600
Speaker 2: nothing is out of consideration right now because it's been

591
00:35:25,640 --> 00:35:30,480
Speaker 2: this long and still no answers. Another thing we must

592
00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:31,960
Speaker 2: address this.

593
00:35:32,160 --> 00:35:33,160
Speaker 1: Listen to Dave Mack.

594
00:35:33,320 --> 00:35:36,160
Speaker 14: The night julian Ice Winder's body has found. Officer's note

595
00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:38,200
Speaker 14: how her mother is pacing back and forth at the

596
00:35:38,200 --> 00:35:41,120
Speaker 14: police station while her stepfather seems stoic as he sits

597
00:35:41,120 --> 00:35:43,759
Speaker 14: in the lobby, the first of several red flags that

598
00:35:43,840 --> 00:35:46,960
Speaker 14: lead investigators to take a closer look at Jim Turnquist.

599
00:35:47,239 --> 00:35:50,520
Speaker 14: Looking at Turnquist, the police asked for his laptop. He complies.

600
00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:54,880
Speaker 14: They ask for a polygraph. He complies twice and passes twice.

601
00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:58,160
Speaker 14: Investigators consult with the FBI and her encourage to take

602
00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:01,319
Speaker 14: a good look at Jim Turnquist. Ternquist is named a

603
00:36:01,320 --> 00:36:04,120
Speaker 14: person of interest and he's charged not in the death

604
00:36:04,120 --> 00:36:07,200
Speaker 14: of Julian nice Winder, but child pornography. There are three

605
00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:10,919
Speaker 14: hundred thousand pictures on his laptop, seven of which lead

606
00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:14,360
Speaker 14: to charges of child porn. At trial, experts testify the

607
00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:17,200
Speaker 14: seven photos are in timp folders and could have been

608
00:36:17,239 --> 00:36:19,520
Speaker 14: pop up ads. You can't even tell the age of

609
00:36:19,560 --> 00:36:22,239
Speaker 14: the people in the pictures. Turnquist is acquitted of the

610
00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:25,440
Speaker 14: child porn charges, but nothing has moved forward on the

611
00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:26,880
Speaker 14: murder of Julia Nicewinder.

612
00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:32,600
Speaker 2: To Julia's mom, Kim Turnquist, what do you make of

613
00:36:32,680 --> 00:36:37,600
Speaker 2: them them charging your then husband? Isn't it true you

614
00:36:37,880 --> 00:36:41,799
Speaker 2: gave him a rock solid alibi for the time during

615
00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:42,920
Speaker 2: which Julie was killed.

616
00:36:43,160 --> 00:36:49,120
Speaker 4: Yes, so here's that whole thing? Is so absurd. So

617
00:36:49,320 --> 00:36:52,120
Speaker 4: we live in Monroe, which I said earlier is about

618
00:36:52,160 --> 00:36:56,000
Speaker 4: forty five minute drives. And let me tell you, yes,

619
00:36:56,080 --> 00:36:58,800
Speaker 4: I'm I'm a person who gets up in the middle

620
00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:01,719
Speaker 4: of the night all the time. Jim was home with me,

621
00:37:02,200 --> 00:37:05,520
Speaker 4: sleeping in the bed with me, got up that same

622
00:37:05,600 --> 00:37:08,799
Speaker 4: morning to go to work like he usually does. I

623
00:37:08,840 --> 00:37:11,719
Speaker 4: did the same thing. He was home all night long

624
00:37:12,160 --> 00:37:16,480
Speaker 4: and all this The story with Jim is just absurd.

625
00:37:17,000 --> 00:37:22,200
Speaker 4: I you know, I never I just I couldn't believe

626
00:37:22,239 --> 00:37:24,279
Speaker 4: what they were trying to do to him. And I'll

627
00:37:24,360 --> 00:37:27,880
Speaker 4: be honest, the firstly detective on the case, he is

628
00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:32,200
Speaker 4: the one who has spoken up recently. The other one

629
00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:34,840
Speaker 4: is the one who tried to do all this stuff,

630
00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:37,719
Speaker 4: who had I hate to say it this way, but

631
00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:40,880
Speaker 4: I think she had heard Jim. She just wanted to

632
00:37:40,960 --> 00:37:44,200
Speaker 4: solve the case, to put another salt case in her pocket.

633
00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:51,080
Speaker 4: This child pornography was absolutely ludicrous to even charge him

634
00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:56,320
Speaker 4: with that. I still get very upset with that because

635
00:37:56,880 --> 00:38:00,600
Speaker 4: you know, it has affected all of our lie in

636
00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:05,319
Speaker 4: different ways, and mainly Gems, because people accused him of

637
00:38:05,400 --> 00:38:09,840
Speaker 4: these things, and I think that it's just it's ridiculous.

638
00:38:10,040 --> 00:38:14,000
Speaker 4: They wanted to find someone to pin this murder on.

639
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:15,520
Speaker 4: And that's what they did.

640
00:38:15,400 --> 00:38:19,880
Speaker 2: Didn't a friend of Julius state that mister Tarnquist had

641
00:38:20,320 --> 00:38:21,759
Speaker 2: made advances.

642
00:38:21,200 --> 00:38:24,320
Speaker 4: On her, you know what. So that's what they said.

643
00:38:24,680 --> 00:38:28,400
Speaker 4: But then when you talked to her, she said that

644
00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:31,520
Speaker 4: she had never said that, that she would testify to

645
00:38:31,560 --> 00:38:35,799
Speaker 4: that if had to. That that was never said. And unfortunately,

646
00:38:35,880 --> 00:38:40,680
Speaker 4: during that time, my family was torn apart because the

647
00:38:41,040 --> 00:38:44,960
Speaker 4: police were telling my family certain things and making my

648
00:38:45,080 --> 00:38:48,719
Speaker 4: family believe that, you know, all these things were going

649
00:38:48,760 --> 00:38:49,640
Speaker 4: on and they weren't.

650
00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:50,040
Speaker 1: Guys.

651
00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:52,319
Speaker 2: I want to address what we do know. We know

652
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:58,080
Speaker 2: that the father, mister Tronquist, wi suspected he was a

653
00:38:58,080 --> 00:39:02,440
Speaker 2: person of interest. He passed two polygraphs and was found

654
00:39:02,480 --> 00:39:06,800
Speaker 2: not guilty by a jury on other charges of child

655
00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:10,880
Speaker 2: porn seven photos out of hundreds and hundreds and hundreds

656
00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:11,520
Speaker 2: of photos.

657
00:39:11,719 --> 00:39:12,480
Speaker 1: What does that mean.

658
00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:16,160
Speaker 2: I've never had child porn pop up on my computer,

659
00:39:16,719 --> 00:39:18,840
Speaker 2: but a jury found him not guilty.

660
00:39:19,680 --> 00:39:20,880
Speaker 1: Now what do we know?

661
00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:25,919
Speaker 2: We know his wife and his daughters gave him an

662
00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:30,240
Speaker 2: alibi and that they lived a good distance away from

663
00:39:30,520 --> 00:39:38,719
Speaker 2: the crime scene. That said, who killed Julia? I guarantee

664
00:39:38,719 --> 00:39:42,000
Speaker 2: you this. I guarantee you that male DNA and those

665
00:39:42,040 --> 00:39:46,399
Speaker 2: gloves have been run against the stepdad.

666
00:39:46,560 --> 00:39:47,840
Speaker 1: You agree with that, Joe.

667
00:39:47,640 --> 00:39:49,200
Speaker 13: Scott, Yes, I agreed.

668
00:39:49,440 --> 00:39:52,600
Speaker 1: So I mean, I don't care what he did before.

669
00:39:52,840 --> 00:39:56,200
Speaker 2: I don't care if he was guilty or innocent on

670
00:39:56,360 --> 00:40:00,839
Speaker 2: anything before. All I care about is who ca Julia,

671
00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:04,399
Speaker 2: Kim Madison? Anybody on this panel? Do you know if

672
00:40:04,400 --> 00:40:07,160
Speaker 2: they ran the DNA panel from the crime saint against

673
00:40:07,200 --> 00:40:07,799
Speaker 2: the step dad?

674
00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:08,680
Speaker 1: Yes or no?

675
00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:09,200
Speaker 12: Yes?

676
00:40:09,320 --> 00:40:12,840
Speaker 1: Okay? Who's speaking? Is this Madison or Kim Kim? Okay?

677
00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:16,280
Speaker 1: If they got a match on that, he would be charged.

678
00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:21,960
Speaker 4: It has totally changed changed our lives. Everyone who you know,

679
00:40:22,440 --> 00:40:26,839
Speaker 4: every family member that has been touched by this. You know,

680
00:40:26,960 --> 00:40:32,319
Speaker 4: our life is not the same without Julia. Family was

681
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:36,520
Speaker 4: really important to her, and you know, and then as

682
00:40:36,560 --> 00:40:41,200
Speaker 4: you heard all the other accusations from twenty fifteen, you

683
00:40:41,239 --> 00:40:44,800
Speaker 4: want to talk about, you know, losing a daughter to

684
00:40:45,840 --> 00:40:49,239
Speaker 4: a murder and no one being arrested, and then you have,

685
00:40:49,840 --> 00:40:53,160
Speaker 4: you know, people trying to accuse at the time your

686
00:40:53,280 --> 00:40:54,879
Speaker 4: husband of something that.

687
00:40:55,520 --> 00:40:58,400
Speaker 9: He would never ever do, and you have.

688
00:40:58,280 --> 00:41:02,000
Speaker 4: To deal with all the public when you know, saying

689
00:41:02,080 --> 00:41:05,320
Speaker 4: things about you, whispering behind your back. We got we

690
00:41:05,440 --> 00:41:10,320
Speaker 4: got death threats. You know, you know your youngest child,

691
00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:13,680
Speaker 4: Remember she was ten in twenty twelve, so she was

692
00:41:13,719 --> 00:41:18,120
Speaker 4: thirteen in twenty fifteen going to school and dealing with

693
00:41:18,280 --> 00:41:23,600
Speaker 4: kids saying things like it had totally changed our whole

694
00:41:23,680 --> 00:41:27,319
Speaker 4: lives in so many different ways, and you know that

695
00:41:27,360 --> 00:41:31,000
Speaker 4: things will never be the same. I still to this

696
00:41:31,120 --> 00:41:36,520
Speaker 4: day will get messages and accusing people of things and

697
00:41:36,920 --> 00:41:40,120
Speaker 4: they just people can be cruel and you're trying to

698
00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:42,920
Speaker 4: deal with the death of your daughter, and you know,

699
00:41:43,040 --> 00:41:45,760
Speaker 4: deal with that. And now the fact that it's eleven

700
00:41:45,880 --> 00:41:49,640
Speaker 4: years and it hasn't been solved, and you know, for

701
00:41:49,680 --> 00:41:54,800
Speaker 4: a while there under old management at the IFC Police Department,

702
00:41:55,120 --> 00:41:57,640
Speaker 4: you know, you weren't getting any cooperation, you weren't getting

703
00:41:57,840 --> 00:42:03,080
Speaker 4: getting any communication. And now we are in talks with

704
00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:07,920
Speaker 4: the new chief, which we are happy about. He communicates

705
00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:11,480
Speaker 4: to us and we really think that with this chief

706
00:42:11,840 --> 00:42:14,239
Speaker 4: in place, that we will have a good chance of

707
00:42:15,040 --> 00:42:18,319
Speaker 4: getting some assistance, that he won't be afraid to ask

708
00:42:18,360 --> 00:42:22,520
Speaker 4: for assistance, and that Julia's case may finally get solved.

709
00:42:23,160 --> 00:42:26,440
Speaker 4: So but it is affect. It has changed our lives

710
00:42:26,440 --> 00:42:29,520
Speaker 4: in so many ways, so many ways.

711
00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:33,319
Speaker 9: Well, nobody really underd truly understands what it does to

712
00:42:33,360 --> 00:42:37,000
Speaker 9: the ten year old that has to grow up, you know, now,

713
00:42:37,040 --> 00:42:38,000
Speaker 9: being I'm.

714
00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:40,840
Speaker 17: Twenty one now, nobody.

715
00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:42,919
Speaker 9: Asked me when I was a kid, you know how

716
00:42:42,960 --> 00:42:48,400
Speaker 9: I felt, how all of it affected me. Yeah, changed,

717
00:42:48,400 --> 00:42:49,160
Speaker 9: It changed.

718
00:42:48,840 --> 00:42:49,520
Speaker 15: My life a lot.

719
00:42:49,680 --> 00:42:51,200
Speaker 8: My sisters.

720
00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:53,440
Speaker 9: I was a little sister, but I was the protector

721
00:42:53,560 --> 00:42:57,840
Speaker 9: over my sisters. The last thing that I did with

722
00:42:57,960 --> 00:43:00,719
Speaker 9: Julia will spend you know, little sieves weekend.

723
00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:04,640
Speaker 15: With her and you know, build, not build, but create,

724
00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:05,000
Speaker 15: you know.

725
00:43:05,280 --> 00:43:08,640
Speaker 9: A heart on her wall made out of you know photos.

726
00:43:10,560 --> 00:43:12,560
Speaker 15: She was my biggest supporter.

727
00:43:12,920 --> 00:43:15,960
Speaker 9: She anytime that I come around is oh my god,

728
00:43:16,040 --> 00:43:19,200
Speaker 9: my little sister, my little sister. That she would you know,

729
00:43:19,320 --> 00:43:22,000
Speaker 9: introduce me to all her friends. I was like, I

730
00:43:22,239 --> 00:43:24,680
Speaker 9: literally felt like a famous person when I was hanging

731
00:43:24,719 --> 00:43:29,440
Speaker 9: out with my sister when everything had happened. After she

732
00:43:29,640 --> 00:43:34,200
Speaker 9: passed away, I kind of became a support system for

733
00:43:34,280 --> 00:43:36,920
Speaker 9: the family because you know, I have a mom who

734
00:43:37,239 --> 00:43:39,040
Speaker 9: I have parents that are dealing with the grief of

735
00:43:39,080 --> 00:43:42,080
Speaker 9: their child, and then I have my other sister who

736
00:43:42,200 --> 00:43:43,800
Speaker 9: is grieving the loss of her twins.

737
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:49,000
Speaker 15: And so I spent a lot of you know, the

738
00:43:49,080 --> 00:43:49,520
Speaker 15: first you.

739
00:43:49,520 --> 00:43:52,360
Speaker 9: Know, six years of Julia's murder being you know, a

740
00:43:52,400 --> 00:43:55,480
Speaker 9: support system to my family. It wasn't until I was

741
00:43:55,520 --> 00:43:57,360
Speaker 9: sixteen that I went to my parents and said, I

742
00:43:57,440 --> 00:44:00,319
Speaker 9: need help. I need to go to counseling. I need

743
00:44:00,400 --> 00:44:03,080
Speaker 9: to agree with my sister in the right way. And

744
00:44:03,200 --> 00:44:06,960
Speaker 9: I still grieve her. There are so many things now

745
00:44:07,120 --> 00:44:10,839
Speaker 9: in my life, being twenty one, that I would want

746
00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:12,120
Speaker 9: to have my sister here for.

747
00:44:12,760 --> 00:44:14,400
Speaker 15: I graduated high school.

748
00:44:14,160 --> 00:44:16,440
Speaker 9: When I wanted to drop out because of everything that

749
00:44:16,520 --> 00:44:20,200
Speaker 9: I went through with her, with her murder and accuse,

750
00:44:20,280 --> 00:44:23,480
Speaker 9: the false accusations on my dad. I was ready to

751
00:44:23,600 --> 00:44:29,120
Speaker 9: drop out in the sixth grade. Through I graduated high school.

752
00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:33,439
Speaker 9: I started a trade school college two to three months

753
00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:36,080
Speaker 9: after I graduated high school. A matter of fact, I

754
00:44:36,200 --> 00:44:39,600
Speaker 9: graduated high school four months early compared to everybody else.

755
00:44:41,760 --> 00:44:43,960
Speaker 17: But my sister wasn't here for that, and she should

756
00:44:44,000 --> 00:44:47,799
Speaker 17: have been. My sister would have been screaming my name

757
00:44:47,920 --> 00:44:51,520
Speaker 17: and cheering for me at my graduation, but I didn't

758
00:44:51,600 --> 00:44:52,280
Speaker 17: get any event.

759
00:44:53,400 --> 00:44:58,000
Speaker 9: I now own my own dog training business. She would

760
00:44:58,040 --> 00:45:01,440
Speaker 9: be my number one supporter, She would my number one networker.

761
00:45:01,560 --> 00:45:03,520
Speaker 9: She would be like, what do you need medicon? I'm

762
00:45:03,520 --> 00:45:05,719
Speaker 9: want to tell everybody they got a dog, go to

763
00:45:05,800 --> 00:45:06,120
Speaker 9: my sister.

764
00:45:06,200 --> 00:45:07,440
Speaker 15: You got a dog, Go to my sister.

765
00:45:07,719 --> 00:45:09,160
Speaker 9: That would have been hurt.

766
00:45:09,640 --> 00:45:12,160
Speaker 15: She would have been here for it all and I.

767
00:45:12,280 --> 00:45:14,800
Speaker 9: Want her to be But obviously that can't happen.

768
00:45:15,239 --> 00:45:17,439
Speaker 1: I want to move forward. We don't have the video,

769
00:45:17,800 --> 00:45:18,880
Speaker 1: we don't have DNA.

770
00:45:19,600 --> 00:45:20,560
Speaker 10: What do we have?

771
00:45:21,480 --> 00:45:26,760
Speaker 2: That's where Jason Jensen comes in, private investigator at Jensen

772
00:45:26,960 --> 00:45:31,960
Speaker 2: Private Investigations dot com. Is it true that you have

773
00:45:32,080 --> 00:45:38,680
Speaker 2: agreed to cover expenses to retest the DNA sopig can

774
00:45:38,760 --> 00:45:39,200
Speaker 2: be done?

775
00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:40,240
Speaker 1: Is this true?

776
00:45:40,520 --> 00:45:43,440
Speaker 12: Yes, it is true, Nancy. I mean what we have

777
00:45:43,680 --> 00:45:45,840
Speaker 12: and what we've discussed so far is the fact that

778
00:45:45,960 --> 00:45:50,920
Speaker 12: there was SDR DNA ran through codis well, that's the

779
00:45:51,000 --> 00:45:54,879
Speaker 12: old technology. You have to really start from scratch again.

780
00:45:55,080 --> 00:45:59,080
Speaker 12: In order to in order to do genetic genealogy, you

781
00:45:59,160 --> 00:46:01,680
Speaker 12: have to have snipped, so you have to run through

782
00:46:01,960 --> 00:46:03,920
Speaker 12: hold genome sequence exactly.

783
00:46:04,600 --> 00:46:07,320
Speaker 2: So now it will be a matter of obtaining the

784
00:46:07,480 --> 00:46:10,960
Speaker 2: DNA from LA Law enforcement in order for you to

785
00:46:11,120 --> 00:46:15,080
Speaker 2: do the test. If you know or think you know

786
00:46:15,480 --> 00:46:20,279
Speaker 2: anything about the murder of this beautiful young girl, call

787
00:46:20,400 --> 00:46:24,600
Speaker 2: toll free one eight hundred, Speak Up one eight hundred, seven,

788
00:46:24,719 --> 00:46:27,880
Speaker 2: seveny three two five eight seven.

789
00:46:28,080 --> 00:46:32,919
Speaker 1: We wait as justice unfolds. Goodbye friend,