Speaker 1: Hey, hey, hey, we're back.
Speaker 2: We're black, we're brown and ambiton.
Speaker 3: Hey manma come through baritone the lower register. Well, we
Speaker 3: are praying that your internet let us do this episode,
Speaker 3: come on Optimum.
Speaker 1: I just I don't know what to do, honestly, I
Speaker 1: uh ba fam if you because where I live in Newark,
Speaker 1: they're literally the only game in town. And for some reason,
Speaker 1: it's just been going in and out. I literally bought
Speaker 1: a brand new router, a brand new modem, all the
Speaker 1: things I've had tech come out three times, I've tweeted,
Speaker 1: I don't know what to do?
Speaker 3: You know, and this is a social justice is you?
Speaker 3: It is a humanitarian crisis. It is a civil rights issue.
Speaker 3: We need our internet.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just you know, we need especially now more
Speaker 1: than ever we did our internet. So I'm honestly, I
Speaker 1: don't I'm not sure like what to do. I mean,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna call them again and be like, uh please,
Speaker 1: somebody something so we shall see.
Speaker 2: So have you been Oh.
Speaker 4: I've been great.
Speaker 3: I just celebrated my five months of being a freelancer,
Speaker 3: being an entrepreneur, which is cool. Ways already, I know,
Speaker 3: I was doing the math and I was like, surely
Speaker 3: not five months of having a human took a lot
Speaker 3: longer than five months of being an entrepreneur. Yeah, five
Speaker 3: whole months. And I have a I have a meeting
Speaker 3: with Well, Me and husby have a session with my
Speaker 3: dear dear financial planner Helen tomorrow too. And it's our
Speaker 3: first call since the call we had when she was like,
Speaker 3: you should just go independent, and I said, you make
Speaker 3: it sound so easy, and then I did it. So
Speaker 3: it's kind of a touch base. And you know, I
Speaker 3: don't know what we're going to talk about in particular,
Speaker 3: but she'll probably want to look at my cash flow
Speaker 3: and how things are going, and I'm.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's it's been.
Speaker 3: It's been a good I kind of was like into
Speaker 3: my fields last night about it because I feel like
Speaker 3: I've done really damn well for five half in business.
Speaker 2: First of all, you were number one trending on CNBC. Okay, yeah,
Speaker 2: I still got it.
Speaker 1: A yeah, I was out of the girl. It's so crazy.
Speaker 1: My friend Cabrel texts me. He was like, isn't this
Speaker 1: your friend, Mandy, She's on my phone.
Speaker 4: No.
Speaker 3: I feel like the little kid's sister who goes to
Speaker 3: college after their big sister who was like Valedictorian. Yeah,
Speaker 3: it's been really freakin fantastic and I have Yeah, so
Speaker 3: I'm excited to talk to Helen. And I've just been
Speaker 3: kind of I'm kind of approaching my whole business kind
Speaker 3: of quarterly, and my first quarter was like is this
Speaker 3: even a thing? And it definitely is. So for the
Speaker 3: last few months of this year, I'm actually trying to
Speaker 3: slow slow down. I'm trying to take in less work
Speaker 3: because it's been like just pouring in and actually focus
Speaker 3: on investing time into something that hopefully will pay off.
Speaker 3: But I have to really spend the time to do
Speaker 3: it and then hopefully I can launch it towards the
Speaker 3: end of the year. So big things popping. But it's
Speaker 3: been a fun ride. What about you.
Speaker 2: Honestly, it's been like it's been really good over here.
Speaker 1: I mean we have been I've been making the transition
Speaker 1: from like, you know, I don't know, a personality brand.
Speaker 1: I mean we always I've always had like a business
Speaker 1: behind the scenes, but we had some real opportunities to
Speaker 1: like quadruple business.
Speaker 2: If we buckle down and do the necessary work.
Speaker 1: So like we're totally overhauling the Literature Academy and as
Speaker 1: a result, if we do like I we always do
Speaker 1: projections for the year, like we should be you know,
Speaker 1: like potentially just under twenty million dollars next year and
Speaker 1: then fifty in the next three years if we do
Speaker 1: what we're supposed to do. But none of that is
Speaker 1: like instagrammables, you know what I mean, Like I had
Speaker 1: to the transition for me has been difficult in reminding
Speaker 1: myself like although you know, social media and things can
Speaker 1: be fun, that I have to be mindful that, you know,
Speaker 1: I want to put things in place where you know,
Speaker 1: I all this work has been for something, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean. So just making those transitions, they are
Speaker 1: like a lot of behind the scene things that have
Speaker 1: nothing to do with like you know, external stuff that
Speaker 1: like we're really putting into place and buckling down to
Speaker 1: be like a business business business, and so it's just exciting. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And so that's what's been happening. It's just been a
Speaker 1: lot of We've been a lot of growing up in business.
Speaker 1: Like so I can literally feel like, oh, this is
Speaker 1: the next level for us.
Speaker 2: So so yeah.
Speaker 3: But I know we have what is that I just
Speaker 3: wanted to share. There's this quote that we actually shared
Speaker 3: on our social from MICHAELA. Coles. She was the woman
Speaker 3: who just won an Emmy. I think she was the
Speaker 3: first black woman or a black person ever to win
Speaker 3: an Emmy for writing of a series. She wrote the
Speaker 3: series This May Destroy You, And one of her viral
Speaker 3: quotes from that acceptance speech was, do not be afraid
Speaker 3: to disappear from it, from us for a while and
Speaker 3: see what comes to you in the silence. And she
Speaker 3: really was speaking to like, get the f off social
Speaker 3: media and go do the damn thing.
Speaker 1: So I'm telling you what I tell you, Like that's
Speaker 1: six weeks away that I took and then consequently not
Speaker 1: coming back to social media like full time. I have
Speaker 1: not been really back. I took all the apps off
Speaker 1: my phone. I only put it on when I go live.
Speaker 1: Then I take them off again and I let the
Speaker 1: team do their posting. It has done more for business
Speaker 1: for me than anything else. And so I encourage people
Speaker 1: to take a moment. Don't get me wrong, Like our
Speaker 1: engagement is not as high as it was. But I
Speaker 1: had to tell my team today honestly, I don't care because.
Speaker 2: That doesn't pay the bills, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Like it does it not in a concrete way like
Speaker 1: what we're going to be able to do as a
Speaker 1: result of the choices that we're making now. It is
Speaker 1: transformative for my team, it is transformative for the women
Speaker 1: that we serve. It's transformative for myself and my family.
Speaker 1: It's transformative for our community. It's just like the things
Speaker 1: that we're doing now because we have the space to
Speaker 1: do it. I'm just excited about It's just the next
Speaker 1: phase of business. Like you know, we're officially going to
Speaker 1: go from small to medium sized business to like a
Speaker 1: business business. Like you know, we we have the potential
Speaker 1: to be nine figures, you know, if we focus, which
Speaker 1: we are. And so yeah, don't be afraid to take
Speaker 1: the step back. Everything is not social medium, you know.
Speaker 1: Once you learn that you don't need the external applause,
Speaker 1: you know, then you can navigate differently and navigat in
Speaker 1: a way that's more meaningful.
Speaker 3: Absolutely. Well, I'm excited for you. I know all the
Speaker 3: hard work you're doing in the background. Well no, I don't,
Speaker 3: cause you keep it under wraps. But anyway, I know
Speaker 3: you're out there working and walking and listening to your
Speaker 3: audio books and getting the damn thing done.
Speaker 4: Well.
Speaker 1: We have speaking of books, we have an exciting guest today.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so you met our guest today, Christine Platt, at
Speaker 3: a book signing, because you know, that's just how a
Speaker 3: normal tuesday for you, signing your best selling book. But no,
Speaker 3: I'm so excited because Christine Platt is our guest today
Speaker 3: and she is called the Afro Minimalist, and her new
Speaker 3: book is literally a blueprint for anyone looking to cut
Speaker 3: back on the things that we are over consuming, you know,
Speaker 3: letting pile up in our homes, in our spaces that
Speaker 3: are just stifling us and stifling our growth. And she's
Speaker 3: got some really fun gems to share.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so you guys are gonna enjoy Christine.
Speaker 3: Well, shall we take a little breaky break, and we'll
Speaker 3: come back with our guest today, Christine, And definitely check
Speaker 3: the show notes and you can find where to follow her,
Speaker 3: where to get her book again, The Afrominimalist, and how
Speaker 3: to catch up on all of her amazing advice.
Speaker 1: We told you we were coming back with somebody amazing
Speaker 1: we have with us, Christine Platt, a k a. The
Speaker 1: Afro Minimalists. Okay, Oh you didn't know black people could
Speaker 1: be minimalists? Oh you know, yeah, everybody, everybody doesn't want
Speaker 1: the you know, the Grandma field House with the plastic
Speaker 1: furniture and the chachkis everywhere.
Speaker 2: Some people, you know, they thrive with lesson.
Speaker 1: Yes, So I just so you like, I met Christine
Speaker 1: in person anyway, for the first time at Mahogany Books,
Speaker 1: and that is National Harbor.
Speaker 2: Christine, is that DC or is that Maryland?
Speaker 4: Is technically oxen Hill, Maryland, but you know we claim
Speaker 4: it in DC.
Speaker 1: So and so we met at this amazing black bookstore
Speaker 1: called Mohockey Books. They were having a book bookstore opening.
Speaker 1: Shout out to Ramanda and your amazing husband. It just
Speaker 1: we just really clicked and we just got to talking.
Speaker 1: And now I was like, you need to come on
Speaker 1: the podcast, and yeah, you know.
Speaker 4: I'm so happy to be here. Thank you both for
Speaker 4: having me. I'm so excited.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, I'm excited to meet you too. And I think
Speaker 3: even just Tiffany when she came back from that book
Speaker 3: signing that y'all did together, she was just gushing about you.
Speaker 3: And then we couldn't stop talking about the connection between
Speaker 3: your idea of afrominimalism and minimalism in general and how
Speaker 3: it relates to finances. So I would love to just
Speaker 3: have you describe or like define what do you mean
Speaker 3: by afrominimalism. And for those of you who haven't ever
Speaker 3: seen Christine, she's literally like a minimalist with no afro,
Speaker 3: just a delightful you have a perfectly shaped head for
Speaker 3: the shape dome you beautiful. But tell us something.
Speaker 4: It's a teeny weeny afro. Okay, it's there, microfro, yes, microfro,
Speaker 4: minimalist fro. Yeah it was. It was wonderful meeting Tiffany
Speaker 4: in person at Mahogany Books, and I think it's I
Speaker 4: just want to shout us both. We are both number
Speaker 4: one and number two in sales at that store. So
Speaker 4: I think it speaks volumes to you know, people's interest
Speaker 4: in finances and you know their over consumption right now. Uh, afrominimalism,
Speaker 4: it's really just my approach to minimalism, which is a
Speaker 4: minimalist lifestyle influenced by the African diaspora. I am a
Speaker 4: historian and lawyer by trade, and you know the history
Speaker 4: of black folks is really important to me. I love
Speaker 4: the beauty and culture of the African diaspora, and so
Speaker 4: I weave that into my approach to minimalism, which at
Speaker 4: the time, so this is about five years ago when
Speaker 4: I first like really honed in on this approach, it
Speaker 4: was very unconventional, right. I think people think of minimalism
Speaker 4: number one, it evokes this idea of scarcity and lack, right,
Speaker 4: But even more than that, it's devoid of color, it's
Speaker 4: devoid of texture, it's devoid of culture.
Speaker 2: Right. Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's like super Scandinavian and we are like not
Speaker 4: in most of us are not in, you know, in
Speaker 4: a country where you know that particular aesthetic. The reason
Speaker 4: it works for you know, for for Scandinavian folks is
Speaker 4: because they don't get a lot of sunlight, and so
Speaker 4: they need a lot of light colors, a lot of
Speaker 4: white walls to reflect light.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 4: But yeah, and so you know, mainstream minimalism has sort
Speaker 4: of taken on this aesthetic of you know, of just
Speaker 4: being all white and barren, and I just really wanted
Speaker 4: to to change the conversation around that, and so and
Speaker 4: so here I am the afrominimalist. I wrote a book
Speaker 4: to try and encourage folks to live with less and
Speaker 4: that you know, I saw so many benefits and I
Speaker 4: would say, like right out the gate the first benefit
Speaker 4: that I saw where it was in my wallet, Right,
Speaker 4: I was like, where's all this money coming from? Like, oh,
Speaker 4: I'm not at the mall uh every weekend. And so yeah,
Speaker 4: it's been very transformative for me and very exciting to
Speaker 4: just see other people, you know, really embracing this and
Speaker 4: really thinking about, you know, how can they live with
Speaker 4: less their way? If the word minimalism, you know, if
Speaker 4: it does evoke some negative feelings or you know, ideas
Speaker 4: of scarcity, you don't have to be a minimalist. You
Speaker 4: can live with less, you can be a more mindful consumer.
Speaker 4: There are so many other ways to define this lifestyle
Speaker 4: that that isn't so limiting for a lot of people.
Speaker 1: So if I was somebody I'm listening and I'm just like,
Speaker 1: you're right, I probably never thought of myself a person
Speaker 1: of color, you know, enjoying the minimalist lifestyle, you know,
Speaker 1: because you know, I want some texture. I want some
Speaker 1: color and some deep hues. So if I am like, oh, huh,
Speaker 1: aside from getting your books, okay, everywhere, aside from getting
Speaker 1: your book, what's like the first thing where I can
Speaker 1: start where it doesn't feel so overwhelming?
Speaker 4: Yes, Okay, So this is. I'm so glad you asked
Speaker 4: that question, because so many people picked up the book
Speaker 4: and they were like, I had my garbage bags ready,
Speaker 4: I wasn't ready for the gentle dragging that happened. I
Speaker 4: really encourage people to first learn about the psychology of
Speaker 4: ownership before they even start to try and declutter. Right,
Speaker 4: So this is where you hear so many people say,
Speaker 4: I've tried this before and it didn't work. I've tried
Speaker 4: this before and it didn't work. And that's because they
Speaker 4: didn't get to the root causes of their over consumption. Right.
Speaker 4: So much of this is inner work right before you
Speaker 4: do the outer work. And I know even when it
Speaker 4: comes to finances that that's the same sort of approach
Speaker 4: for me. Right, it's like why am I so afraid to,
Speaker 4: you know, make this call or manage my money this way,
Speaker 4: or learn about that right, Like, there's usually some root
Speaker 4: cause that is really the reason what I call like
Speaker 4: the why behind the buy or the why behind the spend. Right,
Speaker 4: Because if you don't do the inner work, if you
Speaker 4: don't understand the psychology of ownership, specifically as it relates
Speaker 4: to you and your spending habits, you're just gonna declutter
Speaker 4: and find yourself back at square one. So when I
Speaker 4: talk about the psychology of ownership, that means first of all,
Speaker 4: understanding why you have so much more than you need,
Speaker 4: and then secondly understanding why it's so hard to let go, right,
Speaker 4: because we all have attachments to things and getting to
Speaker 4: the root cause of like why am I so attached,
Speaker 4: you know, to this piece? So that's where you can start.
Speaker 3: You mentioned the diaspora, I mean, are like have you
Speaker 3: found in your research or in your book? Do you
Speaker 3: do you examine how? Because I mean I think anecdotally.
Speaker 3: I just visited my aunt Brenda, and I don't the
Speaker 3: things that she saves, I just don't know. I just
Speaker 3: don't understand. I mean, dusty old toys. And she had
Speaker 3: like an old Barbie doll that was a cowboy from
Speaker 3: maybe nineteen ninety seven or something like that. Anyway, and
Speaker 3: it wasn't even a black Barbie doll. That was nothing.
Speaker 3: But what is this something that black households or African
Speaker 3: American households are just more inclined to hang on to things?
Speaker 3: Was it?
Speaker 4: You know? You know, that's a that's a good question.
Speaker 4: So I think it's twofold, right, So when we talk
Speaker 4: about people of the diaspora, particularly particularly African Americans, right,
Speaker 4: so many of us are first time everything, right, first
Speaker 4: time homeowners, first time six figure income owners, first you know,
Speaker 4: first one in our you know, in our family to
Speaker 4: have an opportunity to own a business. Right. So many
Speaker 4: of us are first time so many things. And what
Speaker 4: happens is that we don't have that sort of generational
Speaker 4: knowledge and awareness that comes when you're not first gen Right.
Speaker 4: The second thing is like, we just have a completely
Speaker 4: different relationship with ownership. It's just a fact, right, So
Speaker 4: many of us it is the first time we're able
Speaker 4: to acquire a lot of things. And I find that
Speaker 4: in particularly Black families, right, it really goes back to
Speaker 4: our childhood. It really grows goes back to if you
Speaker 4: grew up with scarcity, right, or if you grew up
Speaker 4: you know, not being able to have certain things. And
Speaker 4: a lot of those promises that we make to ourselves,
Speaker 4: make to ourselves as children, we are very committed to
Speaker 4: as adults.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 4: One of the examples that I provide in the book
Speaker 4: is actually my ex husband, who is a huge sneaker head,
Speaker 4: and he shared how when he was in high school
Speaker 4: his family would not, you know, like most black families
Speaker 4: could not afford the first pair of Jordan's, and instead
Speaker 4: his parents bought him a pair of knockoffs. I did laugh,
Speaker 4: I'm not gonna lie because the silhouette of Michael Jordan,
Speaker 4: there was another person like blocking Michael Jordan, and I
Speaker 4: just thought about, like how horrible the teasing was. He
Speaker 4: said it was relentless, and he made a promise to
Speaker 4: himself when he got older that he was going to
Speaker 4: buy however many pairs of sneakers he wanted, and he
Speaker 4: counted and like the majority, let's say there were like
Speaker 4: sixty pairs, forty two of them were Jordan's, right, So
Speaker 4: like getting to that root cause. And then I also
Speaker 4: want people to think about Mandy the idea that it's
Speaker 4: not just you know, we think shoes, we think purses,
Speaker 4: we think handbags, but it impacts us in so many
Speaker 4: different ways. My friend's husband when he washes the dishes,
Speaker 4: he likes to use a lot of dishes that like
Speaker 4: the bubbles are overflowing out of the sink. And I would,
Speaker 4: you know, if my friend would complain to me, and
Speaker 4: I'd be like the girl he is washing the dishes
Speaker 4: I don't understand why you complaining about these bubbles. And
Speaker 4: she would just say, like, Christina is just so annoying,
Speaker 4: and I just don't understand why he does it. And
Speaker 4: I said, whatever you have? You ever asked him? And
Speaker 4: she asked him, And you know what. He grew up
Speaker 4: in the South, very poor, was raised by his grandmother.
Speaker 4: Basically everything they purchased came from the dollar store, including
Speaker 4: dish soap, and even then he could only use one drop.
Speaker 4: And he told her, now that he's older and they
Speaker 4: have the resources and means to buy whatever they want,
Speaker 4: he buys the most expensive dish soap and he uses
Speaker 4: as much as he wants, and he finally puts his bubbles.
Speaker 3: I was going to guess that it was because, you know,
Speaker 3: if you're broke, you take that one little inch left
Speaker 3: over of the don dish soap and you add water water.
Speaker 3: You need a bunch of homes, listen.
Speaker 4: I mean when I don't, Oh my god, this is
Speaker 4: Tiffany hate yo.
Speaker 2: He hates it. He's always like, babe, we have soap.
Speaker 2: I'm like wasted just a little.
Speaker 4: I know, you know it is so you know, it
Speaker 4: is so funny, Tiffany. I use a solid dish soap.
Speaker 4: Because of course minimalism, you keep finding other ways, right,
Speaker 4: like you start with your closet and then it transitions
Speaker 4: into every air of your life. And even with the
Speaker 4: solid soap, it comes in a little tin, you know,
Speaker 4: like there'll be some water in there, and I'm like, oh,
Speaker 4: let me just that's extra dish soap, Like I I don't,
Speaker 4: I don't know what it is. But you know, if
Speaker 4: I think back to my childhood, you know, even if
Speaker 4: it wasn't dollar store dish soap, the dish soap that
Speaker 4: we did use, it was like for dishes, it was
Speaker 4: bubble bath.
Speaker 3: It was it wasn't bubbled back.
Speaker 1: I get hand soap in the My husband, Hey, he said,
Speaker 1: did you put the hand soap in the or the
Speaker 1: dish shap in the in the in the the hand
Speaker 1: like so if you go on my half bath, if
Speaker 1: if I'm like, where's I will put? I will squeeze
Speaker 1: the dawn dish soap that when I tell you, Superman,
Speaker 1: is this why black.
Speaker 3: People were so ashy? Because we're secretly using don dish.
Speaker 2: So clean hands or not?
Speaker 4: You know what? I love that we're having this conversation
Speaker 4: because we don't think back to how our childhood and
Speaker 4: the things that we you know, we're accustomed to, like
Speaker 4: Mandy saying like, no, y'all didn't use just Mandy, I'm
Speaker 4: telling you it was it was it was bubble It
Speaker 4: was bubble bath, right. And you know I am also
Speaker 4: of the generation, and you have to think just age wise,
Speaker 4: we we're not that far apart in age. They still
Speaker 4: you know, like if there were four kids, like no
Speaker 4: one was changing the bath water. M m hmm. You
Speaker 4: see what I'm saying. So like if you come from
Speaker 4: you know, that's sort of even if it doesn't feel
Speaker 4: because it didn't feel like scarcity when we were younger.
Speaker 4: It was just like, oh, it's a bubble bath, right,
Speaker 4: But then you grow up and you're like, oh, they
Speaker 4: make actual bubble back. So I didn't know, right, Like.
Speaker 3: You know, kind of a jerk sometimes laughing at my
Speaker 3: aunt when she like saves the wet paper towel after
Speaker 3: she WAPs something up, and she just.
Speaker 2: Like, girl, I did not know.
Speaker 1: We people threw away the foil pants because we had
Speaker 1: to wash them out as kids, like you know, Thanksgiving,
Speaker 1: the foil pants, Like we washed them out and you
Speaker 1: use them until they got to be too disfigured, and
Speaker 1: I'm like, so dressed on me. My husband's on me
Speaker 1: washing it, and he's like, why are you washing out
Speaker 1: the four pants?
Speaker 2: I'm like, you these are expensive?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 2: What are two more uses?
Speaker 4: Yeah? But you know what, Mandy, I love that you
Speaker 4: brought that up about your aunt, because so much of
Speaker 4: this is also generational, right, And so I like to
Speaker 4: tell people too, to think about not only what you
Speaker 4: grew up experiencing, but thinking about what your parents experience.
Speaker 4: So for my for example, my mom was born after
Speaker 4: the Great Depression, shortly after the Great Depression. So even
Speaker 4: though she didn't experience food scarcity to the extent that
Speaker 4: you know her, her family did, who were alive during
Speaker 4: that time. It certainly impacted how they raised her. And
Speaker 4: so even though I did not grow up with food
Speaker 4: and security, I grew up feeling very, very obligated to
Speaker 4: clean my plate. Right even today, even if I know
Speaker 4: good and well, I'm not going to take those I'm
Speaker 4: not going to eat those leftovers when I get home.
Speaker 4: I still I can't throw it away, you know what
Speaker 4: I mean, I'm like, who can eat this? Who can? Right?
Speaker 4: And so like thinking about generationally right, folks who were
Speaker 4: born after the Great Depression or had family members you know,
Speaker 4: who raised them shortly after that time. Are they are
Speaker 4: real different when it comes to consumption. They are either
Speaker 4: over consumers right because they grew up hearing stories you
Speaker 4: never know what's going to happen. Live for today because
Speaker 4: tomorrow wein promised, right, or they are extreme quarters they
Speaker 4: are reusing the paper towels. My mom doesn't even drink
Speaker 4: caffeinated coffee if she is here, which, by the way,
Speaker 4: I don't know why decaf is even a thing, but whatever. Siously,
Speaker 4: But if she's here and I have just a little
Speaker 4: bit of you know, caf, and I go to no, no, no,
Speaker 4: don't throw that down the drain, I'm like, Mommy, you
Speaker 4: don't even you know, I don't waste it. Don't waste it? Right,
Speaker 4: So you also have to think generationally and.
Speaker 3: Be more empathetic to them. And yeah, so I can't
Speaker 3: make fun of my dad for why he has a
Speaker 3: Samuraid sword and a popcorn machine that doesn't work in
Speaker 3: his living room. I can't do that anymore.
Speaker 4: Is that what I'm saying. I don't. I don't think
Speaker 4: you should make fun.
Speaker 3: And part of my identity.
Speaker 1: I don't think the big TV's little TV doesn't work anymore.
Speaker 2: Remember I'm back in the day you have the big
Speaker 2: TV on the little TV, the little bit TV. It
Speaker 2: don't work no more.
Speaker 1: But we're not ready to throw it out because you
Speaker 1: never know, you might fix it.
Speaker 3: It's funny to make fun of our elders. But let's
Speaker 3: talk about the modern you know, millennials of today or
Speaker 3: gen Z. What are you finding because I imagine you get
Speaker 3: stories from so many people and you mentioned your ex's
Speaker 3: sneaker addiction. I actually hoard. I was just making a
Speaker 3: joke about hoarding things that I save to my desktop.
Speaker 3: I just don't want to delete them, and so my
Speaker 3: desktops cluttered. But like, what are the modern ways you find?
Speaker 3: You know, our generation is you're seeing these trends kind
Speaker 3: of manifest the sense of scarcity and how it can
Speaker 3: potentially harm us.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you know it again. It also it goes two ways, right,
Speaker 4: I see a lot of folks in your generation really
Speaker 4: not wanting to repeat some of the decisions. And I'm
Speaker 4: trying trying to be very mindful with language because I
Speaker 4: don't like to call things mistakes or wrongdoings. Right, these
Speaker 4: are decisions and choices that they experienced, you know, growing up,
Speaker 4: that they do not want to replicate, and so I
Speaker 4: see them being very intentional not to do that. I
Speaker 4: also see a lot of folks in your generation who
Speaker 4: are also for gen right, and so they are buying
Speaker 4: all the things, and they are you know, really trying
Speaker 4: to you know, subscribe to conspicuous consumption. I have to
Speaker 4: have this thing that was in this Instagram ad or
Speaker 4: I have to have this because it is a status symbol, right.
Speaker 4: And then what I'm finding, you know, with with some
Speaker 4: of their parents and older folks, is you know this
Speaker 4: idea that hey, I didn't I wasn't even aware of
Speaker 4: my consumption to that level. And I don't want my
Speaker 4: uh you know, descendants, so your generation, Mandy, to have
Speaker 4: inherited clutter. So I'm you know, and.
Speaker 3: You say with that, in fact, I'm pretty sure the
Speaker 3: key to his storage unit is in his will for me,
Speaker 3: and that is my that is what I'm going to
Speaker 3: be bequeathed. I would be, but you know what, I
Speaker 3: am the heir to a storage a storage facility in Atlanta.
Speaker 2: Are you fancy?
Speaker 3: I hate it for you, Mandy, And honestly, like I wait.
Speaker 4: I do encourage I do encourage folks in your generation
Speaker 4: to have these conversations with their elders, right, because right
Speaker 4: now we can laugh about it. And I even think
Speaker 4: of some of the things that I have encouraged my
Speaker 4: mom to just gently let go. It's time to let go, right.
Speaker 4: I know that it would be that much harder when
Speaker 4: she has transitioned. Right. And so you have a lot
Speaker 4: of people my generation, your generation, who also have an
Speaker 4: inherited clutter, and that is even more problematic to do
Speaker 4: with me.
Speaker 3: He wants to talk about death and clutter in the
Speaker 3: same insurance. Listen, ma'am with your parents, Oh my god,
Speaker 3: talk about things I will get hung up on so fast.
Speaker 4: This is why oh no, go ahead.
Speaker 2: To no, no, no, no, go ahead, go ahead, go ahead.
Speaker 4: No. I was gonna say, this is why that we
Speaker 4: thank you. This is why, though, we have to have
Speaker 4: these conversations, because the first reaction is exactly what your
Speaker 4: reaction is, mate. It's like, ooh, I want to talk
Speaker 4: about that. I don't want to get cursed out. I
Speaker 4: don't want it right, but then be inevitable will happen, right,
Speaker 4: And we're like, where are these papers? Where is that
Speaker 4: who's going to take this? What do we do with that?
Speaker 2: Right?
Speaker 4: And it's much more difficult to do that when you're
Speaker 4: in such a state of emotional vulnerability, right. And so
Speaker 4: it's not to say to sit them down at a
Speaker 4: coffee table and say, look, I'm not doing this in
Speaker 4: here to clutter with y'all. So we're about you know
Speaker 4: what I mean. I'm not saying have that conversation in
Speaker 4: that way, But what I'm saying is making sure that
Speaker 4: the people in your family are very much aware of
Speaker 4: your position on this, right. And even if you have siblings, right, like, hey,
Speaker 4: you know Dad is probably going to leave that storage unit.
Speaker 4: I just need y'all to know I will not be
Speaker 4: taking anything out of there, right, And so we need
Speaker 4: to you know, I just want to give you all
Speaker 4: the heads up on that that when the time comes,
Speaker 4: we get right. There are ways to sort of gently
Speaker 4: have these conversations, or at least start these conversations. And
Speaker 4: what I have found is most people, you think there's
Speaker 4: going to be a visceral reaction, and there's not. People
Speaker 4: are fully aware of their unpreparedness. People are fully aware
Speaker 4: of their clutter. People are fully aware of their poor finances, right,
Speaker 4: it's really having someone spark that conversation, spark that inspiration, right,
Speaker 4: And I'm sure you all see that all the time, right,
Speaker 4: people are like, oh, I didn't even know what to
Speaker 4: do about savings until I found y'all. Right, the information
Speaker 4: is out there, but it's hearing it from a source
Speaker 4: that is respected, right, a loved one. But these conversations
Speaker 4: are inevitably going to happen.
Speaker 1: For someone who's on the edge of like, well, I
Speaker 1: think I want to do this, but I want to
Speaker 1: get more clarity on what are the benefits, right, especially
Speaker 1: for diaspora to participate in minimalism, Like aside from oh, okay,
Speaker 1: there's less stuff in my house, but what truly truly
Speaker 1: are the benefits for us in particular?
Speaker 4: Yeah, So, first, because I want to make sure that
Speaker 4: people understand getting through that psychology of ownership piece is
Speaker 4: like where you start, right, And then I have a
Speaker 4: four step approach that I think anyone can follow at
Speaker 4: their own pace, which is step one acknowledging that you
Speaker 4: have more than you need. Step two, which is forgiving yourself.
Speaker 4: Forgiveness is also not really talked about when it comes
Speaker 4: to this type of work. Part three is the letting go,
Speaker 4: which is what we see on television. You can call
Speaker 4: it decluttering, you can call it whatever you want. And
Speaker 4: then part four is paying it forward, right with those
Speaker 4: things that no longer serve you. And I think one
Speaker 4: of the biggest benefits for me has been having an
Speaker 4: opportunity to pay it forward and be smarter with my resources. Right.
Speaker 4: For example, as you all know, my daughter is in college.
Speaker 4: I'm super proud, and you know I was first jen.
Speaker 4: I had a lot of student loan debt. It was
Speaker 4: completely overwhelming. It is unbelievable to me that I am
Speaker 4: able to pay her tuition, her room and board, everything
Speaker 4: so that she does not have student loan debt. Right,
Speaker 4: that is huge, And that is the result of a
Speaker 4: decision that I made five years ago, not ten years ago,
Speaker 4: not twenty years ago, five years ago. Right. That means
Speaker 4: what are the benefits going to look like in ten years?
Speaker 4: But even more so, what are the long term benefits
Speaker 4: for my daughter? Right? Of course, as you said, having
Speaker 4: less to clean is wonderful, right, having fewer choices to
Speaker 4: make in the morning about what you're gonna wear, because
Speaker 4: decision fatigue is real, right, Like, that's beneficial right, having
Speaker 4: resources to not only invest in building generational wealth and
Speaker 4: invest in your children, but also to invest in your community.
Speaker 4: I'll give you a quick example. I have two very
Speaker 4: dear friends who are writers who do a lot for
Speaker 4: our community, that do a lot for our babies. Shout
Speaker 4: out to Mahogany Brown and Jason Reynolds.
Speaker 2: A poet.
Speaker 4: She is yes, I remember, yes, yes.
Speaker 2: I used to go. I was very central. I be
Speaker 2: at all the poetry shows that she was one of
Speaker 2: my favorite poets.
Speaker 4: Isn't she amazing? She is still out here doing amazing things.
Speaker 4: She is the poet in residence, the first poet in
Speaker 4: residence for the Lincoln Center. And I literally have watched
Speaker 4: both of them just like spread themselves than doing this work.
Speaker 4: And they're is a wonderful organization here in DC called
Speaker 4: HOURU Space which offers a weekend of rest and reset
Speaker 4: for folks of colors, for folks of color. And what
Speaker 4: I did was give them both a stay, right, this
Speaker 4: is what they need, and here is an opportunity for
Speaker 4: me to invest in this business, invest in my friends.
Speaker 4: And also this is like what would I have done
Speaker 4: with that back five years ago? I would have used
Speaker 4: that money to purchase a handbag, here's an opportunity for
Speaker 4: it to help three lives, right, And so I think
Speaker 4: when we think of benefits, to also think beyond ourselves, right,
Speaker 4: to think again, even beyond our family and our loved ones,
Speaker 4: think about our community, right, Like, there are so many
Speaker 4: like myriad benefits y'all. And it is a lifestyle that
Speaker 4: I encourage people to considering and doing it your own way,
Speaker 4: right Obviously, Uh, me as a now empty nester, my
Speaker 4: minimalism is going to look totally different than Mandy's. My
Speaker 4: minimalism is going to look totally different than Tiffany's, right,
Speaker 4: but doing it in a way that is beneficial to
Speaker 4: you and your household and your long term goals.
Speaker 3: Do I get a last question?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Yeah, my last question was going to be so for
Speaker 3: me and for people listening. I think even last week
Speaker 3: we had a guest on Deli Ane Boos who we
Speaker 3: were talking about, uh, you know, online shopping and how
Speaker 3: easy they make it for you to make these impulse
Speaker 3: buying you know decisions online. Now you save your credit card,
Speaker 3: get your face ID. You don't even have to do anything,
Speaker 3: get off the couch to bank a purchase. Do you
Speaker 3: have any rules of thumb or tips for people on
Speaker 3: how if you were trying to get a hold on
Speaker 3: unnecessary or overspending or over consumption. Any any tips on
Speaker 3: like here's the rule of thumb, or here's a tip
Speaker 3: where you can, you know, ask yourself this before you
Speaker 3: purchase something, or try doing this just to kind of
Speaker 3: come to grip. Yeah, the constant triggers we have.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so I love to ask that question because I
Speaker 4: have a lot of mantras. I shared one with you earlier,
Speaker 4: which is what's the why behind the by My other
Speaker 4: one though, is it's not a deal if you don't
Speaker 4: need it, and saying that, like when I go to
Speaker 4: pick up something, when I go to put something in
Speaker 4: my cart, right, because it's usually we're enticed by a
Speaker 4: sale or the idea that we're getting a bargain, and
Speaker 4: I have to be like, it's not a deal if
Speaker 4: you don't need it, Christine, you know, do not. I
Speaker 4: don't care how it auto populates unsafe all of the
Speaker 4: card information. There have been so many times, especially during
Speaker 4: the past year and a half because of the pandemic
Speaker 4: we're all in. You know's some emotional vulnerability here, which
Speaker 4: usually can can trigger some of our spending habits. You know,
Speaker 4: there were times I would go to buy something and
Speaker 4: because I would have to go to get my wallet,
Speaker 4: I would be like, you don't want this, right, Like,
Speaker 4: it's really whatever systems you have to put in place
Speaker 4: to pause, because it's usually that pause. Right, you have
Speaker 4: to be very mindful of you know, online it is
Speaker 4: very easy, as you said, right, unsubscribed, unsubscribe from all
Speaker 4: of your favorite brands. And you know, like you buy
Speaker 4: something renmibition. Ah, yes, no, this is a favorite brand. No, Like,
Speaker 4: you know, you purchased something online and it automatically saves
Speaker 4: your email and then all of a sudden, the next
Speaker 4: thing you know, you're getting ads all the time, right,
Speaker 4: or here's a new sale and I you know, there's
Speaker 4: always going to be a sale. I have never seen
Speaker 4: so many, you know, a semi annual sales only supposed
Speaker 4: to happen twice a year, semi y'all just had a
Speaker 4: semi annual sale last month, right, So like this idea
Speaker 4: that you know, and again it goes back to the
Speaker 4: psychology of ownership. We feel like we're gonna miss out.
Speaker 4: We feel like someone else is going to get the deal.
Speaker 4: And when we when we touch something, when we hold something,
Speaker 4: all of those things start to trigger partial ownership, and
Speaker 4: we become very committed to wanting to have full ownership.
Speaker 4: So don't go around touching stuff, Mandy, That's first thing, right,
Speaker 4: And when it comes to when it comes to you know,
Speaker 4: your online spending, just try and put some systems in
Speaker 4: place that make it harder, that make you pause before
Speaker 4: you make that purchase and ask yourself, what's the wide
Speaker 4: Why am I really buying this?
Speaker 3: What's super sid pandemic? I lost my credit cards in
Speaker 3: my wallet during the pandemic. I didn't even need it.
Speaker 4: I didn't even need it.
Speaker 3: Because everything we saved it was terrible. Okay, I lied, though.
Speaker 3: I have one final final question. How do you stop
Speaker 3: people from giving your kids stuff? Because the problem like
Speaker 3: I literally have relatives who listen to the show and
Speaker 3: I'm talking to you, they know who I'm talking to.
Speaker 3: If you have friends who have kids, they're just so
Speaker 3: happy to give you stuff that ends up being you
Speaker 3: become their donation beIN. And then now I'm on a
Speaker 3: finger out doing with this stuff that I don't do
Speaker 3: what I want, you know what I mean? And then
Speaker 3: it's gifts, Yes.
Speaker 4: Go, Mandy, no is your superpower, right, you have to
Speaker 4: just say no. And I you know, I tell people
Speaker 4: all the time because like, my kid has so much stuff,
Speaker 4: and I'm like, do they have a job that I
Speaker 4: don't know about? Right, Like this is coming through you
Speaker 4: either you're buying it or you're allowing it into their
Speaker 4: lives and they're completely overwhelmed with all of these things. Right.
Speaker 4: You know, once you are firm on that, you have
Speaker 4: to be real firm. Might take two or three times.
Speaker 4: People will respect it, Your loved ones will respect it.
Speaker 4: But if you're like oh, and then you still end
Speaker 4: up taking stuff, no one believes you. Right. So also
Speaker 4: when it comes to gifts, I think it's really important
Speaker 4: to think about different ways that we can celebrate those
Speaker 4: milestones like birthdays and holidays. Right, the only birthday party
Speaker 4: that my daughter remembers and that she says is her
Speaker 4: best birthday party ever in life was her eighth birthday party.
Speaker 4: And I was just starting to think about, you know, minimalism.
Speaker 4: We just had so much stuff. I couldn't bear the
Speaker 4: idea of bringing another tiny little thing in this house.
Speaker 4: And I remember saying, you know what, instead of gifts,
Speaker 4: I'm just gonna have kids bring a canned good and
Speaker 4: we'll just donate it to the food pantry. I had
Speaker 4: this big elaborate moon bounce and carnival set up in
Speaker 4: the backyard, and one can good was supposed to be
Speaker 4: their price of admission. Mandy, do you know the night
Speaker 4: before and the morning of, I just started getting all
Speaker 4: of these text messages from parents and they're like, what
Speaker 4: is this again? I thought we were just supposed to
Speaker 4: bring one can. My kid is in here raiding the patry.
Speaker 4: They're making us go to the grosser and they are
Speaker 4: just naturally naturally giving, right, and we have tons of
Speaker 4: tons of donations. So thinking about different ways and then
Speaker 4: lastly encouraging your kids to let go and pay it forward. Now,
Speaker 4: the one caveat that I always say, do not look
Speaker 4: in that bag. Okay, give them a bag. It's all
Speaker 4: in the approach. If you go in there with the
Speaker 4: bag and you're like, it's too much stuff in here,
Speaker 4: get rid of some of it. Now, it evokes a
Speaker 4: different reaction if you go in there and say, wow,
Speaker 4: you know what, you are really blessed. You have a
Speaker 4: lot of wonderful things. There are so many kids in
Speaker 4: our community that don't. Can you if I give you
Speaker 4: this bag, can you go around and just you know,
Speaker 4: donate some things that you think that they might love.
Speaker 4: Your feelings will be so hurt when you realize all
Speaker 4: the things that your children really don't want or need,
Speaker 4: right and how willing that they would be to give
Speaker 4: that to another child if they knew that it would
Speaker 4: make them happy.
Speaker 1: What my step daughter sold her, she sold her American
Speaker 1: Girls doll for like five dollars at a at a
Speaker 1: we had like a like a garage stale, you know,
Speaker 1: I mean, because you know those are like two three
Speaker 1: hundred dollars.
Speaker 4: We did that American Girl dollar life. I know that
Speaker 4: doll lived a good life.
Speaker 1: They're so expensive. And then to see that she was
Speaker 1: so excited to do. We're like, we're gonna have a
Speaker 1: garage show, you know, Alyssa, just go in your things
Speaker 1: and pull out what you don't want.
Speaker 2: She just put He looked he was like a raven,
Speaker 2: like bye, yeah, that they about you last year. Five dollars.
Speaker 4: I know.
Speaker 2: The pair who bought it was like.
Speaker 3: So, but it's sold on eBay for two hundred.
Speaker 1: So it's just to your point, Christine, it's you, you
Speaker 1: know the stuff that we give our kids sometimes, you know,
Speaker 1: we we have more of emotional attachment to giving them
Speaker 1: things and they actually have and receiving those things.
Speaker 4: So to be mind that, you know, a lot of
Speaker 4: that is our own unfulfilled childhood once. Right, Like my
Speaker 4: daughter had American, that girl, Oh, that doll of a
Speaker 4: good life. It had a bed, it had clothes, she
Speaker 4: played the violin, It had a violin, right like, it
Speaker 4: was out of it was out of control. And I remember,
Speaker 4: you know, decluttering and going through all these things, and
Speaker 4: I was like, this is this is the life that
Speaker 4: I wanted my dolls to have. Right, So some of
Speaker 4: that stuff is us fulfilling our own unfulfilled childhood once.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I got to get better at saying no, and
Speaker 3: maybe don't do it the morning of Christmas when you're
Speaker 3: stressed out and another package has been delivered and it's
Speaker 3: a remote control driving car and you tell your father
Speaker 3: never no more toys and he.
Speaker 4: Hangs up on it. Yeah, you need to get get
Speaker 4: that email, that no out, that email out ahead of him.
Speaker 3: To say no in different language. Just now there's all
Speaker 3: these grandparents, well.
Speaker 2: No in Spanish. It's still now.
Speaker 4: It's still a lot of words to it when mother
Speaker 4: in law. Okay, but you know what, Mandy, you can
Speaker 4: also like redirect them, right, so you know what, he
Speaker 4: really does not need another remote control car instead, what
Speaker 4: we're doing this year for Christmas is fill in the
Speaker 4: blank or what I would also tell people who would
Speaker 4: just be what I felt was like not respecting boundaries.
Speaker 4: After certain times you say no, you're like, I really
Speaker 4: don't want it, right, I would say, just so you know,
Speaker 4: I mean, I told you we're trying to live with less.
Speaker 4: We're not taking in all of these toys. Are you
Speaker 4: comfortable with me donating this to an organization in need?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 4: So it's like that redirect too, right, So you got
Speaker 4: some options, Mandy.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I gotta brush up on my intermediary Spanish to
Speaker 3: get to that level of conversation. But this has been
Speaker 3: such a wonderful, wonderful conversation. Thank you so much, Christine,
Speaker 3: thank you both for having me.
Speaker 1: Can you let folks know, like you know, what your
Speaker 1: book is, where they can get it and where they
Speaker 1: can continue.
Speaker 4: Yes, yes, so this is my book see Afro Minimalist
Speaker 4: Guide to Living with Less or I probably have eaten
Speaker 4: something right there, but that's the book. And you can
Speaker 4: find me online. I'm very active on Instagram, have a
Speaker 4: you know, a wonderful community discussions there, and I am
Speaker 4: at Afrominimalist and you can also find me on the
Speaker 4: web under the same name.
Speaker 3: Thank you, well, thank you, thank you, thank you for
Speaker 3: coming on. I love this conversation. Yes, I've you gave
Speaker 3: me a lot to think about personally, so thank you
Speaker 3: for joining us.
Speaker 4: All check Christine.
Speaker 3: Check our show notes for all her links.
Speaker 4: Yes, thanks