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Speaker 2: Welcome in What Drive with Nick rit Episode two forty four.

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Speaker 2: I felt it only appropriate to sheepshually wear Celtic screen

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Speaker 2: demand's you're on the precipice, my friend. This is I

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Speaker 2: don't think you've ever experienced really a championship for any

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Speaker 2: of your teams, No, because I mean you're you're kind

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Speaker 2: of a Chiefs fan, Like you don't root against the Chiefs,

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Speaker 2: but you don't claim the Chiefs because you're not from

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Speaker 2: You don't really claim Kansas City. You don't have a

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Speaker 2: baseball team. The Celtics have been your team ever since

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Speaker 2: you had a Ray Allen fathead on your wall growing up,

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Speaker 2: and you, I mean technically you were you know, you

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Speaker 2: were obviously alive for their last championship, but you weren't

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Speaker 2: a Celtics fan in two.

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Speaker 3: That was when I feel like I first became a

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Speaker 3: Celtics fan. Was when they were facing Kobe in the finals.

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Speaker 4: Like it was like.

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Speaker 3: I almost want to say, it was like one of

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Speaker 3: the first basketball games I've seen.

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Speaker 2: Yes, but I think it was the finals they lost.

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Speaker 2: I think it was.

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Speaker 4: You are right about that.

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Speaker 2: They didn't. Yes, yes, they beat Kobe in the eight finals.

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Speaker 2: They won the twenty ten finals. I'm sorry they lost

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Speaker 2: the twenty ten finals. So yeah, so this is this

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Speaker 2: is a good moment for you, This is a good

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Speaker 2: moment for the folks of Boston who were so kind

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Speaker 2: to me a few days ago. Not a great moment

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Speaker 2: for me, not a great moment for Luka Doncic. And

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Speaker 2: we will discuss all of that, and in fact, let's

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Speaker 2: just get right into all of that. So here's what

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Speaker 2: missed the cut Lamar and I bury the hatchet. How

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Speaker 2: about this? Lamar sent this tweet that I missed. He

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Speaker 2: sent it just hours after he sent that picture of

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Speaker 2: the probiscus monkey with the long nose saying no, not

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Speaker 2: cousin Nick's list. That's my guy for real, just kicking

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Speaker 2: from the net. One hundred emoji and then a Raven's

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Speaker 2: colored heart, which made me feel a little bad when

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Speaker 2: I did the exact same list on television yesterday. But

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Speaker 2: I like Lamar, I root for Lamar. I just gotta

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Speaker 2: be honest. There was never a man, There was never

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Speaker 2: a more obvious. This has to be some marketing ruse

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Speaker 2: than Joey Jessnup banned from the Nathan tot dog eating contest.

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Speaker 2: Chessnu versus Kobe Yashi's gonna be on Labor Day on

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Speaker 2: Netflix and who could have seen this coming? The Lakers

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Speaker 2: are gonna interview JJ Reddick this weekend, but we've got

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Speaker 2: to start with Game three of the finals and these

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Speaker 2: Thermo nuclear Luca takes so de monse go ahead.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: So the Mavericks needed the win last night. They couldn't

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Speaker 3: pull it out.

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Speaker 2: Uh.

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Speaker 3: Luca fouled out with about four minutes left in the

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Speaker 3: fourth quarter. Kyrie obviously couldn't handle the load.

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Speaker 4: After he left, A few media.

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Speaker 3: Members are blaming Luca and saying that his pouting and

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Speaker 3: whining towards the rev is causing them the game or

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Speaker 3: the series. So Lucas never faced any heat like this

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Speaker 3: or eating backlash.

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Speaker 4: Do you think that? Do you think it's at all warranted?

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Speaker 2: Okay, So I am going to try once again to

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Speaker 2: preserve my title as the most honest and fair man

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Speaker 2: in sports media, and that means criticizing my large adult

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Speaker 2: Slovenian son where it's warranted, and it also might mean

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Speaker 2: pumping the brakes on some of the hyperbole that really

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Speaker 2: got rolling by my dear friend Brian Windhorse right after

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Speaker 2: the game. And I am not talking bad about Brian.

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Speaker 2: And in fact, I texted with Brian this morning and

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Speaker 2: I'm not going to you know, I'm not going to

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Speaker 2: reveal private text, but I will say what my first

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Speaker 2: text was too hard on Luca exclamation point, and I

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Speaker 2: will I don't think Brian would be mad. I will

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Speaker 2: reveal his first text back to me, which was that's

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Speaker 2: been a big problem for Luke in his career, people

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Speaker 2: being too hard on him. I sent some sarcasm there, Brian,

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Speaker 2: and then we went back and forth and I also

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Speaker 2: told him a take I had that he replied to

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Speaker 2: with don't go with that, but I am going to

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Speaker 2: go with it at some point. So here, here's the thing.

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Speaker 2: Wendy crushed him, absolutely crushed him. Everyone since then has

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Speaker 2: joined the crushing. Here to me are the fair criticisms,

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Speaker 2: and then I will get into where I think we've

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Speaker 2: lost the plot a bit fair criticism. It's the god

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Speaker 2: Doog NBA Finals, and you cannot give up five on

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Speaker 2: four transition baskets because you are either barking at the

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Speaker 2: ref or laying on the ground trying to sell a

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Speaker 2: call that can't happen. That is on Luca, undeniably, that's

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Speaker 2: on Luca. I'm going to say another one. It is

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Speaker 2: the NBA Finals. Your team can't win without you, which

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Speaker 2: is an important element here. Even if you think you're

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Speaker 2: getting hosed by the refs, which Luca always thinks, he

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Speaker 2: usually has a bit of an argument, but there is

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Speaker 2: clearly a boy who cried Wolf element to it, which

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Speaker 2: is if you're always complaining, then we don't know if

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Speaker 2: it's actually a missed call. There was a sequence early

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Speaker 2: in the game when Luca throws It was kind of

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Speaker 2: an encapsulation of what is got to be frustrating for Luca.

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Speaker 2: He throws a perfect lob to Derek Lively, Lively misses

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Speaker 2: the dunk, they get the offensive rebound, Luca drives to

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Speaker 2: the basket, gets fouled twice on the play. They don't

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Speaker 2: call either foul. They say Maverick's ball, and then the

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Speaker 2: Celtics challenge and it's like, well, he got fouled twice,

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Speaker 2: but the ball went off him, so the calls overturned.

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Speaker 3: So you want to call that a no question foul though,

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Speaker 3: like that that's like what I like, That's another one

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Speaker 3: of those things.

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Speaker 4: I didn't really see the clear foul in that.

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Speaker 3: You tell them when he threw it out of bounds

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Speaker 3: and they and they called it on They called it

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Speaker 3: on Boston initially, and then they challenged it overturned it.

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Speaker 2: So you're if you're I am talking about when Boston

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Speaker 2: challenged it, but if you don't think it was clear foul,

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Speaker 2: then you're thinking of a different play. It's not. When

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Speaker 2: he threw it out of bounds, he was going up

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Speaker 2: for a layup. He gets fouled on the arm by

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Speaker 2: Jalen Brown and then fouled on the hand by Drew Holliday.

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Speaker 2: The broadcast said when they that about how obvious he

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Speaker 2: was fouled twice, so that again, I'm just setting a

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Speaker 2: context here. I wish we could pull the video for

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Speaker 2: the pod, but he complained every time. So in that instance,

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Speaker 2: maybe if he didn't conduct himself the way he normally does.

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Speaker 2: If you then go to the refs and say, man,

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Speaker 2: I got fouled twice on that and now it's gonna

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Speaker 2: be Celtic's ball, maybe they feel like they owe you one.

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Speaker 2: They're never gonna feel like they owe Luca anything, And

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Speaker 2: that's on him and the way he treats the refs

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Speaker 2: from opening tip to the end of the game, that

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Speaker 2: is a fair criticism. Him being hunted defensively is obviously happening.

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Speaker 2: That is a fair criticism. I think what we are

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Speaker 2: seeing is that there is one guy in league history

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Speaker 2: that's been able to have that type of offensive workload

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Speaker 2: demand from game one to Game one hundred and still

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Speaker 2: be able to go on deep playoff runs and have

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Speaker 2: everything left in the tank on both sides of the ball.

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Speaker 2: It's one guy, ever, and Luca's not quite in that

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Speaker 2: same shape as that guy, And so Luca's fitness is

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Speaker 2: a fair critique. The way he lets the refs get

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Speaker 2: in his head is a fair critique. And the fact

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Speaker 2: that the Celtics were able to hunt him on defense,

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Speaker 2: those are all fair critiques. Here's another one. They needed

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Speaker 2: him toy for them to beat this team. He's got

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Speaker 2: to score thirty five a night. He hasn't done that yet.

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Speaker 2: They Kyrie did it last night for the first time.

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Speaker 2: So those are all fair critiques. I was ready to

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Speaker 2: crown Luca the best player in the world. That can't happen, now, okay,

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Speaker 2: So all of that is legitimate and fair, and this

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Speaker 2: is part of the process. And in Wendy's defense, what

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Speaker 2: Wendy he was saying more this morning than in that

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Speaker 2: clip that's going viral last night, is that he believes

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Speaker 2: one day Luca will be a more complete player, will

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Speaker 2: be holding the Larry O'Brien and the Finals MVP trophy.

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Speaker 2: And we'll say I learned from twenty twenty four usually

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Speaker 2: about how it goes. I think there were right there.

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Speaker 2: Wendy was kind of making some Lebron illusions where Lebron

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Speaker 2: talked about learning from twenty eleven. Now that was a

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Speaker 2: different circumstance. I don't think people think that Luca's melting

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Speaker 2: down the way people think Lebron did in that series.

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Speaker 2: So all of those criticisms are fair, okay, But here

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Speaker 2: is what also must be said. No matter what you

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Speaker 2: think Luca's defensive deficiencies are in that game last night,

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Speaker 2: in the thirty eight minutes he played, the Mavericks won

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Speaker 2: by nine, and in the ten minutes he sat, they

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Speaker 2: lost by sixteen. So whatever you think he takes away defensively,

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Speaker 2: which is legitimate, whatever he adds offensively is significant enough

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Speaker 2: that even last night, which people are calling the worst

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Speaker 2: game of his career, they beat the Celtics handily. In

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Speaker 2: the thirty eight minutes he played and got whooped. In

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Speaker 2: the ten minutes he didn't. Now that speaks to why

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Speaker 2: it is very important that he not foul out and

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Speaker 2: why he has to find a way to stay on

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Speaker 2: the court. So I think those criticisms are fair, and

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Speaker 2: then we will get to the fouling out thing in

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Speaker 2: a moment. But it looked demonde like you want wanted

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Speaker 2: to say something, So go ahead, Uh.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean you see his his plus minus wow

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Speaker 3: while he's on and off the court. I get that,

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Speaker 3: But I mean, does it does it matter if at

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Speaker 3: the end of the day he's still gonna have a

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Speaker 3: PC attitude with the refs and make him have an

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Speaker 3: extra target on his back.

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Speaker 2: Well, listen, I think that he needs to mature in

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Speaker 2: that regard. I think that he is hurts he at.

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Speaker 2: I've told you guys before, and I know that you

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Speaker 2: that there is you kind of disagree. I don't know

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Speaker 2: if you disagreed with me. But the point I made

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Speaker 2: a couple rounds ago, which was Luca's always going to

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Speaker 2: have a problem. Up to this point, He's always had

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Speaker 2: a problem with the refs. The question is are we

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Speaker 2: getting snarling angry Luca or hands up rolling his eyes,

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Speaker 2: Woe is me, Luca, because snarling angry Luca is the

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Speaker 2: scariest offensive player in the league. Hands up rolling his eyes,

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Speaker 2: woe is me. Luca can get in his own way.

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Speaker 2: And so I think that though those are all fair criticisms,

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Speaker 2: now let's talk about him fouling out. I thought the

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Speaker 2: fifth and sixth fouls could have gone either way, but

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Speaker 2: you can't put yourself in that position for the sixth foul.

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Speaker 2: I thought the fifth foul jailing, you could have called

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Speaker 2: a hook on Jalen Brown. They didn't, I thought, or

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Speaker 2: was it Tatum? I think it was Tatum and the

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Speaker 2: sixth foul was a to me a fifty to fifty

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Speaker 2: call because Luca's feet weren't set, but there was a

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Speaker 2: push off it felt to me. Tell me, if you

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Speaker 2: agree to monse As someone who's watching rooting for the Celtics,

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Speaker 2: that if they had called that a charge and Boston

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Speaker 2: had challenged it, they wouldn't have overturned the charge. They

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Speaker 2: called it a block, Dallas challenged it. They didn't overturn

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Speaker 2: the block. Do you think that's fair, like that was

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Speaker 2: a judgment call that could have gone either way.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I do.

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Speaker 3: I do think that like with it was very close,

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Speaker 3: it's very close to him being set or not set,

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Speaker 3: and I don't And I think with him having the

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Speaker 3: attitude that he has towards the refs, he's not going

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Speaker 3: to get that benefit of the doubt. And I'm gonna

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Speaker 3: be looking to give you charges if that's how you

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Speaker 3: are the whole game before.

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Speaker 2: It right, And that that part is fair is that

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Speaker 2: you've got to recognize the refs are human and if

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Speaker 2: you're abusing them from the opening minute, you're just not

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Speaker 2: going to get the benefit of the doubt on stuff.

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Speaker 2: And so some of This is kind of a self

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Speaker 2: fulfilling prophecy. Luca thinks the refs are out to get him,

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Speaker 2: so he you know, goes after them, and that makes

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Speaker 2: the refs more likely out to get him. So all

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Speaker 2: of that. So I'm not making excuses and I'm not

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Speaker 2: blaming the refs. But here is what I want to

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Speaker 2: say about Luca fouling out and the reactions to it.

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Speaker 2: You have a player who is an offense unto himself,

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Speaker 2: unlike almost any player in league history, whose team is

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Speaker 2: in the NBA Finals thanks to him more than anyone

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Speaker 2: else by a massive measure, who in a critical championship

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Speaker 2: in the balance finals game gets hunted repeatedly, defensively, loses

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Speaker 2: his composure a number of times, and fouls out of

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Speaker 2: that game. I just told you about Steph Curry in

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Speaker 2: game six of twenty sixteen. Now I also told you

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Speaker 2: about Luca. The difference, I guess there is Steph's team

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Speaker 2: was trying to win a championship that game rather than

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Speaker 2: stave off elimination, and Luca was whining earlier than Steph was.

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Speaker 2: But Steph did end up culminating with throwing his mouthpiece

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Speaker 2: into the crowd, hitting a fan and his wife saying

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Speaker 2: the league was rigged for ratings or money. She doesn't

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Speaker 2: know which. Now, I, once again, trying to be the

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Speaker 2: bastion of fairness and consistency, crushed Steph for that crushed him.

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Speaker 2: So Luca's gotta get similar heat. But my colleagues did not.

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Speaker 2: Nobody was out here saying this is you know, Steph Curry,

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Speaker 2: and now he had already won a championship, he had

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Speaker 2: won two league MVPs. I understand that, but this idea

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Speaker 2: that we've never seen something like this, we actually saw

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Speaker 2: something exactly like it, very similar. A guy who was

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Speaker 2: unimpeachably brilliant offensively, whose weakness on defense can be exploited

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Speaker 2: in the playoffs, and smart teams will hunt him getting

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Speaker 2: in late foul trouble of a critical finals game, fouling

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Speaker 2: out and losing his s. We've seen it. And that's

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Speaker 2: why I push back a little bit on some of

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Speaker 2: the nuclear level Luca takes, because I do think we

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Speaker 2: need a bit of a breath and recognize, hey, the

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Speaker 2: criticism is warranted. When you are trying to become the

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Speaker 2: best player in the world, you are held to a

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Speaker 2: best player in the world standard and you need to overcome,

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Speaker 2: You need to be a plus when your team's only

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Speaker 2: expecting an A. All of those things. Also the pendulum

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Speaker 2: swinging so far in the other direction. As if Luca

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Speaker 2: is the reason the MAVs lost, I reject out of hand.

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Speaker 2: Luca is Kyrie was brilliant last night. Luca is the

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Speaker 2: reason they're in this spot now, demonsay, and see from

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Speaker 2: the look on your face and the split screen you

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Speaker 2: disagreed to a degree, which is fine. I think most

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Speaker 2: of the audience probably does.

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Speaker 3: So go ahead, Wait what you said that if you

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Speaker 3: can't count that, you can't put this on Luca. This

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Speaker 3: isn't Lucas fault. It was just Lucas fault in that game.

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Speaker 4: And then.

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Speaker 2: What I'm saying is that I feel the pendulum has

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Speaker 2: swung in the last twelve hours so far out of whack,

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Speaker 2: to where the discussion turned to, Luca is the problem

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Speaker 2: for the maps, Luca is the solution for the maps.

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Speaker 2: Lucas the reason the MAVs are here. This was a

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Speaker 2: brutal moment for him, and it was, if we're being honest,

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Speaker 2: a game that the MAVs appeared down two to zero

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Speaker 2: at home to let go of the rope in that

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Speaker 2: third quarter, and that's on your leader. That's on like

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Speaker 2: that is fair criticism. The hyper ventilating about the about

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Speaker 2: him fouling out of the game, as if we've never

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Speaker 2: seen that when we saw it in a very famous

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Speaker 2: moment in the NBA Finals with a player whose roles

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Speaker 2: and responsibilities to his team are very similar to Lucas,

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Speaker 2: which is you create our entire offensive system is thanks

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Speaker 2: to your one of one talents, and we're going to

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Speaker 2: have to hide you defensively. That's where I felt like

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Speaker 2: the criticism was out of whack and so and that's

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Speaker 2: what I texted Wendy. Wendy disagrees. I also do want

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Speaker 2: to say, I don't there is There aren't three people

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Speaker 2: in basketball media that I have more affection and professional

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Speaker 2: respect for than Wendy. So I'm not attacking him. I

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Speaker 2: just I thought he has such a respected voice that

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Speaker 2: if the and he's so rarely goes after anybody, that

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Speaker 2: if like, let me use another person, I'll you steven A,

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Speaker 2: another guy that I'm friends with and that I respect.

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Speaker 2: If stephen A had said the exact thing, Wendy said,

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Speaker 2: I don't think it sets the conversation the way it

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Speaker 2: did when Wendy did it, because stephen A says very

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Speaker 2: bombastic if you will things all the time, it's part

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Speaker 2: of the gig. It's just like I do, by the way,

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Speaker 2: so it's not a shock at all. I mean, yeah,

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Speaker 2: he's polarizing and he's out of here giving takes because

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Speaker 2: Wendy so rarely crushes somebody when he does. To me,

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Speaker 2: it signaled to the whole basketball world, Oh, it is

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Speaker 2: going to be feast on Luca today. And I think

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Speaker 2: by the way that I name another guy that I

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Speaker 2: have massive respect and affection for. I think Van Pelt

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Speaker 2: felt the same way, because Van Pelt later in the

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Speaker 2: postgame said, man, I'm still processing Wendy taking a blow

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Speaker 2: torch to Luca, and so I thought that was a

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Speaker 2: touch too harsh. I smart people can disagree. I thought

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Speaker 2: it was a touch too harsh in part because I

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Speaker 2: didn't see, yeah, twenty percent of it. When Steph fouled

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Speaker 2: out and the Warriors were in the midst of losing

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Speaker 2: the three to one lead, I didn't see that. So

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Speaker 2: that's where I fall on the Lucas stuff go out, I.

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Speaker 4: Think it was like a sound of the alarm type

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Speaker 4: of thing.

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Speaker 2: Uh.

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Speaker 3: I think Whendhorse coming out and saying that was just

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Speaker 3: speaks to how dire the situation is. I do think

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Speaker 3: that Curry and Luca are in a little bit different situations,

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Speaker 3: being that Curry had already been there, when he had

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Speaker 3: already done it, Luca hasn't, and it's just like you're

335
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Speaker 3: finally here and that stuff has got.

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Speaker 4: To go out of the window. I think it's just

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Speaker 4: it's like that kind of sounding a lot.

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Speaker 2: Of times that so that demands is a great take,

339
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Speaker 2: it's a fair take. I think it's how most people feel.

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Speaker 2: It's it is level headed, legitimate. I think that is

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Speaker 2: and there is this is where track record matters, that

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Speaker 2: that moment for Steph felt totally aberrant. It felt like

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Speaker 2: what is happened? It felt like a one off meltdown,

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Speaker 2: even though he did then the next year fling his

345
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Speaker 2: mouthpiece into the crowd again, but he hadn't done it

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Speaker 2: up to that point in his career, and he had

347
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Speaker 2: track record matters, and he had earned such massive goodwill,

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Speaker 2: and he already was a champion, So you couldn't have

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Speaker 2: the take Steph Curry's defense is gonna stop you from

350
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Speaker 2: winning a championship? That my My pushback is really twofold.

351
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Speaker 2: One is I just think it was a little too

352
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Speaker 2: harsh the general Luca conversation today and last night. And

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Speaker 2: the other one is the idea that, oh, with Luca

354
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Speaker 2: playing defense like this, the MAVs can't win a title.

355
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Speaker 2: That I think that he should be better. I think

356
00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:10,560
Speaker 2: at twenty five, you're supposed to get better across the board,

357
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Speaker 2: like he's not a finished product. I think all that's true,

358
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Speaker 2: But I also think the MAVs can win a title

359
00:24:18,119 --> 00:24:20,760
Speaker 2: with his defense as it is. I think last night,

360
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:23,840
Speaker 2: I think that other guys have to pick him up

361
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Speaker 2: because of what his deficiencies are. But the idea that

362
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Speaker 2: he and last night. The reason I brought up the

363
00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:36,520
Speaker 2: plus minus is people can show me as many clips

364
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Speaker 2: as they want of Sam, of him losing Sam Hauser,

365
00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:42,040
Speaker 2: him losing Jalen Brown, of all of it. The fact

366
00:24:42,040 --> 00:24:45,440
Speaker 2: of the matter is this, even in that game, which

367
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Speaker 2: was one of the worst defensive performances he's had all postseason,

368
00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:53,080
Speaker 2: when he was on the court, they won those minutes. Now,

369
00:24:53,680 --> 00:24:55,960
Speaker 2: let me also be fair in this regard for you

370
00:24:56,080 --> 00:25:05,639
Speaker 2: move on getting joh ten percent better defensively, twenty percent

371
00:25:05,800 --> 00:25:16,440
Speaker 2: better defensively, in my opinion, is what moved Joker from

372
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Speaker 2: a great offensive player who I was not comfortable calling

373
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Speaker 2: the best player in the world to best player in

374
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Speaker 2: the world. And I thought one of the reasons the

375
00:25:27,680 --> 00:25:32,560
Speaker 2: Nuggets didn't end up in the finals this year was

376
00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:37,280
Speaker 2: he slipped a little defensively, and so that it is

377
00:25:37,400 --> 00:25:39,880
Speaker 2: fair to say Luca needs to do the same thing.

378
00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:43,960
Speaker 2: And it is fair to say that Jokers plus minus

379
00:25:44,040 --> 00:25:47,280
Speaker 2: was always great and he was still subject to criticism.

380
00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:52,720
Speaker 2: I'm not arguing Lucas shouldn't be criticized. I'm not arguing

381
00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:56,920
Speaker 2: he played well yesterday. I am arguing that I think

382
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Speaker 2: it's been in the last twelve.

383
00:25:59,160 --> 00:26:02,280
Speaker 4: Miles gonna lose this series. Like that's what you're.

384
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Speaker 2: Correct, correct, and so like that is that is the

385
00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:12,080
Speaker 2: part of it that is frustrating me. The the Bill

386
00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:15,000
Speaker 2: James quote that I always go to and sometimes I

387
00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:17,520
Speaker 2: get this because to who much is given, much is

388
00:26:17,560 --> 00:26:21,560
Speaker 2: expected the best player. Let me see if I can

389
00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:27,040
Speaker 2: find the quote the Bill James. Let me see Bill

390
00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:33,760
Speaker 2: James blame best player, worst teams. So I can't find it.

391
00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:36,720
Speaker 2: The I think it's the Bill. I think it's Bill

392
00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:41,840
Speaker 2: James who said it. But regardless, the quote is bad

393
00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:46,000
Speaker 2: teams have an uncanny ability to blame their best players

394
00:26:46,040 --> 00:26:50,680
Speaker 2: for their biggest problems. Now, obviously the MAVs aren't a

395
00:26:50,720 --> 00:26:53,320
Speaker 2: bad team, and that's I'm kind of mixing metaphors there

396
00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:57,960
Speaker 2: because I think the MAVs are necessarily blaming Luca. But

397
00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:02,240
Speaker 2: I to the day is going to be across sports

398
00:27:02,280 --> 00:27:08,680
Speaker 2: media annihilate Luka Doncic today, it just is there. Today

399
00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:11,560
Speaker 2: is going to be a if you're trying to win

400
00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:15,960
Speaker 2: a championship, here is the list of players you would

401
00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:20,679
Speaker 2: rather have. And if you make that list and you

402
00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:24,480
Speaker 2: have more than two people on it, I think you're

403
00:27:24,520 --> 00:27:27,440
Speaker 2: being disingenuous. If you want to say you're trying to

404
00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:31,160
Speaker 2: win a championship you'd rather have Joker, Sure, And if

405
00:27:31,160 --> 00:27:34,240
Speaker 2: you want to include Giannis, no problem. But if all

406
00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:37,600
Speaker 2: of a sudden we go from one game of what's

407
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:41,000
Speaker 2: wrong with Jason Tatum to actually Jason Tatum is better

408
00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:45,320
Speaker 2: than Luca, we've gone too far and so like, So

409
00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:48,320
Speaker 2: that's just kind of what I'm pushing against. So there's

410
00:27:48,359 --> 00:27:51,439
Speaker 2: the Luca part of it. Now demands let's get to

411
00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:54,120
Speaker 2: you know, the team that actually won the game.

412
00:27:55,000 --> 00:27:57,159
Speaker 3: Yeah, so on the other side, the Celtics. They are

413
00:27:57,240 --> 00:27:59,399
Speaker 3: in a commanding three to zero lead at this point.

414
00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:03,080
Speaker 3: Nobody's impressed with the Celtics. Everybody's saying this route has

415
00:28:03,119 --> 00:28:06,600
Speaker 3: been easy, and they are They're a game away from

416
00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:09,919
Speaker 3: being twenty to two in the playoffs. Why is nobody

417
00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:12,359
Speaker 3: impressed with what the Celtics are doing right now besides me?

418
00:28:13,119 --> 00:28:15,879
Speaker 2: So I think that's a straw man. I think people

419
00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:19,720
Speaker 2: are very impressed by their finals performance and we don't

420
00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:23,000
Speaker 2: have to relitigate their path to the finals. But in

421
00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:29,119
Speaker 2: these finals, and as I've said all year yet, no

422
00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:31,359
Speaker 2: one is going to care about the path if they

423
00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:35,000
Speaker 2: win the title, and if they they're going to end

424
00:28:35,080 --> 00:28:40,480
Speaker 2: up demanse pardon me, if they finish the sweep with

425
00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:46,040
Speaker 2: some gaudy records, undefeated on the road. Sweet. I don't

426
00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:49,320
Speaker 2: think any team ever has swept the conference and the

427
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:53,880
Speaker 2: NBA finals and they are they're going to finish the year.

428
00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:56,240
Speaker 2: What were they They were.

429
00:28:57,720 --> 00:29:02,480
Speaker 3: Sixty they were sixty four and eighteen.

430
00:29:03,520 --> 00:29:06,880
Speaker 2: Sixty four and eighteen, thank you, So they might end

431
00:29:06,960 --> 00:29:12,400
Speaker 2: up demons eighty and twenty. I mean, that is that's

432
00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:15,080
Speaker 2: all time. That is all time.

433
00:29:15,800 --> 00:29:19,160
Speaker 3: And the Warriors that year, that they did the that

434
00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:21,760
Speaker 3: they they went like seventy two, and what.

435
00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:24,120
Speaker 2: Was it, They went seventy they went seventy three, and

436
00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:27,400
Speaker 2: they win seventy three and nine. But what hurt them

437
00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:32,440
Speaker 2: was they lost the championship to Lebron. They didn't finish it.

438
00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:40,080
Speaker 2: The MJ's Bulls in ninety six went seventy two and ten,

439
00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:43,800
Speaker 2: and then how many playoff games did they lose? I'll

440
00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:46,200
Speaker 2: look that up, like this is going to be on

441
00:29:46,760 --> 00:29:49,400
Speaker 2: the very short list. In ninety six, I know, the

442
00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:55,040
Speaker 2: finals went six games. The Bulls lost three total playoff games,

443
00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:57,960
Speaker 2: so they won. They were fifteen and three in the playoffs,

444
00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:00,880
Speaker 2: seventy two and ten in their regular seasons, so that

445
00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:04,040
Speaker 2: team ended up being eighty seven and thirteen. Pretty unbelievable.

446
00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:07,600
Speaker 2: The next year, by the way, that Bulls team ended

447
00:30:07,640 --> 00:30:10,240
Speaker 2: up being they were sixty nine and thirteen in the

448
00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:12,880
Speaker 2: regular season and then lost four games in the playoffs,

449
00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:17,200
Speaker 2: so that team was eighty four and seventeen. So it's

450
00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:21,160
Speaker 2: that the record and the metrics are going to say

451
00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:23,320
Speaker 2: this is an all time team. We can get to

452
00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:25,360
Speaker 2: that part in a second. First, let me give them

453
00:30:25,360 --> 00:30:31,840
Speaker 2: their flowers. I actually think the maps. So here's the

454
00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:35,640
Speaker 2: other thing that I find so interesting about the Luca

455
00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:39,840
Speaker 2: conversation and the conversation of this series. The MAVs are

456
00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:43,920
Speaker 2: not losing because of their defense. They're just not will

457
00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:46,040
Speaker 2: you can show me as many clips as you want.

458
00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:49,880
Speaker 2: The fact of the matter is, if going into these

459
00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:55,680
Speaker 2: finals you had told Jason Kidd the Celtics are gonna

460
00:30:55,680 --> 00:30:59,720
Speaker 2: score one oh seven, one oh five, one oh six,

461
00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:04,120
Speaker 2: he would say, sign me up for it. The Celtics

462
00:31:04,240 --> 00:31:09,040
Speaker 2: offense because they haven't had that red hot from three game, like,

463
00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:14,680
Speaker 2: you know, shooting for forty attempts. The because they haven't

464
00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:20,800
Speaker 2: had until last night, the simultaneous Tatum and Brown scoring

465
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:23,760
Speaker 2: explosion game. And when they got it last night, they

466
00:31:23,840 --> 00:31:27,360
Speaker 2: were They didn't really get help from the other guys.

467
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:34,080
Speaker 2: The Celtics offense has just been okay despite whatever issues

468
00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:38,280
Speaker 2: the MAVs defense has. The reason the Celtics are in

469
00:31:38,280 --> 00:31:44,400
Speaker 2: this position is the Celtics defense, their scheme, and their

470
00:31:44,480 --> 00:31:52,440
Speaker 2: personnel has been legendary, and that must be credit must

471
00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:57,800
Speaker 2: be given. You. You forced Kyrie Irving into two impossibly

472
00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:02,560
Speaker 2: bad games. You frustrate did Luca enough last night to

473
00:32:02,680 --> 00:32:06,720
Speaker 2: where you're up twenty and he's pressing in the fourth

474
00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:13,920
Speaker 2: quarter and the Celtics defensive personnel last night without Christaps,

475
00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:17,200
Speaker 2: I mean, the MAVs were up twenty five to twelve,

476
00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:21,280
Speaker 2: and then the Celtics were up twenty one. So in

477
00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:24,720
Speaker 2: a basically a two and a half quarter span, the

478
00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:28,719
Speaker 2: Celtics out what's that? So they were up thirteen. They

479
00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:32,560
Speaker 2: had a thirty four point turnaround. I mean that it

480
00:32:32,600 --> 00:32:36,640
Speaker 2: was a seventy nine to forty five run, if you will,

481
00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:40,520
Speaker 2: in the middle middle of this game. They held the

482
00:32:40,560 --> 00:32:43,920
Speaker 2: MAVs last night. How many points did the MAVs have

483
00:32:43,960 --> 00:32:49,480
Speaker 2: at halftime? The MAVs at halftime had fifty one, So

484
00:32:50,360 --> 00:32:53,280
Speaker 2: they held the MAVs last night to fifty one in

485
00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:56,880
Speaker 2: the first half, nineteen in the third quarter, which is

486
00:32:56,920 --> 00:33:00,719
Speaker 2: when the game was decided, and then the obviously went

487
00:33:00,760 --> 00:33:03,560
Speaker 2: on that little run. But you have held the MAVs

488
00:33:04,520 --> 00:33:11,120
Speaker 2: under one hundred every game these playoffs. Like, I'm gonna

489
00:33:11,160 --> 00:33:13,360
Speaker 2: try to look this up very quickly. I should have

490
00:33:13,360 --> 00:33:16,000
Speaker 2: looked it up before, but this is where I'm trying

491
00:33:16,040 --> 00:33:19,600
Speaker 2: to give Boston credit because they deserve it. Did the

492
00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:24,280
Speaker 2: MAVs have three straight games under one hundred points all

493
00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:29,000
Speaker 2: year going into this. I'm looking it up right now,

494
00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:33,200
Speaker 2: so this is all right, So this is pretty remarkable.

495
00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:38,000
Speaker 2: All right. If you remove the final two games of

496
00:33:38,080 --> 00:33:40,840
Speaker 2: the year, and I'm doing this in real time, if

497
00:33:40,880 --> 00:33:44,320
Speaker 2: you remove the final two games of the year when

498
00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:49,200
Speaker 2: the MAVs rested everybody, they scored less than one hundred

499
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 2: points one two, three, four, five five times all season

500
00:34:00,160 --> 00:34:05,800
Speaker 2: in the regular season. In the playoffs, well there's a yeah.

501
00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:10,960
Speaker 2: I mean there's a one forty seven yeah. In the playoffs.

502
00:34:11,719 --> 00:34:16,520
Speaker 2: The MAVs going into this series had been held under

503
00:34:16,520 --> 00:34:21,840
Speaker 2: one hundred four times back to back once. So going

504
00:34:21,880 --> 00:34:26,399
Speaker 2: into the NBA Finals, the Dallas Mavericks had been held

505
00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:29,200
Speaker 2: under one hundred. Again, let's just throw out the final

506
00:34:29,239 --> 00:34:31,320
Speaker 2: two games of the year when they were resting everybody.

507
00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:35,120
Speaker 2: They had been held under one hundred going into the

508
00:34:35,160 --> 00:34:39,480
Speaker 2: playoffs five times. Going into the finals, you include the playoffs,

509
00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:43,000
Speaker 2: they've been held under one hundred nine times back to

510
00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:45,960
Speaker 2: back once the first two games of the Clippers series

511
00:34:46,120 --> 00:34:50,640
Speaker 2: and they actually won game two. And they have now

512
00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:55,440
Speaker 2: been held under one hundred three straight games. Dusty just

513
00:34:55,560 --> 00:35:01,040
Speaker 2: texted me, first time three straight under one hundred since

514
00:35:01,200 --> 00:35:07,160
Speaker 2: December of twenty one, and I'm without knowing I'm gonna

515
00:35:07,160 --> 00:35:11,080
Speaker 2: go ahead and check and see was Luca even playing?

516
00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:14,759
Speaker 2: You know what I mean? Like, was he was in

517
00:35:14,800 --> 00:35:19,680
Speaker 2: that stretch? Was was Luca active in December of twenty one?

518
00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:24,080
Speaker 2: And the answer to that question is, like I thought, no, So, Dusty,

519
00:35:24,080 --> 00:35:27,040
Speaker 2: if you're watching for the first thing's first studio, has

520
00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:31,120
Speaker 2: Luca ever in his career been held on his team

521
00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:33,960
Speaker 2: been held under one hundred points in three straight games

522
00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:38,040
Speaker 2: that he played in. My guess is no. So that's

523
00:35:38,080 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 2: where the Celtics defense deserves all the credit in the world.

524
00:35:44,239 --> 00:35:47,840
Speaker 2: That was not the script I saw coming into this series.

525
00:35:48,600 --> 00:35:52,480
Speaker 2: I obviously was wrong about this series. That's undeniable. I

526
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:58,480
Speaker 2: obviously undersold the Celtics. That's undeniable. I'm just you know

527
00:35:58,520 --> 00:36:01,799
Speaker 2: what I mean, I was wrong, and I'm that there's

528
00:36:01,800 --> 00:36:04,839
Speaker 2: no yeah butts about it. They won yesterday without Chris

529
00:36:04,840 --> 00:36:08,120
Speaker 2: STAPs and by the way, good thing they did, because

530
00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:11,560
Speaker 2: I don't think he's playing again in this playoffs. And

531
00:36:12,640 --> 00:36:16,040
Speaker 2: if they had lost that game, particularly, it'd be one

532
00:36:16,080 --> 00:36:17,759
Speaker 2: thing if they had lost it because the MAVs just

533
00:36:17,840 --> 00:36:20,560
Speaker 2: crushed them, But if they had blown that twenty one

534
00:36:20,600 --> 00:36:23,960
Speaker 2: point lead, then we are having and they don't like

535
00:36:24,080 --> 00:36:27,920
Speaker 2: now we're having a whole different conversation. But they didn't.

536
00:36:28,560 --> 00:36:33,080
Speaker 2: They held on, They kept their composure when it looked

537
00:36:33,120 --> 00:36:37,280
Speaker 2: like it could go a totally another way. And now

538
00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:43,360
Speaker 2: they're a game away from being champions. And I would

539
00:36:43,440 --> 00:36:46,360
Speaker 2: guess I don't know this for certain, but I would

540
00:36:46,360 --> 00:36:50,760
Speaker 2: guess this is the first time in Luca's career he's

541
00:36:50,800 --> 00:36:53,000
Speaker 2: played in three straight games where the team didn't score

542
00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:56,120
Speaker 2: one hundred points. You can now ask the question about history,

543
00:36:56,160 --> 00:36:58,360
Speaker 2: de monsay, unless there's something else you want to ask me.

544
00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:01,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, do you think that it's time to start considering

545
00:37:01,280 --> 00:37:02,839
Speaker 3: Boston a historically great team?

546
00:37:06,320 --> 00:37:12,480
Speaker 2: No, I do think they had a historically great season.

547
00:37:14,080 --> 00:37:19,440
Speaker 2: And folks can say that I am that. This is

548
00:37:19,719 --> 00:37:23,600
Speaker 2: the data says, and Dusty just texts me, it's never

549
00:37:23,680 --> 00:37:27,480
Speaker 2: happened that Luke has played in three straight games where

550
00:37:27,480 --> 00:37:29,720
Speaker 2: his team didn't score one hundred points. It's never happened.

551
00:37:29,960 --> 00:37:33,920
Speaker 2: Then it happened in the first three finals games. Yeah,

552
00:37:33,960 --> 00:37:38,160
Speaker 2: the margin of victory. The record says, this is one

553
00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:41,960
Speaker 2: of the greatest teams ever. And if you want to

554
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:47,879
Speaker 2: the metaphorical, you not you Demanse want to say, well,

555
00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:55,200
Speaker 2: then they are guys, then they are I understand. I disagree.

556
00:37:55,920 --> 00:38:01,840
Speaker 2: And my argument is that pretty simple, simple one, and

557
00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:06,560
Speaker 2: people gonna say it's caveman thinking, But to be a

558
00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:12,600
Speaker 2: historically great team in this sport, you've gotta have There

559
00:38:12,600 --> 00:38:16,359
Speaker 2: were too many of the historically great teams that had

560
00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:18,440
Speaker 2: historically great players.

561
00:38:18,960 --> 00:38:23,479
Speaker 3: And if we just want to do that, you gonna

562
00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:25,960
Speaker 3: you're saying it could end up like the Nugget situation,

563
00:38:27,080 --> 00:38:29,520
Speaker 3: since we don't have the greatest player.

564
00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:29,720
Speaker 4: In the NBA.

565
00:38:30,600 --> 00:38:33,120
Speaker 2: No, the Nuggets might have No, the Nuggets have Jokic.

566
00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:38,279
Speaker 2: I think it's probably more comparable to the Eight Celtics

567
00:38:39,000 --> 00:38:43,600
Speaker 2: or the four Pistons, which were great teams, but not

568
00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:48,279
Speaker 2: historically great teams. When and again, I guess what when

569
00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:52,360
Speaker 2: we say historically great, if we're opening the purview to

570
00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:56,719
Speaker 2: you know, there have been seventy five champions, Is this

571
00:38:56,840 --> 00:39:01,919
Speaker 2: one of the twenty five best champions? Sure? And even

572
00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:05,680
Speaker 2: though some teams they'd be ahead of don't have the

573
00:39:05,800 --> 00:39:10,840
Speaker 2: resume or have have better individual you know, superstars. Sure,

574
00:39:10,840 --> 00:39:13,440
Speaker 2: but when we're talking about the greatest teams of all time,

575
00:39:14,520 --> 00:39:18,640
Speaker 2: just off the top of my head, if we are

576
00:39:18,840 --> 00:39:24,520
Speaker 2: just going through the last since nineteen eighty, right, you've

577
00:39:25,160 --> 00:39:28,040
Speaker 2: I'm going to try to do this kind of in order,

578
00:39:28,160 --> 00:39:32,600
Speaker 2: so to speak, the eighty three six Ers, the eighty

579
00:39:32,719 --> 00:39:39,160
Speaker 2: six Celtics, pick your favorite showtime Lakers team. I think

580
00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:42,799
Speaker 2: there were at least two Bulls teams better than this

581
00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:53,080
Speaker 2: Celtics team with Michael the one Lakers, the twenty thirteen Heat,

582
00:39:54,080 --> 00:39:59,560
Speaker 2: the twenty seventeen and eighteen Warriors. Like now, we're up

583
00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:02,319
Speaker 2: to no teams just off the top of my head.

584
00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:06,160
Speaker 2: So I think all of those teams were better than

585
00:40:06,160 --> 00:40:11,640
Speaker 2: this team. But there is no yeah but about a championship.

586
00:40:12,400 --> 00:40:19,640
Speaker 2: And I will not abide folks who try to retroactively say, well,

587
00:40:20,600 --> 00:40:23,400
Speaker 2: their path in the East was easy. That part's correct,

588
00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:27,560
Speaker 2: and their path in the finals was easy. They are

589
00:40:27,640 --> 00:40:33,400
Speaker 2: making it look easy. But the MAVs were playing unbelievable

590
00:40:33,440 --> 00:40:35,920
Speaker 2: basketball with a guy who looked like he was poised

591
00:40:35,960 --> 00:40:38,680
Speaker 2: to become the best player in the world. So I

592
00:40:38,840 --> 00:40:42,799
Speaker 2: don't think that this is an easy finals. They are

593
00:40:42,840 --> 00:40:45,120
Speaker 2: making it look easy and so.

594
00:40:46,600 --> 00:40:46,799
Speaker 4: That.

595
00:40:47,200 --> 00:40:50,120
Speaker 2: But I don't think that if we are making a

596
00:40:50,200 --> 00:40:57,359
Speaker 2: list of the ten greatest teams in NBA history, that

597
00:40:57,400 --> 00:41:01,040
Speaker 2: you spend much time considering this Celtics. I just don't.

598
00:41:01,160 --> 00:41:09,040
Speaker 2: Now you mentioned the Nuggets demanse Okay, I feel the

599
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:13,200
Speaker 2: same way about last year's Nuggets. If the Nuggets had

600
00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:18,240
Speaker 2: then won the title this year ripped off like three

601
00:41:18,280 --> 00:41:22,560
Speaker 2: and four years, then you're like, well, damn, I guess

602
00:41:22,640 --> 00:41:26,799
Speaker 2: they you know what I mean, retroactively, I guess they were.

603
00:41:27,800 --> 00:41:30,799
Speaker 2: It's a similar boat the Celtics are in. If we're

604
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:33,880
Speaker 2: gonna end up thinking of this Celtics team as good

605
00:41:34,000 --> 00:41:39,719
Speaker 2: as their record is historically speaking, then it's going the

606
00:41:39,760 --> 00:41:43,000
Speaker 2: title defense and everything that comes next plays a piece

607
00:41:43,000 --> 00:41:46,120
Speaker 2: of it, especially because they bring everybody back. They've got

608
00:41:46,120 --> 00:41:49,040
Speaker 2: this whole team locked for next year, so we'll get

609
00:41:49,080 --> 00:41:52,680
Speaker 2: to see it. I don't think that's unfair. I don't

610
00:41:52,719 --> 00:41:55,000
Speaker 2: think that is a double standard.

611
00:41:55,920 --> 00:42:01,279
Speaker 3: You go ahead, that was that's nice, that's nice. I

612
00:42:01,280 --> 00:42:03,920
Speaker 3: didn't know the full team coming back next year is awesome.

613
00:42:05,280 --> 00:42:08,480
Speaker 2: But oh, you didn't know that they had everyone under contract. Yeah,

614
00:42:08,520 --> 00:42:11,880
Speaker 2: they have everyone under contract for next year, all five stars.

615
00:42:12,000 --> 00:42:17,480
Speaker 2: That yeah, But that's similar to the Nuggets, right, That's

616
00:42:17,480 --> 00:42:19,439
Speaker 2: similar to the Nuggets where they had all five stars

617
00:42:19,480 --> 00:42:23,279
Speaker 2: coming back. Nuggets lost Bruce, they lost Bruce Brown well,

618
00:42:23,320 --> 00:42:26,800
Speaker 2: and so and I think here's the thing. Maybe I'm wrong.

619
00:42:29,040 --> 00:42:32,719
Speaker 2: I could out if they win the title, could Al

620
00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:38,959
Speaker 2: Horford retire maybe? I mean he's old, Uh, he does

621
00:42:39,120 --> 00:42:42,480
Speaker 2: have he has one year left on his contract though,

622
00:42:42,520 --> 00:42:44,240
Speaker 2: so I mean they don't have to worry about losing

623
00:42:44,320 --> 00:42:47,479
Speaker 2: him to free agency, but he could retire. But yeah,

624
00:42:47,840 --> 00:42:51,920
Speaker 2: that's kind of their Bruce Brown version of it. Go ahead,

625
00:42:51,920 --> 00:42:52,280
Speaker 2: de Monte.

626
00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:54,600
Speaker 3: So do you think, like, so you're saying that this

627
00:42:54,719 --> 00:42:56,759
Speaker 3: they're not historically great now, but if they do come

628
00:42:56,800 --> 00:42:58,160
Speaker 3: back next year and win it, is that what you

629
00:42:58,200 --> 00:42:59,400
Speaker 3: were just kind of saying.

630
00:43:00,120 --> 00:43:03,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, well then yes, I mean then you start to

631
00:43:03,920 --> 00:43:07,200
Speaker 2: re examine, you know what I mean. Then you start

632
00:43:07,239 --> 00:43:11,600
Speaker 2: to say, like, just like the Four Pistons, that this

633
00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:15,000
Speaker 2: is I know, you don't know this, and a lot

634
00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:18,279
Speaker 2: of the audience probably doesn't know it. The Four Pistons

635
00:43:18,680 --> 00:43:27,920
Speaker 2: are considered, uh, unbelievable team that you know, shocked, shocking

636
00:43:28,080 --> 00:43:32,400
Speaker 2: Kobe's last year together. The Lakers won that finals with

637
00:43:32,719 --> 00:43:37,799
Speaker 2: ease in five games, but they're not considered a historically

638
00:43:37,840 --> 00:43:43,680
Speaker 2: great team. The very next year to Monsey, they lost

639
00:43:43,880 --> 00:43:49,040
Speaker 2: in the NBA Finals in Game seven. The next year,

640
00:43:49,440 --> 00:43:52,640
Speaker 2: they lost in the conference finals. The next year, they

641
00:43:52,680 --> 00:43:55,800
Speaker 2: lost in the conference finals. The next year they lost

642
00:43:55,800 --> 00:44:00,319
Speaker 2: in the conference finals. So that four Pistons team made

643
00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:05,239
Speaker 2: the conference finals in three, then won the championship the

644
00:44:05,400 --> 00:44:09,719
Speaker 2: next year, lost in seven in heartbreaking fashion to the Spurs,

645
00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:14,520
Speaker 2: and then made one, two, three more conference finals in

646
00:44:14,600 --> 00:44:18,680
Speaker 2: a row and never broke through. So here's my point.

647
00:44:19,280 --> 00:44:23,720
Speaker 2: If that O five Pistons team had won the title,

648
00:44:24,920 --> 00:44:27,759
Speaker 2: then I think people might look back on that four

649
00:44:27,800 --> 00:44:31,560
Speaker 2: Pistons team and say, man, maybe they were better than

650
00:44:31,600 --> 00:44:35,040
Speaker 2: we thought, you know what, I and so. But because

651
00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:38,160
Speaker 2: they didn't, and even though they were still really good

652
00:44:38,280 --> 00:44:41,200
Speaker 2: year after year after year, they were just banging on

653
00:44:41,320 --> 00:44:44,160
Speaker 2: the door like they they never quite got into that

654
00:44:44,320 --> 00:44:46,960
Speaker 2: all time team room. Now, they didn't have the regular

655
00:44:47,040 --> 00:44:50,840
Speaker 2: season the Celtics did, and they didn't have this dominant

656
00:44:50,840 --> 00:44:55,400
Speaker 2: of a postseason that the Celtics did. So take that

657
00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:58,240
Speaker 2: for what you will. All right, Demansey, what's a finals

658
00:44:58,320 --> 00:44:59,719
Speaker 2: MVP question before we move on?

659
00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:01,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, a couple because I want to talk to the

660
00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:03,759
Speaker 3: Joel Embiid thing as well. But yeah, do you think

661
00:45:03,840 --> 00:45:06,160
Speaker 3: Jalen is finals MVP or Drew? Who do you think

662
00:45:06,200 --> 00:45:06,480
Speaker 3: is in that?

663
00:45:06,560 --> 00:45:09,240
Speaker 2: And I think right now it's jailing with a bullet.

664
00:45:09,640 --> 00:45:12,680
Speaker 2: I think right now it's clearly Jalen, and my money

665
00:45:12,719 --> 00:45:14,480
Speaker 2: would be on jail and winning it, because I don't

666
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:19,160
Speaker 2: think Drew's going to have this massive offensive explosion he was.

667
00:45:19,239 --> 00:45:21,240
Speaker 3: He was taking a little bit of too many shots,

668
00:45:21,280 --> 00:45:23,920
Speaker 3: like too at the game of the game, he was

669
00:45:23,920 --> 00:45:24,600
Speaker 3: doing a little bit.

670
00:45:24,960 --> 00:45:27,359
Speaker 4: I was like, and listen.

671
00:45:27,120 --> 00:45:31,360
Speaker 2: And Tatum, I mean, Tatum took a bunch of shots

672
00:45:31,840 --> 00:45:32,880
Speaker 2: and obvious.

673
00:45:32,480 --> 00:45:35,640
Speaker 3: At least three three three three three three step back

674
00:45:35,680 --> 00:45:36,600
Speaker 3: in eight step back three.

675
00:45:36,680 --> 00:45:36,759
Speaker 4: Ye.

676
00:45:36,800 --> 00:45:40,720
Speaker 2: Yeah. And so but listen, he's I mean, he scored thirty.

677
00:45:41,200 --> 00:45:43,319
Speaker 2: I'm not crushing him for it, but I think right now,

678
00:45:43,360 --> 00:45:47,040
Speaker 2: I think it's Jalen's MVP to lose for sure. All right,

679
00:45:47,280 --> 00:45:48,440
Speaker 2: you want to talk Joel and bid?

680
00:45:48,680 --> 00:45:48,919
Speaker 4: Yeah.

681
00:45:48,960 --> 00:45:53,239
Speaker 3: So Joel Embiid used his extensive playoff experience to chime

682
00:45:53,280 --> 00:45:56,839
Speaker 3: in on what's going on. He tweeted, did the Bucks?

683
00:45:57,400 --> 00:46:03,400
Speaker 3: Did the Bucks give them the championship? Is refer instance Celtics? So, uh,

684
00:46:03,480 --> 00:46:05,600
Speaker 3: do you what do you think about that?

685
00:46:05,719 --> 00:46:05,799
Speaker 1: Like?

686
00:46:06,680 --> 00:46:07,839
Speaker 2: What do you think about it?

687
00:46:07,880 --> 00:46:10,840
Speaker 3: You wanted to I don't know why Joel e Bead's

688
00:46:10,880 --> 00:46:15,879
Speaker 3: talking about the championship, and I think that he's gonna say, like, oh,

689
00:46:15,920 --> 00:46:17,719
Speaker 3: did the Bucks give it to him? The last time

690
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:21,040
Speaker 3: the Celtics played the Bucks, they beat him in the

691
00:46:21,080 --> 00:46:23,480
Speaker 3: Game seven, and the Bucks had Drew Holiday, Am I

692
00:46:23,960 --> 00:46:25,040
Speaker 3: or am I? Am I wrong about?

693
00:46:25,160 --> 00:46:25,359
Speaker 4: Yes?

694
00:46:25,840 --> 00:46:26,040
Speaker 2: They have?

695
00:46:27,040 --> 00:46:28,759
Speaker 3: And you expected that the Bucks were going to beat

696
00:46:28,760 --> 00:46:31,080
Speaker 3: the Celtics. It's just like, Joe, just stay home and

697
00:46:31,160 --> 00:46:32,400
Speaker 3: enjoy your vacation, dude.

698
00:46:32,880 --> 00:46:35,120
Speaker 2: Okay, So I don't think he was saying the Bucks

699
00:46:35,120 --> 00:46:36,799
Speaker 2: were going to beat the Celtics. What I think he

700
00:46:36,880 --> 00:46:37,520
Speaker 2: was saying is.

701
00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:38,560
Speaker 4: They're going to wear him down.

702
00:46:39,239 --> 00:46:41,280
Speaker 2: No, no, no, no. I don't even think he was looking

703
00:46:41,320 --> 00:46:44,040
Speaker 2: at it as the Bucks versus the Celtics. I think

704
00:46:44,040 --> 00:46:46,760
Speaker 2: he was saying, and I don't think this is actually

705
00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:51,680
Speaker 2: a bad take, that the final piece for Boston was

706
00:46:51,719 --> 00:46:52,520
Speaker 2: made available.

707
00:46:54,800 --> 00:46:59,320
Speaker 4: Yes, And I was just like using that to yes, yeah, yeah.

708
00:46:59,320 --> 00:47:02,399
Speaker 2: I know that's that fair. I was like, oh, I

709
00:47:02,440 --> 00:47:04,920
Speaker 2: was like, you're so close to seeing what he's saying,

710
00:47:04,960 --> 00:47:07,400
Speaker 2: but you didn't. And then you mentioned Drew Holliday but

711
00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:11,000
Speaker 2: you didn't quite get there. What he's saying is the

712
00:47:11,040 --> 00:47:15,560
Speaker 2: Bucks feeling that we have to get Dame was the

713
00:47:15,640 --> 00:47:19,280
Speaker 2: dominance that allowed the Celtics to get.

714
00:47:19,160 --> 00:47:22,359
Speaker 3: Drew, which was all so still to this day kind

715
00:47:22,360 --> 00:47:24,080
Speaker 3: of blame you, honest for but go ahead.

716
00:47:25,040 --> 00:47:28,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's fair. I mean that. I mean they did

717
00:47:28,760 --> 00:47:31,239
Speaker 2: that because they were afraid Giannis was going to say

718
00:47:31,280 --> 00:47:36,560
Speaker 2: I want to leave. So they made a impulsive move

719
00:47:37,280 --> 00:47:39,719
Speaker 2: to try to up because Drew had not been good

720
00:47:39,840 --> 00:47:42,520
Speaker 2: offensively in the playoffs with Milwaukee, even when they won

721
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:45,520
Speaker 2: the title, he wasn't good offensively. They thought they needed

722
00:47:45,560 --> 00:47:48,520
Speaker 2: more in that spot. They were worried about Chris Middleton's

723
00:47:48,600 --> 00:47:53,160
Speaker 2: deteriorating health, so they made a move. But would I

724
00:47:53,160 --> 00:48:01,520
Speaker 2: I guess, the question asked Celtics. Well, there's that question.

725
00:48:01,640 --> 00:48:05,240
Speaker 2: The other question is this, would the Bucks have made

726
00:48:05,440 --> 00:48:10,360
Speaker 2: that Dame trade if they knew Drew was gonna end

727
00:48:10,440 --> 00:48:14,319
Speaker 2: up on Boss? I think the answer that's no, you

728
00:48:14,360 --> 00:48:16,680
Speaker 2: know what I mean, I don't think they would have

729
00:48:16,760 --> 00:48:21,520
Speaker 2: done it if they knew that. And so I.

730
00:48:21,360 --> 00:48:23,440
Speaker 4: I don't think that type of stuff happens.

731
00:48:23,520 --> 00:48:25,560
Speaker 3: I love that type of stuff, like, sorry, you shot

732
00:48:25,600 --> 00:48:27,960
Speaker 3: yourself in the foot, You shouldn't have done it.

733
00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:32,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, that's a that Well, so there was in

734
00:48:32,920 --> 00:48:39,239
Speaker 2: a much, you know, much much smaller stakes. The Thunder

735
00:48:40,200 --> 00:48:44,759
Speaker 2: made two moves on draft Day and then at the

736
00:48:44,800 --> 00:48:50,280
Speaker 2: trade deadline that allowed the MAVs to get Derek Lively

737
00:48:50,880 --> 00:48:55,760
Speaker 2: and Daniel Gafford, and then those two guys were huge

738
00:48:55,800 --> 00:49:00,520
Speaker 2: reasons why the MAVs beat the thunder So it was like, like, oh,

739
00:49:00,600 --> 00:49:03,640
Speaker 2: you helped us get those guys, and now those guys

740
00:49:03,640 --> 00:49:07,400
Speaker 2: are beating you. This is again, it's not the finals,

741
00:49:07,440 --> 00:49:11,120
Speaker 2: and it's different stakes, all of it. But yeah, I mean,

742
00:49:11,160 --> 00:49:15,160
Speaker 2: this was It's so the reason I liked Embiid's tweet

743
00:49:15,280 --> 00:49:19,600
Speaker 2: is I said it on first things first, after Game one,

744
00:49:19,719 --> 00:49:22,480
Speaker 2: I have, you know, I keep all my folders that

745
00:49:22,520 --> 00:49:26,120
Speaker 2: I write all my notes on. I wrote, literally, I

746
00:49:26,160 --> 00:49:27,799
Speaker 2: should take a picture of it and tweet it out

747
00:49:27,880 --> 00:49:33,799
Speaker 2: Later today I wrote something along the lines of do

748
00:49:33,920 --> 00:49:36,720
Speaker 2: the Bucks does someone in the Bucks front office deserve

749
00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:40,279
Speaker 2: a ring if the Celtics win the title? And so,

750
00:49:41,560 --> 00:49:44,040
Speaker 2: I mean I and Drew's been so good for him,

751
00:49:44,120 --> 00:49:47,000
Speaker 2: so good for him, and yeah, so that's what Embiid

752
00:49:47,080 --> 00:49:49,680
Speaker 2: was talking about. So it's not a bad sports take.

753
00:49:50,160 --> 00:49:52,760
Speaker 2: You just might not want to hear it from Joel Embiid.

754
00:49:52,960 --> 00:49:55,759
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, not hear from Joel Embiid, especially in the

755
00:49:55,800 --> 00:49:58,440
Speaker 3: context that I was thinking of it. But now, like

756
00:49:58,480 --> 00:50:02,439
Speaker 3: I understand, okay, all right, let's do let's do Aaron

757
00:50:02,520 --> 00:50:06,359
Speaker 3: Rodgers quickly. Yeah, so Aaron Rodgers' sets is still miss

758
00:50:06,400 --> 00:50:09,279
Speaker 3: mini camp. No one's coming out and saying what the

759
00:50:09,400 --> 00:50:12,480
Speaker 3: actual event is that he's attending. But yeah, so we

760
00:50:12,600 --> 00:50:14,920
Speaker 3: know where you stand on this guy. The rest of

761
00:50:14,960 --> 00:50:17,239
Speaker 3: the media, a lot of other media members are saying

762
00:50:17,280 --> 00:50:19,319
Speaker 3: that this isn't a big deal considering where it is

763
00:50:20,320 --> 00:50:22,719
Speaker 3: in the point of the year. So so, yeah, where

764
00:50:22,760 --> 00:50:24,040
Speaker 3: where do you stand on it?

765
00:50:24,080 --> 00:50:24,319
Speaker 4: Now?

766
00:50:25,200 --> 00:50:25,600
Speaker 2: Okay?

767
00:50:26,600 --> 00:50:27,040
Speaker 3: I mean.

768
00:50:29,120 --> 00:50:34,200
Speaker 2: Everyone else is at their mini camp. He isn't he.

769
00:50:35,400 --> 00:50:39,680
Speaker 2: I'm not I the the I And by the way,

770
00:50:39,800 --> 00:50:46,200
Speaker 2: Colin reported he's on vacation. Colin said, he's on an

771
00:50:46,280 --> 00:50:53,719
Speaker 2: international vacation. And so listen, I don't I have Like

772
00:50:53,800 --> 00:50:59,640
Speaker 2: you said, people know where I stand, and I've talked

773
00:50:59,640 --> 00:51:03,520
Speaker 2: about this a lot on TV, and today's an NBA

774
00:51:03,600 --> 00:51:06,560
Speaker 2: Finals day, so I don't really want to and we've

775
00:51:06,560 --> 00:51:09,520
Speaker 2: gone We're gonna maybe set our record for longest day

776
00:51:09,520 --> 00:51:15,800
Speaker 2: block ever. The guy's a phony and I'm not gonna

777
00:51:15,960 --> 00:51:21,640
Speaker 2: dance around it anymore. He's an absolute phony. He is

778
00:51:22,200 --> 00:51:28,080
Speaker 2: the worst type of leader anyone can have in any organization,

779
00:51:29,000 --> 00:51:35,120
Speaker 2: which is the self righteous, preachy get the bullshout out

780
00:51:35,160 --> 00:51:37,080
Speaker 2: of the building that doesn't have to do with winning.

781
00:51:37,440 --> 00:51:41,040
Speaker 2: We are locked in. We're doing all this. By the way,

782
00:51:41,400 --> 00:51:45,880
Speaker 2: I'm flirting with being the vice president. And also I

783
00:51:46,680 --> 00:51:51,040
Speaker 2: just can't you know, I can't afford the flight switch

784
00:51:51,120 --> 00:51:57,000
Speaker 2: fee to move around my trip stop it and to

785
00:51:57,360 --> 00:52:02,279
Speaker 2: have the the the idea. So here is here is

786
00:52:02,400 --> 00:52:05,520
Speaker 2: one thing that I will say. And every time I

787
00:52:05,600 --> 00:52:10,120
Speaker 2: tweet about this or I post a clip, it's just

788
00:52:10,960 --> 00:52:16,840
Speaker 2: these morons in my mentions being like you must be

789
00:52:16,960 --> 00:52:23,600
Speaker 2: on your fourteenth booster, guys, I could be the biggest

790
00:52:23,760 --> 00:52:33,040
Speaker 2: anti VACS conspiracy theorist RFK junior tattoo. And still think

791
00:52:33,120 --> 00:52:38,400
Speaker 2: Aaron Rodgers, the quarterback leader of the Jets, is a charlatan.

792
00:52:39,600 --> 00:52:46,360
Speaker 2: The idea that it is almost become because he was

793
00:52:46,440 --> 00:52:51,240
Speaker 2: criticized for non football things that now folks are trying

794
00:52:51,280 --> 00:52:57,000
Speaker 2: to pretend all of the criticism about football things are

795
00:52:57,040 --> 00:53:01,200
Speaker 2: related to that. There are thirty two starting quarterbacks in

796
00:53:01,280 --> 00:53:08,000
Speaker 2: the NFL. How many of them are unexcused missing mini

797
00:53:08,080 --> 00:53:13,000
Speaker 2: camp one last year it was zero, the year before

798
00:53:13,480 --> 00:53:16,799
Speaker 2: it was zero, the year before that it was one.

799
00:53:17,239 --> 00:53:22,000
Speaker 2: Any guests on who it was Aaron Rodgers, So don't

800
00:53:22,080 --> 00:53:26,520
Speaker 2: tell me that this. In the last four off seasons,

801
00:53:26,840 --> 00:53:30,400
Speaker 2: there has been one. There have been two times what's

802
00:53:30,800 --> 00:53:34,080
Speaker 2: thirty two times four one hundred and twenty eight. There

803
00:53:34,120 --> 00:53:38,160
Speaker 2: have been one hundred and twenty eight possible instances of

804
00:53:38,200 --> 00:53:44,000
Speaker 2: a starting quarterback being fined for missing mandatory mini camp.

805
00:53:44,360 --> 00:53:48,279
Speaker 2: The whole world is one hundred and twenty six, one

806
00:53:48,360 --> 00:53:51,480
Speaker 2: hundred and twenty four and oher on not being fined

807
00:53:51,880 --> 00:53:56,040
Speaker 2: Aaron Rodgers is five hundred. He's two and two, and

808
00:53:56,560 --> 00:53:59,800
Speaker 2: so that is that's just objective fact.

809
00:54:00,600 --> 00:54:05,200
Speaker 3: And here go ahead, Demonse, go Yeah, I was probably

810
00:54:05,200 --> 00:54:06,520
Speaker 3: the last person you want to hear. But on the

811
00:54:06,560 --> 00:54:09,280
Speaker 3: other side of it, he did just like Terror's Achilles

812
00:54:09,360 --> 00:54:12,880
Speaker 3: last year, and he's like super he's old, and you

813
00:54:12,960 --> 00:54:15,920
Speaker 3: know that his offensive line might have problems. It probably

814
00:54:15,960 --> 00:54:20,520
Speaker 3: isn't his best interest to begetting the most activity going

815
00:54:20,560 --> 00:54:23,560
Speaker 3: on that he possibly can be getty, Like I could

816
00:54:23,560 --> 00:54:25,600
Speaker 3: see if I feel like if he didn't just Terror's

817
00:54:25,640 --> 00:54:28,919
Speaker 3: Achilles last year, it'd almost be a little bit more excusable.

818
00:54:30,239 --> 00:54:34,680
Speaker 2: But oh, you're saying, because he missed so much time

819
00:54:34,760 --> 00:54:37,400
Speaker 2: he needs the practice or he doesn't need the practice.

820
00:54:37,520 --> 00:54:39,680
Speaker 3: No, he probably need like needs it, like to get

821
00:54:39,719 --> 00:54:42,120
Speaker 3: physically back. He missed the whole football season last year.

822
00:54:42,680 --> 00:54:46,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, and they have a new offensive line and they

823
00:54:46,560 --> 00:54:52,359
Speaker 2: have they added receivers. They yes, they need to get

824
00:54:52,400 --> 00:54:58,240
Speaker 2: on the same page. Here is. And also they won't

825
00:54:58,280 --> 00:55:01,719
Speaker 2: say where he is. It's all of it is just

826
00:55:01,840 --> 00:55:09,000
Speaker 2: so it's just so embarrassing. So here is. So people

827
00:55:09,080 --> 00:55:16,120
Speaker 2: are wondering why the Jets didn't let people know this

828
00:55:16,320 --> 00:55:21,120
Speaker 2: was happening a month ago. So and by people, it's

829
00:55:21,160 --> 00:55:25,200
Speaker 2: not just the media. Tyrod Taylor didn't know it. That's

830
00:55:25,239 --> 00:55:28,399
Speaker 2: the other thing. Aaron's teammates did not know he wasn't

831
00:55:28,440 --> 00:55:32,480
Speaker 2: gonna be there until he wasn't there. I'll say that again.

832
00:55:32,880 --> 00:55:35,719
Speaker 2: Aaron's teammates did not know he wasn't gonna be there

833
00:55:35,800 --> 00:55:40,960
Speaker 2: until he wasn't there. And so people are wondering, since

834
00:55:41,000 --> 00:55:44,600
Speaker 2: Aaron was there for all of the optional stuff this offseason,

835
00:55:45,239 --> 00:55:49,040
Speaker 2: why the Jets didn't handle this from a pr perspective better,

836
00:55:49,800 --> 00:55:55,799
Speaker 2: which was six weeks ago. Have as an aside during

837
00:55:55,840 --> 00:55:59,680
Speaker 2: a press conference, when you're singing Aaron's praises about him

838
00:55:59,680 --> 00:56:03,800
Speaker 2: being there, just say, and you know, we're really glad

839
00:56:03,800 --> 00:56:05,799
Speaker 2: he's here because you know, we know he can't be

840
00:56:05,880 --> 00:56:08,120
Speaker 2: at mini camp and blah blah blah. And then at

841
00:56:08,160 --> 00:56:11,000
Speaker 2: some point, someone follows up and they're like, wait, did

842
00:56:11,000 --> 00:56:13,600
Speaker 2: you say he's not gonna be at Mini camp? Be like, yeah,

843
00:56:13,640 --> 00:56:15,600
Speaker 2: we've talked about it. We know it's not a big deal.

844
00:56:15,800 --> 00:56:18,120
Speaker 2: He's got something going on, and then it's not a

845
00:56:18,160 --> 00:56:21,760
Speaker 2: story the first day of Mini camp. So why didn't

846
00:56:21,800 --> 00:56:27,200
Speaker 2: the Jets do that? Everyone is assigning just raw incompetence

847
00:56:27,280 --> 00:56:31,640
Speaker 2: to that decision, and it's the Jets, so raw incompetence

848
00:56:31,719 --> 00:56:36,720
Speaker 2: is always on the board. That's not my theory. Here's

849
00:56:36,760 --> 00:56:39,960
Speaker 2: my theory to Monsey. I haven't heard anyone else say this,

850
00:56:40,320 --> 00:56:44,160
Speaker 2: but to me, it's so clearly what happened. Why didn't

851
00:56:44,200 --> 00:56:47,200
Speaker 2: the Jets let the media know? Why didn't they let

852
00:56:47,200 --> 00:56:54,360
Speaker 2: his teammates knowing? No, No, that's not it. I believe

853
00:56:54,400 --> 00:56:57,040
Speaker 2: they knew. I don't think that. I mean, that's possible.

854
00:56:57,080 --> 00:56:59,720
Speaker 2: I guess that they're lying that they've known for months,

855
00:56:59,719 --> 00:57:04,560
Speaker 2: But I believe they knew. Here's my theory. They were

856
00:57:04,640 --> 00:57:10,479
Speaker 2: hoping he'd change his mind. They were hoping that at

857
00:57:10,520 --> 00:57:16,600
Speaker 2: some point he would be like, hmmm, international vacation or

858
00:57:16,640 --> 00:57:19,760
Speaker 2: the only two days I'm required to be in this

859
00:57:19,880 --> 00:57:24,120
Speaker 2: building in a three month stretch, we can you know

860
00:57:24,200 --> 00:57:28,360
Speaker 2: what I've made the most money of anyone in the

861
00:57:28,440 --> 00:57:32,360
Speaker 2: history of professional football. I can move some flights around.

862
00:57:33,440 --> 00:57:38,960
Speaker 2: They were hoping that, and again raw speculation. My guess

863
00:57:39,040 --> 00:57:41,280
Speaker 2: is the last day of the OTAs there was a

864
00:57:41,280 --> 00:57:44,919
Speaker 2: bit of a you know, hope to see on Tuesday Arin.

865
00:57:45,760 --> 00:57:50,600
Speaker 2: It's like, ah, like, maybe he'll surprise us. The other

866
00:57:50,680 --> 00:57:54,000
Speaker 2: option is they're just totally incompetent in all phases. I

867
00:57:54,040 --> 00:57:58,600
Speaker 2: think they were hoping he'd change his mind because objected,

868
00:57:58,960 --> 00:58:04,200
Speaker 2: and someone would the Jets is pissed, someone important with

869
00:58:04,280 --> 00:58:08,320
Speaker 2: the Jets is pissed, or else they call it excused.

870
00:58:09,880 --> 00:58:13,800
Speaker 2: They simply say he's excused, and this idea, well, they

871
00:58:13,840 --> 00:58:16,800
Speaker 2: can't say he's excused because then they have to excuse

872
00:58:16,840 --> 00:58:20,360
Speaker 2: the Sonrettic. No, they don't. And the other thing is

873
00:58:20,560 --> 00:58:24,400
Speaker 2: they could just excuse a Sonretic, but a Sonrettic. I mean,

874
00:58:24,480 --> 00:58:27,840
Speaker 2: this is the incompetence. The Eagles traded a Sonretic because

875
00:58:27,880 --> 00:58:29,880
Speaker 2: he wanted a new contract they didn't want to give him.

876
00:58:30,000 --> 00:58:35,440
Speaker 2: The Jets traded for him without getting the Sonretic stuff

877
00:58:35,480 --> 00:58:39,520
Speaker 2: locked in. It's just so he's upset didn't have a deal.

878
00:58:40,080 --> 00:58:43,360
Speaker 2: So that's my theory. My other theory is a very

879
00:58:43,400 --> 00:58:47,520
Speaker 2: simple one, which is when Aaron does talk about this,

880
00:58:48,080 --> 00:58:53,080
Speaker 2: he will be sanctimonious. He will not so subtly scold

881
00:58:53,240 --> 00:58:58,440
Speaker 2: Robert Salah like, well, yeah, you know, I don't you know,

882
00:58:58,480 --> 00:59:00,320
Speaker 2: we had talked about it, so I don't know why

883
00:59:00,360 --> 00:59:03,120
Speaker 2: it was, you know, made quite the deal it was.

884
00:59:03,240 --> 00:59:06,920
Speaker 2: And then he will just talk about the fake news

885
00:59:06,960 --> 00:59:10,080
Speaker 2: media and everyone making a big deal out of nothing

886
00:59:11,160 --> 00:59:15,400
Speaker 2: because the guys in Peru or Portugal or wherever the

887
00:59:15,440 --> 00:59:21,200
Speaker 2: hell he is. It's just so embarrassing. Quick break right

888
00:59:21,280 --> 00:59:24,360
Speaker 2: back after a one hour long a block What's Right?

889
00:59:31,320 --> 00:59:34,120
Speaker 2: Welcome back in What's Right? With Nick Wright, episode two

890
00:59:34,200 --> 00:59:38,680
Speaker 2: forty four on what is almost Celtic's coronation Day not

891
00:59:38,800 --> 00:59:44,640
Speaker 2: quite demands some somber news. Yesterday in the sports world,

892
00:59:44,720 --> 00:59:46,360
Speaker 2: let's get to it. Go ahead.

893
00:59:46,560 --> 00:59:49,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, so yesterday the logo Jerry West passed away at

894
00:59:49,840 --> 00:59:52,200
Speaker 3: the age of eighty six, and we had actually just

895
00:59:52,280 --> 00:59:55,560
Speaker 3: touched base on Jerry West, I think the episode before, and.

896
00:59:56,200 --> 00:59:57,920
Speaker 4: He said, over the last sixty years, he's one of the.

897
00:59:57,920 --> 01:00:01,080
Speaker 3: Most impactful players in the sport. Uh, could you ever

898
01:00:01,160 --> 01:00:02,640
Speaker 3: imagine an NBA without him?

899
01:00:03,720 --> 01:00:08,040
Speaker 2: Well? No, I mean so, so here's the thing we

900
01:00:08,880 --> 01:00:12,400
Speaker 2: in order to properly eulogize Jerry West, we'd probably need

901
01:00:12,440 --> 01:00:16,320
Speaker 2: to do a whole episode one of the I was

902
01:00:16,480 --> 01:00:21,960
Speaker 2: really really happy. Happy is obviously the wrong word when

903
01:00:21,960 --> 01:00:26,680
Speaker 2: I heard he passed. You're obviously very sad, but I

904
01:00:26,880 --> 01:00:32,360
Speaker 2: was happy that we had just impromptu talked about him

905
01:00:32,400 --> 01:00:38,880
Speaker 2: on Thursday and did a kind of just off the

906
01:00:39,000 --> 01:00:44,600
Speaker 2: cuff retrospective on what a badass of a player he was.

907
01:00:46,200 --> 01:00:53,240
Speaker 2: What's crazy about his playing career is that you could

908
01:00:53,320 --> 01:00:58,560
Speaker 2: argue it wasn't as good as his executive career, and

909
01:00:59,800 --> 01:01:02,800
Speaker 2: one of the great what if it's an NBA history

910
01:01:03,480 --> 01:01:07,440
Speaker 2: demon say this is worth looking back and finding the

911
01:01:07,520 --> 01:01:13,040
Speaker 2: video of Jerry West. So he builds the showtime Lakers

912
01:01:13,840 --> 01:01:16,640
Speaker 2: that they actually when they announced pat Riley is going

913
01:01:16,680 --> 01:01:23,040
Speaker 2: to be the coach, Doctor Buss announced Jerry West was

914
01:01:23,080 --> 01:01:26,400
Speaker 2: going to be the coach at the press conference and

915
01:01:26,520 --> 01:01:30,360
Speaker 2: Jerry West said, no, I'm not not doing it. At

916
01:01:30,400 --> 01:01:34,320
Speaker 2: the press conference, like doctor Buss surprised him, You're gonna

917
01:01:34,320 --> 01:01:34,800
Speaker 2: be the coach?

918
01:01:35,400 --> 01:01:35,840
Speaker 4: Uh?

919
01:01:35,880 --> 01:01:38,120
Speaker 2: And then it's like because Magic had forced out the

920
01:01:38,160 --> 01:01:41,960
Speaker 2: previous coach didn't like him, and then Jerry West was like, no,

921
01:01:42,040 --> 01:01:44,360
Speaker 2: I'm not so then They're like it was very weird,

922
01:01:44,360 --> 01:01:46,440
Speaker 2: and it's like, Okay, this is not the video. I'm

923
01:01:46,440 --> 01:01:50,640
Speaker 2: telling you to look up. So pat Riley, No, pat

924
01:01:50,720 --> 01:01:53,960
Speaker 2: Riley's going to be the coach, right, yeah, exactly right,

925
01:01:54,000 --> 01:01:56,400
Speaker 2: pat Riley's going to be the coach. Jerry West was

926
01:01:56,440 --> 01:01:59,400
Speaker 2: like an offensive consultant. Pat Riley ends up being one

927
01:01:59,440 --> 01:02:02,240
Speaker 2: of the greatest of all time. Jerry helps build the

928
01:02:02,240 --> 01:02:07,000
Speaker 2: showtime Lakers. Jerry then trades for Shaq, drafts Kobe, and

929
01:02:07,040 --> 01:02:09,600
Speaker 2: you know, executes a draft day trade for Kobe. It

930
01:02:09,640 --> 01:02:13,160
Speaker 2: should be noted Kobe was the thirteenth pick of the

931
01:02:13,240 --> 01:02:17,880
Speaker 2: draft trade, acquired for Vlade divants. It's not like it

932
01:02:18,000 --> 01:02:22,600
Speaker 2: was a Lebron can't miss won the lottery situation. Jerry

933
01:02:22,640 --> 01:02:26,680
Speaker 2: West saw something in him. Brew told a story off

934
01:02:26,720 --> 01:02:29,960
Speaker 2: the air yesterday that one of the reasons the Lakers

935
01:02:30,320 --> 01:02:33,439
Speaker 2: fell in love with Kobe was because when they brought

936
01:02:33,520 --> 01:02:35,760
Speaker 2: him in for a workout, instead of just having him

937
01:02:35,800 --> 01:02:38,760
Speaker 2: work out, they had him work out against Michael Cooper,

938
01:02:39,040 --> 01:02:41,520
Speaker 2: who was aging but was one of the best defensive

939
01:02:41,520 --> 01:02:45,439
Speaker 2: players in the league in his heyday. And Kobe did

940
01:02:45,480 --> 01:02:49,160
Speaker 2: great in that workout. And so Jerry was a visionary.

941
01:02:49,480 --> 01:02:54,400
Speaker 2: He was the reason demands. The Warriors didn't trade Clay

942
01:02:54,560 --> 01:02:59,600
Speaker 2: Thompson for Kevin Love in twenty thirteen. That was on

943
01:02:59,680 --> 01:03:05,240
Speaker 2: the everyone in twenty thirteen. Everyone wanted to do it.

944
01:03:05,240 --> 01:03:08,680
Speaker 2: It's like, we already have staff, we need more rebounding.

945
01:03:09,160 --> 01:03:11,680
Speaker 2: Kevin Love was available. Kevin Love at that point was

946
01:03:11,720 --> 01:03:14,320
Speaker 2: like putting up twenty and twenties all the time. They

947
01:03:14,320 --> 01:03:17,560
Speaker 2: were going to do it, and Jerry West stopped it,

948
01:03:18,280 --> 01:03:20,800
Speaker 2: and then they end up turning into a dynasty. Jerry

949
01:03:20,840 --> 01:03:24,440
Speaker 2: West helped put the Clippers together in later years. Sadly

950
01:03:24,920 --> 01:03:27,760
Speaker 2: he had a falling out with the Lakers. They continue

951
01:03:27,760 --> 01:03:30,160
Speaker 2: to be petty about it. It's one of the reasons

952
01:03:30,200 --> 01:03:34,240
Speaker 2: they are embarrassing as a high level organization. Their statement

953
01:03:34,280 --> 01:03:37,240
Speaker 2: on Jerry West was three sentences long, and in my opinion,

954
01:03:37,280 --> 01:03:40,920
Speaker 2: they shorted him championships and so it's it's weird he

955
01:03:40,960 --> 01:03:44,480
Speaker 2: has a statue there, but they still there's still bitterness

956
01:03:44,960 --> 01:03:48,520
Speaker 2: between ownership there. It's clearly because.

957
01:03:48,320 --> 01:03:51,560
Speaker 3: You said clip teams, it wasn't He ain't have anything

958
01:03:51,600 --> 01:03:52,680
Speaker 3: to do with Lob City, did he?

959
01:03:54,000 --> 01:03:57,720
Speaker 2: So let me know, because with so he was he

960
01:03:57,880 --> 01:04:01,440
Speaker 2: was with the Clippers as a con sultan. Let me

961
01:04:01,480 --> 01:04:04,000
Speaker 2: get it exactly right. When he was with the Clippers.

962
01:04:04,120 --> 01:04:08,360
Speaker 2: I want to have his the timeline correct on that

963
01:04:08,760 --> 01:04:13,560
Speaker 2: it wasn't lob City. He was with the Clippers in

964
01:04:13,640 --> 01:04:17,160
Speaker 2: this latest in twenty seven, starting in twenty seventeen. Oh yeah,

965
01:04:17,280 --> 01:04:22,040
Speaker 2: so he was. He was there with you know when

966
01:04:22,040 --> 01:04:25,800
Speaker 2: they when they got Kawhi and those guys. He was

967
01:04:25,840 --> 01:04:29,120
Speaker 2: with the Warriors from twenty eleven to twenty seventeen and

968
01:04:29,200 --> 01:04:33,840
Speaker 2: the Grizzlies from O two to seven. This is the

969
01:04:34,000 --> 01:04:38,080
Speaker 2: video I was referring to. So he takes over the

970
01:04:38,120 --> 01:04:44,680
Speaker 2: Grizzlies in O two. The three draft is the Lebron Draft.

971
01:04:45,760 --> 01:04:55,840
Speaker 2: The Grizzlies had traded their pick years prior for nothing. Really,

972
01:04:55,840 --> 01:04:57,600
Speaker 2: you know, it was one of those picks like it's

973
01:04:57,640 --> 01:05:02,480
Speaker 2: protected this, protected this, but they find owed it. They

974
01:05:02,720 --> 01:05:07,680
Speaker 2: only got to keep it. It was protected for number

975
01:05:07,840 --> 01:05:14,480
Speaker 2: one overall in the Lebron James Draft. Okay, it was

976
01:05:14,520 --> 01:05:19,560
Speaker 2: gonna go to the Pistons otherwise, And that lottery happens.

977
01:05:20,800 --> 01:05:25,800
Speaker 2: And the final two teams left picking one and two

978
01:05:25,960 --> 01:05:29,480
Speaker 2: or two and one are the Calves and the Grizzlies.

979
01:05:30,080 --> 01:05:33,680
Speaker 2: And Jerry West is on the podium knowing if they

980
01:05:33,680 --> 01:05:38,560
Speaker 2: open the envelope and it's US, we get Lebron James.

981
01:05:39,000 --> 01:05:43,320
Speaker 2: If they open the envelope and it's Cleveland, we get nothing.

982
01:05:44,520 --> 01:05:47,600
Speaker 2: The number two pick then goes to Detroit. So it's

983
01:05:47,680 --> 01:05:53,520
Speaker 2: either the greatest prospect in sports history or nothing. No

984
01:05:53,600 --> 01:05:59,120
Speaker 2: pick ended up being nothing. That pick ended up turning

985
01:05:59,160 --> 01:06:02,360
Speaker 2: into dark O, but it obviously could have been d Wade, Carmelo, Bosch,

986
01:06:02,440 --> 01:06:07,520
Speaker 2: those were the next guys taken. But there is and Cleveland,

987
01:06:07,640 --> 01:06:10,920
Speaker 2: Lebron's from Akron. There's all of that, but there is

988
01:06:10,960 --> 01:06:17,479
Speaker 2: a whole another version of NBA history where Lebron gets

989
01:06:17,560 --> 01:06:22,600
Speaker 2: drafted to a team run by the greatest executive ever

990
01:06:24,120 --> 01:06:26,520
Speaker 2: and does he never you know what I mean. There's

991
01:06:26,600 --> 01:06:29,760
Speaker 2: so many things there or whatever. But Jerry West was

992
01:06:29,960 --> 01:06:33,400
Speaker 2: just a legend's legend. And the clip I played on

993
01:06:33,480 --> 01:06:40,000
Speaker 2: TV yesterday was him recently relatively at a conference talking

994
01:06:40,040 --> 01:06:42,520
Speaker 2: about how players come into the league these days and

995
01:06:42,520 --> 01:06:45,280
Speaker 2: they're like, he's a dog, he's a dog. This guy's

996
01:06:45,320 --> 01:06:48,439
Speaker 2: a dog, and he just says, matter of factly, well,

997
01:06:48,480 --> 01:06:49,280
Speaker 2: I was a wolf.

998
01:06:50,320 --> 01:06:51,400
Speaker 4: I ate dogs.

999
01:06:52,080 --> 01:06:56,720
Speaker 2: And he's not lying, man. And it's also why when

1000
01:06:56,800 --> 01:07:01,240
Speaker 2: he he you know, when JJ did the plumbers and

1001
01:07:01,320 --> 01:07:04,160
Speaker 2: fireman thing. And he was asked about it.

1002
01:07:04,280 --> 01:07:07,600
Speaker 4: Ye, he flamed him.

1003
01:07:08,040 --> 01:07:11,280
Speaker 2: He was like, at some point the numbers matter, young man,

1004
01:07:11,520 --> 01:07:14,560
Speaker 2: what did you eat? His his quote was what did

1005
01:07:14,600 --> 01:07:17,880
Speaker 2: you do in this league to impact winning? I mean,

1006
01:07:17,920 --> 01:07:19,760
Speaker 2: he was like, what were you twelve points per game?

1007
01:07:20,160 --> 01:07:23,720
Speaker 2: And so and again, I understand you have to adjust

1008
01:07:23,760 --> 01:07:29,480
Speaker 2: it for era, but Jerry West, for his era, he

1009
01:07:29,600 --> 01:07:33,400
Speaker 2: said it probably at the highest vertical in the league.

1010
01:07:34,280 --> 01:07:37,040
Speaker 2: Maybe Bill Russell or Wilt had higher, but those guys

1011
01:07:37,040 --> 01:07:40,520
Speaker 2: were freak freak athletes. But was as fast as any

1012
01:07:40,560 --> 01:07:45,320
Speaker 2: player in the league. Was the best shooter in the league.

1013
01:07:45,520 --> 01:07:52,320
Speaker 2: And justin all, it's why you know, most people have

1014
01:07:52,480 --> 01:07:57,760
Speaker 2: him as the third best shooting guard ever, Michael Kobe, Jerry,

1015
01:07:58,520 --> 01:08:01,560
Speaker 2: there's an argument he's the second best shooting guard ever.

1016
01:08:02,120 --> 01:08:05,720
Speaker 2: When I did my Top fifty, one of the reasons

1017
01:08:05,720 --> 01:08:07,960
Speaker 2: I cut it off of the last fifty years is

1018
01:08:07,960 --> 01:08:12,000
Speaker 2: because it is really hard to parse the guys from

1019
01:08:12,080 --> 01:08:15,640
Speaker 2: Jerry's era and the previous era. And here's the other

1020
01:08:15,720 --> 01:08:25,120
Speaker 2: thing that I'll say that is sad. Before Kobe passed demons,

1021
01:08:26,080 --> 01:08:31,920
Speaker 2: if you said, hey, let's get the fifty greatest NBA

1022
01:08:32,120 --> 01:08:37,720
Speaker 2: players ever in a room, all of them were available

1023
01:08:38,120 --> 01:08:42,519
Speaker 2: except for Wilt and Pistol. Pete and Pistol died very young.

1024
01:08:42,560 --> 01:08:43,719
Speaker 4: Pistol died in his forties.

1025
01:08:46,200 --> 01:08:49,880
Speaker 2: Since Kobe passed, we've had a lot of legends go.

1026
01:08:50,520 --> 01:08:53,559
Speaker 2: We just had Bill Walton go recently, Jerry went, Bill

1027
01:08:53,640 --> 01:08:56,360
Speaker 2: Russell went, I'm not gonna be you know, Kobe. Obviously

1028
01:08:56,400 --> 01:08:59,800
Speaker 2: there's others as well, and now when the lead. You know,

1029
01:08:59,840 --> 01:09:04,360
Speaker 2: the league just celebrated its seventy fifth anniversary, which just means,

1030
01:09:04,400 --> 01:09:09,840
Speaker 2: by definition, unfortunately, we're gonna have a lot more of these.

1031
01:09:10,160 --> 01:09:12,720
Speaker 2: You know. Bob Coosey gave a quote yesterday or the

1032
01:09:12,760 --> 01:09:14,479
Speaker 2: day before it is that I'm nine. I don't know

1033
01:09:14,479 --> 01:09:16,479
Speaker 2: if he's ninety five or ninety six. He's like, I'm

1034
01:09:16,560 --> 01:09:19,000
Speaker 2: ninety five years old. I've got one foot in the grave.

1035
01:09:19,360 --> 01:09:21,799
Speaker 2: I just want to see the Celtics hang banner eighteen,

1036
01:09:22,240 --> 01:09:24,920
Speaker 2: which was a great quote by a legendary player. But

1037
01:09:25,000 --> 01:09:28,639
Speaker 2: it's just, you know, it is so many of these guys.

1038
01:09:29,160 --> 01:09:34,599
Speaker 2: And one other thing I'll say, uh, everyone should go

1039
01:09:34,840 --> 01:09:40,599
Speaker 2: check out uh Dan Patrick on Jerry West. So, Dan

1040
01:09:40,720 --> 01:09:46,920
Speaker 2: Patrick is obviously a lot older than me and d

1041
01:09:47,280 --> 01:09:54,800
Speaker 2: so Dan Patrick is he's mid to late sixties looks unbelievable,

1042
01:09:54,800 --> 01:10:00,519
Speaker 2: by the way, but he's you know, he he Jerry

1043
01:10:00,520 --> 01:10:04,240
Speaker 2: West was his favorite player as a little kid, and

1044
01:10:04,280 --> 01:10:07,320
Speaker 2: then he became friends with Jerry West through the show

1045
01:10:08,040 --> 01:10:10,479
Speaker 2: and Dan, I've never I'm sure he's done it before,

1046
01:10:10,520 --> 01:10:12,760
Speaker 2: but I've never seen him do it. He cried on

1047
01:10:12,800 --> 01:10:16,960
Speaker 2: the air yesterday when we found out the news, and

1048
01:10:17,840 --> 01:10:21,080
Speaker 2: it was touching. In a great moment, I text Dan

1049
01:10:21,240 --> 01:10:26,200
Speaker 2: and said how moving it was. The guy's a legend,

1050
01:10:26,920 --> 01:10:28,840
Speaker 2: made the Demons, He made the Hall of Fame three

1051
01:10:28,840 --> 01:10:32,679
Speaker 2: different times. He made the Hall of Fame three different

1052
01:10:32,760 --> 01:10:36,639
Speaker 2: times for three different roles. And obviously I didn't even

1053
01:10:36,680 --> 01:10:39,720
Speaker 2: say it. He is literally the logo. I mean, he's

1054
01:10:39,760 --> 01:10:45,439
Speaker 2: literally the logo. So just in all time, all time legend.

1055
01:10:48,520 --> 01:10:52,639
Speaker 2: Let's the best questions that we have today, save them

1056
01:10:52,960 --> 01:10:55,439
Speaker 2: and let's add them to the questions next week because,

1057
01:10:55,439 --> 01:10:57,479
Speaker 2: by the way, if this thing gets wrapped on Friday,

1058
01:10:57,720 --> 01:11:00,000
Speaker 2: we're gonna have a lot of open space over these

1059
01:11:00,080 --> 01:11:02,760
Speaker 2: next few weeks. Today was a very long show and

1060
01:11:02,800 --> 01:11:04,240
Speaker 2: I kind of want to end it on the Jerry

1061
01:11:04,240 --> 01:11:09,000
Speaker 2: West stuff. Great job demands. Congrats to the Celtics thus far.

1062
01:11:09,439 --> 01:11:12,839
Speaker 2: Everybody pump the brakes a bit on the crushing Luca.

1063
01:11:13,040 --> 01:11:14,519
Speaker 2: I'll try to see what I can do about that

1064
01:11:14,600 --> 01:11:15,799
Speaker 2: on TV in a few hours.

1065
01:11:15,840 --> 01:11:16,320
Speaker 4: What's right?

1066
01:11:17,400 --> 01:11:20,200
Speaker 2: Hey, thanks for watching. If you're still here, do me

1067
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Speaker 2: a favor. Hit the subscribe button, then hit the bell

1068
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Speaker 2: so you can be notified when we have new episodes.

1069
01:11:26,560 --> 01:11:28,960
Speaker 2: After you've done that, one more favor, go to your

1070
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Speaker 2: favorite audio platform of choice and subscribe there as well.

1071
01:11:32,800 --> 01:11:37,000
Speaker 2: Don't forget. We're live every Tuesday and Thursday ten thirty

1072
01:11:37,040 --> 01:11:41,360
Speaker 2: am Eastern Ish ten thirty five, ten forty. It sometimes changes,

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01:11:41,520 --> 01:11:43,600
Speaker 2: but that's why you hit the bell. You hit the

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01:11:43,600 --> 01:11:46,800
Speaker 2: bell so you're notified. You subscribe so we can get

1075
01:11:46,840 --> 01:11:49,840
Speaker 2: to two hundred thousand followers. We're right around one hundred

1076
01:11:49,840 --> 01:11:52,320
Speaker 2: and fifty thousand. We'd love to get to two hundred thousand.

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01:11:52,360 --> 01:11:56,320
Speaker 2: Get demanday another plaque, so like subscribe rate, send a

1078
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Speaker 2: rating to do all that cool stuff. Thanks guys,