Speaker 1: I mean a million AMX points at a very minimum
Speaker 1: is ten thousand dollars in pre travel, so you've got
Speaker 1: at least twenty grand just with your AMX points, which
Speaker 1: certainly even if you have to pay full price, takes
Speaker 1: this seeks.
Speaker 2: He talks so quickly and you have to listen really
Speaker 2: carefully because then you know that you're going to save
Speaker 2: some money. Hi, everybody. Brian Kelly is the passionate travel
Speaker 2: enthusiast better known as the Point Sky. What started as
Speaker 2: a passion for tracking miles and points led to a
Speaker 2: successful business, and today millions of travelers turn to the
Speaker 2: Point Sky or advice on maximizing loyalty programs for travel.
Speaker 2: Welcome to my podcast, Brian.
Speaker 1: Thanks for having me Martha.
Speaker 2: It's so nice to see you after oh a few months,
Speaker 2: I haven't seen you.
Speaker 1: Yes, I think we had dinner this summer. And then
Speaker 1: of course we had our epic cruise to Greenland last
Speaker 1: year or two years ago.
Speaker 2: Was fun, so fun. Never Doceland and Greenland. Yes, yeah,
Speaker 2: and before that Brian and I traveled as Fallbard, which
Speaker 2: is in the Arctic Circle, and that was that was
Speaker 2: a very fun trip.
Speaker 1: I always think I get travel perks when traveling, but
Speaker 1: traveling with you, some people just go to see the
Speaker 1: seed involvement, and we learned a lot we did.
Speaker 2: We learned a lot about where does food come from?
Speaker 2: And how secure is the food supply for the rest
Speaker 2: of the world.
Speaker 1: Right this small bard is one of the most fascinating places.
Speaker 2: Beautiful, and I got so many interesting things there and
Speaker 2: I didn't use any points. But when did the idea
Speaker 2: of the point sky occur to you?
Speaker 1: So it was in the late two thousands. I was
Speaker 1: working for Morgan Stanley and I was traveling a ton.
Speaker 1: I was trying to think of what side hustle I
Speaker 1: could do because I wasn't making a lot of money,
Speaker 1: and I just I've always been very good with points,
Speaker 1: you know, back to the nineties, I was, I was
Speaker 1: using points with.
Speaker 2: It like you were just curious about it or what.
Speaker 1: So my dad, I was always a tech whiz, Like
Speaker 1: when I was seven, I had my first computer. I
Speaker 1: taught myself ms DOS. I was like a little hacker
Speaker 1: and you know, got on Prodigy and Aol Internet way
Speaker 1: back in the day. So my dad had gotten a
Speaker 1: job at a startup and needed me to book his travel.
Speaker 1: He was working from home without a secretary. So my
Speaker 1: first job at age eleven was booking his trips and
Speaker 1: he'd pay me ten dollars a trip.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: And then one day he said, I have all these
Speaker 1: frequent flyer miles if you can figure out how to
Speaker 1: use them. And I called up the airlines. I schmoozed,
Speaker 1: you know, with Shila from American Airlines, and I figured
Speaker 1: out how to get our family of six to the
Speaker 1: Cayman Islands. So I figured out, like, there's these points
Speaker 1: are really valuable. So every year I would use points.
Speaker 1: And this is the nineties, never in a million years
Speaker 1: that I think, you know, fast forward this would become
Speaker 1: a career of mine.
Speaker 2: So and a real business, a real business and a
Speaker 2: profitable business for you.
Speaker 1: And at first it was not a blog even it
Speaker 1: was just a travel agency. So in Wall Street I
Speaker 1: had a lot of people who had points and miles,
Speaker 1: and I realized, like, no one knows how to use them.
Speaker 1: And I've even work in the tech division. These PhDs
Speaker 1: and computer science would come to me and be like, ran,
Speaker 1: how do I use my points? And that was like
Speaker 1: a light bulb moment for me. I'm like, how are
Speaker 1: all these really smart people? And no one knows how
Speaker 1: to use points.
Speaker 2: Something not cashing in on something that everybody gets if
Speaker 2: everybody pays attention exactly.
Speaker 1: So I started a side hustle business to points guy
Speaker 1: was I was a travel agent for points, So you'd
Speaker 1: pay me fifty bucks, and I when I would come
Speaker 1: home from my job at Morgan Stanley, I'd come home
Speaker 1: check my emails and if I could help you, I'd say, Okay,
Speaker 1: PayPal me, you know, one hundred dollars for two tickets,
Speaker 1: and I'll tell you how to go to Rome using
Speaker 1: your points. So, just using the knowledge I was in
Speaker 1: my head, I started making a couple hundred one thousand
Speaker 1: bucks a month, and being twenty six in Manhattan living
Speaker 1: paycheck to paycheck, like a thousand bucks a month was nice,
Speaker 1: you know, sure was. Eventually, about six months into that,
Speaker 1: a friend said, you know, you've got a blog, blog
Speaker 1: blog blog, and I had adjusting the movie Julia, the
Speaker 1: Julia Child's movie about the blogger who started a blog
Speaker 1: that became super famous. And I remember watching that movie
Speaker 1: in two thousand and nine thinking how cool would that
Speaker 1: be if your life you could just pursue your passion.
Speaker 1: And it literally ended up happening to me. I started blogging.
Speaker 1: I started blogging for fun, and within about six months.
Speaker 1: I remember my first cocktail party in New York. Someone
Speaker 1: said you're the Points guy, and I saw their eyes
Speaker 1: light up, and they of course talk my ear off
Speaker 1: because I've realized so many people just wanted to talk
Speaker 1: about travel, and this like niche world of points.
Speaker 2: So now, how many followers do you have.
Speaker 1: The points go dot com or upwards of ten million
Speaker 1: people visiting a month, and you know millions on social media.
Speaker 1: We have a newsletter that a million people read every week.
Speaker 1: There's plenty of travel influencers who have millions of followers.
Speaker 1: I think I've always just been about organic how to advice.
Speaker 1: So it may not be as pretty as a beautiful
Speaker 1: photo of Iceland, but I'll tell you how to get
Speaker 1: to Iceland on points, which I think is more about it.
Speaker 2: I was just picking Brian's brain over a quick lunch
Speaker 2: before the podcast, and I have close to two million points.
Speaker 2: They do accumulate quickly, and I haven't used any of
Speaker 2: them in a while, and I'm trying to make a
Speaker 2: try up to Namimbia, which is quite a distance and
Speaker 2: quite expensive to get to Namibia get to go to Johannesburg.
Speaker 2: So I'm going to take your advice.
Speaker 1: Well, and of course you love a challenge, Martha. So
Speaker 1: three weeks before the busiest travel week of the year,
Speaker 1: going on one particular flight. But even with your AMX,
Speaker 1: I mean, a million MX points at a very minimum
Speaker 1: is ten thousand dollars in free travel. So you've got
Speaker 1: at least twenty grand just with your AMX points, which
Speaker 1: certainly even if you have to pay full price, takes the.
Speaker 2: See he talks, he talks so quickly, and you have
Speaker 2: to listen really carefully because then you know that you're
Speaker 2: going to save some money.
Speaker 1: The point is points are currency. They are they are,
Speaker 1: and I want people to understand that in this day
Speaker 1: with so much inflation and everyone's you know, people are
Speaker 1: not getting the job the bonuses even to cover cost
Speaker 1: of living. So I think now more than ever, if
Speaker 1: you want to get ahead, and you don't need to
Speaker 1: be going to Namibia or far flung places, if you
Speaker 1: want to go to Orlando, if you want to you know,
Speaker 1: see family on fly Southwest, the points game is for you.
Speaker 1: And that's what I really believe and excited to teach
Speaker 1: people in my upcoming book that this is not just
Speaker 1: for the elite.
Speaker 2: And we have his book right in our hands. This
Speaker 2: is just a galley. This is just the galley how
Speaker 2: to Win at Travel Brian Kelly, founder of The Point Sky,
Speaker 2: and it's coming out in February fourth, February twenty five.
Speaker 2: You have to get this book. And really, if you
Speaker 2: read it, you're going to save money. You're going to
Speaker 2: make yourself some money. And by saving money, and I
Speaker 2: love this idea. I'm so glad you finally wrote a
Speaker 2: book because we as friends are always trying to pick
Speaker 2: his brain.
Speaker 1: And so now I can say to people, just read
Speaker 1: my books. I can finally enjoy well the book I
Speaker 1: wanted to take an approach. It's it's an easy read
Speaker 1: and some of the chapters, you know, you can go
Speaker 1: back in reference. I have a whole chapter what to
Speaker 1: do when airlines cancel your flights? What are your rights?
Speaker 1: Here's how to get what you want? You know, how
Speaker 1: to use the terminology when you approach a gate agent.
Speaker 1: There's a certain speek that US travelers have and I'm
Speaker 1: teaching everyday people for example, like if you think you're
Speaker 1: gonna if your flight's delayed and you're going to miss
Speaker 1: your connection, which happens quite a bit. You can even now,
Speaker 1: when you're in flight, on the in flight Wi Fi,
Speaker 1: you message that airline and you say, can you protect
Speaker 1: me on the next flight. Most people wait until they
Speaker 1: miss their connection and then there's no seats left. What
Speaker 1: I teach you in the book is get ahead of
Speaker 1: the game. You've got to be proactive and you can
Speaker 1: ask the airline. What they will do protecting you is
Speaker 1: actually book you on a second ticket, so if you
Speaker 1: do miss your first connection, you already have a seat saved.
Speaker 1: And this is like, these are some of the tactics
Speaker 1: that help you. They want to help you, but frankly,
Speaker 1: the system is set up. You know, if you're a
Speaker 1: top tier elite traveler, they're going to automatically protect you.
Speaker 1: If you don't have elite status, and if you're not
Speaker 1: spending a lot, they will, but you need to advocate
Speaker 1: for yourself. And frankly, the airlines bank on most people
Speaker 1: just saying give me whatever you'll give me, because it's
Speaker 1: easier for them to deal with. But I like to
Speaker 1: empower people to say, be nice, but ask for this,
Speaker 1: because if you don't ask, you're not going to get
Speaker 1: it in most cases.
Speaker 2: This is why I have Ryan on the podcast today
Speaker 2: because you actually can save money, be smart and travel. Well.
Speaker 1: Yeah, one of the not just like points. I can't
Speaker 1: believe how many people have a fear of flying. It's
Speaker 1: actually one of the top questions I geld asked. I've
Speaker 1: even dated people who had fears of flying and that
Speaker 1: didn't work out well.
Speaker 2: But I'm always sure afraid to get on it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know so many people, and which befuddles me because,
Speaker 1: as I talk about in the book, travel is I
Speaker 1: mean air travels extraordinarily safe. Like there's a stat in
Speaker 1: the book you have to travel every single day for
Speaker 1: over one hundred thousand years to statistically die in a
Speaker 1: plane crash, and.
Speaker 2: That you know, all the population of the world correct.
Speaker 1: So it's so safe to travel. Yet at the same time,
Speaker 1: fear of flying seems to be going up. And there's
Speaker 1: a lot of reasons that could be. But but in
Speaker 1: the book, I talked to doctors. I sat down with
Speaker 1: Whoopee Goldberg, who she wouldn't fly for years. She would
Speaker 1: how did she get from East Coast to Wist. She
Speaker 1: bought a dur of us and she had three full
Speaker 1: time drivers, and it would take.
Speaker 2: Her a week two days.
Speaker 1: It was like, I think she could do it in
Speaker 1: two and a half days. But for years and years,
Speaker 1: and when Sister Act hit, she contractually had to go
Speaker 1: to London, and so she tells the story in the book.
Speaker 1: It's fascinating. They actually she got the FAA to allow her.
Speaker 1: They had an anesthesiologist put her down and rolled her
Speaker 1: onto a private jet And fast forward to now what
Speaker 1: has a beautiful property in Italy and she flies domestically.
Speaker 2: Oh good.
Speaker 1: So she talks about all the things throughout the years
Speaker 1: that helped her cope, because we all know someone in
Speaker 1: our life who suffers from that.
Speaker 2: So when do these kinds of loyalty programs that offer
Speaker 2: points and rewards first start to develop? Because I sort
Speaker 2: of remember, but I can't really place the date.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So in nineteen seventy eight, the US government deregulated airfare.
Speaker 1: So pre nineteen seventy eight, no matter the airline you flew,
Speaker 1: it was a set price to fly New York to
Speaker 1: LA and it was very expensive. It was on average
Speaker 1: ten percent of the average American salary to travel. Very
Speaker 1: few people traveled. It was really for the wealth.
Speaker 2: They were real stewardesses. Yes, well, I actually I knew
Speaker 2: some of these stewardesses.
Speaker 1: I actually debunked. I think we're in the best age
Speaker 1: of travel today, an incredible time for travel. It's actually
Speaker 1: more accessible, it's cheaper. May seem expensive today, but it's
Speaker 1: actually much cheaper, much safer. And the fact you can
Speaker 1: now fly, you can now fly to Australia NonStop, that's incredible.
Speaker 2: That's what that's how I go to Australia in Singapore.
Speaker 1: Yeah, in the eighties, the airlines realized they had to
Speaker 1: start competing, so that's where they started creating frequent flyer
Speaker 1: programs and the airlines. It's a tough business. Airlines go
Speaker 1: bankrupt all the time. And in the two thousands the
Speaker 1: airlines realized and Delta was the first one. Amex bailed
Speaker 1: Delta out of bankruptcy. Amex went to Delta and said,
Speaker 1: we're going to pre buy a billion dollars worth of
Speaker 1: frequent flyer miles to use for our credit cards. And
Speaker 1: that's what saved Delta Airlines.
Speaker 2: And now Delta is really one of the premiere I
Speaker 2: just flew to Rome on Delta and the new lounge
Speaker 2: at Kennedy Airport in New York. The Delta one Lounge
Speaker 2: is Oh my gosh, it's so fantacy. It was incredible.
Speaker 2: I was I had never been in there. It was amazing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And that's why I want all to drink everything.
Speaker 1: That's why I think when people start to travel and
Speaker 1: see that side of travel, I think so many people
Speaker 1: who hate travel today just because they're being bullied around.
Speaker 1: They're in the worst seat on the plane. And so
Speaker 1: I have you know, in the book I talk about it,
Speaker 1: even if you're gonna fly economy, there's huge differences in
Speaker 1: how you choose your seats, and no, but no one
Speaker 1: teaches you this. No one teaches you to look at
Speaker 1: the plane type. And even just knowing the plane type
Speaker 1: you're flying on your trip to Paris, choosing the right
Speaker 1: one could mean you know much better for your sleep
Speaker 1: and rest the air the frequent flyer programs today airlines
Speaker 1: make more money by their frequent flyer programs, and they
Speaker 1: do flying airplanes. The way the system works in the
Speaker 1: United States, when you use a credit card, let's call
Speaker 1: it two percent of that purchase price. It's called the
Speaker 1: interchange feed. The credit card company makes money for every
Speaker 1: dollar purchase. So when you use a credit card, there's
Speaker 1: two percent of that purchase is going the merchant is paying,
Speaker 1: and then the credit our companies kicking us all back
Speaker 1: basically one percent of that. So the airlines realize, you know,
Speaker 1: for people, if you fly Delta once or twice a year,
Speaker 1: Delta's only making money a couple times a year. If
Speaker 1: Delta can get you a Delta credit card or American
Speaker 1: whatever airline it may be, every single time you purchase coffee,
Speaker 1: you go to the groceries, they're getting a cut of
Speaker 1: every single dollar you spend. And Delta there was just
Speaker 1: a stat one percent of total USGDP is put on
Speaker 1: a Delta American Express card. So, simply put, these loyalty
Speaker 1: programs are the most compelling and lucrative marketing platform ever created.
Speaker 1: And that's why I tell people in the beginning of
Speaker 1: the book, you got to get in on the program.
Speaker 1: This is not a fad. They're not going away, they
Speaker 1: are changing.
Speaker 2: Do they expire?
Speaker 1: So most airlines have gotten rid of expiration except American Airlines.
Speaker 1: Shame on them. They need to get rid of that
Speaker 1: and to keep that miles active. It's very very simple,
Speaker 1: it's pretty easy to play the game. I think so
Speaker 1: many people just have myths or have not been educated
Speaker 1: on how to do it.
Speaker 2: In our travel Asians who are who people still use
Speaker 2: and they still serve a very very useful purpose on
Speaker 2: do they encourage you?
Speaker 1: Travel agents are amazing and I talk about in the
Speaker 1: book when to use them when not to. There's actually
Speaker 1: now similar to how I started the Points guy, there
Speaker 1: are travel agencies that will help you use your points.
Speaker 1: So if you're listening to this podcast and you're like, okay, great,
Speaker 1: well I'm not going to take the time to just
Speaker 1: all of a sudden become an expert, you don't have to.
Speaker 2: So there's a fight an Asian thing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So point dot me is the website that's an
Speaker 1: actual tool. It's like Google Flights. It'll let you search
Speaker 1: for flights using your points. That's what I was on
Speaker 1: my way here when I was looking at your impossible
Speaker 1: Namibia flights to book. But that's when I found out
Speaker 1: it actually told me, Hey, if you know, Martha really wanted,
Speaker 1: you could actually fly for one hundred twenty thousand points
Speaker 1: business class on the dates you're flying. Most people who
Speaker 1: are somewhat flexible, and I would even say that people
Speaker 1: have never been to Africa, stop in Nairobi, go to
Speaker 1: the giraft manner, which I'm sure your grandkids would love.
Speaker 1: You know, the Hemingway Hotel is beautiful. You stop for
Speaker 1: a day in Nairobi. You can even the elephants when
Speaker 1: you land at the Nairobi airport.
Speaker 2: He's selling me I have a two million.
Speaker 1: Points for a honeymooning couple who wants to go to
Speaker 1: South Africa. I would just say, hey, because these frequent
Speaker 1: flyer programs will actually let you stop over for free.
Speaker 1: So you could fly JFK to Nairobi, spend a couple
Speaker 1: days in beautiful Nairobi and then all for one hundred
Speaker 1: and twenty five thousand points versus fifteen grand. And what
Speaker 1: I would say to people, you know, spend that fifteen
Speaker 1: grand on fabulous safaris and don't give it to the
Speaker 1: airlines invested in the cool meals when you get there.
Speaker 2: So wish loyalty programs credit cards do you recommend most highly?
Speaker 1: So many people have, you know, their airline credit cards
Speaker 1: are nice for getting your free check bags or whatever.
Speaker 1: But I think that one of the biggest mistakes I see,
Speaker 1: especially successful people, is oh, you know, I fly one
Speaker 1: airline and I just it's simple. I'm just gonna have
Speaker 1: my American Airlines credit card that just gets me where
Speaker 1: I want to go. That's a mistake. Almost twenty twenty five.
Speaker 1: You want to get a credit card that gives you
Speaker 1: transferable points. This is the name of the game. So
Speaker 1: historically that was AMEX Platinum and AMEX Gold because when
Speaker 1: you a crew Amex points, you can transfer to thirty
Speaker 1: different partners. You can transfer to Virgin Atlantic, to Emirates,
Speaker 1: so it opens up tons of opportunities. But it's not
Speaker 1: just Amex anymore. Chase Sapphire to the Chase Sapphire Reserve
Speaker 1: the AMEX Gold card, And funny enough, you know many
Speaker 1: people of the Platinum, and I like the Platinum for
Speaker 1: lounge access. The AMEX Gold card gives you four points
Speaker 1: per dollars on all dining and groceries. So for most
Speaker 1: American families you're spending a ton. The Platinum card only
Speaker 1: gives you one point. Oh so so many people say, well,
Speaker 1: that's silly. The Platinum cards some points for every dollar, yes,
Speaker 1: on dining and groceries. So when people when I go
Speaker 1: to dinner with Fantasy CA.
Speaker 2: I have a red card, what are the red cards
Speaker 2: get you.
Speaker 1: I think is that a plumb card. The red card
Speaker 1: would be a I think that's like a cash back
Speaker 1: business card.
Speaker 2: Maybe I don't know.
Speaker 1: I think I need to do an audit on.
Speaker 2: Your accounts and you have to see I need it.
Speaker 2: That's why I'm really doing podcast.
Speaker 1: But the Capitol one venture X card's another great one.
Speaker 1: That card gives two points on every dollar spent.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: So the goal is you're going to use your Amix
Speaker 1: Gold card for dining and groceries four points per dollars,
Speaker 1: very lucrative. Built a company that I helped found Built.
Speaker 1: If you pay rent, everyone should pay with a Built MasterCard,
Speaker 1: no annual fee. Built is a game changing program. You
Speaker 1: earn not only do you earn points for rent, but
Speaker 1: Built will report your rent payment to the credit bureau. So,
Speaker 1: for young people trying to build credit, your biggest expense
Speaker 1: normally that forever it was just a check and that
Speaker 1: was off the credit system. So you're not getting credit
Speaker 1: for paying that monthly rent that so many of us pay.
Speaker 1: Built now gives you points that are very valuable. And
Speaker 1: because this big expense that you're showing your very responsible paying,
Speaker 1: your credit score goes up and when your credit score
Speaker 1: goes up, your mortgage payment and rates go down. So
Speaker 1: that's why, Like my book is called how to Win
Speaker 1: a Travel but I talk about how playing this game
Speaker 1: smartly it's really winning at life. It teaches you how
Speaker 1: to approach everything and look at it to tailor it
Speaker 1: to exactly benefit you.
Speaker 2: What are some of the most creative ways to earn miles?
Speaker 2: Like I traveled with a posse of four, four of
Speaker 2: us or five of us.
Speaker 1: Well, first things first, everyone, so you know kids under
Speaker 1: two you can't earn points because they're free unless you
Speaker 1: buy them a ticket. But everyone, I mean, starting day
Speaker 1: one with kids, start sign them up for frequent flyer
Speaker 1: programs for a whole host of reasons. It'll make even
Speaker 1: just booking their tickets easier when all their information's preloaded.
Speaker 1: The biggest area people are not earning points is online shopping.
Speaker 1: So everyone shops online. Now listen here. People never go
Speaker 1: directly to a retailer's website. Never go to sas dot Com,
Speaker 1: never go to north Face, Nike, whatever. Always click through.
Speaker 1: It's called a shopping portal. And these shopping portals, there's
Speaker 1: Rakutin is the biggest one out there. You download this
Speaker 1: rakutin app and it says cash backs. You can earn
Speaker 1: up to twenty percent cash back. But the little known
Speaker 1: trick is you can actually earn that in Amex points instead,
Speaker 1: which are actually more valuable than cash back. So and
Speaker 1: anytime you go to shop online, you can earn American
Speaker 1: Airlines miles or Delta, whatever types of points you're looking
Speaker 1: to get. All you do is you click through a
Speaker 1: shopping portal to the retailer through through that airline's shopping portal.
Speaker 1: It puts a cookie on your computer and it tracks
Speaker 1: all your expenses. So not only do you get points
Speaker 1: for using your credit card, your ams to make the.
Speaker 2: Or engineer, are you listening to this show?
Speaker 1: He's nodding his head.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Do you do all of this? A few things?
Speaker 2: A few? Are you going to do all of them? Now?
Speaker 2: A lot more? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Well yeah, especially with kids. I mean you you rack
Speaker 1: up so much in expenses, so shopping online that's just
Speaker 1: the single easiest. It's a click of a button and
Speaker 1: it's double dipping. You get your credit card points for
Speaker 1: making all those expenses, and then you get these additional
Speaker 1: points just for clicking the button to shop through the
Speaker 1: shopping portal, you can really get points. I mean, I
Speaker 1: say these days, you know, if you're going to give
Speaker 1: a wedding gift, you can get gift cards, you know,
Speaker 1: like I just like I just said, the AMEX gold card,
Speaker 1: or for graduation gifts. Instead of giving cash, you could
Speaker 1: buy one of many very enticing gift cards from your
Speaker 1: local supermarket. And guess what the five hundred dollars gift
Speaker 1: card that you might buy that's earning you four x
Speaker 1: points because it's purchased at a grocery store, which is
Speaker 1: four x y amics goal. You see where I'm going
Speaker 1: with this. I see you know, you start doing a
Speaker 1: home renovation and instead of having your contract or buy
Speaker 1: all that stuff from home depot or wherever, you buy it. Yes,
Speaker 1: your interior designer, you know many of these. You know,
Speaker 1: your party planner, you're getting points. Of course they are
Speaker 1: unless you ask for them. So points are everywhere. I
Speaker 1: think I want to enlighten people to say, wait a minute,
Speaker 1: like you know when you go out to dinner with
Speaker 1: your friend and there's always that one friends like, oh,
Speaker 1: I'll put it on my credit card. Just you know,
Speaker 1: I know why.
Speaker 2: I know I got on to that earlier in the
Speaker 2: company because we're allowed at our company to keep our
Speaker 2: points exactly, so the one who picks up the check
Speaker 2: gets the points.
Speaker 1: And speaking of these and then you expense. So that's
Speaker 1: how I I mean at Morgan Stanley, that's what I
Speaker 1: was doing. I was paying for career fairs at MIT
Speaker 1: twenty thousand dollars. I write about it in the book
Speaker 1: where all of my colleagues we're like, you're the hero
Speaker 1: of HR because I was the expense guy. Everyone thought
Speaker 1: I was doing it to be nice, those fools I
Speaker 1: was setting around the world. I was so broke. I
Speaker 1: call it my points rich cash poor portion of my life.
Speaker 1: It was cheaper for me to fly to London first
Speaker 1: class for a weekend, and I had all this elite
Speaker 1: status with the hotel, so I got free breakfast, I
Speaker 1: had free canapes in the afternoon. And then it was
Speaker 1: to stay in New York City because if I went
Speaker 1: out in New York and I had had no money,
Speaker 1: so I'd be out to dinner with friends, and I
Speaker 1: was that mortified person like, oh no, when it comes
Speaker 1: time to split, like I don't have any money. So
Speaker 1: I would travel first class, taking the subway to JFK
Speaker 1: to fly British airways first class.
Speaker 2: On the weekends. What fun. So most travelers are on
Speaker 2: economy budgets, what are three chips for getting a first
Speaker 2: class experience?
Speaker 1: So interestingly, one of the biggest trends that has happened,
Speaker 1: and the pandemic helped shift this. A decade ago, first
Speaker 1: class used to be exorbitantly expensive, like it would even
Speaker 1: just flying to Miami, it would be three thousand dollars
Speaker 1: one way, and the airlines would basically fill the cabins
Speaker 1: with their frequent flyers, so they were giving away eighty
Speaker 1: percent of those first class seats, so you had to
Speaker 1: be an elite traveler. So for everyday people, no one's
Speaker 1: spending three thousand. What happened with the pandemic is they
Speaker 1: flipped it. So now they're selling almost all those seats
Speaker 1: in first class, but at a discount, a much lower
Speaker 1: discount than what first class used to be. So the
Speaker 1: easiest way is upgrading using your frequent flyer miles. You
Speaker 1: know these days, just getting a single credit card bonus
Speaker 1: fifty sixty thousand points. So get a credit card or
Speaker 1: two that gives you big points bonuses. And I want
Speaker 1: to reiterate this too, the credit card games amazing and
Speaker 1: it can be essentially an unlimited gravy train of free travel.
Speaker 1: But very important, but you must pay your bills off
Speaker 1: in full every month. If you start opening up credit
Speaker 1: cards and you're paying interest, the thirty percent APR will
Speaker 1: destroy the value. So I never want anyone to open
Speaker 1: up credit cards, even if you have an inkling like
Speaker 1: I might start spending past my do not it? However,
Speaker 1: good advice. Yeah, so get a credit card, use your
Speaker 1: points to upgrade. And I mean, you're not going to
Speaker 1: get an upgrade for your honeymoon. That's like people always say, well,
Speaker 1: it's my honeymoon, the airline is going to do it.
Speaker 1: But I will say this, it never hurts to ask once.
Speaker 1: I would never bank on it. But when I was
Speaker 1: extremely poor and I'm six foot seven, and I was
Speaker 1: flying to Buenos Aires and in coach, and I was
Speaker 1: driading that ten and a half hour flight, and I
Speaker 1: remember going up at JFK. I was like, I went
Speaker 1: up the gate agent. I knew she was sassy, and
Speaker 1: I was like, I kind of went up and just
Speaker 1: did a little bit of sass with her, and I
Speaker 1: was like, you know, if the flight's over sold, in economy, Like,
Speaker 1: if you have to upgrade someone, I would be I'll
Speaker 1: take that responsibility for you off your hand. I was
Speaker 1: like joking, what they're in. This woman was who's used
Speaker 1: to people screaming at her all day, but I was
Speaker 1: just having fun with her. She giggled and was like,
Speaker 1: you gotta be kidding me, but like laughed. And then
Speaker 1: when I was boarding that flight, the beat beat beat
Speaker 1: happened and it spit out the business class ticket. Oh great,
Speaker 1: so being very nice. It's not gonna happen every time.
Speaker 1: But you know, at hotels there is a twin You
Speaker 1: can put a twenty dollars bill between your ID and
Speaker 1: credit card to the front desk agent in Vegas. That
Speaker 1: works quite a bit, but'll at least give you a
Speaker 1: nicer room. So I think I would bank on people
Speaker 1: using your points or you know at check in, a
Speaker 1: lot of airlines will let you bid for an upgrade,
Speaker 1: So put in you know what you think you might
Speaker 1: get it.
Speaker 2: For all excellent advice and making travel nicer and better.
Speaker 1: I remember when we flew to Oslo, you made a
Speaker 1: baked potato and caviar on the plane. Is that a
Speaker 1: do you do that on every flight or just oh yeah.
Speaker 2: We tried it. We tried to take something delicious to
Speaker 2: eat because the plain food still is not just enough.
Speaker 2: And I don't know why. I just don't know. Yah,
Speaker 2: wouldn't you be happy with a baked potato and caviar?
Speaker 2: Seriously all that other stuff that they serve.
Speaker 1: Do you ever eat airplane food?
Speaker 2: Very very rarely?
Speaker 1: But will you eat in the lounge like if it
Speaker 1: looks good? Or do you just try to eat it home?
Speaker 2: I try to eat it home. I mean that's the
Speaker 2: way we are. But I want you, you know, I
Speaker 2: want I want you. I would think it would be
Speaker 2: so nice, But the cheese and crackers even that on
Speaker 2: the way to roam was not so good this time.
Speaker 2: And you're going to Italy where there's fantastic cheese. Where
Speaker 2: is that cheese? You know?
Speaker 1: Has it TSA ever stopped you for bringing caviar through?
Speaker 2: Oh yes, we've got Kevin Charky got into big trouble
Speaker 2: with cavia.
Speaker 1: Oh so you make it. He's your caviar mule.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but you're very careful now, you don't do anything
Speaker 2: to irritate anybody.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because you know, if you ever bring my friend
Speaker 1: brought up a banana from the plane. They often have
Speaker 1: the net. If you ever bring that through you can
Speaker 1: get huge fines. And in the US, so I global
Speaker 1: entry is key being able to zip this and you
Speaker 1: can lose your global entry by bringing in fruit or anything.
Speaker 1: So everyone before every flight, go through your bag, double
Speaker 1: check for any orange you might have taken from the hotel.
Speaker 1: Because global we don't play globble.
Speaker 2: Entry is so perfect, I mean we just it took
Speaker 2: us like no time to get out of the airport
Speaker 2: on Sunday from Rome. Yep, the only t Truman who's
Speaker 2: only twelve. It takes a while for them to read
Speaker 2: his face.
Speaker 1: Yep, since my son, who's baby, got it as a baby.
Speaker 1: Now it actually his baby face. It was registering, but
Speaker 1: now he turned two, I think his face turned enough
Speaker 1: where to get it. It's an issue. But for people listening,
Speaker 1: a lot of credit cards will give you global entries
Speaker 1: one hundred twenty dollars for five years, and that lets
Speaker 1: you go through the immigration when coming home from abroad.
Speaker 1: But it also includes tsa pre check. Yes, so what
Speaker 1: most people don't realize and pre check is when you're
Speaker 1: flying domestically through any airport, so you get both through
Speaker 1: one hundred twenty bucks and most credit cards will reimburse you.
Speaker 2: You don't have to take your shoes off.
Speaker 1: You don't have All children from the age of one
Speaker 1: day and older have to have their own global entry.
Speaker 1: And if you try to bring your kid through global entry,
Speaker 1: even if they're two years old, you can lose your
Speaker 1: global entry. So that's once again an important thing I
Speaker 1: want to do out, yes, right, but global entry is key.
Speaker 1: It's the best one hundred and twenty dollars you'll spend.
Speaker 2: So you and I we took two amazing expeditions together.
Speaker 2: What did you learn from our trip to Smallbard? About
Speaker 2: about travel and about camaraderie and all of that.
Speaker 1: I think one of my most magnificent memories that night
Speaker 1: when we walked up to that Michelin starred restaurant up
Speaker 1: a hill. And I do love travel bringing together people
Speaker 1: of all shapes and sizes. That trip was really it
Speaker 1: was a ragtag group of people all over the place, Europeans,
Speaker 1: the LA contingent actresses, and so I love that, Like
Speaker 1: how our lives are so scripted in a lot of ways.
Speaker 1: When we get comfortable in our own little groups of
Speaker 1: friends and the holidays can be the same. So I
Speaker 1: love what travel can just you know, you meet fascinating people.
Speaker 1: And I love that night you were doing a little
Speaker 1: round table under by the fire and then someone came
Speaker 1: in and said the northern lights. And we all ran
Speaker 1: outside on this hill in the northernmost city and just
Speaker 1: took in mother Nature.
Speaker 2: Saw those amazing green lights.
Speaker 1: The northern lights. And we actually saw them again when
Speaker 1: we were in Greenland in August, which was very rare
Speaker 1: to see with that super moon. I mean, those are
Speaker 1: the moment I love nature.
Speaker 2: And that camp in Newfoundland, remember that beautiful.
Speaker 1: Green camp Kiachua. Yes, and interesting. I don't know if
Speaker 1: you saw United Airlines now flying Nuok just opened their
Speaker 1: new airport. Yeah, so United Airlines next year will be
Speaker 1: flying NonStop to Nook. Nuok is n u Uk, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's the capital of Greenland and it's a little town
Speaker 1: but they have US flight. They have a flight to
Speaker 1: Nuk And it's a camp Kiyatua. It is this fabulous
Speaker 1: tented camp.
Speaker 2: But you have to go out and by a beautiful woman, yes,
Speaker 2: and with her who's children helper.
Speaker 1: It was magical up on a cliff overlooking those fjords
Speaker 1: and just you know, fresh brooks of like water going
Speaker 1: through the camp.
Speaker 2: I mean so, even though Brian spends a lot of
Speaker 2: time counting points and saving cash, he also enjoys the
Speaker 2: traveling that he is the foremost proponent of. You really
Speaker 2: I love that about you. I really think it's amazing
Speaker 2: that you've kept your your awe of what you see
Speaker 2: when you get there.
Speaker 1: I believe travel can be a force for good in
Speaker 1: the world. So I work with Nobel Peace Prize winners.
Speaker 1: We do these youth peace conferences all around the world.
Speaker 1: It's called Peace Jam and it's basically Nobel Laureate's educating
Speaker 1: the next generation of peace leaders, which I think we
Speaker 1: can all agree the world needs more of to be
Speaker 1: pushing our next generation to solve conflict peacefully. So I've donated,
Speaker 1: you know, and help others donate miles to charities. I
Speaker 1: do make a wish, you know, at the Point Sky.
Speaker 1: We team up with American Airlines and make a wish.
Speaker 1: We do the best flight ever, which is when we
Speaker 1: get Broadway actors an entire plane of wish kids and
Speaker 1: we bring them to Disney and in the air they're
Speaker 1: doing performances. So I, you know, I think, yes, I
Speaker 1: love first class travel and the fancy caviar, but I'm
Speaker 1: for the destination. I am for the moments that take
Speaker 1: your breath away, and I think travel helps you just
Speaker 1: reset and realize what's what's important in life.
Speaker 2: I agree. And when people say, oh, where's the best
Speaker 2: place you've ever been, you know what my answer is
Speaker 2: where I haven't been yet, because I have that sort
Speaker 2: of quest for learning something new, and that's one way
Speaker 2: you can learn something new, to visit a new place.
Speaker 2: So Brian travels. He has a traveler that goes with
Speaker 2: him now, a two year old charming son called Dean.
Speaker 2: And talk about how you've integrated a toddler into your
Speaker 2: jet setting lifestyle. Because I see him on your shoulders,
Speaker 2: I see him in your arm.
Speaker 1: I'm so lucky. He's well, I'm lucky, and I'm girding
Speaker 1: my loins because he's my clone. He is just like
Speaker 1: me mine going a million miles an hour, very inquisitive.
Speaker 1: But I mean he because I had him via surrogacy.
Speaker 1: So I decided single gay dad. It was always wanted
Speaker 1: to be a dad, and I was like, I want
Speaker 1: to be a dad in my thirties. So during the pandemic,
Speaker 1: when I had some soul searching of what's the next phase,
Speaker 1: and it became very clear that to become a dad,
Speaker 1: I didn't know exactly what travel would be like, but
Speaker 1: I knew I wanted to start early. Everyone I know
Speaker 1: a lot of people in the travel industry, influencers who
Speaker 1: have young kids, and I see them traveling families that
Speaker 1: go around the world, and everyone said, just start them young.
Speaker 1: And that's what they that's what they know, and that
Speaker 1: you know, his first flight was at three days old,
Speaker 1: flew home and he slept the whole flight. And but
Speaker 1: I tell families, like in the beginning, it's easy when
Speaker 1: you know, get him a douna, the Duna stroller where
Speaker 1: it turns into a car seat and a stroller, so
Speaker 1: you snap it into the airplane seat. They sleep most
Speaker 1: of the time. It gets challenging at like the eighteen
Speaker 1: month mark when they want to start running around, but
Speaker 1: you figure out ways. You just keep them busy, that's
Speaker 1: the biggest thing. Have a bag of tricks at all times.
Speaker 1: And I'll just say to the other parents out there
Speaker 1: who are debating, I was shocked at how child friendly
Speaker 1: the rest of the world is. The US is one
Speaker 1: of the most anti child places with Glarizon planes. You
Speaker 1: go to Portugal, they will pull you aside. There are
Speaker 1: special immage. You don't wait no long immigration line, they'll
Speaker 1: take you and your kids to the front.
Speaker 2: So what advice do you have for people traveling during
Speaker 2: the upcoming peak travel times.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so there's always going to be road bumps the
Speaker 1: biggest mistake. So you can fix a lot of your
Speaker 1: problems before you leave your house. Everyone, especially people who
Speaker 1: book months in advance. So the airlines these days change
Speaker 1: flights all the time, and you know they'll cancel a
Speaker 1: route or they'll put you on a different flight if
Speaker 1: they cancel that frequency, And everyone should go online right now,
Speaker 1: and if you've got upcoming travel, always double check because
Speaker 1: sometimes your flight time might not have changed, but they'll
Speaker 1: change the aircraft, which means you might be in a
Speaker 1: middle seat. So it's a whole lot easier to fix
Speaker 1: those issues before you go to the airport than when
Speaker 1: there's no seats left. So everyone go in. You know,
Speaker 1: you always double check your reservations before you leave, and
Speaker 1: if the airline switches you to from the NonStop to
Speaker 1: one with the stop. The Department of Transportation has new
Speaker 1: rules as of October. So if your flight time changes
Speaker 1: by three hours domestically or six hours internationally, you were
Speaker 1: owed a full refund. So in the past, the airlines
Speaker 1: could put you on a terrible flight with a crazy
Speaker 1: connection and you had to take it. Now consumers need
Speaker 1: to know. But this is what consumers need to know
Speaker 1: their rights first of all, so so to survive the holidays, yeah,
Speaker 1: just always double check your know your rights through the
Speaker 1: Department of Transportation. And another thing, when airlines delay or
Speaker 1: cancel your flight, they're cheap. The most are not giving
Speaker 1: you a hotel, and if it is, it's usually going
Speaker 1: to be horrible. But most people's credit cards have flight
Speaker 1: cancelation and delay coverage. So your AMEX, your Chase card
Speaker 1: will pay if there's a long delay. You can go
Speaker 1: to a nearby hotel, get a day rate with your kids,
Speaker 1: go to a pool, have a meal, and your credit
Speaker 1: card will pay for that. And it shocks me how
Speaker 1: few people know that when you use those credit cards,
Speaker 1: those protections exist. Same thing with baggage. And finally, if
Speaker 1: you're going to check a bag, everyone you must have
Speaker 1: an air tag in your luggage. In fact, I put
Speaker 1: it on my carry on. I put it my stroller.
Speaker 1: I mean, having air tags will show you where your
Speaker 1: bag is. And now the airlines just announced they're teaming
Speaker 1: up with Apple and you'll be able to share your
Speaker 1: air tag location with the airline soon, so it's integrated.
Speaker 1: But knowing that your bag and I've had my son's
Speaker 1: bag with of course all the most essential items. When
Speaker 1: we were in Portugal, that was the one that didn't come.
Speaker 1: I knew exactly where it was at every point in time,
Speaker 1: and I knew when it landed at the airport. I
Speaker 1: didn't wait for the hotel, you know, airport employees to
Speaker 1: call me. I knew the minute it landed, so I
Speaker 1: went to the airport and got it. So having that
Speaker 1: air tag is critical.
Speaker 2: I have two air tags sitting in a drawer and
Speaker 2: I have not put them in my luggage. Oh how
Speaker 2: bad am I?
Speaker 1: I mean, Mark, you can create a holiday wonderland, but
Speaker 1: you can't simply just put an air tag.
Speaker 2: And I'm going through the minute I get on tonight.
Speaker 2: What trends do you, Bryan see for the future of travel?
Speaker 1: Yeah, so we at the point sky. We just did
Speaker 1: an analysis, so there's some good and some bad trends.
Speaker 1: I think in twenty twenty five. The cost of travel
Speaker 1: is going to continue going up. There's a lot of
Speaker 1: reasons aircraft. Boeing is in a state of disaster. I
Speaker 1: mean they're supposed to be. Boeing is many years behind
Speaker 1: on planes. Airbus even has so that's creating issues for
Speaker 1: the airlines who are flying older planes grounding them. So
Speaker 1: there's going to be continued roadbumps and traveling and the
Speaker 1: cost of airfare going up and over. Tourism is a
Speaker 1: big issue this summer. We saw in Barcelona the locals
Speaker 1: were squirting tourists with water guns. I urge everyone start
Speaker 1: really traveling the shoulder season. You going to Rome in
Speaker 1: November much bet are much more enjoyable. So start And
Speaker 1: I know a lot of families you know have spring break,
Speaker 1: but instead of spring break in the Bahamas and paying
Speaker 1: an exorbitant amount, think about Portugal. You know, the flights
Speaker 1: can be the same. So just I encourage people to
Speaker 1: start thinking against the grain going to more unique destinations.
Speaker 1: I am an optimist in general, but the airlines Delta
Speaker 1: came out with an investor day. They're going to continue
Speaker 1: squeezing out revenue. So Jet Blue now charges for a
Speaker 1: dynamic fee for check bags, meaning you don't even know
Speaker 1: how much your bag's going to cost till you check in.
Speaker 1: It could be up with seventy five dollars, you know,
Speaker 1: one hundred dollars flight. So getting this is where getting
Speaker 1: an airline cobra and if you fly Jet Blue several
Speaker 1: times a year, just get the Cobra and it's eighty
Speaker 1: bucks a year and you get you and your family
Speaker 1: get free bags every time you fly.
Speaker 2: So I didn't even know that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so get an airline card for the perks, but
Speaker 1: spend on a card that will let you transfer to
Speaker 1: multiple airliness.
Speaker 2: Everybody listening, you must get this book, How to Win
Speaker 2: at Travel, coming out in February of twenty twenty five.
Speaker 2: Can't wait for it to come out. Really, this is
Speaker 2: a very useful book and I hopefully will help all
Speaker 2: of us travel better and more efficiently and more luxuriously
Speaker 2: in the future. I think it's so good of you
Speaker 2: to write this book for us.
Speaker 1: Thank you, Markin. Really, you've definitely been an inspiration in
Speaker 1: the How to Space.
Speaker 2: Now listen, I want to do a little lightning around
Speaker 2: with you. Okay, check in or carry.
Speaker 1: On carry on when possible.
Speaker 2: What are your travel pet Peeves.
Speaker 1: This is a new one. I hate when people wear
Speaker 1: a so stinkiness on planes. I don't mind those oh perfumes.
Speaker 1: Can we have a discussion about oo oh ooh, Martha.
Speaker 1: I was at Barry's boot camp yesterday and the guy
Speaker 1: next to me had so much tom Ford ood I
Speaker 1: actually had to move. I had to move od And
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know, Harry Mclair Angel, it's time
Speaker 1: that we either dilute it or just put it to pasture,
Speaker 1: because when you know, I agree, favorite seats, favorite seats.
Speaker 1: I mean I'm a window seat guy, through and through
Speaker 1: me too. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Earliest travel memory my parents.
Speaker 1: We would go to Florida as kids, and actually my
Speaker 1: dad and my two brothers, my dad taught us. We
Speaker 1: were gaming family cards, Rummy and I remember learning blackjack
Speaker 1: in the Florida keys, like using pennies, and that's like
Speaker 1: one of my earliest Like me and my brothers and
Speaker 1: my dad.
Speaker 2: Favorite airline are you allowed?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I mean I can say I don't have
Speaker 1: like I'm a free agent these days, I will say, well,
Speaker 1: Etty hod Is, you know the Abu Dhabi based airline
Speaker 1: has what's called the Residents and it's a double bed.
Speaker 1: You get your own bedroom with double bed and you
Speaker 1: why I love this is you can set the temperature
Speaker 1: to the bedroom your own and I sleep at sixty
Speaker 1: seven degrees, so frette linens and sixty seven degrees and
Speaker 1: a closing door for fifteen hours to Abu Dhabi. It's
Speaker 1: like that is the ultimate.
Speaker 2: Oh, and I have to go to Abu Dhabi's I
Speaker 2: will help you book it, Okay, I will call fabulous.
Speaker 2: Favorite airport?
Speaker 1: Ooh, favorite airport? You know this one's you know, Singapore
Speaker 1: Airport is you know, globally renowned, but I like saying
Speaker 1: pomp Springs. It is the most charming outdoor desert airport.
Speaker 1: It just makes me smile.
Speaker 2: Most unforgettable travel experience.
Speaker 1: I have to say taking my parents. My parents are
Speaker 1: my rock and so being able to take them on trips.
Speaker 1: We did it an around the world trip. My dad
Speaker 1: is Brian. I'm Brian and one of the people I
Speaker 1: do charity work with in Ghana. As a thank you
Speaker 1: to me for supporting their charity, he named his final
Speaker 1: son Brian Kelly. Oh, so there's a little Brian Kelly
Speaker 1: and Ghana. So my dad, mom and I we flew
Speaker 1: from London to Akra and I'd use miles and it
Speaker 1: was on the British Airway seven forty seven. And we
Speaker 1: get on the plane and we're the only three people
Speaker 1: in first class and my parents just look at me like,
Speaker 1: you know, we're on the Queen of the Skies, this
Speaker 1: iconic plane going. They just look at me like we're
Speaker 1: going to Ghana for a baby. Man.
Speaker 2: It was like, yeah, that's the way.
Speaker 1: As a kid from Bucks County, you know, like that's.
Speaker 2: A hotel that does luxury the best.
Speaker 1: Oh, I mean, I love Rosewood Hotels as like a brand.
Speaker 1: They've got some really fabulous properties. But I love also adventures.
Speaker 1: So Nihi is a hotel in Indonesia on the island
Speaker 1: of Sumba. My friend Chris Perch owns it and it
Speaker 1: was the number one hotel in the world through Travel
Speaker 1: and Leisure several years. But it's it takes forever to
Speaker 1: get there, but it is exquisite. There's wild horses that
Speaker 1: run along the beach and they're really integrated into the
Speaker 1: local culture. So I say skip Bali and go to Simba.
Speaker 2: You heard it here some best packing tip.
Speaker 1: I am just a huge fan of the foal well.
Speaker 1: Besides the air tag pack and air tag and everything.
Speaker 1: But I do. I'm a fold I put everything, like
Speaker 1: all my shirts, well, I'll start with my blazers and
Speaker 1: then put shirts and then I just fold everything in
Speaker 1: half and half and I almost never have to iron.
Speaker 1: All my pants get stacked half half. They don't crease
Speaker 1: because when they're in a big enough pack, it's not
Speaker 1: tight enough to crease.
Speaker 2: I have, I have a I have a very good thing.
Speaker 2: I put all my dresses, all my shirts, all my
Speaker 2: sweaters on hangers on the middle fingers hangers, and then
Speaker 2: I put each piece of clothing in a plastic cleaner bag.
Speaker 2: And when you fold that into thirds and lay them
Speaker 2: down into your suitcase, nothing, nothing gets wrinkled.
Speaker 1: And then you're able to just hang it out. Because right,
Speaker 1: let's talk about my other pet peeve in life is hotels.
Speaker 1: Beautiful hotels. I'll get upgraded. The penow sweet and there's
Speaker 1: three hangers. Yeah, what is going on? Hotels can?
Speaker 2: But that's my thing is it's absolutely.
Speaker 1: Pen yeah, and it makes keeps them clean and it
Speaker 1: makes yeah.
Speaker 2: And I use and I use the trunk that Romoa
Speaker 2: metal stuff trunk because you can.
Speaker 1: You ever do package you don't use packing cubes?
Speaker 2: Do you or know thing you never leave home without?
Speaker 1: When I travel, it's my Bo's headphones control your environment.
Speaker 1: Even if there's a crying kid, who cares, I'll just
Speaker 1: crank up my own music.
Speaker 2: Bos So Brian, thank you so much for joining us today.
Speaker 2: This has been not only enlightening but educational and very helpful.
Speaker 2: Or do we follow you at?
Speaker 1: The Points Guy is the company's website, and social is
Speaker 1: my personal travels and Points Guy, The Points Guy g
Speaker 1: u I and then I'm at Brian Kelly on Instagram
Speaker 1: and there you can or how to win at travel
Speaker 1: dot com to pre order your book today.
Speaker 2: Have a very happy Christmas and travel safely as we
Speaker 2: all are going to.
Speaker 1: Thank you, Martha, and happiest of holidays to you and
Speaker 1: your family.