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Speaker 1: Originals. This is an iHeart original.

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Speaker 2: In twenty eleven, after many delays, one of the most

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Speaker 2: publicized musicals in all of theater history finally opened on Broadway.

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Speaker 2: It had a brand, it had tons of buzz, and

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Speaker 2: it elicited some strong reactions. It was quite the talk

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Speaker 2: of the town.

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Speaker 1: There were bugs.

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Speaker 2: The show kept stopping. I mean, the hubbub about the

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Speaker 2: show was everywhere.

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Speaker 3: The new actor injury or technical malfunction every week was

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Speaker 3: so bizarre.

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Speaker 2: The musical was Spider Man Turn Off the Dark, and

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Speaker 2: for a show that aimed to rise above all of

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Speaker 2: Broadway musicals in terms of scale and ambition, its downfall

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Speaker 2: would turn out to be long and treacherous.

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Speaker 4: My husband and I were in the audience tonight Chris

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Speaker 4: Tierney fell and it was awful.

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Speaker 2: We honestly thought we'd watched someone die on stage. That

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Speaker 2: fall didn't just traumatize the audience, it echoed a warning.

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Speaker 2: The ambition of Spider Man Turn Off the Dark was

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Speaker 2: swinging dangerously close to the edge. Welcome to very special

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Speaker 2: episodes and I heeart original podcast. I'm your host Danish

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Speaker 2: Schwartz and this is Spider Man Turn Up the Pod.

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Speaker 2: I am so excited about this episode. This has been

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Speaker 2: a subject that has actually been my obsession for a

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Speaker 2: very long time. Jason, I feel like you know that

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Speaker 2: this is the subject that I like bring up in

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Speaker 2: conversation that has just like warped my brain in a

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Speaker 2: way that has altered my physical chemistry permanently. I'm talking,

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Speaker 2: of course, about the Spider Man Turn Off the Dark Musical,

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Speaker 2: a musical I never saw, but that astounds me and

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Speaker 2: delights me to this very day, nonetheless.

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Speaker 5: And not just you. We used a quote from this

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Speaker 5: episode in our trailer a couple months ago, and I

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Speaker 5: think more than any other potential episode that people heard about,

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Speaker 5: this is the one we get the most inquiries about

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Speaker 5: when is the Spider Man? And then they often have

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Speaker 5: some story. Sometimes it's not even a good story, like

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Speaker 5: oh I almost went. I knew someone who went, like

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Speaker 5: people just want to be associated with this musical, and

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Speaker 5: I'm so excited we get to tell this story today.

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Speaker 2: My best friend did see it on Broadway, and she

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Speaker 2: went to one of those magical performances where something went wrong,

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Speaker 2: and so she has a great story about how, during

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Speaker 2: like one of the swinging scenes, the actor who played

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Speaker 2: Spider Man, Reeve Carney was suspended for like a full

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Speaker 2: ten minutes, just above the audience, like the house lights

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Speaker 2: went on, and this poor guy had to just stay

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Speaker 2: there and he was sort of still doing like pew

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Speaker 2: pew like sort of still staying in character. Like ten

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Speaker 2: minutes is a long time.

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Speaker 1: Oh heck were you guys? Are both theater kids correct?

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Speaker 4: Oh?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, is that not obvious?

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Speaker 5: I was the star of the fifth grade play, but

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Speaker 5: that was the peak of my acting career.

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Speaker 1: Can you imagine either one of you standing on stage

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Speaker 1: for ten minutes and you have nothing to do, nothing,

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Speaker 1: You're just standing there.

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Speaker 2: Quiet, suspended above the audience in character.

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Speaker 5: Full minute unbelievable with lots of danger. So I never

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Speaker 5: got to see this show. I was living in the

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Speaker 5: New York area during the entire run. I regret it immentally.

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Speaker 2: Now I can't believe you didn't see I'm so jealous.

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Speaker 2: I was too young, I did not live in New York,

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Speaker 2: and I did not have disposable income. That's my excuse.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I wanted to see it too. I also really

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Speaker 1: would love to if I could. And this is like

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Speaker 1: an imaginary thing, but you know, the choreographer Bob fosse

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Speaker 1: All that jazz. That guy, right, I would love to

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Speaker 1: be able to talk to him about this show, you know, like, hey,

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Speaker 1: well after you were gone, they did Spider Man. I

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Speaker 1: just like see him ask questions.

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Speaker 2: I would love to see Stephen Sondheim's face during a

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Speaker 2: production of this show. For anyone who has not gotten

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Speaker 2: to see the show, and obviously it's no longer running

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Speaker 2: so you can't. You can go to YouTube and look up.

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Speaker 2: I hope it's still up. So I'm saying this, but

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Speaker 2: there is a David Letterman performance of the Broadway show

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Speaker 2: of them singing a song called a Freak like Me

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Speaker 2: Needs Company, and you can see David Letterman's soul leave

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Speaker 2: his body during the performance. Over the course of the performance,

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Speaker 2: you can track it. You see the life draining from

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Speaker 2: his eyes.

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Speaker 1: Speaking your souls leaving their body. Any story for me

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Speaker 1: that involves the youtubo's guitarist, the Edge, walking out of

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Speaker 1: a room and then walking back into a dead man,

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Speaker 1: I'm just like tell me this story.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, I didn't expect deaths, and I knew there were injuries, but.

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Speaker 1: This is all surprised. The story dispacked with surprise.

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Speaker 5: All right, why don't we get into this one? And

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Speaker 5: we will catch up on the other side.

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Speaker 2: As with many recent Broadway shows, the jumping off place

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Speaker 2: for the Spider Man Musical was a movie, specifically the

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Speaker 2: two thousand and two Toby McGuire Spider Man Film, which

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Speaker 2: not only got solid reviews but raked in over eight

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Speaker 2: hundred million dollars. With Disney properties like Beauty and the

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Speaker 2: Beast and The Lion King leaping successfully from the screen

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Speaker 2: to Broadway, Marvel was keen to map a similar course

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Speaker 2: for Spidey's newly invigorated brand. Marvel placed spider Man's Broadway

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Speaker 2: future in the hands of charismatic producer Tony Adams and

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Speaker 2: his business partner, entertainment lawyer David Garfinkel. The two convinced

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Speaker 2: no less than Bono and The Edge of U two

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Speaker 2: to compose the songs for the as yet unwritten show.

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Speaker 2: For the director, Bono and the Edge pushed to bring

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Speaker 2: on Julie Taymour, whose production of The Lion King became

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Speaker 2: the most profitable musical of all time, grossing eight point

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Speaker 2: two billion dollars worldwide. Julie Taymour was universally hailed as

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Speaker 2: an uncompromising visionary, and her clout had now earned her

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Speaker 2: creative control over the forthcoming Spider Man musical. To that end,

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Speaker 2: Taymoor would not only direct, but co write the script

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Speaker 2: or in theater, lingo the book. In two thousand and five,

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Speaker 2: the call went out for prospective writing collaborators to submit

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Speaker 2: a sample scene. Playwright and TV writer Glenn Berger was

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Speaker 2: one of many who submit it, but instead of a scene,

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Speaker 2: he wrote a rambling conceptual treatise. It read, as he

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Speaker 2: tells it, like he was on drugs, but good drugs.

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Speaker 6: Maybe it wasn't the most exquisitely structured piece of writing

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Speaker 6: I've ever done, but it was enough for me to

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Speaker 6: get an interview, and by the ending of the interview

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Speaker 6: it became clear that the thing that they actually wanted

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Speaker 6: was a scene. So I said, oh, yeah, absolutely, a scene.

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Speaker 6: Great idea. So I said, I'll have it to you

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Speaker 6: tomorrow morning, and I sped back home upstate and spent

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Speaker 6: the night writing a scene. And actually I knew that

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Speaker 6: next morning at dawn birds or twittering, and I press send,

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Speaker 6: and I kind of knew that I nailed it, actually,

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Speaker 6: And so it wasn't surprising when later that afternoon Julie

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Speaker 6: called me and said, yeah, yeah, you Got It.

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Speaker 2: Eager to get started, Berger relocated to New York City. Meanwhile,

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Speaker 2: producer and show cheerleader Tony Adams was hammering out the

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Speaker 2: official deal. On October twentieth, though, tragedy struck. Adams had

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Speaker 2: just gotten Bono's and Taymor's signatures on the contract and

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Speaker 2: went to secure the Edges. The Edge left the room

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Speaker 2: to get a pen, and when he came back, Adams

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Speaker 2: was slumped over the table. He'd suffered a stroke. Two

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Speaker 2: days later, he was dead. The show was now in

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Speaker 2: the hands of Adam's partner, David Garfinkel. While Garfinkel was

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Speaker 2: extremely well connected in showbiz circles, he had never before

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Speaker 2: produced a play or musical. Nevertheless, a reading was planned

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Speaker 2: for mid two thousand and seven. Bono and The Edge

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Speaker 2: started writing songs, leaning heavily on their distinctive rock style,

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Speaker 2: while also incorporating faux classical vocal harmonies and typical musical

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Speaker 2: theater razzle dazzle. Glen Berger worked on the book, building

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Speaker 2: dialogue out of the treatment he and Taymor had created.

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Speaker 2: The first act of the show was to be Your

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Speaker 2: Classic Origin Story, as laid out in the comic book,

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Speaker 2: and two thousand and two film Bullied teenager Peter Parker

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Speaker 2: gets bitten by a genetically modified Spider, is sheathed in

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Speaker 2: the iconic form fitting red suit, and becomes the titular superstar,

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Speaker 2: great power, great responsibility, you know the deal. However, the

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Speaker 2: intention was to marry that well known tale with Taymoor's

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Speaker 2: many bold theatrical new ideas. One of these editions was

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Speaker 2: a geek chorus, a pun on the ancient theatrical device

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Speaker 2: of a Greek chorus. Spider Man's geek chorus consists of

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Speaker 2: of four talkative nerds who would move the action along

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Speaker 2: by relaying Peter Parker's thoughts and narrating portions of the events.

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Speaker 2: Here's cobook writer Glenn Berger.

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Speaker 6: The idea is that the geeks are generating this sort

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Speaker 6: of fan thick version of Spider Man based on the

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Speaker 6: one hundred and fifty comic books that they've read, and

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Speaker 6: they're arguing about it. What's the best scenario for the

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Speaker 6: fights that they've read or they can come up with,

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Speaker 6: And then when the girl geek, miss Arrow, introduces this

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Speaker 6: character of Arakney from Greek mythology, this character ends up

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Speaker 6: sort of taking the show away from the geeks. That's

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Speaker 6: the idea at least.

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Speaker 2: The myth of Arakney was referred to in the first

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Speaker 2: issue of the Ultimate Spider Man comic book series. Basically,

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Speaker 2: Arakney was an arrogant weaver of tapestries transformed through godly

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Speaker 2: intervention into the world's first spider. Tamoor conceived this character

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Speaker 2: as the show's primary villain and planned for the show's

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Speaker 2: second act to end with a jaw dropping battle between

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Speaker 2: a Rakney and our web slinging hero. In the fall

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Speaker 2: of two thousand and six, the four creatives Bono, the Edge,

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Speaker 2: Julie Taymoor, and Glenn Berger gathered at Bono's New York

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Speaker 2: City penthouse to read through the first draft of the

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Speaker 2: script and listen to early versions of the songs. In

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Speaker 2: this intimate setting, it seemed like the show was off

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Speaker 2: to a great start, and as the meeting progressed, the

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Speaker 2: excitement mounted.

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Speaker 6: When Bono relaxes, he takes off his sunglasses, you know,

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Speaker 6: and they came off, and they were on the coffee table.

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Speaker 6: The rest of the day. Bono and Edge just had

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Speaker 6: these just germs of ideas for you know, some of

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Speaker 6: the big songs that we wanted for the musical like

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Speaker 6: Rise Above. And then their next song was this bouncing

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Speaker 6: off the Wall song, which is just goofy, you know,

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Speaker 6: throw yourself around the room type of song, and Julie's

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Speaker 6: sort of demonstrating how she imagines the choreography to go.

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Speaker 6: So she begins this nutty dance with her, you know,

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Speaker 6: arms flying all over the place, and Bono understands what

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Speaker 6: she's getting at, and so he's getting up and getting

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Speaker 6: excited about it too, and you could just feel this

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Speaker 6: this real, lovely, lovely little electricity, and things got cooking.

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Speaker 2: According to Berger, this joyous collaborative work session was when

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Speaker 2: he learned what the full title of their show would be.

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Speaker 6: Bono he had a friend whose daughter didn't like when

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Speaker 6: it gets dark when she goes to bed, and so

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Speaker 6: she likes to leave the lights on. But instead of saying, daddy,

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Speaker 6: you leave the lights on, she says, could you turn

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Speaker 6: off the dark?

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Speaker 2: Since internationally famous rock stars Bono and the Edge were

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Speaker 2: constantly distracted by things like making best selling albums and

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Speaker 2: playing sold out arena tours as you do, they still

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Speaker 2: had a lot of songs to complete. As the two

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Speaker 2: thousand and seven reading, which would be attended by theater

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Speaker 2: VIPs and Marvel executives drew near.

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Speaker 6: Bono and Edge did have their work cut out for

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Speaker 6: them to have a completed score in time for our

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Speaker 6: first workshop presentation in July two thousand and seven. Definitely

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Speaker 6: only about four or five months before that. They didn't

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Speaker 6: really have anything completed completed, but musicians, you know, they

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Speaker 6: just need a deadline.

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Speaker 2: A company of actors performed the script and songs in

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Speaker 2: a rehearsal room without sets, props, costumes, or special effects.

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Speaker 2: Despite the bare bones nature of this presentation, the the

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Speaker 2: show seemed to be in good shape. Oh man.

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Speaker 6: The feeling after that reading was we were sitting pretty

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Speaker 6: we were set. Obviously there were some things to work out,

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Speaker 6: but we had a hit man. The songs were killer.

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Speaker 6: The uh, you know, the script. It would get some tweaks,

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Speaker 6: of course, but it was basically there, and that was

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Speaker 6: the consensus. I mean, everyone was feeling such relief. Actually,

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Speaker 6: you know, I mean the idea then is that you

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Speaker 6: build on that. But I think that was probably our

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Speaker 6: peak moment in the evolution of the entire show.

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Speaker 2: Enter the technical elements, since flying sequences were so pivotal

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Speaker 2: to the Spider Man story, aerial designers got to work

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Speaker 2: right away. They came up with a plan that would

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Speaker 2: allow two performers to simultaneously spring into the air and

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Speaker 2: duke it out while suspended. It was based on the

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Speaker 2: koreening cameras used at football games, with multiple wires allowing

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Speaker 2: for movement in any direction. However, it hadn't been used

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Speaker 2: on humans, and it certainly hadn't been used on humans

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Speaker 2: performing live in a Broadway theater. In the nineteen fifties

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Speaker 2: musical Peter Pan, the flying scenes were accomplished by humans

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Speaker 2: pulling ropes backstage to counteract the actor's weight on stage,

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Speaker 2: but Spider Man's aerial magic would be controlled by automation.

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Speaker 2: You know, technology, that fool proof thing. Most musicals do

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Speaker 2: a brief run in another city before officially opening in

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Speaker 2: New York. It's known colloquially as an out of town tryout.

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Speaker 2: Here's playwright and Broadway actor Eric Ayoa, who saw Turn

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Speaker 2: Off the Dark several times during its run.

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Speaker 7: So shows out of town tryout is when they take

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Speaker 7: the show literally, they take it out of town to

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Speaker 7: try it out. You've been in a studio, you've been

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Speaker 7: rehearsing it. It's a very closed experience. And now you're

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Speaker 7: taking in that last part of the puzzle. The audience.

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Speaker 7: Are they reacting, are they laughing? Are they bored?

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Speaker 5: When they leaning?

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Speaker 7: When are they falling asleep? What's not clear. The best

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Speaker 7: shows and the best teams are the ones that actually

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Speaker 7: use their out of town wisely and listen to the

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Speaker 7: audiences and to what they're hearing, and perhaps take some

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Speaker 7: of those bad reviews and use that to fuel a

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Speaker 7: better version.

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Speaker 2: Unfortunately, Spider Man's innovative technical demands were making an out

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Speaker 2: of town tryout impossible. Producer David Garfinkel made the call

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Speaker 2: they would start rehearsals for the Broadway production Cold, One

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Speaker 2: of Broadway's biggest houses, was booked, the eighteen hundred seat

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Speaker 2: Hilton Theater. Design meetings took place day and night. Enormous

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Speaker 2: comic book style sets were being built, and a lot

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Speaker 2: of money started getting spent. No one would officially confirm

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Speaker 2: the budget at that time, but insiders estimated it at

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Speaker 2: forty million dollars. On February twenty fourth, two thousand and nine,

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Speaker 2: The New York Times announced that Spider Man Turn Off

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Speaker 2: the Dark would begin preview performances in January twenty ten.

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Speaker 2: Casting began for all thirty one roles. Movie star Evan

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Speaker 2: rachel Wood, who had performed in the two thousand and

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Speaker 2: seven reading, accepted the role of Peter Parker's love interest

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Speaker 2: Mary Jane, and Alan Cumming was on board to place

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Speaker 2: Spidey's nemesis, the Green Goblin. Though opening night was discreetly

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Speaker 2: delayed until February twenty ten to allow for massive renovations

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Speaker 2: to the theater, Excitement swelled amongst the creative team and

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Speaker 2: the newly cast actors, that is, until they found out

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Speaker 2: the production had run out of money, like completely. In

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Speaker 2: an interview with Sixty Minutes, Bono claimed he found out

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Speaker 2: things were in such bad condition when he read about

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Speaker 2: it in the New York Post. Luckily, Bono, being Bono,

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Speaker 2: knew a few people. He convinced Michael Cole, former chairman

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Speaker 2: of Live Nation, to take the producing rains. In regards

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Speaker 2: to the show's finances, Cole said, quote, I can summarize

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Speaker 2: in one word, bankrupt. Turn off the Dark shut down

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Speaker 2: entirely for the remainder of two thousand and nine. While

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Speaker 2: Cole struggled to secure funding, Evan rachel Wood and Alan

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Speaker 2: Cumming both bowed out for on screen jobs, and work

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Speaker 2: didn't resume at the theater until March of twenty ten,

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Speaker 2: while the show struggled to regain its financial footing. Rehearsals

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00:19:12,002 --> 00:19:17,482
Speaker 2: officially began that August. Director Taymor shuttled back and forth

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Speaker 2: between the rehearsal room and the theater, which had been

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Speaker 2: renamed the Foxwoods, where sets were getting installed and the

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Speaker 2: aerial team was mapping out how to get, among other things,

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Speaker 2: Spider Man to ride the Green Goblin mid air like

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Speaker 2: a surfboard. A lot of scenes were so complex they

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Speaker 2: couldn't be worked out until the start of tech rehearsals,

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Speaker 2: which was a scary prospect. But what else could be

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Speaker 2: done in the same sixty minutes piece. Taymor owned that fear, saying, oh, yeah,

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Speaker 2: I'm scared. If you don't have fear, then you're not

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Speaker 2: taking a chance. But what I do have is a team.

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Speaker 2: If your collaborators are there, which is what answers the

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Speaker 2: fear question, and they all are as an passioned as

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Speaker 2: you are and believe in it, your fear is mitigated.

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Speaker 2: Soon enough it was time to begin the all important

305
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Speaker 2: tech rehearsals. Given the show's enormous scale, it made sense

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Speaker 2: that things were going to go slowly. What worried co

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Speaker 2: writer Glenn Berger though, was just how slowly.

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Speaker 6: After four days we were getting through forty two seconds

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Speaker 6: of the show for every hour of Tech.

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Speaker 2: And to make matters worse, it was only a few

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Speaker 2: days into Tech when the first injury occurred. A dancer

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Speaker 2: playing one of several flying Spider Man was supposed to

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Speaker 2: flip backwards while being hoisted into the air by cables

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Speaker 2: and land on a ramp that was lowering into place

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Speaker 2: behind him. On September twenty sixth, the ramp didn't lower

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Speaker 2: to the proper degree. The off kilter landing fractured the

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Speaker 2: dancer's foot and broke his toe. Then, during a presentation

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Speaker 2: for sales agents and ticket brokers on October nineteenth, another

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Speaker 2: dancer was performing the very same move.

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Speaker 6: I remember seeing him WinCE when he made the landing,

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Speaker 6: and I could tell that something might be up.

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Speaker 2: Something was up, all right. The dancer had broken both

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Speaker 2: his wrists.

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Speaker 6: So alast two injuries now. And really the other thing

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Speaker 6: that no one was really saying out loud, but it

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Speaker 6: was in the back of all our minds, was I

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Speaker 6: hope this doesn't leave the theater, because it would be

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Speaker 6: good if this got out.

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Speaker 2: Unfortunately it did. People were talking about Spider Man, and

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Speaker 2: not in the kindest terms, But no one seemed to

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Speaker 2: take more delight in Spider Man's misfortunes than New York

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Speaker 2: Post columnist Michael Reid, who said of the show quote,

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Speaker 2: I've got my foot on its neck and I'm having

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Speaker 2: too much fun to take it off. Reedel gleefully reported

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Speaker 2: any Spidy gossip that crossed his desk, proclaiming in mid

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Speaker 2: November that the budget was now up to sixty five

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Speaker 2: million dollars. Here's dancer Bethany Moore, who months later would

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Speaker 2: wind up getting cast in the show.

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Speaker 4: It's not like people were scared to audition. Everybody wanted

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Speaker 4: in on this big blockbuster show.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, you had.

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Speaker 4: Some like little titis in the background, but the overall

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Speaker 4: was like, they're doing what they can with what they got.

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Speaker 2: I just hope everybody's okay. With increased safety measures in

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Speaker 2: place and the New York Department of Labor coming by

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00:22:55,722 --> 00:23:00,162
Speaker 2: to sign off on the dangerous stunts, the rehearsal process

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00:23:00,202 --> 00:23:04,682
Speaker 2: slowed even further, do either to safety concerns or a

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Speaker 2: need for more time or bow. With the official opening

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Speaker 2: night was moved yet again to January two, thy eleven.

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Speaker 4: Everything was so high tech, the pit lists and the

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Speaker 4: air pressure needed for those, and everything was computerizing. If

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Speaker 4: it was off a half an inch of that, emergency

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Speaker 4: stops would happen.

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Speaker 2: But hey, the Act one finale, where Spider Man rides

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Speaker 2: the Green Goblin like a surfboard, that at least was

356
00:23:32,762 --> 00:23:38,882
Speaker 2: looking really cool. Suddenly, before anyone was fully prepared, the

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00:23:38,922 --> 00:23:43,322
Speaker 2: first paying audience was filling the Foxwoods Theater for the

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Speaker 2: first preview performance. It was November twenty eighth, twenty ten,

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Speaker 2: and all those people who'd been whispering about the show

360
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Speaker 2: on the outside were about to find out if it

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00:23:56,082 --> 00:24:07,202
Speaker 2: lived up to the hype. The show kept stopping. I

362
00:24:07,242 --> 00:24:09,842
Speaker 2: think there were four or five holds the first night.

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Speaker 3: All I remember is hearing about a new actor injury

364
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Speaker 3: or technical malfunction every week.

365
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Speaker 7: The Spider Man, who was supposed to repel down into

366
00:24:18,842 --> 00:24:21,722
Speaker 7: the aisle missed his mark by a few inches, and

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Speaker 7: I ended up having most of Spider Man's torso on

368
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Speaker 7: my lap, which wasn't the worst thing in the world.

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Speaker 2: The first preview of Spider Man Turn Off the Dark

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00:24:31,322 --> 00:24:35,522
Speaker 2: ran three and a half hours. Technical issues brought the

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Speaker 2: show to a halt five times. In certain moments, actors

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00:24:41,042 --> 00:24:45,122
Speaker 2: dangled helplessly over the heads of the waiting audience while

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Speaker 2: technicians troubleshot the problem. Still, given the size of the undertaking,

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Speaker 2: the fact that there were only five holds was seen

375
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Speaker 2: by some as a win. Let's hear from dancer Bethany Moore.

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Speaker 4: I had seen the show a few weeks before auditioning

377
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Speaker 4: for it, not knowing that it had anything to do

378
00:25:08,282 --> 00:25:12,522
Speaker 4: with my future, and though I was kind of confused

379
00:25:12,562 --> 00:25:17,202
Speaker 4: with some of the more musical theater moments, the spectacle

380
00:25:17,562 --> 00:25:20,562
Speaker 4: was unlike anything I had seen. It was like on

381
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Speaker 4: par with the Circusolay kind of thing, where they're flying

382
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Speaker 4: with silks in the beginning, and the Chrysler building coming

383
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Speaker 4: out into the audience like a pop up book.

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Speaker 2: To make sure that the moments that didn't yet work

385
00:25:35,002 --> 00:25:38,162
Speaker 2: were raised to the level of those that did, the

386
00:25:38,242 --> 00:25:43,322
Speaker 2: producers once again decided to move the opening date, this

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00:25:43,442 --> 00:25:48,482
Speaker 2: time to February seventh, twenty eleven. There was time to

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Speaker 2: keep working and everyone intended to. Of chief concern was

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Speaker 2: the second act, which was mostly about Spider Man's relationship

390
00:25:59,482 --> 00:26:06,362
Speaker 2: with mythical Spider Goddess. A Rackney co book writer Glenn Berger, explains.

391
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Speaker 6: The idea was comin. Back one was going to be

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Speaker 6: this grand battle between Spider Man and the Green Goblin,

393
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Speaker 6: and it was going to be amazing, and there's no

394
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Speaker 6: way you can top it, but we were going to

395
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Speaker 6: top it by having Act too be this incredible battle

396
00:26:20,202 --> 00:26:24,082
Speaker 6: above the heads of the audience, inside this giant web

397
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Speaker 6: that was going to funnel down from the ceiling over

398
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Speaker 6: the heads of the audience, and there's going to be

399
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Speaker 6: this crazy, scrambling spider fight and it was actually going

400
00:26:32,802 --> 00:26:36,362
Speaker 6: to Act one, but the web funnel that we were

401
00:26:36,522 --> 00:26:39,482
Speaker 6: counting on didn't work, and so we had to scrap

402
00:26:39,522 --> 00:26:41,562
Speaker 6: it before even the first preview, and that was a

403
00:26:41,602 --> 00:26:44,322
Speaker 6: million bucks that you went to a landfill.

404
00:26:44,442 --> 00:26:49,122
Speaker 2: Other moments in Act two were just plain overwhelming, not

405
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Speaker 2: necessarily in a good way.

406
00:26:51,602 --> 00:26:54,042
Speaker 7: There was this moment that was almost like a fashion

407
00:26:54,162 --> 00:26:56,522
Speaker 7: runway of villains. They all came at once, and I

408
00:26:56,602 --> 00:26:58,442
Speaker 7: was like, whoa, whoa, whoall we could really keep this

409
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Speaker 7: Green Goblin centric.

410
00:27:00,602 --> 00:27:05,402
Speaker 2: Questions about plot clarity, however, paled in comparison to what

411
00:27:05,642 --> 00:27:11,402
Speaker 2: happened next. On December twentieth, twenty ten, a dancer named

412
00:27:11,482 --> 00:27:15,362
Speaker 2: Chris Tierney, who did some of the show's most impressive

413
00:27:15,522 --> 00:27:20,922
Speaker 2: stunt work, was improperly connected to the safety apparatus that

414
00:27:21,002 --> 00:27:26,082
Speaker 2: suspended him mid air in a live recreation of a

415
00:27:26,482 --> 00:27:30,922
Speaker 2: comic book style leap in front of that night's audience.

416
00:27:31,162 --> 00:27:36,442
Speaker 2: Tierney made the leap, and, with a sickening sense of dread,

417
00:27:36,802 --> 00:27:42,082
Speaker 2: felt the cable go slack with these split second physical

418
00:27:42,162 --> 00:27:47,042
Speaker 2: intelligence required of a professional at his level. Tierney twisted

419
00:27:47,122 --> 00:27:51,802
Speaker 2: himself around so he wouldn't land on his head. Mercifully,

420
00:27:51,922 --> 00:27:57,642
Speaker 2: he landed on his back after falling thirty feet straight down.

421
00:27:58,602 --> 00:28:05,082
Speaker 2: He broke three vertebrae and four ribs and fractured his elbow, scapula,

422
00:28:05,242 --> 00:28:10,082
Speaker 2: and skull. The very next day was supposed to have been,

423
00:28:10,282 --> 00:28:16,522
Speaker 2: at one point, the show's triumphant opening. Instead, Tierney's life

424
00:28:16,602 --> 00:28:21,682
Speaker 2: threatening fall was making headlines, and a bootleg video of

425
00:28:21,722 --> 00:28:26,442
Speaker 2: the catastrophe was starting to be spread. First, the theater

426
00:28:26,562 --> 00:28:31,402
Speaker 2: community took note, with an original Rent cast member writing

427
00:28:31,482 --> 00:28:35,322
Speaker 2: on Facebook quote they should put Julie Taymore in jail

428
00:28:35,442 --> 00:28:41,482
Speaker 2: for assault, and Tony Award winning actor Alice Ripley tweeting quote,

429
00:28:41,762 --> 00:28:45,042
Speaker 2: does someone have to die? Where is the line for

430
00:28:45,162 --> 00:28:50,402
Speaker 2: these decision makers. I am curious, but soon attention crossed

431
00:28:50,442 --> 00:28:51,922
Speaker 2: over into the mainstream.

432
00:28:51,962 --> 00:28:55,042
Speaker 3: Now you're all familiar with the Broadway musical Spider Man.

433
00:28:55,122 --> 00:28:57,522
Speaker 6: It's been having its troubles and what had to close

434
00:28:57,602 --> 00:28:58,442
Speaker 6: down for a while.

435
00:28:58,602 --> 00:29:01,722
Speaker 2: Late night shows poked fun at turn off the Dark,

436
00:29:01,882 --> 00:29:04,562
Speaker 2: as did Saturday Night Live repeatedly.

437
00:29:04,762 --> 00:29:09,362
Speaker 1: We specialize in assisting clients where sustained injuries while working

438
00:29:09,442 --> 00:29:13,642
Speaker 1: at or attending the Broadway musical spider Man too perform.

439
00:29:14,082 --> 00:29:18,602
Speaker 2: Publications from The New York Times to The Onion dissected

440
00:29:18,642 --> 00:29:23,722
Speaker 2: the show's misfortunes. Joan Rivers started opening her stand up

441
00:29:23,762 --> 00:29:28,402
Speaker 2: act with a moment of silence for quote those Americans

442
00:29:28,602 --> 00:29:34,362
Speaker 2: risking their lives daily in spider Man the Musical. Here's

443
00:29:34,442 --> 00:29:38,762
Speaker 2: playwright Eric Ulloa again, who saw the show several times

444
00:29:38,882 --> 00:29:44,082
Speaker 2: during its run, speaking about the aftermath of Tyranney's fall.

445
00:29:44,122 --> 00:29:46,162
Speaker 7: Of course, when it happened, it was all over the news.

446
00:29:46,162 --> 00:29:49,442
Speaker 7: I'm like, every local news was on that. And then

447
00:29:49,482 --> 00:29:51,962
Speaker 7: the weird thing is like and here is just part

448
00:29:51,962 --> 00:29:57,362
Speaker 7: of societal collapse. Ticket sales went up. Ticket sales went

449
00:29:57,442 --> 00:30:01,042
Speaker 7: up because it became this weird thing that like you

450
00:30:01,122 --> 00:30:03,242
Speaker 7: may see someone maimed on Broadway.

451
00:30:03,882 --> 00:30:09,562
Speaker 2: Previews and rehearsals eventually resumed. Opening night was moved again

452
00:30:09,842 --> 00:30:13,562
Speaker 2: to March fifteenth, but by this point the New York

453
00:30:13,722 --> 00:30:18,442
Speaker 2: critics had had it. They made a controversial move publishing

454
00:30:18,522 --> 00:30:22,242
Speaker 2: reviews of Turn Off the Dark on the show's previous

455
00:30:22,442 --> 00:30:27,202
Speaker 2: opening night February seventh. In his New York Times review,

456
00:30:27,722 --> 00:30:31,962
Speaker 2: drama critic Ben Brantley said, quote, only when things go

457
00:30:32,042 --> 00:30:36,322
Speaker 2: wrong in this production does it feel remotely right, if

458
00:30:36,402 --> 00:30:40,722
Speaker 2: by right one means entertaining, before musing that it may

459
00:30:40,762 --> 00:30:43,842
Speaker 2: be one of Broadway's worst shows.

460
00:30:44,442 --> 00:30:49,202
Speaker 6: So it became clear to some of us working on

461
00:30:49,522 --> 00:30:55,322
Speaker 6: the show that things needed to be changed in a

462
00:30:55,322 --> 00:30:59,082
Speaker 6: more drastic fashion than we were changing them in the

463
00:30:59,122 --> 00:31:04,162
Speaker 6: preview period. And so these two camps ended up forming

464
00:31:04,562 --> 00:31:08,002
Speaker 6: and bought on Edge and Me to begin with, we're

465
00:31:08,082 --> 00:31:12,802
Speaker 6: sort of trying to strike a middle ground to find

466
00:31:12,842 --> 00:31:17,682
Speaker 6: a way to move things forward. Cut this and move this.

467
00:31:18,442 --> 00:31:23,402
Speaker 2: Inspired by offhand observations made by a crew member, cobook

468
00:31:23,402 --> 00:31:28,762
Speaker 2: writer Glenn Berger had begun reinvestigating the show's structure. His

469
00:31:28,882 --> 00:31:31,402
Speaker 2: collaborator didn't exactly approve.

470
00:31:32,242 --> 00:31:36,322
Speaker 6: Julie was in the camp of let's implement the original vision.

471
00:31:36,442 --> 00:31:42,762
Speaker 6: And if people start introducing other fixes and visions, you know,

472
00:31:42,802 --> 00:31:46,482
Speaker 6: that have been generated on the fly at the eleventh

473
00:31:46,482 --> 00:31:50,402
Speaker 6: hour before this original vision gets done, not only is

474
00:31:50,442 --> 00:31:54,522
Speaker 6: it going to you know, collapse morale, and not only

475
00:31:54,602 --> 00:31:56,842
Speaker 6: is it vetted in the same way that this original

476
00:31:56,922 --> 00:31:59,242
Speaker 6: vision was vetted, but really is it going to be

477
00:31:59,242 --> 00:31:59,922
Speaker 6: as good?

478
00:32:00,202 --> 00:32:00,402
Speaker 7: You know?

479
00:32:00,482 --> 00:32:03,602
Speaker 6: Can't we just stay the course and see what we have?

480
00:32:04,042 --> 00:32:09,722
Speaker 6: And so don't introduce this option, don't want to hear it.

481
00:32:09,762 --> 00:32:13,042
Speaker 6: So it becomes suddenly it becomes Spyer's Spy.

482
00:32:14,202 --> 00:32:18,242
Speaker 2: In early March, director Julie Taymor gave a TED talk

483
00:32:18,522 --> 00:32:22,482
Speaker 2: discussing her career. She opened the talk with an oblique

484
00:32:22,562 --> 00:32:27,922
Speaker 2: reference to Spider Man, saying, quote, anybody who creates knows

485
00:32:28,002 --> 00:32:31,562
Speaker 2: there's that point where it hasn't quite become the phoenix

486
00:32:32,122 --> 00:32:35,562
Speaker 2: or the burnt char and I am right there on

487
00:32:35,642 --> 00:32:40,122
Speaker 2: the edge. But she didn't say anything about stepping back

488
00:32:40,362 --> 00:32:43,962
Speaker 2: from the fire. If anything, she seemed as keen as

489
00:32:44,002 --> 00:32:48,482
Speaker 2: ever to keep going. She wouldn't have the opportunity to

490
00:32:48,562 --> 00:32:52,722
Speaker 2: do so. Exactly one week after her TED talk, the

491
00:32:52,802 --> 00:32:57,722
Speaker 2: New York Times announced Tamor had been fired the producers,

492
00:32:57,882 --> 00:33:02,402
Speaker 2: along with Bono and the Edge had responded positively to

493
00:33:02,562 --> 00:33:08,122
Speaker 2: Glenn Berger's outline for a potential restructuring of show, and

494
00:33:08,282 --> 00:33:13,042
Speaker 2: they just couldn't find common ground with Tamor on implementing

495
00:33:13,122 --> 00:33:18,802
Speaker 2: these changes. Adjustments included moving the Green Goblin fight from

496
00:33:18,842 --> 00:33:21,802
Speaker 2: the end of Act one to the end of the show,

497
00:33:22,442 --> 00:33:27,322
Speaker 2: making Spider Goddess Arachne less of a major villain, and

498
00:33:27,602 --> 00:33:33,722
Speaker 2: losing the Geek chorus completely. To help implement this overhaul,

499
00:33:33,882 --> 00:33:37,322
Speaker 2: a new book writer was added to the mix, Roberto

500
00:33:37,522 --> 00:33:43,202
Speaker 2: Agire Sikassa. As both a playwright and writer for Marvel Comics,

501
00:33:43,602 --> 00:33:49,362
Speaker 2: he seemed ideal. The New York Times bombshell articles announcing

502
00:33:49,482 --> 00:33:54,322
Speaker 2: all these shakeups also stated that performances would be shut

503
00:33:54,402 --> 00:33:59,082
Speaker 2: down while the show retooled. Opening night would be delayed

504
00:33:59,442 --> 00:34:06,282
Speaker 2: a sixth time a sixth time to June fourteenth, twoenty eleven.

505
00:34:07,602 --> 00:34:12,642
Speaker 2: Julie Taymor's replacement was Philip William McKinley, who had directed

506
00:34:12,722 --> 00:34:17,122
Speaker 2: the Hugh Jackman Broadway vehicle The Boy from Oz, as

507
00:34:17,162 --> 00:34:21,842
Speaker 2: well as several actual circuses. As McKinley got to work

508
00:34:21,922 --> 00:34:27,722
Speaker 2: overseeing the changes, preview performances resumed. At this point. It's

509
00:34:27,722 --> 00:34:33,842
Speaker 2: worth noting that most Broadway shows have about thirty preview performances.

510
00:34:34,562 --> 00:34:39,882
Speaker 2: By March twenty eleven, Spider Man had blown well past

511
00:34:40,322 --> 00:34:40,882
Speaker 2: one hundred.

512
00:34:42,242 --> 00:34:45,522
Speaker 6: The risk to upsetting the Apple car is that, you know,

513
00:34:45,562 --> 00:34:47,682
Speaker 6: a whole lot of apples gets filled out of the cart.

514
00:34:47,722 --> 00:34:52,682
Speaker 6: And there were things both anticipated and not anticipated when

515
00:34:53,082 --> 00:34:58,642
Speaker 6: Julie left the building, and so several people who we

516
00:34:58,722 --> 00:35:02,962
Speaker 6: thought would be retained, like Danny Ezralo, the choreographer, ended

517
00:35:03,042 --> 00:35:07,242
Speaker 6: up just remaining banished out in California. And there were

518
00:35:07,362 --> 00:35:10,722
Speaker 6: dancers who, you know, when they were becoming upset that

519
00:35:10,762 --> 00:35:14,682
Speaker 6: the new choreographer was making them learn all these new

520
00:35:14,882 --> 00:35:18,202
Speaker 6: dance moves, which was confusing to the dancers because they

521
00:35:18,402 --> 00:35:21,242
Speaker 6: thought all of this was a script problem, not a

522
00:35:21,522 --> 00:35:24,322
Speaker 6: dancing problem. But a few of the dancers, a couple

523
00:35:24,362 --> 00:35:28,402
Speaker 6: of them, said well bye, goodbye. At this point, the

524
00:35:28,482 --> 00:35:32,842
Speaker 6: show had been running in previews for what like seven months, right,

525
00:35:32,922 --> 00:35:36,562
Speaker 6: and so it wasn't unusual for there to be turnover

526
00:35:36,642 --> 00:35:39,042
Speaker 6: after seven months. It was just unusual that there was

527
00:35:39,842 --> 00:35:42,802
Speaker 6: turnover after seven months for a show that still hadn't opened.

528
00:35:44,442 --> 00:35:47,842
Speaker 2: Dancer Bethany Moore, again, I got a call from my agent,

529
00:35:48,722 --> 00:35:51,802
Speaker 2: and she says, Bethany there's a last minute replacement call

530
00:35:51,882 --> 00:35:52,522
Speaker 2: for Spider Man.

531
00:35:52,962 --> 00:35:55,242
Speaker 4: Can you make it in two hours? And so I

532
00:35:55,282 --> 00:35:56,922
Speaker 4: called my agent back and I was like, I will

533
00:35:56,922 --> 00:36:00,802
Speaker 4: be there in two hours. So I put my hair

534
00:36:00,842 --> 00:36:05,322
Speaker 4: in a messy ponytail, grabbed some shoes, a shirt off

535
00:36:05,322 --> 00:36:08,402
Speaker 4: the floor. Look looking back on it, I looked kind

536
00:36:08,402 --> 00:36:10,802
Speaker 4: of like a rock star. I walk in there and

537
00:36:11,122 --> 00:36:14,162
Speaker 4: Chase Brock is in there, and I love his stuff.

538
00:36:14,602 --> 00:36:18,882
Speaker 4: It's very quirky and actor driven, and so I'm just

539
00:36:18,962 --> 00:36:22,362
Speaker 4: loving this. I feel like I'm doing Thriller and Rup

540
00:36:22,362 --> 00:36:26,762
Speaker 4: Paul's Drag Race in one combination, and I am thrilled.

541
00:36:27,762 --> 00:36:33,042
Speaker 4: I left feeling great. I was like, I didn't book it,

542
00:36:33,082 --> 00:36:35,362
Speaker 4: but I had a great time. This was so much fun.

543
00:36:35,842 --> 00:36:40,042
Speaker 4: My phone rings just hours after leaving, and it's a

544
00:36:40,082 --> 00:36:42,362
Speaker 4: two one two number, and we always have a joke

545
00:36:42,402 --> 00:36:45,842
Speaker 4: if we don't know what two to one two, it's

546
00:36:45,922 --> 00:36:50,082
Speaker 4: Broadway and I answer it and I couldn't feel my face,

547
00:36:50,402 --> 00:36:53,162
Speaker 4: I couldn't feel my hands. And with my agent saying,

548
00:36:53,242 --> 00:36:57,562
Speaker 4: you've got it and you start tomorrow. So I left there,

549
00:36:58,642 --> 00:37:01,162
Speaker 4: went straight to the place where I was working in

550
00:37:01,242 --> 00:37:04,842
Speaker 4: Hill's kitchen, I said, I quit. I I'm on Broadway, Bye, Sorry,

551
00:37:06,242 --> 00:37:08,682
Speaker 4: and wow. We started the next day.

552
00:37:08,802 --> 00:37:12,322
Speaker 2: Bethany Moore was the last performer cast in the lead

553
00:37:12,402 --> 00:37:16,962
Speaker 2: up to the show's actual opening. All the upheaval meant

554
00:37:17,002 --> 00:37:20,282
Speaker 2: that Bethany, who was brand new to the show, and

555
00:37:20,442 --> 00:37:23,402
Speaker 2: the rest of the beleaguered cast who'd been at it

556
00:37:23,442 --> 00:37:28,162
Speaker 2: for months and months, we're now performing version one point zero,

557
00:37:28,722 --> 00:37:33,522
Speaker 2: aka the Julie Taymor version, while rehearsing a very different

558
00:37:33,762 --> 00:37:36,322
Speaker 2: version two point zero. During the day.

559
00:37:37,442 --> 00:37:41,882
Speaker 4: We would learn a new dance in the same song

560
00:37:41,922 --> 00:37:44,402
Speaker 4: that we had been performing at night in our previews,

561
00:37:44,882 --> 00:37:47,562
Speaker 4: so we would have to remember what we rehearsed in

562
00:37:47,602 --> 00:37:50,882
Speaker 4: the morning, not do that at night because it hadn't

563
00:37:50,922 --> 00:37:53,242
Speaker 4: been tecked. But then you had to go back the

564
00:37:53,282 --> 00:37:55,522
Speaker 4: next day and teck the one that you'd done before,

565
00:37:55,562 --> 00:37:57,722
Speaker 4: so you couldn't do the show that you had.

566
00:37:57,602 --> 00:37:58,362
Speaker 2: Done that night.

567
00:37:59,202 --> 00:38:02,042
Speaker 4: We would be backstage and we'd look at each other, like,

568
00:38:02,362 --> 00:38:05,762
Speaker 4: how does it go? What are we doing tonight? If

569
00:38:05,802 --> 00:38:08,842
Speaker 4: you saw a whole where there was a light, you're like,

570
00:38:09,082 --> 00:38:10,642
Speaker 4: that's probably where I should be.

571
00:38:11,402 --> 00:38:14,762
Speaker 2: When they had to hold mid show for technical issues,

572
00:38:14,842 --> 00:38:16,442
Speaker 2: the cast had a little fun.

573
00:38:16,762 --> 00:38:20,602
Speaker 4: It became almost like a game, so our stage manager

574
00:38:21,282 --> 00:38:25,642
Speaker 4: would sometimes put on single Ladies, and everybody we ended

575
00:38:25,682 --> 00:38:28,082
Speaker 4: up having to learn the single eighties dance, or making

576
00:38:28,082 --> 00:38:30,282
Speaker 4: our own version up and doing it in the ridiculous

577
00:38:30,282 --> 00:38:32,562
Speaker 4: costumes that we happened to be wearing at that time.

578
00:38:33,242 --> 00:38:37,402
Speaker 2: And when a flying spider man got stuck dangling over

579
00:38:37,482 --> 00:38:39,162
Speaker 2: the audience's heads.

580
00:38:39,202 --> 00:38:43,082
Speaker 4: He'd pretend to be swimming up there doing the backstroke,

581
00:38:43,602 --> 00:38:46,562
Speaker 4: and he would also wave.

582
00:38:46,322 --> 00:38:46,922
Speaker 6: At the kids.

583
00:38:46,922 --> 00:38:48,282
Speaker 2: Oh, and the kids loved it.

584
00:38:48,522 --> 00:38:50,682
Speaker 4: They just thought that was the coolest thing.

585
00:38:52,002 --> 00:38:58,282
Speaker 2: The budget was now seventy million dollars. Finally, on April seventeenth,

586
00:38:58,482 --> 00:39:03,642
Speaker 2: the company played their last performance of Version one point zero.

587
00:39:03,802 --> 00:39:08,162
Speaker 2: The actors comprising the Geek Chorus promptly lost their jobs,

588
00:39:08,562 --> 00:39:11,762
Speaker 2: and the show shut down once again, so that the

589
00:39:11,842 --> 00:39:15,962
Speaker 2: remaining cast and crew could go back into three weeks

590
00:39:15,962 --> 00:39:20,242
Speaker 2: of tech. In Sunnier News, Chris Tierney, the dancer who

591
00:39:20,242 --> 00:39:25,242
Speaker 2: had been seriously injured after falling, recovered and rejoined the

592
00:39:25,282 --> 00:39:30,442
Speaker 2: company in April. Version two point zero, which began previewing

593
00:39:30,562 --> 00:39:35,282
Speaker 2: in may have its fans and its detractors. A lot

594
00:39:35,322 --> 00:39:40,162
Speaker 2: of director Tamor's stylish flourishes were gone, but the more

595
00:39:40,322 --> 00:39:46,322
Speaker 2: straightforward plot was certainly easier to grasp. Moving the Spider Man,

596
00:39:46,562 --> 00:39:49,842
Speaker 2: Green Goblin Aerials showdown to the end of the show

597
00:39:50,242 --> 00:39:53,122
Speaker 2: instead of the end of Act one made for a

598
00:39:53,282 --> 00:39:58,402
Speaker 2: satisfying climax two, because the general consensus is that the

599
00:39:58,482 --> 00:39:59,762
Speaker 2: scene was a knockout.

600
00:40:00,522 --> 00:40:03,522
Speaker 4: Even when we would be putting somebody in, like an understudy,

601
00:40:03,562 --> 00:40:06,682
Speaker 4: into the Green Goblin fight or something, we would all

602
00:40:06,722 --> 00:40:09,002
Speaker 4: go sit in the audience. All the lights are up,

603
00:40:09,322 --> 00:40:13,482
Speaker 4: nobody's really in costume, and we couldn't get enough. Even

604
00:40:13,522 --> 00:40:15,842
Speaker 4: the cast. We would sit there and watch, like this

605
00:40:16,042 --> 00:40:18,642
Speaker 4: is amazing. You try to record it on your little

606
00:40:18,642 --> 00:40:21,562
Speaker 4: phone and it never captured it. Because I wanted to

607
00:40:21,602 --> 00:40:24,082
Speaker 4: show how cool it was. You just had to be there.

608
00:40:24,402 --> 00:40:28,442
Speaker 4: I don't think anybody can deny that they were not

609
00:40:28,922 --> 00:40:31,482
Speaker 4: in awe of those moments.

610
00:40:32,242 --> 00:40:36,722
Speaker 2: Though the glitches never entirely went away. Turn Off the

611
00:40:36,802 --> 00:40:41,642
Speaker 2: Dark was finally on track to open, but the fact

612
00:40:41,842 --> 00:40:45,842
Speaker 2: that things were starting to go more smoothly didn't turn

613
00:40:46,002 --> 00:40:50,802
Speaker 2: people's attention away. If anything, the mockery intensified.

614
00:40:51,762 --> 00:40:55,802
Speaker 4: I didn't really have time or the capacity to care

615
00:40:56,122 --> 00:40:58,722
Speaker 4: or see what other people were talking about at that point,

616
00:40:59,362 --> 00:41:01,922
Speaker 4: which probably in retrospect, was a good thing.

617
00:41:02,962 --> 00:41:06,682
Speaker 2: Spider Man was ineligible for the twenty eleven Tony A

618
00:41:06,682 --> 00:41:10,242
Speaker 2: Wary Words because it hadn't officially opened, but it was

619
00:41:10,442 --> 00:41:14,562
Speaker 2: used as a punchline throughout the ceremony. Bono and the

620
00:41:14,682 --> 00:41:18,762
Speaker 2: Edge gamely chuckled from the audience while host Neil Patrick

621
00:41:18,842 --> 00:41:22,442
Speaker 2: Harris challenged himself to make all the jokes about their

622
00:41:22,482 --> 00:41:27,242
Speaker 2: show he could in thirty seconds. This included gems such as.

623
00:41:27,562 --> 00:41:29,562
Speaker 5: Spider Man's the only show on Broadway where the actors

624
00:41:29,642 --> 00:41:31,962
Speaker 5: in the cast they're actually in castsoo.

625
00:41:33,042 --> 00:41:36,602
Speaker 2: This was two days before Spider Man's for Real this

626
00:41:36,762 --> 00:41:41,682
Speaker 2: time opening night. Co writer Glenn Berger had barely spoken

627
00:41:41,722 --> 00:41:45,162
Speaker 2: to Julie Taymour after she'd been fired, but she was

628
00:41:45,282 --> 00:41:49,842
Speaker 2: very much on his mind in advance of this momentous occasion,

629
00:41:50,562 --> 00:41:52,642
Speaker 2: which had been years in the making.

630
00:41:53,202 --> 00:41:56,962
Speaker 6: Literally we were about to open. I'm looking at the

631
00:41:57,082 --> 00:42:02,602
Speaker 6: show and everything that I felt was of worth came

632
00:42:02,602 --> 00:42:07,362
Speaker 6: from her. We had been talking for years of about

633
00:42:07,402 --> 00:42:11,762
Speaker 6: what the show was about, and the anthem was rise above,

634
00:42:11,962 --> 00:42:14,522
Speaker 6: you know, and it was about being the better person

635
00:42:14,642 --> 00:42:19,842
Speaker 6: and finding ways to move forward. You can talk about it,

636
00:42:19,842 --> 00:42:22,082
Speaker 6: you can talk about it all the time, but do

637
00:42:22,122 --> 00:42:25,522
Speaker 6: you live it. It's one thing for artists to like, Oh,

638
00:42:25,722 --> 00:42:27,602
Speaker 6: these are nice sentiments and I'm gonna put them in

639
00:42:27,642 --> 00:42:30,202
Speaker 6: a show. But how much of what an artist writes

640
00:42:30,282 --> 00:42:34,202
Speaker 6: do they mean? Do they live? So in that spirit,

641
00:42:34,562 --> 00:42:38,922
Speaker 6: I also hadn't slept in like nine months. I called Julie.

642
00:42:38,962 --> 00:42:43,082
Speaker 6: I knew she wasn't going to pick up. I left

643
00:42:43,082 --> 00:42:46,442
Speaker 6: the message basically saying, look, everything that's good, it's yours,

644
00:42:46,642 --> 00:42:49,282
Speaker 6: and you should come and you should see the show,

645
00:42:49,362 --> 00:42:54,202
Speaker 6: and you should take the bow and accept the plaudits

646
00:42:54,242 --> 00:42:56,562
Speaker 6: that would be coming to you. Because there was a

647
00:42:56,562 --> 00:42:57,162
Speaker 6: lot of work.

648
00:42:57,922 --> 00:43:01,802
Speaker 4: Opening night, it felt a little dream like because everybody's

649
00:43:02,082 --> 00:43:06,242
Speaker 4: energy was buzzy because it was finally happening.

650
00:43:11,922 --> 00:43:15,002
Speaker 2: At the end of the show, late audition director Philip

651
00:43:15,082 --> 00:43:19,082
Speaker 2: McKinley stood on stage giving shout outs to the cast,

652
00:43:19,322 --> 00:43:24,482
Speaker 2: crew and creators before calling Julie Taymor up from the house.

653
00:43:24,882 --> 00:43:28,922
Speaker 2: She received a bouquet of roses and embraced her former

654
00:43:29,002 --> 00:43:35,482
Speaker 2: collaborators with big smiles all around. After a record breaking

655
00:43:35,682 --> 00:43:39,922
Speaker 2: one hundred and eighty three previews, a record breaking final

656
00:43:40,002 --> 00:43:46,642
Speaker 2: budget of seventy five million dollars, notorious injuries, collaborative rifts,

657
00:43:46,722 --> 00:43:51,442
Speaker 2: and numerous delays, Spider Man Turn Off the Dark had

658
00:43:51,482 --> 00:43:58,042
Speaker 2: survived its gauntlet of setbacks and controversies and was finally open.

659
00:43:59,202 --> 00:44:02,762
Speaker 2: The question now, how long would it stick around?

660
00:44:18,082 --> 00:44:22,562
Speaker 1: I saw it well the first act. It was so bizarre,

661
00:44:23,202 --> 00:44:24,362
Speaker 1: weirdest thing I've ever seen.

662
00:44:24,762 --> 00:44:26,162
Speaker 6: I would actually love to see it again.

663
00:44:27,762 --> 00:44:32,082
Speaker 2: Theater fans and columnists speculated that Spider Man Turn Off

664
00:44:32,122 --> 00:44:36,002
Speaker 2: the Dark wouldn't return its massive investment, nor would it

665
00:44:36,122 --> 00:44:40,162
Speaker 2: last through the end of twenty eleven. While it's true

666
00:44:40,322 --> 00:44:44,482
Speaker 2: it never returned its investment, it did remain open on

667
00:44:44,602 --> 00:44:49,162
Speaker 2: Broadway for two and a half more years. In early

668
00:44:49,282 --> 00:44:53,522
Speaker 2: twenty twelve, turn Off the Dark had Broadways all time

669
00:44:53,842 --> 00:44:59,002
Speaker 2: highest grossing week, raking in two point nine million dollars.

670
00:44:59,682 --> 00:45:03,482
Speaker 2: By the time the twenty twelve Tony Awards rolled around,

671
00:45:03,842 --> 00:45:09,322
Speaker 2: the now eligible Spider Man received two nominations, one for

672
00:45:09,602 --> 00:45:14,482
Speaker 2: George Seepen's eye popping forced perspective sets and another for

673
00:45:14,642 --> 00:45:21,642
Speaker 2: Aiko Ishioka's dazzling costumes. Playwright and Broadway performer Eric Uyoa

674
00:45:21,922 --> 00:45:26,562
Speaker 2: remembers what was beautiful about the show vividly, even all

675
00:45:26,642 --> 00:45:27,802
Speaker 2: these years later.

676
00:45:28,922 --> 00:45:32,842
Speaker 7: There was no dearth of great ideas in this show

677
00:45:32,962 --> 00:45:36,562
Speaker 7: that you know, really interesting choreography that mimicked the idea

678
00:45:36,762 --> 00:45:40,242
Speaker 7: of comic books and action sequences. I remember the sets

679
00:45:40,402 --> 00:45:44,122
Speaker 7: were gorgeous. I always think of Spider Man as like

680
00:45:44,242 --> 00:45:48,082
Speaker 7: some incredible giant opera that happened.

681
00:45:48,122 --> 00:45:48,282
Speaker 4: You know.

682
00:45:48,322 --> 00:45:50,642
Speaker 7: Sometimes I can go to an opera and while it

683
00:45:50,682 --> 00:45:53,322
Speaker 7: may not interest me, or it's just much too long

684
00:45:53,402 --> 00:45:56,522
Speaker 7: and I don't maybe understand the language or whatever it is, like,

685
00:45:56,722 --> 00:45:59,202
Speaker 7: I hate can leave and go. But Dan, that was

686
00:45:59,242 --> 00:46:02,242
Speaker 7: pretty to look at. And that's what I can say.

687
00:46:02,282 --> 00:46:04,322
Speaker 7: You know, with Spider Man as that it did always

688
00:46:04,362 --> 00:46:06,802
Speaker 7: look great. You know, the money was there, God knows

689
00:46:06,802 --> 00:46:07,602
Speaker 7: the money was there.

690
00:46:08,362 --> 00:46:12,522
Speaker 2: In early twenty twelve, Spider Man's producers agreed to pay

691
00:46:12,642 --> 00:46:16,802
Speaker 2: Julie Taymor nearly ten thousand dollars a week for her

692
00:46:16,842 --> 00:46:23,002
Speaker 2: contribution as original director. By April twenty thirteen, the remainder

693
00:46:23,122 --> 00:46:27,682
Speaker 2: of the legal disputes were resolved, and, as always happens

694
00:46:27,722 --> 00:46:33,362
Speaker 2: in showbiz, everyone moved on to other projects. Cast member

695
00:46:33,482 --> 00:46:37,002
Speaker 2: Bethany Moore left Spider Man Turn Off the Dark in

696
00:46:37,242 --> 00:46:38,842
Speaker 2: June twenty twelve.

697
00:46:39,122 --> 00:46:42,642
Speaker 4: I left to go do into the Woods in the Park.

698
00:46:43,402 --> 00:46:45,842
Speaker 4: It felt strange to go from Spider Man to.

699
00:46:45,802 --> 00:46:50,402
Speaker 2: Sondhaig Initially, co writer Glenn Berger had no idea what

700
00:46:50,442 --> 00:46:51,522
Speaker 2: would be next for him.

701
00:46:52,002 --> 00:46:55,442
Speaker 6: So I found myself washed ashore, you know, at the

702
00:46:55,522 --> 00:46:58,722
Speaker 6: end of it. And you know, my agent said, Glenn,

703
00:46:58,802 --> 00:47:01,522
Speaker 6: you've been telling me what's been going on for all

704
00:47:01,562 --> 00:47:04,042
Speaker 6: these months and years, and I've been on the edge

705
00:47:04,042 --> 00:47:07,082
Speaker 6: of my seat the whole time. You need to write

706
00:47:07,082 --> 00:47:09,602
Speaker 6: a book. And that was the last thing I wanted

707
00:47:09,602 --> 00:47:12,162
Speaker 6: to do, was write a book. But she was right.

708
00:47:12,202 --> 00:47:14,802
Speaker 6: Someone had to write it, and I was kind of

709
00:47:15,002 --> 00:47:19,802
Speaker 6: the one who was perfectly placed to write it. And

710
00:47:19,882 --> 00:47:21,562
Speaker 6: I'm a writer, so I wrote it.

711
00:47:21,722 --> 00:47:26,882
Speaker 2: Berger's book was published in twenty thirteen. Few can argue

712
00:47:27,042 --> 00:47:31,362
Speaker 2: that the title song of Spider Man, the inside story

713
00:47:31,442 --> 00:47:36,282
Speaker 2: of the most controversial musical in Broadway history, is hyperbolic.

714
00:47:36,722 --> 00:47:42,242
Speaker 6: Everybody ideally should write a memoir about ten years of

715
00:47:42,242 --> 00:47:44,682
Speaker 6: their life. When I was writing the memoir, every day

716
00:47:44,922 --> 00:47:49,922
Speaker 6: I would sit down with my coffee and be very calm,

717
00:47:50,002 --> 00:47:54,042
Speaker 6: and I start writing, and within an hour, I'm shouting

718
00:47:54,042 --> 00:47:56,442
Speaker 6: at the screen. I'm saying, Glenn, don listen to that.

719
00:47:56,482 --> 00:47:59,202
Speaker 6: You have to, you know, And I'm feeling clammy, I'm sweaty,

720
00:47:59,442 --> 00:48:02,802
Speaker 6: I'm agitated, my heart's racing, and at the end of

721
00:48:02,802 --> 00:48:07,402
Speaker 6: the day, I say to myself, tomorrow, don't do that.

722
00:48:08,122 --> 00:48:11,242
Speaker 6: Keep it chill man. What I realized is that I

723
00:48:11,282 --> 00:48:15,002
Speaker 6: hadn't just recorded these memories in my head. I recorded

724
00:48:15,042 --> 00:48:18,682
Speaker 6: them in my body, which is what we do, and

725
00:48:18,762 --> 00:48:20,802
Speaker 6: so I kind of gave into that and just allowed

726
00:48:20,802 --> 00:48:25,762
Speaker 6: myself to purge. It was like a sauna.

727
00:48:25,922 --> 00:48:30,922
Speaker 2: Producer Michael Cole's son, filmmaker Jacob Cole, shot footage of

728
00:48:30,962 --> 00:48:34,562
Speaker 2: the show throughout the lead up to opening night, creating

729
00:48:34,602 --> 00:48:38,802
Speaker 2: a documentary that has yet to be publicly shown. According

730
00:48:38,842 --> 00:48:42,882
Speaker 2: to one unnamed source, it will quote never see the

731
00:48:43,002 --> 00:48:50,002
Speaker 2: light of day. On August fifteenth, twenty thirteen, there was tragically,

732
00:48:50,322 --> 00:48:55,962
Speaker 2: one more major injury during the performance. A hydraulic lift

733
00:48:56,162 --> 00:48:59,962
Speaker 2: was rising from below the stage. It stopped due to

734
00:49:00,122 --> 00:49:04,642
Speaker 2: a blockage. A company member's foot was caught between the

735
00:49:04,762 --> 00:49:09,042
Speaker 2: hydraulic lift and the stage door. The only way to

736
00:49:09,162 --> 00:49:12,842
Speaker 2: free him was to saw out part of the stage.

737
00:49:13,362 --> 00:49:18,002
Speaker 2: The performer later sued the producers for negligence, though the

738
00:49:18,042 --> 00:49:23,442
Speaker 2: producers stated that the injury was due to human error. Eventually,

739
00:49:23,562 --> 00:49:29,362
Speaker 2: OSHA investigated claimed the producers had failed to secure protective

740
00:49:29,562 --> 00:49:36,402
Speaker 2: machine guarding and find them after weeks of declining ticket sales,

741
00:49:36,842 --> 00:49:41,442
Speaker 2: Spider Man Turn Off the Dark closed on January fourth,

742
00:49:41,762 --> 00:49:48,362
Speaker 2: twenty fourteen. The Foxwoods Theater, formerly The Hilton, is now

743
00:49:48,402 --> 00:49:52,802
Speaker 2: called the Lyric and is currently home to another brand

744
00:49:52,962 --> 00:49:58,202
Speaker 2: name star Harry Potter and the Cursed Child. Oh and

745
00:49:58,482 --> 00:50:01,402
Speaker 2: sidebar because of course he's wrapped up in this too.

746
00:50:01,922 --> 00:50:06,922
Speaker 2: Expelled Congressman George Santos once claimed to be a producer

747
00:50:07,282 --> 00:50:11,122
Speaker 2: on the show, As with a number of other things,

748
00:50:11,162 --> 00:50:16,642
Speaker 2: the former congressman has said this is not true. All

749
00:50:16,722 --> 00:50:21,042
Speaker 2: these years later, questions remain about how the Spider Man

750
00:50:21,242 --> 00:50:26,042
Speaker 2: Musical failed to become something more lauded. The fact that

751
00:50:26,202 --> 00:50:30,402
Speaker 2: initial producer Tony Adams died, leaving the show in the

752
00:50:30,442 --> 00:50:35,082
Speaker 2: hands of producers who hadn't much or any experience in

753
00:50:35,162 --> 00:50:39,522
Speaker 2: theater is often mentioned. The lack of an out of

754
00:50:39,642 --> 00:50:44,522
Speaker 2: town tryout surely helped increase the risk from a low

755
00:50:44,602 --> 00:50:48,842
Speaker 2: simmer to a five alarm fire. Given the show's extremely

756
00:50:48,922 --> 00:50:55,482
Speaker 2: ambitious tech. It all seemed possible on paper, but in practice.

757
00:50:55,482 --> 00:50:59,802
Speaker 6: You're told that it'll work, and you're told by engineers

758
00:50:59,842 --> 00:51:03,202
Speaker 6: or whatever, this will be just as good. It will work,

759
00:51:03,282 --> 00:51:08,202
Speaker 6: I mean, like all the ridiculous dysfunction, which at least

760
00:51:08,282 --> 00:51:10,962
Speaker 6: was limited to a musical on Broadway.

761
00:51:11,522 --> 00:51:15,842
Speaker 2: There's also been much speculation about how much leeway Taymor

762
00:51:16,042 --> 00:51:20,482
Speaker 2: got from the producers, how they should perhaps have strong

763
00:51:20,602 --> 00:51:25,042
Speaker 2: armed her into making clearer or more cost effective choices.

764
00:51:25,922 --> 00:51:31,042
Speaker 2: And yet here's Julie Taymour, a certified MacArthur genius at

765
00:51:31,042 --> 00:51:34,362
Speaker 2: the top of her game, someone who has only ever

766
00:51:34,482 --> 00:51:39,482
Speaker 2: gotten praise for being an uncompromising visionary. It's hard to

767
00:51:39,682 --> 00:51:46,362
Speaker 2: believe she was ever apt to compromise. Early on, Tamor

768
00:51:46,482 --> 00:51:49,802
Speaker 2: had had the instinct that the show shouldn't be done

769
00:51:49,922 --> 00:51:53,242
Speaker 2: in a Broadway theater at all, but more of an

770
00:51:53,242 --> 00:51:59,122
Speaker 2: arena with circus performers and acrobats. Throughout the process, She'd

771
00:51:59,162 --> 00:52:03,162
Speaker 2: even told those involved with the show quote, let's not

772
00:52:03,282 --> 00:52:06,722
Speaker 2: even call it a musical, it's a circus rock and

773
00:52:06,802 --> 00:52:11,242
Speaker 2: ry drama. Perhaps taking it out of the Broadway frame

774
00:52:11,322 --> 00:52:13,322
Speaker 2: would have made more sense, after.

775
00:52:13,122 --> 00:52:16,602
Speaker 7: All, wouldn't that be great Spider Man arena tour featuring

776
00:52:16,642 --> 00:52:19,562
Speaker 7: songs from You two written directly for that arena tour.

777
00:52:20,002 --> 00:52:24,002
Speaker 2: The setbacks, the injuries, the shod in freud. One journalist

778
00:52:24,162 --> 00:52:28,882
Speaker 2: called it spiden freud of going after the big brand name,

779
00:52:29,082 --> 00:52:33,282
Speaker 2: the big rock stars, the big theater auteur, the glee

780
00:52:33,322 --> 00:52:37,762
Speaker 2: of watching them all no pun intended fall. All of

781
00:52:37,802 --> 00:52:42,202
Speaker 2: that is, of course compelling, but it doesn't reflect those

782
00:52:42,282 --> 00:52:45,962
Speaker 2: behind the scenes who did excellent work. Nor does it

783
00:52:46,042 --> 00:52:50,322
Speaker 2: reflect the people in the cast, those Broadway troopers who

784
00:52:50,362 --> 00:52:55,002
Speaker 2: were far less famous and well compensated than Bono or

785
00:52:55,082 --> 00:53:00,162
Speaker 2: the Edge or Tamor. Long after the creatives left the building,

786
00:53:00,762 --> 00:53:05,762
Speaker 2: the cast had to continue actually doing the show night

787
00:53:05,882 --> 00:53:10,362
Speaker 2: after night, directly in the glare of the spotlight, and

788
00:53:10,442 --> 00:53:14,882
Speaker 2: yet not ever really spotlet during the long, uphill battle

789
00:53:15,282 --> 00:53:19,162
Speaker 2: to get Spider Man across the finish line. Maybe the

790
00:53:19,162 --> 00:53:22,802
Speaker 2: biggest question in all of this is how did they

791
00:53:23,042 --> 00:53:23,802
Speaker 2: get through it?

792
00:53:24,682 --> 00:53:27,402
Speaker 4: I think the biggest lesson that I learned from Spider

793
00:53:27,442 --> 00:53:32,602
Speaker 4: Man was learning to love, like, actually love a project,

794
00:53:33,162 --> 00:53:37,202
Speaker 4: even if you aren't the biggest fan of the musical.

795
00:53:37,242 --> 00:53:40,282
Speaker 4: And this is going to happen several times during a career.

796
00:53:40,282 --> 00:53:43,482
Speaker 4: If you're lucky enough to book enough musicals, You're not

797
00:53:43,762 --> 00:53:48,322
Speaker 4: always going to love the show, but you have to

798
00:53:48,642 --> 00:53:52,042
Speaker 4: love what you do as a part of that show.

799
00:53:52,722 --> 00:53:55,082
Speaker 4: And put on my Spider Man sweatshirt and my hoodie

800
00:53:55,082 --> 00:53:57,922
Speaker 4: over my head, and I'd walk up the stairs around

801
00:53:57,922 --> 00:54:02,682
Speaker 4: half hour and I would see all the kids coming

802
00:54:02,682 --> 00:54:06,482
Speaker 4: in in their little Spider Man t shirts or full costumes,

803
00:54:06,602 --> 00:54:09,162
Speaker 4: and I would hear this little girl in a Spider

804
00:54:09,202 --> 00:54:12,642
Speaker 4: Man two too, like Santo got me these tickets six

805
00:54:12,802 --> 00:54:17,042
Speaker 4: months ago. When I'd finally hear, I'm like, oh man,

806
00:54:17,282 --> 00:54:21,722
Speaker 4: we do something really awesome. It's magic to them, and

807
00:54:21,922 --> 00:54:23,882
Speaker 4: we get to be a part of that magic.

808
00:54:25,242 --> 00:54:30,002
Speaker 2: Not every Broadway show will become an unqualified artistic or

809
00:54:30,082 --> 00:54:35,082
Speaker 2: commercial success. In fact, the truth is very few ever are.

810
00:54:35,842 --> 00:54:40,322
Speaker 2: No show is guaranteed a lengthy run, nor are Broadway

811
00:54:40,362 --> 00:54:45,002
Speaker 2: theater investors ever guaranteed anything close to a return on

812
00:54:45,042 --> 00:54:49,362
Speaker 2: their investment. Certainly, no musical is going to appeal to

813
00:54:49,602 --> 00:54:54,562
Speaker 2: every fan of musicals, nor even less likely, every critic.

814
00:54:55,362 --> 00:54:59,402
Speaker 2: But you never know what's going to connect with someone watching,

815
00:55:00,002 --> 00:55:05,122
Speaker 2: what's going to influence the next generation, what moment of

816
00:55:05,282 --> 00:55:10,322
Speaker 2: live stage magic might inspire someone out there to attempt

817
00:55:10,442 --> 00:55:17,122
Speaker 2: that uniquely perilous high wire act. The art of making theater.

818
00:55:22,722 --> 00:55:23,082
Speaker 1: All right?

819
00:55:23,242 --> 00:55:26,242
Speaker 5: Great story lived up to the high one thousand percent, Saron,

820
00:55:26,322 --> 00:55:28,442
Speaker 5: I know you're going to cast this. Before you do,

821
00:55:28,682 --> 00:55:31,442
Speaker 5: I just I don't want the movie version of this.

822
00:55:31,562 --> 00:55:35,122
Speaker 5: I do want that unauthorized documentary that they talked about

823
00:55:35,402 --> 00:55:38,042
Speaker 5: might exist. I definitely want to see that. I just

824
00:55:38,082 --> 00:55:40,402
Speaker 5: want to see this show. Can we get the people?

825
00:55:40,802 --> 00:55:44,762
Speaker 5: This could be a huge thing. They would to gather

826
00:55:44,882 --> 00:55:48,602
Speaker 5: these people. Put this on again. Everything they're remaking everything,

827
00:55:49,122 --> 00:55:49,762
Speaker 5: remake this.

828
00:55:49,882 --> 00:55:52,762
Speaker 2: They're still on Broadway. Let's get Reeve Carney back. What's

829
00:55:52,762 --> 00:55:53,322
Speaker 2: you working on?

830
00:55:53,602 --> 00:55:55,762
Speaker 1: I also would like to see like a cubist version

831
00:55:55,762 --> 00:55:58,042
Speaker 1: of like all the various bootleg cameras and all the

832
00:55:58,122 --> 00:56:00,202
Speaker 1: videos there are and stitch those together.

833
00:56:03,562 --> 00:56:04,362
Speaker 5: All right, go for it?

834
00:56:04,482 --> 00:56:06,642
Speaker 1: Casting? What do you got before? Are you casting?

835
00:56:07,002 --> 00:56:07,282
Speaker 5: Also?

836
00:56:07,322 --> 00:56:10,162
Speaker 1: I coined a word with this show? All right? So

837
00:56:10,202 --> 00:56:12,522
Speaker 1: the Spider Man Show inspired me because I was like

838
00:56:12,522 --> 00:56:14,682
Speaker 1: trying to describe something about a scene to myself and

839
00:56:14,722 --> 00:56:16,282
Speaker 1: I was like, well, then all the Spider Man And

840
00:56:16,282 --> 00:56:18,082
Speaker 1: I was like, wait, spider Man, is that the plural

841
00:56:18,322 --> 00:56:20,442
Speaker 1: for multiple Spider Man? And I started thinking about, you

842
00:56:20,482 --> 00:56:23,122
Speaker 1: know the collective nouns for animals. Right, there's like a

843
00:56:23,202 --> 00:56:26,922
Speaker 1: murder of crows, a crash of rhinos, a bloat of hippos, right,

844
00:56:26,922 --> 00:56:28,922
Speaker 1: So I was like, what would be the collective noun

845
00:56:29,282 --> 00:56:31,682
Speaker 1: for a group of Spider Man. So I came up

846
00:56:31,722 --> 00:56:33,402
Speaker 1: with an amazement of Spider Man.

847
00:56:33,642 --> 00:56:37,802
Speaker 2: An amazement of Spider Man. That's claps to Seren.

848
00:56:37,802 --> 00:56:39,722
Speaker 1: That's why I thought it worked right. But my best friend,

849
00:56:39,722 --> 00:56:41,242
Speaker 1: he was a huge Spiderman fan, so I had to

850
00:56:41,282 --> 00:56:42,682
Speaker 1: kind of a running headstart on this one.

851
00:56:42,762 --> 00:56:45,642
Speaker 5: That's good. It wasn't James Lipton, the one who coined

852
00:56:45,642 --> 00:56:48,042
Speaker 5: a lot of those or helped on Earth a lot

853
00:56:48,042 --> 00:56:49,922
Speaker 5: of those collective believe.

854
00:56:49,682 --> 00:56:51,322
Speaker 1: That's the story. But I don't know that could be

855
00:56:51,362 --> 00:56:53,842
Speaker 1: an episode. Did you guys have any very special characters?

856
00:56:54,122 --> 00:56:57,242
Speaker 2: You know, I respect Julie taymor is just vision. I

857
00:56:57,282 --> 00:57:01,322
Speaker 2: love someone doing something big and new in theater. Look,

858
00:57:01,482 --> 00:57:04,242
Speaker 2: if you're going to take a familiar property and you're

859
00:57:04,282 --> 00:57:07,962
Speaker 2: going to bring it into a new arena, make it

860
00:57:08,042 --> 00:57:10,762
Speaker 2: pun intended a big swing, and so I respect Julie

861
00:57:10,762 --> 00:57:12,202
Speaker 2: Taymore for her vision.

862
00:57:12,562 --> 00:57:15,642
Speaker 5: Absolutely. No, you know, we had some fun. I don't

863
00:57:15,642 --> 00:57:18,802
Speaker 5: think there's any way not to with this story. But

864
00:57:19,362 --> 00:57:23,082
Speaker 5: those people all put a huge amount of time and

865
00:57:23,202 --> 00:57:27,962
Speaker 5: thought and talent into this, And when something is going badly,

866
00:57:28,682 --> 00:57:32,682
Speaker 5: Glenn kind of explains, like that first time they realize that,

867
00:57:32,802 --> 00:57:35,402
Speaker 5: Oh Jude, I hope this doesn't get outside the theater,

868
00:57:35,562 --> 00:57:40,522
Speaker 5: and that is just such a terrifying human moment. It

869
00:57:40,602 --> 00:57:44,122
Speaker 5: definitely felt for him and Julie and everyone involved.

870
00:57:44,202 --> 00:57:47,522
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, completely. I think my very special character has

871
00:57:47,562 --> 00:57:51,322
Speaker 1: to be former Congressman George Santos, who once claimed to

872
00:57:51,322 --> 00:57:53,482
Speaker 1: be a producer of the Spider Man Show.

873
00:57:53,642 --> 00:57:57,522
Speaker 5: So yeah, yeah, he should bring it back.

874
00:57:57,642 --> 00:58:00,122
Speaker 1: He really should, you know, he should take he should

875
00:58:00,122 --> 00:58:02,322
Speaker 1: go to Broadway. I think really he's missed his mark.

876
00:58:02,682 --> 00:58:05,042
Speaker 1: Now you ask about casting, Okay, I thought about this

877
00:58:05,082 --> 00:58:07,162
Speaker 1: one and it was pretty straightforward, right, So I gave

878
00:58:07,162 --> 00:58:09,122
Speaker 1: myself only one rule, which was I was trying to

879
00:58:09,162 --> 00:58:12,082
Speaker 1: cast the fallen Spider Man, you know, the Chris Tianny,

880
00:58:12,442 --> 00:58:15,202
Speaker 1: the dancer. I excluded all the cinematic Spider Man, and

881
00:58:15,242 --> 00:58:19,002
Speaker 1: so I went with Donald Glover, who's technically like kind

882
00:58:19,002 --> 00:58:20,322
Speaker 1: of on the edge of Spider Man. I think he's

883
00:58:20,322 --> 00:58:22,402
Speaker 1: played him, but he hasn't played him in person. So

884
00:58:22,842 --> 00:58:27,442
Speaker 1: Donald Glover, Now Julie Tamoor, I thought Jessica Chestin.

885
00:58:28,522 --> 00:58:31,042
Speaker 2: I swear to god, I also think I was also

886
00:58:31,082 --> 00:58:32,322
Speaker 2: thinking Jessica Chestin to.

887
00:58:32,282 --> 00:58:34,562
Speaker 1: See she's had the same vibe, right, Okay, then so

888
00:58:34,682 --> 00:58:38,282
Speaker 1: for Bono, I thought Ben Stiller, but if he's not available,

889
00:58:38,482 --> 00:58:39,842
Speaker 1: Kate Blanchett perfect.

890
00:58:39,882 --> 00:58:42,402
Speaker 2: She can do anything, honestly, she could also be Tamed.

891
00:58:42,642 --> 00:58:43,642
Speaker 1: She could play both, and.

892
00:58:44,002 --> 00:58:47,722
Speaker 2: She could also be Spider. She could be Reeve Carney Goblins.

893
00:58:48,122 --> 00:58:50,842
Speaker 1: Just now, for the Edge, I thought Paul Rudd, just

894
00:58:50,882 --> 00:58:54,202
Speaker 1: in a surprising, you know, deeply character driven role. And

895
00:58:54,242 --> 00:58:59,242
Speaker 1: then for the journalist Michael Ridle, I would pick possibly.

896
00:59:00,082 --> 00:59:01,322
Speaker 2: Oh what about Nathan Lane.

897
00:59:01,482 --> 00:59:03,962
Speaker 1: Nathan Lane would be great. Oh my god, but he

898
00:59:04,042 --> 00:59:06,442
Speaker 1: has had such Broadway energy. I mean it was almost

899
00:59:06,482 --> 00:59:07,442
Speaker 1: almost too small of.

900
00:59:07,402 --> 00:59:08,202
Speaker 5: A part for him.

901
00:59:08,402 --> 00:59:08,882
Speaker 3: Yeah.

902
00:59:09,202 --> 00:59:10,922
Speaker 2: Oh, so how.

903
00:59:10,882 --> 00:59:12,122
Speaker 1: About Matthew Brodericks.

904
00:59:12,202 --> 00:59:15,122
Speaker 2: Just keep it Broadway, I mean, keep it Broadway Broderick

905
00:59:15,122 --> 00:59:15,602
Speaker 2: can play it.

906
00:59:15,842 --> 00:59:18,642
Speaker 1: Yeah, totally. So there you go. There's my casting.

907
00:59:18,722 --> 00:59:22,322
Speaker 5: Did you have a Glenn Berger, the guy who wrote

908
00:59:22,362 --> 00:59:22,682
Speaker 5: the book.

909
00:59:22,802 --> 00:59:24,842
Speaker 1: I thought Glen Burger should play Glenn Burger. He was

910
00:59:24,882 --> 00:59:27,002
Speaker 1: so good as himself. He's the one. Like it's like

911
00:59:27,082 --> 00:59:29,802
Speaker 1: Jackie Robinson has to play Jackie Robinson in the movie.

912
00:59:29,922 --> 00:59:31,442
Speaker 1: Glenn Burger plays Glenn Berger.

913
00:59:31,882 --> 00:59:33,762
Speaker 2: I think I'm Mike Glenn Burger. I was picturing like

914
00:59:33,762 --> 00:59:36,322
Speaker 2: a Bill hatern Bill Hater with glasses, you know, when

915
00:59:36,362 --> 00:59:37,522
Speaker 2: Bill Hater wears glasses.

916
00:59:38,282 --> 00:59:41,082
Speaker 5: I like that call though, Yeah, did anyone have any

917
00:59:41,202 --> 00:59:43,362
Speaker 5: other tangent on a run through?

918
00:59:44,162 --> 00:59:47,802
Speaker 1: I did have one thing, which was I tried to imagine, like,

919
00:59:47,842 --> 00:59:50,442
Speaker 1: you know, you're this theater kid. You want to go

920
00:59:50,482 --> 00:59:55,202
Speaker 1: to Broadway, right, You've always dreamed of like being on Broadway.

921
00:59:55,242 --> 00:59:57,522
Speaker 1: You're this dancer. Then eventually you get there, right, and

922
00:59:57,562 --> 01:00:00,322
Speaker 1: then what happens? Some tech comes up to you and

923
01:00:00,362 --> 01:00:02,522
Speaker 1: it's like, hey, hey, you know those cameras they got

924
01:00:02,522 --> 01:00:04,482
Speaker 1: these days that fly over the football field and they

925
01:00:04,482 --> 01:00:06,762
Speaker 1: got all those cables and motors like you. They guys like, yeah,

926
01:00:06,962 --> 01:00:08,922
Speaker 1: what if we did that with you? And the guy's like,

927
01:00:08,962 --> 01:00:10,842
Speaker 1: what do you mean? Like that's our plan? You're gonna

928
01:00:10,882 --> 01:00:12,562
Speaker 1: love it? Like this is you get the Broadway. And

929
01:00:12,562 --> 01:00:14,522
Speaker 1: then if it's not that, then you like, let's say

930
01:00:14,522 --> 01:00:16,802
Speaker 1: you're one of the dancers who falls, right, So then yeah,

931
01:00:16,842 --> 01:00:18,962
Speaker 1: you're worried you're gonna be buried and just in a

932
01:00:19,002 --> 01:00:21,082
Speaker 1: Spider Man costume because they can't get it off your

933
01:00:21,082 --> 01:00:23,242
Speaker 1: body because the bones or whatever. It's just like a

934
01:00:23,242 --> 01:00:25,802
Speaker 1: tragic scene. I'm like, these poor dancers, they had a

935
01:00:25,882 --> 01:00:27,202
Speaker 1: dream and then it turned into this.

936
01:00:27,762 --> 01:00:32,682
Speaker 5: I did like listening to the dancer Bethany explaining what

937
01:00:32,722 --> 01:00:36,482
Speaker 5: it was like totally the audition call, Like, even in

938
01:00:36,522 --> 01:00:40,082
Speaker 5: the midst of the bad headlines, this was the biggest

939
01:00:40,122 --> 01:00:42,322
Speaker 5: thing on Broadway. Of course you take that call.

940
01:00:42,602 --> 01:00:45,042
Speaker 2: Oh, I would do it today if they were like Dane,

941
01:00:45,122 --> 01:00:47,202
Speaker 2: We're doing a revival of Spider Man Turned off the Drug?

942
01:00:47,322 --> 01:00:49,442
Speaker 2: Do you want to audition? Is a dancer? I don't

943
01:00:49,442 --> 01:00:51,082
Speaker 2: even know how to dance, And I'm like, I am

944
01:00:51,162 --> 01:00:55,642
Speaker 2: in that room that show. I'll be a Rackney in

945
01:00:55,682 --> 01:00:56,522
Speaker 2: the first version.

946
01:00:56,562 --> 01:00:59,122
Speaker 1: Do it do all the shoes totally less dancing.

947
01:00:59,562 --> 01:01:01,322
Speaker 2: Yeah. Do you know what I kind of wish I

948
01:01:01,402 --> 01:01:03,722
Speaker 2: kind of wish we could have gotten Julie Taymoor's fully

949
01:01:03,842 --> 01:01:07,922
Speaker 2: unadulterated circus vision, like taking place in like a crazy

950
01:01:08,282 --> 01:01:09,482
Speaker 2: site specific tent.

951
01:01:09,802 --> 01:01:10,082
Speaker 1: Yeah.

952
01:01:10,122 --> 01:01:11,082
Speaker 2: I think that would have been great.

953
01:01:11,162 --> 01:01:13,562
Speaker 1: Also, I was thinking about when they're having all their difficulties,

954
01:01:13,602 --> 01:01:16,202
Speaker 1: you know that people like in Vegas and Circuslay were like,

955
01:01:16,322 --> 01:01:18,642
Speaker 1: call me, I can help you with this, Like we

956
01:01:18,722 --> 01:01:19,682
Speaker 1: do this all the time.

957
01:01:19,842 --> 01:01:20,682
Speaker 5: This is what we do.

958
01:01:21,082 --> 01:01:22,362
Speaker 1: Yeah, call us.

959
01:01:22,442 --> 01:01:24,202
Speaker 5: None of us saw this show, But have either of

960
01:01:24,242 --> 01:01:27,722
Speaker 5: you ever seen anything insane happen in live theater?

961
01:01:27,962 --> 01:01:30,242
Speaker 1: I've never seen like an actor get arrested on stage

962
01:01:30,322 --> 01:01:33,202
Speaker 1: or anything that wild. But like, I've seen the audience

963
01:01:33,242 --> 01:01:36,642
Speaker 1: do some wild stuff, like you know, really poorly behaving

964
01:01:36,682 --> 01:01:38,642
Speaker 1: audience members, not just like you know, way past answering

965
01:01:38,682 --> 01:01:40,842
Speaker 1: a phone call, like getting in a food fight with

966
01:01:40,922 --> 01:01:42,882
Speaker 1: like you know, with the drinks that they should not

967
01:01:42,962 --> 01:01:44,002
Speaker 1: even have in the theater.

968
01:01:44,122 --> 01:01:44,282
Speaker 3: You know.

969
01:01:44,522 --> 01:01:47,322
Speaker 1: So I've seen that, but it doesn't feel like that's

970
01:01:47,362 --> 01:01:49,642
Speaker 1: not the actors. I feel like I'm associating.

971
01:01:49,722 --> 01:01:51,762
Speaker 2: All right, you want to hear my crazy story?

972
01:01:51,882 --> 01:01:53,482
Speaker 1: Yes, have you seen?

973
01:01:53,522 --> 01:01:56,282
Speaker 2: Did you end up seeing The Music Man with Sutton

974
01:01:56,282 --> 01:01:59,402
Speaker 2: Foster and Hugh Jackman two times? So here's the thing,

975
01:01:59,402 --> 01:02:01,762
Speaker 2: and you'll know there's a scene in that and you're like,

976
01:02:01,882 --> 01:02:05,442
Speaker 2: star power, Hugh Jackman, Son Foster, what charisma. There's a

977
01:02:05,442 --> 01:02:07,402
Speaker 2: scene I think in the second act, and it's sort

978
01:02:07,402 --> 01:02:10,722
Speaker 2: of a slow scene where he pushes her or she

979
01:02:10,762 --> 01:02:14,562
Speaker 2: pushes him, and they break like they make the joke

980
01:02:14,602 --> 01:02:16,562
Speaker 2: that like she pushed him a little too hard, and

981
01:02:16,562 --> 01:02:18,802
Speaker 2: then Hugh Jackman sort of steps out a character and

982
01:02:18,882 --> 01:02:22,362
Speaker 2: is like, ah, what's that thing? You're like, Oh, that's

983
01:02:22,362 --> 01:02:25,402
Speaker 2: so charming. We get this like winning movie star moment.

984
01:02:25,442 --> 01:02:28,402
Speaker 2: How casual we got the show where they broke. They

985
01:02:28,442 --> 01:02:32,522
Speaker 2: do that every single show. They build in in the

986
01:02:32,562 --> 01:02:37,002
Speaker 2: rehearsals of the show. They built in a moment to

987
01:02:37,242 --> 01:02:41,322
Speaker 2: break specifically, so it feels special and intimate for the audience.

988
01:02:41,682 --> 01:02:43,802
Speaker 5: The first time I saw it it was so endearing,

989
01:02:44,082 --> 01:02:47,442
Speaker 5: and then, like I said, I saw it twice thought, Ah,

990
01:02:47,602 --> 01:02:49,162
Speaker 5: these they're just really good.

991
01:02:48,962 --> 01:02:52,162
Speaker 1: Actors, brilliant. That is so amazing.

992
01:02:52,402 --> 01:02:54,962
Speaker 2: They're such good acting. He truly is the greatest showman.

993
01:02:55,402 --> 01:02:56,482
Speaker 1: I can totally see that.

994
01:02:56,482 --> 01:03:00,522
Speaker 5: That says it all. On another high flying adventure here

995
01:03:00,602 --> 01:03:04,562
Speaker 5: on the Very Special Episodes podcast. We'll be back next week.

996
01:03:04,642 --> 01:03:05,362
Speaker 2: See you next week.

997
01:03:06,362 --> 01:03:09,682
Speaker 5: Very Special Episodes is made by some very special people.

998
01:03:10,362 --> 01:03:14,362
Speaker 5: This episode was written by Joe Kenosian Broadway Joe. We

999
01:03:14,402 --> 01:03:17,522
Speaker 5: call him more on him in a Moment. Our producer

1000
01:03:17,602 --> 01:03:22,042
Speaker 5: is Josh Fisher. Editing and sound design by Chris Childs.

1001
01:03:22,282 --> 01:03:27,282
Speaker 5: Additional editing by Emily Meredof. Story editors are Josh Fisher

1002
01:03:27,602 --> 01:03:32,202
Speaker 5: and Marissa Brown. Mixing and mastering by Beheid Fraser. Original

1003
01:03:32,282 --> 01:03:36,162
Speaker 5: music by Elise McCoy, Research in fact checking by Austin

1004
01:03:36,202 --> 01:03:40,802
Speaker 5: Thompson and Joe Kenosian. Show logo by Lucy Kintonia Very

1005
01:03:40,842 --> 01:03:44,562
Speaker 5: Special Episodes is hosted by Danish Schwartz, Zaren Burnett, and

1006
01:03:44,682 --> 01:03:48,082
Speaker 5: me Jason English. I am your executive producer and we'll

1007
01:03:48,122 --> 01:03:51,522
Speaker 5: see you back here next Wednesday. If you like today's episode,

1008
01:03:51,722 --> 01:03:54,082
Speaker 5: go check out a show called Let's Start a Coup

1009
01:03:54,282 --> 01:03:58,242
Speaker 5: the plot against FDR. That was a six episode series

1010
01:03:58,402 --> 01:04:01,522
Speaker 5: co written and co hosted by Joe Kenosian, who wrote

1011
01:04:01,522 --> 01:04:05,602
Speaker 5: today's story. Lots of character voices. It feels like a play.

1012
01:04:05,882 --> 01:04:08,962
Speaker 5: We ever take that to our first call is the Edge.

1013
01:04:09,282 --> 01:04:12,642
Speaker 5: Very Special Episodes is the production of iHeart Podcasts.