WEBVTT - Here's One Big Reason Tesla Still Doesn't Dominate Our Roads 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:02.200 A couple of months ago, we asked you guys to 0:00:02.240 --> 0:00:04.200 get in touch and tell us what you think about 0:00:04.200 --> 0:00:07.320 one of the buzziest tech companies around. We wanted to 0:00:07.360 --> 0:00:13.360 hear from owners as well as potential buyers. I've had 0:00:13.360 --> 0:00:16.520 my Tesla Model lest for three years. It's the best 0:00:16.560 --> 0:00:19.320 car I've ever owned. I definitely want to get a Tesla. 0:00:19.400 --> 0:00:21.520 I've always wanted one. I think they are beautiful cars. 0:00:21.560 --> 0:00:25.080 I love the Tesla models. I like the smooth ride, 0:00:25.320 --> 0:00:30.920 the great NAV system, the Internet radio, the connected car. 0:00:31.800 --> 0:00:34.479 We got a lot of that. By the way, Tesla owners, 0:00:34.720 --> 0:00:37.320 we can tell you love your cars. And for those 0:00:37.360 --> 0:00:40.280 of you who don't have a Tesla yet, one concern 0:00:40.360 --> 0:00:42.960 stood out. I called up one of our listeners to 0:00:43.000 --> 0:00:46.960 get a better picture. My name is Ramon Old. I 0:00:47.000 --> 0:00:50.600 am a business seannlists living in southern California. Ramon works 0:00:50.640 --> 0:00:54.000 at California State University in Long Beach. He and his 0:00:54.080 --> 0:00:56.600 girlfriend like driving out of the city into the desert 0:00:56.600 --> 0:01:00.240 near Joshua Tree. We go usually two or three times 0:01:00.280 --> 0:01:04.240 per year, two different medeor showers. So now Ramond drives 0:01:04.240 --> 0:01:06.640 a Honda Element he brought in two thousand and seven, 0:01:06.920 --> 0:01:10.000 but he dreams of owning a Tesla. The Tesla brand 0:01:10.600 --> 0:01:13.840 is synonymous with cool for me, particularly just because I 0:01:13.840 --> 0:01:17.560 admire Elon Musk so much and SpaceX and obviously, you know, 0:01:17.640 --> 0:01:20.199 talking about the media showers earlier. Space exploration is something 0:01:20.240 --> 0:01:23.160 that is absolutely fascinating to both me and my partner. 0:01:24.000 --> 0:01:27.640 At a starting price of thirty five thousand dollars, the 0:01:27.720 --> 0:01:30.520 Model three, the first of which just came off the 0:01:30.560 --> 0:01:35.120 assembly line this summer, is Tesla's most affordable car, and 0:01:35.200 --> 0:01:38.240 Ramont thinks he can afford it, but he has one 0:01:38.480 --> 0:01:42.920 last worry that's keeping him from pulling the trigger. I 0:01:43.000 --> 0:01:46.920 don't believe that any of the four or five weekend 0:01:47.000 --> 0:01:49.120 vacations that we've taken in the last twelve months and 0:01:49.200 --> 0:02:03.400 I saw any charging station. Hi em Akito and I'm Pagakari, 0:02:03.760 --> 0:02:07.320 and this week Undecrypted, we're going deep into the world 0:02:07.360 --> 0:02:12.240 of electric cars and asking why, despite tremendous advances and 0:02:12.360 --> 0:02:16.480 much hype, they still haven't gone mainstream. In the US, 0:02:16.600 --> 0:02:20.160 electric vehicles still make up only one percent of new 0:02:20.200 --> 0:02:24.480 car sales. What could finally change that is an ambitious 0:02:24.600 --> 0:02:28.720 and expensive plan that's already underway, funded by Tesla and 0:02:28.760 --> 0:02:32.280 a handful of other companies to build charging stations along 0:02:32.320 --> 0:02:36.000 America's highways, kind of like new gas stations for the 0:02:36.040 --> 0:02:39.440 electric age, so that drivers like Ramont never have to 0:02:39.520 --> 0:02:42.160 worry about running out of battery on a road trip. 0:02:42.600 --> 0:02:47.120 Tesla just announced that it's expanding its network of superchargers 0:02:47.200 --> 0:02:50.360 to not just highways and destinations, but to the center 0:02:50.480 --> 0:02:54.800 of cities like Boston and Chicago. But will more charging 0:02:54.840 --> 0:02:57.960 points be enough to convince drivers all over the world 0:02:58.040 --> 0:03:01.840 to finally make the leap to drip cars? And what 0:03:01.960 --> 0:03:06.040 happens to companies like Tesla if after investing millions of 0:03:06.080 --> 0:03:09.640 dollars on this infrastructure, they don't sell enough cars to 0:03:09.720 --> 0:03:19.800 make up for that investment. Stay with us, all right, 0:03:22.880 --> 0:03:30.200 yea until Antony. After literally years of waiting, Elon Musk 0:03:30.240 --> 0:03:34.480 got on stage at Tesla's headquarters in Fremont, California. He 0:03:34.560 --> 0:03:43.560 unveiled the Model three card. All right, everyone, people in 0:03:43.600 --> 0:03:46.960 the audience are the people that have designed and engineered 0:03:47.040 --> 0:03:53.480 and built the Model three. It was a big milestone 0:03:53.520 --> 0:03:57.120 for Tesla. Elon says, nearly five hundred thousand people have 0:03:57.240 --> 0:04:00.400 reserved a Tesla Model three and because it's so much 0:04:00.480 --> 0:04:04.160 cheaper than Tesla's Model s and Model X cars. It's 0:04:04.160 --> 0:04:06.800 been viewed as a potential tipping point for the entire 0:04:06.880 --> 0:04:10.560 electric car market. Then, while he was on stage, Elon 0:04:10.680 --> 0:04:13.600 must took a moment to mention by the end of 0:04:13.680 --> 0:04:16.320 next year, there will be three times as many super 0:04:16.360 --> 0:04:19.040 charges as there are today. That should really help out 0:04:19.040 --> 0:04:23.640 a lot. Superchargers are the facilities that Tesla has built 0:04:23.720 --> 0:04:27.000 around the country so people on long drives don't run 0:04:27.000 --> 0:04:29.840 out of power in the middle. They charge your car 0:04:29.960 --> 0:04:33.160 in as little as half an hour, much more quickly 0:04:33.200 --> 0:04:35.200 than the kind of plugs you'd have at home or 0:04:35.240 --> 0:04:37.840 at work. That's so you don't have to wait around 0:04:37.839 --> 0:04:40.640 all day at the electric equivalent of a gas station. 0:04:41.680 --> 0:04:45.000 And Elon might sound relaxed, but the need to charge 0:04:45.080 --> 0:04:48.360 up mid drive is an existential issue for the electric 0:04:48.360 --> 0:04:51.840 car industry. It's super significant and I'll tell you why 0:04:51.880 --> 0:04:56.640 it's it's um in our opinion, it's the last barrier 0:04:56.760 --> 0:05:02.360 to sales for the general consumer. That's Pat Romano. He's 0:05:02.400 --> 0:05:07.160 the CEO of a company called charge Point. Most people 0:05:07.160 --> 0:05:09.080 don't want to worry about that. They just want to 0:05:09.080 --> 0:05:11.760 know that when they're driving along and their batteries getting low, 0:05:12.240 --> 0:05:13.839 that if they look to the left and look to 0:05:13.839 --> 0:05:15.839 the right on the highway. Over the next five or 0:05:15.839 --> 0:05:18.719 six miles, they can see something that looks like a 0:05:18.760 --> 0:05:20.520 place that they can go and get a fast charge. 0:05:21.839 --> 0:05:25.440 So if that's the general consumer sentiment, and there's nothing 0:05:25.440 --> 0:05:27.680 wrong with that sentiment, by the way, because your car 0:05:27.800 --> 0:05:30.960 should be something that is serving you and not not 0:05:31.120 --> 0:05:34.280 the reverse. Um, what we have to do is we 0:05:34.320 --> 0:05:39.400 have to focus on planned build out of appropriate sites 0:05:39.440 --> 0:05:44.320 on highways to cover the world's corridors between metro areas 0:05:44.760 --> 0:05:47.400 before the general consumer population is going to say, look, 0:05:47.440 --> 0:05:51.359 I can make this my only vehicle. Pat's company charge 0:05:51.400 --> 0:05:55.080 Point is the world's largest network of electric charging stations. 0:05:55.800 --> 0:05:58.400 For now, most of his business comes from the long 0:05:58.520 --> 0:06:01.840 duration charging connect there's people use at home or at 0:06:01.880 --> 0:06:04.960 work when the car has hours to charge up. Most 0:06:05.040 --> 0:06:09.000 consumers the fueling model for gas cars is so ingrained 0:06:09.440 --> 0:06:13.520 in their minds that they actually are constantly trying to 0:06:14.279 --> 0:06:17.920 frames are thinking about electric vehicles as how much range 0:06:17.960 --> 0:06:19.720 does the battery have? And it doesn't have as much 0:06:19.800 --> 0:06:21.640 range as my gas tanks, So that must be bad 0:06:21.680 --> 0:06:24.599 because I really want to go somewhere three to five 0:06:24.680 --> 0:06:28.000 days and refuel. Why do you want that shore, why 0:06:28.040 --> 0:06:31.440 not just fuel while you're doing something else. So a 0:06:31.440 --> 0:06:33.920 lot of people who drive electric cars will tell you 0:06:33.960 --> 0:06:37.039 a version of what Pat's saying here that really, you 0:06:37.120 --> 0:06:39.760 hardly ever need to do a gas station style charge 0:06:39.839 --> 0:06:43.440 up because you completely emptied your battery. That's because there 0:06:43.440 --> 0:06:47.360 are actually dozens of charging points all around us. That's 0:06:47.440 --> 0:06:50.920 especially true if you live in a big city. So 0:06:50.960 --> 0:06:53.520 I checked out Tesla's map of where you can charge, 0:06:53.560 --> 0:06:56.719 and I had no idea that in Manhattan, you're basically 0:06:56.760 --> 0:06:59.040 never more than a few blocks away from a parking 0:06:59.080 --> 0:07:02.160 garage that's fit it with a few Tesla connectors, so 0:07:02.240 --> 0:07:04.960 you could keep topping up your battery when you're moving around, 0:07:05.360 --> 0:07:08.039 not just when you're at home or at work, but 0:07:08.120 --> 0:07:10.520 when you go out for dinner, go shopping, go to 0:07:10.560 --> 0:07:14.000 the cinema. I guess most people only do these long 0:07:14.160 --> 0:07:17.680 road trips a handful times a year, although I probably 0:07:17.680 --> 0:07:21.080 wouldn't fit into that category of most people. I drive 0:07:21.160 --> 0:07:23.840 hundreds of miles every weekend to get outside the city 0:07:24.120 --> 0:07:27.400 and go camping and biking and whatnot. So Pat has 0:07:27.480 --> 0:07:30.160 future customers like you in mind when he says these things. 0:07:30.240 --> 0:07:32.800 And that's why, even though his main business is in 0:07:32.920 --> 0:07:37.160 long duration charging. He's going to start building fast highway connectors. 0:07:37.800 --> 0:07:40.240 What it does do is it enables people to buy 0:07:40.280 --> 0:07:44.200 cars um more. You know, it'll accelerate the penetration rate 0:07:44.240 --> 0:07:47.080 to vvs. And what that does for charge point is 0:07:47.240 --> 0:07:49.800 it means those cars show up at work, at home, 0:07:50.040 --> 0:07:53.280 at around town locations, and those businesses have to buy 0:07:53.640 --> 0:07:57.760 the long duration chargers, you know, the chargers that serve 0:07:57.800 --> 0:08:00.680 the long duration parking marketer. And we're engaged with project 0:08:00.760 --> 0:08:04.480 companies right now that are looking at building out either um, 0:08:04.680 --> 0:08:08.480 significant geographic patches in the US, uh, you know, for 0:08:08.560 --> 0:08:11.960 highway transport for the entire US. So it's happening and 0:08:12.000 --> 0:08:14.720 there are going to be multi people, multiple players all 0:08:14.800 --> 0:08:18.360 vying for that. So um, that's good for consumers. By 0:08:18.360 --> 0:08:20.400 the way, it's going to give them even more options. 0:08:26.120 --> 0:08:29.280 Eventually you'll be able to go anywhere on Earth. Yeah, 0:08:29.360 --> 0:08:38.600 so I thank you. In June, the University of Michigan 0:08:38.800 --> 0:08:42.520 published a report saying that they're about sixteen thousand public 0:08:42.600 --> 0:08:46.480 electric vehicle charging stations in the US with forty three 0:08:46.520 --> 0:08:51.920 thousand connectors. A sizeable chunk of those chargers belonged to Tesla, 0:08:52.240 --> 0:08:55.839 which just announced that it's expanding its supercharger stations to 0:08:56.000 --> 0:08:58.960 city centers so that people who don't have plugs at 0:08:59.000 --> 0:09:01.600 home or at work will still have somewhere to quickly 0:09:01.679 --> 0:09:05.520 charge their cars. The first of the urban stations launched 0:09:05.520 --> 0:09:09.840 on Monday in Boston and Chicago. Tesla's website shows that 0:09:09.880 --> 0:09:14.400 they're about nine hundred fifty supercharger stations globally with about 0:09:14.480 --> 0:09:18.800 sixty undred connectors. The company's goal is to get that 0:09:18.880 --> 0:09:22.360 to ten thousand by the end of the year. Expanding 0:09:22.360 --> 0:09:26.600 this infrastructure is obviously a top priority for Tesla now 0:09:26.640 --> 0:09:29.560 that it's mass market car the Model three is on 0:09:29.600 --> 0:09:38.320 the market. I am Chelsea Saxton, and I am an 0:09:38.320 --> 0:09:41.600 electric vehicle consultant and advocate working in the space now 0:09:41.640 --> 0:09:48.760 for over twenty years. Well, we do need quite a 0:09:48.760 --> 0:09:53.560 few more stations across the major highway networks, except for Tesla. 0:09:53.600 --> 0:09:55.840 I mean, Tesla does need to beef up their networks 0:09:55.840 --> 0:09:59.000 with the Model three coming in their increasing vehicle volume coming. 0:09:59.280 --> 0:10:02.719 But the main to stepancy at the moment is infrastructure 0:10:02.760 --> 0:10:07.920 for everybody else. When Chelsea talks about infrastructure for everybody else, 0:10:08.400 --> 0:10:10.959 what she means is that Tesla's network of charges is 0:10:11.000 --> 0:10:15.000 actually already pretty good, but also you can only use 0:10:15.040 --> 0:10:18.000 it if you have a Tesla. They're actually a number 0:10:18.040 --> 0:10:21.240 of different charging connectors out there. It's sort of like 0:10:21.280 --> 0:10:24.360 how an iPhone charger doesn't really work for Android phones. 0:10:25.240 --> 0:10:29.000 The Tesla network is called Supercharger. The other connectors have 0:10:29.160 --> 0:10:32.680 names like Chattamo and J one seven seven to. A 0:10:32.760 --> 0:10:36.040 handful of third party companies are building those networks that 0:10:36.080 --> 0:10:40.240 will serve all the non Tesla electric cars. One of 0:10:40.280 --> 0:10:43.240 those players is charge Point, and we've heard from its 0:10:43.240 --> 0:10:47.199 CEO Pat already in this episode. There's also green Lots 0:10:47.240 --> 0:10:52.080 and electrify America. Electrify America is a U S subsidiary 0:10:52.080 --> 0:10:55.640 of Volkswagen, the German car maker. It was created as 0:10:55.679 --> 0:10:59.719 part of their court settlement for cheating regulators over diesel emissions. 0:11:00.200 --> 0:11:02.160 The big elephant home room at the moment is the 0:11:02.200 --> 0:11:05.240 Volkswagen Diesel settlement and the fact that as part of 0:11:05.280 --> 0:11:08.320 that they're spending two billion dollars through a new division 0:11:08.400 --> 0:11:14.360 College by America on agnostic infrastructure and awareness for eighties 0:11:14.840 --> 0:11:18.040 two billion dollars, that's a lot of money that could 0:11:18.080 --> 0:11:22.079 make a lot of things happen very fast. Electrify America 0:11:22.200 --> 0:11:25.240 is planning to spend its money in several phases, and 0:11:25.280 --> 0:11:27.880 it made its first round of investments this year in April. 0:11:28.400 --> 0:11:31.000 Having the whole U S Highway system covered is probably 0:11:31.040 --> 0:11:34.640 two three years off in terms of, you know, really 0:11:34.679 --> 0:11:38.600 adequate infrastructure. Did not think about the you know, not 0:11:38.600 --> 0:11:41.400 not not have to think about you know, what are 0:11:41.400 --> 0:11:44.439 the two metro areas that I'm trying to drive between? Wow? 0:11:44.480 --> 0:11:46.439 I mean, I think if you live on the West coast, 0:11:46.480 --> 0:11:48.160 I think you're fine. And I think if you live 0:11:48.160 --> 0:11:50.120 on the East Coast, I think you'll be fine before 0:11:50.200 --> 0:11:54.520 that or northeast, I should say. But an arbitrary metro 0:11:54.640 --> 0:11:58.960 connectivity your your a couple of years away. Once the 0:11:59.040 --> 0:12:02.120 charging network is in place, Pat thinks customers will be 0:12:02.160 --> 0:12:05.360 a lot less worried about another fear around electric cause, 0:12:05.679 --> 0:12:09.000 and that's something known as range anxiety. A lot of people, 0:12:09.120 --> 0:12:12.280 including Raman who you heard from earlier, want to know 0:12:12.400 --> 0:12:16.120 that they can travel very long distances on a single charge. 0:12:17.320 --> 0:12:20.600 You don't need four or five six miles of range 0:12:20.600 --> 0:12:24.360 in a vehicle. That's actually overkill with respect to that. 0:12:24.520 --> 0:12:26.840 And I think that that need is going to subside 0:12:26.840 --> 0:12:31.199 when people see fast chargers at appropriate intervals on the 0:12:31.280 --> 0:12:34.560 highway above a hundred and fifty or two hundreds, they 0:12:34.600 --> 0:12:37.959 start to realize, Yeah, I'm largely carrying around a battery back. 0:12:38.000 --> 0:12:41.000 I don't use that often. Of course, it costs a 0:12:41.120 --> 0:12:44.840 lot of money in solving thousands of these charging connectors. 0:12:45.480 --> 0:12:48.800 It's one thing for a group like Electrify America, which 0:12:48.880 --> 0:12:52.160 is getting its funds from the v W settlements, But 0:12:52.240 --> 0:12:56.120 what about Tesla. Some investors might question the wisdom of 0:12:56.240 --> 0:13:00.760 an already heavily indebted electric car maker spending big on 0:13:00.840 --> 0:13:15.960 a whole new project. One day this summer, I took 0:13:15.960 --> 0:13:19.120 a trip down to a Tesla supercharger near New York's 0:13:19.240 --> 0:13:22.400 JFK Airport. The connectors were in the back corner of 0:13:22.440 --> 0:13:26.400 a parking lot. The plugs are stationed at the end 0:13:26.480 --> 0:13:30.280 of a regular parking bay, so you'd reverse into the 0:13:30.320 --> 0:13:34.320 spot and then take out the plug. The plug hooks 0:13:34.320 --> 0:13:36.560 into the back of the car near the tail lights. 0:13:40.200 --> 0:13:42.160 I should say I hung out at the parking lot 0:13:42.200 --> 0:13:44.400 for a couple of hours, and nobody pulled in to 0:13:44.559 --> 0:13:47.560 charge up. When the whole point of your trip is 0:13:47.600 --> 0:13:50.640 to go and talk to owners of these Tesla's. Yeah, 0:13:50.720 --> 0:13:53.120 my takeaway was that I was probably a bit too 0:13:53.120 --> 0:13:56.120 close to the city. Drivers have so many other places 0:13:56.160 --> 0:13:59.079 to top up that they probably only need a supercharger 0:13:59.120 --> 0:14:02.120 when they're in a more remote place. Yeah, going to 0:14:02.280 --> 0:14:05.839 these superchargers is not like going to a regular old 0:14:05.880 --> 0:14:09.200 gas station. Rather than standing next to your car like 0:14:09.280 --> 0:14:12.240 you would when you're filling up gas, most Tesla owners 0:14:12.320 --> 0:14:14.480 plug in their cars and then leave them there for 0:14:14.559 --> 0:14:17.360 like twenty thirty minutes. You want to be able to 0:14:17.360 --> 0:14:19.680 go get a coffee, use the restroom, maybe run an 0:14:19.800 --> 0:14:22.320 errand um. I mean at one point I stopped and 0:14:22.320 --> 0:14:23.800 I was charging the car, and I think I went 0:14:23.840 --> 0:14:26.240 outlet shopping and an ant Taylor, which was very convenient 0:14:26.280 --> 0:14:29.880 for me. That's our colleague Dana Hull, who covers Tesla 0:14:29.920 --> 0:14:33.080 and SpaceX for Bloomberg, and not long ago, Tesla loaned 0:14:33.080 --> 0:14:34.520 her a car and she took it out for a 0:14:34.560 --> 0:14:37.400 short vacation. You know, when I have pulled into Tesla's 0:14:37.560 --> 0:14:40.520 either supercharger or the destination charger, you know, chances are 0:14:40.560 --> 0:14:43.640 there's another Tesla there, or as you're getting ready to leave, 0:14:43.640 --> 0:14:45.480 another Tesla might be pulling up, and so you have 0:14:45.560 --> 0:14:48.080 this kind of social connection. It's almost like going to 0:14:48.120 --> 0:14:50.160 a dog park. If you're a dog owner, you quickly 0:14:50.200 --> 0:14:51.800 get to know all of the other dog owners. You 0:14:51.840 --> 0:14:54.480 child chat about your dogs. The same thing happens at 0:14:54.480 --> 0:14:58.360 a Tesla supercharging or destination charging station. You start to 0:14:58.440 --> 0:15:01.160 chat about your vehicle and over the over the air 0:15:01.320 --> 0:15:04.240 software updates and you know what is Elon Musk doing next, 0:15:04.320 --> 0:15:12.600 and um, it's It's just it's different. Building a charging 0:15:12.640 --> 0:15:16.000 network that covers the whole country, eventually the whole world 0:15:16.320 --> 0:15:19.080 is a business imperative for Tesla. This is key to 0:15:19.160 --> 0:15:22.360 Tesla's whole business model. Because the Model three is their 0:15:22.400 --> 0:15:25.200 mass market car. They're going to have a huge volume 0:15:25.200 --> 0:15:29.000 of cars coming onto the roads within the next couple 0:15:29.000 --> 0:15:31.000 of years, and in order to meet that demand, they 0:15:31.040 --> 0:15:34.600 absolutely need to have a charging infrastructure in place. Making 0:15:34.640 --> 0:15:38.000 a viable business out of Tesla over the long term 0:15:38.200 --> 0:15:41.280 will depend on making the Model three a success. And 0:15:41.360 --> 0:15:45.120 it's clear that Tesla is already at its charging capacity. 0:15:45.440 --> 0:15:48.320 In some parts of the network, there really is a 0:15:48.320 --> 0:15:51.800 congestion issue, particularly in California, which is Tesla's home state, 0:15:51.920 --> 0:15:55.800 and on certain routes like the route between San Francisco 0:15:55.840 --> 0:15:58.359 and Los Angeles, for example. You know, on the weekends, 0:15:58.840 --> 0:16:01.120 road trippers, Friday night people go back and forth, and 0:16:01.120 --> 0:16:04.320 you might go into a supercharger on Interstate five where 0:16:04.320 --> 0:16:07.880 there might be eight spots for eight different cars, and 0:16:07.880 --> 0:16:10.840 there could be a line of people actually waiting. There's 0:16:10.880 --> 0:16:13.600 no two ways about it. Expanding the super charge and 0:16:13.680 --> 0:16:16.120 network is going to be expensive, and a lot of 0:16:16.160 --> 0:16:19.480 investors are already nervous about how much money Tesla is 0:16:19.520 --> 0:16:23.600 burning through. Remember, investing in new charging stations is just 0:16:23.800 --> 0:16:28.320 one of the many big, expensive projects that Tesla is overseeing. 0:16:29.000 --> 0:16:32.040 For the last several years, Tesla has been constructing the 0:16:32.160 --> 0:16:36.160 largest factory on Earth, called the Giga Factory, where all 0:16:36.200 --> 0:16:39.720 its batteries will eventually be made. They also merged with 0:16:39.800 --> 0:16:43.160 Solar City in November, taking on a lot of debt 0:16:43.240 --> 0:16:46.840 that the rooftop solar company had on its books. Tesla 0:16:46.880 --> 0:16:49.200 continues to go back to the capital markets in the 0:16:49.240 --> 0:16:51.920 bond market to raise money to kind of fuel the 0:16:51.960 --> 0:16:55.240 Model three and the expansion of both charging and service. 0:16:55.320 --> 0:16:58.440 So they are definitely spending, you know, millions to kind 0:16:58.440 --> 0:17:00.840 of expand this network, but I see it as really 0:17:00.880 --> 0:17:04.640 being first mover advantage and really kind of cementing their brand. 0:17:04.720 --> 0:17:07.719 The brand and the minds of the public. Despite all 0:17:07.800 --> 0:17:10.480 the money that Tesla and others are investing, it's not 0:17:10.560 --> 0:17:13.800 clear at this stage how much revenue electric vehicle charging 0:17:13.840 --> 0:17:17.879 will generate. So while Tesla is pouring millions of dollars 0:17:17.920 --> 0:17:21.520 into building more superchargers, it's an investment that will really 0:17:21.600 --> 0:17:24.439 come back to them once they start selling more cars. 0:17:25.040 --> 0:17:27.560 For a while, it was free for Tesla drivers to 0:17:27.640 --> 0:17:30.000 charge up, but at the beginning of this year, the 0:17:30.040 --> 0:17:33.399 company implemented a new policy where if you exceed the 0:17:33.400 --> 0:17:36.440 equivalent of about one thousand miles, you have to start 0:17:36.480 --> 0:17:39.720 paying a nominal fee. Most of the people I spoke 0:17:39.760 --> 0:17:42.200 to think we'll end up with some kind of a pass, 0:17:42.200 --> 0:17:44.400 something similar to the data plan that comes with your 0:17:44.440 --> 0:17:47.600 cell phone, that gives drivers access to the charging network, 0:17:48.200 --> 0:17:51.040 and if you're really organized, you may never have to 0:17:51.119 --> 0:17:54.639 stop at a supercharger at all unless you're driving a 0:17:54.680 --> 0:17:59.880 long distance. Tesla has also developed something called destination charging. 0:18:00.400 --> 0:18:04.520 It's another little known but important piece of Tesla's business model. 0:18:05.119 --> 0:18:09.960 This is where Tesla makes its charging connectors available to hotels, wineries, 0:18:10.320 --> 0:18:12.960 places where Tesla owners might like to go on vacation. 0:18:13.280 --> 0:18:15.320 I talked to a man who lives in Salt Spring 0:18:15.359 --> 0:18:19.480 Island in Canada, and he regularly drives from Canada all 0:18:19.520 --> 0:18:21.959 the way to Montana and back. Um. I mean, there 0:18:21.960 --> 0:18:24.159 are a lot of a lot of Tesla owners who 0:18:24.280 --> 0:18:25.960 road trips is a big part of their life. It's 0:18:25.960 --> 0:18:27.760 a big part of why they bought an electric car, 0:18:27.960 --> 0:18:31.360 and they will as they plan their route, they will 0:18:31.359 --> 0:18:34.240 plan it around their charging. And this holds true in 0:18:34.320 --> 0:18:37.240 even more remote places. Dana had a chance to test 0:18:37.240 --> 0:18:41.280 this herself actually in Yosemite. The i Wanne Hotel has 0:18:41.320 --> 0:18:44.919 a destination charger. So this was fantastic because we were 0:18:44.920 --> 0:18:47.040 going to be, you know, in a fairly remote place 0:18:47.119 --> 0:18:49.760 in the mountains, far away from any highway where there 0:18:49.760 --> 0:18:52.640 would be a supercharger. And yet I could plan this 0:18:52.960 --> 0:18:55.840 Yosemite vacation with my family knowing that I could charge 0:18:55.880 --> 0:19:05.520 the Tesla overnight. Eventually, as electric cars come to account 0:19:05.520 --> 0:19:07.639 for a bigger and bigger slice of the car market, 0:19:07.760 --> 0:19:10.440 and we should say that's still quite some ways off, 0:19:10.960 --> 0:19:13.760 utilities will have to think about how a new generation 0:19:13.840 --> 0:19:17.639 of electric cars will affect the national grid. See e 0:19:17.800 --> 0:19:20.199 V batteries are big and could add up to a 0:19:20.200 --> 0:19:23.199 lot of extra burden if hundreds of thousands of them 0:19:23.240 --> 0:19:25.440 are all plugged in and charging at the same time. 0:19:26.200 --> 0:19:31.160 If done haphazardly with no coordination with utilities at scale, 0:19:31.880 --> 0:19:34.000 it is actually a very difficult problem for the grid. 0:19:34.560 --> 0:19:37.919 This is pat Romano from charge point again. If done 0:19:38.800 --> 0:19:43.600 with reasonably, you know, very practical, very simple things, in 0:19:43.680 --> 0:19:47.240 coordination with the grid, it actually helps the grid. Utility 0:19:47.280 --> 0:19:51.040 networks in all countries right now are a sort of 0:19:51.080 --> 0:19:54.439 peak demand oriented. They have to be engineered for peak demand. 0:19:55.480 --> 0:19:58.400 Just explain what pat means here. The grid is set 0:19:58.480 --> 0:20:00.719 up in a way that means it can only handle 0:20:00.840 --> 0:20:04.120 a certain amount of demand at a time. If one 0:20:04.160 --> 0:20:07.080 building decides to turn its air conditioning on and that 0:20:07.119 --> 0:20:10.960 exceeds the generation capacity at that moment, it could bring 0:20:11.000 --> 0:20:14.399 the whole grid down. So for now, the ideal time 0:20:14.400 --> 0:20:17.960 to charge electric cars is at night, when skyscrapers have 0:20:18.080 --> 0:20:22.240 their lights off and electricity demand is generally low. But 0:20:22.280 --> 0:20:25.920 there's a chance that equation could change if renewable energy 0:20:26.119 --> 0:20:29.080 like solar and winds start to play a more important 0:20:29.160 --> 0:20:32.560 part in our energy mix. Because our grid is built 0:20:32.600 --> 0:20:35.840 to deliver electricity instantly, we don't have a lot of 0:20:35.880 --> 0:20:39.240 infrastructure in place to store energy that we can use later, 0:20:39.920 --> 0:20:41.919 So we could be in a situation where there's too 0:20:42.040 --> 0:20:45.200 much electricity being generated during the day when the sun 0:20:45.280 --> 0:20:47.399 is out. So what that means is you want cars 0:20:47.440 --> 0:20:49.880 plugged in at work all day long, and you want 0:20:49.880 --> 0:20:52.040 to potentially in the long term, plugged in at home 0:20:52.600 --> 0:20:55.640 so that opportunistically the rate of charge into the car 0:20:55.800 --> 0:21:00.680 can be managed by the utility. So when the sun 0:21:00.760 --> 0:21:04.800 is burning bright and solar is providing an abundance of energy, 0:21:05.280 --> 0:21:07.280 it's a great time to charge vehicles. In fact, in 0:21:07.320 --> 0:21:10.320 many cases they're paying people to take load right now. 0:21:11.680 --> 0:21:13.879 So there's a lot of really interesting debates within the 0:21:13.920 --> 0:21:17.919 industry going on about vehicle to grid so that potentially 0:21:17.960 --> 0:21:20.440 the cars could act to sort of mobile storage units 0:21:20.440 --> 0:21:22.880 and send electricity back to the grid. We're not really 0:21:22.920 --> 0:21:25.600 at the at the point yet where that's become an 0:21:25.600 --> 0:21:28.000 issue or where that's happening in practice, but it's something 0:21:28.000 --> 0:21:30.320 that people are seeing as a potential synergy that could 0:21:30.320 --> 0:21:34.159 really help manage these load issues that utility operators and 0:21:34.160 --> 0:21:41.439 grid operators are always struggling with. So of course the 0:21:41.560 --> 0:21:45.560 big question is whether having more charges around will mean 0:21:45.640 --> 0:21:49.840 that people start buying more electric cars. I tested this 0:21:49.880 --> 0:21:53.280 out with Ramon Vivero. He's the listener from southern California 0:21:53.320 --> 0:21:56.240 who we heard from at the start. In the beginning, 0:21:56.440 --> 0:21:58.720 Ramon was kind of skeptical. He told me he lives 0:21:58.720 --> 0:22:02.880 in an apartment where he couldn't install an electric charging connector. 0:22:03.320 --> 0:22:05.879 He was also worried about taking an electric vehicle on 0:22:05.920 --> 0:22:08.800 a road trip to Palm Springs. But I actually looked 0:22:08.800 --> 0:22:11.520 online and there are places Ramon could stop to charge 0:22:11.520 --> 0:22:13.760 on the way. So I asked him if that made 0:22:13.840 --> 0:22:18.320 him feel different. I'm very impressed. I didn't think that 0:22:18.400 --> 0:22:21.680 they would be at this point for another year or two. Um, 0:22:21.760 --> 0:22:26.040 so conceivably with only a thirty minute detour, you can 0:22:26.040 --> 0:22:29.920 go four miles. I mean, that's Los Angeles to Vegas, 0:22:29.920 --> 0:22:34.119 seems we I mean obviously, once we have the hyperlips, 0:22:34.160 --> 0:22:55.480 that's entirely different. UM. Waiting on that. And that's it 0:22:55.600 --> 0:22:59.639 for this week's episode of Decrypted. Thanks for listening. Do 0:22:59.760 --> 0:23:02.280 you have an electric car or are you thinking about 0:23:02.320 --> 0:23:05.159 getting one? We'd love to hear your story. Get in 0:23:05.240 --> 0:23:09.119 touch at Decrypted at Bloomberg dot net or I'm on 0:23:09.160 --> 0:23:12.840 Twitter at pa Gadkari and I'm at aki Eto seven. 0:23:13.280 --> 0:23:16.240 If you haven't already subscribed to our show wherever you 0:23:16.320 --> 0:23:19.399 get your podcasts, and while you're there, please leave us 0:23:19.400 --> 0:23:22.520 a rating and a review. I read each and every 0:23:22.560 --> 0:23:24.680 single one of these, and it goes such a long 0:23:24.720 --> 0:23:27.080 way to get the show in front of more listeners. 0:23:27.640 --> 0:23:30.800 This episode was produced by Liz Smith and Magnus Hendrickson. 0:23:31.160 --> 0:23:33.600 A very special thanks to Dana Hull for all her 0:23:33.640 --> 0:23:36.920 guidance and expertise on this topic, and to Isabel Gottlieb 0:23:36.960 --> 0:23:39.919 who helped with research for today's episode. We'll see you 0:23:39.920 --> 0:23:40.359 next week.