1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:27,520 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of I Heart Radio. Welcome 2 00:00:27,520 --> 00:00:30,720 Speaker 1: back to the show Ridiculous Historians. If you've been listening 3 00:00:30,720 --> 00:00:33,559 Speaker 1: along to the past few episodes, then you know that 4 00:00:33,680 --> 00:00:38,680 Speaker 1: we are going through a spooky phase, uh, leading up 5 00:00:38,720 --> 00:00:41,519 Speaker 1: to Halloween. I'm enjoying it. I don't want it to end. 6 00:00:41,640 --> 00:00:44,480 Speaker 1: I know I can't last forever. But we've got another 7 00:00:44,479 --> 00:00:48,320 Speaker 1: good one today. We've got a two part episode. Check 8 00:00:48,440 --> 00:00:54,640 Speaker 1: this out, Noel super producer Casey Bangrum, we figured this 9 00:00:54,640 --> 00:00:57,560 Speaker 1: one out in advance. I'm beat. Yeah, it's in the 10 00:00:57,600 --> 00:01:00,800 Speaker 1: spirit of Halloween. Ben I figure here that it would 11 00:01:00,880 --> 00:01:03,120 Speaker 1: we would would be doing a disservice to the listener 12 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:06,880 Speaker 1: if we didn't d mark these two partners ahead of time, 13 00:01:06,880 --> 00:01:09,880 Speaker 1: and this one it is worthy of such and we 14 00:01:10,000 --> 00:01:11,960 Speaker 1: know exactly what we're gonna break it. Oh my god, 15 00:01:12,000 --> 00:01:14,240 Speaker 1: I've got shivers running down my spine just thinking about it. 16 00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:17,760 Speaker 1: This has never happened maybe once. No, I don't think so. No. 17 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:20,319 Speaker 1: I think it's a different show. We've we've said that 18 00:01:20,360 --> 00:01:22,520 Speaker 1: we figured out something was going to be a two parter, 19 00:01:22,600 --> 00:01:26,080 Speaker 1: or it advanced a couple of times, but then we've 20 00:01:26,160 --> 00:01:29,280 Speaker 1: leaned on Casey. Uh and again, thank you, Casey. We've 21 00:01:29,319 --> 00:01:32,000 Speaker 1: been like, you know, Casey'll figure it out. He'll figure 22 00:01:32,040 --> 00:01:35,440 Speaker 1: it out. Super Producer Casey Pegram. And when you say 23 00:01:35,480 --> 00:01:37,640 Speaker 1: another show, you don't mean like somebody else's show. You 24 00:01:37,640 --> 00:01:41,240 Speaker 1: mean like it's one of the other shows that we do. Right, Yeah, okay, cool? 25 00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:44,360 Speaker 1: What do you think about this momentous occasion, Super Producer 26 00:01:44,400 --> 00:01:48,000 Speaker 1: Casey Pegram. We're entering a brand new era and um, 27 00:01:48,040 --> 00:01:50,760 Speaker 1: you know, I'm excited to see where it takes us. Well, 28 00:01:50,920 --> 00:01:56,120 Speaker 1: you're also uh knowing our luck. Dear ridiculous historians, Please 29 00:01:56,200 --> 00:01:59,120 Speaker 1: forgive us if this accidentally ends up being a three parter. 30 00:01:59,440 --> 00:02:01,360 Speaker 1: How Hilaria race would that be? But we think we 31 00:02:01,360 --> 00:02:03,320 Speaker 1: we think we've got it figured out, and we think 32 00:02:03,440 --> 00:02:05,360 Speaker 1: this is something that's got a little bit of law 33 00:02:05,400 --> 00:02:11,360 Speaker 1: in order. It's got some murderous mysteries spookiness. Uh no, 34 00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:15,560 Speaker 1: how could a young, otherwise healthy woman drop dead? All 35 00:02:15,680 --> 00:02:20,480 Speaker 1: the Everlasting Faint, the Everlasting Faith. That's my favorite emo 36 00:02:20,560 --> 00:02:23,760 Speaker 1: band from the early aughts. By the way, the Everlasting Faint. 37 00:02:23,960 --> 00:02:25,600 Speaker 1: I thought it was like a good it would be 38 00:02:25,639 --> 00:02:30,040 Speaker 1: a good uh classic greatest hits album name for the Faint. 39 00:02:30,320 --> 00:02:33,520 Speaker 1: That's very true, that's very true. There also was a 40 00:02:33,639 --> 00:02:36,760 Speaker 1: small Ladder day, small guests. We're still in the latter 41 00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:39,000 Speaker 1: days of the Smashing Pumpkins. I do wish they'd stop, 42 00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:42,600 Speaker 1: but they are coming back with a huge melancholy sadness 43 00:02:42,600 --> 00:02:46,040 Speaker 1: twenty anniversary. By the way, anybody else feel old? I 44 00:02:46,120 --> 00:02:49,960 Speaker 1: sure do? Uh but anyway, Um. They had a song 45 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:55,280 Speaker 1: off of their man album Machina The Machines of God 46 00:02:55,400 --> 00:02:58,880 Speaker 1: called the Everlasting Gaze. But not the same thing as 47 00:02:58,880 --> 00:03:01,480 Speaker 1: an everlasting faith. I think of the everlasting gays might 48 00:03:01,520 --> 00:03:04,560 Speaker 1: be like a stroke. Uh, the everlasting faint is a 49 00:03:04,600 --> 00:03:07,240 Speaker 1: heart attack, or at least in the parlance of of 50 00:03:07,360 --> 00:03:11,000 Speaker 1: the time, which would be eight yes, oh real quick, 51 00:03:11,080 --> 00:03:13,880 Speaker 1: nothing to do with anything. While we're shouting out anniversaries. 52 00:03:14,200 --> 00:03:18,200 Speaker 1: I just learned that today, this very day that we're recording, 53 00:03:18,240 --> 00:03:22,680 Speaker 1: this is the eleven year anniversary. Stuff they don't want 54 00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:25,600 Speaker 1: you to know, is that right? Yeah, we totally missed 55 00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:28,680 Speaker 1: it because we peek behind the curtain. We recorded that 56 00:03:28,840 --> 00:03:32,919 Speaker 1: show earlier today. Well, I guess, I guess turn about 57 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:34,760 Speaker 1: being fair play and all. Now we just have to 58 00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:37,800 Speaker 1: wait till the eleventh anniversary of ridiculous History and forget 59 00:03:37,840 --> 00:03:39,920 Speaker 1: to shout that out on this show and shout out 60 00:03:39,920 --> 00:03:41,960 Speaker 1: out on the other show, and then there you will 61 00:03:42,000 --> 00:03:47,320 Speaker 1: be closed. Perfect. But the year's eight seven, Greenbrier County, 62 00:03:47,600 --> 00:03:53,000 Speaker 1: West Virginia. Um, Mary Jane Heaster. Oh boy, people might 63 00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:54,840 Speaker 1: come at us for the pronunciation here. It's h E 64 00:03:55,000 --> 00:03:56,880 Speaker 1: A S t R. I really don't think. I mean, 65 00:03:56,920 --> 00:04:01,640 Speaker 1: it wouldn't be he astern easter. Hester Hester seemed a 66 00:04:01,640 --> 00:04:03,680 Speaker 1: little more of the time. But I guess I'm just 67 00:04:03,680 --> 00:04:07,040 Speaker 1: thinking of the Crucible or no, I'm sorry that the Crucible, 68 00:04:07,080 --> 00:04:10,840 Speaker 1: the Scarlett. Excuse me, Let's go with Easter. Easter is good. 69 00:04:10,840 --> 00:04:14,000 Speaker 1: We're gonna go with Mary Jane Heaster of Greenbrier County, 70 00:04:14,040 --> 00:04:18,000 Speaker 1: West Virginia is sound asleep. It's winter, it's cold, she's 71 00:04:18,040 --> 00:04:22,680 Speaker 1: bundled up. She's still in mourning from you know, i'm 72 00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:26,080 Speaker 1: editorializing here a bit, but likely from the late January 73 00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:30,520 Speaker 1: death of her newly wedded daughter, Zona, which is the 74 00:04:30,640 --> 00:04:33,640 Speaker 1: name that I absolutely love. So she's she she's asleep 75 00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:38,839 Speaker 1: and she has this vision. She has this dream vision. 76 00:04:39,440 --> 00:04:43,800 Speaker 1: An apparition appears to her and it's Zona's ghost telling 77 00:04:43,839 --> 00:04:48,320 Speaker 1: her how it was that she came to die. Right, 78 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:51,520 Speaker 1: that's her set up because she's haunted by that question. 79 00:04:51,680 --> 00:04:54,640 Speaker 1: They asked the top. You know, she's uh, Mary Jane 80 00:04:54,680 --> 00:04:57,440 Speaker 1: is not a doctor, but she is a person with 81 00:04:57,560 --> 00:05:01,440 Speaker 1: common sense, and she's thinking, uh, healthy person. That's so 82 00:05:01,520 --> 00:05:04,279 Speaker 1: odd that she would drop dead of a of a 83 00:05:04,320 --> 00:05:07,400 Speaker 1: heart attack. That's what the everlasting faint was that the 84 00:05:07,440 --> 00:05:10,719 Speaker 1: doctor had written in the autopsy report in his findings. 85 00:05:10,920 --> 00:05:14,719 Speaker 1: And when she sees what she believes to be the 86 00:05:14,800 --> 00:05:20,440 Speaker 1: apparition of her deceased daughter, Zona, Zona brings her a message. 87 00:05:20,560 --> 00:05:25,360 Speaker 1: At least that's what Mary James believes, and Zona is 88 00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:29,200 Speaker 1: telling her mother it was not an everlasting faint, it 89 00:05:29,279 --> 00:05:31,919 Speaker 1: was not a heart attack, and was homicide. It was 90 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:38,000 Speaker 1: murder most foul. And this this event leads us to 91 00:05:39,080 --> 00:05:44,200 Speaker 1: what remains one of the most unique court cases in 92 00:05:44,480 --> 00:05:48,760 Speaker 1: human history. To get into the details about how weird 93 00:05:48,800 --> 00:05:53,080 Speaker 1: this series of events becomes. I think maybe maybe it's 94 00:05:53,120 --> 00:05:56,200 Speaker 1: good for us to start in a happier place. You know, 95 00:05:56,240 --> 00:05:58,600 Speaker 1: who doesn't love a wedding. We can throw some rom 96 00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:01,640 Speaker 1: common here. There's a bit of a meet cute story 97 00:06:01,720 --> 00:06:04,840 Speaker 1: that happens a year earlier, in the summer of eight 98 00:06:06,240 --> 00:06:08,520 Speaker 1: with another really cool name. By the By the way, 99 00:06:08,880 --> 00:06:10,920 Speaker 1: so many cool names in the story. Uh. And, by 100 00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:12,280 Speaker 1: the way, we'll go ahead and put it out there 101 00:06:12,400 --> 00:06:14,680 Speaker 1: if you didn't see it in the metadata. This is 102 00:06:14,760 --> 00:06:20,039 Speaker 1: the story of the Greenbrier Ghost. So summer, a gentleman 103 00:06:20,040 --> 00:06:25,240 Speaker 1: by the name of Erasmus Stribbling Shoe, fantastic name, moved 104 00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:29,320 Speaker 1: from a place called Droop Mountain, another amazing name for 105 00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:32,760 Speaker 1: a place that was probably only somewhat amazing. Uh, in 106 00:06:32,880 --> 00:06:36,440 Speaker 1: Pocahontas County. It just doesn't stop in West Virginia. Uh. 107 00:06:36,440 --> 00:06:39,000 Speaker 1: And he picked up and moved to live says Mill 108 00:06:39,040 --> 00:06:44,480 Speaker 1: in Greenbrier County. Erasmus being a a handsome gentleman, uh, 109 00:06:44,600 --> 00:06:49,600 Speaker 1: strong of feature, muscular of arm leg one would assume 110 00:06:49,600 --> 00:06:52,159 Speaker 1: as well. Um, he had taken a job at a 111 00:06:52,200 --> 00:06:56,880 Speaker 1: blacksmith shop, a blacksmith shop owned by one James Crookshank, 112 00:06:57,720 --> 00:07:01,560 Speaker 1: Erasmus Wintrow himself to focus this Edward. People knew him 113 00:07:01,640 --> 00:07:03,880 Speaker 1: by the name of Trout, which you know, you could 114 00:07:03,880 --> 00:07:07,520 Speaker 1: either think is charming or sort of like a prison nickname. Um, 115 00:07:08,680 --> 00:07:11,320 Speaker 1: no spoilers quite yet, but we're leaning already kind of 116 00:07:11,360 --> 00:07:14,000 Speaker 1: towards the second one of those two options. Well, I 117 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:17,320 Speaker 1: want to be completely fair to speak from experience in 118 00:07:17,600 --> 00:07:21,680 Speaker 1: West Virginia, Eastern Tennessee areas of the US like this. 119 00:07:21,920 --> 00:07:25,600 Speaker 1: It is very much common. It's a common thing for 120 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:29,760 Speaker 1: people to have somewhat anomalous nicknames that are used in 121 00:07:29,800 --> 00:07:33,000 Speaker 1: place of their names on their birth certificate if they 122 00:07:33,040 --> 00:07:36,160 Speaker 1: had one, And it's also common for people to have 123 00:07:37,240 --> 00:07:40,400 Speaker 1: names that aren't super common in the rest of the country. 124 00:07:40,680 --> 00:07:42,440 Speaker 1: I'm saying this as a guy who has a great 125 00:07:42,480 --> 00:07:47,960 Speaker 1: aunt whose name is literally was literally nine. I guess why. 126 00:07:49,040 --> 00:07:54,320 Speaker 1: It's not hard because she's no. I can't if she 127 00:07:54,520 --> 00:07:56,880 Speaker 1: was the ninth kid, the ninth kid. Did you ever 128 00:07:56,920 --> 00:08:01,320 Speaker 1: see that show ozark On on Netflix? Very very good? 129 00:08:01,360 --> 00:08:03,160 Speaker 1: But then you know, there's like a kind of a 130 00:08:03,200 --> 00:08:06,480 Speaker 1: country family and sort of a clan that lives um 131 00:08:06,520 --> 00:08:08,400 Speaker 1: out in kind of like a rural part of of 132 00:08:08,440 --> 00:08:09,840 Speaker 1: women the whole places the world they live in like 133 00:08:09,880 --> 00:08:12,640 Speaker 1: a trailer situation. And one of the kid's name is six. 134 00:08:13,520 --> 00:08:16,120 Speaker 1: I think, which, uh, that's that's sort of okay, that 135 00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:18,400 Speaker 1: holds true. I'm a big fan of that. I think 136 00:08:18,400 --> 00:08:21,520 Speaker 1: it's cool too. I have a I think I think 137 00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:23,720 Speaker 1: they're related to me. They live in the same town. 138 00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:27,200 Speaker 1: But I know I've met someone named seven as well. 139 00:08:27,480 --> 00:08:29,200 Speaker 1: Got it. I don't know what they were the seventh 140 00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:31,560 Speaker 1: kid or if their parents were just like that is 141 00:08:31,600 --> 00:08:34,360 Speaker 1: the winning number. Seven's cool seven is one of my 142 00:08:34,360 --> 00:08:37,480 Speaker 1: favorite print songs, by the way, underappreciated from the New 143 00:08:37,480 --> 00:08:39,839 Speaker 1: Power Generation era. Check it out if you haven't heard 144 00:08:39,840 --> 00:08:46,320 Speaker 1: it already. So back to Trout. Shortly after Erasmus gets 145 00:08:46,360 --> 00:08:51,800 Speaker 1: to live, says Mill, he meets a farmer's daughter. Uh, Casey, 146 00:08:52,360 --> 00:08:54,360 Speaker 1: to have a little bit of rom com music here 147 00:08:54,400 --> 00:08:57,760 Speaker 1: would be beautiful slap some Seinfeld base perhaps, No, I 148 00:08:57,760 --> 00:08:59,920 Speaker 1: don't know who knows what Casey will come up with. 149 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:01,800 Speaker 1: That'll be great. Whatever it is is happening right now, 150 00:09:01,800 --> 00:09:04,440 Speaker 1: and I love it. Yeah, I think you've outdone yourself, Casey. 151 00:09:04,600 --> 00:09:08,040 Speaker 1: By the way, every time I say something like that, sure, 152 00:09:07,720 --> 00:09:11,280 Speaker 1: I'm sure I'm annoying your Casey because he don't know 153 00:09:11,320 --> 00:09:14,720 Speaker 1: what coming up with anyway. So, as I was saying, so, 154 00:09:14,840 --> 00:09:19,160 Speaker 1: Trout meets a farmer's daughter. To the music. Her name 155 00:09:19,320 --> 00:09:25,240 Speaker 1: is Elva Zona. Heaster. Zona is head over heels with Trout. 156 00:09:25,360 --> 00:09:29,760 Speaker 1: She's smitten, she's over the moon, is handsome man. She's 157 00:09:29,840 --> 00:09:33,160 Speaker 1: thinking and he is feeling the same way. This is 158 00:09:33,160 --> 00:09:37,160 Speaker 1: completely reciprocated. So they courted for a short while. That's 159 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:40,760 Speaker 1: you know, dating, and uh then they were married very 160 00:09:40,760 --> 00:09:46,720 Speaker 1: soon after meeting October six, almost a hundred and twenty 161 00:09:46,760 --> 00:09:50,480 Speaker 1: four years to today, right, we just passed the anniversary 162 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:54,199 Speaker 1: of their meeting their marriage. She was twenty three when 163 00:09:54,400 --> 00:09:58,599 Speaker 1: she met Trout and he was thirty seven, so a 164 00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:00,920 Speaker 1: little bit of age difference there, but nothing you know, 165 00:10:01,080 --> 00:10:07,080 Speaker 1: particularly scandalous. Uh. Mary Jane however, the mother, remember she 166 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:12,640 Speaker 1: was not a fan of Erasmus or Trout. She wasn't 167 00:10:12,679 --> 00:10:17,000 Speaker 1: on board with the marriage. But love, like life, uh 168 00:10:17,200 --> 00:10:20,400 Speaker 1: finds a way, as as Jeff Goldblum would say. So 169 00:10:20,480 --> 00:10:24,280 Speaker 1: the pair settles down into a house right near that 170 00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:28,240 Speaker 1: blacksmith shop. Fast forward three months, as we set up 171 00:10:28,240 --> 00:10:33,480 Speaker 1: at the top, January three, Zona has passed away. Yeah, 172 00:10:33,520 --> 00:10:36,680 Speaker 1: so here's how that came to pass, or at least 173 00:10:36,720 --> 00:10:38,280 Speaker 1: you know how. I've got to tell you. I've been 174 00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:43,079 Speaker 1: watching the first season of the incredible f FXX series 175 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:46,880 Speaker 1: Fargo Um written and created by Noah Holly, who also 176 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:50,320 Speaker 1: did the show Legion, which is fantastic, and he's done 177 00:10:50,360 --> 00:10:52,160 Speaker 1: a bunch of other really cool stuff and has written 178 00:10:52,160 --> 00:10:55,360 Speaker 1: some books, really talented do. But it's uh, the first 179 00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:58,600 Speaker 1: season is all about murder, most foul and and trying 180 00:10:58,640 --> 00:11:00,840 Speaker 1: to cover it up, and all of the length that 181 00:11:00,880 --> 00:11:03,160 Speaker 1: you go to to to make people think that a 182 00:11:03,200 --> 00:11:05,640 Speaker 1: certain thing, a certain chain of events happened. I can't help, 183 00:11:05,640 --> 00:11:07,800 Speaker 1: but my mind can't help but go there in the 184 00:11:07,880 --> 00:11:12,240 Speaker 1: intention that Trout went to, the very specific order of 185 00:11:12,280 --> 00:11:15,160 Speaker 1: operations that he went to to to lead to discovery 186 00:11:15,280 --> 00:11:21,840 Speaker 1: of of his beloved body. So in January, Trout went 187 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:25,839 Speaker 1: and paid a visit to Martha Jones, a k a. 188 00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:30,960 Speaker 1: Auntie Martha, and he asked her son Anderson, if he 189 00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:33,520 Speaker 1: could go to his house to get some eggs and 190 00:11:33,559 --> 00:11:36,360 Speaker 1: to see if Zora and needed anything because she was 191 00:11:36,440 --> 00:11:39,800 Speaker 1: feeling poorly. Uh, just something they would have said in 192 00:11:39,880 --> 00:11:44,320 Speaker 1: eighteen seven. Once he was inside that this kid came 193 00:11:44,400 --> 00:11:49,000 Speaker 1: upon a horror show. Zora's lifeless body at the foot 194 00:11:49,000 --> 00:11:52,720 Speaker 1: of the stairs, face down. You know, from the look 195 00:11:52,760 --> 00:11:56,320 Speaker 1: of it, she had taken a nasty tumble down those stairs. 196 00:11:56,320 --> 00:12:00,760 Speaker 1: Her legs were straight, her arms were stretched out. Um 197 00:12:00,880 --> 00:12:02,480 Speaker 1: she had one or one of her arms stretched out, 198 00:12:02,520 --> 00:12:04,920 Speaker 1: her other arm was tucked under her chest, and her 199 00:12:04,960 --> 00:12:07,040 Speaker 1: head was kind of a little bit of a canted angle. 200 00:12:07,720 --> 00:12:10,360 Speaker 1: He even had a moment. Poor kid, we thought maybe 201 00:12:10,440 --> 00:12:14,080 Speaker 1: she was like asleep, and he stepped towards her, you know, 202 00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:19,319 Speaker 1: calling her name, Mrs Shoe he said, and nothing. So 203 00:12:19,440 --> 00:12:22,520 Speaker 1: he freaked out, as any kid discovering such a thing 204 00:12:22,559 --> 00:12:25,160 Speaker 1: would likely do, and he took off ran to his 205 00:12:25,240 --> 00:12:28,880 Speaker 1: mom's house, where he reported, Uh this this this tragedy 206 00:12:28,920 --> 00:12:31,760 Speaker 1: that he had stumbled upon. Um, at which point they 207 00:12:31,800 --> 00:12:37,520 Speaker 1: called the doctor, who was also the corner one George W. Knap. 208 00:12:38,080 --> 00:12:42,000 Speaker 1: And by the time the doctor has arrived trout she 209 00:12:42,400 --> 00:12:47,240 Speaker 1: Harasmus take him with that name, has already returned home. 210 00:12:47,440 --> 00:12:51,360 Speaker 1: He's carried his former spouse's body up to a bedroom. 211 00:12:51,720 --> 00:12:55,240 Speaker 1: He's washed and dressed her and laid her on the bed. 212 00:12:55,960 --> 00:13:02,120 Speaker 1: Uh this. This is interesting because Victorian Sustum held that 213 00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:06,400 Speaker 1: female family and friends should wash and dress the deceased, 214 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:10,960 Speaker 1: but Erasmus did it himself. Were reasons that will explore later. 215 00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:15,679 Speaker 1: He had prepared her body for burial. He put her 216 00:13:15,760 --> 00:13:19,640 Speaker 1: in a nice dress. It was importantly a high necked 217 00:13:19,720 --> 00:13:22,920 Speaker 1: dress with a stiff collar, but a veil over her face. 218 00:13:23,400 --> 00:13:27,800 Speaker 1: And as the doctor remember this detail, folks, As the 219 00:13:27,880 --> 00:13:33,000 Speaker 1: doctor Nap is examining the corpse, Shoe is cradling his 220 00:13:33,040 --> 00:13:36,440 Speaker 1: wife's head, if you can picture it, and he is crying, 221 00:13:36,520 --> 00:13:40,120 Speaker 1: sobbing inconsolably the whole time, which makes sense. He has 222 00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:45,240 Speaker 1: just lost his wife. An interesting thing happens, though, in 223 00:13:45,280 --> 00:13:48,880 Speaker 1: the course of his examination. The doctor says, you know, 224 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:52,280 Speaker 1: he starts moving towards elver Zona's neck and head, and 225 00:13:52,400 --> 00:13:58,600 Speaker 1: this irritates the Jesus out of trout h and Nap goes, Okay, 226 00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:02,080 Speaker 1: you know I understand is I can't even begin to 227 00:14:02,120 --> 00:14:05,400 Speaker 1: imagine what a terrible, harrowing time this is for you. 228 00:14:05,559 --> 00:14:09,240 Speaker 1: So I'm gonna leave it at that. I have, in 229 00:14:09,280 --> 00:14:14,599 Speaker 1: my examination found nothing wrong with anything about Elva physically, 230 00:14:14,760 --> 00:14:18,040 Speaker 1: other than, of course, the fact that she is dead. Uh. 231 00:14:18,559 --> 00:14:22,320 Speaker 1: And I I had also been treating her, you know, 232 00:14:22,360 --> 00:14:25,480 Speaker 1: as the talent doctor for a few weeks beforehand. So 233 00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:29,360 Speaker 1: I'm gonna call this cause of death heart attack, a 234 00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:31,920 Speaker 1: faint that lasts forever. Yeah, I hope he was a 235 00:14:31,920 --> 00:14:35,080 Speaker 1: better doctor than he was a coroner. Um I got 236 00:14:35,160 --> 00:14:36,920 Speaker 1: Can I tell you this makes my mind to go 237 00:14:37,040 --> 00:14:39,800 Speaker 1: right back to Fargo, because there's all these like hapless 238 00:14:40,200 --> 00:14:43,240 Speaker 1: Minnesota cops that are just like, oh, don't mess with 239 00:14:43,280 --> 00:14:46,440 Speaker 1: the poor man. He's been through so much. Don't ask 240 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:49,000 Speaker 1: him any more questions. You know, it's the same kind 241 00:14:49,040 --> 00:14:51,880 Speaker 1: of deal here is that small town kind of mentality 242 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:55,000 Speaker 1: and the idea that no one would ever do anything 243 00:14:55,520 --> 00:15:01,120 Speaker 1: untoward you know, um or or that alone, you know, 244 00:15:01,600 --> 00:15:05,160 Speaker 1: murder most foul. So this all kind of this kind 245 00:15:05,160 --> 00:15:10,320 Speaker 1: of odd behavior extends to the funeral. Elva's body is 246 00:15:10,520 --> 00:15:13,960 Speaker 1: uh is taken and and just just a quick housekeeping note, 247 00:15:14,200 --> 00:15:16,680 Speaker 1: we worst we've been sometimes referring to this young woman 248 00:15:16,720 --> 00:15:20,280 Speaker 1: as el Elva sometimes Zona. She was referred to that 249 00:15:20,360 --> 00:15:22,920 Speaker 1: interchangeably by by her friends, I believe, and then also 250 00:15:22,960 --> 00:15:26,040 Speaker 1: a lot of the reporting that we found uh interchanges 251 00:15:26,080 --> 00:15:28,120 Speaker 1: those names too, so not to confuse anybody. Then you 252 00:15:28,120 --> 00:15:29,520 Speaker 1: want to stick with one, which one you like better? 253 00:15:29,560 --> 00:15:31,680 Speaker 1: I'm a big fan of Zona. Yeah, I'm a fan 254 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:34,320 Speaker 1: of Zona. But the reason I said Elva Zona a 255 00:15:34,320 --> 00:15:36,880 Speaker 1: few minutes ago is just to establish that is her 256 00:15:36,920 --> 00:15:39,120 Speaker 1: full day. Oh absolutely so, so I'm gonna stick with 257 00:15:39,200 --> 00:15:42,280 Speaker 1: Zona moving forward. So her body is taken to her 258 00:15:42,360 --> 00:15:47,000 Speaker 1: childhood home of Little Sieouel Mountain, which sounds very charming, 259 00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:52,480 Speaker 1: and she's buried. Um after this weird funeral where Trout 260 00:15:53,040 --> 00:15:57,800 Speaker 1: acts like a total sketchy weirdo. This is ridiculous. More 261 00:15:57,800 --> 00:16:00,920 Speaker 1: of the next stuff, more of the crazy edling fiddling, 262 00:16:01,320 --> 00:16:04,120 Speaker 1: you know, messing around with her body as it's laying 263 00:16:04,160 --> 00:16:07,120 Speaker 1: in state, you know, fiddling with her collar and making 264 00:16:07,160 --> 00:16:10,600 Speaker 1: sure it's pulled up high enough, putting too much stuff 265 00:16:10,640 --> 00:16:13,640 Speaker 1: on her on her like putting a suspicious amount of 266 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:17,400 Speaker 1: stuff on her neck and her head. I found this 267 00:16:17,480 --> 00:16:21,360 Speaker 1: beloved scarf that dear Zona loved so well, and I'm 268 00:16:21,400 --> 00:16:23,320 Speaker 1: sorry I must have forgotten to put it on her 269 00:16:23,360 --> 00:16:27,120 Speaker 1: when I very hastily dressed her for burial myself. So 270 00:16:27,400 --> 00:16:29,040 Speaker 1: let's just wrap it on. Let's shove it on there, 271 00:16:29,120 --> 00:16:31,480 Speaker 1: right in the coffin, right in the family and friends 272 00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:33,480 Speaker 1: are going. You know, I know it's a tough time 273 00:16:33,520 --> 00:16:37,560 Speaker 1: for you, trout, but this this is the last time 274 00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:42,680 Speaker 1: any of us are going to see Zona. And uh, 275 00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:46,120 Speaker 1: this scarf doesn't match her burial dress. And so Shoe 276 00:16:46,200 --> 00:16:48,560 Speaker 1: turns on the wet works again and he says, as well, 277 00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:51,520 Speaker 1: this is her favorite scarf. She would want it to 278 00:16:51,560 --> 00:16:54,600 Speaker 1: be buried in it. And then while he's doing this, 279 00:16:54,680 --> 00:16:58,240 Speaker 1: he's like also propping her head up incrementally, first with 280 00:16:58,280 --> 00:17:01,560 Speaker 1: a pillow, then are rolled up cloth. I gotta tell 281 00:17:01,560 --> 00:17:04,640 Speaker 1: you this. Okay, So I just rewatched Death Becomes Her. 282 00:17:04,760 --> 00:17:07,720 Speaker 1: You guys, remember Death Becomes Her? Oh yeah, with the 283 00:17:07,800 --> 00:17:11,520 Speaker 1: makewere where as they start decomposing, they start having to 284 00:17:11,600 --> 00:17:13,879 Speaker 1: lay on the makeup thicker and then like the hellll 285 00:17:13,960 --> 00:17:16,000 Speaker 1: crack or something and they have to like touch it 286 00:17:16,040 --> 00:17:18,680 Speaker 1: up real QUI don't nothing to see here. Definitely not dead, 287 00:17:19,000 --> 00:17:21,480 Speaker 1: you know. Yeah, this this reminds me of that Death 288 00:17:21,480 --> 00:17:24,280 Speaker 1: Becomes Her, by the way, is a wonderful campy romp 289 00:17:24,320 --> 00:17:26,879 Speaker 1: and holds up. So if you want a Halloween movie 290 00:17:26,920 --> 00:17:28,920 Speaker 1: but you don't want to be too scared, it's definitely 291 00:17:28,960 --> 00:17:31,640 Speaker 1: not for the kiddos. But it's uh, you're right then 292 00:17:31,640 --> 00:17:33,919 Speaker 1: it's not. It's got some good effects, good makeup effects. 293 00:17:33,960 --> 00:17:36,320 Speaker 1: It reminds me of like a Tim Burton movie that 294 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:38,600 Speaker 1: Tim Burton wished he had made, you know what I mean? 295 00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:40,359 Speaker 1: Like it, it's got that vibe to it, and I 296 00:17:40,400 --> 00:17:44,160 Speaker 1: love um. Bruce willis playing kind of a chump. He's 297 00:17:44,200 --> 00:17:47,160 Speaker 1: usually such as like badass, kind of like leading man 298 00:17:47,160 --> 00:17:50,400 Speaker 1: action start, and this one he's a total sucker kind 299 00:17:50,440 --> 00:17:53,240 Speaker 1: of what's the word, like a patsy almost you know, 300 00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:56,119 Speaker 1: it was totally take advantage of by these strong willed women. 301 00:17:56,840 --> 00:18:00,280 Speaker 1: He's the character as a redemptive arc, though spoilers he 302 00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:04,800 Speaker 1: does exactly, But I mean it's it's a slapstick for 303 00:18:04,840 --> 00:18:07,080 Speaker 1: the ages. I wouldn't be surprised if it was originally 304 00:18:07,080 --> 00:18:14,960 Speaker 1: written for the stage. Everybody at the funeral isn't kind 305 00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:20,560 Speaker 1: of an awkward, curb your enthusiasm peep show level, uh position, 306 00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:23,800 Speaker 1: because they're like, that's weird, right, They're looking at each 307 00:18:23,800 --> 00:18:27,160 Speaker 1: other and like he's messing with her neck a lot. Well, 308 00:18:27,200 --> 00:18:31,040 Speaker 1: he's grieving, you know, people express the grief in a 309 00:18:31,160 --> 00:18:34,280 Speaker 1: multitude of ways, so we've just got to help him out. 310 00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:37,639 Speaker 1: It's what I like to call pathological politeness, you know 311 00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:39,720 Speaker 1: what I mean, where it's sort of like you want 312 00:18:39,840 --> 00:18:43,200 Speaker 1: so much not to upset anybody that you just ignore 313 00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:47,359 Speaker 1: huge red flags or just don't want to call out 314 00:18:47,560 --> 00:18:51,080 Speaker 1: when something is very very very wrong to the detriment 315 00:18:51,240 --> 00:18:55,000 Speaker 1: of of all concerns, which again shout up to peep show. 316 00:18:55,320 --> 00:18:59,000 Speaker 1: There is one person, though, who rejects this social convention, 317 00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:04,280 Speaker 1: and that is Elva Zona's mother, Mary Jane. So we 318 00:19:04,280 --> 00:19:06,960 Speaker 1: were talking about the very top of the show slipping 319 00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:12,320 Speaker 1: into that deep sleep and she she already like it's 320 00:19:12,359 --> 00:19:16,520 Speaker 1: public knowledge that her son in law is never gonna 321 00:19:16,520 --> 00:19:20,679 Speaker 1: win the Mary Jane Hayster Award for my Favorite Person. 322 00:19:21,560 --> 00:19:23,639 Speaker 1: But she couldn't quite put her finger on it. She 323 00:19:23,720 --> 00:19:26,520 Speaker 1: just there was something off about the dude, something she 324 00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:30,000 Speaker 1: didn't cotton to. And u Zona. She was she was 325 00:19:30,119 --> 00:19:32,640 Speaker 1: very close to Elva Zona, that was not only her 326 00:19:32,640 --> 00:19:37,840 Speaker 1: only daughter but also functionally her best friend. And so 327 00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:41,560 Speaker 1: she felt kind of abandoned when Zona had moved to 328 00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:45,280 Speaker 1: live says Mill on the other side of the county. 329 00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:50,160 Speaker 1: And maybe it was just a mother's intuition, which rarely 330 00:19:50,240 --> 00:19:52,919 Speaker 1: talked things up to, but she had this feeling, she 331 00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:58,600 Speaker 1: had a certitude that this guy Trout had something to 332 00:19:58,680 --> 00:20:00,560 Speaker 1: do with her daughter's death. You know what I mean, 333 00:20:00,600 --> 00:20:03,879 Speaker 1: she's watching him with the neck oh big time and 334 00:20:03,880 --> 00:20:06,960 Speaker 1: and okay, and so you know, being a woman of God, 335 00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:10,959 Speaker 1: she decided to prey on it. And she did. She 336 00:20:11,040 --> 00:20:13,399 Speaker 1: prayed for nights and nights and nights and nights that 337 00:20:13,480 --> 00:20:17,600 Speaker 1: her daughter would somehow give her a sign from the 338 00:20:17,680 --> 00:20:20,879 Speaker 1: Great beyond uh as to as to what really happened, 339 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:23,000 Speaker 1: or at the very least, you know, give her a 340 00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:25,639 Speaker 1: little closure and say goodbye. Because at the you know, 341 00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:28,880 Speaker 1: on the most basic level, she didn't buy the heart 342 00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:33,159 Speaker 1: attack story. She didn't really necessarily hadn't really keyed in 343 00:20:33,280 --> 00:20:36,399 Speaker 1: on anything else or any specific foul play, but she 344 00:20:36,480 --> 00:20:39,720 Speaker 1: knew that didn't make any sense. So according to Mary 345 00:20:39,800 --> 00:20:45,000 Speaker 1: Jane herself, she prayed on this relentlessly for for multiple nights, 346 00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:48,159 Speaker 1: and then that one night that we set up at 347 00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:51,960 Speaker 1: the very top of the show in seven, just after 348 00:20:52,480 --> 00:20:56,439 Speaker 1: when her daughter was laid to rest um, she saw 349 00:20:57,000 --> 00:21:03,680 Speaker 1: a strange light enter into her view. Was she asleep, 350 00:21:04,400 --> 00:21:07,520 Speaker 1: was she awake? She wasn't really sure, But what she 351 00:21:07,600 --> 00:21:10,960 Speaker 1: did know was that she then saw her daughter's form 352 00:21:11,119 --> 00:21:15,240 Speaker 1: appeared to her and began to tell a very interesting 353 00:21:15,480 --> 00:21:20,600 Speaker 1: and upsetting story. Yes, Mary Jane claimed that her daughter 354 00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:24,399 Speaker 1: appeared to her in a dream, not once, but four 355 00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:29,199 Speaker 1: separate times, four consecutive nights, to tell her story. And 356 00:21:30,359 --> 00:21:34,520 Speaker 1: the story she told was grizzly, disturbing, and tragic. She 357 00:21:34,560 --> 00:21:38,400 Speaker 1: would appear as that bright light, assume a human form, 358 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:42,280 Speaker 1: and the room would fall into a chill. So Elva 359 00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:46,840 Speaker 1: Zona's ghost told her mother that Erasmus or Trout had 360 00:21:46,920 --> 00:21:51,840 Speaker 1: abused her severely and that one night, in a rage, 361 00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:55,920 Speaker 1: he attacked her because get this, he thought she hadn't 362 00:21:56,080 --> 00:22:01,280 Speaker 1: made any meat for dinner, because she served portedly apple butter, 363 00:22:02,200 --> 00:22:05,639 Speaker 1: spread of preserves and bread, and so in that rage, 364 00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:09,200 Speaker 1: the ghost says he had broken her neck and her 365 00:22:09,240 --> 00:22:13,320 Speaker 1: head had turned. Death becomes her style completely around or 366 00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:17,280 Speaker 1: exorcist style. Pick your favorite of the Halloween films. There, yes, 367 00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:19,239 Speaker 1: it's exactly and by the way, but I do love 368 00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:21,520 Speaker 1: a good apple butter. I know it's not for everybody, 369 00:22:21,560 --> 00:22:24,800 Speaker 1: but I certainly wouldn't you know, break somebody's neck over 370 00:22:24,880 --> 00:22:27,600 Speaker 1: serving the apple butter. How do you feel about the preserve? 371 00:22:27,840 --> 00:22:30,359 Speaker 1: I yeah, I love I love preserves. I'm good with 372 00:22:30,560 --> 00:22:33,359 Speaker 1: a good apple butter. I'm I'm a seasonal person myself. 373 00:22:33,400 --> 00:22:37,440 Speaker 1: I've never I've never been so moved by rage at 374 00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:40,840 Speaker 1: food that I would break someone's neck or you know, 375 00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:45,119 Speaker 1: even even punch them. I might have in in in 376 00:22:45,160 --> 00:22:47,600 Speaker 1: a show of joy, I may have kissed someone or 377 00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:51,160 Speaker 1: like loudly clapped in the air or something. If there's 378 00:22:51,160 --> 00:22:54,720 Speaker 1: something I love, But that's that's horrible. And then didn't 379 00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:57,520 Speaker 1: she say it's not the first time he had abused her? Well, yeah, 380 00:22:57,520 --> 00:23:00,480 Speaker 1: and subsequent nights, um, she kind of piece meal this 381 00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:03,840 Speaker 1: the full picture together of the real story, and she 382 00:23:03,880 --> 00:23:08,000 Speaker 1: did reveal that her husband had often abused her and 383 00:23:08,080 --> 00:23:11,960 Speaker 1: beating her and treated her absolutely horribly, that he had 384 00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:18,720 Speaker 1: a nightmarishly um foul temper, and that she was essentially 385 00:23:18,760 --> 00:23:22,719 Speaker 1: living in fear of him, and it was he was 386 00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:27,080 Speaker 1: a completely you know, unreasonable person that she couldn't talk 387 00:23:27,119 --> 00:23:30,640 Speaker 1: down once he got into these rages. And again this 388 00:23:30,720 --> 00:23:34,320 Speaker 1: is all from Mary Jane's own recollection. Zona apparently went 389 00:23:34,359 --> 00:23:39,000 Speaker 1: on too to tell her about the neighborhood, because again 390 00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:41,679 Speaker 1: they she didn't live there in the same town as 391 00:23:41,680 --> 00:23:43,760 Speaker 1: her mom anymore. She'd moved out on her own. And 392 00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:45,439 Speaker 1: even though we described it as just being on the 393 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:48,000 Speaker 1: other side of the county, you know, in these days 394 00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:50,720 Speaker 1: and in a rural place like this, that would have 395 00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:54,640 Speaker 1: been a significant distance. Yeah, and after it would tell 396 00:23:54,680 --> 00:23:58,399 Speaker 1: an installment of the story, the ghost would vanish. The 397 00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:02,439 Speaker 1: interesting thing here, uh, and something that's different from a 398 00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:06,840 Speaker 1: lot of regional folk tales of ghostly revenge or something. 399 00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:10,040 Speaker 1: The interesting thing here is that this ghost is very 400 00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:15,680 Speaker 1: specific on how her neck was broken. She says that 401 00:24:15,880 --> 00:24:20,320 Speaker 1: trout snapped it at the first joint, and first he 402 00:24:20,520 --> 00:24:23,120 Speaker 1: squeezed for some time and then snapped it and then 403 00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:27,600 Speaker 1: as if to really drive the points home. Mary Jane, 404 00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:32,160 Speaker 1: according to her testimony, on the final and fourth night, 405 00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:36,600 Speaker 1: watched as Zona's ghost twisted her head around a hundred 406 00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:40,520 Speaker 1: and eight d degrees to show just how severely broken 407 00:24:40,920 --> 00:24:45,240 Speaker 1: her neck was. Terrifying visions, ben, especially if you're beloved 408 00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:50,040 Speaker 1: and uh and and late daughter, to be showing you 409 00:24:50,080 --> 00:24:54,800 Speaker 1: such such sights, as they say, such things to show you. Um. 410 00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:57,440 Speaker 1: But yeah, but this was, you know, in her mind, 411 00:24:58,160 --> 00:25:00,640 Speaker 1: just what her she's been asking for and in her prayers. 412 00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:05,800 Speaker 1: And she took this information, if we could call it that, um, 413 00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:08,920 Speaker 1: and went to the local prosecutor, a gentleman by the 414 00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:13,160 Speaker 1: name of John Preston, over in Louisbourg, and she spent 415 00:25:13,200 --> 00:25:16,720 Speaker 1: an entire afternoon trying to explain the story to him 416 00:25:16,760 --> 00:25:20,560 Speaker 1: and convincing him to open up the case again. Yeah, 417 00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:24,439 Speaker 1: and to this point he's still in We do not 418 00:25:24,640 --> 00:25:30,920 Speaker 1: know whether Prosecutor Preston believed Mary Jane's story, but she 419 00:25:31,160 --> 00:25:37,720 Speaker 1: was incredibly tenacious and persistent and again certain. She began 420 00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:41,000 Speaker 1: to convince him that, regardless of whether or not he 421 00:25:41,040 --> 00:25:44,840 Speaker 1: believed in ghosts, she was definitely not lying. She was 422 00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:48,680 Speaker 1: being sincere. So he went around town and started asking 423 00:25:48,800 --> 00:25:53,360 Speaker 1: some questions. And that's when Preston starts putting together some 424 00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:57,959 Speaker 1: puzzle pieces. Boy, this guy was sure strange when the 425 00:25:58,040 --> 00:26:02,399 Speaker 1: doctor examined his dead spouse, boy who was even stranger 426 00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:07,919 Speaker 1: at the funeral. And hey, wait, doctor Knapp, upon you 427 00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:14,440 Speaker 1: know focus questioning, says, well, my examination was I guess 428 00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:18,120 Speaker 1: I would I would call it eight percent, but not. Yeah, 429 00:26:18,160 --> 00:26:21,959 Speaker 1: he thinks back on that detail of of of trout 430 00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:24,399 Speaker 1: getting agitated when he was making his way up to 431 00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:28,159 Speaker 1: the neck area, and he literally says something to the 432 00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:33,080 Speaker 1: effect of why do you mention it? The husband wouldn't 433 00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:35,800 Speaker 1: let me examine her neck. You don't suppose that might 434 00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:39,920 Speaker 1: be suspicious? Do you don't? Don't bless your little heart, 435 00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:44,199 Speaker 1: doctor Knapp. I pictured like a Mr. Magoo esque, you know, 436 00:26:44,440 --> 00:26:48,120 Speaker 1: like good hearted guy country doctor. But this you're right, 437 00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:52,399 Speaker 1: you're right. Well it's uh it's an interesting character. It's like, 438 00:26:52,600 --> 00:26:55,880 Speaker 1: huh no, well I don't you mention it? Uh? Next 439 00:26:55,920 --> 00:27:00,399 Speaker 1: are important? I am a doctor. That's weird. Anyway, he 440 00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:04,920 Speaker 1: wants some apple butter, apple Butterhi country apple butter? Right, 441 00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:08,480 Speaker 1: and uh this admission not this apple butter this admission 442 00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:11,440 Speaker 1: was enough for the prosecutor to say, Okay, we need 443 00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:15,160 Speaker 1: to order a complete autopsy. I can justify this because 444 00:27:15,200 --> 00:27:18,359 Speaker 1: now I'm not saying I'm ordering this because somebody believes 445 00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:21,240 Speaker 1: in a ghost. I'm saying it because the doctor says 446 00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:24,840 Speaker 1: they didn't get they didn't get a chance to do 447 00:27:24,880 --> 00:27:28,320 Speaker 1: an adequate autopsy. Yeah, that's right, you know, it's it's 448 00:27:28,320 --> 00:27:31,360 Speaker 1: certainly not a pleasant thing to have to have your 449 00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:35,879 Speaker 1: loved one exhumed, you know, for a second autopsy. But again, 450 00:27:36,040 --> 00:27:38,080 Speaker 1: it was the mother that was asking for it, so 451 00:27:38,119 --> 00:27:39,920 Speaker 1: it's not like anyone would have made a fuss about 452 00:27:39,960 --> 00:27:42,160 Speaker 1: it other than her. We don't really hear about any 453 00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:44,880 Speaker 1: other family of her, So speak up. Although I imagined 454 00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:49,679 Speaker 1: the deceased former husband probably wouldn't have been too pleased 455 00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:54,240 Speaker 1: about this news. Oh he was steamed. He was livid. 456 00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:57,359 Speaker 1: This is already a guy who has a temper problem, right, 457 00:27:57,640 --> 00:28:03,040 Speaker 1: so he is doubling down. He uh. The Greenbrier Independent 458 00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:06,400 Speaker 1: you can read part of this on Appalachian history dot net. 459 00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:12,640 Speaker 1: The Greenbrier Independence says that Erasmus quote vigorously complained, but 460 00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:16,760 Speaker 1: then eventually the authority said, look, son, you can have 461 00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:19,199 Speaker 1: all the problems you want, But if you don't go 462 00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:22,920 Speaker 1: to this inquest willingly, we're going to force you to 463 00:28:23,000 --> 00:28:26,520 Speaker 1: go so by hook or by crook, your choice. And uh, 464 00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:30,520 Speaker 1: he said, look, I know you all are gonna arrist me, 465 00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:33,960 Speaker 1: but they will not be able to prove I did it. Whoops, 466 00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:41,640 Speaker 1: I know what a dumb ass, not clever Erasmus, You 467 00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:43,600 Speaker 1: don't I keep thinking, I think I say this out loud, 468 00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:48,280 Speaker 1: Erasmus irascible. Ah, yes, yes, yes, doesn't that mean kind 469 00:28:48,280 --> 00:28:51,640 Speaker 1: of grouchy or like a little bit cantankerous. It means 470 00:28:51,800 --> 00:28:55,520 Speaker 1: being easily angered. It's quite apt a spelled differently. It's 471 00:28:55,560 --> 00:28:58,200 Speaker 1: with an eye if I'm not mistaken. But I'm with it. 472 00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:01,240 Speaker 1: I'm with it. So he based really played himself, as 473 00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:05,200 Speaker 1: the kids would say, uh, and this he's he was 474 00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:09,360 Speaker 1: right though. This wasn't like the age of forensics, you know, 475 00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:12,480 Speaker 1: where they could tie him to the crime scene with 476 00:29:12,560 --> 00:29:15,560 Speaker 1: like you know, d n A samples. It was all circumstantial, 477 00:29:15,840 --> 00:29:19,360 Speaker 1: all of this stuff. But the findings were a real 478 00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:30,040 Speaker 1: bad look for a boy erasthmus trout shoe. Yeah. So 479 00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:34,000 Speaker 1: Nap and two other doctors lay out the corpse in 480 00:29:34,080 --> 00:29:37,080 Speaker 1: the schoolhouse of the town. I know this sounds like 481 00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:39,480 Speaker 1: a very strange place to put a corpse, but in 482 00:29:39,600 --> 00:29:44,600 Speaker 1: Appalachia at the time, in very small pounds, this this 483 00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:49,160 Speaker 1: sort of stuff was not uncommon. Many structures were multi use, 484 00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:56,280 Speaker 1: aside from maybe the local church, and they give it examination. 485 00:29:56,760 --> 00:30:01,720 Speaker 1: The Pocahontas Times later reports on this autopsy that you're 486 00:30:01,720 --> 00:30:05,040 Speaker 1: describing nol and it is worse than bad. It is 487 00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:09,720 Speaker 1: what Orwell would call double plus un good for shoe. Uh. 488 00:30:10,080 --> 00:30:13,320 Speaker 1: They say the discovery was made that the neck was 489 00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:16,480 Speaker 1: broken and the windpipe mashed on the throat were the 490 00:30:16,600 --> 00:30:20,560 Speaker 1: marks of fingers, indicating that she had been choken. That's 491 00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:23,280 Speaker 1: their word also like mashed. I think that's a very 492 00:30:23,280 --> 00:30:27,400 Speaker 1: creative wording there. It's true that the neck was dislocated 493 00:30:27,440 --> 00:30:30,680 Speaker 1: between the first and second vertebrate, remember what the ghost said, 494 00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:33,680 Speaker 1: and that the ligaments were torn and ruptured, the wind 495 00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:36,120 Speaker 1: pipe had been crushed at a point in front of 496 00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:40,239 Speaker 1: the neck. This is all exactly what Mary Jane was 497 00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:44,320 Speaker 1: said the ghost of her daughter told her. But like 498 00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:49,160 Speaker 1: Sho you know, was saying, trout, there was really no evidence. 499 00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:53,640 Speaker 1: All of this was circumstantial um nothing specifically tying him 500 00:30:53,960 --> 00:31:00,000 Speaker 1: to the murder. Uh, even though people recalled his strange behavior, um, 501 00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:03,600 Speaker 1: and it certainly stuck around in that prosecutor's mind too, 502 00:31:03,840 --> 00:31:08,000 Speaker 1: and it did cast a little bit of suspicion on him. Um. 503 00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:14,560 Speaker 1: But it was pretty interesting that Elva's mother, Elva Zona's mother, um, 504 00:31:14,680 --> 00:31:19,080 Speaker 1: was able to describe the murder with such graphic detail. 505 00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:23,320 Speaker 1: So it almost made her a bit of a suspect. 506 00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:27,280 Speaker 1: That's a really good point, yeah, because who else would 507 00:31:27,320 --> 00:31:32,720 Speaker 1: have this information? Right? Curiouser and curiouser. And there was 508 00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:36,760 Speaker 1: even a sense that perhaps, uh, she was just making 509 00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:41,440 Speaker 1: up this ghost story in an effort to frame Shoe um, 510 00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:45,320 Speaker 1: because you know, I mean, this wasn't It's not like superstition, 511 00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:48,560 Speaker 1: random muck. But it was a time where I think 512 00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:50,800 Speaker 1: it would be a little easier to swallow a story 513 00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:54,320 Speaker 1: like this than maybe in a court of law today. Yeah, 514 00:31:54,560 --> 00:31:56,440 Speaker 1: you know, I mean we're look look at we're not 515 00:31:56,560 --> 00:32:02,360 Speaker 1: quite into the century. Uh. People have a much closer 516 00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:07,520 Speaker 1: and more mediate relationship with folklore, right with haints, with 517 00:32:07,560 --> 00:32:12,080 Speaker 1: Willow the wisp and so on. So Ben was it Trout? 518 00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:17,160 Speaker 1: Was it perhaps her own mother that put an end 519 00:32:17,840 --> 00:32:24,080 Speaker 1: to the young life of Elva Zona Hairston? Uh name shoe. 520 00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:27,840 Speaker 1: I for kept trying. Now I speaking like a late 521 00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:32,920 Speaker 1: eight hundreds newspaper men, Well, you gotta half to wait 522 00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:38,520 Speaker 1: until the next episode to find out. This concludes Part 523 00:32:38,680 --> 00:32:43,360 Speaker 1: one of The Greenbrier Ghosts. We've given you the blow 524 00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:47,360 Speaker 1: by blow, not a punt, not an intentional pun, but 525 00:32:47,400 --> 00:32:50,880 Speaker 1: we we've given you this step by step order of events. 526 00:32:51,040 --> 00:32:55,160 Speaker 1: Let's call this the setup. We have ghosts, we have crime, 527 00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:57,960 Speaker 1: we have a mystery of foot, and we hope that 528 00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:03,400 Speaker 1: you join us. Uh and what will probably be a Thursday. No, 529 00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:05,280 Speaker 1: no to predict the future, but we'll probably be a 530 00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:09,120 Speaker 1: Thursday for part two of the Greenbrier Ghosts when we 531 00:33:09,240 --> 00:33:14,840 Speaker 1: add some strange, extraordinary plot twist to the mix. We 532 00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:17,480 Speaker 1: haven't even gotten to court yet. We can't wait to 533 00:33:17,520 --> 00:33:20,720 Speaker 1: explore what happens next with you in part two of 534 00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:23,600 Speaker 1: our episode. And you might even get a little dramatic 535 00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:27,120 Speaker 1: courtroom re enactment. I can neither confirm nor deny that 536 00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:29,640 Speaker 1: that's going to happen, but uh, it's certainly not off 537 00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:32,840 Speaker 1: the table. In the meantime. Thank you so much, super 538 00:33:32,840 --> 00:33:37,320 Speaker 1: producer Casey Pegram for being our partner in crime or 539 00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:43,239 Speaker 1: crime solving spooky crime solving, but whatever, thanks, I've got 540 00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:49,239 Speaker 1: nickname list, super producer, Casey Cadaver, Pegram love it. I 541 00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:54,040 Speaker 1: am still noel Uh Satan Brown because my middle name 542 00:33:54,080 --> 00:33:56,719 Speaker 1: is actually Christian, so it's still kind of a pun I. 543 00:33:56,840 --> 00:34:01,040 Speaker 1: And I also, I've really it's embarrassing, just made a 544 00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:03,959 Speaker 1: big gass list of these. So I had Nold Nosparatto 545 00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:06,520 Speaker 1: Brown love it. I'll tell you could have multiple nicknames. 546 00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:09,799 Speaker 1: It's it's just it's yeah, what about you, Ben uh Uh. 547 00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:13,640 Speaker 1: You've got this policy though, of not nicknaming yourself, and 548 00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:18,279 Speaker 1: I feel woefully underprepared. Ben Bone saw love that. Oh 549 00:34:18,320 --> 00:34:21,280 Speaker 1: that's good. Or I'm trying to think of an actual 550 00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:24,640 Speaker 1: monster bones saws, which just grizzly. Well, we'll get to it. 551 00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:28,880 Speaker 1: We'll get to it. Thanks of course to Alex Willow, 552 00:34:28,920 --> 00:34:34,200 Speaker 1: the Whisp, williams Uh, let's see. Thanks to Jonathan Strickland 553 00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:37,040 Speaker 1: a k A. The Cuister a k A. The What 554 00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:40,400 Speaker 1: do you think for him? How about the Ripper? Yeah? 555 00:34:40,560 --> 00:34:46,640 Speaker 1: The Ripsters? Yeah, I got one for you. Christopher unleashed 556 00:34:46,640 --> 00:34:51,439 Speaker 1: the crack in hasiotis dope. Yeah, that's gonna be big 557 00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:54,399 Speaker 1: for him. That's gonna be big for him, to hope, 558 00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:57,799 Speaker 1: so man one, I can't wait. Guys, and you think 559 00:34:57,840 --> 00:35:00,399 Speaker 1: you're just gonna magically turn around on day one, all 560 00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:04,040 Speaker 1: of the stink of just gonna be like washed away, 561 00:35:04,120 --> 00:35:08,440 Speaker 1: like tears in the rain. My fear handidly is that 562 00:35:08,840 --> 00:35:13,560 Speaker 1: we may well find ourselves in looking back on is 563 00:35:13,560 --> 00:35:18,640 Speaker 1: not that bad? Ah, fun good thing. We got some fun, 564 00:35:18,760 --> 00:35:23,240 Speaker 1: entertaining Halloween content to keep your spirits up or down 565 00:35:23,480 --> 00:35:25,399 Speaker 1: or what what have you. By the way, check out 566 00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:29,400 Speaker 1: our buddy Matt Frederick's amazing show Thirteen Days of Halloween, 567 00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:32,600 Speaker 1: available now wherever you get podcasts. It's three D binaural 568 00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:37,280 Speaker 1: audio spooky storytelling experience with a couple of real chillers, 569 00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:43,160 Speaker 1: written by you Ben Bolan of Ridiculous History. Wow, thank you. Yeah, 570 00:35:43,320 --> 00:35:47,920 Speaker 1: Matt has done amazing work on this. Uh now, Casey Nolan, 571 00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:51,240 Speaker 1: I can say that we're technically co workers with Keegan 572 00:35:51,480 --> 00:35:54,600 Speaker 1: Michael Key from Key and Peel, who was in the 573 00:35:54,600 --> 00:35:56,440 Speaker 1: first season of Fargo, by the way, only in the 574 00:35:56,520 --> 00:35:59,279 Speaker 1: last last stretch of it full circle. You were doing 575 00:35:59,400 --> 00:36:02,200 Speaker 1: so much for far Ago, man, I wish they appreciated you. 576 00:36:02,480 --> 00:36:04,960 Speaker 1: I just think it's I missed it the first time around. 577 00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:07,560 Speaker 1: I saw the second season and I adored it, and 578 00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:09,960 Speaker 1: I'd never watched the first season and Billy about Thornton's 579 00:36:10,040 --> 00:36:14,920 Speaker 1: character in that series, unreal love, unbelievably malevol at, one 580 00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:18,640 Speaker 1: of the best. Like would you call his character chaotic evil? Ben? 581 00:36:18,719 --> 00:36:20,640 Speaker 1: Because he just wants to, like watch the world burn 582 00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:22,880 Speaker 1: and laugh at it. It's all for his own amusement. 583 00:36:23,120 --> 00:36:26,319 Speaker 1: I would He's like a bit more of a restrained 584 00:36:26,640 --> 00:36:31,799 Speaker 1: judge Holden from uh Blood Meridian by Quarterback McCarthy, which 585 00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:35,520 Speaker 1: James Franco keeps saying, he's good to adapt story for 586 00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:38,800 Speaker 1: another day. We want to hear your spooky nicknames. A 587 00:36:38,840 --> 00:36:41,800 Speaker 1: lot of our best ideas come from you, ridiculous historians. 588 00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:44,200 Speaker 1: Tell us about him on the internet. You can find us. 589 00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:48,439 Speaker 1: We love to point to ridiculous historians. Our Facebook page 590 00:36:48,480 --> 00:36:51,520 Speaker 1: where you can meet your fellow listeners a k our 591 00:36:51,640 --> 00:36:53,920 Speaker 1: favorite part of the show. You can also find us 592 00:36:53,960 --> 00:36:57,600 Speaker 1: as individuals if you so please, you may. I am 593 00:36:57,640 --> 00:37:00,600 Speaker 1: at how now Noel Brown on Instagram And I don't 594 00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:02,680 Speaker 1: really mess with Twitter much, but I've been I've been 595 00:37:02,760 --> 00:37:04,719 Speaker 1: using it to keep up with things, but I don't 596 00:37:04,719 --> 00:37:08,080 Speaker 1: really post them. More of a visual learner and express 597 00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:10,520 Speaker 1: or how about you, Ben, Yeah, I'm on I'm on 598 00:37:10,640 --> 00:37:14,479 Speaker 1: Instagram as at Ben Bolen, and I'm on Twitter as 599 00:37:14,600 --> 00:37:18,640 Speaker 1: at Ben boleyn hs W. So there you can read 600 00:37:18,719 --> 00:37:22,880 Speaker 1: my Jack Handy style deep thoughts like uh, maybe I 601 00:37:22,880 --> 00:37:26,240 Speaker 1: should have paid all those blockbuster fees with late fees, 602 00:37:26,280 --> 00:37:27,960 Speaker 1: with the world be a different place. I don't know. 603 00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:30,200 Speaker 1: It's a good question, Ben, one that we all should 604 00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:33,799 Speaker 1: be pondering, and until next time, ponder away. We'll see 605 00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:44,279 Speaker 1: you then. For more podcasts for my heart Radio, visit 606 00:37:44,280 --> 00:37:46,920 Speaker 1: the I heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you 607 00:37:47,040 --> 00:37:48,400 Speaker 1: listen to your favorite shows.