1 00:00:06,880 --> 00:00:09,600 Speaker 1: Hey, welcome in. This is all ball and uh it's 2 00:00:09,640 --> 00:00:12,160 Speaker 1: an all boss basketball podcast. I'm your host, Doug Gottlieb. 3 00:00:12,400 --> 00:00:16,280 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for downloading, subscribing rating. Our numbers 4 00:00:16,320 --> 00:00:18,880 Speaker 1: continue to jump and we're really proud to be part 5 00:00:18,880 --> 00:00:21,480 Speaker 1: of the Herd podcast Network. Quick reminder if you love 6 00:00:21,520 --> 00:00:23,440 Speaker 1: all sports, and we do do a bunch of basketball, 7 00:00:23,480 --> 00:00:26,560 Speaker 1: we also do football and occasionally baseball. These nugleheads finally 8 00:00:26,560 --> 00:00:29,080 Speaker 1: getting back on the baseball field. You can tune into 9 00:00:29,080 --> 00:00:32,160 Speaker 1: The Doug Gottlieb Show daily three to six Eastern time, 10 00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:35,120 Speaker 1: twelve to three Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, the I 11 00:00:35,240 --> 00:00:37,760 Speaker 1: Heart Radio app, or wherever your download podcast. You can 12 00:00:37,760 --> 00:00:41,800 Speaker 1: download the Doug Gotlieb Show podcast as well. So Whop 13 00:00:41,920 --> 00:00:45,160 Speaker 1: is back? We're like a month out and my guest 14 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:47,880 Speaker 1: today is Mark jan Now it's not an NBA guest. 15 00:00:47,960 --> 00:00:50,000 Speaker 1: We will throw some more guests at you and I 16 00:00:50,040 --> 00:00:52,440 Speaker 1: think you will love it. But uh, we're talking to 17 00:00:52,479 --> 00:00:54,840 Speaker 1: Tours a lot about kind of his upbringing as a 18 00:00:54,880 --> 00:00:57,240 Speaker 1: player and a coach, growing up in Topeak, Kansas, playing 19 00:00:57,240 --> 00:00:59,920 Speaker 1: for Larry Brown, coaching with Roy Williams, and then becoming 20 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:02,080 Speaker 1: a head coach in his own right. Kind of the 21 00:01:02,200 --> 00:01:05,119 Speaker 1: The juxtaposition of of those two coaches and those two 22 00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:09,000 Speaker 1: styles is is fascinating to me. But before we get 23 00:01:09,040 --> 00:01:11,039 Speaker 1: to Turs and I think you're really gonna enjoy the 24 00:01:11,040 --> 00:01:13,480 Speaker 1: the the the interview, let me let me give you 25 00:01:13,800 --> 00:01:16,120 Speaker 1: just a couple of thoughts about the NBA getting back 26 00:01:16,200 --> 00:01:19,760 Speaker 1: underway in Orlando. I've said it before on TV, on radio, 27 00:01:19,800 --> 00:01:21,920 Speaker 1: and I think on this podcast, I am not a 28 00:01:21,959 --> 00:01:24,280 Speaker 1: proponent of the bubble idea. I think it's one of 29 00:01:24,280 --> 00:01:27,520 Speaker 1: those Hey, two and a half months ago, this was 30 00:01:27,560 --> 00:01:29,600 Speaker 1: a great idea for two and a half months ago. 31 00:01:30,120 --> 00:01:32,280 Speaker 1: But as time goes on and people start to go 32 00:01:32,360 --> 00:01:34,640 Speaker 1: out and about there's a reason so many people are 33 00:01:34,640 --> 00:01:38,400 Speaker 1: popping up and testing positive for COVID nineteen. Because we're 34 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:43,520 Speaker 1: no longer under quarantine. Athletes are not at a great risk. 35 00:01:43,560 --> 00:01:46,560 Speaker 1: That just that the numbers don't tell you. And if 36 00:01:46,560 --> 00:01:48,320 Speaker 1: you're going to have them away from their homes, which 37 00:01:48,320 --> 00:01:51,120 Speaker 1: you can, it provides them not you know, seeing their 38 00:01:51,120 --> 00:01:54,160 Speaker 1: parents or you know, some of their loved ones or whatever. 39 00:01:54,440 --> 00:01:56,720 Speaker 1: I mean, Look, there's ways to do this at home 40 00:01:56,800 --> 00:01:59,960 Speaker 1: sites like baseball is doing. I don't understand what basket 41 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:03,160 Speaker 1: ball is doing. Baseball obviously not a contact spoard. Basketball 42 00:02:03,280 --> 00:02:05,880 Speaker 1: is a contact sport. But I feel like the quicker 43 00:02:05,920 --> 00:02:07,800 Speaker 1: you get back, the more we could have been treating 44 00:02:07,840 --> 00:02:10,320 Speaker 1: guys and getting them through this, and and and you know, 45 00:02:10,360 --> 00:02:14,000 Speaker 1: now you run the risk of players coming down with 46 00:02:14,040 --> 00:02:16,000 Speaker 1: COVID if they can come down with COVID nine team 47 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:19,919 Speaker 1: while they're they're throwing a complete loop, complete wrench into 48 00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:23,680 Speaker 1: what is a weird plan. Additionally, you're going down to 49 00:02:23,680 --> 00:02:25,840 Speaker 1: Disney World, which as of now, the plan is for 50 00:02:25,880 --> 00:02:28,320 Speaker 1: the place to be open, with the exception of where 51 00:02:28,360 --> 00:02:31,880 Speaker 1: the basketball bubble exists. That that strikes me as odd. 52 00:02:32,639 --> 00:02:35,920 Speaker 1: Um you know do I think players have to be 53 00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:38,679 Speaker 1: around their families, and many of them have young, young families. 54 00:02:39,800 --> 00:02:41,520 Speaker 1: If you could do it, that'd be great. I think 55 00:02:41,520 --> 00:02:43,359 Speaker 1: they're supposed to be in four days of quarantine, which 56 00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:45,080 Speaker 1: is a lot. If you do it, that'd be great. 57 00:02:46,400 --> 00:02:49,520 Speaker 1: If you don't do it, you can't do it. Is 58 00:02:49,520 --> 00:02:52,880 Speaker 1: it that big a deal? Right? Isn't that big a deal? 59 00:02:52,919 --> 00:02:58,080 Speaker 1: Because you've been home for three months, You've been around 60 00:02:58,120 --> 00:03:01,480 Speaker 1: your children when normally you're the meat of the season. 61 00:03:02,600 --> 00:03:05,680 Speaker 1: I know Janice was a big proponent of having families 62 00:03:05,720 --> 00:03:09,400 Speaker 1: there because he just had a baby, but you know. 63 00:03:09,720 --> 00:03:11,840 Speaker 1: I look, if he had just had a baby, he 64 00:03:11,840 --> 00:03:14,160 Speaker 1: would have been getting ready for the NBA Finals anyway, 65 00:03:14,200 --> 00:03:19,639 Speaker 1: Like that's kind of poor planning. It just is. And 66 00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:23,560 Speaker 1: as for Avery Bradley, I I don't agree with the 67 00:03:23,639 --> 00:03:29,359 Speaker 1: idea of of trying to trying to have social justice 68 00:03:29,440 --> 00:03:32,560 Speaker 1: and trying to find ways to donate your time instead 69 00:03:32,600 --> 00:03:35,240 Speaker 1: of playing basketball because basketball's distraction. I don't agree with 70 00:03:35,280 --> 00:03:38,000 Speaker 1: that at all. I think it's an argument which I'm 71 00:03:38,000 --> 00:03:40,280 Speaker 1: willing to nod my head and want to listen. But 72 00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:42,560 Speaker 1: then when I look at him, like, no, that's not really. 73 00:03:43,680 --> 00:03:46,920 Speaker 1: The best way that you can get you have your 74 00:03:46,960 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 1: voice heard is to play in an NBA championship, isn't it. 75 00:03:50,040 --> 00:03:52,160 Speaker 1: I know. Yeah, by the way, use all the money 76 00:03:52,240 --> 00:03:54,320 Speaker 1: that you make or whatever amount of money you make 77 00:03:54,640 --> 00:03:56,920 Speaker 1: and donate to causes, and then you're gonna have a 78 00:03:57,080 --> 00:04:01,800 Speaker 1: lengthy off season at some point. So I I don't 79 00:04:02,600 --> 00:04:04,800 Speaker 1: And and the problem with David Bradley's thing is not 80 00:04:04,920 --> 00:04:08,280 Speaker 1: just that he's doing it for social justice. He's also saying, oh, yeah, 81 00:04:08,280 --> 00:04:10,839 Speaker 1: by the way, my six year old kid has respiratory 82 00:04:10,880 --> 00:04:14,560 Speaker 1: issues and he can't go, so we're not gonna go, like, 83 00:04:14,600 --> 00:04:16,600 Speaker 1: which is it is, are you blaming your kid or 84 00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:21,599 Speaker 1: you blaming social injustice, because because you're splitting votes by 85 00:04:21,640 --> 00:04:25,679 Speaker 1: saying both, no matter how real it is, I think 86 00:04:26,480 --> 00:04:29,800 Speaker 1: he's kicking away a golden opportunity. And look, he has 87 00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:31,680 Speaker 1: a player options, so it's not like there's anything the 88 00:04:31,720 --> 00:04:34,479 Speaker 1: Lakers can do if they don't want him back. But 89 00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:37,280 Speaker 1: it would be very, very awkward to have him back 90 00:04:37,320 --> 00:04:41,039 Speaker 1: next year considering what they have to do defensively at 91 00:04:41,200 --> 00:04:44,280 Speaker 1: at the positions that he guards. I Lou Williams in 92 00:04:44,320 --> 00:04:47,279 Speaker 1: the Western Conference Finals is unguardable, Like, man, I wish 93 00:04:47,320 --> 00:04:51,000 Speaker 1: we had somebody who is a great guard, perimeter defender. 94 00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:53,400 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, what happened, Avory Bradley. He's at home because 95 00:04:53,440 --> 00:04:55,360 Speaker 1: a six year old kid from Austin can't make the trip. 96 00:04:55,440 --> 00:04:59,560 Speaker 1: Like what your kids can't make most trips. This one's 97 00:04:59,600 --> 00:05:02,280 Speaker 1: just longer than others. So so look, I'm gonna call 98 00:05:02,320 --> 00:05:05,760 Speaker 1: it a bullshit here on on Avery Bradley, like you 99 00:05:05,880 --> 00:05:08,560 Speaker 1: partnered up with Carrie Irving and said that social injustice 100 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:12,920 Speaker 1: you think think that this is a distraction to play basketball, 101 00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:16,800 Speaker 1: Like if that's your sole reason behind not wanting to 102 00:05:16,880 --> 00:05:21,600 Speaker 1: play for the Lakers, thinking that's more important, I'll dismantle 103 00:05:21,640 --> 00:05:24,760 Speaker 1: that in a second um and I greatly disagree with that. Look, 104 00:05:24,760 --> 00:05:26,560 Speaker 1: you're allowed to have all of these opinions, and I'm 105 00:05:26,600 --> 00:05:28,200 Speaker 1: allowed to tell you I disagree with your opinion, and 106 00:05:28,240 --> 00:05:30,960 Speaker 1: I think I feel like you're you're wrong in this. 107 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:34,359 Speaker 1: But whatever, if that's your sole reason, why are you 108 00:05:34,480 --> 00:05:36,520 Speaker 1: throwing out that you're six year old won't be able 109 00:05:36,560 --> 00:05:39,680 Speaker 1: to Like the idea you're six year old was for 110 00:05:39,680 --> 00:05:43,080 Speaker 1: people don't know the rules are when your family flies 111 00:05:43,120 --> 00:05:46,360 Speaker 1: there to Disney, they had to be quarantined for four days. 112 00:05:47,600 --> 00:05:49,920 Speaker 1: Now if it's quarantine within like your hotel room or 113 00:05:49,920 --> 00:05:52,880 Speaker 1: you're sweet or whatever, four days with you know, six 114 00:05:52,960 --> 00:05:55,280 Speaker 1: year olds as oldest, so he's got younger. Like that 115 00:05:55,320 --> 00:05:57,880 Speaker 1: sounds a lot of people aren't bringing their kids, especially 116 00:05:57,960 --> 00:06:02,400 Speaker 1: right away. They're not so eventually their kids may visit them, 117 00:06:02,400 --> 00:06:05,279 Speaker 1: and they may they may, they may less than these rules. 118 00:06:06,279 --> 00:06:10,160 Speaker 1: But the idea that you're going to be able to 119 00:06:10,200 --> 00:06:15,600 Speaker 1: achieve social justice by not playing, I can't help you. 120 00:06:16,480 --> 00:06:19,960 Speaker 1: I'm not sitting here saying that that. And and this 121 00:06:20,040 --> 00:06:23,400 Speaker 1: is a big thing because I think sometimes when you 122 00:06:23,520 --> 00:06:26,680 Speaker 1: portray things and you parachute in you're like whoa, it's 123 00:06:26,680 --> 00:06:30,120 Speaker 1: got like this as you died? Is you whatever? I'm 124 00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:34,080 Speaker 1: I'm somebody that, like anybody's against racism, against police brutality, 125 00:06:34,560 --> 00:06:37,760 Speaker 1: and thinks that their needs to me. I think there's 126 00:06:37,839 --> 00:06:41,919 Speaker 1: got to be a lot of change in the training. Um. 127 00:06:41,960 --> 00:06:43,839 Speaker 1: You know, some of the laws, some of the drug 128 00:06:43,920 --> 00:06:45,839 Speaker 1: laws are one of the reasons that the numbers have 129 00:06:45,920 --> 00:06:51,200 Speaker 1: been so skewed. Um, I believe against black people and 130 00:06:51,240 --> 00:06:54,000 Speaker 1: why they're incarceration level is so high. There's some other 131 00:06:54,040 --> 00:06:57,159 Speaker 1: things within the black community which I've read. I haven't lived, 132 00:06:57,279 --> 00:06:59,960 Speaker 1: so I can't necessarily express my feelings on because they're 133 00:07:00,040 --> 00:07:04,840 Speaker 1: not my feelings. But I look, there's a need for reform. 134 00:07:05,839 --> 00:07:09,680 Speaker 1: There's need for re form. All of that said, you 135 00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:12,960 Speaker 1: also need continuing education, and you need money for these things. 136 00:07:14,240 --> 00:07:16,840 Speaker 1: And if you're as passionate as many of these men 137 00:07:16,880 --> 00:07:19,680 Speaker 1: who are super successful are, Look, I don't want to 138 00:07:19,680 --> 00:07:22,720 Speaker 1: tell them how much money they gotta give, but you 139 00:07:22,800 --> 00:07:25,960 Speaker 1: really want to help. The best way to help is 140 00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:29,280 Speaker 1: to win a championship. Make it part of your championship run, 141 00:07:29,640 --> 00:07:31,840 Speaker 1: make it part of your social media feed. You're able 142 00:07:31,880 --> 00:07:35,239 Speaker 1: to broadcast yourself at any moment on your social media feed. 143 00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:37,440 Speaker 1: You're able to broadcasterever you want in any other media, 144 00:07:37,480 --> 00:07:40,320 Speaker 1: like we'll take any of these guys from their hotel 145 00:07:40,440 --> 00:07:43,840 Speaker 1: rooms or whatever. Like, you have a way bigger platform 146 00:07:43,840 --> 00:07:46,560 Speaker 1: and a chance to make a change, not just financially, 147 00:07:46,560 --> 00:07:49,680 Speaker 1: but also with that platform if you're playing, not if 148 00:07:49,720 --> 00:07:52,720 Speaker 1: you're staying home. And then he's not even saying he's 149 00:07:52,720 --> 00:07:54,480 Speaker 1: staying home. He's like, well, it's one of the reason 150 00:07:54,520 --> 00:07:56,240 Speaker 1: I'm staying home. Plus I got a six year old. 151 00:07:56,280 --> 00:07:58,720 Speaker 1: I can't make the trip, Like, come on, man, and 152 00:07:59,520 --> 00:08:03,680 Speaker 1: you got limited maybe one chance ever to win a championship. 153 00:08:03,720 --> 00:08:06,560 Speaker 1: Now he's got a player option with the Lakers. Yes, 154 00:08:06,760 --> 00:08:09,600 Speaker 1: he's gonna pick it up. But you know, how does 155 00:08:09,600 --> 00:08:13,160 Speaker 1: that work if one he gets replaced by somebody better 156 00:08:13,160 --> 00:08:14,760 Speaker 1: of j R. Smith Or if they go out and 157 00:08:14,800 --> 00:08:17,360 Speaker 1: get Darren Collinson and they perform, well, do they even 158 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 1: want to back? Or two do you want a guy 159 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:24,600 Speaker 1: back who basketball wasn't the most important thing. I look, 160 00:08:24,840 --> 00:08:27,200 Speaker 1: I understand that we're in this time when you're more 161 00:08:27,240 --> 00:08:30,760 Speaker 1: than an athlete you're allowed to be. But one of 162 00:08:30,800 --> 00:08:34,800 Speaker 1: the things Lebron James says, and he's right, is keep 163 00:08:34,880 --> 00:08:38,240 Speaker 1: the main thing, the main thing, the main thing is hoop. 164 00:08:39,520 --> 00:08:42,680 Speaker 1: That is the avenue that will lead you to these 165 00:08:42,679 --> 00:08:47,760 Speaker 1: off ramps of post career success. These guys aren't keeping 166 00:08:47,760 --> 00:08:49,640 Speaker 1: the main thing the main There's nothing wrong with being 167 00:08:49,640 --> 00:08:52,640 Speaker 1: a great basketball player, being one of the best hundred 168 00:08:52,640 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 1: two hundred basketball players on the face of this earth, 169 00:08:55,120 --> 00:08:58,680 Speaker 1: and then using that and using success and chance player 170 00:08:58,679 --> 00:09:01,280 Speaker 1: for an NBA championship for all the things that you 171 00:09:01,320 --> 00:09:03,520 Speaker 1: want to change in the world. I don't think this 172 00:09:03,600 --> 00:09:05,160 Speaker 1: is a great strategy, and I think it's really a 173 00:09:05,160 --> 00:09:08,079 Speaker 1: bad strategy to add in the kid thing. What more 174 00:09:08,120 --> 00:09:11,400 Speaker 1: to that upcoming, But first let's get to the head 175 00:09:11,400 --> 00:09:13,600 Speaker 1: coach of the Maryland Terrapins who won the Big Tent 176 00:09:13,720 --> 00:09:15,800 Speaker 1: but didn't get a chance to show the world how 177 00:09:15,800 --> 00:09:17,760 Speaker 1: good they were in the Big tenor n c A tournament. 178 00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:21,720 Speaker 1: Here's our conversation with Mark Tursian. Be sure to catch 179 00:09:21,800 --> 00:09:24,800 Speaker 1: the live edition of The Doug Gottlieb Show weekdays at 180 00:09:24,840 --> 00:09:28,360 Speaker 1: three p m. Easter noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio 181 00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:31,720 Speaker 1: and the I Heart Radio Whip. Let's welcome him in. 182 00:09:31,840 --> 00:09:36,760 Speaker 1: He's He's Mark Tsan, the Pride of Topeka, Kansas. Um 183 00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:44,560 Speaker 1: first basketball memory is what oh gosh um? Probably playing 184 00:09:44,559 --> 00:09:47,560 Speaker 1: in the driveway with my dad, um, and my brother 185 00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:50,000 Speaker 1: was my first basketball memory. My dad was a good 186 00:09:50,040 --> 00:09:52,880 Speaker 1: player and he trouble between his legs and we were 187 00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:55,480 Speaker 1: always trying to dribble like him and chase chase the 188 00:09:55,520 --> 00:09:57,720 Speaker 1: ball between his leg and stuff. So I was probably 189 00:09:57,880 --> 00:10:01,560 Speaker 1: you know, three or four years old remembering, you know, 190 00:10:01,640 --> 00:10:05,080 Speaker 1: back to then. You had four siblings, your brother older 191 00:10:05,240 --> 00:10:09,319 Speaker 1: younger than you, older brother, older sister, and the two 192 00:10:09,360 --> 00:10:12,400 Speaker 1: younger sisters. Okay, so your older brother, what was your 193 00:10:12,400 --> 00:10:16,160 Speaker 1: guy's relationship like, like, was he what was he your idol? Did? 194 00:10:16,320 --> 00:10:18,480 Speaker 1: Was he mean to you? Like? What was what was 195 00:10:18,520 --> 00:10:21,160 Speaker 1: that like? Growing up? I think it was a little 196 00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:23,600 Speaker 1: bit of everything. I think he was an idol, um, 197 00:10:23,640 --> 00:10:25,640 Speaker 1: you know, you know, he wanted to do what he 198 00:10:25,720 --> 00:10:30,080 Speaker 1: was doing. Um. I think he made me tougher because 199 00:10:30,120 --> 00:10:33,160 Speaker 1: he was at times mean, but I'd like to hang 200 00:10:33,160 --> 00:10:35,480 Speaker 1: around his friends. So his friends were two years older, 201 00:10:35,520 --> 00:10:37,560 Speaker 1: and we were always out, you know, playing some type 202 00:10:37,600 --> 00:10:41,199 Speaker 1: of sport. Um. So I think it kind of helped 203 00:10:41,240 --> 00:10:45,679 Speaker 1: me grow up quicker, be a little bit tougher, um, 204 00:10:45,720 --> 00:10:48,400 Speaker 1: you know, throughout the process. But yeah, always trying to 205 00:10:48,440 --> 00:10:50,600 Speaker 1: do you know what he did, and he was always 206 00:10:50,640 --> 00:10:53,600 Speaker 1: real protective of me too. I remember that as a child, 207 00:10:53,640 --> 00:10:56,240 Speaker 1: he was always looking after me and making sure I 208 00:10:56,320 --> 00:10:58,600 Speaker 1: was in a good shape. When was that. Was there 209 00:10:58,640 --> 00:11:00,840 Speaker 1: a moment when you're like, all right, basketball is my 210 00:11:00,920 --> 00:11:02,600 Speaker 1: gym because you weren't you weren't big. I mean you're 211 00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:04,600 Speaker 1: not big now. You weren't big growing up. I'm just 212 00:11:04,960 --> 00:11:06,760 Speaker 1: was there a moment you're like, this is what I 213 00:11:06,800 --> 00:11:12,360 Speaker 1: want to do? Yeah? I always liked it, um, you know, 214 00:11:12,480 --> 00:11:15,520 Speaker 1: like you said, I only phrased, I always loved it. 215 00:11:15,640 --> 00:11:18,520 Speaker 1: I just always remember playing basketball all the time. Whenever 216 00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:25,080 Speaker 1: I could, I was outside playing basketball. But probably didn't 217 00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:27,000 Speaker 1: you know, I was pretty young, pretty good at a 218 00:11:27,040 --> 00:11:29,440 Speaker 1: young age, and then everybody kind of passed me by 219 00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:33,640 Speaker 1: and grew past me. And I think it was probably, uh, 220 00:11:33,840 --> 00:11:36,199 Speaker 1: towards the end of my junior high school, I was like, okay, 221 00:11:36,240 --> 00:11:39,839 Speaker 1: maybe I have a chance to play college basketball. Um. 222 00:11:40,000 --> 00:11:42,440 Speaker 1: And I grew a little bit with helps and a 223 00:11:42,520 --> 00:11:46,320 Speaker 1: good team, and I was always a very confident kid, um, 224 00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:49,760 Speaker 1: but I was also realistic, and then probably towards the 225 00:11:49,800 --> 00:11:51,360 Speaker 1: end of my junior I realized I had a chance 226 00:11:51,360 --> 00:11:54,120 Speaker 1: to play college basketball. Oh okay, so your senior year, 227 00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:57,040 Speaker 1: did you commit before your senior year, after your senior year, 228 00:11:58,520 --> 00:12:02,680 Speaker 1: noth Doug, I wasn't recruited it. So I was when 229 00:12:02,679 --> 00:12:04,880 Speaker 1: I committed to Kansas. I was five eight and a 230 00:12:04,880 --> 00:12:08,079 Speaker 1: half a dred twenty five pounds. Um, it was after 231 00:12:08,720 --> 00:12:13,560 Speaker 1: my senior year. We had won back to back state championships. Uh, 232 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:16,720 Speaker 1: Ku had let Ted Owens go and hired Larry Brown. 233 00:12:17,360 --> 00:12:19,520 Speaker 1: So the timing was, you know, really good for me. 234 00:12:19,679 --> 00:12:22,520 Speaker 1: He like, you know, he was shorter, like shorter point guards. 235 00:12:23,040 --> 00:12:25,880 Speaker 1: Thank god they had fifteen scholarships back then instead of 236 00:12:25,960 --> 00:12:28,280 Speaker 1: thirteen that they have today. So I was the fifteen 237 00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:31,400 Speaker 1: scholarship and um, it was more. It was more kind 238 00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:33,439 Speaker 1: of a one year walk on deal, but the game 239 00:12:33,480 --> 00:12:37,920 Speaker 1: miss scholarship just to kind of proved proved myself and 240 00:12:37,960 --> 00:12:40,000 Speaker 1: of course everything worked out all right. We'll get to 241 00:12:40,040 --> 00:12:42,160 Speaker 1: the college in a second. Can you mentioned back to 242 00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:45,960 Speaker 1: back state championships at Haydon High School? Uh? And I 243 00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:49,360 Speaker 1: think as we've come to learn from the President that 244 00:12:49,360 --> 00:12:52,240 Speaker 1: that Kansas City, at least where Kemper is is in Missouri. 245 00:12:52,320 --> 00:12:56,400 Speaker 1: So where's the is the state championship play in Topeka? Well, 246 00:12:56,440 --> 00:12:59,240 Speaker 1: they were spread out all over. Ours was in Salina, Kansas, 247 00:13:00,160 --> 00:13:02,320 Speaker 1: I've played. I played at the Civic Center several times. 248 00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:05,040 Speaker 1: I actually played with the Salina Rattlers in the ib 249 00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:08,760 Speaker 1: A for like a week. Wow. Yeah, So we used 250 00:13:08,800 --> 00:13:11,200 Speaker 1: to fill that building. You know, we had a great 251 00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:14,320 Speaker 1: following when we played. We played, we'd kill that building 252 00:13:14,400 --> 00:13:18,160 Speaker 1: up for our state championship games. And uh, it was 253 00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:20,120 Speaker 1: a good run. It was. We had a lot of fun. 254 00:13:20,200 --> 00:13:23,040 Speaker 1: We stayed at the Red roof in right on the 255 00:13:23,080 --> 00:13:25,840 Speaker 1: highway there, and uh, I think we had four in 256 00:13:25,880 --> 00:13:28,480 Speaker 1: a room and and uh, we just you know, a 257 00:13:28,480 --> 00:13:30,520 Speaker 1: lot of fun and we expected to win. We had 258 00:13:30,520 --> 00:13:34,080 Speaker 1: good teams and great coach and and we expected to 259 00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:36,280 Speaker 1: win and we were able to do it twice. Okay, 260 00:13:36,280 --> 00:13:41,440 Speaker 1: so three, you show up on Kansas at Kansas as 261 00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:45,600 Speaker 1: basically like a recruited walk on. You know, we'll give 262 00:13:45,640 --> 00:13:51,040 Speaker 1: you a scholarship or whatever. Um yeah, uh what do 263 00:13:51,040 --> 00:13:52,680 Speaker 1: you And obviously you know growing up at to peak 264 00:13:52,720 --> 00:13:55,199 Speaker 1: and people don't know it's uh, you know, just when 265 00:13:55,320 --> 00:13:58,120 Speaker 1: thirty forty five minutes I think from Lawrence if I 266 00:13:58,200 --> 00:14:01,400 Speaker 1: remember correctly, is that accurate said that, Yeah, driveway to 267 00:14:01,480 --> 00:14:05,440 Speaker 1: my dorm room was twenty eight minutes. So you you 268 00:14:05,520 --> 00:14:09,400 Speaker 1: walk into the fog Um, what what do you remember 269 00:14:09,440 --> 00:14:14,800 Speaker 1: about your your first moments as a Jayhawk. Yeah, so 270 00:14:14,880 --> 00:14:18,120 Speaker 1: my first day of pickup we were actually at Lawrence 271 00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:21,720 Speaker 1: High School because camp was going on. And I don't 272 00:14:21,760 --> 00:14:23,600 Speaker 1: know if you remember Tony Guy. Tony Guy was a 273 00:14:23,600 --> 00:14:27,520 Speaker 1: guy from Baltimore, was a great player, uh at Kansas. 274 00:14:27,560 --> 00:14:30,200 Speaker 1: He was about six five six six, and I end 275 00:14:30,280 --> 00:14:33,000 Speaker 1: up guarding him in the pickup game, and uh, he 276 00:14:33,120 --> 00:14:36,680 Speaker 1: was destroying me. And uh, you know, the first day 277 00:14:36,760 --> 00:14:38,880 Speaker 1: goes by. I remember calling my dad and I said, Dad, 278 00:14:38,960 --> 00:14:41,200 Speaker 1: this isn't gonna work. Man, I don't belong here. These 279 00:14:41,200 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 1: guys are so much better than I am. And uh, 280 00:14:44,040 --> 00:14:46,480 Speaker 1: he said, just stick with it and see what happens. 281 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:48,280 Speaker 1: And you know, we had great games that a lot 282 00:14:48,360 --> 00:14:50,760 Speaker 1: of NBA players in town, a lot of former players 283 00:14:50,760 --> 00:14:52,560 Speaker 1: in town, a lot of great players on our team. 284 00:14:52,680 --> 00:14:55,480 Speaker 1: So you got real competitive. He lost, you had to said, 285 00:14:55,560 --> 00:14:57,720 Speaker 1: you know, for thirty five minutes. So he always were 286 00:14:57,720 --> 00:15:00,440 Speaker 1: trying to win. But I got a lot better, Summer 287 00:15:00,440 --> 00:15:03,120 Speaker 1: got a lot bigger, a lot stronger, and and uh 288 00:15:03,160 --> 00:15:06,600 Speaker 1: but I just remember being overwhelmed that, you know, first 289 00:15:06,640 --> 00:15:09,280 Speaker 1: few weeks. Sure, I mean that was really more practice 290 00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:11,480 Speaker 1: for me. You were like it's you're making it sounds 291 00:15:11,560 --> 00:15:13,360 Speaker 1: sound like you were Robbie Benson in One on one. 292 00:15:13,440 --> 00:15:18,520 Speaker 1: You remember that movie. Yeah, yeah, Now practice was the same, 293 00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:20,960 Speaker 1: you know. First, you know, I realized that it wasn't 294 00:15:21,040 --> 00:15:23,320 Speaker 1: high school anymore. Coach Brown was you know, he'd get 295 00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:27,160 Speaker 1: after you and practice. We practiced a long time. But 296 00:15:27,240 --> 00:15:32,120 Speaker 1: I pretty much knew, um, you know, once practice started 297 00:15:32,120 --> 00:15:33,960 Speaker 1: that I was one of the better point guards on 298 00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:36,280 Speaker 1: the team. It was just whether I was going to 299 00:15:36,360 --> 00:15:41,400 Speaker 1: get the opportunity and uh, you know, but I didn't 300 00:15:41,440 --> 00:15:43,840 Speaker 1: know where I stood until our first game. We played. 301 00:15:43,840 --> 00:15:46,240 Speaker 1: Our first game was against the five Slam and Jamma, 302 00:15:47,800 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 1: yeah that loss the year before the North Carolina State 303 00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:55,120 Speaker 1: and Jim Valvano in the championship game and we're on 304 00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:58,600 Speaker 1: CBS Sports, and I just remember I was sitting on 305 00:15:58,600 --> 00:16:00,520 Speaker 1: the bench. I was mad at coach Brown. He started 306 00:16:00,520 --> 00:16:03,280 Speaker 1: Tad Boyle or Jeff Geo one of them, and then 307 00:16:03,440 --> 00:16:05,440 Speaker 1: brought the other one in before me and then finally 308 00:16:05,480 --> 00:16:07,240 Speaker 1: gave me a chance. I was so pissed. When I 309 00:16:07,240 --> 00:16:11,640 Speaker 1: went in there, I wasn't scared and uh and played well. Uh, 310 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:14,040 Speaker 1: and then everything kind of went went great after that. 311 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:18,240 Speaker 1: Uh for me, that freshman year, but uh, we got 312 00:16:18,360 --> 00:16:21,040 Speaker 1: rock pretty good that day, so it's kind of but 313 00:16:21,080 --> 00:16:22,720 Speaker 1: you know, I get to play against Keem the Dream 314 00:16:22,760 --> 00:16:25,680 Speaker 1: and some really good players and realized what it was 315 00:16:25,720 --> 00:16:28,680 Speaker 1: like at that level. Okay, so, um, what what was 316 00:16:28,720 --> 00:16:31,480 Speaker 1: it like? What were because five Sanma Jim has become 317 00:16:31,600 --> 00:16:34,280 Speaker 1: kind of this mythical you know, the greatest team to 318 00:16:34,600 --> 00:16:37,680 Speaker 1: you know, to not have accomplished obviously the year before 319 00:16:37,800 --> 00:16:41,360 Speaker 1: was the was was the n C state thing? What? 320 00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:43,320 Speaker 1: And that was an old hopf heines before they just 321 00:16:43,360 --> 00:16:48,720 Speaker 1: obviously recently redid it. What was what was that team actually? Like, well, 322 00:16:49,240 --> 00:16:54,200 Speaker 1: Directler was gone, um, so it was Alvin Franklin and 323 00:16:53,440 --> 00:16:57,640 Speaker 1: a cheam and came the Dream and I don't remember who, 324 00:16:58,320 --> 00:17:01,640 Speaker 1: um the other players were in that terrible because I 325 00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:04,800 Speaker 1: was worried about the point guard. H But no, they 326 00:17:04,880 --> 00:17:06,680 Speaker 1: were talented and they were good and they whipped this 327 00:17:06,760 --> 00:17:09,280 Speaker 1: pretty good. And it was it was coach Brown's first game. 328 00:17:09,920 --> 00:17:11,600 Speaker 1: And to be honest with you, that was my first 329 00:17:11,960 --> 00:17:18,000 Speaker 1: flight on an airplane, um, flying down to Houston for 330 00:17:18,040 --> 00:17:20,800 Speaker 1: that game. So there was a lot that happened to me. 331 00:17:21,080 --> 00:17:23,080 Speaker 1: Uh And then of course it was on national TV, 332 00:17:23,720 --> 00:17:26,879 Speaker 1: CBS Sports but they were good. I don't know what 333 00:17:26,920 --> 00:17:29,280 Speaker 1: they did that year, if they made it back to 334 00:17:29,400 --> 00:17:32,640 Speaker 1: the final four or or you know, I which would 335 00:17:32,640 --> 00:17:35,199 Speaker 1: have been four. But they were a good team. They 336 00:17:35,240 --> 00:17:36,959 Speaker 1: were much better than us at the time. Okay, that 337 00:17:37,000 --> 00:17:40,080 Speaker 1: team went thirty two and five. They went fifteen and 338 00:17:40,200 --> 00:17:44,560 Speaker 1: one in the Southwest Conference. They won the Southwest Conference tournament. 339 00:17:44,880 --> 00:17:47,280 Speaker 1: They lost to Georgetown in the final four in the 340 00:17:47,359 --> 00:17:51,760 Speaker 1: national championship game. Okay, they're pretty good. Yeah, they're pretty 341 00:17:51,760 --> 00:17:54,240 Speaker 1: and we ended up we end up finishing second in 342 00:17:54,280 --> 00:17:57,800 Speaker 1: the Big Eight. But you won the Big Eight tournament, right, tournament? Yeah, 343 00:17:57,960 --> 00:18:02,160 Speaker 1: every won the Big Eight tournament. Beat Oklahoma. Um. And 344 00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:05,440 Speaker 1: you know they had a great team, waymon Tisdale, uh 345 00:18:05,480 --> 00:18:08,680 Speaker 1: and them, and we played really a almost perfect game 346 00:18:09,240 --> 00:18:12,879 Speaker 1: to beat them. And uh they had beat us about 347 00:18:12,920 --> 00:18:17,040 Speaker 1: two weeks earlier in overtime and Alan philadelf to win 348 00:18:17,440 --> 00:18:19,160 Speaker 1: to win the league, and they cut down the next 349 00:18:19,200 --> 00:18:22,119 Speaker 1: in our building and that didn't sit well with us obviously. 350 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:25,240 Speaker 1: So we were pretty part up playing in the championship game. Okay, 351 00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:28,800 Speaker 1: So I guess the biggest question I have, and I've 352 00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:31,720 Speaker 1: I've watched my dad actually grew up playing ball with 353 00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:35,320 Speaker 1: with Coach Brown. I've got a chance. You know when 354 00:18:35,320 --> 00:18:38,160 Speaker 1: he was at asking you to cover Coach Brown, but 355 00:18:38,520 --> 00:18:41,959 Speaker 1: you know him better having coached with him, having played 356 00:18:41,960 --> 00:18:45,040 Speaker 1: for him. Uh when I mean like, look, I love 357 00:18:45,080 --> 00:18:47,679 Speaker 1: Ted Owens, He's always super kind to me as an 358 00:18:47,920 --> 00:18:51,119 Speaker 1: absolute gentleman. But to go from Ted Owens to the 359 00:18:51,280 --> 00:18:55,080 Speaker 1: very next year finishing second and winning the Big Eight championship, 360 00:18:55,200 --> 00:18:57,840 Speaker 1: this is this is obviously before you guys got got 361 00:18:57,920 --> 00:19:01,440 Speaker 1: Danny Um. What what was it? What what didn't What 362 00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:04,440 Speaker 1: was it about Coach Brown that he was able? Uh? 363 00:19:04,720 --> 00:19:08,520 Speaker 1: For example, A Kansas turned around so quickly. Well, we 364 00:19:08,560 --> 00:19:11,120 Speaker 1: had good players one But I'm not gonna say anything 365 00:19:11,119 --> 00:19:14,080 Speaker 1: away from coach Coach Brown because we were young. Calvin 366 00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:16,919 Speaker 1: Thompson and Ronnie Kellogg and Gregg Drawling, We're all on 367 00:19:16,960 --> 00:19:20,760 Speaker 1: our final four teams. Their senior years were sophomores, and 368 00:19:20,800 --> 00:19:23,640 Speaker 1: they had terrific sophomore years at a senior in Kelly Knight. 369 00:19:23,720 --> 00:19:25,840 Speaker 1: But I think what coach did that year was he 370 00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:29,080 Speaker 1: adapted to his talent and we played a lot of 371 00:19:29,080 --> 00:19:33,240 Speaker 1: his own and that enabled me to play at my size. 372 00:19:33,400 --> 00:19:37,200 Speaker 1: But he worked out he you know, had people come 373 00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:39,560 Speaker 1: in helping teach Zone he didn't like to play it. 374 00:19:39,640 --> 00:19:42,119 Speaker 1: But he was just a teacher, you know, he was 375 00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:46,960 Speaker 1: relentless and individual improvement. He was relentless and one more time, 376 00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:49,359 Speaker 1: let's do it one more time, let's run three down 377 00:19:49,440 --> 00:19:53,520 Speaker 1: one more time, which meant, you know, fifteen more times. Um. 378 00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:57,600 Speaker 1: And he was just relentless and that approach um. And 379 00:19:59,000 --> 00:20:01,800 Speaker 1: you know because as you were so drilled, I mean 380 00:20:01,800 --> 00:20:04,439 Speaker 1: you were just shell drill was an hour, you know, 381 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:08,040 Speaker 1: you know how tough shell drill is and shell drill 382 00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:09,720 Speaker 1: was an hour, and it was it was just it 383 00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:15,000 Speaker 1: was just relentless in his approach that way. Um. And 384 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:17,520 Speaker 1: then you know he would carry you down and build 385 00:20:17,560 --> 00:20:19,800 Speaker 1: you back up, carry you down, build you back up. 386 00:20:20,480 --> 00:20:22,280 Speaker 1: And then he had made individually, he'd meet with you 387 00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:24,000 Speaker 1: and you'd make you still at a million bucks. So 388 00:20:25,160 --> 00:20:28,399 Speaker 1: that was his way of keeping your confident. But when 389 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:30,479 Speaker 1: you're in the middle of it, you really don't really 390 00:20:31,800 --> 00:20:35,040 Speaker 1: understand his expertise because you're just like a grind and 391 00:20:35,200 --> 00:20:38,960 Speaker 1: mix play. You're trying to survive his practices. But then 392 00:20:39,000 --> 00:20:40,280 Speaker 1: as you get a little bit older and get to 393 00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:43,399 Speaker 1: watch him and you know as a g a and 394 00:20:43,440 --> 00:20:45,960 Speaker 1: then you know, being with him with the sixers. You 395 00:20:46,040 --> 00:20:50,280 Speaker 1: got to see that he was just his mind was remarkable. Um. 396 00:20:50,320 --> 00:20:54,040 Speaker 1: And the thing that made him special, Doug is he 397 00:20:54,440 --> 00:20:57,120 Speaker 1: loved the scrimmage. So we would do drills for hours 398 00:20:57,119 --> 00:20:59,000 Speaker 1: and shell drill. Then we had scrimmaged for you know, 399 00:20:59,040 --> 00:21:01,240 Speaker 1: an hour and a half, put ten minutes on the 400 00:21:01,320 --> 00:21:03,359 Speaker 1: clock last one and you know, I met me. We 401 00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:06,800 Speaker 1: were going to do four more those, right, and we'd 402 00:21:06,880 --> 00:21:09,879 Speaker 1: go up back up back, like six crossing, which was 403 00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:12,720 Speaker 1: a lot for him, not to stop it, and he 404 00:21:12,760 --> 00:21:17,480 Speaker 1: could remember three or four things from each crossing, um 405 00:21:17,600 --> 00:21:19,560 Speaker 1: and and correct. Well, it's meant he stood there for 406 00:21:19,600 --> 00:21:22,080 Speaker 1: a while and that's where practices were long. But his 407 00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:24,600 Speaker 1: mind was incredible. I think it was almost a blessing 408 00:21:24,600 --> 00:21:28,560 Speaker 1: and a courage because he could see so much, um, 409 00:21:28,600 --> 00:21:30,800 Speaker 1: you know, and when you have to do earlier, especially 410 00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:33,480 Speaker 1: early season, when you're working with ten twelve guys, trying 411 00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:36,560 Speaker 1: to get him ready to see both sides, the offense 412 00:21:36,600 --> 00:21:39,280 Speaker 1: and defense, not you're working on offense still being able 413 00:21:39,320 --> 00:21:41,679 Speaker 1: to see what the defense is doing. And he was 414 00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:47,080 Speaker 1: a master at that, and his mind was incredibly sharp. Yeah. Um, okay, 415 00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:52,280 Speaker 1: So that year Danny is at Lawrence High School, right 416 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:55,880 Speaker 1: and ed Is on the staff. You know, like I've 417 00:21:56,080 --> 00:21:57,720 Speaker 1: I've read the season on the brink, so I know 418 00:21:57,760 --> 00:22:00,120 Speaker 1: what it was like for Damon Bailey to be coming, 419 00:22:00,560 --> 00:22:03,199 Speaker 1: you know, as like an eighth grade or whatever to Indiana. 420 00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:06,359 Speaker 1: What was that like to have Danny Manning kind of 421 00:22:06,359 --> 00:22:08,639 Speaker 1: waiting in the wings at Canta, Like this is before 422 00:22:08,720 --> 00:22:11,960 Speaker 1: the recruiting, you know, recruiting became what it is today. 423 00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:15,359 Speaker 1: What what what do you remember about knowing that Danny 424 00:22:15,359 --> 00:22:19,280 Speaker 1: Manning was coming from Lawrence High School? Well, obviously we're 425 00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:22,880 Speaker 1: excited because Danny was a great player, but we're more 426 00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:24,879 Speaker 1: excited because he's got to know him and he was 427 00:22:24,920 --> 00:22:30,440 Speaker 1: a great kid and he was very humble. Um, what's 428 00:22:30,480 --> 00:22:32,840 Speaker 1: kind of a reluctant star, to be honest with you, 429 00:22:33,359 --> 00:22:36,240 Speaker 1: just because we know we had, like I said, Greg 430 00:22:36,320 --> 00:22:41,080 Speaker 1: Darling played in the NBA, Ronnie Kellaw drafted Calvin Thompson, 431 00:22:41,600 --> 00:22:44,960 Speaker 1: you know, really good players, and so Danny kind of 432 00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:47,760 Speaker 1: wanted to take, you know, take his time, you know, 433 00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:50,679 Speaker 1: growing into the role. But you know, by the sophomore year, 434 00:22:50,720 --> 00:22:52,760 Speaker 1: he was so terrific. So it was good we knew 435 00:22:52,800 --> 00:22:55,440 Speaker 1: we had a bright future that first class coach Brown 436 00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:57,560 Speaker 1: bought in brought in was actually the first one was 437 00:22:57,600 --> 00:23:01,280 Speaker 1: me and Chris Piper and Cetera Conna who you know, 438 00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:04,920 Speaker 1: we're we were all afterthoughts and we all had pretty 439 00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:07,640 Speaker 1: good careers there. And then the next class was Danny 440 00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:13,720 Speaker 1: Milton Newton, uh shotgun Campbell out of St. Louis Rodney 441 00:23:13,720 --> 00:23:17,200 Speaker 1: Hall is really like top five recruiting class in the country, 442 00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:20,840 Speaker 1: top three or four or whatever. And you know Danny 443 00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:22,920 Speaker 1: and Milk made a big rest of them and really 444 00:23:22,960 --> 00:23:27,920 Speaker 1: didn't um uh make it because we had such good players, 445 00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:30,359 Speaker 1: but you know you could see it. We had Calipari, 446 00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:35,560 Speaker 1: RC Buford, We had all unbelievable coaches, Alvin Gentry, guys 447 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:38,119 Speaker 1: that were you know, gone on and done done some 448 00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:42,480 Speaker 1: many things in our business. Um but uh yeah, we 449 00:23:42,560 --> 00:23:44,360 Speaker 1: knew were always gonna have good players, and you knew 450 00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:46,480 Speaker 1: you couldn't relax in the summer because coach Brown was 451 00:23:46,520 --> 00:23:49,119 Speaker 1: gonna really recruit well and you had to get better. 452 00:23:49,520 --> 00:23:53,840 Speaker 1: Um you get done playing in seven. You guys have 453 00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:57,359 Speaker 1: been to a Final four, your team captain. You know 454 00:23:57,600 --> 00:24:00,640 Speaker 1: you're on the academic All Big eight team like you're 455 00:24:00,720 --> 00:24:04,199 Speaker 1: getting you like a cult hero there, right, And what 456 00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:09,080 Speaker 1: what made you decide to go into coaching. Well, it's 457 00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:12,280 Speaker 1: kind of a bittersweet moment. I'm sure you've heard great uh, Doug. 458 00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:15,159 Speaker 1: I was setting uh in Coach Brown's office after my 459 00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:16,920 Speaker 1: freshman year and I was up to about a hundred 460 00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:21,240 Speaker 1: forty five pounds, braces and acne all over my face, 461 00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:24,160 Speaker 1: and I thought I was pretty good. And he goes, Church, 462 00:24:24,280 --> 00:24:26,240 Speaker 1: what do you want to do? And I just broken 463 00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:29,199 Speaker 1: Darnell Valentine's assist records. And he was a guy who 464 00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:32,200 Speaker 1: idolized growing off. So I'm walking into this office thinking 465 00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:35,040 Speaker 1: I'm this great player, right, and he says, what do 466 00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:36,560 Speaker 1: you want to do? And I said, Coach, come on, 467 00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:39,040 Speaker 1: I'm gonna play in the NBA. And he looked at 468 00:24:39,080 --> 00:24:41,879 Speaker 1: me and he says, Turk, you have no chance of 469 00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:44,400 Speaker 1: being an NBA player, He said, but I do think 470 00:24:44,400 --> 00:24:46,760 Speaker 1: you can be a pretty good coach. And I you know, 471 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:50,560 Speaker 1: I remember, like my mouth I fell wide open and 472 00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:53,359 Speaker 1: just like holy, this guy just went right at me, 473 00:24:53,440 --> 00:24:56,080 Speaker 1: right between the eyes. And by the time I walked 474 00:24:56,119 --> 00:24:58,560 Speaker 1: out of that office, I knew I wanted to be 475 00:24:58,600 --> 00:25:01,400 Speaker 1: a coach, and I wanted to coach in college, and 476 00:25:01,680 --> 00:25:03,920 Speaker 1: we kind of approached it that way. In the next 477 00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:06,920 Speaker 1: three years. Um, whenever I was on the bench, I 478 00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:10,359 Speaker 1: set Uh in the first seat so I could watch 479 00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:13,399 Speaker 1: him coach and listen to other coaches, and you know, 480 00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:16,080 Speaker 1: I'd come early to practice and and just be a 481 00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:19,040 Speaker 1: part of different things. So I knew after my freshman 482 00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:21,960 Speaker 1: year that I wasn't an NBA player and to start 483 00:25:22,080 --> 00:25:23,840 Speaker 1: thinking about being a coach. And it was really the 484 00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:27,040 Speaker 1: best advice that that someone could give me at the time, 485 00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:29,520 Speaker 1: because I was pretty caught up in myself and was 486 00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:32,399 Speaker 1: delusion delusional that I had a chance to play in 487 00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:36,440 Speaker 1: the NBA. Um. Okay, so you get done playing, how 488 00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:39,160 Speaker 1: quickly did the job get like? Was it was? There 489 00:25:39,359 --> 00:25:42,080 Speaker 1: was there a discussion over it? Did you just move 490 00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:44,840 Speaker 1: into an office? Like? What was the process like of 491 00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:47,520 Speaker 1: finishing up and then becoming a coach on the staff? 492 00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:51,280 Speaker 1: That was hard. It was really hard to become a 493 00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:54,240 Speaker 1: coach and you know and not want to hang around 494 00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:57,480 Speaker 1: the players and not be with the players. And um, 495 00:25:57,600 --> 00:25:59,760 Speaker 1: you know, we had a huge staff if you can 496 00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:04,160 Speaker 1: look back at pictures, so, um, I think we had 497 00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:06,879 Speaker 1: three guys in my position at the time. It was 498 00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:11,960 Speaker 1: John Robick, who's with Califaria Kentucky. Uh, David Moe Uh, 499 00:26:12,080 --> 00:26:15,880 Speaker 1: Doug mos Son and myself, and we were all kind 500 00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:18,800 Speaker 1: of like g A and we had just taken over 501 00:26:18,880 --> 00:26:22,840 Speaker 1: for Bill's self and Billy by Oh and guys like that, 502 00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:28,399 Speaker 1: Tommy Butler's and RT. Buford's and and so. Um. He 503 00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:30,960 Speaker 1: didn't really have a lot of responsibility except to come 504 00:26:30,960 --> 00:26:33,760 Speaker 1: to practice. We we did some melouts, we did some things. 505 00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:37,639 Speaker 1: I was pretty immature at the time. Um, I just 506 00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:41,080 Speaker 1: remember coach Brown, you know, just helping coach the JB 507 00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:43,159 Speaker 1: team and going to practice and doing a little bit 508 00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:47,200 Speaker 1: of office work each day. But there was a tremendous 509 00:26:47,280 --> 00:26:49,840 Speaker 1: year one because we won the national championship. But I 510 00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:53,399 Speaker 1: could sit back with no pressure of being a player, 511 00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:56,840 Speaker 1: or no pressure of really not having much responsibility with 512 00:26:56,920 --> 00:27:00,200 Speaker 1: the team except to watch and learn, you know, and 513 00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:02,440 Speaker 1: I do drills that helps with camp. So I helped 514 00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:05,639 Speaker 1: set things up, but it wasn't like they depended on 515 00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:08,159 Speaker 1: me every day. So it was really just kind of 516 00:27:08,200 --> 00:27:11,920 Speaker 1: a gap year for me just to to watch and 517 00:27:12,080 --> 00:27:15,960 Speaker 1: learn and take notes and remember. And I remember that 518 00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:18,960 Speaker 1: year like it was yesterday. Um, all the things we 519 00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:22,439 Speaker 1: are probably a lot better than I do the games 520 00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:25,800 Speaker 1: that I played in, just because I was just more relaxed, 521 00:27:25,800 --> 00:27:28,639 Speaker 1: and I can remember I write things down as we 522 00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:30,879 Speaker 1: went through it. But uh so it was kind of 523 00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:33,639 Speaker 1: a gap year learning and and uh but just a 524 00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:37,119 Speaker 1: tremendous uh. It was an unbelievably fun year for me 525 00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:41,760 Speaker 1: going from a player. Okay, so let's let's let's let's 526 00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:44,199 Speaker 1: challenge you on your knowledge of that year, because it 527 00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:47,280 Speaker 1: was really an interesting year. Right There's you played Kansas 528 00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:50,800 Speaker 1: people forget you played Kansas State four times, right and 529 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:53,280 Speaker 1: and and you played the national championship game in Kansas 530 00:27:53,320 --> 00:27:55,720 Speaker 1: City against Oklahoma, also from the Big Eight. And so 531 00:27:55,880 --> 00:27:58,600 Speaker 1: you played oh you three times. I was a year where, 532 00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:00,320 Speaker 1: you know, without any question, that was the the best 533 00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:02,760 Speaker 1: league in the country. But you guys had this you know, 534 00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:06,280 Speaker 1: you started off losing what the your your two games 535 00:28:06,359 --> 00:28:09,639 Speaker 1: in Hawaii? Uh and then you had a really bad 536 00:28:09,680 --> 00:28:12,720 Speaker 1: stretch I think to begin the Big the Big Eight. 537 00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:15,520 Speaker 1: What what was that season like and why was it 538 00:28:15,680 --> 00:28:21,040 Speaker 1: so up and down? Well, first of all, we had, um, 539 00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:23,280 Speaker 1: we had a lot of new guys we were trying 540 00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:25,760 Speaker 1: to to bring into the fold. I mean we saw 541 00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:29,720 Speaker 1: Chris Piper, Danny Manny Milton, and Kevin Pritcher was a sophomore, 542 00:28:30,280 --> 00:28:32,880 Speaker 1: and we really didn't have a point guard. Um Otis 543 00:28:32,920 --> 00:28:36,720 Speaker 1: Livingston came in, and Otis has done really well and 544 00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:39,840 Speaker 1: and and and the you know business that he's in now. 545 00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:44,880 Speaker 1: But uh in, our chemistry wasn't very good. So we 546 00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:47,200 Speaker 1: had a lot of players, there wasn't a lot of separation. 547 00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:49,760 Speaker 1: We didn't really have a true point guard. And I'm 548 00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:52,720 Speaker 1: not sure exact day, but we had some changes in 549 00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:54,720 Speaker 1: our roster. We had some guys that were on the 550 00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:57,320 Speaker 1: team that were no longer on the team. We brought 551 00:28:57,320 --> 00:29:00,600 Speaker 1: some football players on the team, Marvin Maddox and some 552 00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:04,280 Speaker 1: guys that were just Clinton Normore, just great, great, solid 553 00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:07,560 Speaker 1: people that helped us win. So at one point we 554 00:29:07,560 --> 00:29:11,240 Speaker 1: were twelve and eight UM and we just lost I 555 00:29:11,320 --> 00:29:14,560 Speaker 1: think at Oklahoma State. And I remember sitting at the 556 00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:16,560 Speaker 1: front of the bus and I said, coach, because coach 557 00:29:16,600 --> 00:29:18,440 Speaker 1: wanted me to red shirt the year before he was 558 00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:20,680 Speaker 1: having trouble getting a point guard. And I just didn't 559 00:29:20,680 --> 00:29:22,480 Speaker 1: know it was the right thing for me to do. 560 00:29:22,520 --> 00:29:25,080 Speaker 1: And I didn't do it. And I said something like, Coach, 561 00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:27,600 Speaker 1: I should have read shirted, and he said, no, tours 562 00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:29,880 Speaker 1: will be fine, We'll be fine. We'll be all right, 563 00:29:29,960 --> 00:29:32,640 Speaker 1: Richard's coming along, and they moved him to point, we're 564 00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:35,320 Speaker 1: gonna be fine. We're planning our best players now. And 565 00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:38,640 Speaker 1: what he did was this, he killed these He killed 566 00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:41,520 Speaker 1: these guys, man, I tell you. We started we started 567 00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:44,560 Speaker 1: practice every day with shell drill. We go for an 568 00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:47,480 Speaker 1: hour of shell drill. And it was really it was 569 00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:49,880 Speaker 1: really hard for me because I'm like, I'm one of 570 00:29:49,920 --> 00:29:54,240 Speaker 1: them still, right, and and you know, the losers would 571 00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:56,360 Speaker 1: run the sixty four and then he'd be like, that's 572 00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:58,560 Speaker 1: not enough. We get back on it. We do it again. 573 00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:03,040 Speaker 1: And I mean we went from twelve and eight and uh, 574 00:30:03,120 --> 00:30:05,360 Speaker 1: you know, we lost three home games. We lost the Kikes. 575 00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:07,400 Speaker 1: I never forget. I was out to night before. I 576 00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:09,080 Speaker 1: was having a good year, and I was out a 577 00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:11,000 Speaker 1: bunch of k State fans and we had won fifty 578 00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:14,080 Speaker 1: three or fifty five straight home games, and and it's 579 00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:16,160 Speaker 1: Mitch Richmond and I'm like, all right, well, we're gonna 580 00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:18,240 Speaker 1: get fifty six tomorrow. When they came in and beat 581 00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:22,840 Speaker 1: us and and broke the streak um which was started 582 00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:26,720 Speaker 1: my freshman year, and uh, and we lost the Duke 583 00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:29,080 Speaker 1: at home in a close game, and we lost to 584 00:30:29,160 --> 00:30:32,200 Speaker 1: Oklahoma in a really close game. And then we got 585 00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:34,960 Speaker 1: to play all three of those games, all those three 586 00:30:35,000 --> 00:30:39,160 Speaker 1: teams in the Elite eight final four in National Championship games, 587 00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:41,959 Speaker 1: but they're all close. Lost his game, and so we 588 00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:45,160 Speaker 1: were getting better, getting better, getting better, and I'll just 589 00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:47,080 Speaker 1: never forget. He did the same thing every day. And 590 00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:49,040 Speaker 1: then you know, the day before game, he worked on 591 00:30:49,120 --> 00:30:51,720 Speaker 1: press offense, he worked on zone offense, and it would 592 00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:53,360 Speaker 1: only be like seven or eight minutes. So he just 593 00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:57,280 Speaker 1: he had us so prepared um for everything. And then 594 00:30:57,320 --> 00:31:01,880 Speaker 1: he really loosened up. Him and Dani developed a I 595 00:31:01,920 --> 00:31:04,840 Speaker 1: don't know, I want to say love hate relationship, but 596 00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:07,240 Speaker 1: he allowed Danny to like coach the team a little 597 00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:09,360 Speaker 1: bit more. We were playing music on the bus, we 598 00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:13,000 Speaker 1: were we were really having a lot of fun and 599 00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:14,840 Speaker 1: we just got hot. Now we lost in the Big 600 00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:17,719 Speaker 1: Eight Tournament to K State in the semifinals. A lot 601 00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:21,320 Speaker 1: of guys were I could have this wrong. It might 602 00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:23,000 Speaker 1: have been my junior year, but we had a lot 603 00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:25,080 Speaker 1: of guys sick, and then we just we just kind 604 00:31:25,080 --> 00:31:28,360 Speaker 1: of caught fire. Um, there was you know, an upset 605 00:31:29,320 --> 00:31:33,800 Speaker 1: Vanderbilt upset. I think NC State as we uh, you know, 606 00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:36,520 Speaker 1: Murray State beat somebody, and it was just one of 607 00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:40,160 Speaker 1: these deals where it kind of worked for us up until, uh, 608 00:31:40,200 --> 00:31:41,959 Speaker 1: the Elite eight, and then we play some you know, 609 00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:45,240 Speaker 1: number one or top seeds, and by that time, and 610 00:31:45,280 --> 00:31:46,800 Speaker 1: if you look at the scores dug and I know 611 00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:48,280 Speaker 1: I'm talking a lot, but if you go back and 612 00:31:48,280 --> 00:31:52,680 Speaker 1: look at the scores, uh, sweet sixteen game Vanderbilt, we're 613 00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:56,200 Speaker 1: up like sixteen to four. K State game as a 614 00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:57,720 Speaker 1: hell of the game. But I think we jumped on 615 00:31:57,800 --> 00:32:00,680 Speaker 1: them the Duke game. Uh, in the final four, we 616 00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:03,440 Speaker 1: jumped on them ten or twelve to nothing. So all 617 00:32:03,480 --> 00:32:06,600 Speaker 1: that shell drilled stuff that we were doing was carrying over. 618 00:32:07,440 --> 00:32:11,000 Speaker 1: And you know, guys were playing with the confidence. Coach 619 00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:15,400 Speaker 1: shortened his bench up until the national championship game, and 620 00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:16,680 Speaker 1: he didn't you know, then all of a sudden he 621 00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:18,960 Speaker 1: played guys that hadn't played in two or three games. 622 00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:22,160 Speaker 1: The guys were playing with confidence, and we were prepared 623 00:32:22,200 --> 00:32:25,520 Speaker 1: and and uh, you know, I think the first round 624 00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:29,760 Speaker 1: was in Nebraska, which was close to home, and then 625 00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:31,520 Speaker 1: you know, the second rounds in Nebraska, and we went 626 00:32:31,560 --> 00:32:34,520 Speaker 1: to Detroit and and we played out of our minds 627 00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:37,440 Speaker 1: in Detroit, and then we come home to Kansas City, 628 00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:40,680 Speaker 1: and we were just terrific and maybe one of the greatest, 629 00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:42,880 Speaker 1: you know, one of the one of the better, you know, 630 00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:46,360 Speaker 1: top twenty National championship games ever. Was the first half 631 00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:49,080 Speaker 1: of that Oklahoma Kansas game. And I believe it was 632 00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:52,480 Speaker 1: fifty to fifty at halftime, and just an amazing game. 633 00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:54,320 Speaker 1: You know what it's amazing about ou in that game 634 00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:56,680 Speaker 1: and you mentioned that, you know, Mike Maddox got in 635 00:32:57,600 --> 00:33:00,120 Speaker 1: h Lincoln Minor got got a bunch of minutes, and 636 00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:03,640 Speaker 1: and Keith Harris and Clinton Normore and they played played 637 00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:06,080 Speaker 1: more Midstan the National Championship game on the other side, 638 00:33:06,120 --> 00:33:08,400 Speaker 1: and you know, people for I don't know how much 639 00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:12,160 Speaker 1: nationally people forget you know, Billy Tubbs. They would score, 640 00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:15,440 Speaker 1: they're running. They embraced the three point shot before anybody else. 641 00:33:16,000 --> 00:33:18,800 Speaker 1: You know, Dave Dave Seeger, I think he made seven 642 00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:21,080 Speaker 1: threes in the National Championship game, right, And they had 643 00:33:21,080 --> 00:33:24,080 Speaker 1: Mookie Blaylock and Stacy King and Ricky Grace and whatever. 644 00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:27,040 Speaker 1: Rickey didn't played particularly well, but they didn't. I think 645 00:33:27,040 --> 00:33:30,960 Speaker 1: they only played one guy on the bench. They like, Yeah, 646 00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:34,040 Speaker 1: it was crazy, which would be awesome if you're a player. 647 00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:36,680 Speaker 1: But it does go. It's kind of counterintuitive to usually 648 00:33:36,720 --> 00:33:41,080 Speaker 1: when you play fast like that, you play more guys. Yeah, 649 00:33:41,200 --> 00:33:43,760 Speaker 1: it was crazy because first half we went, we hadn't 650 00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:46,080 Speaker 1: been running, and all of a sudden, Coach Brown just like, 651 00:33:46,160 --> 00:33:49,200 Speaker 1: let's go, man, and we were running. And of course 652 00:33:49,320 --> 00:33:52,000 Speaker 1: Oklahoma's playing into their hands. But in the end it 653 00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:55,600 Speaker 1: might have wore them out. They had they had tripic team. 654 00:33:55,800 --> 00:33:58,160 Speaker 1: Um and I think there's six man only played like 655 00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:02,320 Speaker 1: eight minutes in the game. Um uh. And then the 656 00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:04,760 Speaker 1: second half, if you remember, and it was one of 657 00:34:04,840 --> 00:34:07,480 Speaker 1: the best halftime speeches I've ever ever heard, because you know, 658 00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:09,680 Speaker 1: Coach Brown was the head coach at Util when they 659 00:34:09,680 --> 00:34:13,399 Speaker 1: lost to Louisville. Uh, with Darryl Griffith in that group 660 00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:15,520 Speaker 1: in the in the game was in Indianapolis, and he says, 661 00:34:15,520 --> 00:34:18,760 Speaker 1: I'll never forget. After the game, all the Louisville cars 662 00:34:18,880 --> 00:34:22,200 Speaker 1: on the highways driving back to Louisville larns honk and 663 00:34:22,200 --> 00:34:24,360 Speaker 1: he says, we can have the same thing tonight driving 664 00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:26,840 Speaker 1: back to Lawrence, Kansas. You know it's R and I 665 00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:29,680 Speaker 1: whatever in its fifty to fifty and you know, Danny, 666 00:34:29,680 --> 00:34:32,360 Speaker 1: you're the best player, you know, your best player on 667 00:34:32,400 --> 00:34:34,719 Speaker 1: the floor and you can bring this home. And it 668 00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:36,799 Speaker 1: was just I mean I remember it like I was, 669 00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:39,800 Speaker 1: you know, yesterday sitting in that locker room and we 670 00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:41,880 Speaker 1: just you know, we were so fired up when we 671 00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:43,360 Speaker 1: came out and then all of a sudden about this, 672 00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:45,919 Speaker 1: I believe around the eight minute market the second half, 673 00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:49,600 Speaker 1: he put the brakes on the game and he started 674 00:34:49,640 --> 00:34:51,480 Speaker 1: to laying. He actually started to laying with our big 675 00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:54,759 Speaker 1: guys a little bit. And we had never practiced it. 676 00:34:54,840 --> 00:34:57,919 Speaker 1: That's what was amazing about Coach Brown. We didn't talk 677 00:34:57,960 --> 00:34:59,920 Speaker 1: about it, we didn't do it. We just did it 678 00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:03,560 Speaker 1: in the game. And our guy's talent, well, we got 679 00:35:03,960 --> 00:35:05,480 Speaker 1: and I don't know if you're losing to control the 680 00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:08,240 Speaker 1: game during that point, but coach got back in control 681 00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:09,960 Speaker 1: the game and he got the game because he likes, 682 00:35:10,000 --> 00:35:12,239 Speaker 1: you know, to call plays late in the game. I 683 00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:16,719 Speaker 1: think he felt more comfortable dictating, uh late in the game. 684 00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:21,439 Speaker 1: But it was just masterful coaching obviously to win that game. 685 00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:25,760 Speaker 1: Um for somebody who did not experience the Danny Manning 686 00:35:26,520 --> 00:35:28,680 Speaker 1: era at not just in Kansas, and he had a 687 00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:30,719 Speaker 1: he had a very good NBA career, but of course 688 00:35:30,719 --> 00:35:34,759 Speaker 1: the injury early on with the Clippers. Uh, probably changed, 689 00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:38,520 Speaker 1: like his career trajectory. If you were to describe to 690 00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:41,080 Speaker 1: somebody who never saw him play, like this is what 691 00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:42,920 Speaker 1: made Danny Manning one of the all time greats, what 692 00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:45,640 Speaker 1: would it be? Yeah, I think he's one of the 693 00:35:45,680 --> 00:35:49,000 Speaker 1: top ten college basketball players ever. So when he stayed 694 00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:53,120 Speaker 1: four years, um, you know which kids just don't do today. Um, 695 00:35:53,160 --> 00:35:55,640 Speaker 1: in today's world, Danny would have left after his sophomore year, 696 00:35:55,680 --> 00:35:59,799 Speaker 1: maybe after his freshman year. Um, but one he was 697 00:36:00,000 --> 00:36:02,640 Speaker 1: eight teammate. He could handle the ball. He could shoot 698 00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:06,600 Speaker 1: it back then at six ten, UM, you could really 699 00:36:06,640 --> 00:36:08,880 Speaker 1: pass it. He could really handle it, had a great 700 00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:12,080 Speaker 1: feel and can score left and right hand around the basket. 701 00:36:12,560 --> 00:36:14,800 Speaker 1: And Danny wasn't a great athlete. He was just smarter, 702 00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:17,399 Speaker 1: uh than a lot of players that he played. Again, 703 00:36:17,480 --> 00:36:19,600 Speaker 1: and I remember my senior year was his junior year, 704 00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:22,400 Speaker 1: and we were a sweet sixteen team, but we weren't 705 00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:25,200 Speaker 1: nearly as good as the uh you know, the year 706 00:36:25,239 --> 00:36:27,440 Speaker 1: before the six final four team of the eighty eight 707 00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:32,040 Speaker 1: championship team. And you know, he would have twenty five 708 00:36:32,080 --> 00:36:35,959 Speaker 1: and eight at halftime, you know, his junior year and 709 00:36:36,080 --> 00:36:38,440 Speaker 1: I'd have twenty five the whole big eighth season, you 710 00:36:38,440 --> 00:36:40,400 Speaker 1: know what I'm saying. And and he'd go into a 711 00:36:40,400 --> 00:36:42,160 Speaker 1: half time we'd be up twelve, and he says, Turge, 712 00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:44,520 Speaker 1: I'm not shooting the staff. I'm gonna work on my defense. 713 00:36:45,239 --> 00:36:46,920 Speaker 1: So I throw the ball into him. He throw it 714 00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:50,239 Speaker 1: back out, back in, and throw it back out. And 715 00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:52,000 Speaker 1: I didn't want to you because Coach Brown would take 716 00:36:52,040 --> 00:36:53,719 Speaker 1: me out of the game if I shot. And so 717 00:36:54,440 --> 00:36:56,239 Speaker 1: and finally another team would come back a little bit. 718 00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:58,200 Speaker 1: I said, come on, Danny, and he ended up with 719 00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:02,040 Speaker 1: thirty seven, thirty eight, whatever, whatever it took. Man the kid, 720 00:37:02,200 --> 00:37:05,279 Speaker 1: the kid was. He was something else and and could 721 00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:07,160 Speaker 1: score in a variety of way and just had great 722 00:37:07,200 --> 00:37:13,319 Speaker 1: touch from all over the floor. Uh wait, so LB 723 00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:16,560 Speaker 1: left and went to the Sixers. You went with him, right? 724 00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:19,200 Speaker 1: Is that my remembering correctly that that was the Or 725 00:37:19,200 --> 00:37:20,719 Speaker 1: did you go to or You went to Oregon first 726 00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:23,279 Speaker 1: and then back to the Sixers. Yeah, he went to 727 00:37:23,320 --> 00:37:27,520 Speaker 1: the Spurs and then Roy Williams came and I stayed 728 00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:30,480 Speaker 1: with coach Williams for four years. A can okay, let 729 00:37:30,520 --> 00:37:32,839 Speaker 1: me let me start with let me say so Roy 730 00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:35,960 Speaker 1: Williams inherits, you guys were on probation the first year. 731 00:37:36,239 --> 00:37:38,600 Speaker 1: I mean, and the stuff you're on probation for is 732 00:37:38,680 --> 00:37:42,640 Speaker 1: like some of the most laughable stuff ever. But um, okay, 733 00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:45,920 Speaker 1: so you you you play for and coach with an 734 00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:49,600 Speaker 1: all time great and then here comes in Roy Williams, who, 735 00:37:50,040 --> 00:37:54,080 Speaker 1: um you know from the Carolina family. Um, great pedigree, 736 00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:57,279 Speaker 1: but a very different style. What was What was it 737 00:37:57,320 --> 00:38:02,360 Speaker 1: like to coach with Roy Williams? Well, Um, one, I 738 00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:05,120 Speaker 1: felt bad for him when he got there, Um, falling 739 00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:07,479 Speaker 1: Larry Brown and then all the things we were going through. 740 00:38:07,520 --> 00:38:13,000 Speaker 1: But you knew right away that he was remarkable recruiter 741 00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:17,040 Speaker 1: um and great unbelievable people skills. You spent time with him, 742 00:38:17,040 --> 00:38:19,920 Speaker 1: you know how he is and um, he taught me 743 00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:22,440 Speaker 1: a lot of things that I needed to be taught. 744 00:38:22,600 --> 00:38:26,600 Speaker 1: You know how to work in the office, Um, you 745 00:38:26,640 --> 00:38:29,800 Speaker 1: know how to recruit, Um, you know all the details 746 00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:32,160 Speaker 1: that go into it. And if you know anything about 747 00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:34,359 Speaker 1: Coach Williams, he's one of the most competitive guys I've 748 00:38:34,400 --> 00:38:39,040 Speaker 1: ever been around. And um he he had a philosophy. 749 00:38:39,080 --> 00:38:42,319 Speaker 1: He believed in it, and um he stuck to it 750 00:38:42,920 --> 00:38:45,399 Speaker 1: and he coached it every day, and he coached hard 751 00:38:45,440 --> 00:38:48,680 Speaker 1: every day. And the guy just worked his ass off. 752 00:38:48,719 --> 00:38:51,759 Speaker 1: I just remember all the Red Eye flights heach in California. 753 00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:53,600 Speaker 1: You're just scrouting a lot of guys. You'd come back, 754 00:38:53,640 --> 00:38:56,200 Speaker 1: you'd fly the Red Eye and come straight to work 755 00:38:56,280 --> 00:38:59,560 Speaker 1: and and then he, you know, have practice. And the 756 00:38:59,640 --> 00:39:02,719 Speaker 1: guy was incredible. He's still doing it today. And uh, 757 00:39:02,960 --> 00:39:06,680 Speaker 1: his work ethic um his competitiveness. But he had a 758 00:39:06,680 --> 00:39:08,640 Speaker 1: belief system and he and he sticks to it, and 759 00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:10,600 Speaker 1: he has a great eye for talent, and he can 760 00:39:10,640 --> 00:39:14,120 Speaker 1: really really recruit and he puts guys in position to 761 00:39:14,200 --> 00:39:17,080 Speaker 1: be successful. And he had the style of play. It's 762 00:39:17,120 --> 00:39:20,560 Speaker 1: fun and kids like playing it. So he was he 763 00:39:20,680 --> 00:39:22,760 Speaker 1: was I wouldn't be where I am and I wouldn't 764 00:39:22,760 --> 00:39:25,239 Speaker 1: be with either one of them. Larry Brown taught me 765 00:39:25,320 --> 00:39:28,000 Speaker 1: so much, changed my life, gave me a chance of Kansas. 766 00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:32,480 Speaker 1: And Roy Williams really helped me understand this profession. And 767 00:39:32,560 --> 00:39:36,000 Speaker 1: you know what it took to be successful in this profession. Okay, 768 00:39:36,000 --> 00:39:37,399 Speaker 1: And I don't want to get too far a fuel, 769 00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:40,480 Speaker 1: but I am fascinated by the recruiting angle of it 770 00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:44,480 Speaker 1: because I'll give you my perspective. I'm in southern California 771 00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:46,759 Speaker 1: at the time. My dad is a you know back 772 00:39:46,800 --> 00:39:49,439 Speaker 1: then as a travel team coach right before AU team 773 00:39:49,560 --> 00:39:54,560 Speaker 1: and um, I think Adonis Jordan's and Alonso Jamison right 774 00:39:54,640 --> 00:39:57,960 Speaker 1: to the two of the two first Southern California guys. 775 00:39:58,120 --> 00:40:02,080 Speaker 1: I remember coach Williams to recruit and then it became 776 00:40:02,160 --> 00:40:05,439 Speaker 1: kind of like a pipeline and his thing to all 777 00:40:05,520 --> 00:40:08,560 Speaker 1: of us as players was like he would come and 778 00:40:08,600 --> 00:40:11,840 Speaker 1: whoever it was that he wanted, he would evaluate. He 779 00:40:11,840 --> 00:40:14,799 Speaker 1: would sit mid court and you're like, wait, didn't they 780 00:40:14,880 --> 00:40:16,359 Speaker 1: just have a game last night? And he would sit 781 00:40:16,400 --> 00:40:19,120 Speaker 1: like mid court at a practice or at a slam 782 00:40:19,239 --> 00:40:22,600 Speaker 1: and jam game, and you know, like he looked perfect, 783 00:40:22,640 --> 00:40:26,280 Speaker 1: like hair looked perfect, shirt looked perfect, and he wasn't 784 00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:29,319 Speaker 1: He wasn't gabbing, right, He wasn't b sen, he wasn't 785 00:40:29,360 --> 00:40:31,680 Speaker 1: grabbing guys. He was just sitting there and watching and 786 00:40:31,680 --> 00:40:33,719 Speaker 1: whoever he's watching, Like you knew, whoever the best player 787 00:40:33,760 --> 00:40:36,760 Speaker 1: in the gym was, that's who Roy Williams wants. And 788 00:40:36,960 --> 00:40:39,880 Speaker 1: it was, you know, whether it was Paul Pierce or 789 00:40:39,920 --> 00:40:42,200 Speaker 1: what you know, like you go or became Eric Chenowith, 790 00:40:42,480 --> 00:40:45,440 Speaker 1: you know, But it started with with with Alonzo Jamison 791 00:40:46,040 --> 00:40:49,160 Speaker 1: and uh and Adonnas Jordan's as as as those are 792 00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:53,080 Speaker 1: the first two I remember, Yeah, yeah, Donna's was the 793 00:40:53,080 --> 00:40:54,680 Speaker 1: one we had to get. There was another kid that 794 00:40:54,719 --> 00:40:57,520 Speaker 1: he had committed end up going to USC because of 795 00:40:57,560 --> 00:40:59,520 Speaker 1: the probation. I can't remember if we don't get on 796 00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:01,200 Speaker 1: my camerame, but a hell of a player played in 797 00:41:01,239 --> 00:41:03,600 Speaker 1: the NBA and Coach had both of them, I think 798 00:41:03,640 --> 00:41:06,360 Speaker 1: at the time. And if you've ever sit down with 799 00:41:06,400 --> 00:41:09,240 Speaker 1: Coach Williams one on one, or if you've ever said 800 00:41:09,640 --> 00:41:15,240 Speaker 1: in a conversation when he's recruiting you, um, it's pretty amazing. Um. 801 00:41:15,239 --> 00:41:17,000 Speaker 1: He's one of those guys that can make you feel 802 00:41:17,040 --> 00:41:20,520 Speaker 1: really good. Uh. But he's also has always had a 803 00:41:20,520 --> 00:41:25,800 Speaker 1: plan for you type thing and he just he was 804 00:41:25,960 --> 00:41:28,040 Speaker 1: just flat out good at it. He just outworked people. 805 00:41:28,040 --> 00:41:29,879 Speaker 1: He had a motto, if you want something bad enough, 806 00:41:29,880 --> 00:41:32,480 Speaker 1: you better be willing to work for it, and um, 807 00:41:32,520 --> 00:41:35,239 Speaker 1: he wants that on his tombstone. And he just never 808 00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:37,719 Speaker 1: wants to be out work. And so he's just done 809 00:41:37,719 --> 00:41:40,200 Speaker 1: in his whole life. If you know his childhood, what 810 00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:42,640 Speaker 1: he went through growing up, and all the things he 811 00:41:42,680 --> 00:41:45,440 Speaker 1: had to do to be successful get into coaching, the 812 00:41:45,440 --> 00:41:48,280 Speaker 1: things he did to be on coach Smith's staff, how 813 00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:50,840 Speaker 1: hard he worked. Um, you know it's like, oh, I 814 00:41:50,920 --> 00:41:53,160 Speaker 1: used to watch school six miles up here on the snow. 815 00:41:53,400 --> 00:41:55,160 Speaker 1: Well he actually really did those things, you know what 816 00:41:55,200 --> 00:42:00,600 Speaker 1: I'm saying. So he he really he's earned wething that 817 00:42:00,680 --> 00:42:03,840 Speaker 1: he's gotten and uh what enough? You know what? The 818 00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:08,560 Speaker 1: thing is crazy? It's the really good ones how easy 819 00:42:08,600 --> 00:42:11,359 Speaker 1: they make it look. Because this ship is hard. Man, 820 00:42:11,560 --> 00:42:15,160 Speaker 1: It's it's hard coaching. It's hard, and it's hard for 821 00:42:15,200 --> 00:42:19,200 Speaker 1: them too. Um but I think for majority of the 822 00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:21,440 Speaker 1: years you look at Roy Wimsy man, it's that's easy 823 00:42:21,520 --> 00:42:24,719 Speaker 1: for him. It's not. But he's that good where he 824 00:42:24,760 --> 00:42:29,759 Speaker 1: makes it look easy. Okay, so um but um but 825 00:42:29,960 --> 00:42:33,719 Speaker 1: here here's the now. Here's the analyst player want to 826 00:42:33,719 --> 00:42:37,760 Speaker 1: be coaching me or part time coaching me? Their styles 827 00:42:37,960 --> 00:42:40,840 Speaker 1: are so dramatically different, as you point out, like Larry Brown, 828 00:42:41,640 --> 00:42:43,399 Speaker 1: you know you hadn't run all year, and you start 829 00:42:43,480 --> 00:42:45,440 Speaker 1: running the National championship game. Then you slam on the 830 00:42:45,440 --> 00:42:48,680 Speaker 1: brakes and run delay game in the National Championship games, 831 00:42:48,680 --> 00:42:51,120 Speaker 1: something you hadn't done even practiced all year, as opposed 832 00:42:51,120 --> 00:42:54,200 Speaker 1: to coach Williams, who look, he's I can I can 833 00:42:54,320 --> 00:42:57,359 Speaker 1: tell you exactly what plays he's gonna run. I know 834 00:42:57,560 --> 00:43:00,520 Speaker 1: out of every first time out of each half, he's 835 00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:02,920 Speaker 1: gonna either trap the ball or trapped the first pass 836 00:43:03,080 --> 00:43:05,879 Speaker 1: right like everyone. And he's gonna do what he does, 837 00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:07,840 Speaker 1: and he's gonna sub how he wants a sub and 838 00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:10,640 Speaker 1: it doesn't matter. What is that like from from you? 839 00:43:10,680 --> 00:43:13,080 Speaker 1: Because you're I I feel like in watching you coach, 840 00:43:13,120 --> 00:43:16,520 Speaker 1: you're much more like Larry Brown, much more instinctual feeling 841 00:43:16,680 --> 00:43:20,480 Speaker 1: each game differently. What's that like those the juxtaposition of 842 00:43:20,480 --> 00:43:25,920 Speaker 1: those two styles. Yeah, it's they are different. Um, they 843 00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:29,480 Speaker 1: both work, they're both Hall of famers. Um. So it 844 00:43:29,600 --> 00:43:31,840 Speaker 1: just shows you there's so many different ways to coach. 845 00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:35,520 Speaker 1: And that's really what I've learned. Um. You know, I 846 00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:37,640 Speaker 1: have a lot of great friends that are great coaches 847 00:43:37,680 --> 00:43:39,560 Speaker 1: in the business, and they all do it a little 848 00:43:39,560 --> 00:43:43,560 Speaker 1: bit different. But um, probably because I've played for Coach Brown, 849 00:43:44,600 --> 00:43:47,560 Speaker 1: I might coach a little bit more like him. Um, 850 00:43:47,600 --> 00:43:50,879 Speaker 1: I don't recruit as well as Roy Williams does, or 851 00:43:51,680 --> 00:43:55,440 Speaker 1: haven't been the coach at Kansas or North Carolina. Um, 852 00:43:55,480 --> 00:43:59,120 Speaker 1: And so I knew I coach against Roy Williams. I 853 00:43:59,120 --> 00:44:01,160 Speaker 1: don't know. I'm like in six or oh and seven, 854 00:44:01,160 --> 00:44:03,239 Speaker 1: oh and eight against him. I knew exactly what he 855 00:44:03,320 --> 00:44:06,719 Speaker 1: was gonna do. I still couldn't beat him. Um, you know, 856 00:44:06,880 --> 00:44:09,920 Speaker 1: so they ran past us. Keep him out of transition. 857 00:44:10,080 --> 00:44:12,160 Speaker 1: That is much easier said than done. Keep them out 858 00:44:12,160 --> 00:44:16,160 Speaker 1: of transition, much easier said than done. Yeah, they're terrific 859 00:44:16,160 --> 00:44:19,840 Speaker 1: at that East. I just remember, you know, Coach Williams, 860 00:44:19,840 --> 00:44:21,879 Speaker 1: we'd be right before half. We'd say two for one, 861 00:44:21,960 --> 00:44:25,120 Speaker 1: he says. You know, he never curse. He said, Dad gumming, 862 00:44:25,160 --> 00:44:27,880 Speaker 1: I want three for one. You know, he just wanted 863 00:44:27,920 --> 00:44:32,319 Speaker 1: to run all the time. And uh, but that's what 864 00:44:32,440 --> 00:44:34,719 Speaker 1: makes him who he is. He's a gun slinger and 865 00:44:35,000 --> 00:44:38,160 Speaker 1: he liked old Westerns and uh, you know he's not 866 00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:40,160 Speaker 1: afraid that you know the trap and do things. You're 867 00:44:40,200 --> 00:44:42,920 Speaker 1: not afraid to take chances. Um, and that's what's made 868 00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:45,560 Speaker 1: him who he is. And and uh he's won so 869 00:44:45,640 --> 00:44:47,919 Speaker 1: many darn games. Um, okay, give me the real Tad 870 00:44:47,960 --> 00:44:50,960 Speaker 1: Boil story you guys played together. He goes into the 871 00:44:50,960 --> 00:44:54,600 Speaker 1: business world. You're you were you were an Oregan, right, 872 00:44:54,600 --> 00:44:57,560 Speaker 1: it wasn't at Jacksonville State. You're an Oregon. And you 873 00:44:57,640 --> 00:44:59,839 Speaker 1: talk him into becoming a coach what's what's the real 874 00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:02,440 Speaker 1: We're gonna have him on, what's the real story behind 875 00:45:02,840 --> 00:45:04,880 Speaker 1: how it took place that you got Tad Bull to 876 00:45:04,920 --> 00:45:08,719 Speaker 1: become a coach in which he's an outstanding one today 877 00:45:08,840 --> 00:45:10,799 Speaker 1: he's terrific. What are you doing in Colorado? I don't 878 00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:13,040 Speaker 1: know if anybody will ever touch what he's done. But 879 00:45:14,320 --> 00:45:18,280 Speaker 1: so Tad and I obviously stayed close. He was my captain. 880 00:45:18,360 --> 00:45:21,080 Speaker 1: We hung out together in the summers. He'd come ky, 881 00:45:21,160 --> 00:45:24,640 Speaker 1: you watched practice. We just remain really close friends and 882 00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:27,560 Speaker 1: we still aren't to this day. Um. And so he 883 00:45:27,600 --> 00:45:29,920 Speaker 1: was he was coaching in high school basketball and he 884 00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:33,200 Speaker 1: was doing great. He was really successful, and I think 885 00:45:33,200 --> 00:45:35,120 Speaker 1: he took his team to the final four and stayed 886 00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:39,439 Speaker 1: in Colorado, and um, you know, every time he talked, 887 00:45:39,480 --> 00:45:41,680 Speaker 1: he's like, coach, you know, churge. I'm happy, but I'm 888 00:45:41,719 --> 00:45:46,920 Speaker 1: not real happy. He was making six figures and uh, 889 00:45:47,000 --> 00:45:50,080 Speaker 1: you know the in the in the uh mortgage business, 890 00:45:50,080 --> 00:45:53,320 Speaker 1: not mortgage but UH in the market and handling people's 891 00:45:53,320 --> 00:45:57,120 Speaker 1: money and Jose Ottoman, I am and what he was 892 00:45:57,120 --> 00:45:59,040 Speaker 1: doing really, he was really successful. And I was like, 893 00:45:59,120 --> 00:46:00,799 Speaker 1: you know, we made fun. I'm like, Dad, you take 894 00:46:00,840 --> 00:46:04,480 Speaker 1: six vacations a year. You're always on vacation. Why would 895 00:46:04,520 --> 00:46:07,000 Speaker 1: you want to coach? And he's just like, well, down deep, 896 00:46:07,040 --> 00:46:11,000 Speaker 1: I'm not really happy. Uh. So family wise for him, 897 00:46:11,040 --> 00:46:13,960 Speaker 1: he wasn't married at the time. Uh, it was a 898 00:46:14,000 --> 00:46:18,040 Speaker 1: really good timing for him to uh come. I convinced 899 00:46:18,040 --> 00:46:21,480 Speaker 1: Coach Green to hire him. Uh, and you know the 900 00:46:21,520 --> 00:46:24,880 Speaker 1: rest is history. Uh. I think Tad was with me 901 00:46:25,000 --> 00:46:28,160 Speaker 1: at Oregon for two years. Jerry Green took the Tennessee job. 902 00:46:28,400 --> 00:46:31,880 Speaker 1: I went to the Sixers, Tad went with him to Tennessee, 903 00:46:31,920 --> 00:46:34,479 Speaker 1: and then I got to Jacksonville State job the next year. 904 00:46:35,360 --> 00:46:37,919 Speaker 1: And then Tad was with me for nine years or 905 00:46:37,960 --> 00:46:43,440 Speaker 1: eight years, um, jack which saw State. So UM, it's 906 00:46:43,440 --> 00:46:48,440 Speaker 1: an amazing story. His climb from northern Colorado to Colorado. 907 00:46:48,520 --> 00:46:51,840 Speaker 1: You know, usually you go from northern Colorado Colorado State 908 00:46:52,360 --> 00:46:55,320 Speaker 1: to Colorado. And he kind of jumped that, jumped that, 909 00:46:55,680 --> 00:46:58,400 Speaker 1: uh you know, hooked there and and I just remember 910 00:46:58,520 --> 00:47:01,360 Speaker 1: trying to get him that job and and uh, you know, 911 00:47:01,440 --> 00:47:06,000 Speaker 1: he's done amazing things. He's he's really really smart. Um. 912 00:47:07,000 --> 00:47:10,880 Speaker 1: If you can handle people's money, you know, um, convince 913 00:47:10,920 --> 00:47:13,560 Speaker 1: people to give you money to invest, you can definitely 914 00:47:13,560 --> 00:47:17,680 Speaker 1: convince people to give him your child to coach basketball. 915 00:47:17,800 --> 00:47:21,480 Speaker 1: So it was a natural progression recruiting and what he 916 00:47:21,520 --> 00:47:25,040 Speaker 1: did uh in his business world and Uh, he's just 917 00:47:25,080 --> 00:47:27,839 Speaker 1: an excellent coach. And to me, he's a lot like 918 00:47:28,000 --> 00:47:32,879 Speaker 1: Roy Williams. Uh, we're gonna do it this way. Um. Now, 919 00:47:32,880 --> 00:47:35,120 Speaker 1: he had just you know, they you know, they had 920 00:47:35,120 --> 00:47:38,600 Speaker 1: just they switched ball screens. And he's changed over the years, 921 00:47:38,640 --> 00:47:41,520 Speaker 1: but he believes in what he believes in. He sticks 922 00:47:41,560 --> 00:47:44,680 Speaker 1: to it and it's really worked well for him. You 923 00:47:44,680 --> 00:47:46,560 Speaker 1: you go to the NBA for a year, You've been 924 00:47:46,600 --> 00:47:49,120 Speaker 1: at under Jerry Green, You've been under Roy Williams, been 925 00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:51,640 Speaker 1: under uh and you played for him under Larry Brown. 926 00:47:51,680 --> 00:47:54,240 Speaker 1: You get your first head coaching job at Jacksonville State 927 00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:58,880 Speaker 1: in Alabama. Now that that move eighteen inches from assistant 928 00:47:58,920 --> 00:48:02,480 Speaker 1: to head coach? What what? What do you remember about? 929 00:48:02,760 --> 00:48:05,080 Speaker 1: You know, you're you're running your first practice, You're your 930 00:48:05,120 --> 00:48:09,200 Speaker 1: head coach of your first team. Yeah. Well, I was 931 00:48:09,200 --> 00:48:12,080 Speaker 1: walking up to coach the JB team in Kansas, UM 932 00:48:12,239 --> 00:48:13,960 Speaker 1: when I was twenty three years old. I did it 933 00:48:14,040 --> 00:48:15,680 Speaker 1: for four years and so I got to run my 934 00:48:15,719 --> 00:48:18,360 Speaker 1: own practice. Then of course I had a couple of 935 00:48:18,360 --> 00:48:20,719 Speaker 1: the greatest teachers of all time and Roy Williams and 936 00:48:20,760 --> 00:48:26,839 Speaker 1: Larry Brown. So I was prepared, um, and I felt 937 00:48:26,880 --> 00:48:31,160 Speaker 1: like I always I could always run a good practice. Okay. Now, 938 00:48:31,360 --> 00:48:33,759 Speaker 1: we started out two and oh at Jacksonville State and 939 00:48:33,800 --> 00:48:35,760 Speaker 1: I thought I had I was like, this is easy. 940 00:48:35,800 --> 00:48:40,439 Speaker 1: I got a kid committed, the Hayes twins Jarvison's uh, 941 00:48:40,480 --> 00:48:42,839 Speaker 1: I want to say Jonas Hayes were supposed to come 942 00:48:42,880 --> 00:48:44,880 Speaker 1: play for me to end up going to Western Carolina. 943 00:48:45,160 --> 00:48:47,160 Speaker 1: We're two and oh, They're supposed to call me and commit, 944 00:48:47,200 --> 00:48:49,000 Speaker 1: and I'm like, and this ship is easy. Why to 945 00:48:49,080 --> 00:48:52,160 Speaker 1: wait so long? Well, the Hayes twins end up not 946 00:48:52,320 --> 00:48:54,520 Speaker 1: calling to go to Western Carolina and we lost like 947 00:48:54,560 --> 00:48:57,560 Speaker 1: our next eleven games in a row. So I think 948 00:48:57,560 --> 00:49:00,640 Speaker 1: we were like two and eleven, and I can't remember 949 00:49:00,680 --> 00:49:02,360 Speaker 1: exactly what it was. At some point we lost the 950 00:49:02,400 --> 00:49:05,080 Speaker 1: love and straight game and I realized how hard it 951 00:49:05,200 --> 00:49:09,719 Speaker 1: was and how recruiting was and establishing culture and all 952 00:49:09,719 --> 00:49:13,080 Speaker 1: that kind of stuff. So, um, you know, I feel 953 00:49:13,160 --> 00:49:16,239 Speaker 1: comfortable because I coached JV for four years coach game. 954 00:49:17,239 --> 00:49:21,200 Speaker 1: I was very comfortable, always had been very comfortable in 955 00:49:21,239 --> 00:49:24,360 Speaker 1: the coaching part. It was just, you know, growing into 956 00:49:24,480 --> 00:49:28,560 Speaker 1: the administrative part, the recruiting part as a head coach, 957 00:49:28,760 --> 00:49:31,839 Speaker 1: that was all that was all new to me. And 958 00:49:31,920 --> 00:49:34,280 Speaker 1: you know, making the final decisions who we're going to recruit, 959 00:49:34,280 --> 00:49:36,200 Speaker 1: how we're gonna recruit, how are they going to fit in? 960 00:49:37,120 --> 00:49:40,120 Speaker 1: That was different. But you know, we turned it around quickly. 961 00:49:41,120 --> 00:49:43,520 Speaker 1: You know, I think our second class, our first class 962 00:49:43,520 --> 00:49:47,120 Speaker 1: there we signed eight or nine guys. Um it's kind 963 00:49:47,160 --> 00:49:49,720 Speaker 1: of feel late, and we got the job. Marlon Gurley, 964 00:49:49,800 --> 00:49:53,480 Speaker 1: Richard Willie. I thank god they were Garter Sports and 965 00:49:53,760 --> 00:49:56,440 Speaker 1: they helped us be somewhat successful. But that second year, 966 00:49:56,480 --> 00:49:58,839 Speaker 1: we actually lost the home game right at the end 967 00:49:58,840 --> 00:50:02,160 Speaker 1: of the year, win the league championship, lost like two 968 00:50:02,880 --> 00:50:05,759 Speaker 1: um or we would have won the league. And uh, 969 00:50:05,800 --> 00:50:08,960 Speaker 1: and you know Lefty was coaching in Natalie at Georgia State. 970 00:50:09,000 --> 00:50:12,440 Speaker 1: Stanford was really good back then. Troy State had a 971 00:50:12,480 --> 00:50:14,640 Speaker 1: really good team that year, and so it was a 972 00:50:14,640 --> 00:50:18,040 Speaker 1: heck of a competitive lya we we turned it around 973 00:50:18,040 --> 00:50:20,680 Speaker 1: pretty quickly. Uh. In our two years after you get 974 00:50:20,680 --> 00:50:23,759 Speaker 1: the Wichita job, and and you had a streak. I 975 00:50:23,800 --> 00:50:26,279 Speaker 1: think you lost your first eleven games right of your 976 00:50:26,719 --> 00:50:30,240 Speaker 1: at Wichita State. That was the same thing we started 977 00:50:30,239 --> 00:50:33,839 Speaker 1: out We started out five and one. We beat Oklahoma State, 978 00:50:33,880 --> 00:50:36,319 Speaker 1: it was ranked ten. We beat our my first game, 979 00:50:36,400 --> 00:50:40,040 Speaker 1: which state was ky State. We beat them with Jim Woolridge. 980 00:50:40,640 --> 00:50:42,920 Speaker 1: And we're five and one, and our only loss was 981 00:50:43,000 --> 00:50:47,240 Speaker 1: to Washington with Bob Bender and a real close loss. 982 00:50:47,280 --> 00:50:48,799 Speaker 1: And we had all those games at home, made Kate 983 00:50:48,840 --> 00:50:50,840 Speaker 1: stay at home, We at Oklahoma stay at home, and 984 00:50:50,880 --> 00:50:53,640 Speaker 1: we had Washington at home. And so we started out 985 00:50:53,680 --> 00:50:55,600 Speaker 1: five and one once again, I think it was easy. 986 00:50:56,200 --> 00:50:59,440 Speaker 1: And we ended up nine and eighteen. And so we 987 00:50:59,560 --> 00:51:02,000 Speaker 1: go four and whatever the rest of the way, the 988 00:51:02,000 --> 00:51:04,080 Speaker 1: rest of the way, and I think we won two 989 00:51:04,080 --> 00:51:06,800 Speaker 1: of our last three, and so it was an amazing 990 00:51:06,880 --> 00:51:09,600 Speaker 1: stretch in there where we couldn't I couldn't do anything. 991 00:51:10,280 --> 00:51:13,600 Speaker 1: UH couldn't win any games. We weren't very good. We 992 00:51:13,719 --> 00:51:17,360 Speaker 1: knew we weren't going to be very good. UM, but 993 00:51:17,400 --> 00:51:19,239 Speaker 1: we established a little bit of a culture with some 994 00:51:19,360 --> 00:51:23,600 Speaker 1: guys and and UH brought into a really good recruiting class. 995 00:51:23,600 --> 00:51:26,280 Speaker 1: And you know, I think we went from nine wins 996 00:51:26,320 --> 00:51:31,080 Speaker 1: to fifteen wins, to wins one to twenty two to 997 00:51:31,200 --> 00:51:33,520 Speaker 1: twenty three to twenty six. We got better every year 998 00:51:34,560 --> 00:51:36,719 Speaker 1: like our first six years. But you know, I was 999 00:51:36,719 --> 00:51:39,600 Speaker 1: a grind. It was. It was tough and uh, but 1000 00:51:39,640 --> 00:51:40,840 Speaker 1: I had a great a d and I had a 1001 00:51:40,880 --> 00:51:43,520 Speaker 1: great president. I had a great staff and it was 1002 00:51:43,520 --> 00:51:46,520 Speaker 1: a lot of fun at a young age. And remember 1003 00:51:46,560 --> 00:51:50,840 Speaker 1: that league we had, we had Dana Altman, we had 1004 00:51:52,480 --> 00:51:58,040 Speaker 1: was that you had, well you had Dermott, Yeah great? 1005 00:51:58,719 --> 00:52:03,759 Speaker 1: Was that Northern Iowa? Right? And then we had the 1006 00:52:03,800 --> 00:52:06,080 Speaker 1: salutes were good back then? Right? You had that was 1007 00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:13,160 Speaker 1: drake Head, Tom David. You know you're able to cut 1008 00:52:13,200 --> 00:52:16,200 Speaker 1: your teet going against just great coaching every night. I'll 1009 00:52:16,200 --> 00:52:21,240 Speaker 1: never forget that. It was a tremendous coaching league. Um 1010 00:52:20,160 --> 00:52:25,160 Speaker 1: U in the do for for brevity? Um, how are you? 1011 00:52:25,160 --> 00:52:27,680 Speaker 1: You know? What is it like for you talked about 1012 00:52:27,760 --> 00:52:30,520 Speaker 1: Danny Manning Stags four years. You've kind of downplayed your 1013 00:52:30,520 --> 00:52:34,719 Speaker 1: own recruiting prowess, right because you've like you're like your 1014 00:52:34,719 --> 00:52:37,279 Speaker 1: own worst enemy, whether it's at Maryland or even at 1015 00:52:37,320 --> 00:52:39,759 Speaker 1: A and m DeAndre Jordan for example, and others. It's 1016 00:52:39,840 --> 00:52:42,279 Speaker 1: that you recruited. Is that now you get to the 1017 00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:45,560 Speaker 1: bigger jobs. You signed some of these kids, but the 1018 00:52:45,600 --> 00:52:49,760 Speaker 1: process of holding onto them is really really difficult. Um, 1019 00:52:49,800 --> 00:52:51,960 Speaker 1: how is it? How has it changed? You in terms 1020 00:52:51,960 --> 00:52:55,120 Speaker 1: of your recruiting focus, how you put together a team, 1021 00:52:55,160 --> 00:52:58,759 Speaker 1: the ever changing landscape of how long you're gonna have 1022 00:52:58,840 --> 00:53:01,000 Speaker 1: the five star kids, and and how much you go 1023 00:53:01,040 --> 00:53:04,520 Speaker 1: after the five star kids. Yeah, we don't sign a 1024 00:53:04,520 --> 00:53:06,880 Speaker 1: lot of five star kids. Now. I go after him 1025 00:53:07,000 --> 00:53:10,279 Speaker 1: and especially the local ones. I go after him hard. 1026 00:53:10,880 --> 00:53:12,480 Speaker 1: Doesn't mean I get him. I don't get all of them. 1027 00:53:12,480 --> 00:53:15,239 Speaker 1: A lot of kids haven't stayed home, but we've kept 1028 00:53:15,239 --> 00:53:18,360 Speaker 1: our share. Um. You know, we knew Jalen Smith was 1029 00:53:18,400 --> 00:53:22,960 Speaker 1: a two year guy when we signed him. Bruno Fernando, 1030 00:53:23,360 --> 00:53:25,440 Speaker 1: I knew he wanted to leave. We weren't really sure, 1031 00:53:26,360 --> 00:53:28,719 Speaker 1: but after the first year you were kind of you know, like, yeah, 1032 00:53:28,760 --> 00:53:30,480 Speaker 1: he's gonna leave after this year. He wanted to leave 1033 00:53:30,520 --> 00:53:32,840 Speaker 1: after his first year, which would have been, you know, 1034 00:53:33,000 --> 00:53:37,520 Speaker 1: really bad for his career. But guys like Kevin Herder, uh, 1035 00:53:37,560 --> 00:53:39,840 Speaker 1: you know, he's not even a top fifty player in 1036 00:53:39,880 --> 00:53:43,160 Speaker 1: the country. Uh, and then he leaves after two years. 1037 00:53:43,160 --> 00:53:45,440 Speaker 1: Those are the ones that kind of, even though you 1038 00:53:45,520 --> 00:53:47,960 Speaker 1: kind of see it coming, you're not really prepared for. 1039 00:53:48,200 --> 00:53:50,719 Speaker 1: Those are the ones who sneak up on you a 1040 00:53:50,760 --> 00:53:53,360 Speaker 1: little bit. We're in the same boat with Aaron Wiggins. 1041 00:53:53,360 --> 00:53:56,920 Speaker 1: I think next year, Aaron Wiggins will have a tough choice, uh, 1042 00:53:57,040 --> 00:53:59,239 Speaker 1: to stay or leave. He was, you know, not even 1043 00:53:59,320 --> 00:54:01,759 Speaker 1: the top fifty player coming out of high school and in 1044 00:54:01,719 --> 00:54:05,080 Speaker 1: in a lot of pools. Um. But you know, because 1045 00:54:05,120 --> 00:54:07,799 Speaker 1: I coached in the NBA, because I coached at Jacksonville 1046 00:54:07,920 --> 00:54:11,160 Speaker 1: State and which to day when when it wasn't great. 1047 00:54:11,280 --> 00:54:13,480 Speaker 1: You know, I've always been in the player development, So 1048 00:54:13,480 --> 00:54:15,319 Speaker 1: it's something we take real serious and try to get 1049 00:54:15,360 --> 00:54:17,680 Speaker 1: better at. But you know, we're trying to look at 1050 00:54:17,800 --> 00:54:20,200 Speaker 1: really good force for your players, and we're also trying 1051 00:54:20,200 --> 00:54:21,400 Speaker 1: to get the great ones. You know, we want a 1052 00:54:21,480 --> 00:54:25,400 Speaker 1: league championship last year because we had Jalen Smith. Uh 1053 00:54:25,440 --> 00:54:26,880 Speaker 1: and if we didn't have them, we wouldn't have won 1054 00:54:26,920 --> 00:54:30,040 Speaker 1: the league championships. So you need a great one. We 1055 00:54:30,040 --> 00:54:33,120 Speaker 1: would like to keep the great ones home, um, you know. 1056 00:54:33,320 --> 00:54:35,520 Speaker 1: And and and if we are, you know a lot 1057 00:54:35,520 --> 00:54:38,200 Speaker 1: of those guys aren't gonna be here all four years. Um. 1058 00:54:38,440 --> 00:54:41,160 Speaker 1: You mentioned you in the league championship. You don't have 1059 00:54:41,239 --> 00:54:42,880 Speaker 1: the Big ten tournament, you don't have the n c 1060 00:54:43,040 --> 00:54:45,799 Speaker 1: A tournament. And like, look, it's been a fight. It 1061 00:54:45,800 --> 00:54:48,880 Speaker 1: hasn't been easy for yet at Maryland changed league. So 1062 00:54:49,000 --> 00:54:53,440 Speaker 1: there's the lack of familiarity. Um, there's you know, no 1063 00:54:53,480 --> 00:54:57,200 Speaker 1: matter how reasonable it is, there's the expectations of you 1064 00:54:57,239 --> 00:54:59,200 Speaker 1: know what Gary Williams was able to do during a 1065 00:54:59,239 --> 00:55:02,799 Speaker 1: stretch of compete for national championships. But that last year's 1066 00:55:02,840 --> 00:55:06,480 Speaker 1: team felt like, all right, you finally solidified your program 1067 00:55:06,520 --> 00:55:08,000 Speaker 1: as one of the elite ones in the Big ten. 1068 00:55:08,080 --> 00:55:11,840 Speaker 1: But there's there there's no payoff of of the victory 1069 00:55:11,920 --> 00:55:14,040 Speaker 1: lap in the Big Ten tournament, in the in the 1070 00:55:14,120 --> 00:55:17,040 Speaker 1: n c A tournament. What what does that do to 1071 00:55:17,400 --> 00:55:19,959 Speaker 1: your program? I know, to you like you're gonna fight 1072 00:55:20,320 --> 00:55:23,719 Speaker 1: for regardless of of which. But what what do you 1073 00:55:23,719 --> 00:55:26,480 Speaker 1: think having quarantine and cutting out the n c A 1074 00:55:26,640 --> 00:55:29,919 Speaker 1: tournament did for your program? Specifically the momentum you guys 1075 00:55:29,920 --> 00:55:34,719 Speaker 1: have generated. We'll never know. Um. The good thing is 1076 00:55:34,719 --> 00:55:36,680 Speaker 1: that we get to hang a banner that we wanted. 1077 00:55:37,040 --> 00:55:38,839 Speaker 1: I thought the best league in the country last year. 1078 00:55:38,880 --> 00:55:43,360 Speaker 1: Now we shared it, but we were still on top. Um. 1079 00:55:43,360 --> 00:55:47,680 Speaker 1: You know, Doug, my life to grind was always really short, um, 1080 00:55:47,719 --> 00:55:49,560 Speaker 1: and for me to get where I am in life 1081 00:55:50,040 --> 00:55:53,279 Speaker 1: has been a grind. But I like that, UM. Last 1082 00:55:53,320 --> 00:55:56,600 Speaker 1: year is just another example of you know, one of 1083 00:55:56,640 --> 00:55:59,120 Speaker 1: my great I've only had maybe three or four teams 1084 00:55:59,120 --> 00:56:01,640 Speaker 1: in twenty two years it could advance to a Sweet 1085 00:56:01,640 --> 00:56:03,799 Speaker 1: six team beyond, and last year was one of them. 1086 00:56:04,200 --> 00:56:06,040 Speaker 1: And it just adds to the grind of my life. 1087 00:56:06,400 --> 00:56:11,480 Speaker 1: It is what it is, um. Um. I do know 1088 00:56:11,719 --> 00:56:14,879 Speaker 1: the last six years since we joined the Big time, 1089 00:56:14,960 --> 00:56:17,720 Speaker 1: we've been ranked almost every week of those six years. 1090 00:56:17,719 --> 00:56:22,040 Speaker 1: We had some injuries. Uh, a few years back, Kevin 1091 00:56:22,120 --> 00:56:24,719 Speaker 1: hurt his year, he was hurt, Dustin Jackson was hurt. 1092 00:56:24,760 --> 00:56:26,840 Speaker 1: We had some injuries that prevented us from being a 1093 00:56:26,880 --> 00:56:29,440 Speaker 1: really good team. But we feel like we've been a 1094 00:56:29,440 --> 00:56:32,120 Speaker 1: staple in the top twenty. We feel like we're going 1095 00:56:32,200 --> 00:56:35,200 Speaker 1: to continue to be that way. Um. Did it cost 1096 00:56:35,280 --> 00:56:37,480 Speaker 1: us a little momentum, Yeah, it probably did. We didn't 1097 00:56:37,520 --> 00:56:41,640 Speaker 1: have a great spring as far as signing players. Um, 1098 00:56:41,640 --> 00:56:44,840 Speaker 1: we lost out on a lot of them. Um. You know, 1099 00:56:44,920 --> 00:56:48,200 Speaker 1: under a classroom recruiting seems to be going well. Um. 1100 00:56:48,239 --> 00:56:51,479 Speaker 1: But like the grind, it is, it's always It's always 1101 00:56:51,520 --> 00:56:53,399 Speaker 1: been a grind for me. I wouldn't if it was easy. 1102 00:56:53,440 --> 00:56:55,960 Speaker 1: I wouldn't know what to do with it. And so 1103 00:56:56,040 --> 00:56:59,040 Speaker 1: we'll keep building. I you know, we came here to 1104 00:56:59,120 --> 00:57:05,080 Speaker 1: hopefully win a national championship. Will do it. Um, you know, ah, 1105 00:57:06,280 --> 00:57:09,080 Speaker 1: our fan base loves what we do. Um, we do 1106 00:57:09,160 --> 00:57:11,719 Speaker 1: it the right way. We have good kids. We graduating 1107 00:57:11,719 --> 00:57:14,040 Speaker 1: our kids, thirty three straight seniors. We have five with 1108 00:57:14,120 --> 00:57:17,160 Speaker 1: graduate degree. Yeah, I'm going and on. I love being 1109 00:57:17,160 --> 00:57:20,560 Speaker 1: the coach in Maryland. It's a great place to live, great, great, 1110 00:57:20,600 --> 00:57:24,240 Speaker 1: great public university, one of the great pub universities and 1111 00:57:24,800 --> 00:57:28,000 Speaker 1: in the world. And um, so we love it here. 1112 00:57:28,080 --> 00:57:29,720 Speaker 1: We just feel like we got a lot of great 1113 00:57:30,040 --> 00:57:32,600 Speaker 1: uh days ahead of us and a lot of great 1114 00:57:32,640 --> 00:57:35,200 Speaker 1: victories ahead of us. And hopefully we have that one 1115 00:57:35,280 --> 00:57:37,600 Speaker 1: year where everything comes together and we can you know, 1116 00:57:37,680 --> 00:57:40,240 Speaker 1: do what Gary and his his staff didn't make a 1117 00:57:40,280 --> 00:57:43,240 Speaker 1: final four run hopefully the national scamships. I got a 1118 00:57:43,240 --> 00:57:46,280 Speaker 1: couple of quick ones and then we'll let you go. Um. 1119 00:57:46,320 --> 00:57:48,840 Speaker 1: A coach who have we have yet to mention And 1120 00:57:48,920 --> 00:57:51,640 Speaker 1: you may have no connections with him that you've either 1121 00:57:51,760 --> 00:57:54,080 Speaker 1: you've coached again so or you've watched him coach and 1122 00:57:54,120 --> 00:57:56,720 Speaker 1: you're like, that guy is really good, and not enough 1123 00:57:56,760 --> 00:58:03,840 Speaker 1: people know that this guy is really good. Oh man, Um, Well, 1124 00:58:04,360 --> 00:58:07,200 Speaker 1: you know I was always a Dane Altman's fan. Um. 1125 00:58:07,240 --> 00:58:09,320 Speaker 1: I always thought he was terrific, and he's proven that 1126 00:58:09,360 --> 00:58:13,360 Speaker 1: at Oregon. Uh. You know I felt that way about 1127 00:58:13,400 --> 00:58:17,120 Speaker 1: Tom Davis. Um. You know, I'm trying to think some 1128 00:58:17,200 --> 00:58:21,480 Speaker 1: young coaches I've coached against that are doing a terrific job. 1129 00:58:21,640 --> 00:58:23,439 Speaker 1: But you know, most of the guys at my level 1130 00:58:23,480 --> 00:58:27,840 Speaker 1: are all terrific coaches. Um. Uh. You know, Chris Beard 1131 00:58:27,840 --> 00:58:31,040 Speaker 1: obviously has proven that he's a terrific coach in a 1132 00:58:31,080 --> 00:58:36,160 Speaker 1: short time, Uh, you know doing it. So I'm probably 1133 00:58:36,480 --> 00:58:38,280 Speaker 1: I'll probably think of it five minutes after me and 1134 00:58:38,320 --> 00:58:40,520 Speaker 1: I got that's by a great young man coached. Again. 1135 00:58:40,640 --> 00:58:42,680 Speaker 1: You mentioned how much of a grinder you are. You 1136 00:58:42,760 --> 00:58:45,440 Speaker 1: have you know, you have three kids and your wife Anne, 1137 00:58:46,000 --> 00:58:50,400 Speaker 1: So what was what was quarantine like at the Tursion household? 1138 00:58:50,400 --> 00:58:52,160 Speaker 1: They were like they have been like who are you 1139 00:58:52,280 --> 00:58:56,520 Speaker 1: and what are you doing here at dinner time? Yeah? 1140 00:58:56,760 --> 00:58:59,800 Speaker 1: They Yeah, there's a lot of things that went on 1141 00:59:00,000 --> 00:59:03,600 Speaker 1: family I didn't know about, um, and that I had 1142 00:59:03,600 --> 00:59:06,720 Speaker 1: to try to get corrected. Um. And I know my 1143 00:59:06,800 --> 00:59:09,080 Speaker 1: youngest son was really hating that I was home and 1144 00:59:09,440 --> 00:59:12,360 Speaker 1: it was ready for me to go back to work. Um. 1145 00:59:12,400 --> 00:59:15,800 Speaker 1: But I think it was good because, you know, even 1146 00:59:15,800 --> 00:59:19,760 Speaker 1: though we weren't allowed to go to the office. Um, 1147 00:59:19,800 --> 00:59:22,280 Speaker 1: you know, coaches were crazy and if we're not working, 1148 00:59:22,720 --> 00:59:25,320 Speaker 1: you know, we're not happy. And so they were able 1149 00:59:25,360 --> 00:59:27,760 Speaker 1: to watch me do zoom after zoom, phone call after 1150 00:59:27,840 --> 00:59:30,560 Speaker 1: phone call, you know, work. And then I'd lose a 1151 00:59:30,640 --> 00:59:33,440 Speaker 1: kid that would probably should have got um that clearly 1152 00:59:33,440 --> 00:59:37,840 Speaker 1: should have came to Maryland, but wants to start somewhere else. Um, 1153 00:59:37,880 --> 00:59:40,360 Speaker 1: you know, and they saw all the ups and downs 1154 00:59:40,400 --> 00:59:43,160 Speaker 1: with it. Um. A lot of stuff that I left 1155 00:59:43,160 --> 00:59:45,080 Speaker 1: at the office are handled at the office, or it 1156 00:59:45,200 --> 00:59:47,640 Speaker 1: was on the road recruiting, and so I got to 1157 00:59:47,680 --> 00:59:49,360 Speaker 1: live a little bit of recruiting with me. And I 1158 00:59:49,400 --> 00:59:52,760 Speaker 1: think they appreciate how hard I work in recruiting now. 1159 00:59:53,000 --> 00:59:56,440 Speaker 1: But it's been good too. It's um, you know, just 1160 00:59:56,480 --> 00:59:59,320 Speaker 1: to realize all the stuff that that are all my 1161 00:59:59,400 --> 01:00:03,120 Speaker 1: kids play, my wife's play. Um, A lot of silver 1162 01:00:03,200 --> 01:00:06,600 Speaker 1: linings in the quarantine. Um, we're already for it to 1163 01:00:06,720 --> 01:00:09,440 Speaker 1: end and get back to the normal, but there was 1164 01:00:09,480 --> 01:00:11,400 Speaker 1: a lot of silver linings. I think just being around 1165 01:00:11,400 --> 01:00:14,480 Speaker 1: my kids more was the biggest positive. All Right, we 1166 01:00:14,480 --> 01:00:16,200 Speaker 1: know you have to go. You've been more than generous 1167 01:00:16,200 --> 01:00:19,280 Speaker 1: with your time. I can't thank you enough. And uh 1168 01:00:19,400 --> 01:00:21,520 Speaker 1: and and just so, you know, I wanted to go 1169 01:00:21,560 --> 01:00:25,320 Speaker 1: to Oregon, but Jerry Green was like, I'm never leaving Oregon. 1170 01:00:25,400 --> 01:00:28,760 Speaker 1: I got the greatest contract ever. I get the stipulation 1171 01:00:28,760 --> 01:00:31,000 Speaker 1: of my contractor rolls over. I get this big pay 1172 01:00:31,000 --> 01:00:33,120 Speaker 1: out at the end of my deal. And then a 1173 01:00:33,160 --> 01:00:34,840 Speaker 1: week later he puts on the Tennessee had and I 1174 01:00:34,880 --> 01:00:36,560 Speaker 1: was like, wait what. I was just up there with 1175 01:00:36,640 --> 01:00:39,120 Speaker 1: Turs and Darren Kylish and they just said we're gonna 1176 01:00:39,120 --> 01:00:42,440 Speaker 1: We're gonna roll with this thing, and uh yeah, that 1177 01:00:42,520 --> 01:00:44,760 Speaker 1: was all a shock to all of us. But uh yeah, 1178 01:00:44,800 --> 01:00:46,560 Speaker 1: we recruited you hard, Doug. I thought I knew, I 1179 01:00:46,640 --> 01:00:49,600 Speaker 1: knew we had you. Do you do you know the game? 1180 01:00:49,640 --> 01:00:52,720 Speaker 1: Do you know the game that I attended the Arizona 1181 01:00:52,960 --> 01:00:54,720 Speaker 1: so the only time we ever beat him. Yeah, so 1182 01:00:54,880 --> 01:00:57,360 Speaker 1: a friend for people don't know, this was the Arizona 1183 01:00:58,680 --> 01:01:02,360 Speaker 1: national championship team. They lost to Oregon at the Old Pit, 1184 01:01:02,480 --> 01:01:06,560 Speaker 1: which is are arguably the greatest college basketball venue I've 1185 01:01:06,640 --> 01:01:10,120 Speaker 1: I've ever seen, ever been to, and you guys beat them. 1186 01:01:10,160 --> 01:01:12,920 Speaker 1: I also remember obviously hoping with your kids for the 1187 01:01:13,480 --> 01:01:16,800 Speaker 1: for the n c A tournament. Uh look, let's have 1188 01:01:16,920 --> 01:01:18,760 Speaker 1: been great to me. I know you're busy. I really 1189 01:01:18,760 --> 01:01:21,760 Speaker 1: appreciate it, and uh say hi the family and thanks 1190 01:01:21,800 --> 01:01:26,919 Speaker 1: for joining us. Alright, alright, thanks. Be sure to catch 1191 01:01:27,000 --> 01:01:30,000 Speaker 1: the live edition of The Doug Gottlieb Show weekdays at 1192 01:01:30,040 --> 01:01:34,000 Speaker 1: three p m. Easter noon Pacific. Wow, what a great 1193 01:01:34,000 --> 01:01:37,160 Speaker 1: talk with Mark jan Um. You know, look, I I 1194 01:01:37,280 --> 01:01:41,160 Speaker 1: just I hope you enjoyed getting to know what makes 1195 01:01:41,200 --> 01:01:43,880 Speaker 1: him tick and what he's about and that dude is 1196 01:01:44,120 --> 01:01:49,560 Speaker 1: like the ultimate grinder grinder and is his team was 1197 01:01:49,600 --> 01:01:52,400 Speaker 1: rewarded or he was rewarded with it having a great 1198 01:01:52,400 --> 01:01:55,960 Speaker 1: team this past year. It hasn't gone unnoticed in college 1199 01:01:56,000 --> 01:01:59,920 Speaker 1: basketball at least in terms of basketball people, but national 1200 01:02:00,000 --> 01:02:02,520 Speaker 1: probab would a little bit unnoticed. But he did a magnificent, 1201 01:02:02,600 --> 01:02:05,960 Speaker 1: magnificent job. Um a reminder listening to Doug Gotlieb Show 1202 01:02:06,000 --> 01:02:09,000 Speaker 1: daily three to six Eastern total, three Pacific. More all 1203 01:02:09,080 --> 01:02:12,200 Speaker 1: balls upcoming. We're gonna try and start pupping these things 1204 01:02:12,200 --> 01:02:16,600 Speaker 1: out more readily. Don't forget to download, subscribe, and rate 1205 01:02:17,000 --> 01:02:19,520 Speaker 1: these podcasts. Rating is actually good for us. Hopefully you 1206 01:02:19,520 --> 01:02:21,280 Speaker 1: give us a good rating. And if you have any 1207 01:02:21,360 --> 01:02:24,640 Speaker 1: questions or comments, you on the Facebook page, the Instagram 1208 01:02:24,680 --> 01:02:27,760 Speaker 1: page um or you can tweet at me all at 1209 01:02:27,960 --> 01:02:31,960 Speaker 1: Gottlieb Show, at Gottlieb Show in the meantime, Thank you 1210 01:02:32,000 --> 01:02:33,880 Speaker 1: for listening. This is all ball