1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:03,760 Speaker 1: Fox Nation is coming to Atlanta Wednesday, October twelfth. Join 2 00:00:03,880 --> 00:00:07,840 Speaker 1: Nancy Grace for America's Crime Crisis Live Summit seven pm 3 00:00:07,840 --> 00:00:11,639 Speaker 1: at the Georgia Public Broadcasting Studios. Here from local law enforcement, 4 00:00:11,720 --> 00:00:14,600 Speaker 1: victims and leading experts on whether crime policies are leading 5 00:00:14,640 --> 00:00:17,240 Speaker 1: to skyrocketing crime rates, what can be done to control 6 00:00:17,280 --> 00:00:19,640 Speaker 1: the fentanyl crisis, and is there a way to make 7 00:00:19,640 --> 00:00:22,439 Speaker 1: our streets safer. Be part of the live audience. Go 8 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:24,760 Speaker 1: to Crime online dot com look for the banner at 9 00:00:24,760 --> 00:00:27,000 Speaker 1: the top of the page. Click to get your free ticket. 10 00:00:27,160 --> 00:00:30,440 Speaker 1: Seating is limited for America's Crime Crisis Live Summit with 11 00:00:30,520 --> 00:00:33,960 Speaker 1: Nancy Grace. Get your free ticket now again. That's October 12 00:00:34,000 --> 00:00:43,479 Speaker 1: twelfth at the GPB Studios at seven pm. Crime Stories 13 00:00:43,479 --> 00:00:53,720 Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace. When you think of your own children, 14 00:00:53,920 --> 00:00:58,720 Speaker 1: you spend a lifetime happily giving them all your love, 15 00:00:59,480 --> 00:01:02,080 Speaker 1: all your attention. I was up with my son last 16 00:01:02,160 --> 00:01:06,800 Speaker 1: night till eleven fifteen, editing his essay, and I was 17 00:01:07,040 --> 00:01:13,399 Speaker 1: happy to do it. Years years go into helping them 18 00:01:13,440 --> 00:01:17,959 Speaker 1: advance even one tiny bit in life. Finally you get 19 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:21,640 Speaker 1: them to college. Right. I grew up in an area 20 00:01:21,720 --> 00:01:25,440 Speaker 1: where nobody went to college, so it was a big 21 00:01:25,480 --> 00:01:28,880 Speaker 1: deal for all three of us to go. I remember 22 00:01:28,880 --> 00:01:32,920 Speaker 1: my dad working night shifts, my mom being gone at 23 00:01:32,920 --> 00:01:35,039 Speaker 1: five thirty in the morning to her job, so we 24 00:01:35,120 --> 00:01:38,640 Speaker 1: could go to college. So this dad gets his son 25 00:01:39,080 --> 00:01:42,960 Speaker 1: to college, and a really good one too, and it's 26 00:01:43,040 --> 00:01:50,880 Speaker 1: family weekend. He goes and he is shot. Debt at 27 00:01:50,920 --> 00:01:55,640 Speaker 1: the family weekend. I Nancy Grace, this is crime Stories. 28 00:01:56,080 --> 00:01:58,680 Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us here at Fox Nation 29 00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:04,360 Speaker 1: and Serious Sex one eleven. Of course, we can't bring 30 00:02:04,440 --> 00:02:09,040 Speaker 1: him back, but you know what we can do. We 31 00:02:09,600 --> 00:02:14,240 Speaker 1: can seek justice. Take a listen to this. The hotel 32 00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:18,000 Speaker 1: is just under five miles from the college campus. Police 33 00:02:18,040 --> 00:02:20,480 Speaker 1: say the parent had been staying at the Marriott during 34 00:02:20,760 --> 00:02:25,560 Speaker 1: Marist's Family Weekend, a yearly event with football games and performances. 35 00:02:25,960 --> 00:02:31,560 Speaker 1: Maria students in disbelief, shock, disbelief and also just confusion, 36 00:02:31,800 --> 00:02:34,680 Speaker 1: I think, and just deep sadness for the family, for 37 00:02:34,720 --> 00:02:37,560 Speaker 1: the victims. Police still trying to figure out the events 38 00:02:37,600 --> 00:02:40,280 Speaker 1: that led up to the shooting. No word yet on 39 00:02:40,280 --> 00:02:42,679 Speaker 1: a motive. No word on a motive. Of course, the 40 00:02:42,760 --> 00:02:46,160 Speaker 1: state doesn't have to prove a motive. But out of 41 00:02:46,200 --> 00:02:50,400 Speaker 1: the blue, this dad goes to see his child at 42 00:02:50,440 --> 00:02:55,280 Speaker 1: college on family weekend and he ends up dead at 43 00:02:55,280 --> 00:03:00,680 Speaker 1: a perfectly respectable hotel. You were just hearing our friends 44 00:03:00,680 --> 00:03:03,800 Speaker 1: at Fox five, But now take a listen to our 45 00:03:03,840 --> 00:03:07,720 Speaker 1: friends at NBC four their new developments revealing the violence 46 00:03:07,760 --> 00:03:11,440 Speaker 1: and danger guests faced at a hotel in Poughkeepsie when 47 00:03:11,480 --> 00:03:14,520 Speaker 1: someone opened fire and killed a visitor. The shooting piercing 48 00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:17,600 Speaker 1: the courtyard by Marriott yesterday morning, where many people were 49 00:03:17,600 --> 00:03:21,640 Speaker 1: staying to attend family weekend at nearby Marris College. The 50 00:03:21,680 --> 00:03:25,000 Speaker 1: bullets shattered the lobby windows, left behind bullet holes and 51 00:03:25,080 --> 00:03:29,160 Speaker 1: other windows. Police believe the shooter fired two dozen rounds. 52 00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:32,920 Speaker 1: We cleared that section of the hotel, room the rooms 53 00:03:32,919 --> 00:03:37,200 Speaker 1: aside at just in case, and continued to look for 54 00:03:37,320 --> 00:03:41,000 Speaker 1: wounded individuals make sure everybody was okay in the hotel. 55 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:44,960 Speaker 1: While further cursory looked at the room, they also then 56 00:03:45,000 --> 00:03:52,280 Speaker 1: found manuals that were handbooks on how to make bombs. 57 00:03:53,200 --> 00:03:56,080 Speaker 1: So the tactical unit that was on scene at that 58 00:03:56,160 --> 00:03:59,480 Speaker 1: point requested the rest of the hotel be evacuated. So 59 00:03:59,520 --> 00:04:04,839 Speaker 1: at that we evacuated the hotel, moved them to safe locations, 60 00:04:05,040 --> 00:04:09,800 Speaker 1: relocated them, and then we conducted bomb sweeps as if 61 00:04:09,800 --> 00:04:13,040 Speaker 1: it couldn't get any worse. Here you are at what 62 00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:17,160 Speaker 1: is considered a quiet town, at a quiet hotel with 63 00:04:17,279 --> 00:04:21,719 Speaker 1: respectable people staying there, and a dad gets gunned down 64 00:04:21,800 --> 00:04:25,760 Speaker 1: and then they find bomb making materials. This is with 65 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:31,400 Speaker 1: the islandy, the dichotomy of the fact that this is 66 00:04:31,760 --> 00:04:37,520 Speaker 1: the Marist College mr St which is of the Order 67 00:04:37,720 --> 00:04:42,640 Speaker 1: of Mary, the Mother of Christ, and it is named 68 00:04:42,760 --> 00:04:46,479 Speaker 1: that you may ask why name and after Mary as 69 00:04:46,520 --> 00:04:51,919 Speaker 1: opposed to Christ, because the view of the Order of Marists, 70 00:04:51,960 --> 00:04:55,560 Speaker 1: the Order of Mary, is that she did so many 71 00:04:55,600 --> 00:05:01,320 Speaker 1: good works on Earth that she answered God's calling without question. 72 00:05:02,360 --> 00:05:08,120 Speaker 1: And with that backdrop, bullets fly in the hotel. A 73 00:05:08,279 --> 00:05:12,120 Speaker 1: family weekend with me an all star panel to make 74 00:05:12,200 --> 00:05:14,680 Speaker 1: sense of what we know right now. But first I 75 00:05:14,720 --> 00:05:19,359 Speaker 1: want to go to an investigative reporter with Newsday. You 76 00:05:19,400 --> 00:05:22,280 Speaker 1: can find her at newsday dot com and on Twitter 77 00:05:22,520 --> 00:05:25,360 Speaker 1: at Joan Growl and Joan thank you for being with us. 78 00:05:25,640 --> 00:05:29,320 Speaker 1: I'm just having a hard time letting this soak in. 79 00:05:30,360 --> 00:05:36,400 Speaker 1: My friend just went to her son's college parents' day. 80 00:05:37,040 --> 00:05:40,240 Speaker 1: We just had parents' day at my children's high school. 81 00:05:40,800 --> 00:05:44,160 Speaker 1: And to think this could happen in a family setting, 82 00:05:44,160 --> 00:05:46,080 Speaker 1: I mean It's not like they're out selling dope on 83 00:05:46,080 --> 00:05:48,840 Speaker 1: the street. It's not like this guy's a member of 84 00:05:48,880 --> 00:05:53,240 Speaker 1: a gang. I mean, I'm talking about a dad Paul kuts, 85 00:05:54,080 --> 00:05:59,120 Speaker 1: three sons, a wife left behind because of this. Just 86 00:05:59,560 --> 00:06:03,800 Speaker 1: tell me the beginning, Joan, how did the whole thing start? Well? 87 00:06:03,800 --> 00:06:07,760 Speaker 1: At seven twenty nine the police am on Sunday, the 88 00:06:07,839 --> 00:06:10,880 Speaker 1: police got a call of the disturbance and during that 89 00:06:11,000 --> 00:06:15,320 Speaker 1: call they say the individual calling reported shots fired. Okay, 90 00:06:15,320 --> 00:06:18,400 Speaker 1: hold on, John, because you've already hit me with a 91 00:06:18,440 --> 00:06:21,679 Speaker 1: bag of cement right there. Let me go straight out 92 00:06:21,720 --> 00:06:26,440 Speaker 1: to Wilburt Chapman, former NYPD Deputy Commissioner. Did you hear 93 00:06:26,640 --> 00:06:32,839 Speaker 1: what the Newsday reporter John Garlogist said, seven twenty nine am. Now, listen, 94 00:06:33,480 --> 00:06:38,400 Speaker 1: I have investigated thousands of cases, prosecuted so many I 95 00:06:38,440 --> 00:06:43,719 Speaker 1: can't count them. It's really rare to get violent crime 96 00:06:44,760 --> 00:06:47,680 Speaker 1: when most people are up having their first cup of coffee. 97 00:06:48,279 --> 00:06:50,640 Speaker 1: You usually see that after the dope pads wake up 98 00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:52,920 Speaker 1: at about three or four o'clock in the afternoon, then 99 00:06:52,960 --> 00:06:58,560 Speaker 1: the bullets start flying. But seven twenty nine am at Poughkeepsie, Really, well, Nancy, 100 00:06:58,640 --> 00:07:01,960 Speaker 1: this is a partinually difficult situation for me because the 101 00:07:02,200 --> 00:07:05,159 Speaker 1: Deputy Commission of Training in the NYPD we had a 102 00:07:05,240 --> 00:07:11,680 Speaker 1: particularly close relationship with Maris College, So it's really incredulous 103 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:14,080 Speaker 1: that you have this type of crime that early in 104 00:07:14,120 --> 00:07:17,320 Speaker 1: the morning. However, we live in different times now and 105 00:07:17,480 --> 00:07:23,080 Speaker 1: people have absolutely no respect for what as you put 106 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:25,240 Speaker 1: at the dopets used to get up at noon, and 107 00:07:25,280 --> 00:07:27,560 Speaker 1: we were prepared in policing for one o'clock go on 108 00:07:27,640 --> 00:07:30,000 Speaker 1: and expected them to go late in the morning, late 109 00:07:30,040 --> 00:07:32,840 Speaker 1: into the evening and early morning. Now they're starting early 110 00:07:32,840 --> 00:07:35,760 Speaker 1: in the morning. And when people have this kind of 111 00:07:36,000 --> 00:07:40,200 Speaker 1: antisocial and criminal behavior, there is no way of predicting 112 00:07:40,520 --> 00:07:43,240 Speaker 1: exactly when or how they will strike. You know what, 113 00:07:43,360 --> 00:07:46,360 Speaker 1: Wilbert Chatman, you can say that again. You can say 114 00:07:46,520 --> 00:07:52,120 Speaker 1: that again statistically grow as you know from reporting it newsday. 115 00:07:52,720 --> 00:07:55,000 Speaker 1: Of course, krink can happen at any time, but seven 116 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:59,120 Speaker 1: twenty nine am and the hotel lobby of the Maryat 117 00:07:59,160 --> 00:08:03,480 Speaker 1: Courtyard usually don't expect bullets to fly, but they did. 118 00:08:03,840 --> 00:08:06,520 Speaker 1: Sorry I cut you off in like what sentence? Three 119 00:08:06,680 --> 00:08:10,280 Speaker 1: go ahead, Joan Well. And one of the mysteries that 120 00:08:10,440 --> 00:08:14,480 Speaker 1: I think explains the national attention this tragedy has brought 121 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:19,600 Speaker 1: and are used a TV reporter Cecilia. Dad spoke with 122 00:08:19,640 --> 00:08:23,200 Speaker 1: the neighbors and this is a really wonderful family with 123 00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:27,280 Speaker 1: just a very caring dad. They all described is how 124 00:08:27,360 --> 00:08:33,280 Speaker 1: heavily armed. Heavily armed in a hotel lobby a family 125 00:08:33,320 --> 00:08:38,360 Speaker 1: weekend at the Marist College. Take a listen to the 126 00:08:38,440 --> 00:08:44,439 Speaker 1: chief of the Poughkeepsie Police Department, Chief Joseph Cavalery. Responding 127 00:08:44,480 --> 00:08:47,800 Speaker 1: officers set up a perimeter. They began to treat the wounded. 128 00:08:48,760 --> 00:08:52,280 Speaker 1: Once it was secure, MS was allowed in. They took 129 00:08:52,320 --> 00:08:55,760 Speaker 1: over the treatment of the victim. The victim was transported 130 00:08:55,840 --> 00:09:00,840 Speaker 1: to man Hunts and Regional Hospital, where it was later 131 00:09:00,880 --> 00:09:06,760 Speaker 1: pronounced dead. The officers on scene continued to secure the hotel. 132 00:09:07,520 --> 00:09:14,000 Speaker 1: They went to check a room. They noticed some suspicious items, 133 00:09:14,360 --> 00:09:18,960 Speaker 1: some of which to be materials that they we determined 134 00:09:19,240 --> 00:09:23,280 Speaker 1: could be combined to create an explosive. Guests gathered and 135 00:09:23,320 --> 00:09:27,520 Speaker 1: evacuated because bomb making manuals and flash grenades and other 136 00:09:27,679 --> 00:09:31,760 Speaker 1: possible bombom components found in the hotel room. Moved them 137 00:09:31,760 --> 00:09:36,680 Speaker 1: to safe locations, relocated them, and then we conducted bomb 138 00:09:36,679 --> 00:09:56,640 Speaker 1: sweeps crime stories with Nancy Grace. You know too, Doctor 139 00:09:56,640 --> 00:09:59,719 Speaker 1: Bethany Marshall joining us for now Psychoanalyst joining us out 140 00:09:59,720 --> 00:10:02,000 Speaker 1: of bar Really Hills. You can find her at doctor 141 00:10:02,040 --> 00:10:04,600 Speaker 1: Bethany Marshall dot com. She's a star of a new 142 00:10:04,640 --> 00:10:09,240 Speaker 1: Netflix series, Bling Empire. Doctor Bethany, you heard what Joan 143 00:10:09,280 --> 00:10:11,920 Speaker 1: Garrala said from the Newsday and what Wilburt Chapman said, 144 00:10:11,920 --> 00:10:16,839 Speaker 1: former NYPD Deputy Commissioner, Right, crime can happen anytime. But 145 00:10:17,120 --> 00:10:20,240 Speaker 1: I'm still reeling from the dichotomy of this being the 146 00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:24,360 Speaker 1: Marist College and what it stands for. In Poughkeepsie, which 147 00:10:24,480 --> 00:10:28,120 Speaker 1: is not known for high crime like New York City 148 00:10:28,320 --> 00:10:33,120 Speaker 1: or Inner City Atlanta or Chicago or Detroit. You don't think, Wow, Pokeepsie, 149 00:10:33,280 --> 00:10:35,600 Speaker 1: I'm not gonna go there. I'll get shot dead. And 150 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:41,080 Speaker 1: you're at the family the college family weekend, Doctor Bethany, 151 00:10:41,240 --> 00:10:44,640 Speaker 1: I know. I mean that's enough for a nightmare for parents. 152 00:10:44,880 --> 00:10:47,960 Speaker 1: I'm about to visit a friend in Middlebury, Vermont. He's 153 00:10:47,960 --> 00:10:50,360 Speaker 1: just spotted in there. He's been there for about a year. 154 00:10:50,520 --> 00:10:53,640 Speaker 1: And it's a college town and Nancy, you know, when 155 00:10:53,679 --> 00:10:57,320 Speaker 1: you walk down the street, people are dulling homemade pies. 156 00:10:57,960 --> 00:11:02,280 Speaker 1: Everybody knows each other, there are kids everywhere. It's so 157 00:11:02,720 --> 00:11:06,400 Speaker 1: family friendly. You know, the most exciting activity in the 158 00:11:06,440 --> 00:11:10,800 Speaker 1: town is the book club. Because people are connected, they're engaged. 159 00:11:11,400 --> 00:11:15,840 Speaker 1: There is really no bad element usually in these small towns. 160 00:11:15,880 --> 00:11:19,640 Speaker 1: But here's what really alarms me as a psychoanalyst, a 161 00:11:19,720 --> 00:11:23,160 Speaker 1: mental health professional. The seven thirty in the morning, I 162 00:11:23,200 --> 00:11:26,400 Speaker 1: think is significant because that tells me whoever did this 163 00:11:26,559 --> 00:11:30,640 Speaker 1: had enormous amounts of energy. When somebody comes into my 164 00:11:30,720 --> 00:11:34,600 Speaker 1: office and their sleep wing cycle if turned around, I 165 00:11:34,800 --> 00:11:41,120 Speaker 1: become alarmed. I think about drug use, bipolar disorder, rage, 166 00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:45,240 Speaker 1: rage directed to other people. What are they doing all night? 167 00:11:45,240 --> 00:11:47,560 Speaker 1: What are they thinking all night? I think meth head, 168 00:11:47,600 --> 00:11:51,000 Speaker 1: I think PCP. I think I have to evaluate for 169 00:11:51,080 --> 00:11:53,960 Speaker 1: all these things because most people are not. You know, 170 00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:56,400 Speaker 1: they may get in an argument with their spouse late 171 00:11:56,440 --> 00:12:00,720 Speaker 1: at night, maybe too many cocktails, a dysfunctional abuse marriage. 172 00:12:00,800 --> 00:12:05,520 Speaker 1: But didn't they fall asleep this early morning hour? I 173 00:12:05,559 --> 00:12:08,160 Speaker 1: think is a very crucial part of the story. Now, 174 00:12:08,360 --> 00:12:11,679 Speaker 1: another crucial part of the story is Joe Grawa has 175 00:12:11,720 --> 00:12:13,680 Speaker 1: told us take a listen to our friends at w 176 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:17,120 Speaker 1: ABC seven and I have been on the phone with 177 00:12:17,160 --> 00:12:21,000 Speaker 1: the US Attorney's office through last evening and this morning. 178 00:12:21,400 --> 00:12:24,320 Speaker 1: We are working in conjunction. We for each other as 179 00:12:24,360 --> 00:12:29,080 Speaker 1: this moves forward to determine what exactly we are dealing 180 00:12:29,120 --> 00:12:32,360 Speaker 1: with now. The FBI and the ATF have been looped 181 00:12:32,360 --> 00:12:36,360 Speaker 1: into this investigation with regards specifically to those bomb making 182 00:12:36,400 --> 00:12:40,840 Speaker 1: materials and other charges could stem from this arrest. As 183 00:12:40,960 --> 00:12:43,440 Speaker 1: for the fifty three year old victim, we are not 184 00:12:43,559 --> 00:12:46,320 Speaker 1: releasing his name and the family at this point has 185 00:12:46,320 --> 00:12:49,720 Speaker 1: asked for privacy. Peter Smith joining me high profile lawyer 186 00:12:49,960 --> 00:12:51,840 Speaker 1: out of New York City. He's with the law office 187 00:12:51,880 --> 00:12:54,800 Speaker 1: of Ken Belkin at Belkin Law dot com. Peter, whoever 188 00:12:54,840 --> 00:12:58,520 Speaker 1: this is that has bullets flying at seven twenty nine 189 00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:03,200 Speaker 1: am at the Emily Weekend at Marist College the Order 190 00:13:03,240 --> 00:13:06,640 Speaker 1: of Mary up in a room. I mean, you can't 191 00:13:06,679 --> 00:13:10,160 Speaker 1: just discount them as you know, Hey, they're probably dopeatics, 192 00:13:11,040 --> 00:13:17,440 Speaker 1: they're bomb making materials, bomb making materials. You've already got 193 00:13:17,480 --> 00:13:22,360 Speaker 1: one dad of three shot dead, had no idea who 194 00:13:22,400 --> 00:13:27,280 Speaker 1: these people are, and now bomb making materials. Yeah, I mean, Nancy, 195 00:13:27,360 --> 00:13:31,360 Speaker 1: that just adds to the fright that this case is 196 00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:33,800 Speaker 1: causing in the community. That we don't know what their 197 00:13:33,840 --> 00:13:37,640 Speaker 1: intentions were. They're they're heavily armed, they're hopped up on 198 00:13:37,760 --> 00:13:41,439 Speaker 1: all sorts of dope, and clearly they're they're ready to 199 00:13:41,880 --> 00:13:45,599 Speaker 1: explode at any moment. I mean, given what the reporting 200 00:13:45,679 --> 00:13:51,960 Speaker 1: has suggested, you know, it's probably some minuscule argument that 201 00:13:52,040 --> 00:13:55,679 Speaker 1: happened down in in the lobby that shet them off, 202 00:13:55,960 --> 00:14:01,880 Speaker 1: some small confrontation, maybe the trigger, and of course under 203 00:14:01,920 --> 00:14:06,520 Speaker 1: the law, that means nothing. I'm just thinking through Bob 204 00:14:06,559 --> 00:14:12,480 Speaker 1: making materials in Poughkeepsie at family weekend at Marist College. 205 00:14:12,760 --> 00:14:16,000 Speaker 1: I mean, whenever I travel out of town to work 206 00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:20,040 Speaker 1: on a case and everybody's saying, where are you gonna say, 207 00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:21,520 Speaker 1: I'm like, I don't know the Marrior at Courtyard for 208 00:14:21,520 --> 00:14:25,160 Speaker 1: pizez sake, don't they have free breakfast and WiFi. Everybody 209 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:28,920 Speaker 1: goes to stays at a place like that, Free WiFi, 210 00:14:29,280 --> 00:14:31,600 Speaker 1: breakfast in the morning, you can smell the coffee when 211 00:14:31,640 --> 00:14:34,440 Speaker 1: you wake up. Everybody goes down to the lobby, everything 212 00:14:34,560 --> 00:14:38,600 Speaker 1: safe and secure. But not this time. I've got a 213 00:14:38,680 --> 00:14:44,120 Speaker 1: father of three dead. They couldn't save him over what 214 00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:47,640 Speaker 1: take a listen to this our friends at w CBS. 215 00:14:47,880 --> 00:14:50,120 Speaker 1: One person is dead after a shooting at a hotel 216 00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:54,080 Speaker 1: in Poughkeepsie near Marist College during family weekend. Police say 217 00:14:54,120 --> 00:14:56,560 Speaker 1: someone opened fire around seven thirty this morning at the 218 00:14:56,560 --> 00:14:59,320 Speaker 1: Courtyard Marriott. We're told the victim was a relative of 219 00:14:59,320 --> 00:15:02,000 Speaker 1: a Merrist student, but that person has not been identified. 220 00:15:02,280 --> 00:15:04,520 Speaker 1: During a search of the hotel, police say they found 221 00:15:04,520 --> 00:15:07,600 Speaker 1: materials that could be used as explosives inside a room. 222 00:15:07,960 --> 00:15:11,720 Speaker 1: Safe bomb squad is investigating. We cleared that section of 223 00:15:11,840 --> 00:15:14,240 Speaker 1: the hotel room the rooms aside at just in case, 224 00:15:14,640 --> 00:15:19,960 Speaker 1: and continued to look for wounded individuals, make sure everybody 225 00:15:20,080 --> 00:15:24,000 Speaker 1: was okay in the hotel while further cursory look at 226 00:15:24,040 --> 00:15:29,240 Speaker 1: the room. They also then found manuals that were handbooks 227 00:15:29,280 --> 00:15:35,360 Speaker 1: on how to make bombs. So the tactical unit that 228 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:37,520 Speaker 1: was on scene at that point requested the rest of 229 00:15:37,560 --> 00:15:41,920 Speaker 1: the hotel be evacuated. So at that point, we evacuated 230 00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:46,880 Speaker 1: the hotel, moved them to safe locations, relocated them, and 231 00:15:46,920 --> 00:15:52,760 Speaker 1: then we conducted bomb sweeps. We are now learning even more. 232 00:15:53,120 --> 00:15:56,240 Speaker 1: Take a listen to Jonathan Dents at NBC four, who 233 00:15:56,280 --> 00:15:59,320 Speaker 1: was around seven am. Investigators say that two suspects were 234 00:15:59,320 --> 00:16:03,560 Speaker 1: smoking a PCP like substance in their room. One went 235 00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:06,680 Speaker 1: down to the lobby and got into an argument with staff. 236 00:16:06,680 --> 00:16:09,480 Speaker 1: It was then he allegedly took out the handgun and 237 00:16:09,560 --> 00:16:14,560 Speaker 1: began firing. Innocent individuals convening in the lobby of a 238 00:16:14,680 --> 00:16:20,760 Speaker 1: hotel going about their business, were tragically impacted in one 239 00:16:20,800 --> 00:16:25,120 Speaker 1: life horrifically taken straight out to Wilbert Chapman form an 240 00:16:25,200 --> 00:16:31,040 Speaker 1: NYPD Deputy Commissioner PCP. What is it? Is it mind 241 00:16:31,200 --> 00:16:35,600 Speaker 1: or altering drug that can cause behavior to be amplified 242 00:16:35,640 --> 00:16:38,800 Speaker 1: to the Greek, to the degree where you lose all 243 00:16:38,880 --> 00:16:43,800 Speaker 1: sense of reality, you think you're super strong, you forget 244 00:16:43,840 --> 00:16:47,560 Speaker 1: all types of reasoning, and it usually is involved in 245 00:16:48,280 --> 00:16:53,720 Speaker 1: conduct that closes serious injury to others or in this case, 246 00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:58,280 Speaker 1: the complete loss of life. But Nancy, it's also a hallucinogenic, 247 00:16:58,760 --> 00:17:02,200 Speaker 1: So these people are hallucinating that committed the crime. They're 248 00:17:02,240 --> 00:17:05,040 Speaker 1: hallucinating who God knows what that they're seeing the devil 249 00:17:05,119 --> 00:17:07,960 Speaker 1: that they're saving the world. I have a patient who 250 00:17:08,359 --> 00:17:12,160 Speaker 1: I used PCP for years now, a multi millionaire plumber 251 00:17:12,320 --> 00:17:14,919 Speaker 1: in Beverly Hills. He has a great life, four kids, 252 00:17:14,960 --> 00:17:17,200 Speaker 1: but he was a gang banger for many, many years, 253 00:17:17,720 --> 00:17:23,680 Speaker 1: and he recalls stories of breaking into homes, breaking into houses. 254 00:17:23,720 --> 00:17:25,760 Speaker 1: He said he once hit an old lady over the 255 00:17:25,800 --> 00:17:28,680 Speaker 1: heads so he could grab her purse. I mean, really 256 00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:33,800 Speaker 1: sort of frightening violent crimes, and sometimes they're just barely 257 00:17:33,840 --> 00:17:36,160 Speaker 1: at the edges of his memory because he was so 258 00:17:36,240 --> 00:17:39,080 Speaker 1: high most of that time, and most of the therapists 259 00:17:39,080 --> 00:17:43,520 Speaker 1: been talking about how really, what's a horrible violent criminal 260 00:17:43,560 --> 00:17:46,080 Speaker 1: he was? He spent eight years in federal prison. So 261 00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:49,399 Speaker 1: this drug they were on, I mean, do you remember 262 00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:52,320 Speaker 1: that case, Nancy, where a guy was on PCP and 263 00:17:52,920 --> 00:17:55,439 Speaker 1: ate the face off a homeless person. We covered that 264 00:17:55,480 --> 00:17:58,920 Speaker 1: story many years ago. This reminds me of that, Yes, 265 00:17:59,600 --> 00:18:04,639 Speaker 1: I remember. It is commonly known as angel dust, fan Cyclodyne, 266 00:18:04,960 --> 00:18:08,639 Speaker 1: rocket tool. Yeah, let me go to doctor Jeffrey M. Jensen, 267 00:18:08,720 --> 00:18:13,640 Speaker 1: Professor forensic Pathology, Director of Autopsy Forensic Services, University Michigan 268 00:18:13,720 --> 00:18:19,680 Speaker 1: Medical School, former medical examiner in Milwaukee, Doctor Jenson, what welcome. 269 00:18:19,880 --> 00:18:24,879 Speaker 1: What does PCP do to you? Commonly known as angel dust. Well, again, 270 00:18:24,920 --> 00:18:29,480 Speaker 1: as that was described with the psychosis that occurs these 271 00:18:30,280 --> 00:18:36,760 Speaker 1: individuals can have. In addition to the psychotic disconnection and disorientation, 272 00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:44,640 Speaker 1: they can express excessive strength and force. They're typically very 273 00:18:44,800 --> 00:18:51,440 Speaker 1: violent and and react to and are stimulated by excessive 274 00:18:51,440 --> 00:18:57,640 Speaker 1: outside noise and and threats. So I'm thinking to Joan Grolo, 275 00:18:57,760 --> 00:19:01,400 Speaker 1: jointing US Investigate, a reporter with news Day Newsday dot Com. 276 00:19:02,080 --> 00:19:06,680 Speaker 1: Here's his dad visiting his son. He's got three sons, 277 00:19:07,440 --> 00:19:10,399 Speaker 1: two of them are twins. He's visiting one son at 278 00:19:10,440 --> 00:19:14,800 Speaker 1: Mary's College, Poughkeepsie. He's mining his own business in the lobby, 279 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:18,639 Speaker 1: probably getting that free coffee the Marriott gives you, and 280 00:19:18,760 --> 00:19:22,600 Speaker 1: all of a sudden, here come these two a holes 281 00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:28,480 Speaker 1: technical legal term, hopped up on angel dust and they 282 00:19:28,520 --> 00:19:32,040 Speaker 1: get into an argument with the staff, the Marriott's staff. 283 00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:35,800 Speaker 1: What do we know about that, Joan, That's not something 284 00:19:35,920 --> 00:19:40,800 Speaker 1: I have reported on, I confess. One of the questions 285 00:19:40,880 --> 00:19:46,320 Speaker 1: swirling around us is the two individuals accused of this 286 00:19:46,440 --> 00:19:51,520 Speaker 1: shooting are described as homeless, and the Duchess County executive 287 00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:55,200 Speaker 1: wants to make it very clear that the county was 288 00:19:55,280 --> 00:19:57,920 Speaker 1: not putting them up at this hotel, so they very 289 00:19:57,960 --> 00:20:02,400 Speaker 1: well may not be homeless. Speaking of the two, take 290 00:20:02,440 --> 00:20:04,840 Speaker 1: a listen to our friends at w ABC seven. She 291 00:20:04,960 --> 00:20:10,280 Speaker 1: pursued that gentleman and at taking him down at gunpoint. 292 00:20:10,600 --> 00:20:12,919 Speaker 1: A twenty six year old gunman taken down by a 293 00:20:13,000 --> 00:20:16,600 Speaker 1: female officer in the courtyard of this Poughkeepsie hotel. Sunday 294 00:20:16,640 --> 00:20:18,879 Speaker 1: morning in a shooting that killed a fifty three year 295 00:20:18,880 --> 00:20:22,159 Speaker 1: old father of the mayor's college student simply visiting per 296 00:20:22,240 --> 00:20:26,160 Speaker 1: family weekend. Roy A. Johnson Junior faced his second degree 297 00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:29,920 Speaker 1: murder and weapons charges. Devin M. Taylor, the first suspect 298 00:20:30,080 --> 00:20:34,160 Speaker 1: taken into custody, also facing weapons charges. He reached into 299 00:20:34,280 --> 00:20:40,080 Speaker 1: a fanny pack and threw an item away from him. 300 00:20:40,160 --> 00:20:42,920 Speaker 1: That item was later recovered and turned out to be 301 00:20:42,960 --> 00:20:47,480 Speaker 1: a handgun straight back out to Wilbert Chapman, former NYPD 302 00:20:47,480 --> 00:20:51,200 Speaker 1: Deputy Commissioner. You know, I'm very surprised as female cop 303 00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:54,359 Speaker 1: didn't gun him down right there, because when you're in 304 00:20:54,440 --> 00:20:58,119 Speaker 1: pursuit and you know you've already got one dead victim 305 00:20:58,119 --> 00:21:02,879 Speaker 1: in the lobby and he reaches into their fannie pack 306 00:21:03,760 --> 00:21:06,840 Speaker 1: or their pocket or their jacket, how do you know 307 00:21:06,880 --> 00:21:09,639 Speaker 1: they're not pulling out a gun to fire at you. 308 00:21:10,359 --> 00:21:15,560 Speaker 1: But she didn't. She managed to take him down without 309 00:21:15,560 --> 00:21:20,280 Speaker 1: shooting him dead. And according to Johan Groa with Newsday, 310 00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:23,520 Speaker 1: there have been some reports, not by her, but by 311 00:21:23,560 --> 00:21:27,640 Speaker 1: others that they were homeless. I'm not sure that I 312 00:21:27,680 --> 00:21:30,000 Speaker 1: believe that. Well, well, let's start. Let's start with the 313 00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:33,880 Speaker 1: police tactic. Okay. Obviously, because we're in a place where 314 00:21:33,880 --> 00:21:36,440 Speaker 1: there are a lot of innocent people, the police are 315 00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:40,800 Speaker 1: going to do everything they can to minimize any injury 316 00:21:40,920 --> 00:21:45,000 Speaker 1: to anybody other than the individual they are trying to apprehend. 317 00:21:45,320 --> 00:21:48,399 Speaker 1: It was clearly an excellent police response. The officers should 318 00:21:48,440 --> 00:21:51,840 Speaker 1: be praised for her tactics and bringing down of this 319 00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:57,480 Speaker 1: criminal without without any injury or any property damage other 320 00:21:57,560 --> 00:22:02,119 Speaker 1: than the focus than the focus on the individuals. In 321 00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:06,000 Speaker 1: terms of looking at homelessness, there is a there is 322 00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:09,320 Speaker 1: a real correlation between homelessness and crime. And it's unfortunate 323 00:22:09,359 --> 00:22:12,639 Speaker 1: because the social workers will tell you that it's a 324 00:22:12,680 --> 00:22:16,280 Speaker 1: condition beyond people's control. But yes, one can be homeless, 325 00:22:16,320 --> 00:22:19,400 Speaker 1: but that does not allow them or give them excuse 326 00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:22,720 Speaker 1: that would engage in unlocal activity. I'm not convinced these 327 00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:24,760 Speaker 1: two guys are homeless. If they're homeless, what are they 328 00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:28,720 Speaker 1: doing shut up a Marriott courtyard and from what I understand, 329 00:22:28,920 --> 00:22:31,640 Speaker 1: they've got a car. Guys, take a listen to NBC four. 330 00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:36,399 Speaker 1: These are the two Marriotte Courtyard hotel suspects. The lobby 331 00:22:36,560 --> 00:22:40,120 Speaker 1: was a shooting zone Sunday morning. Bullet holes still visible. 332 00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:43,640 Speaker 1: At least one of those bullets killing a visiting relative 333 00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:49,360 Speaker 1: of a maristed college student. The suspect did not know 334 00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:53,520 Speaker 1: the victim. We believe it's a random act. This is 335 00:22:53,520 --> 00:22:55,440 Speaker 1: a photo of one of the weapons, a so called 336 00:22:55,520 --> 00:23:00,320 Speaker 1: ghost gun assault style rifle. The other the weapon you used, 337 00:23:00,480 --> 00:23:05,159 Speaker 1: a glock nine millimeter like this with a switch to 338 00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:08,399 Speaker 1: make it automatic. When the weapon was later found in 339 00:23:08,440 --> 00:23:13,240 Speaker 1: the parking lot, it's thirty round magazine was empty. Well 340 00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:15,879 Speaker 1: with Chatman, explain what it's a ghost gun. A ghost 341 00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:20,920 Speaker 1: gun is a gun that's manufactured to ensure that there 342 00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:24,439 Speaker 1: is no serial number and it cannot be traced. It 343 00:23:24,560 --> 00:23:27,399 Speaker 1: is a real problem for law enforcement because these ghost 344 00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:30,000 Speaker 1: guns are being manufactured and sold over the internet and 345 00:23:30,040 --> 00:23:33,439 Speaker 1: through the mail, and anyone can get their hands on them, 346 00:23:33,560 --> 00:23:36,160 Speaker 1: rather than going through the normal legal channels of getting 347 00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:39,679 Speaker 1: a weapon with a serial number and making sure that 348 00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:43,160 Speaker 1: it's cracked so you know who sold it and purchased it. 349 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:47,439 Speaker 1: To challenge the law enforcement and until there is legal 350 00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:50,199 Speaker 1: action to make sure that the production of them is ceased, 351 00:23:50,359 --> 00:23:52,800 Speaker 1: we're going to continue to have these guns in circulation 352 00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:55,919 Speaker 1: and endangering our population. What do you make of the glock? 353 00:23:56,119 --> 00:24:01,359 Speaker 1: A glock was a standard weapon in the NYPD for years. 354 00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:05,280 Speaker 1: It's an excellent weapon, but it can be It can 355 00:24:05,359 --> 00:24:08,040 Speaker 1: be altered by arranged so that it shoots as an 356 00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:12,040 Speaker 1: automatic weapon, in which case will it will fire a 357 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:14,320 Speaker 1: large number of rounds in a short period of time, 358 00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:18,320 Speaker 1: and can be exceedingly dangerous if not handled appropriately and 359 00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:22,080 Speaker 1: deadly if the intent is to inflict the injury. Take 360 00:24:22,080 --> 00:24:24,639 Speaker 1: a lot st our friends at WABC seven. Port records 361 00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:28,600 Speaker 1: indicate police recovered a nine millimeter glock from Johnson and 362 00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:31,760 Speaker 1: also recovered an AAR style rifle with the serial number 363 00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:35,280 Speaker 1: removed and we the people stamped on the weapon from Taylor. 364 00:24:35,680 --> 00:24:39,520 Speaker 1: Investigators are reviewing surveillance video from the hotel and bodycam 365 00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:43,000 Speaker 1: footage from other responding agencies to try to piece together 366 00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:46,800 Speaker 1: the events leading up to the shooting. We're still investigating 367 00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:50,480 Speaker 1: well everything that led up to it, so we're not 368 00:24:50,600 --> 00:24:53,119 Speaker 1: ready to get into the more of the details, and 369 00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:55,720 Speaker 1: investigators say up on a search of the suspects hotel room, 370 00:24:55,760 --> 00:24:58,960 Speaker 1: they found bomb making materials a bomb making manual, leading 371 00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:03,919 Speaker 1: to hotel evacuation, but an active explosive device was never found. 372 00:25:04,119 --> 00:25:06,960 Speaker 1: To Joan Gaula joining me from Newsday, she's been on 373 00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:09,320 Speaker 1: the case at the very beginning. This was a nine 374 00:25:09,359 --> 00:25:13,800 Speaker 1: a nine millimeter glock that had a switch to make 375 00:25:13,840 --> 00:25:18,639 Speaker 1: it automatic, which made you hold the trigger and many 376 00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:21,919 Speaker 1: many bullets. There's a spray of bullets, not just bang 377 00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:25,560 Speaker 1: bang each time you pull the trigger. And the weapon 378 00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:28,280 Speaker 1: was found in the parking lot with a thirty round 379 00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:32,959 Speaker 1: magazine empty well. One of the curiosities, and mister Kunst 380 00:25:33,119 --> 00:25:35,560 Speaker 1: shot in the chest and tours of the police say 381 00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:39,960 Speaker 1: that assault rifle as the other guests that had no 382 00:25:40,119 --> 00:25:43,040 Speaker 1: serial number, but it was stamped with the phrase quote 383 00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:47,800 Speaker 1: lead the people unquote, which is one of the curiosities 384 00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:53,359 Speaker 1: that surrounds this case and might possibly go to possible motivation, 385 00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:56,080 Speaker 1: but all of that is very speculative at this point. 386 00:25:56,160 --> 00:26:00,720 Speaker 1: So the gun had what an engraving on it or 387 00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:04,800 Speaker 1: stamp we the people correct a ghost gun with an 388 00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:07,640 Speaker 1: identifying marker, you get a ghost gun, so there's no 389 00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:10,760 Speaker 1: serial number on it. It can't be traced. Yet you 390 00:26:12,080 --> 00:26:16,200 Speaker 1: market with a phrase that no one will forget we 391 00:26:17,040 --> 00:26:20,600 Speaker 1: the people. A lot is being made of these two 392 00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:24,600 Speaker 1: being homeless. I'm not buying it for one minute. I 393 00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:28,080 Speaker 1: don't think they're homeless me neither. I don't buy their homeless. 394 00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:32,080 Speaker 1: These men had so many resources for homeless people. They're 395 00:26:32,119 --> 00:26:35,359 Speaker 1: staying at the Marriott that is not cheap. They have 396 00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:39,800 Speaker 1: the clothing and the appearance of normal people, so that 397 00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:42,439 Speaker 1: they looked a little strange, but they're they're walking in 398 00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:45,000 Speaker 1: out of the hotel. They don't look, smell, act like 399 00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:49,640 Speaker 1: homeless people. Perhaps costs a lot of money to get 400 00:26:49,640 --> 00:26:52,600 Speaker 1: the gun and bomb making women, dontor beth Is this 401 00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:55,359 Speaker 1: doctor Bethany talking doctor Bethany? You're right? What about it, 402 00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:57,959 Speaker 1: John Garrala. I don't think these two were homeless. I 403 00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:00,280 Speaker 1: think they just don't want to give up their address. Why, 404 00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:04,560 Speaker 1: because they're wanted. They're fugitives. Their home address will identify 405 00:27:04,600 --> 00:27:07,760 Speaker 1: who they are, and I could just jump in real quick. 406 00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:10,960 Speaker 1: I think that you're absolutely right that these individuals are 407 00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:13,560 Speaker 1: not homeless in the traditional sense that they were on 408 00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:17,680 Speaker 1: the run from other crimes committed downsta. Are you trying 409 00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:21,320 Speaker 1: to suggest that a fugitive is actually homeless, Peter Smith, 410 00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:24,280 Speaker 1: Not at all, Nancy, I'm saying that it sounds like 411 00:27:24,880 --> 00:27:28,800 Speaker 1: but homeless. I think that they had new resources to 412 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:34,520 Speaker 1: actually initially flee law enforcement from the South, and that 413 00:27:34,600 --> 00:27:39,440 Speaker 1: they were continuing Atlanta specifically no lack of dope business 414 00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:42,840 Speaker 1: in Atlanta. Take a listen to Jonathan Dance NBC four. 415 00:27:43,119 --> 00:27:45,399 Speaker 1: The two suspects have a history of arrests, including for 416 00:27:45,520 --> 00:27:48,879 Speaker 1: robbery and assault, but the hotel shooting this weekend comes 417 00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:52,240 Speaker 1: as the two suspects were already under investigation for a 418 00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:55,720 Speaker 1: drug related killing in August, and it appears the pair 419 00:27:55,920 --> 00:27:59,520 Speaker 1: might have known police were closing in on them. Both 420 00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:03,400 Speaker 1: men have past felony convictions, and police say both were 421 00:28:03,440 --> 00:28:07,800 Speaker 1: being investigated for possible involvement in a past gang related 422 00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:19,520 Speaker 1: murder in the Pokeepsie area. Fox Nation is coming to 423 00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:23,800 Speaker 1: Atlanta Wednesday, October twelfth. Join Nancy Grace for America's Crime 424 00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:27,960 Speaker 1: Crisis Live Summit seven pm at the Georgia Public Broadcasting Studios. 425 00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:31,159 Speaker 1: Here from local law enforcement, victims and leading experts on 426 00:28:31,200 --> 00:28:34,200 Speaker 1: whether crime policies are leading to skyrocketing crime rates, what 427 00:28:34,359 --> 00:28:36,840 Speaker 1: can be done to control the fentinel crisis, and is 428 00:28:36,880 --> 00:28:39,360 Speaker 1: there a way to make our street safer. Be part 429 00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:41,880 Speaker 1: of the live audience. Go to Crime online dot com 430 00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:43,600 Speaker 1: look for the banner at the top of the page. 431 00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:46,240 Speaker 1: Click to get your free ticket. Seating is limited for 432 00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:49,880 Speaker 1: America's Crime Crisis Live Summit with Nancy Grace. Get your 433 00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:53,080 Speaker 1: free ticket now again. That's October twelfth at the GPB 434 00:28:53,240 --> 00:29:06,560 Speaker 1: Studios at seven pm. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. This 435 00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:11,720 Speaker 1: dad gets his son to college and it's family weekend. 436 00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:20,680 Speaker 1: He goes and he is shot dead. Take a listen 437 00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:23,800 Speaker 1: to our friends at NBC four. A day after the 438 00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:26,680 Speaker 1: father of a Marist college student was shot to death 439 00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:29,960 Speaker 1: in this Poughkeepsie hotel lobby, two men are charged in 440 00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:33,560 Speaker 1: the killing. Police were covered two guns, including this rifle, 441 00:29:33,840 --> 00:29:36,520 Speaker 1: a ghost gun with no serial number, according to law 442 00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:40,760 Speaker 1: enforcement sources, and bomb making materials in the hotel room 443 00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:43,480 Speaker 1: where police say the two men were staying. Roy Johnson 444 00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:47,480 Speaker 1: Junior and Devin Taylor, both homeless with previous felony convictions 445 00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:50,600 Speaker 1: and charged in this case. Law enforcement sources tell News 446 00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:54,760 Speaker 1: four Johnson fired dozens of gunshots inside and outside the 447 00:29:54,800 --> 00:29:58,400 Speaker 1: Marriott Courtyard Sunday morning after those sources say he got 448 00:29:58,400 --> 00:30:01,960 Speaker 1: into an argument in the lobby. Joan Growa, Newsday, what 449 00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:04,840 Speaker 1: can you tell me about these two guys criminal history 450 00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:07,120 Speaker 1: that explains to where they've been living part of the 451 00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:11,720 Speaker 1: time anyway in jail. Well, yes, you're absolutely correct, and 452 00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:17,960 Speaker 1: the problem is that the Poughkeepsie police are well, they're 453 00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:22,480 Speaker 1: being extremely cautious, which makes perfect sense, honoring the family's 454 00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:27,240 Speaker 1: wishes about not releasing the victim's name, for example, which 455 00:30:27,280 --> 00:30:30,160 Speaker 1: we only got as reporters from the charging papers. But 456 00:30:30,320 --> 00:30:33,440 Speaker 1: the past history and the violence of this crime and 457 00:30:33,520 --> 00:30:38,920 Speaker 1: the weapons sounds might explain why the individual charged with 458 00:30:39,080 --> 00:30:43,880 Speaker 1: the shooting was remanded and the second individual while his 459 00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:46,640 Speaker 1: bail was set at five hundred thousand dollars in cash 460 00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:50,120 Speaker 1: or a million dollars bond or five million partly secured, 461 00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:53,600 Speaker 1: which you're hefty amounts. What exactly is the bond? Did 462 00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:57,280 Speaker 1: you say? The second individual not the shooter? His bail 463 00:30:57,400 --> 00:31:00,320 Speaker 1: was set at five hundred thousand dollars in cash, a 464 00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:04,320 Speaker 1: one million dollar bond or five million partially secured. Guys, 465 00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:08,560 Speaker 1: let's go straight to our cut. Seventeen Johathan danced w NBC. 466 00:31:09,160 --> 00:31:13,440 Speaker 1: Roy Johnson was a wanted man. Johnson was labeled a 467 00:31:13,440 --> 00:31:17,800 Speaker 1: criminal fugitive by the sheriff in Fulton County, Georgia. Johnson 468 00:31:17,840 --> 00:31:21,960 Speaker 1: allegedly skipped court after his arrest on felony gun and 469 00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:26,240 Speaker 1: cocaine dealing charges. The Sheriff's office says a warrant for 470 00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:30,000 Speaker 1: his arrest, was put into a national database in July. 471 00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:34,840 Speaker 1: In the database in July. Yet here they are at family. 472 00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:38,440 Speaker 1: We can at Marist take a listener more. In August 473 00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:41,280 Speaker 1: of this year, law enforcement sources say Johnson was being 474 00:31:41,320 --> 00:31:44,880 Speaker 1: investigated in the Poughkeepsie area, being looked at as a 475 00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:49,520 Speaker 1: key suspect in connection with a gang related murder. Several 476 00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:52,479 Speaker 1: law enforcement sources say while some investigators wanted to make 477 00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:55,680 Speaker 1: an arrest, they say the DA and others wanted to 478 00:31:55,720 --> 00:31:59,640 Speaker 1: wait for DNA and fingerprint evidence to come back. During 479 00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:03,720 Speaker 1: that August murder investigation, it seems at no time did 480 00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:09,640 Speaker 1: police or prosecutors act on that warrant out of Georgia. Okay, 481 00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:15,000 Speaker 1: what about it, Chapman, He's got a felony warrant out 482 00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:18,680 Speaker 1: of Fulton County, where I prosecuted for ten years, a 483 00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:23,520 Speaker 1: felony warrant. Guns and dope. They know it's him. He 484 00:32:23,680 --> 00:32:28,719 Speaker 1: suspected in another murder right there, and they do nothing. 485 00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:32,360 Speaker 1: And now this father of three is dead. There's a 486 00:32:32,360 --> 00:32:34,960 Speaker 1: lot of explaining that's got to be done relative to 487 00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:39,160 Speaker 1: this case. What the extent of the investigation was, why 488 00:32:39,520 --> 00:32:43,360 Speaker 1: it was necessary to wait longer before apprehension, and I 489 00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:48,480 Speaker 1: think until the police and the prosecutor come forward and 490 00:32:48,560 --> 00:32:51,880 Speaker 1: say exactly what their reasons were, there is great reason 491 00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:55,840 Speaker 1: to be concerned about what the practice was. Concern my 492 00:32:56,000 --> 00:32:58,720 Speaker 1: rear in concern you go tell that to the three 493 00:32:58,760 --> 00:33:01,880 Speaker 1: boys that don't have a father and a mother having 494 00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:04,760 Speaker 1: to raise a family on her own. Take a listen 495 00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:07,920 Speaker 1: to w NBC. The suspect, Johnson is accused of using 496 00:33:07,920 --> 00:33:11,120 Speaker 1: a glock with a thirty round magazine to open fire 497 00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:14,880 Speaker 1: in and around the hotel, allegedly killing cuts Another man, 498 00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:18,960 Speaker 1: Devin Taylor, also charged with weapons possession so called ghost 499 00:33:19,040 --> 00:33:23,440 Speaker 1: gun assault style rifle, and possible bomb making parts found 500 00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:26,880 Speaker 1: in their hotel room. Earlier, the District Attorney's office in 501 00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:29,920 Speaker 1: Georgia told us if police here in New York knew 502 00:33:29,920 --> 00:33:32,880 Speaker 1: where Johnson was this past summer, they would have wanted 503 00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:37,120 Speaker 1: Johnson arrested and sent back to Georgia on his guns 504 00:33:37,160 --> 00:33:41,360 Speaker 1: and drugs charges. Okay, you got, I can jump in. 505 00:33:41,480 --> 00:33:43,280 Speaker 1: I'm sorry if I could just say one thing about 506 00:33:43,320 --> 00:33:47,320 Speaker 1: the father, one of the saddest things. He was killed 507 00:33:47,360 --> 00:33:52,239 Speaker 1: the day before his twins turned twenty twenty two, and 508 00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:56,440 Speaker 1: they also attended marist I believe the father was visiting 509 00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:59,640 Speaker 1: the third son, the younger son, who by all accounts 510 00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:04,040 Speaker 1: is extremely accomplished student. Yeah, and Nancy, this is doctor Jensen. 511 00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:08,200 Speaker 1: This is where the forensic evidence would be helpful and 512 00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:13,239 Speaker 1: helping to explain to the circumstances. We would look to 513 00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:16,279 Speaker 1: do X rays to determine whether it was a high 514 00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:22,120 Speaker 1: velocity round that struck the victim or whether it was 515 00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:26,600 Speaker 1: from the glock handgun. And we can also tell what 516 00:34:26,640 --> 00:34:30,759 Speaker 1: we describe as atypical entrance gunshot wounds, and this would 517 00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:34,120 Speaker 1: be indicative of a bullet coming through some kind of 518 00:34:34,120 --> 00:34:37,800 Speaker 1: an object, such as the glass. There may be also 519 00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:41,880 Speaker 1: some determination of whether the bullet was a ricochet or 520 00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:45,799 Speaker 1: actually was pointed at the individual. So these are the 521 00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:51,600 Speaker 1: kind of questions we try to answer just by routine 522 00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:56,400 Speaker 1: processing of a gunshot wound, X rays, examining the bullet 523 00:34:56,400 --> 00:34:58,840 Speaker 1: fragments and the weapon. Can I ask you a question, 524 00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:02,799 Speaker 1: doctor j and how do you stay so calm when 525 00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:08,520 Speaker 1: you're looking at body after body after body? And I mean, 526 00:35:08,560 --> 00:35:13,719 Speaker 1: I'm just thinking about their children. I mean, it's hard 527 00:35:13,719 --> 00:35:15,840 Speaker 1: for me to take in. It's always the good people 528 00:35:16,239 --> 00:35:19,800 Speaker 1: they get gunned down or murdered. He ran an accounting 529 00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:23,160 Speaker 1: firm with his brother for the last thirty plus years, married, 530 00:35:23,239 --> 00:35:29,080 Speaker 1: one time, great family, faithful, loyal, hard worker. Ma'am, he's 531 00:35:29,120 --> 00:35:32,440 Speaker 1: dead and these two dopeheads are walking for I mean, 532 00:35:32,760 --> 00:35:36,400 Speaker 1: they're alive. They'll probably get bond and what free You 533 00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:40,640 Speaker 1: bring up an interesting point, Nancy, because most pathologists are 534 00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:48,040 Speaker 1: characterized as being stuck in their basement laboratories. But it's 535 00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:51,640 Speaker 1: the forensic pathologist that has intimate contact with both the 536 00:35:51,719 --> 00:35:56,120 Speaker 1: victim and the victim's family. So it's not uncommon that 537 00:35:56,160 --> 00:35:59,960 Speaker 1: when I'm at a crime scene, I'll encounter the big 538 00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:04,560 Speaker 1: his family an attempt to give them my condolences and 539 00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:08,960 Speaker 1: to give them a detailed idea of how we were 540 00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:12,719 Speaker 1: going to treat their loved one. John Garralla, what happens next? Oh, 541 00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:16,879 Speaker 1: that's a great question. The family is asking for all 542 00:36:16,920 --> 00:36:20,880 Speaker 1: of us to respect their privacy. And if you mentioned 543 00:36:20,920 --> 00:36:25,160 Speaker 1: the accounting firm run with his brother, while apparently the 544 00:36:25,280 --> 00:36:28,960 Speaker 1: father was known for arriving very early, like six am, 545 00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:31,920 Speaker 1: always with a smile on his face. And if you 546 00:36:32,040 --> 00:36:35,120 Speaker 1: look at the company website, you see they even list 547 00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:40,960 Speaker 1: their dog Luna, who provides comic relief, they say, and 548 00:36:41,080 --> 00:36:44,120 Speaker 1: emotional support in her role as an office companion, and 549 00:36:44,160 --> 00:36:47,719 Speaker 1: will soon try to prepare your tax returns. This guy 550 00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:51,520 Speaker 1: reminds me so much, and my dad and my husband 551 00:36:52,000 --> 00:36:57,800 Speaker 1: just good. Through and through. We wait as justice and 552 00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:00,719 Speaker 1: false Nancy Grace Crumbs voice sad enough