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Speaker 1: Hey to your Therapist listeners. It's Lori and Guy and

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Speaker 1: we have a quick update.

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Speaker 2: Many of you have told us that you get something

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Speaker 2: new out of each episode when you listen to it

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Speaker 2: again the second or third time. In fact, when we

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Speaker 2: listen to the episodes again, we also get takeaways we

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Speaker 2: didn't remember.

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Speaker 1: We're They're therapy is like that too. There are so

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Speaker 1: many learning moments in a session, and it's difficult to

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Speaker 1: absorb them all at once. So while we're not taping

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Speaker 1: new episodes right now, we are offering you our most

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Speaker 1: popular sessions as encores so that you can continue to

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Speaker 1: gain value from them.

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Speaker 2: We love doing the Therapists episodes, but we're each busy

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Speaker 2: with new and exciting projects that we hope you will

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Speaker 2: love just as much.

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Speaker 1: I have a new advice podcast called Since You Asked,

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Speaker 1: which you can get wherever you listen to podcasts.

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Speaker 2: And I have a new book coming out. It's called

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Speaker 2: Mind Overgrind, How to Break Free when work Hijacks your life,

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Speaker 2: and it will be published by Simon and Schuster. You

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Speaker 2: can find out more about it on my website dot com.

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Speaker 1: You can learn more about these on our socials. And meanwhile,

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Speaker 1: we hope you find these Dear Therapist sessions as valuable

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Speaker 1: as we have making them for you. Hey, fellow travelers,

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Speaker 1: I'm Lori Gottlieb. I'm the author of Maybe You Should

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Speaker 1: Talk to Someone, and I write the Dear Therapist column

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Speaker 1: for The Atlantic.

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Speaker 3: And I'm Guy Winch. I wrote Emotional First Aid, and

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Speaker 3: I write the Dear Guy column for Ted. And this

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Speaker 3: is deo Therapists.

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Speaker 1: This week, a man feels guilty that he isn't connecting

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Speaker 1: enough with his mother in another country during COVID. Oh,

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Speaker 1: and he's not just any fellow traveler. He's a special

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Speaker 1: guest that you may already know.

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Speaker 4: The roles reverse as we get older. And one of

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Speaker 4: the things that I've noticed in that role reversal is

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Speaker 4: there can be a lot of feelings of guilt.

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Speaker 1: Listen in and maybe learn something about yourself and the process.

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Speaker 3: Deo Therapist is for informational purposes only, does not constitute

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Speaker 3: medical advice, and is not a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis,

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Speaker 3: or treatment. Always seek the advice of your physician, mental

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Speaker 3: health professional, or other qualified health provider with any questions

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Speaker 3: you may have regarding a medical condition. By submitting a letter,

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Speaker 3: you are agreeing to let iHeartMedia use it in Potter

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Speaker 3: and Full and we may edit it for lengthen or clarity.

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Speaker 5: Hey Guy, Hey Laurie. So I'm really excited because today.

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Speaker 1: We're doing something a little bit different on Dear Therapists.

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Speaker 1: We are still answering our listeners' questions, but we have

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Speaker 1: a very special guest who's going to join us to

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Speaker 1: do an episode of Speed Advice.

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Speaker 5: Our guest is Jay Shetty.

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Speaker 1: He's a friend of ours and we asked him here

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Speaker 1: specifically because, like us, his mission is to help people

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Speaker 1: live better lives by becoming more aware of their emotional roadblocks.

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Speaker 1: He has a new book out that we can't recommend

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Speaker 1: highly enough.

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Speaker 5: It is called Think like a Monk.

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Speaker 3: Spoiler alert because he used to be a monk. Now

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Speaker 3: Here he is sitting between two therapists. So Jay, welcome

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Speaker 3: to the show.

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Speaker 4: Guy Laurie, thank you so much for that is it

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Speaker 4: always sounds like one of those jokes, what did two

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Speaker 4: therapists and a monk do in a bar? It's awesome

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Speaker 4: to you, it's awesome to be with you both. Thank

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Speaker 4: you for having me. I'm a huge fan of both

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Speaker 4: of your work, so glad to be here with you.

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Speaker 4: Thank you for having me.

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Speaker 5: Oh well, it's our pleasure.

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Speaker 1: We were talking about how in your book you help

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Speaker 1: people with the same kinds of issues that we do, relationships, anxiety,

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Speaker 1: self sabotage. So normally on our show, people get two

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Speaker 1: therapists giving advice, but today people are going to get

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Speaker 1: two therapists and a former monk.

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Speaker 4: And I just.

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Speaker 1: Want to let people know that think like a monk.

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Speaker 5: It's such a game changer.

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Speaker 1: It has been a huge bestseller because it is resonating

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Speaker 1: so widely with people who really want to find a

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Speaker 1: way forward, which is what we like to do on

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Speaker 1: the show. And that's why we're so happy to have

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Speaker 1: Jay here as our special guest in answering these questions.

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Speaker 3: And I have a question for you. Jay. You were

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Speaker 3: a college student, you are pursuing a degree in business,

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Speaker 3: and then you decided to become a monk, and that's

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Speaker 3: an unusual career shift. So I'm very curous that people

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Speaker 3: who knew close friends, how did they respond.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, it's really interesting to go back and reflect on

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Speaker 4: how people reacted to that decision, which was big, extreme,

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Speaker 4: massively rebellious, completely against the grain. And my college friends

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Speaker 4: were all shocked and surprised. I got everything from you know,

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Speaker 4: you're never going to get a job again, through to

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Speaker 4: family and friends saying things like, you realize you're wasting

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Speaker 4: all your parents' efforts and getting you a good education.

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Speaker 4: This is a complete waste of your life, and you're

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Speaker 4: making the worst decision. And it's really interesting because the

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Speaker 4: noise was really high. But a big part of thinking

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Speaker 4: like a monk is being able to down the noise

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Speaker 4: and tune into your inner path and in a calling

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Speaker 4: and in a voice, and I felt that that was

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Speaker 4: really strong. Then the hardest thing was when I actually

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Speaker 4: came back from living as a month three years later,

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Speaker 4: they were like, we told you so. So that was

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Speaker 4: almost harder because the noise that I came back to was, well, look,

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Speaker 4: no one's going to give you a job now. You

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Speaker 4: just wasted three years of your life. So actually coming

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Speaker 4: back was somewhat harder than leaving.

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Speaker 1: So when you came back, you wanted to share with

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Speaker 1: people what you had learned, because you felt like it

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Speaker 1: wasn't about this person sitting on a mountaintop and being

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Speaker 1: removed from the world. It was about how can we

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Speaker 1: use all of this in very practical ways in our

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Speaker 1: daily lives. You're this like.

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Speaker 5: Young cool guy.

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Speaker 1: You're not what we think of when we think of

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Speaker 1: a monk. So how did you think people would get

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Speaker 1: your message or response to your message?

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Speaker 4: To be honest, I've never even thought about it. I

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Speaker 4: feel like when you found something that's so valuable and

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Speaker 4: so useful, you don't have to ask yourself questions about

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Speaker 4: whether someone's going to listen to you or not. If

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Speaker 4: you come across something truly powerful, the last thing you're

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Speaker 4: thinking about is am I the right person? Or is

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Speaker 4: this the right messenger? You just want to share it.

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Speaker 1: Well, we are so excited to bring your wisdom to

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Speaker 1: our listeners. So are you ready to take on some

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Speaker 1: of their questions.

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Speaker 4: I don't know if I'll answer them as well as

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Speaker 4: you and guy, but I would definitely try my best.

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Speaker 3: All right, I'm going to read the first one. They

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Speaker 3: usually start, your therapist. I'm going to skip that.

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Speaker 5: Because now it's dear therapist and a former monk.

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Speaker 3: I am almost forty years old, and I have a

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Speaker 3: successful career as an accountant working for multiple large corporations.

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Speaker 3: In my search for another position, I realized that I

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Speaker 3: really genuinely don't want to do anything related to text

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Speaker 3: or accounting. It really makes me feel sick just thinking

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Speaker 3: about going back to that. I love interacting with people,

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Speaker 3: talking about perspectives and emotions and talking about myself as

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Speaker 3: well as to others about this reason issues. The simple

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Speaker 3: answer is to go back to school and get a

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Speaker 3: degree in something else. However, that doesn't seem to be

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Speaker 3: the answer for me, as it brings up more questions

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Speaker 3: and anxiety than answers. Can you help me?

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Speaker 4: Thank you so much for the detailed question. It's great

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Speaker 4: to have some of those subtle insights into your particular journey.

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Speaker 4: I think it's really brave of you to acknowledge that

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Speaker 4: something that you've invested in and done until the age

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Speaker 4: of forty is something that you're not comfortable with. A

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Speaker 4: lot of people never get to that stage because it's

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Speaker 4: so hard to even admit to yourself that, hey, this

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Speaker 4: thing that I've been investing in for maybe twenty years

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Speaker 4: is not what I'm looking for. I think the key

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Speaker 4: thing here is, first of all, to realize why doing

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Speaker 4: tax still has value in your life. Often we look

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Speaker 4: at things as binary. Either it has value or it

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Speaker 4: doesn't have value. So at one point your current career

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Speaker 4: had value and now you almost feel like it has

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Speaker 4: zero value. The truth is it still has some value.

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Speaker 4: It may pay the bills, it may put food on

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Speaker 4: the table, it may take care of your family, so

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Speaker 4: it still has some value. And allowing yourself to recognize

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Speaker 4: that allows you to keep doing those things if that's

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Speaker 4: still important to you, at the same time as exploring

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Speaker 4: and experimenting with your curiosity. And so what I would

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Speaker 4: suggest is that continuing in the work that you're doing

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Speaker 4: right now to provide a foundation unless you have the

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Speaker 4: financial freedom to make a leap and take a risk

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Speaker 4: and start exploring. And the second thing is looking into

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Speaker 4: that curiosity. So when you start looking into your calling

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Speaker 4: or your passion, it's important to recognize the difference between

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Speaker 4: hobbies and your purpose or something that you're really meant

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Speaker 4: to do. And so you may be missing hobbies or

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Speaker 4: passions or interests that you may want to get back

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Speaker 4: involved in. But the difference between that and another career

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Speaker 4: path is what are you so passionate about that you're

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Speaker 4: willing to invest in building your strengths, your skills, your expertise,

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Speaker 4: and your abilities. And so that exploration starts with courses.

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Speaker 4: It starts with going to shadow people that you maybe

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Speaker 4: not have spent time with. You may listen to podcasts

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Speaker 4: and hear about people in those career paths. This is

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Speaker 4: a great time to allow your mind the openness to

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Speaker 4: explore this new path, but do it in a way

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Speaker 4: that feels safe and comfortable as well. Allowing yourself to

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Speaker 4: test courses. Shadowing people, hearing from people who are doing

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Speaker 4: career paths that you're fascinated by is a great way

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Speaker 4: of starting that initial research.

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Speaker 1: I love what you said about things not being binary,

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Speaker 1: because I think that so often what happens is people

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Speaker 1: are doing something and they feel like there's something better

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Speaker 1: out there, and the thing that they're doing becomes horrible.

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Speaker 1: It makes it really hard to hold on to the

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Speaker 1: fact that the other thing isn't one hundred percent great

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Speaker 1: and the thing that you're doing isn't one hundred percent bad.

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Speaker 1: And so it gives you that perspective, and it also

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Speaker 1: gives you more freedom to explore. So it's not like

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Speaker 1: the desperation of I have to get out of this

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Speaker 1: thing this second, where you said it makes me sick

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Speaker 1: to go back to this right. The reason this person

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Speaker 1: gave for not wanting to go back to school or

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Speaker 1: do something else was the uncertainty, And it wasn't like

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Speaker 1: you have to jump into a graduate program because you

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Speaker 1: don't know what you want to do yet exactly. So

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Speaker 1: what you said, Jay, it's a time to explore and

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Speaker 1: to be able to sit with the uncertainty, and certainty

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Speaker 1: is an opportunity because it opens up all of these possibilities.

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Speaker 3: I agree with both of you. We often make the

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Speaker 3: mistake of thinking we actually have to replace instead of

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Speaker 3: ad change this and switch it out, when maybe you

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Speaker 3: just need to add a component to your life that

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Speaker 3: would make everything else seem more worthwhile and working better.

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Speaker 3: So figure out what it is you can add, and

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Speaker 3: you might find in that exploration. Actually you'll find with

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Speaker 3: going back to what you did, because the combination of

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Speaker 3: the two is sufficient.

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Speaker 1: Let's move on to our next letter, and this one

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Speaker 1: is about an affair and letting go, and it goes

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Speaker 1: like this. When I was in college, I had an

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Speaker 1: affair with a professor twelve years my senior that lasted

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Speaker 1: for four years. He wasn't married, but he had a

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Speaker 1: steady girlfriend with whom he lived. It's the typical story

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Speaker 1: where I fell deeply in love, and I believed with

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Speaker 1: all my heart that he was going to leave her,

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Speaker 1: but he always found an excuse not to. When I

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Speaker 1: realized that I was caught in a cliche that hardly

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Speaker 1: ever ends well, I found the courage to break up

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Speaker 1: with him. But when I did, he uttered the words

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Speaker 1: you meant nothing to me. It was the last time

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Speaker 1: we spoke, and here I am seven years later. Even

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Speaker 1: though I don't have any romantic feelings for him anymore,

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Speaker 1: I still can't get over those words. They still hurt

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Speaker 1: for me. Those four years meant so much. There was

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Speaker 1: a lot of emotional intimacy. We talked daily. He was

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Speaker 1: often the first person I would hear from every morning,

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Speaker 1: and for hours he would confide in me, making me

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Speaker 1: feel special, encouraging and advising me.

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Speaker 5: But now, because of those.

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Speaker 1: Words, every time I think of my college years, I

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Speaker 1: feel sad and naive. And even though I really would

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Speaker 1: like to know if he meant them or not, the

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Speaker 1: last thing I want to do is contact him and

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Speaker 1: ask him. I guess what I really want to know

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Speaker 1: is if a person can fake so much care and

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Speaker 1: attention and for so many years just to sleep with me.

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Speaker 5: So, Jay, what do you think about that one.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, thank you for your courage on sharing that with us.

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Speaker 4: A lot of the time we look to gain closure

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Speaker 4: from other people. We look to gain answers and reasons

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Speaker 4: for something from the other person, but often the other

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Speaker 4: person is not physically accessible or emotionally mature enough to

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Speaker 4: have that conversation. It's really important that we provide that

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Speaker 4: closure and the answers and the reasons to ourself through

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Speaker 4: our own reflection of what we've experienced and what we've

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Speaker 4: been through. When you look at the scenario that you've

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Speaker 4: painted there and the person saying those words, those words

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Speaker 4: are probably shared in pain and spite from their side,

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Speaker 4: and not a reflection of you or what you gave

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Speaker 4: to the relationship or what you committed, but more of

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Speaker 4: a reflection of the state of mind they were in.

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Speaker 4: You stood up for what was right for you. You

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Speaker 4: stood up for what you thought was the best way forward.

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Speaker 4: And if that's something that someone couldn't understand or someone

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Speaker 4: couldn't respect or respond to in a positive way, then

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Speaker 4: you can be pretty sure that you made the right

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Speaker 4: decision to move on. But I would suggest that you

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Speaker 4: allow yourself to reflect on the situation and find the closure.

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Speaker 4: Recognize that final statement had very little to do with

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Speaker 4: you and more to do with how that person fell

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Speaker 4: at the time.

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Speaker 3: It's interesting, Jay, because what's confusing her is that he

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Speaker 3: was twelve years her senior. He was the professor, he

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Speaker 3: was the one she expected was the adult, and so

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Speaker 3: if he said it, he must have meant it. But

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Speaker 3: he actually wasn't responding as an adult. He was responding

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Speaker 3: as a child. He was lashing out because his feelings

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Speaker 3: were hurt, which kind of implies that he actually did care.

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Speaker 3: People can be in a relationship in a big age difference,

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Speaker 3: and sometimes it's the younger one that's the more mature,

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Speaker 3: and so they keep taking what the older person is

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Speaker 3: saying too much to heart.

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Speaker 1: And I think it's so true that when people are hurt,

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Speaker 1: they say hurtful things, and we sometimes forget that, we

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Speaker 1: personalize what they say, we take it at face value

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Speaker 1: when they're just responding from this place of deep woundedness.

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Speaker 1: This is a person who clearly cared about her, because

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Speaker 1: if he didn't care about her, he wouldn't have been

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Speaker 1: so wounded. And I think that we have to go

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Speaker 1: back to what you said, Jay, and what you're saying

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Speaker 1: guy too about you know, we all have this place

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Speaker 1: of knowing inside of us. And she knew at the

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Speaker 1: time this is not right. This is not healthy for me.

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Speaker 1: This is not a reciprocal relationship, and she knows that now.

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Speaker 1: But the problem is that those words are just imprinted

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Speaker 1: in her mind and she's not going to that place

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Speaker 1: of knowing that I knew this wasn't right for me.

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Speaker 1: I knew he didn't have my interest in mind. I

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Speaker 1: think that's going to be really important for her. Hold

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Speaker 1: on too that I know what's right for me. I

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Speaker 1: know what's healthy for me, and this even ruminating about

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Speaker 1: this is not healthy for me. You're listening to Dear

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Speaker 1: Therapists from my Heart Radio. We'll be back after a

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Speaker 1: quick break. I'm Laurie Gottlieb and.

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Speaker 3: I'm Guy Wench and this is Dear Therapist. Our next

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Speaker 3: one is about boundaries. I have a mother who has

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Speaker 3: severe depression. Although I don't live with her, she calls

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Speaker 3: me often being negative, down and crying. I try to

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Speaker 3: help her in the past by talking to her, listening,

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Speaker 3: suggesting things she can do, and every time she would

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Speaker 3: find an excuse not to help herself. I'm at the

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Speaker 3: point that I struggle myself with my anxiety, which results

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Speaker 3: in not wanting to speak to her as I don't

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Speaker 3: want to feel more down. She thinks I'm selfish. How

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Speaker 3: can I deal with my mother without feeling guilty?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, like our parents, there are superheroes and they make

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Speaker 4: everything happen. And then often the roles reverse as we

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Speaker 4: get older and they start looking to us for inspiration

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Speaker 4: or motivations or guidance or resources or whatever it may be.

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Speaker 4: And one of the things that I've noticed in that

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Speaker 4: role reversal is there can be a lot of feelings

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Speaker 4: of guilt and a lot of feelings of not being

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Speaker 4: able to reciprocate or respond with the love or the

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Speaker 4: support you may have received growing up. And that can

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Speaker 4: be a really tough situation to be in. And what

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Speaker 4: I've seen has helped many people is recognizing that sometimes

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Speaker 4: it's not us that our parents need. It's introducing them

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Speaker 4: to different insights, teachers, books, resources that can help them,

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Speaker 4: and providing them with a community, a group of friends,

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Speaker 4: encouraging other people to partake in their life, encouraging them

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Speaker 4: to connect with other people in their lives. It's not

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Speaker 4: the easy way out, it's actually the sustainable way for

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Speaker 4: them to also move forward is by not making them

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Speaker 4: fully dependent on you. And sometimes we can feel that

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Speaker 4: someone's fully dependent on us because we're allowing them to

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Speaker 4: only depend on us for that joy or their happiness

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Speaker 4: or whatever it may be. So allowing that person to

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Speaker 4: find a community, helping them find that community, helping them

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Speaker 4: find that next step for them, it's a patient process.

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Speaker 1: I think so many people are caught in what you're

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Speaker 1: talking about, Jay, where they feel like I know how

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Speaker 1: I can help my parent, meaning I can refer them

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Speaker 1: to a therapist, I can give them this book because

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Speaker 1: they're grieving. What happens is we aren't able to have

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Speaker 1: a boundary. We feel like that somehow it's selfish to

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Speaker 1: set a boundary. And the problem is that negativity is

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Speaker 1: so contagious, and you talk about this in your book, Jay,

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Speaker 1: where the most contagious thing in a household is anxiety negativity,

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Speaker 1: And if somebody doesn't have that under control, it affects

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Speaker 1: everybody around them. And so it's not being selfish to

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Speaker 1: be able to say to your parent, I love you

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Speaker 1: so much and I don't want to see you struggle

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Speaker 1: so much. I am not the person who can help

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Speaker 1: you through this in the most effective way. But I'll

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Speaker 1: help you find a therapist, or I'll send you some

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Speaker 1: books on this or whatever it is. That they're other

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Speaker 1: ways that you could be there and be helpful that

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Speaker 1: are actually more helpful. Then you're having these conversations all

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Speaker 1: the time that go nowhere.

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Speaker 3: I think it's fair when you have a parent who's

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Speaker 3: really depressed and you have to do this lifting from

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Speaker 3: afar to say to them, Look, I understand you're depressed,

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Speaker 3: and I understand it's very difficult. I want to be

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Speaker 3: there for you, but I can't be there to the

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Speaker 3: point that I start feel like I'm drowning as well.

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Speaker 3: So I want us to talk about how we can

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Speaker 3: make our conversations a little more balanced. I'm happy to

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Speaker 3: listen at the beginning to what's going on, and at

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Speaker 3: that point she should be providing emotional validation rather than

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Speaker 3: advice necessarily. But then to pivot and say, and now

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Speaker 3: I want to tell you a little bit about me,

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Speaker 3: and let's see if I can brighten your day by

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Speaker 3: talking about me a little bit. So there's a little

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Speaker 3: bit of a balance there between the positivity and the negativity.

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Speaker 3: And to come to a contract with him. I'm to

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Speaker 3: an agreement that that's what we're going to do. We're

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Speaker 3: going to have elements of both.

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Speaker 4: I'm learning so much. I love hearing you birth. This

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Speaker 4: is fantastic.

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Speaker 1: It's so interesting to hear the overlap between how we

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Speaker 1: as therapist approach something and how you approach something with

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Speaker 1: the teachings from your work.

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Speaker 3: And this is why I think your book is so

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Speaker 3: timely j because over the past ten twenty years there's

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Speaker 3: been a real influx of Eastern thinking into Western psychotherapy

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Speaker 3: in a way that makes us all richer for it.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 5: I agree.

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Speaker 1: Our next letter, in fact, I think is something you

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Speaker 1: talk about too in your book. It's about this idea

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Speaker 1: of revenge and why that's not helpful for us. And

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Speaker 1: here's how the letter goes. Dear Therapist and a Monk.

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Speaker 1: It has been a year. I was engaged and he

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Speaker 1: wanted to marry. After one visit from his daughter, he

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Speaker 1: sent me a WhatsApp message saying he could not leave

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Speaker 1: his old life and start a new life. He put

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Speaker 1: a photo of him and his daughter hugging each other.

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Speaker 1: I was mad, broke the contact immediately and now I

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Speaker 1: want revenge.

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Speaker 5: Is that a good thing?

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Speaker 1: To do.

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Speaker 5: And we think this is a very quick letter.

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Speaker 1: We know that the answer is no, but but we

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Speaker 1: want to give We want to give a.

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Speaker 5: Quick explanation as to why.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I think we all agree that it doesn't matter

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Speaker 4: what the question is, revenge is not the answer. I

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Speaker 4: was just thinking about it out loud of just like yeah,

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Speaker 4: I was trying to think when when would I agree

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Speaker 4: that revenge is the answer, And I can't seem to

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Speaker 4: find a reason, And so I think it's important to

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Speaker 4: explain why revenge is never the answer because revenge places

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Speaker 4: the control and validation of your joy, happiness, and success

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Speaker 4: into someone else's hands. So if you now want to

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Speaker 4: take revenge, the only way your revenge will be satisfied

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Speaker 4: is if that person feels pain. Chances are they may

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Speaker 4: actually feel absolutely fine. And so now you've gone on

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Speaker 4: this whole journey to get a response from this individual

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Speaker 4: that may not give you the response you want. And

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Speaker 4: so revenge as a concept in and of itself is

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Speaker 4: flawed because it has no guarantee and it doesn't make

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Speaker 4: you feel a sense of safety or security or improve

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Speaker 4: your self worth. The key thing here is to reflect

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Speaker 4: on what you feel about you was lost or affected

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Speaker 4: in this situation that happened. What was it about this

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Speaker 4: situation that makes you want to take revenge? Where was

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Speaker 4: your ego hurt? And then creating a plan of action.

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Speaker 4: There's some part of you that doesn't feel as positive

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Speaker 4: about you anymore, and that means that putting some light

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Speaker 4: on it and working on it and helping yourself develop

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Speaker 4: that self confidence, that self esteem, whatever it may be

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Speaker 4: that may have been lost you to this scenario is

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Speaker 4: really where your focus should go. And that's going to

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Speaker 4: make you more attractive internally and externally to anyone in

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Speaker 4: the future, as opposed to trying to get that person's

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Speaker 4: validation from the past.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I'll add one thing that, you know, giving the

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Speaker 3: suddenness of this, you might this person might do some

437
00:23:05,439 --> 00:23:08,239
Speaker 3: work on looking back and seeing what they might have missed.

438
00:23:08,279 --> 00:23:11,199
Speaker 3: This is a big rupted about face. There are probably

439
00:23:11,279 --> 00:23:14,599
Speaker 3: signs there and it may be worthwhile to start looking

440
00:23:14,639 --> 00:23:17,879
Speaker 3: at those and seeing what other indications of this their world,

441
00:23:17,999 --> 00:23:20,479
Speaker 3: Whether you swept them under the rug, compromise too much,

442
00:23:20,519 --> 00:23:22,559
Speaker 3: miss them, what have you. There's a lot of learning

443
00:23:22,599 --> 00:23:24,879
Speaker 3: that can be done here, and there's no learning that

444
00:23:24,919 --> 00:23:26,559
Speaker 3: you get from revenge. None.

445
00:23:27,039 --> 00:23:28,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, this reminds me a little bit of that letter

446
00:23:28,719 --> 00:23:31,759
Speaker 1: we talked about earlier, where the actions of somebody else

447
00:23:31,839 --> 00:23:34,159
Speaker 1: are sitting with you, but the other person isn't feeling it.

448
00:23:34,599 --> 00:23:37,799
Speaker 1: The other person looms so large in your mind, but

449
00:23:38,679 --> 00:23:41,679
Speaker 1: they're in a different place. And so just to even

450
00:23:41,719 --> 00:23:44,999
Speaker 1: be able to have a better perspective on wait a minute,

451
00:23:45,039 --> 00:23:50,359
Speaker 1: this person broke up with me on WhatsApp right with

452
00:23:50,479 --> 00:23:55,079
Speaker 1: no conversation, no respect of a face to face conversation,

453
00:23:55,639 --> 00:23:59,079
Speaker 1: no warning, no indication, or maybe there were some indications

454
00:23:59,079 --> 00:24:01,999
Speaker 1: that this person missed, But the fact is this person

455
00:24:02,759 --> 00:24:07,079
Speaker 1: treated her with a complete lack of regard. And it's

456
00:24:07,079 --> 00:24:09,319
Speaker 1: funny when people treat us with a complete lack of regard.

457
00:24:09,519 --> 00:24:12,599
Speaker 1: Sometimes people say, oh, but I love this person, I

458
00:24:12,639 --> 00:24:14,999
Speaker 1: want to be with this person, And I want to

459
00:24:15,039 --> 00:24:18,039
Speaker 1: say to them, do you really want to be with

460
00:24:18,119 --> 00:24:20,079
Speaker 1: someone who would treat you like that? And so I

461
00:24:20,079 --> 00:24:23,359
Speaker 1: think the better use of her time and her emotional

462
00:24:23,359 --> 00:24:26,719
Speaker 1: real estate is to say, wait a minute, I need

463
00:24:26,719 --> 00:24:28,519
Speaker 1: to be clear on the kind of person I want

464
00:24:28,519 --> 00:24:30,119
Speaker 1: to be with. This is a wake up call for

465
00:24:30,239 --> 00:24:33,079
Speaker 1: me because clearly this is not the kind of person

466
00:24:33,239 --> 00:24:34,719
Speaker 1: that I want to be with. I don't want to

467
00:24:34,759 --> 00:24:37,719
Speaker 1: spend my time thinking about how I can get back

468
00:24:37,719 --> 00:24:39,559
Speaker 1: at him, because it's not going to help me in

469
00:24:39,599 --> 00:24:43,599
Speaker 1: any way. I want to think about helping myself move forward.

470
00:24:44,159 --> 00:24:46,279
Speaker 4: Lari and Guy, I think this is an interesting topic

471
00:24:46,959 --> 00:24:49,679
Speaker 4: that I'd love to pick your brains on. We've had

472
00:24:49,719 --> 00:24:56,479
Speaker 4: two examples now of relationships that started with a bit

473
00:24:56,519 --> 00:25:01,359
Speaker 4: of baggage or when things weren't necessarily transparent or clear

474
00:25:01,399 --> 00:25:04,159
Speaker 4: to some degree. So we had this scenario of dating

475
00:25:04,199 --> 00:25:07,599
Speaker 4: someone who has a long term girlfriend and being aware

476
00:25:07,719 --> 00:25:11,119
Speaker 4: or maybe we're still married or maybe not. But the

477
00:25:11,159 --> 00:25:16,519
Speaker 4: point I'm making is if a relationship starts with a

478
00:25:16,599 --> 00:25:20,879
Speaker 4: lack of transparency, what does studies and research show about

479
00:25:20,879 --> 00:25:23,759
Speaker 4: relationships like that and how they usually pan out? You know,

480
00:25:23,839 --> 00:25:26,519
Speaker 4: if you get honesty from someone three months in, or

481
00:25:26,799 --> 00:25:28,839
Speaker 4: you know about someone but you think they're going to

482
00:25:28,999 --> 00:25:31,999
Speaker 4: change and we're hoping that they're going to leave their partner,

483
00:25:32,319 --> 00:25:35,599
Speaker 4: how does that factor into our decision making when we

484
00:25:35,639 --> 00:25:38,239
Speaker 4: actually get into a relationship. Are we setting ourselves up

485
00:25:38,279 --> 00:25:38,679
Speaker 4: to fail?

486
00:25:38,799 --> 00:25:42,519
Speaker 3: So that's a really important question, And the way I

487
00:25:42,559 --> 00:25:47,199
Speaker 3: think about it is that relationship dynamics are like cement.

488
00:25:48,079 --> 00:25:50,999
Speaker 3: When the cement is wet at the beginning, you can

489
00:25:51,039 --> 00:25:54,959
Speaker 3: mold it, you can make changes, you can shift things around,

490
00:25:55,359 --> 00:25:59,559
Speaker 3: shape it. But the minute it hardens, it's very difficult

491
00:25:59,599 --> 00:26:00,879
Speaker 3: to mold. Now you have to take a hammer and

492
00:26:00,919 --> 00:26:05,079
Speaker 3: a chisel to it, and it hardens really quickly. There's

493
00:26:05,119 --> 00:26:08,799
Speaker 3: an unspoken contract we enter when we're starting to date

494
00:26:08,839 --> 00:26:12,439
Speaker 3: someone in which we're communicating nonverbally that if I'm not

495
00:26:12,759 --> 00:26:15,199
Speaker 3: calling you on something, it must be okay with me.

496
00:26:15,279 --> 00:26:18,639
Speaker 3: If I'm not bringing up something or trying to change something,

497
00:26:18,679 --> 00:26:21,919
Speaker 3: I'm agreeing to it tacitly. So we have to pay

498
00:26:21,999 --> 00:26:26,239
Speaker 3: incredible attention in the early stages, and I mean early

499
00:26:26,319 --> 00:26:32,039
Speaker 3: as in first ten fifteen dates, because everything you're accepting then,

500
00:26:32,079 --> 00:26:34,159
Speaker 3: and you're accepting it. If you're not voicing that you're not,

501
00:26:34,639 --> 00:26:37,879
Speaker 3: you are kind of signing on for in the long term.

502
00:26:37,999 --> 00:26:40,719
Speaker 3: So to say, oh, nowa'la address that later is a mistake.

503
00:26:40,759 --> 00:26:43,559
Speaker 3: The cement will be dry, it'll be much much harder.

504
00:26:43,759 --> 00:26:46,119
Speaker 3: You have to pay a lot of attention very early.

505
00:26:47,079 --> 00:26:49,119
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I also feel like at the very beginning

506
00:26:49,279 --> 00:26:52,279
Speaker 1: trust is being established. People think, well, I don't want

507
00:26:52,319 --> 00:26:55,359
Speaker 1: to tell my new partner about this thing because they

508
00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:57,399
Speaker 1: probably won't like it. So I'm going to wait until

509
00:26:57,479 --> 00:26:59,759
Speaker 1: they already are into.

510
00:26:59,519 --> 00:27:01,119
Speaker 5: Me, and then I'll reveal this.

511
00:27:01,559 --> 00:27:04,039
Speaker 1: And that is so dangerous because what happens is the

512
00:27:04,079 --> 00:27:06,999
Speaker 1: person is now into you, and now you're going to

513
00:27:07,039 --> 00:27:10,639
Speaker 1: tell them something that they were not act and then

514
00:27:10,719 --> 00:27:14,679
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, there is this damage done to

515
00:27:14,879 --> 00:27:18,159
Speaker 1: the trust. So you want to start building trust from

516
00:27:18,199 --> 00:27:21,799
Speaker 1: the very beginning. If the person is going to want

517
00:27:21,839 --> 00:27:24,879
Speaker 1: to be with you, you want to tell them those

518
00:27:24,879 --> 00:27:28,399
Speaker 1: things early on because they will appreciate that if it's

519
00:27:28,399 --> 00:27:30,159
Speaker 1: going to work out, it's going to work out. And

520
00:27:30,199 --> 00:27:31,919
Speaker 1: if it's not going to work out, it's not going

521
00:27:31,999 --> 00:27:33,879
Speaker 1: to be any better when you tell them three months

522
00:27:33,999 --> 00:27:35,879
Speaker 1: or three years down the line, it's actually going to

523
00:27:35,919 --> 00:27:36,519
Speaker 1: be far worse.

524
00:27:36,719 --> 00:27:37,519
Speaker 4: That's great advice.

525
00:27:37,679 --> 00:27:38,399
Speaker 5: So it sounds like.

526
00:27:38,359 --> 00:27:40,759
Speaker 1: This person yet kids, and he was very torn between

527
00:27:40,759 --> 00:27:42,479
Speaker 1: what was going on with the kids and whether he

528
00:27:42,519 --> 00:27:45,039
Speaker 1: can be in a relationship or get married again, and

529
00:27:45,119 --> 00:27:49,279
Speaker 1: he wasn't telling her about that, and then it comes

530
00:27:49,279 --> 00:27:51,039
Speaker 1: out and it seems like this thing out of the blue,

531
00:27:51,079 --> 00:27:52,439
Speaker 1: But for him, it might not have been out of

532
00:27:52,439 --> 00:27:53,879
Speaker 1: the blue at all. For him. He might have been

533
00:27:53,879 --> 00:27:57,759
Speaker 1: thinking about this from the very beginning. But he felt like, oh,

534
00:27:57,799 --> 00:27:59,679
Speaker 1: I'll just work it out myself in my head.

535
00:28:00,439 --> 00:28:00,959
Speaker 5: Not good.

536
00:28:02,399 --> 00:28:04,999
Speaker 3: I want to suggest this to our listeners. I'm going

537
00:28:04,999 --> 00:28:07,279
Speaker 3: to read the next letter, but I want you, when

538
00:28:07,279 --> 00:28:10,599
Speaker 3: i'm done, to pause and think of how you would

539
00:28:10,679 --> 00:28:13,039
Speaker 3: respond to it given what we just said, because it's

540
00:28:13,039 --> 00:28:15,559
Speaker 3: a similar scenario. So let's see what you got from

541
00:28:15,599 --> 00:28:17,439
Speaker 3: that and how you might apply it to the following.

542
00:28:17,479 --> 00:28:18,719
Speaker 3: I mean, you can cheat and just listen to what

543
00:28:18,759 --> 00:28:20,679
Speaker 3: we see, but I'm suggesting it might be fun to

544
00:28:20,799 --> 00:28:23,399
Speaker 3: maybe see what you would say to this letter. All right,

545
00:28:23,439 --> 00:28:26,119
Speaker 3: here it is. I've been dating my boyfriend for close

546
00:28:26,159 --> 00:28:29,159
Speaker 3: to three years, and the relationship is very healthy. We

547
00:28:29,199 --> 00:28:32,039
Speaker 3: have talked about marriage and are both divorced with children.

548
00:28:32,439 --> 00:28:35,559
Speaker 3: Last month, during a heated discussion, it came out that

549
00:28:35,599 --> 00:28:37,919
Speaker 3: he does not want to remarry, doesn't know if he

550
00:28:37,919 --> 00:28:40,679
Speaker 3: can live with someone else. He has been divorced thirteen years,

551
00:28:40,799 --> 00:28:44,359
Speaker 3: me three, and plans to buy a beach house by

552
00:28:44,479 --> 00:28:48,239
Speaker 3: himself and for himself in the near future. This was

553
00:28:48,319 --> 00:28:50,239
Speaker 3: news to me, as we have looked at rings and

554
00:28:50,319 --> 00:28:54,079
Speaker 3: talked about a future together often. My quandary is that

555
00:28:54,119 --> 00:28:56,919
Speaker 3: we are very happy together and he's a wonderful partner.

556
00:28:57,359 --> 00:28:59,879
Speaker 3: Do I hang in knowing the relationship may never lead

557
00:28:59,879 --> 00:29:02,599
Speaker 3: to marriage or walk away and pursue the unknown.

558
00:29:03,479 --> 00:29:05,159
Speaker 4: Thank you for sharing that. I'm sorry to hear that

559
00:29:05,399 --> 00:29:09,639
Speaker 4: it's never great when expectations change, especially as it's as

560
00:29:09,719 --> 00:29:12,639
Speaker 4: like to me that they were set or at least

561
00:29:12,639 --> 00:29:16,639
Speaker 4: spoken about openly for three years and then for someone

562
00:29:16,679 --> 00:29:19,999
Speaker 4: to change how they feel about something is definitely not

563
00:29:20,079 --> 00:29:22,239
Speaker 4: pleasant to be on the receiving end of, especially if

564
00:29:22,239 --> 00:29:25,319
Speaker 4: you're sure of it. For me, if you feel that

565
00:29:25,359 --> 00:29:28,359
Speaker 4: the relationship is good, and that's what I'm hearing, I

566
00:29:28,399 --> 00:29:31,399
Speaker 4: think it's really important to not have a heated but

567
00:29:31,559 --> 00:29:35,159
Speaker 4: have a cool discussion about why that person has changed

568
00:29:35,159 --> 00:29:37,119
Speaker 4: the way they feel. If you've looked at rings, if

569
00:29:37,159 --> 00:29:40,679
Speaker 4: you've talked about marriage, what's happened in that person's life

570
00:29:40,719 --> 00:29:43,799
Speaker 4: in their mind that they haven't shared with you. Because

571
00:29:43,799 --> 00:29:46,479
Speaker 4: if you say the relationship's healthy, then a sign of

572
00:29:46,519 --> 00:29:48,879
Speaker 4: a healthy relationship is that person being able to tell

573
00:29:48,919 --> 00:29:52,519
Speaker 4: you why their decision has changed, what they feel is

574
00:29:52,519 --> 00:29:55,559
Speaker 4: their new priority, and how they still feel about you.

575
00:29:55,879 --> 00:29:58,839
Speaker 4: The next step, based on their answer will be where

576
00:29:58,879 --> 00:30:02,079
Speaker 4: you can decide whether this is an investment in a

577
00:30:02,119 --> 00:30:05,199
Speaker 4: relationship that you still want to continue to do or

578
00:30:05,239 --> 00:30:07,439
Speaker 4: whether it's a relationship that you don't want to invest

579
00:30:07,479 --> 00:30:11,999
Speaker 4: in anymore because you're seeing that you have misaligned gold.

580
00:30:12,399 --> 00:30:14,199
Speaker 4: And the third and final thing you want a question

581
00:30:14,279 --> 00:30:16,919
Speaker 4: for yourself too, is what did marriage mean to you?

582
00:30:17,839 --> 00:30:21,559
Speaker 4: I think it's really important to define what marriage is,

583
00:30:21,759 --> 00:30:23,879
Speaker 4: what the role of a husband is, a wife is

584
00:30:23,959 --> 00:30:28,119
Speaker 4: a partner is, because I think often we also aren't

585
00:30:28,119 --> 00:30:31,239
Speaker 4: fully aware of why we want to get married, and

586
00:30:31,279 --> 00:30:33,839
Speaker 4: we've not really expressed that to the other person either.

587
00:30:33,919 --> 00:30:37,799
Speaker 4: So I think defining why marriage is important or why

588
00:30:37,879 --> 00:30:40,399
Speaker 4: living together is important, and what it means to you

589
00:30:40,839 --> 00:30:42,999
Speaker 4: will help you actually have the discussion. That will be

590
00:30:43,039 --> 00:30:44,599
Speaker 4: a very clarifying conversation.

591
00:30:45,399 --> 00:30:49,999
Speaker 1: Yeah, so often people want to react and just make

592
00:30:49,999 --> 00:30:51,959
Speaker 1: a decision. Well, if he's going to do this, then

593
00:30:52,039 --> 00:30:53,879
Speaker 1: there are two things that can happen. We can break

594
00:30:53,959 --> 00:30:57,439
Speaker 1: up or we can stay together and I'll be resentful, right,

595
00:30:57,639 --> 00:31:00,239
Speaker 1: And that's sort of how it's positioned. Whereas I love

596
00:31:00,239 --> 00:31:02,279
Speaker 1: your advice, which is very much how guy and I

597
00:31:02,319 --> 00:31:05,199
Speaker 1: think about things, which is what's the why under this?

598
00:31:05,279 --> 00:31:06,079
Speaker 1: What happened?

599
00:31:06,199 --> 00:31:06,399
Speaker 4: You know?

600
00:31:06,519 --> 00:31:09,039
Speaker 1: Sometimes we say we're in a healthy relationship, but we're

601
00:31:09,079 --> 00:31:12,639
Speaker 1: not that curious about our partner's inner life. We feel

602
00:31:12,679 --> 00:31:15,839
Speaker 1: so wounded, we feel so hurt that we don't make

603
00:31:15,879 --> 00:31:19,679
Speaker 1: the space to say, I wonder what's going on with him.

604
00:31:19,959 --> 00:31:22,759
Speaker 1: I want to understand him better, and I also want

605
00:31:22,839 --> 00:31:25,319
Speaker 1: him to understand my inner world, and so can we

606
00:31:25,399 --> 00:31:28,639
Speaker 1: have that kind of conversation? She says, he's going to

607
00:31:28,719 --> 00:31:33,599
Speaker 1: buy a beach house and live by himself, So what's

608
00:31:33,639 --> 00:31:35,799
Speaker 1: going on there with him? What does that mean? And

609
00:31:35,839 --> 00:31:38,839
Speaker 1: I can see how this conversation can go very badly

610
00:31:39,079 --> 00:31:40,519
Speaker 1: if she's angry and says, what.

611
00:31:40,479 --> 00:31:41,639
Speaker 5: Do you mean you're doing that?

612
00:31:41,719 --> 00:31:45,999
Speaker 1: Don't you love me? As opposed to I'm really confused

613
00:31:45,999 --> 00:31:49,479
Speaker 1: about this. We were ring shopping, but you're also saying,

614
00:31:49,519 --> 00:31:51,359
Speaker 1: now you don't want to get married and you want

615
00:31:51,359 --> 00:31:52,399
Speaker 1: to live by yourself.

616
00:31:53,159 --> 00:31:54,359
Speaker 5: Help me understand what's.

617
00:31:54,199 --> 00:31:56,759
Speaker 1: Going on with you, and that will help me to

618
00:31:56,839 --> 00:31:59,639
Speaker 1: make choices about my life too. But I don't think

619
00:31:59,679 --> 00:32:03,119
Speaker 1: she can make a good choice until she understands what

620
00:32:03,239 --> 00:32:05,559
Speaker 1: is going on with him, he understands what's going on

621
00:32:05,679 --> 00:32:08,559
Speaker 1: with her, and then they can both have this sort

622
00:32:08,599 --> 00:32:12,759
Speaker 1: of come to Jesus moment with themselves respectively, about what

623
00:32:12,799 --> 00:32:14,239
Speaker 1: do we want from each other.

624
00:32:14,679 --> 00:32:17,919
Speaker 3: I think you're both right on. And I think the

625
00:32:18,039 --> 00:32:21,359
Speaker 3: one concern I would have for this person is that

626
00:32:21,439 --> 00:32:23,999
Speaker 3: she seems to be a little bit reluctant to look

627
00:32:24,079 --> 00:32:26,199
Speaker 3: under the bed at the monsters. In other words, when

628
00:32:26,239 --> 00:32:29,279
Speaker 3: she's opening by saying, we have a really healthy relationship.

629
00:32:29,599 --> 00:32:31,839
Speaker 3: This and this and this happened, but we are really

630
00:32:31,839 --> 00:32:33,599
Speaker 3: happy together. He's a wonderful partner.

631
00:32:33,799 --> 00:32:34,399
Speaker 4: Hey, you're not.

632
00:32:34,519 --> 00:32:37,119
Speaker 3: Really happy together, because if he were, then he wouldn't

633
00:32:37,119 --> 00:32:38,959
Speaker 3: be planning to get a beach house without you or

634
00:32:38,959 --> 00:32:41,039
Speaker 3: telling me he doesn't want to get married, And same

635
00:32:41,119 --> 00:32:44,319
Speaker 3: goes to the health of the relationship. He's making unilateral

636
00:32:44,399 --> 00:32:48,159
Speaker 3: moves as he's making partnering moves with you. She's getting

637
00:32:48,159 --> 00:32:50,159
Speaker 3: a ring, but he's buying the beach house and telling

638
00:32:50,199 --> 00:32:52,399
Speaker 3: you that. So there's a little bit of denial there

639
00:32:52,439 --> 00:32:55,919
Speaker 3: about perhaps their issues here, and maybe she's not asking

640
00:32:55,959 --> 00:32:58,519
Speaker 3: because she doesn't want to find out, but she needs

641
00:32:58,519 --> 00:33:00,759
Speaker 3: to find out clearly at this point she needs to

642
00:33:00,759 --> 00:33:03,159
Speaker 3: really be brave and say, let's talk about how you

643
00:33:03,199 --> 00:33:04,319
Speaker 3: see things moving forward.

644
00:33:04,759 --> 00:33:06,959
Speaker 1: I think that those last two letters were very similar

645
00:33:06,999 --> 00:33:10,239
Speaker 1: in that way about the denial part.

646
00:33:09,999 --> 00:33:11,439
Speaker 5: What were you missing?

647
00:33:11,439 --> 00:33:13,079
Speaker 1: What were you not looking at? And we do that

648
00:33:13,119 --> 00:33:16,039
Speaker 1: to protect ourselves, but as we can see, it doesn't

649
00:33:16,079 --> 00:33:17,119
Speaker 1: really protect us.

650
00:33:17,559 --> 00:33:18,119
Speaker 5: Ultimately.

651
00:33:18,479 --> 00:33:20,839
Speaker 1: It's almost a form of self sabotage when you think

652
00:33:20,879 --> 00:33:25,119
Speaker 1: about it. And our next letter is directly about self sabotage,

653
00:33:25,159 --> 00:33:28,479
Speaker 1: and lots of people deal with these self sabotaging patterns

654
00:33:28,479 --> 00:33:30,319
Speaker 1: in relationships, and that's what this letter is about.

655
00:33:30,359 --> 00:33:30,879
Speaker 5: It goes like this.

656
00:33:32,199 --> 00:33:34,719
Speaker 1: Over the years, I have become pretty familiar and well

657
00:33:34,759 --> 00:33:37,119
Speaker 1: aware of my own relational patterns and picked up some

658
00:33:37,199 --> 00:33:39,399
Speaker 1: insight as to why I do the things that I do,

659
00:33:39,719 --> 00:33:41,919
Speaker 1: and most notably, the kinds of people I pursue when

660
00:33:41,919 --> 00:33:45,599
Speaker 1: it comes to relationships. Even so, I still find myself

661
00:33:45,639 --> 00:33:49,599
Speaker 1: falling into the same self sabotaging patterns. Most recently, I

662
00:33:49,639 --> 00:33:52,279
Speaker 1: am ashamed to say I found myself getting involved for

663
00:33:52,319 --> 00:33:54,279
Speaker 1: the second time with a man who is in a

664
00:33:54,279 --> 00:33:57,679
Speaker 1: committed relationship with another woman. This was a person I

665
00:33:57,719 --> 00:34:00,439
Speaker 1: had worked really hard to distance myself from and had

666
00:34:00,439 --> 00:34:02,919
Speaker 1: successfully been out of contact with for over a year.

667
00:34:03,679 --> 00:34:06,599
Speaker 1: I know how harmful my actions are for all parties involved,

668
00:34:06,719 --> 00:34:10,039
Speaker 1: but somehow I find myself creating creative ways to rationalize

669
00:34:10,039 --> 00:34:13,079
Speaker 1: my behavior. I often find myself wondering what it will

670
00:34:13,079 --> 00:34:15,559
Speaker 1: take for me to translate all of this insight I

671
00:34:15,559 --> 00:34:19,239
Speaker 1: have developed into actually doing something different. What needs to

672
00:34:19,279 --> 00:34:21,639
Speaker 1: happen to translate insight into action?

673
00:34:23,959 --> 00:34:26,319
Speaker 4: Yeah, it sounds like there's a lot of awareness here

674
00:34:26,599 --> 00:34:29,999
Speaker 4: of that mistake that you're getting involved in this situation

675
00:34:30,119 --> 00:34:33,199
Speaker 4: and repeating a pattern that you don't think is healthy

676
00:34:33,279 --> 00:34:36,999
Speaker 4: for you. The second step to turn that insight into action,

677
00:34:37,239 --> 00:34:40,479
Speaker 4: I would really write down and become aware when you're

678
00:34:40,519 --> 00:34:44,279
Speaker 4: at your lowest point in these scenarios, I would voiceenook

679
00:34:44,279 --> 00:34:48,359
Speaker 4: to yourself or record or write down how you feel.

680
00:34:48,439 --> 00:34:51,559
Speaker 4: Because what ends up happening is that our minds end

681
00:34:51,639 --> 00:34:54,759
Speaker 4: up forgetting all of these challenges and pains in the

682
00:34:54,759 --> 00:34:57,959
Speaker 4: pattern that comes with these bad mistakes that we make.

683
00:34:58,359 --> 00:35:01,719
Speaker 4: And so I think it's really important that you allow

684
00:35:01,799 --> 00:35:07,479
Speaker 4: yourself to truly face how complicated, confusing, and challenging the

685
00:35:07,599 --> 00:35:11,359
Speaker 4: situation is. When you you get involved with someone who's

686
00:35:11,399 --> 00:35:14,679
Speaker 4: already in a relationship and it sounds like you've experienced

687
00:35:14,679 --> 00:35:18,919
Speaker 4: that before, allow yourself to really process how challenging it

688
00:35:18,959 --> 00:35:21,279
Speaker 4: was in the past, how challenging it was now, because

689
00:35:21,319 --> 00:35:23,319
Speaker 4: that's going to be your first step in turning insight

690
00:35:23,359 --> 00:35:27,199
Speaker 4: into action. The second thing is look at who and

691
00:35:27,359 --> 00:35:30,559
Speaker 4: where you meet people, because you're going to find patterns

692
00:35:30,559 --> 00:35:32,759
Speaker 4: in that as well. It's not only patterns in the

693
00:35:32,759 --> 00:35:34,599
Speaker 4: people that you choose to be with, the patterns in

694
00:35:34,639 --> 00:35:37,279
Speaker 4: the way you come across people and find people. And

695
00:35:37,319 --> 00:35:40,239
Speaker 4: maybe there's even some parts of your circle or parts

696
00:35:40,239 --> 00:35:42,879
Speaker 4: of your habits that you need to change in order

697
00:35:42,999 --> 00:35:45,039
Speaker 4: to change this part of your life. It may be

698
00:35:45,159 --> 00:35:48,239
Speaker 4: where you socialize, who you socialize with, who you spend

699
00:35:48,279 --> 00:35:50,999
Speaker 4: time with. All of that is going to introduce you

700
00:35:51,359 --> 00:35:53,119
Speaker 4: to a new kind of human, a new kind of

701
00:35:53,119 --> 00:35:55,839
Speaker 4: person that actually may be healthier and better for you.

702
00:35:56,439 --> 00:35:58,679
Speaker 4: And the third and final thing is allow yourself to

703
00:35:58,679 --> 00:36:01,279
Speaker 4: set yourself a rule and a boundary that you stand

704
00:36:01,279 --> 00:36:04,559
Speaker 4: by of noticing the red flags when you start seeing

705
00:36:04,559 --> 00:36:06,999
Speaker 4: yourself go down that way. So when you start seeing

706
00:36:06,999 --> 00:36:09,039
Speaker 4: yourself go down that lane, have a list of three

707
00:36:09,079 --> 00:36:11,839
Speaker 4: red flags that you remember that you don't want to

708
00:36:11,879 --> 00:36:14,959
Speaker 4: take again. That's how you would start tending insight into action.

709
00:36:15,759 --> 00:36:18,199
Speaker 1: I always say that insight is the booby price of therapy.

710
00:36:18,599 --> 00:36:20,439
Speaker 1: That you can have all the insight in the world.

711
00:36:20,519 --> 00:36:22,319
Speaker 1: You can come to therapy every week and say, now

712
00:36:22,319 --> 00:36:24,639
Speaker 1: I understand my pattern. I go after these kinds of

713
00:36:24,639 --> 00:36:27,479
Speaker 1: people this is what I do. But if you don't

714
00:36:27,519 --> 00:36:30,879
Speaker 1: make changes, if you don't take action, the insight is useless.

715
00:36:30,879 --> 00:36:32,639
Speaker 1: And I think that what's great about this letter is

716
00:36:32,679 --> 00:36:35,559
Speaker 1: this person realizes it's not just my awareness, it's that

717
00:36:35,639 --> 00:36:38,159
Speaker 1: I need to do something different. And I love your

718
00:36:38,159 --> 00:36:42,479
Speaker 1: suggestions about something concrete that this person can do. So

719
00:36:42,479 --> 00:36:44,919
Speaker 1: when people come to therapy and they'll they'll say, you know,

720
00:36:44,999 --> 00:36:47,559
Speaker 1: now I understand why. It got into that argument again

721
00:36:47,639 --> 00:36:49,639
Speaker 1: with my partner and I'll say, well, did you do

722
00:36:49,719 --> 00:36:52,519
Speaker 1: something different? And they'll say, well, no, but I understand why.

723
00:36:52,639 --> 00:36:55,759
Speaker 1: But they get into that same argument every weekend. Why

724
00:36:55,799 --> 00:36:58,999
Speaker 1: are you not doing something different? What is keeping you

725
00:36:59,039 --> 00:37:01,199
Speaker 1: from doing so? How does it serve you? And I

726
00:37:01,199 --> 00:37:03,159
Speaker 1: think that what she needs to ask herself, which is

727
00:37:03,159 --> 00:37:05,639
Speaker 1: what I ask therapy patients all the time, is if

728
00:37:05,639 --> 00:37:07,559
Speaker 1: you're not taking action, how does it serve you not

729
00:37:07,599 --> 00:37:10,199
Speaker 1: to take action? And so, how's it serving you right

730
00:37:10,239 --> 00:37:14,039
Speaker 1: now to go after these things that are not satisfying

731
00:37:14,079 --> 00:37:16,559
Speaker 1: for you? Is it because you don't truly believe that

732
00:37:16,599 --> 00:37:19,679
Speaker 1: you can have something that would be more satisfying to you?

733
00:37:19,959 --> 00:37:21,559
Speaker 1: Is it because it feels safer to you? Is it

734
00:37:21,559 --> 00:37:23,639
Speaker 1: because it feels more comforting and familiar to you, even

735
00:37:23,639 --> 00:37:26,199
Speaker 1: though you're miserable in it. What is it about that?

736
00:37:26,559 --> 00:37:29,079
Speaker 1: And once you can figure out what that roadblock is,

737
00:37:29,159 --> 00:37:32,039
Speaker 1: you can start to do something differently. I really wish

738
00:37:32,079 --> 00:37:34,319
Speaker 1: this person luck, and I think they're almost there in

739
00:37:34,439 --> 00:37:37,639
Speaker 1: terms of saying I need to employ these strategies so

740
00:37:37,679 --> 00:37:39,639
Speaker 1: that I can do something differently.

741
00:37:43,879 --> 00:37:47,599
Speaker 3: You're listening to Deotherapists from iHeartRadio. We'll be back after

742
00:37:47,639 --> 00:37:48,279
Speaker 3: a quick break.

743
00:37:55,799 --> 00:37:59,359
Speaker 1: So guy, we have one final letter, and it goes

744
00:37:59,399 --> 00:38:02,359
Speaker 1: like this. I have not been able to see my

745
00:38:02,439 --> 00:38:04,999
Speaker 1: mom for nearly a year now because of the pandemic.

746
00:38:05,439 --> 00:38:07,999
Speaker 1: She's eight hours ahead in time zone, so it's tough

747
00:38:08,039 --> 00:38:10,279
Speaker 1: to talk to her a lot. She's asleep by the

748
00:38:10,279 --> 00:38:12,679
Speaker 1: time I have some free time. I call her as

749
00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:14,559
Speaker 1: much as I can, but I don't know how to

750
00:38:14,599 --> 00:38:17,359
Speaker 1: make sure she feels loved and cared for without seeing her.

751
00:38:17,799 --> 00:38:19,679
Speaker 1: I want her to know how much she means to me.

752
00:38:20,159 --> 00:38:21,959
Speaker 1: I also worry about her safety, etc.

753
00:38:23,119 --> 00:38:24,719
Speaker 3: I think you and I should tackle that one first.

754
00:38:24,799 --> 00:38:26,999
Speaker 3: Let's go first, and then we can give it to Jay.

755
00:38:27,479 --> 00:38:27,999
Speaker 5: Okay, great.

756
00:38:29,479 --> 00:38:33,519
Speaker 3: So there's so many people in this situation who have

757
00:38:33,679 --> 00:38:37,239
Speaker 3: not seen parents for a long, long time, and they're

758
00:38:37,319 --> 00:38:39,999
Speaker 3: worried about them, and they think about them, and they

759
00:38:39,999 --> 00:38:41,879
Speaker 3: talk on the phone and they keep up. But they

760
00:38:41,999 --> 00:38:43,959
Speaker 3: used to seeing their parents much more frequently, and so

761
00:38:44,039 --> 00:38:46,879
Speaker 3: I think it's so difficult. And the letter writer is

762
00:38:46,919 --> 00:38:50,039
Speaker 3: concerned that the mother doesn't know how much she means

763
00:38:50,119 --> 00:38:53,279
Speaker 3: to him and how much he thinks of her, and

764
00:38:53,359 --> 00:38:56,799
Speaker 3: I think that might be her concern, but it's his guilt,

765
00:38:57,119 --> 00:38:59,999
Speaker 3: it's his worry, and I think that's what's generating some

766
00:39:00,079 --> 00:39:02,199
Speaker 3: of this. So I think there needs to be a

767
00:39:02,199 --> 00:39:05,999
Speaker 3: way where he can remind both parties about how much

768
00:39:05,999 --> 00:39:07,799
Speaker 3: he thinks of her, how much he loves her.

769
00:39:08,439 --> 00:39:11,879
Speaker 1: Yeah, So not hearing in the letter is that the

770
00:39:11,999 --> 00:39:16,319
Speaker 1: mother is the person who is making the person feel guilty.

771
00:39:16,839 --> 00:39:18,799
Speaker 1: What I'm hearing is that this person just has so

772
00:39:19,039 --> 00:39:22,279
Speaker 1: much love for his mother. That's what came across to

773
00:39:22,319 --> 00:39:26,039
Speaker 1: me was how much love he has, and how sometimes

774
00:39:26,399 --> 00:39:28,679
Speaker 1: we love somebody so much, but often think of all

775
00:39:28,679 --> 00:39:31,519
Speaker 1: of our relationships, do we really show it? And are

776
00:39:31,559 --> 00:39:33,879
Speaker 1: we sure that we're really showing it? And what can

777
00:39:33,919 --> 00:39:36,679
Speaker 1: we be doing to make sure that we're getting that across?

778
00:39:36,759 --> 00:39:38,919
Speaker 1: And so I think this is really less a letter

779
00:39:39,199 --> 00:39:42,479
Speaker 1: about him not being a good son, because I think

780
00:39:42,479 --> 00:39:44,719
Speaker 1: he probably is a good son. I think it's more

781
00:39:44,799 --> 00:39:49,959
Speaker 1: about is he communicating how he feels to someone that

782
00:39:49,999 --> 00:39:53,799
Speaker 1: he cares so much about. And so we actually have

783
00:39:53,879 --> 00:39:55,679
Speaker 1: some advice for this person that we want him to

784
00:39:55,679 --> 00:39:57,759
Speaker 1: try because he is right here. This is actually a

785
00:39:57,839 --> 00:40:02,239
Speaker 1: letter from Jay Shetty to us. So, Jay, we want

786
00:40:02,279 --> 00:40:04,479
Speaker 1: to give you a little bit of advice to take

787
00:40:04,519 --> 00:40:07,679
Speaker 1: home with you as I need it, like, yeah, and

788
00:40:07,679 --> 00:40:09,799
Speaker 1: you're going to test it out like everybody does our show,

789
00:40:09,839 --> 00:40:11,879
Speaker 1: and then you'll let us know how it went. So, guy,

790
00:40:11,919 --> 00:40:14,599
Speaker 1: do you want to go ahead and give him some

791
00:40:14,639 --> 00:40:15,279
Speaker 1: of our thoughts?

792
00:40:15,439 --> 00:40:17,919
Speaker 3: Sure? So, we would like you, for the next week,

793
00:40:18,359 --> 00:40:22,799
Speaker 3: every time you think of your mom, whether it's fond, nurse, worry, love,

794
00:40:23,039 --> 00:40:26,359
Speaker 3: whatever it is, make a note in your phone. We

795
00:40:26,399 --> 00:40:27,919
Speaker 3: don't want you to text her in the moment, because

796
00:40:27,919 --> 00:40:29,279
Speaker 3: we don't know if she's one of those parents that

797
00:40:29,319 --> 00:40:31,199
Speaker 3: sleeps with the phone by her pillow. We don't want

798
00:40:31,199 --> 00:40:32,479
Speaker 3: you to wake her up in the middle of the night.

799
00:40:32,879 --> 00:40:35,199
Speaker 3: But we'd like you to make a list every time

800
00:40:35,199 --> 00:40:37,359
Speaker 3: you have that thought. It can be twice in the morning,

801
00:40:37,399 --> 00:40:39,799
Speaker 3: whatever it is, and just what the thought was and

802
00:40:39,799 --> 00:40:42,439
Speaker 3: what the feeling was, and then we would like you to,

803
00:40:42,599 --> 00:40:46,239
Speaker 3: at the end of the week send her a letter

804
00:40:46,599 --> 00:40:48,839
Speaker 3: or a text in which you say, Mama, I was

805
00:40:48,919 --> 00:40:51,679
Speaker 3: wondering how often I think about you? Can I miss

806
00:40:51,679 --> 00:40:54,439
Speaker 3: you during the week. So I decided to write it down,

807
00:40:54,719 --> 00:40:57,119
Speaker 3: and I'm sending you my diary of the week of

808
00:40:57,199 --> 00:40:59,959
Speaker 3: mom thoughts. I think would be a nice thing for

809
00:40:59,999 --> 00:41:02,399
Speaker 3: her to see how many of those there are.

810
00:41:03,599 --> 00:41:05,919
Speaker 4: I love that. That's such a great idea. I love that,

811
00:41:06,039 --> 00:41:06,719
Speaker 4: absolutely love that.

812
00:41:06,799 --> 00:41:08,439
Speaker 5: And we think the other purpose of this is that

813
00:41:09,439 --> 00:41:10,559
Speaker 5: we actually.

814
00:41:10,959 --> 00:41:14,479
Speaker 1: Believe that your mom knows how much you love her,

815
00:41:14,999 --> 00:41:18,319
Speaker 1: but that sometimes it's important for us to make sure

816
00:41:18,359 --> 00:41:21,439
Speaker 1: for our own peace of mind that we have communicated

817
00:41:21,479 --> 00:41:25,319
Speaker 1: that directly. And so this is just a gesture that

818
00:41:25,359 --> 00:41:26,799
Speaker 1: you can do. This wouldn't be something you would do

819
00:41:26,839 --> 00:41:30,639
Speaker 1: every week. It's just a one time thing to say, wow,

820
00:41:30,799 --> 00:41:33,679
Speaker 1: for you to notice whoa you know what? I really

821
00:41:33,759 --> 00:41:35,599
Speaker 1: I love her so much. I do think about her

822
00:41:35,639 --> 00:41:38,079
Speaker 1: a lot. And then also to be able to say,

823
00:41:38,079 --> 00:41:39,839
Speaker 1: and I want you to know, Mom, these are the

824
00:41:39,839 --> 00:41:40,999
Speaker 1: times that I thought about you.

825
00:41:41,639 --> 00:41:43,599
Speaker 5: And this happens all the time. This happens every week.

826
00:41:43,599 --> 00:41:44,799
Speaker 5: I'm just going to show you this week.

827
00:41:45,039 --> 00:41:46,679
Speaker 1: But this happens all the time, and I don't know

828
00:41:46,719 --> 00:41:48,519
Speaker 1: if I communicated that to you, I think she will

829
00:41:48,559 --> 00:41:51,959
Speaker 1: be so touched by that, and I think that for you,

830
00:41:52,079 --> 00:41:54,519
Speaker 1: it will reassure you that you don't need to be

831
00:41:54,639 --> 00:41:57,999
Speaker 1: thinking about the person every minute or calling them every minute.

832
00:41:58,479 --> 00:42:01,079
Speaker 1: It's the fact that there is this strong bond between

833
00:42:01,119 --> 00:42:02,919
Speaker 1: you and that Now I want to make sure I've

834
00:42:02,959 --> 00:42:05,519
Speaker 1: told her and now you've told her.

835
00:42:06,199 --> 00:42:08,359
Speaker 4: Yeah, I love that. Thank you both that. I'm definitely

836
00:42:08,359 --> 00:42:11,239
Speaker 4: going to try that out. Actually really love the sound

837
00:42:11,279 --> 00:42:14,359
Speaker 4: of that. I love how practical it is, and I

838
00:42:14,399 --> 00:42:17,559
Speaker 4: could definitely see why that's different to just saying I

839
00:42:17,639 --> 00:42:21,279
Speaker 4: love you, or you know, just sharing it, which I

840
00:42:21,319 --> 00:42:23,919
Speaker 4: do often. But I can totally see why this is

841
00:42:23,919 --> 00:42:25,719
Speaker 4: going to be a lot more meaningful. So thank you

842
00:42:25,759 --> 00:42:28,639
Speaker 4: so much. I love this idea and I can't wait

843
00:42:28,679 --> 00:42:31,079
Speaker 4: to try it out. Honestly, there's this phrase.

844
00:42:30,759 --> 00:42:33,239
Speaker 1: That we have in therapy of being kept in mind

845
00:42:33,479 --> 00:42:35,079
Speaker 1: that you know a lot of people go to therapy

846
00:42:35,119 --> 00:42:37,039
Speaker 1: and they wonder, does my therapist think about me during

847
00:42:37,039 --> 00:42:37,359
Speaker 1: the week?

848
00:42:37,359 --> 00:42:38,319
Speaker 5: Am I kept in mind?

849
00:42:38,639 --> 00:42:41,439
Speaker 1: People think about that with their romantic partners, or with

850
00:42:41,479 --> 00:42:44,359
Speaker 1: their close friends, or with their parents. Or with their children.

851
00:42:44,599 --> 00:42:46,799
Speaker 1: Am I kept in mind? So there's something just so

852
00:42:46,919 --> 00:42:50,519
Speaker 1: beautiful about communicating to your mom that she is kept

853
00:42:50,519 --> 00:42:50,959
Speaker 1: in mind.

854
00:42:52,519 --> 00:42:55,639
Speaker 3: And we would love for you to when you send

855
00:42:55,639 --> 00:42:58,079
Speaker 3: this to her, send us a voicemail let us know

856
00:42:58,119 --> 00:42:59,919
Speaker 3: how that went and how it made you feel while

857
00:42:59,919 --> 00:43:01,759
Speaker 3: you were doing it, and how she responded.

858
00:43:02,799 --> 00:43:05,279
Speaker 4: Ahsome my definitely will, Yeah, one hundred percent. I can't

859
00:43:05,279 --> 00:43:06,599
Speaker 4: wait to see how she responds.

860
00:43:07,039 --> 00:43:07,319
Speaker 5: Great.

861
00:43:07,359 --> 00:43:10,039
Speaker 1: Well, We thank you so much, thank for being our

862
00:43:10,079 --> 00:43:12,959
Speaker 1: guest today and helping answer all of these listener questions.

863
00:43:12,999 --> 00:43:15,159
Speaker 5: And I really want to encourage.

864
00:43:14,879 --> 00:43:17,479
Speaker 1: Everybody to check out Jay's book, Think Like a Monk,

865
00:43:17,599 --> 00:43:19,959
Speaker 1: because it has so much wisdom in it, so much

866
00:43:19,959 --> 00:43:23,959
Speaker 1: of which was interwoven into the answers that Jay gave

867
00:43:23,999 --> 00:43:26,519
Speaker 1: today and that even we as therapists give all the time.

868
00:43:26,839 --> 00:43:28,719
Speaker 4: You're both very kind that I want to thank you.

869
00:43:28,759 --> 00:43:31,839
Speaker 4: I love this format. I think it's such a great podcast.

870
00:43:32,159 --> 00:43:34,719
Speaker 4: I've enjoyed being with both of you, and I've read

871
00:43:34,759 --> 00:43:36,679
Speaker 4: both of your books too, so I can't stop saying

872
00:43:36,759 --> 00:43:39,839
Speaker 4: enough incredible things about both of them. But in regards

873
00:43:39,919 --> 00:43:42,999
Speaker 4: to what you were just sharing right now, I think

874
00:43:42,999 --> 00:43:47,999
Speaker 4: it's amazing that we're all able to collaborate together in

875
00:43:48,039 --> 00:43:50,679
Speaker 4: this way to serve and help other people. I took

876
00:43:50,799 --> 00:43:53,959
Speaker 4: so many notes while both of you were talking, so

877
00:43:54,199 --> 00:43:56,479
Speaker 4: I would encourage everyone to go back and take some

878
00:43:56,599 --> 00:43:59,639
Speaker 4: notes to and listen to it, because, as Laurie was

879
00:43:59,639 --> 00:44:02,879
Speaker 4: pointing out, you know, insight into action is such an

880
00:44:03,079 --> 00:44:05,879
Speaker 4: important part and taking notes is a part of that.

881
00:44:05,919 --> 00:44:08,359
Speaker 4: Like the insight needs to really go deep for us

882
00:44:08,359 --> 00:44:10,399
Speaker 4: to take an action on it. And so for me,

883
00:44:10,479 --> 00:44:13,079
Speaker 4: I was taking notes while Guy and Laurie were speaking,

884
00:44:13,119 --> 00:44:16,359
Speaker 4: and I found it extremely beneficial even in my perspectives.

885
00:44:16,399 --> 00:44:18,999
Speaker 4: And you saw me asking questions, and so I hope

886
00:44:18,999 --> 00:44:21,839
Speaker 4: you feel encouraged to ask questions as well and continue

887
00:44:21,879 --> 00:44:25,639
Speaker 4: learning from both these incredible powerhouses of insight and information.

888
00:44:25,799 --> 00:44:27,999
Speaker 4: So thank you Guy, and thank you Laurie for having me.

889
00:44:28,039 --> 00:44:28,679
Speaker 4: This is wonderful.

890
00:44:28,759 --> 00:44:30,439
Speaker 1: Well, thank you so much, Jay, and we look forward

891
00:44:30,519 --> 00:44:31,879
Speaker 1: to hearing how the advice went for you.

892
00:44:39,279 --> 00:44:40,719
Speaker 5: So Guy, we heard back from Jay.

893
00:44:40,959 --> 00:44:44,119
Speaker 1: It's interesting because he was both the advice giver and

894
00:44:44,159 --> 00:44:46,199
Speaker 1: the advice seeker in this episode.

895
00:44:46,599 --> 00:44:49,279
Speaker 4: Hey Laurie, Hey Guy, it's so great to talk to

896
00:44:49,279 --> 00:44:52,239
Speaker 4: you again. I hope you're well. And hello to all

897
00:44:52,319 --> 00:44:55,919
Speaker 4: the listeners of the Dear Therapist podcast. This is Jay Shetty.

898
00:44:56,359 --> 00:44:59,879
Speaker 4: I'm so glad I tried out the advice of keeping

899
00:44:59,919 --> 00:45:02,439
Speaker 4: the journal every time I think about my mom, whether

900
00:45:02,479 --> 00:45:05,239
Speaker 4: it's something big or small, and then sending it to

901
00:45:05,319 --> 00:45:08,279
Speaker 4: her because it was so fun to see our reaction,

902
00:45:08,559 --> 00:45:10,799
Speaker 4: to see all the little times I think about it,

903
00:45:10,839 --> 00:45:15,439
Speaker 4: whether I'm outside and I see a divali decoration. It's

904
00:45:15,479 --> 00:45:19,359
Speaker 4: been a holiday time for us at the moment, and

905
00:45:19,399 --> 00:45:21,999
Speaker 4: that made me remember my mom and the suits that

906
00:45:22,039 --> 00:45:24,839
Speaker 4: she would make at home, and the different festivities and

907
00:45:24,879 --> 00:45:27,199
Speaker 4: the rituals that we would do. And of course it's

908
00:45:27,239 --> 00:45:29,359
Speaker 4: coming up close to Christmas time, so I've been thinking

909
00:45:29,359 --> 00:45:31,639
Speaker 4: a lot about the advent calendar should get me as

910
00:45:31,679 --> 00:45:34,039
Speaker 4: a kid as I walk around, so being able to

911
00:45:34,079 --> 00:45:36,679
Speaker 4: just write down those small moments, even though those aren't

912
00:45:36,679 --> 00:45:38,959
Speaker 4: moments in which i'd call my mom about that one thing,

913
00:45:39,599 --> 00:45:43,159
Speaker 4: It's been really wonderful to see how that went and

914
00:45:43,199 --> 00:45:45,279
Speaker 4: how she experienced it. She was so happy to see

915
00:45:45,279 --> 00:45:47,039
Speaker 4: that I remember so much, And I think that was

916
00:45:47,079 --> 00:45:49,799
Speaker 4: the key thing about this activity, that what it did

917
00:45:49,919 --> 00:45:54,919
Speaker 4: is that it prompted very natural, organic memories, and sharing

918
00:45:54,999 --> 00:45:58,079
Speaker 4: memories with someone who loves us is a beautiful way

919
00:45:58,119 --> 00:45:59,839
Speaker 4: of telling them we love them and how much we

920
00:45:59,959 --> 00:46:03,399
Speaker 4: value them, because it shows we remember something special they

921
00:46:03,439 --> 00:46:06,039
Speaker 4: did for us, so it acts as a way of

922
00:46:06,039 --> 00:46:09,599
Speaker 4: creating gratitude. So thank you bouth again. Really glad I

923
00:46:09,599 --> 00:46:12,239
Speaker 4: got to do this. Hope this helps everyone who's listening by.

924
00:46:13,279 --> 00:46:15,839
Speaker 3: So we get the response from Jay, who himself gives

925
00:46:15,839 --> 00:46:17,959
Speaker 3: so much advice, and then he tells us what happened,

926
00:46:18,319 --> 00:46:20,599
Speaker 3: and he tells us how he felt about it, and

927
00:46:20,639 --> 00:46:22,759
Speaker 3: then he analyzes it. So I guess we're done. We

928
00:46:22,799 --> 00:46:24,199
Speaker 3: don't have to do much here. He did it all

929
00:46:24,239 --> 00:46:24,559
Speaker 3: for us.

930
00:46:24,679 --> 00:46:26,319
Speaker 5: Yeah, we kind of are done. But I want to.

931
00:46:26,319 --> 00:46:28,319
Speaker 1: Add one thing to it, which is that I think

932
00:46:28,359 --> 00:46:31,959
Speaker 1: sometimes we don't realize how important we are to other

933
00:46:31,999 --> 00:46:36,519
Speaker 1: people and how important other people are to us. And

934
00:46:36,559 --> 00:46:39,519
Speaker 1: I think what was beautiful about what he did and

935
00:46:39,559 --> 00:46:44,759
Speaker 1: he really embraced the assignment was he noticed how much

936
00:46:44,799 --> 00:46:49,039
Speaker 1: his mother comes into his mind in really positive ways.

937
00:46:49,719 --> 00:46:52,439
Speaker 1: And I think sometimes we don't take the time to notice.

938
00:46:52,439 --> 00:46:55,439
Speaker 1: And I think the assignment forced him to slow down

939
00:46:55,439 --> 00:46:57,679
Speaker 1: a little bit and to notice those moments and then

940
00:46:57,719 --> 00:47:00,759
Speaker 1: to be able to share those moments people feel like, well,

941
00:47:00,759 --> 00:47:02,559
Speaker 1: I have to call my mom or I have to

942
00:47:02,559 --> 00:47:04,999
Speaker 1: call my dad and it's such as stressor because it

943
00:47:04,999 --> 00:47:10,959
Speaker 1: doesn't feel organic. But when you notice the organic ways

944
00:47:11,519 --> 00:47:14,079
Speaker 1: in which they're meaningful to you, and then you can

945
00:47:14,079 --> 00:47:16,359
Speaker 1: share that with them, I think it's a very different

946
00:47:16,439 --> 00:47:19,359
Speaker 1: kind of interaction. And I hope that our listeners can

947
00:47:19,359 --> 00:47:21,079
Speaker 1: incorporate this into their own lives.

948
00:47:21,279 --> 00:47:23,799
Speaker 3: And I have to say, in this upcoming holiday season

949
00:47:23,959 --> 00:47:28,239
Speaker 3: and in general, this is a great gift to give

950
00:47:28,519 --> 00:47:30,999
Speaker 3: someone that you care about to just keep that journal

951
00:47:31,039 --> 00:47:33,679
Speaker 3: and the gift is, here's how often and in what

952
00:47:33,719 --> 00:47:35,759
Speaker 3: ways I think about you that you don't know about.

953
00:47:36,199 --> 00:47:38,479
Speaker 3: I just think it's something that could be used very broadly.

954
00:47:39,079 --> 00:47:42,039
Speaker 1: It's a gift that keeps on giving because it's not

955
00:47:42,119 --> 00:47:43,719
Speaker 1: just how the person feels in the moment when they

956
00:47:43,759 --> 00:47:45,679
Speaker 1: receive it, but that's going to stay with them for

957
00:47:45,719 --> 00:47:46,359
Speaker 1: a long time.

958
00:47:51,479 --> 00:47:54,759
Speaker 3: Hey, fellow travelers, if you've used any of our advice

959
00:47:54,799 --> 00:47:57,199
Speaker 3: from the podcast in your own life, send us a

960
00:47:57,279 --> 00:48:00,879
Speaker 3: quick voice memo to Lori and Guy at iHeartMedia dot

961
00:48:00,879 --> 00:48:03,119
Speaker 3: com and tell us about it. We may include it

962
00:48:03,119 --> 00:48:06,239
Speaker 3: in a future show. Thank you so much for listening.

963
00:48:06,879 --> 00:48:09,439
Speaker 3: If you're enjoying the show, please take a moment to

964
00:48:09,519 --> 00:48:10,399
Speaker 3: rate and review it.

965
00:48:11,039 --> 00:48:14,439
Speaker 1: You can follow us both online. I'm at Lorigottlieb dot

966
00:48:14,479 --> 00:48:17,479
Speaker 1: com and you can follow me on Twitter at Lorigottlieb

967
00:48:17,479 --> 00:48:21,879
Speaker 1: one or on Instagram at Lorigottlieb Underscore Author.

968
00:48:21,719 --> 00:48:24,959
Speaker 3: And I'm at Guywinch dot com. I'm on Twitter and

969
00:48:25,039 --> 00:48:28,759
Speaker 3: on Instagram at Guywinch. If you have a dilemma you'd

970
00:48:28,839 --> 00:48:31,639
Speaker 3: like to discuss with us, big or small, email us

971
00:48:31,719 --> 00:48:34,599
Speaker 3: at Lorianguy at iHeartMedia dot com.

972
00:48:34,919 --> 00:48:39,199
Speaker 1: Our executive producers Christopher Hasiotis were produced and edited by

973
00:48:39,199 --> 00:48:43,199
Speaker 1: Mike Johns. Special thanks to Samuel Benefield and to our

974
00:48:43,239 --> 00:48:47,999
Speaker 1: podcast Fairygodmother Katie Couric and Next Week. A woman tries

975
00:48:48,039 --> 00:48:50,919
Speaker 1: to forge a relationship with the younger brother she wasn't

976
00:48:50,999 --> 00:48:53,039
Speaker 1: very nice to when they were children.

977
00:48:53,159 --> 00:48:58,039
Speaker 6: It's very emotional to say that, yes, I was awful

978
00:48:58,199 --> 00:49:02,359
Speaker 6: to have said that I wish you weren't born, you know,

979
00:49:02,479 --> 00:49:05,199
Speaker 6: to a little kid like that, and I have said

980
00:49:05,359 --> 00:49:06,479
Speaker 6: that I'm sorry.

981
00:49:07,079 --> 00:49:10,319
Speaker 1: Dear Therapist is a production of iHeartRadio