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Speaker 1: Joining us now is Dave Smith.

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Speaker 3: He's hot off of a major debate Royal the Internet,

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Speaker 3: host of the Part of the Problem podcast, and more importantly,

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Speaker 3: good friend.

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Speaker 1: It's good to see you, Dave. Thanks for joining us.

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Speaker 4: Man, good to see you too, Man. You thank you

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Speaker 4: both for having me back.

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Speaker 1: On absolutely there.

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Speaker 3: I mean, Dave, look, we're preaching to each other, but

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Speaker 3: it's still satisfying, and we need to sit here and

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Speaker 3: revel a little bit and some of the fallout from

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Speaker 3: your Douglas Murray debate. I mean, I think there are

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Speaker 3: many parts of it, the unquote expert concern trolling from Douglas.

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Speaker 3: There was the general pomposity, But I mean what really

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Speaker 3: struck a nerve and what the pro Israel folks really

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Speaker 3: hung onto in how you allegedly were destroyed was you've

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Speaker 3: never been to Israel.

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Speaker 1: A very lived experience argument.

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Speaker 3: And so Will wanted you to respond to a clip

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Speaker 3: that I know you've surfaced and have seen of Douglas

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Speaker 3: Murray talking about lived experience to you, but then previously

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Speaker 3: shouting down the idea of lived experience as legitimate.

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Speaker 1: Let's take a listen. We're going to get a reaction.

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Speaker 5: Have you been to the crossing Points? I really resent

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Speaker 5: that form of argumentation. When were you last there at all?

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Speaker 6: Sure?

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Speaker 5: I really resent it. You should at least do the

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Speaker 5: courtesy of visiting it. This is not an attractive invitation.

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Speaker 5: I think it's a good idea to see stuff, particularly

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Speaker 5: if you spend a career talking about something. I have

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Speaker 5: the right to talk about whatever the hell I want

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Speaker 5: and no one's going to stop me or try to

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Speaker 5: intimidate me. And I think that if I said to

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Speaker 5: somebody else the other way around, it would be equally reprehensible.

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Speaker 5: I have a journalistic rule of trying never to talk

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Speaker 5: about a country, even in passing un as I've.

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Speaker 6: At least been there.

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Speaker 5: If I said, shut up, you have no right to

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Speaker 5: criticize anything that Douglas Murray says, because hang on, you're

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Speaker 5: talking about crossing points and not only have you never

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Speaker 5: been to a crossing point in either Egypt or in Israel,

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Speaker 5: but you never even been to the region. Okay, it's

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Speaker 5: not an exact comparison, but seriously, is that a reasonable

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Speaker 5: form of argument. No, in that case, nobody can talk

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Speaker 5: about anything. We might as well pack up, go home

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Speaker 5: and isolate ourselves. If you're insisting that you're an expert

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Speaker 5: of some kind, or not claiming you're an expert but

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Speaker 5: still talking about it, if you've never seen any of

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Speaker 5: this going on. I mean, there are some people who've

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Speaker 5: written about them. I mean, there are people whove written

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Speaker 5: about the Holocausts who didn't experience the Holocaust and have

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Speaker 5: written about it better than people who did. But that

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Speaker 5: is a different matter from spending an awfully long amount

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Speaker 5: of time talking about an issue in a region you

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Speaker 5: haven't even had the courtesy to visit. Whilst developing all

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Speaker 5: of these views about it. This idea that the lived

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Speaker 5: experience has to triumph over everything else is not always correct.

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Speaker 5: Should at least know what it is, what the territory is,

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Speaker 5: what the situation.

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Speaker 6: Is in the regions.

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Speaker 5: There's an irony to this, but let's skate over the irony.

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Speaker 1: Dave.

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Speaker 3: I'm sorry to subject to you to that again, but

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Speaker 3: you got to I mean, what's it like, you know,

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Speaker 3: on the other side of nearly three hours of this

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Speaker 3: and now seeing some of this past lived experience argumentation

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Speaker 3: from him.

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Speaker 4: Well, I wish that guy was there at the debate.

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Speaker 4: He did a better job than I did. It's funny.

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Speaker 4: So once I saw this, you know, it's because I

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Speaker 4: brought up my first thing was like, you've never been

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Speaker 4: in Nazi Germany, but you can still have an opinion

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Speaker 4: about that. And then I was like, oh, he made

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Speaker 4: the same point. He made it better than me. Yeah,

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Speaker 4: you know, like, yeah, exactly a lot of people have

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Speaker 4: written about it and explained it better than people who

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Speaker 4: actually lived through it. I mean, look, it's the the

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Speaker 4: expert thing and the have you ever been to the region,

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Speaker 4: Like as I said on the show, I go these

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Speaker 4: are just non arguments like Objectively speaking, you don't win

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Speaker 4: points in a debate for saying this, Like if you

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Speaker 4: if you were to take the most generous interpretation of

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Speaker 4: his point there and which you know, and it's not

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Speaker 4: just the obvious logical fallacy that it is like an

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Speaker 4: appeal to authority, but if you were to take the

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Speaker 4: most generous interpretation would be like, Okay, it's important to

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Speaker 4: know what you're talking about, and you can gain insights

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Speaker 4: into something by traveling there and seeing it firsthand. Now

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Speaker 4: I wouldn't disagree with either of those claims, but the

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Speaker 4: point is that then you got to demonstrate that, like, Okay,

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Speaker 4: if you have a level of expertise that I don't have,

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Speaker 4: and you have insights because you've been there that I

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Speaker 4: don't have, then okay, let's have the debate and that

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Speaker 4: should show you know I said the other day it

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Speaker 4: was kind of like it was almost like if you're

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Speaker 4: like a fighter, like you're a UFC fighter or something,

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Speaker 4: and so you agree to fight someone else and you're

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Speaker 4: like at Madison Square Garden the fight. You know, you

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Speaker 4: get introduced, you're about to fight, and like I put

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Speaker 4: up my hands like okay, let's fight, and then the

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Speaker 4: other guy puts his hands down and goes, I'm such

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Speaker 4: a better fighter than you. I'm just so much better

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Speaker 4: at fighting, you know, yeah, fight, so come show me,

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Speaker 4: you know, and then the rate, it's just all these

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Speaker 4: like Look, it became clear when I was there that

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Speaker 4: Douglas Murray came to do anything but debate me, you know,

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Speaker 4: Like in my mind I was like, Oh, we're going

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Speaker 4: to debate Ukraine and Israel. And then it was like, oh,

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Speaker 4: that's the opposite. And you know, I did resent, you know,

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Speaker 4: because on the whole topic of like being an expert,

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Speaker 4: I do think it's important, and I think it's lost

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Speaker 4: on someone like the casual viewers, because people will think

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Speaker 4: they'll be like, yeah, Dave's an expert on this, and

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Speaker 4: I'm not. And I was quite comfortable saying that there,

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Speaker 4: like I'm not. I'm a commentator. I'm a stand up comedian,

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Speaker 4: you know. But again, Douglas, as you could see in

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Speaker 4: that clip, he doesn't really believe any of the things

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Speaker 4: he's saying. That's right, He's Look, if you really had

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Speaker 4: a pro like commentators who aren't experts permeate the media

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Speaker 4: and not just like the new media, like the old

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Speaker 4: legacy media, but do you think Chris Matthews is an

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Speaker 4: expert on Israel Palestine?

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Speaker 6: You know?

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Speaker 4: Does does Does Douglas Murray have a problem with Bill

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Speaker 4: Maher having a show? Does he have a problem with

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Speaker 4: Dave Rubin having a show. By the way, I'll put

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Speaker 4: my expertise up against those guys any day. And so

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Speaker 4: it's like, you don't really mean this, you don't really

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Speaker 4: have an issue. He didn't have an issue with Coleman

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Speaker 4: Hughes going on Rogan Show and talking about Israel.

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Speaker 6: He's not an expert and he got everything wrong when

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Speaker 6: he was on there.

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Speaker 4: His issue is that there's people who disagree with Israel

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Speaker 4: coming on. His issue isn't with the level of experts

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Speaker 4: any of these people.

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Speaker 2: And I think it's actually quite revealing in my opinion.

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Speaker 7: Two things I want to say.

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Speaker 2: Number One, what I find so troubling about that line

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Speaker 2: of argumentation is I'm a US taxpayer, We're all US taxpayers.

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Speaker 2: Our money is going to fund this would consider genocidal

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Speaker 2: onslaught in Gaza. I don't get to have an opinion

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Speaker 2: because I haven't been to the crossings.

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Speaker 7: Like get out of.

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Speaker 2: Here with that, Like be for real about what you're

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Speaker 2: actually suggesting here, and it's actually very common tactic. You

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Speaker 2: hear it from a lot of like you people who

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Speaker 2: are describing themselves as like liberal Zionists. Well, it's complicated.

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Speaker 2: You just don't understand, and it's a way to completely

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Speaker 2: shut people down from engaging with this debate at all

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Speaker 2: because they feel like, oh, if I don't have a

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Speaker 2: PhD in all every in and out of this history,

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Speaker 2: which you don't know much more about, and you have

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Speaker 2: the mind to hold all those facts in your heads

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Speaker 2: much more so than I do. But you feel like,

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Speaker 2: if I don't know every single fact that has ever

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Speaker 2: happened in what bb Netna who said in nineteen ninety three,

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Speaker 2: in this speech or whatever, then I don't get to

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Speaker 2: have an opinion wrong, wrong, This is a democracy. I

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Speaker 2: get to have an opinion about my money going to

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Speaker 2: drop these bombs on children and women and aid workers

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Speaker 2: and hospitals and mosques and level this whole place and

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Speaker 2: set up a situation where now Trump is like, we're

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Speaker 2: going to take get over.

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Speaker 7: So that's number one. Number two.

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Speaker 2: I think it's actually very revealing that in your language,

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Speaker 2: he came here wanting to avoid a debate with you,

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Speaker 2: because there is no debate at this point.

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Speaker 7: There is no debate.

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Speaker 2: Look at the way that I mean, the public who

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Speaker 2: is consuming this through a very biased media media outlets

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Speaker 2: with you know, very slanted coverage, how much they have

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Speaker 2: turned on Israel, how much their sympathies have changed.

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Speaker 7: The only group that still has a.

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Speaker 2: Majority support of more sympathy for Israel or Palestine is

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Speaker 2: like basically older Republicans. Every other demographic group has shifted.

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Speaker 2: So I think to me, the hollowness and the resorting

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Speaker 2: to effectively rhetorical tricks to try to come out on top,

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Speaker 2: to me, it's just emblematic of the fact that if

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Speaker 2: you're out there arguing like, oh, Israel isn't blocking eight

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Speaker 2: at this point, I mean, you're just that's a ridiculous

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Speaker 2: that's a ridiculous stance to try to claim. So instead

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Speaker 2: you have to go to like, oh, well, you haven't

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Speaker 2: even been to the crossings and personally inspected all the

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Speaker 2: goods that are coming in get out of here.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, well that was yeah, I completely agree, And that

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Speaker 4: was one of the things that was infuriating about it,

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Speaker 4: because he makes this this accusation to me that I

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Speaker 4: claim to be an expert, but then I have kind

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Speaker 4: of like this like get out of jail free card

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Speaker 4: while I go, oh, I'm just a comedian or whatever,

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Speaker 4: And that's just both of those are not true. Like

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Speaker 4: I never do either of those. I never claimed to

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Speaker 4: be an expert. And you guys, I mean, you guys

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Speaker 4: have seen all my stuff, but you guys have seen

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Speaker 4: enough of my content. Has there ever been a time

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Speaker 4: once where like I made a point and then someone

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Speaker 4: countered the point and I went, well, I'm just a comedian,

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Speaker 4: so I do that.

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Speaker 3: I actually know the debate that you did for over

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Speaker 3: two hours, you didn't do that once.

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Speaker 1: I can literally attest to that personally.

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Speaker 6: And I smoked Dennis Prager in that.

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Speaker 1: Debate at least, but you definitely did.

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Speaker 4: I mean, at least he came to debate though, you know,

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Speaker 4: like at least we actually debated the issues. So the

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Speaker 4: thing that was so infuriing is like Douglas Murray is

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Speaker 4: accused me of using this get at like this escape patch.

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Speaker 4: You know, oh, I'm just a comedian. But then he

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Speaker 4: was the only one who did that through every single point,

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Speaker 4: like every time it came to, oh, we're actually talking

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Speaker 4: about the issue. If like the most pedantic semantic if

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Speaker 4: I went, we've been at war for twenty There was

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Speaker 4: one point where he literally goes, I said, we've been

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Speaker 4: at war, you know, for the last twenty five years,

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Speaker 4: and he goes, you have not been at war and

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Speaker 4: I went, I went, oh, because it's not a war here.

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Speaker 4: I go, yeah, we're picking on third world country. But

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Speaker 4: and then he goes into he said, well, in Afghanistan,

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Speaker 4: you were there to take out al Qaeda, and I

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Speaker 4: was like, yeah, maybe that sums up the war through

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Speaker 4: the end of two thousand and one, but after that

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Speaker 4: it was a twenty year regime changed war against the Taliban.

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Speaker 4: And then his next line is that's because you got

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Speaker 4: sucked into war. And it's like, wait, so I we

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Speaker 4: just did this whole thing just to come back to

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Speaker 4: you saying the same thing that you had. And I

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Speaker 4: mean it would be like I'd say, okay. So when

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Speaker 4: we were talking about Ukraine, at one point, I go,

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Speaker 4: I go, well, look, Joe Biden's CIA director wrote the

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Speaker 4: net means net memo. He was the CIA director for

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Speaker 4: all four years of Joe Biden's administration, and he's the

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Speaker 4: one who told you that this is what caused the war.

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Speaker 4: Like he and then I said, the head of NATO

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Speaker 4: said the same thing that he sent a draft treaty.

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Speaker 4: And then his response to that is the warf wasn't

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Speaker 4: about Ukrainian entry to NATO. And you're like, I'm just

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Speaker 4: objectively speaking, like I look, maybe there's a counter to

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Speaker 4: my point there, but he didn't offer it.

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Speaker 6: He just asserted it wasn't.

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Speaker 4: And then when I make the point about you know,

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Speaker 4: when we were talking about the warren Libya, he goes, well,

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Speaker 4: that was a humanitarian intervention. They thought he was going

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Speaker 4: to go genocidal, And I was like, well, that's kind

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Speaker 4: of interesting because didn't. For Star General Wesley Clark claimed

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Speaker 4: that he had already seen the plans ten years earlier,

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Speaker 4: when no one was claiming it was about to go genocidal.

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Speaker 4: Now maybe there's a counter to that, maybe there's an

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Speaker 4: answer to like you know, well, yes he did say that,

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Speaker 4: but those plans were scrapped and then it really was

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Speaker 4: a humanitarian Like maybe there's a count, but he just goes,

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Speaker 4: you can't say the name Wolfowitz or people might hate

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Speaker 4: out with Jews, Like what what is it so to

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Speaker 4: accuse me of like hiding behind being a comedian When

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Speaker 4: you're unwilling to debate any of the topics. And and

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Speaker 4: by the way, for the record, which I probably should

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Speaker 4: have said at the time, but you know, I would

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Speaker 4: argue that, you know, if he's gonna say that, like

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Speaker 4: me pointing out that Paul Wolfwood's had these war plans,

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Speaker 4: is going to lead to anti Semitism, I would say

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Speaker 4: that saying you're not allowed to say that is going

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Speaker 4: to lead to a lot more anti semitism, like to

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Speaker 4: say that, like you're not allowed to criticize Jewish people,

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Speaker 4: like I don't know if you've ever listened to any

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Speaker 4: other people who don't like Jews very much, but that's

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Speaker 4: a huge part of their beef.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, and like they.

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Speaker 4: Kind of have a point on that front. I don't

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Speaker 4: think they're correct to like hate Jews, but they got

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Speaker 4: a good point on that, Like it shouldn't be nobody

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Speaker 4: who has that type of power should ever be absolved

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Speaker 4: from criticism.

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Speaker 6: It's just it's absurd.

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Speaker 3: You're exactly right, Yeah, his idea is it was something

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Speaker 3: I've never even heard this level of argumentation, which was

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Speaker 3: that Wolfowitz was like some low level bureaucrat. It's like, dude,

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Speaker 3: read a fucking book, like September twelfth, two thousand and one,

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Speaker 3: he's at the table with George W.

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Speaker 1: Bush. He's the first guy to mention Iraq this is

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Speaker 1: this is a fact. But whatever. I don't even need

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Speaker 1: to get more into that.

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Speaker 3: You know, it is important though for us to see

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Speaker 3: where Douglas still has a lot of friends in power.

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Speaker 3: Let's go and put this one up there on the screen,

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Speaker 3: Donald Trump, literally the day after your debate truth doubt.

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Speaker 1: Let's can we put that up there please?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, my friend Douglas Murray just released a new book,

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Speaker 3: My Friend, on Democracies and death cults. It's quickly becoming

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Speaker 3: a best seller based on his first hand reporting quote reporting.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we could call it that.

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Speaker 3: Documents the barbarity of Hamas's brutal attack on Israel in

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Speaker 3: October seventh and Israel's heroic response. So I mean, Dave,

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Speaker 3: I mean, this is something you know, you've delved on

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Speaker 3: a little bit in the past. But you know, some

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Speaker 3: of your past discussion just with the Trump administration and

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Speaker 3: their current posture on Israel. And we'll get to the

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Speaker 3: deportations in a little bit, But what was it like

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Speaker 3: to see Trump, you know, just put this book out

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Speaker 3: like that with. Obviously, you know, it's not his own behest.

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Speaker 3: It's either the donor class or somebody around him. But

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Speaker 3: if they never drafted that for Hi, Yeah, somebody drafted

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Speaker 3: it for him, but it was still enough, somebody powerful

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Speaker 3: enough to put that out there, kind of as a

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Speaker 3: counter signal to the moments after your debate.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, look, I don't have any more insight

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Speaker 4: than what you guys have. I'd be speculating about what

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Speaker 4: it is. I just it was amusing to me. I

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Speaker 4: don't know, it's like I feel, you know, a lot

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Speaker 4: of people were telling me, but you know, for for

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Speaker 4: quite a while, but I hear, like, you know, the

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Speaker 4: zionis on Twitter being like like Douglas Murray is the

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Speaker 4: guy you got a debate because he'll smoke you, and

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Speaker 4: like after the debate, I'm like, this is the best

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Speaker 4: guy you guys got, Like who can't even argue the topic? Okay,

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Speaker 4: but I did think it was I don't know, I

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Speaker 4: just thought it was kind of amusing. But look, it's

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Speaker 4: the it's the worst thing about Donald Trump, you know,

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Speaker 4: it's just the worst quality about him.

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Speaker 6: It was true in his first four years and it's

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Speaker 6: true this term too.

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Speaker 4: The absolute worst thing about him is that he is

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Speaker 4: just terrible on the issue of Israel and Palestine. And

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Speaker 4: then that of course undercuts everything else that could be

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Speaker 4: good about the Trump administration, and that you just can't

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Speaker 4: be America first while being more loyal to a foreign

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Speaker 4: country than to your own. And it's never, I mean,

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Speaker 4: it's never been so blatant as it is right now.

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Speaker 4: You know, coming off the last twenty five years of

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Speaker 4: terror wars on behalf of Israel, every last one of

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Speaker 4: them being a disaster, every last one of them. We

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Speaker 4: were sold based off lives, every one of them. You know,

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Speaker 4: none of them can even defend them at this point.

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Speaker 4: I remember when my good friend you guys have had

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Speaker 4: on the show, Scott Horton, debated Bill Kristall, and he goes,

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Speaker 4: when was the last war or someone in the crowd asked,

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Speaker 4: what was the last war you could justify? And I

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Speaker 4: think I can't remember. I think you started talking about

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Speaker 4: the Balkans or something like that. Like even Bill Crystal

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Speaker 4: can't pretend to justify one of these interventions over the

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Speaker 4: last twenty five years. And now right now we're flirting,

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Speaker 4: we're killing people in the poorest country in the Middle East.

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Speaker 4: In Yemen, we're flirting with a war with Iran. And

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Speaker 4: it is so obvious that this is that neither of

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Speaker 4: these countries are any threat to US. No one's even

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Speaker 4: pretending there isn't even like the al Qaeda argument. They

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Speaker 4: don't even have like the Saddam Hussein was in on

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Speaker 4: nine to eleven and he's got nukes and he's going

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Speaker 4: to pass them.

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Speaker 6: Off to alca.

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Speaker 4: No one's even presenting an argument that this could be

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Speaker 4: a risk to the United States of America.

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Speaker 6: It's just simply like, oh.

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Speaker 4: Well, people are upset about what Israel's doing, so we're

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Speaker 4: going to go bomb them.

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Speaker 2: That's obviously all horrendous. You also have now a mass

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Speaker 2: crackdown on dissent at home. Trump obviously positioned himself as

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Speaker 2: some free speech champion in the campaign, and you know

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Speaker 2: the way that the tools of the state have been

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Speaker 2: used against student protesters, have been used against universities to

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Speaker 2: force the expulsion of certain professors, certain students who engage

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Speaker 2: in wrong think. We can put the latest images up

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Speaker 2: on the screen here of a Columbia student who has

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Speaker 2: gone out or this is d one, guys that we

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Speaker 2: can put up on the screen. This is a Columbia

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Speaker 2: student who they arrested during a visit to the immigration

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Speaker 2: office in Vermont. He's a Palestinian. His name is Mosa Madowi.

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Speaker 2: There's a picture of him, and you know, they throw

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Speaker 2: around these words like, oh, they're supporting terrorists, or they're

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Speaker 2: terrorist allnes, etc. I just want people to take a

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Speaker 2: listen to this individual and the way that he personally

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Speaker 2: spoke when he was interviewed by sixty minutes about October seventh.

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Speaker 7: Is about Jewish people.

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Speaker 2: Just take a listen to the way that he spoke

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Speaker 2: and the way that they are demonizing student protesters such

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Speaker 2: as himself.

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Speaker 7: Listen to this.

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Speaker 8: What was your initial reaction when you heard about the

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Speaker 8: Hamas attack on October seventh.

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Speaker 9: I could not believe what my eyes were seeing, where

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Speaker 9: I see Hamas members getting into settlements and so on.

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Speaker 9: But also the first moment I saw that, I put

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Speaker 9: my hand on my heart and I started praying, knowing

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Speaker 9: that there will be a huge level of revenge from

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Speaker 9: the Israelis, and I was praying that this will not

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Speaker 9: be the result because it would be disastrous.

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Speaker 8: The night of the rally, I believe someone in the

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Speaker 8: crowd said something very anti Jewish, not just say anti Israeli,

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Speaker 8: but anti Jewish.

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Speaker 9: Yes, this was as I walk out on November ninth

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Speaker 9: and a person who is not affiliated with Columbia, we've

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Speaker 9: never seen him, we don't know who is. This guy

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Speaker 9: comes down down the stairs yelling death to Jews. I

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Speaker 9: was shocked. And they walked directly to the person and

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Speaker 9: they told him, you don't represent us because this is

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Speaker 9: not something that we agree with. And directly what I've done,

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Speaker 9: I tooked the megaphone and they gave a speech and

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Speaker 9: they said, we here are conscious, educated students, and we

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Speaker 9: know how to separate right from wrong, and what this

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Speaker 9: guy has said is wrong. What this guy has said

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Speaker 9: is clearly anti sematic against Jews. To be anti Semitic

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Speaker 9: is unjust. Is unjust, and the fight for the freedom

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Speaker 9: of Palestine and the fight against anti Semetism go hand

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Speaker 9: in hand because injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere.

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Speaker 2: So this is someone who they're saying is undermining their

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Speaker 2: foreign policy because of his raging anti Semitism. We also

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Speaker 2: know the State Department had actually internally put out a

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Speaker 2: memo about one of the other the young woman who

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Speaker 2: was disappeared with also the video of these masked officers,

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Speaker 2: five or six of them, coming and taking her because

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Speaker 2: she wrote a student newspaper up ed. I mean, what

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Speaker 2: do you make of this direction and what it means

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Speaker 2: not just for these students, but day for.

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Speaker 7: All of us.

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Speaker 10: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: No, that guy sounds like a terrorist to me, right,

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Speaker 4: just so ridiculous. And I am not seen that before

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Speaker 4: and that was like exactly what you'd want someone to say.

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Speaker 4: I don't know, sounded perfect to me. I think it's

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Speaker 4: you know, okay, I'm not like trying to like, you know,

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Speaker 4: go down a conspiracy rabbit hole or something like this,

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Speaker 4: Like I don't know, I'm just speculating, but I do

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Speaker 4: know as we all know. I mean, there were so

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Speaker 4: many attempts made in Donald Trump's first term to undermine him,

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Speaker 4: like by his own government framing him as a as

438
00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:10,600
Speaker 4: a Russian spy for God's sakes, And it does just

439
00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:17,480
Speaker 4: seem to me that if you wanted to undermine mass deportations,

440
00:21:17,480 --> 00:21:19,639
Speaker 4: like if you want, you couldn't go about it in

441
00:21:19,680 --> 00:21:22,240
Speaker 4: a better way than what the Trump administration is doing.

442
00:21:22,240 --> 00:21:25,199
Speaker 4: By the way, mass deportations are not happening, yes, but

443
00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:28,200
Speaker 4: if you you know, like if you're let's say you're

444
00:21:28,280 --> 00:21:32,560
Speaker 4: an immigration restrictionist, which I am, and you you think

445
00:21:32,600 --> 00:21:36,560
Speaker 4: that Biden's you know, uh, immigration policy was like suicidal

446
00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:41,520
Speaker 4: and insane, and you were like, you finally won the day.

447
00:21:42,119 --> 00:21:45,720
Speaker 4: You know, the it is unbelievable how far to the

448
00:21:45,800 --> 00:21:49,159
Speaker 4: right the American population has has been moved under the

449
00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:52,879
Speaker 4: Joe Biden administration. I mean, mass super majorities of the

450
00:21:52,920 --> 00:21:57,359
Speaker 4: American people support mass deportations. Donald Trump, it is his

451
00:21:57,520 --> 00:22:00,359
Speaker 4: signature issue. He won every swing state, at won the

452
00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:04,439
Speaker 4: popular vote. You've won the day. And so then you're like, Okay, well,

453
00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:06,520
Speaker 4: how do we go about doing it, because obviously this

454
00:22:06,600 --> 00:22:08,520
Speaker 4: is a very tricky thing that you want to get right.

455
00:22:08,840 --> 00:22:13,600
Speaker 4: So let's wade into the most controversial issue and start

456
00:22:13,600 --> 00:22:18,000
Speaker 4: deporting legal residents for having the wrong opinion on an

457
00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:22,480
Speaker 4: issue where the majority of Americans are with I mean this,

458
00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:26,159
Speaker 4: it's it's insane. And so that's just from from the

459
00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:29,040
Speaker 4: perspective of even being pro mass deportation, but just then

460
00:22:29,080 --> 00:22:32,399
Speaker 4: from the perspective of just being a human being. I mean,

461
00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:35,680
Speaker 4: it's like, okay, yeah, if people entered your country illegally,

462
00:22:35,760 --> 00:22:37,320
Speaker 4: they don't have a right to be here.

463
00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:40,480
Speaker 6: There probably should be some type of order of.

464
00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:44,760
Speaker 4: You know, operationism, hierarchy of who should go first, and

465
00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:47,879
Speaker 4: you know, we probably all agree with like violent criminals

466
00:22:47,880 --> 00:22:51,240
Speaker 4: and gang members and things like that, but you know,

467
00:22:51,280 --> 00:22:55,000
Speaker 4: to do it because someone is like an eloquent defender

468
00:22:55,280 --> 00:22:58,720
Speaker 4: of one side of a conflict is just I don't know,

469
00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:00,000
Speaker 4: it's it's horrific.

470
00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:03,480
Speaker 6: It's also it, you know, an.

471
00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:07,600
Speaker 4: Incredibly scary president to set you know, this idea that

472
00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:10,600
Speaker 4: we can label you a terrorist. You know it's one

473
00:23:10,680 --> 00:23:13,320
Speaker 4: because this is the game that they always play. It's like, oh, well,

474
00:23:13,400 --> 00:23:16,439
Speaker 4: it's only if you're a pro a terrorist group or

475
00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:18,840
Speaker 4: if you hate Jewish people or something like that. And

476
00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:21,520
Speaker 4: just like with all speech regulations, it's like, fine, but

477
00:23:21,520 --> 00:23:24,280
Speaker 4: who gets to decide that, because I don't know. I mean,

478
00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:26,360
Speaker 4: there certainly are a lot of people out there who

479
00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:28,520
Speaker 4: hate Jewish people, and there certainly are a lot of

480
00:23:28,520 --> 00:23:31,119
Speaker 4: people out there who maybe less people. But there are

481
00:23:31,160 --> 00:23:33,840
Speaker 4: some people out there who defend Hamas. But I get

482
00:23:33,880 --> 00:23:36,520
Speaker 4: accused of that every single day and I've never done either.

483
00:23:36,840 --> 00:23:39,560
Speaker 4: So like, I who gets to determine this? And it

484
00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:42,280
Speaker 4: does seem to me just like more of a continuation

485
00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:44,840
Speaker 4: of kind of the worst of the post nine to

486
00:23:44,880 --> 00:23:47,879
Speaker 4: eleven tradition in America where we just get to label

487
00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:51,560
Speaker 4: something terrorism and then that shuts off the Bill of

488
00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:54,400
Speaker 4: Rights or that shuts off critical thinking.

489
00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:57,480
Speaker 6: It's just, man, it's terrible. It's just so terrible.

490
00:23:58,200 --> 00:24:02,280
Speaker 2: I mean, just to address what you're floating that like,

491
00:24:02,359 --> 00:24:06,240
Speaker 2: it feels like almost directly undermining you know, the other

492
00:24:06,280 --> 00:24:09,000
Speaker 2: things that he ran on that, you know, a more

493
00:24:09,359 --> 00:24:15,320
Speaker 2: sort of rigorous and law abiding, constitutionally compliant deportation process.

494
00:24:15,600 --> 00:24:17,959
Speaker 2: I mean, but he did run on he said multiple

495
00:24:18,040 --> 00:24:20,560
Speaker 2: times he was using Palestinian as a slur. He said

496
00:24:20,640 --> 00:24:25,679
Speaker 2: multiple times he wanted to deport pro Palestine protesters, that

497
00:24:25,720 --> 00:24:27,879
Speaker 2: he wanted to kick them out of the country. You know,

498
00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:31,480
Speaker 2: we covered Bikelly being here and the Alien Enemies Act

499
00:24:31,520 --> 00:24:34,239
Speaker 2: and how they've shipped ninety percent of the people that

500
00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:37,959
Speaker 2: they sent to this you know, notorious prison and El

501
00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:41,639
Speaker 2: Salvador had no criminal records whatsoever. He ran on the

502
00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:44,879
Speaker 2: Alien Enemies Act. So you know, what would you say

503
00:24:44,920 --> 00:24:47,119
Speaker 2: to people such as myself as others to say, like

504
00:24:47,800 --> 00:24:49,960
Speaker 2: he did say he was going to do this stuff,

505
00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:52,240
Speaker 2: and he is very proud about doing it too. There's

506
00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:54,359
Speaker 2: no like, oh, this person screwed up now he's out

507
00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:57,080
Speaker 2: there owning it, saying, Hey, the US citizens, they're going

508
00:24:57,160 --> 00:24:58,680
Speaker 2: to Bokelly next.

509
00:24:59,600 --> 00:24:59,800
Speaker 3: Yeah.

510
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:02,000
Speaker 4: I mean i'd say, you're right. I don't know what,

511
00:25:02,280 --> 00:25:04,000
Speaker 4: you know, I don't really have a counter to that.

512
00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:06,040
Speaker 4: I Mean, the thing about Donald Trump is that he's

513
00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:08,679
Speaker 4: always on every side of every issue, and so you

514
00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:11,119
Speaker 4: just never really know what he's gott right. It's always

515
00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:13,840
Speaker 4: like end the wars and America first, and bomb the

516
00:25:13,840 --> 00:25:16,159
Speaker 4: crap out of them and go after their families. And

517
00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:18,680
Speaker 4: I mean, he's always just so you never you kind

518
00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:21,879
Speaker 4: of never know with Donald Trump, like what is he

519
00:25:22,359 --> 00:25:25,879
Speaker 4: really thinking or what is he just floating out? No, listen,

520
00:25:26,440 --> 00:25:29,719
Speaker 4: it was obviously he's terrible on Israel, and that was

521
00:25:30,280 --> 00:25:34,080
Speaker 4: clear throughout the campaign. I think that for many people,

522
00:25:34,160 --> 00:25:38,680
Speaker 4: like myself, the calculation was essentially that, unfortunately, we were

523
00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:41,440
Speaker 4: caught in a binary and it was going to be

524
00:25:41,560 --> 00:25:44,560
Speaker 4: Kamala Harris or Donald Trump, and she was going to

525
00:25:44,600 --> 00:25:46,960
Speaker 4: be just as awful on Israel. Now, she may not

526
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:48,800
Speaker 4: have gone as far as some of this stuff that

527
00:25:48,800 --> 00:25:51,879
Speaker 4: we're talking about, but in the big picture, there wasn't

528
00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:55,200
Speaker 4: like a true anti war choice. There wasn't a real

529
00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:59,280
Speaker 4: non interventionist and you know, I'd say there from my perspective,

530
00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:04,359
Speaker 4: at least there were a lot of cultural benefits. I

531
00:26:04,359 --> 00:26:08,119
Speaker 4: believe that came from Donald Trump winning. I also just

532
00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:10,800
Speaker 4: thought the Democrats had to lose this one. It's just

533
00:26:11,119 --> 00:26:13,480
Speaker 4: too crazy. I mean, I don't know, it's just the

534
00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:17,640
Speaker 4: policy in Ukraine I view as the most reckless foreign

535
00:26:17,680 --> 00:26:19,880
Speaker 4: policy in the history of the United States of America.

536
00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:22,360
Speaker 4: I really think nothing is a close second to this,

537
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:25,919
Speaker 4: the idea of like flirting with a proxy war of

538
00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:29,600
Speaker 4: choice on the border of the most nuclear armed country

539
00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:32,399
Speaker 4: in the world. I mean, it's just absolutely Throughout the

540
00:26:32,560 --> 00:26:34,600
Speaker 4: entire height of the Cold War, there was never a

541
00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:37,840
Speaker 4: policy as crazy like we always, you know, we fight

542
00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:40,520
Speaker 4: a war in Vietnam or something, but there's a whole

543
00:26:40,600 --> 00:26:43,639
Speaker 4: China in between, you know, Russia and Vietnam that to

544
00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:48,080
Speaker 4: fight on their borders just insane. They funded this, this

545
00:26:48,160 --> 00:26:52,080
Speaker 4: catastrophe in Israel throughout the you know, the whole last

546
00:26:52,160 --> 00:26:55,000
Speaker 4: year of their term, and they had a brain dead,

547
00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:57,840
Speaker 4: senile president and lied to the American people.

548
00:26:58,080 --> 00:26:59,760
Speaker 6: So it was just like I felt like they needed

549
00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:00,320
Speaker 6: to oose.

550
00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:03,800
Speaker 4: But yeah, I can't defend any of this stuff, And

551
00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:06,320
Speaker 4: you're right, and Trump did did talk about it during

552
00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:07,359
Speaker 4: the campaign, and it is.

553
00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:07,640
Speaker 11: Uh.

554
00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:10,639
Speaker 6: Let's hope it doesn't get much worse.

555
00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:12,800
Speaker 3: I'll tell you this, Dave, You're an honest guy and

556
00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:14,359
Speaker 3: you can't say that for most people.

557
00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:16,959
Speaker 1: And so I appreciate you. I always look at you,

558
00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:18,440
Speaker 1: man and thank you for coming on the show.

559
00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:21,560
Speaker 4: Well, thank you so much. I really do appreciate that.

560
00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:23,560
Speaker 4: And as I've told you guys publicly and privately, I

561
00:27:23,960 --> 00:27:26,359
Speaker 4: love Breaking Points. I watch it every day and I

562
00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:28,400
Speaker 4: think you guys are doing an amazing thing with the show.

563
00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:29,280
Speaker 6: So thank you very much.

564
00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:30,440
Speaker 7: Appreciates Steve, good to see you.

565
00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:35,280
Speaker 1: We'll see you later YouTube. Chrystal, what are you taking

566
00:27:35,280 --> 00:27:35,680
Speaker 1: a look at?

567
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:39,240
Speaker 2: Without a doubt, the biggest Liberation Day breakout media star

568
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:42,719
Speaker 2: has been free press calmness and self described maga lefty

569
00:27:42,840 --> 00:27:46,000
Speaker 2: Bachia Ungar Sargan. Whether tariffs are on or off, or

570
00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:49,720
Speaker 2: reciprocal or with exemptions or no exemptions, Bachia has dutifully

571
00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:53,600
Speaker 2: defended Trump's trade war tactics too Pure's Morgan Bill Maher CNN,

572
00:27:53,640 --> 00:27:56,440
Speaker 2: and is of course a regular for the North Korea

573
00:27:56,520 --> 00:27:59,720
Speaker 2: level propagandists over at Fox News. No matter the current

574
00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:02,879
Speaker 2: state of the tariff roller Coaster and Batcha's telling they

575
00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:05,960
Speaker 2: are all part of Trump's glorious revolution against the elites

576
00:28:06,000 --> 00:28:07,520
Speaker 2: in favor of the working class.

577
00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:08,399
Speaker 7: Let's take a listen.

578
00:28:08,640 --> 00:28:11,200
Speaker 11: When somebody has the courage to show up and stay

579
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:15,600
Speaker 11: to Wall Street, screw you. I am waging war. I'm

580
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:19,440
Speaker 11: waging class warfare on behalf of the American working class.

581
00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:21,919
Speaker 11: And you elites and Wall Street, you do what you

582
00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:24,320
Speaker 11: need to do because I'm not going to stop fighting

583
00:28:24,640 --> 00:28:28,200
Speaker 11: for the American working class. Suddenly everybody is sitting around going,

584
00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:31,760
Speaker 11: oh no, the stock market, Yeah, the stock market looks

585
00:28:31,800 --> 00:28:35,600
Speaker 11: like that because the rich are punishing Trump for siding

586
00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:39,960
Speaker 11: with the neglected and humiliated American working class over them.

587
00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:43,720
Speaker 2: So she is correct that Trump's cares are class warfare,

588
00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:47,880
Speaker 2: she just gets the direction completely wrong. In fact, Liberation

589
00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:52,000
Speaker 2: Day is direct class warfare against the working class in

590
00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:54,320
Speaker 2: favor of Trump aligned oligarchs.

591
00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:57,360
Speaker 7: This should be no surprise. Of course. Trump is himself

592
00:28:57,360 --> 00:28:57,960
Speaker 7: a billionaire.

593
00:28:58,040 --> 00:29:01,480
Speaker 2: His administration is stocked with over a dozen billionaires. The

594
00:29:01,600 --> 00:29:04,600
Speaker 2: nation's billionaire class has made a great show of aligning

595
00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:08,240
Speaker 2: and pledging fealty to him and his entire economic project,

596
00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:11,600
Speaker 2: of which tariffs are a key part, has revolved around

597
00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:15,040
Speaker 2: catering to the rich. Trump has all but ended white

598
00:29:15,120 --> 00:29:18,840
Speaker 2: collar enforcement. He's gutting the irs so they cannot audit

599
00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:22,800
Speaker 2: the rich sufficiently. He's engaged in a massive regulatory rollback

600
00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:23,520
Speaker 2: so that big.

601
00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:24,880
Speaker 7: Business can act with impunity.

602
00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:27,520
Speaker 2: He is cutting the social safety net while handing out

603
00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:29,840
Speaker 2: a giant tax cut to the rich, and is destroying

604
00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:33,800
Speaker 2: the last remaining remnants of labor power. As just one

605
00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:38,120
Speaker 2: but very telling example, how do you square Trump's supposed

606
00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:40,560
Speaker 2: war on Wall Street with the fact that on the

607
00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:43,400
Speaker 2: day he rolled back some of the global tariffs, he

608
00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:47,000
Speaker 2: hosted billionaire Charles Schwab at the White House and then

609
00:29:47,120 --> 00:29:49,920
Speaker 2: bragged about how Schwab had been able to make two

610
00:29:49,920 --> 00:29:55,400
Speaker 2: point five billion dollars in the markets that day alone.

611
00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:56,560
Speaker 10: It's not just s.

612
00:30:01,080 --> 00:30:05,440
Speaker 7: Today now.

613
00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:07,560
Speaker 2: That is about as close to an admission of insider

614
00:30:07,640 --> 00:30:10,680
Speaker 2: trading as you could possibly get. While what main streets four, A,

615
00:30:10,760 --> 00:30:14,040
Speaker 2: one k's were puking and retail investors were getting clobbered,

616
00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:16,880
Speaker 2: a group of billionaires at the White House just happened

617
00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:20,040
Speaker 2: to be positioned to cash in on the massive Trump

618
00:30:20,200 --> 00:30:23,320
Speaker 2: triggered rebound. That should be enough to convince you that

619
00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:26,960
Speaker 2: Trump's primary ideological motivation is to accrue wealth and power

620
00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:30,400
Speaker 2: for himself and for his ring of aligned oligarchs.

621
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:31,960
Speaker 7: But there is so much more.

622
00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:36,160
Speaker 2: Here is the definitive proof that Trump's tariffs are class

623
00:30:36,200 --> 00:30:38,720
Speaker 2: war against the ninety nine percent, the likes of which

624
00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:42,400
Speaker 2: we have perhaps never seen before. All right, number one,

625
00:30:42,960 --> 00:30:46,320
Speaker 2: massive corporations are being liberated from Trump's tariffs while the

626
00:30:46,360 --> 00:30:49,880
Speaker 2: little guys are getting screwed. Stocks were up yesterday after

627
00:30:49,880 --> 00:30:53,400
Speaker 2: the Trump administration announced significant exemptions to their one hundred

628
00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:56,720
Speaker 2: and forty five percent China tariffs that would be particularly

629
00:30:56,760 --> 00:31:00,840
Speaker 2: beneficial to so called Magnificent Seven companies like Apple and Nvidia.

630
00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:05,080
Speaker 2: This is, of course no accident. In Vidia's CEO recently

631
00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:07,400
Speaker 2: paid at least a million dollars in order to attend

632
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:10,080
Speaker 2: a Trump super Pac dinner, where he was presumably able

633
00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:13,440
Speaker 2: to have an audience directly with the president. Apple CEO

634
00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:16,760
Speaker 2: Tim Cook gave a million dollars to the Trump inauguration

635
00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:19,840
Speaker 2: and has been quietly courting Trump for years with his

636
00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:24,080
Speaker 2: shitcoin development properties around the world, blatant political favor sellings.

637
00:31:24,080 --> 00:31:27,640
Speaker 2: Through these super Pac dinners, Trump has created an industrial

638
00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:31,920
Speaker 2: scale bribery factory where anyone with the cash can lobby

639
00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:35,160
Speaker 2: the King for a favor. The fear of this exact dynamic,

640
00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:37,600
Speaker 2: by the way, is precisely why the power to raise

641
00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:41,120
Speaker 2: revenue was left to Congress in the Constitution. But while

642
00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:43,960
Speaker 2: the big guys get the world, the small and medium

643
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:47,640
Speaker 2: sized business owners they are getting the shaft. Meet Beth

644
00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:50,480
Speaker 2: and a Rock War veteran and the founder and CEO

645
00:31:50,680 --> 00:31:51,520
Speaker 2: of Busy Baby.

646
00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:54,960
Speaker 12: A problem solver by nature, I decided to create something

647
00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:58,440
Speaker 12: to keep our kids entertained and to save our backs

648
00:31:58,480 --> 00:32:03,160
Speaker 12: and sanity parents keeping your babies busy just got a

649
00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:05,600
Speaker 12: whole lot easier because.

650
00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:06,480
Speaker 7: Of the Busy Baby Matt.

651
00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:09,840
Speaker 2: So Beth was living this small business dream story after

652
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:13,560
Speaker 2: that Shark tank appearance or sales skyrocketed. She was expanding

653
00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:16,239
Speaker 2: Walmart and Target came knocking. She was even honored by

654
00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:20,240
Speaker 2: Trump's Small Business administration as Minnesota's Small Business Person of

655
00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:23,040
Speaker 2: the Year. But now, thanks to the one hundred and

656
00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:26,280
Speaker 2: forty five percent China tariffs, all of it, the business,

657
00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:29,280
Speaker 2: the dream, even her house, which she had leveraged to

658
00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:32,360
Speaker 2: finance her expansion into Walmart, all of it is on

659
00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:34,960
Speaker 2: the line. She recently spoke to The Daily about how

660
00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:38,120
Speaker 2: for her business, the tariffs mean certain death.

661
00:32:38,600 --> 00:32:43,000
Speaker 10: I cannot bring this product into the US now. I

662
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:46,160
Speaker 10: don't have that kind of money. And what that means

663
00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:48,640
Speaker 10: then is if I can't bring in that product and

664
00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:50,680
Speaker 10: I run out of what's in my warehouse now, then

665
00:32:50,720 --> 00:32:53,280
Speaker 10: I no longer have revenue coming into my business. And

666
00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:55,480
Speaker 10: what that means is I can no longer pay my employees,

667
00:32:57,320 --> 00:32:59,400
Speaker 10: I can no longer pay my loans to which my

668
00:32:59,440 --> 00:33:05,280
Speaker 10: house is ridged against, and in about six months I

669
00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:09,840
Speaker 10: could very very possibly lose my home.

670
00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:12,440
Speaker 2: Now, I want you to understand best actually plan for

671
00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:14,480
Speaker 2: some level of tariff. She was ready for that, but

672
00:33:14,600 --> 00:33:16,640
Speaker 2: right now she's got a shipment in China, roughly one

673
00:33:16,720 --> 00:33:19,440
Speaker 2: hundred and fifty thousand dollars worth of product. It would

674
00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:23,680
Speaker 2: now cost two hundred and twenty nine thousand to bring

675
00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:27,080
Speaker 2: that product to the US. She doesn't have that cash.

676
00:33:27,240 --> 00:33:29,040
Speaker 2: She's sure as hell doesn't have the cash to spend

677
00:33:29,080 --> 00:33:31,920
Speaker 2: a million dollars to plead her case directly to Trump.

678
00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:32,680
Speaker 1: Here's the thing.

679
00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:35,040
Speaker 10: I'm not in a face off with the administration because

680
00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:36,800
Speaker 10: I'm not a player in the game. I'm a pawn.

681
00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:39,960
Speaker 10: There's literally nothing I can do. And I was coming

682
00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:42,960
Speaker 10: up with strategies. But then any strategy I came up with,

683
00:33:43,040 --> 00:33:45,680
Speaker 10: I'm afraid to execute it because the policy changes every

684
00:33:45,760 --> 00:33:47,160
Speaker 10: twenty four to thirty six hours.

685
00:33:47,400 --> 00:33:49,480
Speaker 2: Now, this is no small bump in the road for Beth.

686
00:33:49,640 --> 00:33:52,480
Speaker 2: At one point the interview actually turned extremely dark.

687
00:33:52,760 --> 00:33:53,479
Speaker 6: I'm not okay.

688
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:58,040
Speaker 10: I'm scared for my friends. I'm scared for myself.

689
00:33:59,000 --> 00:33:59,719
Speaker 1: They don't understand.

690
00:33:59,760 --> 00:34:03,640
Speaker 10: This is certain death for us. It is certain death

691
00:34:03,800 --> 00:34:07,800
Speaker 10: for so many of my friends and myself. Not in

692
00:34:07,800 --> 00:34:10,759
Speaker 10: the literal sense of Actually, no, I'm not gonna say

693
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:13,680
Speaker 10: not in the literal sense, because the very first thought

694
00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:15,560
Speaker 10: that came to me when he announced one hundred and

695
00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:18,040
Speaker 10: four percent tarif was at least I have at least

696
00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:22,239
Speaker 10: I have life insurance so that there's a way my

697
00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:23,680
Speaker 10: family can still.

698
00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:24,160
Speaker 1: Have a home.

699
00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:27,080
Speaker 2: Now, Beth says she's got a big support network and

700
00:34:27,120 --> 00:34:29,239
Speaker 2: she's going to make it through, but she worries how

701
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:31,680
Speaker 2: many small business owners out there like her are facing

702
00:34:31,760 --> 00:34:35,480
Speaker 2: similarly dire circumstances and are not going to be okay.

703
00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:39,080
Speaker 2: So big business they get Marralago Dinners, they get special

704
00:34:39,120 --> 00:34:42,000
Speaker 2: car balance, they get their rebounding stock prices. Mom and

705
00:34:42,000 --> 00:34:45,280
Speaker 2: pop companies get effectively a business death penalty.

706
00:34:45,719 --> 00:34:47,919
Speaker 7: But that is only one aspect of this class war.

707
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:51,680
Speaker 2: Number two, let's talk about those armies of millions screwing

708
00:34:51,719 --> 00:34:53,960
Speaker 2: in little little screws.

709
00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:54,880
Speaker 8: Great American workers.

710
00:34:54,880 --> 00:34:58,080
Speaker 7: You know, we are going on other networkies.

711
00:34:57,800 --> 00:34:58,800
Speaker 6: Millions of people.

712
00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:02,920
Speaker 8: Well remember the army of millions and millions of human

713
00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:07,000
Speaker 8: beings screwing in little screws to make iPhones. That kind

714
00:35:07,040 --> 00:35:08,640
Speaker 8: of thing is going to come to America.

715
00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:11,920
Speaker 4: It's going to be automated, and great Americans, the trade

716
00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:14,560
Speaker 4: craft of America is going to fix them.

717
00:35:14,880 --> 00:35:17,440
Speaker 2: So one of the many justifications of Trump's tariff policy,

718
00:35:17,440 --> 00:35:18,960
Speaker 2: and the one that has I think the most popular

719
00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:22,640
Speaker 2: emotional resonance, is that it's going to restore American manufacturing.

720
00:35:22,760 --> 00:35:25,400
Speaker 2: Might there are some aspects of that stated goal that

721
00:35:25,520 --> 00:35:28,200
Speaker 2: I am personally sympathetic to. The First thing that you

722
00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:30,440
Speaker 2: should know about this alleged goal, though, is that it's

723
00:35:30,480 --> 00:35:33,520
Speaker 2: not happening. You'd have to be insane to willingly invest

724
00:35:33,520 --> 00:35:36,760
Speaker 2: in US manufacturing given the wild daily shifts in policy.

725
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:42,080
Speaker 2: In fact, Trump's policy incentivizes offshoring and avoiding US markets altogether.

726
00:35:42,800 --> 00:35:45,560
Speaker 2: But let's assume Trump is able to strong arm some

727
00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:49,480
Speaker 2: companies into building some new factories. What is that actually

728
00:35:49,520 --> 00:35:52,719
Speaker 2: going to look like. There is nothing inherently good about

729
00:35:52,800 --> 00:35:55,760
Speaker 2: factory jobs. In fact, the early days of US industrialization

730
00:35:55,840 --> 00:35:59,000
Speaker 2: were a horror show of child labor, low wages, miserable

731
00:35:59,040 --> 00:36:02,440
Speaker 2: living conditions, company towns, and deadly accidents. Go read The

732
00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:04,960
Speaker 2: Jungle by Upton Sinclair or the History of the Triangle

733
00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:08,000
Speaker 2: Shirtwaist Fire for a refresher on how workers were treated

734
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:10,560
Speaker 2: at that time. It is instructive to reflect on the

735
00:36:10,600 --> 00:36:13,239
Speaker 2: fact that Trump is not calling for a return to

736
00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:17,640
Speaker 2: nineteen fifty style industrialization when progressive row reforms, high union

737
00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:20,719
Speaker 2: density and an expanding social safety and that meant that

738
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:24,400
Speaker 2: Dad could work in the factory and support a family instead.

739
00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:28,080
Speaker 2: Trump is inspired by the Gilded Age President William McKinley

740
00:36:28,200 --> 00:36:29,480
Speaker 2: he models his administration.

741
00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:31,239
Speaker 7: He said this repeatedly after a.

742
00:36:31,200 --> 00:36:34,879
Speaker 2: Time when American workers, many newly arrived immigrants, crowded into

743
00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:37,879
Speaker 2: ghettos and worked in sweatshops as Robert Barns commanded ever

744
00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:42,040
Speaker 2: greater portions of the economy. Instead restoring nineteen fifty's working

745
00:36:42,040 --> 00:36:45,439
Speaker 2: class stability, he wants American workers to be pushed into

746
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:48,440
Speaker 2: the global race to the bottom that goes hand and

747
00:36:48,520 --> 00:36:51,960
Speaker 2: glove with the doge efforts to destroy government's ability to

748
00:36:52,000 --> 00:36:56,319
Speaker 2: regulate business and Trump's onslaught against unions. In fact, the

749
00:36:56,440 --> 00:36:59,359
Speaker 2: US already does produce more than every country on Earth

750
00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:02,640
Speaker 2: except China, but due to automation, that production no longer

751
00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:06,800
Speaker 2: requires nearly as many workers, and thanks to attacks on unions,

752
00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:10,120
Speaker 2: those jobs are not nearly as good as they once were.

753
00:37:10,320 --> 00:37:13,640
Speaker 2: As Matt Burning points out McDonald's workers in Denmark, they

754
00:37:13,680 --> 00:37:17,800
Speaker 2: actually make more than Honda workers in Alabama. Bottom line,

755
00:37:17,880 --> 00:37:20,239
Speaker 2: Trump wants you bring back these sweatshops of the early

756
00:37:20,280 --> 00:37:23,520
Speaker 2: Industrial Revolution, not the union backed middle class jobs of

757
00:37:23,560 --> 00:37:24,600
Speaker 2: your grandparents' era.

758
00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:25,640
Speaker 7: The work would be.

759
00:37:25,560 --> 00:37:28,680
Speaker 2: Low, pain, difficult, and lacking in labor protections. Not to

760
00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:31,680
Speaker 2: mention that we're talking about far fewer jobs anyway, since

761
00:37:31,800 --> 00:37:34,399
Speaker 2: robots would be the ones enlisted to screw in those

762
00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:38,120
Speaker 2: little little screws now. A third element of Trump's terra

763
00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:41,160
Speaker 2: fueled class war is his desire to shift funding the

764
00:37:41,160 --> 00:37:44,480
Speaker 2: government away from the income tax and towards the tariff.

765
00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:46,880
Speaker 13: To me, the most beautiful word, and I've said this

766
00:37:46,920 --> 00:37:50,600
Speaker 13: for the last couple of weeks in the dictionary today,

767
00:37:51,080 --> 00:37:55,239
Speaker 13: is the word tariff. It's more beautiful than love. It

768
00:37:55,440 --> 00:37:59,279
Speaker 13: more beautiful than any It's the most beautiful word. This

769
00:37:59,360 --> 00:38:03,320
Speaker 13: country can be come rich with the use, the proper

770
00:38:03,440 --> 00:38:04,719
Speaker 13: use of tariffs.

771
00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:07,880
Speaker 7: It'll Can you just float out the idea of getting

772
00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:11,279
Speaker 7: rid of income taxes and replacing it with tariffs, Well.

773
00:38:11,120 --> 00:38:12,279
Speaker 1: Okay, we're serious about that?

774
00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:13,600
Speaker 6: Hower, Yeah, but why not?

775
00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:16,279
Speaker 2: Trump of course likes to pretend that those tariffs will

776
00:38:16,280 --> 00:38:18,719
Speaker 2: be paid by foreign countries. That's just not true. Just

777
00:38:18,760 --> 00:38:21,480
Speaker 2: remember again our small business owner Beth. She had to

778
00:38:21,520 --> 00:38:24,080
Speaker 2: abandon her shipment of goods in China because she can't

779
00:38:24,120 --> 00:38:27,160
Speaker 2: afford to pay herself the tariff. Now, if she could

780
00:38:27,280 --> 00:38:29,520
Speaker 2: afford to front the tariff, she would then instead have

781
00:38:29,600 --> 00:38:32,000
Speaker 2: to pass a significant amount, if not all, the costs

782
00:38:32,000 --> 00:38:35,320
Speaker 2: of the tariff onto consumers, pushing her thirty dollars, busy

783
00:38:35,360 --> 00:38:39,040
Speaker 2: baby Matt up to let's say fifty dollars. So, in practice,

784
00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:42,240
Speaker 2: tariffs are a consumption tax, and since working class people

785
00:38:42,280 --> 00:38:44,640
Speaker 2: spend a far greater percent of their income on goods

786
00:38:44,680 --> 00:38:48,000
Speaker 2: than the rich do, the tax is directly regressive, hurting

787
00:38:48,040 --> 00:38:51,520
Speaker 2: the poorest people the most and leaving the rich largely unscathed.

788
00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:54,480
Speaker 2: A YO budget Lab analysis found the average American would

789
00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:57,160
Speaker 2: face thirty eight hundred dollars in increased costs from the

790
00:38:57,200 --> 00:39:00,239
Speaker 2: April second tariffs, with the impact falling hardest on the

791
00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:03,360
Speaker 2: lowest end of the income scale. And at the same time,

792
00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:06,000
Speaker 2: Trump is of course planning a massive multi trillion dollar

793
00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:07,319
Speaker 2: tax cut for the rich.

794
00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:08,879
Speaker 7: Large custom of medicaid.

795
00:39:08,600 --> 00:39:11,680
Speaker 2: Social security is being destroyed, and rich tax cheats are

796
00:39:11,719 --> 00:39:14,440
Speaker 2: going to be able to more easily avoid income taxes

797
00:39:14,640 --> 00:39:18,000
Speaker 2: thanks to a gutted IRS. In practice, this means that

798
00:39:18,040 --> 00:39:21,520
Speaker 2: the working class is going to increasingly be forced to

799
00:39:21,600 --> 00:39:24,239
Speaker 2: shoulder the burden of funding the government and frankly, their

800
00:39:24,239 --> 00:39:27,400
Speaker 2: own oppression, as the budget tilts away from social spending

801
00:39:27,480 --> 00:39:30,600
Speaker 2: and towards the police date. After all, Trump the Republican's

802
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:33,480
Speaker 2: new budget calls for a mass expansion of military, a

803
00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:37,400
Speaker 2: record breaking one trillion dollar Pentagon budget also calls for

804
00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:40,120
Speaker 2: a dramatic increase in funding for ice into dole out

805
00:39:40,120 --> 00:39:43,759
Speaker 2: for private prison contractors to create mass detention centers. As

806
00:39:43,760 --> 00:39:48,400
Speaker 2: we covered earlier yesterday, or sorry, as we covered earlier yesterday,

807
00:39:48,440 --> 00:39:51,560
Speaker 2: Trump told El Salvador's president Bkelly that next he wanted

808
00:39:51,600 --> 00:39:55,200
Speaker 2: to send quote homegrowns to rot in the Seacot torture dungeon.

809
00:39:55,600 --> 00:39:58,040
Speaker 2: It has never been more clear that what begins with

810
00:39:58,120 --> 00:40:01,600
Speaker 2: immigrants will rapidly expand to American citizens in an effort

811
00:40:01,640 --> 00:40:05,799
Speaker 2: to silence and intimidate dissenters. I doubt, however, that that

812
00:40:05,920 --> 00:40:08,479
Speaker 2: effort to quash all dissent is going to succeed, because

813
00:40:08,520 --> 00:40:10,759
Speaker 2: already the American people are not buying what Trump and

814
00:40:10,840 --> 00:40:13,680
Speaker 2: Batia are selling. People can see what is being done

815
00:40:13,680 --> 00:40:15,840
Speaker 2: to them to enrich Trump and as ooligarchs, which is

816
00:40:15,840 --> 00:40:20,040
Speaker 2: why Trump's economic approval and overall approval are plummeting. CBS

817
00:40:20,080 --> 00:40:22,520
Speaker 2: has a new pull out which asks Americans who will

818
00:40:22,520 --> 00:40:26,040
Speaker 2: benefit from Trump's trade and teariff policies. Seventy four percent

819
00:40:26,080 --> 00:40:29,440
Speaker 2: say the wealthy, seventy one percent say large corporations, only

820
00:40:29,480 --> 00:40:32,040
Speaker 2: forty two percent say the working class, and only thirty

821
00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:35,640
Speaker 2: nine percent say small business. What's more, only twenty one

822
00:40:35,640 --> 00:40:39,640
Speaker 2: percent of Americans, overwhelmingly Republican partisans, say that Trump's policies

823
00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:43,440
Speaker 2: are making them personally better off. As the economy worsens,

824
00:40:43,480 --> 00:40:46,279
Speaker 2: Trump's popularity it's going to continue to fall, and he's

825
00:40:46,320 --> 00:40:48,360
Speaker 2: going to reach for war and more tools of repression

826
00:40:48,440 --> 00:40:51,480
Speaker 2: in order to maintain his power. You simply cannot do

827
00:40:51,600 --> 00:40:54,279
Speaker 2: this to people without expecting a backlash, and if you

828
00:40:54,320 --> 00:40:56,719
Speaker 2: are an authoritarian, the response to a backlash is not

829
00:40:56,800 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 2: to back off, it is to crack down. And on

830
00:40:59,200 --> 00:41:01,560
Speaker 2: that I'm going to end this particular monologue, but I'm

831
00:41:01,560 --> 00:41:04,040
Speaker 2: going to have more on that note later this week.

832
00:41:04,280 --> 00:41:06,560
Speaker 2: And Sager, this is a crazy making.

833
00:41:06,360 --> 00:41:09,120
Speaker 3: And if you want to hear my reaction to Crystal's monologue,

834
00:41:09,120 --> 00:41:15,080
Speaker 3: become a premium subscriber today at Breakingpoints dot com. I

835
00:41:15,080 --> 00:41:17,480
Speaker 3: don't usually do personal segments here on Breaking Points, but

836
00:41:17,520 --> 00:41:19,480
Speaker 3: I guess this one qualifies. My wife and I are

837
00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:22,239
Speaker 3: having a baby. Do date is basically anytime in the

838
00:41:22,280 --> 00:41:24,120
Speaker 3: next few weeks. So first, I hope you can all

839
00:41:24,160 --> 00:41:27,359
Speaker 3: forgive me. I've been unexpectedly absent or less engaged than

840
00:41:27,400 --> 00:41:29,480
Speaker 3: I may have been in the last several months, navigating

841
00:41:29,600 --> 00:41:33,279
Speaker 3: doctor's appointments, illness, and the general chaos of an irrevocable

842
00:41:33,360 --> 00:41:36,040
Speaker 3: change to your entire life. If you see me disappear

843
00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:38,640
Speaker 3: unexpectedly sometime in the next few weeks, you'll know why.

844
00:41:38,840 --> 00:41:40,759
Speaker 3: And while I'll be off for a little while, rest

845
00:41:40,760 --> 00:41:43,280
Speaker 3: assured i'll be back and the team here is well prepared.

846
00:41:43,560 --> 00:41:45,360
Speaker 3: So what I thought I would do is reflect on

847
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:47,600
Speaker 3: a few lessons that I have learned throughout the process

848
00:41:47,680 --> 00:41:49,759
Speaker 3: so far and point people in the direction of some

849
00:41:49,840 --> 00:41:51,799
Speaker 3: great books that I've read in the last nine months

850
00:41:51,800 --> 00:41:54,040
Speaker 3: that you may also enjoy if you find yourself in

851
00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:54,960
Speaker 3: a similar position.

852
00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:57,840
Speaker 1: There is an absolute ocean of bullshit.

853
00:41:57,440 --> 00:42:00,040
Speaker 3: I've discovered out there whenever it comes to pregnancy and

854
00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:02,040
Speaker 3: what foods that women are not supposed to eat, and

855
00:42:02,080 --> 00:42:04,920
Speaker 3: whether you're supposed to drink coffee or not, an exercise

856
00:42:05,040 --> 00:42:07,719
Speaker 3: and everything else. If you just absorb knowledge through pop

857
00:42:07,760 --> 00:42:10,520
Speaker 3: culture like I did, you're forgiven. But in my opinion,

858
00:42:10,640 --> 00:42:13,520
Speaker 3: it is much more useful to actually investigate claims behind

859
00:42:13,520 --> 00:42:16,920
Speaker 3: these societal expectations and see which ones actually hold up

860
00:42:17,000 --> 00:42:19,880
Speaker 3: under scrutiny. For this, there is a rightfully famous book

861
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:23,520
Speaker 3: I cannot recommend enough. It's called Expecting Better, Why the

862
00:42:23,520 --> 00:42:26,279
Speaker 3: conventional Pregnancy wisdom is wrong and What you really need

863
00:42:26,320 --> 00:42:29,120
Speaker 3: to Know, by Professor Emily Oster. Emily Oster is an

864
00:42:29,120 --> 00:42:32,319
Speaker 3: economist who actually used hard data sets to investigate the

865
00:42:32,320 --> 00:42:35,799
Speaker 3: claims of societal myths and doctors recommendations behind everything like

866
00:42:35,800 --> 00:42:38,120
Speaker 3: whether you can eat sushi while pregnant, what type of

867
00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:41,000
Speaker 3: exercise you're allowed to do, how much if any alcohol

868
00:42:41,080 --> 00:42:44,040
Speaker 3: or caffeine is actually safe and much much more.

869
00:42:44,280 --> 00:42:45,040
Speaker 1: The book is.

870
00:42:45,200 --> 00:42:48,640
Speaker 3: Unbelievably useful because it opened my eyes both to the

871
00:42:48,719 --> 00:42:52,600
Speaker 3: absolute relative risk or lack thereof, of certain behaviors the

872
00:42:52,640 --> 00:42:55,319
Speaker 3: society or the medical system says that there is risk of,

873
00:42:55,640 --> 00:42:58,799
Speaker 3: but also showed me really how public health guidelines and

874
00:42:58,840 --> 00:43:01,960
Speaker 3: societal norms are set broadly, and I am painting, obviously

875
00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:04,520
Speaker 3: with a big brush. Public health guidance is written for

876
00:43:04,600 --> 00:43:07,120
Speaker 3: the lowest common denominator in the United States.

877
00:43:07,239 --> 00:43:08,400
Speaker 1: For example, sushi.

878
00:43:08,640 --> 00:43:12,200
Speaker 3: Sushi has a relatively higher risk of making people sick. Therefore,

879
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:14,279
Speaker 3: because there is a portion higher risk of getting sick

880
00:43:14,320 --> 00:43:17,360
Speaker 3: from sushi. Absolutely, because of the existence of things like

881
00:43:17,440 --> 00:43:20,400
Speaker 3: gas station sushi, they have a recommendation don't need it

882
00:43:20,400 --> 00:43:23,480
Speaker 3: at all, or you could just say, wait, don't get

883
00:43:23,520 --> 00:43:25,920
Speaker 3: it from a gas station. Exercise the same level of

884
00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:28,279
Speaker 3: judgment a normal person would when they go to a

885
00:43:28,280 --> 00:43:30,840
Speaker 3: steakhouse and order a rare steak or beef tartar.

886
00:43:31,120 --> 00:43:31,400
Speaker 1: Yes.

887
00:43:31,600 --> 00:43:34,080
Speaker 3: Absolutely, of course your risk of getting sick is hire.

888
00:43:34,239 --> 00:43:37,560
Speaker 3: But we can recognize restaurant reputation, sourcing and other things

889
00:43:37,640 --> 00:43:40,200
Speaker 3: obviously matter. You can do a simple Google search and

890
00:43:40,200 --> 00:43:42,640
Speaker 3: see whether pregnant women in Japan still eat sushi, and

891
00:43:42,680 --> 00:43:45,279
Speaker 3: what their birth outcomes are, it will shock you to

892
00:43:45,320 --> 00:43:48,040
Speaker 3: learn that they are perfectly healthy. The same example and

893
00:43:48,080 --> 00:43:50,680
Speaker 3: the same safetiest philosophy behind a guidance from a medical

894
00:43:50,719 --> 00:43:54,760
Speaker 3: establishment pervades basically everything pregnancy and birth related.

895
00:43:55,080 --> 00:43:56,840
Speaker 1: You again will be forgiven.

896
00:43:56,480 --> 00:43:58,239
Speaker 3: For not knowing any of this, and that is why

897
00:43:58,320 --> 00:44:01,560
Speaker 3: I am urging any expected pairs read these books and

898
00:44:01,600 --> 00:44:04,680
Speaker 3: her follow up cripsheet. Furthermore, if you are able, one

899
00:44:04,719 --> 00:44:08,400
Speaker 3: of these flagship statistics from Oster's book is this recommendation

900
00:44:08,520 --> 00:44:11,480
Speaker 3: to hire a doula for better birth outcomes and for

901
00:44:11,520 --> 00:44:13,879
Speaker 3: fewer sea sections. My wife and I have found having

902
00:44:13,920 --> 00:44:17,680
Speaker 3: a doula to be incredibly helpful in helping understand exactly

903
00:44:17,719 --> 00:44:22,319
Speaker 3: what we face and to have actual informed consent when

904
00:44:22,480 --> 00:44:26,759
Speaker 3: and if the time comes to participate in any medical intervention.

905
00:44:27,120 --> 00:44:29,880
Speaker 3: I want to underscore if you do not do your

906
00:44:29,920 --> 00:44:33,759
Speaker 3: own research or speak with people deeply familiar with the process,

907
00:44:34,000 --> 00:44:36,840
Speaker 3: you will be at their mercy of the medical system.

908
00:44:37,040 --> 00:44:39,160
Speaker 3: And I do not think that the doctors themselves are

909
00:44:39,200 --> 00:44:42,080
Speaker 3: actively trying to harm anyone, but it is obvious from

910
00:44:42,080 --> 00:44:44,880
Speaker 3: the USC section rate and the US maternal outcomes. The

911
00:44:44,920 --> 00:44:47,440
Speaker 3: system that we are forced to participate in does not

912
00:44:47,680 --> 00:44:50,880
Speaker 3: line up with the ideal broadly. This brings me to philosophy.

913
00:44:51,160 --> 00:44:54,680
Speaker 3: In the United States, everything is about individualism. What type

914
00:44:54,680 --> 00:44:56,800
Speaker 3: of health insurance you have, whether you can afford something

915
00:44:56,880 --> 00:44:58,880
Speaker 3: or not, how much leave can you take, what childcare

916
00:44:58,960 --> 00:45:01,000
Speaker 3: to pursue. It's all a to you, and there's no

917
00:45:01,080 --> 00:45:03,360
Speaker 3: true authority on what is best or not. This is

918
00:45:03,400 --> 00:45:05,920
Speaker 3: not bad per se. It has a lot of strengths.

919
00:45:06,080 --> 00:45:08,640
Speaker 3: But this process and reading different books has really made

920
00:45:08,680 --> 00:45:09,960
Speaker 3: me appreciate.

921
00:45:09,480 --> 00:45:11,640
Speaker 1: Other countries' attitudes and customs.

922
00:45:11,840 --> 00:45:14,680
Speaker 3: For example, in the United States today, only about sixty

923
00:45:14,719 --> 00:45:17,000
Speaker 3: percent of women are covered by the Family and Medical

924
00:45:17,080 --> 00:45:19,960
Speaker 3: Leave Act for an average amount of leave of eleven weeks.

925
00:45:20,160 --> 00:45:22,160
Speaker 3: That is, of course, if you are lucky, and to

926
00:45:22,280 --> 00:45:25,360
Speaker 3: most people it sounds reasonable. That is honestly, until I

927
00:45:25,400 --> 00:45:28,839
Speaker 3: saw what an actual physical eleven week old baby looks like.

928
00:45:29,120 --> 00:45:32,560
Speaker 3: It's a barely functional, tiny human being, handing it off

929
00:45:32,560 --> 00:45:35,680
Speaker 3: to a daycare center or stranger. It seems so difficult

930
00:45:35,680 --> 00:45:37,600
Speaker 3: for me, and I'm not even there yet. This does

931
00:45:37,640 --> 00:45:39,960
Speaker 3: not even contend with the run of the mill medical

932
00:45:40,000 --> 00:45:41,759
Speaker 3: trauma that any mother will go through.

933
00:45:41,840 --> 00:45:42,680
Speaker 1: While giving birth.

934
00:45:42,880 --> 00:45:45,560
Speaker 3: In the United States, postpartum women are expected to attend

935
00:45:45,800 --> 00:45:48,640
Speaker 3: doctor's appointments in the days after birth, and paternity leave

936
00:45:48,920 --> 00:45:52,000
Speaker 3: is a luxury roughly available to twenty percent of US males.

937
00:45:52,239 --> 00:45:54,680
Speaker 3: By reading books such as The First Forty Days, I

938
00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:57,800
Speaker 3: learned this is not normal in the rest of the world,

939
00:45:58,040 --> 00:46:01,040
Speaker 3: a major departure from more civilized societies and how they

940
00:46:01,040 --> 00:46:03,480
Speaker 3: care for women. In China and in Japan, there is

941
00:46:03,520 --> 00:46:06,839
Speaker 3: a societal custom known as a confinement period, where women

942
00:46:06,880 --> 00:46:09,840
Speaker 3: basically don't even leave the house for forty days. Traditionally,

943
00:46:09,840 --> 00:46:11,920
Speaker 3: they are surrounded by other women who can cook and

944
00:46:11,960 --> 00:46:14,719
Speaker 3: clean and take care of every basic need that they have.

945
00:46:15,040 --> 00:46:18,359
Speaker 3: The regimen is incredibly strict and important for recovery. It

946
00:46:18,400 --> 00:46:21,759
Speaker 3: is more modern versions that include government sponsored programs that

947
00:46:21,800 --> 00:46:24,680
Speaker 3: include home help recovery sites for these women, where the

948
00:46:24,719 --> 00:46:27,400
Speaker 3: notion that someone would be able to be responsible for

949
00:46:27,440 --> 00:46:30,600
Speaker 3: feeding an infant and doing household tasks in their culture

950
00:46:30,800 --> 00:46:34,120
Speaker 3: that's insane. In the US, this is basically the norm

951
00:46:34,360 --> 00:46:36,359
Speaker 3: unless you have a family member or you can help

952
00:46:36,560 --> 00:46:40,120
Speaker 3: are well off enough to have hired help. Even then,

953
00:46:40,239 --> 00:46:44,200
Speaker 3: the expectation is vastly different. Millions are expected literally back

954
00:46:44,239 --> 00:46:47,360
Speaker 3: at work after mere weeks of giving birth, very little

955
00:46:47,360 --> 00:46:51,160
Speaker 3: societal understanding or support. Broadly, this reflects my more Asian

956
00:46:51,200 --> 00:46:53,759
Speaker 3: collectivist mindset to how I think people should be treated

957
00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:56,000
Speaker 3: after giving birth. But a book that showed me how

958
00:46:56,040 --> 00:46:58,480
Speaker 3: this can still work in a more Western context is

959
00:46:58,520 --> 00:47:00,399
Speaker 3: a very popular one from a few years back.

960
00:47:00,600 --> 00:47:02,120
Speaker 1: It's called Bringing Up Bebe.

961
00:47:02,160 --> 00:47:05,279
Speaker 3: One American mother discovers the wisdom of French parenting, and

962
00:47:05,360 --> 00:47:08,000
Speaker 3: as low as I will be to praise Europeans, it

963
00:47:08,040 --> 00:47:11,160
Speaker 3: is undeniable after reading this that a Western society that

964
00:47:11,200 --> 00:47:13,800
Speaker 3: can encourage women to be able to pursue careers without

965
00:47:13,840 --> 00:47:17,680
Speaker 3: Asian collectivist values can absolutely work. The caveat is you

966
00:47:17,719 --> 00:47:20,719
Speaker 3: need decades long cultural buy in as to the standards

967
00:47:20,760 --> 00:47:23,440
Speaker 3: of what such state sponsored childcare institutions should look like,

968
00:47:23,680 --> 00:47:25,960
Speaker 3: and you need to surrender to standards that are about

969
00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:30,080
Speaker 3: ten times higher than the United States. It's unbelievable reading

970
00:47:30,120 --> 00:47:32,440
Speaker 3: this the level of care and attention that the French

971
00:47:32,480 --> 00:47:35,840
Speaker 3: government puts not only onto discipline and childcare centers, but

972
00:47:36,040 --> 00:47:39,480
Speaker 3: ensuring proper nutrition from a very early age. Their system

973
00:47:39,520 --> 00:47:43,040
Speaker 3: works because of decades of proven state capacity and its

974
00:47:43,080 --> 00:47:46,960
Speaker 3: availability to anyone rich or poor. Costs are variable for

975
00:47:47,040 --> 00:47:50,400
Speaker 3: the same service based upon your income. I can easily

976
00:47:50,440 --> 00:47:52,719
Speaker 3: see how it would not work here with so much

977
00:47:52,719 --> 00:47:56,040
Speaker 3: societal division, but it is something to aspire to, especially

978
00:47:56,120 --> 00:47:58,680
Speaker 3: compared to the ad hoc and individual fend for yourself

979
00:47:58,719 --> 00:48:01,520
Speaker 3: system that we have here in America. So broadly, these

980
00:48:01,520 --> 00:48:03,520
Speaker 3: are the reflections that have been on my mind. It

981
00:48:03,560 --> 00:48:07,080
Speaker 3: is a weird sensation. I'm patriotic, I'm an American. Baseline

982
00:48:07,080 --> 00:48:09,240
Speaker 3: assumption was, yeah, we're the best country in the world,

983
00:48:09,360 --> 00:48:12,120
Speaker 3: but honestly, you have to wonder if that's truly true

984
00:48:12,120 --> 00:48:14,400
Speaker 3: when you're starting a family. It is certainly is a

985
00:48:14,440 --> 00:48:17,120
Speaker 3: good place to make money, to pursue individual interests or

986
00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:20,200
Speaker 3: liberty by consumer goods. But I can't help but looking

987
00:48:20,239 --> 00:48:23,680
Speaker 3: around at skyrocketing costs, distrust in the most basic levels

988
00:48:23,680 --> 00:48:25,839
Speaker 3: of systems, and see how these women are just left

989
00:48:25,880 --> 00:48:28,200
Speaker 3: to fend for themselves, and think that we really need

990
00:48:28,239 --> 00:48:30,160
Speaker 3: to change things up if we want more people in

991
00:48:30,160 --> 00:48:32,600
Speaker 3: this country to have kids. Finally, for fun and letting

992
00:48:32,600 --> 00:48:34,560
Speaker 3: my mind wander, I read a bunch of different books

993
00:48:34,640 --> 00:48:36,680
Speaker 3: that won't apply for many years. You may find them

994
00:48:36,760 --> 00:48:38,719
Speaker 3: useful if you're at this age. How to raise kids

995
00:48:38,719 --> 00:48:42,120
Speaker 3: who aren't assholes, the anxious Generation, the self driven child,

996
00:48:42,280 --> 00:48:44,919
Speaker 3: and even throwbacks like Battle Him of the Tiger Mother.

997
00:48:45,360 --> 00:48:46,640
Speaker 1: All of those books.

998
00:48:46,360 --> 00:48:48,960
Speaker 3: Have parts that I do not agree with necessarily, but

999
00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:51,279
Speaker 3: they all plant interesting seeds of things that I may

1000
00:48:51,360 --> 00:48:53,520
Speaker 3: or may not do as a parent. So anyways, I

1001
00:48:53,520 --> 00:48:55,839
Speaker 3: hope everyone can wish me luck. Luckily, I'm not doing

1002
00:48:55,840 --> 00:48:56,600
Speaker 3: any of the hard work.

1003
00:48:56,600 --> 00:48:59,000
Speaker 1: My wife is. I'm sitting. I'm here to support her.

1004
00:48:59,160 --> 00:49:01,880
Speaker 3: And the meanwhile, the true horror that I cannot stop

1005
00:49:01,920 --> 00:49:03,959
Speaker 3: thinking about is I will not get a good night's

1006
00:49:03,960 --> 00:49:07,080
Speaker 3: sleep again for a long time, and my cherished days

1007
00:49:07,080 --> 00:49:09,359
Speaker 3: of the eight pm bedtime are finally over.

1008
00:49:12,040 --> 00:49:14,960
Speaker 2: And if you want to hear my reaction to Sager's monologue,

1009
00:49:15,000 --> 00:49:18,200
Speaker 2: become a premium subscriber today at Breakingpoints dot com.

1010
00:49:18,560 --> 00:49:20,160
Speaker 1: Thank you guys so much for watching. We appreciate it.

1011
00:49:20,200 --> 00:49:22,080
Speaker 1: We're about to take the AMA. Now, let's get to it.