Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.
Speaker 2: The CEO of Alphabet and Google, Sindhar Pachai, is here
Speaker 2: with us. Let's welcome Sindar to the stage.
Speaker 3: Thank you so much for being here.
Speaker 2: We talked last year about a year ago on the circuit,
Speaker 2: so it's really good to catch up.
Speaker 4: Good to ceogain.
Speaker 2: Starting with the most important question, did you come in
Speaker 2: a way moo?
Speaker 4: I would have loved to.
Speaker 1: We are still working on making sure they're safe and
Speaker 1: can get through freebays. We're making great progress, but hopefully
Speaker 1: same time next year, I can do it all the
Speaker 1: way from Mountain Review.
Speaker 3: All right, I'm gonna hold you to it.
Speaker 2: So I just want to start with a vibe check
Speaker 2: post io.
Speaker 3: I feel like we saw a slightly.
Speaker 2: More confident and cohesion of Google. How would you describe it?
Speaker 1: Like?
Speaker 3: Are you getting better at choosing your own dance music?
Speaker 4: Look?
Speaker 1: I think when you undertake a set of things, you
Speaker 1: know it takes time, but you know internally we have
Speaker 1: known all of this was in progress. We've been training Gemini,
Speaker 1: releasing versions every few months.
Speaker 4: I think two point five.
Speaker 1: Was a real breakthrough in terms of capabilities, and it's
Speaker 1: at the frontier of where the models are and so
Speaker 1: putting that in our products across our suite of products.
Speaker 1: I think that's what makes the story come alive.
Speaker 2: So candidly, I'm using chatbots more and I'm using Google less.
Speaker 3: Maybe you are too.
Speaker 2: What is the fate of search in a world of
Speaker 2: AI agents and personalized answers?
Speaker 3: Is it evolution or extinction?
Speaker 1: Look, people have been asking this question now for a
Speaker 1: couple of years. You've had these chatboards scale up to
Speaker 1: hundreds of millions of users. We've grown in querries, So
Speaker 1: I think it feels very far from a zero sum
Speaker 1: game to me to use other areas in parallel. Like
Speaker 1: TikTok came in, everybody started using TikTok. YouTube grew and
Speaker 1: did very very well in those moments too.
Speaker 4: So you know, I do think.
Speaker 1: Search is very very good at what it does. Empirically,
Speaker 1: people value it for what it does, and they're actually
Speaker 1: showing it by using it.
Speaker 2: More So, investors are clamoring to know where you haven't
Speaker 2: shared the specifics. How much money are you pouring into
Speaker 2: AI and how much money are you actually making from AI?
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, in twenty twenty five, our capex is
Speaker 1: seventy five billion dollars, right, so we are definitely investing
Speaker 1: for the long run. But you know it's the same
Speaker 1: investment which powers businesses from search to YouTube, to cloud,
Speaker 1: to workspace, to Android and play to way more right
Speaker 1: and so and to our subscriptions business.
Speaker 4: We just launched.
Speaker 1: Google AI Pro and Ultra and you know it's definitely
Speaker 1: doing well. I mean pleased to see the reception. So
Speaker 1: I think it's such a profound technology. I feel the
Speaker 1: opportunity ahead is bigger than the opportunity we had in.
Speaker 2: The taxt So to double click there, if I may,
Speaker 2: what specific new revenue streams do you see increasing and
Speaker 2: what revenue streams do you see decreasing?
Speaker 4: There is look, I mean.
Speaker 1: Our entire between the growth in cloud like Vertex AI
Speaker 1: is up forty x in usage on a token basis.
Speaker 4: Just in the last twelve months.
Speaker 1: So obviously you know we have billions of dollars in
Speaker 1: providing AI based solutions, in AI as an infrastructure, AI subscriptions,
Speaker 1: so there are many many new businesses.
Speaker 2: YouTube and the web more broadly is being overrun with
Speaker 2: AI generated content.
Speaker 3: What effect is that having on Google products and services?
Speaker 2: Are you finding you need to allocate more resources to
Speaker 2: filter out the low quality content.
Speaker 1: I mean, look, anytime there are these technological inflection points,
Speaker 1: it's always a cat and mouse game, right, So the
Speaker 1: new technology creates new opportunity, more people can create content,
Speaker 1: but you also have a rise in low quality content.
Speaker 4: I think moments like this.
Speaker 1: Is what we actually it's what Google is good at, right,
Speaker 1: separating finding the needle in the haystack, making sure you
Speaker 1: surface the higher quality content. We are using Gemini to
Speaker 1: help improve YouTube's recommendations, so we're using AI to help
Speaker 1: improve how we did at content at Scrive. You know,
Speaker 1: there are good content being created using AI as well,
Speaker 1: so we're just trying to elevate high quality content.
Speaker 2: There is a lot of anxiety out there about the
Speaker 2: health of the open web, you know AI, as you
Speaker 2: just relies on the good stuff, like it relies on
Speaker 2: high quality content. As you push further into AI generated content,
Speaker 2: does that undermine the entire system? Like does the web
Speaker 2: become just a watered down version of itself?
Speaker 4: Look, it's another area.
Speaker 1: You know people have had questions about the web now
Speaker 1: for the past ten twenty years, Right, I said.
Speaker 4: This during IO.
Speaker 1: But if you look at the index we index the web,
Speaker 1: the number of web pages that we are indexing is
Speaker 1: up forty five percent just in the last two years alone.
Speaker 3: What about the last two months.
Speaker 1: Ah, there's just definitely people are creating a lot more content.
Speaker 1: I do think, you know, creation is getting easier, not
Speaker 1: just in web across you know, if you look at YouTube,
Speaker 1: the amount of content is exploding, right, And so I
Speaker 1: do think as content creator you have to think about many,
Speaker 1: many modalities, platforms, etc. But the opportunity space gets bigger.
Speaker 2: You've said AI overviews are good for publishers. The publishers
Speaker 2: we talk to say, it's tragic. Studies show drop and
Speaker 2: click through rates. I'm not always I don't always click
Speaker 2: through when I see ANAI overview. You're answering the question
Speaker 2: for me right there on Google publishers say they can't
Speaker 2: opt out or they might be.
Speaker 3: De indexed from Google entirely.
Speaker 2: So what is the concrete evidence that this is actually
Speaker 2: good for them and not just good for Google?
Speaker 4: Look a few things.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think compared to most companies in the world,
Speaker 1: we take care to design experiences which is going to
Speaker 1: showcase links right, and it's we took a long time
Speaker 1: testing aioviews and prioritized approaches which result in high quality
Speaker 1: traffic out. I'm confident that many years from now, that's
Speaker 1: how Google will work, right, Like you know, we think
Speaker 1: the value proposition in Google is people come. Yes, sometimes
Speaker 1: they may get answers. That was true when we launched
Speaker 1: featured snippets many years ago. But people come back. People
Speaker 1: are curious, people are expanding their use cases, and people
Speaker 1: do seek out sources on the web, and we are
Speaker 1: going to prioritize approaches. Obviously with AIO aviews, the quality improves,
Speaker 1: the context we are giving users improve. What we are
Speaker 1: seeing is people are clicking and going to a more
Speaker 1: diverse set of websites, and they are spending more time
Speaker 1: on average per click.
Speaker 3: You announced new spectacles at io. Maybe Google Glass was
Speaker 3: ahead of.
Speaker 2: Its time, but I'm curious what evidence you have that
Speaker 2: we really want to put computers on my faces now,
Speaker 2: on our faces now, and give tech companies even more
Speaker 2: of our information.
Speaker 1: Ultimately, you know, you could have asked questions like this
Speaker 1: about driverless cars, right. Ultimately, it's the people who choose
Speaker 1: what they want to do, right, and so you will
Speaker 1: only succeed in these things if you're building something delightful.
Speaker 4: I am wearing glasses right now, right.
Speaker 3: So for me, they don't have a camera in them,
Speaker 3: do this.
Speaker 1: They don't And they don't have a display in them.
Speaker 1: They don't have audio in them. But if he could
Speaker 1: make something which is no additional cost for me, but
Speaker 1: when I wanted to, it's going to give me important information,
Speaker 1: make it more useful, my life gets better.
Speaker 4: Look, I've been playing around with ar glasses.
Speaker 1: In fact, I was talking with a friend who had
Speaker 1: it on and shot basketball and he had an air ball,
Speaker 1: and it told him like that was a bad air ball.
Speaker 2: Right, So look, and he still wants to wear them.
Speaker 1: He found the experience delightful. You know, this natural instinct
Speaker 1: was like, what should I be doing better?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 1: And so you're going to have these things. Be a companion,
Speaker 1: be a coach, all of it. So I think I think,
Speaker 1: I think we have to do it tastefully, but if
Speaker 1: done correctly, I think people will respond positively.
Speaker 3: But Johnny, I've sam Altman Alliance.
Speaker 2: It seemed perfectly time to crash your io party. Did
Speaker 2: that rain on your parade a little? And are you
Speaker 2: at all worried?
Speaker 1: Look, I mean I expect in this moment to be
Speaker 1: that there'll be a lot of innovation, right, you know,
Speaker 1: enormous respect for what Johnny has done, and I'm looking
Speaker 1: forward to seeing what new computing devices are on the horizon.
Speaker 2: Mark Zuckerberg has said that almost all of Lama's code
Speaker 2: will be AI generated very soon. Sacha Nadella has said
Speaker 2: it's as much as thirty five percent for Microsoft right now.
Speaker 2: You've said twenty five percent last year. I believe you
Speaker 2: said that that of Google's code.
Speaker 3: Is AI generated.
Speaker 2: You have over one hundred and eighty thousand employees right now.
Speaker 3: Is it half that in the future.
Speaker 1: Look, I expect we will grow from our current engineering
Speaker 1: pace even into next year, right because it allows us
Speaker 1: to do more, right, I think the opportunity space is
Speaker 1: also increasing. I just view this as making engineers dramatically
Speaker 1: more productive, getting a lot of the mundane aspects out
Speaker 1: of what they do, allowing them to spend on higher
Speaker 1: value added tasks. But that means it's an accelerator. People
Speaker 1: will be able to do more, which means maybe we'll
Speaker 1: create new products and hence we will need more people,
Speaker 1: at least in the near term. To me, it looks like,
Speaker 1: you know, we will expand engineering velocity, and that doesn't
Speaker 1: mean we're constrained in what we will do. We'll end
Speaker 1: up doing more as a company as well.
Speaker 3: What about the long term?
Speaker 1: Look, I mean, I mean long horizontally. As a technology,
Speaker 1: it's tough to predict all all efforts of it long term.
Speaker 1: Just the fact that today sixty percent of the jobs
Speaker 1: today didn't exist in nineteen forty right at least why
Speaker 1: I'm mighty study by an economist called David Order. Right,
Speaker 1: So it is so tough to sit at any given time.
Speaker 1: I was just looking at YouTube in India. There are
Speaker 1: one hundred million channels in India alone, there are fifteen
Speaker 1: thousand channels with one million subscribers. Just imagine describing this
Speaker 1: world to someone in India fifteen years ago.
Speaker 4: It would make no sense. So, you know, I don't
Speaker 4: want to.
Speaker 1: You know, I think it's a bit pointless to think
Speaker 1: that far ahead. But I think we underestimate how expansionary
Speaker 1: this moment is.
Speaker 3: So this isn't too far ahead. So I hope you'll
Speaker 3: humor me.
Speaker 2: But anthropic CEO says AI could eliminate fifty percent of
Speaker 2: white collar jobs in the next five years, unemployment rising
Speaker 2: to ten to twenty percent do you agree?
Speaker 1: Look, I think we should take those concerns super seriously.
Speaker 1: Right with this technology to my earlier point about new
Speaker 1: jobs getting created, you're going to create new opportunities. I
Speaker 1: look at something like VO three with video, it's clear
Speaker 1: to me you're going to allow pretty much everyone in
Speaker 1: the world to be a sophisticated creator. I can't sit
Speaker 1: in linearly like you know, imagine all the impact of
Speaker 1: that will be right, So you're creating all these new opportunities.
Speaker 1: You have tremendous positive externalities. You know, we will tackle
Speaker 1: tough vexing problems, make progress on areas like cancer, right,
Speaker 1: you know all that, educate a lot more people as
Speaker 1: part of that. You know there could be job display
Speaker 1: in Those are serious concerns. So as a society you
Speaker 1: have to think about how do you reskill people? What
Speaker 1: are new social safety nets that you would need? Those
Speaker 1: are super important conversations for society to have. But I
Speaker 1: think being too specific and saying that many jobs of
Speaker 1: you know, I just don't see that. We've made predictions
Speaker 1: like that for the last twenty years about technology and automation.
Speaker 1: It hasn't quite played out that way. Yep, But I
Speaker 1: do I respect that. You know, I think it's important
Speaker 1: to voice those concerns and debate them, and.
Speaker 4: I think that those are important conversations to have.
Speaker 2: In two trials now, judges have said that Google is
Speaker 2: a monopoly in search and partly a monopoly in ads.
Speaker 3: How do you address the.
Speaker 2: Concern that your AI is built on an existing domination
Speaker 2: of search and ads and that this is just reinforcing
Speaker 2: original monopolies.
Speaker 1: First of all, you know, we disagree with the rulings,
Speaker 1: and we are in the process of appealing these things. Look,
Speaker 1: if anything, this moment has shown I don't think there's
Speaker 1: anyone here who is using anything they don't want to use.
Speaker 1: You look at the success of chat, JPD or any
Speaker 1: other product. People are literally have more choice than ever before.
Speaker 1: The reason people use Google is because they want to
Speaker 1: use it, right, And so I think I think we
Speaker 1: continue to innovate. I think choice is good for users,
Speaker 1: competition is good for the world.
Speaker 4: So that's how I say it.
Speaker 3: You've said the remedies proposed are too extreme.
Speaker 2: Would you ever voluntarily break yourself up control your own destiny?
Speaker 1: Look, I mean I see, I mean those are they
Speaker 1: seem compared to what the initial scope of the ruling
Speaker 1: was some of the proposed solutions are far overreaching.
Speaker 4: We'll see how it plays out.
Speaker 1: I look at the amount of we spent over fifty
Speaker 1: billion dollars in R and D last year. We are
Speaker 1: one of the top R and D investors in the world.
Speaker 1: We take such a lot. We didn't build things like chrome,
Speaker 1: and you know, we've invested a couple of decades into
Speaker 1: these way more we've been building it over a decade.
Speaker 1: We've been doing that with quantum computing for over a decade.
Speaker 1: This amount of R and D, this amount of innovation,
Speaker 1: I think makes sense to do, and we take a
Speaker 1: long term view.
Speaker 4: So that's how I think about it.
Speaker 2: I've heard you say a few times that you think
Speaker 2: of AI as an expansionary moment, but so far it
Speaker 2: does seem to be favoring tech giants and well funded
Speaker 2: startups with access to GPUs and data centers.
Speaker 3: And enormous amounts of capital.
Speaker 2: Like, isn't this really concentrating power in fewer hands?
Speaker 3: And is AI just another winner take all game?
Speaker 1: Look, I think there are you know, well, I'm confident
Speaker 1: there is a company that's going to be created with AI,
Speaker 1: just like when they Internet happened many years after the
Speaker 1: Internet happened, Googled didn't exist. So you know, there's no
Speaker 1: doubt to me that three years from now there will
Speaker 1: be a company which will be dominant in this AI
Speaker 1: age which we don't even know the name of today.
Speaker 1: That's the only way things work in the future, right.
Speaker 2: So you have all this information about us, and I
Speaker 2: mean you have our deepest, darkest secrets. It's it's already
Speaker 2: hard to me personal Well yeah, actually you do, not
Speaker 2: you personally, but your company does. It's already hard to
Speaker 2: trust big tech, and now you're going to be using
Speaker 2: more of this information to integrate AI and to more
Speaker 2: personalized experiences. Why should we trust you now more than
Speaker 2: ever before?
Speaker 1: I mean, we earned the trust by you know, we've
Speaker 1: been storing people's emails now for many, many years, but
Speaker 1: we've handled that content responsibly. I hope we protected from
Speaker 1: bad actors. We fight against un warranted requests. So I
Speaker 1: think more than any other company, I think we've we've
Speaker 1: taken you know, this is a responsibility. People trust us
Speaker 1: in those moments, and we are only evolving the products
Speaker 1: in the way people are telling us, you know, with
Speaker 1: their feedback. Look, they you know, the biggest thing people
Speaker 1: ask with Gemini and Gmail is why can't it write
Speaker 1: more like me?
Speaker 4: It's a it's an ask which we are responding.
Speaker 3: To Google's rolling out Gemini to kids.
Speaker 2: I mean, I've got enough on my parenting with more screen.
Speaker 3: Time and social media.
Speaker 2: Are our kids best friends going to be chatbots?
Speaker 1: Look, there's always going to be a sense of discomfort
Speaker 1: with new technology. I don't know, like when online dating
Speaker 1: first game, people who ask questions like are you really
Speaker 1: going to meet someone online?
Speaker 4: And so people adapt to these things.
Speaker 1: Will people comfortably naturally interact with AI in their life
Speaker 1: in the future, Yes, Like we're seeing it empirically in
Speaker 1: terms of how people are using them, Like I see
Speaker 1: people coming to Gemini asking questions Like at an aggregate,
Speaker 1: we see questions like how should I prepare.
Speaker 4: For this interview? All?
Speaker 1: I mean, they're talking as if it's a companion. So
Speaker 1: we do see evidence of that.
Speaker 3: What about kids? Like Gemini for kids?
Speaker 1: Maybe with kids, just like you know today, when we
Speaker 1: design YouTube for kids, we design it with a different
Speaker 1: set of gudrails, and so for kids, I think, you know,
Speaker 1: you would scope it down to those appropriate experiences.
Speaker 2: Obviously, you just unveiled VO three, which you were talking.
Speaker 2: I mean, it is mind blowing seeing these super super
Speaker 2: lifelike videos, but it is also really scary.
Speaker 3: Is this the end of truth as we know it?
Speaker 1: I think this is part of the role when you ask,
Speaker 1: I think this is part of the value proposition.
Speaker 4: This is why people.
Speaker 1: Will come to places like Google, because they're trying to
Speaker 1: ascertain what's reality.
Speaker 4: Right and this is not?
Speaker 1: And I do think it's well, we are going to
Speaker 1: evolve new norms around. For example, with vieo, we are
Speaker 1: watermarking videos. They are built with syntide so people can
Speaker 1: detect that they were generated. With vio you can upload
Speaker 1: any video to Google and ask about any image to Google.
Speaker 1: Ask about this image and it would tell you if
Speaker 1: it was generated by VO three. We built a syntidi
Speaker 1: detector for researchers and journalists. So you know, all these
Speaker 1: things are going to evolve in parallel. Down the line,
Speaker 1: we will need regulations maybe to say something which is
Speaker 1: a true deep fax, just like your financial fraud. You know,
Speaker 1: you would need new norms around things like that. So
Speaker 1: all you know, we have to evolve. As new technology
Speaker 1: comes along.
Speaker 2: They just wonder like, are we gonna have a shared
Speaker 2: sense of reality again, Like it's just like this is
Speaker 2: made with AI.
Speaker 3: It's insane.
Speaker 1: I think so, like you know how I think humans
Speaker 1: as humanity, we would value that shad sense of reality,
Speaker 1: and so you would, you know, you would value human
Speaker 1: human experiences even more in the future.
Speaker 4: Right. That's that's how I think about it.
Speaker 2: YouTube is arguably the most influential media platform in the
Speaker 2: world now. I mean, it is a political force, it's
Speaker 2: a cultural force. Our kids are learning there. All kids
Speaker 2: think they want to be creators. Seventy five percent of teenagers,
Speaker 2: I believe, say they're watching it every single day. I'm
Speaker 2: a mom, you're a dad, Like, I know you're in
Speaker 2: charge of the thing, but does it ever terrify you
Speaker 2: to have that much power?
Speaker 1: Okay, I mean I I think that sense of part
Speaker 1: is an illusion. I think like when you're working in
Speaker 1: the tech industry, you know, you've simultaneously started with the
Speaker 1: conversation with like, are you about to go extinct? And
Speaker 1: then you're ending the conversation with aren't you the most
Speaker 1: powerful thing? Like, so you've got to choose in discussion
Speaker 1: of only one of that can be the truth?
Speaker 2: Fair enough, I'm curious about your approach to the Trump administration.
Speaker 2: You are front and center at the inauguration. Google has
Speaker 2: rolled back some of its DEI policies.
Speaker 3: Did you compromise on something that you believe in?
Speaker 1: Look, first of all, you know, we are one of
Speaker 1: the leading American companies, global companies in this particular moment,
Speaker 1: with the point of inflection around AI, I do think
Speaker 1: the next few years are critical from many aspects. So
Speaker 1: we are committed to engage in comment. We did that
Speaker 1: with the first Trump administration. We are committed to doing that.
Speaker 1: Look around the world, you know, we comply with laws
Speaker 1: and regulations in all the countries we operate in. Doesn't
Speaker 1: mean we agree with every aspect of everything, right, but
Speaker 1: as a company, we do have our set of values
Speaker 1: and like so we have committed to.
Speaker 4: Them as well.
Speaker 1: So I think, for example, as a company, I think
Speaker 1: we have committed to making sure we develop AI in
Speaker 1: a way that protects the planet.
Speaker 4: That's an important value for us.
Speaker 1: And you've seen as prioritize efforts around renewable energy. So
Speaker 1: we'll continue doing those things. But Look, but I think
Speaker 1: it's important that as a company we engage. You know,
Speaker 1: there are many, many people in the administration, particularly around
Speaker 1: critical energy needs, critical infrastructure. These are all important areas
Speaker 1: we want to work together.
Speaker 2: When you were on the circuit last year, we spoke
Speaker 2: about the criticisms. You know that Google and you personally
Speaker 2: have been too late to the AA game, too late
Speaker 2: to get AI to market, and I wonder how has
Speaker 2: your own leadership style evolved over the last couple of years, specifically,
Speaker 2: like have you changed at all to meet this moment
Speaker 2: of radical disruption?
Speaker 1: Look, I feel like this is the main thing I
Speaker 1: did as a CEO setting up the company is to
Speaker 1: really be at the forefront of AI. When I look
Speaker 1: at the depth and breadth of what we are doing
Speaker 1: as a company, across everything we are doing on multiple fronts,
Speaker 1: I think we are incredibly well positioned. But definitely, you
Speaker 1: know through this moment, you know, it's a moment in
Speaker 1: which we realize it's a moment to accelerate at scale
Speaker 1: what we are doing, and that involved you know, think
Speaker 1: stepping back and thinking about how you can make the
Speaker 1: company work faster, setting up Google DeepMind, bringing our best
Speaker 1: teams into one team, scaling up our AI infrastructure in
Speaker 1: our capex is seventy five billion. That was twenty billion
Speaker 1: dollars a few years ago. So we are dramatically scaling
Speaker 1: up our infrastructure. So you're undertaking these big bets. Way
Speaker 1: more people are talking about it now, but three years
Speaker 1: ago people who are very pessimistic on it. I increased
Speaker 1: our investment in way more at that time. So, you know,
Speaker 1: so you are making decisions not based on what people
Speaker 1: are currently saying at any given moment, but with the
Speaker 1: long term view in market.
Speaker 2: Are you still getting involved in nitty gritty product decisions
Speaker 2: or is that leaving that to Serge.
Speaker 1: You know, Okay, I mean fortunate to have Sergey is
Speaker 1: deeply working on the Gemini models, but I'm very very
Speaker 1: involved in various aspects of our product decisions. I think
Speaker 1: you have to do that in the in the in
Speaker 1: the in the tech space.
Speaker 2: You've been CEO for ten years now, however many years
Speaker 2: out it is what kind of person do you think
Speaker 2: Google's future CEO should be?
Speaker 4: Look?
Speaker 1: I think I think it's important to understand, like the
Speaker 1: products we build, you know, tremendously impact society, and you
Speaker 1: know the journey of technology is doing the hard work
Speaker 1: to make sure you or harnessing it in a way
Speaker 1: that it benefits people, and that takes a lot of work,
Speaker 1: you know, and I think that'll be an important quality
Speaker 1: to have.
Speaker 2: You're driving this massive technological change that's also bound to
Speaker 2: create like major societal disruption. How do you personally wrestle
Speaker 2: with that? Like is there some philosopher or religion or
Speaker 2: deeper code that you turn to to help you answer
Speaker 2: some of these questions?
Speaker 1: Okay, first of all, there are many of us doing this.
Speaker 1: I think ultimately it comes down to you don't need
Speaker 1: much more than having empathy for you know, for your
Speaker 1: fellow people.
Speaker 4: On this journey.
Speaker 1: And I think I'm doing what I'm doing so or
Speaker 1: many others in the industry because you get a chance
Speaker 1: to positively impact people with the work you do, And
Speaker 1: that's the true north star at.
Speaker 4: The end of the day.
Speaker 3: What should kids be studying these days?
Speaker 2: Like should they still be learning how as a coach,
Speaker 2: should we still be getting computer science degrees?
Speaker 1: Like I've got four of them, so they're probably they're
Speaker 1: probably going to be talking to AI asking this question,
Speaker 1: so my answer doesn't matter.
Speaker 4: Maybe. Look, I think.
Speaker 1: One of the things that's great about this moment is
Speaker 1: I think AI over time will allow us all to
Speaker 1: pursue our passions more right, And I think that's the
Speaker 1: truly liberating aspect.
Speaker 4: Of a lot of this.
Speaker 1: You're giving pretty much everyone a powerful tool they express
Speaker 1: themselves in the way they want to. And so I
Speaker 1: won't change anything of what you're studying. I think I
Speaker 1: would still ask encourage people to follow their passions and
Speaker 1: find something that's of interest to them. I think, you know,
Speaker 1: pretty much all disciplines which are valuable today, there'll be
Speaker 1: a version of that valuable in the future.
Speaker 3: What are the limits of AI? Like, is it possible
Speaker 3: we don't reach AGI?
Speaker 4: Oh?
Speaker 1: With the current Oh, It's entirely possible. I mean, like
Speaker 1: you could be dealing with Look everything we can see,
Speaker 1: you know, I feel very positive there's a lot of
Speaker 1: forward progress ahead with the paths we are on, not
Speaker 1: only the set of ideas we are working on today,
Speaker 1: some of the newer ideas we are experimenting with. Some
Speaker 1: very optimistic on seeing a lot of progress. But you know,
Speaker 1: you've always had these technology curves where you may hit
Speaker 1: a temporary plateau. So are we currently on an absolute
Speaker 1: path to AGI. I don't think anyone can say for sure.
Speaker 1: I am the pace of progress is staggering and looking ahead.
Speaker 1: I sense you will have that pace of progress, but
Speaker 1: you know, there could be limitations in the technology, you know,
Speaker 1: I you know, the technology currently feels like you're seeing
Speaker 1: dramatic progress, but then there are areas where justin can't
Speaker 1: do this obvious thing right, you know.
Speaker 4: Like weymo's doing very very well.
Speaker 1: But remember you can teach a kit to drive in
Speaker 1: about twenty hours, right and so so. Both the technology
Speaker 1: is amazing, but we are quite far from a generalized
Speaker 1: technology as well.
Speaker 2: We talked a little bit about your vibe coding backstage
Speaker 2: next to share how often are you vibe coding and
Speaker 2: what are you working on?
Speaker 1: I wish I could I could do more, but you know,
Speaker 1: I've just been messing around, be it either with cursor
Speaker 1: or you know, I wipe coded with replet, trying to
Speaker 1: build a custom web page with all the sources of
Speaker 1: information I wanted in one place so I could type
Speaker 1: of location, get it all partially complete, so, you know,
Speaker 1: but it's exciting to see how casually you can do
Speaker 1: it now, right, and compared to the early days of coding,
Speaker 1: things have come a long way.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 1: It feels so delightful to be a coder in this
Speaker 1: moment in time.
Speaker 3: Even after that, you still need all those software engineers.
Speaker 3: Are you sure?
Speaker 4: Okay? I think so?
Speaker 1: Yes.
Speaker 3: Last question.
Speaker 2: We've got a new episode of the Circuit out this
Speaker 2: week actually about Microsoft's fiftieth anniversary. Google's twenty seven years old.
Speaker 3: What is Google at fifty?
Speaker 4: What's Google at fifty? Look? I hope, I hope.
Speaker 1: We are nimble and innovating, and you know, in the
Speaker 1: technology industry you have to earn your success every year,
Speaker 1: and so for me, it's more about building a culture
Speaker 1: that's you know, really innovative at its core, takes a
Speaker 1: long term view and does deep technology work and translates
Speaker 1: that into products that impact billions of people.
Speaker 2: All right, So are you going to is a human
Speaker 2: going to be running Google or an AI?
Speaker 4: Well?
Speaker 1: I do think whoever is running it will have an
Speaker 1: extraordinary AI companion to help, all
Speaker 3: Right, Sendar Pachaye, Everyone you g can just little bit