Speaker 1: Hey, Brack. Okay, this is Brack Costin. I've known him.
Speaker 1: Do you know how long we've known each other, Breck.
Speaker 2: It's probably been close to twenty years at this point, no.
Speaker 1: More, because I was like thirty thirty one, maybe even
Speaker 1: younger anyway, so easily, No, I think it's twenty five.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I've never I've never been with time.
Speaker 1: And yeah, I think I was like in my early thirties.
Speaker 1: All right, So this is Breck Costin. I've known him
Speaker 1: for years because a group of friends of mine had
Speaker 1: found this Freedom course in LA and it was transformative
Speaker 1: for them, and I liked the name Freedom, and I
Speaker 1: was like at a crossroads with a relationship. Yeah, Breck,
Speaker 1: I think it was earlier. It was like in my twenties. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I was. So that was like a long time ago,
Speaker 1: maybe almost thirty years ago, and you could probably go
Speaker 1: back and look at the dates. I probably still my
Speaker 1: Freedom notebook upstairs. And I went to this like three
Speaker 1: day immersive experience at Breck and uh learned a language
Speaker 1: a lot of people use now that I actually know
Speaker 1: is because of me, which we'll get into. And Breck's
Speaker 1: sort of like oblivious to all that, like commercial stuff
Speaker 1: in ways, which I like because like he never knows
Speaker 1: how many times I use his words, but I do
Speaker 1: always give him credit, but like other people do also.
Speaker 1: So Breck is a life coach slash non traditional therapist
Speaker 1: but not like a doctor. And we've known each other
Speaker 1: for years and we talk fairly regularly, and he's a
Speaker 1: great guy and he's had a big life, and I
Speaker 1: wanted to have him on here. I think you came
Speaker 1: on years ago when I started.
Speaker 2: No I never came on as a podcast. We did
Speaker 2: you and you had your talk show?
Speaker 1: You didn't, I think we did, but maybe yeah we
Speaker 1: did in the very beginning, one hundred.
Speaker 2: Percent telling you you know, it's way too long now
Speaker 2: I can't remember apparently, yeah, I.
Speaker 1: Mean one hundred percent. In the very very beginning we talked.
Speaker 1: So you're in LA and we spoke the other day,
Speaker 1: and I thought that hopefully you'd want to come on more,
Speaker 1: but I'll sort of drive and I wanted to just
Speaker 1: like bring up different concepts that we've discussed over the
Speaker 1: years that jump off the page to me, and also
Speaker 1: that you probably don't even know that I've discussed the
Speaker 1: people and have jumped off the page with them. So
Speaker 1: like you talk about a million things, but like probably
Speaker 1: the things you wouldn't even think would be the biggest thing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's true. I mean, you know, people will take
Speaker 2: away what they think is really relevant and resonates. And
Speaker 2: I think we're, you know, as a as a coach
Speaker 2: or just as as a person who's contributing, You're you're
Speaker 2: always looking for different portals and different metaphors and different language, music,
Speaker 2: anything you can that you think will get something from
Speaker 2: your mouth to someone's ear that will be useful, right,
Speaker 2: like digestible and people respond to you know, two different
Speaker 2: different image imagery, different music, different rhythms, different metaphors. So
Speaker 2: it's kind of figuring out what's what will translate for
Speaker 2: each person.
Speaker 1: So I guess we'll go with the biggest ticket item.
Speaker 1: I was going to do Charming, which we'll do after
Speaker 1: because they really surprises people on the charming. I had
Speaker 1: a podcast called Charming is a Red Flag and it
Speaker 1: was it was very It had a lot of impact,
Speaker 1: which was shocking because it really people. It spoke to
Speaker 1: people because charming is used as something positive. But let
Speaker 1: me just park that for one second. Okay, let's talk
Speaker 1: about noise. Okay, many people use the term noise as
Speaker 1: a result of me commercializing the term noise as a
Speaker 1: result of learning it from you at the Freedom course,
Speaker 1: and I took it to another level. You talked about
Speaker 1: food noise and money noise, and different people have different
Speaker 1: noise or like talking about someone's particularly noisy in that area.
Speaker 1: And I wrote a book called Naturally Thin about food noise.
Speaker 1: But I've seen people, I've seen on social media other
Speaker 1: people talk about it. They don't even realize that it
Speaker 1: came from me and that it came from you. So
Speaker 1: just talk. Let's talk about noise for a little bit, okay.
Speaker 2: So and I like that, you know, I love that.
Speaker 2: As you said, you know, I kind of think of
Speaker 2: myself as me the scenes, and not to diminish any
Speaker 2: other coaches or any other people who are in the
Speaker 2: working in you know, transformational world or in a self
Speaker 2: help world, spiritual world. But I just think the contract
Speaker 2: really is is that you're you're a source, right, you know,
Speaker 2: you're not the you know, you're not not that you
Speaker 2: can't be the mouthpiece for what you're delivering, but you're
Speaker 2: actually the source, and you want other people to be
Speaker 2: able to deliver that from their own particular expression, right,
Speaker 2: and they make it their own, they take it to
Speaker 2: a whole other level. So that's always exciting for me
Speaker 2: when you know, like as you take noise and kind
Speaker 2: of disseminate it so it becomes part of the vernacular,
Speaker 2: part of the culture. Right. I like that. I like
Speaker 2: watching that those kinds of things happen.
Speaker 1: They say the best relationships are the rock and the stars.
Speaker 1: So you have many stars that you talk to, but
Speaker 1: like you're they're the star. You're the rock, Like you're
Speaker 1: behind the.
Speaker 2: Scenes and understanding. Like any great team, you understand your position,
Speaker 2: you know, and you play your position. And I think
Speaker 2: a lot of times where it's conflicted, and I'll get
Speaker 2: into noise even from this context, think for a lot
Speaker 2: of people that they're they're they're so wanting to play
Speaker 2: a position that they're just not designed for and it's
Speaker 2: and it's just and then and I consider that to
Speaker 2: be one of the you know, when you're trying to
Speaker 2: compete where you're not competitive, it is it is a
Speaker 2: source of suffering. Wow, it is. And people will spend
Speaker 2: years and years and years trying to squeeze them into
Speaker 2: something that they just weren't designed to do. And so,
Speaker 2: and that goes right into noise as well. So noise
Speaker 2: is this very basically, it's your really your internal commentary
Speaker 2: that's good or bad. Now, this is what people think,
Speaker 2: they oh, good noise is good. I'm saying no, no,
Speaker 2: good noise. You're trying to keep around. Bad noise you're
Speaker 2: trying to get rid of. So it has you either way.
Speaker 2: It holds you hostage either way.
Speaker 1: So you're saying, like, the absence of noise is real,
Speaker 1: true piece. It doesn't matter if it's good or bad.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's where freedom and peace is right. And if
Speaker 2: you look at when you're the most brilliant, you're when
Speaker 2: you look at where your essence is being fully expressed,
Speaker 2: and it's the essential you, it's when there's no noise.
Speaker 2: So that's a singer singing in front of the sick
Speaker 2: two thousand people, and they're not trying to remember their lyrics.
Speaker 2: They're not remembering they're connected to the audience. They're expressing themselves.
Speaker 2: They're they don't have like oh man, I'm crushing it
Speaker 2: or I'm you know, or this when badly.
Speaker 1: Meaning like even if it's family noise and you're managing it,
Speaker 1: you're still having to deal with that. You're thinking about
Speaker 1: it positive, like I've got it under control. That's noisy too,
Speaker 1: and bad noises.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so management, the management of something is even more.
Speaker 2: I kind of think of this as like a feral tiger, Like,
Speaker 2: you know, your noise can be running rampant and just
Speaker 2: eating anything that's on the African plane, right, feral, and
Speaker 2: then when it comes up a solution to a problem, Okay,
Speaker 2: I'll manage this. I'll just quester this animal, this ferocious animal,
Speaker 2: and that just as bad. Right. It's literally like this
Speaker 2: is a Siegfreedo and roy of noise is they know
Speaker 2: how to work with white tigers, you know. They they
Speaker 2: made millions of dollars working with with this, you know,
Speaker 2: So it's a it's understanding. It's understanding how to work
Speaker 2: with you know, your own, you know animal. I'll talk
Speaker 2: about survival noise in that regard as well, but it
Speaker 2: really is understanding that when you are truly there is
Speaker 2: when there's no noise. So that's that's when you like,
Speaker 2: in this conversation that we're having, if you and I
Speaker 2: were going, God, I hope this is going well. I
Speaker 2: wonder if this is going all right or our internal
Speaker 2: dialogue was like, I'm not sure what to say.
Speaker 1: It's noisy, Yeah, it'd be like a noise. Well, that's
Speaker 1: funny because in the book Naturally Thin, the way that
Speaker 1: I took it to the next level, which I forgot
Speaker 1: until this exact moment, is I said that with people
Speaker 1: with food, they wanted to turn their noise into a voice,
Speaker 1: like you're having just a conversation. I'm about to have
Speaker 1: a meal, and this what I'm gonna have versus I
Speaker 1: was bad, I was good. I ate so much so
Speaker 1: I have to beat myself up and eat more or
Speaker 1: I have to eat nothing like that's managing. That's noisy,
Speaker 1: but just being like okay, chocolate I wanted, and I'm
Speaker 1: you know, next, I'm doing this like have it be
Speaker 1: like a voice, which to me seemed calmer.
Speaker 2: Well it's not only calmer, but you know that it's
Speaker 2: it's I see this in phases bethany where you kind
Speaker 2: of like are first of all recognizing it's coming out
Speaker 2: of the ethers. You're recognizing if as an internal dialogue
Speaker 2: rather that's just your personality or that's just the way
Speaker 2: it is. So you're seeing some distinction between oh, this
Speaker 2: isn't me, this is the noise in my head. But
Speaker 2: most people associate the noise in their head with them.
Speaker 2: And when you are your essential you, there's no noise,
Speaker 2: and it's a strange phenomenon, like, oh, when I'm truly
Speaker 2: being myself, it's when there's no noise that's happening.
Speaker 1: That's the most meditative state, is being.
Speaker 2: Just just there, right, yeah, So, and I think in
Speaker 2: a world attempting that right to get to that. So,
Speaker 2: I call that the thing you just mentioned, the cherry
Speaker 2: pie I made it up as a cherry pye conflict.
Speaker 2: And that is like, okay, you got to you got
Speaker 2: to lunch, you got to dinner. And the waiter says, okay,
Speaker 2: would you like dessert? And it says with a cherry pie.
Speaker 2: Person goes no, you know, no, I'm not gonna have
Speaker 2: any cherry pie, and so and and he goes ask again,
Speaker 2: do you want any cherry pie? And Vera says no,
Speaker 2: I don't want a cherry pie. And so throughout the
Speaker 2: day you're like, hey, you know I didn't eat that
Speaker 2: cherry pie. I didn't eat the cherry pie at all.
Speaker 2: You know, you didn't have the cherry pie. But you're
Speaker 2: still being dominated by cherry pie, when whether you ate
Speaker 2: it or not, you.
Speaker 1: Should have just had, yeah, take a bite, a couple
Speaker 1: of bites of it. Yeah, that's funny.
Speaker 2: Whether you ate it or not.
Speaker 1: That's noisy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's what noise looks like.
Speaker 1: Well, also, I want to tell everyone that, and we
Speaker 1: can move to something else because I think they maybe
Speaker 1: get it. But like that when Breck introduced it to me,
Speaker 1: because we're talking about thirty years ago, but I have
Speaker 1: a crazy memory for this stuff. You've taught so many
Speaker 1: different things and talked about so many different things. But
Speaker 1: I want to like take people back to what I
Speaker 1: learned that He talked about how each person has different
Speaker 1: Someone could have religion, noise, food, noise, money, noise, age, noise, vanity, noise,
Speaker 1: like it could be anything. It could be all the
Speaker 1: seven Deadly sins. It's just you could be noisy about something.
Speaker 1: It could it could be anything, right, Like, it could
Speaker 1: be the Emperor has no clothes or I'm not I'm
Speaker 1: even someone has billion dollars. They could still think they're
Speaker 1: going to lose it all.
Speaker 2: Oh no, no, that happens. I mean, have a lot
Speaker 2: of clients just like you know, who have you know,
Speaker 2: storty amount of money, and there they can be the
Speaker 2: most terrified.
Speaker 1: Okay, So that that's overall. Noise can be different for
Speaker 1: every single person.
Speaker 2: But the goal it doesn't mean that noise doesn't produce.
Speaker 2: It doesn't mean that it can't produce, meaning like you
Speaker 2: can make a ton of money in a certain area. Right.
Speaker 2: But the thing is is that it mostly where you
Speaker 2: have no noise is where you're the most created, most
Speaker 2: most evolved, most accomplished, most you know, most evolutionary. Right.
Speaker 1: Well, that's interesting, Okay, So this is why that's interesting
Speaker 1: to me because usually the thing that the person's most
Speaker 1: obsessed with, you've called it, their plates of wounding, the
Speaker 1: thing that they're thinking about the most, is the thing
Speaker 1: that isn't coming naturally to them. And I also think
Speaker 1: that like between sleep and wake is when all my
Speaker 1: best ideas come, and when I'm the most relaxed, is
Speaker 1: when my amazing like ideas they just come to solve
Speaker 1: a problem that I've had forever. And that's quiet, it's
Speaker 1: literally quiet.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, you can't you can't solve you know, certainly,
Speaker 2: you know you can can't be creative or innovative or
Speaker 2: generative when fear or shame is dominating. Right, It's it's
Speaker 2: a it's a threat, right, So why I say it
Speaker 2: can it can produce? It means that someone can can
Speaker 2: start like they're there, can start start their mote or
Speaker 2: their engine. In terms of I don't want to be
Speaker 2: like that. I'm going to change my circumstances. I'm going
Speaker 2: to drive something, right, So, like the difference between ambition
Speaker 2: and invention is you can start something from a place
Speaker 2: of noise, right, you can. It can kick off from
Speaker 2: place like I don't want to be like my dad.
Speaker 2: I don't want to be like my mom, and I
Speaker 2: don't want to live like this. I'm wanting to do
Speaker 2: something from a reactive place. But in order for it
Speaker 2: to fulfill and move, it's got to move into an
Speaker 2: evolutionary creative place where it's not driven drop driven from
Speaker 2: that that source. So we're all we're always looking at
Speaker 2: at you know, what is it that? What is it
Speaker 2: that has us? And what is it that we have
Speaker 2: right and what is holding us hostage? And what do
Speaker 2: I actually have? So today, you know, we're just riddled
Speaker 2: with anxiety, right, And anxiety is I mean just kind
Speaker 2: of globally anxiety is trying to get control of something
Speaker 2: of no control over right, and so people come up
Speaker 2: with tons of solutions to that.
Speaker 1: Like you're you're saying, because you talk about this with
Speaker 1: charm too, anxiety has us and you say that charm
Speaker 1: has people too, Like, so go into like how these
Speaker 1: things are having us, Like, we're going to that because
Speaker 1: I think that's interesting. Most people don't say that.
Speaker 2: Okay, So when I say someone can be productive, I'm
Speaker 2: saying that they don't know that. People don't distinguish out enough.
Speaker 2: You know, what is it, you know where they have
Speaker 2: noise and no noise, so it just looks like, oh,
Speaker 2: I if that I'm being manic here, And I'm going, well, no,
Speaker 2: you're actually not being manic there. You know here you're
Speaker 2: pretty freed up. Here you're manic and you're collapsing both
Speaker 2: of those those things. So someone could be have their
Speaker 2: craft just to kind of finish that up. Their craft
Speaker 2: could be Jordan like, they'd be able to play the
Speaker 2: guitar brilliantly. They can do that, but their career is noisy,
Speaker 2: so they never fulfill in their career. But they could
Speaker 2: be the best, the best guitarist in the world, and
Speaker 2: people understand, Well, if I'm really great at this out come,
Speaker 2: this isn't fulfilling. And someone can be mediocre in their
Speaker 2: craft but really freed up in their career, right, meaning
Speaker 2: they have all this room to make mistakes, to fail,
Speaker 2: to lose, to move right. And so you know, watching,
Speaker 2: you know, watching where things produce and how they produce,
Speaker 2: you know, is my entire kind of work, right, Like,
Speaker 2: what is what is it that has someone be effective,
Speaker 2: you know in a particular way. So the question that
Speaker 2: you're asking is, I consider identities. I look at identities,
Speaker 2: and the identity is a way you want to be
Speaker 2: seen or a way you do not want to be seen. Right,
Speaker 2: So I want to I might want to be seen
Speaker 2: as smart. I can't be seen as stupid. I want
Speaker 2: to be seen as a tractor. I can't be seen
Speaker 2: as ugly. I obt to see this as powerful. They
Speaker 2: can't be seen as weak.
Speaker 1: I feel like you used to call that image. Also
Speaker 1: is that are you saying that's.
Speaker 2: The same, Well I did, it was? It was an
Speaker 2: image has a much broader context, okay, right, But the
Speaker 2: identity is very specific. You know, we walk around, you know,
Speaker 2: wanting me seen in a particular way. And if we're
Speaker 2: not seen in a particular way, we get reactive, threatened, disconsolate,
Speaker 2: something like that. So I always consider that identities have you,
Speaker 2: qualities and characteristics you have. So this is there to
Speaker 2: your point about charming. So you could have an identity
Speaker 2: of loyal like you need to be seen as a
Speaker 2: loyal person. That's an identity, right, So you're loyal to
Speaker 2: a fault, s you'll stay in situations long after you should.
Speaker 2: You don't get out fast enough. You ally yourself to
Speaker 2: things you shouldn't because you've got a dysfunction, so you're
Speaker 2: not seeing things correctly. So loyal to a fault is problematic.
Speaker 1: Yep, agreed. And that's almost like the obligation to a fault.
Speaker 1: When people constantly have to go, they always have to
Speaker 1: show up. It feels disingenuous, like they're doing it to
Speaker 1: check the box.
Speaker 2: So with regards to loyalty as a characteristic equality, that's
Speaker 2: different than an identity. I mean you have loyalty, Loyalty
Speaker 2: doesn't have you. So you can be loyal to the
Speaker 2: appropriate situations, you can exit situations appropriately, and you can
Speaker 2: be disloyal if you have loyal I mean, I'm not
Speaker 2: going to be loyal to someone who's saying, you know,
Speaker 2: an asshole or someone who's doing this, right, But you
Speaker 2: can't be disloyal if loyalty to a fault has you.
Speaker 2: So that is true for everything. So it could be
Speaker 2: so everything to be positive or negative depending on the context.
Speaker 1: Okay, so talk about obligation, because everybody that's listening is
Speaker 1: doing a bunch of things they don't actually want to
Speaker 1: be doing. And I do many things for other people,
Speaker 1: but I don't do anything anywhere that I don't want
Speaker 1: to do. And I think that's jarring, and I.
Speaker 2: That's revolution that's this almost is like you now we're
Speaker 2: talking kind of like graduate school in terms of self help,
Speaker 2: just because it really is such a revolutionary concept because
Speaker 2: it looks completely selfish. Yes, because someone says, but what
Speaker 2: looks what looks one way to the culture might be
Speaker 2: entirely different to what's actually true.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: So if someone is saying, oh, you you know, you
Speaker 2: never do anything, you know, obligatorily, and I go and
Speaker 2: I say, yeah, I don't, and they go, well, that's
Speaker 2: just completely selfish. I go, well, actually know it's selfless
Speaker 2: because who wants someone around who's doing something as they're
Speaker 2: a pain in the ass. They're doing it for you.
Speaker 2: They're sanctimonious about it, they're self righteous about it, and
Speaker 2: that's not yielding anything. It's no benefit to any right.
Speaker 1: I don't like when people count who gave a gift
Speaker 1: to give a gift back. I don't want any gifts.
Speaker 1: I have one, no gifts. Gifts giving is literally my
Speaker 1: love language. I don't want any because I'm not giving
Speaker 1: a gift because I want something back or because I
Speaker 1: got something. They have nothing to do with each other,
Speaker 1: and it irritates me when I hear someone, well, can
Speaker 1: you believe they came to the wedding and they only
Speaker 1: did whatever? Who gives a shit that? So I hate
Speaker 1: that shit. I hate counting. That's the opposite of being
Speaker 1: a good person.
Speaker 2: An obligation can can just like you said that, it
Speaker 2: can trans can translate to many many situations. It can
Speaker 2: go to it can go to gift giving. It can
Speaker 2: go to emotional context like I love you. I didn't
Speaker 2: hear it back, right, You're obligated to say it back,
Speaker 2: so it can be I agree with that too. That's
Speaker 2: so ridiculous. It can be on emotional context, it can
Speaker 2: be in a physical context, obligation can translate to many
Speaker 2: many different situations. So obligation, you know, to live a
Speaker 2: life obligation free, right, meaning you know, I'm only going
Speaker 2: to do things that I want to do, and I'm
Speaker 2: only going to do things that I say I'm gonna
Speaker 2: do or I'm not going to do them, right. And
Speaker 2: you know, like when someone goes, well, what if your
Speaker 2: wife asks you to do something to me, I go,
Speaker 2: that's usually my pleasure. You know, I want to do
Speaker 2: something for it. It's not an obligation right, right.
Speaker 1: But you may not totally want to do that thing,
Speaker 1: but you want to do like.
Speaker 2: But you want to do that for them because you
Speaker 2: know what it'll.
Speaker 1: Like Yes, I'm saying yes exactly.
Speaker 2: So that's for people get stuck. And you know, in
Speaker 2: my marriage, I mean I think it's been really generous
Speaker 2: in that way. Like if I say I don't want
Speaker 2: to do exit like something simple like Jene goes, oh,
Speaker 2: the dishes are the in the sink. Yeah, I said
Speaker 2: I didn't want to do them. She goes, Okay, so
Speaker 2: it's it's gonna be as simple as that, and then
Speaker 2: they get done you know down the road right where
Speaker 2: it's kind of something you want to do, but it's
Speaker 2: like literally simple.
Speaker 1: Well no if she lets that go a couple of times,
Speaker 1: and it's like says to you like it would be
Speaker 1: nice if you did them, but doesn't give you damage
Speaker 1: next time you might want to do them. It's kind
Speaker 1: of like this weekend, I was with someone that I
Speaker 1: care about and I was exhausted, and I just I
Speaker 1: am always activated, but I'm when I do a lot
Speaker 1: of things that involve other people, I really need to restore.
Speaker 1: And it could be like organizing sweaters, or like looking
Speaker 1: at lip gloss or just staring at the TV. I
Speaker 1: just need to be alone ish, or like wandering in
Speaker 1: a house with someone else there, but not like a
Speaker 1: you know, in an obligation mode. Yes, so this person
Speaker 1: is an extrovert and I'm more of an introvert. And
Speaker 1: they said, my cousin's in town and I was in
Speaker 1: the Hampton's and do you want to go for lunch
Speaker 1: with him? Now? I really didn't want to go, but
Speaker 1: I really care about this person who's doing a lot
Speaker 1: of things for me and and really caring. And I said,
Speaker 1: I first just want to know if you care if
Speaker 1: I go or not, Like I just want to know
Speaker 1: where you stand with it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was the question I go to say, is
Speaker 2: this important to you?
Speaker 1: That I go like do you care? Like how much?
Speaker 1: On a one to ten, because often you're not communicating
Speaker 1: and you just say yes and then you resent it
Speaker 1: or you say no and they resent that you said no,
Speaker 1: even though they didn't really care. But it was the
Speaker 1: way that it was discussed. I said, listen, you, if
Speaker 1: it's really important to you, then we should discuss that.
Speaker 1: I wasn't even ready to go yet. I just was
Speaker 1: ready to say, if it's really important, you should discuss that.
Speaker 1: I on my own vacuum don't want to go, but like,
Speaker 1: if it's really important to you, because as a family member,
Speaker 1: that's a discussion. And then he was like it's really
Speaker 1: not and I was like, okay, great, I really don't
Speaker 1: want to go. And then later he was gone for
Speaker 1: like three hours and he was worried that it was
Speaker 1: too long, and that became a I'm like, no, like
Speaker 1: not to make you feel bad. You could go for
Speaker 1: five hours like I you know, I want eventually I
Speaker 1: want you to come back and not be But it's
Speaker 1: like that kind of stuff. It like frees you up
Speaker 1: because you could really go on the wrong road. You
Speaker 1: could go and resent it.
Speaker 2: First of all, you're always looking to maintain like you're
Speaker 2: now talking relationship stuff, so you're talking, so you always
Speaker 2: are looking to maintain the affinity of the connection, the
Speaker 2: love connection and the relationship. That's kind of like the intention, right,
Speaker 2: and in between fights and disagreements and you don't feel
Speaker 2: appreciated or whatever people's issues are, you know, that can
Speaker 2: be that can that can get threatened that affinity, right,
Speaker 2: So those kinds of conversations of like, well is this
Speaker 2: important to you? No, it's not, okay, then I'm not
Speaker 2: going to go, and it maintains the affinity in the
Speaker 2: relationship rather than I'm just not going right.
Speaker 1: No, you're right, or like going and resenting. I do
Speaker 1: ask a lot if something's important, because someone one said
Speaker 1: to me years ago, Dennis, who you knew, He said,
Speaker 1: if it's important to you, it's important to me. He
Speaker 1: didn't act that way, but I liked the sentence.
Speaker 2: I do too, and I like and I like that too.
Speaker 2: So it's obligation. So you live a life obligation free, right,
Speaker 2: So you take away the victim. That's really what you're doing.
Speaker 2: Because a victim is somewhere something or someone.
Speaker 1: Smarter like the marthing, or someone's.
Speaker 2: Doing something to you. You take away the victim in
Speaker 2: the conversation, right, and then we so get into those
Speaker 2: habits of acting like victims and situations and and living
Speaker 2: life implication free. So obligation and implication free are like
Speaker 2: implication free means you know what it means about you.
Speaker 2: If I do this, I'm a good person. If I
Speaker 2: don't do this, I'm a bad person. Right, And people
Speaker 2: live mostly obligatorily.
Speaker 1: No, they want and they check the butt, they want
Speaker 1: the scorecard. It's counting, which is the opposite of a
Speaker 1: good relationship, is counting anything.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're looking to live a life you know, obligation free,
Speaker 2: implication free, and you're more generous, you're more creative, you're
Speaker 2: more connected, you're more communication and you have less noise
Speaker 2: in your head.
Speaker 1: Bravo. So we've accomplished. Okay, let's get into charm. So
Speaker 1: tell me about charming. I'm eating a little bite of
Speaker 1: my snack because I have very breakfast. Let's talk about charming.
Speaker 2: So you know, when someone says and usually charm is
Speaker 2: associated with you know, men or masculine. Let's call it
Speaker 2: that way, you know, can take it.
Speaker 1: Wow? Yeah, right, so explain that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So you know, we don't usually say the woman's charming.
Speaker 2: We will use a different term for that. Oh god,
Speaker 2: she's really gracious, she's really sweet, you know, sweet like
Speaker 2: all kinds of different things. But that's associated culturally with
Speaker 2: a man, right, and it's usually associated in a really
Speaker 2: favorable way. Right now. The thing about charm is that
Speaker 2: it's and people people don't like this, But I considered
Speaker 2: myself quite charming, you know, early on, So I figured
Speaker 2: I can get away with talking about this, right even
Speaker 2: I've got you know, it's like someone like who's who's
Speaker 2: If you've got the wound, you can really talk about
Speaker 2: the wound, right.
Speaker 1: So you probably were really charming. That's why you know
Speaker 1: about it so well? Yeah, because you would just guys,
Speaker 1: Breck was like a hotshot data models, party like a
Speaker 1: rock star, came from money, trust fun like big swinging dick.
Speaker 1: The whole thing, had a life. Life humbled you. You
Speaker 1: probably were a charming motherfucker with that money and the
Speaker 1: models and the looks and all that shit in New
Speaker 1: York City partying in La got it? Okay?
Speaker 2: Yeah, So I mean so I feel like I have
Speaker 2: a strong sense of this right now. You can also
Speaker 2: have a strong sense of how, you know how the
Speaker 2: narcissistic wound that's associated with charming right which is very
Speaker 2: you know, it's a it's a painful thing for people
Speaker 2: to say, but that's what it is. Why is it?
Speaker 2: Because it if you're a man who's incredibly charming, you
Speaker 2: are you create an addiction of meeting that kind of
Speaker 2: attention and that kind of feedback. Do you know you
Speaker 2: go to a party, you go to this and something
Speaker 2: has to be said about you.
Speaker 1: Okay, So I want to tell everybody because this was
Speaker 1: I talked about this. It's the guy who sometimes not you,
Speaker 1: but sometimes the charming is the hey Dan, how's your
Speaker 1: golf game? And like real Gregario is then at home
Speaker 1: like treating his wife like shit, or I've had that scenario.
Speaker 1: I've also had this scenario where the guy's like the bro,
Speaker 1: real bro, real friend, you know, just hugging everybody and
Speaker 1: good looking and everybody likes him and girls like it,
Speaker 1: and he's a life of the party and like the
Speaker 1: peacock like and you're right, because it is an addiction,
Speaker 1: they just go to it right away. It works so well,
Speaker 1: and go ahead.
Speaker 2: So it becomes really your go to in as a man,
Speaker 2: and and that's and you and it gets narrowed down
Speaker 2: so that becomes mostly your entire or you're you're organized
Speaker 2: around what you're driven by, you know, getting feedback for
Speaker 2: how charming you are, needing to seduce all the time,
Speaker 2: whether it's men or women. You're just you're like an
Speaker 2: animal and is constantly generating that.
Speaker 1: You're singing the karaoke song, You're doing the shots, You're
Speaker 1: a charming, the mom you got, everybody loves you.
Speaker 2: Whatever's required. If what's required is be completely quiet, what's
Speaker 2: required to be totally entertaining, what's required to be this
Speaker 2: You're you're you're managing whatever you need to do to
Speaker 2: get that feedback. Wow, so and and it and it
Speaker 2: becomes an addiction like anything else. That's why age can
Speaker 2: be really challenging for people as they you know, as
Speaker 2: they fall and they don't have the same skills, they
Speaker 2: don't do the same resources that they had. So what
Speaker 2: I all say to women, and women will say this
Speaker 2: right as well, is if you see someone who's particularly charming,
Speaker 2: run for the hills.
Speaker 1: I literally called the podcast charming is a red flag.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so run for the hills because in two years
Speaker 2: you're gonna hate this guy. You're gonna hate, You're gonna go,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna kill this guy.
Speaker 1: The very thing that you found so fascinating that the stick,
Speaker 1: this bit is gonna make you sick, it.
Speaker 2: Is, and in two years you're gonna be out of
Speaker 2: your mind. Right. So I say I say this to
Speaker 2: women when women go, you know, I'm in marrying my
Speaker 2: yoga instructor. I go. Just because he can put his
Speaker 2: you know, legs around his head doesn't mean that he's
Speaker 2: got emotional flexibility. Don't confuse those two, right. I'm not
Speaker 2: saying he doesn't. I'm saying that those are different phenomenas.
Speaker 2: There's a different photomen be meean spiritual evolution, creative evolution,
Speaker 2: emotional evolution, right, and these things so a lot of times,
Speaker 2: and that can be a highly seductive thing for you know,
Speaker 2: and and dating charm. So I'm saying most men, other
Speaker 2: men who so who have integrity, you know, a sense
Speaker 2: of themselves and a sense of you know, kind of
Speaker 2: a moral compass in terms of who they are and
Speaker 2: what they are, and they don't need all that feedback,
Speaker 2: they have a stronger sense to themselves. They can have charm,
Speaker 2: So meaning you can have charmed from a context of integrity, right,
Speaker 2: But if charm is your whole story, that's where it's problematic.
Speaker 1: It's owning you, it's wearing you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's what it has your own habit. So
Speaker 2: it doesn't mean you can't have charm. It just can't.
Speaker 2: It's got to be like anything. You've got to be
Speaker 2: able to pick it up and put it down and
Speaker 2: use it, and it's got to be more more mobile
Speaker 2: in play in all that way. And most men who
Speaker 2: have integrity and have a great deal of respect dismiss charm.
Speaker 2: They'll see other men and they'll they'll dismiss it because
Speaker 2: they can smell like it's it's self centered, it's narcissistic,
Speaker 2: it's it's superficial, it doesn't.
Speaker 1: Have enough weight love it wow.
Speaker 2: And so you've got to be interested. And this is
Speaker 2: always the game that you know, for me, loss is
Speaker 2: always the game that you're willing to lose what you
Speaker 2: consider maybe your most important asset for the possibility of
Speaker 2: your own evolution.
Speaker 1: Well, it's funny you say that, because the way I
Speaker 1: think of it is things that you're good for and
Speaker 1: things that are good for you. So I used to
Speaker 1: remember friends of our Shannon, et cetera. I used to
Speaker 1: produce events, large scale events, multimillion dollar events, the Grammy's,
Speaker 1: the Emmys, on the Rock, Alcatraz. No one was ever
Speaker 1: better at it than I was. No one you could
Speaker 1: ask the woman who ran all the events at Disney.
Speaker 1: My body line was perfect, my P and L sheet.
Speaker 1: I missed out a detail. I didn't I picked up
Speaker 1: every floral, like every chair.
Speaker 2: Like I mean, yeah, that mad that make perfect sense
Speaker 2: because I'm.
Speaker 1: Sick like so. But I was great for it. It
Speaker 1: wasn't great for me. So I had to be like
Speaker 1: you know, And that's what goes on in my work
Speaker 1: every day. Things that I'm good at, and my whole
Speaker 1: entire team relies on me for all the details in
Speaker 1: the detail of every video and every caption and all
Speaker 1: the weeds because I'm amazing at them, but they're not
Speaker 1: good for me. And it's like a discipline for the
Speaker 1: people around me. Like you guys cannot come to Mommy
Speaker 1: for every single question otherwise I cannot do what I
Speaker 1: need to do in my business. It's not good for me.
Speaker 1: So that's sort of my like cross to bear is
Speaker 1: what I'm good for, but what's not good for me?
Speaker 2: Yeah, and those are those are and they can be
Speaker 2: very different, right they can. They can be very very different. So,
Speaker 2: and that's also understanding what's bankrupt, you know as it
Speaker 2: because because you can be highly productive and have no
Speaker 2: sense of that illution. Yes, do you know what I mean?
Speaker 2: Like you know? I mean you can. You can make
Speaker 2: a billion dollars, you can do all kinds of things,
Speaker 2: and yet your sense of self, your development, you know,
Speaker 2: you're still maintaining the same You're still maintaining the same
Speaker 2: way of being because.
Speaker 1: You do the same exercise at the gym every time.
Speaker 1: My inclination is to solve the problem, is to tell
Speaker 1: you I'm dealing with the situation with this guy or
Speaker 1: with Brin's school, or with work, and go attack and
Speaker 1: produce the problem and use it like a relief effort
Speaker 1: and solve it. But I'm not growing, I'm a feeling.
Speaker 1: I'm not learning. I just know how to like wrap
Speaker 1: it up. And so Millin to my therapist, who you've met,
Speaker 1: will be like, now she's not like a how do
Speaker 1: you feel? But she doesn't really care about me, giving
Speaker 1: her like the news, sports and weather. She wants to
Speaker 1: like get to like what's going on about it?
Speaker 2: Yeah, like what what is the what is the thing
Speaker 2: that you're that you have kind of have to lose
Speaker 2: in order to gain Now, people think that they're going
Speaker 2: to lose their their essential asset, and I'm going no,
Speaker 2: that's an illusion that they The essential asset just moves
Speaker 2: into the foundation of your life. It's no longer in
Speaker 2: the foreground, right, but you have to have that noise
Speaker 2: back to noise. That noise in your head is like
Speaker 2: if you if you introduce a new possibility something and
Speaker 2: I don't care where it's an emotional possibility, like you know,
Speaker 2: I want to be I want to I want to
Speaker 2: be on time I don't know, or I want to
Speaker 2: I want to complete things. I want to what I say,
Speaker 2: I'm going to start a complete whatever you introduce or
Speaker 2: I want to be more compassionate. Whatever you might introduce,
Speaker 2: you also introduce because you wouldn't be introducing that if
Speaker 2: it was something that you didn't have. You're introducing it
Speaker 2: because it's something you don't have that you're wanting, right,
Speaker 2: And so if you're introducing that you're also introducing the loss,
Speaker 2: the loss of well, wait, may I won't I won't
Speaker 2: be able to produce over here, or I won't be
Speaker 2: effective over here, or this might you know, fall apart.
Speaker 2: So that's the fear. That's why when someone says, well,
Speaker 2: most people don't change, they're not wrong, just because what
Speaker 2: it requires to change is huge.
Speaker 1: You mean, like, I'm stopping drinking, so I'm not gonna
Speaker 1: be the life of the party anymore. I'm overweight, I'm
Speaker 1: losing weight. I'm not going to be joevial exactly.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's that Friends, that episode about fun, and I
Speaker 2: think it's fun Bobby Worth, right, Oh god, Bobby's coming over,
Speaker 2: you know, because he is an alcoholic and he was
Speaker 2: hysterical and now and he's no longer drinking and he's
Speaker 2: not fun anymore, right, which is not accurate. It's not
Speaker 2: you know, lots of people have been sober for years
Speaker 2: who are incredibly entertaining and great and creative at all
Speaker 2: and more productive than ever. So it's not a function
Speaker 2: of that, but it is a function of not being
Speaker 2: afraid to lose. And I think and I look at
Speaker 2: that as one of the major themes of evolution, right,
Speaker 2: that you're willing in some area to you know, to
Speaker 2: lose in a powerful, profound way.
Speaker 1: Okay, so now I have two little things. So the
Speaker 1: two things I want to talk about are something you
Speaker 1: said recently about people don't come batteries are not included
Speaker 1: the way that we start like catastrophizing and thinking about something.
Speaker 1: But they're not this, but they're this, or they're different
Speaker 1: than the last person. And I was with and like,
Speaker 1: and you've said, like battery, people don't come with batteries.
Speaker 1: That's one concept, and then the other one is like
Speaker 1: I don't think this is just like a bit. But
Speaker 1: when I was talking to a writer who works for
Speaker 1: Fortune magazine last night, this woman Diane Brady, and she
Speaker 1: was talking really intimately about the difference between extroverts and
Speaker 1: introverts as it pertains to being a CEO, and she
Speaker 1: was like, I'm an extrovert. She knew who she was,
Speaker 1: and she was like, the pandemic killed me. I was
Speaker 1: like wanting to like go talk to like essential essential worker. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: she was like I wanted to walk out. And for me,
Speaker 1: I was like I was a in a like blanket.
Speaker 1: I extended the pandemic two years by that behavior like
Speaker 1: it gave me license to keep using it as an
Speaker 1: excuse to never leave the house. So and then she
Speaker 1: was talking about how entrepreneurs introverts are very good entrepreneurs
Speaker 1: because they get really deep and granular and extroverts don't
Speaker 1: have have more difficult time focusing. They may be good
Speaker 1: at knowing a lot of different things, maybe at the
Speaker 1: market about so many different companies and different topics, but
Speaker 1: they don't they have a difficulty focusing.
Speaker 2: I think that's a really use just just to put
Speaker 2: some you know, parentheses around it. I think that's I
Speaker 2: think it's really astute in terms of introverts and extroverts
Speaker 2: that if you look at CEO, someone who's doing all
Speaker 2: the operations and managing all those operations and managing people, yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, they're mostly extroverts. They have that ability visionaries,
Speaker 2: you know, founders, entrepreneurs, they're more introverted. They're like, you know,
Speaker 2: that's a very that's a that's more of a thing.
Speaker 2: They wouldn't be running and managing a bunch of people.
Speaker 2: So that's why when I when I look at you know,
Speaker 2: like when Elon Musk kind of took over twitteratent is
Speaker 2: not his you know, he's an inventor, right.
Speaker 1: And what are you? I'm totally an introvert and people
Speaker 1: are shocked by that, but I can't. I hate managing
Speaker 1: people from the so I'm the same way. I'm a
Speaker 1: complete introvert.
Speaker 2: Okay, interesting, I'm a complete and everybody says, so I'm
Speaker 2: much more like the pandemic. I thrived in the pandemic
Speaker 2: and and zoom became everything. So everybody, even I always say,
Speaker 2: an act of love is that you don't invite me anywhere, right,
Speaker 2: so you.
Speaker 1: Cancel on me?
Speaker 2: Right, So, so all of those that's that's but being creative, generative,
Speaker 2: you know, collaborative and making something happen. Those that's you know,
Speaker 2: that's where I thrive. And you don't want me running
Speaker 2: your company.
Speaker 1: But this woman said that that that they draw upon
Speaker 1: each other like, well, it's interesting though, because I find
Speaker 1: that people. I've had people gravitate towards me because of
Speaker 1: my like the light and the way that I am,
Speaker 1: like my passion, which isn't about being an extrovert, and
Speaker 1: sometimes they'll like dim my light as a result. It's
Speaker 1: kind of a different thing. But I'm thinking who is
Speaker 1: attracted to who introverts are attracted to extroverts or extroverts
Speaker 1: because are two extroverts are not the best combination, right,
Speaker 1: because you can't focus.
Speaker 2: Well, well, you don't necessarily want to, you know when
Speaker 2: when you're just back to the whole idea of knowing
Speaker 2: your position, which you kind of started with, like yeah,
Speaker 2: and knowing what your contribution is and people wanting to
Speaker 2: be what they're not. Right, you know, this is really understanding.
Speaker 2: You know how you where you fully express yourself and
Speaker 2: what does that look like? And just like in a relationship,
Speaker 2: if if you have two people the same issues, you
Speaker 2: know that's problematic and you know, meaning like oh we're
Speaker 2: going to run out of money, Yeah, we're going to die.
Speaker 2: You don't want those two things or like god, look
Speaker 2: out fat i am, look out a look at my butt.
Speaker 2: You don't want both those all those issues colliding. You
Speaker 2: want them missing. And that's the same with assets. When
Speaker 2: you build a team, you know, the the CEO is
Speaker 2: not the is not the CTO, and the CTO is
Speaker 2: not the CEO, and the and the founders and the
Speaker 2: visionaries not and they're all they're all And building a
Speaker 2: profound championship team is understanding each person playing their position
Speaker 2: perfectly and the intersect.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you could be in the I've had pe someone
Speaker 1: who's seems who's in the wrong seat, but and they're
Speaker 1: great in the right seat.
Speaker 2: Like absolutely, just a little exactly.
Speaker 1: Okay, you could have someone who seems terrible because they're
Speaker 1: in the wrong fucking seat. But if they're loyal and
Speaker 1: seems smart enough, you should play musical chairs. And what's
Speaker 1: interesting is that, So I'm at this Fortune event last night.
Speaker 1: I'm sitting at the table with a woman very high
Speaker 1: up at General Motors and another and we're next to uh,
Speaker 1: Josh Kushner, uh, and the guy who is the CEO,
Speaker 1: Sebastian of hult Renfrew, like major people. And this woman
Speaker 1: Diane Brady next to me, who had an interesting conversation
Speaker 1: with journalists and she's at Fortune. Now that's her, that's her.
Speaker 1: She's the one who said it. But to be honest,
Speaker 1: I have never heard anyone use it in human resources
Speaker 1: and in staffing and in executive searches. And they should,
Speaker 1: like you're not allowed to ask someone how old they are,
Speaker 1: but you should be you should actually do the emotionally
Speaker 1: intelligent conversation in staffing and ask are you an introvise?
Speaker 1: This is no wrong answer, but here's the here's the quiz,
Speaker 1: or give them the quiz, like it's like an IQ
Speaker 1: quiz because it's true, Like I have been in relationships
Speaker 1: with introverts many times because I'm attracted to someone similar
Speaker 1: to me because they're gonna say I don't want to
Speaker 1: go out either. But it's bad for me. It's bad
Speaker 1: for me, and I haven't realized that because it's like
Speaker 1: I get into like sort of like there's like a
Speaker 1: film on us. It's like stale.
Speaker 2: Understanding, you know, understanding and the one hundred of nuances
Speaker 2: that go to those kind of headlines intovert an extrovert
Speaker 2: r because underneath those two things are tons of nuances that, yeah,
Speaker 2: that someone should use this as some sort of scrutiny
Speaker 2: in terms of discerning like, well is this person the
Speaker 2: right position? I mean, I'm doing that all day long.
Speaker 2: In terms of subtle pivot. It's like just a little
Speaker 2: subtle pivot and changes is a game changer with that
Speaker 2: person or a dramatic pivot, right, Yeah.
Speaker 1: But I think in this case the label is important
Speaker 1: because I don't think that the average person if I
Speaker 1: were applying for a job. They would not think that
Speaker 1: I was an introvert.
Speaker 2: No, no, no, no, they wouldn't. They wouldn't have no
Speaker 2: idea you.
Speaker 1: Too, if someone were hiring you, Breck, they would.
Speaker 2: Not No, no, absolutely right.
Speaker 1: So they might think you could manage bunch of people.
Speaker 1: They might think you could be the head. You know.
Speaker 2: You know what I mean, I've done that. When I'm
Speaker 2: pitching something that I really want you to take over this,
Speaker 2: I go, that's a lesson you want me doing exactly,
Speaker 2: And I say that directly. You know that's not I'm
Speaker 2: not I'm not doing that, right.
Speaker 1: But that's because also you won't do obligation.
Speaker 2: Yes, so, but I was saying about Bethane. When you're
Speaker 2: seeing being attracted to your light, that is what. That's
Speaker 2: what someone who's an entrepreneur, visionary, you know, someone who
Speaker 2: like you. People know that shit's going to happen over there.
Speaker 2: This is something. This is you know, there's something creative,
Speaker 2: something innovative, something will happen that will translate into, you know,
Speaker 2: into the world. Right, So I think people know that, right.
Speaker 1: And I get vampired and I don't even realize it
Speaker 1: is and then you.
Speaker 2: Need to know who Then you need to know, like
Speaker 2: who are you going to allow do that, because they
Speaker 2: have to be complementary in terms of feeding you as
Speaker 2: much as you feed that. Right, it's a it's that's
Speaker 2: part of the dance.
Speaker 1: And by the way, that's a thing. That's another construct
Speaker 1: that like could be a chapter in a book that
Speaker 1: I never have thought about that and this age I've
Speaker 1: never thought about that. I'm gonna draw certain people, but
Speaker 1: if they're if we're not gonna be playing tennis where
Speaker 1: I'm playing with a better tennis player and they're just
Speaker 1: gonna draw off of me, but I'm not getting anything positive,
Speaker 1: it's gonna kill me. And it's happened like it actually
Speaker 1: you feel like you're just light is dimming. It's actually
Speaker 1: happened to me.
Speaker 2: It's wild and that I mean, I'm possibly I don't
Speaker 2: know if it's actually, you know, completely true. But that's
Speaker 2: an age thing also where you then know that because
Speaker 2: mostly you're just gonna you're gonna draw in everything because
Speaker 2: that's what the light does. It'll draw in all kinds
Speaker 2: of things. And then the ability to discern who you
Speaker 2: actually collaborate with, who you're with, what.
Speaker 1: You're gonna do Mark that's exactly. My biggest problem. Literally,
Speaker 1: access is my number one problem. Everyone around me. We
Speaker 1: have to go on an access diet. Two things. Having
Speaker 1: too many ideas is number one. But access it's insane.
Speaker 1: Like I'll talk, I'll be giving my phone number to
Speaker 1: the person that's bringing the ice bucket to the table
Speaker 1: because they're like fun and they were so good at it,
Speaker 1: like and people around me. But then to everybody in
Speaker 1: business and everybody in charity and people around me like, stop,
Speaker 1: we're on an access you can't know too much.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think I do think that's a function
Speaker 2: of a of age and wisdom where you just have
Speaker 2: the ability to discern and that and that you start doing.
Speaker 2: It's like one action impacts one hundred actions rather than
Speaker 2: a hundred actions impact one hundred actions. Right, you really
Speaker 2: use your leverage and your understanding and your discernment and
Speaker 2: you and you honor the you know your capacity and
Speaker 2: what you have to offer. I mean, I'm saying that
Speaker 2: all the time. Like, you know, I remember years ago.
Speaker 2: It's a it's a crazy story, but I remember this
Speaker 2: person came to me and I don't know they were
Speaker 2: kind of they were a client, but they said, I
Speaker 2: really want to be. I really want to be friends
Speaker 2: with you, brick correct, Like, he said, what are you seven?
Speaker 2: It's an interesting thing like seven year olds do? I said,
Speaker 2: He goes, I really want to be friends with you.
Speaker 2: And I said, I can either tell you the truth
Speaker 2: or nor your phone call. Which one do you want?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 2: And he said, okay, tell me the truth. I go,
Speaker 2: I would never be friends with you, and he said
Speaker 2: what I said, you understand my friendships are based on
Speaker 2: collaborative things. That doesn't mean emergencies don't happen. That doesn't
Speaker 2: mean we're not there for each other. It means that
Speaker 2: you know, we're not there's no draining of each other.
Speaker 2: And I said, you would be draining the hell out
Speaker 2: of me, right, And they said there'd be not enough
Speaker 2: that you could bring that would actually, you know, change that.
Speaker 2: So why don't you just keep coming to me until
Speaker 2: you can be your own best friend? Okay? I like,
Speaker 2: so that's so it's understanding, you know that, not from
Speaker 2: an egotistical place. It's more from really understanding.
Speaker 1: And so it's actually selfless because you're being honest, and
Speaker 1: it's useful for him.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's useful to see like, really, well, what is
Speaker 2: it about me. That's doing that right, where's the neediness
Speaker 2: in me? That's you know, and that's that's U telling
Speaker 2: complete Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I could talk to Breck forever, and I'm
Speaker 1: like exasperated today. I'm a little manic because there's so
Speaker 1: many topics that I want to get you guys in
Speaker 1: two with him, and next time there'll be ten more.
Speaker 1: So I'm reminding myself the next time, I want to
Speaker 1: talk about intervening in our own behavior. And also that
Speaker 1: Breck has said batteries not including batteries are not included
Speaker 1: in people like how we expect to either fix someone
Speaker 1: or them to be everything, or to just start criticizing
Speaker 1: what they are today when they're a fully formed human
Speaker 1: being when you meet them, and also catastrophizing. So I
Speaker 1: want to talk to you about a lot of things.
Speaker 1: It's too many.
Speaker 2: There also just to add, I mean, there's so many
Speaker 2: things you're right that can go on forever. And that's
Speaker 2: the whole nature of just when we're talking about partnerships
Speaker 2: or relationships, most people commit to their expectations, they don't
Speaker 2: really commit to the to the actual person.
Speaker 1: They don't really all right, So that we're going to
Speaker 1: get into that all right, So we got to do
Speaker 1: this more. I could go for days, but you got
Speaker 1: to get off.
Speaker 2: All right, all right, great talking, all.
Speaker 1: Right, Oh my God, beyond bye Breck.
Speaker 2: After to a w B after