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Speaker 2: Dozens of reporters also at the White House today for
Speaker 2: an awfully important meeting. It may not generate a lot
Speaker 2: of news, but it's a big deal in this country
Speaker 2: when we talk about continuity of government, the peaceful transfer
Speaker 2: of power. Yes, the transition has officially begun, not just
Speaker 2: naming names, but Donald Trump in the Oval office with
Speaker 2: Joe Biden. And that's why we bring in my colleague
Speaker 2: Kaylee Lines, who's on the North lawn and has been
Speaker 2: out there for the duration with some interesting activity. Kaylee,
Speaker 2: I don't know if we're going to get some comments
Speaker 2: from Donald Trump at the state out location in the
Speaker 2: driveway or what you can tell us, but.
Speaker 3: Speak to the importance of this meeting.
Speaker 4: Well, the optics, of course, are incredibly important here, Joe.
Speaker 4: Perhaps the most important part of the meeting itself is
Speaker 4: the fact that the meeting is happening at all. Is
Speaker 4: we didn't get this in twenty twenty, Donald Trump did
Speaker 4: not extend this kind of offer to Joe Biden after
Speaker 4: he beat him in the last cycle, still, of course,
Speaker 4: was contesting the results at that time. But Joe Biden
Speaker 4: has welcomed Donald Trump here to the White House, and
Speaker 4: he congratulated him on his victory, said he will be
Speaker 4: supporting him throughout this transfer of power, that they intend
Speaker 4: to accommodate anything he needs. While Donald Trump, for his part,
Speaker 4: said that while politics is not always a nice world,
Speaker 4: that it is a nice world today, thanking Joe Biden
Speaker 4: for welcoming him to the White House. I would point
Speaker 4: out I am one of potentially hundreds of people that
Speaker 4: are here gathered Joe waiting to see if the President
Speaker 4: elect emerges from this meeting and speaks to the press.
Speaker 4: Is they did not take questions from the press when
Speaker 4: they first met in that public portion of the meeting.
Speaker 4: Once the spray left, we aren't really sure what will
Speaker 4: happen behind closed doors. We do know it is not
Speaker 4: just Trump and Biden speaking to each other, but they're
Speaker 4: a respective chief of staff or chief of staff designate
Speaker 4: in the case of Susie Wiles and Jeff Zionce are
Speaker 4: also there with them in that meeting, and it right
Speaker 4: now is only up for a question what they are discussing.
Speaker 4: But we'll see if Donald Trump himself is willing to
Speaker 4: shed a little light on that later on.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll be deeply curious. We'll have eyes on the stick,
Speaker 2: says they say. Kaylee, talk to us.
Speaker 3: About Elon Musk. We saw him over at the hotel.
Speaker 2: He andally came to Washington today with Donald Trump, and
Speaker 2: there was some talk that he actually might go to
Speaker 2: the White House. Apparently that did not happen, but he
Speaker 2: is going to be now officially as of last night,
Speaker 2: working with this administration.
Speaker 4: Indeed co heading the Department of Government Efficiency, alongside for
Speaker 4: bak Ramaswami, who of course ran against Trump during the
Speaker 4: primary campaign. DOGE, as it will be called, will focus
Speaker 4: on or I guess we might call it an Elon
Speaker 4: Musk might call it as well. We'll be focusing on
Speaker 4: trying essentially to trim the fat, cut down on spending,
Speaker 4: deregulate as much as possible, or really make recommendations as
Speaker 4: for how to do so. Because, of course, Joe, you
Speaker 4: and I both know well that while they can suggest
Speaker 4: all they want in terms of where spending should be cut.
Speaker 4: The actual power of the purse lies with Congress. It
Speaker 4: is Congress that is going to have to actually allocate
Speaker 4: the funds, appropriate them to the different government agencies. So
Speaker 4: there's only so much Elon Musk is really going to
Speaker 4: be able to wield in terms of influence. But his
Speaker 4: very presence here in Washington today does show just how
Speaker 4: close the richest man in the world has become to
Speaker 4: one of the most powerful men in the world, Donald Trump,
Speaker 4: who's about to become the forty seventh President of the
Speaker 4: United States.
Speaker 2: All Right, Bloomberg's Kaylee lines at the White House. Will
Speaker 2: see you back here in the newsroom, Kayley a little
Speaker 2: bit later on, as we add the voice of Barbara Perry.
Speaker 3: This is a significant.
Speaker 2: Moment, regardless of who you prefer, Trump or Biden, an
Speaker 2: important moment for our democracy and just for the history
Speaker 2: of the presidency. To see these two men together after
Speaker 2: such a vicious campaign, one that of course ended with
Speaker 2: Kamala Harris at the top of the ticket, not Joe Biden.
Speaker 2: She's professor in Presidential Studies at the Unionity of Virginia's
Speaker 2: Miller Center, and we try to reach Barbara in times
Speaker 2: of historical significance, Professor, it's great to have you back
Speaker 2: your thoughts as you saw these two men sitting down
Speaker 2: today inside the White House.
Speaker 5: Great to be with you, Joe. Yes, this is a
Speaker 5: historic moment for a lot of reasons. This is a
Speaker 5: fairly modern event whereby a sitting president welcomes the president's
Speaker 5: elect to the White House. And we have to remember
Speaker 5: that is in part because travel was not always easy
Speaker 5: in our pastime. So the one that I remember, if
Speaker 5: not starting this tradition, but certainly carrying on past it
Speaker 5: was Eisenhower meeting with Kennedy, and there was not a
Speaker 5: lot of love lost between them, but certainly Kennedy, as
Speaker 5: a junior officer in World War Two, respected the five
Speaker 5: star general and his commander in chief, Dwight Eisenhower. So
Speaker 5: they had a meeting at the White House. And again
Speaker 5: this has continued accepted was said that was not a
Speaker 5: courtesy that was afforded by Donald Trump to Joe Biden
Speaker 5: four years ago because Donald Trump didn't believe, or at
Speaker 5: least said he didn't believe that Joe Biden had won
Speaker 5: the election. So it's historic because it's symbolic of the
Speaker 5: passing of the torch. But there's also content in the
Speaker 5: sense that that symbolism has content, and it's good for
Speaker 5: the American people to see a smooth transition, and it's
Speaker 5: good for the world to see that as well.
Speaker 6: Well.
Speaker 3: It is good to see.
Speaker 2: I wonder how Donald Trump will be accepted, if not
Speaker 2: ever in the club of former presidents seeing him up
Speaker 2: there today.
Speaker 3: Is there ever going to be an.
Speaker 2: Event where it's Bush, Obama, Trump, Biden standing on a
Speaker 2: stage doing something or is he singular.
Speaker 3: In that way?
Speaker 5: He's singular and unprecedented in a host of ways that
Speaker 5: we've been covering now since certainly twenty fifteen. As it
Speaker 5: relates to the presidential politics, one opportunity will be the
Speaker 5: inauguration itself. Again, he did not afford the long standing
Speaker 5: courtesy of the outgoing president being president at even though
Speaker 5: he had lost the incoming president's inauguration, So that will
Speaker 5: be a test that I'm sure Joe Biden will pass
Speaker 5: that as the statesman that he's been for fifty years
Speaker 5: in politics. But I think the next opportunity when we
Speaker 5: will see something like that potentially would be the opening
Speaker 5: of the it's not being called Presidential Library, the Obama
Speaker 5: Presidential Center in Chicago, which should come up in the
Speaker 5: next year or two. And that is typically when all
Speaker 5: the former presidents come for that opening of a former
Speaker 5: president's library or center, and usually all the first Ladies
Speaker 5: come as well, and they are all pictured as a group,
Speaker 5: first the President's then the First Ladies on stage, and
Speaker 5: so we will see maybe this is a different Donald
Speaker 5: Trump presidency. It's hard to imagine that his personality will
Speaker 5: change over this, but we're seeing a different kind of
Speaker 5: transition with his appointments. So maybe he will be a
Speaker 5: different style president from his first term. Remains to be seen.
Speaker 2: Well, we're going to find out together here. Noteworthy, the
Speaker 2: Milennia Trump was not with him on the visit today.
Speaker 2: She is not at the White House, of course, having
Speaker 2: lived there. I do want to ask you, though, about
Speaker 2: what Joe Biden has in front of him as the
Speaker 2: lame duck president. We just ran a headline, Barbara that
Speaker 2: he's going to be meeting with President she on Saturday
Speaker 2: on the sidelines of the APEX summit in Peru. What
Speaker 2: is the point of these meetings? If Donald Trump is
Speaker 2: already meeting with world leaders to set up the next administration, what.
Speaker 5: Will come from this, Yes, and we should say that
Speaker 5: the first appointees or nominees for the Donald Trump second
Speaker 5: administration are almost all very hawkish on China, so unlike
Speaker 5: the Obama administration in which Joe Biden served as Vice
Speaker 5: president for eight years, in which there was an attempt
Speaker 5: to as they say, the Asia and Pivot obviously to
Speaker 5: stay strong against China and tried to push through the
Speaker 5: free trade pack that would keep a strong market against
Speaker 5: China in the Pacific and on the Pacific coastlines that
Speaker 5: obviously went away with the anti free trade movement of
Speaker 5: the first foul Trump administration. So I think that what
Speaker 5: Joe Biden will be doing for China and our relations
Speaker 5: with China and President she as well as around the world,
Speaker 5: is to say that there will be a peaceful transition
Speaker 5: of power and that the United States remains powerful in
Speaker 5: both military and market terms, and that no one should
Speaker 5: try anything conflictual in this period of a lane up
Speaker 5: Joe Biden presidency.
Speaker 2: You mentioned some of the appointments we've heard about. The
Speaker 2: others are being reported on as part of the transition. Here,
Speaker 2: Barbara Perry, the one that's blowing a lot of minds
Speaker 2: today is Pete Hegseth, who helps the host of Box
Speaker 2: and Friends on the weekends. He's a combat veteran, not
Speaker 2: on any short list, has already publicly pledged to fire
Speaker 2: the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, And I
Speaker 2: can go down the list with a lot of these.
Speaker 3: Here.
Speaker 2: We can talk about Elon Musk in this new office
Speaker 2: aimed at cutting spending the Department of Government efficiency. We
Speaker 2: can talk about the idea of Mike Huckabee going to
Speaker 2: Israel as our ambassador, an evangelical ambassador in Israel. When
Speaker 2: you add all of these up, you look at the
Speaker 2: mosaic of names that we're putting together here. Does this
Speaker 2: feel like a different administration than the first time around?
Speaker 3: Or more of the same.
Speaker 5: Again, I think going back to Donald Trump's style, we'll
Speaker 5: see if that changes at all or if there's more
Speaker 5: of the same. I think what's very different is people
Speaker 5: have been pointing out about these nominations and appointees who
Speaker 5: will probably those who have to be confirmed will no
Speaker 5: doubt stay all through the Senate, well unless there's something
Speaker 5: desperately wrong in their personal backgrounds. But I would say
Speaker 5: that what we're seeing is the number one criterion is
Speaker 5: loyalty to both now future and former President Trump. And
Speaker 5: then I would also say loyalty to the approach to
Speaker 5: foreign affairs. Again, hawkishness against probably the Palestinians, hawkishness against
Speaker 5: the Chinese, perhaps cozying up with Putin as well as
Speaker 5: the North Korean dictator. So they are going to be changes,
Speaker 5: I think, along those lines in foreign policy, and then
Speaker 5: in domestic policy, it's going to be the twenty twenty
Speaker 5: five approach from the Heritage Foundation, that platform of Project
Speaker 5: twenty twenty five. These people were, no doubt have to
Speaker 5: proclaim that they are loyal to that and to President Trump,
Speaker 5: and we'll see if that can carry itself out in reality.
Speaker 2: Barbara Perry, Professor in Presidential Studies, University of Virginia's Miller's Center.
Speaker 3: Thank you for the insights. As always.
Speaker 2: Senator John Barrosso elected the next Senate Republican whip as expected,
Speaker 2: fun as leader.
Speaker 3: This is Bloomberg.
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast kens
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Speaker 3: Big day here in Washington, d C.
Speaker 2: With a lot of headlines flying if you're just joining us.
Speaker 2: Donald Trump is at the White House right now. In fact,
Speaker 2: it appears he might be leaving as we speak, just
Speaker 2: wrapping his meeting with Joe Biden in the Oval Office.
Speaker 2: It does not appear he's going to come to the
Speaker 2: reporter stakeout in the driveway, but if he does.
Speaker 3: We will let you know.
Speaker 2: We brought you some very brief remarks from both Biden
Speaker 2: and Trump sitting in front of the fireplace in the
Speaker 2: Oval Office, pledging a smooth as Donald Trump said, so
Speaker 2: smooth transition and continuity of government, of course important to
Speaker 2: Joe Biden.
Speaker 3: Today.
Speaker 2: It's unclear what they discussed after reporters were ushered out.
Speaker 3: Of the room.
Speaker 2: Then we've got what's going on on Capitol Hill, where
Speaker 2: Donald Trump was earlier today spoke with House Republicans endorsed
Speaker 2: the Speaker, Mike Johnson, of course, set to maintain a
Speaker 2: very thin majority in the House in what appears to
Speaker 2: be a red sweep across the White House, the Senate,
Speaker 2: the House of Representatives, and We just got word earlier
Speaker 2: this hour, just as we took air shortly after noontime Eastern,
Speaker 2: that John Thune will be the next Senate Republican leader.
Speaker 2: The vote twenty nine, twenty four. The headline says it
Speaker 2: all on the terminal Steve Dennis Dan Flatley, Senate Republicans
Speaker 2: reject Musk's pick elevate Thun de leader.
Speaker 5: Yes.
Speaker 2: Remember, Elon Musk was pushing for Rick Scott, Florida Senator,
Speaker 2: who did not make it past the first ballot. After
Speaker 2: all the uproar over the weekend by Tucker Carlson, Elon
Speaker 2: Musk and the MAGA community on social media, it was
Speaker 2: not enough to propel Rick Scott to win. Here, So
Speaker 2: John thun and Mike Johnson are your two congressional leaders.
Speaker 2: Right as Chuck Schumer steps back in the Senate having
Speaker 2: seen the chamber flip, our political panel is with us
Speaker 2: to talk about an important day in politics. Lisa Camuso Miller,
Speaker 2: former r NC communications director, host of the Friday Reporter
Speaker 2: podcast Republican Strategist, is here, and Adam Hodge as well,
Speaker 2: former spokesperson for the National Security Counselor in the White House.
Speaker 2: He's managing director now Bully Pulpit International Democratic strategist. Great
Speaker 2: to see you both here, Lisa, I'll start with you,
Speaker 2: as not only a Republican but one who spent many
Speaker 2: years on Capitol Hill. What do you think of the
Speaker 2: selection here and how easy or not will it be
Speaker 2: for John thun to work with Mike Johnson and Donald Trump.
Speaker 7: Well, I mean living in different times these days, and
Speaker 7: so I think that everyone on the on the Hill
Speaker 7: is going to have to work in a way that
Speaker 7: is going to be a little bit different.
Speaker 8: Right.
Speaker 7: The good news I think for the Senate is that
Speaker 7: John Thune is someone who understands fundamentally how the Senate works,
Speaker 7: how the process works. But he's also someone that will
Speaker 7: work together with the House and with the White House
Speaker 7: in order to advance change and to get legislative action passed.
Speaker 8: And so that to me is a good sign.
Speaker 7: It's also he's a he's long been an ally and
Speaker 7: a friend to the to the House and someone that
Speaker 7: understands fundamentally how the process works.
Speaker 8: So to me, this is good news.
Speaker 7: It also to me signals that the party itself, no
Speaker 7: matter how much this is true also for the Republican
Speaker 7: National Committee, no matter how much outside factors try to
Speaker 7: play in the election of the various options and processes
Speaker 7: inside of Washington, the voters definitely decide who comes here,
Speaker 7: but the insiders, those inside the Senate definitely still decide
Speaker 7: who becomes the leader in the in the in the
Speaker 7: in the chamber.
Speaker 2: I guess both chambers are showing their stripes here adam
Speaker 2: realizing they're red, but they approach things a little bit differently.
Speaker 2: And part of the concern going into this, those who
Speaker 2: supported Rick Scott were concerned that some senators were offended.
Speaker 2: They don't like to be bullied, they don't like to
Speaker 2: be told what to do, and that may have actually
Speaker 2: helped John Thune win.
Speaker 3: What do you think about this results, Well, I think.
Speaker 9: It's encouraging that there will be a little bit of
Speaker 9: sanity within the Senate Republican Conference. Look, John Thune, he's
Speaker 9: been in a leadership fixture for many, many years.
Speaker 10: He knows how the body operates. I think he has
Speaker 10: a chance to.
Speaker 9: Try to work also with Democrats in the minority, to
Speaker 9: try to get things done. We're going There's been a
Speaker 9: lot of things on his plate, from you know, getting
Speaker 9: the tax reform done, raising the debt ceiling, you know,
Speaker 9: funding the government, as you were talking about earlier this hour,
Speaker 9: so that there's some real big issues on his plate.
Speaker 9: And I think it's also a really smart reflection on
Speaker 9: the inability of outside forces in the online groups to
Speaker 9: force the Senate to fall at that they're bidding. I'm
Speaker 9: reminded similarly, when Jim Jordan made his push to replace
Speaker 9: and then to become House Speaker, it was all kinds
Speaker 9: of noise from the MAGA movement and folks online to
Speaker 9: try to get him installed as a speaker, and that
Speaker 9: failed as well. Members of Congress are going to do
Speaker 9: what they think is in the best interest of their conference,
Speaker 9: and I think that's why I think you ended up
Speaker 9: seeing the vote go pretty handily towards Thune on the
Speaker 9: first ballot, and why he ended up getting elected as
Speaker 9: a Senate majority leader.
Speaker 2: Lisa, what do you think of Elon Musk showing up today?
Speaker 2: It was actually in the room for this when Donald
Speaker 2: Trump went to meet with House Republicans.
Speaker 3: You used to work for a Speaker of the House.
Speaker 3: You know what this meeting is like.
Speaker 2: When everybody comes back from the election, they all get
Speaker 2: back together here for the lame duck and talk about
Speaker 2: the way forward, the leaders that they want to pick,
Speaker 2: and so forth.
Speaker 3: Elon Musk was in the room.
Speaker 2: Apparently he didn't say anything, did a lot of waving,
Speaker 2: But there's a report that came out of thereafter Lauren
Speaker 2: Windsor tweeting. A senator told me that Elon Musk is
Speaker 2: threatening to fund a primary challenge to any House Republican
Speaker 2: who does not fall in line with Trump's agenda. How
Speaker 2: important of a role is Elon Musk playing in Washington
Speaker 2: right now?
Speaker 8: Well, you know, I think it remains to be seen. Joe.
Speaker 7: This is to me one of those things where I'm
Speaker 7: not sure there's enough room in Washington, or really in
Speaker 7: the globe for the two egos.
Speaker 8: That are going to be competing for one another.
Speaker 7: So I think right now it's very interesting to see
Speaker 7: that someone like Elon Musk wants to play a role.
Speaker 7: But look, he played a role in the disruption of Twitter, right,
Speaker 7: he played a role in the disruption of a lot
Speaker 7: of other That is primarily his role in the world
Speaker 7: right is to be a disruptor and an agent of change.
Speaker 7: And it also is the exact role that Donald Trump
Speaker 7: plays in not only the Republican Party, but in the
Speaker 7: American culture, right. So these two forces as they sort
Speaker 7: of work around one another, are going to be very
Speaker 7: interesting to watch to me, because Elon Musk did definitely
Speaker 7: try to play very much in Pennsylvania, rewarding those who
Speaker 7: would come out and support Donald Trump with resources and
Speaker 7: even a bounty to win.
Speaker 8: So it's going to be interesting to watch how that
Speaker 8: all plays out.
Speaker 7: But I also think too that it's also a signal
Speaker 7: to the House, the house that I once knew, that
Speaker 7: I once worked in, that things are going.
Speaker 8: To work very differently.
Speaker 7: And that's I think, sort of reflective of what you're
Speaker 7: seeing even in the picks for the cabinet, Joe, is
Speaker 7: that we are not We can't apply the old playbook
Speaker 7: to the playbook that's being used today. This is very
Speaker 7: different Washington. This is very different governing, and it's going
Speaker 7: to be the way things are going to move now
Speaker 7: for the next four years.
Speaker 2: Really interesting at your thoughts on this. I don't know
Speaker 2: that Elon Musk was on your dance card for the
Speaker 2: new Congress, never mind the new White House. But he
Speaker 2: is going to be working with Donald Trump, who made
Speaker 2: this official last night, a new Department of Government Efficiency.
Speaker 2: Remember they came up with this with while they were
Speaker 2: spitballing in their interview on Twitter spaces. So cut government
Speaker 2: spending to streamline bureaucracy. If Avake Ramaswami is going to
Speaker 2: help run this thing used to work in the White House.
Speaker 2: This is not an official government agency. So is this
Speaker 2: just window dressing? How would it work?
Speaker 10: Well, first, let's say this tip back. I think it's
Speaker 10: a bit hilarious that they have a Department of Government
Speaker 10: Efficiency and have two people running it.
Speaker 9: But putting that aside, I think it's also you know,
Speaker 9: an exam way for them to get around, you know,
Speaker 9: the some of the ethics rules within the White House
Speaker 9: we have should ask serious questions. I mean, if you
Speaker 9: go in to work in the White House, you have
Speaker 9: to submit your financials, you have to go through a
Speaker 9: whole background check. There's a whole bunch of questions that
Speaker 9: they ask about your you know, drug use and everything else.
Speaker 10: And that's something that if you're an outside you.
Speaker 9: Know, government uh employee ors or someone who's supporting in
Speaker 9: this weird structure, you're not subject to those ethics rules.
Speaker 9: And so there's real you could quit I think questions
Speaker 9: to be asked there.
Speaker 10: It's gonna be very hard to one put forward ideas.
Speaker 10: You've got to get them passed. And we know the
Speaker 10: House majority. If it as it.
Speaker 9: Looks like Republicans end up taking the House, you're gonna
Speaker 9: have one to two votes, maybe maybe three vote margin
Speaker 9: to get all those things past. Is gonna That's gonna
Speaker 9: be a lot of capital that Speaker Mike Johnson, if
Speaker 9: he's Speaker, will have to.
Speaker 10: Have to spend.
Speaker 9: And that's before we even get to whether he'll even
Speaker 9: have a lot of these members who Trump is plucking
Speaker 9: for his cabinet, who will.
Speaker 10: Even then whether there will be new members to replace them.
Speaker 9: So I think there's a lot of kind of questions
Speaker 9: to be asked about how quickly this will go into
Speaker 9: effect and whether the you know, the Doge structure will
Speaker 9: actually end up living up to its name.
Speaker 2: I love that you're calling it that. I mean, this
Speaker 2: is like, this is for real. Every time we say
Speaker 2: Doge Lisa producer James retirement account goes up.
Speaker 10: I should know better.
Speaker 2: Elon Musk said it could become the Manhattan Project of
Speaker 2: our time.
Speaker 3: Is that what you expect? Lisa Kamussa Miller.
Speaker 7: You know, Look, I think Joe that we need to stay,
Speaker 7: stay stort of steady on this. I think Elon Musk
Speaker 7: would love for it to be the Manhattan Project.
Speaker 8: In his time. But you know, to Adam's point that he.
Speaker 7: Made about all of the processes that are in place,
Speaker 7: don't forget that the last time Trump was in office,
Speaker 7: he circumvented a.
Speaker 8: Lot of those processes. So I do think.
Speaker 7: That this very well could be the kind of disruptor
Speaker 7: that Elon Musk and vi vaik Ramaswami and the President
Speaker 7: himself want to see happen.
Speaker 8: They want to affect change. They feel like the election.
Speaker 7: Results absolutely galvanize that for them as a pathway forward. People,
Speaker 7: regardless of all of the issues that surround Donald Trump,
Speaker 7: are anxious and willing for change, and I think that
Speaker 7: this is absolutely an indication that that is the direction
Speaker 7: that this administration is going to take.
Speaker 2: Well, there's a lot there, Adam. Elon Musk says, this
Speaker 2: will send shock waves through the system. This is a
Speaker 2: quote and anyone involved in government waste, which is a
Speaker 2: lot of people exclamation point when we talk about government waste, though, Adam,
Speaker 2: everyone's got a different idea of what counts as waste.
Speaker 2: The fact of the matter is every Penny has a
Speaker 2: constituency behind it, doesn't it How easy is this going
Speaker 2: to be to cut two trillion dollars?
Speaker 10: I mean, it's not gonna be easy at all.
Speaker 9: But look, I'm old enough to remember, and I get
Speaker 9: the great hairs to prove it. I guess when Elon
Speaker 9: Musk's own you know, Tesla was considered you know, a
Speaker 9: boon doggle that is by the Obama administration way back
Speaker 9: when it was funding to try to help get an
Speaker 9: electric vehicle industry off the ground in the in the US,
Speaker 9: and people deem that, you know, as something that was
Speaker 9: a waste of money. So I think every interest in Washington,
Speaker 9: there are people who were there to defend it, to
Speaker 9: protect it.
Speaker 10: And that goes both sides.
Speaker 9: That not not just you know, on the defense spending,
Speaker 9: that's not just you know this healthcare across the board.
Speaker 10: And so there's a lot of questions I think to
Speaker 10: be asked about how effective he will actually be in
Speaker 10: shaping that. And again Congress will have to have a say.
Speaker 9: There's going to be a budget process, and I think
Speaker 9: you're cutting two trillion from the budget in a year.
Speaker 10: There's a lot of pain. And Elon's alluded to that pain.
Speaker 9: But members of Congress don't exactly like to go back
Speaker 9: and sell pain back to their constituents.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they kind of have a thing about that.
Speaker 2: I thought when you said you're old enough to remember,
Speaker 2: you might reach for Simpson Bulls.
Speaker 3: Been hearing a lot about that lately.
Speaker 2: And I don't I don't mean to give you PTSD, Lisa,
Speaker 2: because I know we all look through that.
Speaker 3: We'll see if this is more effective.
Speaker 2: We have a lot to learn here about the DOGE,
Speaker 2: but in the meantime, let's help producer James make some money.
Speaker 2: Our panel stays with us, Lisa Camusa, Miller and the
Speaker 2: great Adam Hodge. This is a good combination and we're
Speaker 2: gonna have a lot more to talk about next hour.
Speaker 2: As we run through the list, we've barely gotten to
Speaker 2: anything beyond Elon Musk. How about the new choice for
Speaker 2: Defense Secretary? A lot more where this came from, the
Speaker 2: new head of the CIA, Donald Trump coming out with
Speaker 2: a lot of appointments in the last twenty four hours.
Speaker 2: Kaylee Lions will be back from the White House in
Speaker 2: our second hour as we welcome our global television audience
Speaker 2: to the conversation. It's a big day around here, continuity
Speaker 2: of government, the two presidents meet, and a new leadership
Speaker 2: battle on Capitol Hill.
Speaker 3: John Thune in front of the Senate This is Bloomberg.
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch
Speaker 1: Just Live weekdays at noon Eastern on Epocarplay and then
Speaker 1: Rounoro with the Bloomberg Business app. Listen on demand wherever
Speaker 1: you get your podcasts A watch us live on YouTube.
Speaker 4: Here in Washington. Kaylee lines alongside Joe Matthew. This is
Speaker 4: Balance of Power on Bloomberg TV and Radio. On what
Speaker 4: is an incredibly busy day in Washington. Is Donald Trump,
Speaker 4: the President elect and former president, comes back to town,
Speaker 4: beginning his day meeting with the House Republican Conference and
Speaker 4: then moving on to the White House where we saw
Speaker 4: something that didn't take place the last go around in
Speaker 4: twenty twenty, a meeting and in some ways a visual
Speaker 4: image of the handoff that is happening between two presidents.
Speaker 4: Joe Biden sitting down in the Oval with Donald Trump West.
Speaker 11: The President elect and former president. Thank you mc donald, congratulation,
Speaker 11: thank you, and looking forward to having a likely said
Speaker 11: smooth transition toever we can make sure you're a commodating
Speaker 11: what you need, and we're going to get a chance
Speaker 11: to talk across on that today.
Speaker 1: It's good.
Speaker 11: Welcome.
Speaker 12: Weank you, Jay, thank you very much. And politics is tough,
Speaker 12: and it's many cases not a very nice world, but
Speaker 12: it is a nice world today, and I appreciate very
Speaker 12: much a transition that's so smooth. It'll be as smooth
Speaker 12: as can get it.
Speaker 5: I very much appreciate that you you are.
Speaker 2: Sitting in front of the fireplace in the Oval Office,
Speaker 2: Donald Trump and Joe Biden. We've learned that meeting has concluded.
Speaker 1: Now.
Speaker 2: It was a lengthy one, the better part of two hours.
Speaker 2: That was just the beginning. By the way, if you're
Speaker 2: with us on Bloomberg TV or radio seeing or hearing,
Speaker 2: what just.
Speaker 3: Occurred was the start of a lengthy session.
Speaker 2: The press pool then ushered out of the room, and
Speaker 2: we want to bring you back to the White House
Speaker 2: right now on the North lawn for an update from
Speaker 2: Bloomberg's Tyler Kendall.
Speaker 3: They must have had a lot to talk about, Tyler.
Speaker 3: What are you seeing there?
Speaker 6: Yeah, hey, Joe, So I'm here at the White House
Speaker 6: as you just announced that meeting between President Biden and
Speaker 6: President Elect Donald Trump has concluded. They started at eleven
Speaker 6: seven Eastern, so going for almost two hours.
Speaker 8: Now.
Speaker 6: Of course, this meeting was largely viewed as symbolic, right
Speaker 6: the White House saying it was to ensure a peaceful
Speaker 6: transfer of power, President Biden saying He'll make sure that
Speaker 6: that goes as smooth as possible, earlier in the week,
Speaker 6: saying that's because that is what Americans quote deserve. Now,
Speaker 6: we do know that four years ago Donald Trump did
Speaker 6: not extend this same tradition to president then President elect
Speaker 6: Joe Biden. However, today they did appear cordial, as you
Speaker 6: heard in those remarks off the top. We also know
Speaker 6: that they were both joined by their respective chiefs of staff,
Speaker 6: of course, the current White House Chief of Staff Jeff
Speaker 6: Science and incoming Chief of Staff Susie Wiles. Now, in
Speaker 6: terms of what they could have talked about, we are
Speaker 6: still waiting to hear if he does come out, if
Speaker 6: there is any readout from the meeting, but experts do
Speaker 6: tell us that national security was probably pretty high on
Speaker 6: that list, mostly because President Electrump hasn't received those same
Speaker 6: sort of classified briefings these last four years. Another clue
Speaker 6: that we can look to is what President Biden has
Speaker 6: been pushing for in these final weeks of his administration.
Speaker 6: We know that National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan has said
Speaker 6: that they will push the truck transition, particularly when it
Speaker 6: comes to continued security assistance for Ukraine. So that might
Speaker 6: be one of those potential talking points that they spoke about.
Speaker 6: But Joe and Keyley, just quickly, I will note that
Speaker 6: as somebody who has interviewed Senator Jade Vance now Vice
Speaker 6: President elect JD Vance numerous times on Capitol Hill, he
Speaker 6: is one of those staunchest opponents of ah Ukraine. So
Speaker 6: that's definitely one of the stories we're going to be
Speaker 6: following and see if any headlines come out of that
Speaker 6: meeting today.
Speaker 4: All right, bloombergs Tyler, Kendall live at the North lawn
Speaker 4: of the White House. Thank you so much. Again that
Speaker 4: meeting between President Biden and President Elect Trump at the
Speaker 4: White House has concluded. We want to turn now for
Speaker 4: more reaction to Bloomberg. Senior reporter and editor who covers
Speaker 4: the White House, Michelle jam Risco, who's here with us
Speaker 4: in our Washington.
Speaker 12: D C.
Speaker 4: Studio. So Michelle Tyler was just making the point that
Speaker 4: foreign policy could have featured heavily in this conversation. We
Speaker 4: also got some foreign policy news while this meeting was happening.
Speaker 4: Joe Biden meeting in the Oval, and we're getting news
Speaker 4: about a meeting Joe Biden will have on the sidelines
Speaker 4: of the APEX summit in Peru this weekend.
Speaker 13: Yeah, finally some confirmation of a meeting that we thought
Speaker 13: might occur, a final meeting between the two, So it'll
Speaker 13: be the last of three that they've had as leaders,
Speaker 13: of course interrupted a little bit by COVID era negotiations.
Speaker 13: But yeah, I think there's a lot of emphasis on
Speaker 13: national security issues, and for good reason. I think there's
Speaker 13: a lot that Biden, who is especially a foreign policy
Speaker 13: president in his own terms and his own liking, there's
Speaker 13: a lot that he wants to discuss. He wants to
Speaker 13: close the loop on.
Speaker 3: He wants to.
Speaker 13: Pass the torch and ensure that he is able to
Speaker 13: Trump proof, so to speak, some of his legacy on
Speaker 13: foreign policy issues, even knowing that the two leaders, Trump
Speaker 13: and Biden disagree strongly on many ways of foreign policy
Speaker 13: and on many of the conflicts that are raging right
Speaker 13: now the.
Speaker 2: World of this conversation, if we've got a lame duck
Speaker 2: president here, of course, and how is it collared by
Speaker 2: the election of Donald Trump, who is professing to be
Speaker 2: the greatest China Hawk of them all.
Speaker 13: Yeah, I mean, I think one thing that the White
Speaker 13: House is keen to do is to kind of I
Speaker 13: shouldn't say celebrate, but at least point to successes of
Speaker 13: their intense diplomacy as they call it, and managing the
Speaker 13: relationship with China. You know, this is another thing. You know,
Speaker 13: if you talk about optics, you know, the meeting, you
Speaker 13: could say the same or asked the same question of
Speaker 13: the meeting today between Biden and Trump. I mean, why
Speaker 13: do it if they both disagree on so many things.
Speaker 13: They wanted to show in that sense they wanted to
Speaker 13: show a smooth transition, and in the sense of meeting
Speaker 13: Biden and she, I mean, I think they want to
Speaker 13: kind of ensure that the relationship is managed in a
Speaker 13: stable way as possible during this transition, as well as
Speaker 13: when they hand off to someone who has a very
Speaker 13: different view of how to handle things with the world's
Speaker 13: number two economy.
Speaker 4: Well, so, as we consider the myriad views here, it's
Speaker 4: not just about the view of the President elect himself,
Speaker 4: but also those who he has chosen to be close
Speaker 4: to him and advise him on matters of national security
Speaker 4: and foreign policy. Given the nature of the picks he
Speaker 4: has already made, what picture is it painting?
Speaker 8: Yeah, well, at first.
Speaker 13: We saw some China hawks, right We saw lis Stefanak,
Speaker 13: who's had that high on her agenda. We saw Mike Waltz,
Speaker 13: who's talked about a cold war between the US and China.
Speaker 13: And we saw Rubio, who is yet to be confirmed
Speaker 13: by Trump but floated as Secretary of State, who's one
Speaker 13: of the biggest China hawks of them all. But you know,
Speaker 13: on this issue, of course, Washington is rife with folks
Speaker 13: who want to get tough on China and who have
Speaker 13: championed some of the tougher negotiations and tougher sanctions and
Speaker 13: penalties that the US has applied under the Biden administration.
Speaker 13: But there's also at least two big obstacles to a
Speaker 13: sort of China hawk policy in the way that it
Speaker 13: has been under a Trump administration. When you have someone
Speaker 13: like Elon Musk, the world's richest man, who has a
Speaker 13: pretty dense network financial network in Asia and in China,
Speaker 13: included half of his electric vehicles produced in China. I mean,
Speaker 13: there's one obstacle to hitting them very hard and kind
Speaker 13: of removing and decoupling or you know, separating the economies
Speaker 13: in any regard. And then the second is this intriguing
Speaker 13: and unfolding story about Trump's plans or supposed plans to
Speaker 13: try to overturn or not comply with the TikTok ban
Speaker 13: or forced sale or ban, i should say, which is
Speaker 13: really coming hot in January. So there's a lot to
Speaker 13: discuss there, and a lot that will be at odds
Speaker 13: between who he's drafting into his administration and what he
Speaker 13: wants to do with his foreign policy toward China.
Speaker 2: Deeply curious to see what Donald Trump does with the
Speaker 2: TikTok situation, Michelle jim Risco, Bloomberg Senior Reporter Editor, Thank
Speaker 2: you so much for the insights, Michelle. On an important
Speaker 2: day in Washington, as we add the voice of a
Speaker 2: member of Congress, a Republican member who was in the
Speaker 2: room today for the meeting with Donald Trump, Elon Musk
Speaker 2: in tow and of course Speaker Mike Johnson, who received
Speaker 2: the endorsement of the President elects Mark Molinaro, outgoing Republican
Speaker 2: Congressman from New York's nineteenth Congressman, great to see you,
Speaker 2: Welcome back to Bloomberg TV and Radio. Bring us in
Speaker 2: the room for this opportunity today. Who was a bigger
Speaker 2: hit Trump or Musk?
Speaker 14: A little question, that was President Donald Trump. There was
Speaker 14: a great degree of enthusiasm. I think you know met meeting.
Speaker 14: That enthusiasm in the room has been the economic rebound,
Speaker 14: and we certainly see that across the country. But without question,
Speaker 14: there's unity and the House Republican Conference and that unity
Speaker 14: in partnership with Senator Thoune now as majority leader, really
Speaker 14: sets up the environment for President Trump to deliver not
Speaker 14: only on his mandate but on his vision to make
Speaker 14: this country great again.
Speaker 4: Well before the next Congress takes its seats. Congressman, there
Speaker 4: is this Congress to finish up in this lame duck session.
Speaker 4: Did he express what he would like to see accomplished
Speaker 4: before he takes the oath of office in January?
Speaker 14: He was very specific about about assembling his cabinet, and
Speaker 14: I will tell you it was more for thinking than
Speaker 14: the next thirty or forty days. I mean, quite frankly,
Speaker 14: with an incoming Republican majority in the Senate. It benefits
Speaker 14: the president to obviously put bigger questions into that Congress,
Speaker 14: right because again, the American people spoke overwhelmingly. They embrace
Speaker 14: the America First agenda. They support President Trump with now
Speaker 14: an historic victory and frankly, a unified government Senate, House
Speaker 14: and White House, and to deliver on efficiencies. And I
Speaker 14: will tell you this, he spent a lot of time
Speaker 14: talking about efficiency and government. Obviously the big ticket items
Speaker 14: border security, confronting and strengthening America's role across the globe,
Speaker 14: but also looking internally and making this government function again,
Speaker 14: respect taxpayers, and deliver on greater efficiency and his vision
Speaker 14: for making sure that the federal government actually do its job.
Speaker 2: Well, Well, Congressman, we've got a funding deadline coming up
Speaker 2: on December twentieth. There's some reporting out there today that
Speaker 2: there's a desire by some Republicans, some pro Trump Republicans,
Speaker 2: to extend funding with a stop gap through September. Take
Speaker 2: it off as plate, let him work on the rest
Speaker 2: of the agenda. I'm assuming the Freedom Caucus wouldn't stand
Speaker 2: for that. Where do you stand on that matter? And
Speaker 2: what's a more likely scenario if that's not the case.
Speaker 14: Well, we're at the point now where we're going to
Speaker 14: start very early next year in appropriations discussions for twenty
Speaker 14: five and twenty six. It does make sense to extend
Speaker 14: the current CR later in the year, allow the President
Speaker 14: to assemble the cabinet, get organized. We're going to have
Speaker 14: to deal with a whole host of his issues. They
Speaker 14: will of course reconciliation, confronting obviously international questions. And I
Speaker 14: just think the setting forth the process to get the
Speaker 14: twenty five to twenty six appropriation structure in place, you know,
Speaker 14: really lends itself simply to extending the CR later into
Speaker 14: next year.
Speaker 3: It likely makes sense.
Speaker 14: It'll have some opposition, certainly, and frankly, the two Houses
Speaker 14: are going to respond to what the President really hopes
Speaker 14: to achieve. But we have this moment. I mean, listen,
Speaker 14: the President is focused on delivering results, and I think
Speaker 14: that means everything from getting FEMA to focus on responding
Speaker 14: effectively to Americans to making sure our transportation infrastructure actually
Speaker 14: is safe and works. And so there's going to be
Speaker 14: a hefty agenda moving forward. See our extension later in
Speaker 14: the year seems to make the most sense.
Speaker 2: Yeah, later being September or are you in the camp
Speaker 2: to get this done through March.
Speaker 14: Oh, I mean, listen, I won't be returning next year,
Speaker 14: but I think later in the year is the better option.
Speaker 14: It's going to be too if we try to crunch
Speaker 14: this into the first quarter of next year. There's just
Speaker 14: too much to have to achieve in that very short
Speaker 14: window of opportunity. We don't want to compound or complicate
Speaker 14: the president's agenda, and he has a broad, bold agenda
Speaker 14: that was met with a national mandate.
Speaker 4: Well, Congressman, you certainly won't be there in January, but
Speaker 4: I do wonder if you may have a return to
Speaker 4: the House in your sites. Congressman Elise Stephonic, whose district
Speaker 4: is very close to yours in the state of New York,
Speaker 4: has been tapped to be ambassador to the UN assuming
Speaker 4: she gets confirmed. That's a seat up for grabs. Would
Speaker 4: you go for it?
Speaker 14: I've said this for some flattered A good number of
Speaker 14: people in that district have reached out to me. I
Speaker 14: know upstate New York pretty well. I ran for governor
Speaker 14: in twenty eighteen and frankly gave voice to a lot
Speaker 14: of these communities. This has been an honor of lifetime
Speaker 14: these last two years. They just finished counting votes in
Speaker 14: my race yesterday. My hope and my goal is to
Speaker 14: remain active in representing in some capacity and serving in
Speaker 14: some capacity people up state New York. And so at
Speaker 14: this point we'll see how that plays out. But I'm
Speaker 14: very much interested in furthering the President's agenda, ensuring that
Speaker 14: America meets this moment and that the people up state
Speaker 14: New York have an aggressive fighter on their behalf.
Speaker 2: Sounds like you might have plans, Congressman. They did just
Speaker 2: finish counting the votes in your race yesterday, and I
Speaker 2: think it's worth noting as we saw Donald Trump return
Speaker 2: to the White House today with Joe Biden, who is
Speaker 2: clearly trying to express the importance of continuity of government
Speaker 2: here in the peaceful transfer of power that you immediately
Speaker 2: conceded your race.
Speaker 3: You had some very nice things, in.
Speaker 2: Fact, to say about Democrat Josh Riley, who won the election,
Speaker 2: congratulating him early on. Is that a model for your
Speaker 2: colleagues to follow.
Speaker 14: A Listen, I honor the results and do wish him well.
Speaker 14: We're not enemies, we're opponents, and I do think even
Speaker 14: as President Trump earlier met with President Biden, there was
Speaker 14: a camaraderie and acknowledgment that the transition of power should
Speaker 14: should move seamlessly, and that there needs to be a
Speaker 14: respect for the great democratic proceeds. And by the way, again,
Speaker 14: America delivered a hit, an historic win for the president,
Speaker 14: and the president in return seeks to fulfill that mandate,
Speaker 14: and that means serving everybody. And I think we heard that.
Speaker 14: I certainly know we heard that in conference today. But
Speaker 14: I respect the outcome of the election. Listen, I was
Speaker 14: at the receiving end of a brutalized and brutal, a
Speaker 14: brutal campaign. They outspent us by about eight and a
Speaker 14: half million dollars. But the results are the results. We
Speaker 14: respect them. We move forward, and I will tell you though,
Speaker 14: I remain committed to ensuring both the success of the
Speaker 14: House Republican Conference, the success of President Donald Trump and
Speaker 14: his administration, and the goal of truly making this country
Speaker 14: as great as it can be and as it ought
Speaker 14: to be, but also making sure the people upstate New
Speaker 14: York are well represented and respected well.
Speaker 4: Finally, Congressman, as we considered the conference, you obviously have
Speaker 4: been operating in what has been a thin majority for
Speaker 4: the last two years, and While the majority does look
Speaker 4: like it will be retained once again, the margin could
Speaker 4: be very tight. How would you advise your colleagues to
Speaker 4: avoid the mistakes of the last two years in the
Speaker 4: next two and remaining cohesive.
Speaker 14: Well, we have the benefit of now having a Republican
Speaker 14: majority in the Senate and of course at President Trump's election,
Speaker 14: so there's going to be a real push to stay united.
Speaker 14: The President made that clear in conference in the meeting
Speaker 14: we had today, But there's gonna be a push to
Speaker 14: stay united. I think that pressure and the leadership that
Speaker 14: the President will provide in that regard will keep some
Speaker 14: from causing some degree of chaos. But yes, the Speaker
Speaker 14: is well aware, and I've got nothing but admiration for
Speaker 14: Mike Johnson and the leadership team in particular as at
Speaker 14: least dephonically. Obviously, her leadership and conference will be very,
Speaker 14: very useful and effective. But again, I think the Speaker
Speaker 14: understands that there's going to have to be a lot
Speaker 14: of coalition building and consensus molding. Having the President lean
Speaker 14: in and Senator Thun and the majority in the Senate
Speaker 14: makes that a little bit easier. But we're diverse. Conference,
Speaker 14: you know that you've seen it on full display. It's
Speaker 14: just my advice. My advice is work hard to mold consensus,
Speaker 14: Listen to voices, both that which agree with you and
Speaker 14: that which disagree. Into My colleagues throughout the House Republican Conference,
Speaker 14: respect the fact that Republicans were given a mandate to
Speaker 14: deliver a safer country, a more secure nation, and a
Speaker 14: stronger economy.
Speaker 4: All right, Congressman Mark Molnaro, the Republican from New York
Speaker 4: live from Capitol Hill, thank you so much for joining us,
Speaker 4: And of course, a reminder, the Republican House leadership elections
Speaker 4: will be taking place later today after Senator John Thune
Speaker 4: was tapped as the next majority leader. We'll have full
Speaker 4: coverage here on Bloomberg TV and radio.
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast kens
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Speaker 4: We consider it the fact that leadership is going to
Speaker 4: be instrumental in both chambers in advancing the agenda of
Speaker 4: Donald Trump. As we heard Senator thun there, he does
Speaker 4: want to ensure that Trump has the tools and support
Speaker 4: needed for that agenda, and on things like tax policy,
Speaker 4: sure you need Congress to go along with you. On
Speaker 4: other policies the president is able to act with a
Speaker 4: little bit more authority, like say on tariffs.
Speaker 2: I think that you're reaching to the right place here,
Speaker 2: which is something that we want to talk about. In
Speaker 2: an important conversation with Nazak Nikochtar, national Security Practice.
Speaker 3: Group lead at Wiley Rain here.
Speaker 2: In Washington, former Department of Commerce Assistant secretary and under secretary.
Speaker 3: Great to see you at the table, Thanks for joining us.
Speaker 2: Your concerns now maybe none about this train rolling down
Speaker 2: the tracks because Donald Trump just stopped by the White House.
Speaker 2: The next time he's there, I suspect he'll be the
Speaker 2: president of the United States.
Speaker 15: Absolutely. He's made no mistakes that he There's lots of
Speaker 15: economic distortions that he's going to take on that have
Speaker 15: impaired the US's ability to produce. His downwardly has had
Speaker 15: downward impacts on jobs, productivity, innovation, corporate profits right GDP.
Speaker 15: And so he has made clear that he is going
Speaker 15: to pursue terror policies primarily to correct for those distortions.
Speaker 4: Well, so let's talk about what he's really said about tariffs.
Speaker 4: He suggested ten to twenty percent blanket on all imports.
Speaker 4: You suggested numbers of sixty percent plus on Chinese goods,
Speaker 4: perhaps one hundred percent or more on certain goods like
Speaker 4: cars coming out of Mexico. How realistic are those figures
Speaker 4: or do you expect in reality they will be much lower.
Speaker 15: So it's going to be really based on industry by industry.
Speaker 15: But I want to address the global tariff issue because
Speaker 15: I hear this question constantly. And this isn't really a
Speaker 15: matter of picking fights with our allies, because that's just
Speaker 15: not what anybody is in the business to do. This
Speaker 15: is really recognizing the fact that China's industrial policies, China's
Speaker 15: overcapacity dotworted global prices. When you think about critical minerals,
Speaker 15: when you think about autos, when you think about semiconductors,
Speaker 15: when you think about steel, aluminum, the list goes on.
Speaker 15: These are materials that go into a lot of manufactured goods,
Speaker 15: and when we are overflowed in the United States by cheap,
Speaker 15: distortedly priced goods because of the overcapacity, has depressed global
Speaker 15: prices we're losing jobs, we're losing industry output. We've got it,
Speaker 15: introduced tariffs globally to correct for those distortions.
Speaker 2: The big conversation, or I guess argument here in Washington
Speaker 2: has been whether the money from tariffs would be enough
Speaker 2: to offset tax cuts, for instance, when you start considering
Speaker 2: lack of revenues potentially in a Trump administration, we don't
Speaker 2: talk much about retribution. What would be the answer to
Speaker 2: all of these teriffs from other countries, starting with China.
Speaker 15: Yeah, I mean, I think without question what I found,
Speaker 15: having previously served in the Trump administration is that when
Speaker 15: we have articulated to the EU, for example, the reason
Speaker 15: for our care of policies, right, we do have an
Speaker 15: issue with steal and aluminum overcapacity. The European producers who
Speaker 15: are not selling in their home markets and have been
Speaker 15: displaced from the global markets and now are shifting to
Speaker 15: the United States, they actually tend to understand what we're doing.
Speaker 15: And furthermore, when we have imposed teriffs to correct for
Speaker 15: these distortions, our allies were then inundated with the Chinese
Speaker 15: over capacity, and then they invoked safeguard measures to protect
Speaker 15: their industries too from those distortions. So I think that
Speaker 15: once we engage with allies and articulate the reasons why
Speaker 15: we're doing this, they'll either not retaliate or they will
Speaker 15: take the corrective measures they need that will allow us
Speaker 15: to remove the tariffs because they've addressed those distortions in
Speaker 15: their market. We've done that before. I think we're going
Speaker 15: to expect to see that again.
Speaker 4: But what would you say to those who view this
Speaker 4: mechanism for correcting those distortions is effectively just raising the
Speaker 4: price of everything because importers are still going to have
Speaker 4: to pay these levies. Is that's what is necessary in
Speaker 4: flight prices in order to correct this?
Speaker 15: That is a great question. So in the last administration,
Speaker 15: when we impose those tariffs on the Chinese goods, and
Speaker 15: when we pose it the tariffs on steel and aluminum goods,
Speaker 15: the US International Trade Commission, it's a quasi unit, a
Speaker 15: government body, bipartisan bases, conducted a study about two years
Speaker 15: ago and found that those tariffs had zero inflationary effect
Speaker 15: in it at most infinitesimony we're targeted.
Speaker 4: We're not talking about the global terariffs.
Speaker 15: Right that you're discussing, right, And so there's a couple
Speaker 15: of things that I that's worth underscoring. We're not looking
Speaker 15: at just price increases in isolation. It's really important for
Speaker 15: the economy to be healthy to correct for those distortions
Speaker 15: and the prices that gives you long term economic growth stability,
Speaker 15: and those price increases that may be somewhat will be
Speaker 15: offset by rises and wages, corporate productive output, et cetera.
Speaker 15: So I would expect that those moderate tariffs would translate
Speaker 15: into healthy economic gains for the United States. On the
Speaker 15: China side, President Trump has underscored significant tariffs. Even with
Speaker 15: the those tariffs on the Mexican industries, right, it's where
Speaker 15: China has been behind those We've noticed that China tends
Speaker 15: to up to a certain point, China tends to absorb
Speaker 15: those tariffs. And the reason it doesn't translate those tariffs
Speaker 15: into price increases is because China doesn't want to displace
Speaker 15: itself from the market, and if those tariffs gets too high,
Speaker 15: China then abandons the US market. But we see very
Speaker 15: few instances of actually the pass through on the China side.
Speaker 2: Was it the right thing for the Biden administration to
Speaker 2: continue with the Trump tariffs that that have been in
Speaker 2: place this has become the new normal.
Speaker 15: Absolutely, And it wasn't just the continuation of the Trump tariffs.
Speaker 15: President Trump, the Trump administration imposed those tariffs as a countermeasure,
Speaker 15: a legally authorized countermeasure to address China's IP theft. And
Speaker 15: as long as China's IP theft continues and it imposes
Speaker 15: an economic cost to the US economy of fifty billion
Speaker 15: dollars a year, absolutely, those tariff measures are appropriate. They're
Speaker 15: legally authorized. Plus, what else are we going to do
Speaker 15: to compel the Chinese government to change its acts, policies,
Speaker 15: and practices.
Speaker 4: We consider other ways in which to compel them. It's
Speaker 4: not just tariff'sys administration has pursued, but export controls as well,
Speaker 4: making it harder for China to develop strategic technologies. Have
Speaker 4: those been affected or should we effective or should we
Speaker 4: expect this incoming administration to go harder on that, to
Speaker 4: crack down more?
Speaker 15: I think very much harder. I think there's been a
Speaker 15: growing recognition. I am really glad that Congress and folks
Speaker 15: in the industry and in the think tank community have
Speaker 15: learned to take the times to educate themselves about export controls,
Speaker 15: because I think the growing recognition has been the small
Speaker 15: yard high friends approach isn't working. We need to expand it.
Speaker 15: With respect to China, I think there's going to be
Speaker 15: a significant movement which I wholeheartedly support. Did you regulate
Speaker 15: with respect to allies and really increase those guardrails with
Speaker 15: respect to countries of concern? And I think the Trump
Speaker 15: administration most certainly will move in that direction just quickly.
Speaker 4: We have thirty seconds left here. Should Robert Leithheiser reprise
Speaker 4: his role as USTR in this incoming administration? Would you
Speaker 4: advocate for that?
Speaker 15: I think Robert Leiittheiser is doing the nation of Serus
Speaker 15: by lending his expertise to President Trump on all things
Speaker 15: trade and trade, national security, and nexus. I would be
Speaker 15: glad for him to continue in any capacity. He and
Speaker 15: President Trump se fit all right, And I.
Speaker 4: Was like, thank you so much for joining us, And
Speaker 4: I was like, Nacoctar is national Security Practice group lead
Speaker 4: at Wiley Rihan and former Department of Commerce Assistant Secretary
Speaker 4: and undersecretary during the Trump administration. Thank you for being
Speaker 4: here with us on the early edition of Balance of Power.
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