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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. You're listening to the

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch Just Live weekdays at

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Speaker 1: noon Eastern on Applecarplay and Enroudo with the Bloomberg Business app.

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Speaker 1: Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts. Watch us

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Speaker 1: live on YouTube.

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Speaker 2: Dozens of reporters also at the White House today for

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Speaker 2: an awfully important meeting. It may not generate a lot

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Speaker 2: of news, but it's a big deal in this country

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Speaker 2: when we talk about continuity of government, the peaceful transfer

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Speaker 2: of power. Yes, the transition has officially begun, not just

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Speaker 2: naming names, but Donald Trump in the Oval office with

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Speaker 2: Joe Biden. And that's why we bring in my colleague

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Speaker 2: Kaylee Lines, who's on the North lawn and has been

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Speaker 2: out there for the duration with some interesting activity. Kaylee,

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Speaker 2: I don't know if we're going to get some comments

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Speaker 2: from Donald Trump at the state out location in the

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Speaker 2: driveway or what you can tell us, but.

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Speaker 3: Speak to the importance of this meeting.

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Speaker 4: Well, the optics, of course, are incredibly important here, Joe.

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Speaker 4: Perhaps the most important part of the meeting itself is

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Speaker 4: the fact that the meeting is happening at all. Is

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Speaker 4: we didn't get this in twenty twenty, Donald Trump did

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Speaker 4: not extend this kind of offer to Joe Biden after

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Speaker 4: he beat him in the last cycle, still, of course,

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Speaker 4: was contesting the results at that time. But Joe Biden

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Speaker 4: has welcomed Donald Trump here to the White House, and

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Speaker 4: he congratulated him on his victory, said he will be

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Speaker 4: supporting him throughout this transfer of power, that they intend

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Speaker 4: to accommodate anything he needs. While Donald Trump, for his part,

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Speaker 4: said that while politics is not always a nice world,

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Speaker 4: that it is a nice world today, thanking Joe Biden

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Speaker 4: for welcoming him to the White House. I would point

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Speaker 4: out I am one of potentially hundreds of people that

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Speaker 4: are here gathered Joe waiting to see if the President

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Speaker 4: elect emerges from this meeting and speaks to the press.

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Speaker 4: Is they did not take questions from the press when

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Speaker 4: they first met in that public portion of the meeting.

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Speaker 4: Once the spray left, we aren't really sure what will

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Speaker 4: happen behind closed doors. We do know it is not

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Speaker 4: just Trump and Biden speaking to each other, but they're

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Speaker 4: a respective chief of staff or chief of staff designate

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Speaker 4: in the case of Susie Wiles and Jeff Zionce are

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Speaker 4: also there with them in that meeting, and it right

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Speaker 4: now is only up for a question what they are discussing.

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Speaker 4: But we'll see if Donald Trump himself is willing to

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Speaker 4: shed a little light on that later on.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll be deeply curious. We'll have eyes on the stick,

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Speaker 2: says they say. Kaylee, talk to us.

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Speaker 3: About Elon Musk. We saw him over at the hotel.

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Speaker 2: He andally came to Washington today with Donald Trump, and

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Speaker 2: there was some talk that he actually might go to

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Speaker 2: the White House. Apparently that did not happen, but he

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Speaker 2: is going to be now officially as of last night,

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Speaker 2: working with this administration.

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Speaker 4: Indeed co heading the Department of Government Efficiency, alongside for

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Speaker 4: bak Ramaswami, who of course ran against Trump during the

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Speaker 4: primary campaign. DOGE, as it will be called, will focus

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Speaker 4: on or I guess we might call it an Elon

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Speaker 4: Musk might call it as well. We'll be focusing on

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Speaker 4: trying essentially to trim the fat, cut down on spending,

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Speaker 4: deregulate as much as possible, or really make recommendations as

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Speaker 4: for how to do so. Because, of course, Joe, you

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Speaker 4: and I both know well that while they can suggest

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Speaker 4: all they want in terms of where spending should be cut.

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Speaker 4: The actual power of the purse lies with Congress. It

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Speaker 4: is Congress that is going to have to actually allocate

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Speaker 4: the funds, appropriate them to the different government agencies. So

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Speaker 4: there's only so much Elon Musk is really going to

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Speaker 4: be able to wield in terms of influence. But his

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Speaker 4: very presence here in Washington today does show just how

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Speaker 4: close the richest man in the world has become to

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Speaker 4: one of the most powerful men in the world, Donald Trump,

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Speaker 4: who's about to become the forty seventh President of the

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Speaker 4: United States.

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Speaker 2: All Right, Bloomberg's Kaylee lines at the White House. Will

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Speaker 2: see you back here in the newsroom, Kayley a little

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Speaker 2: bit later on, as we add the voice of Barbara Perry.

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Speaker 3: This is a significant.

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Speaker 2: Moment, regardless of who you prefer, Trump or Biden, an

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Speaker 2: important moment for our democracy and just for the history

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Speaker 2: of the presidency. To see these two men together after

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Speaker 2: such a vicious campaign, one that of course ended with

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Speaker 2: Kamala Harris at the top of the ticket, not Joe Biden.

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Speaker 2: She's professor in Presidential Studies at the Unionity of Virginia's

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Speaker 2: Miller Center, and we try to reach Barbara in times

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Speaker 2: of historical significance, Professor, it's great to have you back

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Speaker 2: your thoughts as you saw these two men sitting down

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Speaker 2: today inside the White House.

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Speaker 5: Great to be with you, Joe. Yes, this is a

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Speaker 5: historic moment for a lot of reasons. This is a

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Speaker 5: fairly modern event whereby a sitting president welcomes the president's

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Speaker 5: elect to the White House. And we have to remember

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Speaker 5: that is in part because travel was not always easy

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Speaker 5: in our pastime. So the one that I remember, if

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Speaker 5: not starting this tradition, but certainly carrying on past it

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Speaker 5: was Eisenhower meeting with Kennedy, and there was not a

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Speaker 5: lot of love lost between them, but certainly Kennedy, as

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Speaker 5: a junior officer in World War Two, respected the five

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Speaker 5: star general and his commander in chief, Dwight Eisenhower. So

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Speaker 5: they had a meeting at the White House. And again

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Speaker 5: this has continued accepted was said that was not a

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Speaker 5: courtesy that was afforded by Donald Trump to Joe Biden

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Speaker 5: four years ago because Donald Trump didn't believe, or at

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Speaker 5: least said he didn't believe that Joe Biden had won

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Speaker 5: the election. So it's historic because it's symbolic of the

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Speaker 5: passing of the torch. But there's also content in the

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Speaker 5: sense that that symbolism has content, and it's good for

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Speaker 5: the American people to see a smooth transition, and it's

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Speaker 5: good for the world to see that as well.

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Speaker 6: Well.

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Speaker 3: It is good to see.

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Speaker 2: I wonder how Donald Trump will be accepted, if not

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Speaker 2: ever in the club of former presidents seeing him up

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Speaker 2: there today.

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Speaker 3: Is there ever going to be an.

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Speaker 2: Event where it's Bush, Obama, Trump, Biden standing on a

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Speaker 2: stage doing something or is he singular.

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Speaker 3: In that way?

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Speaker 5: He's singular and unprecedented in a host of ways that

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Speaker 5: we've been covering now since certainly twenty fifteen. As it

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Speaker 5: relates to the presidential politics, one opportunity will be the

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Speaker 5: inauguration itself. Again, he did not afford the long standing

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Speaker 5: courtesy of the outgoing president being president at even though

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Speaker 5: he had lost the incoming president's inauguration, So that will

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Speaker 5: be a test that I'm sure Joe Biden will pass

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Speaker 5: that as the statesman that he's been for fifty years

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Speaker 5: in politics. But I think the next opportunity when we

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Speaker 5: will see something like that potentially would be the opening

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Speaker 5: of the it's not being called Presidential Library, the Obama

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Speaker 5: Presidential Center in Chicago, which should come up in the

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Speaker 5: next year or two. And that is typically when all

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Speaker 5: the former presidents come for that opening of a former

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Speaker 5: president's library or center, and usually all the first Ladies

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Speaker 5: come as well, and they are all pictured as a group,

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Speaker 5: first the President's then the First Ladies on stage, and

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Speaker 5: so we will see maybe this is a different Donald

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Speaker 5: Trump presidency. It's hard to imagine that his personality will

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Speaker 5: change over this, but we're seeing a different kind of

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Speaker 5: transition with his appointments. So maybe he will be a

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Speaker 5: different style president from his first term. Remains to be seen.

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Speaker 2: Well, we're going to find out together here. Noteworthy, the

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Speaker 2: Milennia Trump was not with him on the visit today.

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Speaker 2: She is not at the White House, of course, having

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Speaker 2: lived there. I do want to ask you, though, about

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Speaker 2: what Joe Biden has in front of him as the

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Speaker 2: lame duck president. We just ran a headline, Barbara that

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Speaker 2: he's going to be meeting with President she on Saturday

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Speaker 2: on the sidelines of the APEX summit in Peru. What

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Speaker 2: is the point of these meetings? If Donald Trump is

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Speaker 2: already meeting with world leaders to set up the next administration, what.

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Speaker 5: Will come from this, Yes, and we should say that

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Speaker 5: the first appointees or nominees for the Donald Trump second

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Speaker 5: administration are almost all very hawkish on China, so unlike

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Speaker 5: the Obama administration in which Joe Biden served as Vice

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Speaker 5: president for eight years, in which there was an attempt

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Speaker 5: to as they say, the Asia and Pivot obviously to

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Speaker 5: stay strong against China and tried to push through the

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Speaker 5: free trade pack that would keep a strong market against

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Speaker 5: China in the Pacific and on the Pacific coastlines that

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Speaker 5: obviously went away with the anti free trade movement of

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Speaker 5: the first foul Trump administration. So I think that what

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Speaker 5: Joe Biden will be doing for China and our relations

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Speaker 5: with China and President she as well as around the world,

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Speaker 5: is to say that there will be a peaceful transition

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Speaker 5: of power and that the United States remains powerful in

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Speaker 5: both military and market terms, and that no one should

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Speaker 5: try anything conflictual in this period of a lane up

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Speaker 5: Joe Biden presidency.

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Speaker 2: You mentioned some of the appointments we've heard about. The

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Speaker 2: others are being reported on as part of the transition. Here,

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Speaker 2: Barbara Perry, the one that's blowing a lot of minds

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Speaker 2: today is Pete Hegseth, who helps the host of Box

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Speaker 2: and Friends on the weekends. He's a combat veteran, not

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Speaker 2: on any short list, has already publicly pledged to fire

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Speaker 2: the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, And I

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Speaker 2: can go down the list with a lot of these.

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Speaker 3: Here.

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Speaker 2: We can talk about Elon Musk in this new office

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Speaker 2: aimed at cutting spending the Department of Government efficiency. We

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Speaker 2: can talk about the idea of Mike Huckabee going to

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Speaker 2: Israel as our ambassador, an evangelical ambassador in Israel. When

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Speaker 2: you add all of these up, you look at the

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Speaker 2: mosaic of names that we're putting together here. Does this

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Speaker 2: feel like a different administration than the first time around?

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Speaker 3: Or more of the same.

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Speaker 5: Again, I think going back to Donald Trump's style, we'll

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Speaker 5: see if that changes at all or if there's more

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Speaker 5: of the same. I think what's very different is people

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Speaker 5: have been pointing out about these nominations and appointees who

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Speaker 5: will probably those who have to be confirmed will no

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Speaker 5: doubt stay all through the Senate, well unless there's something

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Speaker 5: desperately wrong in their personal backgrounds. But I would say

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Speaker 5: that what we're seeing is the number one criterion is

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Speaker 5: loyalty to both now future and former President Trump. And

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Speaker 5: then I would also say loyalty to the approach to

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Speaker 5: foreign affairs. Again, hawkishness against probably the Palestinians, hawkishness against

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Speaker 5: the Chinese, perhaps cozying up with Putin as well as

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Speaker 5: the North Korean dictator. So they are going to be changes,

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Speaker 5: I think, along those lines in foreign policy, and then

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Speaker 5: in domestic policy, it's going to be the twenty twenty

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Speaker 5: five approach from the Heritage Foundation, that platform of Project

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Speaker 5: twenty twenty five. These people were, no doubt have to

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Speaker 5: proclaim that they are loyal to that and to President Trump,

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Speaker 5: and we'll see if that can carry itself out in reality.

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Speaker 2: Barbara Perry, Professor in Presidential Studies, University of Virginia's Miller's Center.

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Speaker 3: Thank you for the insights. As always.

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Speaker 2: Senator John Barrosso elected the next Senate Republican whip as expected,

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Speaker 2: fun as leader.

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Speaker 3: This is Bloomberg.

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Speaker 3: Big day here in Washington, d C.

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Speaker 2: With a lot of headlines flying if you're just joining us.

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Speaker 2: Donald Trump is at the White House right now. In fact,

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Speaker 2: it appears he might be leaving as we speak, just

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Speaker 2: wrapping his meeting with Joe Biden in the Oval Office.

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Speaker 2: It does not appear he's going to come to the

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Speaker 2: reporter stakeout in the driveway, but if he does.

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Speaker 3: We will let you know.

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Speaker 2: We brought you some very brief remarks from both Biden

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Speaker 2: and Trump sitting in front of the fireplace in the

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Speaker 2: Oval Office, pledging a smooth as Donald Trump said, so

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Speaker 2: smooth transition and continuity of government, of course important to

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Speaker 2: Joe Biden.

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Speaker 3: Today.

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Speaker 2: It's unclear what they discussed after reporters were ushered out.

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Speaker 3: Of the room.

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Speaker 2: Then we've got what's going on on Capitol Hill, where

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Speaker 2: Donald Trump was earlier today spoke with House Republicans endorsed

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Speaker 2: the Speaker, Mike Johnson, of course, set to maintain a

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Speaker 2: very thin majority in the House in what appears to

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Speaker 2: be a red sweep across the White House, the Senate,

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Speaker 2: the House of Representatives, and We just got word earlier

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Speaker 2: this hour, just as we took air shortly after noontime Eastern,

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Speaker 2: that John Thune will be the next Senate Republican leader.

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Speaker 2: The vote twenty nine, twenty four. The headline says it

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Speaker 2: all on the terminal Steve Dennis Dan Flatley, Senate Republicans

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Speaker 2: reject Musk's pick elevate Thun de leader.

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Speaker 5: Yes.

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Speaker 2: Remember, Elon Musk was pushing for Rick Scott, Florida Senator,

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Speaker 2: who did not make it past the first ballot. After

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Speaker 2: all the uproar over the weekend by Tucker Carlson, Elon

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Speaker 2: Musk and the MAGA community on social media, it was

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Speaker 2: not enough to propel Rick Scott to win. Here, So

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Speaker 2: John thun and Mike Johnson are your two congressional leaders.

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Speaker 2: Right as Chuck Schumer steps back in the Senate having

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Speaker 2: seen the chamber flip, our political panel is with us

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Speaker 2: to talk about an important day in politics. Lisa Camuso Miller,

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Speaker 2: former r NC communications director, host of the Friday Reporter

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Speaker 2: podcast Republican Strategist, is here, and Adam Hodge as well,

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Speaker 2: former spokesperson for the National Security Counselor in the White House.

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Speaker 2: He's managing director now Bully Pulpit International Democratic strategist. Great

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Speaker 2: to see you both here, Lisa, I'll start with you,

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Speaker 2: as not only a Republican but one who spent many

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Speaker 2: years on Capitol Hill. What do you think of the

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Speaker 2: selection here and how easy or not will it be

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Speaker 2: for John thun to work with Mike Johnson and Donald Trump.

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Speaker 7: Well, I mean living in different times these days, and

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Speaker 7: so I think that everyone on the on the Hill

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Speaker 7: is going to have to work in a way that

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Speaker 7: is going to be a little bit different.

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Speaker 8: Right.

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Speaker 7: The good news I think for the Senate is that

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Speaker 7: John Thune is someone who understands fundamentally how the Senate works,

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Speaker 7: how the process works. But he's also someone that will

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Speaker 7: work together with the House and with the White House

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Speaker 7: in order to advance change and to get legislative action passed.

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Speaker 8: And so that to me is a good sign.

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Speaker 7: It's also he's a he's long been an ally and

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Speaker 7: a friend to the to the House and someone that

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Speaker 7: understands fundamentally how the process works.

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Speaker 8: So to me, this is good news.

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Speaker 7: It also to me signals that the party itself, no

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Speaker 7: matter how much this is true also for the Republican

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Speaker 7: National Committee, no matter how much outside factors try to

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Speaker 7: play in the election of the various options and processes

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Speaker 7: inside of Washington, the voters definitely decide who comes here,

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Speaker 7: but the insiders, those inside the Senate definitely still decide

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Speaker 7: who becomes the leader in the in the in the

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Speaker 7: in the chamber.

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Speaker 2: I guess both chambers are showing their stripes here adam

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Speaker 2: realizing they're red, but they approach things a little bit differently.

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Speaker 2: And part of the concern going into this, those who

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Speaker 2: supported Rick Scott were concerned that some senators were offended.

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Speaker 2: They don't like to be bullied, they don't like to

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Speaker 2: be told what to do, and that may have actually

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Speaker 2: helped John Thune win.

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Speaker 3: What do you think about this results, Well, I think.

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Speaker 9: It's encouraging that there will be a little bit of

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Speaker 9: sanity within the Senate Republican Conference. Look, John Thune, he's

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Speaker 9: been in a leadership fixture for many, many years.

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Speaker 10: He knows how the body operates. I think he has

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Speaker 10: a chance to.

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Speaker 9: Try to work also with Democrats in the minority, to

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Speaker 9: try to get things done. We're going There's been a

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Speaker 9: lot of things on his plate, from you know, getting

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Speaker 9: the tax reform done, raising the debt ceiling, you know,

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Speaker 9: funding the government, as you were talking about earlier this hour,

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Speaker 9: so that there's some real big issues on his plate.

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Speaker 9: And I think it's also a really smart reflection on

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Speaker 9: the inability of outside forces in the online groups to

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Speaker 9: force the Senate to fall at that they're bidding. I'm

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Speaker 9: reminded similarly, when Jim Jordan made his push to replace

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Speaker 9: and then to become House Speaker, it was all kinds

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Speaker 9: of noise from the MAGA movement and folks online to

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Speaker 9: try to get him installed as a speaker, and that

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Speaker 9: failed as well. Members of Congress are going to do

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Speaker 9: what they think is in the best interest of their conference,

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Speaker 9: and I think that's why I think you ended up

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Speaker 9: seeing the vote go pretty handily towards Thune on the

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Speaker 9: first ballot, and why he ended up getting elected as

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Speaker 9: a Senate majority leader.

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Speaker 2: Lisa, what do you think of Elon Musk showing up today?

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Speaker 2: It was actually in the room for this when Donald

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Speaker 2: Trump went to meet with House Republicans.

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Speaker 3: You used to work for a Speaker of the House.

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Speaker 3: You know what this meeting is like.

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Speaker 2: When everybody comes back from the election, they all get

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Speaker 2: back together here for the lame duck and talk about

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Speaker 2: the way forward, the leaders that they want to pick,

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Speaker 2: and so forth.

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Speaker 3: Elon Musk was in the room.

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Speaker 2: Apparently he didn't say anything, did a lot of waving,

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Speaker 2: But there's a report that came out of thereafter Lauren

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Speaker 2: Windsor tweeting. A senator told me that Elon Musk is

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Speaker 2: threatening to fund a primary challenge to any House Republican

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Speaker 2: who does not fall in line with Trump's agenda. How

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Speaker 2: important of a role is Elon Musk playing in Washington

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Speaker 2: right now?

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Speaker 8: Well, you know, I think it remains to be seen. Joe.

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Speaker 7: This is to me one of those things where I'm

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Speaker 7: not sure there's enough room in Washington, or really in

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Speaker 7: the globe for the two egos.

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Speaker 8: That are going to be competing for one another.

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Speaker 7: So I think right now it's very interesting to see

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Speaker 7: that someone like Elon Musk wants to play a role.

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Speaker 7: But look, he played a role in the disruption of Twitter, right,

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Speaker 7: he played a role in the disruption of a lot

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Speaker 7: of other That is primarily his role in the world

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Speaker 7: right is to be a disruptor and an agent of change.

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Speaker 7: And it also is the exact role that Donald Trump

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Speaker 7: plays in not only the Republican Party, but in the

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Speaker 7: American culture, right. So these two forces as they sort

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Speaker 7: of work around one another, are going to be very

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Speaker 7: interesting to watch to me, because Elon Musk did definitely

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Speaker 7: try to play very much in Pennsylvania, rewarding those who

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Speaker 7: would come out and support Donald Trump with resources and

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Speaker 7: even a bounty to win.

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Speaker 8: So it's going to be interesting to watch how that

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Speaker 8: all plays out.

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Speaker 7: But I also think too that it's also a signal

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Speaker 7: to the House, the house that I once knew, that

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Speaker 7: I once worked in, that things are going.

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Speaker 8: To work very differently.

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Speaker 7: And that's I think, sort of reflective of what you're

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Speaker 7: seeing even in the picks for the cabinet, Joe, is

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Speaker 7: that we are not We can't apply the old playbook

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Speaker 7: to the playbook that's being used today. This is very

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Speaker 7: different Washington. This is very different governing, and it's going

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Speaker 7: to be the way things are going to move now

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Speaker 7: for the next four years.

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Speaker 2: Really interesting at your thoughts on this. I don't know

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Speaker 2: that Elon Musk was on your dance card for the

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Speaker 2: new Congress, never mind the new White House. But he

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Speaker 2: is going to be working with Donald Trump, who made

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Speaker 2: this official last night, a new Department of Government Efficiency.

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Speaker 2: Remember they came up with this with while they were

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Speaker 2: spitballing in their interview on Twitter spaces. So cut government

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Speaker 2: spending to streamline bureaucracy. If Avake Ramaswami is going to

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Speaker 2: help run this thing used to work in the White House.

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Speaker 2: This is not an official government agency. So is this

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Speaker 2: just window dressing? How would it work?

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Speaker 10: Well, first, let's say this tip back. I think it's

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Speaker 10: a bit hilarious that they have a Department of Government

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Speaker 10: Efficiency and have two people running it.

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Speaker 9: But putting that aside, I think it's also you know,

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Speaker 9: an exam way for them to get around, you know,

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Speaker 9: the some of the ethics rules within the White House

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Speaker 9: we have should ask serious questions. I mean, if you

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Speaker 9: go in to work in the White House, you have

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Speaker 9: to submit your financials, you have to go through a

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Speaker 9: whole background check. There's a whole bunch of questions that

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Speaker 9: they ask about your you know, drug use and everything else.

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Speaker 10: And that's something that if you're an outside you.

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Speaker 9: Know, government uh employee ors or someone who's supporting in

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Speaker 9: this weird structure, you're not subject to those ethics rules.

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Speaker 9: And so there's real you could quit I think questions

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Speaker 9: to be asked there.

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Speaker 10: It's gonna be very hard to one put forward ideas.

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Speaker 10: You've got to get them passed. And we know the

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Speaker 10: House majority. If it as it.

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Speaker 9: Looks like Republicans end up taking the House, you're gonna

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Speaker 9: have one to two votes, maybe maybe three vote margin

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Speaker 9: to get all those things past. Is gonna That's gonna

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Speaker 9: be a lot of capital that Speaker Mike Johnson, if

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Speaker 9: he's Speaker, will have to.

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Speaker 10: Have to spend.

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Speaker 9: And that's before we even get to whether he'll even

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Speaker 9: have a lot of these members who Trump is plucking

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Speaker 9: for his cabinet, who will.

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Speaker 10: Even then whether there will be new members to replace them.

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Speaker 9: So I think there's a lot of kind of questions

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Speaker 9: to be asked about how quickly this will go into

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Speaker 9: effect and whether the you know, the Doge structure will

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Speaker 9: actually end up living up to its name.

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Speaker 2: I love that you're calling it that. I mean, this

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Speaker 2: is like, this is for real. Every time we say

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Speaker 2: Doge Lisa producer James retirement account goes up.

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Speaker 10: I should know better.

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Speaker 2: Elon Musk said it could become the Manhattan Project of

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Speaker 2: our time.

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Speaker 3: Is that what you expect? Lisa Kamussa Miller.

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Speaker 7: You know, Look, I think Joe that we need to stay,

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Speaker 7: stay stort of steady on this. I think Elon Musk

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Speaker 7: would love for it to be the Manhattan Project.

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Speaker 8: In his time. But you know, to Adam's point that he.

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Speaker 7: Made about all of the processes that are in place,

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Speaker 7: don't forget that the last time Trump was in office,

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Speaker 7: he circumvented a.

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Speaker 8: Lot of those processes. So I do think.

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Speaker 7: That this very well could be the kind of disruptor

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Speaker 7: that Elon Musk and vi vaik Ramaswami and the President

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Speaker 7: himself want to see happen.

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Speaker 8: They want to affect change. They feel like the election.

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Speaker 7: Results absolutely galvanize that for them as a pathway forward. People,

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Speaker 7: regardless of all of the issues that surround Donald Trump,

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Speaker 7: are anxious and willing for change, and I think that

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Speaker 7: this is absolutely an indication that that is the direction

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Speaker 7: that this administration is going to take.

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Speaker 2: Well, there's a lot there, Adam. Elon Musk says, this

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Speaker 2: will send shock waves through the system. This is a

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Speaker 2: quote and anyone involved in government waste, which is a

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Speaker 2: lot of people exclamation point when we talk about government waste, though, Adam,

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Speaker 2: everyone's got a different idea of what counts as waste.

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Speaker 2: The fact of the matter is every Penny has a

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Speaker 2: constituency behind it, doesn't it How easy is this going

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Speaker 2: to be to cut two trillion dollars?

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Speaker 10: I mean, it's not gonna be easy at all.

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00:22:38,280 --> 00:22:40,879
Speaker 9: But look, I'm old enough to remember, and I get

443
00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:43,720
Speaker 9: the great hairs to prove it. I guess when Elon

444
00:22:43,800 --> 00:22:47,439
Speaker 9: Musk's own you know, Tesla was considered you know, a

445
00:22:47,480 --> 00:22:51,080
Speaker 9: boon doggle that is by the Obama administration way back

446
00:22:51,119 --> 00:22:53,520
Speaker 9: when it was funding to try to help get an

447
00:22:53,520 --> 00:22:56,359
Speaker 9: electric vehicle industry off the ground in the in the US,

448
00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:58,760
Speaker 9: and people deem that, you know, as something that was

449
00:22:58,800 --> 00:23:02,800
Speaker 9: a waste of money. So I think every interest in Washington,

450
00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:05,600
Speaker 9: there are people who were there to defend it, to

451
00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:06,119
Speaker 9: protect it.

452
00:23:06,280 --> 00:23:07,399
Speaker 10: And that goes both sides.

453
00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:09,960
Speaker 9: That not not just you know, on the defense spending,

454
00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:14,359
Speaker 9: that's not just you know this healthcare across the board.

455
00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:16,359
Speaker 10: And so there's a lot of questions I think to

456
00:23:16,359 --> 00:23:19,240
Speaker 10: be asked about how effective he will actually be in

457
00:23:19,320 --> 00:23:21,440
Speaker 10: shaping that. And again Congress will have to have a say.

458
00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:23,520
Speaker 9: There's going to be a budget process, and I think

459
00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:25,760
Speaker 9: you're cutting two trillion from the budget in a year.

460
00:23:26,080 --> 00:23:28,720
Speaker 10: There's a lot of pain. And Elon's alluded to that pain.

461
00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:31,440
Speaker 9: But members of Congress don't exactly like to go back

462
00:23:31,640 --> 00:23:33,720
Speaker 9: and sell pain back to their constituents.

463
00:23:34,600 --> 00:23:37,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, they kind of have a thing about that.

464
00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:39,560
Speaker 2: I thought when you said you're old enough to remember,

465
00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:41,359
Speaker 2: you might reach for Simpson Bulls.

466
00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:43,520
Speaker 3: Been hearing a lot about that lately.

467
00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:46,040
Speaker 2: And I don't I don't mean to give you PTSD, Lisa,

468
00:23:46,040 --> 00:23:47,520
Speaker 2: because I know we all look through that.

469
00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:49,120
Speaker 3: We'll see if this is more effective.

470
00:23:49,880 --> 00:23:52,200
Speaker 2: We have a lot to learn here about the DOGE,

471
00:23:52,720 --> 00:23:56,359
Speaker 2: but in the meantime, let's help producer James make some money.

472
00:23:56,480 --> 00:23:59,919
Speaker 2: Our panel stays with us, Lisa Camusa, Miller and the

473
00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:02,119
Speaker 2: great Adam Hodge. This is a good combination and we're

474
00:24:02,119 --> 00:24:03,680
Speaker 2: gonna have a lot more to talk about next hour.

475
00:24:03,680 --> 00:24:05,919
Speaker 2: As we run through the list, we've barely gotten to

476
00:24:06,160 --> 00:24:10,040
Speaker 2: anything beyond Elon Musk. How about the new choice for

477
00:24:10,320 --> 00:24:13,679
Speaker 2: Defense Secretary? A lot more where this came from, the

478
00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:15,879
Speaker 2: new head of the CIA, Donald Trump coming out with

479
00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:19,159
Speaker 2: a lot of appointments in the last twenty four hours.

480
00:24:19,280 --> 00:24:21,520
Speaker 2: Kaylee Lions will be back from the White House in

481
00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:24,360
Speaker 2: our second hour as we welcome our global television audience

482
00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:28,040
Speaker 2: to the conversation. It's a big day around here, continuity

483
00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:30,840
Speaker 2: of government, the two presidents meet, and a new leadership

484
00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:32,240
Speaker 2: battle on Capitol Hill.

485
00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:35,160
Speaker 3: John Thune in front of the Senate This is Bloomberg.

486
00:24:38,840 --> 00:24:42,359
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch

487
00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:45,479
Speaker 1: Just Live weekdays at noon Eastern on Epocarplay and then

488
00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:49,000
Speaker 1: Rounoro with the Bloomberg Business app. Listen on demand wherever

489
00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:56,480
Speaker 1: you get your podcasts A watch us live on YouTube.

490
00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:57,520
Speaker 4: Here in Washington. Kaylee lines alongside Joe Matthew. This is

491
00:24:57,600 --> 00:25:00,359
Speaker 4: Balance of Power on Bloomberg TV and Radio. On what

492
00:25:00,480 --> 00:25:03,840
Speaker 4: is an incredibly busy day in Washington. Is Donald Trump,

493
00:25:03,920 --> 00:25:06,760
Speaker 4: the President elect and former president, comes back to town,

494
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:09,960
Speaker 4: beginning his day meeting with the House Republican Conference and

495
00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:12,720
Speaker 4: then moving on to the White House where we saw

496
00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:15,080
Speaker 4: something that didn't take place the last go around in

497
00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:18,560
Speaker 4: twenty twenty, a meeting and in some ways a visual

498
00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:21,280
Speaker 4: image of the handoff that is happening between two presidents.

499
00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:25,720
Speaker 4: Joe Biden sitting down in the Oval with Donald Trump West.

500
00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:30,000
Speaker 11: The President elect and former president. Thank you mc donald, congratulation,

501
00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:34,080
Speaker 11: thank you, and looking forward to having a likely said

502
00:25:34,960 --> 00:25:38,760
Speaker 11: smooth transition toever we can make sure you're a commodating

503
00:25:38,840 --> 00:25:40,960
Speaker 11: what you need, and we're going to get a chance

504
00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:42,040
Speaker 11: to talk across on that today.

505
00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:42,720
Speaker 1: It's good.

506
00:25:43,119 --> 00:25:43,560
Speaker 11: Welcome.

507
00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:48,520
Speaker 12: Weank you, Jay, thank you very much. And politics is tough,

508
00:25:49,359 --> 00:25:53,080
Speaker 12: and it's many cases not a very nice world, but

509
00:25:53,480 --> 00:25:55,800
Speaker 12: it is a nice world today, and I appreciate very

510
00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:59,680
Speaker 12: much a transition that's so smooth. It'll be as smooth

511
00:25:59,720 --> 00:26:00,720
Speaker 12: as can get it.

512
00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:04,000
Speaker 5: I very much appreciate that you you are.

513
00:26:05,200 --> 00:26:07,520
Speaker 2: Sitting in front of the fireplace in the Oval Office,

514
00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:11,080
Speaker 2: Donald Trump and Joe Biden. We've learned that meeting has concluded.

515
00:26:11,119 --> 00:26:11,280
Speaker 1: Now.

516
00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:14,160
Speaker 2: It was a lengthy one, the better part of two hours.

517
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:16,160
Speaker 2: That was just the beginning. By the way, if you're

518
00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:19,800
Speaker 2: with us on Bloomberg TV or radio seeing or hearing,

519
00:26:20,440 --> 00:26:20,960
Speaker 2: what just.

520
00:26:20,920 --> 00:26:23,240
Speaker 3: Occurred was the start of a lengthy session.

521
00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:25,359
Speaker 2: The press pool then ushered out of the room, and

522
00:26:25,400 --> 00:26:27,400
Speaker 2: we want to bring you back to the White House

523
00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:30,000
Speaker 2: right now on the North lawn for an update from

524
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:31,439
Speaker 2: Bloomberg's Tyler Kendall.

525
00:26:31,760 --> 00:26:33,679
Speaker 3: They must have had a lot to talk about, Tyler.

526
00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:35,000
Speaker 3: What are you seeing there?

527
00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:37,520
Speaker 6: Yeah, hey, Joe, So I'm here at the White House

528
00:26:37,560 --> 00:26:41,399
Speaker 6: as you just announced that meeting between President Biden and

529
00:26:41,440 --> 00:26:44,640
Speaker 6: President Elect Donald Trump has concluded. They started at eleven

530
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:47,320
Speaker 6: seven Eastern, so going for almost two hours.

531
00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:47,520
Speaker 8: Now.

532
00:26:47,520 --> 00:26:50,479
Speaker 6: Of course, this meeting was largely viewed as symbolic, right

533
00:26:50,520 --> 00:26:52,880
Speaker 6: the White House saying it was to ensure a peaceful

534
00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:55,880
Speaker 6: transfer of power, President Biden saying He'll make sure that

535
00:26:55,880 --> 00:26:58,280
Speaker 6: that goes as smooth as possible, earlier in the week,

536
00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:02,520
Speaker 6: saying that's because that is what Americans quote deserve. Now,

537
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:05,680
Speaker 6: we do know that four years ago Donald Trump did

538
00:27:05,680 --> 00:27:09,560
Speaker 6: not extend this same tradition to president then President elect

539
00:27:09,640 --> 00:27:12,119
Speaker 6: Joe Biden. However, today they did appear cordial, as you

540
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:14,359
Speaker 6: heard in those remarks off the top. We also know

541
00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:17,359
Speaker 6: that they were both joined by their respective chiefs of staff,

542
00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:19,440
Speaker 6: of course, the current White House Chief of Staff Jeff

543
00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:22,399
Speaker 6: Science and incoming Chief of Staff Susie Wiles. Now, in

544
00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:24,280
Speaker 6: terms of what they could have talked about, we are

545
00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:26,560
Speaker 6: still waiting to hear if he does come out, if

546
00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:28,600
Speaker 6: there is any readout from the meeting, but experts do

547
00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:31,359
Speaker 6: tell us that national security was probably pretty high on

548
00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:34,480
Speaker 6: that list, mostly because President Electrump hasn't received those same

549
00:27:34,520 --> 00:27:38,280
Speaker 6: sort of classified briefings these last four years. Another clue

550
00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:40,239
Speaker 6: that we can look to is what President Biden has

551
00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:43,240
Speaker 6: been pushing for in these final weeks of his administration.

552
00:27:43,359 --> 00:27:46,240
Speaker 6: We know that National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan has said

553
00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:49,080
Speaker 6: that they will push the truck transition, particularly when it

554
00:27:49,119 --> 00:27:52,320
Speaker 6: comes to continued security assistance for Ukraine. So that might

555
00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:54,920
Speaker 6: be one of those potential talking points that they spoke about.

556
00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:56,960
Speaker 6: But Joe and Keyley, just quickly, I will note that

557
00:27:57,000 --> 00:27:59,560
Speaker 6: as somebody who has interviewed Senator Jade Vance now Vice

558
00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:02,760
Speaker 6: President elect JD Vance numerous times on Capitol Hill, he

559
00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:05,600
Speaker 6: is one of those staunchest opponents of ah Ukraine. So

560
00:28:05,640 --> 00:28:07,399
Speaker 6: that's definitely one of the stories we're going to be

561
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:09,240
Speaker 6: following and see if any headlines come out of that

562
00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:11,240
Speaker 6: meeting today.

563
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:14,000
Speaker 4: All right, bloombergs Tyler, Kendall live at the North lawn

564
00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:16,480
Speaker 4: of the White House. Thank you so much. Again that

565
00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:20,399
Speaker 4: meeting between President Biden and President Elect Trump at the

566
00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:22,600
Speaker 4: White House has concluded. We want to turn now for

567
00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:25,800
Speaker 4: more reaction to Bloomberg. Senior reporter and editor who covers

568
00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:28,080
Speaker 4: the White House, Michelle jam Risco, who's here with us

569
00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:29,480
Speaker 4: in our Washington.

570
00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:29,359
Speaker 12: D C.

571
00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:31,679
Speaker 4: Studio. So Michelle Tyler was just making the point that

572
00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:34,680
Speaker 4: foreign policy could have featured heavily in this conversation. We

573
00:28:34,760 --> 00:28:38,360
Speaker 4: also got some foreign policy news while this meeting was happening.

574
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:40,480
Speaker 4: Joe Biden meeting in the Oval, and we're getting news

575
00:28:40,520 --> 00:28:42,600
Speaker 4: about a meeting Joe Biden will have on the sidelines

576
00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:44,600
Speaker 4: of the APEX summit in Peru this weekend.

577
00:28:44,640 --> 00:28:47,080
Speaker 13: Yeah, finally some confirmation of a meeting that we thought

578
00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:49,920
Speaker 13: might occur, a final meeting between the two, So it'll

579
00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:52,640
Speaker 13: be the last of three that they've had as leaders,

580
00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:56,280
Speaker 13: of course interrupted a little bit by COVID era negotiations.

581
00:28:56,320 --> 00:29:00,160
Speaker 13: But yeah, I think there's a lot of emphasis on

582
00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:02,520
Speaker 13: national security issues, and for good reason. I think there's

583
00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:05,760
Speaker 13: a lot that Biden, who is especially a foreign policy

584
00:29:05,800 --> 00:29:09,920
Speaker 13: president in his own terms and his own liking, there's

585
00:29:09,920 --> 00:29:11,560
Speaker 13: a lot that he wants to discuss. He wants to

586
00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:12,240
Speaker 13: close the loop on.

587
00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:13,160
Speaker 3: He wants to.

588
00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:15,640
Speaker 13: Pass the torch and ensure that he is able to

589
00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:19,320
Speaker 13: Trump proof, so to speak, some of his legacy on

590
00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:23,440
Speaker 13: foreign policy issues, even knowing that the two leaders, Trump

591
00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:28,040
Speaker 13: and Biden disagree strongly on many ways of foreign policy

592
00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:30,800
Speaker 13: and on many of the conflicts that are raging right

593
00:29:30,840 --> 00:29:31,160
Speaker 13: now the.

594
00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:35,320
Speaker 2: World of this conversation, if we've got a lame duck

595
00:29:35,360 --> 00:29:38,640
Speaker 2: president here, of course, and how is it collared by

596
00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:41,880
Speaker 2: the election of Donald Trump, who is professing to be

597
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:43,480
Speaker 2: the greatest China Hawk of them all.

598
00:29:43,760 --> 00:29:46,160
Speaker 13: Yeah, I mean, I think one thing that the White

599
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:48,680
Speaker 13: House is keen to do is to kind of I

600
00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:51,360
Speaker 13: shouldn't say celebrate, but at least point to successes of

601
00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:54,120
Speaker 13: their intense diplomacy as they call it, and managing the

602
00:29:54,160 --> 00:29:57,240
Speaker 13: relationship with China. You know, this is another thing. You know,

603
00:29:57,760 --> 00:29:59,640
Speaker 13: if you talk about optics, you know, the meeting, you

604
00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:01,360
Speaker 13: could say the same or asked the same question of

605
00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:03,600
Speaker 13: the meeting today between Biden and Trump. I mean, why

606
00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:05,800
Speaker 13: do it if they both disagree on so many things.

607
00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:09,480
Speaker 13: They wanted to show in that sense they wanted to

608
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:12,240
Speaker 13: show a smooth transition, and in the sense of meeting

609
00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:14,840
Speaker 13: Biden and she, I mean, I think they want to

610
00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:18,640
Speaker 13: kind of ensure that the relationship is managed in a

611
00:30:18,680 --> 00:30:22,000
Speaker 13: stable way as possible during this transition, as well as

612
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:24,040
Speaker 13: when they hand off to someone who has a very

613
00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:25,960
Speaker 13: different view of how to handle things with the world's

614
00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:26,920
Speaker 13: number two economy.

615
00:30:27,520 --> 00:30:30,720
Speaker 4: Well, so, as we consider the myriad views here, it's

616
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:33,600
Speaker 4: not just about the view of the President elect himself,

617
00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:36,040
Speaker 4: but also those who he has chosen to be close

618
00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:38,640
Speaker 4: to him and advise him on matters of national security

619
00:30:38,680 --> 00:30:42,200
Speaker 4: and foreign policy. Given the nature of the picks he

620
00:30:42,200 --> 00:30:44,200
Speaker 4: has already made, what picture is it painting?

621
00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:45,720
Speaker 8: Yeah, well, at first.

622
00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:48,800
Speaker 13: We saw some China hawks, right We saw lis Stefanak,

623
00:30:48,800 --> 00:30:51,200
Speaker 13: who's had that high on her agenda. We saw Mike Waltz,

624
00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:55,240
Speaker 13: who's talked about a cold war between the US and China.

625
00:30:55,600 --> 00:30:57,920
Speaker 13: And we saw Rubio, who is yet to be confirmed

626
00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:00,800
Speaker 13: by Trump but floated as Secretary of State, who's one

627
00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:03,080
Speaker 13: of the biggest China hawks of them all. But you know,

628
00:31:03,120 --> 00:31:06,040
Speaker 13: on this issue, of course, Washington is rife with folks

629
00:31:06,080 --> 00:31:08,160
Speaker 13: who want to get tough on China and who have

630
00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:12,520
Speaker 13: championed some of the tougher negotiations and tougher sanctions and

631
00:31:12,560 --> 00:31:15,000
Speaker 13: penalties that the US has applied under the Biden administration.

632
00:31:15,560 --> 00:31:18,920
Speaker 13: But there's also at least two big obstacles to a

633
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:20,960
Speaker 13: sort of China hawk policy in the way that it

634
00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:24,280
Speaker 13: has been under a Trump administration. When you have someone

635
00:31:24,280 --> 00:31:27,240
Speaker 13: like Elon Musk, the world's richest man, who has a

636
00:31:27,560 --> 00:31:31,400
Speaker 13: pretty dense network financial network in Asia and in China,

637
00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:34,880
Speaker 13: included half of his electric vehicles produced in China. I mean,

638
00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:38,200
Speaker 13: there's one obstacle to hitting them very hard and kind

639
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:41,920
Speaker 13: of removing and decoupling or you know, separating the economies

640
00:31:41,920 --> 00:31:44,760
Speaker 13: in any regard. And then the second is this intriguing

641
00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:48,840
Speaker 13: and unfolding story about Trump's plans or supposed plans to

642
00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:51,600
Speaker 13: try to overturn or not comply with the TikTok ban

643
00:31:51,880 --> 00:31:54,600
Speaker 13: or forced sale or ban, i should say, which is

644
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:57,840
Speaker 13: really coming hot in January. So there's a lot to

645
00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:00,160
Speaker 13: discuss there, and a lot that will be at odds

646
00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:04,200
Speaker 13: between who he's drafting into his administration and what he

647
00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:06,880
Speaker 13: wants to do with his foreign policy toward China.

648
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:09,320
Speaker 2: Deeply curious to see what Donald Trump does with the

649
00:32:09,360 --> 00:32:13,200
Speaker 2: TikTok situation, Michelle jim Risco, Bloomberg Senior Reporter Editor, Thank

650
00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:15,640
Speaker 2: you so much for the insights, Michelle. On an important

651
00:32:15,720 --> 00:32:18,880
Speaker 2: day in Washington, as we add the voice of a

652
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:21,720
Speaker 2: member of Congress, a Republican member who was in the

653
00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:24,480
Speaker 2: room today for the meeting with Donald Trump, Elon Musk

654
00:32:24,920 --> 00:32:28,040
Speaker 2: in tow and of course Speaker Mike Johnson, who received

655
00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:33,000
Speaker 2: the endorsement of the President elects Mark Molinaro, outgoing Republican

656
00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:36,520
Speaker 2: Congressman from New York's nineteenth Congressman, great to see you,

657
00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:40,440
Speaker 2: Welcome back to Bloomberg TV and Radio. Bring us in

658
00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:43,480
Speaker 2: the room for this opportunity today. Who was a bigger

659
00:32:43,560 --> 00:32:44,960
Speaker 2: hit Trump or Musk?

660
00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:48,520
Speaker 14: A little question, that was President Donald Trump. There was

661
00:32:48,560 --> 00:32:52,360
Speaker 14: a great degree of enthusiasm. I think you know met meeting.

662
00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:55,080
Speaker 14: That enthusiasm in the room has been the economic rebound,

663
00:32:55,120 --> 00:32:58,760
Speaker 14: and we certainly see that across the country. But without question,

664
00:32:59,200 --> 00:33:02,760
Speaker 14: there's unity and the House Republican Conference and that unity

665
00:33:03,040 --> 00:33:06,520
Speaker 14: in partnership with Senator Thoune now as majority leader, really

666
00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:09,360
Speaker 14: sets up the environment for President Trump to deliver not

667
00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:12,000
Speaker 14: only on his mandate but on his vision to make

668
00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:12,920
Speaker 14: this country great again.

669
00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:18,320
Speaker 4: Well before the next Congress takes its seats. Congressman, there

670
00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:22,120
Speaker 4: is this Congress to finish up in this lame duck session.

671
00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:24,520
Speaker 4: Did he express what he would like to see accomplished

672
00:33:24,600 --> 00:33:27,400
Speaker 4: before he takes the oath of office in January?

673
00:33:28,280 --> 00:33:31,800
Speaker 14: He was very specific about about assembling his cabinet, and

674
00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:34,280
Speaker 14: I will tell you it was more for thinking than

675
00:33:34,760 --> 00:33:37,960
Speaker 14: the next thirty or forty days. I mean, quite frankly,

676
00:33:38,040 --> 00:33:41,520
Speaker 14: with an incoming Republican majority in the Senate. It benefits

677
00:33:41,840 --> 00:33:46,360
Speaker 14: the president to obviously put bigger questions into that Congress,

678
00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:50,080
Speaker 14: right because again, the American people spoke overwhelmingly. They embrace

679
00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:54,160
Speaker 14: the America First agenda. They support President Trump with now

680
00:33:54,160 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 14: an historic victory and frankly, a unified government Senate, House

681
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:02,600
Speaker 14: and White House, and to deliver on efficiencies. And I

682
00:34:02,600 --> 00:34:04,400
Speaker 14: will tell you this, he spent a lot of time

683
00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:07,360
Speaker 14: talking about efficiency and government. Obviously the big ticket items

684
00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:12,040
Speaker 14: border security, confronting and strengthening America's role across the globe,

685
00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:14,960
Speaker 14: but also looking internally and making this government function again,

686
00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:19,120
Speaker 14: respect taxpayers, and deliver on greater efficiency and his vision

687
00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:22,279
Speaker 14: for making sure that the federal government actually do its job.

688
00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:25,799
Speaker 2: Well, Well, Congressman, we've got a funding deadline coming up

689
00:34:25,840 --> 00:34:28,799
Speaker 2: on December twentieth. There's some reporting out there today that

690
00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:33,000
Speaker 2: there's a desire by some Republicans, some pro Trump Republicans,

691
00:34:33,000 --> 00:34:36,399
Speaker 2: to extend funding with a stop gap through September. Take

692
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:38,200
Speaker 2: it off as plate, let him work on the rest

693
00:34:38,239 --> 00:34:41,200
Speaker 2: of the agenda. I'm assuming the Freedom Caucus wouldn't stand

694
00:34:41,200 --> 00:34:44,480
Speaker 2: for that. Where do you stand on that matter? And

695
00:34:44,520 --> 00:34:46,919
Speaker 2: what's a more likely scenario if that's not the case.

696
00:34:47,480 --> 00:34:49,680
Speaker 14: Well, we're at the point now where we're going to

697
00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:53,640
Speaker 14: start very early next year in appropriations discussions for twenty

698
00:34:54,040 --> 00:34:56,840
Speaker 14: five and twenty six. It does make sense to extend

699
00:34:57,360 --> 00:35:01,360
Speaker 14: the current CR later in the year, allow the President

700
00:35:01,400 --> 00:35:04,400
Speaker 14: to assemble the cabinet, get organized. We're going to have

701
00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:06,560
Speaker 14: to deal with a whole host of his issues. They

702
00:35:06,560 --> 00:35:12,719
Speaker 14: will of course reconciliation, confronting obviously international questions. And I

703
00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:16,920
Speaker 14: just think the setting forth the process to get the

704
00:35:16,960 --> 00:35:19,759
Speaker 14: twenty five to twenty six appropriation structure in place, you know,

705
00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:22,600
Speaker 14: really lends itself simply to extending the CR later into

706
00:35:22,640 --> 00:35:23,080
Speaker 14: next year.

707
00:35:23,360 --> 00:35:24,239
Speaker 3: It likely makes sense.

708
00:35:24,239 --> 00:35:27,520
Speaker 14: It'll have some opposition, certainly, and frankly, the two Houses

709
00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:29,640
Speaker 14: are going to respond to what the President really hopes

710
00:35:29,680 --> 00:35:31,800
Speaker 14: to achieve. But we have this moment. I mean, listen,

711
00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:35,399
Speaker 14: the President is focused on delivering results, and I think

712
00:35:35,400 --> 00:35:38,080
Speaker 14: that means everything from getting FEMA to focus on responding

713
00:35:38,080 --> 00:35:41,720
Speaker 14: effectively to Americans to making sure our transportation infrastructure actually

714
00:35:41,760 --> 00:35:43,560
Speaker 14: is safe and works. And so there's going to be

715
00:35:43,600 --> 00:35:47,120
Speaker 14: a hefty agenda moving forward. See our extension later in

716
00:35:47,120 --> 00:35:48,239
Speaker 14: the year seems to make the most sense.

717
00:35:48,320 --> 00:35:51,959
Speaker 2: Yeah, later being September or are you in the camp

718
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:53,560
Speaker 2: to get this done through March.

719
00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:58,279
Speaker 14: Oh, I mean, listen, I won't be returning next year,

720
00:35:58,719 --> 00:36:00,880
Speaker 14: but I think later in the year is the better option.

721
00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:03,480
Speaker 14: It's going to be too if we try to crunch

722
00:36:03,520 --> 00:36:05,640
Speaker 14: this into the first quarter of next year. There's just

723
00:36:05,719 --> 00:36:08,000
Speaker 14: too much to have to achieve in that very short

724
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:10,800
Speaker 14: window of opportunity. We don't want to compound or complicate

725
00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:14,240
Speaker 14: the president's agenda, and he has a broad, bold agenda

726
00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:16,160
Speaker 14: that was met with a national mandate.

727
00:36:17,960 --> 00:36:21,640
Speaker 4: Well, Congressman, you certainly won't be there in January, but

728
00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:23,920
Speaker 4: I do wonder if you may have a return to

729
00:36:23,960 --> 00:36:27,840
Speaker 4: the House in your sites. Congressman Elise Stephonic, whose district

730
00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:30,319
Speaker 4: is very close to yours in the state of New York,

731
00:36:30,360 --> 00:36:33,200
Speaker 4: has been tapped to be ambassador to the UN assuming

732
00:36:33,280 --> 00:36:35,799
Speaker 4: she gets confirmed. That's a seat up for grabs. Would

733
00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:36,359
Speaker 4: you go for it?

734
00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:40,160
Speaker 14: I've said this for some flattered A good number of

735
00:36:40,160 --> 00:36:42,640
Speaker 14: people in that district have reached out to me. I

736
00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:44,319
Speaker 14: know upstate New York pretty well. I ran for governor

737
00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:46,600
Speaker 14: in twenty eighteen and frankly gave voice to a lot

738
00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:48,760
Speaker 14: of these communities. This has been an honor of lifetime

739
00:36:48,800 --> 00:36:52,239
Speaker 14: these last two years. They just finished counting votes in

740
00:36:52,239 --> 00:36:55,080
Speaker 14: my race yesterday. My hope and my goal is to

741
00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:58,880
Speaker 14: remain active in representing in some capacity and serving in

742
00:36:58,880 --> 00:37:02,080
Speaker 14: some capacity people up state New York. And so at

743
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:05,319
Speaker 14: this point we'll see how that plays out. But I'm

744
00:37:05,800 --> 00:37:09,520
Speaker 14: very much interested in furthering the President's agenda, ensuring that

745
00:37:09,600 --> 00:37:12,279
Speaker 14: America meets this moment and that the people up state

746
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:14,400
Speaker 14: New York have an aggressive fighter on their behalf.

747
00:37:15,640 --> 00:37:18,880
Speaker 2: Sounds like you might have plans, Congressman. They did just

748
00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:21,480
Speaker 2: finish counting the votes in your race yesterday, and I

749
00:37:21,480 --> 00:37:24,720
Speaker 2: think it's worth noting as we saw Donald Trump return

750
00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:28,200
Speaker 2: to the White House today with Joe Biden, who is

751
00:37:28,239 --> 00:37:31,120
Speaker 2: clearly trying to express the importance of continuity of government

752
00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:34,399
Speaker 2: here in the peaceful transfer of power that you immediately

753
00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:35,600
Speaker 2: conceded your race.

754
00:37:36,520 --> 00:37:38,040
Speaker 3: You had some very nice things, in.

755
00:37:37,960 --> 00:37:41,400
Speaker 2: Fact, to say about Democrat Josh Riley, who won the election,

756
00:37:41,560 --> 00:37:44,680
Speaker 2: congratulating him early on. Is that a model for your

757
00:37:44,719 --> 00:37:45,920
Speaker 2: colleagues to follow.

758
00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:50,480
Speaker 14: A Listen, I honor the results and do wish him well.

759
00:37:50,680 --> 00:37:53,239
Speaker 14: We're not enemies, we're opponents, and I do think even

760
00:37:53,239 --> 00:37:56,960
Speaker 14: as President Trump earlier met with President Biden, there was

761
00:37:57,000 --> 00:38:00,000
Speaker 14: a camaraderie and acknowledgment that the transition of power should

762
00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:03,360
Speaker 14: should move seamlessly, and that there needs to be a

763
00:38:03,400 --> 00:38:06,360
Speaker 14: respect for the great democratic proceeds. And by the way, again,

764
00:38:06,719 --> 00:38:10,960
Speaker 14: America delivered a hit, an historic win for the president,

765
00:38:11,000 --> 00:38:14,480
Speaker 14: and the president in return seeks to fulfill that mandate,

766
00:38:14,480 --> 00:38:16,359
Speaker 14: and that means serving everybody. And I think we heard that.

767
00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:19,480
Speaker 14: I certainly know we heard that in conference today. But

768
00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:21,440
Speaker 14: I respect the outcome of the election. Listen, I was

769
00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:25,319
Speaker 14: at the receiving end of a brutalized and brutal, a

770
00:38:25,320 --> 00:38:27,640
Speaker 14: brutal campaign. They outspent us by about eight and a

771
00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:30,799
Speaker 14: half million dollars. But the results are the results. We

772
00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:33,439
Speaker 14: respect them. We move forward, and I will tell you though,

773
00:38:33,600 --> 00:38:37,120
Speaker 14: I remain committed to ensuring both the success of the

774
00:38:37,120 --> 00:38:40,279
Speaker 14: House Republican Conference, the success of President Donald Trump and

775
00:38:40,320 --> 00:38:43,800
Speaker 14: his administration, and the goal of truly making this country

776
00:38:43,840 --> 00:38:45,680
Speaker 14: as great as it can be and as it ought

777
00:38:45,680 --> 00:38:48,600
Speaker 14: to be, but also making sure the people upstate New

778
00:38:48,680 --> 00:38:52,879
Speaker 14: York are well represented and respected well.

779
00:38:52,920 --> 00:38:56,000
Speaker 4: Finally, Congressman, as we considered the conference, you obviously have

780
00:38:56,080 --> 00:38:59,160
Speaker 4: been operating in what has been a thin majority for

781
00:38:59,200 --> 00:39:01,839
Speaker 4: the last two years, and While the majority does look

782
00:39:01,920 --> 00:39:04,120
Speaker 4: like it will be retained once again, the margin could

783
00:39:04,160 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 4: be very tight. How would you advise your colleagues to

784
00:39:07,719 --> 00:39:10,440
Speaker 4: avoid the mistakes of the last two years in the

785
00:39:10,480 --> 00:39:11,960
Speaker 4: next two and remaining cohesive.

786
00:39:12,719 --> 00:39:15,080
Speaker 14: Well, we have the benefit of now having a Republican

787
00:39:15,120 --> 00:39:17,400
Speaker 14: majority in the Senate and of course at President Trump's election,

788
00:39:17,520 --> 00:39:19,920
Speaker 14: so there's going to be a real push to stay united.

789
00:39:19,960 --> 00:39:22,799
Speaker 14: The President made that clear in conference in the meeting

790
00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:24,160
Speaker 14: we had today, But there's gonna be a push to

791
00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:26,880
Speaker 14: stay united. I think that pressure and the leadership that

792
00:39:26,920 --> 00:39:29,000
Speaker 14: the President will provide in that regard will keep some

793
00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:32,880
Speaker 14: from causing some degree of chaos. But yes, the Speaker

794
00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:35,440
Speaker 14: is well aware, and I've got nothing but admiration for

795
00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:37,840
Speaker 14: Mike Johnson and the leadership team in particular as at

796
00:39:37,880 --> 00:39:41,640
Speaker 14: least dephonically. Obviously, her leadership and conference will be very,

797
00:39:41,719 --> 00:39:45,480
Speaker 14: very useful and effective. But again, I think the Speaker

798
00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:48,839
Speaker 14: understands that there's going to have to be a lot

799
00:39:48,840 --> 00:39:53,600
Speaker 14: of coalition building and consensus molding. Having the President lean

800
00:39:53,680 --> 00:39:56,720
Speaker 14: in and Senator Thun and the majority in the Senate

801
00:39:57,080 --> 00:40:00,000
Speaker 14: makes that a little bit easier. But we're diverse. Conference,

802
00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:02,879
Speaker 14: you know that you've seen it on full display. It's

803
00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:07,040
Speaker 14: just my advice. My advice is work hard to mold consensus,

804
00:40:07,120 --> 00:40:10,160
Speaker 14: Listen to voices, both that which agree with you and

805
00:40:10,160 --> 00:40:15,120
Speaker 14: that which disagree. Into My colleagues throughout the House Republican Conference,

806
00:40:15,360 --> 00:40:18,200
Speaker 14: respect the fact that Republicans were given a mandate to

807
00:40:18,280 --> 00:40:23,080
Speaker 14: deliver a safer country, a more secure nation, and a

808
00:40:23,120 --> 00:40:24,000
Speaker 14: stronger economy.

809
00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:28,680
Speaker 4: All right, Congressman Mark Molnaro, the Republican from New York

810
00:40:28,719 --> 00:40:31,759
Speaker 4: live from Capitol Hill, thank you so much for joining us,

811
00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:34,920
Speaker 4: And of course, a reminder, the Republican House leadership elections

812
00:40:34,960 --> 00:40:38,400
Speaker 4: will be taking place later today after Senator John Thune

813
00:40:38,400 --> 00:40:40,600
Speaker 4: was tapped as the next majority leader. We'll have full

814
00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:45,480
Speaker 4: coverage here on Bloomberg TV and radio.

815
00:40:46,160 --> 00:40:49,560
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast kens

816
00:40:49,680 --> 00:40:52,439
Speaker 1: just live weekdays at noon Eastern on Apple car Play

817
00:40:52,480 --> 00:40:54,880
Speaker 1: and then roud Oro with the Bloomberg Business app. You

818
00:40:54,920 --> 00:40:58,160
Speaker 1: can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship

819
00:40:58,239 --> 00:41:01,640
Speaker 1: New York station, just say to play Bloomberg eleven.

820
00:41:04,080 --> 00:41:06,160
Speaker 4: We consider it the fact that leadership is going to

821
00:41:06,200 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 4: be instrumental in both chambers in advancing the agenda of

822
00:41:09,760 --> 00:41:11,960
Speaker 4: Donald Trump. As we heard Senator thun there, he does

823
00:41:12,000 --> 00:41:13,960
Speaker 4: want to ensure that Trump has the tools and support

824
00:41:14,080 --> 00:41:17,000
Speaker 4: needed for that agenda, and on things like tax policy,

825
00:41:17,080 --> 00:41:19,640
Speaker 4: sure you need Congress to go along with you. On

826
00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:22,239
Speaker 4: other policies the president is able to act with a

827
00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:24,920
Speaker 4: little bit more authority, like say on tariffs.

828
00:41:25,120 --> 00:41:27,839
Speaker 2: I think that you're reaching to the right place here,

829
00:41:27,880 --> 00:41:30,400
Speaker 2: which is something that we want to talk about. In

830
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:34,959
Speaker 2: an important conversation with Nazak Nikochtar, national Security Practice.

831
00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:36,719
Speaker 3: Group lead at Wiley Rain here.

832
00:41:36,840 --> 00:41:40,440
Speaker 2: In Washington, former Department of Commerce Assistant secretary and under secretary.

833
00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:42,799
Speaker 3: Great to see you at the table, Thanks for joining us.

834
00:41:43,440 --> 00:41:47,040
Speaker 2: Your concerns now maybe none about this train rolling down

835
00:41:47,080 --> 00:41:50,640
Speaker 2: the tracks because Donald Trump just stopped by the White House.

836
00:41:50,680 --> 00:41:52,440
Speaker 2: The next time he's there, I suspect he'll be the

837
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:53,760
Speaker 2: president of the United States.

838
00:41:54,400 --> 00:41:57,440
Speaker 15: Absolutely. He's made no mistakes that he There's lots of

839
00:41:57,480 --> 00:42:00,400
Speaker 15: economic distortions that he's going to take on that have

840
00:42:01,040 --> 00:42:05,040
Speaker 15: impaired the US's ability to produce. His downwardly has had

841
00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:12,080
Speaker 15: downward impacts on jobs, productivity, innovation, corporate profits right GDP.

842
00:42:12,719 --> 00:42:15,120
Speaker 15: And so he has made clear that he is going

843
00:42:15,160 --> 00:42:18,719
Speaker 15: to pursue terror policies primarily to correct for those distortions.

844
00:42:18,880 --> 00:42:21,480
Speaker 4: Well, so let's talk about what he's really said about tariffs.

845
00:42:21,480 --> 00:42:24,640
Speaker 4: He suggested ten to twenty percent blanket on all imports.

846
00:42:24,680 --> 00:42:28,120
Speaker 4: You suggested numbers of sixty percent plus on Chinese goods,

847
00:42:28,160 --> 00:42:30,600
Speaker 4: perhaps one hundred percent or more on certain goods like

848
00:42:30,640 --> 00:42:34,480
Speaker 4: cars coming out of Mexico. How realistic are those figures

849
00:42:34,560 --> 00:42:37,120
Speaker 4: or do you expect in reality they will be much lower.

850
00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:41,280
Speaker 15: So it's going to be really based on industry by industry.

851
00:42:41,760 --> 00:42:45,000
Speaker 15: But I want to address the global tariff issue because

852
00:42:45,239 --> 00:42:49,840
Speaker 15: I hear this question constantly. And this isn't really a

853
00:42:50,000 --> 00:42:52,359
Speaker 15: matter of picking fights with our allies, because that's just

854
00:42:52,360 --> 00:42:54,759
Speaker 15: not what anybody is in the business to do. This

855
00:42:54,840 --> 00:42:58,480
Speaker 15: is really recognizing the fact that China's industrial policies, China's

856
00:42:58,520 --> 00:43:02,840
Speaker 15: overcapacity dotworted global prices. When you think about critical minerals,

857
00:43:02,840 --> 00:43:05,120
Speaker 15: when you think about autos, when you think about semiconductors,

858
00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:08,560
Speaker 15: when you think about steel, aluminum, the list goes on.

859
00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:12,840
Speaker 15: These are materials that go into a lot of manufactured goods,

860
00:43:13,160 --> 00:43:16,360
Speaker 15: and when we are overflowed in the United States by cheap,

861
00:43:17,120 --> 00:43:20,920
Speaker 15: distortedly priced goods because of the overcapacity, has depressed global

862
00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:25,040
Speaker 15: prices we're losing jobs, we're losing industry output. We've got it,

863
00:43:25,160 --> 00:43:28,400
Speaker 15: introduced tariffs globally to correct for those distortions.

864
00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:31,480
Speaker 2: The big conversation, or I guess argument here in Washington

865
00:43:31,520 --> 00:43:34,839
Speaker 2: has been whether the money from tariffs would be enough

866
00:43:34,840 --> 00:43:38,640
Speaker 2: to offset tax cuts, for instance, when you start considering

867
00:43:38,719 --> 00:43:42,600
Speaker 2: lack of revenues potentially in a Trump administration, we don't

868
00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:46,759
Speaker 2: talk much about retribution. What would be the answer to

869
00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:49,560
Speaker 2: all of these teriffs from other countries, starting with China.

870
00:43:49,640 --> 00:43:52,560
Speaker 15: Yeah, I mean, I think without question what I found,

871
00:43:52,719 --> 00:43:56,239
Speaker 15: having previously served in the Trump administration is that when

872
00:43:56,320 --> 00:43:59,480
Speaker 15: we have articulated to the EU, for example, the reason

873
00:43:59,560 --> 00:44:02,040
Speaker 15: for our care of policies, right, we do have an

874
00:44:02,040 --> 00:44:05,920
Speaker 15: issue with steal and aluminum overcapacity. The European producers who

875
00:44:05,960 --> 00:44:07,640
Speaker 15: are not selling in their home markets and have been

876
00:44:07,640 --> 00:44:09,920
Speaker 15: displaced from the global markets and now are shifting to

877
00:44:09,960 --> 00:44:13,120
Speaker 15: the United States, they actually tend to understand what we're doing.

878
00:44:13,440 --> 00:44:17,239
Speaker 15: And furthermore, when we have imposed teriffs to correct for

879
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:21,320
Speaker 15: these distortions, our allies were then inundated with the Chinese

880
00:44:21,360 --> 00:44:24,760
Speaker 15: over capacity, and then they invoked safeguard measures to protect

881
00:44:24,760 --> 00:44:28,080
Speaker 15: their industries too from those distortions. So I think that

882
00:44:28,160 --> 00:44:31,320
Speaker 15: once we engage with allies and articulate the reasons why

883
00:44:31,360 --> 00:44:34,960
Speaker 15: we're doing this, they'll either not retaliate or they will

884
00:44:35,000 --> 00:44:37,719
Speaker 15: take the corrective measures they need that will allow us

885
00:44:37,760 --> 00:44:40,560
Speaker 15: to remove the tariffs because they've addressed those distortions in

886
00:44:40,600 --> 00:44:42,480
Speaker 15: their market. We've done that before. I think we're going

887
00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:43,520
Speaker 15: to expect to see that again.

888
00:44:43,680 --> 00:44:46,200
Speaker 4: But what would you say to those who view this

889
00:44:46,320 --> 00:44:50,160
Speaker 4: mechanism for correcting those distortions is effectively just raising the

890
00:44:50,160 --> 00:44:52,759
Speaker 4: price of everything because importers are still going to have

891
00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:56,160
Speaker 4: to pay these levies. Is that's what is necessary in

892
00:44:56,160 --> 00:44:58,319
Speaker 4: flight prices in order to correct this?

893
00:44:58,600 --> 00:45:01,359
Speaker 15: That is a great question. So in the last administration,

894
00:45:01,400 --> 00:45:03,400
Speaker 15: when we impose those tariffs on the Chinese goods, and

895
00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:06,640
Speaker 15: when we pose it the tariffs on steel and aluminum goods,

896
00:45:06,960 --> 00:45:10,000
Speaker 15: the US International Trade Commission, it's a quasi unit, a

897
00:45:10,040 --> 00:45:13,719
Speaker 15: government body, bipartisan bases, conducted a study about two years

898
00:45:13,760 --> 00:45:16,720
Speaker 15: ago and found that those tariffs had zero inflationary effect

899
00:45:16,760 --> 00:45:19,560
Speaker 15: in it at most infinitesimony we're targeted.

900
00:45:19,600 --> 00:45:21,680
Speaker 4: We're not talking about the global terariffs.

901
00:45:21,400 --> 00:45:24,080
Speaker 15: Right that you're discussing, right, And so there's a couple

902
00:45:24,080 --> 00:45:27,320
Speaker 15: of things that I that's worth underscoring. We're not looking

903
00:45:27,360 --> 00:45:31,680
Speaker 15: at just price increases in isolation. It's really important for

904
00:45:31,719 --> 00:45:34,560
Speaker 15: the economy to be healthy to correct for those distortions

905
00:45:34,560 --> 00:45:38,279
Speaker 15: and the prices that gives you long term economic growth stability,

906
00:45:38,680 --> 00:45:41,880
Speaker 15: and those price increases that may be somewhat will be

907
00:45:41,960 --> 00:45:46,800
Speaker 15: offset by rises and wages, corporate productive output, et cetera.

908
00:45:47,000 --> 00:45:51,320
Speaker 15: So I would expect that those moderate tariffs would translate

909
00:45:51,360 --> 00:45:55,080
Speaker 15: into healthy economic gains for the United States. On the

910
00:45:55,160 --> 00:45:59,600
Speaker 15: China side, President Trump has underscored significant tariffs. Even with

911
00:45:59,800 --> 00:46:03,160
Speaker 15: the those tariffs on the Mexican industries, right, it's where

912
00:46:03,239 --> 00:46:06,520
Speaker 15: China has been behind those We've noticed that China tends

913
00:46:06,520 --> 00:46:09,000
Speaker 15: to up to a certain point, China tends to absorb

914
00:46:09,040 --> 00:46:11,960
Speaker 15: those tariffs. And the reason it doesn't translate those tariffs

915
00:46:11,960 --> 00:46:14,320
Speaker 15: into price increases is because China doesn't want to displace

916
00:46:14,360 --> 00:46:17,040
Speaker 15: itself from the market, and if those tariffs gets too high,

917
00:46:17,239 --> 00:46:20,040
Speaker 15: China then abandons the US market. But we see very

918
00:46:20,120 --> 00:46:23,040
Speaker 15: few instances of actually the pass through on the China side.

919
00:46:23,200 --> 00:46:25,319
Speaker 2: Was it the right thing for the Biden administration to

920
00:46:25,400 --> 00:46:28,200
Speaker 2: continue with the Trump tariffs that that have been in

921
00:46:28,320 --> 00:46:30,000
Speaker 2: place this has become the new normal.

922
00:46:30,239 --> 00:46:33,720
Speaker 15: Absolutely, And it wasn't just the continuation of the Trump tariffs.

923
00:46:34,160 --> 00:46:38,359
Speaker 15: President Trump, the Trump administration imposed those tariffs as a countermeasure,

924
00:46:38,400 --> 00:46:42,080
Speaker 15: a legally authorized countermeasure to address China's IP theft. And

925
00:46:42,160 --> 00:46:45,560
Speaker 15: as long as China's IP theft continues and it imposes

926
00:46:45,560 --> 00:46:48,040
Speaker 15: an economic cost to the US economy of fifty billion

927
00:46:48,080 --> 00:46:51,920
Speaker 15: dollars a year, absolutely, those tariff measures are appropriate. They're

928
00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:54,839
Speaker 15: legally authorized. Plus, what else are we going to do

929
00:46:55,200 --> 00:46:58,320
Speaker 15: to compel the Chinese government to change its acts, policies,

930
00:46:58,320 --> 00:46:59,000
Speaker 15: and practices.

931
00:46:59,440 --> 00:47:02,359
Speaker 4: We consider other ways in which to compel them. It's

932
00:47:02,360 --> 00:47:05,839
Speaker 4: not just tariff'sys administration has pursued, but export controls as well,

933
00:47:05,840 --> 00:47:09,319
Speaker 4: making it harder for China to develop strategic technologies. Have

934
00:47:09,360 --> 00:47:12,360
Speaker 4: those been affected or should we effective or should we

935
00:47:12,440 --> 00:47:15,759
Speaker 4: expect this incoming administration to go harder on that, to

936
00:47:15,800 --> 00:47:16,520
Speaker 4: crack down more?

937
00:47:16,719 --> 00:47:18,680
Speaker 15: I think very much harder. I think there's been a

938
00:47:18,719 --> 00:47:23,120
Speaker 15: growing recognition. I am really glad that Congress and folks

939
00:47:23,360 --> 00:47:25,520
Speaker 15: in the industry and in the think tank community have

940
00:47:25,680 --> 00:47:29,160
Speaker 15: learned to take the times to educate themselves about export controls,

941
00:47:29,360 --> 00:47:31,840
Speaker 15: because I think the growing recognition has been the small

942
00:47:31,920 --> 00:47:35,080
Speaker 15: yard high friends approach isn't working. We need to expand it.

943
00:47:35,080 --> 00:47:37,040
Speaker 15: With respect to China, I think there's going to be

944
00:47:37,120 --> 00:47:40,960
Speaker 15: a significant movement which I wholeheartedly support. Did you regulate

945
00:47:41,040 --> 00:47:44,440
Speaker 15: with respect to allies and really increase those guardrails with

946
00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:47,600
Speaker 15: respect to countries of concern? And I think the Trump

947
00:47:47,640 --> 00:47:51,000
Speaker 15: administration most certainly will move in that direction just quickly.

948
00:47:51,000 --> 00:47:53,560
Speaker 4: We have thirty seconds left here. Should Robert Leithheiser reprise

949
00:47:53,640 --> 00:47:56,560
Speaker 4: his role as USTR in this incoming administration? Would you

950
00:47:56,560 --> 00:47:57,120
Speaker 4: advocate for that?

951
00:47:57,239 --> 00:48:00,320
Speaker 15: I think Robert Leiittheiser is doing the nation of Serus

952
00:48:00,480 --> 00:48:03,240
Speaker 15: by lending his expertise to President Trump on all things

953
00:48:03,280 --> 00:48:07,040
Speaker 15: trade and trade, national security, and nexus. I would be

954
00:48:07,080 --> 00:48:09,480
Speaker 15: glad for him to continue in any capacity. He and

955
00:48:09,520 --> 00:48:11,160
Speaker 15: President Trump se fit all right, And I.

956
00:48:11,200 --> 00:48:12,680
Speaker 4: Was like, thank you so much for joining us, And

957
00:48:12,719 --> 00:48:15,560
Speaker 4: I was like, Nacoctar is national Security Practice group lead

958
00:48:15,600 --> 00:48:19,239
Speaker 4: at Wiley Rihan and former Department of Commerce Assistant Secretary

959
00:48:19,239 --> 00:48:22,359
Speaker 4: and undersecretary during the Trump administration. Thank you for being

960
00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:24,800
Speaker 4: here with us on the early edition of Balance of Power.

961
00:48:29,160 --> 00:48:32,359
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to the Balance of Power podcast. Make

962
00:48:32,400 --> 00:48:35,320
Speaker 2: sure to subscribe if you haven't already at Apple, Spotify,

963
00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:38,000
Speaker 2: or wherever you get your podcasts, and you can find

964
00:48:38,080 --> 00:48:41,320
Speaker 2: us live every weekday from Washington, DC at noontime Eastern

965
00:48:41,600 --> 00:48:43,000
Speaker 2: at Bloomberg dot com