1 00:00:03,640 --> 00:00:05,960 Speaker 1: One of the most recognized names and faces in the 2 00:00:05,960 --> 00:00:09,160 Speaker 1: world today is Kim Kardashian. She has more than three 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,280 Speaker 1: hundred and sixty five million Instagram followers. I don't have 4 00:00:12,360 --> 00:00:16,120 Speaker 1: any Instagram followers. Recently, she decided to get into my business, 5 00:00:16,120 --> 00:00:18,840 Speaker 1: the private equity business, and it's starting a private equity 6 00:00:18,880 --> 00:00:21,599 Speaker 1: fund with one of my former partners, Jay Sammons. I 7 00:00:21,640 --> 00:00:23,800 Speaker 1: had a chance at a private equity conference in Berlin 8 00:00:24,079 --> 00:00:27,520 Speaker 1: to interview both Jay and Kim about their private equity fund, 9 00:00:27,600 --> 00:00:29,880 Speaker 1: and I also had a chance to interview Kim Kardashian 10 00:00:29,920 --> 00:00:35,160 Speaker 1: alone before the conference began. I've often said that private 11 00:00:35,200 --> 00:00:37,839 Speaker 1: equity is the highest calling of mankind. Why did it 12 00:00:37,840 --> 00:00:40,320 Speaker 1: take you so long to realize that and that to 13 00:00:40,400 --> 00:00:41,680 Speaker 1: join the private equity world. 14 00:00:43,400 --> 00:00:46,360 Speaker 2: I finally got talked into it once I came to 15 00:00:46,400 --> 00:00:51,880 Speaker 2: that realization. I have had a long standing relationship with Jay, 16 00:00:52,159 --> 00:00:56,440 Speaker 2: who came from the Carlisle Group, and I was pretty 17 00:00:56,480 --> 00:00:59,440 Speaker 2: close to doing a few deals with Jay when he 18 00:00:59,480 --> 00:00:59,880 Speaker 2: was at. 19 00:00:59,720 --> 00:01:00,680 Speaker 3: The car Allowed Groups. 20 00:01:00,760 --> 00:01:04,679 Speaker 2: So for about ten years we had conversations, whether it 21 00:01:04,760 --> 00:01:07,400 Speaker 2: was through something we were going to do or people 22 00:01:07,480 --> 00:01:09,720 Speaker 2: close to us we're going to do. And I was 23 00:01:09,760 --> 00:01:16,959 Speaker 2: privy to all of those conversations, so we finally, you know, 24 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:19,399 Speaker 2: had the conversation that we. 25 00:01:19,319 --> 00:01:21,120 Speaker 3: Should really get into business together. 26 00:01:22,000 --> 00:01:22,280 Speaker 4: Okay. 27 00:01:22,640 --> 00:01:24,640 Speaker 3: It's been a fascinating process. 28 00:01:24,800 --> 00:01:29,720 Speaker 1: So the name of your firm is Sky Partners. Sky 29 00:01:29,959 --> 00:01:36,240 Speaker 1: is usually spelled sky yours is s KK. Why how 30 00:01:36,240 --> 00:01:37,360 Speaker 1: did you come up with that name? 31 00:01:39,760 --> 00:01:42,679 Speaker 3: You know, we had to have a little bit of influence. 32 00:01:42,800 --> 00:01:46,200 Speaker 2: I thought, you know, Jay Salmons, I thought that the 33 00:01:46,560 --> 00:01:50,280 Speaker 2: S for Salmon's and KK Kim Kardashian. 34 00:01:50,400 --> 00:01:51,400 Speaker 1: Okay, it worked out. 35 00:01:51,720 --> 00:01:52,360 Speaker 3: It worked out. 36 00:01:53,200 --> 00:01:57,040 Speaker 1: So you've now been exposed to the private ecuy world 37 00:01:57,160 --> 00:01:59,480 Speaker 1: for a little bit of time. You've met the investors 38 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:02,840 Speaker 1: here and around the world, so forth, what is your 39 00:02:02,880 --> 00:02:07,800 Speaker 1: review of the private equity investment community? The most honest 40 00:02:07,840 --> 00:02:08,640 Speaker 1: people you ever. 41 00:02:08,520 --> 00:02:16,120 Speaker 2: Met, very very nice people. I actually have been introduced 42 00:02:16,200 --> 00:02:19,399 Speaker 2: to the world a lot of my friends growing up 43 00:02:19,760 --> 00:02:23,280 Speaker 2: they are in this space now. So I'm on a 44 00:02:24,080 --> 00:02:27,519 Speaker 2: group chat where I'm being asked all the time about 45 00:02:27,560 --> 00:02:30,600 Speaker 2: different companies and businesses, mostly tech that they invest in 46 00:02:30,720 --> 00:02:33,840 Speaker 2: if they're really good companies. And I've even gotten on 47 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:36,560 Speaker 2: you know, zooms with all of the founders to hear 48 00:02:36,600 --> 00:02:41,280 Speaker 2: their pitches on their businesses. As if I work with 49 00:02:41,320 --> 00:02:45,880 Speaker 2: them already, so I felt like it would be a 50 00:02:45,919 --> 00:02:49,160 Speaker 2: really good next step to do it together. 51 00:02:49,600 --> 00:02:52,160 Speaker 1: So Jay, how did you two of you first meet 52 00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:54,400 Speaker 1: and how did you get in the private equity and 53 00:02:54,400 --> 00:02:57,120 Speaker 1: why did you specialize in consumer? Well? 54 00:02:57,120 --> 00:02:59,440 Speaker 4: I started, first of all, David, thanks for having us 55 00:02:59,480 --> 00:03:02,000 Speaker 4: and for being here with us. I started my investing 56 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 4: career about twenty three years ago, and I had the 57 00:03:05,080 --> 00:03:07,960 Speaker 4: privilege of spending almost the last seventy years working for you. 58 00:03:08,440 --> 00:03:10,520 Speaker 4: As you know, I actually did not start investing in 59 00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:15,760 Speaker 4: consumer businesses until I started at Carlisle, but obviously, you know, 60 00:03:15,760 --> 00:03:17,680 Speaker 4: spend the entirety of my time at Carlisle doing that. 61 00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:20,519 Speaker 4: In particular, I spent all of my time trying to 62 00:03:20,560 --> 00:03:23,800 Speaker 4: back great, disruptive, high growth consumer brands, and I have 63 00:03:23,840 --> 00:03:25,679 Speaker 4: a passion for that. I believe it's the best place 64 00:03:25,720 --> 00:03:28,480 Speaker 4: to invest in consumer and the experiences that I had 65 00:03:28,480 --> 00:03:30,520 Speaker 4: at Carlisle, as I said, are putting us in a 66 00:03:30,520 --> 00:03:32,000 Speaker 4: position to build something really special here. 67 00:03:32,080 --> 00:03:36,400 Speaker 1: Sky. So you also have a clothing company which is 68 00:03:36,520 --> 00:03:41,880 Speaker 1: called a Skims, right, and you have a skin care 69 00:03:42,040 --> 00:03:46,800 Speaker 1: beauty products company called skin Skin by Kim Kim. Okay, 70 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:49,360 Speaker 1: all right, all right, did you need a lot of 71 00:03:49,360 --> 00:03:52,520 Speaker 1: help coming up with that name. Probably not. Yeah, Okay, 72 00:03:52,800 --> 00:03:56,600 Speaker 1: so that's two businesses is pretty big. Those are big businesses. 73 00:03:57,080 --> 00:03:59,160 Speaker 1: Why did you think you had the time you have 74 00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:04,240 Speaker 1: four children to do another business in the private equity world, 75 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:06,440 Speaker 1: how much time do you really have for something like this? 76 00:04:09,160 --> 00:04:14,000 Speaker 2: I feel like in life you have to do things 77 00:04:14,000 --> 00:04:17,000 Speaker 2: that challenge you and help you grow and evolve. 78 00:04:17,360 --> 00:04:18,320 Speaker 3: And this is a. 79 00:04:18,279 --> 00:04:21,440 Speaker 2: Space that after spending a lot of time with Jay 80 00:04:21,760 --> 00:04:27,440 Speaker 2: and with the knowledge that I've learned starting businesses, taking 81 00:04:27,480 --> 00:04:31,080 Speaker 2: investments from firms and people that I've learned so much about, 82 00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:34,440 Speaker 2: and having great relationships, and also being on the other 83 00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:38,320 Speaker 2: side seeing relationships not work out if you don't partner 84 00:04:38,360 --> 00:04:43,159 Speaker 2: with the right investment person and team. And I really 85 00:04:43,240 --> 00:04:48,920 Speaker 2: felt like we could set ourselves apart by me really 86 00:04:50,560 --> 00:04:54,760 Speaker 2: being that person that has been the founder, that believes 87 00:04:54,760 --> 00:04:58,560 Speaker 2: in the founder, that wants to really help that company 88 00:04:58,680 --> 00:05:03,080 Speaker 2: grow and thrive and really support them because I've been 89 00:05:03,120 --> 00:05:07,520 Speaker 2: there and seen relationships work and not work. And it 90 00:05:07,640 --> 00:05:10,880 Speaker 2: was just something that I was really interested in that 91 00:05:10,920 --> 00:05:13,080 Speaker 2: I was willing to cut back on other things. 92 00:05:13,480 --> 00:05:16,560 Speaker 1: Okay, And so when you ask people to do meetings, 93 00:05:16,560 --> 00:05:19,160 Speaker 1: do they say no? Or is it that hard to 94 00:05:19,200 --> 00:05:21,640 Speaker 1: get a meeting or probably with investors, or not that hard. 95 00:05:22,800 --> 00:05:26,120 Speaker 4: So the answer is no, and I'm grateful for that. 96 00:05:26,200 --> 00:05:28,800 Speaker 4: And it's largely because, you know, I believe that what 97 00:05:28,920 --> 00:05:32,599 Speaker 4: KEM and I are building is unlike anything else that's 98 00:05:32,640 --> 00:05:35,680 Speaker 4: being built in this space, and it's a very intentional 99 00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:40,680 Speaker 4: combination of two really complementary skill sets that other firms 100 00:05:40,680 --> 00:05:41,159 Speaker 4: don't have. 101 00:05:41,400 --> 00:05:46,040 Speaker 1: So, say, right now, the private ecuy world's tough to 102 00:05:46,080 --> 00:05:48,680 Speaker 1: get financing for deals and so forth, So are you 103 00:05:48,680 --> 00:05:51,919 Speaker 1: going to be doing buyouts which require financing or are 104 00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:53,960 Speaker 1: you going to do growth capital deals which presumably don't 105 00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:55,400 Speaker 1: need as much financing or any. 106 00:05:55,520 --> 00:05:58,880 Speaker 4: Yeah, our strategy is actually really consistent again with what 107 00:05:58,960 --> 00:06:02,680 Speaker 4: I've done in the which was very unreliant on leverage. 108 00:06:03,440 --> 00:06:06,480 Speaker 4: In the consumer growth world, it's about great asset selection 109 00:06:06,600 --> 00:06:09,920 Speaker 4: and great execution on value creation plans. It's not about 110 00:06:09,960 --> 00:06:12,440 Speaker 4: the marginal amount of leverage that will drive a few 111 00:06:12,480 --> 00:06:14,840 Speaker 4: basis points of incremental returns. So in some instances, when 112 00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:16,640 Speaker 4: the companies can support it, we'll use a little bit, 113 00:06:17,000 --> 00:06:19,600 Speaker 4: but in most instances we won't. It's all about just 114 00:06:19,600 --> 00:06:21,039 Speaker 4: getting behind the right ideas. 115 00:06:21,160 --> 00:06:24,080 Speaker 1: Okay, so when a deal comes along, how do you 116 00:06:24,120 --> 00:06:26,640 Speaker 1: have an investment committee. I presume you're on the investment committee, 117 00:06:26,480 --> 00:06:29,800 Speaker 1: and so is it a one person veto If you 118 00:06:29,800 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 1: don't like the deal, it's not going to get done, 119 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 1: Or if you don't like the deal, it's not going 120 00:06:32,360 --> 00:06:33,400 Speaker 1: to get done. How does that work? 121 00:06:33,839 --> 00:06:36,440 Speaker 2: Well, so far, we haven't really run into that issue. 122 00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:39,760 Speaker 2: We both, I think, respect each other's opinion and trust 123 00:06:39,800 --> 00:06:44,360 Speaker 2: each other. I think culturally we have the same vision 124 00:06:44,760 --> 00:06:47,800 Speaker 2: of what brands we think can grow and that we 125 00:06:47,839 --> 00:06:51,800 Speaker 2: can really help make an impact. But we also both 126 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:56,240 Speaker 2: really believe that our team being included in these decisions 127 00:06:56,320 --> 00:06:58,720 Speaker 2: is really important and we want everyone on our team 128 00:06:58,760 --> 00:06:59,480 Speaker 2: to have a voice. 129 00:06:59,560 --> 00:07:01,920 Speaker 1: What is it that you're most looking forward to about 130 00:07:01,960 --> 00:07:05,279 Speaker 1: private equity? Is it coming to conferences like this? Is 131 00:07:05,320 --> 00:07:07,160 Speaker 1: that what you're most looking forward to? 132 00:07:07,320 --> 00:07:13,280 Speaker 2: Absolutely, I'm honestly most looking forward to my relationships with 133 00:07:13,920 --> 00:07:18,640 Speaker 2: the founders. I'm really fascinated to hear their backstory. I'm 134 00:07:18,680 --> 00:07:25,240 Speaker 2: a storyteller. I'm so excited just to have the opportunity 135 00:07:25,320 --> 00:07:30,800 Speaker 2: to help them win, and I love hearing people's stories 136 00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:35,520 Speaker 2: and hearing what their magic sauces behind their company and 137 00:07:35,640 --> 00:07:38,040 Speaker 2: why they wanted to start the company that they did 138 00:07:38,360 --> 00:07:40,480 Speaker 2: and what their vision is and just hope that I 139 00:07:40,480 --> 00:07:41,240 Speaker 2: can help that. 140 00:07:44,920 --> 00:07:47,640 Speaker 1: So you can be called one of the first influencers, 141 00:07:47,680 --> 00:07:50,800 Speaker 1: or maybe the first of the influencers. Did you know 142 00:07:50,840 --> 00:07:53,040 Speaker 1: what an influencer was really going to lead to when 143 00:07:53,080 --> 00:07:55,000 Speaker 1: you first became a quote influencer? 144 00:07:55,920 --> 00:07:56,880 Speaker 3: No, I really didn't. 145 00:07:57,320 --> 00:08:01,000 Speaker 2: I knew that social media was really interesting in a 146 00:08:01,040 --> 00:08:05,480 Speaker 2: way where I personally, when I got on used it 147 00:08:05,520 --> 00:08:08,800 Speaker 2: as like a free focus group when I had questions 148 00:08:08,840 --> 00:08:12,080 Speaker 2: about I mean, I was launching my first product ever, 149 00:08:12,280 --> 00:08:17,000 Speaker 2: which was a Fragrance, and I needed opinions, and I 150 00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 2: went to Twitter. I remember Twitter was like the first 151 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:27,120 Speaker 2: real platform besides MySpace, which at that time, an influencer 152 00:08:27,200 --> 00:08:28,600 Speaker 2: wasn't even in the mindset. 153 00:08:28,880 --> 00:08:29,560 Speaker 3: Same with Twitter. 154 00:08:29,600 --> 00:08:33,040 Speaker 2: Really for a while, it was more of, I think, 155 00:08:33,080 --> 00:08:35,679 Speaker 2: a way to communicate with a fan base. 156 00:08:36,320 --> 00:08:37,160 Speaker 3: But I did use it. 157 00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:40,160 Speaker 2: As like a free focus group that I thought was fascinating, 158 00:08:40,200 --> 00:08:45,480 Speaker 2: and I felt like the customer became more invested in 159 00:08:45,520 --> 00:08:47,640 Speaker 2: the Fragrance that I was launching because they felt like 160 00:08:47,679 --> 00:08:49,640 Speaker 2: they were a part of it, and I just thought 161 00:08:49,720 --> 00:08:53,000 Speaker 2: that was really interesting. And I didn't quite at that 162 00:08:53,120 --> 00:08:57,400 Speaker 2: time though, realize what a tool social media would be 163 00:08:57,440 --> 00:08:58,400 Speaker 2: for business. 164 00:08:58,640 --> 00:09:01,520 Speaker 1: Now you've built several businesses. Is when you were building them, 165 00:09:01,559 --> 00:09:04,760 Speaker 1: people would say, well, she can't really build a fragrance business, 166 00:09:04,880 --> 00:09:08,360 Speaker 1: or she can't really build a clothing business because she 167 00:09:08,360 --> 00:09:09,920 Speaker 1: doesn't have a background on that. But they turn out 168 00:09:09,920 --> 00:09:13,559 Speaker 1: to be extremely successful. So did people not thinking you 169 00:09:13,600 --> 00:09:16,199 Speaker 1: could do it urge you to make it even more successful? 170 00:09:16,280 --> 00:09:18,280 Speaker 1: Or were you nervous that maybe they were right and 171 00:09:18,320 --> 00:09:20,640 Speaker 1: you couldn't build those businesses? Or how did you feel 172 00:09:20,640 --> 00:09:22,679 Speaker 1: about when you were building these businesses from scratch. 173 00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:27,680 Speaker 2: I definitely always took the doubt as motivation. I always 174 00:09:27,760 --> 00:09:32,240 Speaker 2: felt like, and still do always feel a bit insecure 175 00:09:32,240 --> 00:09:35,680 Speaker 2: about it, confident in the brand. I love creating a 176 00:09:35,720 --> 00:09:38,480 Speaker 2: brand and launching a brand and the whole process of it. 177 00:09:39,920 --> 00:09:44,400 Speaker 2: I always have those I think healthy nerves when you're 178 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:47,280 Speaker 2: launching something, especially on a launch day or a product 179 00:09:47,360 --> 00:09:51,120 Speaker 2: launch day. But I've always felt a little bit. I've 180 00:09:51,120 --> 00:09:54,520 Speaker 2: always felt a doubt, and I've always just taken that 181 00:09:54,679 --> 00:09:58,200 Speaker 2: as motivation to have me focus more and work harder 182 00:09:58,240 --> 00:09:59,760 Speaker 2: and felt like I had more to prove. 183 00:10:00,240 --> 00:10:02,920 Speaker 1: So nobody can build a business or run a business 184 00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:05,839 Speaker 1: by themselves, so you have to hire people and get 185 00:10:05,840 --> 00:10:08,160 Speaker 1: people around you from time to time for your businesses. 186 00:10:08,480 --> 00:10:10,559 Speaker 1: How do you select who you're going to hire? And 187 00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:13,400 Speaker 1: do you ever have to fire anybody and say well 188 00:10:13,480 --> 00:10:15,040 Speaker 1: you're good but not quite good enough. 189 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:18,959 Speaker 2: Yes, I have a great team and a small team, 190 00:10:19,240 --> 00:10:22,760 Speaker 2: and the fires. Firing's really difficult for me, so I 191 00:10:22,800 --> 00:10:25,559 Speaker 2: always have someone else do it. It's really really hard 192 00:10:25,600 --> 00:10:27,680 Speaker 2: for me unless it's someone that works in my household 193 00:10:27,760 --> 00:10:30,120 Speaker 2: and I have a personal relationship with them. Obviously I 194 00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:32,960 Speaker 2: would give them their respect to do that. But I 195 00:10:33,000 --> 00:10:35,520 Speaker 2: have a small team. When I started my beauty business, 196 00:10:35,520 --> 00:10:40,000 Speaker 2: when we started Skims, my business, everything that I do 197 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:44,840 Speaker 2: starts with a really selective in house team, even from 198 00:10:44,880 --> 00:10:48,800 Speaker 2: my business manager. Everyone is just someone that I've taken 199 00:10:49,000 --> 00:10:50,120 Speaker 2: a lot of time to. 200 00:10:50,000 --> 00:10:52,120 Speaker 3: Get to know. I trust. 201 00:10:52,600 --> 00:10:58,120 Speaker 2: And a good community relationship within my office and within 202 00:10:58,200 --> 00:11:01,880 Speaker 2: my house staff everywhere is the most important thing. 203 00:11:02,160 --> 00:11:04,360 Speaker 1: And you test all the products yourself, in other words, 204 00:11:04,400 --> 00:11:06,679 Speaker 1: if it's a beauty product or something you always. 205 00:11:06,440 --> 00:11:10,440 Speaker 2: Tested, oh everything, Yes, yes, I'm so hands on. I'm 206 00:11:10,480 --> 00:11:12,959 Speaker 2: so involved. I mean to this day for Skims, I'm 207 00:11:13,000 --> 00:11:16,679 Speaker 2: still our fit model, which we have like a group 208 00:11:16,720 --> 00:11:19,520 Speaker 2: of fit models, and I'll know the collection that I 209 00:11:19,559 --> 00:11:23,120 Speaker 2: didn't fit for I'm very specific on how things fit 210 00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:26,760 Speaker 2: and make. I pick the fabrics that come up with 211 00:11:26,840 --> 00:11:30,960 Speaker 2: all of the marketing. So with Skims and my beauty brand, Skin, 212 00:11:31,240 --> 00:11:36,120 Speaker 2: I do every last thing from packaging design to helping 213 00:11:36,200 --> 00:11:41,199 Speaker 2: with the fonts and the you know, every campaign, every photographer, 214 00:11:41,200 --> 00:11:44,440 Speaker 2: We pick every formula of every product. I mean, I 215 00:11:44,559 --> 00:11:46,760 Speaker 2: have to be involved one hundred percent. 216 00:11:47,559 --> 00:11:50,640 Speaker 1: So many people would say in one family, you probably 217 00:11:50,679 --> 00:11:54,240 Speaker 1: can't have too many talented business people in your family. 218 00:11:54,240 --> 00:11:56,280 Speaker 1: You seem to have a lot of talented business people. 219 00:11:56,400 --> 00:11:59,520 Speaker 1: So is there a competition between you and your sisters 220 00:11:59,640 --> 00:12:01,840 Speaker 1: or you're so friendly there's no competition. 221 00:12:03,760 --> 00:12:06,199 Speaker 2: You know, even like Kylie and I are both in 222 00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:09,280 Speaker 2: the beauty business and we don't compete. We feel like 223 00:12:09,320 --> 00:12:14,800 Speaker 2: we have two totally different brands and two totally different demographics. 224 00:12:14,880 --> 00:12:17,559 Speaker 2: So I would say we don't really compete in that way. 225 00:12:17,640 --> 00:12:22,120 Speaker 2: If anything, we would motivate each other. And even we 226 00:12:22,160 --> 00:12:26,160 Speaker 2: work on everything really privately and don't really communicate with 227 00:12:26,200 --> 00:12:28,920 Speaker 2: each other about, you know, what we're launching and what 228 00:12:28,960 --> 00:12:31,720 Speaker 2: our campaigns look like. I mean, if we're really excited 229 00:12:31,720 --> 00:12:36,680 Speaker 2: about something, we'll share the process. But it's really rare 230 00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:39,320 Speaker 2: that we do that now, and we don't really. 231 00:12:39,120 --> 00:12:40,000 Speaker 3: Compete like that. 232 00:12:40,360 --> 00:12:42,560 Speaker 2: I think we all just really focus and do our 233 00:12:42,600 --> 00:12:43,040 Speaker 2: own thing. 234 00:12:43,720 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 1: So your mother has been involved with your career as well, 235 00:12:47,040 --> 00:12:49,480 Speaker 1: and your mother is involved, I guess with your sister's 236 00:12:49,559 --> 00:12:52,760 Speaker 1: careers as well. So is she a superstar business manager 237 00:12:52,920 --> 00:12:56,280 Speaker 1: or impresario or how did she manage to keep all 238 00:12:56,320 --> 00:12:58,280 Speaker 1: of the children happy and have them each have their 239 00:12:58,320 --> 00:13:01,360 Speaker 1: own career and owned businesses and still be so close 240 00:13:01,360 --> 00:13:01,680 Speaker 1: to them. 241 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:05,760 Speaker 2: She's definitely the smartest woman I know, and it really 242 00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:09,160 Speaker 2: started for she was a housewife when she was married 243 00:13:09,160 --> 00:13:11,079 Speaker 2: to my dad and she raised the four of us. 244 00:13:11,120 --> 00:13:13,880 Speaker 2: And then when she married my stepdad, she became his 245 00:13:14,160 --> 00:13:20,200 Speaker 2: agent and manager and got her agent license and figured 246 00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:25,040 Speaker 2: it out and really helped that, and then it bled 247 00:13:25,080 --> 00:13:27,839 Speaker 2: into wanting to help her children when the time was 248 00:13:27,960 --> 00:13:30,000 Speaker 2: right and when our career started. 249 00:13:30,080 --> 00:13:31,480 Speaker 3: So I ask her all. 250 00:13:31,400 --> 00:13:35,000 Speaker 2: The time how she manages six kids and we all 251 00:13:35,040 --> 00:13:39,480 Speaker 2: have very similar lives. But I find it really interesting 252 00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:42,960 Speaker 2: that a lot of people call her to want to 253 00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:46,720 Speaker 2: get her to be their manager, and she just like 254 00:13:46,760 --> 00:13:49,560 Speaker 2: her heart is with her children, So I think it's 255 00:13:50,160 --> 00:13:53,439 Speaker 2: a different kind of love and motivation. But she completely 256 00:13:53,480 --> 00:13:55,920 Speaker 2: has helped us all figure it out. We come to 257 00:13:55,960 --> 00:13:59,080 Speaker 2: her for every ounce of advice, and she's really been 258 00:13:59,160 --> 00:14:03,120 Speaker 2: so great managing all of us. But she's also really 259 00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:07,600 Speaker 2: good at being the best mom. And even maybe a 260 00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:10,480 Speaker 2: manager would push for one decision, she'll push for a 261 00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:11,880 Speaker 2: mom decision first. 262 00:14:12,280 --> 00:14:14,400 Speaker 1: So you were very close to your father, who passed 263 00:14:14,440 --> 00:14:17,800 Speaker 1: away a very young age of cancer. He was a lawyer, 264 00:14:17,880 --> 00:14:20,880 Speaker 1: well known lawyer. Did that motivate you to want to 265 00:14:20,920 --> 00:14:22,480 Speaker 1: go and become a lawyer yourself? 266 00:14:23,200 --> 00:14:23,920 Speaker 3: Absolutely? 267 00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:27,160 Speaker 2: I mean I think just seeing him every day he 268 00:14:27,200 --> 00:14:30,520 Speaker 2: would get up, be on his way to work, drop 269 00:14:30,600 --> 00:14:34,040 Speaker 2: us off at school, see him, you know, go to work, 270 00:14:34,080 --> 00:14:37,160 Speaker 2: come home for dinner, like we just I saw how 271 00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:40,920 Speaker 2: hard he worked, and I saw just his work ethic 272 00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:45,520 Speaker 2: that really drove me, and especially his law studies I 273 00:14:45,560 --> 00:14:46,800 Speaker 2: think really inspired me. 274 00:14:47,000 --> 00:14:47,920 Speaker 3: We talked about it. 275 00:14:47,960 --> 00:14:49,600 Speaker 2: I mean, he passed away when I was twenty two, 276 00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:53,840 Speaker 2: so it was I was in college, and we talked 277 00:14:53,840 --> 00:14:57,320 Speaker 2: about my path in college and he was really realistic 278 00:14:57,360 --> 00:14:59,920 Speaker 2: with me. I did not like school, and he said, 279 00:15:00,120 --> 00:15:03,440 Speaker 2: you know, I just don't think that this. I don't 280 00:15:03,480 --> 00:15:05,720 Speaker 2: think you want to do this full time. I really 281 00:15:05,760 --> 00:15:09,360 Speaker 2: want you to think about this, but if you stay 282 00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:13,040 Speaker 2: in school, I will, you know, help with your apartment, 283 00:15:13,160 --> 00:15:15,360 Speaker 2: And it was like a trade off that he would help, 284 00:15:15,840 --> 00:15:18,400 Speaker 2: and I just wanted to be independent and I wanted 285 00:15:18,440 --> 00:15:24,440 Speaker 2: to not go down that journey at that time. But 286 00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:27,320 Speaker 2: I do think that he would. I think he'd absolutely 287 00:15:27,400 --> 00:15:28,840 Speaker 2: be proud of me. But I think he would get 288 00:15:28,880 --> 00:15:31,320 Speaker 2: a kick out of the fact that I'm doing it 289 00:15:31,400 --> 00:15:35,240 Speaker 2: now and he'd be the best study buddy with me 290 00:15:35,280 --> 00:15:37,280 Speaker 2: and help me study. 291 00:15:37,520 --> 00:15:40,080 Speaker 1: Now, to be a lawyer in California, you don't have 292 00:15:40,120 --> 00:15:42,920 Speaker 1: to go to law school. You can read the law, 293 00:15:43,080 --> 00:15:45,040 Speaker 1: which is what people used to do many years ago. 294 00:15:45,120 --> 00:15:47,280 Speaker 1: Abraham Lincoln never went to law school, and he did 295 00:15:47,280 --> 00:15:50,560 Speaker 1: okay as a lawyer. So you're reading the law, and 296 00:15:50,600 --> 00:15:52,600 Speaker 1: you've passed one of the bar exams, and you're going 297 00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:54,400 Speaker 1: to take another one at some point in time, is 298 00:15:54,440 --> 00:15:55,520 Speaker 1: that right? Yeah? 299 00:15:55,640 --> 00:15:58,240 Speaker 2: I think in about two years I take the next one. 300 00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:01,120 Speaker 2: So you need two bars in order to pass to 301 00:16:01,760 --> 00:16:04,920 Speaker 2: become a lawyer. So I think now, since I've passed 302 00:16:04,960 --> 00:16:10,960 Speaker 2: the first one, I could practice under someone, but to 303 00:16:11,240 --> 00:16:13,240 Speaker 2: be a lawyer on my own, I have to pass 304 00:16:13,320 --> 00:16:18,040 Speaker 2: the second bar. So I'm constitutional law is kicking my 305 00:16:18,160 --> 00:16:20,360 Speaker 2: butt right now, and that's what I'm that's what I'm 306 00:16:20,400 --> 00:16:26,880 Speaker 2: studying currently, and it's you know, it's extremely time consuming, 307 00:16:26,920 --> 00:16:28,000 Speaker 2: but so worth it. 308 00:16:28,480 --> 00:16:31,160 Speaker 1: So as you've become so well known, I think you 309 00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:35,160 Speaker 1: have more Twitter followers than probably almost anybody in the world. 310 00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:37,960 Speaker 1: Twitter followers, Instagram followers. You have something like three hundred 311 00:16:37,960 --> 00:16:42,120 Speaker 1: and fifty million Instagram followers. Is that the right number, something. 312 00:16:41,840 --> 00:16:45,480 Speaker 2: Like that, three fifty nine, three hundred and fifty nine million. 313 00:16:45,560 --> 00:16:48,680 Speaker 1: I have zero. I have no Instagram followers. I'm afraid 314 00:16:48,720 --> 00:16:50,720 Speaker 1: to be on Instagram because I wouldn't have any followers. 315 00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:52,880 Speaker 1: But you have three hundred and fifty nine million. So 316 00:16:53,320 --> 00:16:56,400 Speaker 1: when you go to a restaurant or you go out 317 00:16:56,440 --> 00:17:00,000 Speaker 1: in the public anywhere, can you ever be not bothered 318 00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:02,920 Speaker 1: by people who want to take your picture, want a selfie, 319 00:17:03,000 --> 00:17:05,440 Speaker 1: want an autograph? How do you deal with all that? 320 00:17:05,960 --> 00:17:09,000 Speaker 2: I think you know, depending where you go, you really 321 00:17:09,040 --> 00:17:11,280 Speaker 2: have to know where to go, and you definitely can 322 00:17:11,320 --> 00:17:15,000 Speaker 2: get away with that sometimes, but you also have to 323 00:17:15,080 --> 00:17:17,920 Speaker 2: understand when you're going out in public. That's just kind 324 00:17:17,960 --> 00:17:20,320 Speaker 2: of I guess what comes along with the territory. I 325 00:17:20,359 --> 00:17:23,200 Speaker 2: love to travel the world. If I go to Japan, 326 00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:28,080 Speaker 2: you know, no one will ask their culture is very different. 327 00:17:30,520 --> 00:17:33,280 Speaker 2: Different places all over the world just have different i 328 00:17:33,280 --> 00:17:38,160 Speaker 2: think beliefs and cultures where it's just not as important 329 00:17:38,200 --> 00:17:41,800 Speaker 2: for them to ask for photos. So it's fun to 330 00:17:41,920 --> 00:17:46,760 Speaker 2: travel and get away sometimes from that. But I also 331 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:50,240 Speaker 2: know that that kind of comes along with the territory 332 00:17:50,280 --> 00:17:50,720 Speaker 2: as well. 333 00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:53,200 Speaker 1: And how do you convince your children that not every 334 00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:55,879 Speaker 1: mother is as famous as you? Because they see people 335 00:17:55,960 --> 00:17:59,080 Speaker 1: coming calling you, you're very well known. How do you 336 00:17:59,160 --> 00:18:01,240 Speaker 1: convince your children and then not every mother is that 337 00:18:01,320 --> 00:18:04,000 Speaker 1: way and therefore they have to live a life maybe 338 00:18:04,040 --> 00:18:05,600 Speaker 1: a little bit different than the one you're living. 339 00:18:05,960 --> 00:18:10,720 Speaker 2: Well, I think that they really do understand that every 340 00:18:10,800 --> 00:18:14,159 Speaker 2: family is different. I mean even within my sisters, you know, 341 00:18:14,200 --> 00:18:16,840 Speaker 2: other sisters have different rules, snacks that they can eat, 342 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:19,280 Speaker 2: snacks we can eat, shows they can want, you know, 343 00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:22,119 Speaker 2: So we do talk about different families and different rules 344 00:18:22,119 --> 00:18:22,760 Speaker 2: all the time. 345 00:18:23,280 --> 00:18:25,240 Speaker 3: I think that they grew up. 346 00:18:27,000 --> 00:18:30,480 Speaker 2: Seeing a lot and you know, whether we're they were 347 00:18:30,520 --> 00:18:34,960 Speaker 2: at their dad's you know, big events or at filming 348 00:18:35,119 --> 00:18:37,360 Speaker 2: you know, with me and seeing stuff. I think they 349 00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:40,080 Speaker 2: just have known, and we've been really open and honest 350 00:18:40,080 --> 00:18:42,479 Speaker 2: with them about our lives and how big it is 351 00:18:42,520 --> 00:18:45,560 Speaker 2: and how different it is. And let's be positive and 352 00:18:45,560 --> 00:18:48,159 Speaker 2: think of all of like the good, positive things and 353 00:18:49,800 --> 00:18:52,320 Speaker 2: just try to give them amazing experiences. But they are 354 00:18:52,359 --> 00:18:57,560 Speaker 2: also so normal and well grounded that I'm so happy 355 00:18:57,760 --> 00:19:02,240 Speaker 2: that they have a group of cousins that can all relate, 356 00:19:02,520 --> 00:19:05,400 Speaker 2: and that we all live in the same gated community 357 00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:08,119 Speaker 2: and they ride bikes to each other's houses and scooters, 358 00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:12,920 Speaker 2: and I mean, it's they're the most normal, well adjusted kids, 359 00:19:13,040 --> 00:19:16,160 Speaker 2: and it just makes me so happy. And as a mom, 360 00:19:16,280 --> 00:19:19,280 Speaker 2: you just feel like you're doing something right when your 361 00:19:19,359 --> 00:19:20,200 Speaker 2: kids are happy. 362 00:19:20,640 --> 00:19:22,639 Speaker 1: When you were growing up and you were a little 363 00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:27,399 Speaker 1: girl at the age of your children, could everybody pronounce 364 00:19:27,440 --> 00:19:31,280 Speaker 1: the name Kardashian then, because now it's a well known name. 365 00:19:31,320 --> 00:19:35,040 Speaker 1: But I imagine people have said pronounce it incorrectly then 366 00:19:35,080 --> 00:19:38,040 Speaker 1: and you correct them or were you? Was everybody pronouncing 367 00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:39,240 Speaker 1: it correctly then? No? 368 00:19:39,520 --> 00:19:44,160 Speaker 2: I remember then. I would laugh with my dad about 369 00:19:44,160 --> 00:19:47,800 Speaker 2: this during the oj trial, when reporters would always say 370 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:50,800 Speaker 2: his name, they would always get it wrong and say 371 00:19:50,800 --> 00:19:53,080 Speaker 2: different versions of it. And my dad told me a 372 00:19:53,119 --> 00:19:56,600 Speaker 2: story that when the Armenians came over to America, they 373 00:19:56,680 --> 00:19:59,280 Speaker 2: usually took off the iaan off their last name, so 374 00:19:59,320 --> 00:20:02,679 Speaker 2: anyone with Ia and they're Armenian, and so you know, 375 00:20:02,720 --> 00:20:06,360 Speaker 2: our last name would be like kardash you know. And 376 00:20:06,760 --> 00:20:08,840 Speaker 2: he just would always say, just never take the ia 377 00:20:08,960 --> 00:20:10,919 Speaker 2: in off your last name, like it's okay if they 378 00:20:10,960 --> 00:20:13,520 Speaker 2: mispronounce it. We would laugh all the time that no 379 00:20:13,560 --> 00:20:15,639 Speaker 2: one can get our last name. And now it seems 380 00:20:15,680 --> 00:20:16,320 Speaker 2: really simple. 381 00:20:17,400 --> 00:20:19,840 Speaker 1: Well, you and your mother and your sisters and your 382 00:20:19,840 --> 00:20:23,320 Speaker 1: whole family became famous initially, I think with the TV 383 00:20:23,440 --> 00:20:26,560 Speaker 1: show called Keeping Up with the Kardashians. Is that what 384 00:20:26,600 --> 00:20:29,760 Speaker 1: it was? Yes, So when you were first approached about that, 385 00:20:29,800 --> 00:20:31,960 Speaker 1: did you roll your eyes and say I don't want 386 00:20:32,000 --> 00:20:33,760 Speaker 1: to do a reality TV show? Or you say, no, 387 00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:35,119 Speaker 1: this is going to be great. We're going to be 388 00:20:35,119 --> 00:20:37,240 Speaker 1: famous because of this, Or how did you get the 389 00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:39,199 Speaker 1: idea or who came to you with the idea and 390 00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:41,440 Speaker 1: did all of you want to do it unanimously or 391 00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:42,879 Speaker 1: did all of you say maybe not? 392 00:20:43,359 --> 00:20:43,560 Speaker 3: Yeah? 393 00:20:43,560 --> 00:20:46,359 Speaker 2: Well, when I remember so vividly being at my best 394 00:20:46,359 --> 00:20:49,320 Speaker 2: friend's house nineteen eighty nine, So I was nine years 395 00:20:49,320 --> 00:20:51,840 Speaker 2: old and the show The Real World launched, and I 396 00:20:51,920 --> 00:20:53,960 Speaker 2: looked at my best friend and I said, that's it. 397 00:20:54,160 --> 00:20:57,240 Speaker 2: I have to be on a reality show. And she 398 00:20:57,320 --> 00:20:58,720 Speaker 2: said I go, that's what I want to do when 399 00:20:58,720 --> 00:21:01,320 Speaker 2: I grow up, and she said, okay, well when we're eighteen, 400 00:21:02,160 --> 00:21:05,560 Speaker 2: we'll make an audition tape for the Real World. And 401 00:21:05,600 --> 00:21:07,000 Speaker 2: she goes, I don't want to be on, but I'll 402 00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:10,480 Speaker 2: be your manager. And her dad's a manager and we 403 00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:14,440 Speaker 2: laugh now at our conversation then. And the show came 404 00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:18,080 Speaker 2: about because Kathy Lee Gifford is one of my mom's 405 00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:20,600 Speaker 2: closest friends, and when she'd come in town and stay 406 00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:22,760 Speaker 2: with us, she would just laugh and say, you guys 407 00:21:22,840 --> 00:21:25,440 Speaker 2: are a reality show. What you guys are talking about, 408 00:21:25,480 --> 00:21:27,920 Speaker 2: fighting about, how you guys live your life. 409 00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:29,600 Speaker 3: This has to be a reality show. 410 00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:35,120 Speaker 2: And we called Ryan Seacrest, got connected to him, met 411 00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:37,480 Speaker 2: with the E Network, and our show was on the air. 412 00:21:37,680 --> 00:21:40,439 Speaker 2: We started filming a week later. I think we were 413 00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:43,080 Speaker 2: a filler show for a show that fell out of 414 00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:47,960 Speaker 2: production and they needed something quickly, and we just started filming. 415 00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:50,640 Speaker 2: We thought we'd be on for maybe a season or two, 416 00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:54,920 Speaker 2: and we did twenty seasons of Keeping Up with the Kardashians, 417 00:21:55,040 --> 00:22:00,359 Speaker 2: ten spinoffs, and now we're in filming season five four 418 00:22:00,760 --> 00:22:05,240 Speaker 2: of the Kardashians, which is basically the same thing, just 419 00:22:05,280 --> 00:22:06,800 Speaker 2: on a streaming on Hulu. 420 00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:08,760 Speaker 1: When I was nine years old, I wanted to be 421 00:22:08,760 --> 00:22:11,359 Speaker 1: a major League baseball player. That didn't work out for me, 422 00:22:11,480 --> 00:22:13,760 Speaker 1: but usually when you want something at nine, it doesn't 423 00:22:13,800 --> 00:22:15,480 Speaker 1: usually work out. But I guess it worked out for 424 00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:16,560 Speaker 1: you and your sisters. 425 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:17,480 Speaker 3: I was determined. 426 00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:19,320 Speaker 2: They didn't want, they didn't care, and they didn't want 427 00:22:19,320 --> 00:22:21,400 Speaker 2: to do it. But I talked them into it by 428 00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:24,400 Speaker 2: saying that we had a clothing store and I said, 429 00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:26,320 Speaker 2: you guys, this would be the best promotion for our 430 00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:30,560 Speaker 2: clothing store. We should really consider this, and that got 431 00:22:30,560 --> 00:22:31,080 Speaker 2: them hooked. 432 00:22:31,600 --> 00:22:35,800 Speaker 1: Worked out, it did. Thanks for listening to hear more 433 00:22:35,800 --> 00:22:38,840 Speaker 1: of my interviews. You can subscribe and download my podcast 434 00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:41,600 Speaker 1: on Spotify, Apple, or wherever you listen.