WEBVTT - The Man Behind the Curtain 0:00:11.840 --> 0:00:14.560 Good morning, peeps, and welcome to bokay F Daily with 0:00:14.720 --> 0:00:18.880 Meet your Girl Danielle Moody. Recording from the Bunker. Folks, 0:00:18.920 --> 0:00:24.119 we have a very special woke F Pride episode today. 0:00:24.239 --> 0:00:27.000 I am really excited for you all to hear the 0:00:27.120 --> 0:00:31.040 voice and see the face of my producer Andrew Marcello, 0:00:31.120 --> 0:00:33.720 who has been the producer for woke F for the 0:00:33.880 --> 0:00:37.080 last five years and is the reason why the show 0:00:37.800 --> 0:00:41.159 is as great as it is, and so on today's episode, 0:00:41.800 --> 0:00:44.800 for our Pride Month special, we get into a conversation 0:00:44.880 --> 0:00:51.200 about what young queer people are thinking with regard to 0:00:51.240 --> 0:00:54.760 their feelings around Pride, but also for Andrew, you know 0:00:54.880 --> 0:00:59.800 how his identity has shaped his political views and narrative, 0:01:00.400 --> 0:01:04.920 and thinking about what the pushback and violent pushback at 0:01:04.959 --> 0:01:08.880 that that the LGBTQ community is experiencing at this time, 0:01:09.160 --> 0:01:11.760 what this means for the future. So we're going to 0:01:11.840 --> 0:01:16.800 get into this conversation and so much more today on 0:01:16.880 --> 0:01:21.120 woke F. I will give you my thoughts on the hearing, 0:01:21.640 --> 0:01:24.200 which has as of the taping of this has not 0:01:24.280 --> 0:01:28.200 yet happened, so I will be doing that later in 0:01:28.240 --> 0:01:31.000 the week. But coming up next my conversation with woke 0:01:31.240 --> 0:01:38.600 F producer Andrew Marcello. Folks, I am very excited about 0:01:38.680 --> 0:01:43.120 today's episode because we're actually peeling back the woke F 0:01:44.120 --> 0:01:50.040 curtain and having a conversation with Andrew Marcello, my producer 0:01:50.080 --> 0:01:53.640 who's been the producer of woke F my god for 0:01:54.160 --> 0:01:57.080 I don't actually know how long Andrew, how long it 0:01:57.080 --> 0:02:00.640 has been. It's been legitimately it's almost five years. Legitimately 0:02:00.640 --> 0:02:05.600 five years. And Andrew is the person that has makes 0:02:05.640 --> 0:02:10.520 this show magic, makes it sound good, makes it brings 0:02:10.560 --> 0:02:13.800 in the guests that you all enjoy. And so during 0:02:13.800 --> 0:02:18.640 this Pride we decided to have a conversation that we 0:02:18.760 --> 0:02:22.400 probably have over text a million times and actually take 0:02:22.440 --> 0:02:27.640 the text conversation to the podcast. So, Andrew, we'll start 0:02:27.639 --> 0:02:30.160 out the way that we have with the last several 0:02:30.200 --> 0:02:33.400 guests that we've had on this show. Our theme this 0:02:33.480 --> 0:02:38.160 month has been Pride as a Riot. What does pride 0:02:38.440 --> 0:02:41.040 mean to you? What does that theme mean to you? 0:02:42.200 --> 0:02:45.960 That's actually a great question. Now I understand why people 0:02:46.000 --> 0:02:51.000 say that so often. Let me answer you, but yeah, 0:02:51.080 --> 0:02:55.519 it's what does pride mean to me? I think? So 0:02:55.600 --> 0:02:59.919 you you started off mentioning my identity, and I am pansexual, 0:03:00.040 --> 0:03:02.120 and I realized that I was pansexual I think when 0:03:02.160 --> 0:03:06.080 I was eighteen, But pride actually wasn't really something that 0:03:06.160 --> 0:03:10.800 I thought about until my adult life after I graduated college. 0:03:11.000 --> 0:03:14.799 A few years after I graduated college, actually probably around 0:03:15.040 --> 0:03:17.520 twenty sixteen or twenty seventeen, when I moved to New 0:03:17.600 --> 0:03:19.520 York from living in New Jersey and sort of living 0:03:19.520 --> 0:03:21.400 in the same environment that I had lived in before 0:03:21.440 --> 0:03:24.239 going to college. I think part of that is that 0:03:24.919 --> 0:03:29.680 my immediate family didn't necessarily recognize my sexuality. They were 0:03:29.720 --> 0:03:33.720 kind of just like in denial about it, and rather 0:03:33.760 --> 0:03:35.760 than like push back against that harder and have that 0:03:35.840 --> 0:03:37.240 make me feel like, oh, I'm going to be really 0:03:37.320 --> 0:03:38.800 loud about it, I was just like, Okay, you know, 0:03:38.880 --> 0:03:41.760 you'll you'll deny me, and I'll find like other outlets 0:03:41.760 --> 0:03:44.640 and other ways to express this. But once I moved 0:03:44.680 --> 0:03:46.800 to New York, and once I was in a partnership 0:03:46.800 --> 0:03:49.400 and environment where I felt more like I could, you know, 0:03:49.480 --> 0:03:55.600 be outwardly myself pride to some extent, At the beginning, 0:03:55.880 --> 0:03:59.840 I was almost envious of people who, to me as 0:03:59.880 --> 0:04:02.040 an outside observer, they had already gotten to where I 0:04:02.080 --> 0:04:05.120 wanted to be, Like I saw not just like the 0:04:05.280 --> 0:04:10.280 NYC Pride Parade, but the Unicorn Parade in Brooklyn. Like 0:04:10.360 --> 0:04:12.760 that was something that I looked at as like, Wow, 0:04:12.800 --> 0:04:15.200 that's incredible that like these people can go out there 0:04:15.240 --> 0:04:18.920 and just like be themselves and celebrate themselves in a 0:04:18.960 --> 0:04:24.320 way that I do not feel comfortable with. And so 0:04:24.360 --> 0:04:27.880 when I think about Pride, I think about that journey 0:04:28.000 --> 0:04:31.560 that it took me to get from. Like because as myself, 0:04:31.800 --> 0:04:35.599 I am assis white man. Because I'm pansexual, I date, 0:04:35.920 --> 0:04:37.520 I can, you know, day and be with people of 0:04:37.560 --> 0:04:40.040 all genders, and I do end up in relationships with 0:04:40.080 --> 0:04:42.680 sis women that you know, from the outside it looks like, okay, 0:04:42.720 --> 0:04:45.480 we could both be straight. That's often not the case, 0:04:45.760 --> 0:04:48.360 but outside observers don't know, so I can be like 0:04:48.520 --> 0:04:52.279 straight passing. And so to me, to sum up, Pride 0:04:52.520 --> 0:04:55.440 is rejecting that and rejecting the idea of being straight 0:04:55.440 --> 0:04:59.200 passing and like being loud and proud about the fact 0:04:59.240 --> 0:05:02.720 that I am pants and I'm existing in my life 0:05:02.760 --> 0:05:05.599 in this way even when you're not perceiving me that way. 0:05:05.640 --> 0:05:09.279 You know. I think that there are some people who 0:05:09.400 --> 0:05:13.040 may have heard of the term pan sexual and that 0:05:13.080 --> 0:05:16.400 may have come into the lexicon because of a couple 0:05:16.400 --> 0:05:19.600 of celebrities, Janelle Monee being one of them, who came 0:05:19.600 --> 0:05:22.159 out as pan sexual a couple of years ago. Can 0:05:22.200 --> 0:05:26.320 you explain to the audience who may not be familiar 0:05:26.360 --> 0:05:29.679 with with all of the terms, what does pant set, 0:05:29.680 --> 0:05:33.200 what does the pan sexual identity mean to you? And 0:05:33.240 --> 0:05:38.599 how did you come to understand this about yourself? Sure, 0:05:39.120 --> 0:05:41.159 one thing I will say, since you mentioned Janelle Monee, 0:05:41.200 --> 0:05:44.000 I think it's great that Janelle Monee had this music 0:05:44.080 --> 0:05:46.960 video a few years ago that, like, you know, bisexual 0:05:47.040 --> 0:05:48.839 lighting is now a term that gets used a lot 0:05:48.880 --> 0:05:52.400 because the bisexual flag is just like, very aesthetically appealing colors, 0:05:52.400 --> 0:05:55.120 and a lot of art, either on purpose or by accident, 0:05:55.320 --> 0:05:57.960 uses the color scheme of the bisexual flag. But I 0:05:58.000 --> 0:06:00.440 believe with her it was very purposeful given the content 0:06:00.480 --> 0:06:02.760 that she was putting out there. But now she identifies 0:06:02.800 --> 0:06:05.440 publicly as pan sexual, and so I think that's an 0:06:05.440 --> 0:06:09.240 indication that, like there is crossover in those identities, but 0:06:09.279 --> 0:06:12.239 they're not the same. And also, you know, a person 0:06:12.279 --> 0:06:16.880 who identifies as by one year, you know, might realize 0:06:16.920 --> 0:06:20.800 that pan fits better for them or vice versa, and 0:06:20.880 --> 0:06:24.440 so you know, just because to introduce my answer, I'm 0:06:24.480 --> 0:06:27.080 just thinking about the fact that, unfortunately there is some 0:06:27.120 --> 0:06:32.640 friction between prescriptivists when it comes to language, and I 0:06:32.680 --> 0:06:35.400 do think they are distinct. But at the same time, 0:06:35.720 --> 0:06:40.160 it's okay for a person who's pand to realize that 0:06:40.279 --> 0:06:43.479 there by and then later realize that maybe they were 0:06:43.520 --> 0:06:47.000 incorrect and they have been panned all along. And those 0:06:47.040 --> 0:06:49.000 things happen with all kinds of different identities. I know, 0:06:49.160 --> 0:06:52.919 you know people who they started their life, like most 0:06:52.960 --> 0:06:57.640 people probably interact indoctrinated into heteropatriarchy, thinking straight and then 0:06:58.279 --> 0:07:00.520 you know this just as an example, this person then 0:07:00.760 --> 0:07:04.000 thought they were a lesbian, and then they thought they 0:07:04.000 --> 0:07:07.360 were a straight trans man, and then they thought they 0:07:07.360 --> 0:07:10.480 were a gay trans man, and so like that's an example. 0:07:10.520 --> 0:07:13.640 But you know, through life sexuality is fluid. Is a 0:07:13.640 --> 0:07:15.760 trend that gets used a lot, but like through life, 0:07:16.120 --> 0:07:19.200 that is something that's true. And to segue, I think 0:07:19.560 --> 0:07:24.080 for myself, pan sexuality is a state of fluidity. It's 0:07:24.120 --> 0:07:27.760 this state of like, I'm not rigidly attracted to any 0:07:28.280 --> 0:07:32.280 gender category. For some people, I think they use it 0:07:32.400 --> 0:07:36.280 or interpret it as gender doesn't matter to me, or 0:07:36.320 --> 0:07:41.160 I don't perceive gender. However, you know, whoever is pansexual, 0:07:41.160 --> 0:07:43.040 and however it applies to them, that's valid to me. 0:07:43.520 --> 0:07:46.400 What it means is like, of course I perceive your gender, 0:07:46.440 --> 0:07:50.120 but I'm attracted to you irrespective of your gender. I'm 0:07:50.160 --> 0:07:52.800 attracted to a lot of people use the term hearts 0:07:52.840 --> 0:07:54.640 not parts, which is kind of cringey, and I'm not 0:07:54.720 --> 0:07:58.640 endorsing it, but the message's your faith. But the message 0:07:58.680 --> 0:08:01.840 of it is like, you know, you understand the meaning 0:08:01.840 --> 0:08:03.520 of right. I do think it's cringe but like the 0:08:03.560 --> 0:08:07.520 idea you're falling in love with a person not you know, 0:08:07.720 --> 0:08:12.200 not what they are either you know, ascribed to or 0:08:12.240 --> 0:08:16.080 assigned or in any way that has to do with 0:08:16.240 --> 0:08:19.760 their physicality. Right, I'll say that, I'll say exactly exactly. 0:08:19.800 --> 0:08:23.040 It goes beyond gender. It's it's gender to the physical form. 0:08:23.080 --> 0:08:26.640 I'm glad you understand that. Yeah, you know, so I 0:08:26.680 --> 0:08:30.239 think that what is really what I find really interesting now. 0:08:30.760 --> 0:08:32.400 And there have been like a couple of studies that 0:08:32.440 --> 0:08:36.280 have been done recently with younger people, and I want 0:08:36.280 --> 0:08:39.199 to say younger, and I mean like thirty and below, um, 0:08:39.480 --> 0:08:44.400 where people are more so choosing to identify themselves as 0:08:44.400 --> 0:08:50.479 either pan sexual, non binary um in a more outside 0:08:50.600 --> 0:08:54.920 of these prescribe box place. What do you think that 0:08:55.040 --> 0:08:59.719 it is that has because society in general, I mean 0:08:59.760 --> 0:09:03.120 for queer people, particularly trans people, has become a lot 0:09:03.160 --> 0:09:07.840 more unsafe, has become a lot more violent. So what 0:09:07.920 --> 0:09:11.680 do you think, you know, just on your own ideas 0:09:11.679 --> 0:09:13.760 and in your own community, what do you think has 0:09:13.920 --> 0:09:19.080 people now ascribe themselves to be more outside of the 0:09:19.120 --> 0:09:26.439 box than before? What I perceive or have perceived among 0:09:26.960 --> 0:09:30.600 my generation and sort of my generational peers, I guess 0:09:30.920 --> 0:09:32.719 it's hard to speak for a whole generation, but like 0:09:32.760 --> 0:09:35.600 my generational peers who are sort of in my narrow 0:09:35.880 --> 0:09:39.200 five year age group, I would say, and you know, 0:09:39.280 --> 0:09:43.520 within the more left wing queer or at least queer 0:09:43.559 --> 0:09:47.319 friendly group, I think there's been a transformation in how 0:09:47.320 --> 0:09:53.560 we understand gender, sex sexuality. For me, a lot of 0:09:53.559 --> 0:09:57.320 that just came from being exposed to more different kinds 0:09:57.320 --> 0:10:00.319 of people. I also had the privilege of how a 0:10:00.400 --> 0:10:02.880 college education that didn't include I went to a Catholic 0:10:02.960 --> 0:10:07.200 university and we had probably a Title nine mandated Women 0:10:07.200 --> 0:10:09.839 and Gender studies department, and it was like one class 0:10:09.880 --> 0:10:13.040 every semester. To keep that department rolling, and you bet 0:10:13.080 --> 0:10:16.439 I took at whatever class one class was being offered 0:10:16.520 --> 0:10:20.280 that semester. But even beyond that, I was on I 0:10:20.320 --> 0:10:22.480 was thinking about this earlier before we talked, I was 0:10:22.480 --> 0:10:24.400 on Tumblr and at the time, like at the turn 0:10:24.440 --> 0:10:26.959 of the twenty tens, Tumbler was it. Tumbler was the 0:10:27.000 --> 0:10:30.520 place to be. And they're sure there was misinformation and 0:10:30.559 --> 0:10:34.600 misunderstanding on Tumbler, but at the same time it exposed people, 0:10:34.679 --> 0:10:37.800 and especially younger people and people who were becoming young 0:10:37.840 --> 0:10:40.480 adults around the same time that I was, to these 0:10:40.520 --> 0:10:44.160 ideas that like some people would radically explain it as 0:10:44.240 --> 0:10:46.400 gender does not exist. Some people would, in a more 0:10:46.480 --> 0:10:49.360 nuanced way, explain gender is a social construct and explain 0:10:49.480 --> 0:10:52.480 how I'm not there to explain those things. If you're 0:10:52.520 --> 0:10:54.760 not aware of those things, there's a lot of more 0:10:54.800 --> 0:10:57.320 intelligent and informed people than I am to explain those 0:10:57.440 --> 0:11:00.480 very detailed concepts if you were not familiar, but your listener, 0:11:00.520 --> 0:11:03.439 if you're aware and familiar with the idea of gender 0:11:03.480 --> 0:11:06.960 being a social construct, and even the fact that I 0:11:07.000 --> 0:11:10.080 can say that, right, do you like do you think 0:11:10.120 --> 0:11:12.040 I wasn't an adult at the time, but like, if 0:11:12.080 --> 0:11:14.280 you think back to like the mid two thousands, well 0:11:14.320 --> 0:11:18.600 before the concept of gender being a social construct. Did 0:11:18.640 --> 0:11:22.719 that exist within the general public consciousness? No, it honestly did, 0:11:22.720 --> 0:11:25.320 and I don't even think I think that in general 0:11:26.400 --> 0:11:30.199 we were still trying to wrap our minds around what 0:11:30.600 --> 0:11:34.000 it meant to be trans, right, So, so, oh sure, 0:11:34.120 --> 0:11:37.040 I watched Comity Central, right, So it was it was 0:11:37.280 --> 0:11:40.880 really that as being and as a person that has 0:11:40.920 --> 0:11:44.280 been in movement LGBTQ movement politics for a long time, 0:11:44.920 --> 0:11:49.440 even being trans and having those conversations was divergent to 0:11:49.720 --> 0:11:54.360 the rest of the LGBU community, right who who at 0:11:54.360 --> 0:11:57.839 that time was really just focused on marriage equality. So 0:11:57.880 --> 0:11:59.959 you want to talk about gender as we're trying to 0:12:00.600 --> 0:12:03.920 at that time assimilate, to be accepted, to then be 0:12:04.000 --> 0:12:06.960 able to pass. So no, I think that there has 0:12:07.040 --> 0:12:09.600 been there is there. We have let go of the 0:12:09.679 --> 0:12:13.079 boxes in that way over the past very short time 0:12:13.280 --> 0:12:17.640 of ten fifteen years to have these conversations that are 0:12:17.720 --> 0:12:23.680 part of national discourse as opposed to just community based. Yeah. 0:12:23.720 --> 0:12:26.280 And I think one thing too, as you were talking, 0:12:26.320 --> 0:12:29.280 I was thinking of I think something that sort of 0:12:29.800 --> 0:12:33.320 that social uprising fed into and then at the same 0:12:33.320 --> 0:12:36.960 time that legal validation fed into the social strata is 0:12:37.520 --> 0:12:42.880 the Supreme Court decision to officially recognize same sex marriage 0:12:43.160 --> 0:12:46.320 and the validity of it as marriage, not unions or whatever. 0:12:46.360 --> 0:12:49.240 And I completely recognize that in the very long journey, 0:12:49.640 --> 0:12:53.120 activists were fighting for civil unions as a strategic move. 0:12:53.320 --> 0:12:54.920 I know a lot of people who were in civil 0:12:55.000 --> 0:12:58.160 unions who call themselves married because to them they were, 0:12:58.480 --> 0:13:00.000 and that was the way that they could get it 0:13:00.080 --> 0:13:03.280 legally recognized. And it's great for me for a young person, 0:13:03.400 --> 0:13:05.679 like what was that twenty thirteen? So I was like 0:13:05.800 --> 0:13:08.440 twenty twenty one when that was passed, and that was 0:13:10.440 --> 0:13:12.920 twenty fifteen. I was okay, a little later than I thought, 0:13:12.920 --> 0:13:15.800 but still that was there was a lot of agitation, 0:13:15.840 --> 0:13:19.839 and I think the agitation got louder when younger people 0:13:19.880 --> 0:13:23.800 started to become voting age and the Obama administration getting 0:13:24.120 --> 0:13:27.800 voted in was very catalyzing for both young people who 0:13:27.880 --> 0:13:31.480 voted for him and people who didn't who saw that that. 0:13:33.200 --> 0:13:35.360 I hate to call it this, but like all all 0:13:35.520 --> 0:13:38.000 good elections are run on like marketing campaigns, right and 0:13:38.080 --> 0:13:40.520 like with the benefit of hindsight, like Hope and Change 0:13:40.559 --> 0:13:41.800 was kind of it was a little bit more of 0:13:41.800 --> 0:13:45.079 a marketing campaign than it was promised, but we buy 0:13:45.120 --> 0:13:49.640 into it. Right, he won, So there was like this 0:13:49.720 --> 0:13:52.520 optimism even if people who maybe didn't get a chance 0:13:52.559 --> 0:13:54.520 to vote for him, that like there was hope and 0:13:54.520 --> 0:13:57.559 there was hope for change. And even when President Obama 0:13:57.679 --> 0:14:01.280 was saying, I don't think we can do gay marriage. 0:14:01.320 --> 0:14:03.880 I don't think we can legalize I don't believe in 0:14:04.080 --> 0:14:07.040 even he was saying at the beginning, and then of 0:14:07.080 --> 0:14:11.880 all people, Joe Biden oop seed that he was turning around, 0:14:11.880 --> 0:14:14.320 which will never know. Maybe we will find out one day, 0:14:14.360 --> 0:14:16.280 but like we'll never know whether that was a strategic 0:14:16.360 --> 0:14:18.880 move to him in that direction, right, or it was 0:14:18.960 --> 0:14:22.400 really just like a you know, uncle Joe oopsie. But 0:14:22.520 --> 0:14:27.360 either way, that was astronomical, both the administration pushing for it, 0:14:27.480 --> 0:14:30.160 that itself was a big social step, but then it 0:14:30.240 --> 0:14:33.720 being validated by the Supreme Court. I think that opened 0:14:33.720 --> 0:14:36.720 all kinds of doors that now we're seeing unfortunately awful 0:14:36.760 --> 0:14:39.840 pushback against Hey, I'm David plots a slice political gab fest. 0:14:40.320 --> 0:14:44.400 As another election season accelerates, it can be tricky to 0:14:44.480 --> 0:14:47.440 sort through all the noise and the news each week 0:14:47.440 --> 0:14:50.520 on the Gabfest, John Dickerson, Emily Bathlon and I decipher 0:14:50.560 --> 0:14:53.040 the headlines, break down the races, and tell you what 0:14:53.120 --> 0:14:57.600 issues really matter. 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So that's 0:16:08.960 --> 0:16:11.080 and I'm so glad that you made that correlation because 0:16:11.120 --> 0:16:13.880 that's actually you know, I have been thinking about for 0:16:13.920 --> 0:16:17.280 the last couple of for the last couple of weeks really, 0:16:17.640 --> 0:16:20.200 as we're in Pride Month and talking to a lot 0:16:20.240 --> 0:16:23.680 of different folks, is that you know, you sent me 0:16:23.720 --> 0:16:29.520 a message yesterday that was personally heartbreaking, UM, with regard 0:16:29.560 --> 0:16:33.640 to Smithtown, a town in Long Island in Suffolk County, 0:16:34.000 --> 0:16:38.920 that the city council or whatever the township council has 0:16:38.960 --> 0:16:44.160 decided to board, has decided to ban pretty much any 0:16:44.200 --> 0:16:49.400 display of pride, any books, any uh, you know, decorations 0:16:49.480 --> 0:16:53.120 or anything in all of their libraries. UM. And I 0:16:53.160 --> 0:16:58.320 think about, you know, how we have seen the the 0:16:58.600 --> 0:17:03.520 pushback again, the idea of hope and change, the idea 0:17:03.560 --> 0:17:06.560 that we could actually have a black president, the idea 0:17:06.800 --> 0:17:11.959 that you know, there could be queer people in cabinet positions, 0:17:12.359 --> 0:17:15.040 right whether or not we love those people, and it 0:17:15.080 --> 0:17:17.520 doesn't matter. It's the fact that you have a person 0:17:17.600 --> 0:17:21.600 that is trans, that is out trans. As a part 0:17:21.600 --> 0:17:24.879 of the Abiden administration, you had people that were you know, 0:17:25.000 --> 0:17:29.520 out and queer. In the Obama administration, you have a 0:17:29.560 --> 0:17:33.919 Secretary of Transportation that is a married gay man. But 0:17:34.080 --> 0:17:37.920 now we see all of these targets, all of this violence, 0:17:38.280 --> 0:17:42.600 and I wonder, Andrew, what do you think they're like, 0:17:42.720 --> 0:17:46.520 what are you hearing? The response to this is going 0:17:46.560 --> 0:17:51.000 to be because we're being jammed back into the closet, 0:17:51.040 --> 0:17:55.240 We're being pushed into places that you know, you know, again, 0:17:55.480 --> 0:17:58.560 I've been working in politics for a long time. I've 0:17:58.560 --> 0:18:01.520 only been a part of the ups I have never 0:18:01.720 --> 0:18:05.280 been a part of you know, of the regression. And 0:18:05.320 --> 0:18:07.640 so what are you hearing and what are you feeling 0:18:07.720 --> 0:18:13.960 now about the direction that that this country is headed in. Yeah, 0:18:14.000 --> 0:18:16.560 I'm kind of in the same boat where you say, 0:18:16.680 --> 0:18:18.720 I've only been part of the upswing. And I think 0:18:18.760 --> 0:18:22.040 the upswing part of it is important because you know, 0:18:22.119 --> 0:18:26.000 being born I was born basically when Clinton was elected, 0:18:26.760 --> 0:18:30.879 like one month between my birth and Clinton's election. So 0:18:31.240 --> 0:18:34.399 there was you know, the nineties where it's sort of 0:18:34.480 --> 0:18:38.199 I feel like culturally it was essentially a softened continuation 0:18:38.240 --> 0:18:40.119 of the Reagan era. I remember a lot of just 0:18:40.280 --> 0:18:44.600 dominant cultural conservativism at the time. There was don't ask, 0:18:44.680 --> 0:18:46.720 don't tell, which I was too young to recognize, but 0:18:46.760 --> 0:18:48.919 I feel like that was probably the prevailing attitude at 0:18:48.920 --> 0:18:51.560 the time. I have an uncle who was gay, and 0:18:51.880 --> 0:18:53.440 he could certainly speak more of this. I don't want 0:18:53.440 --> 0:18:54.720 to speak for him, but when I was a kid, 0:18:54.880 --> 0:18:57.000 I wasn't allowed to know that he was gay. My 0:18:57.080 --> 0:19:00.639 uncle Adam was his roommate. They were friends whatever they were, 0:19:00.920 --> 0:19:03.080 they weren't a couple, and me, as a child, I 0:19:03.200 --> 0:19:06.480 was asking like, are they married? Are their boyfriends? Because 0:19:06.480 --> 0:19:09.520 that didn't matter to me. But my religious family, in 0:19:09.560 --> 0:19:13.280 my religious suburban family, was maintaining the lie to a 0:19:13.440 --> 0:19:16.040 child who was making it evident that he didn't care, 0:19:16.160 --> 0:19:19.720 that he wasn't passing judgment, but that lie was being maintained. 0:19:19.760 --> 0:19:23.040 And then we entered the Bush years, and I, you know, 0:19:24.320 --> 0:19:27.080 I want to talk about cultural conservatism. We were both 0:19:27.119 --> 0:19:29.720 there moving on. So then you get the Obama years, 0:19:29.760 --> 0:19:32.800 and then Obama years were the rejection of that heightened 0:19:32.840 --> 0:19:35.760 cultural conservativism, in my opinion, and then you get that 0:19:36.200 --> 0:19:40.359 real upswing, that big upswing where people can be out 0:19:40.400 --> 0:19:43.239 and proud and validated by their government and recognized by 0:19:43.240 --> 0:19:46.600 their government and start to be recognized by society at large. 0:19:47.320 --> 0:19:52.040 All that to say, with this changing tide, I think 0:19:52.080 --> 0:19:54.760 about people my age for sure, because we're not going 0:19:54.800 --> 0:19:56.080 to be shoved back in the closet. I don't think. 0:19:56.080 --> 0:19:57.600 I don't think most people my age are going to 0:19:57.640 --> 0:20:00.240 take to being shoved back in the closet. But I 0:20:00.240 --> 0:20:02.400 think about younger people who just grow up in this 0:20:02.520 --> 0:20:08.520 is wider age of acceptance and just like the high 0:20:08.560 --> 0:20:10.680 school experience. From what I understand, I worked as a 0:20:10.720 --> 0:20:13.800 substitute about five years ago and there was a boy 0:20:13.840 --> 0:20:16.280 putting on his makeup in the detention room. So this 0:20:16.400 --> 0:20:18.960 is like the hard kids, and he's over putting on 0:20:19.000 --> 0:20:22.080 his makeup and like no one's saying anything, and then 0:20:22.200 --> 0:20:25.320 the sub like asks about or the eight whoever they 0:20:25.320 --> 0:20:28.040 asked him about, like what kind of makeup he was using, 0:20:28.080 --> 0:20:29.560 And he was in front of all these other like 0:20:30.040 --> 0:20:32.840 tough guys who were in detention for doing whatever tough 0:20:32.880 --> 0:20:35.480 shit they were doing, and he's like, oh, I'm you know, 0:20:35.640 --> 0:20:39.640 seeing my like beauty later or whatever, you know, not boyfriend, 0:20:39.640 --> 0:20:42.760 but like the guy he was talking to and like no, 0:20:43.760 --> 0:20:46.000 not even no slurs, which is what would have happened 0:20:46.000 --> 0:20:48.760 when I was in high school and you know, and 0:20:48.840 --> 0:20:51.040 sometimes slurs were said and the teacher wasn't like, hey, 0:20:51.160 --> 0:20:54.800 don't say that. They were just said yep. So the 0:20:54.880 --> 0:20:57.720 generation younger is sure as shit not going to be 0:20:57.720 --> 0:21:00.359 pushed back in the closet. They you can't drag them 0:21:00.400 --> 0:21:05.040 kicking and screaming. So they're you talk about this all 0:21:05.080 --> 0:21:08.080 the time. There's going to be a cultural war, and 0:21:08.160 --> 0:21:11.360 I don't think it's going to be passive. I think 0:21:11.359 --> 0:21:14.080 if it gets to a point where you know, yeah, 0:21:14.119 --> 0:21:18.199 I just I think that that is my that's the 0:21:18.320 --> 0:21:21.359 place of worry that I find myself right now, is 0:21:21.480 --> 0:21:23.239 that I don't think a lot of young people are 0:21:23.280 --> 0:21:25.240 so worried. And I'm going to say that too. I 0:21:25.240 --> 0:21:28.399 think they're more ready than they are worried. What do 0:21:28.400 --> 0:21:34.680 you think that they're ready for? Um? I think because 0:21:34.720 --> 0:21:37.119 I know what the right is ready for? Right, I 0:21:37.320 --> 0:21:39.879 know what they're a R fifteens and they're you know, 0:21:39.960 --> 0:21:43.720 the the White Nationalist group, the thirty one members that 0:21:43.760 --> 0:21:48.199 were just arrested in Idaho for you know, attempting a 0:21:48.320 --> 0:21:51.600 riot at at a pride in Idaho. We know, you 0:21:51.640 --> 0:21:55.000 know what happened with the Proud Boys rushing into a 0:21:56.200 --> 0:22:01.000 drag que queen children's story time. So what do you 0:22:01.160 --> 0:22:04.680 believe that they are ready for? Well, I will say 0:22:04.720 --> 0:22:08.399 among just this is more general than queer communities and 0:22:08.440 --> 0:22:10.960 discourse that I've observed. I would say, just generally, among 0:22:11.160 --> 0:22:16.280 leftist millennials and younger people, there is less emphasis on 0:22:16.359 --> 0:22:22.760 gun control and more thought being given to I mean today, right, 0:22:22.800 --> 0:22:26.639 we're recording this today, the Supreme Court has made a 0:22:26.640 --> 0:22:31.160 decision regarding I believe, open carry as well as concealed 0:22:31.240 --> 0:22:37.000 carry of firearms. And so it's if everyone around you, 0:22:37.080 --> 0:22:38.600 and I hate to say it, because this is a 0:22:38.680 --> 0:22:42.800 move designed, yeah, at least partially to benefit gun manufacturers 0:22:42.840 --> 0:22:46.320 and put more money into their pockets. At the same time, Logically, 0:22:46.640 --> 0:22:51.080 if there's a very real possibility wherever you go in 0:22:51.119 --> 0:22:53.879 the United States of America, and you are choosing to 0:22:53.920 --> 0:22:57.240 stay in the United States of America, that anyone around 0:22:57.280 --> 0:23:00.639 you at any time could have a firearm, what logically 0:23:00.680 --> 0:23:04.800 are you meant to do to defend yourself? That's all. 0:23:05.080 --> 0:23:08.720 And when it comes to younger people, I think they're, 0:23:08.800 --> 0:23:11.000 like I said, there's a more of a rejection of 0:23:11.119 --> 0:23:15.600 the what's becoming an increasingly liberal and center left idea 0:23:15.760 --> 0:23:19.359 of gun control and more of this idea of you know, 0:23:20.160 --> 0:23:22.280 feeling where the wins are going. And you're talking about 0:23:22.280 --> 0:23:24.400 like being prepared for what conservatives are doing. I think 0:23:24.440 --> 0:23:27.560 young people, and certainly young leftists are more prepared for 0:23:27.640 --> 0:23:31.359 what the conservative political majority in this country, not the 0:23:31.359 --> 0:23:35.080 cultural majority, not the actual majority, but unfortunately, the conservative 0:23:35.160 --> 0:23:39.320 political majority, the people who maintain and use power in 0:23:39.359 --> 0:23:41.800 this country, some of whom are in the Democratic Party 0:23:43.040 --> 0:23:45.600 if they're in control right now, and the Democrats are 0:23:45.600 --> 0:23:47.760