1 00:00:02,960 --> 00:00:05,280 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of 2 00:00:05,320 --> 00:00:10,680 Speaker 1: My Heart Radio. Hey you welcome to Stuff to Blow 3 00:00:10,720 --> 00:00:13,760 Speaker 1: your Mind a listener mail. This is Robert Lamb and 4 00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:16,160 Speaker 1: this is Joe McCormick, and it's Monday, the day of 5 00:00:16,160 --> 00:00:18,479 Speaker 1: the week. We read back some messages you've sent into 6 00:00:18,520 --> 00:00:20,520 Speaker 1: the show account, which I always say at the end 7 00:00:20,520 --> 00:00:22,239 Speaker 1: of the episode, I'll say at the beginning this time 8 00:00:22,239 --> 00:00:25,400 Speaker 1: it is contact at stuff to Blow your Mind dot 9 00:00:25,440 --> 00:00:27,600 Speaker 1: com if you ever want to get in touch, maybe 10 00:00:27,600 --> 00:00:30,400 Speaker 1: a little bit more accessible up here, Rob did did 11 00:00:30,440 --> 00:00:33,080 Speaker 1: you and Seth do some kind of teenage Mutant Ninja 12 00:00:33,120 --> 00:00:37,160 Speaker 1: Turtles related uh listener mail episode? While I was out? Yes, 13 00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:41,600 Speaker 1: basically we I pulled up to listener mails. UH one 14 00:00:41,640 --> 00:00:45,400 Speaker 1: about elden Ring and Cauldron's Okay, are you have you 15 00:00:45,440 --> 00:00:47,159 Speaker 1: played that game? Do you have any Yeah? Yeah, I have. 16 00:00:48,840 --> 00:00:52,800 Speaker 1: With this Cauldron character, I think maybe I think I've 17 00:00:52,800 --> 00:00:57,360 Speaker 1: come across him once. Okay, I'm I'm progressing very slowly 18 00:00:57,360 --> 00:00:59,800 Speaker 1: in elden Ring. Okay, well, I guess it's this is 19 00:00:59,800 --> 00:01:01,640 Speaker 1: what you missed that one because it has spoilers in 20 00:01:01,680 --> 00:01:05,200 Speaker 1: it for elden Ring. But yeah, we also talked about 21 00:01:05,240 --> 00:01:08,360 Speaker 1: the new Teenage meeting Ninja Turtles arcade game Shredders Revenge, 22 00:01:08,920 --> 00:01:11,600 Speaker 1: So that was pretty fun, just a little reminiscent about 23 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:14,880 Speaker 1: old Turtles games and Turtles movies and the cartoon a 24 00:01:14,959 --> 00:01:17,280 Speaker 1: little bit. Well, we got some feedback on the episode 25 00:01:17,319 --> 00:01:20,600 Speaker 1: coming up later on, but first, I guess we should 26 00:01:20,800 --> 00:01:25,000 Speaker 1: talk about document duplication because we got this message from Ian, 27 00:01:25,480 --> 00:01:28,280 Speaker 1: who has written in before to provide a lawyer's perspective 28 00:01:28,360 --> 00:01:31,479 Speaker 1: on several issues. Always nice to have, and Ian had 29 00:01:31,480 --> 00:01:34,880 Speaker 1: thoughts about originals and copies. So Rob, if you don't mind, 30 00:01:34,920 --> 00:01:37,360 Speaker 1: I'm gonna jump right into this one. Go for it. 31 00:01:42,640 --> 00:01:45,600 Speaker 1: Dear Rob and Joe. I was recently listening to your 32 00:01:45,640 --> 00:01:48,440 Speaker 1: two part episode about the history of duplicating documents, and 33 00:01:48,480 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 1: I was struck by your discussion of the fact that 34 00:01:50,640 --> 00:01:54,440 Speaker 1: in ancient times, the written record of an agreement or 35 00:01:54,480 --> 00:01:59,240 Speaker 1: other legally significant proclamation would sometimes embody the legal rights 36 00:01:59,320 --> 00:02:03,600 Speaker 1: in responsivelities associated with it, and that destroying the record 37 00:02:03,760 --> 00:02:08,000 Speaker 1: would be tantamount to terminating those rights and responsibilities. Yeah, 38 00:02:08,040 --> 00:02:12,160 Speaker 1: this was in the context of of practices in ancient 39 00:02:12,240 --> 00:02:15,760 Speaker 1: Greece having to do with like uh contracts and decrees 40 00:02:15,800 --> 00:02:18,959 Speaker 1: by rulers and treaties and so forth, that there was 41 00:02:19,000 --> 00:02:21,840 Speaker 1: a widespread assumption that in order to show that this 42 00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:24,800 Speaker 1: document was no no longer held true or was no 43 00:02:24,919 --> 00:02:27,520 Speaker 1: longer in force, you would have to destroy all the 44 00:02:27,560 --> 00:02:31,400 Speaker 1: copies of that document. Ian continues. You mentioned that in 45 00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:34,120 Speaker 1: modern times we do not think of written records in 46 00:02:34,160 --> 00:02:37,160 Speaker 1: this way, and for instance, would not have to destroy 47 00:02:37,200 --> 00:02:39,920 Speaker 1: an out of date employee handbook as a way of 48 00:02:39,919 --> 00:02:43,160 Speaker 1: showing it was no longer in force. You're absolutely correct 49 00:02:43,200 --> 00:02:46,280 Speaker 1: in most instances. But as an attorney, I am well 50 00:02:46,320 --> 00:02:50,280 Speaker 1: acquainted with one area where originals do carry the metaphysical 51 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:54,600 Speaker 1: embodiment of abstract concepts they represent. That is the law. 52 00:02:55,240 --> 00:02:58,840 Speaker 1: The law, particularly trial procedure, is filled with instances where 53 00:02:58,840 --> 00:03:02,640 Speaker 1: originals have a level of importance that exceeds what society 54 00:03:02,680 --> 00:03:06,960 Speaker 1: in general gives them. With wills, for example, the original 55 00:03:07,160 --> 00:03:10,880 Speaker 1: truly embodies the wishes of the uh. Oh, I don't 56 00:03:10,919 --> 00:03:15,360 Speaker 1: know this word. Testator or testator, I'm gonna say testator, uh, 57 00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:17,960 Speaker 1: the person who made the will, to the extent that 58 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:22,200 Speaker 1: if the testator voluntarily destroys the original will, it does 59 00:03:22,360 --> 00:03:26,160 Speaker 1: render that will null and void. And even if copies exist, 60 00:03:26,480 --> 00:03:29,400 Speaker 1: they are of no effect. So while a scene in 61 00:03:29,400 --> 00:03:32,440 Speaker 1: a movie with a character tearing up an iou may 62 00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:35,520 Speaker 1: not actually have any meaning. If they tear up a will, 63 00:03:36,040 --> 00:03:40,400 Speaker 1: it most certainly does. More generally, there is a principle 64 00:03:40,520 --> 00:03:44,480 Speaker 1: in courtroom procedure known as the best evidence rule, which 65 00:03:44,520 --> 00:03:47,680 Speaker 1: requires that the original of a document or a video 66 00:03:47,920 --> 00:03:52,280 Speaker 1: or audio recording, etcetera be presented rather than a copy. 67 00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:56,120 Speaker 1: A copy is only allowed if the original has been lost, destroyed, 68 00:03:56,200 --> 00:03:59,920 Speaker 1: or is otherwise unavailable. Even then you're not technically admit 69 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:03,000 Speaker 1: the copy is direct evidence in its own right. It's 70 00:04:03,040 --> 00:04:06,520 Speaker 1: always the original that is legally relevant, and the copy 71 00:04:06,680 --> 00:04:09,920 Speaker 1: is merely admitted as evidence of what the contents of 72 00:04:09,960 --> 00:04:14,000 Speaker 1: the original were. So if so, if you have a 73 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:17,000 Speaker 1: theft caught on security video and do not have access 74 00:04:17,040 --> 00:04:20,040 Speaker 1: to the original video, you may present a copy not 75 00:04:20,120 --> 00:04:23,080 Speaker 1: to prove that the accused committed the theft, but to 76 00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:26,880 Speaker 1: prove that the original video showed the accused committing the theft. 77 00:04:27,240 --> 00:04:29,920 Speaker 1: It's definitely a case of legal hair splitting, but as 78 00:04:29,920 --> 00:04:33,839 Speaker 1: a practical matter, copies are typically treated as simply admissible, 79 00:04:33,960 --> 00:04:37,320 Speaker 1: at least in my jurisdiction. But that is the technical 80 00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:40,360 Speaker 1: legal theory underlying that sort of evidence, and I suspected 81 00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:43,320 Speaker 1: dates back to a time when copies of documents were 82 00:04:43,400 --> 00:04:46,560 Speaker 1: uncommon or inexact. Yeah, this sounds like it would be 83 00:04:46,600 --> 00:04:49,919 Speaker 1: based on a world where copies may introduce changes or 84 00:04:50,080 --> 00:04:52,520 Speaker 1: errors as a as a regular matter of course, rather 85 00:04:52,600 --> 00:04:56,960 Speaker 1: than an era of digital duplication Inan goes On. Also 86 00:04:57,040 --> 00:04:59,920 Speaker 1: tangentially related to the legal realm, if you ever get 87 00:04:59,920 --> 00:05:02,919 Speaker 1: a speeding ticket, you may encounter a modern use of 88 00:05:02,960 --> 00:05:06,240 Speaker 1: carbon paper. Many police still write their tickets on a 89 00:05:06,279 --> 00:05:09,400 Speaker 1: stack of carbon paper, which yields the original ticket and 90 00:05:09,600 --> 00:05:13,360 Speaker 1: two copies for us locally, the bottom or pink copy 91 00:05:13,520 --> 00:05:15,640 Speaker 1: is given to the person who got the ticket, the 92 00:05:15,680 --> 00:05:18,400 Speaker 1: middle or green copy goes to the court, and the 93 00:05:18,400 --> 00:05:21,720 Speaker 1: original white copy goes to the local prosecutor. It has 94 00:05:21,720 --> 00:05:23,919 Speaker 1: always seemed odd to me that the copy that is 95 00:05:23,960 --> 00:05:26,359 Speaker 1: the hardest to read is the one given to the 96 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:30,440 Speaker 1: person accused of the traffic violation. Uh. And then finally, 97 00:05:30,480 --> 00:05:33,520 Speaker 1: I'm gonna summarize Ian's last point, But it's an interesting 98 00:05:33,560 --> 00:05:37,599 Speaker 1: comparison between illuminated manuscripts, which we talked about in the 99 00:05:37,920 --> 00:05:40,320 Speaker 1: with relevance to the idea of fact simile, that sometimes 100 00:05:40,320 --> 00:05:43,799 Speaker 1: copying a document is not only accurately capturing the code 101 00:05:43,839 --> 00:05:48,200 Speaker 1: of its text, but literally capturing every element of the 102 00:05:48,279 --> 00:05:51,200 Speaker 1: design of each page, such as with you know, medieval 103 00:05:51,200 --> 00:05:54,960 Speaker 1: manuscripts that might have illustrations or beautiful calligraphy or something 104 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:58,559 Speaker 1: like that. And Ian compares this to the novel House 105 00:05:58,600 --> 00:06:01,719 Speaker 1: of Leaves, which I think is a great point of comparison, 106 00:06:01,720 --> 00:06:04,400 Speaker 1: because that's a novel that is not just the code 107 00:06:04,440 --> 00:06:07,680 Speaker 1: of its text, but it is how each individual page appears, 108 00:06:07,800 --> 00:06:10,840 Speaker 1: because it's a lot many parts of that novel are 109 00:06:10,880 --> 00:06:15,480 Speaker 1: sort of weird sort of artifacts or imagery that they're 110 00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:19,200 Speaker 1: like documents as documents, not documents as just the text 111 00:06:19,279 --> 00:06:22,440 Speaker 1: of the document. Yeah, it's it's kind of it's kind 112 00:06:22,480 --> 00:06:26,279 Speaker 1: of a one of a kind book. Uh, quite a 113 00:06:26,320 --> 00:06:29,800 Speaker 1: rewarding experience, but yeah, difficult to compare to most other books. 114 00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:31,520 Speaker 1: I think you might be able to compare it to 115 00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:35,600 Speaker 1: like William Blake, you know, the Originals, where the poems 116 00:06:35,600 --> 00:06:38,880 Speaker 1: are associated with with paintings or illustrations. There's kind of 117 00:06:39,000 --> 00:06:41,680 Speaker 1: an appearance of the page that adds to the value 118 00:06:41,680 --> 00:06:44,400 Speaker 1: of the text. Yeah. Yeah, it's it's one of these 119 00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:46,479 Speaker 1: which you do have to read it in in that 120 00:06:46,520 --> 00:06:50,599 Speaker 1: original format. You can't, like I can't imagine reading it 121 00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:54,040 Speaker 1: on a an e book format or an audio book format, 122 00:06:54,080 --> 00:06:56,919 Speaker 1: and certainly, uh, there's been a lot of discussions about 123 00:06:57,000 --> 00:07:00,279 Speaker 1: any kind of film or TV adaptation, though apparently was 124 00:07:01,160 --> 00:07:03,000 Speaker 1: sort of in the works not too long ago. But 125 00:07:03,200 --> 00:07:05,000 Speaker 1: I don't think it went anywhere. I don't know how 126 00:07:05,000 --> 00:07:08,880 Speaker 1: that would work. That doesn't I think it seems unadaptable. 127 00:07:09,000 --> 00:07:12,760 Speaker 1: I think if memory serves, like the principle was this is, 128 00:07:12,840 --> 00:07:15,320 Speaker 1: this cannot be a complete adaptation. It has to be 129 00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:19,080 Speaker 1: something that is kind of auxiliary to it. So sort 130 00:07:19,120 --> 00:07:22,040 Speaker 1: of like a continuation of the House of Leaves project 131 00:07:22,640 --> 00:07:27,600 Speaker 1: um as opposed to a a film version offset project. 132 00:07:27,680 --> 00:07:31,120 Speaker 1: You know. Yeah, and then finally Ian says thank you 133 00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:34,320 Speaker 1: as always for your entertaining and lightning podcast. I'll leave 134 00:07:34,360 --> 00:07:38,000 Speaker 1: you with one final thought about modern infinite copying and distribution. 135 00:07:38,280 --> 00:07:41,040 Speaker 1: If you mark every email as important, then none of 136 00:07:41,080 --> 00:07:46,400 Speaker 1: them are what wise words and I agree, um so yeah, 137 00:07:46,440 --> 00:07:48,440 Speaker 1: a couple of comments on that. Number One. I have 138 00:07:48,760 --> 00:07:52,200 Speaker 1: in my life received a speeding ticket that was written 139 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:55,760 Speaker 1: on carbon paper, and I the copy I got, I 140 00:07:55,800 --> 00:07:58,400 Speaker 1: could not tell you what it said. It was not text, 141 00:07:58,480 --> 00:08:02,560 Speaker 1: it was just squiggles. And I always wondered that if 142 00:08:02,560 --> 00:08:05,480 Speaker 1: I'd had the resources of the time to like take 143 00:08:05,520 --> 00:08:08,440 Speaker 1: it to court and fight it out. I wonder if 144 00:08:08,480 --> 00:08:11,280 Speaker 1: the fact that the copy I had was completely illegible 145 00:08:11,320 --> 00:08:13,000 Speaker 1: would have been able to get me out of that ticket. 146 00:08:13,040 --> 00:08:14,720 Speaker 1: I don't know, Yeah, I don't know. We'll have to 147 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:16,800 Speaker 1: I'll have to ask for more more legal insight from 148 00:08:16,880 --> 00:08:19,320 Speaker 1: listeners on that one. But yeah, this was I guess. 149 00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:21,560 Speaker 1: I was a teenager at the time, and I got 150 00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:23,720 Speaker 1: it in a place different from where I lived, so 151 00:08:23,760 --> 00:08:26,320 Speaker 1: it just wasn't yeah, I could do really, I just 152 00:08:26,360 --> 00:08:33,160 Speaker 1: had to pay it, all right. This one comes to 153 00:08:33,240 --> 00:08:36,520 Speaker 1: us from Laney. Hey, Robin, Joe, my name is Laney 154 00:08:36,720 --> 00:08:41,040 Speaker 1: and I'm from cut Off, Louisiana, and you can say 155 00:08:41,040 --> 00:08:43,840 Speaker 1: it on air. I wanted to write into you about, 156 00:08:43,920 --> 00:08:46,800 Speaker 1: in effect simily episodes. Even on the first episode, I 157 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:49,079 Speaker 1: kept waiting for you all to talk about carbon copies. 158 00:08:49,400 --> 00:08:52,240 Speaker 1: I had to laugh when Joe talked about carbon copies 159 00:08:52,240 --> 00:08:54,800 Speaker 1: in the twenty one century, because I still use them today. 160 00:08:55,120 --> 00:08:58,360 Speaker 1: I'm a middle school teacher, and our behavior Consequences sheets 161 00:08:58,760 --> 00:09:02,200 Speaker 1: are on carbon cop our behavior and fractions fall into 162 00:09:02,240 --> 00:09:07,400 Speaker 1: three categories. Recessed attentions, minor infractions, and major infractions. Major 163 00:09:07,440 --> 00:09:10,520 Speaker 1: infractions are done completely on the computer, but our recessed 164 00:09:10,520 --> 00:09:14,720 Speaker 1: attention forms and minor infraction forms are on carbon copy 165 00:09:14,760 --> 00:09:18,840 Speaker 1: paper handouts for recessed detentions and minor infractions. The original 166 00:09:18,880 --> 00:09:20,679 Speaker 1: copy is for the students to bring home and have 167 00:09:20,720 --> 00:09:22,920 Speaker 1: the parents signed. The first carbon copy goes to the 168 00:09:22,920 --> 00:09:26,440 Speaker 1: teacher who writes the infraction ticket to keep their records, 169 00:09:26,440 --> 00:09:28,720 Speaker 1: and the second carbon copy goes to the disciplinary and 170 00:09:28,720 --> 00:09:31,880 Speaker 1: at school still using them in two and I don't 171 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:35,040 Speaker 1: see them going away since. Also I remember when I 172 00:09:35,080 --> 00:09:38,920 Speaker 1: realized the CC on email stood for carbon copy mind blown, 173 00:09:39,320 --> 00:09:42,079 Speaker 1: mind blown emoji. Thanks for the incredible work you do, 174 00:09:42,520 --> 00:09:46,840 Speaker 1: Lanni from Louisiana. I thought this email was either a 175 00:09:46,920 --> 00:09:50,719 Speaker 1: very interesting coincidence or somehow indicative of something in the zeitgeist. 176 00:09:50,840 --> 00:09:54,400 Speaker 1: That two major remaining uses for carbon paper that have 177 00:09:54,480 --> 00:09:57,400 Speaker 1: been mentioned by listeners have to do with punishment, speeding 178 00:09:57,400 --> 00:10:02,160 Speaker 1: tickets and disciplinary records. Also interesting that in the school 179 00:10:02,400 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 1: the offender gets the original copy, or at least their 180 00:10:04,760 --> 00:10:07,680 Speaker 1: parents do, and in the speeding ticket the offender gets 181 00:10:07,679 --> 00:10:12,559 Speaker 1: the worst least least fidelity uh fight. What's the adjective 182 00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:16,560 Speaker 1: version of fidelity? The least uh? The least good copy. 183 00:10:18,200 --> 00:10:19,880 Speaker 1: Have you Have you ever gotten carbon paper from a 184 00:10:19,920 --> 00:10:23,640 Speaker 1: school or is that another thing here? I'm trying to 185 00:10:23,640 --> 00:10:26,480 Speaker 1: remember the last time I received a carbon A lot 186 00:10:26,480 --> 00:10:28,280 Speaker 1: of times, you know, you get carbon copy on stuff 187 00:10:28,320 --> 00:10:32,000 Speaker 1: and it's, um, it's not important. It's something that's it's 188 00:10:32,040 --> 00:10:35,240 Speaker 1: almost instantly thrown away. UM. So I'm not sure if 189 00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:38,120 Speaker 1: they're still using it in terms of like place places 190 00:10:38,120 --> 00:10:40,040 Speaker 1: I've been going in, like the local school. I don't know. 191 00:10:45,400 --> 00:10:47,840 Speaker 1: All right, you're ready to move on to some responses 192 00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:51,040 Speaker 1: to Cauldron's. Oh yeah, Cauldron's it's the it's the flavor 193 00:10:51,040 --> 00:10:54,440 Speaker 1: of the month. Let's do it, okay. Uh, we got 194 00:10:54,480 --> 00:10:58,680 Speaker 1: a cool message from Michaela. I'm gonna summarize and paraphrase 195 00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:00,800 Speaker 1: a few parts of it. So Michaela begins by saying 196 00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:03,319 Speaker 1: some nice things about the show and by recommending we 197 00:11:03,400 --> 00:11:07,719 Speaker 1: check out an email newsletter called Dracula Daily, which is 198 00:11:07,760 --> 00:11:10,319 Speaker 1: an interesting concept. Basically from what I can tell, it's 199 00:11:10,400 --> 00:11:13,680 Speaker 1: that since Dracula is an epistolary novel, meaning you know, 200 00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:17,160 Speaker 1: it's made up of fictional letters, diary entrees, newspaper articles, 201 00:11:17,200 --> 00:11:19,720 Speaker 1: and so forth. But I'll have a date attached to them. 202 00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:23,880 Speaker 1: You can actually serve up the novel along its own timeline, 203 00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:29,040 Speaker 1: So subscribers to Dracula Daily apparently receive the individual parts 204 00:11:29,080 --> 00:11:31,840 Speaker 1: of the novel on the dates of the year that 205 00:11:31,880 --> 00:11:34,920 Speaker 1: those parts are written or published within the fictional timeline. 206 00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:38,400 Speaker 1: I like that idea. Yeah, yeah, that's an interesting idea. 207 00:11:38,800 --> 00:11:41,840 Speaker 1: But finally, MICHAELA had something to add about our discussion 208 00:11:41,880 --> 00:11:45,880 Speaker 1: of stone soup. So to briefly refresh on the concept 209 00:11:45,880 --> 00:11:50,560 Speaker 1: of the sound stoop sound stoop stone soup tail. Uh. 210 00:11:50,600 --> 00:11:53,240 Speaker 1: You know, the story is that like someone in the story, 211 00:11:53,360 --> 00:11:56,040 Speaker 1: maybe a soldier or a traveler or a beggar or 212 00:11:56,160 --> 00:11:59,000 Speaker 1: somebody crafty, comes into a town and they have no 213 00:11:59,080 --> 00:12:01,320 Speaker 1: food of their own, but they bring a pot and 214 00:12:01,400 --> 00:12:03,360 Speaker 1: they put some water in it, and they put a 215 00:12:03,440 --> 00:12:05,960 Speaker 1: stone in the pot and they start to boil it. 216 00:12:06,320 --> 00:12:08,360 Speaker 1: And then locals come around asking, hey, what are you 217 00:12:08,400 --> 00:12:11,120 Speaker 1: doing there? And they say, well, I'm making some stone soup. 218 00:12:11,200 --> 00:12:13,319 Speaker 1: It's it's gonna be delicious, but you know, I need 219 00:12:13,320 --> 00:12:15,720 Speaker 1: a little bit of garnish, right, there's one ingredient I 220 00:12:15,760 --> 00:12:17,920 Speaker 1: don't have. And uh, they say, would you happen to 221 00:12:17,960 --> 00:12:20,760 Speaker 1: have an onion? That would really make the stone soup perfect? 222 00:12:20,760 --> 00:12:22,880 Speaker 1: And then I'll share it with you, and the person says, well, sure, 223 00:12:22,920 --> 00:12:28,080 Speaker 1: I'll contribute one onion, and by that same strategy they 224 00:12:28,080 --> 00:12:31,199 Speaker 1: can get in some carrots and some garlic and some 225 00:12:31,320 --> 00:12:34,480 Speaker 1: herbs and some seasoning, some salt and pepper, and some 226 00:12:34,559 --> 00:12:37,600 Speaker 1: meats and stuff, with each person thinking well, I'm just 227 00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:39,520 Speaker 1: contributing a little tiny bit, and then I get some 228 00:12:39,559 --> 00:12:41,800 Speaker 1: of this delicious soup, and by the end you have 229 00:12:41,880 --> 00:12:44,720 Speaker 1: an actual soup that's full of nutrition and flavor that 230 00:12:44,800 --> 00:12:47,960 Speaker 1: was built with no starting ingredients. So I think the 231 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:52,280 Speaker 1: story is mostly supposed to be a parable about resourcefulness 232 00:12:52,360 --> 00:12:56,760 Speaker 1: and sharing and communal activities and stuff. But uh Michaela 233 00:12:56,800 --> 00:13:00,800 Speaker 1: contributes a sort of literal interpretation of the story. She says, 234 00:13:00,920 --> 00:13:02,680 Speaker 1: I don't remember where I heard this, but there was 235 00:13:02,679 --> 00:13:05,480 Speaker 1: a version of the story where the stone itself actually 236 00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:09,360 Speaker 1: added flavor to the stone soup. The story was that 237 00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:11,680 Speaker 1: it was still a ruse, but the stone carried some 238 00:13:11,800 --> 00:13:14,960 Speaker 1: flavors from previous soups it had been in. Perhaps the 239 00:13:15,000 --> 00:13:17,839 Speaker 1: stones used back then also contributed to the flavor of 240 00:13:17,880 --> 00:13:20,040 Speaker 1: the soups they were used in, not just if they 241 00:13:20,080 --> 00:13:22,920 Speaker 1: had been used in a soup before, but from minerals 242 00:13:22,920 --> 00:13:25,840 Speaker 1: that would leach out, adding to the overall nutrition via 243 00:13:25,880 --> 00:13:28,760 Speaker 1: small doses of iron, calcium, or salt and the like. 244 00:13:29,160 --> 00:13:31,840 Speaker 1: I don't know how scientifically viable this is at all, 245 00:13:31,880 --> 00:13:35,120 Speaker 1: but it makes some sense in my head. Well, MICHAELA, 246 00:13:35,120 --> 00:13:37,880 Speaker 1: I looked this up, and sure enough, I found several 247 00:13:37,880 --> 00:13:41,319 Speaker 1: accounts of people actually claiming to have used or two 248 00:13:41,320 --> 00:13:44,640 Speaker 1: have known people who use stones in soup for different 249 00:13:44,640 --> 00:13:48,840 Speaker 1: reasons such as supposedly adding flavor or nutrition. And again, 250 00:13:49,280 --> 00:13:51,520 Speaker 1: like you, I can't vouch for this actually working to 251 00:13:51,559 --> 00:13:54,880 Speaker 1: add much flavor nutrition, but that was the reasoning, and 252 00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:57,319 Speaker 1: it seems like this was a practice in some Depression 253 00:13:57,400 --> 00:14:00,360 Speaker 1: era American cooking, like with the idea that if you 254 00:14:00,400 --> 00:14:02,640 Speaker 1: had a stone that was used in a pot that 255 00:14:02,679 --> 00:14:05,120 Speaker 1: cooked previous soup, you put that stone in the next 256 00:14:05,120 --> 00:14:08,079 Speaker 1: soup pot. It's like a way of adding extra flavor. 257 00:14:08,200 --> 00:14:10,559 Speaker 1: It just you know, but brings it from the last spot. 258 00:14:11,559 --> 00:14:14,480 Speaker 1: But MICHAELA also had some comments on our discussion of 259 00:14:14,559 --> 00:14:18,360 Speaker 1: the earliest cooking pots, of those Joeman ceramic cooking pots 260 00:14:18,679 --> 00:14:21,400 Speaker 1: having round bottoms rather than flat one. So some of 261 00:14:21,440 --> 00:14:24,520 Speaker 1: the earliest ceramic cooking vessels were actually things that wouldn't 262 00:14:24,560 --> 00:14:26,480 Speaker 1: stand up on their own. They either probably had to 263 00:14:26,520 --> 00:14:29,800 Speaker 1: be suspended over a fire or or held in some 264 00:14:29,880 --> 00:14:34,640 Speaker 1: kind of holding frame or something. So MICHAELA says, spherical 265 00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:37,160 Speaker 1: earthen pots could have a few advantages off the top 266 00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:39,720 Speaker 1: of my head, being that a sphere has the greatest 267 00:14:39,800 --> 00:14:43,360 Speaker 1: volume to surface area ratio, It could proportionally hold more 268 00:14:43,400 --> 00:14:46,840 Speaker 1: than a cylindrical pot, and it would retain heat for longer. 269 00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:49,400 Speaker 1: I can also imagine if you're putting stones in it 270 00:14:49,480 --> 00:14:51,720 Speaker 1: to heat it up, having a spherical shape would mean 271 00:14:51,760 --> 00:14:54,840 Speaker 1: the rocks would fall to the same central point, less 272 00:14:54,840 --> 00:14:58,600 Speaker 1: fishing around for them. That that last idea, That that's 273 00:14:58,640 --> 00:15:01,600 Speaker 1: interesting anyway, Kala says, feel free to read this on 274 00:15:01,720 --> 00:15:04,480 Speaker 1: listener mail, edit out whatever to make it fit. I 275 00:15:04,520 --> 00:15:07,400 Speaker 1: would be delighted and to make my like decade. I 276 00:15:07,440 --> 00:15:09,360 Speaker 1: would love to see you guys if you come to 277 00:15:09,520 --> 00:15:13,000 Speaker 1: the Twin Cities. Well, if we ever, if we're ever 278 00:15:13,040 --> 00:15:15,240 Speaker 1: on tour, we will certainly announce it ahead of time. 279 00:15:15,280 --> 00:15:17,440 Speaker 1: So yeah, if if we make it up that way, 280 00:15:17,560 --> 00:15:19,400 Speaker 1: you can be there. You can't help a thing back 281 00:15:19,440 --> 00:15:21,480 Speaker 1: of the stone soup thing though, and think, well, you 282 00:15:21,520 --> 00:15:24,840 Speaker 1: can also have certainly some magical thinking related the to 283 00:15:24,880 --> 00:15:27,720 Speaker 1: the idea that this stone was once in a really 284 00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:30,880 Speaker 1: good soup. If this stone were to be in your soup, 285 00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:34,880 Speaker 1: then surely years would be as delicious. Uh. In the 286 00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:36,560 Speaker 1: same way that you know, we've talked about this on 287 00:15:36,600 --> 00:15:39,160 Speaker 1: the show before, like ideas of say, um, you know, 288 00:15:39,200 --> 00:15:42,160 Speaker 1: treating a weapon to to cure the wound, sort of 289 00:15:42,360 --> 00:15:45,840 Speaker 1: a situation exactly. Uh. And it also makes me think 290 00:15:45,880 --> 00:15:48,720 Speaker 1: it could be a sort of magical version of the 291 00:15:48,800 --> 00:15:51,240 Speaker 1: idea of the infinite broth. I'm sure you've heard of. 292 00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:53,800 Speaker 1: You know, there are places that will just keep the 293 00:15:53,840 --> 00:15:57,320 Speaker 1: same pot of souper stew or broth bubbling for maybe 294 00:15:57,440 --> 00:16:00,280 Speaker 1: years at a time, and you'd be constantly taking parts 295 00:16:00,280 --> 00:16:02,360 Speaker 1: of it out to eat, but also adding to the 296 00:16:02,400 --> 00:16:05,040 Speaker 1: same pot. And uh and like they're I think there 297 00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:07,680 Speaker 1: are restaurants that do this. I can't remember where I've 298 00:16:07,680 --> 00:16:09,440 Speaker 1: read about this happening. I think I think this might 299 00:16:09,480 --> 00:16:12,160 Speaker 1: be a sort of Eastern phenomenon. But you just keep 300 00:16:12,240 --> 00:16:15,480 Speaker 1: the same pot going and uh. And I think the 301 00:16:15,520 --> 00:16:18,520 Speaker 1: idea is it just continually develops more and more complex 302 00:16:18,560 --> 00:16:21,800 Speaker 1: flavor over the years. Well, this reminds me though some 303 00:16:21,880 --> 00:16:25,480 Speaker 1: of the like the Irish and or Welsh smiths we 304 00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:28,120 Speaker 1: were looking at and talking about the cauldron as as 305 00:16:28,160 --> 00:16:32,880 Speaker 1: a source of infinite goodness. Perhaps that has some connections 306 00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:43,600 Speaker 1: to this as well. All right, let's go to another 307 00:16:43,600 --> 00:16:47,120 Speaker 1: one here. This one comes to us from Matt good Day. 308 00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:50,680 Speaker 1: Fellas really enjoyed the series and cauldrons. It was great 309 00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:53,040 Speaker 1: to hear so many insights about a significance of such 310 00:16:53,120 --> 00:16:56,920 Speaker 1: objects to Gaelic and Britonic cultures, as well as many 311 00:16:56,960 --> 00:17:01,040 Speaker 1: others mentioned. Discussions of cauldron esque ups and the communal 312 00:17:01,120 --> 00:17:04,879 Speaker 1: nature of cauldron's reminded me of the Gaelic and Gaelic 313 00:17:04,960 --> 00:17:10,399 Speaker 1: warning um um. They pronounced this wrong. Uh koatch, also 314 00:17:10,480 --> 00:17:14,880 Speaker 1: commonly known as quake, which I think is a Scots 315 00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:19,399 Speaker 1: version of the older Gaelic name a quat katch, is 316 00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:22,879 Speaker 1: a sort of ceremonial drinking vessel used for special occasions. 317 00:17:23,160 --> 00:17:26,120 Speaker 1: I've always pronounced it like quake, but I'm a full 318 00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:28,320 Speaker 1: blooded Canadian, so I leave it to our Scottish and 319 00:17:28,359 --> 00:17:34,280 Speaker 1: Irish cousins to clarify. So quake, uh kowatch, quatch quake Um. 320 00:17:35,119 --> 00:17:36,840 Speaker 1: I'm not not sure where to land on this one, 321 00:17:37,119 --> 00:17:41,679 Speaker 1: but not quatto, not quato. Anyway, my friends and I 322 00:17:41,760 --> 00:17:44,840 Speaker 1: have employed the We'll go with quake, since this is 323 00:17:44,840 --> 00:17:49,160 Speaker 1: in his voice to imbibe in a wee drum during 324 00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:53,040 Speaker 1: Robert Burns night suppers before COVID. Anyway, I believe they 325 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:56,639 Speaker 1: are also used as part of wedding ceremonies. Despite getting 326 00:17:56,760 --> 00:17:59,800 Speaker 1: kilted up for my own betrothal, though my wife and 327 00:17:59,840 --> 00:18:02,080 Speaker 1: I did not share a drink from a quake at 328 00:18:02,080 --> 00:18:05,720 Speaker 1: our own ceremony, However, I have heard of others doing so. 329 00:18:06,400 --> 00:18:09,000 Speaker 1: I thought it was an interesting example, if not just 330 00:18:09,080 --> 00:18:11,800 Speaker 1: an extension of the discussion around the role of cauldron 331 00:18:11,840 --> 00:18:16,240 Speaker 1: like vessels in community relationships, feasting, etcetera. I imagine the 332 00:18:16,320 --> 00:18:18,639 Speaker 1: quake was an object for every day use back in 333 00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:21,640 Speaker 1: the day, but additionally would take on a ceremonial role 334 00:18:21,720 --> 00:18:26,000 Speaker 1: during events or cultural formalities uh such as when to 335 00:18:26,160 --> 00:18:29,840 Speaker 1: clan chieftains meet or when welcoming a stranger seeking shelter. 336 00:18:30,200 --> 00:18:32,760 Speaker 1: I don't have much direct knowledge myself. It just seems 337 00:18:32,800 --> 00:18:35,840 Speaker 1: logical given the nature of older clan based societies where 338 00:18:35,840 --> 00:18:39,800 Speaker 1: hospitality played such a critical role in community relations those 339 00:18:39,840 --> 00:18:43,199 Speaker 1: of the Gaelic world, just being one of many examples. 340 00:18:43,480 --> 00:18:46,679 Speaker 1: That's it. Just thought you might find it an interesting example. Matt, 341 00:18:47,080 --> 00:18:49,320 Speaker 1: that is interesting. I don't think I knew about this, uh, 342 00:18:49,400 --> 00:18:52,240 Speaker 1: this type of artifact though. Of course even in our 343 00:18:52,240 --> 00:18:55,920 Speaker 1: our episodes we talked about sometimes the gray line between 344 00:18:56,800 --> 00:19:00,560 Speaker 1: a bowl and a drinking vessel. Uh. Yeah, so there's 345 00:19:00,600 --> 00:19:02,800 Speaker 1: there's a certain amount of overlap. I think, yeah, what 346 00:19:02,960 --> 00:19:05,960 Speaker 1: is a grail? You know, you watch Monty Python. It's 347 00:19:05,960 --> 00:19:09,399 Speaker 1: a drinking cup, right, But but isn't a grail originally? 348 00:19:09,840 --> 00:19:12,520 Speaker 1: I mean something like cauldron or maybe in some context 349 00:19:12,560 --> 00:19:21,400 Speaker 1: it does, all right. This next message is in response 350 00:19:21,440 --> 00:19:24,080 Speaker 1: to a previous Listener mail where somebody wrote in about 351 00:19:24,080 --> 00:19:28,600 Speaker 1: a traditional Mongolian dish and some interesting methods of animal 352 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:32,840 Speaker 1: butchery and cookery. So this is from m M. Says Hi, 353 00:19:33,000 --> 00:19:35,000 Speaker 1: Robert and Joe. A couple of weeks ago, somebody wrote 354 00:19:35,000 --> 00:19:38,280 Speaker 1: about a traditional Mongolian dish where a goat's skull and 355 00:19:38,440 --> 00:19:42,040 Speaker 1: hide is used as a sealed vessel for cooking other ingredients, 356 00:19:42,040 --> 00:19:45,639 Speaker 1: and you asked about other cuisine traditions that did something similar. 357 00:19:46,280 --> 00:19:48,960 Speaker 1: Here in Colombia, we use that method to cook the 358 00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:53,440 Speaker 1: traditional lechona Spanish for suckling pig. Although the modern version 359 00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:55,880 Speaker 1: uses a full grown animal instead of a small one. 360 00:19:56,280 --> 00:19:59,360 Speaker 1: It evolved from an older Spanish tradition that was basically 361 00:19:59,400 --> 00:20:03,199 Speaker 1: an oven cooked spatch cocked piglet. To make lacona, the 362 00:20:03,200 --> 00:20:06,320 Speaker 1: pigs meat, bones, and organs are removed, while keeping the 363 00:20:06,359 --> 00:20:09,320 Speaker 1: skin of the back and torso with the head intact. 364 00:20:09,760 --> 00:20:12,240 Speaker 1: The meat is cut in small pieces and stuffed back 365 00:20:12,320 --> 00:20:16,880 Speaker 1: into the skin, mixed with spices, onions, green peas, sometimes 366 00:20:16,960 --> 00:20:20,920 Speaker 1: rice because it's cheap but sacrilegious according to the traditional recipe, 367 00:20:21,440 --> 00:20:24,400 Speaker 1: and then you stitch the skin to seal everything inside, 368 00:20:24,560 --> 00:20:27,040 Speaker 1: bathe it in orange juice, and cook the whole thing 369 00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:29,639 Speaker 1: in a brick oven until the inside is done and 370 00:20:29,680 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 1: has infused with the drippings from the skin's fat, and 371 00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:35,080 Speaker 1: the outer layer is thin and crispy, similar to the 372 00:20:35,119 --> 00:20:38,560 Speaker 1: skin in peking duck. A single achona can feed a 373 00:20:38,600 --> 00:20:42,800 Speaker 1: small army or an average Colombian family gathering winky face emoji, 374 00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:46,080 Speaker 1: with each person getting a generous scoop of the stuffing 375 00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:49,640 Speaker 1: along with a square of the thin, crispy skin. It's very, 376 00:20:49,760 --> 00:20:51,919 Speaker 1: very good, despite some people finding the side of a 377 00:20:51,960 --> 00:20:55,359 Speaker 1: pig's head a bit grotesque in medieval but let's not 378 00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:57,959 Speaker 1: forget that you guys over there didn't just put the 379 00:20:58,000 --> 00:21:01,440 Speaker 1: herbs and spices inside. The thanks Giving turkey. You used 380 00:21:01,480 --> 00:21:03,480 Speaker 1: to put pretty much all of the things that are 381 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:06,919 Speaker 1: now served as side dishes inside the bird, so they 382 00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:09,240 Speaker 1: would cook with it and mix with its own flavor. 383 00:21:09,560 --> 00:21:12,199 Speaker 1: Today's practice of cooking the turkey on its own and 384 00:21:12,240 --> 00:21:15,320 Speaker 1: the stuffings on the side came with the popularization of 385 00:21:15,359 --> 00:21:19,159 Speaker 1: stovetop cooking and the appearance of some sanitary concerns in 386 00:21:19,200 --> 00:21:22,080 Speaker 1: the seventies. Keep up the good work, Love the show 387 00:21:22,440 --> 00:21:26,239 Speaker 1: m in Columbia. That's that's good. That reminds me of 388 00:21:26,280 --> 00:21:29,440 Speaker 1: something in Martin Wallon's book on Squid. I talked to 389 00:21:29,520 --> 00:21:32,800 Speaker 1: him on a recent episode of the show. Uh talks 390 00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:37,320 Speaker 1: a little bit about ancient use of culinary use of 391 00:21:37,320 --> 00:21:39,639 Speaker 1: of squid and how you would have it stuffed with, 392 00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:42,640 Speaker 1: say sheep's brains, at least according to one ancient recipe, 393 00:21:43,119 --> 00:21:46,399 Speaker 1: but that later on its discussed that the squid body 394 00:21:46,760 --> 00:21:51,439 Speaker 1: is essentially the perfect the perfect thing to stuff anything into, 395 00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:53,720 Speaker 1: Like it's just the perfect body cavity to make and 396 00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:57,159 Speaker 1: it's like nature's ravioli. I guess so Nature's dumpling, or 397 00:21:57,240 --> 00:22:00,520 Speaker 1: you can think that the ocean's sausage casing in it's 398 00:22:00,560 --> 00:22:03,920 Speaker 1: a tube like a like a sheep intestine or whatever. Yeah, 399 00:22:03,960 --> 00:22:06,840 Speaker 1: but I'm I'm all for yes, keep the pigs head 400 00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:10,120 Speaker 1: on it. Maybe, yes, it could be a big growth, 401 00:22:10,119 --> 00:22:13,360 Speaker 1: tesque and a bit medieval, but you know, people need 402 00:22:13,400 --> 00:22:15,800 Speaker 1: to know where their their porks coming from. Look a look, 403 00:22:15,840 --> 00:22:23,760 Speaker 1: your your your your feast in the face. All right. 404 00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:26,120 Speaker 1: This one comes to us from Ben Ben Rights in Hello, 405 00:22:26,119 --> 00:22:28,159 Speaker 1: stuff to blow your mind people's. I was so stoked 406 00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:30,720 Speaker 1: to hear your last email bag episode. I started typing 407 00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:33,879 Speaker 1: this message before the episode was over. I've been following 408 00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:37,920 Speaker 1: the progress of this game, Teenage Muting Turtles Shredders Revenge, uh, 409 00:22:38,840 --> 00:22:42,440 Speaker 1: uh and um for over a year, and I'm well impressed. Uh. 410 00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:45,959 Speaker 1: And from here, he goes into a number of details 411 00:22:46,000 --> 00:22:51,360 Speaker 1: about his excitement for the game, his experience with the game. Uh. 412 00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:55,119 Speaker 1: Suffice to say he was very excited and very impressed. 413 00:22:55,640 --> 00:22:58,239 Speaker 1: But then he also mentioned Robert and Seth spoke of 414 00:22:58,280 --> 00:23:01,120 Speaker 1: the other teenage Meeting Ninja Turtle properties in the episode, 415 00:23:01,119 --> 00:23:03,480 Speaker 1: and I would like to throw in another couple. The 416 00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:07,040 Speaker 1: Last Ronan is a comic from I d W Publishing 417 00:23:07,040 --> 00:23:09,880 Speaker 1: that is being released as a trade paperback next month 418 00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:13,320 Speaker 1: and looks amazing. Also check out the most recent Teenage 419 00:23:13,359 --> 00:23:16,160 Speaker 1: Muting Ninja Turtles cartoon Rise of the Teenage Muting Ninja 420 00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:19,960 Speaker 1: Turtles available via Nickelodeon and Paramount Plus. Both are different 421 00:23:19,960 --> 00:23:24,600 Speaker 1: takes on the franchise on very opposite points of the spectrum. 422 00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:26,600 Speaker 1: Thank you for all the great content you make. I'm 423 00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:29,560 Speaker 1: glad I have stb y m as quote friends in 424 00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:35,000 Speaker 1: my ears. Keep up the great work, Cowabunga Dues Benjamin ps, 425 00:23:35,119 --> 00:23:40,040 Speaker 1: I'm a Raphael. What does that mean? If you're a Raphael? 426 00:23:40,080 --> 00:23:42,920 Speaker 1: Does that mean you're like moody and angry? Well, this 427 00:23:43,000 --> 00:23:46,280 Speaker 1: is one thing. Seth and I discussed that if you 428 00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:47,920 Speaker 1: have to select a turtle to be in one of 429 00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:51,440 Speaker 1: these games. Uh, there's the discussion that does this say 430 00:23:51,480 --> 00:23:54,160 Speaker 1: something about me? Uh? So Seth and I are both 431 00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:56,280 Speaker 1: Donna Donna Tello's I don't know if you have a 432 00:23:56,320 --> 00:23:58,560 Speaker 1: gut answer to which turtle you are, which one you 433 00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:01,600 Speaker 1: would select. I think I was also a Donna Tello, 434 00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:04,360 Speaker 1: But I don't know if that's psychologically revealing. I think 435 00:24:04,359 --> 00:24:07,840 Speaker 1: it was just because I regarded their weapons and thought 436 00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:10,320 Speaker 1: that his bow staff had the longest reach, which was 437 00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:14,240 Speaker 1: true in that really hard side scrolling in the S game. Ah. Well, 438 00:24:14,680 --> 00:24:16,240 Speaker 1: it helps to in this game as well. He does 439 00:24:16,320 --> 00:24:19,080 Speaker 1: have very long reach with it. My son, by the way, 440 00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:22,280 Speaker 1: is Rafael. So there you go. The other thing. I 441 00:24:22,320 --> 00:24:26,119 Speaker 1: did look up this this. Yeah, I mean Rafael in 442 00:24:26,119 --> 00:24:28,960 Speaker 1: their teenage years, you gotta watch out. Yeah, well Rafa 443 00:24:29,000 --> 00:24:31,320 Speaker 1: Rafael has got some some good news in that game. Uh. 444 00:24:31,400 --> 00:24:33,199 Speaker 1: This is the last Ronan. I did look up, and 445 00:24:33,240 --> 00:24:34,840 Speaker 1: it does look kind of interesting it. I think it's 446 00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:38,240 Speaker 1: like a futuristic situation where there's only one Turtle left, 447 00:24:38,920 --> 00:24:41,800 Speaker 1: uh kind of deal, and he's having to fight the powers, 448 00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:44,320 Speaker 1: the d and so forth. That's interesting. So I wonder 449 00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:47,840 Speaker 1: what Benjamin means here about saying the Last Ronan and 450 00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:50,720 Speaker 1: and Rise of the Turtles or opposites. I assume he 451 00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:53,359 Speaker 1: means like one is very dark and one is more 452 00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:55,960 Speaker 1: light and fun. Yeah, I think one is still for 453 00:24:56,040 --> 00:24:58,520 Speaker 1: the kids and one is for the more of the 454 00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:02,159 Speaker 1: you know, the not necessarily grown up audience. But you 455 00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:04,680 Speaker 1: know that the edge or comic book content I'm imagining, 456 00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:06,840 Speaker 1: which I think that has roots back to some of 457 00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:10,480 Speaker 1: the original uh comic book stuff regarding the teenage mutant 458 00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:13,600 Speaker 1: Ninja Turtles. Are you ready? Could could you? Or maybe 459 00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:15,480 Speaker 1: you and Seth take a stab at a couple of 460 00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:18,359 Speaker 1: random Turtles questions that popped into my head. They're both 461 00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:21,639 Speaker 1: about fashion in the Tin Tinja Turtles. Okay, so the 462 00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:24,840 Speaker 1: first one is, are Bebop and rock Steady supposed to 463 00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:28,919 Speaker 1: code as punks? Like Bebop's got the mohawk and the 464 00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:32,760 Speaker 1: nose ring and the fashion glasses. Is he supposed to 465 00:25:32,800 --> 00:25:35,359 Speaker 1: be a punk or is that just like as just 466 00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:38,520 Speaker 1: random uh stuff to to make him look cool? And 467 00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:39,959 Speaker 1: if he is supposed to be a punk, or if 468 00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:43,560 Speaker 1: they're both supposed to be punks, are they like, are 469 00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:46,000 Speaker 1: they into the music or did they be? Were they 470 00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:50,480 Speaker 1: transformed into punks after being exposed to the ooze? Could 471 00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:53,359 Speaker 1: they have become surfers or goths? What's the what's the 472 00:25:53,359 --> 00:25:55,480 Speaker 1: origin on this? Here? Well, Seth what and I have 473 00:25:55,520 --> 00:25:58,399 Speaker 1: to chime in? But my recollection on this is that 474 00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:02,199 Speaker 1: they were human beings already belonged to these subcultures and 475 00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:05,800 Speaker 1: then they got used and transformed. But maybe I'm wrong 476 00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:08,280 Speaker 1: on that. Maybe they were an actual rhino and an 477 00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:11,520 Speaker 1: actual pig of some sort. Oh, Okay, I think I'm 478 00:26:11,560 --> 00:26:14,520 Speaker 1: going more with like the Ninja Turtles movie too, where 479 00:26:14,520 --> 00:26:17,640 Speaker 1: you just start with regular animals and then they're transformed 480 00:26:17,640 --> 00:26:20,159 Speaker 1: into human forms, but if they started as humans, that 481 00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:23,399 Speaker 1: would make way more sense. Okay, here's what I know. Okay, 482 00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:27,520 Speaker 1: hello everyone, it's out here. Um So, if you watch 483 00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:30,120 Speaker 1: the animated series. Now I know all of the series, 484 00:26:30,160 --> 00:26:33,359 Speaker 1: whether it's the comics, the movies, the animated series, et cetera, 485 00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:37,719 Speaker 1: they each have slightly different timelines. But picture those street 486 00:26:37,760 --> 00:26:43,119 Speaker 1: punks from Jason Takes Manhattan, Okay, the ones where it's like, gosh, 487 00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:46,240 Speaker 1: isn't New York or dirty filthy city? All these kids, 488 00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:49,600 Speaker 1: we don't understand where they're coming from. They're wearing crazy fashions. 489 00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:53,080 Speaker 1: What's with this? If you see pictures of bebop and 490 00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:57,160 Speaker 1: rock study before they mutate, that's exactly what they look like. 491 00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:02,879 Speaker 1: Those like filthy you know, nineteen seventies, nineteen eighties street 492 00:27:02,960 --> 00:27:04,960 Speaker 1: kids in New York. That that that that was our 493 00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:08,000 Speaker 1: five very Warriors, esk. You know they are there are 494 00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:11,159 Speaker 1: punk slash heavy metal criminals, as would appear in a 495 00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:14,240 Speaker 1: movie made by people who don't really understand these music 496 00:27:14,320 --> 00:27:18,880 Speaker 1: genres exactly that they there are mainstream cultures bastardizations of 497 00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:23,240 Speaker 1: these subcultures, and so therefore, yes they are punk. Yes 498 00:27:23,280 --> 00:27:26,040 Speaker 1: they are heavy metal, but only in the regard that 499 00:27:26,119 --> 00:27:28,600 Speaker 1: like a forty year old man who is writing a 500 00:27:28,720 --> 00:27:33,520 Speaker 1: children's cartoon show under sticking these concepts very good. I've 501 00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:35,920 Speaker 1: got a second question. Are you ready? I'm ready? Okay. 502 00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:41,440 Speaker 1: Also about fashion in Ninja Turtles, can anyone explain why 503 00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:44,920 Speaker 1: the reporter April O'Neil has classically been depicted wearing an 504 00:27:44,960 --> 00:27:48,399 Speaker 1: all yellow jumpsuit? Is that just random or is this 505 00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:52,600 Speaker 1: an outfit associated with TV journalism in some context that 506 00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:55,520 Speaker 1: I don't know that I'm not aware of. I have 507 00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:58,800 Speaker 1: my interpretation. How about how about you, Robert? Do you 508 00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:01,120 Speaker 1: do have a word on this? I never really thought 509 00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:04,879 Speaker 1: about it, but uh, I mean a good jumpsuit, A 510 00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:07,960 Speaker 1: jumpsuit is a good look, so I never right yellow. 511 00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:10,080 Speaker 1: I mean you could like super visible. I guess like 512 00:28:10,119 --> 00:28:13,360 Speaker 1: you're not. Here's Here's always been my interpretation. I bet 513 00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:16,399 Speaker 1: there's a real reason somewhere deep and like you know, 514 00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:19,600 Speaker 1: the the red conning of the Ninja Turtle world, I 515 00:28:19,640 --> 00:28:22,119 Speaker 1: always figured it was to let us know as the 516 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:25,080 Speaker 1: audience that this is an action oriented woman, that she 517 00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:26,600 Speaker 1: is going to get out there and she's going to 518 00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:29,320 Speaker 1: run around, She's gonna do some stuff and then in 519 00:28:29,400 --> 00:28:33,040 Speaker 1: addition to that, this part is probably the childhood speculation. 520 00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:35,879 Speaker 1: The only yellow clothes that I would see as a 521 00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:38,720 Speaker 1: kid would be like a yellow like rain suit. So 522 00:28:38,800 --> 00:28:42,240 Speaker 1: I was assumed that she was like basically environment ready. 523 00:28:42,280 --> 00:28:44,120 Speaker 1: She could run down into the sewers. She could be 524 00:28:44,120 --> 00:28:46,479 Speaker 1: out on a dirty street and she could you know, 525 00:28:46,800 --> 00:28:50,280 Speaker 1: just you know, just just just just stay dry, mobile, 526 00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:54,360 Speaker 1: you know, well protected and in this in this jumpsuite. 527 00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:57,120 Speaker 1: I know what you mean. Actually, when I was a kid, 528 00:28:57,160 --> 00:29:00,440 Speaker 1: I think the closest way I had to make sense 529 00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:01,959 Speaker 1: of that was that it looks kind of like a 530 00:29:02,080 --> 00:29:06,800 Speaker 1: radiation suit. M hmm. It does give her like a 531 00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:10,720 Speaker 1: sense of official belonging, like she's you until it is 532 00:29:10,720 --> 00:29:13,200 Speaker 1: almost like a uniform, like I am supposed to be here, 533 00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:16,480 Speaker 1: I am here on official business, I am a reporter. Well, 534 00:29:16,520 --> 00:29:19,000 Speaker 1: I think we should bring that back the TVs TV 535 00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:23,480 Speaker 1: journalists on the scene now, full body, yellow jumpsuit. Okay, 536 00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:30,640 Speaker 1: thanks for your input, seth Rob. Do you want to 537 00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:34,520 Speaker 1: tackle one more message here? How about how about doing 538 00:29:34,560 --> 00:29:36,480 Speaker 1: this one about weird hout cinema? All right, this one 539 00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:39,160 Speaker 1: comes to us from James. James says, hello again, gents, 540 00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:42,040 Speaker 1: So I don't remember what James said last time, but 541 00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:46,280 Speaker 1: now he's saying stuff again. Um. I was excited to 542 00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:49,840 Speaker 1: see returned to the expansive collection of classic horror flis 543 00:29:49,920 --> 00:29:53,040 Speaker 1: referenced by The Misfits on your recent episode of Weird 544 00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:55,760 Speaker 1: House Cinema covering a Fiend without a Face. Well that' 545 00:29:55,760 --> 00:30:00,000 Speaker 1: saw that James was someone who wrote in about the Misfits. 546 00:30:01,400 --> 00:30:04,040 Speaker 1: James continues, I immediately felt a sense of obligation to 547 00:30:04,040 --> 00:30:07,080 Speaker 1: seek out a used VHS copy on eBay and re 548 00:30:07,240 --> 00:30:10,480 Speaker 1: listen to the podcast after viewing it. Apologies for my 549 00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:14,200 Speaker 1: late email about this topic. Shipping took a while. Overall, 550 00:30:14,360 --> 00:30:16,800 Speaker 1: I thoroughly enjoyed both the movie and You're Hilarious in 551 00:30:16,840 --> 00:30:19,880 Speaker 1: depth analysis of the film, those sound effects were truly 552 00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:22,760 Speaker 1: something else, and I still ponder the folly work used 553 00:30:22,760 --> 00:30:27,000 Speaker 1: to produce the walking through the kicks cereal while slurping 554 00:30:27,040 --> 00:30:30,760 Speaker 1: noodle soup monster sounds. While the first two thirds of 555 00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:33,000 Speaker 1: the film did have me asking when are they going 556 00:30:33,040 --> 00:30:36,200 Speaker 1: to get to the fireworks factory, the climactic scenes at 557 00:30:36,200 --> 00:30:38,800 Speaker 1: the end made the whole experience well worth it. The 558 00:30:38,880 --> 00:30:42,760 Speaker 1: obviously dated, yet surprisingly good and gory stop motion animation 559 00:30:42,800 --> 00:30:45,880 Speaker 1: Battles left me yearning for a video game adaptation of 560 00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:50,400 Speaker 1: this schlocky old Jim Oh, that would be great. Yes, yeah, 561 00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:52,280 Speaker 1: I can, as long as you focused on again, the 562 00:30:52,360 --> 00:30:55,160 Speaker 1: last thirteen minutes of the film, don't. I guess you 563 00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:57,360 Speaker 1: could do a role playing sort of a thing with 564 00:30:57,400 --> 00:30:59,480 Speaker 1: the rest of the movie. I guess you could, or 565 00:30:59,840 --> 00:31:02,000 Speaker 1: I feel like it would be a great opportunity for 566 00:31:02,040 --> 00:31:05,280 Speaker 1: one of those side scroller movie adaptation video games that's 567 00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:07,479 Speaker 1: full of things that are not in the movie at all. Like, 568 00:31:07,560 --> 00:31:10,520 Speaker 1: so you play a guy jumping on platforms with the 569 00:31:10,520 --> 00:31:13,400 Speaker 1: pistol and there's brains flying at you. But then there's like, 570 00:31:13,440 --> 00:31:15,320 Speaker 1: I don't know, you know, clowns popping up out of 571 00:31:15,360 --> 00:31:18,120 Speaker 1: trash cans to bite you or something. That's how all 572 00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:20,720 Speaker 1: those those movie games were. They had stuff that was 573 00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:22,720 Speaker 1: never in the movie. Well, we know what the power 574 00:31:22,760 --> 00:31:24,840 Speaker 1: up would be in the game, that's for sure. Oh, 575 00:31:25,080 --> 00:31:27,400 Speaker 1: Ben's a drain, right, Yeah, you have to keep popping 576 00:31:27,400 --> 00:31:29,200 Speaker 1: those bensa drains in order to keep up with the 577 00:31:29,240 --> 00:31:34,080 Speaker 1: brain monsters. Yeah, all right, Well, James continues Random Tangent. 578 00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:37,040 Speaker 1: In a previous episode, one of you mentioned a friends 579 00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:40,760 Speaker 1: band doing a bluegrass cover of the Misfits Astro Zombies, 580 00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:43,680 Speaker 1: and this song has coincidentally been a staple in my 581 00:31:43,720 --> 00:31:47,600 Speaker 1: own solo acoustic open mic set for years. Smiley Face, 582 00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:50,880 Speaker 1: I'll start working on Fiend without a Face next. Perhaps 583 00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:53,720 Speaker 1: I'll try to send a recording someday. As always, I 584 00:31:53,720 --> 00:31:56,440 Speaker 1: am really enjoying your pod and appreciate the diversity of 585 00:31:56,440 --> 00:31:59,360 Speaker 1: topics and themes you cover. After the Ninja Turtles chat 586 00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:01,280 Speaker 1: with Seth, I'll have to seek out that new beat 587 00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:05,320 Speaker 1: him up game soon too, cheers James, Thank you, James. 588 00:32:05,720 --> 00:32:08,080 Speaker 1: All right, Well, we're gonna go ahead close up the 589 00:32:08,080 --> 00:32:10,160 Speaker 1: mail bag there, but we'd love to hear from everyone 590 00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:14,320 Speaker 1: out there. Uh So, right in you can find our 591 00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:16,680 Speaker 1: listener mail episodes on Mondays and the Stuff to Blow 592 00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:21,560 Speaker 1: Your Mind podcast feed Uh yeah, so right in past episodes, 593 00:32:21,560 --> 00:32:25,160 Speaker 1: current episodes, future episodes. Anything's fair game Huge thanks as 594 00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:29,120 Speaker 1: always to our excellent audio producer Seth Nicholas Johnson. Uh. 595 00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:30,640 Speaker 1: If you would like to get in touch with us 596 00:32:30,640 --> 00:32:33,200 Speaker 1: with feedback on this episode or any other, to suggest 597 00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:34,920 Speaker 1: a topic for the future, or just to say hello, 598 00:32:35,040 --> 00:32:37,560 Speaker 1: you can email us at contact at stuff to Blow 599 00:32:37,600 --> 00:32:47,200 Speaker 1: your Mind dot com. Stuff to Blow Your Mind is 600 00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:49,840 Speaker 1: a production of I heart Radio. For more podcasts for 601 00:32:49,920 --> 00:32:52,960 Speaker 1: my heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, 602 00:32:53,040 --> 00:32:54,800 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.