WEBVTT - The History of Area 51 - Part One 0:00:04.240 --> 0:00:07.520 Get in touch with technology with tex stuff from stuff 0:00:07.520 --> 0:00:14.360 works dot com either and welcome to text stuff. I'm 0:00:14.440 --> 0:00:18.200 Jonathan Strickland, and today joining me in the studio is 0:00:18.320 --> 0:00:24.520 my esteemed colleague and UH conspiracy theorist extraordinaire Ben Bolan. 0:00:25.200 --> 0:00:28.280 Now I would say that I use critical thinking. I know, 0:00:28.440 --> 0:00:31.480 I think conspiracy theorists is a little bit of a pejorative. 0:00:31.640 --> 0:00:34.720 Nowadays I appreciate it. Yeah, there are a lot of 0:00:34.720 --> 0:00:37.360 other pejoratives I often used to describe you. I could 0:00:37.479 --> 0:00:39.880 rely on some of those if you prefer. Yeah, I've seen, 0:00:40.240 --> 0:00:43.680 I've seen, we hate been dot blogspot dot com, and 0:00:43.720 --> 0:00:47.600 I appreciate. No, we're we're kidding ladies and gentlemen. Uh, 0:00:47.760 --> 0:00:51.000 it's always fantastic to be on the show with one 0:00:51.040 --> 0:00:55.960 of my favorite UH colleagues, and uh, we're actually friends 0:00:56.120 --> 0:00:58.520 outside of the shows. That's absolutely true. Yeah, if you 0:00:58.520 --> 0:01:00.640 ever hear us beating each other up, I want to 0:01:00.680 --> 0:01:04.160 assure you that it's even worse off the air. But 0:01:04.200 --> 0:01:08.240 it's all man in good fun. So we decided I 0:01:08.280 --> 0:01:11.520 had talked about doing an episode about Area fifty one 0:01:11.760 --> 0:01:14.600 for years. Threatening might be the better word for it. 0:01:14.720 --> 0:01:16.959 I've been threatening to do an episode about Area fifty 0:01:17.000 --> 0:01:20.240 one for years and just it was one of those 0:01:20.240 --> 0:01:22.360 things that we kept on putting off because it's a 0:01:22.400 --> 0:01:24.959 it's a big topic and it's so big that Ben 0:01:25.000 --> 0:01:27.440 has been very generous with his time and he and 0:01:27.480 --> 0:01:31.440 I are going to be doing three episodes about this subject. 0:01:31.520 --> 0:01:35.160 So the first two episodes are a history of this 0:01:35.240 --> 0:01:39.560 facility and what what is actually documented as having happened there, 0:01:40.240 --> 0:01:43.600 the real history, mind you. The third episode will be 0:01:43.640 --> 0:01:46.480 the mythology of Area fifty one and some of the 0:01:47.120 --> 0:01:51.600 stories that have been attributed to that area, some of 0:01:51.640 --> 0:01:55.920 which border on um whacka doodle. I think it's a 0:01:55.920 --> 0:01:58.240 good way of putting in. Yeah. So yeah, So we're 0:01:58.240 --> 0:02:00.320 gonna cover all of that. So this episod So we're 0:02:00.320 --> 0:02:02.720 gonna look at the history and if you've heard the 0:02:02.840 --> 0:02:06.840 term Area fifty one, but you've only seen the depictions 0:02:06.920 --> 0:02:10.680 in pop culture, like in science fiction, you probably aren't 0:02:10.880 --> 0:02:14.040 entirely sure what it is now. First of all, Area 0:02:14.160 --> 0:02:19.800 fifty one isn't necessarily the the proper designation for this facility. 0:02:19.840 --> 0:02:24.000 It's the popular one, but really it's more often referred 0:02:24.000 --> 0:02:27.680 to within within UM documents official documentation as Groom Lake 0:02:28.120 --> 0:02:31.520 and that's because there's a big dry lake bed in 0:02:31.600 --> 0:02:36.519 Nevada called Groom Lake, and this facility is built right 0:02:36.600 --> 0:02:40.480 on there, right, and it's built there for a reason. 0:02:40.760 --> 0:02:45.600 It's in Nevada. And you you've got some great notes 0:02:45.639 --> 0:02:49.480 on this all the way down to latitude and longitude. Yes, yeah, 0:02:49.560 --> 0:02:51.480 because because this was the thing, you know, for years 0:02:51.520 --> 0:02:55.680 and years and years, the government would would very very 0:02:55.720 --> 0:03:00.160 carefully disavow any inform any knowledge of such a facility. 0:03:00.160 --> 0:03:02.840 They would say, no, you know, nothing out there exists 0:03:02.960 --> 0:03:06.080 Groom Lake. What what is that? Why would you groom 0:03:06.080 --> 0:03:09.720 a late That's what purpose a dry lake? You are 0:03:09.800 --> 0:03:13.880 speaking crazy talk. So yeah, but but one of the 0:03:13.880 --> 0:03:17.120 big reasons why it's out there is cause a dry 0:03:17.200 --> 0:03:20.920 lake bed in Nevada tends to be pretty darn flat. 0:03:21.520 --> 0:03:24.919 And if you want to say have a remote location 0:03:25.400 --> 0:03:30.320 where you can develop and test secret aircraft and you 0:03:30.400 --> 0:03:33.160 need that space in order to take off and land 0:03:33.200 --> 0:03:36.680 the aircraft, a big dry lake beds a pretty good 0:03:37.400 --> 0:03:41.440 you know location, right, Yeah, it's fantastic. It's also far 0:03:41.560 --> 0:03:46.720 enough inland that the any foreign observers at the time 0:03:46.760 --> 0:03:50.400 of Groom Lakes construction would have a really difficult time 0:03:50.680 --> 0:03:54.480 observing anything to happen there without being noticed. First absolutely, 0:03:54.480 --> 0:03:57.680 because at the time, this is before we get into satellites, right, 0:03:57.760 --> 0:04:01.320 So if you are trying to spy upon the construction 0:04:01.520 --> 0:04:04.160 of Area fifty one it was built back in the fifties, 0:04:04.640 --> 0:04:07.280 then you essentially had to have a spy plane flying 0:04:07.280 --> 0:04:09.880 over the United States, which was a pretty risky thing 0:04:09.920 --> 0:04:13.960 to do. But meanwhile, that's exactly what was going on 0:04:14.000 --> 0:04:16.680 at Area fifty one was the development and testing of 0:04:16.760 --> 0:04:20.520 spy planes. So it's also known as Homey Airport. That's 0:04:20.520 --> 0:04:25.720 more that's a more recent moniker over there. Um and 0:04:25.839 --> 0:04:29.080 it's uh, it's probably I have it in my notes. 0:04:29.160 --> 0:04:35.840 I have it as the most famous secret facility, worst kept. Yeah, 0:04:35.880 --> 0:04:38.400 it's the it's the secret facility everyone has heard of, 0:04:38.480 --> 0:04:40.600 which is kind of funny, but but they still managed 0:04:40.640 --> 0:04:45.760 to keep the actual activities within the the facility itself 0:04:45.880 --> 0:04:49.560 largely secret. There's been some reports that have come out. 0:04:49.600 --> 0:04:51.520 Some of them are credible, some of them are less so. 0:04:52.240 --> 0:04:54.800 But it's it's one of those things that that secrecy 0:04:54.839 --> 0:04:58.720 has also led to some serious issues that will get 0:04:58.760 --> 0:05:00.760 to more in the second part. Some things that have 0:05:00.920 --> 0:05:05.479 happened that that bring up the question of accountability, like, 0:05:05.520 --> 0:05:09.159 how can you be accountable if you can't acknowledge the 0:05:09.240 --> 0:05:13.120 stuff that goes on at that site? Right? And it's 0:05:13.160 --> 0:05:16.119 no wonder we know that whenever there is a lack 0:05:16.160 --> 0:05:19.719 of transparency, we find a plethora and I'm using that 0:05:19.760 --> 0:05:23.120 word correctly of speculation. Absolutely, because we have to fill 0:05:23.120 --> 0:05:25.320 in the gaps. Right. Yeah, it's like a Hitchcock movie. 0:05:25.400 --> 0:05:27.640 The monster you don't see is always going to be 0:05:27.640 --> 0:05:30.720 worse than the monster on screen. Absolutely, But let's go 0:05:30.880 --> 0:05:34.440 to uh as, as they say in Alice in Wonderland, 0:05:34.800 --> 0:05:37.120 let's start at the beginning. What do you say? Absolutely, 0:05:37.200 --> 0:05:41.280 So let's say that you are uh you are a 0:05:41.440 --> 0:05:45.159 country that is involved in a little altercation called World 0:05:45.200 --> 0:05:49.039 War two, and as a result, you need to start 0:05:49.080 --> 0:05:53.839 building out your own military capabilities. Well, the United States 0:05:54.480 --> 0:05:57.960 was very much concerned with s and started to look 0:05:58.040 --> 0:06:02.880 for all sorts of places where they could build various airport, 0:06:03.000 --> 0:06:07.000 landing strips, or military purposes. So they identified this one 0:06:07.040 --> 0:06:09.000 spot and you mentioned I had the latitude and longitude. 0:06:09.000 --> 0:06:11.080 I'm gonna go ahead and give it. It's at thirty 0:06:11.080 --> 0:06:14.920 seven degrees fourteen minutes north latitude and one fifteen degrees 0:06:14.960 --> 0:06:19.120 forty eight minutes west longitude, which means it's right, it's 0:06:19.120 --> 0:06:22.240 within a hundred miles or hundred sixty one kilometers of 0:06:22.320 --> 0:06:26.520 Las Vegas. Uh, that's that's to the south of Area 0:06:26.560 --> 0:06:29.719 fifty one. And then the closest town is actually called Rachel, Nevada, 0:06:29.760 --> 0:06:32.560 and that's about twenty five miles or forty kilometers to 0:06:32.560 --> 0:06:37.640 the north. And uh, the the original purpose of the facility, 0:06:37.920 --> 0:06:39.919 which wasn't really even a facility, was just a couple 0:06:39.960 --> 0:06:43.080 of landing strips, like more like a little compound or 0:06:43.160 --> 0:06:46.799 small airport. Yeah, it was meant to be a training 0:06:46.880 --> 0:06:50.920 place for gunner schools, for for people who are actually 0:06:50.920 --> 0:06:54.680 working on on gunner positions within aircraft. So it's a 0:06:54.720 --> 0:06:59.200 training facility. And uh it was created by the Army 0:06:59.360 --> 0:07:05.159 Air Corps. Notice we didn't say Army Air Force. Yeah, 0:07:05.360 --> 0:07:07.839 this is before the Air Force was ever a thing. 0:07:08.200 --> 0:07:11.360 So yeah, it was Army Air Corps. Uh. They ended 0:07:11.440 --> 0:07:14.320 up using it, like I said, during the forties. By 0:07:14.320 --> 0:07:18.200 the end of it, they essentially they didn't formally decommission 0:07:18.240 --> 0:07:20.960 it because there wasn't really enough there to do that. Yeah, 0:07:21.000 --> 0:07:23.200 they just sort of stopped using it. Yeah, they're kind 0:07:23.240 --> 0:07:26.520 of like, well, wars done, let's pack up and go, 0:07:26.640 --> 0:07:28.960 and they left it kind of where it was. Now, 0:07:29.200 --> 0:07:32.440 that didn't mean that that was the only you only 0:07:32.560 --> 0:07:36.560 organization to use that area. Uh, there was something else 0:07:36.640 --> 0:07:39.960 that happened. So in the nineteen fifties, and this is 0:07:40.040 --> 0:07:41.960 jumping around a little bit because I don't actually have 0:07:42.040 --> 0:07:44.200 it right here in my notes, But in the nineteen fifties, 0:07:44.440 --> 0:07:46.680 two things are going on. One is you have the 0:07:46.800 --> 0:07:49.520 rise of the Cold War, which means that now we 0:07:49.560 --> 0:07:53.840 no longer have an active armed conflict going on, but 0:07:53.880 --> 0:07:57.720 we do have an escalating political conflict between the United 0:07:57.760 --> 0:08:01.560 States and the Soviet Union. And bunch of spine, yes, 0:08:01.600 --> 0:08:04.320 a bunch of spine, which would factor in heavily. We 0:08:04.400 --> 0:08:07.880 also had that same time on both sides. Both the 0:08:07.920 --> 0:08:11.400 United States and Soviet Union had an era of developing 0:08:11.480 --> 0:08:15.280 nuclear weapons, right, So the part of the developing them 0:08:15.360 --> 0:08:17.760 was testing them to make sure that one they worked 0:08:17.760 --> 0:08:21.800 and two you you wanted you wanted other countries to 0:08:21.880 --> 0:08:25.800 know you had them without knowing specifically what your armament was, right, 0:08:25.840 --> 0:08:30.040 and without you explicitly admitting that you had them either, right, 0:08:30.240 --> 0:08:34.680 It was tricky stuff. So the the waste lands of 0:08:34.840 --> 0:08:39.800 Nevada were often areas that UH, the Atomic Energy Commission 0:08:39.800 --> 0:08:42.120 would use to test this stuff. And there was this 0:08:42.480 --> 0:08:46.840 grid of land that they were using to test various 0:08:46.880 --> 0:08:50.520 types of atomic weapons, including some that were developed by 0:08:50.679 --> 0:08:54.480 Edward Teller. UH. Joe McCormick and I recorded an episode 0:08:54.520 --> 0:08:57.439 about five technologies that were supposed to bring it into 0:08:57.440 --> 0:09:01.240 World War but didn't and were Teller is the father 0:09:01.320 --> 0:09:04.079 of the hydrogen bombs, so several of his designs were 0:09:04.080 --> 0:09:07.520 tested in this area. That grid had thirty squares in it, 0:09:07.800 --> 0:09:10.160 and each square was called an area alright, so he 0:09:10.200 --> 0:09:14.440 had areas one through Area thirty. This particular parcel of 0:09:14.520 --> 0:09:18.800 land where the former Army Air Corps facility was, it 0:09:18.920 --> 0:09:21.360 was more or less adjacent to a square known as 0:09:21.400 --> 0:09:25.560 Area fifteen. So it's possible that the Area fifty one 0:09:25.679 --> 0:09:29.840 name comes from transposing the one in five and saying, 0:09:29.880 --> 0:09:31.600 all right, well that was the area fifteen. This is 0:09:31.640 --> 0:09:35.559 Area fifty one. It was not part of the grid originally. 0:09:35.559 --> 0:09:39.160 In fact, when when the facility was constructed, the grid 0:09:39.200 --> 0:09:42.240 had not expanded. It did expand gradually. I think it 0:09:42.320 --> 0:09:45.680 eventually had something like two squares to it. Testing increased 0:09:45.679 --> 0:09:48.480 and they built the fake towns and everything, right, right, yeah, 0:09:48.559 --> 0:09:51.760 and then you see Indiana Jones getting the refrigerator. I knew, 0:09:52.040 --> 0:09:53.800 I knew we were going to say that. Yeah, that's 0:09:53.840 --> 0:09:56.160 the new Jump the Shark, isn't it. Yeah. Yeah, there's 0:09:56.240 --> 0:09:59.520 Jump the Shark and Jump in the Fridge, which which 0:09:59.559 --> 0:10:02.080 did not work out for Punky Brewster but did work 0:10:02.080 --> 0:10:06.800 out for Indiana Jones. Um. So, I mean, while we've 0:10:06.800 --> 0:10:09.520 got this testing going on in this remote part of Nevada, 0:10:09.600 --> 0:10:11.880 which I don't know if you're aware of. This turns 0:10:11.880 --> 0:10:14.040 out that if you're testing lots of nuclear weapons in 0:10:14.040 --> 0:10:17.000 an area, it tends to be a deterrent for people 0:10:17.000 --> 0:10:19.400 to come snooping around. Oh that's what we did wrong. 0:10:21.000 --> 0:10:25.600 We weren't we weren't actively testing new devices around the office. 0:10:25.760 --> 0:10:30.120 Oh yeah, so yeah, that's true. There's a there's a 0:10:30.160 --> 0:10:34.320 profound effect. And I know it sounds like we're jokingly 0:10:35.080 --> 0:10:40.400 noting something that is glaringly obvious. But even at that time, 0:10:40.480 --> 0:10:43.760 before there had been the before we had had such 0:10:43.800 --> 0:10:48.720 extensive research on the effects of this sort of weaponry. Uh, 0:10:48.840 --> 0:10:52.040 everybody kind of saw the writing on the wall. Yeah. Right, 0:10:52.120 --> 0:10:54.560 So at that same time, like you were saying with 0:10:54.600 --> 0:10:56.439 all the spine going on, and there was a lot 0:10:56.480 --> 0:10:58.640 of it. We've we've done episodes on tech stuff about 0:10:58.640 --> 0:11:02.000 spy tech before, and we've even done episodes on specific 0:11:02.040 --> 0:11:05.000 spy planes, like the the YouTube plane being one of 0:11:05.000 --> 0:11:08.679 the most famous. There needed to be some way of 0:11:08.760 --> 0:11:12.720 developing this technology and testing it without people being aware 0:11:12.720 --> 0:11:15.920 of it, so that we can maintain that superiority of 0:11:16.240 --> 0:11:18.640 folks not knowing what we're we are and are not 0:11:18.760 --> 0:11:24.400 capable of doing so. That led to the Central Intelligence 0:11:24.480 --> 0:11:27.560 Agency trying to find a good spot for this. And 0:11:27.600 --> 0:11:29.719 you might say, wait, the c i A. Aren't they 0:11:29.720 --> 0:11:33.440 for an intelligence They are foreign intelligence. So these were 0:11:33.480 --> 0:11:35.959 going to be mostly spy plane spying on other places, 0:11:36.000 --> 0:11:38.760 not the United States. We have plenty of agencies that 0:11:38.800 --> 0:11:41.040 are here to spy on us, and it isn't the 0:11:41.120 --> 0:11:44.520 Air Force already involved? So that's what you would think, right, like, 0:11:44.640 --> 0:11:47.880 why why the CIA? Why not the Air Force? Well, 0:11:48.040 --> 0:11:51.600 it comes down to and Ben, I know you've heard 0:11:51.640 --> 0:11:55.640 this term black budgets, the idea that you need to 0:11:55.720 --> 0:12:00.800 have a budget that is impenetrable people. People are prove them, 0:12:00.840 --> 0:12:02.920 but they cannot see what the budgets are actually for. 0:12:03.240 --> 0:12:06.640 And it's all under the umbrella of national security. And 0:12:06.679 --> 0:12:09.360 the reason that this exists now, I know these get 0:12:09.440 --> 0:12:14.160 a tough time nowadays, and they should. There's a great 0:12:14.240 --> 0:12:17.800 argument for the transparency at this time. Just to be 0:12:17.840 --> 0:12:21.120 fair we have to play devil's advocate and say that 0:12:21.200 --> 0:12:25.680 the argument against transparency is, of course, during the Cold War, 0:12:26.000 --> 0:12:30.720 when people are trying to mask their capabilities, anyone with 0:12:30.840 --> 0:12:36.320 the right amount of subterfusion influence could find uh something 0:12:36.360 --> 0:12:39.040 that wasn't a black budget all the way down to 0:12:39.760 --> 0:12:43.240 individual components, the literal nuts and bolts. So at the 0:12:43.360 --> 0:12:46.800 time their argument will be that this is necessity and 0:12:46.840 --> 0:12:50.439 if you want something secret, you put it under At 0:12:50.480 --> 0:12:53.480 this time in American history, you put it under the CIA, 0:12:54.320 --> 0:12:56.959 because the Air Force would end up having a budget 0:12:57.000 --> 0:12:59.840 that was reviewable by Congress, right exactly, and so this 0:13:00.000 --> 0:13:03.160 would at least mean that everyone in Congress and plus 0:13:03.160 --> 0:13:06.640 all the congressional aids would have access to those budgets, 0:13:06.679 --> 0:13:08.880 which could mean that that's a security risk that that 0:13:08.920 --> 0:13:11.120 information could leak out and it would get into the 0:13:11.160 --> 0:13:16.679 hands of of of foreign agents that would end up 0:13:16.840 --> 0:13:19.319 having the advantage because now they know what we were 0:13:19.360 --> 0:13:21.880 capable of by having it as a black budget. You 0:13:21.960 --> 0:13:24.200 take that out, it also means that again you don't 0:13:24.200 --> 0:13:27.839 have that transparency and you leave the world wide open 0:13:27.960 --> 0:13:31.280 to just speculate on what's actually going on. So there's 0:13:31.320 --> 0:13:35.080 a there's another edge to that sword. So the CIA 0:13:35.200 --> 0:13:37.319 is in charge of this. They work with the Air Force. 0:13:37.360 --> 0:13:39.760 But I mean when we talk about testing these planes, 0:13:40.000 --> 0:13:43.040 it was CIA pilots that we're doing the testing, right, 0:13:43.120 --> 0:13:45.839 not Air Force pilots. It's very important distinct. So they 0:13:45.840 --> 0:13:50.800 were civilians who then got uh classification of top secret 0:13:51.200 --> 0:13:55.000 access through the CIA. I think I've talked about this before, 0:13:55.200 --> 0:13:58.199 way way back. But top secret, by the way, does 0:13:58.240 --> 0:14:01.320 not mean you automatically have access to everything that's classified 0:14:01.360 --> 0:14:04.599 top secret right spot on intelligence at that level is 0:14:04.679 --> 0:14:08.720 often what they call compartmentalized altely. Yeah, so you have 0:14:08.800 --> 0:14:13.000 access to one specific branch, but anything outside of that 0:14:13.080 --> 0:14:15.120 you don't. So you may be able to go to 0:14:15.200 --> 0:14:18.959 the very furthest links in that branch, but it doesn't 0:14:18.960 --> 0:14:21.280 mean you have access to everything. It doesn't mean, for instance, 0:14:21.320 --> 0:14:24.800 So then just to illustrate this, the c I a pilot. 0:14:25.120 --> 0:14:27.760 Let's call him Mr. Smith because that's not a sketchy name, 0:14:27.920 --> 0:14:30.960 that's perfect. Mr Smith might be They call it being 0:14:31.000 --> 0:14:34.000 read onto a program, So Mr Smith might be read 0:14:34.040 --> 0:14:37.400 onto a program for a particular plane, or even something 0:14:37.440 --> 0:14:40.600 as small as just a particular engine or design of 0:14:40.600 --> 0:14:45.160 a plane. Everything else about that is a mystery, and 0:14:45.320 --> 0:14:47.680 it is understood that he is not even supposed to 0:14:47.680 --> 0:14:50.960 pretend that he thought of asking everyone who was working 0:14:51.000 --> 0:14:53.320 at VERA fifty one, whether you're a pilot or an engineer, 0:14:53.400 --> 0:14:56.000 you were only really allowed to know about whatever it 0:14:56.080 --> 0:15:00.560 was your specific project was was concerned with, right, yeah, yeah, 0:15:00.680 --> 0:15:04.520 even if you're in the private industry, which also was 0:15:04.560 --> 0:15:07.120 involved with this. A couple of people are familiar with 0:15:07.160 --> 0:15:11.120 this story. You're probably waiting in there saying, Jonathan Ben Sure, 0:15:11.560 --> 0:15:15.160 the CIA, the Air Force, but why aren't you talking 0:15:15.160 --> 0:15:17.640 about the people who actually built the planes. So you're 0:15:17.680 --> 0:15:21.640 talking about Lockheed hold On one. So Lockheed is a 0:15:21.680 --> 0:15:25.360 military contractor among other things, but they do a lot 0:15:25.440 --> 0:15:29.480 of work with the United States military, and so Lockheed 0:15:29.560 --> 0:15:32.800 was going to be the company that was largely responsible 0:15:32.800 --> 0:15:35.920 for building the planes that we're going to be tested 0:15:35.960 --> 0:15:39.200 at Area fifty one. So when we get down to 0:15:39.240 --> 0:15:42.320 this point where the CIA is ready to find a 0:15:42.440 --> 0:15:46.000 site for this, they work with Lockheed And there is 0:15:46.040 --> 0:15:49.320 a designer at Lockeed who is absolutely famous in the 0:15:49.320 --> 0:15:55.840 spy world, Clarence Kelly Johnson. Yeah, it's you if you've 0:15:55.880 --> 0:16:00.440 heard some of the stories about this stuff. Is definitely 0:16:00.480 --> 0:16:03.520 famous in the spy world. But he is a I 0:16:03.560 --> 0:16:05.280 think we're a family show here, so I'll just say 0:16:05.280 --> 0:16:08.840 he is a gosh darn good designer. Absolutely. Yeah. As 0:16:08.840 --> 0:16:11.360 a matter of fact, he's the top dog at Lockey. 0:16:11.520 --> 0:16:16.120 Jonathan earlier mentioned the YouTube spy playing that is our 0:16:16.160 --> 0:16:22.000 boy Kelly. Yeah. He also ended up largely defining skunk 0:16:22.040 --> 0:16:24.320 Works at Lockeed, and we've done an episode on Tech 0:16:24.360 --> 0:16:27.800 Stuff about skunk Works as well. Skunk Works now is 0:16:27.840 --> 0:16:30.160 just a general term that a lot of companies used 0:16:30.160 --> 0:16:33.840 to describe their secret R and D projects that aren't 0:16:34.120 --> 0:16:37.320 aren't meant for public consumption. This is stuff that is 0:16:37.360 --> 0:16:40.920 going to end up becoming part of products maybe five 0:16:41.040 --> 0:16:43.480 or ten years down the line, right, But that was 0:16:43.560 --> 0:16:48.080 defined at Lockeed. That was the top secret development lab 0:16:48.160 --> 0:16:51.640 where anyone outside of that lab was not aware of 0:16:51.640 --> 0:16:53.920 what was going on, and even people within the lab 0:16:53.960 --> 0:16:56.240 may only be aware of very small parts of what 0:16:56.440 --> 0:17:01.120 is going on. So uh, with you two and unk works. Obviously, 0:17:01.160 --> 0:17:04.240 he had already kind of developed this reputation of being 0:17:04.359 --> 0:17:06.640 the go to guy when it comes to this kind 0:17:06.640 --> 0:17:08.919 of thing. So the CIA consulted with him as well 0:17:08.920 --> 0:17:12.040 as some other military folks, and they started looking around. Now, 0:17:12.119 --> 0:17:15.200 Johnson had said that the facility needed to be remote 0:17:15.320 --> 0:17:18.520 enough to escape casual attention, so you couldn't have it 0:17:18.560 --> 0:17:21.800 close to any kind of metropolitan area or or settlement. 0:17:22.440 --> 0:17:26.119 Um it also had to be close enough to a 0:17:26.200 --> 0:17:29.240 major city so that you could get supplies for all 0:17:29.280 --> 0:17:31.720 the stuff you need in order to do the testing, 0:17:31.760 --> 0:17:34.439 the building and and all of that kind of stuff. Now, 0:17:34.440 --> 0:17:37.640 a lot of these vehicles were not actually constructed at 0:17:37.680 --> 0:17:40.240 Area fifty one. They'd be built in another facility and 0:17:40.280 --> 0:17:43.240 then would be transported Area fifty one for all the testing. 0:17:43.960 --> 0:17:46.000 But even so, like you have to get all the 0:17:46.040 --> 0:17:48.440 food there, you have to you know, all the all 0:17:48.480 --> 0:17:50.800 the basic the fuel that you would need, you would 0:17:50.840 --> 0:17:53.280 have to have all of that shipped to Area fifty 0:17:53.320 --> 0:17:55.119 one in some way. So there were a lot of 0:17:55.119 --> 0:17:57.080 logistics involved, which meant that it had to be far 0:17:57.200 --> 0:17:59.679 enough away from a city to avoid UH notice, but 0:17:59.760 --> 0:18:01.880 not so far as to make it impossible to get 0:18:01.920 --> 0:18:05.560 stuff there. It had to be inconvenient but not inaccessible. 0:18:05.600 --> 0:18:09.119 There's a Goldilocks zone here, Uh, sort of like in 0:18:09.880 --> 0:18:12.639 Star Trek where everybody's looking for an M class planet. 0:18:12.800 --> 0:18:15.280 That's a very good way of putting it. So as 0:18:15.359 --> 0:18:18.119 they were looking around, uh, there was a member on 0:18:18.280 --> 0:18:22.840 the search team named Colonel Osman Ritland who had actually 0:18:22.880 --> 0:18:26.360 trained at the gunnery school that had existed at Groom Lake, 0:18:27.000 --> 0:18:28.480 and so he said, hey, you know, there was this 0:18:28.560 --> 0:18:31.240 place that I had to work at when during World 0:18:31.280 --> 0:18:34.399 War Two that might be worth checking out. And so 0:18:34.480 --> 0:18:36.320 they ended up going there and as soon as Johnson 0:18:36.359 --> 0:18:38.600 saw it, he said that that was the perfect spot. 0:18:38.960 --> 0:18:40.680 It would mean that they would have to do obviously 0:18:40.720 --> 0:18:43.199 a lot of work to make it ready for it 0:18:43.240 --> 0:18:46.080 to actually be a test facility, but he said, this, 0:18:46.080 --> 0:18:48.920 this meets all the requirements I had in mind. So 0:18:49.000 --> 0:18:54.760 he called it Paradise Ranch, right, which, uh, you have 0:18:54.840 --> 0:18:57.640 a great note about this, Yeah, it says, uh, it's 0:18:57.640 --> 0:19:00.320 a little more attractive than quote site at jay into 0:19:00.359 --> 0:19:03.840 a former nuclear test area indo quote Uh. In fact, 0:19:03.840 --> 0:19:06.879 it wasn't even former, it was a current nuclear test area. 0:19:06.920 --> 0:19:10.120 There were times when the Atomic Energy Commission in later, 0:19:10.160 --> 0:19:14.040 the Nevada test site ended up having to uh evacuate 0:19:14.080 --> 0:19:16.040 Area fifty one because they were going to be doing 0:19:16.080 --> 0:19:19.159 some tests and it's possible that wind could carry radioactive 0:19:19.160 --> 0:19:21.840 particles over towards the facility. I mean, you win some, 0:19:21.960 --> 0:19:25.199 you lose some, right, Yeah. So the other term you 0:19:25.240 --> 0:19:28.840 could have used is desolate hell whole, but that also 0:19:29.600 --> 0:19:33.760 not so attractive if you're trying to get uh civilians 0:19:33.800 --> 0:19:39.440 interested in helping out. So they actually did employ civilians 0:19:39.480 --> 0:19:43.920 to help construct a right, Yeah, from us surrounding Las 0:19:44.000 --> 0:19:47.359 Vegas area and from Rachel, Nevada as well. Yeah, and 0:19:47.400 --> 0:19:50.719 it meant it meant that people had to pass some 0:19:50.800 --> 0:19:55.600 pretty stringent background checks, and they had to sign silence oaths. 0:19:55.680 --> 0:19:58.560 And for the most part, people have been really good 0:19:58.560 --> 0:20:00.240 at keeping those oaths. I mean, they're only been a 0:20:00.280 --> 0:20:02.920 few people who have ever talked about Area fifty one, 0:20:03.080 --> 0:20:05.440 which is pretty amazing because we talked about how it's 0:20:05.440 --> 0:20:10.160 really hard to keep secrets, especially in that that difficulty 0:20:10.240 --> 0:20:14.760 increases exponentially the more people involved with the secret. But 0:20:14.920 --> 0:20:17.440 in this in this part too, it's important for us 0:20:17.440 --> 0:20:20.320 to remember that even the people who had signed the 0:20:20.400 --> 0:20:25.200 secrets didn't really have that much access for me. They were. 0:20:25.240 --> 0:20:29.920 They were limited by necessity, which meant that even first 0:20:29.920 --> 0:20:33.399 of all, if you were to communicate outside of area 0:20:33.440 --> 0:20:36.679 fifty one, it would very quickly become obvious who was 0:20:36.720 --> 0:20:39.240 talking because it would all be dependent upon what they knew. 0:20:40.320 --> 0:20:42.359 So if you were talking about stuff that you knew 0:20:42.359 --> 0:20:45.239 but you didn't know other things, that narrows down that 0:20:45.320 --> 0:20:49.600 list of suspects, and there could be some pretty serious penalties. 0:20:49.960 --> 0:20:53.679 We're talking like scary, scary penalties that could go against 0:20:53.680 --> 0:20:56.399 you if you were to spell the beans and those people. Also, 0:20:56.520 --> 0:20:58.520 this is a side note, but I think this is 0:20:58.600 --> 0:21:02.760 a illustrative of the kind of scrutiny that these folks 0:21:02.760 --> 0:21:06.919 were under. Afterwards, The I R. S UH keeps a 0:21:07.200 --> 0:21:12.280 tab for on these people afterward to verify that they're 0:21:12.280 --> 0:21:16.800 not suddenly coming into inexplicable amounts of income, to make 0:21:16.800 --> 0:21:20.560 sure that they're not right. Even though if you, I mean, 0:21:20.600 --> 0:21:22.879 even though, if you think about it, man, those secrets 0:21:23.520 --> 0:21:26.359 I'm air quoting so hard here, folks. Those secrets would 0:21:26.359 --> 0:21:30.520 be things like, um, I was paid to drive a 0:21:30.600 --> 0:21:35.520 truck from Rachel to this location drop off fuel right, 0:21:35.760 --> 0:21:39.040 and and I didn't you know there were three gates. 0:21:39.040 --> 0:21:41.719 I got into one or something like that. Um, and 0:21:41.760 --> 0:21:44.040 that's you know, that's for sake of example. I don't 0:21:44.080 --> 0:21:48.160 know if there was a number of tiered gates. Quote, 0:21:48.920 --> 0:21:51.000 don't come after us. We have not been there, nor 0:21:51.040 --> 0:21:55.720 have we tried to look. Um. So the Yeah, during 0:21:55.800 --> 0:21:59.720 the lifetime of the the test site, which again bordered 0:22:00.000 --> 0:22:03.280 Are one, it was pretty active. They did a hundred 0:22:03.280 --> 0:22:06.760 and five above ground explosions and more than eight hundred 0:22:06.880 --> 0:22:11.800 underground explosions. They would do their last test in nine two, 0:22:11.880 --> 0:22:13.919 So this was kind of a just a fact of 0:22:14.000 --> 0:22:16.879 life at Area fifty one, is that nuclear testing was 0:22:16.960 --> 0:22:19.600 going on. I mean several miles away. I don't want 0:22:19.600 --> 0:22:22.840 to give the implication that it was like just outside 0:22:22.880 --> 0:22:25.399 the gates, but it was certainly close enough for it 0:22:25.440 --> 0:22:30.920 to be concerned. Yeah. Because and also a lot of 0:22:30.920 --> 0:22:33.680 people are probably surprised to hear that that continued until 0:22:33.840 --> 0:22:38.880 nineteen two. So, you know, most people will place the 0:22:39.040 --> 0:22:42.160 end of the Cold War in the late eighties. But 0:22:42.480 --> 0:22:48.080 this doesn't mean that the testing would stop completely. Because, uh, 0:22:48.320 --> 0:22:50.280 just as a Cold war has kind of a hazy 0:22:50.359 --> 0:22:53.840 conflict zone, it also has a hazy beginning and end. 0:22:53.920 --> 0:22:58.640 Whereas we can trace World War Two with some concrete dates, right, yeah, 0:22:58.680 --> 0:23:00.760 I mean, if nothing else, so you can go with 0:23:00.800 --> 0:23:03.040 the declaration of war and the treaties that ended it. 0:23:03.600 --> 0:23:06.119 But when you get down to this, you also have 0:23:07.000 --> 0:23:11.200 the first acknowledgement that there was actually something there, which 0:23:11.240 --> 0:23:16.080