Speaker 1: Thinking Sideways. I don't you've never known. The story is
Speaker 1: of things we simply don't know the answer too. Well. Hi, there,
Speaker 1: welcome to another episode of Thinking Sideways, the hard hitting
Speaker 1: Internet podcast. We're laughing but true. The most accurate thing
Speaker 1: he said yet, Damn we're hard hitting. Okay, So I
Speaker 1: am Joe and I'm joined as always by and Steve
Speaker 1: Alright today, so today we're going to solve it on
Speaker 1: the mystery. And this is one of you guys may
Speaker 1: or may not have heard about. It's called the Nazi Bell.
Speaker 1: That's right, the Nazi Bell. I had never heard of this,
Speaker 1: and I consider myself to be a strong mystery buff
Speaker 1: on solved mysteries. I know, I would say that the
Speaker 1: things that we do, I've heard of before we do them.
Speaker 1: I hadn't heard about this until about a month ago
Speaker 1: when I came across an article somehow I think it
Speaker 1: was advertised on something and what is that? And I
Speaker 1: hadn't heard about it until you sent me a link
Speaker 1: to that article. Yeah, yeah, this is right up your alley. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So anyway, you know, I jumped on a plane and
Speaker 1: went to Germany, dug through the Nazi archives and well,
Speaker 1: here's what I found. Well, not really. Yeah, as soon
Speaker 1: as we get a budget, then we're gonna be doing
Speaker 1: stuff like that. Uh, we're gonna actually be covering a
Speaker 1: lot of unsolved mysteries in places like Hawaii, um, you know,
Speaker 1: a lot of Paris. Very nice. Yeah. So anyway back
Speaker 1: to the Nazi Bell. The Nazi Bell was pretty much
Speaker 1: unknown as far as the world is concerned until the
Speaker 1: year two thousand. Polish writer named Igor Vitkowski published a
Speaker 1: book called The Truth about the Wounderwaffa. Of course, of
Speaker 1: course that was not It was a Owlish books, so
Speaker 1: obviously it wasn't in English, but yeah, the Truth about
Speaker 1: the Wonder Weapon. He describes this this thing as being
Speaker 1: about about nine ft wide, about twelve to fifteen feet high,
Speaker 1: and shaped like a bell. Other descriptions you guys can
Speaker 1: see here. Oh yeah, by the way, he had a
Speaker 1: Nazi swastick on the side the bell did, of course. Yeah, yeah, naturally. Uh.
Speaker 1: Alternative descriptions have described it as a saucer shaped object.
Speaker 1: But for the most part, saucer looks just like the
Speaker 1: NASA saucer we were talking about earlier, the thing that
Speaker 1: they're sending to marks. I like that yeah, I like
Speaker 1: a little chimney in the top, tough in the wheel,
Speaker 1: like the car sticking out from you. Yeah, well I
Speaker 1: think that actually has a car park behind. But yeah,
Speaker 1: that thing looks a little crude. I'm not sure this
Speaker 1: was actually the wounder of Offa or not. But anyway,
Speaker 1: there's also you can find pictures of the bell. Of course,
Speaker 1: those are pictures that have either been you know, paintings
Speaker 1: by artists or recreation or recreations that people have taken
Speaker 1: pictures of. So nobody has a picture of the actual
Speaker 1: Nazi bell. So are we saying we don't actually know
Speaker 1: that it existed, even that's that's the possibility. That's no. No,
Speaker 1: you can't say that it definitely existed, but we can't
Speaker 1: say it definitely didn't either. Well I guess not. Okay,
Speaker 1: Well we'll solve that mystery before the show is over.
Speaker 1: So I know why yougo. Vitkowski published his wounderboff A book,
Speaker 1: and the way he found out about is he claims
Speaker 1: to have had a contact in Polish intelligence and this
Speaker 1: Polish intelligence officer allowed him to look at a file
Speaker 1: which had a transcript of an interview by Polish agents
Speaker 1: of a Nazi s S officer whose name was I'm
Speaker 1: just gonna pronounce it in regular English Jacob Sparenberg. And
Speaker 1: it might be Yakuber, who knows, but I'm just gonna
Speaker 1: say Jacob Sparenberg. Uh. Supposedly in this transcript he described
Speaker 1: the bell and apparently some of its wondrous capabilities. And Vikkowski,
Speaker 1: the author never said who in Polish intelligence actually shared
Speaker 1: this with him. There's no documentation, Yeah, I know source
Speaker 1: and the the you know, the supposed transcripted the interrogation.
Speaker 1: Nobody's ever seen it. And what did they call it?
Speaker 1: The bell? The bell? Yeah, and German it's called it's
Speaker 1: called gluca, which is German for the bell. Okay, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's just called the bell. And when Igor was looked
Speaker 1: at these files, if when I was doing the reading,
Speaker 1: when I found a little off putting was the fact that, yeah,
Speaker 1: he couldn't say who gave it to him, that makes sense,
Speaker 1: and they wouldn't give him a copy of it, which
Speaker 1: if it's from intelligence I can understand. So he hand
Speaker 1: wrote a transcript of it. So all we have is
Speaker 1: his handwritten copy of it, which seems like a guy
Speaker 1: could have just sat around and made up right off
Speaker 1: the start, I'm a little I'm a little worried about this. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's uh, that's that's a good point. I mean he
Speaker 1: could have, but like, is it is it suspicious because
Speaker 1: he was allowed to like take a transcript of it?
Speaker 1: Is that what suspicious to you know? Just I think
Speaker 1: what he's saying is that I'll go ahead. Sorry, Uh,
Speaker 1: there's just I mean, there's no other way for him
Speaker 1: to have gotten that information out of there except for
Speaker 1: to handwrite it. It's to make some notes. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's I guess what what's hinky to me is that
Speaker 1: it's not an official transcript, so therefore we don't know
Speaker 1: if it really happened. So the first piece of the
Speaker 1: puzzle I'm already questioning, I guess is where I'm getting at,
Speaker 1: Because if you know, let's say, the Freedom of Information
Speaker 1: Act in this country, I could request that document and
Speaker 1: have that document heavily redacted, whether it's redacted or not,
Speaker 1: I'd have that document as my base, whereas this guy
Speaker 1: doesn't have anything. So that's that's yeah, and its it's
Speaker 1: it's believable that if he was allowed to see as
Speaker 1: some sort of secret file like that, that he would
Speaker 1: only be able to make notes and not make copies
Speaker 1: or anything. I take photos. But at the same time, now, yeah,
Speaker 1: you're right, it's there's no documentation. Almost more worrying to
Speaker 1: me that he was allowed to take notes, right, because
Speaker 1: if they're like, yeah, this is a class by thing,
Speaker 1: you can look at it, but you can't take any
Speaker 1: written anything out of here. You know, you can't make
Speaker 1: a copy of it, that makes more sense to me
Speaker 1: than I'm saying, Yeah, take all the notes you want. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you can trade in your own hand. Yeah, that's totally fine. Whatever,
Speaker 1: But uh, you know, and I guess this Polish intelligence
Speaker 1: officer never showed this transcript to anybody else or no
Speaker 1: one else who couldn't keep their mouth shuts, and maybe
Speaker 1: you got some of them got whacked. So the people
Speaker 1: who say that the saucer it's a saucer shaped object
Speaker 1: rather than a bell shaped objects said it is powered
Speaker 1: by a pair of rotating drums containing a mysterious irridescent
Speaker 1: purple liquid. So okay, that's uh. But typically it's described
Speaker 1: as a device that's made out of heavy heart metal
Speaker 1: about nine ft wide twelve fift tall, bell shaped Nazi
Speaker 1: swastick like I said, before the story was picked up
Speaker 1: by a guy named Nick Cook. And we'll talk about
Speaker 1: in a few more more. Well, i'll talk I'll talk
Speaker 1: about it now. What the hell? Nick Cook used to
Speaker 1: be the aviation editor for Jane's Defense Weekly, and you
Speaker 1: got you guys have heard of James correct, of course? Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: they like to go to source for everything about war
Speaker 1: planes and warships and all that. Stuffy sitting here, suspiciously quiet. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and you've never heard of Jane's. Yeah, they I was
Speaker 1: I was just going, yeah, yeah, they are, like you know,
Speaker 1: you can think of Jane's is almost like a private
Speaker 1: intelligence service. I mean they gather a lot of information
Speaker 1: and they're very, very credible, and so they have If
Speaker 1: you go to Jans, you can find out everything you
Speaker 1: need to know about the defense forces of any country.
Speaker 1: They've got it all mapped out. They've got it intelligence
Speaker 1: on every every plane that these people have, every submarine,
Speaker 1: every ship, data collection for military information. And so we're
Speaker 1: saying that this guy is pretty credible, right, well, that
Speaker 1: that that gives them a little bit of an our respectability. Yeah,
Speaker 1: because this guy works Janes. Up until two thousand one,
Speaker 1: he was aviation editor for Jane and was like fired
Speaker 1: or I don't know exactly. Isn't like an outrage scandal
Speaker 1: that he left, not that I know of, But I
Speaker 1: have not actually investigated this guy's background too carefully, and
Speaker 1: it's like, I've got a job. Seems like that would
Speaker 1: have come up in any kind of reading, and it
Speaker 1: kind of took who by the way, I was fired
Speaker 1: for making stuff up? Yeah? Actually, yeah, and I did.
Speaker 1: I read a review of his book in Salon, and
Speaker 1: Salon was you know, they were a little unkind to
Speaker 1: the book. But I think that if if he had
Speaker 1: been like booted out of Change in Disgrace, it might
Speaker 1: have been mentioned. I think that's probably true. Yeah, I'll
Speaker 1: talk about that later. But anyway, So Nick Cook wrote
Speaker 1: a book and published it just a few years after
Speaker 1: igor Vitkowski published his book. So he was talking about
Speaker 1: anti gravity. It's called The Hunt for Zero Point. And
Speaker 1: this is Nick Cook, this is Nick Cook. So anyway,
Speaker 1: according to Nick Cook, this device contained two kind of
Speaker 1: rotating cylinders which would be filled with it a mercury
Speaker 1: like substance which was violent and color of some people
Speaker 1: who claimed that this is red mercury, which I don't
Speaker 1: I don't even quite understand what red mercury is. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it doesn't exist. It doesn't exist. Okay, red mercury is
Speaker 1: it real? Red mercury is not real. But anyway, we
Speaker 1: got back to this. According to what Nick Cook says,
Speaker 1: the metallic liquid was code named zero five and that's
Speaker 1: spelled x c R U M, and we're not used.
Speaker 1: Was stored in a therminus flask that was encased in lead,
Speaker 1: so apparently it was dangerous stuff. Additional substances using the
Speaker 1: experiments include thorium and brilliant peroxide. Brilliant peroxide also doesn't exist.
Speaker 1: There is such a thing as brilliant oxide, so maybe
Speaker 1: that was a type on his part. I'm not sure.
Speaker 1: You know, I've seen it referred to as peroxide on
Speaker 1: every article I came across on this, So either it's
Speaker 1: a lot of copying pasting by everybody on the internet,
Speaker 1: or they're calling it peroxide on purpose. Because I've seen
Speaker 1: it in different it's it's not always written the same,
Speaker 1: so I know it's not cop being directly, But I
Speaker 1: have seen it called peroxide a lot of time. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I've seen the number of references to it too, and
Speaker 1: in this whole Bell thing. But I think somebody originally
Speaker 1: confused peroxide with oxide. Brilliant oxide exists from brilliant peroxide
Speaker 1: does not exist as far as we know. As far
Speaker 1: as we know, yeah, might have made it. Yeah. Well,
Speaker 1: when I was I was looking at if they were
Speaker 1: talking about the berrillium and the thoramine. Is that thorium? Okay,
Speaker 1: thank you? They were both. Then they kept calling it
Speaker 1: peroxide because it was a gel like substance, and that
Speaker 1: seemed to be where everybody was getting the peroxide part
Speaker 1: is it was blah blah peroxide which is a gel
Speaker 1: like substance. I don't know how that relates because the
Speaker 1: science I couldn't quite follow it, but it seems that's
Speaker 1: where they were going with this peroxide thing. Right or wrong,
Speaker 1: it seems to be what they were doing. Brilliant peroxide
Speaker 1: doesn't exist. But billium is actually actually does have some use,
Speaker 1: isn't certain things? And and and actually somebody has put
Speaker 1: forth a theory for how barrillium could have been used
Speaker 1: in the Bell to generate pure weapons. Great, uh, uranium
Speaker 1: two thirty three and no there. But there are a
Speaker 1: bunch of peroxides, right, Yeah, there are other peroxides like
Speaker 1: moron and stuff like that, and hydrogen yeah, and hydrogen peroxide. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you're my favor. That's the only one I know science
Speaker 1: factor the day. Did you know that hydrogen peroxide is real?
Speaker 1: So anyway, maybe somebody was talking about hydrogen oxides somebody
Speaker 1: else read it and then and then confused it and
Speaker 1: got confused and hydrogen and then were auto corrected on them.
Speaker 1: And yeah, maybe it was that handwriting from note taking
Speaker 1: and of course you know they and they were they
Speaker 1: were like say, copy and pasted onto thousands of other
Speaker 1: conspiracy websites and next thing, you know, there we go. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So anyway, uh, well, back to the story of the bell. Supposedly,
Speaker 1: when it was activated, it had very strong radiation and
Speaker 1: supposedly it killed a bunch of scientists who are working
Speaker 1: on it because apparently when they first turned it on
Speaker 1: for the first time, they didn't realize they were gonna
Speaker 1: get fried. So uh. And also they had some test
Speaker 1: animal and and uh and plant subjects that also got
Speaker 1: toasted by this. And if I am I right, Joe,
Speaker 1: I mean, this is terrible, but I remember some account
Speaker 1: saying that the scientists who died at least one or
Speaker 1: two of them their skin literally melted off. I heard
Speaker 1: these stories. Yeah, yeah, so for everybody who doesn't know,
Speaker 1: because I actually started doing a little research because I
Speaker 1: was thinking, well, it's got to be you know, let's
Speaker 1: just look at standardrad can make a skin melt off,
Speaker 1: like their face melt off is the Ark of the
Speaker 1: Covenant from the documentary Raiders at the Lost Time. Anything
Speaker 1: above three thousand rads will burn your skins so badly
Speaker 1: and fastly that it could look like you're skin was melting. Yeah.
Speaker 1: There's only one problem with that is that anybody who
Speaker 1: witnessed that event would Yeah, I guess you have to
Speaker 1: be in a reactor, though nuclear reactor to get that
Speaker 1: kind of exposure. Base. It's the easiest way to do it,
Speaker 1: I guess, you know. I guess The problem for me
Speaker 1: isn't so much that like, Okay, it's conceivable that somebody
Speaker 1: came in after and was like, wow, their skin has
Speaker 1: melted off of the right that it doesn't doesn't necessarily
Speaker 1: have to be somebody witnessed it melting off of them.
Speaker 1: That's very true. But he turned it off. That's good.
Speaker 1: I mean, if it killed everybody that was close enough
Speaker 1: to like, haven't you seen the action movie where the
Speaker 1: hero dies and falls on the off switch and saves
Speaker 1: the world. That's what this guy did. Actually, No, actually,
Speaker 1: what happened is they were powering this thing via extension cord.
Speaker 1: The person in the next room where the screaming, and
Speaker 1: then he pulled the extension cord out of the the
Speaker 1: out of the outlet. Yeah, I saved the day. But okay, okay,
Speaker 1: I'm sure that's what happen. And there's something very much
Speaker 1: like that. Maybe you flipped a circuit breaker. Sweet. Yeah,
Speaker 1: supposedly the bell did require vast amounts of electricity to operate,
Speaker 1: and so nobody knows why that is. That's weird. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so it was like, I'm sorry, the usefulness of something
Speaker 1: goes down drastically when you have to actually like plug
Speaker 1: it in. Yeah, I mean, eventually, maybe, you know, maybe
Speaker 1: it becomes self sustain sustaining. Yeah, you know, I mean
Speaker 1: and and and maybe your initial version requires three million volts,
Speaker 1: you know, and stuff like that in massive amounts of current.
Speaker 1: But maybe eventually, with refining and research and experimentation, you
Speaker 1: can get it down to the to where you can
Speaker 1: actually put it on a battleship or a tank or something.
Speaker 1: Like her a plane, if this was a weapon. All
Speaker 1: of those things are things that I want to do
Speaker 1: with vast amounts of radiation. Yeah, well, but if you
Speaker 1: don't know what it's going to do, you don't know
Speaker 1: that that radiation is going to your crew. That's true. Yeah,
Speaker 1: there was. There was a lot of stuff that that
Speaker 1: we did back in like the forties and the fifties,
Speaker 1: as far as experimentation with bombs and radiation. We had
Speaker 1: no idea that it was going to like so many people,
Speaker 1: short and long term. You guys, I know, I'm pretty
Speaker 1: sure both of you've seen is the movie that was
Speaker 1: shot by I think their air Fish soldiers out in
Speaker 1: the desert watching a nuke go off in the air,
Speaker 1: standing there and laughing and joking and talking about it,
Speaker 1: and it's like a mile above them, so they're just
Speaker 1: bombarded with reading. It's it's really not easy to watch
Speaker 1: because they're just having a good time. Wow, that's so awesome,
Speaker 1: and you're just looking at it going you have no
Speaker 1: idea what is happening right now? Fred I think the
Speaker 1: most there was. There are a lot of different films
Speaker 1: from all the experiments that they did back in those
Speaker 1: days and the most horrible one that I ever saw,
Speaker 1: and it was truly awful. It was like they were
Speaker 1: experimenting with with protective suits for our troops protect them
Speaker 1: from the intense heat of a nearby nuclear blast. And
Speaker 1: it's like like I have a kind of tinfoil. So
Speaker 1: they they made up a bunch of little suits for
Speaker 1: for some pigs. No, I'm not gonna tell you anymore.
Speaker 1: It was. It was terrible. It's already yeah, it was
Speaker 1: bad anyway. So back back to Vitkowski. According to him,
Speaker 1: the bell was built, or at least was how used,
Speaker 1: in a German facility known as Theresa called which is
Speaker 1: known as the Giant. And it's actually it's not a
Speaker 1: single buility. It's like there's a like a valley in Silesia,
Speaker 1: which is in Poland, southern Poland, near the Czech border,
Speaker 1: about seventy miles east of the German border, and of
Speaker 1: course that was German territory during World War two, and
Speaker 1: they built this massive complex. It wasn't just one building,
Speaker 1: it was actually this valley had a lot of massive
Speaker 1: complexes and tunnels and all kinds of secret stuff going
Speaker 1: on in there. I just want to mention how uncreative
Speaker 1: the Germans were when naming things. Everything is the something, right, Oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's the giant, that's the bell, that's uh the well.
Speaker 1: Code names are like that, though an intelligence officer can
Speaker 1: only go so far before he gets really bored with
Speaker 1: just coming up with words. Oh, it's the osprey, it's
Speaker 1: the eagle. Eventually, lamp share table, project table, Yeah, project
Speaker 1: table is more interesting than the giants the giant. The
Speaker 1: giants kind of kind of got a cool edge to it.
Speaker 1: Let's go it's it's it's kind of intimidating. You heard
Speaker 1: that a giant was living in this valley, would you
Speaker 1: go down there? Hell? No, it's uh. Kaska also claimed
Speaker 1: that there was a massive concrete well not that massive,
Speaker 1: but and there's pictures of it on the internet if
Speaker 1: anybody cares to go look see. It's called the Hande
Speaker 1: And it's like it's a circular structure with vertical like
Speaker 1: vertical concrete supports and then it's like basically a concrete,
Speaker 1: steel reinforced I'm sure circle on the top of it.
Speaker 1: It looks like Stonehenge but made out of concrete. Yeah,
Speaker 1: made out of skinnier stoves to Okay, I get the
Speaker 1: name now. Yea, yeah, and so the yeah, he claimed
Speaker 1: that it was it served as a test rig where
Speaker 1: they could put the bell and experiment with anti gravity stuff.
Speaker 1: He's claiming that there's some anti gravity work involved here.
Speaker 1: But didn't people say that they also thought that that
Speaker 1: was probably just a cooling tower. Yeah, yeah, exactly the
Speaker 1: basis for a cooling tower. So yeah, and that's kind
Speaker 1: of what it looks like. So but that's what that's
Speaker 1: a that's a like a nuclear cooling tower, right, it
Speaker 1: doesn't look big enough. Nuclear cooling towers are pretty annorying.
Speaker 1: Well they're huge. So yeah, so I started to figure
Speaker 1: out what kind of cooling tower that would be for
Speaker 1: I mean, I mean, I mean, that's the thing about it.
Speaker 1: It's like, when you look at the pictures of it,
Speaker 1: you can't really get an idea of the scale. It
Speaker 1: looks too small to be the base of a nuclear
Speaker 1: cooling tower. But you know, the thing is with the
Speaker 1: nuclear cooling tower is that they've got a structure on
Speaker 1: top of their base, which kind of looks like the Henge.
Speaker 1: So it could have been. Yeah, you know, it's it's
Speaker 1: always hard to tell with surely there are pictures from
Speaker 1: the time somewhere. Yeah. Actually, you know what I think
Speaker 1: is um, I think it looks like the base for
Speaker 1: a water tank that would actually supply the water to
Speaker 1: a cooling tower. That yeah, because I don't I don't know.
Speaker 1: The Germans weren't that far in terms of nuclear technology
Speaker 1: as far as we know, so they wouldn't have a
Speaker 1: reason to use a cooling tower that for nukes. Well,
Speaker 1: I mean there's there's other there's other things that generate heat.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's like an other indust la industrial applications.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I think it could have been just an
Speaker 1: ordinary thing. Alternately, it was definitely a house for the bell.
Speaker 1: It could have been I mean, you know, to hold
Speaker 1: it down away, No, no no, just to like, how's it
Speaker 1: make a little pen for it? You know that's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it'd be tall enough. Right, they could test its floating capabilities,
Speaker 1: but not lose it out in the field somewhere banking
Speaker 1: hand curtains around the side so people couldn't spy in
Speaker 1: and see it was going on. It would be kind
Speaker 1: of funny and ironic if they take it out for
Speaker 1: the tat that the entire first gravity test they turn
Speaker 1: it on, it just goes never see it again. I
Speaker 1: guess we're gonna have to start over again. The better
Speaker 1: better still would be they turn it on and it
Speaker 1: slowly starts to rise, and it starts to rise, and
Speaker 1: it starts to rise, and then and then somebody says,
Speaker 1: do we know how to turn it off? And Uh,
Speaker 1: it's like a like a balloon, it just starts away.
Speaker 1: Uh no, it we made it self sustaining. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So anyway, so the anti gravity thing was pursued somewhat
Speaker 1: by by Nick Cook and also by Wokowski. Wakowski claims
Speaker 1: that the US government actually has been working on anti
Speaker 1: gravity devices for decades now and spending lots of money
Speaker 1: on it. Why wouldn't we? Yeah, well it's not a
Speaker 1: bad idea as not at all. Yeah, And the hunt
Speaker 1: for zero point. Zero point energy is the the energy
Speaker 1: state that a particle is in at its lowest state
Speaker 1: of energy, on its coldest and so apparently, and I
Speaker 1: don't understand the physics behind this or the math behind
Speaker 1: this at all, but apparently a particle at that point,
Speaker 1: if you can, if you can harness the energy possessed
Speaker 1: by that particle, then it's almost infinite. In other words,
Speaker 1: we would have a fantastic energy source. This is what
Speaker 1: although other other physicists have derived that derided, this is
Speaker 1: basically the equivalent of a perpetual motion machine. You know. Yeah,
Speaker 1: if you can find a way to get to release
Speaker 1: that energy, then you'll have all kinds of energy. But
Speaker 1: the energy required to release that energy will probably be more,
Speaker 1: in fact, almost certainly will be more than the energy
Speaker 1: to get back. It's kind of like nuclear fusion, same thing.
Speaker 1: That's our perpetual motion machine that we've been striving after
Speaker 1: for decades to spend two dollars to get a dollar. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So yeah, nuclear fusion we've we've totally achieved. I mean,
Speaker 1: and it's not that we can't do that. We can
Speaker 1: do that easily, but getting more energy out of the
Speaker 1: transaction than we put in that's a tough part. And
Speaker 1: we haven't figured that one out. When I was a kid,
Speaker 1: by today, we were supposed to all be it was
Speaker 1: our entire society was going to be powered by nuclear fusion.
Speaker 1: They were sure of it. And we're still about that
Speaker 1: far away. Yeah. Yeah, so when you're a kid again,
Speaker 1: it'll be there. Yeah, Hey, kids, when you're adults, it's
Speaker 1: going to be all fusion. Yeah, I remember, and Actually
Speaker 1: I wasn't around for this, but when nuclear power first
Speaker 1: came out, they said it would be the energy would
Speaker 1: be so cheap there would be no point to even
Speaker 1: charging people for electricity. And of course that didn't come
Speaker 1: about either. There was a lot of claims didn't really
Speaker 1: pay a lot of optimism. And yeah, I mean there
Speaker 1: was talk after after Hairoshima Nagasaki, there was there was
Speaker 1: some actually people's theorizing that we would it would be
Speaker 1: a fantastic money saver because we could dismantle our army
Speaker 1: because we just got we just have nukes. Every time
Speaker 1: something goes around with the world will lob a nuke
Speaker 1: adam and so there's no point in having a standing army, tanks,
Speaker 1: battleships or any of that stuff. Yeah, that never came
Speaker 1: about either, okay. Um, So the besides the anti grad
Speaker 1: any propulsion thing with that involved that big hands leg thing.
Speaker 1: There are the claims. There's been a number of authors
Speaker 1: that have come up with books about this thing, and
Speaker 1: one author says that the bell was so important to
Speaker 1: the Nazis that they killed sixty scientists who were working
Speaker 1: on the project and buried them in a mass grave.
Speaker 1: That doesn't really sound like Nazis mass Graves. Not at all, No,
Speaker 1: not at all. It's like, yes, well, mask mass Graves
Speaker 1: are kind of popular all around the world, frankly, yeah, unfortunately. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's a great way to advance your project though. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's so secret. We're gonna kill you. That's how important
Speaker 1: your work is to us. Yeah, we're gonna kill you.
Speaker 1: We value you so much. Yeah. Uh yeah, And there's
Speaker 1: another Another author claims that it contains red mercury, and
Speaker 1: red mercury is kind of this big box. Yeah, we
Speaker 1: talked about that already, but he said that it had
Speaker 1: when you put a concave mirror on the top of
Speaker 1: the device, it gave you the ability to see images
Speaker 1: from the past. So it was a time machine. Uh.
Speaker 1: Igor Btkowski said that the bell ended up in a
Speaker 1: South American country, and Nick claims it was taken to
Speaker 1: the US as part of the deal made with a
Speaker 1: general named Hans Kamler. So if this thing did exist,
Speaker 1: we don't know where it went. You and I don't. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this is the general public. Okay, Now, before I know that,
Speaker 1: we're about to get into theories. But before we get
Speaker 1: into that, what I'm curious about is when I did
Speaker 1: some of the research this bell. The Nazis moved it
Speaker 1: around a lot over the course of two years. And
Speaker 1: this things seems like it would be kind of a
Speaker 1: big deal to move around, and they moved it around.
Speaker 1: And I almost got the impression through some of the
Speaker 1: reading that they had more than one. Yeah, I've heard.
Speaker 1: I have heard that rumors of more than one also
Speaker 1: to three four of them. They figured they built the
Speaker 1: first one and then oh, we gotta go here, Well,
Speaker 1: let's just build a new one there. And rather than
Speaker 1: packing this thing over there, which seems I guess if
Speaker 1: it's not hard to make, that's okay. But it's again,
Speaker 1: they were doing strange things. They were shuffling the deck constantly,
Speaker 1: so who knows what was going on in the high command. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and this is one of those things too that we've
Speaker 1: talked about in the previous stories. Some of these stories
Speaker 1: grow in the telling. I remember right now, I know Wakowski.
Speaker 1: I only claimed that it was down in in the
Speaker 1: giant the valley with all the all the cool secret facilities.
Speaker 1: But then other people who have chimed in and said
Speaker 1: to no, no, it was it was housed in in
Speaker 1: this university and then went up being moved here and
Speaker 1: moved there, and it's like, okay, maybe, yeah, I guess
Speaker 1: you don't know where. Which is the true vein of truth? Yeah,
Speaker 1: the true vein of truth. Yeah. So anyway, so it
Speaker 1: let's let's talk about some theories. Sweet. Yeah, we've already
Speaker 1: talked about this a little bit. It was an anti
Speaker 1: gravity device that was claimed by Wadkowski and Cook that
Speaker 1: then they did and we're doing anti gravity experiments, which
Speaker 1: could have conceivably it produced a very powerful weapon for
Speaker 1: the war. I mean, I'm trying to I'm thinking, like,
Speaker 1: if you had a powerful enough antigravity device, you could
Speaker 1: build like a land battleship. Imagine the tank, but it
Speaker 1: doesn't need to actually like touch the land. It just
Speaker 1: floats over it. And it's like not the size of
Speaker 1: a tank, it's like the size of a small building. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that'd be kind of cool. And I know that some
Speaker 1: of the people that are supporting that it was for
Speaker 1: anti gravity, they point out that scientists that were and
Speaker 1: this is supposed, but scientists that were involved in the
Speaker 1: V two and the V one program, which is the
Speaker 1: Nazis rocket program, which they were the innovators, and they
Speaker 1: had the farthest reaching rockets at the time. Yeah, the
Speaker 1: same scientists were involved with the Bell, So they were thinking, well,
Speaker 1: if I can only get it so far propelled by fuel,
Speaker 1: what if I could just make the things float over there?
Speaker 1: And the conjecture was that they were doing it because
Speaker 1: they knew they couldn't use a rocket fuel based rocket
Speaker 1: to go all the way to say the States, Yeah,
Speaker 1: which was something that they were working on. If you
Speaker 1: had an anti gravity device that could go there, it
Speaker 1: would be much simpler, and you could do it with
Speaker 1: less fuel because it's just floating along on its own
Speaker 1: or rather than pushing its way through the atmosphere and
Speaker 1: fighting grab And I guess it wouldn't if it were
Speaker 1: something that was kind of big and heavy like the Bell.
Speaker 1: I think kind of it was right. You don't even
Speaker 1: need to put explosives really in it for it to
Speaker 1: have some kind of damaging effect. If you've got a
Speaker 1: thing that's going really fast that's really heavy, you can
Speaker 1: just barrel it through a bunch of stuff, right, or
Speaker 1: even like ships, you don't have to shoot missiles or
Speaker 1: anything like that. You just shoot your thing and it
Speaker 1: pokes a hole in it. And I was thinking more
Speaker 1: of it, Like it's it's just towing some kind of
Speaker 1: nuclear device or some kind of explosive device, and nuclear
Speaker 1: is the wrong word. Explosive device. Like you watch helicopters
Speaker 1: towing things and they're dragging it under their suspended beneath them.
Speaker 1: So if this thing could float on its own and
Speaker 1: then just carry and explosive and then just get over
Speaker 1: its target and drop it and keep going, theoretically that
Speaker 1: means you can come back to home and you can
Speaker 1: use it again. There's lots of lots of uses. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, they're all the fairies. Yeah. Well, and that's
Speaker 1: the thing that you know, in order to like not
Speaker 1: be knocked down by by the US fighters or whoever
Speaker 1: they were planning on attacking, they would have to be
Speaker 1: like above the atmosphere. So that's essentially have to be
Speaker 1: a spaceship. But you know, I mean the Nazis were
Speaker 1: way ahead of us in many other regards, so they
Speaker 1: could have done that too. Mostly, you know, it's shocking
Speaker 1: how far you can get when you don't really care
Speaker 1: about morals and people. Yeah, yeah, it's true. But yeah,
Speaker 1: that was We're gonna we're gonna get We're gonna talk
Speaker 1: about some of those people, by the way, before we're
Speaker 1: done here. Yeah, Now, so the anti gravity thing, even
Speaker 1: though it's and and and Cook spent a lot of
Speaker 1: time in his book talking about not just the bill,
Speaker 1: but talking about the U. S. Government in general investigating
Speaker 1: the whole anti gravity thing. They're like, he claims that
Speaker 1: they've been doing it a lot. He thinks that they
Speaker 1: have the bill. He thinks that they've been spending a
Speaker 1: lot of money on anti gravity research, which you know,
Speaker 1: actually wouldn't really surprise me because actually it's something we
Speaker 1: should be trying to understand. If it's possible to understand
Speaker 1: how to make gravity waves, how to how to block
Speaker 1: gravity waves, that would be pretty useful technology. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: thank thankfully, we haven't had any suggestions, nor do I
Speaker 1: think we have any interest in ever tackling like Rawswell
Speaker 1: or anything like that. But I do know that a
Speaker 1: lot of the kind of more modern, more believable theories
Speaker 1: about Roswell, an Area fifty one and things like that
Speaker 1: are that people see these things that they identify as
Speaker 1: unidentified flying objects because the U. S. Military is testing
Speaker 1: these new kind of propulsion systems or anti gravity or
Speaker 1: anything like that, or even stuff that's not even that
Speaker 1: out of this world, like the Stealth Fighter, which they
Speaker 1: definitely were there. Yeah, and they kept that under wraps
Speaker 1: for a long time, and supposedly the CEI IS admitted
Speaker 1: that they actually they actually stirred the pot with UFO
Speaker 1: stories for a while just so that people spotted one
Speaker 1: of our experimental craft flying around they would be dismissed
Speaker 1: as kooks. Yeah. I think you know that's a that's
Speaker 1: a strong possibility and play it is, and it wouldn't.
Speaker 1: It would not shock me at all if that was
Speaker 1: something that we were working on it, I you know,
Speaker 1: have a problem with them working on that or keeping
Speaker 1: it secret. Honestly, it would be. It would be an
Speaker 1: extremely powerful technology if anybody could actually do it. But
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't know that we understand gravity well
Speaker 1: enough at this point to really create an anti gravity machine. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I don't think we do. Yeah, I could if we
Speaker 1: figure it out in this day and age. We're gonna
Speaker 1: it's going to be an accident. Yeah, We're going to
Speaker 1: stumble upon something and go WHOA, and we want to
Speaker 1: understand will know how to do it kind of, but
Speaker 1: we will know how to do it, right, Yeah, absolutely, yeah.
Speaker 1: But yeah, so I think that as far as as
Speaker 1: far as like you know, grabbing the Nazi bell and
Speaker 1: trying to build rebuild a Nazi bell, I think the
Speaker 1: better better to just fund theoretical research by scientists and
Speaker 1: the gravity and the nature thereof and all that stuff.
Speaker 1: We need to understand gravity a little bit better, and
Speaker 1: that's probably a good way to Yeah, okay, So anyway,
Speaker 1: there's always and I mentioned previously also there was a
Speaker 1: time machine time travel machine theory, and this is like
Speaker 1: that didn't allow you to go back and forward in time,
Speaker 1: but you could see backward in time, which would be
Speaker 1: kind of cool, I guess. But I've always thought that
Speaker 1: that's the least one of the least useful time travel technology,
Speaker 1: the ability to see into our past, right, because okay,
Speaker 1: so I can understand seeing into our future or traveling
Speaker 1: into our past, but seeing the past is kind of like, no,
Speaker 1: we I mean we saw that already. Yeah, maybe not
Speaker 1: all of the useful for murder investigations and things like that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I was gonna say, let's let's put this into context.
Speaker 1: So somebody reports a detractor is what you would were
Speaker 1: called when you got reported to the s S was
Speaker 1: that the correct word detractor. What do they call when
Speaker 1: somebody would would out you, it's oh, he's an enemy
Speaker 1: of the state, him record, they would disappear you anyway.
Speaker 1: The would people would say, oh, you know, and I
Speaker 1: don't like Joe, I'm going to report him the s
Speaker 1: S and then Joe would disappear because I had reported
Speaker 1: that he did something. So think about this. You are
Speaker 1: wondering if high high level official is maybe not as
Speaker 1: loyal as you think he is, that might be feeding information.
Speaker 1: It would actually be really informative and useful to be
Speaker 1: able to if you could control the thing, focus on
Speaker 1: that guy and say, you know, I know that in
Speaker 1: this time frame of let's say two months, he did
Speaker 1: some kind of off stuff. So let's just watch what
Speaker 1: he did and see if he did anything that wasn't right.
Speaker 1: And then we we have proof and we don't need
Speaker 1: to prove in a court law. We just know that
Speaker 1: we're right. The question is is could you know? I mean,
Speaker 1: it's tough enough to see in the past, but say
Speaker 1: you're you're there, and you're you're there in your secret
Speaker 1: factory and you're looking into the past, I would think
Speaker 1: you'd only be able to see it in the past
Speaker 1: and your location. Well now now you're now you're putting
Speaker 1: parameters on it. We don't know what this thing could do.
Speaker 1: I'm what if I could, you know, maybe you could
Speaker 1: to go to any locations past, maybe you can you
Speaker 1: know where, whenever and wherever I want it. I gotta
Speaker 1: say I'm impressed with those Nazis, because yeah, that's pretty
Speaker 1: amazing me too. And I also don't have the sense.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm not, by any means a Nazi historian.
Speaker 1: I don't know a whole lot about this kind of
Speaker 1: time in history or anything like that. But the impression
Speaker 1: that I have is not overwhelmingly that Nazis cared about
Speaker 1: individual life. I mean, I think that's kind of the
Speaker 1: idea of like communism is like for the greater good, right,
Speaker 1: so like you know, carring like a high level ranking officer, right,
Speaker 1: But nine times out of ten, like if I go
Speaker 1: report Joe and he gets disappeared, I don't have the
Speaker 1: impression and they're gonna be like, all right, we're gonna
Speaker 1: turn on the machine and look into the past and
Speaker 1: see if you actually did this thing. More than they're
Speaker 1: just going to be like, wow, a bullets super cheap. Yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: but but no, no, no, no no. I First, first
Speaker 1: of all, I mean the Nazis were socialists, so there
Speaker 1: they you know, I mean, so they thought that what
Speaker 1: they were doing is for the greater good too, just
Speaker 1: like the Communists did. And so you know, but but
Speaker 1: it's like it's like it always seems to be the
Speaker 1: way with comedies and socialists is that you know, it's
Speaker 1: always well, you can't make an omelet without breaking a
Speaker 1: few eggs, exactly what I'm saying. Yeah, so they get
Speaker 1: crushed underfoot. But nonetheless, you know, even even the Nazi Germany,
Speaker 1: even though like they're they're a heartless bunch, they still
Speaker 1: can't kill everybody. You can. For example, found out, like
Speaker 1: you know, that the murdering his entire officer corps in
Speaker 1: the army didn't really serve them. Well, you know, in
Speaker 1: World War Two, it's like, you know, it's like all
Speaker 1: the competent people that could actually like you know, save
Speaker 1: my country from the invaders, well I had to executed
Speaker 1: or sent to the goolak oops. Sure, right. And of course,
Speaker 1: you know, if that was a big thing, if that's
Speaker 1: what we're saying it was used for, is to like
Speaker 1: exonerate higher ranking all board. I am on board. It
Speaker 1: would be a great spine tool as well. I want
Speaker 1: to see what the President of the United States was doing.
Speaker 1: And let's say I just tuned it into two minutes
Speaker 1: ago for him and just watches it. So I've got
Speaker 1: a two minute delay on what the President of the
Speaker 1: United States conversation. All right, I'm on board. Now it's
Speaker 1: a cool idea. Now, I remember when I was a kid,
Speaker 1: I used to read more a lot more sci fi
Speaker 1: than I do today. And Isaac aske him off throw
Speaker 1: the story that was about this machine that this guy
Speaker 1: built that could look into the past. He could look
Speaker 1: you know, you could look into the past and and
Speaker 1: and anywhere and just and it was really really cool.
Speaker 1: And but the thing about it is is that like
Speaker 1: every time somebody came up with this technology, government agents
Speaker 1: would shut would show up and take it away. And
Speaker 1: so this guy, like he had these government agents after him,
Speaker 1: so he just takes it, takes this and he basically
Speaker 1: puts the whole thing out in public, you know, he publishes,
Speaker 1: publishes everything about it, so that anybody can build one
Speaker 1: of these things. And then and then the government agents
Speaker 1: say and just say you know, you can look a
Speaker 1: hundred years into the past, or you can look two
Speaker 1: minutes into the past. What you've just done is you've
Speaker 1: just destroyed everybody's privacy. Welcome to the future whole. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and so it was it was kind of a kind
Speaker 1: of a nice twist on the stage. Yeah, what a
Speaker 1: boso Yeah yeah, so anyway, yeah, yeah, yeah for for
Speaker 1: a kind of a silly little theory. Another theory put
Speaker 1: out there is that it was a heavy particle accelerator.
Speaker 1: It was there. They were using it to create bomb
Speaker 1: grade or excuse me, weapons grade you two thirty three,
Speaker 1: that's uranium. Yeah. So, uh so apparently there's, uh, there's
Speaker 1: people that have claimed that it has some sort of
Speaker 1: special acceleration process there. There are these small particle accelerators
Speaker 1: that are called cyclotrons that that's kind of if you
Speaker 1: want to don't want to have a linear accelerator, it's
Speaker 1: like half a mile long, you can use a cyclatron
Speaker 1: on which moves a particle in a spiral outward from
Speaker 1: the center and it builds up speed and then you
Speaker 1: can like you know, smash particles in other particles and
Speaker 1: chief fusion or fission or whatever it is. You're trying
Speaker 1: to do among these The theory is that they were
Speaker 1: trying to create, trying to convert thorium two thirty two
Speaker 1: into uranium two thirty three. I don't know what any
Speaker 1: of those things mean. Yeah, well is this me being
Speaker 1: an idiot, This is me being a This is complex,
Speaker 1: this complex chemistry. Yeah. I think the simple version is
Speaker 1: they were trying to take what was the first one again,
Speaker 1: Joe thorium two thirty two thorium, and they were trying
Speaker 1: to create uranium, which is then uh, weapons create, correct,
Speaker 1: So they were trying to turn it into weapons grade uranium.
Speaker 1: And if this thing was a particle accelerator. Again, this
Speaker 1: is my understanding of the science, and I'm not a
Speaker 1: mathematician or a scientist, but it has some and do
Speaker 1: with spinning at that velocity you break off. I can't
Speaker 1: remember if it's a I think it's electrons, yea electrons,
Speaker 1: electron nuclei. Yeah, and so they combine and slam together
Speaker 1: and then form a new element like the large hand
Speaker 1: client that's exactly correct. Yeah, well yeah, I think that
Speaker 1: that specifically what what is vaporized mercury spins in the
Speaker 1: magnetic field and electron has become excited, uh and disassociate.
Speaker 1: When they were timing nuclei, they swirl around rapidly in
Speaker 1: this in a sort of plasma inside this and as
Speaker 1: a as a hit protons, they emit X rays. This
Speaker 1: is I have no idea. I'm not a physicist, but
Speaker 1: this is the way I've heard it described as the
Speaker 1: theoretical way that the Bell could have worked. So that
Speaker 1: would explain the people white people died because exactly, yeah,
Speaker 1: so it generates X rays and then and then the
Speaker 1: X rays when you when the X rays hit brilliant brilliant. Supposedly,
Speaker 1: that's what's called donating. It donates neutrons, and so yeah, exactly,
Speaker 1: he's gonna done it. So essentially I need a deduction
Speaker 1: on my taxes going to donate an electron. No, I
Speaker 1: think I think b willium is very generous, A big
Speaker 1: fun of it. So anyway, So anyway, so apparently under
Speaker 1: the series they were trying to they were trying to
Speaker 1: use fusion to create basically add protons and two and
Speaker 1: neutrons to rate two to transform it to uranium two thirty.
Speaker 1: This isn't a better way to generate weapons. Get great. Supposedly,
Speaker 1: I guess they were looking for a simpler way, looking
Speaker 1: for a quick to reach your shortcut to create you
Speaker 1: two thirty or maybe even in the field to create it. Well,
Speaker 1: there's no point in creating in the field though. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but yeah, you created and then you just like squirt
Speaker 1: gun it the other guys and then they're like, oh,
Speaker 1: the X rays or yeah, super soaker party. Ever No, well,
Speaker 1: so anyway, they have a heavy particle accelerator. Is probably
Speaker 1: one of the more credible theories that you know. Certainly
Speaker 1: it beats and I think it beats the time machine
Speaker 1: by a little bit. Yeah, it's the anti gravity device,
Speaker 1: but not quite so much, but also by a little bit.
Speaker 1: But there's a fourth theory. What's that? It was a bell? Oh,
Speaker 1: please tell me the uses of the Nazi bell that
Speaker 1: rings calls people to church, you know, Yeah, that's the
Speaker 1: Nazi bell. So yeah, so you guys, you guys have
Speaker 1: been doing a little independent research on this yourselves, I assume. Yeah,
Speaker 1: have you come up with any other any other credible
Speaker 1: theories for this? I mean I would say that my
Speaker 1: only other credible theory is that it's a made up thing.
Speaker 1: It doesn't actually exist. Well, we'll talk about that talking
Speaker 1: about let's talk about it. Yeah. The origins, of course
Speaker 1: was Polish author Igor with Kowski, as we talked about earlier,
Speaker 1: wrote The Truth about the Wounder WAFA. Yeah, and it
Speaker 1: got wider play when Nick Cook published his book The
Speaker 1: Hunt for Zero Points a couple of years later, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: and he probably sourced a lot of his information, if
Speaker 1: not froll of it from from Kowski. Yeah. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: he says he found incredible and believable. So I've got
Speaker 1: named Kirk Kleiner Roatar review of The Hunt for Zero
Speaker 1: Point and uh and here's what he had to say
Speaker 1: about Cook's reliance on with Kowski. That's a little bit scathing.
Speaker 1: It's like, you know, in a settle sort of way.
Speaker 1: So why does Cook believe with Kowsky? I'm quoting now
Speaker 1: the Kowsky had been recommended to me by polar sources.
Speaker 1: Now in quoting Nick Cook, do my work at James
Speaker 1: as someone who's both highly knowledgeable and reliable. Had Wikowski
Speaker 1: been in any way a lightweight, I would have turned
Speaker 1: around and got on the first plane home. But when
Speaker 1: I saw him, I knew he was okay unquote, just
Speaker 1: as shaking are most of Cook's conclusions. So anyway, so
Speaker 1: quoting from he just keeps going, I'm going I wanted
Speaker 1: a big review, and yeah I don't, I don't want to,
Speaker 1: but yeah I kind of kind of ripped on Cook
Speaker 1: just a little bit. Uh, And yeah, you guys should
Speaker 1: read read the review's kind of fun. But so he
Speaker 1: relied very heavily on Wkowski's story. I don't know, and
Speaker 1: he claims that he was able to go because he
Speaker 1: spent a lot of he supposed to supposedly kind of
Speaker 1: an expert on black programs, and black programs being the
Speaker 1: stuff that's in the black budget, the stuff that's hidden
Speaker 1: in the budget that you don't know about, things like
Speaker 1: the stealth bomber for example, the stealth fighter. So he
Speaker 1: claims that by by looking at our black budgets and stuff,
Speaker 1: he's be able to find huge gaping holes where he
Speaker 1: can infer lots of anti gravity research and maybe you know,
Speaker 1: monkying with the bells going on, but there's a lot
Speaker 1: of the big extrapolations going on there. He doesn't actually
Speaker 1: have access to that much information about that stuff. And
Speaker 1: so he realized on guys like Yvonne igor Wadkowski. So
Speaker 1: anyway back to Wakowski's he's got us. There's a little
Speaker 1: problem with this story, which is Jacob Spornberg, who was
Speaker 1: who was indeed a German high ranking German s S. Soldier,
Speaker 1: But and that, and of course it was Jacob Swarburgh
Speaker 1: was the guy that Polish Intelligence ppposedly interrogated and and
Speaker 1: made a transcript of the interrogation. And then what Kowski
Speaker 1: got to read that they talked about the Bell So
Speaker 1: he's he was. He was a soldier, he wasn't a scientist.
Speaker 1: He spent he spent most of the war fighting partisans
Speaker 1: in bell Belarus and in Poland, and eventually wound up
Speaker 1: in Norway, where he was captured by the British. Let
Speaker 1: me throw up a map real quick like here. Well,
Speaker 1: first of all, down here this is this is the
Speaker 1: giant the valley where all that all that secret stuff
Speaker 1: is going on in those vast complexes on the border
Speaker 1: of the Republican on the of the Czech Republic and
Speaker 1: not too far east of Germany. Spormberg was initially stationed
Speaker 1: in Minsk in Belarus, which is I don't know, eight
Speaker 1: hundred to a thousand miles northeast there, and eventually he
Speaker 1: was stationed in Lublin, Poland, which is several hundred miles
Speaker 1: to the east of where the bell would have been,
Speaker 1: and then after that wound up in Norway. It doesn't
Speaker 1: appear to me from his biography anyway, unless unless they cleverly,
Speaker 1: cleverly cut some stuff out. Number one, it didn't appear
Speaker 1: that he physically got anywhere close to the bell. And
Speaker 1: also there's no particular reason why he would have been,
Speaker 1: because he was a soldiery and basically kind of you know,
Speaker 1: there never reason to be there. I had no reason
Speaker 1: to be there really. Or two, and if he if
Speaker 1: he was staying down there for any reason, it's not
Speaker 1: like somebody's gonna take him aside and say, hey, check
Speaker 1: out this really cool anti gravity thing we're working on. Well,
Speaker 1: you could be another soldier trying to impress me. Buddy,
Speaker 1: You're not gonna believe what I found. But you know
Speaker 1: what it kind of sounds like to me, is you know,
Speaker 1: if you couldn't tell I've never been to war, I've
Speaker 1: never been a soldier, But I have the impression that
Speaker 1: there's a lot of like kind of b sen and
Speaker 1: like storytelling, almost like campfire storytelling, particularly if you're like
Speaker 1: in the trenches of an awful war like, and you know,
Speaker 1: it's just it's human nature to kind of like make
Speaker 1: up these stories. And often you want to make up
Speaker 1: stories about this awesome new technology that you have, the
Speaker 1: you are fighting for have that's going to help you
Speaker 1: in a war. And so me, you know, it's totally possible.
Speaker 1: This guy heard somebody who was like, oh man, you
Speaker 1: know what I saw recently, or like this scientist dude
Speaker 1: told me they have been working on It was just
Speaker 1: kind of a campfire story. But he got captured and
Speaker 1: interrogated and he was like, Okay, I'm just gonna tell
Speaker 1: you everything that might be anything, and it's just kind
Speaker 1: of spiraled out of control. Does that even seem plausible?
Speaker 1: I mean, let's let's talk about that for a second.
Speaker 1: So by the time the polls interrogated him, he had
Speaker 1: to have known he was going to be hung for
Speaker 1: for his war crimes, because this guy committed some serious
Speaker 1: war crimes, biggest among them operational harvest festival in Poland,
Speaker 1: which involved they rounded up. They were having troubles. They're
Speaker 1: not just having troubles with the local Jews. They were
Speaker 1: they were like, you know, rising up. And then you know,
Speaker 1: because the Jews basically being kept in slave labor camps,
Speaker 1: and so there were rebellions and all kinds of stuff,
Speaker 1: all kinds of trouble, all kinds of trouble with them,
Speaker 1: and so they finally decided to just killed them all.
Speaker 1: And so Operation Harvest Festival was they had all these
Speaker 1: all these slaves come out and dig quote unquote tank trenches,
Speaker 1: defensive tank trenches, and so that's what they basically got
Speaker 1: to dig their own mass grave. And then yeah, over
Speaker 1: a period of a couple of days, they slaughtered them
Speaker 1: all and then buried them. There we're talking a serious,
Speaker 1: seriously huge, heinous war crime. So, like I said, he
Speaker 1: wound up being stationed in Norway where he was captured
Speaker 1: by the British. After interrogation, they decided to send Sender
Speaker 1: to London for further interrogation regarding his war crimes, and
Speaker 1: he was eventually extradited after the war to Poland and
Speaker 1: he was executed by the Polish in nineteen e sees
Speaker 1: me by the Poles in nineteen fifty two. So it's
Speaker 1: unlikely that he would be trying to trade information for
Speaker 1: well precisely, yeah, because there's no point he knows he's
Speaker 1: going to get shot or strong up or something. Well,
Speaker 1: people are inherently trying to stay alive as long as possible,
Speaker 1: and it's pretty it's it's kind of well known fact
Speaker 1: that if I'm in custody, I might as well just
Speaker 1: start telling you everything I can, because as long as
Speaker 1: I'm talking, you've got a reason to keep me right. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: it took me a second to make that connection of
Speaker 1: but I also just you know, turned a name into
Speaker 1: an adverber. But yeah, you keep talking, keep giving them
Speaker 1: even if your jaws pulling it out of your backside.
Speaker 1: You just keep talking and telling them stuff because I
Speaker 1: just keep writing it down and going with it. And yeah,
Speaker 1: maybe I mean I you know, I think that would
Speaker 1: have bought him about an extra five minutes, but not
Speaker 1: really worth it. And and he had a credibility problem there,
Speaker 1: and that you know, he was he was basically his
Speaker 1: job was just to like, you know, repress people and
Speaker 1: slaughter Jews and stuff like that, and so it has
Speaker 1: no credibility when comes talking about secret scientific things. So anyway,
Speaker 1: that's why I don't think that Kowski's story is really credible,
Speaker 1: because I don't see how Spoortingberg could have been involved
Speaker 1: in anything any sort of scientific project. I don't see why.
Speaker 1: He seems like we've got a pretty good record of
Speaker 1: what he was doing. Yeah, and I don't see why
Speaker 1: he would have spent any time and interrogation talking about
Speaker 1: some secret Nazi bell thing. It doesn't make any sense
Speaker 1: to me. That could have happened. I mean, you never know.
Speaker 1: I mean, they might have drugged him, and it might
Speaker 1: be by this point in time he was he's been
Speaker 1: spending He's spent years in cells and an interrogation rooms
Speaker 1: and everything like that. Maybe he was out of his mind.
Speaker 1: I mean, maybe you know, solitary does awful things to
Speaker 1: people and they just want to say, don't say anything,
Speaker 1: you know. So anyway back to let's talk about Nick
Speaker 1: Cook for a second. Um, he seems a little credulous,
Speaker 1: you know, and he seems like a credible person because
Speaker 1: he worked for Jame's Defense Weekly and now even even
Speaker 1: like since then, he submits articles as a contributor to
Speaker 1: Financial Times, Wall Street Journal. You know, not not a
Speaker 1: not a raving loon or anything like that. But he
Speaker 1: seems a bit credulous. I came across an interview of
Speaker 1: him in the Atlantic and from ways back and he's
Speaker 1: queered about a guy named John Hutchison, and he spends
Speaker 1: some time talking about Hutchesson, and he thinks this stuff
Speaker 1: is interesting and credible and true. But how just said,
Speaker 1: if you do a little Internet searching on the guy,
Speaker 1: he's a total crank who has claimed that he created
Speaker 1: a zero gravity field and and he's been able to
Speaker 1: transmit metal steel to lead things like that, and uh
Speaker 1: what else. He says he's created a battery that has
Speaker 1: almost infinite power. He's made all these claims. He can't
Speaker 1: replicate any of these claims, and so he's he's universally
Speaker 1: accepted as just alluded to crank. So basically what you're
Speaker 1: getting at is that Cook kind of buys in easily,
Speaker 1: maybe not the right people. He's yeah, kind of yeah yeah.
Speaker 1: Also in his book he talks about Hans Kammler. We
Speaker 1: talked about that a little earlier than he said that.
Speaker 1: He said that Hans Kammler had had arranged arranged for
Speaker 1: clamming see from the Allies for by trading them a
Speaker 1: lot of valuable technology scientific research. That's how the bell
Speaker 1: supposedly came to the Kammler written moved the bell to
Speaker 1: a safe spot a hidden spot and then negotiated with
Speaker 1: with the US and said, hey, I've got this incredible WOUNDERWAFFA,
Speaker 1: you know, this anti gravity time machine device, and you know,
Speaker 1: if you guys will and this guy was also a
Speaker 1: war criminal, and so if you guys will forgive my sins,
Speaker 1: I'll tell you where it is. And yeah, and so
Speaker 1: that is what Cook claims. But I did a little
Speaker 1: research on haunts Kammler's biography, and he was a civil
Speaker 1: engineer and he built a lot of things, including including
Speaker 1: concentration camps. He designed and build like for example, some
Speaker 1: of the some of the crematoriums where they gassed all
Speaker 1: the Jews. I mean, yeah, he was it was involved
Speaker 1: in a lot of stuff like that. He was a
Speaker 1: competent engineer, and he rose in power and eventually wound
Speaker 1: up being in charge of not just he was essentially
Speaker 1: was he was charged with building a V two rocket
Speaker 1: production facility, and then eventually he wound up being put
Speaker 1: in charge of actually running the facility and producing V
Speaker 1: two rockets, which were by the way, produced with slave labor.
Speaker 1: For the reasons, he was very effective at it because
Speaker 1: he was ruthless and he didn't really care about working
Speaker 1: people to death and things like that, and later on
Speaker 1: he got put in charge of aircraft. Also, Cook claims
Speaker 1: that that Hants Kammler was in charge of all of
Speaker 1: their secret weapons programs, but that's not true. That's an exaggeration.
Speaker 1: He was in charge of rocket production and apparently aircraft production,
Speaker 1: but that's about it. He was a civil engineer. He
Speaker 1: wasn't a scientist. But Cook claims that he was in
Speaker 1: charge of all these super secret programs and that therefore
Speaker 1: he was the guy that could have traded these to
Speaker 1: the Allies. But no, so we're saying he's not super credible. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so yeah, I would say he is not credible, and
Speaker 1: so in snce, he's the guy who actually popularized his theory.
Speaker 1: I mean, igor Igorotkowski is the guy who first put
Speaker 1: it out there in the public square. But Cook is
Speaker 1: the guy who actually sold all more books on this
Speaker 1: whole thing. Yeah, it seems to me like Cook is
Speaker 1: a bit of a crank after all. It's like hard
Speaker 1: to believe, but apparently so that's kind of the end
Speaker 1: of our theories. Uh yeah, well that's that's not a
Speaker 1: theory about the about that. Yeah, yeah, that's that's that's
Speaker 1: kind of the end of at least my researching least
Speaker 1: because the only information we have on this thing is
Speaker 1: from Vikkowski and then through Nick Cook, through Nick Cook Wittskowsky,
Speaker 1: I don't see that Nick Cook has been able to
Speaker 1: uncover anymore about the bell. About the bell he's conjectured
Speaker 1: about about Hans Kambler, but none of that is credible.
Speaker 1: Hans Kambler didn't have access, wouldn't have had access to
Speaker 1: the bell. So is where did the bell go? Is
Speaker 1: it's like buried somewhere still in Czechoslovakia? Is it in America?
Speaker 1: Is it in the South American country? Well? I think
Speaker 1: it never existed. Personally, Kevin, I think that um Joe
Speaker 1: has been fairly persuasive and that the evidence is strong
Speaker 1: that perhaps it never existed. But you guys know me,
Speaker 1: so I'm gonna say you could look back in time
Speaker 1: with it, even though I think that's useless technology. I personally,
Speaker 1: the though I don't get it, I am swayed by
Speaker 1: the amount of science that has written about the bell.
Speaker 1: I also don't know that it really existed, but people
Speaker 1: have theorized a lot of stuff, and it seems to
Speaker 1: have some credible science behind it. Which is pretty interesting.
Speaker 1: And I also like the time thing, but I I
Speaker 1: have also seen that it was a time machine, and
Speaker 1: I kind of like that theory, and we're not I
Speaker 1: don't want to take go into it a whole lot here,
Speaker 1: But have you heard the theory that time is one
Speaker 1: giant loaf of bread In every moment it is a slice,
Speaker 1: That time is a circle? No, No, that it's a
Speaker 1: loaf of bread, and that you can you can if
Speaker 1: you go back, you're going back to the previous slice
Speaker 1: if you look it up, and you actually, I think
Speaker 1: if you just google time is a loaf of bread
Speaker 1: or a slice of bread, you can find this theory
Speaker 1: because it's really kind of heard about, simple and interesting,
Speaker 1: and I like that idea. I think it's kind of slick.
Speaker 1: I also don't think the thing is real. Time is
Speaker 1: just an endless circle. Time is a piece of topes. No,
Speaker 1: I am making a listener call out name that reference
Speaker 1: time is an endless circle circle. Okay, yeah, there's another
Speaker 1: theory that And actually it's credible that time is actually
Speaker 1: doesn't actually really will it exists, but it's just a
Speaker 1: way for us to sort out reality. Yeah yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: let's just just want to take a second. It's like
Speaker 1: time essentially. What happens, what's going on is that everything
Speaker 1: is happening all at once. What happened yesterday, what's happening
Speaker 1: right now, what's happening to, what's going to happen tomorrow,
Speaker 1: All happened at the same time. Time is just our
Speaker 1: way of our mental const mental contiving the world around us,
Speaker 1: telling you this is another show. Yeah, okay, we will
Speaker 1: do this, all right, we'll talk about this at the time. Yeah,
Speaker 1: So anyway, at the time and the time machine, that's exciting,
Speaker 1: fun stuff. The thing about it is is like the
Speaker 1: stuff that's been spun, like you're talking about this, some
Speaker 1: of the theories that have been spun about how it
Speaker 1: could have been used to create uranium two thirties three
Speaker 1: and stuff like that is and and I've seen some
Speaker 1: very elaborate depictions of the internal setup of this thing
Speaker 1: and how it all worked. Well, And you sent me
Speaker 1: something about how in two thousand one somebody claimed to
Speaker 1: have recreated a scale version of the bell. Yeah, exactly exactly.
Speaker 1: And it's like zoo died gravitational fields or I don't
Speaker 1: remember what it was, but yeah, and it's like and
Speaker 1: It's interesting because against Sportingberg was the only source of
Speaker 1: information for this thing. Uh and Sparinberg did exist, but
Speaker 1: he's been dead since nineteen fifty two. So he describes
Speaker 1: this thing and describes basically as a box and says, well,
Speaker 1: you know, it's capable of doing the US and then
Speaker 1: somebody in two thousand and one, based on that, goes
Speaker 1: out and creates a replica of it. It's like, really,
Speaker 1: how does you manage to do that? I could see
Speaker 1: if you stumbled across some plans and you knew precisely
Speaker 1: what it was supposed to do, and you had an
Speaker 1: idea of how it worked and everything, you could do that.
Speaker 1: But Sparinberg had didn't have a clue if he really existed,
Speaker 1: he had no clue how it worked or even precisely
Speaker 1: what it did. I have a new theory. The bell
Speaker 1: was actually a field shower that works yet in it
Speaker 1: and it would spiral water up and heat it up
Speaker 1: and just shower it down you and you have privacy,
Speaker 1: so that Hitler could It was a mobile shower. It
Speaker 1: was a mobile spaw. It was the mobile spa. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we just mistranslated the German. It's badly badly recorded. That's
Speaker 1: what it is. It's actually Dave Fear's spaw. Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: my new theory. You know, if you look at it,
Speaker 1: actually almost looks like a space cap, so like they
Speaker 1: you know, like like like uh, you know, maybe they
Speaker 1: were working at space caps. So maybe they were going
Speaker 1: to put a man in orbit. They were going to
Speaker 1: replace the Liberty Bell. Yeah, maybe that's what it was.
Speaker 1: When they finally invaded America. There it is. That would
Speaker 1: have been actually a cool prank, you know, sneak and sneaking,
Speaker 1: and one day Americans get up and there's this bell
Speaker 1: with a swastick on the side of it in Philadelphia.
Speaker 1: I think that's I think that's what they were. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they were totally gonna punk us. Okay, so that's about it.
Speaker 1: We've talked about this long enough, so if you want
Speaker 1: to learn more, we'll have some links up on our website,
Speaker 1: which is as always Thinking Sideways podcast dot com, and
Speaker 1: if you want to find us on iTunes, we're out
Speaker 1: there too. If you do find us, please stop to
Speaker 1: give us a comment and a rating. We would really
Speaker 1: appreciate that. You can also find us on Stitcher if
Speaker 1: you don't want to go through that whole iTunes thing.
Speaker 1: Also know it's so so much and RS you could
Speaker 1: find us and like us and friend us on Facebook.
Speaker 1: We are on Facebook and set us an email at
Speaker 1: Thinking Sideways Podcast at gmail dot com. Well that's about it.
Speaker 1: If you guys have any comments about us, like, we
Speaker 1: would totally love to get an email from you about
Speaker 1: the Nazi Bell. And if you are the Nazi Bell,
Speaker 1: please send us an email. Would so you know, I
Speaker 1: think we're gonna have to do some deciphering because I
Speaker 1: don't know if the Nazi Bell has hands. Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: kind of hard. He's gonna tap, He's gonna use the
Speaker 1: top of his face. Yeah, we'll have to use Google Translate.
Speaker 1: If if you're if you're a Nazi war criminal who
Speaker 1: was involved in this, we would love to love to
Speaker 1: hear from you. If your skin was melted off by
Speaker 1: the radiation from the Nazi Bell. Absolutely. So that's about
Speaker 1: it for this week's so tata everybody talk to you
Speaker 1: next week. Guys. I'm pretty sure it was aliens, no,
Speaker 1: no doubt.