1 00:00:02,520 --> 00:00:10,119 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. You're listening to the 2 00:00:10,119 --> 00:00:13,880 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch us live weekdays at 3 00:00:13,920 --> 00:00:17,119 Speaker 1: noon and five pm Eastern on Apple, Cocklay and Android 4 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:20,520 Speaker 1: Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. Listen on demand wherever 5 00:00:20,600 --> 00:00:24,160 Speaker 1: you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube. 6 00:00:25,480 --> 00:00:28,880 Speaker 2: Tyler Kendall here in Washington alongside Joe Matthew and the 7 00:00:28,880 --> 00:00:34,600 Speaker 2: federal government is reopened after the longest shutdown in US history. Now, 8 00:00:34,720 --> 00:00:38,000 Speaker 2: this is a funding package that includes a stopgap measure, 9 00:00:38,040 --> 00:00:40,800 Speaker 2: which means that we are funding partially the government through 10 00:00:40,880 --> 00:00:43,839 Speaker 2: January thirtieth. Some key agencies will be funded through the 11 00:00:43,840 --> 00:00:47,320 Speaker 2: fiscal year, like the USDA. So theoretically the question of 12 00:00:47,360 --> 00:00:50,800 Speaker 2: snap benefits should be off the table for the next negotiation. 13 00:00:51,040 --> 00:00:53,080 Speaker 2: But we do have our eyes on the next negotiation 14 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:55,680 Speaker 2: because this deal does not address that core demand that 15 00:00:55,720 --> 00:01:00,280 Speaker 2: we saw from Democrats when it comes to expanding the 16 00:01:00,480 --> 00:01:03,520 Speaker 2: expiring Affordable Care Act premium subsidies. 17 00:01:03,560 --> 00:01:04,760 Speaker 3: Looking for an extension there. 18 00:01:04,959 --> 00:01:07,039 Speaker 2: We heard from President Trump last night who put the 19 00:01:07,080 --> 00:01:10,520 Speaker 2: blame squarely on Democrats, as Democrats themselves have been saying 20 00:01:10,840 --> 00:01:13,279 Speaker 2: that they did this to fight for the American people. 21 00:01:14,360 --> 00:01:19,360 Speaker 4: With my signature, the federal government will now resume normal operations. 22 00:01:19,400 --> 00:01:21,280 Speaker 5: How to do it? The hardware, and they look very bad, 23 00:01:21,360 --> 00:01:22,200 Speaker 5: the Democrats do. 24 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:25,840 Speaker 4: I just want to tell the American people you should 25 00:01:25,880 --> 00:01:28,240 Speaker 4: not forget this when we come up to midterms and 26 00:01:28,280 --> 00:01:30,600 Speaker 4: other things. Don't forget what they've done to our country. 27 00:01:30,640 --> 00:01:33,360 Speaker 4: We'll work on something having to do with healthcare. We 28 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:35,680 Speaker 4: can do a lot better. We can do great. 29 00:01:37,720 --> 00:01:39,880 Speaker 6: Brown ten thirty last night in the Oval Office, and 30 00:01:39,880 --> 00:01:41,600 Speaker 6: a big round of applause for the President as he 31 00:01:41,680 --> 00:01:45,160 Speaker 6: put the sharpie to paper. And we start with what's 32 00:01:45,200 --> 00:01:47,840 Speaker 6: going on ahead of our conversation with Congressman Brad Sherman, 33 00:01:47,880 --> 00:01:49,480 Speaker 6: the Democrat from California. 34 00:01:49,520 --> 00:01:50,960 Speaker 5: It will be with us in just a moment. 35 00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:54,280 Speaker 6: We start with Laura Davison, our deputy Washington Bureau Chief, 36 00:01:54,600 --> 00:01:57,120 Speaker 6: here at the table. Laura, this is seen as a 37 00:01:57,120 --> 00:01:59,080 Speaker 6: good moment for the president, at least he was casting 38 00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:01,200 Speaker 6: it as a good moment of victory. 39 00:02:01,240 --> 00:02:04,080 Speaker 5: He called it. Did anyone actually win here? No one 40 00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:04,760 Speaker 5: actually want. 41 00:02:04,880 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 7: In fact, a lot of people lost in terms of 42 00:02:06,560 --> 00:02:09,760 Speaker 7: federal workers who went without pay and stat benefit recipients. 43 00:02:10,200 --> 00:02:14,080 Speaker 7: From a political angle, Republicans came out ahead. They didn't 44 00:02:14,120 --> 00:02:17,040 Speaker 7: have to make any concessions. They sort of staked their territory, 45 00:02:17,080 --> 00:02:20,079 Speaker 7: and it was ultimately a handful of Democrats and moderate 46 00:02:20,120 --> 00:02:22,120 Speaker 7: Democrats in the Senate who said, look, we just want 47 00:02:22,120 --> 00:02:23,480 Speaker 7: to get this over with and move on to the 48 00:02:23,520 --> 00:02:27,239 Speaker 7: next fight, which will theoretically be this Affordable Care Act subsidy, 49 00:02:27,600 --> 00:02:29,560 Speaker 7: though it's unclear, you know, if they're going to actually 50 00:02:29,600 --> 00:02:32,520 Speaker 7: achieve what they're looking for here to get those premium 51 00:02:32,520 --> 00:02:34,480 Speaker 7: tax credits renewed before the end of the year. 52 00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:37,520 Speaker 2: Have we gotten any update from the administration on when 53 00:02:37,639 --> 00:02:40,280 Speaker 2: Americans could see relief. You mentioned the food benefits, but 54 00:02:40,400 --> 00:02:43,040 Speaker 2: also what about our air travel system, because we know 55 00:02:43,120 --> 00:02:46,280 Speaker 2: that that has caused thousands of delays and cancelations across 56 00:02:46,320 --> 00:02:46,800 Speaker 2: the country. 57 00:02:46,919 --> 00:02:49,040 Speaker 7: We're looking about at about a week for things to 58 00:02:49,080 --> 00:02:52,240 Speaker 7: return to normal, so and the Secretary Duffy said air 59 00:02:52,240 --> 00:02:54,280 Speaker 7: travel will take about a week. That puts it right 60 00:02:54,280 --> 00:02:57,280 Speaker 7: before the Thanksgiving holiday when air travel gets really busy. Also, 61 00:02:57,320 --> 00:03:00,200 Speaker 7: for people expecting snap benefits, there's only two processors in 62 00:03:00,200 --> 00:03:02,480 Speaker 7: the entire country that do all fifty states, so there 63 00:03:02,480 --> 00:03:04,400 Speaker 7: could be a backlog there as everyone is trying to 64 00:03:04,400 --> 00:03:06,720 Speaker 7: get those up and running, you know, today and through 65 00:03:06,720 --> 00:03:09,120 Speaker 7: the weekend. Federal workers who are waiting for their paychecks, 66 00:03:09,280 --> 00:03:12,600 Speaker 7: they can start should start receiving money as soon as Saturday, 67 00:03:12,639 --> 00:03:15,600 Speaker 7: but it may take again until next Wednesday. There's also 68 00:03:15,639 --> 00:03:17,880 Speaker 7: going to be a higher withholding rate, so that they 69 00:03:17,919 --> 00:03:20,959 Speaker 7: may have to wait. Their paychecks may be smaller than anticipated, 70 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:22,720 Speaker 7: and they'll get that in a refund next year. So 71 00:03:22,760 --> 00:03:25,360 Speaker 7: there's not you know, this is not no one is 72 00:03:25,400 --> 00:03:27,720 Speaker 7: held completely harmless here. There are you know, some latent 73 00:03:27,760 --> 00:03:28,800 Speaker 7: effects that will continue. 74 00:03:28,840 --> 00:03:32,400 Speaker 6: Wow, remarkable, So all right, everybody comes back next week 75 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:35,200 Speaker 6: with new vigor. I guess there's going to be a 76 00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:37,480 Speaker 6: debate over healthcare, but we still don't have a plan 77 00:03:38,040 --> 00:03:40,480 Speaker 6: from Republicans, right, so this starts as a debate over 78 00:03:40,520 --> 00:03:44,360 Speaker 6: extending Obamacare subsidies or are we starting from scratch because 79 00:03:44,360 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 6: we're hearing from Republicans that Obamacare simply makes healthcare less 80 00:03:48,640 --> 00:03:51,960 Speaker 6: affordable and they like the President's idea of sending money 81 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:53,000 Speaker 6: directly to people. 82 00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:55,120 Speaker 7: This is really going to be a political mess. You 83 00:03:55,120 --> 00:03:57,520 Speaker 7: have Democrats who don't even know exactly what they're asking is. 84 00:03:57,560 --> 00:03:59,240 Speaker 7: You know, they will kind of get the first move 85 00:03:59,280 --> 00:04:01,360 Speaker 7: in the Senate to to put some bill forward, but 86 00:04:01,400 --> 00:04:03,520 Speaker 7: in the House and with the President. You have them 87 00:04:03,520 --> 00:04:05,360 Speaker 7: talking about, you know, doing some sort of repeal and 88 00:04:05,400 --> 00:04:08,400 Speaker 7: replace thing when it comes to affordable Carrick and you 89 00:04:08,440 --> 00:04:10,840 Speaker 7: know didn't go so well the last time. You even 90 00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 7: heard Trump in the Oval office last night saying, you know, 91 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:15,440 Speaker 7: he doesn't want to have these insurance subsidies go to 92 00:04:15,480 --> 00:04:18,600 Speaker 7: insurance companies. He wants them to go to people directly 93 00:04:18,640 --> 00:04:20,560 Speaker 7: and then they can buy insurance. It's unclear who they 94 00:04:20,600 --> 00:04:23,520 Speaker 7: would buy insurance from, if not from a health insurance company. 95 00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:25,760 Speaker 7: So there's a lot of sort of conceptual questions that 96 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:28,320 Speaker 7: haven't even been answered, much less to this brass tax 97 00:04:28,400 --> 00:04:29,920 Speaker 7: of what is the bill and how does it move forward? 98 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:32,000 Speaker 2: So that's healthcare, which is going to be an issue, 99 00:04:32,000 --> 00:04:34,880 Speaker 2: But what about what funding the government? Is actually about 100 00:04:34,960 --> 00:04:37,720 Speaker 2: the spending levels for the rest of the fiscal year, 101 00:04:37,800 --> 00:04:41,800 Speaker 2: because this minibus will fund some agencies through the rest 102 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:43,760 Speaker 2: of the fiscal year, but it leaves a lot an 103 00:04:43,760 --> 00:04:47,880 Speaker 2: open question and it sounds like Senate Republicans and House 104 00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:50,320 Speaker 2: Republicans aren't really on the same page when it comes 105 00:04:50,360 --> 00:04:52,560 Speaker 2: to the sort of spending levels that we could see 106 00:04:52,560 --> 00:04:53,080 Speaker 2: going forward. 107 00:04:53,160 --> 00:04:56,360 Speaker 3: Could that cause a shutdown? On January thirtieth? It absolutely could. 108 00:04:56,400 --> 00:04:58,320 Speaker 7: Basically, the way they structured this bill is they gave 109 00:04:58,320 --> 00:05:01,599 Speaker 7: themselves until January thirtieth to through all these additional funding 110 00:05:01,640 --> 00:05:04,400 Speaker 7: bills through the government. You know, they said, Okay, look, 111 00:05:04,400 --> 00:05:05,920 Speaker 7: we have a couple months, but remember there's a lot 112 00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:07,479 Speaker 7: that happens between now and then. They're going to be 113 00:05:07,640 --> 00:05:10,640 Speaker 7: out for the Thanksgiving holiday, out for Christmas. Then suddenly 114 00:05:10,720 --> 00:05:12,479 Speaker 7: they will be back, and that deadline will be bearing 115 00:05:12,520 --> 00:05:15,400 Speaker 7: down on both chambers of Congress again to get all 116 00:05:15,480 --> 00:05:18,359 Speaker 7: of this work done. And emotions are not going to 117 00:05:18,400 --> 00:05:20,160 Speaker 7: be in a great place. There will probably be some 118 00:05:20,560 --> 00:05:22,840 Speaker 7: tension over this healthcare fight. There may be tension over 119 00:05:22,920 --> 00:05:25,520 Speaker 7: you know, whatever new political crisis comes up within the 120 00:05:25,560 --> 00:05:27,800 Speaker 7: next couple months. So we should not expect that things 121 00:05:27,839 --> 00:05:29,960 Speaker 7: will be smooth sailing come the end of January. People 122 00:05:30,000 --> 00:05:31,400 Speaker 7: should definitely keep their calendars open. 123 00:05:31,480 --> 00:05:32,599 Speaker 5: Oh my god. Okay. 124 00:05:32,680 --> 00:05:35,480 Speaker 6: In the meantime, then, when we start considering the idea 125 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:39,400 Speaker 6: of regular order that would require a lot more work 126 00:05:39,440 --> 00:05:42,479 Speaker 6: to actually get all twelve spending bills together, do we 127 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:44,840 Speaker 6: potentially see another cr I mean, how serious are we 128 00:05:44,880 --> 00:05:47,559 Speaker 6: about regular order? Because that hasn't actually taken place in 129 00:05:47,600 --> 00:05:48,240 Speaker 6: a generation. 130 00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:49,920 Speaker 7: I feel very safe to say that we are not 131 00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:53,680 Speaker 7: serious about regular order in the US Congress. It could 132 00:05:53,720 --> 00:05:55,920 Speaker 7: be another situation like we've seen here of a minibus, 133 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:57,839 Speaker 7: you know, a couple of those bills packaged together with 134 00:05:57,880 --> 00:06:00,520 Speaker 7: another CR and there's just an iterative process to get 135 00:06:00,520 --> 00:06:03,440 Speaker 7: this done. Or it could just be a straight blanket CR. 136 00:06:03,920 --> 00:06:05,679 Speaker 7: Democrats are going to have to figure out their strategy. 137 00:06:05,720 --> 00:06:07,160 Speaker 7: You know, do they do they try to force a 138 00:06:07,200 --> 00:06:08,839 Speaker 7: shut down or play a game of chicken again, or 139 00:06:08,880 --> 00:06:11,200 Speaker 7: do they just say, look, we need to get this resolved. 140 00:06:11,400 --> 00:06:14,159 Speaker 7: The political calculations for both sides will be different. In January, 141 00:06:14,160 --> 00:06:16,840 Speaker 7: you're just that much closer to the midterms. And so 142 00:06:17,200 --> 00:06:19,799 Speaker 7: those are the things Democrats are also hoping that Republicans 143 00:06:19,839 --> 00:06:22,200 Speaker 7: are feeling pressure from this healthcare fight if there isn't 144 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:23,640 Speaker 7: a resolution by the end of the year, that they're 145 00:06:23,680 --> 00:06:26,159 Speaker 7: suddenly you know, they're hearing from their constituents. You know, 146 00:06:26,160 --> 00:06:30,040 Speaker 7: ACA subsidies, you know, tend more towards Republican states than 147 00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:34,400 Speaker 7: Democratic ones. So there's there's definitely not no political risk 148 00:06:34,440 --> 00:06:35,280 Speaker 7: there for Republicans. 149 00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:37,599 Speaker 2: All right, well, we may have the chance to pose 150 00:06:37,680 --> 00:06:39,920 Speaker 2: that question to a Democrat coming up here in bounds 151 00:06:39,920 --> 00:06:42,440 Speaker 2: of power. Laura Davison, Deputy Bureau Chief here in our 152 00:06:42,480 --> 00:06:45,240 Speaker 2: Washington Bureau. Thank you as always, and for more. We 153 00:06:45,279 --> 00:06:48,040 Speaker 2: turn now to Congressman Brad Sherman. He's a Democrat representing 154 00:06:48,080 --> 00:06:51,120 Speaker 2: California's thirty second district. He joins us live now from 155 00:06:51,160 --> 00:06:53,800 Speaker 2: Capitol Hill. Congressman, thanks so much for joining us here 156 00:06:54,120 --> 00:06:56,760 Speaker 2: on Bloomberg. I just want to start with big picture, 157 00:06:56,920 --> 00:07:01,599 Speaker 2: get your perspective here first. What did demos achieve now 158 00:07:01,600 --> 00:07:05,720 Speaker 2: that the government's reopened, Well. 159 00:07:05,560 --> 00:07:10,080 Speaker 8: At very least, we raised the awareness that we're about 160 00:07:10,120 --> 00:07:15,320 Speaker 8: to see a doubling of these premiums for twenty four 161 00:07:15,400 --> 00:07:19,280 Speaker 8: million Americans. Hopefully people will be calling the White House 162 00:07:19,760 --> 00:07:24,760 Speaker 8: and demanding that we fund those premium subsidies the same 163 00:07:24,760 --> 00:07:28,240 Speaker 8: way we have for the last several years, and hopefully 164 00:07:28,280 --> 00:07:32,360 Speaker 8: the President will get the message. Instead, what he's doing 165 00:07:32,840 --> 00:07:36,920 Speaker 8: is he's throwing out just to distract people, the idea, well, 166 00:07:37,120 --> 00:07:39,840 Speaker 8: maybe you'll get the money and some of you'll get 167 00:07:39,880 --> 00:07:43,440 Speaker 8: the healthcare too. If he had a particular proposal, that 168 00:07:43,520 --> 00:07:46,720 Speaker 8: would be fine. But since he came down that escalator, 169 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:50,119 Speaker 8: he's been saying he's going to replace Obamacare with something 170 00:07:50,200 --> 00:07:52,280 Speaker 8: much much better, and he'll tell you next week what 171 00:07:52,360 --> 00:07:55,960 Speaker 8: it is, and his objective is to destroy Obamacare and 172 00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:56,800 Speaker 8: replace it with nothing. 173 00:07:58,240 --> 00:08:02,800 Speaker 6: Wow, Congressman, I've appreciate your joining us and staying in 174 00:08:02,840 --> 00:08:03,240 Speaker 6: town here. 175 00:08:03,280 --> 00:08:04,720 Speaker 5: I know a lot of folks have already left. 176 00:08:04,720 --> 00:08:07,840 Speaker 6: I'm just wondering if you think this was worth it. 177 00:08:07,880 --> 00:08:09,600 Speaker 5: Did Democrats in the Senate. 178 00:08:09,760 --> 00:08:12,760 Speaker 6: Cross over too early because we kept hearing that a 179 00:08:12,760 --> 00:08:14,800 Speaker 6: promise of a vote was not enough, And it looks 180 00:08:14,840 --> 00:08:16,840 Speaker 6: like there is no promise in the House. 181 00:08:18,000 --> 00:08:20,680 Speaker 8: The promise of a vote is illusory. Even if they 182 00:08:20,720 --> 00:08:23,520 Speaker 8: were to voted on the Senate, it probably wouldn't pass 183 00:08:23,560 --> 00:08:26,200 Speaker 8: because Republicans would vote against it. Even if it passes Senate, 184 00:08:26,560 --> 00:08:29,080 Speaker 8: it would be shredded as soon as Mike Johnson, the 185 00:08:29,080 --> 00:08:32,160 Speaker 8: House Speaker, got his hands on it. So that's an 186 00:08:32,160 --> 00:08:35,120 Speaker 8: illusory promise. What we really need is to bring down 187 00:08:35,200 --> 00:08:38,679 Speaker 8: the cost of the overall health care system, and that requires, 188 00:08:38,880 --> 00:08:41,840 Speaker 8: I think, adopting Medicare for all. We've just got a 189 00:08:41,920 --> 00:08:45,040 Speaker 8: crazy and complicated and very expensive system in this country. 190 00:08:45,320 --> 00:08:48,040 Speaker 8: Medicare for all is the way to make it sane. Also, 191 00:08:48,040 --> 00:08:50,800 Speaker 8: I'll be introducing a bill later this month or early 192 00:08:50,840 --> 00:08:55,880 Speaker 8: next month to regulate all pharmaceutical prices. The same way 193 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:57,920 Speaker 8: we regulate electric prices. 194 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:03,400 Speaker 2: Preciate you bringing up some tangible policy solutions we could 195 00:09:04,120 --> 00:09:08,000 Speaker 2: see to help lower costs for Americans when it comes 196 00:09:08,040 --> 00:09:11,760 Speaker 2: to healthcare, because we've heard Republicans say that just extending 197 00:09:11,800 --> 00:09:14,520 Speaker 2: the Affordable Care Act premium subsidies would be putting a 198 00:09:14,559 --> 00:09:17,760 Speaker 2: subsidy on top of subsidies. That's often the talking point 199 00:09:17,800 --> 00:09:20,440 Speaker 2: that we hear. But I'm wondering, do we need to 200 00:09:20,440 --> 00:09:23,520 Speaker 2: see an extension first when it comes to these tax 201 00:09:23,559 --> 00:09:26,040 Speaker 2: credits in order for there to be time down the 202 00:09:26,160 --> 00:09:29,800 Speaker 2: road to negotiate on a fuller deal like you might 203 00:09:29,840 --> 00:09:30,720 Speaker 2: be outlining here. 204 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:36,920 Speaker 8: Look, President Trump, he keeps talking about abolishing Obamacare and 205 00:09:36,920 --> 00:09:39,480 Speaker 8: replacing it with something even better, and he won't re 206 00:09:39,520 --> 00:09:44,040 Speaker 8: propose anything progressive Democrats have. We call it Medicare for All, 207 00:09:44,960 --> 00:09:48,800 Speaker 8: but that's not a solution to the problem that we have. 208 00:09:49,000 --> 00:09:52,320 Speaker 8: In the next six weeks, those premiums are going to double. 209 00:09:52,679 --> 00:09:56,760 Speaker 8: We need those subsidies restored. And if millions of people 210 00:09:56,760 --> 00:09:58,920 Speaker 8: will call the White House and say that it'll. 211 00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:04,000 Speaker 6: Happen Medicare for all, Congressmen, you're bringing us back to 212 00:10:04,080 --> 00:10:06,320 Speaker 6: two thousand and eight, two thousand and nine. If Barack 213 00:10:06,360 --> 00:10:07,880 Speaker 6: Obama could not get that done. 214 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:11,120 Speaker 5: How do you do it with this Congress? Well, we. 215 00:10:13,240 --> 00:10:18,120 Speaker 8: Tried Obamacare. It's work, I think reasonably well. Republicans think 216 00:10:18,160 --> 00:10:21,040 Speaker 8: it needs to be repealed and replaced. They don't have 217 00:10:21,559 --> 00:10:26,000 Speaker 8: a proposal. We do, and I think that as and 218 00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:30,240 Speaker 8: more attention is paid to our healthcare system, we'll realize 219 00:10:30,360 --> 00:10:33,480 Speaker 8: that we are by far not the healthiest of the 220 00:10:33,559 --> 00:10:36,400 Speaker 8: rich countries in the world, but we pay usually about 221 00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:41,040 Speaker 8: double for healthcare what other advanced countries do. A system 222 00:10:41,160 --> 00:10:44,520 Speaker 8: of covering everyone makes sense and would be a lot 223 00:10:44,559 --> 00:10:45,280 Speaker 8: less expensive. 224 00:10:47,080 --> 00:10:50,280 Speaker 2: Have you gotten any indications from Republicans that this is 225 00:10:50,320 --> 00:10:53,640 Speaker 2: something that they would negotiate on. Have any talks been 226 00:10:53,640 --> 00:10:56,040 Speaker 2: happening on Capitol Hill. I realize you've only been back 227 00:10:56,080 --> 00:10:58,199 Speaker 2: for one day, but it is clear that this has 228 00:10:58,280 --> 00:11:01,720 Speaker 2: been the issue that we've been teeing up for a 229 00:11:01,760 --> 00:11:04,040 Speaker 2: conversation on this entire shutdown. 230 00:11:05,280 --> 00:11:08,040 Speaker 8: There are a few Republicans that want to restore the 231 00:11:08,080 --> 00:11:12,640 Speaker 8: Obamacare subsidies, more in the Senate perhaps than in the House. 232 00:11:13,400 --> 00:11:17,320 Speaker 8: But Republican leadership, I think, is going to try to 233 00:11:17,360 --> 00:11:22,480 Speaker 8: do either nothing or do just a little bit so 234 00:11:22,520 --> 00:11:27,000 Speaker 8: they can say they did something. But they're hell bent 235 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:32,120 Speaker 8: on even increasing the tax cuts for the very wealthy, 236 00:11:32,520 --> 00:11:35,920 Speaker 8: and they know they can't do that without gutting programs 237 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:37,600 Speaker 8: like Obamacare. 238 00:11:38,920 --> 00:11:41,240 Speaker 6: I want to ask you about the discharge petition that 239 00:11:41,280 --> 00:11:43,720 Speaker 6: we now understand will get a vote next week to 240 00:11:43,760 --> 00:11:47,440 Speaker 6: release the Epstein files. We spoke yesterday with Rocana and 241 00:11:47,600 --> 00:11:50,960 Speaker 6: with Tim Burchett about their efforts here to get the 242 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:56,120 Speaker 6: files out, and I'm wondering if you're prepared for that vote, 243 00:11:56,120 --> 00:11:58,480 Speaker 6: and if that's as far as we go, Congressman, it 244 00:11:58,480 --> 00:12:00,760 Speaker 6: doesn't appear to have support in the Senate. The President 245 00:12:00,760 --> 00:12:03,640 Speaker 6: would have to sign it, right. Is the Oversight Committee 246 00:12:03,640 --> 00:12:06,120 Speaker 6: the best venue for these documents? 247 00:12:06,160 --> 00:12:08,360 Speaker 8: Well, the best venue is the floor of the House, 248 00:12:08,760 --> 00:12:12,000 Speaker 8: and we will be voting on that next month. But 249 00:12:12,080 --> 00:12:14,800 Speaker 8: it's going to take a lot of political pressure to 250 00:12:14,880 --> 00:12:17,280 Speaker 8: get the Senate to vote on it. The reason for 251 00:12:17,320 --> 00:12:20,720 Speaker 8: that is that in the House you have a dispart 252 00:12:20,880 --> 00:12:24,920 Speaker 8: charge petition process, so two hundred and eighteen members can sign, 253 00:12:25,240 --> 00:12:28,000 Speaker 8: and a few Republicans joined us. In the Senate, it 254 00:12:28,000 --> 00:12:31,160 Speaker 8: would take a lot of pressure on thun because there 255 00:12:31,240 --> 00:12:35,520 Speaker 8: is no discharge petition process, there's only popular will. 256 00:12:35,720 --> 00:12:38,440 Speaker 2: But is there any indication that that pressure is building 257 00:12:38,520 --> 00:12:42,280 Speaker 2: or is this going to be a futile exercise if 258 00:12:42,559 --> 00:12:44,880 Speaker 2: ultimately these documents don't get released. 259 00:12:46,240 --> 00:12:49,960 Speaker 8: I think that this is the issue that will not die, 260 00:12:50,440 --> 00:12:54,679 Speaker 8: and that eventually the public will demand the release of 261 00:12:54,720 --> 00:12:57,040 Speaker 8: the files. You see the release of some of those 262 00:12:57,080 --> 00:13:00,439 Speaker 8: files just this week. We're going to continue to have that, 263 00:13:00,800 --> 00:13:04,800 Speaker 8: and ultimately the president is going to have to explain 264 00:13:05,280 --> 00:13:09,640 Speaker 8: what his relationship with Epstein was and why he is 265 00:13:09,640 --> 00:13:13,160 Speaker 8: so opposed to releasing the documents. 266 00:13:13,440 --> 00:13:15,479 Speaker 6: You know, you step back from all of this, Congressman, 267 00:13:15,520 --> 00:13:17,680 Speaker 6: I just wonder how you're feeling today. We've been talking 268 00:13:17,679 --> 00:13:20,439 Speaker 6: with Democrats and Republicans over the past forty eight hours 269 00:13:20,440 --> 00:13:23,200 Speaker 6: and in fact, over this entire shutdown, and now that 270 00:13:23,240 --> 00:13:26,640 Speaker 6: we've actually got the government back open, everybody seems to 271 00:13:26,679 --> 00:13:29,240 Speaker 6: have some kind of a hangover, in a bad mood. 272 00:13:29,280 --> 00:13:31,600 Speaker 6: There's a lot of concern about the healthcare debate coming, 273 00:13:31,640 --> 00:13:34,600 Speaker 6: whether we shut down again in January, what the President's 274 00:13:34,640 --> 00:13:37,680 Speaker 6: going to do next, where the leadership is on everything 275 00:13:37,720 --> 00:13:40,360 Speaker 6: that we've been talking about. How would you describe this 276 00:13:40,520 --> 00:13:41,800 Speaker 6: political moment that we're in. 277 00:13:43,200 --> 00:13:46,560 Speaker 8: This country is more divided than it's been since the 278 00:13:46,559 --> 00:13:53,600 Speaker 8: eighteen sixties, and hopefully there'll be more people who say, 279 00:13:53,720 --> 00:13:56,120 Speaker 8: I know I want this or I want that, but 280 00:13:56,200 --> 00:14:00,480 Speaker 8: what I really want is a compromise that that gives 281 00:14:00,520 --> 00:14:03,520 Speaker 8: the other side something as well. I haven't seen that 282 00:14:04,120 --> 00:14:06,680 Speaker 8: from either side of the political spectrum, and all the 283 00:14:06,720 --> 00:14:09,400 Speaker 8: polls are telling and a lot of the problem is 284 00:14:09,400 --> 00:14:13,520 Speaker 8: your phone, which is programmed to give you opinions that's 285 00:14:13,640 --> 00:14:15,480 Speaker 8: push you in the direction. 286 00:14:15,200 --> 00:14:18,080 Speaker 5: You're already in. And I wish I had a solution 287 00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:18,400 Speaker 5: to that. 288 00:14:19,560 --> 00:14:23,560 Speaker 8: But hopefully people are getting more of a reasonable and 289 00:14:23,640 --> 00:14:25,200 Speaker 8: centrist view here on Bloomberg. 290 00:14:26,200 --> 00:14:29,000 Speaker 6: So throw your phone on the water tiler, if only 291 00:14:29,280 --> 00:14:30,720 Speaker 6: absolutely watch Bloomberg. 292 00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:31,680 Speaker 5: Throw away your phone. 293 00:14:31,840 --> 00:14:36,920 Speaker 3: Yep, Oh, well that's the political stakes. Perhaps. 294 00:14:37,000 --> 00:14:39,160 Speaker 2: I also wanted to pull on your expertise on the 295 00:14:39,160 --> 00:14:42,600 Speaker 2: House Financial Services Committee and asked about the economic stakes 296 00:14:42,640 --> 00:14:45,200 Speaker 2: here because the NEC director Kevin Hasset today said that 297 00:14:45,240 --> 00:14:47,800 Speaker 2: we may not get the unemployment rate for October if 298 00:14:47,880 --> 00:14:49,000 Speaker 2: hindsight's twenty twenty. 299 00:14:49,040 --> 00:14:50,680 Speaker 3: We're talking about the stakes right now. 300 00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:52,280 Speaker 2: Do you think in a different world we should have 301 00:14:52,280 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 2: deemed data essential so that we could have accurate forecasts 302 00:14:55,720 --> 00:14:56,480 Speaker 2: for the economy. 303 00:14:57,480 --> 00:15:02,040 Speaker 8: Absolutely, I think that what the Bureau of Labor Statistics 304 00:15:02,080 --> 00:15:05,200 Speaker 8: does is essential, and I know it's been derided by 305 00:15:05,480 --> 00:15:11,160 Speaker 8: this administration, but the fact is that you talk to people, 306 00:15:11,440 --> 00:15:17,000 Speaker 8: they think there's inflation. The statisticians have shown us there's inflation. 307 00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:19,520 Speaker 8: The only guy who doesn't see inflation is Donald Trump. 308 00:15:21,000 --> 00:15:22,320 Speaker 5: It's good to have you back with us. 309 00:15:22,360 --> 00:15:25,000 Speaker 6: Congressman safe travels getting home Brad Sherman, the Democrat from 310 00:15:25,040 --> 00:15:27,640 Speaker 6: California with us on Bloomberg TV and Radio and Tyler 311 00:15:27,720 --> 00:15:30,400 Speaker 6: really does give you a sense of that kind of 312 00:15:30,400 --> 00:15:33,360 Speaker 6: feeling of despair right now ahead of the holidays and 313 00:15:33,400 --> 00:15:34,680 Speaker 6: before this debate begins. 314 00:15:34,840 --> 00:15:37,520 Speaker 2: And lack of trust really, Joe, which is something that 315 00:15:37,600 --> 00:15:39,680 Speaker 2: both sides of the aisle have told us about, but 316 00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:41,960 Speaker 2: it seems really poigtant on the Democrats end. 317 00:15:42,160 --> 00:15:44,320 Speaker 6: Stay with us on Balance of Power. We'll have much 318 00:15:44,360 --> 00:15:45,560 Speaker 6: more coming up after this. 319 00:15:50,920 --> 00:15:54,400 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch 320 00:15:54,480 --> 00:15:57,440 Speaker 1: us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on 321 00:15:57,600 --> 00:16:00,840 Speaker 1: Alma Coarcley and Android Otto with the bloom Ark Business Up. 322 00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:04,240 Speaker 1: Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch 323 00:16:04,360 --> 00:16:05,920 Speaker 1: us live on YouTube. 324 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:10,600 Speaker 6: How about this Yesterday, the US Treasurer Brandon Beach presiding 325 00:16:10,640 --> 00:16:14,200 Speaker 6: over the stamping of the final set of pennies at 326 00:16:14,200 --> 00:16:18,480 Speaker 6: the Philadelphia Mint and this is by order of President Trump. 327 00:16:19,080 --> 00:16:22,360 Speaker 6: It was back in February he announced on truth Social 328 00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:25,680 Speaker 6: for far too long in the United States, his minted pennies, 329 00:16:25,720 --> 00:16:29,200 Speaker 6: which literally cost us more than two cents. This is 330 00:16:29,240 --> 00:16:31,760 Speaker 6: so wasteful, he said, I've instructed my Secretary of the 331 00:16:31,880 --> 00:16:34,680 Speaker 6: US Treasury to stop producing new pennies. Let's rip the 332 00:16:34,680 --> 00:16:36,920 Speaker 6: waiste out of our great nation's budget, even if it's 333 00:16:36,920 --> 00:16:39,200 Speaker 6: a penny at a time. He didn't write that one, 334 00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:42,440 Speaker 6: did he James, that somebody else put some time into that, 335 00:16:43,800 --> 00:16:45,080 Speaker 6: even if it's a penny at a time. 336 00:16:45,080 --> 00:16:46,160 Speaker 5: I don't feel like that's Trump. 337 00:16:48,800 --> 00:16:50,160 Speaker 6: Now, as I mentioned, there's a whole lot of them 338 00:16:50,160 --> 00:16:52,760 Speaker 6: still in circulation, so you're going to still be seeing pennies. 339 00:16:53,320 --> 00:16:55,320 Speaker 6: But then we're told some stores can't even get their 340 00:16:55,320 --> 00:16:58,320 Speaker 6: hands on pennies anymore because they're going extinct. 341 00:16:58,600 --> 00:16:59,880 Speaker 5: So let's get to the bottom of this. 342 00:17:00,520 --> 00:17:03,760 Speaker 6: Producer James and I have fantasized about this panel, the 343 00:17:03,920 --> 00:17:08,040 Speaker 6: Power Penny panel, only on Bloomberg. There are two men 344 00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:11,080 Speaker 6: up to the job. Bloomberg's Stephen Dennis, who's been following 345 00:17:11,080 --> 00:17:14,560 Speaker 6: this story closer than any journalists really should. And Dan Flatley, 346 00:17:14,560 --> 00:17:16,520 Speaker 6: who of course covers the Treasury for US. Look at 347 00:17:16,560 --> 00:17:19,560 Speaker 6: these guys. Get on YouTube right now search Bloomberg Business 348 00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:20,040 Speaker 6: News Live. 349 00:17:20,119 --> 00:17:22,600 Speaker 5: Gentlemen, it's great to see you, Steve. 350 00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:26,320 Speaker 6: You know, if the President says it's time to rip 351 00:17:26,359 --> 00:17:28,679 Speaker 6: the waste out of our great nation's budget, the nickel 352 00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:31,280 Speaker 6: would be the place to start, wouldn't it. Let's go 353 00:17:31,280 --> 00:17:34,199 Speaker 6: to the beginning now and what this means for the 354 00:17:34,280 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 6: United States as the institutionalist. You are to say goodbye 355 00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:41,280 Speaker 6: to the penny. Are you doing okay? 356 00:17:41,480 --> 00:17:41,560 Speaker 5: No? 357 00:17:41,800 --> 00:17:44,920 Speaker 9: I mean this is really a moment that arguably should 358 00:17:44,920 --> 00:17:46,480 Speaker 9: have happened twenty years ago. 359 00:17:46,680 --> 00:17:48,800 Speaker 5: That's when we started. 360 00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:52,760 Speaker 9: That's when the penny started costing more to make than 361 00:17:52,800 --> 00:17:56,480 Speaker 9: it was worth, and there were jokes on TV shows 362 00:17:56,520 --> 00:17:59,320 Speaker 9: like The West Wing about how useless the penny was. 363 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:02,640 Speaker 9: One of the reasons why there are three hundred billion 364 00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:07,240 Speaker 9: pennies in circulation, according to the Treasure's estimate, is because 365 00:18:07,320 --> 00:18:11,359 Speaker 9: they are so useless in the eyes of consumers. You know, 366 00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:14,920 Speaker 9: if you actually were using them, they wouldn't be in circulation. 367 00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:18,639 Speaker 9: People would be spending them and not putting them in 368 00:18:18,760 --> 00:18:21,480 Speaker 9: jars in their basements where most of those three hundred 369 00:18:21,480 --> 00:18:25,320 Speaker 9: billion pennies are so it just you know, it's one 370 00:18:25,320 --> 00:18:29,439 Speaker 9: of those things where everybody that I talked to in 371 00:18:29,640 --> 00:18:32,919 Speaker 9: Washington kind of saw the penny as a joke for 372 00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:36,320 Speaker 9: a long time, but up until the Super Bowl moment 373 00:18:36,520 --> 00:18:40,240 Speaker 9: with that tweet, people weren't willing to take on this issue. 374 00:18:41,880 --> 00:18:44,960 Speaker 6: The Super bowld moment, Dan Flatley, I'm sure you could 375 00:18:44,960 --> 00:18:48,399 Speaker 6: feel the ground shake at the Treasury when this took place. 376 00:18:48,440 --> 00:18:49,480 Speaker 5: I'm curious what happens. 377 00:18:49,480 --> 00:18:53,560 Speaker 6: We're going to talk to you, Congressman from Pennsylvania a 378 00:18:53,560 --> 00:18:55,960 Speaker 6: little bit later on the ranking member on the Budget Committee. 379 00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:58,560 Speaker 6: What happens to this mint that's been making these since 380 00:18:58,560 --> 00:18:59,600 Speaker 6: the seventeen hundreds. 381 00:18:59,680 --> 00:19:03,000 Speaker 5: Dan, Yeah, you know, it's a great question, Joe. 382 00:19:03,080 --> 00:19:07,800 Speaker 10: I mean, I'm sort of a rank nostalgist, so, you know, 383 00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:10,920 Speaker 10: losing the penny I felt a little sad. 384 00:19:10,960 --> 00:19:12,760 Speaker 5: There were some great pieces yesterday. 385 00:19:13,520 --> 00:19:17,480 Speaker 10: You know, we wrote about it, obviously, but basically everybody 386 00:19:17,560 --> 00:19:20,240 Speaker 10: who covers Treasury wrote wrote something. It was kind of 387 00:19:20,240 --> 00:19:22,680 Speaker 10: a unique moment because everybody who covered Treasury wrote something 388 00:19:22,720 --> 00:19:25,160 Speaker 10: about the demise of the penny, and they all sort 389 00:19:25,200 --> 00:19:27,000 Speaker 10: of had their own unique kind of take on it. 390 00:19:27,200 --> 00:19:29,840 Speaker 10: I think the Times did like an obituary of the penny, 391 00:19:29,920 --> 00:19:33,679 Speaker 10: and you know, our friends over the Wall Street Journal 392 00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:36,760 Speaker 10: did something, you know, in a similar vein, and so, yeah, 393 00:19:36,760 --> 00:19:39,280 Speaker 10: it was it was definitely a moment. I do think, 394 00:19:39,720 --> 00:19:42,320 Speaker 10: you know, it's not a small thing. You know, Steve 395 00:19:42,440 --> 00:19:46,000 Speaker 10: probably has the figures closer at hand. But let's say 396 00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:51,240 Speaker 10: it's roughly around three fourths of all transactions are done digitally. Now, 397 00:19:51,320 --> 00:19:55,160 Speaker 10: maybe there's a fourth or so that are still done 398 00:19:55,359 --> 00:20:01,080 Speaker 10: in cash. But for those transactions that are conducted in cash, 399 00:20:01,200 --> 00:20:04,080 Speaker 10: you have to give exact change. A lot of times, 400 00:20:05,040 --> 00:20:07,159 Speaker 10: it varies state to state. There's a sort of a 401 00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:11,920 Speaker 10: patchwork of laws. But it does create some complications. I'm 402 00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:14,080 Speaker 10: not saying that it's a reason to keep the penny 403 00:20:14,080 --> 00:20:18,199 Speaker 10: around forever necessarily, but it does create some complications. And 404 00:20:18,280 --> 00:20:21,160 Speaker 10: so you did have a couple of folks yesterday come out, 405 00:20:21,160 --> 00:20:25,800 Speaker 10: including a association representing retailers, saying Congress seeds to act 406 00:20:25,800 --> 00:20:27,880 Speaker 10: here provide some clarity. And that's kind of what we're 407 00:20:27,880 --> 00:20:30,040 Speaker 10: waiting for now. So we'll see. I'm be curious to 408 00:20:30,080 --> 00:20:32,360 Speaker 10: hear what the what the representative has to say. 409 00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:36,080 Speaker 6: Well leave, yeah, we'll get into this a little bit later. 410 00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:38,600 Speaker 6: On Brendan Boyle will be here that so Dan points 411 00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:40,439 Speaker 6: us to the real news here. This isn't just a 412 00:20:40,520 --> 00:20:45,280 Speaker 6: nostalgia show, although I know there are some folks who 413 00:20:45,320 --> 00:20:49,040 Speaker 6: are feeling a little sad right now. Retailers Steve want 414 00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:53,159 Speaker 6: Congress to authorize rounding prices up to override state in 415 00:20:53,240 --> 00:20:56,720 Speaker 6: local laws and food stamp regulations. We invoke snap here 416 00:20:57,560 --> 00:21:01,080 Speaker 6: against the practice, so we're not going to see anymore 417 00:21:01,119 --> 00:21:04,520 Speaker 6: two ninety nine, three ninety nine, and then by extension 418 00:21:04,720 --> 00:21:08,240 Speaker 6: once they get rid of the nickel. What's the point anyway, 419 00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:09,880 Speaker 6: Why don't we just charge dollars? 420 00:21:12,119 --> 00:21:12,320 Speaker 11: Yeah? 421 00:21:12,359 --> 00:21:15,320 Speaker 9: I mean the reality is for the eighty four percent 422 00:21:15,480 --> 00:21:19,600 Speaker 9: and rising of people who pay with digital dollars already, 423 00:21:19,920 --> 00:21:22,600 Speaker 9: they're going to see no difference. What the big fight 424 00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:26,000 Speaker 9: is that the you know, the the retailers. I think 425 00:21:26,040 --> 00:21:29,400 Speaker 9: what they don't want is if say you're owed three 426 00:21:29,440 --> 00:21:31,760 Speaker 9: cents change, they don't want to have to give you 427 00:21:31,840 --> 00:21:32,480 Speaker 9: five cents. 428 00:21:32,560 --> 00:21:33,960 Speaker 5: They want to keep that two cents. 429 00:21:34,160 --> 00:21:37,440 Speaker 9: So even though pennies, you know, are kind of worthless, 430 00:21:37,840 --> 00:21:40,200 Speaker 9: if you're the Walmarts of the world or the Targets 431 00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:42,000 Speaker 9: of the world and you have to deal with millions 432 00:21:42,040 --> 00:21:46,359 Speaker 9: and millions of these transaction transactions a year that could 433 00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:48,720 Speaker 9: you know, affect their bottom line to the tune of 434 00:21:48,720 --> 00:21:52,400 Speaker 9: millions of dollars. So this is sort of the lobbying fight. 435 00:21:52,480 --> 00:21:54,600 Speaker 9: They also want to get clarity, so there's one rule 436 00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:57,040 Speaker 9: across the country, not a patchwork of state laws. And 437 00:21:57,080 --> 00:22:00,960 Speaker 9: there are some regulatory hurdles involving snap benefits. There are 438 00:22:01,040 --> 00:22:03,960 Speaker 9: bills in Congress, they have been debated. It's possible it 439 00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:07,000 Speaker 9: could be included in one of these upcoming spending bills. 440 00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:10,400 Speaker 9: But you know, this is the culmination of decades of 441 00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:15,680 Speaker 9: lobbying to keep the penny, specifically by the company that's 442 00:22:15,800 --> 00:22:19,320 Speaker 9: made the billions and billions of blanks in Tennessee, called Artisan. 443 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:22,800 Speaker 9: You know, they funded lobbying campaigns and they were very 444 00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:26,280 Speaker 9: successful for a long time until it got frankly, so 445 00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:30,040 Speaker 9: ridiculous that we're spending almost four pennies to make every 446 00:22:30,080 --> 00:22:32,679 Speaker 9: penny and most of those pennies go straight into the 447 00:22:32,720 --> 00:22:33,439 Speaker 9: trash drawer. 448 00:22:35,480 --> 00:22:36,520 Speaker 5: The penny lobby. 449 00:22:36,960 --> 00:22:38,960 Speaker 6: We're gonna blow the lid off of that one next 450 00:22:38,960 --> 00:22:41,359 Speaker 6: although maybe it doesn't exist anymore. I guess that's the 451 00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:43,840 Speaker 6: point of this. You still carrying change around, Steve. 452 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:48,520 Speaker 9: Now, I mean I haven't used cash in a very 453 00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:52,800 Speaker 9: long time, except for occasionally to like tip my the 454 00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:57,000 Speaker 9: person who cuts my hair. The only person I've seen 455 00:22:57,119 --> 00:23:00,720 Speaker 9: in the US capital pay with pennies the last couple 456 00:23:00,720 --> 00:23:05,040 Speaker 9: of years have basically been really old senators who are 457 00:23:05,080 --> 00:23:08,280 Speaker 9: sort of stuck in their ways, and you know, you're 458 00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:11,040 Speaker 9: kind of waiting behind them in line, and you're thinking, 459 00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:14,560 Speaker 9: I'm thinking to myself, Okay, this guy is wasting ten 460 00:23:14,600 --> 00:23:17,440 Speaker 9: cents of his ten seconds of his very valuable time 461 00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:20,800 Speaker 9: because they're US senator, ten seconds of my very valuable time, 462 00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:23,200 Speaker 9: ten seconds of the cashier's time. And then that penny 463 00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:25,760 Speaker 9: has to go be counted and then send to a 464 00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:28,000 Speaker 9: bank on a truck, and then from the bank to 465 00:23:28,040 --> 00:23:30,080 Speaker 9: the FED on another truck, and from the Fed to 466 00:23:30,119 --> 00:23:34,520 Speaker 9: a retailer on another truck for a penny. And it 467 00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:37,639 Speaker 9: just strike strikes me as kind of silly that we 468 00:23:37,720 --> 00:23:40,960 Speaker 9: still have them. But you know, there it is a 469 00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:44,159 Speaker 9: part of Americana. You know, penny saved is a penny 470 00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:47,800 Speaker 9: earn a penny for your thoughts, and we are losing something, 471 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:51,400 Speaker 9: except there are three hundred billion out there. Now here's 472 00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:54,439 Speaker 9: one thing the government doesn't one thing the government really 473 00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:57,800 Speaker 9: does not want you to do. They don't want people 474 00:23:57,880 --> 00:24:01,720 Speaker 9: to panic and give them back. The last thing the 475 00:24:01,720 --> 00:24:05,560 Speaker 9: government needs is to have three hundred billion pennies returned 476 00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:07,440 Speaker 9: to banks this week. That's one of the reasons I 477 00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:10,439 Speaker 9: think why the Treasurer was saying, hey, it's still legal tender. 478 00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:12,359 Speaker 9: You don't need to give it to us real fast, 479 00:24:12,880 --> 00:24:17,360 Speaker 9: because there have been studies done on this. But when 480 00:24:17,440 --> 00:24:19,880 Speaker 9: John McCain tried to get rid of the penny during 481 00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:23,080 Speaker 9: the first Trump administration, that warned, hey, it would cost 482 00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:26,159 Speaker 9: us lots and lots of money if people did that, 483 00:24:26,359 --> 00:24:29,320 Speaker 9: because we don't have the facilities to securely store three 484 00:24:29,359 --> 00:24:30,360 Speaker 9: hundred billion pennies. 485 00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:33,879 Speaker 5: You know, Rick Davis is listening to this. 486 00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:35,720 Speaker 6: We're going to talk to him in a moment about 487 00:24:36,320 --> 00:24:40,760 Speaker 6: John McCain's role here. Danny, you carry and change around you. 488 00:24:40,760 --> 00:24:42,919 Speaker 6: You keep a couple of dollars in your pocket, and 489 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:45,320 Speaker 6: I come to the debates a penny, but to bury it. 490 00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:50,080 Speaker 10: But wow, I will give two quick thoughts, you know, 491 00:24:50,119 --> 00:24:53,440 Speaker 10: in response to Steve's commentary there. 492 00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:55,000 Speaker 5: I mean one. 493 00:24:55,080 --> 00:24:57,080 Speaker 10: I was at the drug store over the weekend and 494 00:24:57,119 --> 00:25:00,560 Speaker 10: all the cash registers, the self serve, every went down 495 00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:03,240 Speaker 10: at the same time, and the clerk behind the counter said, 496 00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:05,240 Speaker 10: do you have any cash. Of course I said, no, 497 00:25:05,280 --> 00:25:07,840 Speaker 10: I don't have any cash, and so I had to 498 00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:10,000 Speaker 10: put my stuff back and walk out because they weren't 499 00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:11,760 Speaker 10: conducting transactions digitally. 500 00:25:11,880 --> 00:25:14,520 Speaker 5: So that does happen from time to time. And the 501 00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:16,800 Speaker 5: other thing was, you know, I thought, on a more. 502 00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:19,920 Speaker 10: Again nostalgic note, but you know, Derek Tyer, who's performing 503 00:25:19,920 --> 00:25:22,080 Speaker 10: the duties of the Deputy Secretary, was at the Mint 504 00:25:22,160 --> 00:25:25,040 Speaker 10: yesterday and one of the things that he said which 505 00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:28,320 Speaker 10: was interesting was he noted that the penny bears the 506 00:25:29,040 --> 00:25:32,560 Speaker 10: imprint of Abraham Lincoln, and he talked about the history 507 00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:35,159 Speaker 10: there and he did say which I thought was kind 508 00:25:35,200 --> 00:25:36,560 Speaker 10: of funny and I put it in the story, but 509 00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:39,320 Speaker 10: he said, you know, as somebody who has studied and 510 00:25:39,359 --> 00:25:43,359 Speaker 10: practices accounting, I appreciate you know that Abraham Lincoln was 511 00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:45,919 Speaker 10: always diligent about getting everybody the penny, you. 512 00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:47,840 Speaker 5: Know, down to the exact change and all of that. 513 00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:50,840 Speaker 10: So I mean, I think, to Steve's point, we're probably 514 00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:52,080 Speaker 10: better off without the penny. 515 00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:54,280 Speaker 5: It makes sense, but I will miss it. 516 00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:58,520 Speaker 6: Then reassembling our panel here when the nickel goes away, 517 00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:02,080 Speaker 6: because I'm guessing that comes now, Steve Dennis, Dan Flatley, 518 00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:07,200 Speaker 6: thank you for fulfilling your mission on this passion project 519 00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:10,960 Speaker 6: only at Bloomberg. Now you need to figure out what 520 00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:12,960 Speaker 6: to do with all those dirty pennies. I can't help 521 00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:16,080 Speaker 6: you there. We'll assemble our panel next. Only on Bloomberg Radio, 522 00:26:16,440 --> 00:26:18,640 Speaker 6: stay with us on Balance of Power. We'll have much 523 00:26:18,680 --> 00:26:19,880 Speaker 6: more coming up after this. 524 00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:27,640 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch 525 00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:30,760 Speaker 1: us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on 526 00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:34,119 Speaker 1: Apple Cockway and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. 527 00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:37,159 Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 528 00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:38,520 Speaker 1: flagship New York station. 529 00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:43,280 Speaker 5: Just say Alexa play Bloomberg. Eleven thirty The. 530 00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:46,760 Speaker 6: Government is reopened. We thought there'd be some optimism around this, 531 00:26:46,880 --> 00:26:50,040 Speaker 6: but guess what. Everyone in Washington is still upset as well. 532 00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:54,800 Speaker 6: No deal yet on a healthcare extension in terms of subsidies, 533 00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:58,240 Speaker 6: no common ground when it comes to healthcare at all, 534 00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:01,920 Speaker 6: it sounds like. And of course the cr only goes 535 00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:04,800 Speaker 6: to January thirty, so there are worries about whether we're 536 00:27:05,119 --> 00:27:08,480 Speaker 6: counting down to another shutdown in the new year. All 537 00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:12,119 Speaker 6: of this, of course, has yet to become known. With 538 00:27:12,160 --> 00:27:14,560 Speaker 6: the President of the United States taking a victory lap 539 00:27:14,600 --> 00:27:17,000 Speaker 6: last evening. He did sign that bill, so we're reopened. 540 00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:19,440 Speaker 6: We're waiting for the airports, the snap benefits and everything else, 541 00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:24,400 Speaker 6: paychecks for federal workers to follow. The newest member of Congress, 542 00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:27,720 Speaker 6: by the way, has had the lapel pen for less 543 00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:30,720 Speaker 6: than twenty four hours. It was four o'clock in the 544 00:27:30,760 --> 00:27:34,200 Speaker 6: afternoon yesterday, right before they got to voting that Adelie 545 00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:37,879 Speaker 6: de Grijalva of Arizona, the Democrat, was actually sworn in, 546 00:27:38,040 --> 00:27:42,480 Speaker 6: having waited through the entire shutdown. Speaker Johnson had said 547 00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:46,119 Speaker 6: he was following the Pelosi president. We'll ask Archie about 548 00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:48,760 Speaker 6: that in a minute. But there was a speech we 549 00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:52,680 Speaker 6: had the formal swearing in. Congresswoman Grijalva had this to. 550 00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:58,879 Speaker 12: Say, it has been fifty days since the people of 551 00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:02,600 Speaker 12: Arizona's seventh the aggressional District, elected me to represent them. 552 00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:08,080 Speaker 12: Fifty days that over eight hundred thousand Arizonans have been 553 00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:13,680 Speaker 12: left without access to the basic services that every constituent deserves. 554 00:28:15,400 --> 00:28:17,520 Speaker 5: This is an abuse of power. 555 00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:21,560 Speaker 12: I will sign the discharge petition right now to release 556 00:28:21,640 --> 00:28:25,000 Speaker 12: the Epstein files. Justice cannot wait another day. 557 00:28:26,760 --> 00:28:30,080 Speaker 6: Well, she said, we'll talk about the Epstein files as well, 558 00:28:30,119 --> 00:28:33,440 Speaker 6: and the discharge petition that now has the votes. That's 559 00:28:33,640 --> 00:28:36,359 Speaker 6: why many thought she had to wait over fifty days 560 00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:39,320 Speaker 6: to stall this whole effort. And now we understand the 561 00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:41,920 Speaker 6: discharge petition, we'll get a vote next week, not in 562 00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:45,560 Speaker 6: early December, as both Rokanna and Tim Burchett told us yesterday. 563 00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:47,600 Speaker 6: So let's bring in the panel on all of this, 564 00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:51,480 Speaker 6: the end of the shutdown, and yes, the Epstein files. 565 00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:54,800 Speaker 6: Rick Davis is here Bloomberg Politics contributor, Republican strategist and 566 00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:57,720 Speaker 6: partner at Stone Court Capital and with me in studio. 567 00:28:57,880 --> 00:28:59,960 Speaker 5: Arshie Sidiki, former senior aide too. 568 00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:03,680 Speaker 6: The aforementioned how Speaker, Nancy Pelosi, founder CEO Bellweather Government 569 00:29:03,680 --> 00:29:06,880 Speaker 6: Affairs are democratic strategists. Great to see both of you here, 570 00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:09,880 Speaker 6: and Archie, I'll start with you on this. The symbolism 571 00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:13,360 Speaker 6: of that swearing in was clearly meaningful for Democrats in 572 00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:15,600 Speaker 6: the chamber beyond the Epstein files. 573 00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:18,480 Speaker 13: Yes, absolutely, I mean I think it shows that elections 574 00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:21,959 Speaker 13: matter and having it was interesting. It did take her 575 00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:26,720 Speaker 13: fifty days, which given the state of the world, affordability, 576 00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:29,200 Speaker 13: all these issues that are going on, it was a 577 00:29:29,240 --> 00:29:31,640 Speaker 13: little bit. It was jarring, I think for Democrats, but 578 00:29:31,680 --> 00:29:34,080 Speaker 13: I think it's one more seat, one more person to 579 00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:35,080 Speaker 13: fight for constituents. 580 00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:36,800 Speaker 3: And on this affordability. 581 00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:38,280 Speaker 5: Pelosi precedent a real thing. 582 00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:41,040 Speaker 6: Speaker Johnson said he was simply doing what Nancy Pelosi 583 00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:41,880 Speaker 6: had done before him. 584 00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:46,120 Speaker 13: I think if Speaker Johnson was taking I guess a 585 00:29:46,160 --> 00:29:48,760 Speaker 13: template from Speaker Pelosi, then it probably would have been 586 00:29:49,160 --> 00:29:52,840 Speaker 13: maybe on the shut down negotiation by Cameron, bipartisan negotiations. 587 00:29:52,880 --> 00:29:55,600 Speaker 13: So it's this picking and choosing and cherry picking. I 588 00:29:56,640 --> 00:29:58,720 Speaker 13: would say, no comment. All right, Rick, how are you 589 00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:01,400 Speaker 13: feeling today? Because everybody we talked to last night, d's 590 00:30:01,440 --> 00:30:04,080 Speaker 13: in ours. We're all in a bad mood. Nobody's on 591 00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:06,960 Speaker 13: the same page with healthcare. The president's angry. He is 592 00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:10,480 Speaker 13: trying to score points last evening saying, remember what they 593 00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:13,280 Speaker 13: did here to partially ruin the country. We still have 594 00:30:13,320 --> 00:30:15,719 Speaker 13: a couple one hundred thousand workers who have yet to 595 00:30:15,760 --> 00:30:18,040 Speaker 13: be paid. How do you pick up the pieces for 596 00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:19,440 Speaker 13: the longest shutdown in history. 597 00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:25,560 Speaker 11: Yeah, it's amazing how miserable Washington comes when they overcome misery. 598 00:30:26,120 --> 00:30:30,080 Speaker 11: The Washington shutdown was not good, and the fact that 599 00:30:30,320 --> 00:30:33,840 Speaker 11: everyone immediately is instead of celebrating the fact that they 600 00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:37,800 Speaker 11: finally got a bipartisan solution to this and by the way, 601 00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:41,000 Speaker 11: Republicans are be thrilled they took our deal, right. I mean, like, 602 00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:44,880 Speaker 11: I don't really get why any Republican would argue about this. 603 00:30:44,920 --> 00:30:48,000 Speaker 11: It's the first time they've sort of stuck to the 604 00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:50,680 Speaker 11: negotiation and said this is the only thing we're going 605 00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:52,120 Speaker 11: to say yes to, and. 606 00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:54,840 Speaker 5: The Democrats capitulated and gave it to them. So I 607 00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:55,200 Speaker 5: don't know. 608 00:30:55,320 --> 00:30:58,360 Speaker 11: I mean, maybe it's just the time of year. Maybe 609 00:30:58,400 --> 00:31:02,440 Speaker 11: it's kind of grumpy or Christmas. I mean, there's a 610 00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:06,000 Speaker 11: grinch aspect to this that I don't understand. But look, 611 00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:09,040 Speaker 11: that part's over and now we get to fight over 612 00:31:09,080 --> 00:31:13,680 Speaker 11: the fun stuff, real stuff healthcare and Jeffrey Emstein, which 613 00:31:13,880 --> 00:31:16,240 Speaker 11: I'm not sure is real, but that's definitely going to 614 00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:17,880 Speaker 11: get its time in court. 615 00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:20,800 Speaker 6: God well, yes, indeed, and we're going to get into 616 00:31:20,800 --> 00:31:23,320 Speaker 6: that in a moment. I do want to mention we 617 00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:26,760 Speaker 6: just heard from Senator John Fetterman's office, and I'm just 618 00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:29,959 Speaker 6: reading this with you for the first time. During an 619 00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:33,960 Speaker 6: early morning walk, Senator Fetterman sustained a fall near his 620 00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:36,600 Speaker 6: home in Braddock, and they say, out of an abundance 621 00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:39,760 Speaker 6: of caution, he was transported to a hospital in Pittsburgh. 622 00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:43,760 Speaker 6: Upon evaluation, it was established that he had a ventricular 623 00:31:43,760 --> 00:31:47,160 Speaker 6: fibrillation flare up that led the senator to feeling light headed, 624 00:31:47,760 --> 00:31:49,880 Speaker 6: falling to the ground, hitting his face. 625 00:31:49,720 --> 00:31:51,360 Speaker 5: And he did sustain minor injuries. 626 00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:53,960 Speaker 6: It says the senator had this to say, if you 627 00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:56,920 Speaker 6: thought my face looked bad before, will you see it now. 628 00:31:57,320 --> 00:31:58,720 Speaker 5: So he's at least got his sense of. 629 00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:00,560 Speaker 6: Humor with him still, and we'll let you know if 630 00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:03,480 Speaker 6: anything else comes from all of this. Senator John Fennerman 631 00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:05,320 Speaker 6: falling this morning while he was out. 632 00:32:05,120 --> 00:32:06,000 Speaker 5: For a walk. 633 00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:11,160 Speaker 6: So let's talk about this effort to expose the Epstein files, 634 00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:13,960 Speaker 6: because if you've been reading anything recently, you see that 635 00:32:14,120 --> 00:32:17,680 Speaker 6: many are being exposed, having been released through the Oversight 636 00:32:17,720 --> 00:32:20,800 Speaker 6: Committee in the House. Democrats released a couple of selected 637 00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:23,440 Speaker 6: emails yesterday didn't make the president look very great, and 638 00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:27,400 Speaker 6: then Republicans dropped about twenty thousand documents here as they 639 00:32:27,440 --> 00:32:30,520 Speaker 6: had promised to do in this effort. The Speaker, Mike 640 00:32:30,600 --> 00:32:33,160 Speaker 6: Johnson was asked about all of this last evening. The 641 00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:36,000 Speaker 6: effort to bring this through the Committee, and also by 642 00:32:36,040 --> 00:32:38,240 Speaker 6: the discharge petition we were just talking about. 643 00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:39,080 Speaker 5: Here's Mike Johnson. 644 00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:42,440 Speaker 14: We have been for maximum transparency of the Epstein files 645 00:32:42,440 --> 00:32:45,400 Speaker 14: from the very beginning. What I was opposed to is 646 00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:49,240 Speaker 14: the reckless disregard that was used in drafting the discharge petition. 647 00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:51,680 Speaker 14: And we've been over this many times, but it was 648 00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:54,000 Speaker 14: not drafted into such a way that it would adequately 649 00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:57,840 Speaker 14: protect innocent victims. We have a responsibility to do that. 650 00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:01,200 Speaker 14: There's many as a thousand women by some stamates of 651 00:33:01,200 --> 00:33:03,920 Speaker 14: people who have been victimized because the sex trafficking and 652 00:33:04,040 --> 00:33:07,880 Speaker 14: Epstein and all these horrendous, heinous crimes, and we can't 653 00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:10,280 Speaker 14: have them subjected any further harm. So we wanted to 654 00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:12,680 Speaker 14: make sure that they were properly as names are properly 655 00:33:12,720 --> 00:33:15,960 Speaker 14: redacted out of the files. But the discharge petition is 656 00:33:16,000 --> 00:33:19,280 Speaker 14: not only reckless, it is also a totally moot point. 657 00:33:21,360 --> 00:33:24,040 Speaker 6: So let's get into this for a minute, or she's 658 00:33:24,040 --> 00:33:26,360 Speaker 6: get real about this. Let's say it actually passes and 659 00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:29,960 Speaker 6: we understand that forty to fifty Republicans probably vote yes 660 00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:33,400 Speaker 6: on this, then it goes to the Senate where it 661 00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:35,480 Speaker 6: could die, and even if it passes, the Senate. The 662 00:33:35,480 --> 00:33:37,840 Speaker 6: President would need to sign it. So what's this effort 663 00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:39,760 Speaker 6: all about. It is simply getting people on the record. 664 00:33:40,240 --> 00:33:42,960 Speaker 13: Well, I think it's interesting Speaker Johnson the way he 665 00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:45,400 Speaker 13: laid it out, because discharge petitions, as you know, are 666 00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:49,880 Speaker 13: not the ideal preferred way to make policy. They are 667 00:33:49,960 --> 00:33:53,080 Speaker 13: a procedural tool for the minority to really push the envelope, 668 00:33:53,160 --> 00:33:56,240 Speaker 13: but they certainly are not well suited. So there was 669 00:33:56,280 --> 00:33:58,160 Speaker 13: a way to do a bipart as an effort to 670 00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:01,720 Speaker 13: actually come up with smart that actually does focus on 671 00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:05,320 Speaker 13: these women, a thousand women, as the Speaker mentioned, and 672 00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:06,640 Speaker 13: this is serious stuff. 673 00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:08,439 Speaker 3: There are many of these. 674 00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:12,319 Speaker 13: Victims really want accountability, they want transparency, and that is 675 00:34:12,360 --> 00:34:15,840 Speaker 13: the charge. And it's up to the House and Senate 676 00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:18,480 Speaker 13: to put that pressure on the White House to get 677 00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:19,479 Speaker 13: this over the finish line. 678 00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:21,879 Speaker 5: Is the discharge petition a waste of time? Rick? 679 00:34:22,040 --> 00:34:23,960 Speaker 6: Or is it important to get people on the record 680 00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:28,080 Speaker 6: in this case, likely Republicans who would potentially be voting no. 681 00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:30,680 Speaker 5: Yeah, if you look at. 682 00:34:30,640 --> 00:34:33,839 Speaker 11: It from the perspective of sort of the Republican magabase 683 00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:36,840 Speaker 11: that has been pushing for this, and it's been promised 684 00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:41,040 Speaker 11: to them, you know, throughout multiple campaigns by the President 685 00:34:41,080 --> 00:34:42,840 Speaker 11: of United States and other leaders. 686 00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:45,560 Speaker 5: The reality is they're not going to be happy, right. 687 00:34:45,640 --> 00:34:47,200 Speaker 5: I mean, like, even though. 688 00:34:47,200 --> 00:34:51,359 Speaker 11: The focus is on Congresswoman Grijalva and being the two 689 00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:53,719 Speaker 11: hundred and eighteen vote, this has been something Republicans have 690 00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:56,960 Speaker 11: been talking about for a long time, and they're not 691 00:34:57,040 --> 00:34:59,279 Speaker 11: going to be successful. I mean, as you pointed out, 692 00:34:59,280 --> 00:35:01,800 Speaker 11: the process will against I'm sure they'll get this discharge 693 00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:05,000 Speaker 11: petition done next week. It'll go to the Senate where 694 00:35:05,000 --> 00:35:07,840 Speaker 11: it likely will die, but it will not have Donald 695 00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:10,160 Speaker 11: Trump's pen attached to it. I mean, this won't be 696 00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:13,640 Speaker 11: one of the beautiful signatures on a fancy leather bound document. 697 00:35:14,239 --> 00:35:19,520 Speaker 5: And so what's going to happen then? I mean it's. 698 00:35:19,120 --> 00:35:23,279 Speaker 11: Really quite a trap, if anything, a great trap set 699 00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:27,200 Speaker 11: by Democrats to make Republicans look like hypocrites because they 700 00:35:27,239 --> 00:35:32,160 Speaker 11: haven't used the offices of the DOJ to distribute this information, 701 00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:38,799 Speaker 11: which they said they would do. And so honestly, I 702 00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:41,600 Speaker 11: think that, you know, no matter what happens, it's going 703 00:35:41,640 --> 00:35:44,839 Speaker 11: to be a mark on Republican leadership not making their 704 00:35:44,840 --> 00:35:48,640 Speaker 11: base happy. All that being said, the trap is also 705 00:35:48,680 --> 00:35:51,880 Speaker 11: set for the Democrats because talking about Jeffrey Epstein is 706 00:35:51,920 --> 00:35:55,200 Speaker 11: not talking about affordability, is not talking about healthcare, is 707 00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:58,480 Speaker 11: not talking about their wins last Tuesday at elections. I mean, 708 00:35:58,680 --> 00:36:03,040 Speaker 11: they are way off mess. The Epstein files will not 709 00:36:03,520 --> 00:36:07,960 Speaker 11: succeed as being an electoral issue. It's just a distraction 710 00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:11,879 Speaker 11: and frankly one probably welcome by some Republicans at this point. 711 00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:13,680 Speaker 5: Well fascinating. 712 00:36:14,120 --> 00:36:18,239 Speaker 6: We heard from Lauren Bobert yesterday who apparently got an 713 00:36:18,280 --> 00:36:20,480 Speaker 6: invite to come over to the White House and was 714 00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:25,080 Speaker 6: sat down to talk about maybe reportedly removing her name. 715 00:36:25,560 --> 00:36:26,840 Speaker 5: From the discharge petition. 716 00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:29,600 Speaker 6: She went on Twitter after and wrote simply, I want 717 00:36:29,640 --> 00:36:32,840 Speaker 6: to thank White House officials for meeting with me today. Together, 718 00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:36,680 Speaker 6: we remain committed to ensuring transparency for the American people. 719 00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:39,120 Speaker 6: Doesn't sound like she can repeat much of what she heard. 720 00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:42,480 Speaker 6: Nancy Mace apparently getting the same phone call, playing phone tag. 721 00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:45,759 Speaker 6: Why would the president be trying to remove Republicans at 722 00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:46,719 Speaker 6: this eleventh hour? 723 00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:48,200 Speaker 5: You know, it's interesting. 724 00:36:48,239 --> 00:36:50,120 Speaker 13: I think it goes back to what Rick was talking 725 00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:52,440 Speaker 13: about in terms of the Republican base and how this 726 00:36:52,640 --> 00:36:57,279 Speaker 13: was this was a promise, and you know, the congresswoman 727 00:36:57,320 --> 00:37:01,880 Speaker 13: in Grijalva's election really did break the law logjamuntil this point, 728 00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:05,280 Speaker 13: it actually this issue has been shoved in the wayside. 729 00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:06,799 Speaker 13: One place where I would push back a little bit 730 00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:09,680 Speaker 13: with Rick is this isn't about electoral politics. This is 731 00:37:09,719 --> 00:37:12,360 Speaker 13: actually about the young women who were who were harmed 732 00:37:12,480 --> 00:37:15,120 Speaker 13: and creating kind of some sort of sense of closure 733 00:37:15,400 --> 00:37:17,320 Speaker 13: and some sort of path forward. 734 00:37:17,360 --> 00:37:18,759 Speaker 5: Well, you know the line from Republicans. 735 00:37:18,800 --> 00:37:20,799 Speaker 6: Mike Lawler said it to us even last evening, Tim 736 00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:23,520 Speaker 6: Burchett said, Democrats do not care about these victims. They 737 00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:27,920 Speaker 6: are just motivated by politics to make Republicans and specifically 738 00:37:28,120 --> 00:37:29,200 Speaker 6: Donald Trump look bad. 739 00:37:29,480 --> 00:37:31,440 Speaker 5: Well, you look at it. A pretty tough line. It's 740 00:37:31,480 --> 00:37:32,080 Speaker 5: a tough line. 741 00:37:32,080 --> 00:37:33,720 Speaker 13: And on top of it, look at I mean, if 742 00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:36,160 Speaker 13: I think Rick is right, if anything, if we were, 743 00:37:36,320 --> 00:37:38,720 Speaker 13: if Democrats were being political, it would be talk about, 744 00:37:38,960 --> 00:37:42,799 Speaker 13: especially after these last elections, talk about affordability, double down 745 00:37:42,840 --> 00:37:45,719 Speaker 13: there and put this in the background. But I think 746 00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:49,640 Speaker 13: at every level Democrats know that they have to push 747 00:37:49,640 --> 00:37:52,120 Speaker 13: this forward to do the right thing by these women. 748 00:37:52,239 --> 00:37:54,440 Speaker 6: You know what else, Tim Burchett suggested last evening, Rick 749 00:37:54,480 --> 00:37:56,480 Speaker 6: that we've heard from a lot of Republicans is that 750 00:37:56,520 --> 00:37:59,240 Speaker 6: if there was actually something in here that would damage 751 00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:02,440 Speaker 6: Donald Trump. Democrats would have pulled this out during the campaign. 752 00:38:02,719 --> 00:38:03,799 Speaker 6: Is there not some truth to that? 753 00:38:05,440 --> 00:38:08,520 Speaker 11: Well, some of these records have not been seen by anybody. 754 00:38:08,800 --> 00:38:11,920 Speaker 11: Democrats are Republicans alike, and so it's hard to tell 755 00:38:12,160 --> 00:38:14,560 Speaker 11: who had eyes on any of this stuff. And look, 756 00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:17,600 Speaker 11: I mean, it's pretty clear that the only reason Republicans 757 00:38:17,600 --> 00:38:20,279 Speaker 11: released the twenty thousand pages they released is because the 758 00:38:20,280 --> 00:38:23,440 Speaker 11: Democrats released a few dozen pages that were specific to 759 00:38:23,520 --> 00:38:27,239 Speaker 11: Donald Trump. So honestly, I mean, it's just the lack 760 00:38:27,320 --> 00:38:32,720 Speaker 11: of transparency and honesty in this process is pretty sad. 761 00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:35,320 Speaker 5: But again, it's all off message. 762 00:38:35,360 --> 00:38:37,799 Speaker 11: Republicans shouldn't be talking about this, and Democrats are going 763 00:38:37,840 --> 00:38:40,759 Speaker 11: to miss an opportunity by talking about this, and the 764 00:38:40,800 --> 00:38:42,840 Speaker 11: whole thing I think is just a distraction to the 765 00:38:42,840 --> 00:38:45,799 Speaker 11: American people. None of these promises should have been made. 766 00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:50,279 Speaker 11: This should have been done through a legal channel and 767 00:38:50,880 --> 00:38:54,480 Speaker 11: nothing more. You know, I agree it shouldn't be a 768 00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:57,600 Speaker 11: political issue, but it's one now and it's going to 769 00:38:57,960 --> 00:39:01,440 Speaker 11: occupy a lot of our time. But also remind everybody, 770 00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:04,799 Speaker 11: once you've signed a discharge position and it goes live. 771 00:39:04,920 --> 00:39:07,040 Speaker 11: In other words, it has the two hundred and eighteenth 772 00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:09,720 Speaker 11: you can't take your name off of it. 773 00:39:09,719 --> 00:39:11,439 Speaker 5: It's actually outside the rule. 774 00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:14,200 Speaker 15: So hauling these people over the White House last night 775 00:39:14,520 --> 00:39:17,719 Speaker 15: just added more fodder to list notion that what do 776 00:39:17,800 --> 00:39:20,640 Speaker 15: they have any idea what happens on Capitol Hill procedurally 777 00:39:21,160 --> 00:39:23,879 Speaker 15: because they can't remove their name. 778 00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:27,960 Speaker 6: Yeah, well maybe that's why they called her before Grihava 779 00:39:28,080 --> 00:39:32,120 Speaker 6: was sworn in. That's a great point, Rick, fascinating conversation 780 00:39:32,280 --> 00:39:34,600 Speaker 6: that's going to get louder next week because we're going 781 00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:37,440 Speaker 6: to have the vote on the discharge petition and reportedly 782 00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:40,880 Speaker 6: Rocanna and Thomas Massey we'll be having another news conference 783 00:39:40,920 --> 00:39:44,359 Speaker 6: with victims, so prepared to hear a lot more of this, 784 00:39:44,600 --> 00:39:46,200 Speaker 6: Rick Davison, Archie Sidiki. 785 00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:48,799 Speaker 5: Thanks for listening to the Balance of Power podcast. 786 00:39:49,400 --> 00:39:52,520 Speaker 6: Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already an Apple, Spotify, 787 00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:55,200 Speaker 6: or wherever you get your podcasts, and you can find 788 00:39:55,280 --> 00:39:58,080 Speaker 6: us live every weekday from Washington, DC at New Time 789 00:39:58,160 --> 00:40:00,000 Speaker 6: Eastern at Bloomberg dot com.