Speaker 1: Hi Brian, Hi Katie. Well that was quite a morning,
Speaker 1: wasn't it. We just wrapped up our conversation with the one,
Speaker 1: the only, the icon, Miss Dion von Furstemburg, or has
Speaker 1: her children call her DVF and as her grandchildren call
Speaker 1: her Madam. No, I'm just kidding. Anyway, we should add
Speaker 1: that she was kind enough to let us interview her
Speaker 1: at her amazing office kumb store, coom, home, coom everything,
Speaker 1: or should we say here a tellier. It was really
Speaker 1: a very cool space, lots of colors and patterns and
Speaker 1: animal prints and everything you would imagine. Dion von Furstemburg
Speaker 1: statue from the King of Bhutan. I think she mentioned, yes, yes,
Speaker 1: so yes, this little thing from the King of Bhutan.
Speaker 1: I have one of those actually in my powder room.
Speaker 1: I'm just kidding, But anyway, she really is quite an
Speaker 1: amazing woman. Her life is like something out of a
Speaker 1: fairy tale. Before she turned thirty and I remember this,
Speaker 1: ladies and gentlemen, I'm old enough to she had married
Speaker 1: a prince, started a fashion line and was on the
Speaker 1: cover of Newsweek with that really famous style that put
Speaker 1: her on the map. That would be the wrap dress.
Speaker 1: That's right, and a fun fact, it was inspired by
Speaker 1: the rap tops that ballerinas were in rehearsal. And another
Speaker 1: fun fact I learned preparing for this interview was that
Speaker 1: it was designed for women to make a quick getaway
Speaker 1: if they were with a guy they didn't really want
Speaker 1: to wake up, if you know what I'm saying an
Speaker 1: alternative to the walk of It was designed so that
Speaker 1: women could get the dress off quickly. But that that
Speaker 1: may be wrong. It's sort of the the clothing alternative
Speaker 1: to coyote love, which means biting off your arms so
Speaker 1: you don't have to wake up the person with whom
Speaker 1: you slept. Interesting anyway, I read the Dion sold five
Speaker 1: million of these dresses by the mid nineteen seventies. And
Speaker 1: like most people who have had a long and public careers,
Speaker 1: Diannest faced her share of challenges to cancer, divorce, business challenges.
Speaker 1: So somebody needs to make a biopick of her life.
Speaker 1: Absolutely well. She did have her own reality show on
Speaker 1: e a few years back called House of DVF. But
Speaker 1: she's an incredible woman. She's also very outspoken and she's
Speaker 1: all about at age seventy one, inspiring other women, which
Speaker 1: reminds me, Brian, this is the last episode Sniff Sniff
Speaker 1: of our wonder Women's series. I couldn't think of anyone
Speaker 1: more fitting to wrap it up. Anyway. We spoke to
Speaker 1: Dion about the events she's throwing an honor of International
Speaker 1: Women's Day. We talked to her about her marriage to
Speaker 1: Barry Diller, her mother, who was a Holocaust survivor, and
Speaker 1: how she really infused her with this desire to succeed
Speaker 1: in many ways and to be independent. She had lots
Speaker 1: of advice for young women and young men. She's really
Speaker 1: an extra nary person, remarkable, and the fact that she
Speaker 1: is aging naturally and beautifully. I might add, we're saying Dion,
Speaker 1: by the way, because that was one of the first
Speaker 1: questions I asked, is that Diane Dione. She answers to both,
Speaker 1: so she told me that Dion was her given name,
Speaker 1: so we decided to dutifully call her Dion. I should
Speaker 1: tell you, Katie, I'm actually Brian duly noted Brian. Anyway,
Speaker 1: here's our conversation with Dion, Bond Person and Burke. My
Speaker 1: name is really Dianne. I was born Dienne, so my
Speaker 1: mother husband they called Medienne, but my children call me,
Speaker 1: so it's whatever you want. Well, I think we'll call
Speaker 1: you Dion because that was your given name, and and
Speaker 1: I like when people get my name right too. So yes,
Speaker 1: So here, Brian and I are here at the epicenter
Speaker 1: of DVF land. This is your office, this is your store,
Speaker 1: and this is your home. Well it's it's my My
Speaker 1: real home is in Connecticut, but this is where I
Speaker 1: camp out when I'm here, when you're in New York.
Speaker 1: So tell me what it's like to be in this
Speaker 1: space right now, at this point in your life with
Speaker 1: the world. Oh, it is the how it is it? Well,
Speaker 1: it's it's so many things at the same time, because
Speaker 1: you know, there's such a disruption in the world, such
Speaker 1: a disruption in the world, and therefore there's such a
Speaker 1: disruption in every industry. And so as the chairman of
Speaker 1: the cfd A, which is the Council of Fashion Design
Speaker 1: of America, I have to advise all my fellow designers
Speaker 1: and help them to navigate the tsunami of all these
Speaker 1: changes and and it's very difficult. So my advice. Usually
Speaker 1: before fashion Week I email everybody to wish them good luck.
Speaker 1: And this year when I emailed them, I said, you know,
Speaker 1: at this moment of disruption. It's my biggest advice to
Speaker 1: you is to be yourself and to stand for who
Speaker 1: you are and who your brand stands for, and don't
Speaker 1: look so much left and right and do what is
Speaker 1: right for you because at the end is that authenticity
Speaker 1: that will last. What do you see is the biggest
Speaker 1: challenges that the fashion industry and really all businesses are facing.
Speaker 1: You mentioned the word disruption, But when you use that word, Yon,
Speaker 1: what do you mean exactly? Well, everything is changing. I mean,
Speaker 1: you know, you just have to make sure that you
Speaker 1: are true to who your yourself live. So us I
Speaker 1: mean DVF as a brand that is now forty five
Speaker 1: years old. I mean that's a long time. It is
Speaker 1: a global brand, so it's time to take a major
Speaker 1: X ray of who you are and what you stand for.
Speaker 1: So I've gone through this exercise so that I can
Speaker 1: change the business model or alter the business model in
Speaker 1: order to be ready for this new world. You know,
Speaker 1: so you have to analyze yourself. So DVFS worked well.
Speaker 1: We have an iconic product, the rap dress, that has
Speaker 1: lived for years and years and years and years and
Speaker 1: decades and so on. Now, I mean, and that is
Speaker 1: like a big deal that it has existed and survived
Speaker 1: for so many generations. We have a vocabulary of colors
Speaker 1: and prints. But then at the end we also have
Speaker 1: which is probably the most distinguishable thing, is that we
Speaker 1: have a um marketing people called it a love brand
Speaker 1: because we have a connection. Women have a connection and
Speaker 1: emotional connection with the brand and with the story and
Speaker 1: in some cases with me personally, or at least for
Speaker 1: what I symbolize. I was gonna say, I think so
Speaker 1: many people associate you beyond with the brand, and also
Speaker 1: the brand standing for something beyond a rap dress or
Speaker 1: beyond colorful friends. But but but I am seventy one
Speaker 1: years old, you know, So I am aging. So how
Speaker 1: do you deal with the present? You know? And that's
Speaker 1: why now I had the creative director, Nathan Genderen, who
Speaker 1: was with me for the best ten years of the
Speaker 1: second generation. He's back, and so something came from the past,
Speaker 1: and I'm very excited about it, and so I wanted
Speaker 1: something for the future. So the ar Muse is now
Speaker 1: my granddaughter who is almost nineteen and who is in college,
Speaker 1: and that that is the continuity of it all. Can
Speaker 1: I ask you about that? People hear about this term
Speaker 1: muse in the fashion industry. What does that actually means? Well,
Speaker 1: it's it's the face. It's the face of the brand.
Speaker 1: You know, I I was the face of the brand
Speaker 1: for so long at some point, you know, it's so
Speaker 1: thank god. I have a lot of old pictures and
Speaker 1: the muses. You know, is is the woman? Who is
Speaker 1: the DVF woman? Right, if you have to say so?
Speaker 1: I kept on saying who is the dv The truth
Speaker 1: is DVF woman is the woman in charge. She's in
Speaker 1: charge of her life, or at least she feels in charge.
Speaker 1: She wants to be in charge. She wants to be
Speaker 1: responsible for herself. And DVF the brand is supposed to
Speaker 1: give her the tools in order for her to be
Speaker 1: the woman she wants to be. I want to talk
Speaker 1: more about the business, but we also you have such
Speaker 1: a fascinating life story, Dion that some people know some
Speaker 1: people don't know that. Well, let's start at the beginning
Speaker 1: with your mom, who was a Holocaust survivor and who
Speaker 1: was told I guess she weighed very little when she
Speaker 1: was released. Yes, my mother was. My mother was twenty
Speaker 1: two when she was living in occupied Belgium and she
Speaker 1: was arrested. She was arrested. She was twenty two. She
Speaker 1: was arrested because she was doing resistance and she was
Speaker 1: found in a resistance house, and she was very scared
Speaker 1: that she was going to be tortured in order to
Speaker 1: reveal the name of her bosses and things like that.
Speaker 1: So she said, no, no, no, I'm just hiding here
Speaker 1: because I'm Jewish. Now she was Jewish, but she wasn't
Speaker 1: really hiding. She was working. But that's and the woman
Speaker 1: who interrogated her say, you shouldn't say that, because you're
Speaker 1: going to be shipped away, but she did. And so
Speaker 1: she was shipped away, and she was shipped away in
Speaker 1: those terrible cattle convoys where for four days until they
Speaker 1: got to Auschwitz. And and she was there. I mean,
Speaker 1: she was lucky that she was young and strong and
Speaker 1: therefore she was not killed. And she was put in
Speaker 1: a working camp. She was wor king in a bullet factory.
Speaker 1: And then then they were shipped to another camp because
Speaker 1: they were losing the war, and then another camp. And
Speaker 1: when she finally was found by the Americans, she was
Speaker 1: forty nine pounds and which is less than her bones
Speaker 1: should be. And but it's very funny because now I
Speaker 1: have all the documents, you know, the Holocaust Museum sent
Speaker 1: me all these documents. And in the documents that when
Speaker 1: she was found, she wrote, you know, she had to
Speaker 1: feel name, last name, where she came from a state
Speaker 1: of health, and even though she couldn't move, she wrote
Speaker 1: excellent health, which you know is why she was survived.
Speaker 1: And so, and my mother used to say to me always,
Speaker 1: God saved me so that I can give you life
Speaker 1: because I was born after she was told she would not.
Speaker 1: She couldn't get pregnant for quite a while, and she
Speaker 1: got pregnant, she goes right away and she said the
Speaker 1: child wouldn't be normal, and indeed I was non normal.
Speaker 1: And uh and uh, and she said, so God saved
Speaker 1: me so that I can give you life. And by
Speaker 1: giving you life, you gave me my life back. You
Speaker 1: are my torture freedom. So it's wonderful to have a
Speaker 1: mother too that tells you that you are a torture freedom.
Speaker 1: But it's a very heavy burden. But I'm glad I
Speaker 1: had that burden and I was gonna and I honored
Speaker 1: that burden. How how did that infuse you both through nature?
Speaker 1: Because of her incredible spirit and resilience, but also through
Speaker 1: nurture because these experiences obviously shaped her for the rest
Speaker 1: of her life. But she wasn't She was a tiger mum.
Speaker 1: You know, she was tough. If I was afraid of
Speaker 1: the dark, she would close me in the closet and
Speaker 1: she'd probably get the rest of today. And but but
Speaker 1: after ten minutes, when you're in the dark closet, first
Speaker 1: of all, it doesn't stay dark. You always have a
Speaker 1: little bit of light that shows up. And second of all,
Speaker 1: you know, when why am I afraid the dark of
Speaker 1: the dark? So you know, it was tough to be
Speaker 1: her daughter because she was tough, and she wanted me
Speaker 1: to be independent, and she didn't want me to be needy,
Speaker 1: and she didn't want me to be afraid, and she
Speaker 1: wanted to equip me for everything that I could possibly
Speaker 1: happen to me. But I'm thankful for it. And that's why,
Speaker 1: very early in life I decided, you know, the only
Speaker 1: way I can deal with everything is to be in
Speaker 1: charge of my life. And so what lessons do you
Speaker 1: think privileged kids today ought to take from your upbringing
Speaker 1: that you know often you hear about helicopter parents and
Speaker 1: parents who call all their kids and prevent them from
Speaker 1: taking unnecessary risks. That was not your childhood at all,
Speaker 1: And it told you. I think that those are not
Speaker 1: good parents. I mean is people who say constantly be
Speaker 1: careful and don't do I mean the the what you
Speaker 1: want most for your children is to be independent, because
Speaker 1: there's no way you can predict what can happen. You
Speaker 1: can lose everything. You can lose your wealth, you can
Speaker 1: lose your vialance, you can use your health, but you
Speaker 1: never lose your character. And character building and making your
Speaker 1: children isn't independent is the best and the only thing
Speaker 1: a parent should do. And your mother taught you independence
Speaker 1: in more than one way. She left your father, which
Speaker 1: was a rare thing to do in that time. She
Speaker 1: left my father after sixteen years. Yes, and and you
Speaker 1: supported her, and that stories in the book. And my father,
Speaker 1: I mean, I love my father, but I supported her, Yes,
Speaker 1: I did. And she always supported me too. I mean,
Speaker 1: you know, she never told me, oh don't do this,
Speaker 1: or it be it's dangerous. She was she was something
Speaker 1: my mother I mean, I mean, but of course it's
Speaker 1: very heavy. And while she was a layer alive, you know,
Speaker 1: she would always give advice to everybody. All my friends
Speaker 1: would come for her advice, and I would so annoy me,
Speaker 1: and now I do the same hundred times work. I
Speaker 1: was going to say that story and much more is
Speaker 1: in your book The Woman I Wanted to Be, which
Speaker 1: was fantastic, but she wrote in two thousand fourteen. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and but but talk about sort of this privileged upbringing
Speaker 1: you had to dion because uh, you know, obviously you
Speaker 1: were pally means well once I and probably not as
Speaker 1: a child, but once you got married. I I was
Speaker 1: privileged as a child. I mean, I have loving parents
Speaker 1: and my my father was well off, so I was
Speaker 1: privileged in that sense. I lived in Belgium and it
Speaker 1: rained all the time, and I had curly hair, and
Speaker 1: and I looked like so different than all my schoolmates
Speaker 1: and whatever, and and then I thought nothing would ever
Speaker 1: happen to me. My mother sent me to boarding school
Speaker 1: in Switzerland and then in England, and I'm so thankful
Speaker 1: that she did that because for me, it was beginning
Speaker 1: my own life where I started to socialize and to
Speaker 1: meet people, you know, out of my own surroundings. And
Speaker 1: eventually I went to school university in Switzerland. I met
Speaker 1: this very handsome, good looking, rich prince Agon who was
Speaker 1: my boyfriend. He eventually became the my husband and the
Speaker 1: father of my children. So I through him, I discovered
Speaker 1: the world that I did not know that the jet said,
Speaker 1: so to see, did you feel comfortable in that world?
Speaker 1: Because I would feel intimidated. Well, I was intimidated at first,
Speaker 1: but I you know, obviously I would never show it.
Speaker 1: And you know, and at first I said, how do
Speaker 1: everybody know everybody? And how does it happen? And and
Speaker 1: they speak, you know, five languages at the same time,
Speaker 1: and this and that and so on, and then all
Speaker 1: of a sudden, you're part of it, and you know,
Speaker 1: you don't you you find that normal. But that wasn't
Speaker 1: enough for me, so to speak. I didn't want to
Speaker 1: just be an idle Park Avenue princess. I always wanted
Speaker 1: to work. And I must say that Eggon always pushed
Speaker 1: me and encouraged me to do that. And I started
Speaker 1: to work even before I was married, because I worked
Speaker 1: for this Italian man who had a factory and who
Speaker 1: taught me everything about printing and and jersey and and so.
Speaker 1: I mean, by the time I came to New York
Speaker 1: with my as a young bride and pregnant. I already
Speaker 1: had with me a suitcase full of samples, and that
Speaker 1: was the beginning of my career. I loved your advice
Speaker 1: to women because it's the same thing that I tell
Speaker 1: young women, and including my two daughters about twenty Yeah,
Speaker 1: they were, I know, they're grown up women now. And
Speaker 1: I've always felt very strongly that women should not only,
Speaker 1: as you do, Dean, be engaged in the world, but
Speaker 1: also be financially independent because you never know what is
Speaker 1: coming around, because you can't be independent unless you can
Speaker 1: pay your billiness. Well, that's what I learned. There's no
Speaker 1: way that's that's the first thing. That's why do you
Speaker 1: think it's so important? What it was that your mother?
Speaker 1: Who who taught you that? Yeah? My mother. My mother
Speaker 1: never worked because she really didn't have the health to
Speaker 1: to work. She really, I mean she was really damaged
Speaker 1: after the war, but she had the brains. She she
Speaker 1: was a force, and she always told me that you
Speaker 1: had to be. She didn't have to tell me, really,
Speaker 1: I mean, I wasn't gonna be anybody's whatever. I just
Speaker 1: had to I just had to be. And that's my
Speaker 1: big advice, my number one advice to anyone, anyone, child, man, woman, whoever.
Speaker 1: Is the most important relationship in life is the one
Speaker 1: you have with yourself. And if you have that, any
Speaker 1: other relationship is a plus another. And to be needy
Speaker 1: is a very unattractive condition. I agree. But you know
Speaker 1: the thing is, I know you feel that way, but
Speaker 1: you also through the years have been racked with self doubt, insecurity.
Speaker 1: I know that you called there's a passage in your
Speaker 1: book where you talk about calling Anna Wint where I
Speaker 1: believe you know she was having lunch breakfast like that.
Speaker 1: She wasn't where you are sitting now. And it was
Speaker 1: the morning, and I said, Anna, do you ever feel
Speaker 1: like a loser? And she said all the time. I
Speaker 1: mean most people, only only real losers don't feel like losers.
Speaker 1: You know, IM put that on a pillow. Only real
Speaker 1: losers was interviewing you, and you asked the interviewer, don't
Speaker 1: you ever get up sometimes in the morning and feel
Speaker 1: like a loser? And the interviewer said, no, never, and
Speaker 1: you were sort of shocked, and you said, oh, I
Speaker 1: get up and feel like a loser all the time.
Speaker 1: I feel like a loser all the time. Do you
Speaker 1: feel like a losersant okay, but but you know so
Speaker 1: the word loser is a very un active word actually,
Speaker 1: but but but the point is that you have doubts
Speaker 1: and oh, best quote and this is not my quote,
Speaker 1: but I use it all the time because when you
Speaker 1: do feel like that, this is what you have to
Speaker 1: speak out, allowed to yourself, and you say, when you
Speaker 1: doubt your power, you give power to your doubts. That's
Speaker 1: a very good one who said that. I think it's
Speaker 1: worth there, but I'm not completely about Zach. We'll say
Speaker 1: it's DVF. We'll be back soon with DVF. Right after
Speaker 1: we hear from some of our sponsors. What's your middle name?
Speaker 1: Macm okay, Oh, that's good, b MG and k A. C.
Speaker 1: Will be back soon with DVF. And now back to
Speaker 1: our conversation with the one, the Only, Dion bon Thurstenburg.
Speaker 1: We should say, by the way, that being self reliant
Speaker 1: and independent doesn't mean, in your view, that you don't
Speaker 1: rely on other people. And you talked in the book
Speaker 1: and in other interviews about the role of your husband's
Speaker 1: and mentors throughout your life. And one of your really
Speaker 1: critical early mentors was Diana Breland, who was a legendary
Speaker 1: editor at Vogue. Can you talk about the role she
Speaker 1: played and getting your business off the ground, you know,
Speaker 1: I mean to me, Diana every Land, it was the
Speaker 1: most intimidating thing in the world. You know. I walked
Speaker 1: in and I was pregnant. Actually, I walked into that office,
Speaker 1: the Vogue office with all the you know, the perfume
Speaker 1: and the clothes and all of that, and I empty
Speaker 1: in my suitcase and I put the clothes on the rack,
Speaker 1: and then all of a sudden walks this woman, you know,
Speaker 1: with a long cigarette holder and black hair and red
Speaker 1: nail polish and red mouth. And first thing she said
Speaker 1: is a chin up up up, And I thought, oh
Speaker 1: my god, this is not going well anyway. And and
Speaker 1: she received me and she said, oh, it's wonderful. And
Speaker 1: before I knew, I was out the door with a
Speaker 1: clothes on the floor and what has happened to me?
Speaker 1: And her assistant said, I think she liked it. I
Speaker 1: think she'll help you. And I said, well, what do
Speaker 1: I do now? And the assistant, Keshia Kibo, actually is
Speaker 1: the one who actually told me what to do. She said,
Speaker 1: you know, soon it's going to be market week. You
Speaker 1: should take a hotel room. About what hotel, Well maybe
Speaker 1: if you take it in that hotel, that's where the
Speaker 1: California people come, and so they will you will have traffic.
Speaker 1: And then you should try to get a little story
Speaker 1: in women's wear daily, and you should do this, and
Speaker 1: you should do that. And then I did it all
Speaker 1: and that was and indeed that a brilliant helped me.
Speaker 1: She photographed my clothes and bogue and I was off,
Speaker 1: which proves my adage that no one is more important
Speaker 1: than the assistant. Now, yes, that's right away to the assistant.
Speaker 1: Now it's true. It's well, it's really important just as
Speaker 1: a human being, but also they are often the whole
Speaker 1: that you should pay attention to everybody. I agree. I
Speaker 1: mean because paying attention is a secret in life, just
Speaker 1: paying attention to who and what and how and and
Speaker 1: talk to people as human being. That's my second pillow.
Speaker 1: Paying attention is the secret life because I think you
Speaker 1: have to be as kind to the doorman or the
Speaker 1: cab driver as you are to the CEO. That is
Speaker 1: I think critically important. And it's also so important for
Speaker 1: your children to model that behavior because children watch and
Speaker 1: they absorb, and you have so much power on your children.
Speaker 1: I know, when you actually have children, especially when your
Speaker 1: children are teenagers, you think they don't listen to you.
Speaker 1: I mean you think you're completely totally powerless. But if
Speaker 1: you wait long enough and you see you watch them
Speaker 1: when they have children, all of a sudden you remember.
Speaker 1: You realize that every single thing you said, they remember
Speaker 1: because they say themselves. So you have huge power on
Speaker 1: your child. I mean, had I known I had so
Speaker 1: much power on my children where they were growing up,
Speaker 1: I could have probably abused them. How how are your
Speaker 1: children and your grand my children? I mean that is
Speaker 1: my pride. I have the most incredible family. I have
Speaker 1: a son and a daughter, four grandchildren. No one is banal.
Speaker 1: Everyone is generous. Everyone now is a kiss of death?
Speaker 1: Is I know? Then nobody is banal. Nobody is comes
Speaker 1: out of one form. But they know about generosity, and
Speaker 1: they are kind and fun and engaged, and each one
Speaker 1: is themselves. Is anyone bourgeois because you said that's the
Speaker 1: worst your bohemian? I mean you always be bohemia. I
Speaker 1: don't know, but no one is bourgeois. No, no one
Speaker 1: is banal. No one of the things that I find
Speaker 1: so impressive among a whole list of things about you
Speaker 1: is how you have so successfully evolved through the years
Speaker 1: and changed and adapted your your role in your eyes
Speaker 1: just a bit. But and I know there have been
Speaker 1: challenges and setbacks along the way, but I really give
Speaker 1: you so much credit for noticing trends and changing with them.
Speaker 1: And how have you done that? And why has that
Speaker 1: been so important for longevity? Life is a journey, right,
Speaker 1: and it's your journey, right, And so you know, landscape changes,
Speaker 1: it rains, it's sunny, it's desert, it's mountain. I mean,
Speaker 1: people come in, people leave, but you always on the trip.
Speaker 1: You know, it's your trip, it's your journey. And so
Speaker 1: it's very important to pay attention and and to understand
Speaker 1: and to constantly who am I going to be? I mean,
Speaker 1: when I turned seventy, what kind of old lady am
Speaker 1: I gonna do? That? Freak you out, by the way, No,
Speaker 1: it didn't really. I mean I mean, first of all,
Speaker 1: I prepare myself yours in advance. I always do that.
Speaker 1: How do you do that? Well? Like, first of all,
Speaker 1: when I was I thought I would never make it
Speaker 1: to be thirty, right, And I remember I had small
Speaker 1: children because by the time I had thirty, my son
Speaker 1: was eight, my daughter was seven, so they were already there.
Speaker 1: But I remember telling them, you know, you have to
Speaker 1: take care of yourself because anything can happen. You know,
Speaker 1: I could die, And I remember they looked at me
Speaker 1: and they were crying. So I don't intend to, but
Speaker 1: it's a possibility. And so you have to be in
Speaker 1: charge of your life. So I always prepare me oh,
Speaker 1: and then then forty and then this and that. I
Speaker 1: always prepare because probably I don't like surprises, and so
Speaker 1: I like to prepare myself. So what kind of an
Speaker 1: old lady am I going to be? You know? How
Speaker 1: do I stay relevant? You know? And so the way
Speaker 1: to stay relevant is really to help people, you know,
Speaker 1: and and and and what you gain when you're successful.
Speaker 1: Two things happen once you could pay your bills. And too,
Speaker 1: you have a voice. And when you have a voice,
Speaker 1: it's your duty, but it's also you privileged to use
Speaker 1: your voice and the voice of the people that you
Speaker 1: know who have a voice, and weave this into a
Speaker 1: fabric so that you can have compassion and impact for
Speaker 1: people who have no voice. And that's and philanthropy is
Speaker 1: intimidating when you're young. I mean, I you know, it's
Speaker 1: like landscaping. You know, landscaping you need an architect to
Speaker 1: tell you can I cut that tree? Or can I
Speaker 1: plan this? And then you start planting and you say,
Speaker 1: you know what, I could do it, and I philanthropy
Speaker 1: is a little bit that way, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: When I started the DVF Award, I was so shy.
Speaker 1: I wanted to keep it so quiet because people were
Speaker 1: going to say, who is she? Why? Why? Why does
Speaker 1: she feel entitled to create an award? But if you are,
Speaker 1: you create an award because you can give exposure and
Speaker 1: money to people, to women who do things, and therefore
Speaker 1: you encourage them. Now it's gonna be next April is
Speaker 1: in a April thirteen is going to be our ninth
Speaker 1: awards ceremony, which means that the year after it will
Speaker 1: be ten years. And so if I look back, I've
Speaker 1: given over five million dollars to all these different women.
Speaker 1: They are not part of my family. I know them.
Speaker 1: I keep touch with them. Some we discovered and then
Speaker 1: they became you know, they've got more awards and more awards,
Speaker 1: and you turn around you say, wow, you know I've
Speaker 1: done something. So. I mean, at first, when you try something,
Speaker 1: you think it's so meaningless and so small in this
Speaker 1: but you pile it up. And that's what life is about.
Speaker 1: And that's why I don't understand people who refuse their age.
Speaker 1: I mean, how can I pretend that I am not
Speaker 1: my age when I've lived so fully I should be
Speaker 1: twice my age, you know, So whatever. One of the
Speaker 1: other things you've learned over the course of your life
Speaker 1: is how to cope with adversity and setbacks. As Katie mentioned, Uh,
Speaker 1: the iconic wrap dress was hugely popular and then it
Speaker 1: wasn't and then you helped to make it come back.
Speaker 1: Can you describe that there was a rough period in
Speaker 1: the middle of those two things where the business was
Speaker 1: really in tatters. You moved to Paris, and I know
Speaker 1: that you had some self doubts at that point that
Speaker 1: we had this big interview together when wasn't three Oh
Speaker 1: is it too Yeah? I just actually posted a picture
Speaker 1: of us. You looked much better than It was an
Speaker 1: unfortunate band period for me, right shore, Don't you looked great?
Speaker 1: Thing in my head was very straight and I like it.
Speaker 1: We'll seeing neither of us as please, but we both
Speaker 1: like how we think you both looked great. But but
Speaker 1: you know, I think to Brian's point, you have had
Speaker 1: ups and downs and everybody no, I know, I know,
Speaker 1: but I think for you just powered through all the time,
Speaker 1: which you know. Also, you have to understand that sometimes
Speaker 1: people think you are the peak and knew yourself. No
Speaker 1: you're not. You know when I was like on the
Speaker 1: cover of Newsweek and that I was twenty nine, but
Speaker 1: I was terrified because I knew that I was going
Speaker 1: through a difficult thing. And some other times when people think,
Speaker 1: oh she's a has been and blah blah blah, you
Speaker 1: already know that you're doing so you can only you
Speaker 1: have to kind of shut the noise out, don't you.
Speaker 1: You just have to do again. You drive your own car.
Speaker 1: The one thing you have to be is trying to
Speaker 1: be true to yourself as much as possible, because if
Speaker 1: you make a mistake because somebody told you to do that,
Speaker 1: you will never forgive yourself. If you make a mistake
Speaker 1: because you believed in it, then it's okay because you
Speaker 1: were true to you. Fashion, though was so capricious, and
Speaker 1: the business is doing better than ever right now, isn't it? Well? Right?
Speaker 1: Now is the moment that, in a weird way, I'm
Speaker 1: shrinking the company in order to change a little bit
Speaker 1: of the business model so that it can grow for
Speaker 1: the for after me. How do you change the business? Well,
Speaker 1: it's a lot, of course, you know, everything has changed
Speaker 1: because of the digital world, right, because of buying online.
Speaker 1: So a lot of effort go onto your website because
Speaker 1: you know so. So it's a lot directly to the consumer.
Speaker 1: You think brick brick and mortar stores will always exist,
Speaker 1: though I was talking to someone who knows a lot
Speaker 1: about these things. And because of the communal experience, because
Speaker 1: people want to socialize, they want to actually touch things.
Speaker 1: It's it's both, you know, the people who started all
Speaker 1: the big you know startups that started online, then I'm
Speaker 1: doing brick and motor. But it has to be about
Speaker 1: the experience. It's very there's a lot of things that
Speaker 1: are different. It's the same, but you just have to
Speaker 1: wear different lenses and look at the different way. You
Speaker 1: have to calibrate things, don't you constantly because things are
Speaker 1: changing every single day, easter and faster and faster, you know.
Speaker 1: So you know, We've got a question for you from
Speaker 1: one of our listeners. About clothing design and functionality? Can
Speaker 1: we play that? This is Brianna from Brooklyn. I just
Speaker 1: wanted to pose a question to Diane von Kerstenberg. Since
Speaker 1: she is such a proponent of comfortable fashion for women
Speaker 1: as a way to gain confidence in yourself. Why does
Speaker 1: she think so few other designers seem to care about that.
Speaker 1: I'm thinking about zippers of the deck and buttons and
Speaker 1: places that we can't possibly reach. We never have functional
Speaker 1: pockets on our clothing, So why does she think that
Speaker 1: so few other designers are thinking about the practical aspects
Speaker 1: of a woman's life. Thanks. You know, the French designer
Speaker 1: Christian Lacroix once told me that men men design to
Speaker 1: make costume and women design to make clothes and it
Speaker 1: has some value I mean women. And that's why even
Speaker 1: male designers have women's muses of women's assistant, because a
Speaker 1: woman knows what is important. For example, the fabric jersey
Speaker 1: is something that is I mean if you look at
Speaker 1: a piece of jersey and you look at a piece
Speaker 1: of saturn silk, of course the saturn silk is more beautiful,
Speaker 1: but women know that the comfort of jersey. So jersey fabric,
Speaker 1: for example, is always been used by all women designers,
Speaker 1: from Koko Chanel to Donna Karen to Norma Kamali to
Speaker 1: Dine First Nomber. You know, so fashion design is is
Speaker 1: not art. Design deals with function. So I think women
Speaker 1: women designers understand function better. Can you talk about and
Speaker 1: then world transition uh dion to International Women's Day and
Speaker 1: all that and what you're doing here? But mentoring has
Speaker 1: become so important to you, and I think I know
Speaker 1: I would like to ment tour more. I try to.
Speaker 1: But what makes a good mentor? Everyone says it's important?
Speaker 1: But how do you do it? What are some of
Speaker 1: the practical steps? I don't know. I think you know
Speaker 1: you don't know who will turn up to be your mentor.
Speaker 1: You really don't. I mean, in some cases you do.
Speaker 1: People say, oh I'm going to mentor you, and but
Speaker 1: how do you mentor others? Now? But first of all,
Speaker 1: you in my case, I I really you you You
Speaker 1: just give advice without I mean, you know you don't
Speaker 1: want to patronize either, I mean, nothing is I mean
Speaker 1: I'll condescend them or any of that. Mentoring is just
Speaker 1: giving people advice, you know, introducing somebody to somebody else.
Speaker 1: I mean today through the emails. I have a game
Speaker 1: I play with myself that my first two emails every
Speaker 1: day is something that doesn't benefit me. I love that,
Speaker 1: you know, and that, and it's so easy. I can
Speaker 1: introduce somebody to you without speaking, without leaving a message,
Speaker 1: and I can change that person's life. You know. That
Speaker 1: is so incredible, and that's the chain of love. And
Speaker 1: you do that and then funny, funnily enough to you know,
Speaker 1: half an hour later you may need that person that
Speaker 1: you just did a favor too. I mean, that is
Speaker 1: what but that's not what motivates you, which I think
Speaker 1: is so wonderful. It's like, has nothing to do with you.
Speaker 1: I like to use my magic one. I see it
Speaker 1: that way. It makes me feel good and and I
Speaker 1: use it more and more, and as I get older
Speaker 1: and older, it's it's more and more effective because I
Speaker 1: know more people, and I have gained more legitimacy, and
Speaker 1: therefore people take my word for value, and so if
Speaker 1: I introduce somebody to somebody, they will pay attention. And
Speaker 1: blah blah blah. All that thought, it's time for another
Speaker 1: quick break. We'll be back with more DVF right after this.
Speaker 1: Thanks so much to our listeners. Who called in with
Speaker 1: their thoughts. As always, Drew from Indianapolis wends the award
Speaker 1: for our most enthusiastic caller of the week. Let's hear
Speaker 1: what he had to say. Oh my gosh, Hi, I
Speaker 1: love you Katie, and I love Brian too, Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1: And I'm so excited about the Wonder Woman series. And
Speaker 1: I just would die for more of your interview with
Speaker 1: UM with Kara. It was so good. Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1: I'm so sorry. I love Kara Switcher so much. I
Speaker 1: love Recode, I love her and I love you and
Speaker 1: it was just such a wonderful like and I'm so
Speaker 1: excited about your Dyane one person for an interview, and
Speaker 1: I have so many questions for her. Thank you so much.
Speaker 1: I love Dyane on person, burd I love you Katie,
Speaker 1: I love you Brian, I love Kara Swisher, I love
Speaker 1: your podcast. It is so wonderful. Thank you so much.
Speaker 1: Thank you. All I have to say is, oh my gosh, Drew,
Speaker 1: I love you too. I'll have what Drew saving. Drew,
Speaker 1: by the way, also some great questions for Dion on
Speaker 1: which we are going to use for this very episode.
Speaker 1: So Drew, thank you for your compliments and thank you
Speaker 1: for your great questions as well. Remember we'd always love
Speaker 1: to hear from you, good, bad, or in different. Actually,
Speaker 1: if it's in different, it's probably a waste of all
Speaker 1: of our time. But give us a call on our
Speaker 1: voicemail line at nine to nine to to four four
Speaker 1: six three seven. You may just hear yourself on our show.
Speaker 1: And you don't have to be quite as enthusiastic as Drew,
Speaker 1: but we like it if you Drew. So I want
Speaker 1: to call your attention everyone to another podcast you might enjoy.
Speaker 1: It's called Ricode Decode. It's hosted by one of our
Speaker 1: wonder women, Kara Swisher. On Recode Decode, Kara talks to
Speaker 1: key players and tech and media about how they're changing
Speaker 1: the world. So whether you're a student and entrepreneur, a CEO,
Speaker 1: or just an interested consumer who wants to know what's
Speaker 1: going on in the world, you should understand how that
Speaker 1: change will affect everything. Once again, the name of the
Speaker 1: show is Recode Decode, hosted by Kara Swisher. You can
Speaker 1: find it and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. And
Speaker 1: now back to the one, the Only Dion von Furstenburg.
Speaker 1: So this podcast is going to air on International Women's Day,
Speaker 1: and you're hosting a four day event here for that occasion,
Speaker 1: and can you tell us a little bit more about
Speaker 1: what you're up to and wine. Well, I always, I
Speaker 1: mean as a European, I always celebrated International Women's Day,
Speaker 1: even before I remember ten years ago, almost no one
Speaker 1: in America celebrated that. So I always have celebrated that.
Speaker 1: So this time we decided that we were going to
Speaker 1: do it not just a one day event, but it's
Speaker 1: actually a five days event and create panels and you know,
Speaker 1: and make it a celebratory but also networking. That's great.
Speaker 1: You know. Part of the DVF Award is one award
Speaker 1: that is People's Voice, so people everybody can vote. And
Speaker 1: the reason that I did that is that I therefore
Speaker 1: can have even though I will only have one winner,
Speaker 1: I can expose four, So I can expose four people
Speaker 1: who are doing great works. So exposure is really part
Speaker 1: of what you can give them. You give them money,
Speaker 1: but exposure is too and then they get and then
Speaker 1: they get more support. So the four people that you
Speaker 1: can vote from is and you can go on DVF
Speaker 1: Awards dot com and you can vote and please I
Speaker 1: encourage everybody to vote because your vote is important. So
Speaker 1: the nominees are Aaron Louis Coutraro of She Should Run
Speaker 1: and It's an organization that is nonpartisan that helps women
Speaker 1: to run for office. The second award is Luma Moffle
Speaker 1: of Fugiz Family. This is a nonprofit organization that uses
Speaker 1: the power of soccer, education and community to empower refugee
Speaker 1: children to successfully integrate in the US. The third people
Speaker 1: to vote for is Laura Hackney and Jessica Hapley from
Speaker 1: Any Canons, a non governmental organization working to transform survivors
Speaker 1: of human trafficking into software professionals. Human trafficking is so
Speaker 1: horrible and it is everywhere and it doesn't get at it.
Speaker 1: There's so much great one and if you can change that,
Speaker 1: that is a very very big thing. And the last,
Speaker 1: but not least, is Georgie Smith who has created a
Speaker 1: Sense of Home, which is a nonprofit organization based in
Speaker 1: Los Angeles that is dedicated to create homes, community and
Speaker 1: the new beginning for foster youth after exiting the first
Speaker 1: It can which an amazing organization. Amazing So all of
Speaker 1: those four are very important, so please go on DVF
Speaker 1: a world dot com and people's voice, and look at it,
Speaker 1: know about it, vote for it, tell your friend to
Speaker 1: vote for it, and and then get involved if you
Speaker 1: want to. Even just highlighting these four individuals and the
Speaker 1: great work they're doing is giving them a much higher profile.
Speaker 1: I feel bad because I would like to vote for
Speaker 1: all of them because you know, honestly, they're all doing
Speaker 1: extraordinary ordinary. But by the way, by giving them exposure,
Speaker 1: then you know, maybe there will be next time on
Speaker 1: the CNN hero on this one, on that one. That's
Speaker 1: that's what we do, and that's and and we all
Speaker 1: like a family. So please vote. And you know what's
Speaker 1: your reaction to this me too moment times up in Hollywood,
Speaker 1: to this whole movement to overcome sexual assault and harassment? Um,
Speaker 1: there was you know you gave and say, there was
Speaker 1: a quote you gave that struck me where you said
Speaker 1: a lot of men, including my husband, say, oh, but
Speaker 1: men won't be able to flirt. Yeah. Okay. So, first
Speaker 1: of all, when I grew up part of the generation
Speaker 1: that you just assumed that if you were a woman,
Speaker 1: you had your periods every month and you constantly will
Speaker 1: get groped. That's it. That's just part of as sure
Speaker 1: as the monthly cycle. I mean, that's just part of
Speaker 1: being a woman. And so you manage yourself and you
Speaker 1: did the best you can, and you defended yourself and
Speaker 1: as I did, and whatever, and and and you never
Speaker 1: even mentioned the stories to anyone, because what's the point,
Speaker 1: you know. But I was also lucky in the sense
Speaker 1: that I only had three bosses before I was I
Speaker 1: started my own business. And sure, indeed they all tried
Speaker 1: to seduce me, and some in a more cavalier way
Speaker 1: than others, but very quickly I was my own boss.
Speaker 1: So I never dealt with the pressure of being in
Speaker 1: a job that I liked, that I was good at,
Speaker 1: that I had to pay my my bills. I have
Speaker 1: children at home, and I was afraid my boss would
Speaker 1: rest me and I couldn't say anything because if I
Speaker 1: said anything, they would say that I'm completely so I
Speaker 1: never really So I think that what has happened is great.
Speaker 1: Does it have collateral damage, Yes, do people come out
Speaker 1: and say things that were for sure, But if you
Speaker 1: compare the collateral damage to the amount of harassment that
Speaker 1: has been it's nothing. And I think that now you know,
Speaker 1: the genie came out of the of the bottle and
Speaker 1: it's not going back. And I think that it is
Speaker 1: very important and I'm all for it and I think that,
Speaker 1: but again, you know, we have to be careful. Like
Speaker 1: my husband actually gets offended when I wear this shirt
Speaker 1: in charge, you know, and yet he's so understanding and
Speaker 1: completely supportive and he's never made me feel small and everything.
Speaker 1: But he said you should say in charge and vulnerable.
Speaker 1: I say no, I don't want to say charge and valerable.
Speaker 1: That's so funny. I know why because because it is,
Speaker 1: because it's an adjustment and they take it in an
Speaker 1: aggressive way. And by the way, being in charge doesn't
Speaker 1: mean that, you know, I'm constantly in the driving scene.
Speaker 1: Being in charge is being in charge of your vulnerability
Speaker 1: as well. It's just you know, just make sure that
Speaker 1: you are in charge of you. When you think about
Speaker 1: change though, and this is something that I think a
Speaker 1: lot about, in addition to awareness and attention to speaking out,
Speaker 1: what positive policy change ages, what positive changes can come
Speaker 1: from this movement that will actually really well, more change
Speaker 1: to the equation equality first and more more, how do
Speaker 1: you achieve that More women in office, for sure, more
Speaker 1: women in leadership roles? Yes, and more in equal pay
Speaker 1: and just equality. You know, the problem is women are stronger,
Speaker 1: so we have to Sorry, Brian, it's true, and I know,
Speaker 1: so when we become equal, you know, it's it's we
Speaker 1: just have to make sure that you know, we I
Speaker 1: mean men just say okay, maybe we should do honor men,
Speaker 1: you know, I mean they it's very threatening two men.
Speaker 1: I worry too because I had someone say to me
Speaker 1: her husband, she's a doctor, husband's a very successful businessman,
Speaker 1: and she said, my husband told me he will never
Speaker 1: mentor I young woman again. And that just broke my
Speaker 1: heart because now there's so much concern. Yes, but but
Speaker 1: I know, but that is part of the collateral damage,
Speaker 1: you know, I mean, and maybe a short term response
Speaker 1: maybe on the business woman on the business trip. We
Speaker 1: don't take the women. But that's why we need women
Speaker 1: in management, because then it's their decision. You mentioned Barry,
Speaker 1: and I just have to ask you about him. You
Speaker 1: all have been married since two thousand one, and I
Speaker 1: didn't realize until I reread the book that you all
Speaker 1: actually knew each other in your early thirties. Oh we
Speaker 1: fell in love. I wasn't thirty years you were in
Speaker 1: your late twenties and he was thirty two and I
Speaker 1: know thirty three. And yes, we fell in love and
Speaker 1: very much so. And we stayed together for five years
Speaker 1: and then I left and but we stayed always very
Speaker 1: close and somehow we knew we would end up together.
Speaker 1: And we always knew that. And what is about him?
Speaker 1: You dedicate this book to him for protecting all of you,
Speaker 1: you know, your children and the people you love, and
Speaker 1: and what is it about this relationship that makes it
Speaker 1: work so? Well? Listen, it's very mysterious relationships as so mysterious.
Speaker 1: Barry was first my lover, then my friend and my husband. Uh,
Speaker 1: he has failed so many roles. He's been in my
Speaker 1: life for so long. I mean he has known my
Speaker 1: children since they were tiny, so you know, I gave
Speaker 1: him a family. Uh, it's it's and now it's just
Speaker 1: so obvious, you know. Now it's like forty five years
Speaker 1: that we know each other. Wow, I mean, it's it's
Speaker 1: so But we always knew very early in in in
Speaker 1: our relationship. We he came to the country and we
Speaker 1: were driving back to New York and h and Barry
Speaker 1: drives very fast and then he has to slow down
Speaker 1: to let this very very old couple across the street,
Speaker 1: and they were helping each other and holding each other,
Speaker 1: and in a very weird way, both of us at
Speaker 1: the same time looked at that couple and knew that
Speaker 1: one day we would be that couple. And we both
Speaker 1: remember that image completely vividly. The only thing we disagree
Speaker 1: on he thought, he thinks it's Madison Avenue, and I
Speaker 1: know it wasn't Lexington Avenue. In your book, you wrote
Speaker 1: his friends were incredulous. No one had known him with
Speaker 1: a woman before. Yeah, yeah, no it was. He was
Speaker 1: incredulous too, And but it was real love. I mean
Speaker 1: it was and now we know how that it was
Speaker 1: real love. And you know, it's only when you look
Speaker 1: back and you see and and this unconditional love, and it's, uh,
Speaker 1: it's been amazing. I never thought that would I mean,
Speaker 1: I kind of knew it would end up together, but
Speaker 1: I didn't really know that it would be so meaningful.
Speaker 1: In in in in our Lives. You said recently to
Speaker 1: our old Yahoo colleague Josie that every marriage is open,
Speaker 1: or should be. And I just thought about that for
Speaker 1: a second. My my wife is not going to be
Speaker 1: thrilled with that. What does it mean open. Well, what
Speaker 1: does it mean to you? You're the one who said it.
Speaker 1: Oh but I said that with my first marriage. Uh yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean maybe you were refraining to you at first.
Speaker 1: I was that was a little defensives. And yeah, but
Speaker 1: everything should be open. I mean everything should be open. Marriage,
Speaker 1: not marriage, you, yourself, everything. I mean, I'm very transparent
Speaker 1: and I don't lie, so as a result, I can't
Speaker 1: be blackmail abone. And you feel very strongly about the
Speaker 1: lying thing that the lying, Yeah, that really struck me reading.
Speaker 1: I would not allow lying in in my families ever, ever, ever, ever,
Speaker 1: lie ever lie. I hate lies. I don't lie. I
Speaker 1: never will lie. That was very clear. But then you
Speaker 1: become you know, very kilful as as you know sometimes
Speaker 1: of how to say the truth. You never say a
Speaker 1: white line like you know, if somebody says, does this
Speaker 1: make me look fat? You say no, it's not the
Speaker 1: dress that makes no. I want to say, I wouldn't
Speaker 1: say that's just me. That's not being honest. Well, it's
Speaker 1: so inspiring to just sit here with you, and I
Speaker 1: love that you embrace every age. You're my role model
Speaker 1: and really striving at every age. And here you are
Speaker 1: seventy one, and when you look at the next decade, Dione,
Speaker 1: what what do you see as your goal and your
Speaker 1: passion and your life. Well, right now I am transforming
Speaker 1: the business model of my company and so that I
Speaker 1: can put it in good hands so that it can
Speaker 1: go on its own. And I want really to focus
Speaker 1: on on on my voice and making a difference and
Speaker 1: helping out and and and using using my voice and
Speaker 1: using my experience and using my connections to make to
Speaker 1: make it a better a better wound. Well, you've done that,
Speaker 1: I think almost all your life, really well, but certainly
Speaker 1: more in the last decade. You do more as you
Speaker 1: get older. I mean, for sure, and and and and
Speaker 1: it's normal that's what you do. But because you have
Speaker 1: more experience, and actually you have more of a voice,
Speaker 1: because when you're very young you say, well, who am
Speaker 1: I to say that? Right? I mean, now I feel
Speaker 1: like I've earned it, you know I've earned it with
Speaker 1: yours have you? I've earned it with experience. I've learned,
Speaker 1: with making mistakes and having successes. And you have nothing
Speaker 1: left to prove but everything to give. Yeah, you still
Speaker 1: have a lot to prove. You want to ask the
Speaker 1: listener question before sure, this young man called. He was
Speaker 1: hyper ventilating, Dion that we were talking to you. His
Speaker 1: name is Drew Shemily. He's from Indianapolis. He honestly, I
Speaker 1: thought he was going to have a heart attack. But
Speaker 1: he has a very sort of fashion question. What does
Speaker 1: Dion think of the se now, Buy now model that's
Speaker 1: popped up? He said, Designers traditionally show their collections before production.
Speaker 1: With see now, Buy Now, though the closes are available
Speaker 1: to buy immediately after they appear on the runway. No,
Speaker 1: I think that the I'm the one who raised that
Speaker 1: years ago as the head of the cd A, because
Speaker 1: with social media and with influences and all of that,
Speaker 1: it was very very confusing for the consumer to see
Speaker 1: things out there and then to go to the shop
Speaker 1: and see something entirely different. So the gap had to
Speaker 1: to merge. So I think it is very important that
Speaker 1: when you, I mean for us right now, as a company,
Speaker 1: we decided that we put the woman at the center
Speaker 1: of everything we do, and therefore when we show something,
Speaker 1: we message it at the same time and people and
Speaker 1: it's it's it's or it's a month later, but it's
Speaker 1: it's not so because before it was all for trade.
Speaker 1: The fashion shows used to be for trade, so you
Speaker 1: maybe you maybe you would only see one picture and
Speaker 1: that was it. But now it's no longer like you
Speaker 1: would see things six to nine months before they're available,
Speaker 1: and I'd be like, wait, what, there's winter, So that's
Speaker 1: why you have to It's but but that's all part
Speaker 1: of the you know, the disruption of the digital one.
Speaker 1: So Drew, there you go. Dione answered your question. I
Speaker 1: know you're going to be very excited and and my
Speaker 1: final question is incredibly shallow. But I love the way
Speaker 1: that you don't do stuff to your face because I
Speaker 1: watched the Oscars and I thought, some of those ladies,
Speaker 1: you can't get a match near them, you know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying. You know, I don't know. I I look
Speaker 1: at that too, and then I said, I appreciate it,
Speaker 1: and what But in a weird way, I kind of
Speaker 1: find interesting what time does to you and what time
Speaker 1: does to your face that all of a sudden you
Speaker 1: have this that you didn't have before, but it's there
Speaker 1: because of so much expression that you had. So I
Speaker 1: know that I'm probably people probably look at me and say,
Speaker 1: why why she do things? I love it? Can I
Speaker 1: just say I love it, and I look beautiful, by
Speaker 1: the way. I don't know about that, but it's it's
Speaker 1: just a decision and whatever. But I wish more women
Speaker 1: would do this, because I think what's hard for women
Speaker 1: is when they don't age naturally. Of course, in a year,
Speaker 1: I'll probably come in with looking like I'm pulling five
Speaker 1: gees from a facelift. I'm getting it. I don't think so,
Speaker 1: but I don't. I think people aren't used to seeing
Speaker 1: people look natural, and so as a result, they're they're
Speaker 1: they're almost conditioned have Lothian style to see women's feelings
Speaker 1: that and then everybody starts to love everything but is upholsted.
Speaker 1: But I don't judge, and you can leave that to me.
Speaker 1: It's okay, it's listen, this is my choice, and at
Speaker 1: this point that's my choice. And and and then and
Speaker 1: then you get to be that old and then all
Speaker 1: of a sudden becomes interesting again. And and uh, I mean,
Speaker 1: what I don't understand is people who say, oh, you
Speaker 1: don't look your age. I don't tell me that. Tell
Speaker 1: me you look great for your age. That's a compliment,
Speaker 1: But you don't look your age. I am my age.
Speaker 1: I've lived every single day so fully. I deserve to
Speaker 1: be my age. I cannot. I don't want not to
Speaker 1: be my age. I just want to be the best
Speaker 1: of what I can in my age. It's so weird.
Speaker 1: I mean, when children are little, Oh you're eight years old, Great,
Speaker 1: you're gonna be ten. Oh, you're twelve, and then all
Speaker 1: of a sudden, you know, you stop celebrating that you
Speaker 1: are getting older. It's it's it's a very odd thing.
Speaker 1: I try to celebrate and I try to be incredibly
Speaker 1: transparent that I'm sixty one years old, and I'm okay
Speaker 1: with that. I mean, sometimes I'm like, the only thing
Speaker 1: that upsets me is that I don't want to stop,
Speaker 1: and I don't I don't want to die. Well, I mean,
Speaker 1: but if you were told, let me tell you something,
Speaker 1: if you somebody told me that I would never die,
Speaker 1: I think that really would confuse me. I don't think
Speaker 1: I would like that at all. So you're not afraid
Speaker 1: at all of death. I wanted to be the longest
Speaker 1: away from me than possible. But I think that to
Speaker 1: know that you will die is giving more value to
Speaker 1: your life. Before we go, Can I ask one thing
Speaker 1: that maybe a little funny Barbara streisand got a lot
Speaker 1: of attention for announcing that she had cloned her dog.
Speaker 1: You also cloned your dog. Well, my husband closing these songs?
Speaker 1: How about that? And you know who knows? I said,
Speaker 1: I would joke that maybe he's cloning me. Maybe there's
Speaker 1: a twelve year lady somewhere. We should all be so lucky.
Speaker 1: Dion on fer Senburgh, thank you. This was so fun.
Speaker 1: I love seeing you. Thanks, Thank you well. Folks. Up
Speaker 1: marks the end of our show and the finale of
Speaker 1: our wonder women's series. It was fun, wasn't it. Brian
Speaker 1: only men from now on? That's enough of the women,
Speaker 1: only white men, right, perfect? So I really liked working
Speaker 1: on our first series for the show, and I don't
Speaker 1: think it's going to be our last. Yeah, we'd love
Speaker 1: to get ideas from other folks. What would they like
Speaker 1: to have a deep dive on. I'm no, we're thinking
Speaker 1: about doing a series on cancer, and there's so many
Speaker 1: other topics that deserve I think not just one podcast,
Speaker 1: but several podcasts. So we'd love to hear from you.
Speaker 1: What are you all interested in? Because we're here not
Speaker 1: only to feed our own curiosities, but also to serve you.
Speaker 1: That's right. We're here to serve you, help us, help you,
Speaker 1: and leave us a message with your ideas for new
Speaker 1: series at nine to nine, two to four, four, six,
Speaker 1: three seven or comments at kirk podcast dot com. By
Speaker 1: the way, we oh big thank you to Dion von
Speaker 1: Fersenburgh and her entire staff for hosting us at her
Speaker 1: beautiful office for this episode. Thanks also to Gianna Palmer,
Speaker 1: our producer, our audio engineer, Charod O'Connell, our assistant producer,
Speaker 1: Nora Richie. What can I say, It takes a village people.
Speaker 1: Also my assistant Beth Demaz, who I don't know. I
Speaker 1: couldn't get dressed in the morning without bath, much less
Speaker 1: figure out how to get anywhere literally Bena over at
Speaker 1: Katie Kirk Media, Alison Bresnik, who takes my Instagram stories
Speaker 1: by storm with a little help from me. If you
Speaker 1: ever wonder though, who's holding the camera, usually it is
Speaker 1: Allison Mark Phillips or at our theme music. And you
Speaker 1: can find Katie on social media under Katie Kurk me
Speaker 1: on Twitter at Goldsmith b. Katie Kurik and I are
Speaker 1: the show's executive producers and don't forget to leave us
Speaker 1: your reviews on Apple Podcasts. Everyone. It really does help
Speaker 1: more people to find the show, so we would appreciate
Speaker 1: a review. Five stars would be nice. Brian and I
Speaker 1: will be away next week recording some special episodes for
Speaker 1: you at south By Southwest in Austin, Texas. I'm very excited.
Speaker 1: I've never been there, and while we're there, we're going
Speaker 1: to be rebroadcasting an episode of one of our favorite podcasts,
Speaker 1: director Ava du Verney. I'm excited to see her new film,
Speaker 1: A Wrinkle in Time, which is out March nine, and
Speaker 1: she's certainly of the moment because we talk a lot
Speaker 1: about diversity in Hollywood, about female directors, and that's getting
Speaker 1: a lot of attention these days, and she's very active
Speaker 1: in Time's Up and Me Too and all these movements
Speaker 1: that are transforming the entertainment industry. We'll be back with
Speaker 1: a fresh episode the week after next, so we'll talk
Speaker 1: to you soon. Everyone,