Speaker 1: Hi, everybody.
Speaker 2: Welcome to another episode of the Philly Show with Ruben
Speaker 2: Tomorrow Junior Jim Salisbury. I am Todd Solecki. It is Monday,
Speaker 2: April eighth, twenty twenty four. Does everybody have their solar
Speaker 2: eclipse glasses? Jim, I know you're gonna be in the
Speaker 2: backyard today, right in your garden, peering up towards the sky.
Speaker 3: I don't have any glasses, so I'm not going to
Speaker 3: be looking up there because you can. I mean, that's
Speaker 3: not a myth. You can hurt your eyes. So unless
Speaker 3: you have the glasses, be very careful.
Speaker 1: Ruben, you got your glasses.
Speaker 4: I have sunglasses, but I have special sunglasses.
Speaker 1: Don't be looking I actually.
Speaker 5: Would not be peaking at it.
Speaker 6: I don't know.
Speaker 4: We're right on the edge here in Saint Louis because
Speaker 4: I'm getting ready to broadcast these three games here, and
Speaker 4: that's t.
Speaker 5: L but.
Speaker 4: I think that we're gonna have special glasses on the broadcast.
Speaker 1: Oh that's cool, that's cool. I actually nerd it out today.
Speaker 2: I walked over the Saint Louis Library, well, the library
Speaker 2: see if I could get.
Speaker 1: Some, and they're all out, so I will now also
Speaker 1: not be.
Speaker 3: Where do you get them. Can you get them?
Speaker 2: Maybe I'll go get some any eyeglass store now, but
Speaker 2: I think as it's last minute, they're probably all all gone.
Speaker 2: So call your optometrist or whatever you call your eye.
Speaker 6: What is the actual when is the actual timing?
Speaker 2: That's a great question. I don't even know, but it's
Speaker 2: gonna be some point.
Speaker 3: Today's when it when it comes to you're closing schools
Speaker 3: and stuff.
Speaker 1: My son's getting out of school early.
Speaker 3: When it comes to celestial oddities, Haley's comments my thing.
Speaker 3: So I'm just gonna wait for that.
Speaker 1: Okay, that's fantastic. I don't know when that's coming around,
Speaker 1: but I'm gonna I'm gonna keep an eye on that.
Speaker 1: You did there, Well, that's oddities.
Speaker 2: Phillies take two out of three this weekend in d C.
Speaker 2: They lose this year finale on Sunday three two. They're
Speaker 2: four and five. I thought we should start with something
Speaker 2: that's kind of been a hot topic topic of conversation,
Speaker 2: which is the Phillies' base running. They have made twelve
Speaker 2: outs on the bases this season, which leads major League Baseball.
Speaker 2: It is four more than any other team. They've been
Speaker 2: caught stealing six times, they've made six other outs on
Speaker 2: the bases. Kyle Schwarber got doubled off at first base
Speaker 2: yesterday and I thought Rob Thompson said something interesting yesterday.
Speaker 2: Asked him what do you do about this? And he said,
Speaker 2: this is a tricky, complicated conversation to have with players
Speaker 2: because if you start hammering them on, you guys need
Speaker 2: to be smarter.
Speaker 1: You guys cannot start.
Speaker 2: You guys can't get thrown out taking extra bases. Then
Speaker 2: they lose their aggressiveness. So now tonight, what you don't
Speaker 2: want to happen is you have a guy stop at
Speaker 2: second when he could have gotten a third. So I
Speaker 2: guess I want to start with Ruben because you are
Speaker 2: the base running coach with the Red Sox and the Mets.
Speaker 2: So put yourself in Poco Figureo's shoes right now.
Speaker 1: You need to clean it up.
Speaker 2: But you don't want them to lose their aggressiveness.
Speaker 1: What what do you say? What's your message?
Speaker 6: Well, the hope is that they went over this stuff.
Speaker 6: You know, I talk.
Speaker 4: I'm pretty adamant and very It's something I'm very passionate about,
Speaker 4: is the base running, because I think it sets the
Speaker 4: tone for your organization.
Speaker 6: I think it sets the tone for your team.
Speaker 4: I believe that it can change the game in a
Speaker 4: lot in a lot of ways.
Speaker 6: And you can win championships.
Speaker 4: So Kennissey Rules basically Run won a championship on their
Speaker 4: base running in twenty fifteen.
Speaker 6: I think it was and.
Speaker 4: I think it's just a a sort of a mindset.
Speaker 4: It's one thing to be aggressive, it's another thing to
Speaker 4: be aggressive.
Speaker 6: And dumb on the base path.
Speaker 4: And they just I mean, they have some veteran guys
Speaker 4: in that on that team that are not making, you know,
Speaker 4: very good.
Speaker 6: Decisions on the base path.
Speaker 4: I always would want my team to air on the
Speaker 4: side of aggressiveness because getting that extra ninety feet means
Speaker 4: a lot, especially with as many strikeouts as there are
Speaker 4: on the on every game, if you can figure out
Speaker 4: a way to get another ninety feet somehow, that can
Speaker 4: translate into another run or two.
Speaker 6: So I think that's important.
Speaker 4: That said, and I know they have eleven bags, which
Speaker 4: is good, ranks them pretty high in the National League.
Speaker 4: But the fact that they have been thrown out six
Speaker 4: times not good. The fact that they've been picked.
Speaker 6: Off, especially on a left lefty a couple of times on.
Speaker 4: Like first moves I just feel like, you know, there's
Speaker 4: a level of concentration that's not quite there. I would
Speaker 4: assume that they worked on this stuff in spring training,
Speaker 4: but doing rob tops and did say something about, you know,
Speaker 4: this is sort of being on him. It's because maybe
Speaker 4: they didn't work on it, or they didn't set the tone.
Speaker 4: I know, every year when I was a player in
Speaker 4: the Phillies organization and then when I was a coach,
Speaker 4: we would go what we would call around the horn,
Speaker 4: and basically, you know, John Vukovich went through based from
Speaker 4: home plate all the way around the home plate, all
Speaker 4: the responsibilities you have as a base runner. And that
Speaker 4: was something that.
Speaker 6: Was really near and dear to me. And when I
Speaker 6: did it with.
Speaker 4: The Boston Red Sox, did it with the I did
Speaker 4: it with the Mets. The Mets they had never done
Speaker 4: anything like that, so they were it was like.
Speaker 6: New news to them.
Speaker 4: But I, Brian Butterfield and I were worked on the
Speaker 4: with the Red Sox, worked on the.
Speaker 6: Base running stuff.
Speaker 4: At nauseum in UH.
Speaker 6: In spring training, and we were all on the same page.
Speaker 4: Man, we were you know, old kind of old school
Speaker 4: about it, and and I think it's just repetition. I've
Speaker 4: seen I've seen. I've seen us do some things already
Speaker 4: this year.
Speaker 6: Fly balls in the.
Speaker 4: Outfield with nobody out and not tag up and advance,
Speaker 4: not make the right decisions going halfway or tagging up.
Speaker 6: That kind of stuff.
Speaker 5: That's stuff that's fundamental, stuff that should not ever happen,
Speaker 5: especially for this team that's been around a little bit.
Speaker 6: You know, these guys are you know, they're not.
Speaker 4: Oh they're not rookies. There's only one rookie in the
Speaker 4: lineup in Rojas, and I want that guy to be
Speaker 4: as aggressive as hell. So I just think it's a mindset.
Speaker 4: I think that they're not concentrating well enough. And you're right,
Speaker 4: there is a fine line because you don't want to
Speaker 4: you don't want to say, hey, uh, you know, got
Speaker 4: to be a little smarter. Well, I think it's more
Speaker 4: about just paying attention. You got to pay attention and
Speaker 4: understand the scoreboard and understand the score and do what
Speaker 4: you're supposed to do, and know where the fielders are
Speaker 4: when you check.
Speaker 6: Get on the base path.
Speaker 5: It's not about whether I got a hit or not,
Speaker 5: or you know what.
Speaker 6: The deal is. It's about concentrating on scoring a.
Speaker 3: Right Now, did you hear those two.
Speaker 6: Yeah, are those two?
Speaker 2: No, we're having technical difficulties somehow, Rubin had a.
Speaker 6: We had some realities. Yeah, it wasn't for me.
Speaker 3: So Rubin. I I remember those sessions with John Vukovich
Speaker 3: fondly because we're both very fond of the late great
Speaker 3: John Vukovich.
Speaker 6: Yes we are, but I.
Speaker 3: Mean they were they were like a signature day in Clearwater.
Speaker 3: Today is camp vuk Er vuke one on one right,
Speaker 3: and he would you know, start off, play first base,
Speaker 3: second base, I mean, where to hit the bag and
Speaker 3: stuff you learn a little league, but you have to
Speaker 3: you know, turns and stuff and where to look picking
Speaker 3: up balls. Stuff you learn as a kid. But you know,
Speaker 3: even at the major league level, it has to be reinforced.
Speaker 3: I like, you will always err on the side of
Speaker 3: aggression because I think it's not a good thing when
Speaker 3: an athlete, almost at any level, is afraid to make
Speaker 3: a mistake. All of a sudden, you're tentative. And when
Speaker 3: you're tentative, you actually make more mistakes. It becomes like
Speaker 3: they're reverse. So you know, the importance an extra ninety
Speaker 3: feet is huge. I think they stressed that a lot
Speaker 3: in spring training. I think coming out of spring training.
Speaker 3: It's on their minds and it sounds simplistic, but just
Speaker 3: you know, do it the right way. And I think
Speaker 3: this is a small sample size. I think it's going
Speaker 3: to level out. I think they're going to be all
Speaker 3: right there. But just don't lose your aggressiveness and don't
Speaker 3: be afraid to make a mistake. It's it's a really
Speaker 3: really fine line. I mean, the guy who's the most
Speaker 3: daring on the basis is Harper. Occasionally he will do
Speaker 3: something that you like sitting upstairs and you're like, you know,
Speaker 3: why did he do that? Clearly he's trying to do
Speaker 3: too much, being too aggressive, trying to carry a team
Speaker 3: on his all on his back. Remember that mistake that
Speaker 3: Travis Jankowski made a few years ago, Yes, on second bag.
Speaker 3: I always and I still feel bad for him on
Speaker 3: that because he hadn't played a lot. He was like,
Speaker 3: you know, a reserve guy. They put him in. I
Speaker 3: think the pinch run they you know, he needed to
Speaker 3: move up ninety feet. It would have really helped if
Speaker 3: they and he wanted to be aggressive. He read the
Speaker 3: ball down, it gets lost in the catcher's equipment, it
Speaker 3: blends in his dust, you're trying to do too much.
Speaker 3: You know, you're getting in the game for the first
Speaker 3: time in a while, you want to make a difference,
Speaker 3: and next thing you know, you're just a little bit
Speaker 3: over aggressive. But even though that was like his signature
Speaker 3: moment here, you know, he's.
Speaker 6: A good base he's a good base runner. Yeah, it happens.
Speaker 5: I just feel like it's a level of concentration.
Speaker 4: It's another level of concentration that at at least in
Speaker 4: the early part of the season, just.
Speaker 6: Like anything else.
Speaker 4: And I think it's part of like not getting enough
Speaker 4: reps in spring training. If you're not on base in
Speaker 4: spring training and then you're trying to do certain things that.
Speaker 6: You haven't done since last October, it's it's a little unwieldy.
Speaker 4: It's it's like you practice things and if you don't
Speaker 4: do them in a game situation and you don't get
Speaker 4: to do them a lot during the course of the spring.
Speaker 6: And a lot of guys, there's some guys you don't
Speaker 6: even get on base.
Speaker 3: During spring and Ruben tell me if I'm wrong, you
Speaker 3: got practice, You've got spring training. When the lights go
Speaker 3: on and the third deck was on, the game moves
Speaker 3: even faster so you're trying to take that extra ninety
Speaker 3: feet and that split second is the difference between you
Speaker 3: being bang out or safe. The game moves that much
Speaker 3: faster in the regular season. I just think I don't
Speaker 3: think it's gonna last all year. I think it's kind
Speaker 3: of an adjustment thing. But does the game move faster
Speaker 3: in regular season, Well.
Speaker 4: It does, And even more so with with you know,
Speaker 4: when you can make you know, calls based on the video,
Speaker 4: like those bang bang plays.
Speaker 5: You might have been safe, you know ten years ago,
Speaker 5: you're no longer safe.
Speaker 4: Right Well, you know there's replay and stuff like that
Speaker 4: that that that factors in as well.
Speaker 2: And I think everything that you guys just said you
Speaker 2: don't want you want guys to air on the side
Speaker 2: of aggressiveness is important to say because yesterday again social media.
Speaker 2: Rob Thompson has to send a message, he has to
Speaker 2: bench these guys when they make a mistake. That gosh,
Speaker 2: that would be such a massive overreaction.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 2: Kyle Schwarber after the game, I went up to him
Speaker 2: and I said, you know, can you tell me what
Speaker 2: happened that play? Just said totally bad read in my part,
Speaker 2: totally bad reading my part, and the second thing is
Speaker 2: I wouldn't have been able to get the third base anyway,
Speaker 2: so I don't know kind of what I was doing there.
Speaker 2: But he said, you know, I've got to you know, obviously,
Speaker 2: I've got to.
Speaker 6: Clean it up.
Speaker 2: And Rob also has said he's like, and I can't
Speaker 2: find these numbers, but he thought they started slowly last
Speaker 2: season too, in terms of making too many mistakes on
Speaker 2: the bases, and then they did clean it up as
Speaker 2: the season went on and they finished Abut they finished
Speaker 2: about middle of the.
Speaker 1: Pack in baseball and outs on the bases whatever that is.
Speaker 2: So they also put a lot of guys on the
Speaker 2: bases as well, so that might factor into those numbers.
Speaker 6: I think they got better and better.
Speaker 4: I generally view them as like a good aggressive base
Speaker 4: running team, but not when you're running into outs. I mean,
Speaker 4: we talked about uh, we talked about harp.
Speaker 5: You know. Sometimes he reminds me of Scott Rowling.
Speaker 6: I'm going to run till I'm out, and I you.
Speaker 4: Know, you'll you'll love the aggressiveness, but you also have
Speaker 4: to have to have some you have to have some
Speaker 4: prudence as well.
Speaker 2: Spencer Strider is out probably for the season, a huge
Speaker 2: blow for the Braves. Shane Bieber is out, but you know,
Speaker 2: the Strider one obviously has greater implications for the Braves
Speaker 2: and for the Phillies and mean, I guess I'm just wondering,
Speaker 2: you know, do you guys, what do you guys think
Speaker 2: about Strider going down and this uptick in UCL injuries
Speaker 2: over the past few years. You know, so the league
Speaker 2: and the Union going back at each other over the
Speaker 2: over the weekend. You know, I don't think it's any
Speaker 2: secret that the velocity going up and up and up
Speaker 2: over the years has correlated with the increase in UCL injuries.
Speaker 1: What do you guys think?
Speaker 3: Well, you know, the velocity is a product of guys
Speaker 3: training to throw harder and pushing their bodies further and further,
Speaker 3: and their body just their elbow, their arm up in
Speaker 3: able to hold up to the stress and the exertion
Speaker 3: level of trying to throw it harder and harder because
Speaker 3: there's pressure to throw it harder and harder. It's how
Speaker 3: you get noticed in the showcase circuit. It's how you
Speaker 3: get a college coach to come look at you. It's
Speaker 3: how you get a scout to drive two hundred miles
Speaker 3: and fill out a report on you. And it's the
Speaker 3: same for hitters. Power dominates the game. It's the reason
Speaker 3: we see the elevated or the you know, the the
Speaker 3: bat path with the launch type of angle. It's the
Speaker 3: reason we see less line drive approach, power, power, power.
Speaker 3: It's intoxicating. But you know, I, you know, the art
Speaker 3: of pitching has been replaced by the desire to just
Speaker 3: blow up by people. But I feel bad for Strider.
Speaker 3: I feel bad for the game. You know, I love
Speaker 3: the game. I love watching that guy pitch. I love
Speaker 3: watching him go out there with those Martin sant Louis thighs.
Speaker 3: You can look it up. Todd.
Speaker 1: Is he a hockey player?
Speaker 6: I like to call him Eric Heiden.
Speaker 3: Eric Heiden is a good get. Rubin nice. You were
Speaker 3: watching the Winter Olympics. I don't watch.
Speaker 1: Hey, how about Dan Janssen.
Speaker 5: Dan Jansen, he's a Wisconsin You guys remember Rick Kelling,
Speaker 5: right handed, big strong, right hander.
Speaker 6: What about Albi Lopez? How about those calves?
Speaker 3: So I thought, But Stryder drives off that rubber. He's
Speaker 3: fun to watch. Yeah, I mean last the last two
Speaker 3: years he led the majors and strikeouts, and he spent
Speaker 3: part part of that time as a reliever. A big
Speaker 3: blow to the Braves. I mean they were twenty six
Speaker 3: and six in his starts last year. It's a big blow. Uh.
Speaker 3: That said, I'm sorry to see him go down because
Speaker 3: you want your best players on the field. I'm sure
Speaker 3: that in that Phillies clubhouse they're sorry to see him
Speaker 3: go down because you know, any competitor worth his salt
Speaker 3: wants to bang heads with with another competitor who's at
Speaker 3: full strength. But yeah, I mean, you can't be naive.
Speaker 3: Braves have lost their best pitcher, maybe the best picture
Speaker 3: in boseball.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 3: The Phillies' they're aware of that. They're gonna face him
Speaker 3: five less times this year, and it's it's it's it
Speaker 3: could be to their advantage. But that said, the Atlanta
Speaker 3: Braves are a professional unit. They know how to win.
Speaker 3: They really know how to win. And I'm not just
Speaker 3: talking about recent years. I'm talking going way back over
Speaker 3: the last generation really, so you're gonna have to be
Speaker 3: your best to beat him. But it's it's definitely a blow,
Speaker 3: and it's sad. It's sad to see Bieber go down.
Speaker 3: This epidemic of elbow injuries is really sad, and it's
Speaker 3: it's it's it's the crisis for the game.
Speaker 5: I'm gonna get on my stub box, guys.
Speaker 6: I might it might be a while.
Speaker 3: We get a stop watch.
Speaker 6: Yeah, here's the issue.
Speaker 4: I think people who don't really know the game have
Speaker 4: affected the game in a really negative way in this
Speaker 4: regard we drive, we have weighted balls, we have drive line,
Speaker 4: we have stuff that has created and jimmuted it and
Speaker 4: nail on the head.
Speaker 6: I mean, everybody's worried about.
Speaker 4: Velocity and spin rate and forgotten how to the art
Speaker 4: of pitching, and everybody's worried about trying to hit the
Speaker 4: ball in the air and drive the ball out of
Speaker 4: the ballpark. And we've lost our way with regard to
Speaker 4: what the game of baseball is supposed to be and
Speaker 4: how it really should be played.
Speaker 6: And we've got.
Speaker 4: People who are now taking over the game, who running
Speaker 4: the game at the major league level and all the
Speaker 4: way down, who don't really know the game and feel
Speaker 4: like the biomechanics of the game are you should be
Speaker 4: changed because you know that's the way to have success.
Speaker 6: Well, guess what, there's.
Speaker 4: A billion dollars of people on the IL right now
Speaker 4: because of it. The body cannot biomechanically take the sort
Speaker 4: of pressure that is created by the velocities and the
Speaker 4: spin rates and the way you're twisting your joints and
Speaker 4: your soft tissues in your ooints to be able to
Speaker 4: withstand any of this.
Speaker 6: And this is the result.
Speaker 4: And so we allowed people who don't really understand the
Speaker 4: game take over the game, and this is.
Speaker 6: What you're gonna get.
Speaker 4: And so it's so disappointing because you want the because
Speaker 4: the athletes in this day and age are better than
Speaker 4: they ever were.
Speaker 6: I mean, it's ridiculous from a decade ago till now.
Speaker 7: These guys are big and strong and fast and unbelievable,
Speaker 7: but they're not taught to play the game the right
Speaker 7: way because what's become more important is, you know, biomechanics
Speaker 7: and that kind of stuff, and not the game of
Speaker 7: baseball still a game of baseball that is unique to
Speaker 7: any other sport. And so maybe the cricket as close
Speaker 7: as you can get, and that's pretty damn popular too,
Speaker 7: but that that's a real problem because you want.
Speaker 4: To have the best athletes on the field that fans deserve,
Speaker 4: that you deserve it. And I think this has really
Speaker 4: created a situation where now when you go to a
Speaker 4: baseball game, you're not going to see Garrett Cole, You're
Speaker 4: not gonna see Spencer Strider, You're not gonna see Uri Perez,
Speaker 4: You're not going to see Bieber. And it's disappointing now
Speaker 4: for the Phillies on for their part, when you start
Speaker 4: looking at what you know, guys like Aaron Nola, who's
Speaker 4: as durable as hell, and Zach Wheeler, who is now
Speaker 4: learned over the last several years how to pitch without
Speaker 4: his great velocity, to move the ball, to cut the ball,
Speaker 4: to keep the ball off the.
Speaker 6: Barrel, to pitch.
Speaker 5: I love it.
Speaker 4: And the same thing with a guy like even Christopher Sanchez,
Speaker 4: same thing. I mean, they didn't have a great out
Speaker 4: in his last outing, kept the team in the game,
Speaker 4: but he was one of the most consistent guys because
Speaker 4: he's learned how to pitch and throw strikes.
Speaker 3: Wheeler still brings it. He's just kind of easy velocity,
Speaker 3: beautiful Anne's easy velocity and everything looks to He's got
Speaker 3: a big, tall frame, big strong man. It fits his frame.
Speaker 3: He's not a grunter and a groaner.
Speaker 4: No, there's so much maximum effort now in a lot
Speaker 4: of the pitchers that that maximum effort is causing real problems.
Speaker 2: I don't know if it ever goes back, because I
Speaker 2: asked Rob Thompson that I said, it's never going to
Speaker 2: change though, right because I don't know how you go
Speaker 2: from wanting a bullpen that averages ninety six miles an
Speaker 2: hour on your fastball, which is what you should want.
Speaker 2: I guess because you're going to get a ton of
Speaker 2: guys out. Is it ever going to cycle back to
Speaker 2: that pitch ability? And he says he thinks everything goes
Speaker 2: in cycles. I guess I just have trouble seeing a
Speaker 2: time where twenty years from now, we're going remember back
Speaker 2: in twenty twenty four when everybody was throwing ninety six
Speaker 2: miles an hour and Baseball just decided, hey, we don't
Speaker 2: want that. I mean, maybe it does cycle back, but
Speaker 2: you know, right now, for sure, it's just it's all
Speaker 2: it's all velo all the time.
Speaker 4: I've heard some interesting things over the last couple of
Speaker 4: weeks that the pitchers now are realizing that they're getting hurt,
Speaker 4: and I think that's going to it's going to make
Speaker 4: the players have to decide, you know what, what's best
Speaker 4: for me, what's best for my career? And the valuate
Speaker 4: The people who are evaluating are also going to have
Speaker 4: to understand the game a little bit better and say, Okay,
Speaker 4: what's best for our organizations. Should we have the picture
Speaker 4: throw as hard as you possibly can blow out or
Speaker 4: should we have him hang around for a while and
Speaker 4: build him up properly the way you do with long
Speaker 4: toss and leg work and all that other kind of stuff.
Speaker 4: And I think the players are starting to realize that
Speaker 4: the Tampa Bay Rays, while they have done a great
Speaker 4: job of maximizing players, they're taking a play who has
Speaker 4: a certain pitch, split, scutter, slider, whatever they're and they're
Speaker 4: throwing it seventy percent of the time and they're breaking.
Speaker 4: They're going on the il and they're bringing up the
Speaker 4: next guy to do it. That's kind of and the
Speaker 4: next guy is gonna throw a hundred and to cut
Speaker 4: that fastball or to spin it or to do whatever
Speaker 4: at you know, three thousand RPMs. And I think the
Speaker 4: players are going to have to realize for themselves, say
Speaker 4: this is breaking me, It's gould ruin my career, and
Speaker 4: they have to I think they're going to have to
Speaker 4: take a stand in some way, shape or form, And
Speaker 4: I think it's one of the reasons why you saw
Speaker 4: them sort of, you know, stick their chests out and
Speaker 4: talk about the pitch clock.
Speaker 6: That for me, is not it's not the reason. It's
Speaker 6: not the pitch clock. I don't care what you say.
Speaker 4: It's the combination of having to get on the mound
Speaker 4: more quickly and then still trying to throw a maximum
Speaker 4: effort pitch.
Speaker 6: That's the problem. And and so you know, we're gonna
Speaker 6: have to do a lot better job.
Speaker 4: Of developing guys who have stamina and pitch ability. And
Speaker 4: we don't do that, then you're this is going to
Speaker 4: be the result, and it's going to continue to get
Speaker 4: exponentially worse.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's it's it's a topic that's I forgot about
Speaker 3: Garrett Cole as you mentioned Bieber, and it's a topic
Speaker 3: that is it's not going away, and it's uh, it's
Speaker 3: just bad for baseball and it's sad for baseball. I
Speaker 3: just wanted to shift back to something in front of
Speaker 3: we're experiencing right now. What are you guys thinking of
Speaker 3: Johann Rojas, what are you seeing You're seeing progress? And
Speaker 3: how long of a leash. You know, does he have
Speaker 3: or will the team give him before they I'm sure
Speaker 3: they're talking about which way to go, But how long
Speaker 3: does this thing last without getting better?
Speaker 2: Well, I when the season started, I thought, you got
Speaker 2: to give him at least a month.
Speaker 1: I thought, you have to give him.
Speaker 2: It's a month worth of at bats, just so he doesn't,
Speaker 2: you know, and get settled in.
Speaker 1: The bats have not been great.
Speaker 2: You now they will point out that he is chasing
Speaker 2: less compared to last season, and he is chasing less again,
Speaker 2: super small sample size.
Speaker 1: His chase rate is down. Is that good?
Speaker 2: Yes in theory, But he's also swinging at fewer pitches
Speaker 2: in the zone. So I feel like there's been some
Speaker 2: times where he will chase and then in the next
Speaker 2: step bat. I specifically remember this is a spring training game,
Speaker 2: but there was a game in Tampa against the Yankees
Speaker 2: where he's swinging at three pitches out of the zone.
Speaker 2: The next step bat, very next at bat, all three
Speaker 2: pitches were in the zone.
Speaker 1: Take take, take strikeout, see you later. Back to the dugout.
Speaker 2: So I wonder if he's he's I'm sure he's just
Speaker 2: pressing and thinking too much, and I don't know how
Speaker 2: long they go with him. But you know a lot
Speaker 2: of those, you know, he's swinging at the first pitch less,
Speaker 2: you know, like I said, swing swings, Uh, swinging pitches
Speaker 2: in the zone is down as well. So he's just
Speaker 2: I feel like maybe he's too tentative out there, and
Speaker 2: I don't know what you do to kind of get
Speaker 2: him get him going.
Speaker 1: But I think he needs more time in my opinion.
Speaker 2: But you guys might you guys might disagree on that,
Speaker 2: might think that you know this is going a bad
Speaker 2: way fast, and you don't want to kill the guy's confidence.
Speaker 4: Hey Tom uh Todd, you're what would you say to
Speaker 4: that biggest spot on?
Speaker 6: I see, I know that these it.
Speaker 4: We all know how difficult it is to hit already,
Speaker 4: But when you start thinking while you're hitting instead of
Speaker 4: just reacting as as Jim has talked about and being
Speaker 4: able to instinctively make the right decisions to swing, you're
Speaker 4: in trouble. And I see a tentativeness now because he
Speaker 4: is trying to, you know, stay in the zone with
Speaker 4: his swing where he's taking pitches he should be whacking.
Speaker 4: And I also see a less aggressive overall swing out
Speaker 4: of him.
Speaker 6: I mean he's he's he's he.
Speaker 5: Swings hard, always sort of.
Speaker 4: Has, and I don't see him having that swagger of
Speaker 4: confidence to do that now.
Speaker 6: In the clubhouse.
Speaker 4: He's been great, great kid. He doesn't seem to be wavering.
Speaker 4: But when you get between the lines and then I've
Speaker 4: lived it. I've lived it when I've stood in the box.
Speaker 4: And that was the one thing I did well as
Speaker 4: a minor leaguer was hit, could hit a lot.
Speaker 6: Check the numbers.
Speaker 4: Well I got to the big leagues, man, I didn't
Speaker 4: have a whole lot of confidence. And I and my
Speaker 4: decisions and my you know, and the pitches I was
Speaker 4: swinging at, not strikes. I mean when I when you're
Speaker 4: when you're struggling and thinking about things mentally, it makes
Speaker 4: it so much more difficult to hit when you're in
Speaker 4: the major leagues and you are in the spotlight.
Speaker 6: I don't, I don't. I just don't want the kid
Speaker 6: to get buried.
Speaker 4: And it may and I went through this myself, and
Speaker 4: it may just take him to go down for like
Speaker 4: three weeks to gain get his mojo back, get his
Speaker 4: get his act together again, and remember who he is
Speaker 4: to come.
Speaker 6: Back and help out this ball club.
Speaker 4: I don't know what the timeline is, but if I
Speaker 4: see another week or ten days of this sort of
Speaker 4: sane approach, I might think about sending him out.
Speaker 1: What about you, Jim.
Speaker 3: Well, I mean, you both use this word, and it
Speaker 3: scares me. Tentative an athlete can't be tentative. I mean,
Speaker 3: you know, if you're tentative on the fall line, you're
Speaker 3: not gonna finish and it's not gonna go in the hole,
Speaker 3: you know. I mean, if you're tentative in football, you're
Speaker 3: gonna get your head knocked off. If you're if you're
Speaker 3: tentative in baseball, you're not gonna You're just thinking too much.
Speaker 3: You're not gonna You're not gonna be on time. You're
Speaker 3: not gonna be on time for any pitches. So if
Speaker 3: you're both seeing that, that really that really worries me.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: I think though we focused a lot on their off
Speaker 3: to a slow start, there's still four and five as
Speaker 3: we sit here going into the what fourth series of
Speaker 3: the year. It would be a lot worse if they
Speaker 3: were like, you know, one and eight or or two
Speaker 3: and six or something, so you know the team is
Speaker 3: treading water. I guess you'd say around five hundred.
Speaker 6: It.
Speaker 3: It doesn't feel as glaring as it could be. It
Speaker 3: would certainly help if they were producing one through eight
Speaker 3: in the lineup, and they're not. But you know, their
Speaker 3: organization has a responsibility for this kid physically and mentally,
Speaker 3: and we all know the the mind leads the body
Speaker 3: in a lot of cases and athletics, and if if
Speaker 3: it's best to get him a you know, to take
Speaker 3: to exhale and go to triple A. But is it
Speaker 3: going to be that much better in triple A? I mean,
Speaker 3: there are a lot of veteran guys down there that
Speaker 3: know how to spin the ball, you know, not as
Speaker 3: sharp as up here, or they'd be here. But it's
Speaker 3: a really difficult decision. But I think the leash has
Speaker 3: to be maybe a little bit longer. You asked them
Speaker 3: to make adjustments. It's hard to make adjustments in real time,
Speaker 3: and it gave the speed in the big leagues. It's
Speaker 3: a really tough dilemma, one that I'm sure that they're
Speaker 3: talking about right Rubin. They're talking about this every day
Speaker 3: based on the four at bats they see that night, these.
Speaker 4: Four they're certainly talking about it internally. I will say
Speaker 4: one thing about is it different in triple A. Yes,
Speaker 4: I will tell you what's different about a triple A.
Speaker 4: You're not in the middle of the spotlight.
Speaker 5: Man.
Speaker 6: Triple A is like being in a different world.
Speaker 4: I will tell you that when I went down, it
Speaker 4: was almost like when they sent me back down.
Speaker 6: I was hitting a buck ninety or whatever it was,
Speaker 6: I was hitting.
Speaker 4: It literally released the albat tross off of me, and
Speaker 4: I said, I'm going to go back to just playing
Speaker 4: baseball and being myself. And then, fortunately for me and
Speaker 4: I got advice from John Kruck about this, it was great.
Speaker 6: When I was in the big leagues, you just got
Speaker 6: to be yourself.
Speaker 4: Right when I came back, I was way more myself
Speaker 4: at the end of that season that was ninety two.
Speaker 4: I think it was I just felt like so differently
Speaker 4: about my approach and my confidence, and I just said,
Speaker 4: you know what, screw it, I'm going to be myself
Speaker 4: and be my and play my game and that'll be fine.
Speaker 4: And it got better. I Mean, I don't know what
Speaker 4: all the numbers look like, but I guarantee you by
Speaker 4: the time I came back, I didn't finish.
Speaker 8: With a great you know, like two twenty that year,
Speaker 8: but I went from one ninety to one hundred to
Speaker 8: twenty or whatever whatever the number was. And it's just
Speaker 8: a different mindset and different feel and at sometimes that's
Speaker 8: what you need.
Speaker 2: When you mentioned one ninety, how aware were you of
Speaker 2: your batting average every time you stepped into the batter's box?
Speaker 2: Because I know players love to say I don't really
Speaker 2: look at the scoreboard. I don't really don't pay attention,
Speaker 2: but I know that that isn't that.
Speaker 5: Is a lot.
Speaker 4: That is a flat out lie. So you're on single
Speaker 4: person on the planet. I mean, this is a game
Speaker 4: of numbers. You can be sure that every single person
Speaker 4: are in your head. You don't want to say you're
Speaker 4: calculating your numbers as you're as you're running down the line.
Speaker 4: I mean that's life, man, And that's what I'm judged
Speaker 4: on your numbers.
Speaker 1: And that's what Johann Rojas's looking up there tonight.
Speaker 4: Unless you fifty, yeah, unless you're like, unless you're in
Speaker 4: the you know, big leagues for ten years.
Speaker 7: And even if even those guys, I mean, think about
Speaker 7: Trey Turner last year.
Speaker 3: Tree Turner, you don't.
Speaker 4: Think he was looking up there going You don't think
Speaker 4: kyleege Schwarber is going.
Speaker 6: I was in that under two hundred.
Speaker 4: I know I'm hitting home runs and I'm doing other damage.
Speaker 4: But you know, these are human beings man, baseball players.
Speaker 4: Everybody knows their numbers. Everybody knows their numbers almost to
Speaker 4: the te Sure doesn't.
Speaker 9: Matter now now that now that I know their numbers
Speaker 9: broken down, seven hundred thousand ways w r C plus
Speaker 9: my man, please, that will be the next episode.
Speaker 1: We'll get into some ex wOBA. Let's let's know will
Speaker 1: not Let's let's wrap this up.
Speaker 2: Cardinals Phillies beginning tonight, Spencer Turnbull versus Miles Michaelis, Zach Wheeler.
Speaker 2: Sonny Gray is going to make his debut on Tuesday.
Speaker 2: That's why Rob started, Rob Thompson started, Whitmerfield and.
Speaker 1: Hasha and you know, am I blanking on the other guy?
Speaker 1: And Mundo us had a big game.
Speaker 2: They started started him on Sunday because they're not going
Speaker 2: to face the lefty for a while, so they wanted
Speaker 2: to get them in there. And then Nola versus Lanceln
Speaker 2: on Wednesdays so Phillies can get back up to five
Speaker 2: hundred if they they win this series.
Speaker 3: That's what it's all about. Just win series.
Speaker 1: Man, just they win. They went too out of three
Speaker 1: every series.
Speaker 2: The rest of the way, they're gonna have one of
Speaker 2: the best seasons in baseball history.
Speaker 6: The World Series, exactly right. I mean, I know it's
Speaker 6: a slow start.
Speaker 5: I'm a little you know, their offense has been weak.
Speaker 6: It's been not good.
Speaker 4: They're supposed to be a better offensive team. They gotta
Speaker 4: get Castillanos going, They gotta get Turner going. Those guys,
Speaker 4: I mean, I know we're talking about Rojas, but those
Speaker 4: two guys, man, you gotta go get rolling.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you can get them rolling. Now. Some the focus
Speaker 3: a little bit is off Rojas, and I mean that
Speaker 3: was sort of the template from the beginning. They thought
Speaker 3: they were strong enough one through weight where they could
Speaker 3: carry him. If you're not going to be strong one
Speaker 3: through eight, his shortcomings are going to be magnified.
Speaker 4: They will at some point. It's just a matter of
Speaker 4: when I see some good signs.
Speaker 3: I was surprised that turn of strikeouts the last two
Speaker 3: years much higher than we.
Speaker 6: He's a swinger, He's an aggressive swinger.
Speaker 4: So he's also been a sort of a victim of
Speaker 4: some some umpire.
Speaker 6: That's been a little.
Speaker 3: They really, I mean, when he won his batting title.
Speaker 3: He was striking out like fifteen percent of the time.
Speaker 3: And now just I know, small sample sizes, it's like
Speaker 3: thirty this year, a very small sample size, but I mean, he,
Speaker 3: you know, so much more dangerous to putting in imply.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, and interestingly, I mean he should be
Speaker 4: He's should be getting pitches of hit. He's hitting in
Speaker 4: front of Harper, you know, should be getting pitches to
Speaker 4: hit and doing some damage.
Speaker 6: And it's really more about.
Speaker 4: The pitches that he's not hitting, you know, missing the
Speaker 4: ones that are in the zone, than it is swinging
Speaker 4: the ones out of the zone.
Speaker 6: I've seen a lot of takes for strike threes.
Speaker 4: From both Turner and Cassianos because you know, maybe they're
Speaker 4: up there just maybe thinking a little bit too much.
Speaker 2: Right now, Well, guys, Jim go get your eclipse glasses.
Speaker 1: If not, do not, do not look at the sun.
Speaker 1: Do not look at the sun.
Speaker 2: Hopefully we will see you and you'll see us when
Speaker 2: we do our next show later this week. Thanks guys,
Speaker 2: and thanks for listening and watching the Philly show.
Speaker 6: The Todd Pot