1 00:00:06,880 --> 00:00:10,639 Speaker 1: Hello everybody, and welcome to another edition of Cardinal Territory. 2 00:00:11,039 --> 00:00:16,000 Speaker 1: Jim Hayes beside Kyle Gibson and Lance Lynn, and gentlemen, 3 00:00:16,560 --> 00:00:21,799 Speaker 1: as usual, before we start, we beg okay, we want 4 00:00:21,840 --> 00:00:25,799 Speaker 1: more subscribers blue past six thousand. As you know, the 5 00:00:25,840 --> 00:00:29,960 Speaker 1: goal is to get to seven thousand subscribers. So if 6 00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:33,360 Speaker 1: you enjoy Cardinal Territory as much as we do, go 7 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:36,400 Speaker 1: ahead and reach out and hit that button and subscribe 8 00:00:37,080 --> 00:00:42,680 Speaker 1: and subscribe to Cardinal Territory. All right, gentlemen, full squad 9 00:00:43,400 --> 00:00:46,800 Speaker 1: is in Jupiter, Florida. The Cardinals are getting ready for 10 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:51,440 Speaker 1: the season ahead. Ali Marmal, who we're all friends with, 11 00:00:52,240 --> 00:00:55,560 Speaker 1: is at the Helm, thirty nine year old guy, young manager, 12 00:00:56,400 --> 00:01:00,200 Speaker 1: in the last year of his contract. So my quest 13 00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 1: to you to get us started in this episode of 14 00:01:03,360 --> 00:01:06,319 Speaker 1: Cardinal Territory. And I'm going to start with Lance because 15 00:01:06,360 --> 00:01:10,119 Speaker 1: he looks he looks the least engaged, So I'm gonna 16 00:01:10,120 --> 00:01:15,880 Speaker 1: start with Lance. Ali is overseeing a rebuild. Now you're 17 00:01:15,920 --> 00:01:19,720 Speaker 1: a manager that's looking for another contract. Right, they talked 18 00:01:19,720 --> 00:01:23,880 Speaker 1: about maybe getting him one, maybe extending him hasn't happened. 19 00:01:24,360 --> 00:01:27,160 Speaker 1: If you're Oli Marble, what's the goal of this season, 20 00:01:27,720 --> 00:01:30,720 Speaker 1: so you look good. Obviously, you have a team that's 21 00:01:30,800 --> 00:01:32,360 Speaker 1: gonna go through some growing pains. 22 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:35,880 Speaker 2: What's the goal for Ali Marble Lance now? 23 00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:38,240 Speaker 3: I think the number one thing he needs to show 24 00:01:39,240 --> 00:01:42,920 Speaker 3: anybody is that these guys can improve daily and that 25 00:01:43,000 --> 00:01:46,240 Speaker 3: he can make sure that they stay engaged when they're 26 00:01:46,280 --> 00:01:50,680 Speaker 3: going to go through some losing streets this year. These 27 00:01:50,720 --> 00:01:53,440 Speaker 3: young guys have to be able to you know, you 28 00:01:53,520 --> 00:01:55,840 Speaker 3: have to keep him accountable, but they've got to be 29 00:01:55,880 --> 00:01:58,120 Speaker 3: able to grow at the same time. So it's going 30 00:01:58,200 --> 00:02:01,120 Speaker 3: to be a trying year for him, I think in 31 00:02:01,200 --> 00:02:03,960 Speaker 3: certain ways, because it's not about winning, it's about developing. 32 00:02:04,800 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 3: And then when you're losing at the big league level 33 00:02:06,680 --> 00:02:07,640 Speaker 3: trying to trying. 34 00:02:07,480 --> 00:02:09,480 Speaker 4: To develop it, it can it can be tough. 35 00:02:10,360 --> 00:02:12,600 Speaker 3: But the main thing with these guys is you see 36 00:02:13,400 --> 00:02:16,840 Speaker 3: things that probably fans and us won't be able to see, 37 00:02:16,880 --> 00:02:19,960 Speaker 3: but behind the scenes and stuff like that, seeing these 38 00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:24,160 Speaker 3: guys grow, do their work, make sure they're getting better 39 00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:26,360 Speaker 3: a little bit at a time, and then by the 40 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:28,600 Speaker 3: end of the year, you know, you're starting to see 41 00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:31,799 Speaker 3: every day big leaguers and guys that you can kind 42 00:02:31,800 --> 00:02:34,440 Speaker 3: of build the future around. So I think that's going 43 00:02:34,520 --> 00:02:36,560 Speaker 3: to be the main thing for him this year is 44 00:02:36,600 --> 00:02:38,800 Speaker 3: to be able to hold the room and keep it 45 00:02:38,960 --> 00:02:41,080 Speaker 3: right when you lose, because it's it's tough to do that, 46 00:02:41,200 --> 00:02:43,639 Speaker 3: but also keep these young guys moving in the right 47 00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:46,560 Speaker 3: direction and you know, getting them to develop the way 48 00:02:46,600 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 3: that you need them to be to be a successful 49 00:02:49,320 --> 00:02:51,720 Speaker 3: major league team when when when the time comes. 50 00:02:52,720 --> 00:02:54,760 Speaker 1: I think Ali has done a great job of keeping 51 00:02:54,800 --> 00:02:59,040 Speaker 1: the room good, bad, things going well, things not going well. 52 00:02:59,320 --> 00:03:02,280 Speaker 1: His player played for him. But Kyle, I'll ask you 53 00:03:02,320 --> 00:03:06,959 Speaker 1: a similar question for Ali this year under these circumstances, 54 00:03:07,040 --> 00:03:08,920 Speaker 1: what are the expectations. 55 00:03:12,200 --> 00:03:16,480 Speaker 5: Uh, it's a good question. I mean, I don't know. 56 00:03:16,800 --> 00:03:23,239 Speaker 5: I think building building some type of culture that is sustainable. 57 00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:27,360 Speaker 5: I suppose I don't know that that's hard. The only 58 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:30,360 Speaker 5: people that really know the expectations of what makes it 59 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:33,880 Speaker 5: a good year are the people who've been in those conversations. Ollie, 60 00:03:33,960 --> 00:03:38,480 Speaker 5: I'm front office, rest of the coaching staff. We can 61 00:03:38,560 --> 00:03:42,760 Speaker 5: sit here and speculate what might get him an extension. 62 00:03:42,880 --> 00:03:46,720 Speaker 5: And Jim, I know you love speculating and you know, 63 00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:50,080 Speaker 5: giving everybody your hypothesis and what's gonna happen. I know 64 00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:54,640 Speaker 5: you're like that word, but I don't know. It's such 65 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:57,800 Speaker 5: a tough spot to be in. I've seen it with 66 00:03:57,840 --> 00:04:01,440 Speaker 5: Paul Malder in Minnesota firsthand, where he was you know, 67 00:04:01,600 --> 00:04:03,960 Speaker 5: new regime came in. He ended up winning Manager of 68 00:04:04,000 --> 00:04:05,760 Speaker 5: the Year in twenty seventeen because it went from one 69 00:04:05,840 --> 00:04:10,480 Speaker 5: hundred losses to the playoffs. He was there in twenty eighteen, 70 00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 5: we just barely missed the playoffs, and then they got 71 00:04:12,760 --> 00:04:17,080 Speaker 5: a new manager, and then with Rock Coball Delhi. I 72 00:04:17,080 --> 00:04:20,200 Speaker 5: don't know, only Tim and all in those guys have 73 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:24,080 Speaker 5: had those conversations. But I think if you trust him 74 00:04:24,080 --> 00:04:28,120 Speaker 5: to oversee this part of the process, in my mind, 75 00:04:28,279 --> 00:04:30,840 Speaker 5: you trust him going forward when it goes well and 76 00:04:31,440 --> 00:04:34,200 Speaker 5: when you start to move back into the playoff un so, 77 00:04:35,560 --> 00:04:37,360 Speaker 5: I think the right thing to do would be, Hey, 78 00:04:38,520 --> 00:04:40,880 Speaker 5: as long as the development and the culture side of 79 00:04:40,920 --> 00:04:43,599 Speaker 5: things go well, then you can expect to be here 80 00:04:43,760 --> 00:04:44,520 Speaker 5: moving forward. 81 00:04:45,640 --> 00:04:50,000 Speaker 1: I don't go with hypothesis. I would say nuanced analysis. 82 00:04:50,080 --> 00:04:53,760 Speaker 1: That's what I provide based on many years of being 83 00:04:53,760 --> 00:04:57,080 Speaker 1: a regional cable of journalists. But Lanes, yeah, you have 84 00:04:57,120 --> 00:05:00,919 Speaker 1: to admit, yeah, I have to admit that this is 85 00:05:00,960 --> 00:05:03,400 Speaker 1: a tough job for any manager, Being a big league 86 00:05:03,440 --> 00:05:07,440 Speaker 1: manager is a great thing, but winning isn't what you're 87 00:05:07,480 --> 00:05:09,960 Speaker 1: based on. And generally a lot of the teaching and 88 00:05:10,040 --> 00:05:11,800 Speaker 1: learning happens in the minor leagues. 89 00:05:11,880 --> 00:05:14,600 Speaker 2: When you're rebuilding, it's a different story. 90 00:05:14,640 --> 00:05:17,360 Speaker 1: So how much of a challenge is this for Ali 91 00:05:18,040 --> 00:05:21,120 Speaker 1: knowing he's got to teach these kids, he's got to 92 00:05:21,160 --> 00:05:23,279 Speaker 1: get growth out of these kids. 93 00:05:23,320 --> 00:05:26,359 Speaker 2: At the same time, he'd like to get an extension. 94 00:05:28,279 --> 00:05:31,080 Speaker 3: I think that you're gonna see. I mean, he has 95 00:05:31,120 --> 00:05:33,279 Speaker 3: a background in this, right, He was in the minor leagues. 96 00:05:33,360 --> 00:05:35,919 Speaker 3: He was in the minor league manager and stuff, so 97 00:05:36,000 --> 00:05:37,239 Speaker 3: he knows. 98 00:05:37,080 --> 00:05:39,720 Speaker 4: What it it entails to have to do that. 99 00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:44,800 Speaker 3: But what happens is you get put in a win 100 00:05:44,920 --> 00:05:47,480 Speaker 3: loss record in the big leagues that make you look 101 00:05:47,800 --> 00:05:51,080 Speaker 3: worse manager like as a manager than you are because 102 00:05:51,120 --> 00:05:54,839 Speaker 3: everyone based stuf on win loss. But I think he's 103 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:57,080 Speaker 3: you know, he came into a group that was expected 104 00:05:57,120 --> 00:05:58,720 Speaker 3: to win, he did a good job. 105 00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:00,479 Speaker 4: Then now he's. 106 00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:04,760 Speaker 3: Being asked to see the next group come and see 107 00:06:04,760 --> 00:06:07,480 Speaker 3: what we can build. So then it's like, okay, so 108 00:06:07,640 --> 00:06:10,240 Speaker 3: he came through the minor leagues doing that anyways, so 109 00:06:10,279 --> 00:06:12,280 Speaker 3: why wouldn't it be like, Hey, here's what we got 110 00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:14,320 Speaker 3: going forward. The only thing that you ever see when 111 00:06:14,360 --> 00:06:16,960 Speaker 3: you see a new front office come in and they 112 00:06:17,040 --> 00:06:20,160 Speaker 3: keep the old manager, it gives them a year of 113 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:23,720 Speaker 3: another year where they can say, oh, well, I didn't 114 00:06:23,760 --> 00:06:26,479 Speaker 3: have my own manager. So that's my only worry because 115 00:06:26,960 --> 00:06:29,120 Speaker 3: Oli and I are. You know, I like Ali a lot, 116 00:06:29,240 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 3: we're close. I just hope that he's not like sitting 117 00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:35,640 Speaker 3: there gonna wear it for him and then him's gonna say, okay, 118 00:06:35,720 --> 00:06:37,520 Speaker 3: you know, now I'm going to do my own manager. 119 00:06:37,520 --> 00:06:40,080 Speaker 3: So it gives him another year in this rebuild too. 120 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:42,320 Speaker 3: It's like, oh, it's my first year with my new manager. 121 00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:45,040 Speaker 3: And if you if that's kind of the way it's 122 00:06:45,080 --> 00:06:47,000 Speaker 3: going to go, that sucks for all. It really does, 123 00:06:47,080 --> 00:06:51,000 Speaker 3: because he doesn't deserve that. But if you're a front 124 00:06:51,040 --> 00:06:54,839 Speaker 3: office and you have a really bad year and the 125 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:58,159 Speaker 3: kids don't take off and do this and that, okay, cool, 126 00:06:58,320 --> 00:06:59,800 Speaker 3: I can let Ali go and then I can. 127 00:06:59,680 --> 00:07:00,560 Speaker 4: Bring my own manager. 128 00:07:00,600 --> 00:07:03,159 Speaker 3: It gives me another year of saying, give me some 129 00:07:03,240 --> 00:07:07,120 Speaker 3: more time, and then then it becomes okay, here we are. 130 00:07:07,200 --> 00:07:10,920 Speaker 3: So that's my only worry because that's kind of how 131 00:07:10,920 --> 00:07:12,680 Speaker 3: we've all seen it go in every group we've been 132 00:07:12,720 --> 00:07:14,880 Speaker 3: to right, you get a new front office this and that, 133 00:07:16,000 --> 00:07:17,640 Speaker 3: but the old manager wear it for a year, and 134 00:07:17,720 --> 00:07:21,400 Speaker 3: then I got two years of of newness that I 135 00:07:21,400 --> 00:07:24,800 Speaker 3: can get away with until I have to actually start 136 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:27,600 Speaker 3: proving that I'm worth the higher as a front office guy. 137 00:07:27,760 --> 00:07:30,240 Speaker 4: So it's an interesting place for everybody to be in. 138 00:07:31,960 --> 00:07:35,000 Speaker 1: See now, Lance is being honest, because we have seen 139 00:07:35,040 --> 00:07:38,760 Speaker 1: that before. But to me and Kyle, you know him. 140 00:07:38,880 --> 00:07:41,520 Speaker 1: Both of you guys know Ali pretty well. He played 141 00:07:41,520 --> 00:07:42,360 Speaker 1: for him. 142 00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:43,880 Speaker 2: There's a guy. 143 00:07:44,120 --> 00:07:46,080 Speaker 1: To me when I look at Oli, it's a guy 144 00:07:46,080 --> 00:07:49,560 Speaker 1: who can handle it. There's some pressure there. Obviously, he 145 00:07:49,680 --> 00:07:53,600 Speaker 1: knows he's gonna he's gonna take some some shots because 146 00:07:53,640 --> 00:07:55,760 Speaker 1: the team is going to go through some ups and 147 00:07:55,840 --> 00:07:57,120 Speaker 1: downs and plenty of downs. 148 00:07:57,400 --> 00:07:58,400 Speaker 2: What is it about. 149 00:07:58,160 --> 00:08:01,360 Speaker 1: Ali that you know that that tells you that maybe 150 00:08:01,400 --> 00:08:04,400 Speaker 1: he can get through this and then beehims guy? 151 00:08:05,920 --> 00:08:08,120 Speaker 5: Well, relationally, he's just really really good. 152 00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:08,760 Speaker 4: You know. 153 00:08:08,760 --> 00:08:11,760 Speaker 5: I think we mentioned this on the servant up before 154 00:08:11,760 --> 00:08:13,520 Speaker 5: we got here at foul Territory. At work, he just 155 00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:17,680 Speaker 5: Ali relationally really knows how to not only handle the 156 00:08:17,720 --> 00:08:20,160 Speaker 5: locker room, but he handles the media well, he handles 157 00:08:20,440 --> 00:08:25,320 Speaker 5: the relationship with the front office well, and He really 158 00:08:25,400 --> 00:08:28,520 Speaker 5: acts as the buffer when needing to be there, and 159 00:08:28,560 --> 00:08:31,080 Speaker 5: he kind of wears it a little bit when when 160 00:08:31,320 --> 00:08:33,920 Speaker 5: times aren't going well, and I think that buys him 161 00:08:33,920 --> 00:08:36,760 Speaker 5: a lot of equity in the locker room. I think 162 00:08:36,920 --> 00:08:40,800 Speaker 5: that's one of the reasons why players enjoy playing for him. 163 00:08:41,160 --> 00:08:43,719 Speaker 5: He walks around and maybe a lot of managers walk 164 00:08:43,760 --> 00:08:46,600 Speaker 5: around the outfields or a VP, but he walks around to 165 00:08:46,640 --> 00:08:49,840 Speaker 5: get a temperature of everybody when you're there on any 166 00:08:49,880 --> 00:08:54,400 Speaker 5: given day. Probably I don't know, and I was a veteran, 167 00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:56,480 Speaker 5: so maybe it was a little bit different, But ninety 168 00:08:56,480 --> 00:08:59,079 Speaker 5: percent of the days I showed up, I had some 169 00:08:59,240 --> 00:09:02,320 Speaker 5: type of converse with Ali about how this is going, 170 00:09:02,360 --> 00:09:04,720 Speaker 5: how that's going. And there was a lot of players 171 00:09:04,760 --> 00:09:06,480 Speaker 5: I think could say the same thing. That if they 172 00:09:06,480 --> 00:09:09,720 Speaker 5: weren't intimidated to say hello to the manager, then they 173 00:09:09,800 --> 00:09:13,360 Speaker 5: probably had a conversation with him, even if it was just, Hey, 174 00:09:13,480 --> 00:09:17,120 Speaker 5: how's your kids doing, how's your body feeling. That's that's 175 00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:19,640 Speaker 5: one thing about Ali that makes him really really good, 176 00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:24,200 Speaker 5: And not all managers are like that. So I don't 177 00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:27,400 Speaker 5: know how I think he I hate to speculate if 178 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:29,079 Speaker 5: it doesn't work out here because I think he's the 179 00:09:29,160 --> 00:09:31,560 Speaker 5: right guy for the job. But I say that because 180 00:09:31,840 --> 00:09:33,720 Speaker 5: if it doesn't work out here, Oli will have a 181 00:09:33,800 --> 00:09:37,320 Speaker 5: job somewhere else. In my mind quickly, because relationally, he 182 00:09:37,400 --> 00:09:39,520 Speaker 5: has what it takes to be a good manager in 183 00:09:39,520 --> 00:09:40,920 Speaker 5: this day and age in the big leagues and to 184 00:09:40,960 --> 00:09:41,959 Speaker 5: be successful. 185 00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:49,320 Speaker 1: He's also good about, like established establishing relationships with the media, 186 00:09:49,800 --> 00:09:52,000 Speaker 1: Like he's good on all fronts like the media. 187 00:09:52,040 --> 00:09:54,080 Speaker 5: Are you sure you guys are friends, Like, are you 188 00:09:54,080 --> 00:09:56,679 Speaker 5: guys actually friends? Like Lance and I are friends with him? 189 00:09:57,360 --> 00:10:00,120 Speaker 2: He would say no. He would say no as he 190 00:10:00,200 --> 00:10:00,679 Speaker 2: told him. 191 00:10:01,080 --> 00:10:06,240 Speaker 1: I actually told him, well, he makes me think we're friends. 192 00:10:07,880 --> 00:10:09,199 Speaker 2: I saw he can played the room. 193 00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:11,439 Speaker 1: I told him I was going to make a thumbnail 194 00:10:11,520 --> 00:10:14,280 Speaker 1: for this podcast, and I was going to pick out 195 00:10:14,280 --> 00:10:17,480 Speaker 1: an unflattering picture, just because I like to let him 196 00:10:17,520 --> 00:10:19,760 Speaker 1: know that I have a little juice. It isn't much, 197 00:10:20,200 --> 00:10:22,839 Speaker 1: but a little juice. Plus you know, sounds like we. 198 00:10:22,880 --> 00:10:25,599 Speaker 5: Where's that thumbnail, Jim, where's the thumbnail? I want to 199 00:10:25,600 --> 00:10:27,000 Speaker 5: see you do this. I don't know if you're going 200 00:10:27,040 --> 00:10:27,600 Speaker 5: to do it or not. 201 00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:31,920 Speaker 1: We'll see you watch It's on my phone and I'm 202 00:10:32,000 --> 00:10:35,040 Speaker 1: using my phone now. Now we're going behind the scenes 203 00:10:35,080 --> 00:10:39,280 Speaker 1: of Cardinal territory lance. I'm gonna ask you because he 204 00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:41,560 Speaker 1: didn't want to say it. Kyle didn't want to say it. 205 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:46,080 Speaker 1: You'll say whatever comes up, it comes out. So do 206 00:10:46,160 --> 00:10:48,840 Speaker 1: you think that Ali will get an extension? 207 00:10:49,960 --> 00:10:52,080 Speaker 3: I think he should. If you're going to let him 208 00:10:52,160 --> 00:10:56,400 Speaker 3: wear this year and firing, that's that's a dick move, 209 00:10:56,920 --> 00:10:59,160 Speaker 3: to be honest with you. There's really no way to 210 00:10:59,200 --> 00:11:03,200 Speaker 3: say it. I think with what you're building and hims 211 00:11:03,200 --> 00:11:09,440 Speaker 3: had two years of you know, conversations and everything with 212 00:11:09,600 --> 00:11:11,959 Speaker 3: Ali because he's been in the organization for two years, 213 00:11:12,600 --> 00:11:15,600 Speaker 3: they knew, they knew who needed to be moved where 214 00:11:15,640 --> 00:11:18,360 Speaker 3: and what needed to happen. So they know each other 215 00:11:18,440 --> 00:11:20,360 Speaker 3: well enough to know, hey, this is what we want 216 00:11:20,400 --> 00:11:23,400 Speaker 3: to build and all that. So if those communications have 217 00:11:23,480 --> 00:11:27,000 Speaker 3: happened and and everybody's you know, sees the future head, 218 00:11:27,400 --> 00:11:30,000 Speaker 3: why would you not a guy that's been there, it's 219 00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:32,840 Speaker 3: been in the organization, he's going to see the see 220 00:11:32,840 --> 00:11:35,160 Speaker 3: the rebuild through. Why not give him a two year 221 00:11:35,160 --> 00:11:38,640 Speaker 3: extension right now on things that are going because these 222 00:11:38,679 --> 00:11:40,600 Speaker 3: young guys will see that and be like, Okay, here's 223 00:11:40,640 --> 00:11:43,079 Speaker 3: what we need to do. Because he's good to be here. 224 00:11:43,120 --> 00:11:45,800 Speaker 3: And I got to do this or I'm not playing here. 225 00:11:47,160 --> 00:11:49,839 Speaker 3: If a guy's on a on a short leap as 226 00:11:49,840 --> 00:11:52,880 Speaker 3: a manager and you're a young player and you see, 227 00:11:52,960 --> 00:11:55,000 Speaker 3: oh we're losing and people start calling for his head 228 00:11:55,040 --> 00:11:58,280 Speaker 3: and he doesn't have an extension, you might get guys 229 00:11:58,360 --> 00:12:01,280 Speaker 3: not listening to him. That might be a thing because 230 00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:03,679 Speaker 3: they're like, oh, he's probably gone and we'll get a 231 00:12:03,720 --> 00:12:05,600 Speaker 3: new manager in next year. So if you want to 232 00:12:05,640 --> 00:12:08,240 Speaker 3: actually build a culture and do these things, the guy 233 00:12:08,240 --> 00:12:11,080 Speaker 3: that's actually good, that's there every day right now to 234 00:12:11,240 --> 00:12:14,680 Speaker 3: make these guys accountable, you need to have his back. 235 00:12:15,280 --> 00:12:18,280 Speaker 3: So that's why I think an extension is probably should 236 00:12:18,280 --> 00:12:21,480 Speaker 3: be had moving here forward this spring training so these 237 00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:23,120 Speaker 3: guys know, hey, I'm going to be here and he's 238 00:12:23,120 --> 00:12:23,720 Speaker 3: going to be here. 239 00:12:25,360 --> 00:12:28,319 Speaker 1: Kyle, I'm one of the half backwards. As a tribute 240 00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:31,760 Speaker 1: to Ali, do you think a manager who wears his 241 00:12:31,880 --> 00:12:35,760 Speaker 1: hat backwards can get an extension? You see the way 242 00:12:36,320 --> 00:12:38,040 Speaker 1: you see the way phrase that to you to make 243 00:12:38,080 --> 00:12:40,400 Speaker 1: it easier for you to answer. 244 00:12:41,760 --> 00:12:42,040 Speaker 4: Yeah. 245 00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:45,760 Speaker 5: I think if I was in times shoes, I would 246 00:12:45,760 --> 00:12:50,080 Speaker 5: be giving Ali an extension for when I think we 247 00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:52,560 Speaker 5: should be back to the playoffs. So if that's in 248 00:12:52,600 --> 00:12:55,240 Speaker 5: two years, then that's your extension. You get him through 249 00:12:55,280 --> 00:12:58,679 Speaker 5: that year. And I think it's it's easy for us 250 00:12:58,720 --> 00:13:01,480 Speaker 5: to see that when things don't start, when things don't 251 00:13:01,480 --> 00:13:03,520 Speaker 5: go up with managers, they don't care about the two 252 00:13:03,559 --> 00:13:05,280 Speaker 5: years left on the deal. They pay that guy to 253 00:13:05,280 --> 00:13:07,480 Speaker 5: get the right guy. So you give all of his 254 00:13:07,559 --> 00:13:10,000 Speaker 5: extension and to when you know, you think you're in 255 00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:13,120 Speaker 5: the playoffs, and along the lines, you just have you 256 00:13:13,280 --> 00:13:16,280 Speaker 5: have checks on where you think the organization should be. 257 00:13:16,679 --> 00:13:18,400 Speaker 5: And if you're not keeping up with where you should 258 00:13:18,440 --> 00:13:21,480 Speaker 5: be and you're not, you know, staying in line with 259 00:13:21,559 --> 00:13:25,480 Speaker 5: that timeline, then okay, you make a cage. But I 260 00:13:25,520 --> 00:13:30,920 Speaker 5: think operating under the extension would be better for everybody 261 00:13:31,080 --> 00:13:31,720 Speaker 5: in this case. 262 00:13:33,120 --> 00:13:35,760 Speaker 1: Yep, be interesting to see how it all shakes out. 263 00:13:35,960 --> 00:13:38,360 Speaker 1: We're going to take a quick break here. You're watching 264 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:41,640 Speaker 1: Cardinal Territory on the Foul Territory Network. 265 00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:46,240 Speaker 5: All right, we got the warby Parkers, I got the Raiders, 266 00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:50,920 Speaker 5: but one thing that upgraded to polarized, Sorry about it. 267 00:13:51,760 --> 00:13:54,400 Speaker 6: Yeah, these are good not only for wearing but also 268 00:13:54,440 --> 00:13:56,520 Speaker 6: out in the sun. When I become that baseball coach, 269 00:13:56,520 --> 00:13:58,240 Speaker 6: I always want to be with my kids. I got 270 00:13:58,240 --> 00:14:02,079 Speaker 6: the Hatchers. They're darker, a little bit wider for my face. 271 00:14:02,120 --> 00:14:05,320 Speaker 6: They fit perfect, They're comfortable. It's an easy process to 272 00:14:05,440 --> 00:14:07,240 Speaker 6: order these really really cool glasses. 273 00:14:07,559 --> 00:14:11,160 Speaker 7: I am a diehard Warby Parker fan. I do have 274 00:14:11,320 --> 00:14:14,560 Speaker 7: prescription glasses and I wear Warby Parker every day for 275 00:14:14,679 --> 00:14:17,120 Speaker 7: many years. I'm excited about this one. Give it a shot. 276 00:14:17,200 --> 00:14:20,280 Speaker 7: Warby Parker gives you quality and better looking prescription I 277 00:14:20,360 --> 00:14:22,800 Speaker 7: wear at a fraction of the going price. Our listeners 278 00:14:22,800 --> 00:14:25,440 Speaker 7: get fifteen percent off plus free shipping when they buy 279 00:14:25,480 --> 00:14:28,840 Speaker 7: two or more pairs of prescription glasses at Warbyparker dot 280 00:14:28,920 --> 00:14:31,720 Speaker 7: com slash foul. That's fifteen percent off. When you buy 281 00:14:31,720 --> 00:14:36,160 Speaker 7: two pairs of glasses at wa Rby Parker dot com 282 00:14:36,160 --> 00:14:39,080 Speaker 7: slash foul. After you purchase, they will ask you where 283 00:14:39,080 --> 00:14:41,280 Speaker 7: you heard about them. Please support our show and tell 284 00:14:41,320 --> 00:14:42,840 Speaker 7: them Foul Territory sent you. 285 00:14:44,800 --> 00:14:49,680 Speaker 1: Warby Parker good glasses. I think people should shot there, gentlemen. 286 00:14:49,800 --> 00:14:53,400 Speaker 1: Next topic, So we talked about the rebuild. We've been 287 00:14:53,480 --> 00:14:55,800 Speaker 1: talking about it for a while. Not a reset, but 288 00:14:55,880 --> 00:14:58,840 Speaker 1: there's a bunch of players now I'm the Cardinals. Young 289 00:14:58,880 --> 00:15:03,040 Speaker 1: players who the Cardinals have seen before. Now they're gonna 290 00:15:03,040 --> 00:15:03,880 Speaker 1: get a longer. 291 00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:04,360 Speaker 2: Look. 292 00:15:04,880 --> 00:15:07,680 Speaker 1: My question is, and I'll start with Lance on this, 293 00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:09,600 Speaker 1: of all the players, who do you who do you 294 00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:13,320 Speaker 1: think might have the shortest runway meaning we've gotten the 295 00:15:13,360 --> 00:15:16,920 Speaker 1: look now you kind of got to produce while other 296 00:15:16,960 --> 00:15:19,560 Speaker 1: guys are young enough where they might be given more time. 297 00:15:19,680 --> 00:15:21,840 Speaker 2: Do you have a guy who might fit there? 298 00:15:22,920 --> 00:15:25,640 Speaker 3: I mean, I think the only one that's kind of 299 00:15:25,640 --> 00:15:28,440 Speaker 3: in that mold he got to arp this year was Gorman, Right, 300 00:15:28,560 --> 00:15:30,840 Speaker 3: So Gorman's it's it's like a make or break for him. 301 00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:35,240 Speaker 3: I think, so that would be the leash that you 302 00:15:35,240 --> 00:15:40,160 Speaker 3: would probably go to moving forward. And I say that, 303 00:15:40,200 --> 00:15:43,280 Speaker 3: I mean he's got Yeah, that would be my guess. 304 00:15:43,960 --> 00:15:47,080 Speaker 3: I think everyone else is kind of like, hey, still 305 00:15:47,120 --> 00:15:48,800 Speaker 3: young enough and all that. But when you look at 306 00:15:48,880 --> 00:15:51,600 Speaker 3: him and what he's accomplished already with being able to 307 00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:53,760 Speaker 3: hit some home runs, when he's done it, he's just 308 00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:55,280 Speaker 3: got to get there and do it a little bit. 309 00:15:55,360 --> 00:15:59,960 Speaker 3: So leash wise, that's probably the one. I think fan 310 00:16:00,200 --> 00:16:02,560 Speaker 3: are like, hey, like letting play the first half, but 311 00:16:02,600 --> 00:16:04,080 Speaker 3: if it's not there, it's not there. 312 00:16:04,160 --> 00:16:07,360 Speaker 4: I think that would be the shortest leash there. 313 00:16:07,480 --> 00:16:11,040 Speaker 1: Answer, Kyle, do you have a guy then I'll give 314 00:16:11,040 --> 00:16:11,440 Speaker 1: you mind. 315 00:16:13,160 --> 00:16:15,920 Speaker 5: Yeah you're gonna answer it, Okay, I'll try to make 316 00:16:15,920 --> 00:16:19,000 Speaker 5: this quick then. Uh yeah, I mean, I don't know. 317 00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:23,240 Speaker 5: I think you probably have. I don't know. That's a 318 00:16:23,240 --> 00:16:26,680 Speaker 5: tough one. I don't know that you maybe Gorman okay, 319 00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:29,240 Speaker 5: but if you're going to give them a half a year, 320 00:16:29,800 --> 00:16:31,320 Speaker 5: why not give him the full year? You know, same 321 00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:34,120 Speaker 5: with Walker, Right, you got these guys around because you 322 00:16:34,160 --> 00:16:35,760 Speaker 5: want to see what they can do for a full year. 323 00:16:36,520 --> 00:16:39,800 Speaker 5: I hate judging somebody on two months of a season 324 00:16:39,920 --> 00:16:42,080 Speaker 5: because I've been that guy that has two months of 325 00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:44,520 Speaker 5: a season and then four really good months, And had 326 00:16:44,520 --> 00:16:46,720 Speaker 5: I been given up on after the first two months, 327 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:48,880 Speaker 5: then the rest of it wouldn't happen. You know, we're 328 00:16:48,920 --> 00:16:50,720 Speaker 5: in this for one sixty two. When you're in that 329 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:54,920 Speaker 5: locker room. It's something that I've preached multiple times, you know, 330 00:16:55,000 --> 00:16:57,560 Speaker 5: to young guys. It's like, hey, don't judge yourself on 331 00:16:57,560 --> 00:17:02,040 Speaker 5: one start, one week, two weeks, give yourself one sixty two, 332 00:17:02,040 --> 00:17:03,360 Speaker 5: and then when you get to the end, take a 333 00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:04,479 Speaker 5: look back and see where you're at. 334 00:17:05,440 --> 00:17:07,679 Speaker 1: So I'm not going to say my guy has to 335 00:17:07,720 --> 00:17:09,720 Speaker 1: do it in the first couple of months. I'm saying 336 00:17:10,119 --> 00:17:12,840 Speaker 1: this year, and it's a guy who you guys love, 337 00:17:12,920 --> 00:17:16,240 Speaker 1: I love him to Polonte, right, And I say this 338 00:17:16,520 --> 00:17:21,679 Speaker 1: because Polante has had really good stretches, He's shown he 339 00:17:21,680 --> 00:17:24,320 Speaker 1: can make it. Then he has had others not so good, 340 00:17:24,359 --> 00:17:26,640 Speaker 1: where he falls back into some things. I think this 341 00:17:26,720 --> 00:17:29,080 Speaker 1: is the year that the Cardinals are going to look 342 00:17:29,119 --> 00:17:31,560 Speaker 1: to him to put it all together, and he can't 343 00:17:31,560 --> 00:17:35,080 Speaker 1: be in the starting rotation. Maybe he's better suited for 344 00:17:35,119 --> 00:17:37,080 Speaker 1: the bullpen. I think he can be a good starter, 345 00:17:37,160 --> 00:17:39,719 Speaker 1: But I think in this case, this year, with the 346 00:17:39,720 --> 00:17:42,800 Speaker 1: rebuild going on, the Cardinals are going to look at 347 00:17:42,800 --> 00:17:45,679 Speaker 1: Polonte and say, all right, this year, we expect you 348 00:17:46,200 --> 00:17:49,679 Speaker 1: to be the best version of Andre Polante that you 349 00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:50,040 Speaker 1: could be. 350 00:17:50,680 --> 00:17:52,600 Speaker 2: Final question for you, gentlemen. 351 00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:55,760 Speaker 1: One of the things that hem Bloom has brought to 352 00:17:55,840 --> 00:17:58,439 Speaker 1: the Cardinals, and I don't know all the specifics, but 353 00:17:58,560 --> 00:18:01,760 Speaker 1: I read a lot, hear a lot about it, is 354 00:18:01,800 --> 00:18:06,879 Speaker 1: that he's sort of upgrading player development, meaning more tech, 355 00:18:07,800 --> 00:18:12,840 Speaker 1: more analysis, in particular with pictures. Now I've heard over 356 00:18:12,880 --> 00:18:16,120 Speaker 1: the years the Cardinals could use this upgrade. But I'm wondering, 357 00:18:16,240 --> 00:18:20,560 Speaker 1: you guys, in your stories, you're both pictures Lance when 358 00:18:20,560 --> 00:18:24,240 Speaker 1: you were pitching. How did you see player development for 359 00:18:24,560 --> 00:18:28,800 Speaker 1: pictures sort of evolved, if it did at all. 360 00:18:29,920 --> 00:18:32,480 Speaker 3: Yeah, And I think every organization is different. Right when 361 00:18:32,480 --> 00:18:35,600 Speaker 3: I came up with the Cardinals, it was throw your sinker, 362 00:18:36,160 --> 00:18:38,240 Speaker 3: get quick out, so we don't try to strike people out. 363 00:18:38,840 --> 00:18:39,520 Speaker 4: Things like that. 364 00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:42,520 Speaker 3: And when you leave I went to Minnesota, they had 365 00:18:42,560 --> 00:18:46,760 Speaker 3: a different philosophy. Yankees wanted me to do something totally 366 00:18:46,760 --> 00:18:49,720 Speaker 3: different when I got there. So I think the main 367 00:18:49,720 --> 00:18:52,960 Speaker 3: thing with all these you know, all the numbers that 368 00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:55,600 Speaker 3: everyone's chasing now is like, Okay, they put a lot 369 00:18:55,600 --> 00:18:58,840 Speaker 3: of technology in, but are where we out on getting 370 00:18:58,880 --> 00:19:02,199 Speaker 3: guys to help them use that on the field. So 371 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:04,280 Speaker 3: that's going to be the next phase, right, you know 372 00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:06,080 Speaker 3: what you're supposed to do, but you know is it. 373 00:19:06,119 --> 00:19:08,320 Speaker 3: Are you going to change everything about yourself to chase 374 00:19:08,320 --> 00:19:10,399 Speaker 3: certain things? Or are you how are you going to 375 00:19:10,480 --> 00:19:13,040 Speaker 3: incorporate it throughout the season? How are you going to 376 00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:16,919 Speaker 3: incorporate it to your arsenal, your pitch ability, you know, 377 00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:19,280 Speaker 3: your pitch shape. How you going to do all those things? 378 00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:21,639 Speaker 3: So we can get all the tech in the world, 379 00:19:21,640 --> 00:19:23,440 Speaker 3: But if you don't have anybody there to teach them 380 00:19:23,440 --> 00:19:26,040 Speaker 3: actually how to pitch, and use what they're seeing on 381 00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:28,040 Speaker 3: the tech to get actual hitters out. 382 00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:29,440 Speaker 4: It's surely not going to matter. 383 00:19:29,560 --> 00:19:33,000 Speaker 3: So that's going to be the next thing, Right, Okay, 384 00:19:33,000 --> 00:19:35,200 Speaker 3: you have all this tech and I've got this great 385 00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:38,040 Speaker 3: spin rate or I've got this great vertical or horizontal 386 00:19:38,119 --> 00:19:40,760 Speaker 3: on this pitch. But how you're going to teach them 387 00:19:40,760 --> 00:19:42,560 Speaker 3: how to get and out with it? And what are 388 00:19:42,600 --> 00:19:44,160 Speaker 3: you going to do to set it up so you're 389 00:19:44,160 --> 00:19:47,320 Speaker 3: not you know, over exposing in or you know, teach 390 00:19:47,359 --> 00:19:49,600 Speaker 3: them actually how to pitch with it. So it's going 391 00:19:49,680 --> 00:19:53,280 Speaker 3: to be an interesting philosophy. I guess are we just 392 00:19:53,359 --> 00:19:56,000 Speaker 3: chasing numbers now in tech or are they going to 393 00:19:56,119 --> 00:19:58,800 Speaker 3: chase it both of them with withouts, because I don't 394 00:19:58,800 --> 00:20:02,320 Speaker 3: know if they've added any pitching development. They've added people 395 00:20:02,359 --> 00:20:05,359 Speaker 3: that look at a computer screen effort, But the pitching 396 00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:08,600 Speaker 3: development is people that actually can teach you to develop pitching, 397 00:20:09,240 --> 00:20:11,560 Speaker 3: not show you a spreadsheet on here's what you should do. 398 00:20:12,240 --> 00:20:14,719 Speaker 3: Good luck, sir, because that's what it sounds like. Its 399 00:20:14,760 --> 00:20:15,800 Speaker 3: more is than anything else. 400 00:20:17,240 --> 00:20:21,000 Speaker 1: Kyle, tell me a story about your development as a 401 00:20:21,040 --> 00:20:22,320 Speaker 1: pitcher as you went. 402 00:20:22,200 --> 00:20:25,560 Speaker 2: Through the major leagues. 403 00:20:24,960 --> 00:20:28,600 Speaker 5: The first story that came to mind just now was 404 00:20:28,680 --> 00:20:32,840 Speaker 5: in twenty nineteen. Wes Johnson comes in as the pitching 405 00:20:32,880 --> 00:20:36,720 Speaker 5: coach and he's like, listen, as a pitching staff. We 406 00:20:36,760 --> 00:20:39,840 Speaker 5: threw too many fastballs last year, and we got to 407 00:20:39,880 --> 00:20:43,040 Speaker 5: make sure we're throwing more off speed pitches. And Jacob, 408 00:20:43,119 --> 00:20:44,680 Speaker 5: Rizzy and I look at each other and we said, 409 00:20:44,680 --> 00:20:46,960 Speaker 5: do you realize Lance Lynn was one of our starters 410 00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:51,280 Speaker 5: last year. He's now in Chicago. You cannot blame us 411 00:20:51,320 --> 00:20:54,320 Speaker 5: for Lance Lynn throwing eighty five to ninety percent heaters 412 00:20:54,320 --> 00:20:56,520 Speaker 5: as a starter, and he was a lot of the 413 00:20:56,600 --> 00:21:00,520 Speaker 5: problem here. So we fixed throwing more off speed pitches 414 00:21:00,640 --> 00:21:03,560 Speaker 5: just by having Lance not in the story rotation. So 415 00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:06,959 Speaker 5: thankfully we didn't have to make too many adjustments. But 416 00:21:07,040 --> 00:21:08,959 Speaker 5: that was one thing that Wes Johnson wanted to make 417 00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:13,119 Speaker 5: sure it worked on, was throwing more spin. So Lance, 418 00:21:13,640 --> 00:21:16,359 Speaker 5: thank you for upping the heated percentage and causing a 419 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:18,720 Speaker 5: twenty minute meeting in spring training that we all love, 420 00:21:19,680 --> 00:21:22,359 Speaker 5: even though you weren't there anymore. I texted them right 421 00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:26,399 Speaker 5: after that meeting. Actually so, but I do think Lance 422 00:21:26,440 --> 00:21:29,320 Speaker 5: makes a good point. I think Dusty and Julio and 423 00:21:29,359 --> 00:21:31,720 Speaker 5: those guys are they're the right people to be able 424 00:21:31,840 --> 00:21:35,359 Speaker 5: to take the tech and to describe to them how 425 00:21:35,400 --> 00:21:37,879 Speaker 5: to use the tech right. It really is what it is. 426 00:21:37,920 --> 00:21:40,000 Speaker 5: You can have all the research and development in the world, 427 00:21:40,359 --> 00:21:42,560 Speaker 5: but if you can't apply it, and you can't create 428 00:21:42,560 --> 00:21:45,440 Speaker 5: people that can pitch with that tech and with that information, 429 00:21:45,560 --> 00:21:48,800 Speaker 5: you have a problem. So I think they have those guys. 430 00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:52,080 Speaker 5: I think now it's somewhat getting in the minor leagues 431 00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:54,720 Speaker 5: as well. Can we teach these guys how to use 432 00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:57,239 Speaker 5: the tech in the right way earlier and not just 433 00:21:57,440 --> 00:22:00,600 Speaker 5: pitch to the iPad because I think that's one thing 434 00:22:00,640 --> 00:22:02,600 Speaker 5: that kind of can get young guys in trouble is 435 00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:05,240 Speaker 5: that they get this idea through the minor leagues that 436 00:22:05,280 --> 00:22:08,040 Speaker 5: I need to chase this type of pitch, and then 437 00:22:08,040 --> 00:22:09,800 Speaker 5: they get to the big leagues and realize, well, all 438 00:22:09,840 --> 00:22:12,280 Speaker 5: the big league hitters have seen that type of pitch already. 439 00:22:12,560 --> 00:22:14,080 Speaker 5: Now I need to be able to pitch with that 440 00:22:14,119 --> 00:22:18,960 Speaker 5: type of pitch. So it's nuanced, you know. But I 441 00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:21,439 Speaker 5: think that's that really is a big part of it is, 442 00:22:21,520 --> 00:22:23,520 Speaker 5: you know, trying to start that development a little bit earlier, 443 00:22:23,520 --> 00:22:25,679 Speaker 5: and you know, hopefully we have those pitching coaches in 444 00:22:25,680 --> 00:22:26,720 Speaker 5: the minor leagues that can do that. 445 00:22:27,760 --> 00:22:31,480 Speaker 1: If you're a veteran lance and you go to a 446 00:22:31,560 --> 00:22:35,160 Speaker 1: new team and they try to reinvent you as a pitcher. 447 00:22:35,280 --> 00:22:38,720 Speaker 1: I don't know if you encountered that, but how would 448 00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:41,840 Speaker 1: you react to that? If you're a major league pitcher 449 00:22:41,880 --> 00:22:44,240 Speaker 1: with a resume and they're trying to tell you something 450 00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:47,200 Speaker 1: that you don't do that they believe. 451 00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:48,960 Speaker 2: Will make you better, how do you handle that? 452 00:22:50,240 --> 00:22:52,879 Speaker 3: I think every team I went to, the pitching coaches 453 00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:55,520 Speaker 3: have an idea of you know, hey, what you do well, 454 00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:58,560 Speaker 3: what you could do better at and they give you ideas. 455 00:22:59,320 --> 00:23:01,480 Speaker 3: For me, I was always open to hearing whatever you 456 00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:04,480 Speaker 3: had to say, and if it's something that I can incorporate, 457 00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:06,320 Speaker 3: then so be it. But some of that stuff you 458 00:23:06,400 --> 00:23:08,680 Speaker 3: can learn and you can help your teammate with too. 459 00:23:08,760 --> 00:23:11,199 Speaker 3: So I was always on board with, hey, you know, 460 00:23:11,400 --> 00:23:14,199 Speaker 3: I'll listen and do whatever you know, try whatever you 461 00:23:14,240 --> 00:23:16,720 Speaker 3: need me to do, you know, and then you learn 462 00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:19,040 Speaker 3: something new every day. You learn that that worked for you, 463 00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:21,760 Speaker 3: you learn that it doesn't work for you. So that 464 00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:25,160 Speaker 3: was the That was my mindset on things. And then 465 00:23:25,160 --> 00:23:28,359 Speaker 3: when I kept going and you started bouncing around, you 466 00:23:28,440 --> 00:23:30,399 Speaker 3: need to get a lot of different uh I call 467 00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:34,480 Speaker 3: them terminologies, right, People always talk uh pitching, but everyone 468 00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:37,280 Speaker 3: has their different terminologies for some of the similar things. 469 00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:40,280 Speaker 3: So I feel like the more terminology you use, the 470 00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:43,760 Speaker 3: more you're able to develop relationships with different guys on 471 00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:46,480 Speaker 3: on different ways to help people. So I always use 472 00:23:46,520 --> 00:23:48,920 Speaker 3: that as a way to you know, kind of help myself, 473 00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:52,160 Speaker 3: but also help a teammate if you know he's going 474 00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:54,560 Speaker 3: through something or they're trying to you know, change something 475 00:23:54,560 --> 00:23:57,040 Speaker 3: with him, and be like, hey, I know you're thinking 476 00:23:57,080 --> 00:24:00,880 Speaker 3: this and this I think of this terminology. I've heard 477 00:24:00,880 --> 00:24:03,840 Speaker 3: this terminology of being able to do it and incorporate it. 478 00:24:03,880 --> 00:24:06,800 Speaker 3: And you can help guys that way too. So every 479 00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:08,600 Speaker 3: team gives you a little bit, a little bit of 480 00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:11,200 Speaker 3: something to make you better, and then you're always adding 481 00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:12,960 Speaker 3: in this game, you always want to do a little 482 00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:15,119 Speaker 3: bit right because the hitters are trying to catch up 483 00:24:15,119 --> 00:24:17,840 Speaker 3: to you and or they're trying to find patterns and 484 00:24:17,840 --> 00:24:20,920 Speaker 3: stuff like that, and it's teams that are always finding like, hey, 485 00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:23,880 Speaker 3: this is you know, get you ran into it when 486 00:24:23,880 --> 00:24:26,080 Speaker 3: he started to say, hey, this work pitch worked really 487 00:24:26,119 --> 00:24:28,080 Speaker 3: well for you, but you might be overusing it, so 488 00:24:28,119 --> 00:24:30,240 Speaker 3: we need to you know, hide it with this pitch 489 00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:31,000 Speaker 3: and adding. 490 00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:31,600 Speaker 4: This side of the plate. 491 00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:34,360 Speaker 3: So stuff that you just don't realize over the course 492 00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:36,040 Speaker 3: of a year, and then they see it because they 493 00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:36,600 Speaker 3: had to face you. 494 00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:42,159 Speaker 1: So, Kyle, open minded approach by Lance Lynn who's always 495 00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:45,560 Speaker 1: open minded, not stubborn at all. Do you did you 496 00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:47,400 Speaker 1: follow the same approach? 497 00:24:49,600 --> 00:24:49,840 Speaker 4: Yeah? 498 00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:53,480 Speaker 5: I think so, hold on like the actual same approach 499 00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:54,520 Speaker 5: as lance Or did I. 500 00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:58,520 Speaker 2: Have meaning that you listen with a smile and you 501 00:24:58,600 --> 00:25:00,520 Speaker 2: go okay. Yes. 502 00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:03,920 Speaker 5: I've been accused before of not listening, which was really 503 00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:06,080 Speaker 5: interesting to me because I always felt like I was 504 00:25:06,160 --> 00:25:07,639 Speaker 5: pretty open minded to coaching. 505 00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:10,520 Speaker 2: When I was bringing the question to you, you weren't 506 00:25:10,560 --> 00:25:11,040 Speaker 2: listening there. 507 00:25:11,080 --> 00:25:14,879 Speaker 5: But it's fun asking for clarification. Jim, that's it. We 508 00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:16,359 Speaker 5: can talk about after the show. I don't want to 509 00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:20,280 Speaker 5: place anybody else's time. I think you have to be 510 00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:22,679 Speaker 5: open minded. I think one thing when it comes to 511 00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:26,520 Speaker 5: a veteran coming in as a pitching staff, you have 512 00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:29,479 Speaker 5: to gain that trust and make sure that that veteran 513 00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:32,720 Speaker 5: understands that you are there only to make them better, 514 00:25:32,840 --> 00:25:35,560 Speaker 5: not to put your fingerprint on their career. There's a 515 00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:38,280 Speaker 5: lot of coaches that have been in that camp where 516 00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:41,040 Speaker 5: they just try to make changes, to make change when 517 00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:44,520 Speaker 5: sometimes it's not necessary. But you can get a veteran 518 00:25:44,600 --> 00:25:47,240 Speaker 5: to buy in if you can build that trust. First, 519 00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:50,280 Speaker 5: ask more questions to figure out, Okay, if you want 520 00:25:50,280 --> 00:25:52,920 Speaker 5: to change a slider, take two weeks and figure out 521 00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:55,800 Speaker 5: why this guy throws a slider this way. Take another 522 00:25:55,880 --> 00:25:58,080 Speaker 5: week to figure out, you know, maybe is he open 523 00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:01,119 Speaker 5: to the change, and then go after it. So you 524 00:26:01,200 --> 00:26:03,239 Speaker 5: got to build that trust and build that relationship if 525 00:26:03,280 --> 00:26:07,800 Speaker 5: you want players to really buy in and be willing 526 00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:10,560 Speaker 5: to make the changes that you would. I never would 527 00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:13,199 Speaker 5: have canned my slider in twenty twenty two if I 528 00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:16,480 Speaker 5: didn't trust Caleb in the pitching staff in Philadelphia when 529 00:26:16,480 --> 00:26:17,680 Speaker 5: he came to me that day to see if I 530 00:26:17,720 --> 00:26:20,720 Speaker 5: wanted to throw a sweeper. But it's that trust, in 531 00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:22,560 Speaker 5: that relationship that made that happen. 532 00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:27,600 Speaker 1: I trust that the people watching this program enjoyed it, 533 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:30,040 Speaker 1: and that's going to do it for this edition of 534 00:26:30,160 --> 00:26:33,200 Speaker 1: Cardinal Territory. We'll see you next time for the next episode. 535 00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:35,320 Speaker 1: Hopefully that one won't suck.