Speaker 1: From Marhart where Innovation, Money and power Collie in Silicon Valley, NBN.
Speaker 2: This is Bloomberg Technology with Caroline Hyde and.
Speaker 3: Ed loved Love.
Speaker 4: Live from New York and San Francisco. This is Bloomberg
Speaker 4: Technology coming up. Bitcoin rallies past eighty four thousand to
Speaker 4: reach a new record high, boosted by the election outcome.
Speaker 4: Where next for crypto.
Speaker 5: Plus Tesla shorts proved to be a losing bett Hedge
Speaker 5: funds shorting must company lose billions of dollars.
Speaker 4: And we talk about the future of defense tech and
Speaker 4: American dynamism and Andrews and Horowitz partner Catherine Boyle. But first,
Speaker 4: let's just check in on bitcoin. It is the story
Speaker 4: of the day. It leaps yet further another five percent
Speaker 4: higher on the day. We're at eclipsing eighty four thousand,
Speaker 4: never been seen in terms of numbers, and it's the
Speaker 4: same reasoning behind it. Let's get to that with blubg
Speaker 4: Shnani Bassack, who can talk us through basically us being
Speaker 4: the capital of the crypto planet. But what do we
Speaker 4: need to see in the short term to keep vindicating
Speaker 4: an eighty four thousand level for bitcoin?
Speaker 6: One thing is just watching the flows because they have
Speaker 6: been dramatic, and you have seen stunning flows not just
Speaker 6: into Bitcoin but almost every stock related to bitcoin as well.
Speaker 6: If you think about it over a seven day period,
Speaker 6: you have coinbase up almost seventy five percent in a
Speaker 6: seven day timeframe, and you have micro Strategy up more
Speaker 6: now today than it was the day that the Trump
Speaker 6: victory was announced. So that's just how much you're seeing
Speaker 6: the excitement around these stocks. And what's interesting, too, Caroline,
Speaker 6: is you haven't even seen some critical moves by the
Speaker 6: Trump the future Trump administration, rather, for example, who would
Speaker 6: be the SEC chair? What tone would they take when
Speaker 6: it comes to crypto? Will that make Bitcoin go higher?
Speaker 6: From here, we're looking at Salana, dogecoin as well over
Speaker 6: one week, and you're seeing the gains across the crypto
Speaker 6: atmosphere just stunning.
Speaker 5: This is an industry that put one hundred million dollars
Speaker 5: into backing its preferred candidates, and in President elect Trump,
Speaker 5: they got their preferred candidate. And you're so right about, well,
Speaker 5: what happens next? The market thinks that bitcoin keeps going right,
Speaker 5: it thinks bitcoin goes to one hundred thousand US dollars
Speaker 5: for token, It does well.
Speaker 6: Let me give you one man's example for what we
Speaker 6: heard this morning. We talked to a metified CEO, Frank Speiser.
Speaker 6: He gave us essentially a target of about one hundred
Speaker 6: thousand dollars for the end of the year and one
Speaker 6: hundred and fifty into next year. Towards the end of
Speaker 6: next year, so a significant move higher. But the one
Speaker 6: hundred thousand dollars time frame he gave us was also
Speaker 6: what he had given us before. So the additional upside
Speaker 6: remains a question at least what it looks like for
Speaker 6: the next year or so. To the point that you've
Speaker 6: been making flows have driven the story here, but what
Speaker 6: about fundamentals and is there anything here?
Speaker 3: You just take the beginning of the.
Speaker 6: Year, for example, when you saw the new bitcoin ETFs
Speaker 6: approved by the SEC. You saw a huge run up
Speaker 6: into that moment, but a leveling off for a long time.
Speaker 6: Ed you and I have sat here talking about it.
Speaker 3: One question I.
Speaker 6: Have is the assets outside of Bitcoin, the places where
Speaker 6: the SEC had cracked down on different forms of tokens
Speaker 6: that are trading on exchanges.
Speaker 3: Do you see more of a flow.
Speaker 6: Into that and does that take away from Bitcoin at all?
Speaker 6: Something to keep an eye on. As the story goes on.
Speaker 5: Keep an eye on bitcoin eighty four thousand US dollars
Speaker 5: per token, risk on attitude in markets if you look
Speaker 5: at it, Bloomberg shan Ali Bassek, thank you so much.
Speaker 5: You look away from bitcoin and the equity markets. Technology
Speaker 5: more risk off, particularly the chip sector with the socks
Speaker 5: down significantly. Jordan Klein and lists of Assoo America's joins
Speaker 5: US now and let's start there. It's an interesting sentiment
Speaker 5: in the market this morning, Bitcoin going gangbusters, semiconductors softer.
Speaker 7: Why Well, I don't know if there's any one specific
Speaker 7: data point today that's putting the semiconductor sector under pressure.
Speaker 7: I mean, this is a sector that's going to be
Speaker 7: pretty volatile. I think until Trump takes office and you
Speaker 7: can get more clarity around his positioning around tariffs, how
Speaker 7: aggressively be what will the impact be on global trade?
Speaker 3: And this group has had a nice move. I mean it's.
Speaker 7: Underperformed broader tech and definitely software since the election. But
Speaker 7: remember it's one of the top performers in the equity
Speaker 7: market year to date, with Nvidia leading the way. So
Speaker 7: I just think you're going to see ebbs and flows,
Speaker 7: but clearly there's a lot of momentum in SEMIS, and
Speaker 7: when it sees a sector like crypto and fintech take off,
Speaker 7: there's going to be some people who want to play
Speaker 7: into that.
Speaker 4: Can I go micro for a moment? And super Microcomputer
Speaker 4: we completely basically ignored because it came out with its
Speaker 4: update for the market on the same day as the
Speaker 4: election results. But it needs focusing on because it's down
Speaker 4: another eleven percent. It is a raised an awful lot
Speaker 4: of market capitalization because well, why basically not only about
Speaker 4: disappointing sales forecasts, but ultimately about accounting probes, about a
Speaker 4: DJ investigation, about a delayed ten K financial disclosure, all
Speaker 4: of the above. How much do you focus in on
Speaker 4: these individual names and as to whether they can vindicate
Speaker 4: the AI bubbles.
Speaker 7: Well, we cover SMCI, as do a lot of people
Speaker 7: who follow it, you know, as a big you know,
Speaker 7: supplier of the AI servers and these Blackwell rack systems
Speaker 7: that are such in such high demands, so they're part
Speaker 7: of the ecosystem for AI. And this is a huge
Speaker 7: question mark. It's a big dark cloud, particularly over that
Speaker 7: company and the stock obviously, and people are looking to
Speaker 7: figure out, like, what could this mean for customers who
Speaker 7: are waiting for these Blackwell rack systems, and what could
Speaker 7: it mean for other competitors who might benefit if you know,
Speaker 7: order move from super Micro into players like Dell or
Speaker 7: Hewlett Packard or Hanhai. I don't necessarily think it changes
Speaker 7: the whole dynamic of AI investment and demand exceeding supply.
Speaker 7: I think that's going to remain intact into next year.
Speaker 7: But I think it just shows you the risk associated
Speaker 7: with some of these names. You know, what goes up
Speaker 7: can come down, and you never know when you're going
Speaker 7: to be hit with some of these headlines kind of
Speaker 7: out of the blue, to be honest, Jordan.
Speaker 5: Common to super micro and video the industry at large
Speaker 5: is China, and when it comes to President elect Trump,
Speaker 5: we have a firmer sort of understanding of a tariff policy.
Speaker 5: But when you think about the end market that is China,
Speaker 5: do you have a clear sense of whether President Elect
Speaker 5: Trump will or will not allow America's biggest technology companies
Speaker 5: to do more business in China going forward?
Speaker 7: Now, I think that's part of the uncertainties is I
Speaker 7: don't think he's going to restrict you know, across the board,
Speaker 7: US companies dealing in China, but I think he definitely
Speaker 7: wants to gain more leverage over you know, the trade
Speaker 7: and balance, and he wants to bring as much investment
Speaker 7: to the United States as possible, particularly companies you know
Speaker 7: that that go overseas for their production or their purchasing,
Speaker 7: and that's why you've seen things like the chip decks
Speaker 7: stimulate US investment. So again, I think he's going to
Speaker 7: do anything he can to incentivize companies, whether they're US
Speaker 7: based or even overseas, to look to the United States first,
Speaker 7: you know, as opposed to China. And I already think
Speaker 7: that was going on right even before Trump was elected.
Speaker 7: I think this was part of the Biden administration's focus
Speaker 7: with the chips ACKed money. But I think that only accelerates,
Speaker 7: and then the question becomes, what is the actual implication
Speaker 7: if he puts these large tariffs on It's it's going
Speaker 7: to be something we have to wait and see.
Speaker 5: I'm a creature of habit. Every day I wake up
Speaker 5: and I read the same thing client's Quick Tech Bites
Speaker 5: authored by you, And in today's edition, you're talking a
Speaker 5: lot about cyberstocks. What's your focus there?
Speaker 7: Well, this is an area I would watch closely if
Speaker 7: I was an investor looking to make money into the
Speaker 7: coming year. I mean, security stocks are always topical, just
Speaker 7: because there's a lot of risks for companies globally from
Speaker 7: attacks and breaches and so forth. But we did a
Speaker 7: survey of over one hundred US based IT managers and
Speaker 7: ask them, you know, their propensity to spend and invest
Speaker 7: in the security sector and how AI might actually impact
Speaker 7: their spending, and the results.
Speaker 3: Were quite favorable.
Speaker 7: It's a long report, but the summary is is that
Speaker 7: companies are looking to spend more in security, not less.
Speaker 7: I think AI is going to drive more investment. And
Speaker 7: some of the companies that you know were talked about
Speaker 7: that look to be the clear beneficiaries not only include Microsoft,
Speaker 7: but also CrowdStrike, Palo Alto, and a company called cyber Arc.
Speaker 7: So I think you want to overweight this group. You're
Speaker 7: going to get some earnings this week which could make
Speaker 7: it volatile, but a year from now, I think a
Speaker 7: lot of these stocks are higher.
Speaker 4: What else are you seeing your phone and ring off
Speaker 4: the hook about what stock aren't we talking about that
Speaker 4: your clients are well, I'll.
Speaker 7: Tell you one group that I think is going to
Speaker 7: remain and focus. It's done well, but I think generally
Speaker 7: the more average investor is still unaware of the opportunity
Speaker 7: is optical. So a lot of the cloud data centers
Speaker 7: to be able to handle all the data and the
Speaker 7: higher speeds from Nvidia's Blackwell, they need to basically upgrade
Speaker 7: all the connection points inside the data center and from
Speaker 7: data center to data center, and optical is the fastest.
Speaker 3: Most efficient way to do that.
Speaker 7: So you've seen some companies if you pull up the
Speaker 7: charts on Coherent, Cohrlumentum Lite, other companies called Asteri Labs,
Speaker 7: and uh, you know these are companies, and you even
Speaker 7: look at Marvel and Broadcom, which a lot of people
Speaker 7: own and know, but they're all going to benefit from
Speaker 7: this shift. And Capex spend in the data center to
Speaker 7: broaden out into connecting all these high speed GPUs together
Speaker 7: so that they can basically, you know, produce the output
Speaker 7: that these cloud companies are seeking with this, with these
Speaker 7: AI enabled applications.
Speaker 3: That's an area that's.
Speaker 7: Going to remain and focus and I continue to expect
Speaker 7: more money to move into those stocks.
Speaker 4: Okay, hearing down on the day, but up thirteen percent
Speaker 4: on the month. We appreciate it. Jord and Client analyst
Speaker 4: and a Zooho Americas.
Speaker 5: Since Donald Trump's election win, the hedge funds clinging on
Speaker 5: too bets against Tesla have lost billions of dollars feeling
Speaker 5: the fallout of the special relationship between the President elect
Speaker 5: and Elon Musk. According to Bloomberg calculations, hedge funds that
Speaker 5: had short positions against Tesla between election day and Friday's
Speaker 5: close took an on paper hit of at least five
Speaker 5: point two billion dollars. Let's bring in Bloomberg's David Welsh
Speaker 5: in Detroit. I mean, this has been the calculus for
Speaker 5: some time, but that time period and a five point
Speaker 5: two billion dollar loss is quite something, David.
Speaker 1: It is. Look, people have lost money trying to short
Speaker 1: Tesla and bet against Elon Musk for a long time.
Speaker 1: But in this case, I think the bed was that
Speaker 1: his whole robotaxi plan turning Tesla into an AI company
Speaker 1: either wouldn't happen or wouldn't happen on time, so there
Speaker 1: would be a lot of bad or delayed news on
Speaker 1: Tesla stock and go down, and the shorts would do
Speaker 1: well with it, when in fact, now you've got this
Speaker 1: tight relationship with Donald Trump that means you'll see ev
Speaker 1: policies probably that are crafted to help Tesla, and more importantly,
Speaker 1: you'll probably see some sort of permissive federal framework for
Speaker 1: autonomous vehicles that will also help Tesla's plans for robotaxis
Speaker 1: and invest like that. They're willing to bet on that,
Speaker 1: and the shorts they got hit, hit and hit hard.
Speaker 4: Is anyone still clinging on I know that Bloomberg spoke
Speaker 4: to play Lacanda, ceof h fund manager Clean Energy Transition,
Speaker 4: who had a little bit of skin in the game
Speaker 4: when betting against Tesla, But what's the sort of percentage
Speaker 4: float that shortened?
Speaker 1: Now, Look, I think it's pretty small. I figure what
Speaker 1: it was in the story, But I think a lot
Speaker 1: of people have had to buy to basically cover their
Speaker 1: short positions. I think there's some still in there who
Speaker 1: are thinking that Trump will gut some of these IRA
Speaker 1: credits and things that help EV sell. And if Trump
Speaker 1: had a lawsuit against the state of California before, and
Speaker 1: if that happens again, if it's successful and you get
Speaker 1: rid of some of these clean air credits that other
Speaker 1: companies have to buy from Tesla, which is a very
Speaker 1: profitable part of Tesla's business, if that shrinks because of this,
Speaker 1: then it could work against the company a Trump presidency.
Speaker 1: But again you've got UoN Musk is sitting next to
Speaker 1: Donald Trump talking to him about policies for this thing.
Speaker 1: So it's hard to for these kinds of things, it's
Speaker 1: hard to imagine he's going to suggest that Donald Trump
Speaker 1: do anything that's going to hurt Queen Air credits, that's
Speaker 1: going to hurt Ira credits, and other things that will
Speaker 1: help his company.
Speaker 4: As on November, the sick the story says only seven
Speaker 4: percent of hedge funds were net short Tesla, way down
Speaker 4: from seventeen percent, but only eight percent to actually net
Speaker 4: long the stock, probably reflecting how far it's already run up.
Speaker 4: David Welch, we really appreciate it, Thank you so much. Next,
Speaker 4: Switch Gears, let's talk about China and China Singles Day
Speaker 4: kicks off officially to day with many retailers slashing prices
Speaker 4: offering promotions for the big shopping day. But look, for
Speaker 4: many this has been a week's long affair. That's his. China,
Speaker 4: of course, grapples with weak economic data and flaming domestic demand.
Speaker 4: We want to go out to China. Jacob Cook is
Speaker 4: with us WPIC Marketing and Technology CEO, and it has
Speaker 4: been weeks long in the making. What of today, Jacob,
Speaker 4: how much spending is done on eleven eleven?
Speaker 2: Well, probably about twenty five to thirty percent has actually
Speaker 2: done on the day Now. The festival has been getting
Speaker 2: longer and longer every year. We started back in October
Speaker 2: this year. But we're all pretty optimistic. We just closed
Speaker 2: out about ten minutes ago. Here we're now the twelfth
Speaker 2: in China. But overall we're actually predicting a little bit
Speaker 2: stronger growth we had year over year this year than
Speaker 2: last year, So it's looking pretty optimistic so far.
Speaker 4: And what are they buying?
Speaker 2: Well, a lot different things now actually, you know, there's
Speaker 2: a lot about the hobbies and outdoor consumption. You know,
Speaker 2: pat had a really good shopping festival as well, exercise,
Speaker 2: outdoor vitamins, personal care, cosmetics, these types of things. Definitely,
Speaker 2: what we've kind of summarized this trend is to be
Speaker 2: more around the Lulu lemon and a little bit less
Speaker 2: than Louis Baton, And that's kind of just a general
Speaker 2: emergence of that new consumer that's come out of China.
Speaker 5: For global audience on Blombow Technology, a lot of people
Speaker 5: watching this won't have experience, particularly of Ali Barber, but
Speaker 5: also JD dot COM's consumer facing businesses. What's the experience
Speaker 5: like in China? Is it kind of something akin to
Speaker 5: an Amazon Prime Day window in the United States? How
Speaker 5: do people rush to do their shopping?
Speaker 3: Well, I think there's two things.
Speaker 2: One, there's probably people that have had their eye on
Speaker 2: certain items for the year, maybe it's a new set
Speaker 2: of golf clubs or supporting equipment. And then there's also
Speaker 2: the people that stock up. You know, pet food really
Speaker 2: has a lot to do. And the pad category with
Speaker 2: people stocking up for months and months in advance, You're
Speaker 2: going to see basically every ad on elevators and TVs,
Speaker 2: et cetera. Promoting the Shopping festival for about a month
Speaker 2: and combining this with the six to eighteen Shopping Festival
Speaker 2: in June. A lot of brands are expecting to do
Speaker 2: about fifty percent of their online sales during these two
Speaker 2: periods combined, so it's obviously very substantial.
Speaker 4: Jacob, you help global brands make inroads into China, but
Speaker 4: also Japan, South Korea other Asian markets. What are they
Speaker 4: telling you about nervousness around continuing to focus in on
Speaker 4: China at this moment, given the economic concerns, given a
Speaker 4: new administration that's going to come in the US.
Speaker 2: Yeah, certainly are brands has been asking for diversification throughout
Speaker 2: the region, and we operate, as you said, all throughout Asia,
Speaker 2: so that's Korea, Southeast Asia. We are taking a lot
Speaker 2: of learnings from here. So if you look at a
Speaker 2: lot of the dominant platforms, whether it's Copang in Korea
Speaker 2: or Lazada Shoppy in Southeast Asia, a lot of them
Speaker 2: are either owned by Chinese, heavily invested by Chinese, or
Speaker 2: they have some major operations that have come out of China.
Speaker 2: So as we're diversifying, you know, China's still being about
Speaker 2: two thirds of all e commerce GMB when you add
Speaker 2: up that region. But we do see a lot of
Speaker 2: the learnings coming from China being able to be applied,
Speaker 2: especially in the live streaming, the influencer marketing, and these
Speaker 2: types of things that are becoming more and more popular,
Speaker 2: especially when we see the rise of TikTok sales throughout
Speaker 2: Asia too as well.
Speaker 5: Jacob Kirk of WPIC Marketing and Technologies, thank you very much.
Speaker 5: Coming up AI sales startup eleven x gets an investment
Speaker 5: boost from Andres and Horror.
Speaker 2: It's more on that next.
Speaker 5: Let me go back to Tesla. So Tesla is trading
Speaker 5: more than ten percent session high, at its highest level
Speaker 5: since April fifth of twenty twenty two. It is up
Speaker 5: for a fifth straight day post the election, matching the
Speaker 5: runou games it had in September. A lot of momentum there,
Speaker 5: not for the shorts. This is Bloomberg. Artificial intelligence powered
Speaker 5: sales start up eleven x has raised fifty million dollars
Speaker 5: in a new funding round led by Andres and Horowitz,
Speaker 5: boosting its total funding to seventy six million with evaluation
Speaker 5: of around three hundred and twenty million. For more, eleven
Speaker 5: x CEO Hasansuka joins us in San Francisco. An interesting
Speaker 5: story because this is a company and startup started in
Speaker 5: London and you've just moved to the Bay Area, San Francisco.
Speaker 5: You've now got fifty million dollars more. What's the next
Speaker 5: phase of eleven x?
Speaker 8: Absolutely, First of all, it's great to see you, Ed.
Speaker 8: You're exactly right. We recently moved eleven x from London
Speaker 8: to San Francisco. Moved quite a big portion of our
Speaker 8: team here to accelerate the development of the company, and
Speaker 8: there's a tremendous amount of exciting milestones we're pushing towards
Speaker 8: that I'm happy to take you through.
Speaker 5: That's on the basics. What is an artificial intelligence powered
Speaker 5: sales startup?
Speaker 8: Absolutely so. Look at its core. Eleven X is an
Speaker 8: automation company that builds digital workers. You can think of
Speaker 8: digital workers as AI employees. They have names and faces
Speaker 8: and job categories they're trained on, and companies can hire
Speaker 8: them to execute tasks. And really it's about the work
Speaker 8: outcomes the software licenses or seats. Our digital workers focus
Speaker 8: on revenue teams or go to market teams. More broadly,
Speaker 8: we have a two different products, but ultimately, really the
Speaker 8: core model is digital workers instead of traditional saaspace software.
Speaker 4: It's a competitive space as a who do you want
Speaker 4: to take on?
Speaker 3: How do you.
Speaker 4: Partner with the other big players in this space?
Speaker 8: Absolutely so. The way we think about it, traditional software
Speaker 8: was built to make employees more productive or more efficient
Speaker 8: or more collaborative. But with AI agents, the scope for
Speaker 8: what you can automate and how you can automate is different.
Speaker 8: So you can take entire processes, workflows, streams, of work
Speaker 8: and have agents execute them. And we believe this will
Speaker 8: create a huge shift in how people think about software
Speaker 8: the way we think about it internally, just like how
Speaker 8: about twenty five years ago Salesforce really innovated on the
Speaker 8: cloud based software model we think with agents, and there's
Speaker 8: the beginning of a big shift in how customers and
Speaker 8: enterprises around the world think of the value of utilizing
Speaker 8: agents at work. And that's how we think of the
Speaker 8: opportunity here.
Speaker 4: But Salesforce is all in on agents itself, and so
Speaker 4: how do you muscle in and ensure that you you
Speaker 4: take and run with the market share we see the
Speaker 4: companies that you've already got as clients.
Speaker 8: Absolutely, so customers are smart and they realized that companies
Speaker 8: that are AI native companies with agentic architectures and workflows
Speaker 8: at their core, are best suited to truly capture the
Speaker 8: benefits of the technology that the agents enable, and really
Speaker 8: the way to think about it, just like how historically
Speaker 8: you know when the move to cloud happened and it
Speaker 8: enabled a pletfor of opportunities in companies that are native
Speaker 8: to that cycle to how eleven x is really operating
Speaker 8: with agents at the core. So ultimately the way we
Speaker 8: build technology is leading to much bigger impact for our
Speaker 8: customers than what you would get in co pilots or
Speaker 8: in more incremental software editions.
Speaker 5: Hassana, I want to go back to your move from
Speaker 5: the United Kingdom to here on the West Coast. Why
Speaker 5: what was the sort of motivating factor to do that.
Speaker 8: We believe that there is no better place in the
Speaker 8: world to scale a company than San Francisco. Everything from
Speaker 8: so many of our customers are here, the depth of talent,
Speaker 8: where our investors are, and ultimately just an environment where
Speaker 8: we can scale to the huge market opportunity that we
Speaker 8: see ahead of us. Being the core reason behind or
Speaker 8: moved to.
Speaker 4: To ss Ile an x Ai CEO A Sansuka come back,
Speaker 4: we appreciate it.
Speaker 9: My reaction on kind of the more business side, the
Speaker 9: defense side is it's great to have someone inbound who
Speaker 9: is deeply, I guess deeply aligned with the idea that
Speaker 9: we need to be spending less on defense while still
Speaker 9: getting more, that we need to do a better job
Speaker 9: of procuring the defense tools that protect our country.
Speaker 3: Trump famously got involved.
Speaker 9: In the nitty gritty of some of our aircraft carrier design,
Speaker 9: some of the procurement of Air Force One.
Speaker 3: To see that level of involvement from a president.
Speaker 9: Is pretty rare, and I think an indicator of his priorities.
Speaker 5: That was Anderil founder Palmer Lucky on the show last Thursday.
Speaker 5: Lucky also told us he's in touch with the transition
Speaker 5: team on key posts like the next Secretary of Defense.
Speaker 5: Our next guest is Catherine Boyle, an investor in Anderil
Speaker 5: and general partner at Andresen Horris. She's the co founder
Speaker 5: of the firm's American Dynamism Practice, which investing companies supporting
Speaker 5: national interests across aerospace, defense, and critical infrastructure. And Catherine,
Speaker 5: this is the first opportunity we've had to talk since
Speaker 5: the outcome of the election. Part of what Palmer was
Speaker 5: talking about there was, I guess evidence that President Electrump
Speaker 5: will spend in those areas that you're focused on defense technology.
Speaker 5: But beyond the spend, what else can you give our
Speaker 5: audience that convinces you that President elect Trump was the
Speaker 5: right candidate for the American dynamism movement.
Speaker 10: Well, so, I think the focus of this administration is,
Speaker 10: particularly as it relates to defense, will be on production, production, production,
Speaker 10: Let's invest in the defense industrial base. Let's make sure
Speaker 10: that the technologies that are needed for the battles of
Speaker 10: the twenty first century are procured as quickly as possible.
Speaker 10: And as Palmer said, which I think is often a
Speaker 10: message that's lost inside of the DoD and outside of it,
Speaker 10: we need to focus on doing more with less. Technology
Speaker 10: is actually better for the American tax paper. Pair these
Speaker 10: companies that are startups that are focused on production, that
Speaker 10: are building products that are for the.
Speaker 3: Next generation warfighter.
Speaker 10: These are actually cheaper than the large, exquisite systems that
Speaker 10: have dominated the Department of Defense for many decades. I
Speaker 10: think that will be a huge focus of this administration
Speaker 10: going forward.
Speaker 5: Catherine doing more with less Department of Government efficiency. Elon Musk,
Speaker 5: what is it that you think that Elon Musk will
Speaker 5: actually do, or encourage or guide President electrom to do
Speaker 5: if he's to have some sort of role in this administration.
Speaker 3: Well, so, I don't know much about the DOGE Department.
Speaker 10: I think there's lots of details on that that will
Speaker 10: remain to be seen. But I think the thing that's
Speaker 10: most important about the people who are around this administration
Speaker 10: and the administration themselves, is that they very much understand
Speaker 10: the importance of American dynamism and little tech. They very
Speaker 10: much understand how tech that makes things more efficient, not
Speaker 10: less efficient, how I can save taxpayer dollars across.
Speaker 3: A range of industries. And I think that will be paramount.
Speaker 10: That is, you know, the Silicon Valley understands company building,
Speaker 10: understands how important job creation is to the American economy,
Speaker 10: and I think you also have that and Vice President
Speaker 10: elect Jdvans.
Speaker 3: You know, the story that.
Speaker 10: Really wasn't told that much on the campaign trail is
Speaker 10: that JD left San Francisco, moved to Ohio and started
Speaker 10: investing in companies in the Midwest with his venture firm
Speaker 10: because he believed that investing directly in manufacturing, investing directly
Speaker 10: in companies that are based around the country is the
Speaker 10: funt of American dynamism. That is a large part of
Speaker 10: our American dynamism thesis, that you can build companies anywhere
Speaker 10: in America and that tech is good for all Americans
Speaker 10: in all society. So I think you're going to see
Speaker 10: that be a an innovation message in this administration because
Speaker 10: they have first hand experience with building companies.
Speaker 4: You invested alongside Jed Evans. I think in some of
Speaker 4: the seed rounds for Androil, What then of his presence
Speaker 4: in Washington and what do you think he will evolve
Speaker 4: there well.
Speaker 10: So I think there's an understanding again that it is
Speaker 10: important to invest in next generation capabilities for the Department
Speaker 10: of Defense. But the thing that I think Senator Vance
Speaker 10: has been very, very focused on throughout his entire career
Speaker 10: is manufacturing.
Speaker 3: And again I want to go.
Speaker 10: Back to say production is such an important part of this.
Speaker 3: Philosophy of the administration.
Speaker 10: But also I think where the DoD is going, that
Speaker 10: we need to invest in companies that.
Speaker 3: Are building and supporting.
Speaker 10: Our defense industrial base, because the defense industrial base cannot
Speaker 10: be removed from manufacturing. The future of manufacturing in this
Speaker 10: country is reliant on these companies that are building for aerospace,
Speaker 10: building for defense, bringing next generation manufacturing capabilities inside of
Speaker 10: all of the industries that are important to the American economy.
Speaker 10: So I think that is going to be a key
Speaker 10: belief of this administration. It's something that they've talked about
Speaker 10: very publicly before, and that will that will that will
Speaker 10: speak volumes to the to the companies that are coming
Speaker 10: up today that want to build as quickly as possible
Speaker 10: for next generation capabilities.
Speaker 4: Senator Mitch McConnell, echoing in many ways your view that
Speaker 4: we need to ramp up defense spending. He's been saying
Speaker 4: it's a lot cheaper to prevent war, of course, than
Speaker 4: it is to have one. Kevin, what about outside of
Speaker 4: America investing in American startups or larger defense companies. We've
Speaker 4: already hear from Taiwan, for example, discussing how it's going
Speaker 4: to up its defense spending. Europe probably trying to front
Speaker 4: run that too.
Speaker 10: I think there's an understanding that deterrence matters, and that
Speaker 10: if you do not have a strong defense industrial base
Speaker 10: in your home country, that that is a weak point
Speaker 10: for national security.
Speaker 3: And I very much agree with the sentiment.
Speaker 10: That the best way to stop wars is to prevent war,
Speaker 10: to invest in the capabilities, the manufacturing capabilities in country.
Speaker 10: And so just as you're seeing a focus and an
Speaker 10: emphasis on the American defense industry base, which definitely needs
Speaker 10: injections of both public and private capital, you're also seeing
Speaker 10: that across other countries that say, Okay, we're going to
Speaker 10: start investing in our defense industrial base as well. And
Speaker 10: I think there's a lot that those countries can learn
Speaker 10: from American companies. There's a lot that they can learn
Speaker 10: from the startup ecosystem and what's happened with American dynamism
Speaker 10: over the last several years in terms of bringing autonomy
Speaker 10: into capabilities, making sure that you're not investing again in
Speaker 10: these large exquisite systems that are very expensive and time
Speaker 10: consuming to build, but investing in drone's autonomy, unmanned surface vessels,
Speaker 10: things that can be built very cheaply, very quickly, and
Speaker 10: be put in the hands of the warfighter if need be.
Speaker 5: Catherine I wrote in the Tech Daily newsletter this morning
Speaker 5: about your colleagues in industry who supported Kamla Harris doing
Speaker 5: some soul searching, right, but also considering how Trump two
Speaker 5: point zero will work for them for their portfolio companies.
Speaker 5: Would you be able just to talk a little bit
Speaker 5: about the conversations you've had with your colleagues and your
Speaker 5: competitors even in the world events capital, and the case
Speaker 5: that you would make that this is going to be
Speaker 5: a good four year period for them.
Speaker 10: Well, what I'll say is American dynamism is probably one
Speaker 10: of the few categories of innovation where Republicans and Democrats
Speaker 10: in Washington agree wholeheartedly.
Speaker 3: We need to be investing in our events industrial base.
Speaker 10: We need to make sure that we're restoring and restoring
Speaker 10: the resiliency in America. This is these are not controversial issues.
Speaker 10: In fact, you know, Republicans and Democrats alike come together
Speaker 10: on them very often. So I think that that is
Speaker 10: something that you know, our colleagues that supported, you know,
Speaker 10: the Harris administration. There's definitely a view that this is
Speaker 10: this is a category of innovation that will touch all Americans,
Speaker 10: something that I think everyone can agree is important and
Speaker 10: that we need to we need to invest in these
Speaker 10: capabilities going forward.
Speaker 5: Catherine, how does a VC focus on American dynamism need
Speaker 5: to invest now at which stages, which geographies, what kind
Speaker 5: of companies.
Speaker 3: Well, so, I don't know that the strategy necessarily changes.
Speaker 10: Again, I think this is something that you know, since
Speaker 10: twenty fifteen, former Secretary of Defense Ash Carter has been
Speaker 10: pounding the drum that the Department of Defense needs to change.
Speaker 10: As Palmer said last week on your show, every administration
Speaker 10: has been sort of has an understanding that the Defense
Speaker 10: Department needs to modernize, that aerospace needs to modernize. And
Speaker 10: so I think in many ways there will be a
Speaker 10: continuation of investing in companies that are fantastic for the
Speaker 10: national interest, Companies in aerospace, defense, transportation, potentially nuclear, you know,
Speaker 10: companies that are important for all Americans. And I think
Speaker 10: we're just going to continue to see more and more
Speaker 10: investment in these categories, in particular.
Speaker 4: In his Veterans' Day. And we want to note that
Speaker 4: you have invested in a number of companies founded by veterans.
Speaker 4: But I want to go to another founder that you've backed,
Speaker 4: and we mentioned him briefly, but Elil Musk, you are
Speaker 4: invested in SpaceX, and can you just tell us as
Speaker 4: to whether you worry about if there is a long
Speaker 4: term role for him within well, whether it's kabinat or
Speaker 4: indeed as a whisperer to the White House, does that
Speaker 4: worry you about leadership at the companies that he currently helms.
Speaker 10: I know, I mean, Elon is a superhuman figure in
Speaker 10: terms of the number of companies that he's support or
Speaker 10: the number of companies that he's built. He is the
Speaker 10: most extraordinary founder not only of our era, but when
Speaker 10: we look back in history, we will remember the name
Speaker 10: Elon Musk, and so I'm very excited that he is
Speaker 10: you know, taking on interest in politics, that he is
Speaker 10: thinking about how to make the government more efficient. And
Speaker 10: I think a lot of people, a lot of people
Speaker 10: would agree with that sentiment, that he is one of
Speaker 10: the most extraordinary builders, one of the most efficient people
Speaker 10: with his time, and that he will have an incredible
Speaker 10: impact on American government.
Speaker 4: Katherine Boyle, we appreciate you joining us today of Andrews
Speaker 4: and Horowitz. Meanwhile, technology that once seemed like science fiction
Speaker 4: is rapidly becoming reality. In a new four part series
Speaker 4: called Posthuman, the New Megamini Chang meets some of the
Speaker 4: world's most advanced robots. Here's a sneak peak. I what
Speaker 4: to expect. There is this Hollywood idea of killer robots.
Speaker 3: Actually not that far fetched.
Speaker 11: Oh, it's not far fetched at all. It's coming very soon,
Speaker 11: like in the next few years. And all of the
Speaker 11: governments to sell arms, like the US and Russia and
Speaker 11: Britain and Israel, all of those governments refuse to regulate
Speaker 11: military uses of AI. So if you look at the
Speaker 11: European regulations, they've got all these limitations on AI. Should
Speaker 11: be sort of transparent in this amount, shouldn't be discriminate.
Speaker 11: But there's a little clause in there that says none
Speaker 11: of this applies to military uses of AI. They don't
Speaker 11: like regulating themselves, and all of the big arments manufacturers
Speaker 11: are very keen to make killer robots. So if you
Speaker 11: look at Asimov's laws of robotics, that you know the
Speaker 11: first law should be do not harm people. Well, that's
Speaker 11: the whole point of a killer robot. That's not going
Speaker 11: to be built into a killer robot.
Speaker 5: You can catch the first episode airing tonight on Bloomberg
Speaker 5: TV at ten pm Eastern time.
Speaker 4: Let's have a quick check on these markets as we
Speaker 4: trade it, because when we're talking about it throughout the morning,
Speaker 4: eighty four and a half thousand now is the level
Speaker 4: for bitcoin, new record high. Of course, with the idea
Speaker 4: that not just a Trump in the White House, but
Speaker 4: a far more pro crypto Congress at large will mean
Speaker 4: more regulation that gives more clarity, more change. At the
Speaker 4: top of the sec micro Strategy dining out on that rally.
Speaker 4: Of course, this has basically become a proxy for bitcoin ownership,
Speaker 4: but Michael Saylor, the leader of micro Strategy, has been
Speaker 4: investing yet more. Another twenty seven thousand bitcoin have been
Speaker 4: bought over the last few trading days and where up
Speaker 4: some eighteen percent on that particular stop is outperformed even
Speaker 4: in Vidia since the start of twenty twenty an absolutely
Speaker 4: phenomenal run for that particular stop. And what's also interesting,
Speaker 4: we got news when it comes to crypto FTX that
Speaker 4: old chestnut filed a lawsuit against Binance and its former
Speaker 4: CEO to recover one point eight billion dollars which is
Speaker 4: allegedly forudulately transferred by Sam Bangmanfreed then also claims that
Speaker 4: Baguan Freed used ftx's exchange token and Binance branded coins
Speaker 4: to pay for a share repurchase steal in twenty twenty one,
Speaker 4: which was made fraudulent since FTX was allegedly insolvent at
Speaker 4: the time.
Speaker 5: Ed okay, a lot more to come up on the show.
Speaker 5: We're going to discuss how AI is transforming solutions in
Speaker 5: the climate tech space with James Jaquin from Obvious Ventures.
Speaker 3: That's next. This is Bloomberg.
Speaker 5: Technology time for the VC Roundup. First stup, Talabat says
Speaker 5: they're eyeing ways to diversify beyond food and grocery deliveries,
Speaker 5: with a possible expansion to healthcare, beauty, and fintech. This
Speaker 5: is the Middle Eastern subsidiary of delivery hero Tease up
Speaker 5: a share sale that could value it at fourteen point
Speaker 5: four billion dollars plus. Indian food delivery platform Swiggy Sorry,
Speaker 5: it's one point three billion dollar IPO subscribe more than
Speaker 5: three times on Friday, driven in part by a late
Speaker 5: surge in demand. One of the few one billion dollar
Speaker 5: plus listings in India this year, it drew bids for
Speaker 5: six times the shares kept for foreigners and domestic money managers,
Speaker 5: and LG has added access capital to its roster of
Speaker 5: banks for a potential IPO of its Indian unit. That's
Speaker 5: according to sources. The South Korean company selected the Indian
Speaker 5: bank as it moves forward with a share sale in
Speaker 5: Mumbai seeking to raise one to one point five billion dollars. Caroline,
Speaker 5: and let's just.
Speaker 4: Talk about the US and how it will continue its
Speaker 4: fight against climate change as even with Donald Trump in
Speaker 4: the White House. Those are the words of Biden's top
Speaker 4: climate negotiator John Pedesta earlier today at COP twenty nine.
Speaker 4: Let's discuss this and how perhaps artificial intelligence can be
Speaker 4: helping with that. James Jaquin is with US today's VC
Speaker 4: Spotlight co founder managing director at Obvious Ventures, which was
Speaker 4: founded more than a decade ago. And James, when you
Speaker 4: do see potentially a new administration coming in that doesn't
Speaker 4: seem to be as pro climate change avoidance as the
Speaker 4: current administry, what does that mean in terms of your
Speaker 4: thesis in termes you're investing in this space, Well.
Speaker 12: First and foremost, we're long term investors. I think all
Speaker 12: of venture capital is an industry where we'll spend sometimes
Speaker 12: twelve or fifteen years building a company before it reaches.
Speaker 3: The public markets.
Speaker 12: That's three presidential administrations, so we worry less about what's
Speaker 12: going to happen in one administration or another. We try
Speaker 12: to focus more on bringing these breakthrough technologies to market,
Speaker 12: some of the ones.
Speaker 4: That you've backed that we all know about beyond meat
Speaker 4: for example, you know multiple rounds there. What is the
Speaker 4: new area of innovation in climate change and how is
Speaker 4: it being how spearheaded from a generative AI perspective.
Speaker 12: For example, Well, with climate there's a lot of unsolved problems.
Speaker 12: We need better battery technologies, we need more renewable energy
Speaker 12: to power all of our AI data centers, and the
Speaker 12: thing that we're excited about is using AI to solve
Speaker 12: these unsolvable problems. We call it generative science, and it's
Speaker 12: an idea of instead of using large language models trained
Speaker 12: on the Internet, we're backing teams that are building large
Speaker 12: science models trained in areas like chemistry, biology, and physics,
Speaker 12: and those generative science AI systems can actually output or
Speaker 12: generate new scientific breakthroughs.
Speaker 5: James I was writing this morning in the Tech Daily
Speaker 5: newsletter about the idea that there are lots of vench
Speaker 5: capses that backed Harris because they felt she was the
Speaker 5: better candidate in the context of climate, the work of
Speaker 5: the Inflation Reduction Act, but there are others out there
Speaker 5: that basically see staying power. They would cite data on
Speaker 5: install stalled capacity of renewable energy sources, the hiring in
Speaker 5: those fields. You said you're a long term investor. How
Speaker 5: closely would you track those data sets over the next
Speaker 5: four years.
Speaker 12: Well, there's a lot to be optimistic about ed with
Speaker 12: climate and particularly with the Inflation Reduction Act. There's a
Speaker 12: lot of fear and uncertainty that Trump two point zero
Speaker 12: administration is going to somehow repeal that, and I share
Speaker 12: those concerns. However, there's data to be optimistic. If we
Speaker 12: look at the two hundred plus billion that has already
Speaker 12: been deployed out to states. One hundred and sixty five
Speaker 12: billion have gone to Red states, so more than three
Speaker 12: times what Blue states have received. That means in states
Speaker 12: like Georgia and North Carolina and Tennessee, we have new
Speaker 12: electric battery and electric vehicle plants coming online. That's good
Speaker 12: green jobs in red states. That's Christmas for climate tech.
Speaker 5: James, how focus should everyone be on nuclear and how
Speaker 5: important is it for you?
Speaker 12: It's funny nuclear has really had a change of heart.
Speaker 12: I think with investors and with environmentalists as we look
Speaker 12: at the needs of our energy grid. We're going to
Speaker 12: have to double the number of electrons on the US
Speaker 12: grid to power electric vehicles and bitcoin mining and AI
Speaker 12: data centers. At Obvious we want those electrons to be green.
Speaker 12: We don't want more coal plants, we don't want more
Speaker 12: natural gas plants, and so to deliver that much power
Speaker 12: need I think two big areas. One is geothermal, which
Speaker 12: we're investing in, and the other is nuclear.
Speaker 5: James fucking co founder and managing director Obvious Ventures, thank
Speaker 5: you very much. For years, Apple Watches customers and investors
Speaker 5: have been fixated on the same question, what is the
Speaker 5: company's next blockbuster products? Bloombos Mark Goman wrote about it
Speaker 5: in this week's Power On and joins us. Now, beyond
Speaker 5: the iPhone, what is it? What is the next thing
Speaker 5: that is going to be the driver of growth?
Speaker 13: Well, let's just take a step back and talk about
Speaker 13: the iPhone for a second.
Speaker 9: Rate.
Speaker 13: It generates over half of the company's revenue as a standbone.
Speaker 3: Product, but almost the rest of all.
Speaker 13: Of Apple's revenue from services to things like Apple Care,
Speaker 13: to AirPods, to Apple watches, even iPads marixx Apple TVs
Speaker 13: flon pods. All of these things are bought by customers
Speaker 13: because they have an iPhone, or because they're in the
Speaker 13: Apple ecosystem, because they fall in love with the iPhone.
Speaker 13: There will never be another Apple product like the iPhone,
Speaker 13: something that sits at the center of the company and
Speaker 13: generates half of the revenue from a hardware standpoint and
Speaker 13: the other half from an attachment and services standpoint. Right,
Speaker 13: So investors have to understand that and come to that realization.
Speaker 13: But there are little beats, more modest things that Apple
Speaker 13: will bring to market, some built around the iPhone, some
Speaker 13: completely standalone, and the hope for Apple investors is that
Speaker 13: you can stack up a bunch of twenty to fifty
Speaker 13: billion dollars a year businesses, things about the size of
Speaker 13: the AirPods, Apple Watch, and iPad. So to answer your question,
Speaker 13: the areas that Apple is exploring and moving into obviously headsets,
Speaker 13: but beyond mixed reality, going into pure augmented reality glasses
Speaker 13: or standalone glasses without displays, things like expanded versions of
Speaker 13: AirPods that tap into AI.
Speaker 3: There have been.
Speaker 13: Explorations into home robotics, explorations into home energy, a way
Speaker 13: to monetize the health products into a subscription service. Right.
Speaker 13: The big thing coming next year is a push into
Speaker 13: the smart home.
Speaker 3: So for the first time, Apple's really.
Speaker 13: Going to dive two feet first into smart home appliances.
Speaker 13: So in the first half of next year, you'll see
Speaker 13: a push into smart home displays. Right, a couple of
Speaker 13: years after that, you'll see a new smart display with
Speaker 13: the robotic limb. So definitely a bunch of these little
Speaker 13: categories that they hope will add up into something bigger.
Speaker 4: One key category that was new, innovative and perhaps hasn't
Speaker 4: taken off in the way they expected was Vision Pro.
Speaker 4: But you're saying in the latest power on that we
Speaker 4: finally got the color app. Just talk us through it.
Speaker 13: If you have a vision Pro, and I know there's
Speaker 13: not many of us out there you want to try.
Speaker 13: Coming out in the beginning of next month is a
Speaker 13: vision OS two point two update. It's available in beta now.
Speaker 13: I've been using it. There's been this long lasting Mac
Speaker 13: external monitor feature. You can put on the headset and
Speaker 13: you can view your Mac display in there, and it's
Speaker 13: basically an enlarged version of your what's on your Mac.
Speaker 13: Right now, a lot of people vision pros use that.
Speaker 13: They're adding a new feature that allows you to add
Speaker 13: a wide monitor or an ultra wide monitor, and so
Speaker 13: if you turn this feature on, you get a gigantic
Speaker 13: curved display that can go almost three hundred and sixty
Speaker 13: degrees and you can see what's on your Mac through that,
Speaker 13: and it's a really powerful tool and a great productivity
Speaker 13: use case for the vision Pro. The problem is is
Speaker 13: that the vision Pro, if you're not laying down with
Speaker 13: your head on the back of a pillow on your couch,
Speaker 13: it's often hard to wear the vision Pro for extended
Speaker 13: periods of time. And the bands that Apple include in
Speaker 13: the box of the Vision pro are part of the reason.
Speaker 13: There's a backup headband and then there's a band that
Speaker 13: has a thin strap that goes behind the head on
Speaker 13: top of the head. Neither are very good for long
Speaker 13: term productivity. But Belkan, this is a company that's owned
Speaker 13: by a fox Con subsidiary, so they work very closely
Speaker 13: with Apple came out with a new overhead strap that
Speaker 13: attaches to the back of head strap and combined you
Speaker 13: can wear it for longer use cases.
Speaker 4: Mark German. With all the latest and greater out of Apple,
Speaker 4: we really appreciate. Meanwhile, let's do a quick check on
Speaker 4: the rest of the tech sector for you, because ed
Speaker 4: we are down on the NASDAK chip sector falls. But
Speaker 4: Bitcoin above eighty four thousand Tesla you said it at
Speaker 4: a higher since twenty twenty.
Speaker 5: Yeah, astonishing momentum. That does it for this edition of
Speaker 5: the show, check out the pod. You know where to
Speaker 5: find it. Happy Monday.
Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg